This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
The big movement came in July and August suggesting some working class Leavers thought the Chequers Deal made too many compromises to make Brexit worthwhile but would back No Deal hard Brexit (the reverse is likely the case with most middle class voters for whom Chequers Deal Brexit would be better than No Deal hard Brexit).
Though even post Chequers Deal more working class voters still back Leave than Remain overall
So the uneducated masses are still as unwitting as they were in the first place then, that bit hasn’t really changed?
Anyone know what would have happened if Alec Douglas-Home had lost the Kinross and Western Perthshire by-election?
End of his Premiership or would he continued on regardless?
So far as I know, there is no actual constitutional requirement for Ministers including Prime Ministers to be members of Parliament. Wilson had a Foreign Secretary who was not an MP.
However, in this particular case given he was facing a divided and rebellious PCP already deeply unhappy they had been told not one of them was up to being Prime Minister and a Labour Opposition tearing chunks out of the democratic process being subverted by a 14th Earl, I think Home would have had to resign.
Not that that was ever likely to happen with that seat at that time.
There is no constitutional requirement. Like much of the UK constitution, the PM being an MP is a convention that has evolved over time.
It is not inconceivable that the Queen could ask a Lord to attempt to form a government through commanding the House, but seems very unlikely.
Having said that, we are in strange times.
Its certainly been suggested that, in the event of the PM resigning with immediate effect, Lord Hague or Lord Howard could be a caretaker PM until someone is elected to the post of party leader.
One of the quirks of the British constitution is that there is always a PM.
Um, no. Except for certain specific tasks (appointing and firing Cabinet Ministers, chairing Cabinet meetings, representing the UK at European Council meetings[1], PMQs) there is no need for a PM, and certainly not a continuous one. Orders to the Armed Forces can be given by the Minster of Defence[2], Cabinet meetings can be chaired by the Lord President of the Council[3], and PMQs can be taken by a designated individual. The only thing IIRC that the PM and only the PM can do is issue orders to launch the nukes ("Prime Minister's Directives")
[1] Until X-Day [2] Which is why Churchill was PM and Minister for War simultaneously [3] I think
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
Parliament can vote to ask the government to ask the EU for an extension to Article 50.
But they can’t compel the government to ask for an extension.
They can, a Sovereign Parliament can direct the government.
That's how Parliamentary democracy works.
You still don’t understand Parliamentary Sovereignty do you?
It is the Crown-in-Parliament (ie the Executive) that is Sovereign, not Parliament.
Am I reading Cable right, a new leader of the liberals can be anyone even with no seat in the HOC
They are loopy
Not really. The convention that the PM be a MP is simply that: a convention, not a necessity. As somebody else has pointed out, Alec Douglas Home is an example in living memory.
Although can somebody jog my memory: can the Leader of the Opposition be a non-MP?
I'm sure someone could call themselves it and not be an MP, but I don't think they could officially be said leader, since they are formally the Leader of the Opposition in the Commons, I believe (even though the leader in the Lords is subordinate, clearly) and I believe legislation dictates that the LoTo means a member of at least one of the Houses.
Not sure what the latest relevant statute might be but Erskine May makes reference to the Ministers of the Crown Act 1937 as setting the salary for the post, and that has been repealed and replaced, and the Ministerial and other salaries act 1975 defines LoTo as a member a House. Maybe something else more recent eclipses that?
2(1)In this Act “Leader of the Opposition” means, in relation to either House of Parliament, that Member of that House who is for the time being the Leader in that House of the party in opposition to Her Majesty’s Government having the greatest numerical strength in the House of Commons; https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1975/27
Ah, thank you. So the PM may not be a MP, but the LOTO must be a MP or a Lord.
Pause.
So that actually fucks up Vince's plan, then.
I believe Lord Rennard of Manyhands might still be available
Anyone know what would have happened if Alec Douglas-Home had lost the Kinross and Western Perthshire by-election?
End of his Premiership or would he continued on regardless?
So far as I know, there is no actual constitutional requirement for Ministers including Prime Ministers to be members of Parliament. Wilson had a Foreign Secretary who was not an MP.
However, in this particular case given he was facing a divided and rebellious PCP already deeply unhappy they had been told not one of them was up to being Prime Minister and a Labour Opposition tearing chunks out of the democratic process being subverted by a 14th Earl, I think Home would have had to resign.
Not that that was ever likely to happen with that seat at that time.
There is no constitutional requirement. Like much of the UK constitution, the PM being an MP is a convention that has evolved over time.
It is not inconceivable that the Queen could ask a Lord to attempt to form a government through commanding the House, but seems very unlikely.
Having said that, we are in strange times.
Its certainly been suggested that, in the event of the PM resigning with immediate effect, Lord Hague or Lord Howard could be a caretaker PM until someone is elected to the post of party leader.
One of the quirks of the British constitution is that there is always a PM.
Not quite always, surely? This isn't a 'The king is dead; long live the king' situation, we are at least without a PM in the time between the monarch accepting a resignation/taking away the role and the arrival of the new person to accept the role from the monarch.
Endpedantmode>
Indeed in the event that the PM dies unexpectedly its entirely possible to take a bit of time to sort out who the successor is. Other nations (like the US 25th Amendment) have designated successors, we don't.
Harold Holt's successor as Australian Prime Minister took office two days after Holt's presumed death.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
Parliament can vote to ask the government to ask the EU for an extension to Article 50.
But they can’t compel the government to ask for an extension.
They can, a Sovereign Parliament can direct the government.
That's how Parliamentary democracy works.
You still don’t understand Parliamentary Sovereignty do you?
It is the Crown-in-Parliament (ie the Executive) that is Sovereign, not Parliament.
Anyone know what would have happened if Alec Douglas-Home had lost the Kinross and Western Perthshire by-election?
End of his Premiership or would he continued on regardless?
So far as I know, there is no actual constitutional requirement for Ministers including Prime Ministers to be members of Parliament. Wilson had a Foreign Secretary who was not an MP.
However, in this particular case given he was facing a divided and rebellious PCP already deeply unhappy they had been told not one of them was up to being Prime Minister and a Labour Opposition tearing chunks out of the democratic process being subverted by a 14th Earl, I think Home would have had to resign.
Not that that was ever likely to happen with that seat at that time.
There is no constitutional requirement. Like much of the UK constitution, the PM being an MP is a convention that has evolved over time.
It is not inconceivable that the Queen could ask a Lord to attempt to form a government through commanding the House, but seems very unlikely.
Having said that, we are in strange times.
Its certainly been suggested that, in the event of the PM resigning with immediate effect, Lord Hague or Lord Howard could be a caretaker PM until someone is elected to the post of party leader.
One of the quirks of the British constitution is that there is always a PM.
