Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

Options

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Opinium: Most of those polled say 2nd Scottish IndyRef ‘not ju

135

Comments

  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,193
    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    chestnut said:

    Vincenzo Scarpetta‏ @LondonerVince 8h8 hours ago

    Berlusconi has unveiled a revamped election manifesto including a 'parallel currency' (new lira alongside €). Big.

    The mark of a single currency is not only that all other currencies must be extinguished but that the capacity of other institutions to issue currencies must also be extinguished

    N. Tebbit, 30 October 1990
    I'm sorry, but that's appalling ignorant comment from Mr Tebbit.

    There are lots of parallel currencies in the world, in the UK, and in the Eurozone. They range from cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin, through airmiles, gold, US dollars and various other tradable things.

    In Greece, the government created an alternative monetary system to enable them to pay bills during the height of their crisis a few years ago. They would pay you with an IOU that would be redeemable at some point in the future. Said IOUs (trading at a sizeable discount to face value) were used as money as suppliers paid their suppliers, etc. etc. etc.

    My favourite example of an alternative monetary system was Ireland in the 1970s, when all the bank clerks in the country went on strike for several months. Cheques were endorsed and re-endorsed and passed from person to person. New currencies sprung into existence to enable people to continue to do business. What was truly extraordinary is that almost no-one attempted to cheat the system.

    So, Mr Tebbit is surely wrong that the capacity of "other institutions to issue currencies" is or has been extinguished.

    If you want to leave the Euro, the only sensible plan that has been drafted so far is that of the Front National in France. Creating a parallel Lira in Italy wouldn't work, because no-one would want to be paid in it, because it would have been created with the explicit purpose of devaluation. Really, to leave the Euro you simply need to bite the bullet, close the banks for a week or ten days, and pass legislation to move everyone onto a new currency. You need to do this in absolute secrecy, otherwise you will crash the banking system through deposit flight ahead of you leaving the Euro. You also need to put in stabalisers to deal with the fact that many companies are going to have entered into contracts that they will be unable to fulfil, due to the Euro price of services being (top of the head) 30% higher than they were beforehand.
    I knew you wouldn't be able to resist, the Ireland example is a good one. I think the powers that be will find it difficult to keep it a secret should any country want to leave the Euro. What do you think the chances are that a country will leave the Euro in the next year or two?
  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    isam said:

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Nick Palmer FPT


    I locked myself out the other day and had a locksmith round. He openly offered me the choice of paying more with VAT or less without paperwork. I frowned and said curtly "The legal option with proper paperwork" and left it at that. Was he committing an offence by making the unsolicitied offer (there was a witness - a family friend)? Would HMRC prosecute on that basis? (And is it wise to make an enemy of a local locksmith?)



    The divide between politicians and normal people, Exhibit A

    Lol - FWIW my non-political friend was more shocked by the offer than I was. It's one of those things where people tend to do what friends do and assume that evertyone else is the same.

    I do remember a poll on whether people would agree to payment in cash to evade tax - there was a fairly even split. But what people say and actually do may be two different things. Is there any hard data on it?
    I guess I fulfil your hypothesis as I don't think I know anybody who wouldn't just pay them cash
    Lots of people would agree. But if you help other people illegally pay less tax than they should => you end up paying more tax youself (current estimate is £769 per family*) AND conspire to commit a criminal offence. It's short-sighted, and undermines any indignation you might feel about people who commit other crimes.

    *http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/articles/prosecuting_tax_evasion/

    I never use anyone who asks for cash in hand. On top of all the wider social reasons, my experience is that such people are often prone to doing a shoddy job. And when they do, how do you get them to put it right?
    You aren't friends with any builders, decorators, plumbers or electricians?
    You mean the bastards who are complaining about the only good measure the Tories have proposed in a zonk ?

    Certainly not.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,952
    surbiton said:

    isam said:

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Nick Palmer FPT


    I locked myself out the other day and had a locksmith round. He openly offered me the choice of paying more with VAT or less without paperwork. I frowned and said curtly "The legal option with proper paperwork" and left it at that. Was he committing an offence by making the unsolicitied offer (there was a witness - a family friend)? Would HMRC prosecute on that basis? (And is it wise to make an enemy of a local locksmith?)



    The divide between politicians and normal people, Exhibit A

    Lol - FWIW my non-political friend was more shocked by the offer than I was. It's one of those things where people tend to do what friends do and assume that evertyone else is the same.

    I do remember a poll on whether people would agree to payment in cash to evade tax - there was a fairly even split. But what people say and actually do may be two different things. Is there any hard data on it?
    I guess I fulfil your hypothesis as I don't think I know anybody who wouldn't just pay them cash
    Lots of people would agree. But if you help other people illegally pay less tax than they should => you end up paying more tax youself (current estimate is £769 per family*) AND conspire to commit a criminal offence. It's short-sighted, and undermines any indignation you might feel about people who commit other crimes.

    *http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/articles/prosecuting_tax_evasion/

    I never use anyone who asks for cash in hand. On top of all the wider social reasons, my experience is that such people are often prone to doing a shoddy job. And when they do, how do you get them to put it right?
    You aren't friends with any builders, decorators, plumbers or electricians?
    You mean the bastards who are complaining about the only good measure the Tories have proposed in a zonk ?

    Certainly not.
    I thought that was journalists!!
  • Options
    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937
    isam said:

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Nick Palmer FPT


    I locked myself out the other day and had a locksmith round. He openly offered me the choice of paying more with VAT or less without paperwork. I frowned and said curtly "The legal option with proper paperwork" and left it at that. Was he committing an offence by making the unsolicitied offer (there was a witness - a family friend)? Would HMRC prosecute on that basis? (And is it wise to make an enemy of a local locksmith?)



    The divide between politicians and normal people, Exhibit A

    Lol - FWIW my non-political friend was more shocked by the offer than I was. It's one of those things where people tend to do what friends do and assume that evertyone else is the same.

    I do remember a poll on whether people would agree to payment in cash to evade tax - there was a fairly even split. But what people say and actually do may be two different things. Is there any hard data on it?
    I guess I fulfil your hypothesis as I don't think I know anybody who wouldn't just pay them cash
    Lots of people would agree. But if you help other people illegally pay less tax than they should => you end up paying more tax youself (current estimate is £769 per family*) AND conspire to commit a criminal offence. It's short-sighted, and undermines any indignation you might feel about people who commit other crimes.

    *http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/articles/prosecuting_tax_evasion/

    I never use anyone who asks for cash in hand. On top of all the wider social reasons, my experience is that such people are often prone to doing a shoddy job. And when they do, how do you get them to put it right?
    You aren't friends with any builders, decorators, plumbers or electricians?

    There are two electricians in the family.

  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,952

    isam said:

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Nick Palmer FPT


    I locked myself out the other day and had a locksmith round. He openly offered me the choice of paying more with VAT or less without paperwork. I frowned and said curtly "The legal option with proper paperwork" and left it at that. Was he committing an offence by making the unsolicitied offer (there was a witness - a family friend)? Would HMRC prosecute on that basis? (And is it wise to make an enemy of a local locksmith?)



    The divide between politicians and normal people, Exhibit A

    Lol - FWIW my non-political friend was more shocked by the offer than I was. It's one of those things where people tend to do what friends do and assume that evertyone else is the same.

    I do remember a poll on whether people would agree to payment in cash to evade tax - there was a fairly even split. But what people say and actually do may be two different things. Is there any hard data on it?
    I guess I fulfil your hypothesis as I don't think I know anybody who wouldn't just pay them cash
    Lots of people would agree. But if you help other people illegally pay less tax than they should => you end up paying more tax youself (current estimate is £769 per family*) AND conspire to commit a criminal offence. It's short-sighted, and undermines any indignation you might feel about people who commit other crimes.

    *http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/articles/prosecuting_tax_evasion/

    I never use anyone who asks for cash in hand. On top of all the wider social reasons, my experience is that such people are often prone to doing a shoddy job. And when they do, how do you get them to put it right?
    You aren't friends with any builders, decorators, plumbers or electricians?

    There are two electricians in the family.

    Ah they do it free!
  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    chestnut said:

    Vincenzo Scarpetta‏ @LondonerVince 8h8 hours ago

    Berlusconi has unveiled a revamped election manifesto including a 'parallel currency' (new lira alongside €). Big.

