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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Compared with the 2016 “Enemies of the People” Mail coverage t

SystemSystem Posts: 8,489
edited September 2019 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Compared with the 2016 “Enemies of the People” Mail coverage today’s tabloids appear quite restrained

While watching the Supreme Court verdict yesterday morning I wondered quite how the strident pro-Brexit tabloids would cover it. We all remember the very powerful Daily Mail front page after the first Gina Miller case in the High Court and I was expecting something along the same lines.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • The Daily Mirror front page with the former short-serving prime ministers is excellent; the Guardian won't thank you for lumping them in with the tabloids.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 42,807
    Second like the LibDems
  • This really is beyond a joke; there is no effective government at all.

    This has got to be put to the people in general election
  • How old would you need to be to get the Dick Emery reference in the Sun headline? Mid-50s, 60s?
  • TheJezziahTheJezziah Posts: 3,840

    spudgfsh said:

    Cyclefree said:

    If we had an opposition leader with a moral compass, some brains to think with and the ability to string a sentence together, this government would be out on its arse before the day is out.

    As it is it will shamelessly ignore the decision and probably win the next GE. God help us.

    I think Ed Milliband would have had the trust/confidence of the opposition parties and called the VoNC.
    At the moment, the Government have only 288 MPs.
    Unfortunately, the opposition only have 53 (35SNP + 18LD).
    The Labour party have completely taken themselves out of the equation, and resort to ranting from the sidelines (usually calling for an election, or demanding someone resign - all something they could force) instead of doing anything useful.
    And worse is that probably 200 Labour MPs should know better.
    You do realise the opposition have defeated Boris like 5 or 6 times, they defeated May several times.

    If we take your statement as true though there is no way it could be happening without either 120 odd Tory rebellions (more when May was in charge), or maybe the Lib Dems and SNP going through the voting lobby multiple times with fake moustaches and comedy glasses.

    The other possibility is that it is actually Labour MPs who have been doing the bulk of the work in opposing and defeating the government. I think Corbyn, actually some votes ago, overtook Thatcher as the LOTO with the most government defeats. Although I'm not 100% sure how far back that went, WW2 maybe.

    You can not like Labour, that is fair enough. I don't see the point in claiming easily disprovable nonsense though. I don't like the Conservatives but I don't claim their 4th in the polling. As much as I'd like them to be 4th in the polling someone would just come along and prove me wrong because it is clearly not true.

  • How old would you need to be to get the Dick Emery reference in the Sun headline? Mid-50s, 60s?

    Does anyone under 50 read the Sun? Strikes me as a format which is quite literally dying out. Like the Conservative and Unionist Party.

    (How many PBers know who Dick Emery was, without googling?)
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,426

    How old would you need to be to get the Dick Emery reference in the Sun headline? Mid-50s, 60s?

    I'm 50 and I got it straight away. But I must admit I thought it was from "Are you being served", until I read your comment. The joke though, is just pathetic.
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,426

    https://twitter.com/BBCNewsnight/status/1176615713026428928?s=19

    Ummm once no deal is off the table why would they need a caretaker PM? #coup

    So that the person who illegally closed down parliament is not Prime Minister during the election campaign.
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,426

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
  • A cowardly Prime Minister lying to a monarch and unlawfully suspending parliamentary democracy.

    A bullying POTUS facing impeachment.

    Spain digging up the stinking corpse of Franco.

    A Prime Minister who thinks he is above the law being investigated for not being able to keep his pants on, and using taxpayers’ cash to treat his girlfriend.

    A vulnerable Swedish teenager having a very public mental breakdown, live on all global media.

    The Dutch government losing its parliamentary majority.

    The monarch’s pervie second son promoting himself as “[email protected]” (boke).

    That must have been the perfect day to bury bad news (come back Jo Moore, all is forgiven). What did I miss?

  • alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    The Mail is not the Mail on Sunday. The editor was a remainer whose paper advocated remain when he ran the MOS at the time of the referendum. If you actually look at the Brexit coverage since he switched roles you will actually notice that it is the Sunday paper that has generated nearly all the extreme headlines, with the Mail itself being relatively restrained.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,912
    edited September 2019

    A cowardly Prime Minister lying to a monarch and unlawfully suspending parliamentary democracy.

