1. Nominating Corbyn was a mistake. 2. He will be gone after the election. 3. Cooper, Starmer or Jarvis will be the likely candidates. 4. May will win. 5. Important that she does not get such an enormous win that there is no effective opposition. 6. If Hampstead remains Labour she, Tulip, will be one of the MPs providing such opposition, particularly in relation to Brexit. 7. I should think of the seat rather than Corbyn.
She really said all that? Admirably frank. Even though like you, I'd not be able to vote for herr given the circumstances.
She did indeed. I put her on the spot. I am a fearsome interrogator. And fair play to her. She didn't bullshit me in return. I liked her more than I expected to. I told her that I felt a bit sorry for her and others like her because they were in effect asking the electorate for a pity fuck. (And yes I said just that.) And she laughed.
There will, sadly, be a lot of good MPs who will lose their jobs because of the clots at the top. I will be sorry if Norman Lamb loses his seat, for instance, just as I was sorry that Ed Davey lost his. But Labour MPs have collectively behaved like a bunch of scared nitwits, willing to wound, afraid to strike. The hard left is ruthless. They should have been even more ruthless. They weren't and will now pay the price.
This is life. Sadly. And it doesn't just happen in politics. The ability of those at the top to fuck things up royally is a sight to behold. It is one reason why I am contemplating a serious career change.
In the end, you can only beat your head against a brick wall for so long before you decide that there are better things to do with your life - and head.
FPT (and thanks to @Peter the Punter for your comments):-
Some thoughts on Hampstead and Kilburn.
Tulip Siddiq was canvassing in my street last week. She came across as engaging and feisty and rather fun. I was impressed by her willingness to debate with me (and others in my household). Were it not for the Corbyn factor - and based on my impressions of her (and what I know of what she has done as an MP) - I might even be tempted to vote for her. I would not be heartbroken if she remained as my MP.
Her line is this:-
1. Nominating Corbyn was a mistake. 2. He will be gone after the election. 3. Cooper, Starmer or Jarvis will be the likely candidates. 4. May will win. 5. Important that she does not get such an enormous win that there is no effective opposition. 6. If Hampstead remains Labour she, Tulip, will be one of the MPs providing such opposition, particularly in relation to Brexit. 7. I should think of the seat rather than Corbyn.
I can understand her strategy. It makes sense for her - and it may succeed, though it will be tight.
But - and it is a very big but indeed - every vote for Labour will be taken by Corbyn as a vote for him and will make it less likely that he will go.
So 2. won't happen. And if it does (or even if it doesn't) Labour have proved inept at no. 6.
I simply do not want to risk Corbyn using votes for Labour (even if they are given in spite of him rather than because of him) as a reason for him to stay in power and continue his destruction of the Labour party. So much as I liked Tulip and admired her willingness to fight for her seat (in all the time Glenda Jackson was MP I never sight nor sound of her) I simply cannot bring myself to vote for a Labour party which, collectively, has lost its moral compass - sad as that is for the decent people (and there are some - even though some of them have shown all the toughness of marshmallows) in it.
Corbyn and his particular brand of illiberal leftist politics need to be crushed. This is no time for sentimentality just because Corbyn speaks softly, makes jam and likes gardening. Corbynism is a virus which is destroying a once great and fundamentally decent party. That is a shame for us all, regardless of whether or not we support it.
In fact, as I keep repeating, Labour's canvassing should be this:
1. We are NOT going to win. 2. For the good of democracy, we should not have a landslide 3. How have I done personally as your MP ?
Tulip's arguments are very cogent.
She'll have pissed off the Momentum mob, but maybe that doesn't matter.
I expect most of her vote comes from the Kilburn end of constituency where they wouldn't be likely to set foot. It's a bit rough down there. In some parts, you can walk all of twenty yards without finding a coffee shop.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I see that Barron Trump will be going to St Andrews Episcopal school as of next academic year in North Potomac. The next door high school is Winston Churchill ...
FPT (and thanks to @Peter the Punter for your comments):-
Some thoughts on Hampstead and Kilburn.
Tulip Siddiq was canvassing in my street last week. She came across as engaging and feisty and rather fun. I was impressed by her willingness to debate with me (and others in my household). Were it not for the Corbyn factor - and based on my impressions of her (and what I know of what she has done as an MP) - I might even be tempted to vote for her. I would not be heartbroken if she remained as my MP.
Her line is this:-
1. Nominating Corbyn was a mistake. 2. He will be gone after the election. 3. Cooper, Starmer or Jarvis will be the likely candidates. 4. May will win. 5. Important that she does not get such an enormous win that there is no effective opposition. 6. If Hampstead remains Labour she, Tulip, will be one of the MPs providing such opposition, particularly in relation to Brexit. 7. I should think of the seat rather than Corbyn.
I can understand her strategy. It makes sense for her - and it may succeed, though it will be tight.
But - and it is a very big but indeed - every vote for Labour will be taken by Corbyn as a vote for him and will make it less likely that he will go.
So 2. won't happen. And if it does (or even if it doesn't) Labour have proved inept at no. 6.
I simply do not want to risk Corbyn using votes for Labour (even if they are given in spite of him rather than because of him) as a reason for him to stay in power and continue his destruction of the Labour party. So much as I liked Tulip and admired her willingness to fight for her seat (in all the time Glenda Jackson was MP I never sight nor sound of her) I simply cannot bring myself to vote for a Labour party which, collectively, has lost its moral compass - sad as that is for the decent people (and there are some - even though some of them have shown all the toughness of marshmallows) in it.
Corbyn and his particular brand of illiberal leftist politics need to be crushed. This is no time for sentimentality just because Corbyn speaks softly, makes jam and likes gardening. Corbynism is a virus which is destroying a once great and fundamentally decent party. That is a shame for us all, regardless of whether or not we support it.
In fact, as I keep repeating, Labour's canvassing should be this:
1. We are NOT going to win. 2. For the good of democracy, we should not have a landslide 3. How have I done personally as your MP ?
Tulip's arguments are very cogent.
Cogent up to a point only. Up to the point when you realize that a vote for a Labour MP is a vote for Corbyn. So Labour MPs will have to be sacrificed in order to get rid of Corbyn.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
What right-wing tripe did she say to get herself banned?
Might have called all lefties ugly motherfu****s? I dunno.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
I didn't know Tissue Price was a Tory. Probably because he did not have a view on most matters. If he had, I cannot remember any.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
What right-wing tripe did she say to get herself banned?
That Donald Trump would be elected POTUS.
How we all laughed.
She didn't predict that - she predicted a narrow Hillary victory
At one point, yes. But you (and others) miss the point.
She refused to join the echo-chamber and she contributed news and opinions from sources that weren't in the Hillary camp. Plato showed us that there were two sides to the election.
1. Nominating Corbyn was a mistake. 2. He will be gone after the election. 3. Cooper, Starmer or Jarvis will be the likely candidates. 4. May will win. 5. Important that she does not get such an enormous win that there is no effective opposition. 6. If Hampstead remains Labour she, Tulip, will be one of the MPs providing such opposition, particularly in relation to Brexit. 7. I should think of the seat rather than Corbyn.