Not quite always, surely? This isn't a 'The king is dead; long live the king' situation, we are at least without a PM in the time between the monarch accepting a resignation/taking away the role and the arrival of the new person to accept the role from the monarch.
Endpedantmode>
Oooo there might be a political thriller in this...
Outgoing PM goes to the Palace to resign, incoming PM is killed in a car crash on their way to accept the Monarch's commission to form a new government.
Who rules? Quick, get Michael Dobbs to write it...
Unnecessarily complicated. Existing PM is killed in a car crash (or by drowning like Holt), who rules? Your scenario would presumably be no different as the new PM can't change ministers until they're sworn in then presumably the old deputy PM or whoever else would step in under that scenario still will.
Unless the change is due to an election in which case the deputy/acting leader of the incoming party would take over.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
Parliament can vote to ask the government to ask the EU for an extension to Article 50.
But they can’t compel the government to ask for an extension.
They can, a Sovereign Parliament can direct the government.
That's how Parliamentary democracy works.
You still don’t understand Parliamentary Sovereignty do you?
It is the Crown-in-Parliament (ie the Executive) that is Sovereign, not Parliament.
I do.
It is you Leavers that don't understand it.
CF The revelation by David Davis.
Let’s hear your version. And then we can compare it to what Vernon Bogdanor taught me
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
LOL. The “end of free movement” will have so many loopholes it will resemble a sieve, that’s what troo BINO is. Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
Parliament can vote to ask the government to ask the EU for an extension to Article 50.
But they can’t compel the government to ask for an extension.
They can, a Sovereign Parliament can direct the government.
That's how Parliamentary democracy works.
You still don’t understand Parliamentary Sovereignty do you?
It is the Crown-in-Parliament (ie the Executive) that is Sovereign, not Parliament.
The executive of a minority government refusing to abide by Parliament on a critical issue?
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
LOL. The “end of free movement” will have so many loopholes it will resemble a sieve, that’s what troo BINO is. Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
May's plan resembles the transition controls Blair should have imposed on free movement in 2004 and the lack of which was pivotal to Leave winning the referendum
Anyone know what would have happened if Alec Douglas-Home had lost the Kinross and Western Perthshire by-election?
End of his Premiership or would he continued on regardless?
So far as I know, there is no actual constitutional requirement for Ministers including Prime Ministers to be members of Parliament. Wilson had a Foreign Secretary who was not an MP.
However, in this particular case given he was facing a divided and rebellious PCP already deeply unhappy they had been told not one of them was up to being Prime Minister and a Labour Opposition tearing chunks out of the democratic process being subverted by a 14th Earl, I think Home would have had to resign.
Not that that was ever likely to happen with that seat at that time.
There is no constitutional requirement. Like much of the UK constitution, the PM being an MP is a convention that has evolved over time.
It is not inconceivable that the Queen could ask a Lord to attempt to form a government through commanding the House, but seems very unlikely.
Having said that, we are in strange times.
Its certainly been suggested that, in the event of the PM resigning with immediate effect, Lord Hague or Lord Howard could be a caretaker PM until someone is elected to the post of party leader.
One of the quirks of the British constitution is that there is always a PM.
Not quite always, surely? This isn't a 'The king is dead; long live the king' situation, we are at least without a PM in the time between the monarch accepting a resignation/taking away the role and the arrival of the new person to accept the role from the monarch.
Endpedantmode>
Oooo there might be a political thriller in this...
Outgoing PM goes to the Palace to resign, incoming PM is killed in a car crash on their way to accept the Monarch's commission to form a new government.
Who rules? Quick, get Michael Dobbs to write it...
Unnecessarily complicated. Existing PM is killed in a car crash (or by drowning like Holt), who rules? Your scenario would presumably be no different as the new PM can't change ministers until they're sworn in then presumably the old deputy PM or whoever else would step in under that scenario still will.
Unless the change is due to an election in which case the deputy/acting leader of the incoming party would take over.
iirc if the PM suddenly dies, the Cabinet makes an immediate decision as to who is acting PM. I think convention is that it is the Home Sec.
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
LOL. The “end of free movement” will have so many loopholes it will resemble a sieve, that’s what troo BINO is. Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
May's plan resembles the transition controls Blair should have imposed on free movement in 2004 and the lack of which was pivotal to Leave winning the referendum
Chequers is a dead parrot, it has ceased to be, gone to meet its maker, and is pushing up the daisies.
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
LOL. The “end of free movement” will have so many loopholes it will resemble a sieve, that’s what troo BINO is. Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
May's plan resembles the transition controls Blair should have imposed on free movement in 2004 and the lack of which was pivotal to Leave winning the referendum
Chequers is a dead parrot, it has ceased to be, gone to meet its maker, and is pushing up the daisies.
If it wasn't nailed to the perch...
So what are you expecting to happen in its stead? Chequers looks pretty dead, yes, but there's a lot of wildly optimistic hypothesising about other options getting through parliament when Chequers cannot. And because of that optimism (be it for no deal or remain) a lot of people seem oddly content with demolishing CHequers (yes the EU are doing that too) with an overly firm belief that it will all work out the way they want.
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
LOL. The “end of free movement” will have so many loopholes it will resemble a sieve, that’s what troo BINO is. Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
May's plan resembles the transition controls Blair should have imposed on free movement in 2004 and the lack of which was pivotal to Leave winning the referendum
Chequers is a dead parrot, it has ceased to be, gone to meet its maker, and is pushing up the daisies.
If it wasn't nailed to the perch...
So what are you expecting to happen in its stead? Chequers looks pretty dead, yes, but there's a lot of wildly optimistic hypothesising about other options getting through parliament when Chequers cannot.
Interesting article IMO: "Left-wing liberals who are opposed to the identity politics developments on the left increasingly find ourselves accused of being right wing, referred to as “right wing” and scornfully urged to admit that we are right wing by identitarian lefties.
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
LOL. The “end of free movement” will have so many loopholes it will resemble a sieve, that’s what troo BINO is. Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
May's plan resembles the transition controls Blair should have imposed on free movement in 2004 and the lack of which was pivotal to Leave winning the referendum
Chequers is a dead parrot, it has ceased to be, gone to meet its maker, and is pushing up the daisies.
If it wasn't nailed to the perch...
So what are you expecting to happen in its stead? Chequers looks pretty dead, yes, but there's a lot of wildly optimistic hypothesising about other options getting through parliament when Chequers cannot.
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
LOL. The “end of free movement” will have so many loopholes it will resemble a sieve, that’s what troo BINO is. Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
May's plan resembles the transition controls Blair should have imposed on free movement in 2004 and the lack of which was pivotal to Leave winning the referendum
Chequers is a dead parrot, it has ceased to be, gone to meet its maker, and is pushing up the daisies.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
How can it be enforced on arrival unless they implement tourist visas for EU citizens?