    A bullying POTUS facing impeachment.

    Spain digging up the stinking corpse of Franco.

    A Prime Minister who thinks he is above the law being investigated for not being able to keep his pants on, and using taxpayers’ cash to treat his girlfriend.

    A vulnerable Swedish teenager having a very public mental breakdown, live on all global media.

    The Dutch government losing its parliamentary majority.

    The monarch’s pervie second son promoting himself as “[email protected]” (boke).

    That must have been the perfect day to bury bad news (come back Jo Moore, all is forgiven). What did I miss?

    Arron Banks finally being cleared of all electoral offences in relation to the 2016 referendum.

    NI bus manufacturer Wrightbus going into administration.

    Thomas Cook still bust, repratriation effort going well but pressure on auditors and directors over conduct in the run-up to the collapse.

    Efforts by US democrats to impeach Trump, because Joe Biden’s son did some allegedly dodgy stuff in Ukraine - or something like that.

    Our own @Tissue_Price has been selected to fight a marginal seat when the election comes about.

    Duchess of Sussex will be really upset because no-one is talking about her.
  • A cowardly Prime Minister lying to a monarch and unlawfully suspending parliamentary democracy.

    A bullying POTUS facing impeachment.

    Spain digging up the stinking corpse of Franco.

    A Prime Minister who thinks he is above the law being investigated for not being able to keep his pants on, and using taxpayers’ cash to treat his girlfriend.

    A vulnerable Swedish teenager having a very public mental breakdown, live on all global media.

    The Dutch government losing its parliamentary majority.

    The monarch’s pervie second son promoting himself as “[email protected]” (boke).

    That must have been the perfect day to bury bad news (come back Jo Moore, all is forgiven). What did I miss?

    Bet Salmond wishes his trial was underway!
  • eristdoof said:

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
    As one old enough to remember both Dick Emery and the joke, I don’t know the source..
  • How old would you need to be to get the Dick Emery reference in the Sun headline? Mid-50s, 60s?

    ....quite literally dying out. Like the Conservative and Unionist Party.
    I’ve been reading that for 40 years.....
  • Dick Emery......some of it hasn’t aged well:

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qVpS4kJ8ZOg
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 45,286

    eristdoof said:

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
    As one old enough to remember both Dick Emery and the joke, I don’t know the source..
    It’s based on the recursive acronym for an open source operating system which originated in the 1980s - “GNU’s not UNIX”.

    Unlike the deeply unfunny tabloid effort, it’s up there with the magnificent punnage of @ydoethur .
    Made me laugh.

    Or was your comment a pun too ?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Nigelb said:

    eristdoof said:

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
    As one old enough to remember both Dick Emery and the joke, I don’t know the source..
    It’s based on the recursive acronym for an open source operating system which originated in the 1980s - “GNU’s not UNIX”.

    Unlike the deeply unfunny tabloid effort, it’s up there with the magnificent punnage of @ydoethur .
    Made me laugh.

    Or was your comment a pun too ?
    It’s a gnother gnu
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,912
    edited September 2019
    eristdoof said:

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
    It’s an open source joke. ;)

    (Is this PB or Slashdot this morning?)
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 45,286
    Sandpit said:

    eristdoof said:

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
    It’s an open source joke. ;)

    (Is this PB or Slashdot this morning?)
    Strictly speaking, it’s a free joke.
    Stallman might be upset if you call it open source.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 41,912
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    eristdoof said:

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
    It’s an open source joke. ;)

    (Is this PB or Slashdot this morning?)
    Strictly speaking, it’s a free joke.
    Stallman might be upset if you call it open source.
    Fair point, and Stallman does now have rather a lot of time on his hands.
  • Sandpit said:

    eristdoof said:

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
    It’s an open source joke. ;)

    (Is this PB or Slashdot this morning?)
    I used to read Slashdot regularly fifteen to twenty years ago. Now, when I pop in every so often, it seems a little dead. ISTR there was a takeover that changed it slightly?