    The mark of a single currency is not only that all other currencies must be extinguished but that the capacity of other institutions to issue currencies must also be extinguished

    N. Tebbit, 30 October 1990
    I'm sorry, but that's appalling ignorant comment from Mr Tebbit.

    There are lots of parallel currencies in the world, in the UK, and in the Eurozone. They range from cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin, through airmiles, gold, US dollars and various other tradable things.

    In Greece, the government created an alternative monetary system to enable them to pay bills during the height of their crisis a few years ago. They would pay you with an IOU that would be redeemable at some point in the future. Said IOUs (trading at a sizeable discount to face value) were used as money as suppliers paid their suppliers, etc. etc. etc.

    My favourite example of an alternative monetary system was Ireland in the 1970s, when all the bank clerks in the country went on strike for several months. Cheques were endorsed and re-endorsed and passed from person to person. New currencies sprung into existence to enable people to continue to do business. What was truly extraordinary is that almost no-one attempted to cheat the system.

    So, Mr Tebbit is surely wrong that the capacity of "other institutions to issue currencies" is or has been extinguished.

    If you want to leave the Euro, the only sensible plan that has been drafted so far is that of the Front National in France. Creating a parallel Lira in Italy wouldn't work, because no-one would want to be paid in it, because it would have been created with the explicit purpose of devaluation. Really, to leave the Euro you simply need to bite the bullet, close the banks for a week or ten days, and pass legislation to move everyone onto a new currency. You need to do this in absolute secrecy, otherwise you will crash the banking system through deposit flight ahead of you leaving the Euro. You also need to put in stabalisers to deal with the fact that many companies are going to have entered into contracts that they will be unable to fulfil, due to the Euro price of services being (top of the head) 30% higher than they were beforehand.
    Just think what Modi did to India ! And they were just taking out two denominations. It took weeks of people queuing ATM's. And, it was India ! OK appalling organisation behind it. But if you have to keep it secret, and you have to, you cannot be seen to be organising something like this.
  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    One statistic puzzles me. If the UK economy is bigger than France , how come there is such a vast difference in electricity consumption.

    Right now, UK : 40GW. FR : 56GW.

    http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    edited March 2017

    RobD said:

    I see no ships.

    twitter.com/AdamBienkov/status/840981294674771968

    I think he is implying someone else sent it out on his account, which isn't that unusual.
    Nuttalism as it's known.
    I'm guessing Adam* looks after the twitter side of things. Plus I am not sure what is wrong with what he said anyway - the genesis of the EC was that Germany was getting sick of doing the marching on Paris thing, and Paris had had it up to here with being marched on. Which was nowt to do wi' us.

    *Werritty not Bienkov
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    surbiton said:

    One statistic puzzles me. If the UK economy is bigger than France , how come there is such a vast difference in electricity consumption.

    Right now, UK : 40GW. FR : 56GW.

    http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/

    Probably being distorted atm by the low marginal cost of nuclear and hydro.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,101
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Plus I am not sure what is wrong with what he said anyway - the genesis of the EC was that Germany was getting sick of doing the marching on Paris thing, and Paris had had it up to here with being marched on. Which was nowt to do wi' us.

    Nowt to do wi' us? In which alternative history was this the case?
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    The results of this poll suggest that a referendum in England, Wales and NI to break from Scotland would deliver a big No.

    That can't be right surely? A perennial claque on here saying that the English want rid of whiny, subsidy junky Jocks.
    Given the percentage who think Scotland would be financially better off out of the UK that means more people in the rest of the UK than in Scotland think that Scotland would be richer.
  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549

    surbiton said:

    One statistic puzzles me. If the UK economy is bigger than France , how come there is such a vast difference in electricity consumption.

    Right now, UK : 40GW. FR : 56GW.

    http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/

    Probably being distorted atm by the low marginal cost of nuclear and hydro.
    Understood. But by 40% ? Very similar populations. France, of course, cannot shut off supply so easily at off-peak hours because it is mostly nuclear. Sometimes it produces more than demand.

    Ideal place for electric cars. Charge up during the night.
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    Cyan said:

    malcolmg said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    tlg86 said:

    Third. Very interesting, thank you Keiran. It is interesting to consider what the no campaign would look like second time around. Would Darling front it again? Or would it need someone else?

    Davidson would front it now
    Another broken pledge from TRuthy?

    "Ruth Davidson rules out leading No campaign for indyref2"

    http://tinyurl.com/gldyjre
    She has said no party leader should lead it (and indeed the chairman of any future No campaign would likely be apolitical) but most likely she would be the main No spokesperson
    She is only a regional leader , she does not lead "A Party", being Westminster sockpuppet does not make her a leader of a real party
    It's Nicola Sturgeon who is a regional leader.

    Ruth Davidson would make an acceptable leader of a Scottish government of Unionist unity [*], which I think the majority of people in Scotland would like to have (if I had a pound for every time someone has said to me that Sturgeon should shut the eff up about independence and start running Scotland properly, etc.), but she is not the right person to be the sole "main No spokesperson". For goodness sake, don't help the SNP with their line that Unionism = Tories = Westminster = London media = FEBs, their sockpuppets, and the stupid.

    (*) Sturgeon wants a referendum before the next Holyrood election. The SNP lost their majority in 2016, and hopefully in 2021 (or maybe 2020, depending on when the next British GE is held) the Unionists will regain a majority and if necessary Kezia, Willie and Ruth will be mature enough to do the right thing and form a coalition.
    You're showing a similar level of Scottish insight as the loon who asserted that Scotland would vote even more strongly for Brexit than rUK. I wonder whatever became of him?
    He never took me up on that bet.
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,193
    surbiton said:

    One statistic puzzles me. If the UK economy is bigger than France , how come there is such a vast difference in electricity consumption.

    Right now, UK : 40GW. FR : 56GW.

    http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/

    They still have some heavy industry.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,919
    edited March 2017
    surbiton said:

    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    chestnut said:

    I'm sorry, but that's appalling ignorant comment from Mr Tebbit.

    *Snip*
    My favourite example of an alternative monetary system was Ireland in the 1970s, when all the bank clerks in the country went on strike for several months. Cheques were endorsed and re-endorsed and passed from person to person. New currencies sprung into existence to enable people to continue to do business. What was truly extraordinary is that almost no-one attempted to cheat the system.

    So, Mr Tebbit is surely wrong that the capacity of "other institutions to issue currencies" is or has been extinguished.

    If you want to leave the Euro, the only sensible plan that has been drafted so far is that of the Front National in France. Creating a parallel Lira in Italy wouldn't work, because no-one would want to be paid in it, because it would have been created with the explicit purpose of devaluation. Really, to leave the Euro you simply need to bite the bullet, close the banks for a week or ten days, and pass legislation to move everyone onto a new currency. You need to do this in absolute secrecy, otherwise you will crash the banking system through deposit flight ahead of you leaving the Euro. You also need to put in stabalisers to deal with the fact that many companies are going to have entered into contracts that they will be unable to fulfil, due to the Euro price of services being (top of the head) 30% higher than they were beforehand.
    Just think what Modi did to India ! And they were just taking out two denominations. It took weeks of people queuing ATM's. And, it was India ! OK appalling organisation behind it. But if you have to keep it secret, and you have to, you cannot be seen to be organising something like this.
    What India did was just replacing banknotes, that's an order of magnitude different from replacing the currency itself.

    There would need to be a lot of planning from a small and very secret committee, that's the easy bit. They'd need to decide what denominations to print and how many notes they'd need initially. The difficult bit is the logistics - printing and transport of the new banknotes under absolute secrecy - they'd probably get De La Rue to print them, and package them to look like Euros as they went to the central bank. Once they're ready to go, an announcement is made at 5pm on Friday that there's to be five bank holidays the following week to set up the new currency.

    The really tricky bit with leaving the Euro is that literally no-one will want to exchange Euro bills unless they're forced to, as the new currency will almost certainly lose value against the Euro. This leaves the problem of how the rest of the Eurozone manages this withdrawal, say of "Italian" Euros.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,362

    rcs1000 said:

    Personally, I think the Italians are very poorly served. Berlusconi is a corrupt joke. Grillo is an ignorant joke. They really need a sensible Euro-sceptic party.