Tourists come from all over the world not just the EU to the UK and some form of tourist visa is likely in the final agreement both for EU visitors to the UK and UK visitors to the EU
Let’s hear your version. And then we can compare it to what Vernon Bogdanor taught me
Bills are headed:
BE IT ENACTED by the Queen's most Excellent Majesty, by and with the advice and consent of the Lords Spiritual and Temporal, and Commons, in this present Parliament assembled, and by the authority of the same, as follows:
This enacting formula emphasizes that, although legally the bill is being enacted by the Queen of the United Kingdom (specifically, by the Queen-in-Parliament), it is not through her initiative but through that of Parliament that legislation is created.
Focus on the advice and consent part and you'll understand.
PS - Next time you're about to name drop let me know, so I can wear a helmet.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
Parliament can vote to ask the government to ask the EU for an extension to Article 50.
But they can’t compel the government to ask for an extension.
They can, a Sovereign Parliament can direct the government.
That's how Parliamentary democracy works.
You still don’t understand Parliamentary Sovereignty do you?
It is the Crown-in-Parliament (ie the Executive) that is Sovereign, not Parliament.
The executive of a minority government refusing to abide by Parliament on a critical issue?
That would be quite some political crisis.
Not at all. It would be Parliament overstepping their remit to instruct the Executive to act in a certain way.
Of course, should they see fit, Parliament could sack the Executive for not following their wishes
Interesting article IMO: "Left-wing liberals who are opposed to the identity politics developments on the left increasingly find ourselves accused of being right wing, referred to as “right wing” and scornfully urged to admit that we are right wing by identitarian lefties.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
Parliament can vote to ask the government to ask the EU for an extension to Article 50.
But they can’t compel the government to ask for an extension.
They can, a Sovereign Parliament can direct the government.
That's how Parliamentary democracy works.
You still don’t understand Parliamentary Sovereignty do you?
It is the Crown-in-Parliament (ie the Executive) that is Sovereign, not Parliament.
The executive of a minority government refusing to abide by Parliament on a critical issue?
That would be quite some political crisis.
Not at all. It would be Parliament overstepping their remit to instruct the Executive to act in a certain way.
Of course, should they see fit, Parliament could sack the Executive for not following their wishes
How do you think the public would react to such high handedness? or the MPs?
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
The Parliament Act ensures the Lords can be overruled.
Just writing that should ring alarm bells for you. The government will not have time to hang around waiting to invoke the Parliament Act.
They will as May would not call a Deal or No Deal referendum until she had signed the Deal with the EU.
She would then say the only alternative to not backing the continuation of the Deal is now No Deal to ensure enough Remainers also get behind the Chequers Deal to win the referendum
Can't happen, she's promised the HOC a meaningful vote on the deal.
Which in practice means deal or no deal. Parliament can’t compel the EU to negotiate.
Parliament can vote to ask the government to ask the EU for an extension to Article 50.
But they can’t compel the government to ask for an extension.
They can, a Sovereign Parliament can direct the government.
That's how Parliamentary democracy works.
You still don’t understand Parliamentary Sovereignty do you?
It is the Crown-in-Parliament (ie the Executive) that is Sovereign, not Parliament.
I do.
It is you Leavers that don't understand it.
CF The revelation by David Davis.
Is this one of those arguments you can only settle by chopping off someone’s head? And not just any someone.
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
LOL. The “end of free movement” will have so many loopholes it will resemble a sieve, that’s what troo BINO is. Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
May's plan resembles the transition controls Blair should have imposed on free movement in 2004 and the lack of which was pivotal to Leave winning the referendum
Chequers is a dead parrot, it has ceased to be, gone to meet its maker, and is pushing up the daisies.
I thought you had grwon a pait with your initial criticism of Chequers. But no, like a good Tory, you go back to doing what you are told. No wonder the Government is such a mess.
Chequers is dead. May’s sellout is just beginning. She is going to try to sign a withdrawal agrement which gives the EU everything that it wants (money, NI backstop) and doesn’t address the future relationship in any meaningful way so she can hang on to power for another couple of years. At the end of which she will rely on lemmings like HYUFD to try and tell people that she got a really good deal even though having given away all our cards the EU will renege on everything she thought they promised (surprise!). Tories will be out of power for 20 years at this rate.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
How can it be enforced on arrival unless they implement tourist visas for EU citizens?
Tourists come from all over the world not just the EU to the UK and some form of tourist visa is likely in the final agreement both for EU visitors to the UK and UK visitors to the EU
If a Bulgarian tourist without a visa flies to Dublin and then drives to Northern Ireland, where will their passport be checked and what will happen if it’s discovered they don’t have a visa?
Interesting article IMO: "Left-wing liberals who are opposed to the identity politics developments on the left increasingly find ourselves accused of being right wing, referred to as “right wing” and scornfully urged to admit that we are right wing by identitarian lefties.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
How can it be enforced on arrival unless they implement tourist visas for EU citizens?
Tourists come from all over the world not just the EU to the UK and some form of tourist visa is likely in the final agreement both for EU visitors to the UK and UK visitors to the EU
If a Bulgarian tourist without a visa flies to Dublin and then drives to Northern Ireland, where will their passport be checked and what will happen if it’s discovered they don’t have a visa?
Free movement isn’t about tourism. Free movement is about entitlement to benefits.
Let’s hear your version. And then we can compare it to what Vernon Bogdanor taught me
Bills are headed:
BE IT ENACTED by the Queen's most Excellent Majesty, by and with the advice and consent of the Lords Spiritual and Temporal, and Commons, in this present Parliament assembled, and by the authority of the same, as follows:
This enacting formula emphasizes that, although legally the bill is being enacted by the Queen of the United Kingdom (specifically, by the Queen-in-Parliament), it is not through her initiative but through that of Parliament that legislation is created.
Focus on the advice and consent part and you'll understand.
PS - Next time you're about to name drop let me know, so I can wear a helmet.
You have missed the point. Parliament is sovereign for legislation. But they cannot direct the executive to negotiate in a certain way. Charles is right that the constitutional solution to the executive refusing to do what the Parliament wants is for the Parliament to no confidence the executive and form a new executive. If they can’t do that, tough luck.
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
LOL. The “end of free movement” will have so many loopholes it will resemble a sieve, that’s what troo BINO is. Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
May's plan resembles the transition controls Blair should have imposed on free movement in 2004 and the lack of which was pivotal to Leave winning the referendum
Chequers is a dead parrot, it has ceased to be, gone to meet its maker, and is pushing up the daisies.
If it wasn't nailed to the perch...
So what are you expecting to happen in its stead? Chequers looks pretty dead, yes, but there's a lot of wildly optimistic hypothesising about other options getting through parliament when Chequers cannot.
