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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Lucian Fletcher on the latest Northern Ireland assembly poll

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  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,667
    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Virtue signalling, then?
    The idea of Trump pronouncing on morality is an interesting one, to say the least.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933
    edited February 2017

    isam said:

    I'm more interested in why Leave.EU would release this.

    To build narrative and momentum.

    In 2015 the Tories and UKIP were neck and neck, now they can say only UKIP can beat Labour here.
    Perhaps, but then why not show Labour and UKIP neck and neck? There is a danger in making undecided voters think it's all over. If the EU ref polling had overestimated Leave I suspect the result may have been different.
    If there's one thing I've learned over the years, UKIP are shite at expectations management.
    That's the only thing you've learned UKIP are shite at?
    How are they at winning referendums/achieving their ambitions?
    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
    I think that's right. People like me would have felt very uncomfortable having just Farage in our corner. I would probably have abstained.
    So even then UKIP needed the Tories to win referendums/achieve ambitions.
    Bit of a pattern emerging..
    If you can stop yourself being an unsuccessful troll for a minute, would you care to answer this?

    Would it not be an SNP success if Scotland gained independence with the help of high profile politicians from other parties heading the official campaign?
    Would you feel a bit less happy that you were independent & that your aim had been achieved?
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,987

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Virtue signalling, then?
    Potential virtue signalling, it doesnt exist at the moment, and might not exist at all, so also potential Fake News ;)
    Does sound somewhat unlikely. However, with Donald it is hard to tell!
  • Options
    EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,956

    John_M said:

    Good news about the BoE forecasts, at least the wheels will keep turning this year.

    I've just galloped through the A50 white paper. I would be ashamed to have produced something like this in my pomp. It's pretty thin gruel. It skates over all the hard stuff (e.g. NI/Eire border), with a bunch of platitudes, aspirational statements, with just a hint of tractor statistics (10k pigs per week!). Not at all what I was expecting.

    Humph.

    When the boss (i.e. the people) gives you duff instructions there's only so much you can do...
    You think the people are boss? What kind of Federalist EU-phile are you?
  • Options
    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,748
    edited February 2017
    Irony must be even deader than it was before.
    Scott_P said:
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,030
    edited February 2017
    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Virtue signalling, then?
    Trump would be taking the same moral position as the Pope, whether he can do it with a straight face or not given his history is another matter!
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    edited February 2017
    Golly - Milo has made the Sun

    Alt-right figurehead Milo Yiannopoulos has opened up his white male privilege fund to help men get a degree https://t.co/CySMVlfwcV https://t.co/9zD8qMGN6y

    "Speaking at the California Polytechnic State University, he said that applicants have until Feburary 14 to submit an essay and short video clip explaining why they deserve the grant.

    The vocal critic of feminism, Islam, social justice, political correctness and avid Trump fan said he was “happy that white men are now on their way to achieving their dreams.”

    He said: “If you’re a woman, if you’re black, if you’re a Muslim, if you’re a refugee or if you identify as an attack helicopter you can get free money.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,667
    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Virtue signalling, then?
    Trump would be taking the same moral position as the Pope, whether he can do it with a straight face or not given his history is another matter!
    Not so much a whited sepulchre as one which has been spray tanned.
  • Options


    Surely that would be tantamount to ripping the US constitution into pieces and tossing it up like confetti. Separation of religion and state.

    Ripping the US constitution into pieces and tossing it up like confetti was the entire point of the Trump candidacy.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,030
    Nigelb said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Virtue signalling, then?
    Trump would be taking the same moral position as the Pope, whether he can do it with a straight face or not given his history is another matter!
    Not so much a whited sepulchre as one which has been spray tanned.
    Pretty much
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Virtue signalling, then?
    Trump would be taking the same moral position as the Pope, whether he can do it with a straight face or not given his history is another matter!
    Sometimes you just have to check the calendar - no almost two months to go until April 1st.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,333

    John_M said:

    isam said:

    I'm more interested in why Leave.EU would release this.

    To build narrative and momentum.

    In 2015 the Tories and UKIP were neck and neck, now they can say only UKIP can beat Labour here.
    Perhaps, but then why not show Labour and UKIP neck and neck? There is a danger in making undecided voters think it's all over. If the EU ref polling had overestimated Leave I suspect the result may have been different.
    If there's one thing I've learned over the years, UKIP are shite at expectations management.
    That's the only thing you've learned UKIP are shite at?
    How are they at winning referendums/achieving their ambitions?
    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
    I think that's right. People like me would have felt very uncomfortable having just Farage in our corner. I would probably have abstained.
    Yep. Farage was driving me into the Remain camp every time he opened his gob. Fortunately, there were even more odious people on the other side, Bob Geldof being my personal bete noire.
    Geldof is a wank but more odious than Farage is a little harsh.
    Geldof working hard for the Leave campaign.

    image
    What's Pat Rice doing in there?
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    edited February 2017
    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Virtue signalling, then?
    Trump would be taking the same moral position as the Pope, whether he can do it with a straight face or not given his history is another matter!
    Perhaps he will practise potus interruptus. That would be good.
  • Options
    Ishmael_Z said:

    isam said:

    I'm more interested in why Leave.EU would release this.