    They need a party that can push through structural reform of the economy and labour market. A Eurosceptic party blaming their predicament on Europe is highly unlikely to be the solution.

    Italy's big problem is that for a large number of Italians being Italian comes second to being from somewhere more local. It's no way to run a country. Maybe it should be more of a federal state.
    Yes, a federal state would make a lot of sense, and would be historically coherent.
    South Tyrol, Valle d'Aosta, Friuli, Sardinia and Sicily already have a large degree of autonomy.
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    That would be classic Lib Dem :-)
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,031
    tlg86 said:

    I knew you wouldn't be able to resist, the Ireland example is a good one. I think the powers that be will find it difficult to keep it a secret should any country want to leave the Euro. What do you think the chances are that a country will leave the Euro in the next year or two?

    Next two years? Low.

    If a country is to leave the Euro in the next five years, it will be Italy I would wager. While I don't buy the idea of Five Star / Forza Italia / and Northern League getting together to form a one-off "leave the Euro" coalition, it is undoubtedly the country where political forces are most likely to align and result in Italexit.

    The Italian economic model was always based on labour market inflexibility being compensated for by constant devaluation. It sucked for savers (who lost out in inflation), but it kept people employed and resulted in fairly buoyant economic growth. Spain had a similar system, of course, but their the political class recognised that there was a choice: either reform the labour market to deal with the rigidity of the currency system or crash out the Eurozone. They chose the former option. The Italians have spent the last 15 years denying such a choice is necessary. While the current cyclical upturn in the Eurozone is likely to buy them some time, the next downturn will likely be brutal for them. Of course, they could reform, but their political system is so broken, I just don't see it happening.
  • Options
    BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,489
    surbiton said:

    One statistic puzzles me. If the UK economy is bigger than France , how come there is such a vast difference in electricity consumption.

    Right now, UK : 40GW. FR : 56GW.

    http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/

    That's a really good question, I don't know. just speculating but: given that it is a Sunday afternoon, so it will mostly be domestic use, are most French homes heated by Electricity instead of gas?
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Sean_F said:

    surbiton said:

    Sean_F said:


    I think both Sinn Fein and the SNP have a window of opportunity between now and Brexit taking place. After Brexit, that window will slam shut.

    Actually autumn 2018 or even May 2019. I know May 2019 maybe after UK is out , but with Brexit having hit the barriers and people having seen it coming in slow motion, the Scots would vote for independence.

    Then, the UK will have to contend with another slide in the pound,

    or, hefty increase in interest rates to protect it.

    Neither looks good. The markets have already recognised this.

    10 year gilt which was at 0.52% in August 2016 ended at 1.23% on Friday. The creep has started big time.
    I think we'll survive interest rates at 1.23%. I'm old enough to remember when they were in double digits.
    oh god yes - these rates are not a sign of financial health
  • Options
    rural_voterrural_voter Posts: 2,038
    tlg86 said:

    surbiton said:

    One statistic puzzles me. If the UK economy is bigger than France , how come there is such a vast difference in electricity consumption.

    Right now, UK : 40GW. FR : 56GW.

    http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/

    They still have some heavy industry.
    France has a lot of electric space heating. Because most Brits. heat their house with gas (or oil), the winter peak demand is lower than it is in France (52 GW versus about 90 GW this winter).
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,031
    edited March 2017
    tlg86 said:

    surbiton said:

    One statistic puzzles me. If the UK economy is bigger than France , how come there is such a vast difference in electricity consumption.

    Right now, UK : 40GW. FR : 56GW.

    http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/

    They still have some heavy industry.
    I was in France at half term, and driving through the centre of the country I was amazed by how much industry there is.
  • Options
    NeilVWNeilVW Posts: 709
    edited March 2017
    In case you missed it, from this morning's Red Box email:

    Those wondering why the leader of the opposition made nothing of the national insurance mess in his response to the budget should look no further than this gem: "On Budget eve, when the Labour leader should have been prepping furiously, he decided to drive up from the Commons to Holloway market in North London to buy a large bag of North African dates – which he then spread out in a pretty pattern on his desk."

    (They link to the Daily Mail article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-4305304/Hopeless-Jezza-s-North-African-date-disaster.html#ixzz4b64zPkgo)
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    edited March 2017
    BigRich said:

    surbiton said:

    One statistic puzzles me. If the UK economy is bigger than France , how come there is such a vast difference in electricity consumption.

    Right now, UK : 40GW. FR : 56GW.

    http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/

    That's a really good question, I don't know. just speculating but: given that it is a Sunday afternoon, so it will mostly be domestic use, are most French homes heated by Electricity instead of gas?
    I think it's a combination of heavy industry driving high peak demand, coupled with a system of hydro and nuclear power which effectively maintains most of peak demand even on Sunday evenings.

    Reduced demand in the UK has made an enormous difference to our ability to decommission dirty coal.
  • Options
    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
  • Options
    NeilVW said:

    In case you missed it, from this morning's Red Box email:

    Those wondering why the leader of the opposition made nothing of the national insurance mess in his response to the budget should look no further than this gem: "On Budget eve, when the Labour leader should have been prepping furiously, he decided to drive up from the Commons to Holloway market in North London to buy a large bag of North African dates – which he then spread out in a pretty pattern on his desk."

    (They link to the Daily Mail article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-4305304/Hopeless-Jezza-s-North-African-date-disaster.html#ixzz4b64zPkgo)

    You couldn't make it up
  • Options
    PeterCPeterC Posts: 1,274
    edited March 2017
    surbiton said:

    Sean_F said:


    I think both Sinn Fein and the SNP have a window of opportunity between now and Brexit taking place. After Brexit, that window will slam shut.

    Actually autumn 2018 or even May 2019. I know May 2019 maybe after UK is out , but with Brexit having hit the barriers and people having seen it coming in slow motion, the Scots would vote for independence.

    Then, the UK will have to contend with another slide in the pound,

    or, hefty increase in interest rates to protect
    Neither looks good. The markets have already recognised this.

    10 year gilt which was at 0.52% in August 2016 ended at 1.23% on Friday. The creep has started big time.
    No matter how bad BREXIT might turn out to be, Scottish independence would be far worse. Scotland would not be in the EU and it would be out of both the UK and the EU single markets. Sterling would be its only recourse as a currency, and outside the UK it would have no lender of last resort. These factors were explored in depth in 2014 and they apply even more so today. With the collapse in the oil price, Scotland's deficit is approaching 10 per cent, rendering it ineligible for EU membership. Germany does not want another Greece to bail out. Independence is pure snake oil.
  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Nick Palmer FPT


    I locked myself out the other day and had a locksmith round. He openly offered me the choice of paying more with VAT or less without paperwork. I frowned and said curtly "The legal option with proper paperwork" and left it at that. Was he committing an offence by making the unsolicitied offer (there was a witness - a family friend)? Would HMRC prosecute on that basis? (And is it wise to make an enemy of a local locksmith?)



    The divide between politicians and normal people, Exhibit A

    Lol - FWIW my non-political friend was more shocked by the offer than I was. It's one of those things where people tend to do what friends do and assume that evertyone else is the same.

    I do remember a poll on whether people would agree to payment in cash to evade tax - there was a fairly even split. But what people say and actually do may be two different things. Is there any hard data on it?
    I guess I fulfil your hypothesis as I don't think I know anybody who wouldn't just pay them cash
    Lots of people would agree. But if you help other people illegally pay less tax than they should => you end up paying more tax youself (current estimate is £769 per family*) AND conspire to commit a criminal offence. It's short-sighted, and undermines any indignation you might feel about people who commit other crimes.

    *http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/articles/prosecuting_tax_evasion/

    I never use anyone who asks for cash in hand. On top of all the wider social reasons, my experience is that such people are often prone to doing a shoddy job. And when they do, how do you get them to put it right?
    I share your suspicion. People working in the cash economy are possibly going to be dodgy in other ways too.

  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    PeterC said:

    surbiton said:

    Sean_F said:


    I think both Sinn Fein and the SNP have a window of opportunity between now and Brexit taking place. After Brexit, that window will slam shut.

    Actually autumn 2018 or even May 2019. I know May 2019 maybe after UK is out , but with Brexit having hit the barriers and people having seen it coming in slow motion, the Scots would vote for independence.