Am I reading Cable right, a new leader of the liberals can be anyone even with no seat in the HOC
They are loopy
Not really. The convention that the PM be a MP is simply that: a convention, not a necessity. As somebody else has pointed out, Alec Douglas Home is an example in living memory.
Although can somebody jog my memory: can the Leader of the Opposition be a non-MP?
I'm sure someone could call themselves it and not be an MP, but I don't think they could officially be said leader, since they are formally the Leader of the Opposition in the Commons, I believe (even though the leader in the Lords is subordinate, clearly) and I believe legislation dictates that the LoTo means a member of at least one of the Houses.
Not sure what the latest relevant statute might be but Erskine May makes reference to the Ministers of the Crown Act 1937 as setting the salary for the post, and that has been repealed and replaced, and the Ministerial and other salaries act 1975 defines LoTo as a member a House. Maybe something else more recent eclipses that?
2(1)In this Act “Leader of the Opposition” means, in relation to either House of Parliament, that Member of that House who is for the time being the Leader in that House of the party in opposition to Her Majesty’s Government having the greatest numerical strength in the House of Commons; https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1975/27
Ah, thank you. So the PM may not be a MP, but the LOTO must be a MP or a Lord.
Pause.
So that actually fucks up Vince's plan, then.
I believe Lord Rennard of Manyhands might still be available
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Mate, you don’t get it. There is no Chequers deal. You can’t make a deal negotiatimg with yourself.
Let’s hear your version. And then we can compare it to what Vernon Bogdanor taught me
Bills are headed:
BE IT ENACTED by the Queen's most Excellent Majesty, by and with the advice and consent of the Lords Spiritual and Temporal, and Commons, in this present Parliament assembled, and by the authority of the same, as follows:
This enacting formula emphasizes that, although legally the bill is being enacted by the Queen of the United Kingdom (specifically, by the Queen-in-Parliament), it is not through her initiative but through that of Parliament that legislation is created.
Focus on the advice and consent part and you'll understand.
PS - Next time you're about to name drop let me know, so I can wear a helmet.
That’s legislation, which was the remit of Parliament even when the Monarch was de facto Sovereign as well as just de jure.
Parliamentary Sovereignty refers to the exercise of the Royal Prerogative by the Crown-in-Parliament (ie the C-in-P acting as Sovereign).
As for name dropping, I spent a year studying constitutional government with the good Professor and I’m just repeating what he taught me. So it’s an appeal to authority as opposed to name dropping...
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
How can it be enforced on arrival unless they implement tourist visas for EU citizens?
Tourists come from all over the world not just the EU to the UK and some form of tourist visa is likely in the final agreement both for EU visitors to the UK and UK visitors to the EU
If a Bulgarian tourist without a visa flies to Dublin and then drives to Northern Ireland, where will their passport be checked and what will happen if it’s discovered they don’t have a visa?
Free movement isn’t about tourism. Free movement is about entitlement to benefits.
HYUFD is saying we’ll enforce the requirement for a job on arrival, which can’t be done if you let tourists in without visas.
Do we know if Corbyn has attacked the Egyptians for their blockade of Gaza or has he just singled out the Israelis?
Not sure about Corbyn but the hard-left line is normally to blame the Americans for that, the thought being that when Egyptian voters tried to elect a government that stopped collaborating with Israel on this it got mysteriously overthrown by the US-backed military.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
How can it be enforced on arrival unless they implement tourist visas for EU citizens?
Tourists come from all over the world not just the EU to the UK and some form of tourist visa is likely in the final agreement both for EU visitors to the UK and UK visitors to the EU
If a Bulgarian tourist without a visa flies to Dublin and then drives to Northern Ireland, where will their passport be checked and what will happen if it’s discovered they don’t have a visa?
Free movement isn’t about tourism. Free movement is about entitlement to benefits.
Free movement is whatever you want it to be. Christ on a cross. A bogeyman under the bed. I’ll explain why. The EUs free movement is nothing to do with the EU. Sounds bonkers. But it’s true.
Blair and Brown could have used the rules to protect Britain better from free movement? You know when someone says but I want you to argue from the opposite point of view? You are Tony Blair. This is 2004. You know what decision was taken, can you put forward an argument justifying it?
I know exactly what is going to happen to you if you tried to do so. You will journey down a path and be hit by a blinding light, and something will become obvious to you. It’s the way the world is now, you can no more opt out of it than opt of getting suntan out in the sun.
If you are going to ride across a Mesa, wear a hat.
On the graph above it looks like "right" has crashed since Chequers?
People are rejecting Theresa's non-Brexit more than Brexit itself?
Working class people maybe (though they still narrowly back Leave), middle class people are more pro Chequers hence the Tory vote is holding up through some middle class 2017 Labour and LD centrists moving to the Tories even as some working class 2017 Tory voters have moved back to UKIP
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and allows UK free trade deals while getting a Deal to protect the economy.
It is the best middle ground between diehard Remainers who want to reverse Brexit or stay in the single market with free movement (which really would be BINO) and diehard Leavers who want hard Brexit and No Deal with the EU at all
Mate, you don’t get it. There is no Chequers deal. You can’t make a deal negotiatimg with yourself.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
How can it be enforced on arrival unless they implement tourist visas for EU citizens?
Tourists come from all over the world not just the EU to the UK and some form of tourist visa is likely in the final agreement both for EU visitors to the UK and UK visitors to the EU
If a Bulgarian tourist without a visa flies to Dublin and then drives to Northern Ireland, where will their passport be checked and what will happen if it’s discovered they don’t have a visa?
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
This period will go down, of course, as TMay's finest hour. A principled woman doing her duty following the referendum result whilst causing the least amount of damage to the economy and our way of life.
Lol. Bit busy this evening, but When we have time we will explain to you what BINO is, and how it’s architects will be remembered. In the meantime, two words.
Vassal.
State.
Chequers Deal still technically ends free movement and U at all
Or in other words it pleases nobody.
It is the inevitable result of a divided nation. Neither side gets what it wants
LOL. The “end of free movement” will have so many loopholes it will resemble a sieve, that’s what troo BINO is. Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
It will still require a work permit or studreferendum
Chequers is a dead parrot, it has ceased to be, gone to meet its maker, and is pushing up the daisies.
I thought you had grwon a pait with your initial criticism of Chequers. But no, like a good Tory, you go back to doing what you are told. No wonder the Government is such a mess.
Chequers is dead. May’s sellout is just beginning. She is going to try to sign a withdrawal agrement which gives the EU everything that it wants (money, NI backstop) and doesn’t address the future relationship in any meaningful way so she can hang on to power for another couple of years. At the end of which she will rely on lemmings like HYUFD to try and tell people that she got a really good deal even though having given away all our cards the EU will renege on everything she thought they promised (surprise!). Tories will be out of power for 20 years at this rate.