    And this tells me that I'm getting old - and so is t'Internet and t'web. We're seeing a second generation born of people who have lived whilst the web has existed in a popular, commercial sense. Their world growing up is massively different to the one I grew up in - and much of that is down to the web.
  • The Sun headline is weird. Just unfunny and probably completely over the heads of anyone under 40.
  • Sandpit said:

    eristdoof said:

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
    It’s an open source joke. ;)

    (Is this PB or Slashdot this morning?)
    I used to read Slashdot regularly fifteen to twenty years ago. Now, when I pop in every so often, it seems a little dead. ISTR there was a takeover that changed it slightly?

    And this tells me that I'm getting old - and so is t'Internet and t'web. We're seeing a second generation born of people who have lived whilst the web has existed in a popular, commercial sense. Their world growing up is massively different to the one I grew up in - and much of that is down to the web.
    Everyone has moved onto Reddit. r/technology and r/ProgrammingHumor have effectively superseded slashdot.
  • The Sun headline is weird. Just unfunny and probably completely over the heads of anyone under 40.

    The Dick Emery show ended in 1982 when today’s 40 year olds would have been 3 - I’d add at least a decade (and a bit) to that!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,855

    The Sun headline is weird. Just unfunny and probably completely over the heads of anyone under 40.

    The Dick Emery show ended in 1982 when today’s 40 year olds would have been 3 - I’d add at least a decade (and a bit) to that!
    Who or what was the Dick Emery show?
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    ydoethur said:

    The Sun headline is weird. Just unfunny and probably completely over the heads of anyone under 40.

    The Dick Emery show ended in 1982 when today’s 40 year olds would have been 3 - I’d add at least a decade (and a bit) to that!
    Who or what was the Dick Emery show?
    In its day it was a top show, but it became very sameish...
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 35,620
    alex. said:

    The Mail is not the Mail on Sunday. The editor was a remainer whose paper advocated remain when he ran the MOS at the time of the referendum. If you actually look at the Brexit coverage since he switched roles you will actually notice that it is the Sunday paper that has generated nearly all the extreme headlines, with the Mail itself being relatively restrained.

    The Mail's "Who Runs Britain" headline is quite a subtle dig, with echoes of Ted Heath's "Who Governs Britain?" Slogan for the Feb 1974 election. The answer of course was "Not you!".



  • The Sun headline is weird. Just unfunny and probably completely over the heads of anyone under 40.

    I am in my mid 40s and have no idea what they're on about. Mind you, since I have only limited interest in football, reality TV or tits I don't pay much attention to the Sun.
  • ydoethur said:

    The Sun headline is weird. Just unfunny and probably completely over the heads of anyone under 40.

    The Dick Emery show ended in 1982 when today’s 40 year olds would have been 3 - I’d add at least a decade (and a bit) to that!
    Who or what was the Dick Emery show?
    I've just turned 41 and I know who Dick Emery is, he's the manager of Arsenal.

    Ooh, I am awful.
  • TGOHF2 said:
    Who's going to listen to a man who didn't like Hamilton?
  • Has Harriet Harman said she should be caretaker Prime Minister because it’s time for a woman yet?
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Two ideas have led to this mistake and the team at No 10 now need to reflect on both.

    The first is that delivering the referendum result justifies almost any sort of rough move, however questionable. The second is that the cunning and gamesmanship of the No 10 team is of a higher order than anyone else’s and enables them to act with appropriate ruthlessness. A ruthlessness that eluded, say, Theresa May or others for whose intelligence or ability they have little regard.

    The Supreme Court ruling shows how unwise both ideas are.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/comment/supreme-court-ruling-this-is-a-car-crash-not-just-a-bump-in-the-road-fpnjxf635
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,465
    Scott_P said:
    Cox appears to be a patsy who will do as he is told by Johnson and clearly plenty of top legal figures thought there was a chance of success at least. Rees-Mogg seems to regard himself as the only person who knows what constitutional law is, makes up conventions to suit his desires, and by his comments is proving the lie that the government respects the judiciary and its role.

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least
  • kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Cox appears to be a patsy who will do as he is told by Johnson and clearly plenty of top legal figures thought there was a chance of success at least. Rees-Mogg seems to regard himself as the only person who knows what constitutional law is, makes up conventions to suit his desires, and by his comments is proving the lie that the government respects the judiciary and its role.