    Then, the UK will have to contend with another slide in the pound,

    or, hefty increase in interest rates to protect
    Neither looks good. The markets have already recognised this.

    10 year gilt which was at 0.52% in August 2016 ended at 1.23% on Friday. The creep has started big time.
    No matter how bad BREXIT might turn out to be, Scottish independence would be far worse. Scotland would not be in the EU and it would be out of both the UK and the EU single markets. Sterling would be its only recourse as a currency, and outside the UK it would have no lender of last resort. These factors were explored in depth in 2014 and they apply even more so today. With the collapse in the oil price, Scotland's deficit is approaching 10 per cent rendering it ineligible for EU membership. Independence is pure snake oil.
    Quite possibly so, it is however for Scots to decide, and who knows.?
  • Options
    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,352
    isam said:



    Lots of people would agree. But if you help other people illegally pay less tax than they should => you end up paying more tax youself (current estimate is £769 per family*) AND conspire to commit a criminal offence. It's short-sighted, and undermines any indignation you might feel about people who commit other crimes.

    *http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/articles/prosecuting_tax_evasion/

    Not really, people are allowed to view some crimes as more or less important than others
    Sure - but it's a risky tendency to take a dim view of crimes one isn't tempted to commit, and a relaxed view of the ones that one might commit oneself. For example, people who use mobiles while driving (anoither law very frequently broken) presumably reckon it's no big deal, and just one of the judgment calls drivers need to make. In the end it's a slippery slope when we start to pick and choose what laws we'll follow.

    Britain is IMO more hit and miss on this than most Northern countries, incidentally - we're more like Italy, where the assessment is more what one can reasonably hope to get away with.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    NeilVW said:

    In case you missed it, from this morning's Red Box email:

    Those wondering why the leader of the opposition made nothing of the national insurance mess in his response to the budget should look no further than this gem: "On Budget eve, when the Labour leader should have been prepping furiously, he decided to drive up from the Commons to Holloway market in North London to buy a large bag of North African dates – which he then spread out in a pretty pattern on his desk."

    (They link to the Daily Mail article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-4305304/Hopeless-Jezza-s-North-African-date-disaster.html#ixzz4b64zPkgo)

    He makes Trump look good.
  • Options
    RestharrowRestharrow Posts: 233

    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
    Over 30 years ago, as a relatively inexperienced driver, I was first to arrive at the scene of a head-on coalition on the A9 caused by bad overtaking. It's an experience I've never been able to forget. If the A9 had been in the West Midlands it would have been dualled in the 1960s. Not all Scottish resentments are misplaced.
  • Options
    PeterCPeterC Posts: 1,274

    PeterC said:

    surbiton said:

    Sean_F said:


    I think both Sinn Fein and the SNP have a window of opportunity between now and Brexit taking place. After Brexit, that window will slam shut.

    Actually autumn 2018 or even May 2019. I know May 2019 maybe after UK is out , but with Brexit having hit the barriers and people having seen it coming in slow motion, the Scots would vote for independence.

    Then, the UK will have to contend with another slide in the pound,

    or, hefty increase in interest rates to protect
    Neither looks good. The markets have already recognised this.

    10 year gilt which was at 0.52% in August 2016 ended at 1.23% on Friday. The creep has started big time.
    No matter how bad BREXIT might turn out to be, Scottish independence would be far worse. Scotland would not be in the EU and it would be out of both the UK and the EU single markets. Sterling would be its only recourse as a currency, and outside the UK it would have no lender of last resort. These factors were explored in depth in 2014 and they apply even more so today. With the collapse in the oil price, Scotland's deficit is approaching 10 per cent rendering it ineligible for EU membership. Independence is pure snake oil.
    Quite possibly so, it is however for Scots to decide, and who knows.?
    I know, it does worry me. The pied piper charlatans of the SNP are so very similar to the most extreme Brexiteers.
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    Floater said:

    Sean_F said:

    surbiton said:

    Sean_F said:


    I think both Sinn Fein and the SNP have a window of opportunity between now and Brexit taking place. After Brexit, that window will slam shut.

    Actually autumn 2018 or even May 2019. I know May 2019 maybe after UK is out , but with Brexit having hit the barriers and people having seen it coming in slow motion, the Scots would vote for independence.

    Then, the UK will have to contend with another slide in the pound,

    or, hefty increase in interest rates to protect it.

    Neither looks good. The markets have already recognised this.

    10 year gilt which was at 0.52% in August 2016 ended at 1.23% on Friday. The creep has started big time.
    I think we'll survive interest rates at 1.23%. I'm old enough to remember when they were in double digits.
    oh god yes - these rates are not a sign of financial health
    ALso an interesting period of comparison Surbiton has chosen. Rates went down immediately after the vote, and have risen back to 1.23% which is if anything lower than before the vote.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,130
    NeilVW said:

    In case you missed it, from this morning's Red Box email:

    Those wondering why the leader of the opposition made nothing of the national insurance mess in his response to the budget should look no further than this gem: "On Budget eve, when the Labour leader should have been prepping furiously, he decided to drive up from the Commons to Holloway market in North London to buy a large bag of North African dates – which he then spread out in a pretty pattern on his desk."

    (They link to the Daily Mail article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-4305304/Hopeless-Jezza-s-North-African-date-disaster.html#ixzz4b64zPkgo)

    Looks like someone in the inner circle leaked that little detail....
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,193

    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
    Over 30 years ago, as a relatively inexperienced driver, I was first to arrive at the scene of a head-on coalition on the A9 caused by bad overtaking. It's an experience I've never been able to forget. If the A9 had been in the West Midlands it would have been dualled in the 1960s. Not all Scottish resentments are misplaced.
    They've had devolution for 18 years, if it's that bad, why hasn't Holyrood done something about it?
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich
  • Options
    welshowlwelshowl Posts: 4,460
    Sean_F said:

    surbiton said:

    Sean_F said:


    I think both Sinn Fein and the SNP have a window of opportunity between now and Brexit taking place. After Brexit, that window will slam shut.

    Actually autumn 2018 or even May 2019. I know May 2019 maybe after UK is out , but with Brexit having hit the barriers and people having seen it coming in slow motion, the Scots would vote for independence.

    Then, the UK will have to contend with another slide in the pound,

    or, hefty increase in interest rates to protect it.

    Neither looks good. The markets have already recognised this.

    10 year gilt which was at 0.52% in August 2016 ended at 1.23% on Friday. The creep has started big time.
    I think we'll survive interest rates at 1.23%. I'm old enough to remember when they were in double digits.
    For the umpteenth time folks interest rates getting up off the canvass is a good thing. Anyone with a pension scheme or hoping to retire with better annuity rates will be cheering any rise in gilt yields to the rafters. I know I am.

    The eye watering defensive saving going on in the UK economy filling huge pension black holes (largely created through bonkers legislation) is a huge drag.

    As far as I am concerned a lower Pound and any higher interest rates are total manna from heaven.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited March 2017
    Wally with the brolly been given his matching orders by derby for a second time.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Just a lark on a twitter state....Top Gear is so bad, even Dave won't buy the repeats.
  • Options
    calumcalum Posts: 3,046
    tlg86 said:

    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
    Over 30 years ago, as a relatively inexperienced driver, I was first to arrive at the scene of a head-on coalition on the A9 caused by bad overtaking. It's an experience I've never been able to forget. If the A9 had been in the West Midlands it would have been dualled in the 1960s. Not all Scottish resentments are misplaced.
    They've had devolution for 18 years, if it's that bad, why hasn't Holyrood done something about it?
    Is doing so - many competing projects though - A74 upgrade, M80, FRB etc
  • Options

    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
    Over 30 years ago, as a relatively inexperienced driver, I was first to arrive at the scene of a head-on coalition on the A9 caused by bad overtaking. It's an experience I've never been able to forget. If the A9 had been in the West Midlands it would have been dualled in the 1960s. Not all Scottish resentments are misplaced.
    According to MalcG the SNP were going to do it but were prevented by labour and the conservatives. No matter it is a dangerous road that is long overdue upgrading