    To build narrative and momentum.

    In 2015 the Tories and UKIP were neck and neck, now they can say only UKIP can beat Labour here.
    Perhaps, but then why not show Labour and UKIP neck and neck? There is a danger in making undecided voters think it's all over. If the EU ref polling had overestimated Leave I suspect the result may have been different.
    If there's one thing I've learned over the years, UKIP are shite at expectations management.
    That's the only thing you've learned UKIP are shite at?
    How are they at winning referendums/achieving their ambitions?
    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
    I think that's right. People like me would have felt very uncomfortable having just Farage in our corner. I would probably have abstained.
    So even then UKIP needed the Tories to win referendums/achieve ambitions.
    Bit of a pattern emerging..
    This Ukip are shite/Farage never won an election shite is up there with Jilted John when it comes to missing the point:

    Oh, she is cruel and heartless
    to pack me for Gordon
    Just cos he's better looking than me
    Just cos he's cool and sexy

    But I know he's a moron, Gordon is a moron
    Gordon is a moron, Gordon is a moron.

    In the same way as Trump is POTUS even if he is an odious joke, so Farage engineered Brexit even if he is an odious joke.
    Trump is POTUS, Farage is a radio talk show guy.
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    Ishmael_Z said:

    isam said:

    I'm more interested in why Leave.EU would release this.

    To build narrative and momentum.

    In 2015 the Tories and UKIP were neck and neck, now they can say only UKIP can beat Labour here.
    Perhaps, but then why not show Labour and UKIP neck and neck? There is a danger in making undecided voters think it's all over. If the EU ref polling had overestimated Leave I suspect the result may have been different.
    If there's one thing I've learned over the years, UKIP are shite at expectations management.
    That's the only thing you've learned UKIP are shite at?
    How are they at winning referendums/achieving their ambitions?
    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
    I think that's right. People like me would have felt very uncomfortable having just Farage in our corner. I would probably have abstained.
    So even then UKIP needed the Tories to win referendums/achieve ambitions.
    Bit of a pattern emerging..
    This Ukip are shite/Farage never won an election shite is up there with Jilted John when it comes to missing the point:

    Oh, she is cruel and heartless
    to pack me for Gordon
    Just cos he's better looking than me
    Just cos he's cool and sexy

    But I know he's a moron, Gordon is a moron
    Gordon is a moron, Gordon is a moron.

    In the same way as Trump is POTUS even if he is an odious joke, so Farage engineered Brexit even if he is an odious joke.
    Trump is POTUS, Farage is a radio talk show guy.
    a radio talk show guy who engineered Brexit. Or are the consequences of brexit too trivial to catch your attention?
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,667


    Surely that would be tantamount to ripping the US constitution into pieces and tossing it up like confetti. Separation of religion and state.

    Ripping the US constitution into pieces and tossing it up like confetti was the entire point of the Trump candidacy.
    Absolutely. A true conservative attitude is better reflected in this piece (which I pretty well agree with):
    http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/conservatism-after-trump/
    The first of those considerations is to minimize damage to the Constitution, whether inflicted by Trump himself or by his opponents. In that regard, conservatives should side with their brethren on the left in standing foursquare against actions by Trump or members of his lunatic inner circle that jeopardize any aspect of the Bill of Rights, whether relating to speech, assembly, privacy, the free exercise of religion, or limits on the police power of the state.

    On the other hand, conservatives should insist that Trump’s opponents also adhere to terms set out in the Constitution. Among more radical members of the left, eagerness to remove Trump from office, using any available pretext, is palpable. I myself will not shed a tear should Trump be involuntarily and permanently returned to the eponymous tower from which he descended to complete the corruption of American politics. Let it be done, however, in strict compliance with either Article II, Section 4 of the Constitution or alternatively in accordance with Section 4 of the 25th Amendment...
  • Options
    isam said:

    isam said:

    I'm more interested in why Leave.EU would release this.

    To build narrative and momentum.

    In 2015 the Tories and UKIP were neck and neck, now they can say only UKIP can beat Labour here.
    Perhaps, but then why not show Labour and UKIP neck and neck? There is a danger in making undecided voters think it's all over. If the EU ref polling had overestimated Leave I suspect the result may have been different.
    If there's one thing I've learned over the years, UKIP are shite at expectations management.
    That's the only thing you've learned UKIP are shite at?
    How are they at winning referendums/achieving their ambitions?
    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
    I think that's right. People like me would have felt very uncomfortable having just Farage in our corner. I would probably have abstained.
    So even then UKIP needed the Tories to win referendums/achieve ambitions.
    Bit of a pattern emerging..
    If you can stop yourself being an unsuccessful troll for a minute, would you care to answer this?

    Would it not be the SNP's success if Scotland gained independence with the help of high profile politicians from other parties heading the official campaign?
    Would you feel a bit less happy that you were independent & that your aim had been achieved?
    You keep squeezing out wibbly, defensive replies, so not that unsuccessful.