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least
    As Theresa May can attest Geoffrey Cox gives legal advice that PMs do not like, Cox is no patsy.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,465
    Scott_P said:
    Once again the view that because people disagree with the decision it means they screwed up and are fair game, meaning they admit had the government won the judges would have been fair game for the opposition, who would claim the same justification. Deeply unconvincing.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    kle4 said:

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least

    It was mentioned before the prorogation clusterfuck; which Dominic is smarter, Grieve or Cummings?

    Now we know...
  • ydoethur said:

    The Sun headline is weird. Just unfunny and probably completely over the heads of anyone under 40.

    The Dick Emery show ended in 1982 when today’s 40 year olds would have been 3 - I’d add at least a decade (and a bit) to that!
    Who or what was the Dick Emery show?
    I've just turned 41 and I know who Dick Emery is, he's the manager of Arsenal.

    Ooh, I am awful.
    Didn't Dick Emery invent some paper?
  • kle4 said:


    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least

    Whatever else the next GE night brings I shall be raising a toast to the humiliating departure of Grieve...a joy shared by millions no doubt.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 35,620
    ydoethur said:

    The Sun headline is weird. Just unfunny and probably completely over the heads of anyone under 40.

    The Dick Emery show ended in 1982 when today’s 40 year olds would have been 3 - I’d add at least a decade (and a bit) to that!
    Who or what was the Dick Emery show?
    It passed as comedy in the Seventies and early Eighties, but was blown away by alternative comedy.

    When there were only 3 channels, few video recorders, and no t'internet, people would watch any old rot. Though in those days news and current affairs were very well done. People had longer attention spans then, and channel hopping was less common without a remote control. You actually had to get off the sofa to change channel.
  • Scott_P said:
    I want him (and the government) to resign and i'm blue.

    I want Labour to submit the extension request prior to going in to a GE.

    Lab and LD's should be praying for Johnson to stay in post.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 4,556
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    eristdoof said:

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
    It’s an open source joke. ;)

    (Is this PB or Slashdot this morning?)
    Strictly speaking, it’s a free joke.
    Stallman might be upset if you call it open source.
    Heh, was about to say the same, good job I read further down the comments!

    So, are political geeks also general geeks given several of us apparently got the joke?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,465
    edited September 2019

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Cox appears to be a patsy who will do as he is told by Johnson and clearly plenty of top legal figures thought there was a chance of success at least. Rees-Mogg seems to regard himself as the only person who knows what constitutional law is, makes up conventions to suit his desires, and by his comments is proving the lie that the government respects the judiciary and its role.

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least
    As Theresa May can attest Geoffrey Cox gives legal advice that PMs do not like, Cox is no patsy.
    I said a patsy in respect of Johnson. He definitely showed he was not one to May. But Johnson keeps getting no. 10 sources to attack judges and repeatedly hints he might not follow the Benn Act, and Cox and the others mouth formulaic lines and then nod and say yes sir, thank you for the privilege of serving in your cabinet sir.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 35,620
    TGOHF2 said:
    24 April?

    If it's a misprint it shows a Labour conference bounce.

    The adage that "there is no such thing as bad publicity" is being tested to destruction by current politics.
  • kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Cox appears to be a patsy who will do as he is told by Johnson and clearly plenty of top legal figures thought there was a chance of success at least. Rees-Mogg seems to regard himself as the only person who knows what constitutional law is, makes up conventions to suit his desires, and by his comments is proving the lie that the government respects the judiciary and its role.

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least
    As Theresa May can attest Geoffrey Cox gives legal advice that PMs do not like, Cox is no patsy.
    John Major’s prorogation wouldn’t have survived this new test.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 29,179

    kle4 said:


    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least

    Whatever else the next GE night brings I shall be raising a toast to the humiliating departure of Grieve...a joy shared by millions no doubt.
    Jumping to conclusions, Captain, jumping to conclusions.
    Personally I shall await the result in US&R with interest. That is, of course, if the current Member has not been found in contempt of Parliament and excluded.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,465
    Selebian said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    eristdoof said:

    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Minor point, but if a caretaker/emergency government happens, I really hope they don't try to call it a "government of national unity". People might well think it's the least-worst option from where we are now, but nobody is going to think that it will unify the country. Like with "People's Vote", that attempt at fuzzy and warm branding just confirms that they doth protest too much.