    Once when returning to Wales driving through south Edinburgh in wet conditions the car but two in front went head on at a road junction. I had had a short period in the City Police before leaving to go to Wales and was able to direct the traffic.The car in front belonged to a doctor and my wife assisted him in performing a tracheotomy on a young child. After the police and ambulance arrived we continued home to Wales but could not get the little girl out of our mind. It transpired that she died later in Edinburgh Royal Infirmary. So sad and upsetting
  • Options
    RestharrowRestharrow Posts: 233
    tlg86 said:

    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
    Over 30 years ago, as a relatively inexperienced driver, I was first to arrive at the scene of a head-on coalition on the A9 caused by bad overtaking. It's an experience I've never been able to forget. If the A9 had been in the West Midlands it would have been dualled in the 1960s. Not all Scottish resentments are misplaced.
    They've had devolution for 18 years, if it's that bad, why hasn't Holyrood done something about it?
    I can't answer that, other than to say it should have been done 30 years before devolution.
  • Options

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Nick Palmer FPT


    I locked myself out the other day and had a locksmith round. He openly offered me the choice of paying more with VAT or less without paperwork. I frowned and said curtly "The legal option with proper paperwork" and left it at that. Was he committing an offence by making the unsolicitied offer (there was a witness - a family friend)? Would HMRC prosecute on that basis? (And is it wise to make an enemy of a local locksmith?)



    The divide between politicians and normal people, Exhibit A

    Lol - FWIW my non-political friend was more shocked by the offer than I was. It's one of those things where people tend to do what friends do and assume that evertyone else is the same.

    I do remember a poll on whether people would agree to payment in cash to evade tax - there was a fairly even split. But what people say and actually do may be two different things. Is there any hard data on it?
    I guess I fulfil your hypothesis as I don't think I know anybody who wouldn't just pay them cash
    Lots of people would agree. But if you help other people illegally pay less tax than they should => you end up paying more tax youself (current estimate is £769 per family*) AND conspire to commit a criminal offence. It's short-sighted, and undermines any indignation you might feel about people who commit other crimes.

    *http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/articles/prosecuting_tax_evasion/

    I never use anyone who asks for cash in hand. On top of all the wider social reasons, my experience is that such people are often prone to doing a shoddy job. And when they do, how do you get them to put it right?
    I share your suspicion. People working in the cash economy are possibly going to be dodgy in other ways too.

    A lot of the plasterers, plumbers and mechanics etc I've known over the years pay tax on their regular Monday to Friday work. It's just the odd PJ at the weekend that's the cash work. Working entirely in the informal economy is relatively rare. And I would never use a tradesman that I didn't either know or was recommended by someone i know
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,362
    edited March 2017

    NeilVW said:

    In case you missed it, from this morning's Red Box email:

    Those wondering why the leader of the opposition made nothing of the national insurance mess in his response to the budget should look no further than this gem: "On Budget eve, when the Labour leader should have been prepping furiously, he decided to drive up from the Commons to Holloway market in North London to buy a large bag of North African dates – which he then spread out in a pretty pattern on his desk."

    (They link to the Daily Mail article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-4305304/Hopeless-Jezza-s-North-African-date-disaster.html#ixzz4b64zPkgo)

    Looks like someone in the inner circle leaked that little detail....
    Bad dates!
  • Options
    stodgestodge Posts: 12,877
    Evening all :)

    Once again, it seems, talk of referenda in the air. Whatever your views or otherwise on their usage, the notion of a referendum or neverendum if you prefer seems never to be far away.

    So what should happen when Theresa May returns from the A50 negotiations with a deal - let's assume she does for a moment ? I recognise there's a chance there'll be no deal at all but that's another discussion.

    At the moment, as I understand it, Parliament will vote on the new Treaty once it has been properly and (hopefully) thoroughly scrutinised. Unless it's a real dog's dinner which comes apart under the slightest analysis, one can assume most Conservatives will support it, hail it and the FTAs that will be announced on the day we leave the EU (1/1/20 presumably) and we'll march toward a May 2020 GE with labour in turmoil and a Conservative landslide just over the horizon.

    The problem is all this requires a reasonable Treaty - as said, May might not get any deal at all so it'll be "sod you, EU", welcome to WTO rules apart from the various FTAs (see above). The other possibility is May will get a less than perfect treaty to which some, even in ever own party, will declare themselves implacably opposed. The scene will be set for a dogfight within and across the Conservative party (and other parties) between pro and anti Treaty elements.

    The poor old British public, you'll note, get no say in it. Yes, there'll be a GE in May 2020 it's said, and in effect that will be a referendum on the Treaty. Er, not quite. It's entirely possible Conservatives will vote to want Conservative but be opposed to the Treaty while supporters of other parties may differ from the official party view (as we saw in the 23/6/16 vote).

    Yet should that be enough for a second referendum ? After all, no one is suggesting the FTA with New Zealand or Australia should be put to a popular vote before ratification and given that immigration policy (a big part of the EU vote last year) will now be a matter for the British Government, we will be able to decide between the Conservative, Labour, Lib Dem, UKIP etc immigration policies (and migration policies).

    And yet I'm still uncomfortable - what happens if the A50 treaty isn't very good and there's a clear move to oppose ? As with voting LEAVE on 23/6/16, voting down the A50 Treaty would be for various reasons - to kick the Prime Minister, because WTO rules are preferred, because we'd rather still be in the EU etc. There seems to be a lack of clarity (deliberately of course) concerning the scenario whereby the A50 Treaty is voted down in the Commons - some say it would have to be WTO rules (a little bit of Project Fear perhaps ?).

  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,796
    tlg86 said:

    isam said:
    She's a great loss to our democracy. Not.
    I rather like her. She has lost the plot though.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,952
    edited March 2017

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Nick Palmer FPT


    I locked myself out the other day and had a locksmith round. He openly offered me the choice of paying more with VAT or less without paperwork. I frowned and said curtly "The legal option with proper paperwork" and left it at that. Was he committing an offence by making the unsolicitied offer (there was a witness - a family friend)? Would HMRC prosecute on that basis? (And is it wise to make an enemy of a local locksmith?)



    The divide between politicians and normal people, Exhibit A

    Lol - FWIW my non-political friend was more shocked by the offer than I was. It's one of those things where people tend to do what friends do and assume that evertyone else is the same.

    I do remember a poll on whether people would agree to payment in cash to evade tax - there was a fairly even split. But what people say and actually do may be two different things. Is there any hard data on it?
    I guess I fulfil your hypothesis as I don't think I know anybody who wouldn't just pay them cash
    Lots of people would agree. But if you help other people illegally pay less tax than they should => you end up paying more tax youself (current estimate is £769 per family*) AND conspire to commit a criminal offence. It's short-sighted, and undermines any indignation you might feel about people who commit other crimes.

    *http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/articles/prosecuting_tax_evasion/

    I never use anyone who asks for cash in hand. On top of all the wider social reasons, my experience is that such people are often prone to doing a shoddy job. And when they do, how do you get them to put it right?
    I share your suspicion. People working in the cash economy are possibly going to be dodgy in other ways too.

    A lot of the plasterers, plumbers and mechanics etc I've known over the years pay tax on their regular Monday to Friday work. It's just the odd PJ at the weekend that's the cash work. Working entirely in the informal economy is relatively rare. And I would never use a tradesman that I didn't either know or was recommended by someone i know
    Yeah that's what I mean. If a small job needs fixing and a mate is in the trade, they do it and I give them a drink. I assumed everyone did this
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    tlg86 said:

    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
    Over 30 years ago, as a relatively inexperienced driver, I was first to arrive at the scene of a head-on coalition on the A9 caused by bad overtaking. It's an experience I've never been able to forget. If the A9 had been in the West Midlands it would have been dualled in the 1960s. Not all Scottish resentments are misplaced.
    They've had devolution for 18 years, if it's that bad, why hasn't Holyrood done something about it?
    Mainly used by teuchters and English poshos?
  • Options
    isam said:

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Nick Palmer FPT


    I locked myself out the other day and had a locksmith round. He openly offered me the choice of paying more with VAT or less without paperwork. I frowned and said curtly "The legal option with proper paperwork" and left it at that. Was he committing an offence by making the unsolicitied offer (there was a witness - a family friend)? Would HMRC prosecute on that basis? (And is it wise to make an enemy of a local locksmith?)



