Look at JRM, he has a hedge fund that has been invested in non-sterling assets that will rise in value as sterling falls. The paradox with JRM is he is betting against Britain and has been incorporated into a cabinet run by a PM who said he wanted "those who bet against Britain to lose their shirts". After making this comment Johnson then appoints a man who bets against Britain to his cabinet FFS! Where were the opposition when this happened? Its not like nobody knows about JRM and the hedge fund....
Anybody with any semblance of a balanced portfolio will be invested in non-sterling assets along with UK exposure.
Using this as an argument against JRM is a stretch at best but may be useful for more low information types looking to have prejudices reinforced.
Well of course anyone who can has their assets safe, or hedgd in foreign currency. Certainly I have done so.
Indeed, there is the risk of loss if Brexit doesn't go through...
So what's the problem?
People who earn in sterling and spend in sterling are fine. People who earn abroad are fine. People who have diversified are fine.
Well, we will see how those who earn less and cannot hedge get on.
The great irony is that Remainers are much better protected.
Remainers tend to be better off and have done well / feel more secure with the status quo of being within the EU for the last near 50 years. It is an illusion as the EU is changing and we don't know whether ever closer union will result in stability or instability.
Yes, hard to see any obvious Brexit benefits for the folk of the Welsh valleys or Hartlepool though. Brexit is just the new politics of envy.
They will be able to elect and eject, democratically, those who make the laws that govern them. Remainers = affluent Tory snobs of the 19th century who resisted universal suffrage.
This is a totally stupid comparison. It is like remainers complaining that Brexiteers are fascists. It isn't funny. It is just annoying. Please stop it.
It clearly worked and it clearly stung because it is clearly true. Oh so many Remainers would love to restrict the franchise to those with property, education, and status = Remainers. They’ve said it time and again. It is time to take them - you - at their word.
That's me disenfranchised on 2 out of the 3 then. You?
As for decent form recent first class innings read 7, 8, 7, 60, 0, 40, 12, 30, 62, 2, 57. That's not 'decent form.' This season he averages 30 with a high score of 69.
Like pretty much the whole Surrey side, he's had a season disrupted by injury and a loss of form. Sam Curran is batting well, though.
Look at JRM, he has a hedge fund that has been invested in non-sterling assets that will rise in value as sterling falls. The paradox with JRM is he is betting against Britain and has been incorporated into a cabinet run by a PM who said he wanted "those who bet against Britain to lose their shirts". After making this comment Johnson then appoints a man who bets against Britain to his cabinet FFS! Where were the opposition when this happened? Its not like nobody knows about JRM and the hedge fund....
Anybody with any semblance of a balanced portfolio will be invested in non-sterling assets along with UK exposure.
Using this as an argument against JRM is a stretch at best but may be useful for more low information types looking to have prejudices reinforced.
Well of course anyone who can has their assets safe, or hedgd in foreign currency. Certainly I have done so.
Indeed, there is the risk of loss if Brexit doesn't go through...
So what's the problem?
People who earn in sterling and spend in sterling are fine. People who earn abroad are fine. People who have diversified are fine.
Well, we will see how those who earn less and cannot hedge get on.
The great irony is that Remainers are much better protected.
Remainers tend to be better off and have done well / feel more secure with the status quo of being within the EU for the last near 50 years. It is an illusion as the EU is changing and we don't know whether ever closer union will result in stability or instability.
Yes, hard to see any obvious Brexit benefits for the folk of the Welsh valleys or Hartlepool though. Brexit is just the new politics of envy.
They will be able to elect and eject, democratically, those who make the laws that govern them. Remainers = affluent Tory snobs of the 19th century who resisted universal suffrage.
This is a totally stupid comparison. It is like remainers complaining that Brexiteers are fascists. It isn't funny. It is just annoying. Please stop it.
It clearly worked and it clearly stung because it is clearly true. Oh so many Remainers would love to restrict the franchise to those with property, education, and status = Remainers. They’ve said it time and again. It is time to take them - you - at their word.