Not on current polling where the Tories are roughly tied with Labour.
The polling shows Remain beats No Deal but Chequers Deal plus No Deal support tends to beat Remain
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
How can it be enforced on arrival unless they implement tourist visas for EU citizens?
Tourists come from all over the world not just the EU to the UK and some form of tourist visa is likely in the final agreement both for EU visitors to the UK and UK visitors to the EU
If a Bulgarian tourist without a visa flies to Dublin and then drives to Northern Ireland, where will their passport be checked and what will happen if it’s discovered they don’t have a visa?
Free movement isn’t about tourism. Free movement is about entitlement to benefits.
Free movement is whatever you want it to be. Christ on a cross. A bogeyman under the bed. I’ll explain why. The EUs free movement is nothing to do with the EU. Sounds bonkers. But it’s true.
Blair and Brown could have used the rules to protect Britain better from free movement? You know when someone says but I want you to argue from the opposite point of view? You are Tony Blair. This is 2004. You know what decision was taken, can you put forward an argument justifying it?
I know exactly what is going to happen to you if you tried to do so. You will journey down a path and be hit by a blinding light, and something will become obvious to you. It’s the way the world is now, you can no more opt out of it than opt of getting suntan out in the sun
There is no form of Brexit FOM ends. Hands up if you haven’t realised that yet.
It will still require a work permit or study place on arrival not after 3 months like free movement.
How can it be enforced on arrival unless they implement tourist visas for EU citizens?
Tourists come from all over the world not just the EU to the UK and some form of tourist visa is likely in the final agreement both for EU visitors to the UK and UK visitors to the EU
If a Bulgarian tourist without a visa flies to Dublin and then drives to Northern Ireland, where will their passport be checked and what will happen if it’s discovered they don’t have a visa?
Free movement isn’t about tourism. Free movement is about entitlement to benefits.
Free movement is whatever you want it to be. Christ on a cross. A bogeyman under the bed. I’ll explain why. The EUs free movement is nothing to do with the EU. Sounds bonkers. But it’s true.
Blair and Brown could have used the rules to protect Britain better from free movement? You know when someone says but I want you to argue from the opposite point of view? You are Tony Blair. This is 2004. You know what decision was taken, can you put forward an argument justifying it?
I know exactly what is going to happen to you if you tried to do so. You will journey down a path and be hit by a blinding light, and something will become obvious to you. It’s the way the world is now, you can no more opt out of it than opt of getting suntan out in the sun.
If you are going to ride across a Mesa, wear a hat.
The hollow Time Cube in which the 4 quadrant corners of Earth rotate, equates to your 4 corner bedroom, or to a 4 corner classroom which represents the 4 corners of Earth - in which brilliant and boring pedants teach dumb students 1 corner knowledge. Each of the 4 corners of Earth is the beginning and ending of its own separate 24 hour day - all 4 simultaneous days within a single rotation of Earth. Place 4 different students in the 4 corners of a classroom and rotate them 4 corners each. Note that they rotate simultaneously wthin the same Time frame as if only one is rotating - just as the 4 different days on Earth rotate. 3D math applied within this hollow Cube would be erroneous math, as it would not account for the 4th corner perspective dimension. Place a 100 people within this Cubic like room and they will not increase the number of corners anymore than 6 billion people on Earth will increase the 4 corners of Earth. It is dumb, brilliant, boring and unworthy of life on Earth to claim that this Creation Cube has 6 sides - or no top and bottom. Academia equates to a deadly plague.
The hollow Time Cube in which the 4 quadrant corners of Earth rotate, equates to your 4 corner bedroom, or to a 4 corner classroom which represents the 4 corners of Earth - in which brilliant and boring pedants teach dumb students 1 corner knowledge. Each of the 4 corners of Earth is the beginning and ending of its own separate 24 hour day - all 4 simultaneous days within a single rotation of Earth. Place 4 different students in the 4 corners of a classroom and rotate them 4 corners each. Note that they rotate simultaneously wthin the same Time frame as if only one is rotating - just as the 4 different days on Earth rotate. 3D math applied within this hollow Cube would be erroneous math, as it would not account for the 4th corner perspective dimension. Place a 100 people within this Cubic like room and they will not increase the number of corners anymore than 6 billion people on Earth will increase the 4 corners of Earth. It is dumb, brilliant, boring and unworthy of life on Earth to claim that this Creation Cube has 6 sides - or no top and bottom. Academia equates to a deadly plague.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Interesting article IMO: "Left-wing liberals who are opposed to the identity politics developments on the left increasingly find ourselves accused of being right wing, referred to as “right wing” and scornfully urged to admit that we are right wing by identitarian lefties.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
I believe the working title is "It's All Somebody Else's Fault"
Or 'The Proles Don't Know Their Place':
Friends of Gove believe that approach reveals that the former prime minister expected unquestioning loyalty from someone he viewed as a social inferior, while his fellow Old Etonian was quickly readmitted to his circle.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Citation required.
Dismantling the Common Travel Area, unlike a few customs posts, would be taken very negatively in NI.
I believe the working title is "It's All Somebody Else's Fault"
Or 'The Proles Don't Know Their Place':
Friends of Gove believe that approach reveals that the former prime minister expected unquestioning loyalty from someone he viewed as a social inferior, while his fellow Old Etonian was quickly readmitted to his circle.
From the limited amount I know about Cameron and Gove (the Shipman books and various bits and bobs), that seems oddly plausible.
I like Matthew Goodwin's analyst skills quite a lot, but he often confuses analysing a situation with advocating for a position, and I think he does that here. In what possible universe is Adonis's Twitter blocks important?
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
As you point out visa free travel is not the same as freedom of movement. NIcaraguans and Colombians can cross the NI Irish border now unhindered as they have visa free travel for tourism but they cannot work in the UK or live here permanently or claim welfare.
We won't need to stop Bulgarians - they will keep their visa free travel but will only be able to live and work and access public services as of right in the Republic.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Citation required.
Dismantling the Common Travel Area, unlike a few customs posts, would be taken very negatively in NI.
No doubt - but since Mr Glenn knows the GFA backwards I'm sure he can point to the specific text......
And as for the Common Travel Area - the Irish check passports on entry to the Republic from the UK mainland.....
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
We are already not in Schengen so extending passport checks from the mainland UK to NI would make little difference and it is the threat of tariffs and customs points which is of most concern in Ireland which staying in the single market for goods as May proposes would avoid. Though even if there were no passport checks in NI it would make little real difference as passport checks could easily be done in Liverpool or Bristol.