    The divide between politicians and normal people, Exhibit A

    Lol - FWIW my non-political friend was more shocked by the offer than I was. It's one of those things where people tend to do what friends do and assume that evertyone else is the same.

    I do remember a poll on whether people would agree to payment in cash to evade tax - there was a fairly even split. But what people say and actually do may be two different things. Is there any hard data on it?
    I guess I fulfil your hypothesis as I don't think I know anybody who wouldn't just pay them cash
    Lots of people would agree. But if you help other people illegally pay less tax than they should => you end up paying more tax youself (current estimate is £769 per family*) AND conspire to commit a criminal offence. It's short-sighted, and undermines any indignation you might feel about people who commit other crimes.

    *http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/articles/prosecuting_tax_evasion/

    I never use anyone who asks for cash in hand. On top of all the wider social reasons, my experience is that such people are often prone to doing a shoddy job. And when they do, how do you get them to put it right?
    I share your suspicion. People working in the cash economy are possibly going to be dodgy in other ways too.

    A lot of the plasterers, plumbers and mechanics etc I've known over the years pay tax on their regular Monday to Friday work. It's just the odd PJ at the weekend that's the cash work. Working entirely in the informal economy is relatively rare. And I would never use a tradesman that I didn't either know or was recommended by someone i know
    Yeah that's what I mean. If a small job needs fixing and a mate is in the trade, they do it and I give them a drink. I assumed everyone did this
    I'm sure they do as well. PB has some virtuous posters.
  • Options
    stodgestodge Posts: 12,877
    welshowl said:



    For the umpteenth time folks interest rates getting up off the canvass is a good thing. Anyone with a pension scheme or hoping to retire with better annuity rates will be cheering any rise in gilt yields to the rafters. I know I am.

    The eye watering defensive saving going on in the UK economy filling huge pension black holes (largely created through bonkers legislation) is a huge drag.

    As far as I am concerned a lower Pound and any higher interest rates are total manna from heaven.

    I don't think anyone argues a return to a more normal monetary policy is long overdue - I've never been a fan of QE to be honest - but interest rates aren't going to be high any time soon. At best, I can see base rate returning to 2% in a couple of years.

    Sensible people have used low interest rates to pay off mortgages and pare down debt. Sensible organisations have used low interest rates to borrow to develop Investment property portfolios and the like.

  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,855

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
  • Options
    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,081
    A1 north of Newcastle also needs dueling. It isn't just a Scottish problem.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited March 2017
    Sean_F said:

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
    I caught Marc Almond on Radio Daily Mirror the other day and he was drawing equivalence between homophobic / racist / insert -ism in the UK and Russia. Not only did he make incorrect claims about the levels of homophobia in the UK, he actually said he didn't think there was much difference in the levels and he has never suffered homophobia in Russia, but has here.....

    Some of these luuvies really do live in a different world.
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,193

    A1 north of Newcastle also needs dueling. It isn't just a Scottish problem.

    The farce that is the A303 upgrade also rumbles on.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,362
    Sean_F said:

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
    "Mein Fuhrer, I can walk!"
  • Options
    calumcalum Posts: 3,046

    A1 north of Newcastle also needs dueling. It isn't just a Scottish problem.

    Would've been great if both Glasgow and Edinburgh had been connected to the M network back in the 60s - wasn't until 2008 Glasgow finally connected via M74/M6 !!
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,362
    calum said:

    A1 north of Newcastle also needs dueling. It isn't just a Scottish problem.

    Would've been great if both Glasgow and Edinburgh had been connected to the M network back in the 60s - wasn't until 2008 Glasgow finally connected via M74/M6 !!
    At least the old A74 was dual all the way from Carlisle.
  • Options
    Sean_F said:

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
    It does, the reaction of some Leavers to the Article 50 court case result was reminiscent of the Nazi reaction to the outcome of the Reichstag Fire trial.

    Honestly, I thought some Leavers like Suzanne Evans wanted to set up a UK People's Court with her call to sack the High Court Judges.

    :lol:
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,193

    Sean_F said:

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
    It does, the reaction of some Leavers to the Article 50 court case result was reminiscent of the Nazi reaction to the outcome of the Reichstag Fire trial.

    Honestly, I thought some Leavers like Suzanne Evans wanted to set up a UK People's Court with her call to sack the High Court Judges.

    :lol:
    My problem with the court case is that it was held after the referendum. It should have been held before.
  • Options
    RestharrowRestharrow Posts: 233
    Sean_F said:

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
    Just lagging behind on dual carriageways.
  • Options
    glwglw Posts: 9,549

    Some of these luuvies really do live in a different world.

    There's nothing wrong with the likes of Almond or McEwan voicing their opinions, the mistake is to think that they might have some words of wisdom when discussing things outside of their area of expertise. In such circumstances they are as likely to say something stupid as any other randomly chosen member of the public. If the fault lies with anyone it's the press that thinks celebs talking about such stuff is likely to be enlightening, rather than merely a vox pop with someone people recognise.

  • Options
    CookieCookie Posts: 11,480
    edited March 2017
    tlg86 said:

    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
    Over 30 years ago, as a relatively inexperienced driver, I was first to arrive at the scene of a head-on coalition on the A9 caused by bad overtaking. It's an experience I've never been able to forget. If the A9 had been in the West Midlands it would have been dualled in the 1960s. Not all Scottish resentments are misplaced.
    They've had devolution for 18 years, if it's that bad, why hasn't Holyrood done something about it?
    I have a little expertise in this area. It's pretty hard to make a case for dualling the A9 in cost-benefit terms alone - the average annual daily flows are very low for a strategic route; certainly I can't think of a stretch of the strategic network in England with flows as low which is dualled. It may be the main route north, but the population of Scotland beyond Blair Atholl is really very low - much less, for example, than the population of Cornwall. On the other hand, special cases like this where there isn't really an English equivalent (the A69, perhaps?) are exactly the sort of issue devolution was meant to address.
  • Options
    calumcalum Posts: 3,046

    calum said:

    A1 north of Newcastle also needs dueling. It isn't just a Scottish problem.

    Would've been great if both Glasgow and Edinburgh had been connected to the M network back in the 60s - wasn't until 2008 Glasgow finally connected via M74/M6 !!
    At least the old A74 was dual all the way from Carlisle.
    10 years + of single lane 40mph contra flows during m74 upgrade !
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,855

    Sean_F said:

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
    I caught Marc Almond on Radio Daily Mirror the other day and he was drawing equivalence between homophobic / racist / insert -ism in the UK and Russia. Not only did he make incorrect claims about the levels of homophobia in the UK, he actually said he didn't think there was much difference in the levels and he has never suffered homophobia in Russia, but has here.....

    Some of these luuvies really do live in a different world.
    Hugh Muir was arguing in the Guardian that the our government treats ethnic minorities so badly that we can't expect them to be loyal to this country. As you say, a different world.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    glw said:

    Some of these luuvies really do live in a different world.

    There's nothing wrong with the likes of Almond or McEwan voicing their opinions, the mistake is to think that they might have some words of wisdom when discussing things outside of their area of expertise. In such circumstances they are as likely to say something stupid as any other randomly chosen member of the public. If the fault lies with anyone it's the press that thinks celebs talking about such stuff is likely to be enlightening, rather than merely a vox pop with someone people recognise.

    It is also wrong that the media don't pick them up on their false statements. Almond was allowed free reign on R5 to make a number of totally inaccurate statements about the state of hate crimes in the UK.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,362

    Sean_F said:

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
    It does, the reaction of some Leavers to the Article 50 court case result was reminiscent of the Nazi reaction to the outcome of the Reichstag Fire trial.

    Honestly, I thought some Leavers like Suzanne Evans wanted to set up a UK People's Court with her call to sack the High Court Judges.

    :lol:
    https://twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/746355750289670144
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,054
    tlg86 said:

    A1 north of Newcastle also needs dueling. It isn't just a Scottish problem.

    The farce that is the A303 upgrade also rumbles on.
    What surprises me is that the eco-warriors appear to be less prominent. Go back 20+ years, and the media was filled with Swampy et al during construction of the Newbury Bypass and the one in Devon. Such protests probably put paid to a fair few road enhancements (or gave governments an excuse not to do them).