Look at JRM, he has a hedge fund that has been invested in non-sterling assets that will rise in value as sterling falls. The paradox with JRM is he is betting against Britain and has been incorporated into a cabinet run by a PM who said he wanted "those who bet against Britain to lose their shirts". After making this comment Johnson then appoints a man who bets against Britain to his cabinet FFS! Where were the opposition when this happened? Its not like nobody knows about JRM and the hedge fund....
Anybody with any semblance of a balanced portfolio will be invested in non-sterling assets along with UK exposure.
Using this as an argument against JRM is a stretch at best but may be useful for more low information types looking to have prejudices reinforced.
Well of course anyone who can has their assets safe, or hedgd in foreign currency. Certainly I have done so.
Indeed, there is the risk of loss if Brexit doesn't go through...
So what's the problem?
People who earn in sterling and spend in sterling are fine. People who earn abroad are fine. People who have diversified are fine.
Well, we will see how those who earn less and cannot hedge get on.
The great irony is that Remainers are much better protected.
Remainers tend to be better off and have done well / feel more secure with the status quo of being within the EU for the last near 50 years. It is an illusion as the EU is changing and we don't know whether ever closer union will result in stability or instability.
Yes, hard to see any obvious Brexit benefits for the folk of the Welsh valleys or Hartlepool though. Brexit is just the new politics of envy.
They will be able to elect and eject, democratically, those who make the laws that govern them. Remainers = affluent Tory snobs of the 19th century who resisted universal suffrage.
This is a totally stupid comparison. It is like remainers complaining that Brexiteers are fascists. It isn't funny. It is just annoying. Please stop it.
It clearly worked and it clearly stung because it is clearly true. Oh so many Remainers would love to restrict the franchise to those with property, education, and status = Remainers. They’ve said it time and again. It is time to take them - you - at their word.
How about the employees of the Sun, Mail, Express, Telegraph, Times, Spectator and other purveyors of professional bollocks?
Look at JRM, he has a hedge fund that has been invested in non-sterling assets that will rise in value as sterling falls. The paradox with JRM is he is betting against Britain and has been incorporated into a cabinet run by a PM who said he wanted "those who bet against Britain to lose their shirts". After making this comment Johnson then appoints a man who bets against Britain to his cabinet FFS! Where were the opposition when this happened? Its not like nobody knows about JRM and the hedge fund....
Anybody with any semblance of a balanced portfolio will be invested in non-sterling assets along with UK exposure.
Using this as an argument against JRM is a stretch at best but may be useful for more low information types looking to have prejudices reinforced.
Well of course anyone who can has their assets safe, or hedgd in foreign currency. Certainly I have done so.
Indeed, there is the risk of loss if Brexit doesn't go through...
So what's the problem?
People who earn in sterling and spend in sterling are fine. People who earn abroad are fine. People who have diversified are fine.
Well, we will see how those who earn less and cannot hedge get on.
The great irony is that Remainers are much better protected.
Remainers tend to be better off and have done well / feel more secure with the status quo of being within the EU for the last near 50 years. It is an illusion as the EU is changing and we don't know whether ever closer union will result in stability or instability.
Yes, hard to see any obvious Brexit benefits for the folk of the Welsh valleys or Hartlepool though. Brexit is just the new politics of envy.
They will be able to elect and eject, democratically, those who make the laws that govern them. Remainers = affluent Tory snobs of the 19th century who resisted universal suffrage.
This is a totally stupid comparison. It is like remainers complaining that Brexiteers are fascists. It isn't funny. It is just annoying. Please stop it.
It clearly worked and it clearly stung because it is clearly true. Oh so many Remainers would love to restrict the franchise to those with property, education, and status = Remainers. They’ve said it time and again. It is time to take them - you - at their word.
I'll just leave that there and say nothing, absolutely nothing. Not going to make a response. No, siree. Can't possibly think of a response, nope, nothing...
