The young electrician was right - unless you manage to get the sort of job @MaxPB has it isn't worth heading to London. Move north, and you can accumulate assets.
Who is the young electrician ?
Someone on QT or someone important such as a PBer ?
On Question Time. The comic on the panel had a massive go at him for being anti working class or something 23:10 in.
Oh dear. I’m sure at some point the youngsters will vote with their feet. It is difficult if you put down roots in an area. Perhaps what will happen is the current university students will see what’s happening and avoid London from the off. But the bright lights really are a pull factor and most people aren’t as hard nosed as we are on here.
In reality, the bright lights involve working round the clock in order to live in some crummy rental place and not have much left over at the end of the month. Or, if you have parents in London, live at home. Other cities provide a better lifestyle and the hope of a realistic independence.
Yebbut as @MaxPB has shown, working hard in London, moreso than any other UK city, can get you very tangible benefits indeed.
If you work in the City.....
But you’re still a hamster on a wheel, albeit it’s a very gilded wheel. If you have a large mortgage to pay for a flat in London, you are still a wage slave.
What you want - or should want - is the ability to acquire a large “Fuck Off” or “Running Away” Fund so that you are not trapped - as all too many London professionals are - in a cycle of having to work in high earning jobs in order to pay for the homes and school fees and higher transport (and every other sort of) costs and expensive holidays in order to cope with the stress of working every hour God sends etc etc.....
Most people struggle wherever they are. Bus drivers, solicitors, gardeners, investment bankers. A nice home, children with a good education, and nice holidays seems like a good payback.
Sure. But that sort of life may be easier to achieve outside of London and is now much harder to achieve for those in their mid-late 20’s in London than it was when I was doing it.
Cons appear to be doing very well in areas where they're still miles off winning. Which is, I suppose, nice news for them if not actually any bloody use.
Once upon a time, Labour was miles off winning Kensington and the Tories were miles off winning Bolsover. Things change.
Cons appear to be doing very well in areas where they're still miles off winning. Which is, I suppose, nice news for them if not actually any bloody use.
Once upon a time, Labour was miles off winning Kensington and the Tories were miles off winning Bolsover. Things change.
Anywhere which is very Leave, Labour looks set to do badly.
Indeed. But my view is that this is only indirectly to do with Brexit. Labour have, after all, hardly been ardent remainers these last 12 months. And local elections are not desperately concerned with our relations with the European Union. My view is that Labour are doing badly in places like Nuneaton and Sunderland because they are inreasinly seen as concerned with a weird Metropolitan agenda. Now it's also the case that Metropolitans tend to be the keenest remainers, and how an area voted in the referendum was a good litmus test of how disgruntled its Labour voters are likely to be with the sort of Metropolitan agenda currently being pushed. But I don't think it's necessarily the case that Sunderland Labour voters are drifting away because of Brexit.
Lib Dems have Richmond, the old "quietly confident" has come out.
Agreed, you can almost picture the smirk of Vince delivering that line to a journalist (not that he was the source, but I'm sure he was once upon a time on a night like this).
Alas, I decided the swing in odds to the LDs this morning was groundless so took a punt on a blue hold. Still, no official results yet. It was groundless, of course, but that doesn't mean my bet will win!
For the record I think the same thing about the sudden surge of money on Labour in Barnet this morning - despite my well attested views on the borough generally.
(Who is this LD pundit on the BBC? She just parrots incongruous party lines with no particular relevance, doesn't she know no undecided voters are watching?)
Anywhere which is very Leave, Labour looks set to do badly.
Indeed. But my view is that this is only indirectly to do with Brexit. Labour have, after all, hardly been ardent remainers these last 12 months. And local elections are not desperately concerned with our relations with the European Union. My view is that Labour are doing badly in places like Nuneaton and Sunderland because they are inreasinly seen as concerned with a weird Metropolitan agenda. Now it's also the case that Metropolitans tend to be the keenest remainers, and how an area voted in the referendum was a good litmus test of how disgruntled its Labour voters are likely to be with the sort of Metropolitan agenda currently being pushed. But I don't think it's necessarily the case that Sunderland Labour voters are drifting away because of Brexit.
I don’t necessarily think it’s because the specific Brexit positions Labour have taken, but rather that Brexit is connected to a social liberal metropolitan /social conservative divide. Remainers as you say tend to be more metropolitan - it’s that view that contributed them to voting Remain. So areas that care a lot about immigration (and immigration was the main reason to vote Leave for many) Labour won’t do well. Basically, the values divide between Remainers and Leavers is being reflected here.
Cons appear to be doing very well in areas where they're still miles off winning. Which is, I suppose, nice news for them if not actually any bloody use.
Once upon a time, Labour was miles off winning Kensington and the Tories were miles off winning Bolsover. Things change.
True - not much use this election, but you can't win in 2027 without making progress in 2022.
Big LD swing in Bolton, winning a previously safe Labour ward. Maybe we will win a few seats in Manchester City Council after all...