    Yet the new multi-billion A14 enhancement scheme seems to have escaped the attention of the unwashed bearded ones (and even the Lib Dems seem unperturbed :) ), as have other large road schemes.

    Have the eco-warriors moved onto Heathrow et al instead of roads, are they finding it harder to get media attention or are they just fewer in number?
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,362

    Sean_F said:

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
    It does, the reaction of some Leavers to the Article 50 court case result was reminiscent of the Nazi reaction to the outcome of the Reichstag Fire trial.

    Honestly, I thought some Leavers like Suzanne Evans wanted to set up a UK People's Court with her call to sack the High Court Judges.

    :lol:
    https://twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/746690302128300033
  • Options
    Shows how long I have been going to the North of Scotland as I can remember having to go over Shap before the M6 started at Preston
  • Options
    glwglw Posts: 9,549
    edited March 2017

    It is also wrong that the media don't pick them up on their false statements. Almond was allowed free reign on R5 to make a number of totally inaccurate statements about the state of hate crimes in the UK.

    It's not his fault that R5 employs a lot of credulous idiots. :)
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    glw said:

    It is also wrong that the media don't pick them up on their false statements. Almond was allowed free reign on R5 to make a number of totally inaccurate statements about the state of hate crimes in the UK.

    It's not his fault that R5 employs a lot of credulous idiots. :)
    It ain't called Radio Daily Mirror for nothing.
  • Options
    Off topic, Grant Shapps has pretty much dumped Nick Timothy in the whole Thanet South expenses saga.

    Though there is history between those two.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285

    Off topic, Grant Shapps Mr Green has pretty much dumped Nick Timothy in the whole Thanet South expenses saga.

    Though there is history between those two.

    Corrected for you...
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,027

    NeilVW said:

    In case you missed it, from this morning's Red Box email:

    Those wondering why the leader of the opposition made nothing of the national insurance mess in his response to the budget should look no further than this gem: "On Budget eve, when the Labour leader should have been prepping furiously, he decided to drive up from the Commons to Holloway market in North London to buy a large bag of North African dates – which he then spread out in a pretty pattern on his desk."

    (They link to the Daily Mail article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-4305304/Hopeless-Jezza-s-North-African-date-disaster.html#ixzz4b64zPkgo)

    Looks like someone in the inner circle leaked that little detail....
    Daily Mail ......... unmentionable imitation news?
  • Options

    Off topic, Grant Shapps Mr Green has pretty much dumped Nick Timothy in the whole Thanet South expenses saga.

    Though there is history between those two.

    Corrected for you...
    I do think Thanet South will turn into such a shit storm, that quite a lot of Tories will find themselves not only up shit creek with a paddle, but also sans a canoe.
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,216
    Sean_F said:

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
    More or less than GrossdEUtschland..oops..the EUSSR..oops the EU?
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,952
    edited March 2017
    I trust all PBers I lost money to on the Thanet South seat at GE 2015 will be returning the dosh if it is proven the Tories were cheating?? :smiley:
  • Options
    As an edinburgh council tax payer, the trams are really depressing. And now the 20mph speed zones that people are ignoring (I drove at 20 the other day and got flashed headlights from behind through Morningside)
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Ishmael_Z said:

    tlg86 said:

    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
    Over 30 years ago, as a relatively inexperienced driver, I was first to arrive at the scene of a head-on coalition on the A9 caused by bad overtaking. It's an experience I've never been able to forget. If the A9 had been in the West Midlands it would have been dualled in the 1960s. Not all Scottish resentments are misplaced.
    They've had devolution for 18 years, if it's that bad, why hasn't Holyrood done something about it?
    Mainly used by teuchters and English poshos?
    The A9 goes through the fucking heart of SNP country - it was in their 2007 manifesto but funding was voted down by opposition parties.
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    As an edinburgh council tax payer, the trams are really depressing. And now the 20mph speed zones that people are ignoring (I drove at 20 the other day and got flashed headlights from behind through Morningside)
    I'm generally in favour of the 20 zones but some of the choices about which roads are 30 and 20 are moronic. Making all of Holyrood Park 20 is crazy. I already had people jammed up my bumper when it was 30mph.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,362

    Sean_F said:

    Order of the OTT....

    Ian McEwan has reportedly described the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit as reminiscent of Nazi Germany

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/12/ian-mcewan-decision-on-brexit-vote-reminds-me-of-the-third-reich

    Obviously modern Britain has much in common with Nazi Germany.
    More or less than GrossdEUtschland..oops..the EUSSR..oops the EU?
    https://twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/735826531289829382
  • Options
    Clegg popping TM in the Independent over her sacking of Heseltine as it makes her look callous. Really, they all need to grow up - Heseltine challenged her authority and was dismissed. Pity Corbyn hasn't got the same courage

    Tomorrow could be the last push by remainers to torpedo the Brexit bill as I believe that once A50 is served voters will expect encouragement to those negotiating the deal and opposition to the negotiations from within the UK will become unpopular and unproductive
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,101

    Tomorrow could be the last push by remainers to torpedo the Brexit bill as I believe that once A50 is served voters will expect encouragement to those negotiating the deal and opposition to the negotiations from within the UK will become unpopular and unproductive

    The clock will be ticking and it will be for the government to deliver. They won't get away with deflecting the blame for failure onto people who are not at the negotiating table.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    chestnut said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Does the SNP actually want to win an independence referendum?

    Of course!

    Like Brexit it is an aim in itself, with no real concern about what follows.

    I am by nature a Unionist, but think it will be different this time, and do not think that May will handle it well. Nothing would go down worse in Scotland than her refusal, but if May supports another indyref it will rile Scottish Unionists. I cannot see a way out for her.
    I don't disagree, but if things don't go well, the politicians who negotiated the exit from the UK would not go down well in history if they were perceived to have done a bad deal.
    With a start point of a £15bn deficit on a £150bn economy they would be toast very quickly.
    another halfwit , the deficit is due to westmonster vanity projects, drop all the crap and willy waving and you start of with no deficit.
    .
    , crossrail , High speed railway , hosing our money down the drain.
    Talking of infrastructure projects, how's that big new bridge looking - finished yet?
    [Sunil utters a cough that sounds suspiciously like "Edinburgh Tram"]
    That was a labour council project and their Tory pals
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edinburgh_Tram_Inquiry
    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)
    The subway is brilliant.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285

    Clegg popping TM in the Independent over her sacking of Heseltine as it makes her look callous. Really, they all need to grow up - Heseltine challenged her authority and was dismissed. Pity Corbyn hasn't got the same courage

    Tomorrow could be the last push by remainers to torpedo the Brexit bill as I believe that once A50 is served voters will expect encouragement to those negotiating the deal and opposition to the negotiations from within the UK will become unpopular and unproductive

    Clegg who?
  • Options

    Tomorrow could be the last push by remainers to torpedo the Brexit bill as I believe that once A50 is served voters will expect encouragement to those negotiating the deal and opposition to the negotiations from within the UK will become unpopular and unproductive

    The clock will be ticking and it will be for the government to deliver. They won't get away with deflecting the blame for failure onto people who are not at the negotiating table.
    They will if it is perceived that elements inside the UK are actively trying to subvert the negotiations as it will be if the EU does the same
  • Options
    ExiledInScotlandExiledInScotland Posts: 1,507
    edited March 2017
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:


    another halfwit , the deficit is due to westmonster vanity projects, drop all the crap and willy waving and you start of with no deficit.

    Um. I thought the latest GERs figures for 2014-15 showed Total Revenue of £53Bn and Total Public Expenditure of £68Bn - a £15Bn defecit = 28% of revenue, or about 10% of Scottish GDP. I looked through the GERs numbers - where are the westmonster vanity projects? This is a genuine question: I really want to understand how we can get the Scottish economy in line with the EU 3% defecit requirement without doubling income tax and corporation tax, or cutting social spending in half. Assuming we'll be in the EU of course.
    Another one that has no clue, Trident , London infrastructure , unlimited borrowing , grandstanding , crossrail , High speed railway , hosing our money down the drain.
    Sorry but I was offline for a bit of I'd have responded. I have read your comments with interest and have always appreciated your passion as well intentioned. I think I do have a clue. The GERs figures are the Scottish Government's figures for their income and expenditure. The impact of the projects you mention are minimal. Indeed they are dwarfed by the fact that the UK government effectively funds the Scottish overspend. Personally I believe this is not unreasonable given the degree of tax take from Oil and Gas over the years, and the fact that Scotland's northern societal infrastructure is relatively expensive to support. Given that we have additional government spend per head of £1400-£1500 per annum compared to England, I just want to know how we can keep affording all of this when we leave. I can't afford my taxes to double. Can you? Give me a reasoned answer because I genuinely want to understand how to square the circle.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    calum said:

    A1 north of Newcastle also needs dueling. It isn't just a Scottish problem.