Look at JRM, he has a hedge fund that has been invested in non-sterling assets that will rise in value as sterling falls. The paradox with JRM is he is betting against Britain and has been incorporated into a cabinet run by a PM who said he wanted "those who bet against Britain to lose their shirts". After making this comment Johnson then appoints a man who bets against Britain to his cabinet FFS! Where were the opposition when this happened? Its not like nobody knows about JRM and the hedge fund....
Anybody with any semblance of a
Well of course anyone who can has their assets safe, or hedgd in foreign currency. Certainly I have done so.
Indeed, there is the risk of loss if Brexit doesn't go through...
So what's the problem?
People who earn in sterling and spend in sterling are fine. People who earn abroad are fine. People who have diversified are fine.
Well, we will see how those who earn less and cannot hedge get on.
The great irony is that Remainers are much better protected.
Remainers tend to be better off and have done well / feel more secure with the status quo of being within the EU for the last near 50 years. It is an illusion as the EU is changing and we don't know whether ever closer union will result in stability or instability.
Yes, hard to see any obvious Brexit benefits for the folk of the Welsh valleys or Hartlepool though. Brexit is just the new politics of envy.
They will be able to elect and eject, democratically, those who make the laws that govern them. Remainers = affluent Tory snobs of the 19th century who resisted universal suffrage.
This is a totally stupid comparison. It is like remainers complaining that Brexiteers are fascists. It isn't funny. It is just annoying. Please stop it.
It clearly worked and it clearly stung because it is clearly true. Oh so many Remainers would love to restrict the franchise to those with property, education, and status = Remainers. They’ve said it time and again. It is time to take them - you - at their word.
How about the employees of the Sun, Mail, Express, Telegraph, Times, Spectator and other purveyors of professional bollocks?
Or those horny handed sons of honest toil, Bozo, Jacob, Nigel, Aaron and their little imp Dominic?
Look at JRM, he has a hedge fund that has been invested in aradox with JRM is he is betting against Britain and has been incorporated into a cabinet run by a PM who said he wanted "those who bet against Britain to lose their shirts". After making this comment Johnson then appoints a man who bets against Britain to his cabinet FFS! Where were the opposition when this happened? Its not like nobody knows about JRM and the hedge fund....
Anybody with any semblance of a balanced portfolio will be invested in non-sterling assets along with UK exposure.
Using this as an argument against JRM is a stretch at best but may be useful for more low information types looking to have prejudices reinforced.
Well of course anyone who can has their assets safe, or hedgd in foreign currency. Certainly I have done so.
Indeed, there is the risk of loss if Brexit doesn't go through...
So what's the problem?
People who earn in sterling and spend in sterling are fine. People who earn abroad are fine. People who have diversified are fine.
Well, we will see how those who earn less and cannot hedge get on.
The great irony is that Remainers are much better protected.
Remainers tend to be better off and have done well / feel more secure with the status quo of being within the EU for the last near 50 years. It is an illusion as the EU is changing and we don't know whether ever closer union will result in stability or instability.
Yes, hard to see any obvious Brexit benefits for the folk of the Welsh valleys or Hartlepool though. Brexit is just the new politics of envy.
They will be able to elect and eject, democratically, those who make the laws that govern them. Remainers = affluent Tory snobs of the 19th century who resisted universal suffrage.
This is a totally stupid comparison. It is like remainers complaining that Brexiteers are fascists. It isn't funny. It is just annoying. Please stop it.
It clearly worked and it clearly stung because it is clearly true. Oh so many Remainers would love to restrict the franchise to those with property, education, and status = Remainers. They’ve said it time and again. It is time to take them - you - at their word.
Fintan O'Toole had an excellent point on this when reviewing Rod Liddle's latest culture-war screed on Brexit. He pointed out that, if a reader paused for a second amongst all his newly zealous invective about remainers sneering at the working-class, he would notice that Rod Liddle's last london media and publishing world smash before his embrace of Brexit was about "fat, idiotic chavs".
A perfect, succinct metaphor for many of the comfortable london jornalists, and entire news organisations, now newly posing as tribunes of the people.