She really said all that? Admirably frank. Even though like you, I'd not be able to vote for herr given the circumstances.
It is the right strategy for Corbyn-sceptic Lab MPs though, appealing to party and personal loyalty. I pointed out the other day that which @Cyclefree also suggested was quite obvious - i.e. that enough votes for Labour would simply be taken as an endorsement of Corbyn, and allow him and his tendency to continue to flourish, however appalling the loss of seats. But I was swiftly, and probably correctly, reminded that most voters don't spend hours sat around talking politics like us, and that their analysis probably doesn't, therefore, run very deep.
If Labour MPs ask wavering supporters to back them for the sake of loyalty and/or to stop Theresa May having a gigantic majority, then it is possible that a lot of them will come back into the fold even though they might also loathe Corbyn and want him gone. The notion that their well-meaning support might be twisted into a vote of confidence in the man is something for further down the line after the election, and they may well not realise that this is a possibility until it happens. By which time, of course, it's too late.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Perhaps I can answer because I know and like them both.
TP first established his reputation on PB as a highly knowledgeable punter. I think he developed an interest in becoming an MP only fairly recently and even then he didn't become particularly political in his posts.
Nick has always been more political although he too is a shrewd punter. I think he was an MP when he first started posting here.
In short, I think it's Nick's more 'political' presence here that singles him out for more robust (and occasionally rude) treatment.
I was tempted to conclude that perhaps Labour representatives here get a rougher ride generally, but I recall Stewart Jackson MP used to attract a lot of flak when he was a regular poster here so I don't think the rule holds universally.
That help?
I don't find Nick to be especially partisan. I think he posted after the 2010 election that there were things that he knew from canvassing but wasn't at liberty to say publicly (and he did caveat his postings by saying he was a loyal Labour MP which would inform what he would say publicly, but that he would endeavour to not post things that he knew to be untrue.) , but I don't think he has been ramping or campaigning on here.
He's also quite willing to get into the statistical side of things, which I like.
I recall Stewart Jackson was more keen to get into the partisan back and forth, which PB.com isn't really the best venue.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
I didn't know Tissue Price was a Tory. Probably because he did not have a view on most matters. If he had, I cannot remember any.
Difference between having a view and stating a view.
1. Nominating Corbyn was a mistake. 2. He will be gone after the election. 3. Cooper, Starmer or Jarvis will be the likely candidates. 4. May will win. 5. Important that she does not get such an enormous win that there is no effective opposition. 6. If Hampstead remains Labour she, Tulip, will be one of the MPs providing such opposition, particularly in relation to Brexit. 7. I should think of the seat rather than Corbyn.
She really said all that? Admirably frank. Even though like you, I'd not be able to vote for herr given the circumstances.
She did indeed. I put her on the spot. I am a fearsome interrogator. And fair play to her. She didn't bullshit me in return. I liked her more than I expected to. I told her that I felt a bit sorry for her and others like her because they were in effect asking the electorate for a pity fuck. (And yes I said just that.) And she laughed.
There will, sadly, be a lot of good MPs who will lose their jobs because of the clots at the top. I will be sorry if Norman Lamb loses his seat, for instance, just as I was sorry that Ed Davey lost his. But Labour MPs have collectively behaved like a bunch of scared nitwits, willing to wound, afraid to strike. The hard left is ruthless. They should have been even more ruthless. They weren't and will now pay the price.
This is life. Sadly. And it doesn't just happen in politics. The ability of those at the top to fuck things up royally is a sight to behold. It is one reason why I am contemplating a serious career change.
In the end, you can only beat your head against a brick wall for so long before you decide that there are better things to do with your life - and head.
I have much the same problem here in Cannock Chase. Paul Dadge is a great candidate. He's a small business owner, a hero of 7/7, a nice guy, a local, every box ticked. I'd have voted for him two years ago (heck, if I could vote for them when they put forward the abject Janos Toth...).
But I am not going to vote for a party led by a man who hangs out with Holocaust Deniers, supports terrorists and has awkward questions to answer about his role in the Islington paedophilia scandal.
I hope he fights the seat next time as well, but that's as far as I'll go.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
I am from Eastbourne and my family still live there. They aren't especially political, but have been disappointed by the Tory incumbent. Meanwhile the former Lib Dem MP has carried on working hard and the joke is that he'll turn up for the opening of a fridge. I'd think they are in with a chance - though as the Eastbourne Herald has claimed Theresa May as a local girl that might help the Conservative.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
I didn't know Tissue Price was a Tory. Probably because he did not have a view on most matters. If he had, I cannot remember any.
1. Nominating Corbyn was a mistake. 2. He will be gone after the election. 3. Cooper, Starmer or Jarvis will be the likely candidates. 4. May will win. 5. Important that she does not get such an enormous win that there is no effective opposition. 6. If Hampstead remains Labour she, Tulip, will be one of the MPs providing such opposition, particularly in relation to Brexit. 7. I should think of the seat rather than Corbyn.
She really said all that? Admirably frank. Even though like you, I'd not be able to vote for herr given the circumstances.
It is the right strategy for Corbyn-sceptic Lab MPs though, appealing to party and personal loyalty. I pointed out the other day that which @Cyclefree also suggested was quite obvious - i.e. that enough votes for Labour would simply be taken as an endorsement of Corbyn, and allow him and his tendency to continue to flourish, however appalling the loss of seats. But I was swiftly, and probably correctly, reminded that most voters don't spend hours sat around talking politics like us, and that their analysis probably doesn't, therefore, run very deep.
If Labour MPs ask wavering supporters to back them for the sake of loyalty and/or to stop Theresa May having a gigantic majority, then it is possible that a lot of them will come back into the fold even though they might also loathe Corbyn and want him gone. The notion that their well-meaning support might be twisted into a vote of confidence in the man is something for further down the line after the election, and they may well not realise that this is a possibility until it happens. By which time, of course, it's too late.
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
FPT (and thanks to @Peter the Punter for your comments):-
Her line is this:-
1. Nominating Corbyn was a mistake. 2. He will be gone after the election. 3. Cooper, Starmer or Jarvis will be the likely candidates. 4. May will win. 5. Important that she does not get such an enormous win that there is no effective opposition. 6. If Hampstead remains Labour she, Tulip, will be one of the MPs providing such opposition, particularly in relation to Brexit. 7. I should think of the seat rather than Corbyn.
I can understand her strategy. It makes sense for her - and it may succeed, though it will be tight.
But - and it is a very big but indeed - every vote for Labour will be taken by Corbyn as a vote for him and will make it less likely that he will go.
So 2. won't happen. And if it does (or even if it doesn't) Labour have proved inept at no. 6.
I simply do not want to risk Corbyn using votes for Labour (even if they are given in spite of him rather than because of him) as a reason for him to stay in power and continue his destruction of the Labour party. So much as I liked Tulip and admired her willingness to fight for her seat (in all the time Glenda Jackson was MP I never sight nor sound of her) I simply cannot bring myself to vote for a Labour party which, collectively, has lost its moral compass - sad as that is for the decent people (and there are some - even though some of them have shown all the toughness of marshmallows) in it.