    Would've been great if both Glasgow and Edinburgh had been connected to the M network back in the 60s - wasn't until 2008 Glasgow finally connected via M74/M6 !!
    M8 Glasgow to Edinburgh at 2 lanes is a national disgrace , meanwhile they have real motorways all over England. Go north of Stirling and there is nothing.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062

    PeterC said:

    surbiton said:

    Sean_F said:


    I think both Sinn Fein and the SNP have a window of opportunity between now and Brexit taking place. After Brexit, that window will slam shut.

    Actually autumn 2018 or even May 2019. I know May 2019 maybe after UK is out , but with Brexit having hit the barriers and people having seen it coming in slow motion, the Scots would vote for independence.

    Then, the UK will have to contend with another slide in the pound,

    or, hefty increase in interest rates to protect
    Neither looks good. The markets have already recognised this.

    10 year gilt which was at 0.52% in August 2016 ended at 1.23% on Friday. The creep has started big time.
    No matter how bad BREXIT might turn out to be, Scottish independence would be far worse. Scotland would not be in the EU and it would be out of both the UK and the EU single markets. Sterling would be its only recourse as a currency, and outside the UK it would have no lender of last resort. These factors were explored in depth in 2014 and they apply even more so today. With the collapse in the oil price, Scotland's deficit is approaching 10 per cent rendering it ineligible for EU membership. Independence is pure snake oil.
    Quite possibly so, it is however for Scots to decide, and who knows.?
    Yes and quite possibly not as well , the idiot is talking out his erchie.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062

    tlg86 said:

    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
    Over 30 years ago, as a relatively inexperienced driver, I was first to arrive at the scene of a head-on coalition on the A9 caused by bad overtaking. It's an experience I've never been able to forget. If the A9 had been in the West Midlands it would have been dualled in the 1960s. Not all Scottish resentments are misplaced.
    They've had devolution for 18 years, if it's that bad, why hasn't Holyrood done something about it?
    I can't answer that, other than to say it should have been done 30 years before devolution.
    Tories and Labour to thank for that, but hey we got a mile or two of tram line instead, while the carnage on the A9 continues.
  • Options
    malcolmg said:

    calum said:

    A1 north of Newcastle also needs dueling. It isn't just a Scottish problem.

    Would've been great if both Glasgow and Edinburgh had been connected to the M network back in the 60s - wasn't until 2008 Glasgow finally connected via M74/M6 !!
    M8 Glasgow to Edinburgh at 2 lanes is a national disgrace , meanwhile they have real motorways all over England. Go north of Stirling and there is nothing.
    Edinburgh to Perth is motorway
  • Options
    nunununu Posts: 6,024
    Anyone know why the BJP did so well in Muslim areas of Uttar Pradesh elections? Some estimates out it as high as 39%.
  • Options
    I assume we've done Liam Fox's latest impression of a bell end?
  • Options
    MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584
    malcolmg said:

    calum said:

    A1 north of Newcastle also needs dueling. It isn't just a Scottish problem.

    Would've been great if both Glasgow and Edinburgh had been connected to the M network back in the 60s - wasn't until 2008 Glasgow finally connected via M74/M6 !!
    M8 Glasgow to Edinburgh at 2 lanes is a national disgrace , meanwhile they have real motorways all over England. Go north of Stirling and there is nothing.

    There are places all over England which need upgrades, new junctions, and bypasses.

    Labour cancelled a bunch of plans in '97 that have never been done.

  • Options
    malcolmg said:

    tlg86 said:

    Alistair said:



    Edinburgh is in Scotland, last time I checked...

    (BTW I haven't ridden the tram yet, aim to do it with Glasgow Subway eventually, once I do the Tyne and Wear Metro, the last English "urban railway" I have yet to conquer, I mean ride)

    The SNP wanted to dual the A9. Instead the opposition parties voted enblock to fund the Trams i stead which the SNP opposed.

    At the elections last year the Lib Dems campaigned on the SNP failing to dual the A9, which they had voted against! Such chutzpah.
    In travelling to the North of Scotland over the last 50 years, a distance of 458 miles, the A9 is the slowest and most dangerous part of the journey. It is decades overdue to be dual carriageway from Perth to Inverness.
    Over 30 years ago, as a relatively inexperienced driver, I was first to arrive at the scene of a head-on coalition on the A9 caused by bad overtaking. It's an experience I've never been able to forget. If the A9 had been in the West Midlands it would have been dualled in the 1960s. Not all Scottish resentments are misplaced.
    They've had devolution for 18 years, if it's that bad, why hasn't Holyrood done something about it?
    I can't answer that, other than to say it should have been done 30 years before devolution.
    Tories and Labour to thank for that, but hey we got a mile or two of tram line instead, while the carnage on the A9 continues.
    The A9 is very heavy on speed cameras which are needed due to the dangerous nature of the road. That it is not dual carriageway after all these years is an insult to all those Scots and their businesses in the Highlands and beyond
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,054
    malcolmg said:

    calum said:

    A1 north of Newcastle also needs dueling. It isn't just a Scottish problem.

    Would've been great if both Glasgow and Edinburgh had been connected to the M network back in the 60s - wasn't until 2008 Glasgow finally connected via M74/M6 !!
    M8 Glasgow to Edinburgh at 2 lanes is a national disgrace , meanwhile they have real motorways all over England. Go north of Stirling and there is nothing.
    Perth on the M90 is north of Stirling ... ;)

    What is the point-to-point journeys like north of Perth? The major population centres are, I reckon, Dundee, Inverness, Aberdeen. Do they generate enough journeys to warrant a motorway?

    On a similar note, I see the A82's finally been sorted out on Loch Lomond (Pulpit Rock?). About time, and it must have been quite difficult engineering.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:


    another halfwit , the deficit is due to westmonster vanity projects, drop all the crap and willy waving and you start of with no deficit.

    Um. I thought the latest GERs figures for 2014-15 showed Total Revenue of £53Bn and Total Public Expenditure of £68Bn - a £15Bn defecit = 28% of revenue, or about 10% of Scottish GDP. I looked through the GERs numbers - where are the westmonster vanity projects? This is a genuine question: I really want to understand how we can get the Scottish economy in line with the EU 3% defecit requirement without doubling income tax and corporation tax, or cutting social spending in half. Assuming we'll be in the EU of course.
    Another one that has no clue, Trident , London infrastructure , unlimited borrowing , grandstanding , crossrail , High speed railway , hosing our money down the drain.
    Sorry but I was offline for a bit of I'd have responded. I have read your comments with interest and have always appreciated your passion as well intentioned. I think I do have a clue. The GERs figures are the Scottish Government's figures for their income and expenditure. The impact of the projects you mention are minimal. Indeed they are dwarfed by the fact that the UK government effectively funds the Scottish overspend. Personally I believe this is not unreasonable given the degree of tax take from Oil and Gas over the years, and the fact that Scotland's northern societal infrastructure is relatively expensive to support. Given that we have additional government spend per head of £1400-£1500 per annum compared to England, I just want to know how we can keep affording all of this when we leave. I can't afford my taxes to double. Can you? Give me a reasoned answer because I genuinely want to understand how to square the circle.
    The numbers are what Westminster release, it is impossible to know what the real position is. Also it is madness to assume these will be the correct numbers and we will have the same spending on independence. We will not need to fund Trident , military fantasies and Westminster borrowing that is not spent on Scotland. If we are such a basket case why do the unionists seem so desperate to hang on to us. Why would Scotland be the only small country in the world unable to manage its own affairs. Loads of countries with little or no natural assets seem to manage a lot better than we do being so generously funded by teh largesse of England.
This discussion has been closed.