It sticks in the craw when lifelong highly skilled construction workers like my Dad are disparaged by arsewipe City wankers as doing a job "anyone can do". But it really is galling when the selfsame people try to portray him, the child of a miner and a mill worker in post war Wigan, who left school at 14, as a fucking, snobbish elitist just cos he proudly and unashamedly voted, campaigned and still insists, on his 79th birthday, we should Remain.
It sticks in the craw when lifelong highly skilled construction workers like my Dad are disparaged by arsewipe City wankers as doing a job "anyone can do". But it really is galling when the selfsame people try to portray him, the child of a miner and a mill worker in post war Wigan, who left school at 14, as a fucking, snobbish elitist just cos he proudly and unashamedly voted, campaigned and still insists we should Remain.
It sticks in the craw when lifelong highly skilled construction workers like my Dad are disparaged by arsewipe City wankers as doing a job "anyone can do". But it really is galling when the selfsame people try to portray him, the child of a miner and a mill worker in post war Wigan, who left school at 14, as a fucking, snobbish elitist just cos he proudly and unashamedly voted, campaigned and still insists we should Remain.
I adore sleb goss. (So kill me ). The best one isn't Perez Hilton or Popbitch, it's AGC Blind Items. In the Noughties it was great: who's gay, who's having an affair, who's an alcoholic or on drugs. But over the past three-four years it's gotten dark: who's a pedo, who's the wifebeater, who's the murderer, who's in the sex ring, which child star gave up acting or died young because of abuse, and so on. It's still compulsive but it's a bit chilling...
Anyhoo, If you go thru the archives, Prince Andrew does pop up occasionally...
The scale of the existential threat from climate change, other environmental deterioration, WMDs and AI means that we have to transition to a very closely cooperating or unitary system of governance pretty quickly, or face a major wipe-out.
It sticks in the craw when lifelong highly skilled construction workers like my Dad are disparaged by arsewipe City wankers as doing a job "anyone can do". But it really is galling when the selfsame people try to portray him, the child of a miner and a mill worker in post war Wigan, who left school at 14, as a fucking, snobbish elitist just cos he proudly and unashamedly voted, campaigned and still insists we should Remain.
It sticks in the craw when lifelong highly skilled construction workers like my Dad are disparaged by arsewipe City wankers as doing a job "anyone can do". But it really is galling when the selfsame people try to portray him, the child of a miner and a mill worker in post war Wigan, who left school at 14, as a fucking, snobbish elitist just cos he proudly and unashamedly voted, campaigned and still insists we should Remain.
Everything, because whatever anecdote you bring out about your father being a working class Remainer most Remainers are both richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter
On skim-reading that piece, it is a bit of a non-denial denial of a different allegation (and which might depend on different meanings of under-age here and in America) but if the tabloids are not running with it, there is probably not much red meat there, though of course more could emerge later.
I adore sleb goss. (So kill me ). The best one isn't Perez Hilton or Popbitch, it's AGC Blind Items. In the Noughties it was great: who's gay, who's having an affair, who's an alcoholic or on drugs. But over the past three-four years it's gotten dark: who's a pedo, who's the wifebeater, who's the murderer, who's in the sex ring, which child star gave up acting or died young because of abuse, and so on. It's still compulsive but it's a bit chilling...
Anyhoo, If you go thru the archives, Prince Andrew does pop up occasionally...
It sticks in the craw when lifelong highly skilled construction workers like my Dad are disparaged by arsewipe City wankers as doing a job "anyone can do". But it really is galling when the selfsame people try to portray him, the child of a miner and a mill worker in post war Wigan, who left school at 14, as a fucking, snobbish elitist just cos he proudly and unashamedly voted, campaigned and still insists we should Remain.
Everything, because whatever anecdote you bring out about your father being a working class Remainer most Remainers are both richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter
"some", "many", "most"...