    You're comparing a successful governing party with one that's not governed anything; the latter managed to ride a popular, mainly English wave, and its single issue ambition was attained for a number of reasons. Now that party has subsided back into incoherent irrelevance.

    In the extremely unlikely event of a successful campaign for an independent Scotland being dependent on the support of someone like Farage, I'll vote No.
  • Options
    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    edited February 2017
    A very interesting and forceful response by Mark Carney in response to a French journalist's question about banks moving to the EU27. It's worth reading in full (13:35)

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/live/2017/feb/02/bank-of-england-interest-rates-quarterly-inflation-report-brexit-live
  • Options

    John_M said:

    I've just galloped through the A50 white paper. I would be ashamed to have produced something like this in my pomp. It's pretty thin gruel. It skates over all the hard stuff (e.g. NI/Eire border), with a bunch of platitudes, aspirational statements plus just a smear of tractor statistics (10k pigs per week!). Not at all what I was expecting.

    Humph.

    There's nothing much to it, but I'm not at all surprised. On every question of importance, it says that 'that will be a matter for negotiation'. That seems to me to be a simple statement of the obvious, which is why all those calls from Labour and others for more clarity don't make sense.

    It's quite a useful summary of some of the basic statistics, however.
    It was interesting to see the wording on the "no contributions" para on page 49; that seemed to be setting up a red line of our own, there.

    Although, thinking about it, I suppose you can read "no vast contributions" two ways. Either it's emphatic to the point of confrontation, or it's opening the door to "but modest contributions are ok". Probably the latter, I guess.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,013
    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Remember, it's only pre-marital sex if you actually end up getting married one day.
  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,009

    Scott_P said:
    What will she do at Third Reading then?
    She and Corbyn will have a pre-arranged trip to see collective farms on the outskirts of Dresden. On a motorbike.
    Not for nothing is Dresden known as the Tal der Ahnunglosen. Perfect for JC and DA.
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    Nigelb said:


    Surely that would be tantamount to ripping the US constitution into pieces and tossing it up like confetti. Separation of religion and state.

    Ripping the US constitution into pieces and tossing it up like confetti was the entire point of the Trump candidacy.
    Absolutely. A true conservative attitude is better reflected in this piece (which I pretty well agree with):
    http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/conservatism-after-trump/
    The first of those considerations is to minimize damage to the Constitution, whether inflicted by Trump himself or by his opponents. In that regard, conservatives should side with their brethren on the left in standing foursquare against actions by Trump or members of his lunatic inner circle that jeopardize any aspect of the Bill of Rights, whether relating to speech, assembly, privacy, the free exercise of religion, or limits on the police power of the state.

    On the other hand, conservatives should insist that Trump’s opponents also adhere to terms set out in the Constitution. Among more radical members of the left, eagerness to remove Trump from office, using any available pretext, is palpable. I myself will not shed a tear should Trump be involuntarily and permanently returned to the eponymous tower from which he descended to complete the corruption of American politics. Let it be done, however, in strict compliance with either Article II, Section 4 of the Constitution or alternatively in accordance with Section 4 of the 25th Amendment...
    There is a strong case for saying that to prohibit religion-based discrimination infringes both the church/state divide and the right to freedom of speech; after all saying "I hate ethnic or religious or sexual minority x y or z" is speech, innit? If there is such an argument, it is the constitution which should give way, obviously, but there isn't an open-and-shut constitution-based case against Trump that I can see here.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933
    edited February 2017

    isam said:

    isam said:

    I'm more interested in why Leave.EU would release this.

    To build narrative and momentum.

    In 2015 the Tories and UKIP were neck and neck, now they can say only UKIP can beat Labour here.
    Perhaps, but then why not show Labour and UKIP neck and neck? There is a danger in making undecided voters think it's all over. If the EU ref polling had overestimated Leave I suspect the result may have been different.
    If there's one thing I've learned over the years, UKIP are shite at expectations management.
    That's the only thing you've learned UKIP are shite at?
    How are they at winning referendums/achieving their ambitions?
    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
    I think that's right. People like me would have felt very uncomfortable having just Farage in our corner. I would probably have abstained.
    So even then UKIP needed the Tories to win referendums/achieve ambitions.
    Bit of a pattern emerging..
    If you can stop yourself being an unsuccessful troll for a minute, would you care to answer this?

    Would it not be the SNP's success if Scotland gained independence with the help of high profile politicians from other parties heading the official campaign?
    Would you feel a bit less happy that you were independent & that your aim had been achieved?
    You keep squeezing out wibbly, defensive replies, so not that unsuccessful.

    You're comparing a successful governing party with one that's not governed anything; the latter managed to ride a popular, mainly English wave, and its single issue ambition was attained for a number of reasons. Now that party has subsided back into incoherent irrelevance.

    In the extremely unlikely event of a successful campaign for an independent Scotland being dependent on the support of someone like Farage, I'll vote No.
    Wow that's quite remarkable, party politics over country!