Corbyn and his particular brand of illiberal leftist politics need to be crushed. This is no time for sentimentality just because Corbyn speaks softly, makes jam and likes gardening. Corbynism is a virus which is destroying a once great and fundamentally decent party. That is a shame for us all, regardless of whether or not we support it.
In fact, as I keep repeating, Labour's canvassing should be this:
1. We are NOT going to win. 2. For the good of democracy, we should not have a landslide 3. How have I done personally as your MP ?
Tulip's arguments are very cogent.
Cogent up to a point only. Up to the point when you realize that a vote for a Labour MP is a vote for Corbyn. So Labour MPs will have to be sacrificed in order to get rid of Corbyn.
Believe me, Corbyn will be out or there will be a new grouping in the HoC , which immediately will become the Official Opposition.
As Rentoul says, a Corbyn loyalist will not be able to get a nomination anyway. If Corbyn stands, he will lose the members vote. One on one, in the second or third round, he will not get 50% of the votes against Yvette or Kier.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
What right-wing tripe did she say to get herself banned?
That Donald Trump would be elected POTUS.
How we all laughed.
She didn't predict that - she predicted a narrow Hillary victory
At one point, yes. But you (and others) miss the point.
She refused to join the echo-chamber and she contributed news and opinions from sources that weren't in the Hillary camp. Plato showed us that there were two sides to the election.
It would be a shame if people who didn't join in the echo chamber were dismissed as broken-brained meth-heads, wouldn't it?
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
I didn't know Tissue Price was a Tory. Probably because he did not have a view on most matters. If he had, I cannot remember any.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Perhaps I can answer because I know and like them both.
TP first established his reputation on PB as a highly knowledgeable punter. I think he developed an interest in becoming an MP only fairly recently and even then he didn't become particularly political in his posts.
Nick has always been more political although he too is a shrewd punter. I think he was an MP when he first started posting here.
In short, I think it's Nick's more 'political' presence here that singles him out for more robust (and occasionally rude) treatment.
I was tempted to conclude that perhaps Labour representatives here get a rougher ride generally, but I recall Stewart Jackson MP used to attract a lot of flak when he was a regular poster here so I don't think the rule holds universally.
That help?
I don't find Nick to be especially partisan. I think he posted after the 2010 election that there were things that he knew from canvassing but wasn't at liberty to say publicly (and he did caveat his postings by saying he was a loyal Labour MP which would inform what he would say publicly, but that he would endeavour to not post things that he knew to be untrue.) , but I don't think he has been ramping or campaigning on here.
He's also quite willing to get into the statistical side of things, which I like.
I recall Stewart Jackson was more keen to get into the partisan back and forth, which PB.com isn't really the best venue.
I think complete radio silence is the only realistic option if the alternative is an undertaking to "endeavour" not to post falsehoods.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
What right-wing tripe did she say to get herself banned?
That Donald Trump would be elected POTUS.
How we all laughed.
She didn't predict that - she predicted a narrow Hillary victory
At one point, yes. But you (and others) miss the point.
She refused to join the echo-chamber and she contributed news and opinions from sources that weren't in the Hillary camp. Plato showed us that there were two sides to the election.
It would be a shame if people who didn't join in the echo chamber were dismissed as broken-brained meth-heads, wouldn't it?
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
What right-wing tripe did she say to get herself banned?
That Donald Trump would be elected POTUS.
How we all laughed.
She didn't predict that - she predicted a narrow Hillary victory
At one point, yes. But you (and others) miss the point.
She refused to join the echo-chamber and she contributed news and opinions from sources that weren't in the Hillary camp. Plato showed us that there were two sides to the election.
Plato gave Trump a 60 per cent chance of victory when I asked her in the final week, so she can claim that as a win.
But 99 per cent of what she posted here was fake news, and most of it obviously fake. So obvious that she cannot actually have looked at it -- she was just copying and pasting from Twitter, so far as I could make out. I certainly wasted a lot of time watching dodgy Youtube videos and reading alt-right sites she linked to.
1. Nominating Corbyn was a mistake. 2. He will be gone after the election. 3. Cooper, Starmer or Jarvis will be the likely candidates. 4. May will win. 5. Important that she does not get such an enormous win that there is no effective opposition. 6. If Hampstead remains Labour she, Tulip, will be one of the MPs providing such opposition, particularly in relation to Brexit. 7. I should think of the seat rather than Corbyn.
She really said all that? Admirably frank. Even though like you, I'd not be able to vote for herr given the circumstances.
She did indeed. I put her on the spot. I am a fearsome interrogator
I can well imagine- all MPs need to be prepared to face a Cyclefree when out on the campaign trail, it would make many situations as an MP much easier.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Perhaps I can answer because I know and like them both.
TP first established his reputation on PB as a highly knowledgeable punter. I think he developed an interest in becoming an MP only fairly recently and even then he didn't become particularly political in his posts.
Nick has always been more political although he too is a shrewd punter. I think he was an MP when he first started posting here.
In short, I think it's Nick's more 'political' presence here that singles him out for more robust (and occasionally rude) treatment.
I was tempted to conclude that perhaps Labour representatives here get a rougher ride generally, but I recall Stewart Jackson MP used to attract a lot of flak when he was a regular poster here so I don't think the rule holds universally.
That help?
I don't find Nick to be especially partisan. I think he posted after the 2010 election that there were things that he knew from canvassing but wasn't at liberty to say publicly (and he did caveat his postings by saying he was a loyal Labour MP which would inform what he would say publicly, but that he would endeavour to not post things that he knew to be untrue.) , but I don't think he has been ramping or campaigning on here.
He's also quite willing to get into the statistical side of things, which I like.
I recall Stewart Jackson was more keen to get into the partisan back and forth, which PB.com isn't really the best venue.
I think complete radio silence is the only realistic option if the alternative is an undertaking to "endeavour" not to post falsehoods.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
She was one of the Tory £3ers for Corbyn. Presumably all the pious PB Tories saying what a disaster a Corbyn-led Labour is for UK democracy would think her banishment condign.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
What right-wing tripe did she say to get herself banned?
Might have called all lefties ugly motherfu****s? I dunno.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Actually I thought her linkages to the alt-right websites during the Trump campaign were useful in illuminating his tactics and giving a different perspective. It was her continued linkages after he was elected in order to support his fake news agenda that grated.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
She was one of the Tory £3ers for Corbyn. Presumably all the pious PB Tories saying what a disaster a Corbyn-led Labour is for UK democracy would think her banishment condign.
I personally regard that as the best £3 I've ever spent. Ever.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
She was one of the Tory £3ers for Corbyn. Presumably all the pious PB Tories saying what a disaster a Corbyn-led Labour is for UK democracy would think her banishment condign.
Hers was an interesting journey from Blairite, to floating voter, to Tory member, to alt-right.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler.
He's been a great sounding board for me when I edit PB during Mike's holidays.
I know for damn sure I've made a lot of money following his advice and tips.
I've gotten to know him a lot in the past couple of years, and I consider him a friend.
As for Nick, I met him two days before GE2015 and wished him the best of luck, and I was also chuffed when he was readopted in 2013.
He's also been a useful poster, whilst I understand what MPs/candidates are constrained by what they can say on websites,
It would be great for politics if we had more MPs like Aaron, who haven't done professional politics before.