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
Though even if there were no passport checks in NI it would make little real difference as passport checks could easily be done in Liverpool or Bristol.
If you check the passports at Liverpool or Bristol, then that is where the de facto border is. Under your proposed system, illegal migrants into NI would not be caught unless/until they caught a ferry to GB.
I like Matthew Goodwin's analyst skills quite a lot, but he often confuses analysing a situation with advocating for a position, and I think he does that here. In what possible universe is Adonis's Twitter blocks important?
Surely blocking the Twitter account of a group in your own party demonstrates a certain unwillingness to listen to alternative points of view?
I've always thought it smarter to 'know thine enemy'.....
I like Matthew Goodwin's analyst skills quite a lot, but he often confuses analysing a situation with advocating for a position, and I think he does that here. In what possible universe is Adonis's Twitter blocks important?
Surely blocking the Twitter account of a group in your own party demonstrates a certain unwillingness to listen to alternative points of view?
I've always thought it smarter to 'know thine enemy'.....
Calling it a Labour group is pushing it given that they funnelled money to UKIP.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
Perhaps you can point to where LEAVE advocated visas for all foreign visitors?
There are currently (ex-EU/EEA) 56 countries nationals who qualify for Visa free entry (for up to 6 months) to the UK. Are you suggesting that should change?
EU 'Freedom of Movement' is not controlled at the border - but at the workplace and benefits office.
I like Matthew Goodwin's analyst skills quite a lot, but he often confuses analysing a situation with advocating for a position, and I think he does that here. In what possible universe is Adonis's Twitter blocks important?
Surely blocking the Twitter account of a group in your own party demonstrates a certain unwillingness to listen to alternative points of view?
I've always thought it smarter to 'know thine enemy'.....
(Part 1) I am informed (unreliably?) that Labour Leave is not affiliated to Labour per se, so the point does not stand.
But returning to your substantive point: it is smarter to "know thine enemy". Yes it is, and arguably it is the reason why I spend so much time on this blog.
But IMHO Matthew Goodwin is wrong on this point: it may not be the case that Remain has failed to listen to Leaver grievances and understand their position, it may simply be that Remain has carefully listened to Leaver grievances, understood their position, and still disagree with them
(there's a PJ O'Roarke quote about "the more you understand, the less you forgive", which I wish I could remember... )
Though even if there were no passport checks in NI it would make little real difference as passport checks could easily be done in Liverpool or Bristol.
If you check the passports at Liverpool or Bristol, then that is where the de facto border is. Under your proposed system, illegal migrants into NI would not be caught unless/until they caught a ferry to GB.
Fine.
Northern Ireland voted Remain (albeit Protestants did not), free movement is less of an issue there than in England and Wales
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Citation required.
Dismantling the Common Travel Area, unlike a few customs posts, would be taken very negatively in NI.
No doubt - but since Mr Glenn knows the GFA backwards I'm sure he can point to the specific text......
And as for the Common Travel Area - the Irish check passports on entry to the Republic from the UK mainland.....
Is it compatible with allowing people to exercise their birthright to be Irish to make them show their passports moving from one part of Ireland to another?
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
As you point out visa free travel is not the same as freedom of movement. NIcaraguans and Colombians can cross the NI Irish border now unhindered as they have visa free travel for tourism but they cannot work in the UK or live here permanently or claim welfare.
We won't need to stop Bulgarians - they will keep their visa free travel but will only be able to live and work and access public services as of right in the Republic.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Citation required.
Dismantling the Common Travel Area, unlike a few customs posts, would be taken very negatively in NI.
No doubt - but since Mr Glenn knows the GFA backwards I'm sure he can point to the specific text......
And as for the Common Travel Area - the Irish check passports on entry to the Republic from the UK mainland.....
Is it compatible with allowing people to exercise their birthright to be Irish to make them show their passports moving from one part of Ireland to another?
But its ok for the Irish to demand them when travelling from one part of the CTA to another?
I like Matthew Goodwin's analyst skills quite a lot, but he often confuses analysing a situation with advocating for a position, and I think he does that here. In what possible universe is Adonis's Twitter blocks important?
Surely blocking the Twitter account of a group in your own party demonstrates a certain unwillingness to listen to alternative points of view?
I've always thought it smarter to 'know thine enemy'.....
(Part 2) The Fukuyama essay which somebody posted a link to the other day (you? @AndyJS ?) spoke of how identity politics was marked by a tendency of the individual to demand respect for self-asserted identities, ideas or emotions without offering evidence. He also pointed out that this tendency occurs across the political spectrum. Matthew Goodwin IMHO is falling into this trap.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
Perhaps you can point to where LEAVE advocated visas for all foreign visitors?
There are currently (ex-EU/EEA) 56 countries nationals who qualify for Visa free entry (for up to 6 months) to the UK. Are you suggesting that should change?
EU 'Freedom of Movement' is not controlled at the border - but at the workplace and benefits office.
We already have passport checks as we are not in Schengen for EU/EEA citizens though as you point out it is at the workplace or university and the benefit office where a job offer or study place on arrival requirement will be enforced
I believe the working title is "It's All Somebody Else's Fault"
Or 'The Proles Don't Know Their Place':
Friends of Gove believe that approach reveals that the former prime minister expected unquestioning loyalty from someone he viewed as a social inferior, while his fellow Old Etonian was quickly readmitted to his circle.
An obvious fabrication! I don't believe for a second that Gove has friends.
I like Matthew Goodwin's analyst skills quite a lot, but he often confuses analysing a situation with advocating for a position, and I think he does that here. In what possible universe is Adonis's Twitter blocks important?
Surely blocking the Twitter account of a group in your own party demonstrates a certain unwillingness to listen to alternative points of view?
I've always thought it smarter to 'know thine enemy'.....
it may simply be that Remain has carefully listened to Leaver grievances, understood their position, and still disagree with them
If that was the case they have been remarkably tone deaf in communicating......I'm pretty sure this de haut en bas stuff isn't terribly effective....
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Citation required.
Dismantling the Common Travel Area, unlike a few customs posts, would be taken very negatively in NI.
No doubt - but since Mr Glenn knows the GFA backwards I'm sure he can point to the specific text......
And as for the Common Travel Area - the Irish check passports on entry to the Republic from the UK mainland.....
Is it compatible with allowing people to exercise their birthright to be Irish to make them show their passports moving from one part of Ireland to another?
Northern Ireland is part of the UK, not part of the Republic of Ireland
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
Perhaps you can point to where LEAVE advocated visas for all foreign visitors?
There are currently (ex-EU/EEA) 56 countries nationals who qualify for Visa free entry (for up to 6 months) to the UK. Are you suggesting that should change?
EU 'Freedom of Movement' is not controlled at the border - but at the workplace and benefits office.