I can believe that "some" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter. I can believe that "many" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter. But for "..."most" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter..." I'll need numbers, and your definition of "average"
It sticks in the craw when lifelong highly skilled construction workers like my Dad are disparaged by arsewipe City wankers as doing a job "anyone can do". But it really is galling when the selfsame people try to portray him, the child of a miner and a mill worker in post war Wigan, who left school at 14, as a fucking, snobbish elitist just cos he proudly and unashamedly voted, campaigned and still insists we should Remain.
Everything, because whatever anecdote you bring out about your father being a working class Remainer most Remainers are both richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter
"some", "many", "most"...
I can believe that "some" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter. I can believe that "many" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter. But for "..."most" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter..." I'll need numbers, and your definition of "average"
I seem to remember it was education that was most strongly correlated with the Remain/ rather than Leave vote, rather than wealth.
Wealth has a certain correlation with education but not such a straightforward one as to say they're interchangeable.
It sticks in the craw when lifelong highly skilled construction workers like my Dad are disparaged by arsewipe City wankers as doing a job "anyone can do". But it really is galling when the selfsame people try to portray him, the child of a miner and a mill worker in post war Wigan, who left school at 14, as a fucking, snobbish elitist just cos he proudly and unashamedly voted, campaigned and still insists we should Remain.
Everything, because whatever anecdote you bring out about your father being a working class Remainer most Remainers are both richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter
"some", "many", "most"...
I can believe that "some" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter. I can believe that "many" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter. But for "..."most" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter..." I'll need numbers, and your definition of "average"
Not difficult, upper middle class ABs (the most educated and skilled workers) voted 59% Remain only 41% Leave and as I posted earlier finance workers in the City of London (amongst the richest in the country) voted 67% Remain and only 25% Leave.
The scale of the existential threat from climate change, other environmental deterioration, WMDs and AI means that we have to transition to a very closely cooperating or unitary system of governance pretty quickly, or face a major wipe-out.
The scale of the existential threat from climate change, other environmental deterioration, WMDs and AI means that we have to transition to a very closely cooperating or unitary system of governance pretty quickly, or face a major wipe-out.
I have a lot of sympathy with this. However I’m not sure how it tallies with elitist and anti-democratic institutions like the EU. If humanity is to make a step-change in how it lives, it needs the consent of the governed, and the masses. The people. The EU is designed to avoid the will of the people
The scale of the existential threat from climate change, other environmental deterioration, WMDs and AI means that we have to transition to a very closely cooperating or unitary system of governance pretty quickly, or face a major wipe-out.
That is what the UN is for and even post Brexit we will still be in the UN and the Security Council
I have a lot of sympathy with this. However I’m not sure how it tallies with elitist and anti-democratic institutions like the EU. If humanity is to make a step-change in how it lives, it needs the consent of the governed, and the masses. The people. The EU is designed to avoid the will of the people
I think the EU is a pretty decent first step in this process. It provides a consistent institutional framework, and defends an international rules-based system on a cooperative and egalitarian basis. Obviously it fails on this basis too when it lets larger countries bend the rules a bit more than others, but that's politics for you. It's certainly the only defence against unfettered corporate power.
As you say, the consent of the governed is vital. There aren't many simple solutions here.
Not difficult, upper middle class ABs (the most educated and skilled workers) voted 59% Remain only 41% Leave and as I posted earlier finance workers in the City of London (amongst the richest in the country) voted 67% Remain and only 25% Leave.
Yet the country voted 52% Leave and only 48% Remain
No, that's not how percentages work. Let's take your figures and have a play. So: AB's: 59% Remain, 41% Leave and finance workers: 67% Remain, 25% Leave.
Fair enough. entirely believable. But all this tells me me is most AB's voted Remain and most Finance workers voted Remain. That's not enough. There are three points that I need to make here[1]
* 1) "Most AB's voted Remain" is not the same as "most Remainers were ABs". * 2) Similarly "Most AB's voted Remain" is not the same as "most Remainers had a higher salary than the average Leaver". * 3) You have to remember that 30% of A plus 20% of B plus 10% of C does not necessarily equal 60% of (A+B+C)
The best I can get for an estimate for the size of the ABs is 22.17%[3] of the 26,993,600[2] HRPs (household reference person, ie 1 per household), which is 5,984,481 people: call it six million. So from your figures, 59% of them voted Remain - about 3.5 million - and 41% voted Leave - about 2.5 million.