Plus it would be great for PB if we had another MP on the board.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
She was one of the Tory £3ers for Corbyn. Presumably all the pious PB Tories saying what a disaster a Corbyn-led Labour is for UK democracy would think her banishment condign.
Hers was an interesting journey from Blairite, to floating voter, to Tory member, to alt-right.
I imagine she'll pop us as a Momentumite next.
To be honest, I don't believe the Blairite to floating voter bit. I also think she was a reluctant Tory. She voted Tory because there was very little choice.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler.
He's been a great sounding board for me when I edit PB during Mike's holidays.
I know for damn sure I've made a lot of money following his advice and tips.
I've gotten to know him a lot in the past couple of years, and I consider him a friend.
As for Nick, I met him two days before GE2015 and wished him the best of luck, and I was also chuffed when he was readopted in 2013.
It would be great for politics if we had more MPs like Aaron, who haven't done professional politics before.
Plus it would be great for PB if we had another MP on the board.
"Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler." - If he wins, I hope he is not in the Public Accounts Committee.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
He's visiting marginal Conservative seats he can't possibly win to show willing.
He's visiting safe Labour seats he can't possibly lose to keep him out of the way.
When he starts visiting Labour marginals, that's when Labour's back in the game.
Or not. Who could forget John O'Farrell's wonderfully bitter description of the 1983 Labour battlebus: 'this was a secret weapon that toured the marginal seats, helping to turn them into Conservative strongholds.'
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Perhaps I can answer because I know and like them both.
TP first established his reputation on PB as a highly knowledgeable punter. I think he developed an interest in becoming an MP only fairly recently and even then he didn't become particularly political in his posts.
Nick has always been more political although he too is a shrewd punter. I think he was an MP when he first started posting here.
In short, I think it's Nick's more 'political' presence here that singles him out for more robust (and occasionally rude) treatment.
I was tempted to conclude that perhaps Labour representatives here get a rougher ride generally, but I recall Stewart Jackson MP used to attract a lot of flak when he was a regular poster here so I don't think the rule holds universally.
That help?
I don't find Nick to be especially partisan. I think he posted after the 2010 election that there were things that he knew from canvassing but wasn't at liberty to say publicly (and he did caveat his postings by saying he was a loyal Labour MP which would inform what he would say publicly, but that he would endeavour to not post things that he knew to be untrue.) , but I don't think he has been ramping or campaigning on here.
He's also quite willing to get into the statistical side of things, which I like.
I recall Stewart Jackson was more keen to get into the partisan back and forth, which PB.com isn't really the best venue.
I think complete radio silence is the only realistic option if the alternative is an undertaking to "endeavour" not to post falsehoods.
Probably a poor choice of words from me
Well... post-2015 he conceded that he had a policy which tended to accentuate the positive and eliminate the negative (more precisely, that he dramatically cut down reports in the final week when it was clear things were less than rosy). Understandable, but a good argument for saying nowt at any stage.
No, people have had 44 years of being in the EU. They know how it works.
Sadly, many don't. Many haven't got a clue about the difference between the European parliament and the Commission. And most view the EU as always having been a foreign power separate from Britain, charging huge fees to impose unwanted rules. They will give you a blank look if you try to explain that the acquis was incorporated into British law post-referendum result, meaning that if it was straight cucumbers before then it will be straight cucumbers outside the union too. I have even met people who think Britain has already left the EU.
I would give you a blank look if you tried to explain that the acquis was incorporated into British law post-referendum result. The ghastly truth about democracy is that thick proles vote and the only way to mitigate that fact is by reasoning with them, in terms they understand, beforehand, not sneering at them on niche websites a year later. Do a lot of canvassing last June?
OK, I should have said that the government has promised to introduce a Great Reform Bill to incorporate the acquis. I wasn't sneering, and I've never done any canvassing. I talk to people, though, and ISTM that most people are largely unfamiliar with how the EU works. They are of course very familiar with the fact that membership means that Poles, Lithuanians, Romanians and Bulgarians can come here and don't have to apply for work permits.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
She was one of the Tory £3ers for Corbyn. Presumably all the pious PB Tories saying what a disaster a Corbyn-led Labour is for UK democracy would think her banishment condign.
Hers was an interesting journey from Blairite, to floating voter, to Tory member, to alt-right.
I imagine she'll pop us as a Momentumite next.
To be honest, I don't believe the Blairite to floating voter bit. I also think she was a reluctant Tory. She voted Tory because there was very little choice.
She was a card-carrying member of the Conservative Party.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
No. Corbyn was always a member of the Labour party, even though at the fringes. Each party has about 20-25 of these mavericks [ I am choosing my words carefully ]. There were also MPs in John Major's time who were at the other end but they were proper Conservatives. The only exception I would make would probably be Harvey Proctor.
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
An increasingly probable scenario. I think the conflict within the Labour Party is likely to play out as follows:
1. The current situation indicated by most of the polls is wrong: Labour will not poll 30%+. But nor will it collapse. The ICM data, which generally puts it somewhere in the neighbourhood of Michael Foot territory, is nearer the mark. Labour could conceivably do slightly worse than Foot, but if so it won't be by very much. It still has too many tribally loyal voters left, in addition to remaining core voter groups like the very young, the very poor, public sector workers, Muslim voters, upper middle-class faux Marxists and genuine Far Left sympathisers, all of whom find at least parts of the Corbynite platform very appealing. I expect Labour to finish short of 200 seats, but not to be totally routed.
2. The majority of the party membership are Corbyn enthusiasts, and at least a large part of them are oblivious to the mood of the country and convinced that their man is on the verge of sweeping to power. When they are disabused of this notion, they will be crestfallen, and about five minutes later incandescent with thwarted, frustrated, bitter rage. The three likely targets of said rage will be (1) ungrateful, selfish and stupid voters, (2) the dreaded MSM, and (3) Blairites (i.e. everybody in the Labour Movement deemed insufficiently loyal to the leader, including the bulk of the PLP.) Most of all, it'll be the Blairites who cop the flak, and get the blame (because, for the Far Left, everybody is to blame for their failures except they themselves.)
3. Therefore, the notion that the Labour Party mass membership will meekly accept the verdict of the ballot box is for the birds. If the Corbynites lack the numbers to nominate a successor, Jeremy will fight whatever challengers the PLP manages to put up and wipe the floor with them. Labour will probably then split, with SDP Mk.2 having the bulk of the MPs but Rump Labour retaining much of the surviving Labour core vote. Under those circumstances, it doesn't, of course, matter at all if the two rival parties put together poll 35% or even 40%; unless SDP Mk.2 can somehow kill Rump Labour quickly, then they'll be so busy scratching each others' eyes out for years on end that the Conservatives will have carte blanche to do whatever they please during the coming Parliament, and then wipe most of SDP Mk.2 out at the General Election after next.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Perhaps I can answer because I know and like them both.
TP first established his reputation on PB as a highly knowledgeable punter. I think he developed an interest in becoming an MP only fairly recently and even then he didn't become particularly political in his posts.
Nick has always been more political although he too is a shrewd punter. I think he was an MP when he first started posting here.