  • Options
    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Remember, it's only pre-marital sex if you actually end up getting married one day.
    Three times, in his case isn't it?
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,667

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Remember, it's only pre-marital sex if you actually end up getting married one day.
    Three times, in his case isn't it?
    Not very potent, then - though I'm curious to know how you obtained the intimate details.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,030
    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Remember, it's only pre-marital sex if you actually end up getting married one day.
    True or you are a lifelong virgin and it is pretty safe to say Trump fails on both counts!
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,598
    edited February 2017
    FF43 said:

    Irony must be even deader than it was before.

    Scott_P said:
    I am not inclined to believe that in full, particularly given that it comes from the Indy; the Beano is more reliable.

    Looks like another story where the anti-Trumpers have exaggerated or believed the outpost of his rhetoric. Compare the suspension of visitors from a list of countries which became #MuslimBan.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @BBCNormanS: Brexit White paper suggests Govt will seek single market deals for car manufacturers, financial services and chemicals
  • Options
    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Remember, it's only pre-marital sex if you actually end up getting married one day.
    Three times, in his case isn't it?
    Not very potent, then - though I'm curious to know how you obtained the intimate details.
    If you know which websites to go to, we've all seen the footage of the Don.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,667
    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    Irony must be even deader than it was before.

    Scott_P said:
    I am not inclined to believe that in full, particularly given that it comes from the Indy; the Beano is more reliable.

    Looks like another story where the anti-Trumpers have exaggerated or believed the outpost of his rhetoric. Compare the suspension of visitors from a list of countries which became #MuslimBan.
    There is, of course, the strong possibility that it's just the White House trolling. It's still dismaying that his supporters think that's acceptable behaviour for a president.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,013
    Scott_P said:

    @BBCNormanS: Brexit White paper suggests Govt will seek single market deals for car manufacturers, financial services and chemicals

    What about recreational pharmaceuticals?
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,030
    Ishmael_Z said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Virtue signalling, then?
    Trump would be taking the same moral position as the Pope, whether he can do it with a straight face or not given his history is another matter!
    Perhaps he will practise potus interruptus. That would be good.

    I expect TSE knows the right sites to go to!
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,030

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Virtue signalling, then?
    Trump would be taking the same moral position as the Pope, whether he can do it with a straight face or not given his history is another matter!
    Sometimes you just have to check the calendar - no almost two months to go until April 1st.
    With Trump every day is April 1st!
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,333
    Hugely amusing line from the paper:

    "Whilst Parliament has remained sovereign throughout our membership of the EU, it has not always felt like that."

    "not always felt like that" = you are morons who have fundamentally misunderstood the concept of sovereignty. Talking to you, PB Leavers.
  • Options
    ARSENAL manager Arsene Wenger and Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn are to trade roles in a bid to transform the fortunes of their respective teams.

    The year-long experiment will see Corbyn don Wenger’s ‘very hungry caterpillar’ anorak in the Arsenal dugout, while Wenger will grow a beard to face Theresa May across the despatch box.

    A Labour spokesman said: “Mr Wenger has already pledged that Labour will finish in the top four of every by-election while he is in charge.

    “He also plans to bring in a number of European politicians into the party who will be ideally suited to travel up to Stoke or Burnley on a cold February weekday night and perform fantastically well, so long as they are wearing gloves.”

    http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/sport/sport-headlines/wenger-and-corbyn-to-swap-jobs-20170202121449
  • Options
    isam said:

    isam said:

    isam said:

    I'm more interested in why Leave.EU would release this.

    To build narrative and momentum.

    In 2015 the Tories and UKIP were neck and neck, now they can say only UKIP can beat Labour here.
    Perhaps, but then why not show Labour and UKIP neck and neck? There is a danger in making undecided voters think it's all over. If the EU ref polling had overestimated Leave I suspect the result may have been different.
    If there's one thing I've learned over the years, UKIP are shite at expectations management.
    That's the only thing you've learned UKIP are shite at?
    How are they at winning referendums/achieving their ambitions?
    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
    I think that's right. People like me would have felt very uncomfortable having just Farage in our corner. I would probably have abstained.
    So even then UKIP needed the Tories to win referendums/achieve ambitions.
    Bit of a pattern emerging..
    If you can stop yourself being an unsuccessful troll for a minute, would you care to answer this?

    Would it not be the SNP's success if Scotland gained independence with the help of high profile politicians from other parties heading the official campaign?
    Would you feel a bit less happy that you were independent & that your aim had been achieved?
    You keep squeezing out wibbly, defensive replies, so not that unsuccessful.

    You're comparing a successful governing party with one that's not governed anything; the latter managed to ride a popular, mainly English wave, and its single issue ambition was attained for a number of reasons. Now that party has subsided back into incoherent irrelevance.

    In the extremely unlikely event of a successful campaign for an independent Scotland being dependent on the support of someone like Farage, I'll vote No.
    Wow that's quite remarkable, party politics over country!