We already have passport checks as we are not in Schengen for EU/EEA citizens though as you point out it is at the workplace or university and the benefit office where a job offer or study place on arrival requirement will be enforced
"On arrival" again... It's meaningless if you can enter freely as a tourist and a job offer automatically gets transformed into a work permit with no limit. In practice it's almost identical to free movement of labour.
I believe the working title is "It's All Somebody Else's Fault"
Or 'The Proles Don't Know Their Place':
Friends of Gove believe that approach reveals that the former prime minister expected unquestioning loyalty from someone he viewed as a social inferior, while his fellow Old Etonian was quickly readmitted to his circle.
An obvious fabrication! I don't believe for a second that Gove has friends.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
Perhaps you can point to where LEAVE advocated visas for all foreign visitors?
There are currently (ex-EU/EEA) 56 countries nationals who qualify for Visa free entry (for up to 6 months) to the UK. Are you suggesting that should change?
EU 'Freedom of Movement' is not controlled at the border - but at the workplace and benefits office.
We already have passport checks as we are not in Schengen for EU/EEA citizens though as you point out it is at the workplace or university and the benefit office where a job offer or study place on arrival requirement will be enforced
"On arrival" again... It's meaningless if you can enter freely as a tourist and a job offer automatically gets transformed into a work permit with no limit. In practice it's almost identical to free movement of labour.
No it is not. Unless you arrive as a tourist and then get a job offer it will not be free movement. If that really becomes an issue tourism visas could then be issued with an explicit exclusion of work whilst in the UK.
Free movement means you can come to the UK for 3 months without a job offer or study place even if you are not a tourist as it stands now
I like Matthew Goodwin's analyst skills quite a lot, but he often confuses analysing a situation with advocating for a position, and I think he does that here. In what possible universe is Adonis's Twitter blocks important?
Surely blocking the Twitter account of a group in your own party demonstrates a certain unwillingness to listen to alternative points of view?
I've always thought it smarter to 'know thine enemy'.....
it may simply be that Remain has carefully listened to Leaver grievances, understood their position, and still disagree with them
If that was the case they have been remarkably tone deaf in communicating......I'm pretty sure this de haut en bas stuff isn't terribly effective....
I am extraordinarily tempted to make a joke along the lines of "I don't care how high your decorative coving is", but it's late...
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
Perhaps you can point to where LEAVE advocated visas for all foreign visitors?
There are currently (ex-EU/EEA) 56 countries nationals who qualify for Visa free entry (for up to 6 months) to the UK. Are you suggesting that should change?
EU 'Freedom of Movement' is not controlled at the border - but at the workplace and benefits office.
We already have passport checks as we are not in Schengen for EU/EEA citizens though as you point out it is at the workplace or university and the benefit office where a job offer or study place on arrival requirement will be enforced
"On arrival" again... It's meaningless if you can enter freely as a tourist and a job offer automatically gets transformed into a work permit with no limit. In practice it's almost identical to free movement of labour.
That's simply fixed. Make it a requirement that the Work Visa application is done when outside the UK. Plenty of countries use such devices. Your visa is then stamped on arrival.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
Perhaps you can point to where LEAVE advocated visas for all foreign visitors?
There are currently (ex-EU/EEA) 56 countries nationals who qualify for Visa free entry (for up to 6 months) to the UK. Are you suggesting that should change?
EU 'Freedom of Movement' is not controlled at the border - but at the workplace and benefits office.
We already have passport checks as we are not in Schengen for EU/EEA citizens though as you point out it is at the workplace or university and the benefit office where a job offer or study place on arrival requirement will be enforced
"On arrival" again... It's meaningless if you can enter freely as a tourist and a job offer automatically gets transformed into a work permit with no limit. In practice it's almost identical to free movement of labour.
No it is not. Unless you arrive as a tourist and then get a job offer it will not be free movement. If that really becomes an issue tourism visas could then be issued with an explicit exclusion of work whilst in the UK.
Free movement means you can come to the UK for 3 months without a job offer or study place even if you are not a tourist as it stands now
Remember the mobility framework is also supposed to allow people to fly in and out to perform services. It's not going to be feasible to impose some kind of bureaucratic regime to distinguish between different purposes of travel on the border.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
Perhaps you can point to where LEAVE advocated visas for all foreign visitors?
There are currently (ex-EU/EEA) 56 countries nationals who qualify for Visa free entry (for up to 6 months) to the UK. Are you suggesting that should change?
EU 'Freedom of Movement' is not controlled at the border - but at the workplace and benefits office.
We already have passport checks as we are not in Schengen for EU/EEA citizens though as you point out it is at the workplace or university and the benefit office where a job offer or study place on arrival requirement will be enforced
"On arrival" again... It's meaningless if you can enter freely as a tourist and a job offer automatically gets transformed into a work permit with no limit. In practice it's almost identical to free movement of labour.
If that really becomes an issue tourism visas could then be issued with an explicit exclusion of work whilst in the UK.
Though even if there were no passport checks in NI it would make little real difference as passport checks could easily be done in Liverpool or Bristol.
If you check the passports at Liverpool or Bristol, then that is where the de facto border is. Under your proposed system, illegal migrants into NI would not be caught unless/until they caught a ferry to GB.
Fine.
Northern Ireland voted Remain (albeit Protestants did not), free movement is less of an issue there than in England and Wales
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
Perhaps you can point to where LEAVE advocated visas for all foreign visitors?
There are currently (ex-EU/EEA) 56 countries nationals who qualify for Visa free entry (for up to 6 months) to the UK. Are you suggesting that should change?
EU 'Freedom of Movement' is not controlled at the border - but at the workplace and benefits office.
We already have passport checks as we are not in Schengen for EU/EEA citizens though as you point out it is at the workplace or university and the benefit office where a job offer or study place on arrival requirement will be enforced
"On arrival" again... It's meaningless if you can enter freely as a tourist and a job offer automatically gets transformed into a work permit with no limit. In practice it's almost identical to free movement of labour.
No it is not. Unless you arrive as a tourist and then get a job offer it will not be free movement. If that really becomes an issue tourism visas could then be issued with an explicit exclusion of work whilst in the UK.
Free movement means you can come to the UK for 3 months without a job offer or study place even if you are not a tourist as it stands now
Remember the mobility framework is also supposed to allow people to fly in and out to perform services. It's not going to be feasible to impose some kind of bureaucratic regime to distinguish between different purposes of travel on the border.
Of course it is, that is what we have passport control for.
The Americans take a far tougher line for example on who enters their country than we do.
Passports will still be checked coming into Northern Ireland even if there remains free movement for goods over the Irish border.
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
Oh dear. And how do you distinguish between Irish and Bulgarians?