In short, I think it's Nick's more 'political' presence here that singles him out for more robust (and occasionally rude) treatment.
I was tempted to conclude that perhaps Labour representatives here get a rougher ride generally, but I recall Stewart Jackson MP used to attract a lot of flak when he was a regular poster here so I don't think the rule holds universally.
That help?
I am old enough to remember RikW, the Tory candidate for Sutton & Cheam in the '05 Election. Appalling partisan ramper with no sense of humour whatsoever.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler.
He's been a great sounding board for me when I edit PB during Mike's holidays.
I know for damn sure I've made a lot of money following his advice and tips.
I've gotten to know him a lot in the past couple of years, and I consider him a friend.
As for Nick, I met him two days before GE2015 and wished him the best of luck, and I was also chuffed when he was readopted in 2013.
It would be great for politics if we had more MPs like Aaron, who haven't done professional politics before.
Plus it would be great for PB if we had another MP on the board.
"Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler." - If he wins, I hope he is not in the Public Accounts Committee.
Let's all hope he gets onto the Gambling Commission and makes them do something about the iniquitous way Bookmakers close the accounts of successful punters.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Perhaps I can answer because I know and like them both.
TP first established his reputation on PB as a highly knowledgeable punter. I think he developed an interest in becoming an MP only fairly recently and even then he didn't become particularly political in his posts.
Nick has always been more political although he too is a shrewd punter. I think he was an MP when he first started posting here.
In short, I think it's Nick's more 'political' presence here that singles him out for more robust (and occasionally rude) treatment.
I was tempted to conclude that perhaps Labour representatives here get a rougher ride generally, but I recall Stewart Jackson MP used to attract a lot of flak when he was a regular poster here so I don't think the rule holds universally.
That help?
I am old enough to remember RikW, the Tory candidate for Sutton & Cheam in the '05 Election. Appalling partisan ramper with no sense of humour whatsoever.
Your memory is better than mine, young Carp.
Yes, it all comes back to me now. He used to get a fairly torrid time though, didn't he?
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Perhaps I can answer because I know and like them both.
TP first established his reputation on PB as a highly knowledgeable punter. I think he developed an interest in becoming an MP only fairly recently and even then he didn't become particularly political in his posts.
Nick has always been more political although he too is a shrewd punter. I think he was an MP when he first started posting here.
In short, I think it's Nick's more 'political' presence here that singles him out for more robust (and occasionally rude) treatment.
I was tempted to conclude that perhaps Labour representatives here get a rougher ride generally, but I recall Stewart Jackson MP used to attract a lot of flak when he was a regular poster here so I don't think the rule holds universally.
That help?
I don't find Nick to be especially partisan. I think he posted after the 2010 election that there were things that he knew from canvassing but wasn't at liberty to say publicly (and he did caveat his postings by saying he was a loyal Labour MP which would inform what he would say publicly, but that he would endeavour to not post things that he knew to be untrue.) , but I don't think he has been ramping or campaigning on here.
He's also quite willing to get into the statistical side of things, which I like.
I recall Stewart Jackson was more keen to get into the partisan back and forth, which PB.com isn't really the best venue.
Both are informative, and, more importantly, polite. Neither villifies those who do not agree with them. That this is effective politics - Nick has previously said that you don't persuade anyone to agree with you by abusing you - takes nothing away from it's laudability on a site such as this.
With the papers' covering his apparent weakness for the IRA (etc) JC's goose is overcooked with ordinary workers. I hope that local MPs who don't support him will be returned. Then, will a Phoenix arise from the ashes? Ed Balls or Yvette Cooper or....? David Miliband would be a very bad choice; plainly he's not tough enough.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Perhaps I can answer because I know and like them both.
TP first established his reputation on PB as a highly knowledgeable punter. I think he developed an interest in becoming an MP only fairly recently and even then he didn't become particularly political in his posts.
Nick has always been more political although he too is a shrewd punter. I think he was an MP when he first started posting here.
In short, I think it's Nick's more 'political' presence here that singles him out for more robust (and occasionally rude) treatment.
I was tempted to conclude that perhaps Labour representatives here get a rougher ride generally, but I recall Stewart Jackson MP used to attract a lot of flak when he was a regular poster here so I don't think the rule holds universally.
That help?
I don't find Nick to be especially partisan. I think he posted after the 2010 election that there were things that he knew from canvassing but wasn't at liberty to say publicly (and he did caveat his postings by saying he was a loyal Labour MP which would inform what he would say publicly, but that he would endeavour to not post things that he knew to be untrue.) , but I don't think he has been ramping or campaigning on here.
He's also quite willing to get into the statistical side of things, which I like.
I recall Stewart Jackson was more keen to get into the partisan back and forth, which PB.com isn't really the best venue.
Nick has previously said that you don't persuade anyone to agree with you by abusing you .
Certainly true, although also certainly true that most political discourse is not done to persuade.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
Funny, when I was likely to stand for Parliament, I was told I might get sued by Jim Messina for linking to Mark Pack's website! Bankrupts cant MP's they told me!
Gentle encouragement!
Mind you, I didn't really have any chance of winning so it didnt matter anyway
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Perhaps I can answer because I know and like them both.
TP first established his reputation on PB as a highly knowledgeable punter. I think he developed an interest in becoming an MP only fairly recently and even then he didn't become particularly political in his posts.
Nick has always been more political although he too is a shrewd punter. I think he was an MP when he first started posting here.
In short, I think it's Nick's more 'political' presence here that singles him out for more robust (and occasionally rude) treatment.
I was tempted to conclude that perhaps Labour representatives here get a rougher ride generally, but I recall Stewart Jackson MP used to attract a lot of flak when he was a regular poster here so I don't think the rule holds universally.
That help?
I am old enough to remember RikW, the Tory candidate for Sutton & Cheam in the '05 Election. Appalling partisan ramper with no sense of humour whatsoever.
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
An increasingly probable scenario. I think the conflict within the Labour Party is likely to play out as follows:
1. The current situation ..........
2. The majority of the party membership are Corbyn enthusiasts, ............
3. Therefore, the notion that the Labour Party mass membership will meekly accept the verdict of the ballot box is for the birds. If the Corbynites lack the numbers to nominate a successor, Jeremy will fight whatever challengers the PLP manages to put up and wipe the floor with them. Labour will probably then split, with SDP Mk.2 having the bulk of the MPs but Rump Labour retaining much of the surviving Labour core vote. Under those circumstances, it doesn't, of course, matter at all if the two rival parties put together poll 35% or even 40%; unless SDP Mk.2 can somehow kill Rump Labour quickly, then they'll be so busy scratching each others' eyes out for years on end that the Conservatives will have carte blanche to do whatever they please during the coming Parliament, and then wipe most of SDP Mk.2 out at the General Election after next.
I disagree with you. I am not going to rebut your points line by line but I will answer your point #3.
In 1983, very few MPs actually defected. Only 26 if I recall. The party as a whole and its MPs stayed loyal.
The SDP/Libs did not get enough seats to make an impact. In fact, Labour still elected 209 MPs including Scotland. Ironically, if they achieve, 180-190, they would be doing better in England.