But you haven't told me anything about the other 14.9 million Leave voters (17.4 minus 2.5) nor the other 12.6 million Remain voters (16.1 minus 3.5). And until you do, you can't conclude that "most Remainers have a larger salary than the average Leave voter"
This is why I keep insisting on absolute numbers and thresholds as well as percentages. You can't automatically get from one to the other. I'm not telling you that you're wrong - I genuinely don't know if you are. But you need more info to make that conclusion, the percentages are not enough by themselves.
Apologies if any of my sums are wrong: it's 1:57am...
These are uplifting figs but still circa 50% think its Right or DK. You have to ask why given that the economics of the Brexit ...deteriorates just about everything that moves( i.e. measurable) be it our currency, prices, exports, investments, capital, services, funds/investment trusts/pension pots, departing companies, manufacturing, and retail and property prices and soon jobs...
I will tell you why Brexit discourse triumphs because our opposition leaders are weak, ineffectual, lack oratory , cannot reach the Brexit Voters and say 'Holy Sh*t guys they have sold you a whopper which is going to make your country & families poorer'. The leaders of Green, Change, Lib-Dems, Plaid, SNP are individually nice people but they need to use more slogans, get in the gutter, fight hard. The Remain side are too fractured, fragmented, too cerebral, too dis-organised as the Brexit elite work together, dominate the airwaves and create the story its 'Remain Politicians Vs the People' . The Remain groups and Parties need to copy the Brexit Elite. Meanwhile experienced Labour figures need to forget Corbyn the Feeble and join with Remain groups to forge not just Westminster groups but ways to reach regional Brexit voters with slogans of truth.
Not difficult, upper middle class ABs (the most educated and skilled workers) voted 59% Remain only 41% Leave and as I posted earlier finance workers in the City of London (amongst the richest in the country) voted 67% Remain and only 25% Leave.
Yet the country voted 52% Leave and only 48% Remain
No, that's not how percentages work. Let's take your figures and have a play. So: AB's: 59% Remain, 41% Leave and finance workers: 67% Remain, 25% Leave.
Fair enough. entirely believable. But all this tells me me is most AB's voted Remain and most Finance workers voted Remain. That's not enough. There are three points that I need to make here[1]
* 1) "Most AB's voted Remain" is not the same as "most Remainers were ABs". * 2) Similarly "Most AB's voted Remain" is not the same as "most Remainers had a higher salary than the average Leaver". * 3) You have to remember that 30% of A plus 20% of B plus 10% of C does not necessarily equal 60% of (A+B+C)
The best I can get for an estimate for the size of the ABs is 22.17%[3] of the 26,993,600[2] HRPs (household reference person, ie 1 per household), which is 5,984,481 people: call it six million. So from your figures, 59% of them voted Remain - about 3.5 million - and 41% voted Leave - about 2.5 million.
But you haven't told me anything about the other 14.9 million Leave voters (17.4 minus 2.5) nor the other 12.6 million Remain voters (16.1 minus 3.5). And until you do, you can't conclude that "most Remainers have a larger salary than the average Leave voter"
This is why I keep insisting on absolute numbers and thresholds as well as percentages. You can't automatically get from one to the other. I'm not telling you that you're wrong - I genuinely don't know if you are. But you need more info to make that conclusion, the percentages are not enough by themselves.
Apologies if any of my sums are wrong: it's 1:57am...
Not difficult, upper middle class ABs (the most educated and skilled workers) voted 59% Remain only 41% Leave and as I posted earlier finance workers in the City of London (amongst the richest in the country) voted 67% Remain and only 25% Leave.
Yet the country voted 52% Leave and only 48% Remain
No, that's not how percentages work. Let's take your figures and have a play. So: AB's: 59% Remain, 41% Leave and finance workers: 67% Remain, 25% Leave.