    Andy Burnham is a good example of party before country.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @PolhomeEditor: BREAKING The parliamentary branch of Unite has voted 35-25 to nominate Gerard Coyne to be the union's new general secretary.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    TOPPING said:

    Hugely amusing line from the paper:

    "Whilst Parliament has remained sovereign throughout our membership of the EU, it has not always felt like that."

    "not always felt like that" = you are morons who have fundamentally misunderstood the concept of sovereignty. Talking to you, PB Leavers.

    https://twitter.com/law_and_policy/status/827152571819245569
  • Options
    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,908
    FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    The Trump administration expects to declare war on China apparently. Are we sending our troops as part of Anglosphere?

    @Philip_Thompson: Source?

    Major news item. Google it: www.google.co.uk/webhp?q=steve+bannon+china&tbm=nws

    I suspect even Republicans will say, wait a minute, and dispense with Trump before that happens. But I wouldn't rely on it!
    And in case anyone thinks being at war with China is far-fetched, this is essentially the same rhetoric as at the start of the Bush administration about war with Iraq (and before 9/11).
    Iran is more likely I think?
    No need to worry really though the conservatives on pb have assured us many times that Trump makes war less likely.
  • Options
    TOPPING said:

    Hugely amusing line from the paper:

    "Whilst Parliament has remained sovereign throughout our membership of the EU, it has not always felt like that."

    "not always felt like that" = you are morons who have fundamentally misunderstood the concept of sovereignty. Talking to you, PB Leavers.

    I feel the government should have posted a trigger warning for Leavers before they published that.
  • Options
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    isam said:

    I'm more interested in why Leave.EU would release this.

    To build narrative and momentum.

    In 2015 the Tories and UKIP were neck and neck, now they can say only UKIP can beat Labour here.
    Perhaps, but then why not show Labour and UKIP neck and neck? There is a danger in making undecided voters think it's all over. If the EU ref polling had overestimated Leave I suspect the result may have been different.
    If there's one thing I've learned over the years, UKIP are shite at expectations management.
    That's the only thing you've learned UKIP are shite at?
    How are they at winning referendums/achieving their ambitions?
    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
    I think that's right. People like me would have felt very uncomfortable having just Farage in our corner. I would probably have abstained.
    So even then UKIP needed the Tories to win referendums/achieve ambitions.
    Bit of a pattern emerging..
    This Ukip are shite/Farage never won an election shite is up there with Jilted John when it comes to missing the point:

    Oh, she is cruel and heartless
    to pack me for Gordon
    Just cos he's better looking than me
    Just cos he's cool and sexy

    But I know he's a moron, Gordon is a moron
    Gordon is a moron, Gordon is a moron.

    In the same way as Trump is POTUS even if he is an odious joke, so Farage engineered Brexit even if he is an odious joke.
    Trump is POTUS, Farage is a radio talk show guy.
    a radio talk show guy who engineered Brexit. Or are the consequences of brexit too trivial to catch your attention?
    I refer you to my previous statement:

    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
  • Options
    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592
  • Options
    Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019
    Scott_P said:

    @BBCNormanS: Brexit White paper suggests Govt will seek single market deals for car manufacturers, financial services and chemicals

    So immediately the EU negotiators say 'not without free movement' Declaring your negotiating strategy up front is idiotic and shame on any MP that wants details
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,333
    Scott_P said:

    TOPPING said:

    Hugely amusing line from the paper:

    "Whilst Parliament has remained sovereign throughout our membership of the EU, it has not always felt like that."

    "not always felt like that" = you are morons who have fundamentally misunderstood the concept of sovereignty. Talking to you, PB Leavers.

    https://twitter.com/law_and_policy/status/827152571819245569
    haha well it stood out a country mile, but also well done DD at least he isn't shirking from that truth.
  • Options
    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,748

    John_M said:

    I've just galloped through the A50 white paper. I would be ashamed to have produced something like this in my pomp. It's pretty thin gruel. It skates over all the hard stuff (e.g. NI/Eire border), with a bunch of platitudes, aspirational statements plus just a smear of tractor statistics (10k pigs per week!). Not at all what I was expecting.

    Humph.

    There's nothing much to it, but I'm not at all surprised. On every question of importance, it says that 'that will be a matter for negotiation'. That seems to me to be a simple statement of the obvious, which is why all those calls from Labour and others for more clarity don't make sense.

    It's quite a useful summary of some of the basic statistics, however.
    @ProfChalmers,one of the most interesting of the Scottish Twitterati, made an interesting point yesterday that the "no pre-negotiations", far from being a handicap is actually a get-out for the government. He was talking about trade deals with third parties, but the same applies to the EU negotiations as well:

    The issue of the UK signing trade deals pre-Brexit initially looked like a govt handicap; it's actually a get-out. http://bbc.in/2juMZkO ...

    Instead, MPs will be asked to sign off on the Brexit deal on the basis that lots of great deals are just round the corner; honestly…

    Any attempt to probe the detail of the "pipeline" will be stonewalled. "You surely don't want to prejudice confidential discussions?"

    And then when any deals materialise, the scope for challenging any aspect of them will be minimised. "Britain needs this because of Brexit."