If Corbyn stays [ He will not be able to wipe the floor, believe me ], the new grouping in the HoC, having resigned the Labour whip, becomes the official opposition.
That will be the main difference between 2017/2018 and 1983/1984. Night after night, on TV, people will begin to see sensible left of centre faces opposing the by-then unpopular Tory government. The Liberals will be too small to matter. I think , if the Liberals do not reach 12 seats this time, it may begin to subside gradually.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
There aren't too many Corbynistas here.
Some former Corbynistas, surely?
Like who ?
I don't know, that's why it was a question. Some people voted for him, and not only PB Tories, I presume.
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"...It is one reason why I am contemplating a serious career change.
In the end, you can only beat your head against a brick wall for so long before you decide that there are better things to do with your life - and head."
Are you still pondering, Mrs. Free? Is there anything to really ponder about? You children are grown up, so what is stopping you doing what you want to do? Is it money? It was for me when I was thinking about bailing out of the public sector do do what I really wanted to do. In the end I just went for it and hang the financial security. There are a lot more important things in life, like enjoying it, we only get one crack at it and there isn't much to be said for being a financially secure corpse.
I know that there are at least three others who regularly post on this site who have made similar life changing decisions and all of us seem to have done OK. Financially at the very least we have all kept the lupine pest from lolling around on the front doorstep and I think we have all been much happier doing what we wanted to do.
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"not for the few .... but for the many" was also Tony Blair's line in 1997 !
An increasingly probable scenario. I think the conflict within the Labour Party is likely to play out as follows:
1. The current situation indicated by most of the polls is wrong: Labour will not poll 30%+. But nor will it collapse. The ICM data, which generally puts it somewhere in the neighbourhood of Michael Foot territory, is nearer the mark. Labour could conceivably do slightly worse than Foot, but if so it won't be by very much. It still has too many tribally loyal voters left, in addition to remaining core voter groups like the very young, the very poor, public sector workers, Muslim voters, upper middle-class faux Marxists and genuine Far Left sympathisers, all of whom find at least parts of the Corbynite platform very appealing. I expect Labour to finish short of 200 seats, but not to be totally routed.
2. The majority of the party membership are Corbyn enthusiasts, and at least a large part of them are oblivious to the mood of the country and convinced that their man is on the verge of sweeping to power. When they are disabused of this notion, they will be crestfallen, and about five minutes later incandescent with thwarted, frustrated, bitter rage. The three likely targets of said rage will be (1) ungrateful, selfish and stupid voters, (2) the dreaded MSM, and (3) Blairites (i.e. everybody in the Labour Movement deemed insufficiently loyal to the leader, including the bulk of the PLP.) Most of all, it'll be the Blairites who cop the flak, and get the blame (because, for the Far Left, everybody is to blame for their failures except they themselves.)
3. Therefore, the notion that the Labour Party mass membership will meekly accept the verdict of the ballot box is for the birds. If the Corbynites lack the numbers to nominate a successor, Jeremy will fight whatever challengers the PLP manages to put up and wipe the floor with them. Labour will probably then split, with SDP Mk.2 having the bulk of the MPs but Rump Labour retaining much of the surviving Labour core vote. Under those circumstances, it doesn't, of course, matter at all if the two rival parties put together poll 35% or even 40%; unless SDP Mk.2 can somehow kill Rump Labour quickly, then they'll be so busy scratching each others' eyes out for years on end that the Conservatives will have carte blanche to do whatever they please during the coming Parliament, and then wipe most of SDP Mk.2 out at the General Election after next.
Under 2. you omitted the fact that the system is rigged.
Do we have any feel for the membership of the much-diminished PLP after the election as between Corbynistas and normal people - does that division map onto marginality/safety of seat at all? And what are the chances of the Labour conference implementing the reduction of minimum number of nominations from MPs in leadership elections from 15% to 5%?
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"not for the few .... but for the many" was also Tony Blair's line in 1997 !
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"not for the few .... but for the many" was also Tony Blair's line in 1997 !
Well, he certainly had the backing of the many, unlike Corbyn's Labour at least.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
There aren't too many Corbynistas here.
Some former Corbynistas, surely?
Like who ?
I don't know, that's why it was a question. Some people voted for him, and not only PB Tories, I presume.
I am sure a lot, in fact, a majority including the £3ers. Personally, I am not totally convinced that he would have got 50% in 2015 had it not been for the £3ers.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
There aren't too many Corbynistas here.
Some former Corbynistas, surely?
Like who ?
I don't know, that's why it was a question. Some people voted for him, and not only PB Tories, I presume.
I think BJO still supports Corbyn.
I voted for him in 2015, for reasons well documented, but I would never have described myself as a Corbynite.
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
They used to say the Church of England was the Tory party at prayer, these days the church leaders are most definitely Corbynites.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
There aren't too many Corbynistas here.
Some former Corbynistas, surely?
Like who ?
I don't know, that's why it was a question. Some people voted for him, and not only PB Tories, I presume.
I am sure a lot, in fact, a majority including the £3ers. Personally, I am not totally convinced that he would have got 50% in 2015 had it not been for the £3ers.
I was talking about Labour supporters in PB.
I thought he received the majority in all blocks of the party, both £3ers and full members?
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"not for the few .... but for the many" was also Tony Blair's line in 1997 !
Spock also uttered a very similar phrase.
Quite so, he was a font of wisdom - from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs was one of his too, I'm sure of it.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
There aren't too many Corbynistas here.
Some former Corbynistas, surely?
Like who ?
I don't know, that's why it was a question. Some people voted for him, and not only PB Tories, I presume.
I am sure a lot, in fact, a majority including the £3ers. Personally, I am not totally convinced that he would have got 50% in 2015 had it not been for the £3ers.
I was talking about Labour supporters in PB.
So was I - did none vote for Corbyn either time? It's not a trick question, I don't know, though I feel like someone at least must have if only once.
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"not for the few .... but for the many" was also Tony Blair's line in 1997 !
Spock also uttered a very similar phrase.
Quite so, he was a font of wisdom - from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs was one of his too, I'm sure of it.
Similarly, Chancellor Palpatine has some good quotes on security and stability...
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
There aren't too many Corbynistas here.
Some former Corbynistas, surely?
Like who ?
I don't know, that's why it was a question. Some people voted for him, and not only PB Tories, I presume.
I am sure a lot, in fact, a majority including the £3ers. Personally, I am not totally convinced that he would have got 50% in 2015 had it not been for the £3ers.
I was talking about Labour supporters in PB.
I thought he received the majority in all blocks of the party, both £3ers and full members?
Wasn't it 47 or 48% of the members ? I could be wrong.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler.
He's been a great sounding board for me when I edit PB during Mike's holidays.
I know for damn sure I've made a lot of money following his advice and tips.
I've gotten to know him a lot in the past couple of years, and I consider him a friend.
As for Nick, I met him two days before GE2015 and wished him the best of luck, and I was also chuffed when he was readopted in 2013.
It would be great for politics if we had more MPs like Aaron, who haven't done professional politics before.
Plus it would be great for PB if we had another MP on the board.
"Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler." - If he wins, I hope he is not in the Public Accounts Committee.
Let's all hope he gets onto the Gambling Commission and makes them do something about the iniquitous way Bookmakers close the accounts of successful punters.