    Undoubtedly. The abuse of the word 'unity' in recent times has been nothing short of shameless. The term itself is fine, but in this situation let us not pretend it is about national unity, it would be so divorced from reality it just draws parallels with the absurd names of various juntas about the 'Committe to restore democracy and national harmony' or some such bollocks, and it would be unfair on such a government to allow such an easy comparison based on the name.

    Transitional government perhaps.
    GNU stands for GNU's Not Unity
    I reckon fewer PBers will know the source behind this joke than for the Dick Emery joke.
    It’s an open source joke. ;)

    (Is this PB or Slashdot this morning?)
    Strictly speaking, it’s a free joke.
    Stallman might be upset if you call it open source.
    Heh, was about to say the same, good job I read further down the comments!

    So, are political geeks also general geeks given several of us apparently got the joke?
    In my experience people who are geeky in one aspect are highly likely to be geeky in another. Sci/fi and fantasy fans are likely to be over represented too.
  • TGOHF2TGOHF2 Posts: 584

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Cox appears to be a patsy who will do as he is told by Johnson and clearly plenty of top legal figures thought there was a chance of success at least. Rees-Mogg seems to regard himself as the only person who knows what constitutional law is, makes up conventions to suit his desires, and by his comments is proving the lie that the government respects the judiciary and its role.

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least
    As Theresa May can attest Geoffrey Cox gives legal advice that PMs do not like, Cox is no patsy.
    John Major’s prorogation wouldn’t have survived this new test.
    Yes it would - he’s a remainer.
  • Good morning, everyone.

    Beckett is one of the idiots who put Corbyn on the short list.

    But it'd be nice of Conservative MPs to provide the nation with its first female Labour PM :p
  • FregglesFreggles Posts: 3,484
    Foxy said:

    TGOHF2 said:
    24 April?

    If it's a misprint it shows a Labour conference bounce.

    The adage that "there is no such thing as bad publicity" is being tested to destruction by current politics.
    It should say September. BXP not anywhere near that in April
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 45,286
    Foxy said:



    ydoethur said:

    The Sun headline is weird. Just unfunny and probably completely over the heads of anyone under 40.

    The Dick Emery show ended in 1982 when today’s 40 year olds would have been 3 - I’d add at least a decade (and a bit) to that!
    Who or what was the Dick Emery show?
    It passed as comedy in the Seventies and early Eighties, but was blown away by alternative comedy.

    When there were only 3 channels, few video recorders, and no t'internet, people would watch any old rot. Though in those days news and current affairs were very well done. People had longer attention spans then, and channel hopping was less common without a remote control. You actually had to get off the sofa to change channel.
    Merely part of the overlong and glorious tradition of unfunny BBC comedy.

    I hadn’t realised he was born during the First World War (!)
  • Foxy said:

    TGOHF2 said:
    24 April?

    If it's a misprint it shows a Labour conference bounce.

    The adage that "there is no such thing as bad publicity" is being tested to destruction by current politics.
    The nearest ComRes poll to 24 Apr was on 16 Apr and had Labour leading the Tories by 33% - 23%, with the Brexit Party third on 14%, some outfit called ChangeUK on 9% and the Lib Dems languishing in fifth on 7%.

    Some minor changes since then.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,465
    TGOHF2 said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Cox appears to be a patsy who will do as he is told by Johnson and clearly plenty of top legal figures thought there was a chance of success at least. Rees-Mogg seems to regard himself as the only person who knows what constitutional law is, makes up conventions to suit his desires, and by his comments is proving the lie that the government respects the judiciary and its role.

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least
    As Theresa May can attest Geoffrey Cox gives legal advice that PMs do not like, Cox is no patsy.
    John Major’s prorogation wouldn’t have survived this new test.
    Yes it would - he’s a remainer.
    Ah, so every member of the supreme court is a remainer? Even the A50 case dissenters? That seems totally likely and not a lazy comfort blanket.
  • TGOHF2TGOHF2 Posts: 584
    Foxy said:

    TGOHF2 said:
    24 April?