  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,333
    edited February 2017
    My other question is, once EU law has been incorporated into UK law, which elements will the devolved legislatures be able to determine themselves?

    " the [Great Repeal] Bill will preserve EU law where it stands at the moment before we leave the EU. Parliament (and, where appropriate, the devolved legislatures) will then be able to decide which elements of that law to keep, amend or repeal once we have left the EU"
  • Options
    AlsoIndigoAlsoIndigo Posts: 1,852

    TOPPING said:

    Hugely amusing line from the paper:

    "Whilst Parliament has remained sovereign throughout our membership of the EU, it has not always felt like that."

    "not always felt like that" = you are morons who have fundamentally misunderstood the concept of sovereignty. Talking to you, PB Leavers.

    I feel the government should have posted a trigger warning for Leavers before they published that.
    Nah, I think most Leavers feel they can afford to be magnanimous, what with winning and all :smirk:
  • Options
    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,748
    edited February 2017
    rkrkrk said:

    FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    The Trump administration expects to declare war on China apparently. Are we sending our troops as part of Anglosphere?

    @Philip_Thompson: Source?

    Major news item. Google it: www.google.co.uk/webhp?q=steve+bannon+china&tbm=nws

    I suspect even Republicans will say, wait a minute, and dispense with Trump before that happens. But I wouldn't rely on it!
    And in case anyone thinks being at war with China is far-fetched, this is essentially the same rhetoric as at the start of the Bush administration about war with Iraq (and before 9/11).
    Iran is more likely I think?
    No need to worry really though the conservatives on pb have assured us many times that Trump makes war less likely.
    There will be a war in the Middle East (Iran probably?) AT THE SAME TIME as the one with China, according to Mr Bannon. More special relationship opportunities for us!
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    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,013

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    Wait, they catch more in our waters...
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    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    isam said:

    I'm more interested in why Leave.EU would release this.

    To build narrative and momentum.

    In 2015 the Tories and UKIP were neck and neck, now they can say only UKIP can beat Labour here.
    Perhaps, but then why not show Labour and UKIP neck and neck? There is a danger in making undecided voters think it's all over. If the EU ref polling had overestimated Leave I suspect the result may have been different.
    If there's one thing I've learned over the years, UKIP are shite at expectations management.
    That's the only thing you've learned UKIP are shite at?
    How are they at winning referendums/achieving their ambitions?
    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
    I think that's right. People like me would have felt very uncomfortable having just Farage in our corner. I would probably have abstained.
    So even then UKIP needed the Tories to win referendums/achieve ambitions.
    Bit of a pattern emerging..
    This Ukip are shite/Farage never won an election shite is up there with Jilted John when it comes to missing the point:

    Oh, she is cruel and heartless
    to pack me for Gordon
    Just cos he's better looking than me
    Just cos he's cool and sexy

    But I know he's a moron, Gordon is a moron
    Gordon is a moron, Gordon is a moron.

    In the same way as Trump is POTUS even if he is an odious joke, so Farage engineered Brexit even if he is an odious joke.
    Trump is POTUS, Farage is a radio talk show guy.
    a radio talk show guy who engineered Brexit. Or are the consequences of brexit too trivial to catch your attention?
    I refer you to my previous statement:

    If Boris and Gove had supported 'Remain' we would have had a different outcome.
    And if my aunt were a wagon she'd have wheels.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,329
    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    Remember, it's only pre-marital sex if you actually end up getting married one day.
    Getting twitchy Robert? BoE says 2% now.
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,760
    edited February 2017

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    £484million is more than £114million?

    By about minus £370 million......

    And I note the EU fisheries has "heavy reliance" on the UK, while to the UK the EU is "important".......
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    They catch 7x as much as us worth (for some reason) 5x as much. I imagine saying we want a mutually beneficial deal is a carrot.
  • Options
    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,748
    rcs1000 said:

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    Wait, they catch more in our waters...
    British fishermen have been shafted - less by the EU than our own governments who traded away their interest for other more lucrative or politically better connected causes. I doubt that's going to change post-Brexit. We need Denmark and Spain to agree our trading arrangements, with Spain also having a big say over Gibraltar. Not a problem - have the fish from our waters. The difference now is that our Brexit supporting farmers will join them as chips to be bargained away. They really didn't know what they were voting for.
  • Options
    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    rcs1000 said:

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    Wait, they catch more in our waters...
    misread it. need new readers....
  • Options
    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,908

    rcs1000 said:

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    Wait, they catch more in our waters...
    misread it. need new readers....
    One apology point to you sir!
  • Options
    notmenotme Posts: 3,293

    TOPPING said:

    Hugely amusing line from the paper:

    "Whilst Parliament has remained sovereign throughout our membership of the EU, it has not always felt like that."

    "not always felt like that" = you are morons who have fundamentally misunderstood the concept of sovereignty. Talking to you, PB Leavers.

    I feel the government should have posted a trigger warning for Leavers before they published that.
    But Parliament is and has been sovereign since the Glorious Revolution.
  • Options
    CD13CD13 Posts: 6,351
    Mr Z,

    "And if my aunt were a wagon she'd have wheels."