Sunbets;
"As a courtesy, we wish to inform you that following an account review, we are no longer able to offer you access to certain enhanced odds and promotional offers. As you may be aware, this is usual practice in our industry."
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"not for the few .... but for the many" was also Tony Blair's line in 1997 !
Spock also uttered a very similar phrase.
Quite so, he was a font of wisdom - from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs was one of his too, I'm sure of it.
Tough on Klingons, tough on the causes of Klingons.
Anyone seen Plato? I share no brief for her politics but she did provide a useful commentary on Eastbourne in 2015. LD's might hope to regain that seat or more likely Lewes next door
Still on the naughty step. Not sure if it is permanent.
Yes, Plato is now on Morris's blog/twitter account every day with lots of animal photos and stories. I asked her if she wanted to return to PB but got no answer.
She should stay away.
I was already banned when Plato was booted. What did she do that was so terrible?
I think it was the continual linkages to alt-right fake news sites that did it.
My personal view [ it is not my website ] is that views from the Right to the Left should be accommodated. But not the extreme Right or the extreme Left. So no alt-Right and no SWP types.
Does that mean we should ban Corbyn supporters?
Aren't they suffering enough right now? If they can't even vent at the rest of us they might explode.
There aren't too many Corbynistas here.
Some former Corbynistas, surely?
Like who ?
I don't know, that's why it was a question. Some people voted for him, and not only PB Tories, I presume.
I think BJO still supports Corbyn.
I voted for him in 2015, for reasons well documented, but I would never have described myself as a Corbynite.
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"not for the few .... but for the many" was also Tony Blair's line in 1997 !
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
Did your church service mention a man with a beard and the initials JC?
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"not for the few .... but for the many" was also Tony Blair's line in 1997 !
Spock also uttered a very similar phrase.
Quite so, he was a font of wisdom - from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs was one of his too, I'm sure of it.
Similarly, Chancellor Palpatine has some good quotes on security and stability...
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"not for the few .... but for the many" was also Tony Blair's line in 1997 !
Spock also uttered a very similar phrase.
Quite so, he was a font of wisdom - from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs was one of his too, I'm sure of it.
Tough on Klingons, tough on the causes of Klingons.
Like Shakespeare, that slogan is best in the original Klingon
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
Did your church service mention a man with a beard and the initials JC?
The case isn't comparable. Joshua bar Joseph called the Christ wore sandals.
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler.
He's been a great sounding board for me when I edit PB during Mike's holidays.
I know for damn sure I've made a lot of money following his advice and tips.
I've gotten to know him a lot in the past couple of years, and I consider him a friend.
As for Nick, I met him two days before GE2015 and wished him the best of luck, and I was also chuffed when he was readopted in 2013.
It would be great for politics if we had more MPs like Aaron, who haven't done professional politics before.
Plus it would be great for PB if we had another MP on the board.
"Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler." - If he wins, I hope he is not in the Public Accounts Committee.
Let's all hope he gets onto the Gambling Commission and makes them do something about the iniquitous way Bookmakers close the accounts of successful punters.
Sunbets;
"As a courtesy, we wish to inform you that following an account review, we are no longer able to offer you access to certain enhanced odds and promotional offers. As you may be aware, this is usual practice in our industry."
My crime? Attempting to bet on out-of-line odds.
Bet was rejected, odds slashed, email received.
I've never won a bet with them.
"this is usual practice in our industry"
pft.
What do successful punters do about this? I've spent a few months gambling now - I've had one account closed, and six or seven others not taking bets above £10 or so. I'm not a major player by any means. Presumably major gamblers run out of bookies very quickly?
What has Tissue Price ever done to deserve the ludicrously overdone praise on here? I'm sure he is a nice bloke - but so is Nick, yet he and other PBMPs don't receive such sycophantic adulation!
Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler.
He's been a great sounding board for me when I edit PB during Mike's holidays.
I know for damn sure I've made a lot of money following his advice and tips.
I've gotten to know him a lot in the past couple of years, and I consider him a friend.
As for Nick, I met him two days before GE2015 and wished him the best of luck, and I was also chuffed when he was readopted in 2013.
It would be great for politics if we had more MPs like Aaron, who haven't done professional politics before.
Plus it would be great for PB if we had another MP on the board.
"Because first and foremost he's a top tipster and gambler." - If he wins, I hope he is not in the Public Accounts Committee.
Let's all hope he gets onto the Gambling Commission and makes them do something about the iniquitous way Bookmakers close the accounts of successful punters.
Sunbets;
"As a courtesy, we wish to inform you that following an account review, we are no longer able to offer you access to certain enhanced odds and promotional offers. As you may be aware, this is usual practice in our industry."
My crime? Attempting to bet on out-of-line odds.
Bet was rejected, odds slashed, email received.
I've never won a bet with them.
"this is usual practice in our industry"
pft.
You don't have to be a Hypocritical Coward to be a Bookmaker... but it helps
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
Did your church service mention a man with a beard and the initials JC?
Indeed. And I would not be surprised if Labour get a higher vote than we might expect precisely because of this. All it will mean is that Labour - as a decent left of centre party rather than a combination of the SWP/Respect - dies completely.
I was at a church service yesterday marking the start of Christian Aid week. Included in the material was some phrasing very close to Labour's slogan for this GE.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"not for the few .... but for the many" was also Tony Blair's line in 1997 !
Spock also uttered a very similar phrase.
Quite so, he was a font of wisdom - from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs was one of his too, I'm sure of it.
Didn't Kirk ask him (in Wrath of Khan) how each of the trainees will do under pressure and he said something like; "like as with all things, each according to his gifts"?
Comments
There will, sadly, be a lot of good MPs who will lose their jobs because of the clots at the top. I will be sorry if Norman Lamb loses his seat, for instance, just as I was sorry that Ed Davey lost his. But Labour MPs have collectively behaved like a bunch of scared nitwits, willing to wound, afraid to strike. The hard left is ruthless. They should have been even more ruthless. They weren't and will now pay the price.
This is life. Sadly. And it doesn't just happen in politics. The ability of those at the top to fuck things up royally is a sight to behold. It is one reason why I am contemplating a serious career change.
In the end, you can only beat your head against a brick wall for so long before you decide that there are better things to do with your life - and head.
I expect most of her vote comes from the Kilburn end of constituency where they wouldn't be likely to set foot. It's a bit rough down there. In some parts, you can walk all of twenty yards without finding a coffee shop.
She refused to join the echo-chamber and she contributed news and opinions from sources that weren't in the Hillary camp. Plato showed us that there were two sides to the election.
If Labour MPs ask wavering supporters to back them for the sake of loyalty and/or to stop Theresa May having a gigantic majority, then it is possible that a lot of them will come back into the fold even though they might also loathe Corbyn and want him gone. The notion that their well-meaning support might be twisted into a vote of confidence in the man is something for further down the line after the election, and they may well not realise that this is a possibility until it happens. By which time, of course, it's too late.
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=CITIZEN+SMITH&FORM=IARRTH&ufn=Citizen+Smith&stid=0797a0b5-0076-9231-f29d-69c26d27c71d&cbn=EntityAnswer&cbi=0&FORM=IARRTH
He's also quite willing to get into the statistical side of things, which I like.