Fair enough. entirely believable. But all this tells me me is most AB's voted Remain and most Finance workers voted Remain. That's not enough. There are three points that I need to make here[1]
* 1) "Most AB's voted Remain" is not the same as "most Remainers were ABs". * 2) Similarly "Most AB's voted Remain" is not the same as "most Remainers had a higher salary than the average Leaver". * 3) You have to remember that 30% of A plus 20% of B plus 10% of C does not necessarily equal 60% of (A+B+C)
The best I can get for an estimate for the size of the ABs is 22.17%[3] of the 26,993,600[2] HRPs (household reference person, ie 1 per household), which is 5,984,481 people: call it six million. So from your figures, 59% of them voted Remain - about 3.5 million - and 41% voted Leave - about 2.5 million.
But you haven't told me anything about the other 14.9 million Leave voters (17.4 minus 2.5) nor the other 12.6 million Remain voters (16.1 minus 3.5). And until you do, you can't conclude that "most Remainers have a larger salary than the average Leave voter"
This is why I keep insisting on absolute numbers and thresholds as well as percentages. You can't automatically get from one to the other. I'm not telling you that you're wrong - I genuinely don't know if you are. But you need more info to make that conclusion, the percentages are not enough by themselves.
Apologies if any of my sums are wrong: it's 1:57am...
Oh for goodness sake, Leavers won C1s, C2s and DEs, Remainers won ABs and the most highly paid professions so of course they were better educated and more highly paid and it is absurd to try and continue to contest the point. Indeed 68% of graduates voted Remain but only 30% of those without qualifications
Not difficult, upper middle class ABs (the most educated and skilled workers) voted 59% Remain only 41% Leave and as I posted earlier finance workers in the City of London (amongst the richest in the country) voted 67% Remain and only 25% Leave.
Yet the country voted 52% Leave and only 48% Remain
No, that's not how percentages work. Let's take your figures and have a play. So: AB's: 59% Remain, 41% Leave and finance workers: 67% Remain, 25% Leave.
Fair enough. entirely believable. But all this tells me me is most AB's voted Remain and most Finance workers voted Remain. That's not enough. There are three points that I need to make here[1]
* 1) "Most AB's voted Remain" is not the same as "most Remainers were ABs". * 2) Similarly "Most AB's voted Remain" is not the same as "most Remainers had a higher salary than the average Leaver". * 3) You have to remember that 30% of A plus 20% of B plus 10% of C does not necessarily equal 60% of (A+B+C)
The best I can get for an estimate for the size of the ABs is 22.17%[3] of the 26,993,600[2] HRPs (household reference person, ie 1 per household), which is 5,984,481 people: call it six million. So from your figures, 59% of them voted Remain - about 3.5 million - and 41% voted Leave - about 2.5 million.
But you haven't told me anything about the other 14.9 million Leave voters (17.4 minus 2.5) nor the other 12.6 million Remain voters (16.1 minus 3.5). And until you do, you can't conclude that "most Remainers have a larger salary than the average Leave voter"
This is why I keep insisting on absolute numbers and thresholds as well as percentages. You can't automatically get from one to the other. I'm not telling you that you're wrong - I genuinely don't know if you are. But you need more info to make that conclusion, the percentages are not enough by themselves.
Apologies if any of my sums are wrong: it's 1:57am...
Comments
They still seem pretty well-placed to me. A few tight races against the Lib Dems, but some soft Tory targets to pick up too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfMwWLnpgGw
A perfect, succinct metaphor for many of the comfortable london jornalists, and entire news organisations, now newly posing as tribunes of the people.
But it really is galling when the selfsame people try to portray him, the child of a miner and a mill worker in post war Wigan, who left school at 14, as a fucking, snobbish elitist just cos he proudly and unashamedly voted, campaigned and still insists, on his 79th birthday, we should Remain.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/ba-business-class-is-like-ryanair-with-free-food-say-passengers-sjlw97282
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-the-papers-49301360
Anyhoo, If you go thru the archives, Prince Andrew does pop up occasionally...
http://www.agcwebpages.com/BLINDITEMS/MAINPAGE.html
The scale of the existential threat from climate change, other environmental deterioration, WMDs and AI means that we have to transition to a very closely cooperating or unitary system of governance pretty quickly, or face a major wipe-out.