    A delicate gloss on an old-fashioned phrase. But I suppose "And if my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle." is out of date. Now she'd be my uncle in transition.
  • Options
    notme said:

    TOPPING said:

    Hugely amusing line from the paper:

    "Whilst Parliament has remained sovereign throughout our membership of the EU, it has not always felt like that."

    "not always felt like that" = you are morons who have fundamentally misunderstood the concept of sovereignty. Talking to you, PB Leavers.

    I feel the government should have posted a trigger warning for Leavers before they published that.
    But Parliament is and has been sovereign since the Glorious Revolution.
    I know that, you know that, but if I wanted to be cruel, I could go back into the PB archives and point out all the times I said that when PB Leavers said they voted Leave to ensure Parliament was sovereign.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933
    rkrkrk said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    Wait, they catch more in our waters...
    misread it. need new readers....
    One apology point to you sir!
    I don't think so! That's an acknowledgement of a mistake (rare, I grant you) swiftly followed by a blame shift (classic PB)
  • Options
    Subtle:

    3.6
    We must also recognise the importance of trade within the UK to all parts of the Union. For example, Scotland’s exports to the rest of the UK are estimated to be four times greater than those to the EU27 (in 2015, £49.8 billion compared with £12.3 billion). So our guiding principle will be to ensure that – as we leave the EU – no new barriers to living and doing business within our own Union are created.
  • Options
    Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019
    FF43 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    Wait, they catch more in our waters...
    British fishermen have been shafted - less by the EU than our own governments who traded away their interest for other more lucrative or politically better connected causes. I doubt that's going to change post-Brexit. We need Denmark and Spain to agree our trading arrangements, with Spain also having a big say over Gibraltar. Not a problem - have the fish from our waters. The difference now is that our Brexit supporting farmers will join them as chips to be bargained away. They really didn't know what they were voting for.
    Yes, once we're out and UK politicians gain nothing by sucking up to the EU then perhaps we'll get better deals.
  • Options
    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    edited February 2017
    The most interesting thing about the White Paper is the fact that they carefully include graphs by country, as a not-very-subtle hint that if they play nasty, some of the little guys amongst the EU27 are gonna get hurt. That's quite smart.

    Pity about the screw-up on Chart 7.1, though!
  • Options
    mattmatt Posts: 3,789
    FF43 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    Wait, they catch more in our waters...
    British fishermen have been shafted - less by the EU than our own governments who traded away their interest for other more lucrative or politically better connected causes. I doubt that's going to change post-Brexit. We need Denmark and Spain to agree our trading arrangements, with Spain also having a big say over Gibraltar. Not a problem - have the fish from our waters. The difference now is that our Brexit supporting farmers will join them as chips to be bargained away. They really didn't know what they were voting for.
    British fishermen also knowingly sold their quotas to offshore companies, pocketed the proceeds and expect HMG to reclaim them for said fishermen.
  • Options
    CD13 said:

    Mr Z,

    "And if my aunt were a wagon she'd have wheels."

    A delicate gloss on an old-fashioned phrase. But I suppose "And if my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle." is out of date. Now she'd be my uncle in transition.

    I'd imagine if aunty CD13 had balls, (s)he'd be pretty much past the transition stage.
  • Options
    AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 2,869
    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    What is the purpose of such an Executive Order? It sounds rather like issuing a fiat that we disapprove of Gravity.

    Good afternoon, everyone.
  • Options
    You all want a good giggle?

    I'm flying to New York for a short visit at the end of the month.

    What would me the mid price of how long I'm questioned for by the authorities at the airport?
  • Options
    Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019
    matt said:

    FF43 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    Wait, they catch more in our waters...
    British fishermen have been shafted - less by the EU than our own governments who traded away their interest for other more lucrative or politically better connected causes. I doubt that's going to change post-Brexit. We need Denmark and Spain to agree our trading arrangements, with Spain also having a big say over Gibraltar. Not a problem - have the fish from our waters. The difference now is that our Brexit supporting farmers will join them as chips to be bargained away. They really didn't know what they were voting for.
    British fishermen also knowingly sold their quotas to offshore companies, pocketed the proceeds and expect HMG to reclaim them for said fishermen.
    Perhaps because their quota wasn't large enough to earn any type of living on and they couldn't afford to buy extra quota because they were already poor.
  • Options
    rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 7,908
    isam said:

    rkrkrk said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    Wait, they catch more in our waters...
    misread it. need new readers....
    One apology point to you sir!
    I don't think so! That's an acknowledgement of a mistake (rare, I grant you) swiftly followed by a blame shift (classic PB)
    Controversy already!
    You're right though and I apologize.
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    AnneJGP said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    What is the purpose of such an Executive Order? It sounds rather like issuing a fiat that we disapprove of Gravity.