    If it's a misprint it shows a Labour conference bounce.

    The adage that "there is no such thing as bad publicity" is being tested to destruction by current politics.

    Typo by Britain Elects - should be 24/Sep
  • Scott_P said:
    I wouldn't trust anything from ComRes except the voting share leads, since they've been letting their customers play a lot of shady Sir-Humphrey-style games with subsidiary questions.

    I'm not entirely sure you can trust the voting share leads either, but definitely don't trust the subsidiaries unless you've read the whole thing.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,465
    Foxy said:

    TGOHF2 said:
    24 April?

    If it's a misprint it shows a Labour conference bounce.

    The adage that "there is no such thing as bad publicity" is being tested to destruction by current politics.
    And more to the point shows that BXP will kill Brexit as they still are not getting behind the only party that will deliver it if they get a majority.
  • CaptainBuzzkillCaptainBuzzkill Posts: 335
    edited September 2019
    Scott_P said:

    From polling it would seem that a majority of the public support the establishment being taken on as they continue their efforts to stop Brexit.

    It may be a simplistic view but it does seem to be one shared by more than those on the other side who refuse to accept that the actions of remainers have created the ruptures in our democratic institutions and processes.

    You only need to ask yourself would this be happening if remainers had supported May's deal...and the answer of course is no.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 17,461
    Quentin Letts is an anti semite. A real one. His prejudices should be ignored
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 35,620
    edited September 2019

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Cox appears to be a patsy who will do as he is told by Johnson and clearly plenty of top legal figures thought there was a chance of success at least. Rees-Mogg seems to regard himself as the only person who knows what constitutional law is, makes up conventions to suit his desires, and by his comments is proving the lie that the government respects the judiciary and its role.

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least
    As Theresa May can attest Geoffrey Cox gives legal advice that PMs do not like, Cox is no patsy.
    John Major’s prorogation wouldn’t have survived this new test.
    Wouldn't it?

    Major wanted a longer GE campaign, thinking that he could regain some ground against New Labour. He may have been right.

    It was in the context of a GE, not a mechanism to prevent parliamentary scrutiny of a minority government amidst the biggest political crisis of the post war period.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,855

    You only need to ask yourself would this be happening if remainers had supported May's deal...and the answer of course is no.

    Is that an admission that Mogg, Baker, Francois and Cox are all remainers?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 45,286

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Cox appears to be a patsy who will do as he is told by Johnson and clearly plenty of top legal figures thought there was a chance of success at least. Rees-Mogg seems to regard himself as the only person who knows what constitutional law is, makes up conventions to suit his desires, and by his comments is proving the lie that the government respects the judiciary and its role.

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least
    As Theresa May can attest Geoffrey Cox gives legal advice that PMs do not like, Cox is no patsy.
    John Major’s prorogation wouldn’t have survived this new test.
    We discussed this yesterday - it almost certainly would.

    Though deeply objectionable, and worth scrutiny, it’s actual effect would very probably not have been of sufficient significance to meet the test of significance (the court’s test isn’t a single one, but imposes several hurdles before any remedy might be considered).

    And in any event, there would have been no appropriate remedy.

    The 1948 Attlee prorogation is more interesting. I think it likely would have passed scrutiny, but others don’t.
    The fact that only two prorogations in the past seventy years might even possibly have faced a challenge emphasises the court’s point about exceptional circumstances.
  • kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Cox appears to be a patsy who will do as he is told by Johnson and clearly plenty of top legal figures thought there was a chance of success at least. Rees-Mogg seems to regard himself as the only person who knows what constitutional law is, makes up conventions to suit his desires, and by his comments is proving the lie that the government respects the judiciary and its role.

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least
    As Theresa May can attest Geoffrey Cox gives legal advice that PMs do not like, Cox is no patsy.
    John Major’s prorogation wouldn’t have survived this new test.
    Which shows how good the Supremes decision is.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 17,461
    Scott_P said:
    A good old fashioned front page.