Fairly easily, we do not yet even now have fully EU only passports but the nationality is stated on the cover. In any case whether Irish or Bulgarian the rules on work permits and study places and tourism visas would apply to both
But there are no passport checks on the Irish border, and implementing them would go against the Good Friday Agreement.
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
Perhaps you can point to where LEAVE advocated visas for all foreign visitors?
There are currently (ex-EU/EEA) 56 countries nationals who qualify for Visa free entry (for up to 6 months) to the UK. Are you suggesting that should change?
EU 'Freedom of Movement' is not controlled at the border - but at the workplace and benefits office.
We already have passport checks as we are not in Schengen for EU/EEA citizens though as you point out it is at the workplace or university and the benefit office where a job offer or study place on arrival requirement will be enforced
"On arrival" again... It's meaningless if you can enter freely as a tourist and a job offer automatically gets transformed into a work permit with no limit. In practice it's almost identical to free movement of labour.
If that really becomes an issue tourism visas could then be issued with an explicit exclusion of work whilst in the UK.
Visa free entry already excludes 'work'.
Well that is another of William Glenn's nitpicking points torpedoed then
Comments
[1] Until X-Day
[2] Which is why Churchill was PM and Minister for War simultaneously
[3] I think
It is the Crown-in-Parliament (ie the Executive) that is Sovereign, not Parliament.
https://vimeo.com/259763757
Harold Holt's successor as Australian Prime Minister took office two days after Holt's presumed death.
It is you Leavers that don't understand it.
CF The revelation by David Davis.
Unless the change is due to an election in which case the deputy/acting leader of the incoming party would take over.
Think of Norway under the EU empire. Think of Judea under the Romans. That’s where May’s Finest Hour is taking us.
You just wonder what you will wake up to next in politics
In years to come the study of this period will be fascinating
Have a restful night folks
That would be quite some political crisis.
May's plan resembles the transition controls Blair should have imposed on free movement in 2004 and the lack of which was pivotal to Leave winning the referendum
If it wasn't nailed to the perch...
We enter Transition without a known destination.
"Left-wing liberals who are opposed to the identity politics developments on the left increasingly find ourselves accused of being right wing, referred to as “right wing” and scornfully urged to admit that we are right wing by identitarian lefties.
No. Because that is not true."
https://areomagazine.com/2018/08/23/no-we-are-not-right-wing-we-are-liberal-lefties-and-we-are-many/
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6042765/amp/EU-offer-UK-stay-single-market-goods-without-free-movement.html
BE IT ENACTED by the Queen's most Excellent Majesty, by and with the advice and consent of the Lords Spiritual and Temporal, and Commons, in this present Parliament assembled, and by the authority of the same, as follows:
This enacting formula emphasizes that, although legally the bill is being enacted by the Queen of the United Kingdom (specifically, by the Queen-in-Parliament), it is not through her initiative but through that of Parliament that legislation is created.
Focus on the advice and consent part and you'll understand.
PS - Next time you're about to name drop let me know, so I can wear a helmet.
Of course, should they see fit, Parliament could sack the Executive for not following their wishes
And not just any someone.
Chequers is dead. May’s sellout is just beginning. She is going to try to sign a withdrawal agrement which gives the EU everything that it wants (money, NI backstop) and doesn’t address the future relationship in any meaningful way so she can hang on to power for another couple of years. At the end of which she will rely on lemmings like HYUFD to try and tell people that she got a really good deal even though having given away all our cards the EU will renege on everything she thought they promised (surprise!). Tories will be out of power for 20 years at this rate.
The NI backstop will stay.
Parliamentary Sovereignty refers to the exercise of the Royal Prerogative by the Crown-in-Parliament (ie the C-in-P acting as Sovereign).
As for name dropping, I spent a year studying constitutional government with the good Professor and I’m just repeating what he taught me. So it’s an appeal to authority as opposed to name dropping...
People are rejecting Theresa's non-Brexit more than Brexit itself?
Blair and Brown could have used the rules to protect Britain better from free movement? You know when someone says but I want you to argue from the opposite point of view? You are Tony Blair. This is 2004. You know what decision was taken, can you put forward an argument justifying it?
I know exactly what is going to happen to you if you tried to do so. You will journey down a path and be hit by a blinding light, and something will become obvious to you. It’s the way the world is now, you can no more opt out of it than opt of getting suntan out in the sun.
If you are going to ride across a Mesa, wear a hat.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6042765/amp/EU-offer-UK-stay-single-market-goods-without-free-movement.html
If they don't have a visa they will be denied entry exactly as they would be at Dover
The polling shows Remain beats No Deal but Chequers Deal plus No Deal support tends to beat Remain
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1033464810367844354
"It should be annulled."
http://robertreich.org/post/177349093095
I believe the working title is "It's All Somebody Else's Fault"
Or 'The Proles Don't Know Their Place':
Friends of Gove believe that approach reveals that the former prime minister expected unquestioning loyalty from someone he viewed as a social inferior, while his fellow Old Etonian was quickly readmitted to his circle.
We won't need to stop Bulgarians - they will keep their visa free travel but will only be able to live and work and access public services as of right in the Republic.
And as for the Common Travel Area - the Irish check passports on entry to the Republic from the UK mainland.....
Ending free movement as it stood before the EU referendum is the only way to properly respect the Leave vote
I've always thought it smarter to 'know thine enemy'.....
There are currently (ex-EU/EEA) 56 countries nationals who qualify for Visa free entry (for up to 6 months) to the UK. Are you suggesting that should change?
EU 'Freedom of Movement' is not controlled at the border - but at the workplace and benefits office.
I am informed (unreliably?) that Labour Leave is not affiliated to Labour per se, so the point does not stand.
But returning to your substantive point: it is smarter to "know thine enemy". Yes it is, and arguably it is the reason why I spend so much time on this blog.
But IMHO Matthew Goodwin is wrong on this point: it may not be the case that Remain has failed to listen to Leaver grievances and understand their position, it may simply be that Remain has carefully listened to Leaver grievances, understood their position, and still disagree with them
(there's a PJ O'Roarke quote about "the more you understand, the less you forgive", which I wish I could remember...
Northern Ireland voted Remain (albeit Protestants did not), free movement is less of an issue there than in England and Wales
The Fukuyama essay which somebody posted a link to the other day (you? @AndyJS ?) spoke of how identity politics was marked by a tendency of the individual to demand respect for self-asserted identities, ideas or emotions without offering evidence. He also pointed out that this tendency occurs across the political spectrum. Matthew Goodwin IMHO is falling into this trap.
Free movement means you can come to the UK for 3 months without a job offer or study place even if you are not a tourist as it stands now
The Americans take a far tougher line for example on who enters their country than we do.
https://twitter.com/FLOTUS/status/1033515442244018177
Spot the difference.....