I can believe that "some" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter.
I can believe that "many" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter.
But for "..."most" Remainers are richer and more highly educated than the average Leave voter..." I'll need numbers, and your definition of "average"
Wealth has a certain correlation with education but not such a straightforward one as to say they're interchangeable.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/08/09/george-osbornes-toxic-tax-policies-lead-super-rich-fleeing-uk/
https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/how-britain-voted-2016-eu-referendum
https://news.efinancialcareers.com/uk-en/250125/this-is-how-city-of-london-workers-voted-in
Yet the country voted 52% Leave and only 48% Remain
Tyrannical oppression I leave to right-wingers and Stalinists.
defends an international rules-based system on a cooperative and egalitarian basis. Obviously it fails on this basis too when it lets larger countries bend the rules a bit more than others, but that's politics for you. It's certainly the only defence against unfettered corporate power.
As you say, the consent of the governed is vital. There aren't many simple solutions here.
On the positive side there is apparently enough money to send RAFAT and over 100 hangers-on on a 12 week tour of North America.
AB's: 59% Remain, 41% Leave and finance workers: 67% Remain, 25% Leave.
Fair enough. entirely believable. But all this tells me me is most AB's voted Remain and most Finance workers voted Remain. That's not enough. There are three points that I need to make here[1]
* 1) "Most AB's voted Remain" is not the same as "most Remainers were ABs".
* 2) Similarly "Most AB's voted Remain" is not the same as "most Remainers had a higher salary than the average Leaver".
* 3) You have to remember that 30% of A plus 20% of B plus 10% of C does not necessarily equal 60% of (A+B+C)
The best I can get for an estimate for the size of the ABs is 22.17%[3] of the 26,993,600[2] HRPs (household reference person, ie 1 per household), which is 5,984,481 people: call it six million. So from your figures, 59% of them voted Remain - about 3.5 million - and 41% voted Leave - about 2.5 million.
But you haven't told me anything about the other 14.9 million Leave voters (17.4 minus 2.5) nor the other 12.6 million Remain voters (16.1 minus 3.5). And until you do, you can't conclude that "most Remainers have a larger salary than the average Leave voter"
This is why I keep insisting on absolute numbers and thresholds as well as percentages. You can't automatically get from one to the other. I'm not telling you that you're wrong - I genuinely don't know if you are. But you need more info to make that conclusion, the percentages are not enough by themselves.
Apologies if any of my sums are wrong: it's 1:57am...
[1] To make the sums easier I'm going to have to leave out the "finance" workers" number, because I don't know what the overlap is with AB's and I don't want to double-count either way.
[2] https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/families/adhocs/005873householdsbysexofthehouseholdreferencepersonhrpuk2015
[3] https://www.ukgeographics.co.uk/blog/s/HRP
I will tell you why Brexit discourse triumphs because our opposition leaders are weak, ineffectual, lack oratory , cannot reach the Brexit Voters and say 'Holy Sh*t guys they have sold you a whopper which is going to make your country & families poorer'. The leaders of Green, Change, Lib-Dems, Plaid, SNP are individually nice people but they need to use more slogans, get in the gutter, fight hard. The Remain side are too fractured, fragmented, too cerebral, too dis-organised as the Brexit elite work together, dominate the airwaves and create the story its 'Remain Politicians Vs the People' . The Remain groups and Parties need to copy the Brexit Elite. Meanwhile experienced Labour figures need to forget Corbyn the Feeble and join with Remain groups to forge not just Westminster groups but ways to reach regional Brexit voters with slogans of truth.
NEW THREAD
https://www.ipsos.com/ipsos-mori/en-uk/how-britain-voted-2016-eu-referendum