    And the most powerful of them all
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 35,620

    Scott_P said:

    From polling it would seem that a majority of the public support the establishment being taken on as they continue their efforts to stop Brexit.

    It may be a simplistic view but it does seem to be one shared by more than those on the other side who refuse to accept that the actions of remainers have created the ruptures in our democratic institutions and processes.

    You only need to ask yourself would this be happening if remainers had supported May's deal...and the answer of course is no.
    It is not the role of Civil Service and Judicary to be popular.
  • The 27% for the Conservatives in this latest ComRes is their lowest share in any poll since the 25% in a YouGov poll back when Johnson became leader. Unsurprisingly then, the 17% for the Brexit Party is the equal highest share since the same poll.

    Maybe Farage called this one right compared to the twitter trolls?
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    edited September 2019

    kle4 said:

    Scott_P said:
    Cox appears to be a patsy who will do as he is told by Johnson and clearly plenty of top legal figures thought there was a chance of success at least. Rees-Mogg seems to regard himself as the only person who knows what constitutional law is, makes up conventions to suit his desires, and by his comments is proving the lie that the government respects the judiciary and its role.

    Grieve is an arse but on this hes probably right, and unlike Rees-Mogg his success rate shows he has brains at least
    As Theresa May can attest Geoffrey Cox gives legal advice that PMs do not like, Cox is no patsy.
    John Major’s prorogation wouldn’t have survived this new test.
    No one would have gone to the effort of bringing a court case.
  • eekeek Posts: 21,819
    ydoethur said:

    You only need to ask yourself would this be happening if remainers had supported May's deal...and the answer of course is no.

    Is that an admission that Mogg, Baker, Francois and Cox are all remainers?
    Well Mogg and Baker have always voted against the only deal to leave the EU.
  • eekeek Posts: 21,819

    Good morning, everyone.

    Beckett is one of the idiots who put Corbyn on the short list.

    But it'd be nice of Conservative MPs to provide the nation with its first female Labour PM :p

    It's because Beckett put Corbyn on the shortlist that she is the likeliest option (a moderate who Corbyn doesn't dislike).
  • My main recollection of Dick Emery was that he had a very complicated love life.
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 4,426

    ydoethur said:

    The Sun headline is weird. Just unfunny and probably completely over the heads of anyone under 40.

    The Dick Emery show ended in 1982 when today’s 40 year olds would have been 3 - I’d add at least a decade (and a bit) to that!
    Who or what was the Dick Emery show?
    I've just turned 41 and I know who Dick Emery is, he's the manager of Arsenal.

    Ooh, I am awful.
    Didn't Dick Emery invent some paper?
    That sounds very painful :wink: (and this joke is about the same quality as most of Emery's material).
  • Just to point out again, I tipped Margaret Beckett in a thread header a month ago.
  • Foxy said:


    It is not the role of Civil Service and Judicary to be popular.

    Would you like to point to where I said it was their role?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,465
    Scott_P said:
    The easy retort will be that he would never be in that position, but in any case the problem for the party and the country is not really Boris.

    His choices are affecting the specific events that are occurring, but for the tories the problem is they will not win an election without brexiting and cannot Brexit without an election.

    Boris is considered the best chance to prevent the former, but his success rate overcoming remainers is not looking good. Either way him going doesnt seem as though it will help them much.

    For the country the problem is theres no grouping with sufficient support to run the country and it looks like no election will be permitted to try to change that for several months. Again, Boris going doesnt change thst much.
  • Just to point out again, I tipped Margaret Beckett in a thread header a month ago.

    And I will be celebrating with you if you are proved right.

    Unlike Corbyn and Labour who will be searching for the whisky and mess revolver.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 16,467
    edited September 2019

    Just to point out again, I tipped Margaret Beckett in a thread header a month ago.

    Is there any evidence that Corbyn will go for this? If you're an extremely shit party leader, it seems dangerous to let your party put up a reasonably OK Prime Minister.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 35,620
    edited September 2019

    My main recollection of Dick Emery was that he had a very complicated love life.

    He was Trans before it was fashionable?
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 18,591

    Just to point out again, I tipped Margaret Beckett in a thread header a month ago.