(Or maybe not, translating from one Bolton ward to our south Manchester targets is pretty imprecise!)
Bolton is a special case - massively unpopular Labour council there for reasons I'm not sure I fully understand. They've been losing safe seats in by-elections for some time.
Anywhere which is very Leave, Labour looks set to do badly.
Indeed. But my view is that this is only indirectly to do with Brexit. Labour have, after all, hardly been ardent remainers these last 12 months. And local elections are not desperately concerned with our relations with the European Union. My view is that Labour are doing badly in places like Nuneaton and Sunderland because they are inreasinly seen as concerned with a weird Metropolitan agenda. Now it's also the case that Metropolitans tend to be the keenest remainers, and how an area voted in the referendum was a good litmus test of how disgruntled its Labour voters are likely to be with the sort of Metropolitan agenda currently being pushed. But I don't think it's necessarily the case that Sunderland Labour voters are drifting away because of Brexit.
I don’t necessarily think it’s because the specific Brexit positions Labour have taken, but rather that Brexit is connected to a social liberal metropolitan /social conservative divide. Remainers as you say tend to be more metropolitan - it’s that view that contributed them to voting Remain. So areas that care a lot about immigration (and immigration was the main reason to vote Leave for many) Labour won’t do well. Basically, the values divide between Remainers and Leavers is being reflected here.
Not sure it is Leave/Remain or liberal/conservative, but more provincial/metropolitan.
Provincial remainers, for example, are not marching for Europe.
Lib Dems have Richmond, the old "quietly confident" has come out.
Agreed, you can almost picture the smirk of Vince delivering that line to a journalist (not that he was the source, but I'm sure he was once upon a time on a night like this).
Alas, I decided the swing in odds to the LDs this morning was groundless so took a punt on a blue hold. Still, no official results yet. It was groundless, of course, but that doesn't mean my bet will win!
The LibDems were 10,000 votes ahead in Twickenham + Richmond Park, and the Blue-est bits of Richmond Park are actually in the Kingston Council area, so it's likely they were 12-13,000 votes ahead in the council area last year.
Big LD swing in Bolton, winning a previously safe Labour ward. Maybe we will win a few seats in Manchester City Council after all...
(Or maybe not, translating from one Bolton ward to our south Manchester targets is pretty imprecise!)
Bolton is a special case - massively unpopular Labour council there for reasons I'm not sure I fully understand. They've been losing safe seats in by-elections for some time.
BBC tickers suggest the net Lab/Con/LD/Kip/Grn seat change is currently -5. UKIP's decline is giving independents some life back, I suspect UKIP took the protest vote which some independents had been benefiting from.
Anywhere which is very Leave, Labour looks set to do badly.
Indeed. But my view is that this is only indirectly to do with Brexit. Labour have, after all, hardly been ardent remainers these last 12 months. And local elections are not desperately concerned with our relations with the European Union. My view is that Labour are doing badly in places like Nuneaton and Sunderland because they are inreasinly seen as concerned with a weird Metropolitan agenda. Now it's also the case that Metropolitans tend to be the keenest remainers, and how an area voted in the referendum was a good litmus test of how disgruntled its Labour voters are likely to be with the sort of Metropolitan agenda currently being pushed. But I don't think it's necessarily the case that Sunderland Labour voters are drifting away because of Brexit.
I don’t necessarily think it’s because the specific Brexit positions Labour have taken, but rather that Brexit is connected to a social liberal metropolitan /social conservative divide. Remainers as you say tend to be more metropolitan - it’s that view that contributed them to voting Remain. So areas that care a lot about immigration (and immigration was the main reason to vote Leave for many) Labour won’t do well. Basically, the values divide between Remainers and Leavers is being reflected here.
Not sure it is Leave/Remain or liberal/conservative, but more provincial/metropolitan.
Provincial remainers, for example, are not marching for Europe.
Yes, but they may still have a more socially liberal world view which influences their voting intention.
Lib Dems have Richmond, the old "quietly confident" has come out.
Agreed, you can almost picture the smirk of Vince delivering that line to a journalist (not that he was the source, but I'm sure he was once upon a time on a night like this).
Alas, I decided the swing in odds to the LDs this morning was groundless so took a punt on a blue hold. Still, no official results yet. It was groundless, of course, but that doesn't mean my bet will win!
The LibDems were 10,000 votes ahead in Twickenham + Richmond Park, and the Blue-est bits of Richmond Park are actually in the Kingston Council area, so it's likely they were 12-13,000 votes ahead in the council area last year.
If (IF) the mood music is right about London, then it appears that at least the basic narrative of 'Good night for Labour in London, good night for Tories outside' was right. Nice to know the polls and pundits are right about some things.
But when you roam from a UK network you get shunted to 3G or lower.
Cheeky gits. Just about able to watch the BBC’s coverage.
Happens across the world, not just perfidious paella eaters.
Do we do that to visitors?
Yes, it is a technical issue based on the frequencies used by mobile operators.