I recall Stewart Jackson was more keen to get into the partisan back and forth, which PB.com isn't really the best venue.
But I am not going to vote for a party led by a man who hangs out with Holocaust Deniers, supports terrorists and has awkward questions to answer about his role in the Islington paedophilia scandal.
I hope he fights the seat next time as well, but that's as far as I'll go.
As Rentoul says, a Corbyn loyalist will not be able to get a nomination anyway. If Corbyn stands, he will lose the members vote. One on one, in the second or third round, he will not get 50% of the votes against Yvette or Kier.
But 99 per cent of what she posted here was fake news, and most of it obviously fake. So obvious that she cannot actually have looked at it -- she was just copying and pasting from Twitter, so far as I could make out. I certainly wasted a lot of time watching dodgy Youtube videos and reading alt-right sites she linked to.
Presumably all the pious PB Tories saying what a disaster a Corbyn-led Labour is for UK democracy would think her banishment condign.
https://twitter.com/seanair_iain/status/864041440455913474
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39927866
I imagine she'll pop us as a Momentumite next.
Don't mention it!
(Sorry, couldn't resist!)
He's been a great sounding board for me when I edit PB during Mike's holidays.
I know for damn sure I've made a lot of money following his advice and tips.
I've gotten to know him a lot in the past couple of years, and I consider him a friend.
As for Nick, I met him two days before GE2015 and wished him the best of luck, and I was also chuffed when he was readopted in 2013.
He's also been a useful poster, whilst I understand what MPs/candidates are constrained by what they can say on websites,
It would be great for politics if we had more MPs like Aaron, who haven't done professional politics before.
Plus it would be great for PB if we had another MP on the board.
He's visiting marginal Conservative seats he can't possibly win to show willing.
He's visiting safe Labour seats he can't possibly lose to keep him out of the way.
When he starts visiting Labour marginals, that's when Labour's back in the game.
Or not. Who could forget John O'Farrell's wonderfully bitter description of the 1983 Labour battlebus: 'this was a secret weapon that toured the marginal seats, helping to turn them into Conservative strongholds.'
The only exception I would make would probably be Harvey Proctor.
1. The current situation indicated by most of the polls is wrong: Labour will not poll 30%+. But nor will it collapse. The ICM data, which generally puts it somewhere in the neighbourhood of Michael Foot territory, is nearer the mark. Labour could conceivably do slightly worse than Foot, but if so it won't be by very much. It still has too many tribally loyal voters left, in addition to remaining core voter groups like the very young, the very poor, public sector workers, Muslim voters, upper middle-class faux Marxists and genuine Far Left sympathisers, all of whom find at least parts of the Corbynite platform very appealing. I expect Labour to finish short of 200 seats, but not to be totally routed.
2. The majority of the party membership are Corbyn enthusiasts, and at least a large part of them are oblivious to the mood of the country and convinced that their man is on the verge of sweeping to power. When they are disabused of this notion, they will be crestfallen, and about five minutes later incandescent with thwarted, frustrated, bitter rage. The three likely targets of said rage will be (1) ungrateful, selfish and stupid voters, (2) the dreaded MSM, and (3) Blairites (i.e. everybody in the Labour Movement deemed insufficiently loyal to the leader, including the bulk of the PLP.) Most of all, it'll be the Blairites who cop the flak, and get the blame (because, for the Far Left, everybody is to blame for their failures except they themselves.)
3. Therefore, the notion that the Labour Party mass membership will meekly accept the verdict of the ballot box is for the birds. If the Corbynites lack the numbers to nominate a successor, Jeremy will fight whatever challengers the PLP manages to put up and wipe the floor with them. Labour will probably then split, with SDP Mk.2 having the bulk of the MPs but Rump Labour retaining much of the surviving Labour core vote. Under those circumstances, it doesn't, of course, matter at all if the two rival parties put together poll 35% or even 40%; unless SDP Mk.2 can somehow kill Rump Labour quickly, then they'll be so busy scratching each others' eyes out for years on end that the Conservatives will have carte blanche to do whatever they please during the coming Parliament, and then wipe most of SDP Mk.2 out at the General Election after next.
Good evening, everyone.
Yes, it all comes back to me now. He used to get a fairly torrid time though, didn't he?
Deserved it, of course.
That this is effective politics - Nick has previously said that you don't persuade anyone to agree with you by abusing you - takes nothing away from it's laudability on a site such as this.
Gentle encouragement!
Mind you, I didn't really have any chance of winning so it didnt matter anyway
https://twitter.com/MikkiL/status/864192271532642305
In 1983, very few MPs actually defected. Only 26 if I recall. The party as a whole and its MPs stayed loyal.
The SDP/Libs did not get enough seats to make an impact. In fact, Labour still elected 209 MPs including Scotland. Ironically, if they achieve, 180-190, they would be doing better in England.
If Corbyn stays [ He will not be able to wipe the floor, believe me ], the new grouping in the HoC, having resigned the Labour whip, becomes the official opposition.
That will be the main difference between 2017/2018 and 1983/1984. Night after night, on TV, people will begin to see sensible left of centre faces opposing the by-then unpopular Tory government. The Liberals will be too small to matter. I think , if the Liberals do not reach 12 seats this time, it may begin to subside gradually.
".... not only for the few .... but for the many...."
Coincidence? I would think this material has been available since well before the GE was called. Maybe someone noted the line & suggested the slogan.
Nevertheless, it was there. Will it sway any votes? Who knows.
"...It is one reason why I am contemplating a serious career change.
In the end, you can only beat your head against a brick wall for so long before you decide that there are better things to do with your life - and head."
Are you still pondering, Mrs. Free? Is there anything to really ponder about? You children are grown up, so what is stopping you doing what you want to do? Is it money? It was for me when I was thinking about bailing out of the public sector do do what I really wanted to do. In the end I just went for it and hang the financial security. There are a lot more important things in life, like enjoying it, we only get one crack at it and there isn't much to be said for being a financially secure corpse.
I know that there are at least three others who regularly post on this site who have made similar life changing decisions and all of us seem to have done OK. Financially at the very least we have all kept the lupine pest from lolling around on the front doorstep and I think we have all been much happier doing what we wanted to do.
Do we have any feel for the membership of the much-diminished PLP after the election as between Corbynistas and normal people - does that division map onto marginality/safety of seat at all? And what are the chances of the Labour conference implementing the reduction of minimum number of nominations from MPs in leadership elections from 15% to 5%?
I was talking about Labour supporters in PB.
I voted for him in 2015, for reasons well documented, but I would never have described myself as a Corbynite.
"As a courtesy, we wish to inform you that following an account review, we are no longer able to offer you access to certain enhanced odds and promotional offers. As you may be aware, this is usual practice in our industry."
My crime? Attempting to bet on out-of-line odds.
Bet was rejected, odds slashed, email received.
I've never won a bet with them.
"this is usual practice in our industry"
pft.
Reinforces big picture overwhelmingly - he doesn't look like a PM.
http://aboutasfarasdelgados.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/you-dont-have-to-be-hypocritical-coward.html