    You’re almost as modest as @TheScreamingEagles !
  • kle4 said:


    For the country the problem is theres no grouping with sufficient support to run the country and it looks like no election will be permitted to try to change that for several months. Again, Boris going doesnt change thst much.

    If the government resigns the only acceptable replacement would be one whose only purpose would be to extend and then call a GE.

  • Just to point out again, I tipped Margaret Beckett in a thread header a month ago.

    You’re almost as modest as @TheScreamingEagles !
    No point hiding your light under a bushel. Lord knows I get it wrong often enough.
  • Jezbollah is going on the Today programme? On the Biased Broadcasting Company?

    As there's nothing happening today he'll probably attack the lies and toxic actions of a Prime Minister who should have resigned a long time ago. Tony Blair. Only by attacking the evil Tory Blair can Labour persuade middle ground punters that True Socialism is nearly here, and thus win a glorious 704 seat (Jennie Formby is counting the votes) majority at the election
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,855

    Just to point out again, I tipped Margaret Beckett in a thread header a month ago.

    Is there any evidence that Corbyn will go for this? If you're an extremely shit party leader, it seems dangerous to let your party to put up a reasonably OK Prime Minister.
    Well, yes. That's why Margaret Beckett seems likelier than Ken Clarke.
  • alex.alex. Posts: 4,658

    Just to point out again, I tipped Margaret Beckett in a thread header a month ago.

    Is there any evidence that Corbyn will go for this? If you're an extremely shit party leader, it seems dangerous to let your party to put up a reasonably OK Prime Minister.
    I’m not sure what Margaret Beckett has ever demonstrated to suggest justification for the latter prediction.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 54,855

    Just to point out again, I tipped Margaret Beckett in a thread header a month ago.

    You’re almost as modest as @TheScreamingEagles !
    No point hiding your light under a bushel. Lord knows I get it wrong often enough.
    I think it's fair to say your predictions for this year will probably not quite match events.

    But even Nostradamus would have given up on this one.
  • ydoethur said:

    Just to point out again, I tipped Margaret Beckett in a thread header a month ago.

    Is there any evidence that Corbyn will go for this? If you're an extremely shit party leader, it seems dangerous to let your party to put up a reasonably OK Prime Minister.
    Well, yes. That's why Margaret Beckett seems likelier than Ken Clarke.
    Ken Clarke is much better, because there's no risk that he will take over as de-facto leader of the Labour Party.

    (OK, shit is getting weird, there's *some* risk of that happening, but not much.)
  • ydoethur said:

    Just to point out again, I tipped Margaret Beckett in a thread header a month ago.

    You’re almost as modest as @TheScreamingEagles !
    No point hiding your light under a bushel. Lord knows I get it wrong often enough.
    I think it's fair to say your predictions for this year will probably not quite match events.

    But even Nostradamus would have given up on this one.
    My year end predictions have held up a lot better than I expected when I made them. The main mistake I made was not appreciating just how far the can could be kicked.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 35,620

    kle4 said:


    For the country the problem is theres no grouping with sufficient support to run the country and it looks like no election will be permitted to try to change that for several months. Again, Boris going doesnt change thst much.

    If the government resigns the only acceptable replacement would be one whose only purpose would be to extend and then call a GE.

    The last GE showed the British electorate didn't want a government that could ram through partisan policies. The Tories tried to anyway, which is why we are watching a government collapsing.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 81,465

    kle4 said:


    For the country the problem is theres no grouping with sufficient support to run the country and it looks like no election will be permitted to try to change that for several months. Again, Boris going doesnt change thst much.

    If the government resigns the only acceptable replacement would be one whose only purpose would be to extend and then call a GE.

    I honestly cannot see another move for Johnson unless the EU for some reason decide to cave in, and by his own logic it wont because parliament has taken no deal off the table.

    He cannot stop the Commons doing whatever it wants anymore, he cannot take action other than resignation. But that's such a nuclear option.

    Seriously, what can he try next? He and the Tories will be petrified of that BXP rating, even attacking the judges is not getting the share down, what more can he do?
This discussion has been closed.