Spain uses the same 4G bands we do.
In Spain, they have 4G on 2600 and 1800 Mhz. Your iPhone X definitely supports those frequencies.
(In the UK, I think we're 800, 1800 and 2600.)
I’m using an iPhone 5s...
I don't know which bands that has, but I'd be staggered if it didn't have 2600. If your network operator has a 4G deal with Telefonica or one of the other Spanish operators (Orange, Vodafone IIRC), then you'll get 4G.
But when you roam from a UK network you get shunted to 3G or lower.
Cheeky gits. Just about able to watch the BBC’s coverage.
Happens across the world, not just perfidious paella eaters.
Do we do that to visitors?
Yes, it is a technical issue based on the frequencies used by mobile operators.
Spain uses the same 4G bands we do.
In Spain, they have 4G on 2600 and 1800 Mhz. Your iPhone X definitely supports those frequencies.
(In the UK, I think we're 800, 1800 and 2600.)
I’m using an iPhone 5s...
I don't know which bands that has, but I'd be staggered if it didn't have 2600. If your network operator has a 4G deal with Telefonica or one of the other Spanish operators (Orange, Vodafone IIRC), then you'll get 4G.
But when you roam from a UK network you get shunted to 3G or lower.
Cheeky gits. Just about able to watch the BBC’s coverage.
Happens across the world, not just perfidious paella eaters.
Do we do that to visitors?
Yes, it is a technical issue based on the frequencies used by mobile operators.
Spain uses the same 4G bands we do.
In Spain, they have 4G on 2600 and 1800 Mhz. Your iPhone X definitely supports those frequencies.
(In the UK, I think we're 800, 1800 and 2600.)
I’m using an iPhone 5s...
I don't know which bands that has, but I'd be staggered if it didn't have 2600. If your network operator has a 4G deal with Telefonica or one of the other Spanish operators (Orange, Vodafone IIRC), then you'll get 4G.
I’m on a cheap deal with Virgin. I’m getting movistar in Spain, my guess is I’m getting what I paid for. Not that I particularly care, it’s doing the job.
A reminder that the LDs got only 13% NEV in 2014, so the current average of 4% up on those results will just be keeping the party in line with the 2017 locals (18% NEV). The different areas up for election mean that we're gaining seats instead of losing them on the same vote share, however.
I see Tim Aker has won a seat in Thurrock - as an independent. Impressive, and I guess shows the UKIP to Indy relationship is complicated by candidates running as unofficial Kippers in some ways.
Labour before tonight: Ed Miliband was a horrific failure who the party owes nothing to. Labour tonight: Ed Miliband achieved astonishing results in 2014, we obviously could never improve much on them.
Rumours from Barnet very mixed for Labour. Straws in the wind from Bury and Salford aren't good, but initial results from Wandsworth, Westminster etc show Labour definitely stronger in London - albeit under expectations. Given how close they are in Barnet no-one seems willing to predict either way.
Comments
My view is that Labour are doing badly in places like Nuneaton and Sunderland because they are inreasinly seen as concerned with a weird Metropolitan agenda. Now it's also the case that Metropolitans tend to be the keenest remainers, and how an area voted in the referendum was a good litmus test of how disgruntled its Labour voters are likely to be with the sort of Metropolitan agenda currently being pushed. But I don't think it's necessarily the case that Sunderland Labour voters are drifting away because of Brexit.
Lab 17 seats/-4
Con 5/+2
LD 3/+3
Ind 0/ -1
But Labour weren't thrashed there last year as they were in Amber Valley or Cannock or Leicestershire NW.
That is big churn!
Alas, I decided the swing in odds to the LDs this morning was groundless so took a punt on a blue hold. Still, no official results yet. It was groundless, of course, but that doesn't mean my bet will win!
Dogsthorpe: Lab gain from Liberal
Leave 54.7%
https://election.news.sky.com/referendum/swindon-3019
(In the UK, I think we're 800, 1800 and 2600.)
(Or maybe not, translating from one Bolton ward to our south Manchester targets is pretty imprecise!)
Horwich and Blackrod : Con gain from Lab
Westhoughton South: LD gain from Lab
Provincial remainers, for example, are not marching for Europe.
LGiU have called it, and they seem to be the quickest tonight.
https://www.broxbourne.gov.uk/sites/default/files/RESULTS - 2018 (Borough).pdf
I'd think they'll walk the council this year.
Lee Chapel North: Lab gain from UKIP
Pitsea North West: Lab gain from UKIP
In Harlow so far
2 Lab gains from UKIP
1 Con gain from UKIP
https://portal.southtyneside.info/elections/LocalGovernment.aspx?id=32
Sounds good for Labour that.
NEW THREAD NEW THREAD
Lib Dem GAIN from Conservative
Lib Dems 564 (46%)
Conservative 492 (40%)
Labour 113 (9%)
Green 47 (4%)
Turnout 47.7%
Labour tonight: Ed Miliband achieved astonishing results in 2014, we obviously could never improve much on them.