    Good afternoon, everyone.
    Virtue signalling. Like actual real honest to goodness virtue signalling because if they were serious try could actually draft some legislation about it. But they aren't. So it's virtue signalling to make their base think they care.
  • Options
    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,171

    A very interesting and forceful response by Mark Carney in response to a French journalist's question about banks moving to the EU27. It's worth reading in full (13:35)

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/live/2017/feb/02/bank-of-england-interest-rates-quarterly-inflation-report-brexit-live

    "Black box risk" (© M. Carney) has the subtle implication that the European blowhards trying to get financial stuff from the City don't understand what they are trying to do.
  • Options
    AnneJGP said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    What is the purpose of such an Executive Order? It sounds rather like issuing a fiat that we disapprove of Gravity.

    Good afternoon, everyone.
    Might be something to do with where federal funds can be used to support these views.
  • Options
    MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584
    AnneJGP said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    What is the purpose of such an Executive Order? It sounds rather like issuing a fiat that we disapprove of Gravity.

    Good afternoon, everyone.

    Nobody likes Gravity. It just gets you down.

  • Options

    You all want a good giggle?

    I'm flying to New York for a short visit at the end of the month.

    What would me the mid price of how long I'm questioned for by the authorities at the airport?

    It would depend a lot on how you answer the question 'Do you intend to commit a terrorist act in the United States?'
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,333

    You all want a good giggle?

    I'm flying to New York for a short visit at the end of the month.

    What would me the mid price of how long I'm questioned for by the authorities at the airport?

    What happens if you go via Dublin?
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    CD13CD13 Posts: 6,351
    Mr Isam,

    You really don't need to be upset by the bitter Remainers on here. They are few in number, are probably fervent Internationalists and have seen their world dissolve before their eyes. They are also in a small minority even among the Remain voters. And to make it worse, probably live in London,

    Have some sympathy, man. Think how you'd feel in those circumstances.
  • Options

    You all want a good giggle?

    I'm flying to New York for a short visit at the end of the month.

    What would me the mid price of how long I'm questioned for by the authorities at the airport?

    You'll sail through, so I'd say the average time of around 40 minutes.
  • Options
    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,748
    Scott_P said:

    @BBCNormanS: Brexit White paper suggests Govt will seek single market deals for car manufacturers, financial services and chemicals

    Convenient ready summary of sectors, tariffs and balance of trade from Open Europe. Seems like they are going for sectors with high disruption risks. Wonder if the UK government would accept free trade on cars and chmicals, but not financial services

    image
  • Options
    geoffw said:

    A very interesting and forceful response by Mark Carney in response to a French journalist's question about banks moving to the EU27. It's worth reading in full (13:35)

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/live/2017/feb/02/bank-of-england-interest-rates-quarterly-inflation-report-brexit-live

    "Black box risk" (© M. Carney) has the subtle implication that the European blowhards trying to get financial stuff from the City don't understand what they are trying to do.
    Or they get one that blows up in their face & they have to foot the bill.....
  • Options
    Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019

    You all want a good giggle?

    I'm flying to New York for a short visit at the end of the month.

    What would me the mid price of how long I'm questioned for by the authorities at the airport?

    If you're only going for a couple of days then get used to seeing the inside of an airport before returning to Blighty :grin:
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,190

    You all want a good giggle?

    I'm flying to New York for a short visit at the end of the month.

    What would me the mid price of how long I'm questioned for by the authorities at the airport?

    The last time I entered the US it took me 20 minutes. I don't know what all the fuss is about.
  • Options
    Oh dear, will we cut workers rights so they are as bad as they are in the EU?

    in many areas the UK Government has already extended workers’ rights beyond those set out in EU law. For example, UK domestic law already provides for 5.6 weeks of statutory annual leave, compared to the four weeks set out in EU law. In the UK, women who have had a child can enjoy 52 weeks of statutory maternity leave and 39 weeks of pay, not just the 14 weeks under EU law.
  • Options
    Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019

    AnneJGP said:

    HYUFD said:

    Scott_P said:
    Morally wrong, not legally wrong, if he declared them legally wrong over half of under 30s in the US would be arrested
    What is the purpose of such an Executive Order? It sounds rather like issuing a fiat that we disapprove of Gravity.

    Good afternoon, everyone.

    Nobody likes Gravity. It just gets you down.

    Yes, gravity sucks
  • Options

    You all want a good giggle?

    I'm flying to New York for a short visit at the end of the month.

    What would me the mid price of how long I'm questioned for by the authorities at the airport?

    It would depend a lot on how you answer the question 'Do you intend to commit a terrorist act in the United States?'
    I shall be on my best behaviour, my favourite exchange.

    Agent: Do you have any weapons?

    Me: Why, what do you need? Because the white Englishman who is my friend, who you haven't stopped works for a defence contractor and might be able to help you.
  • Options
    CD13CD13 Posts: 6,351
    edited February 2017
    Mr Divvie,

    "I'd imagine if aunty CD13 had balls, (s)he'd be pretty much past the transition stage."

    They're all long gone, but my recollection of them from childhood is that they did have balls - especially the maiden aunts.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,329

    You all want a good giggle?

    I'm flying to New York for a short visit at the end of the month.

    What would me the mid price of how long I'm questioned for by the authorities at the airport?

    It would depend a lot on how you answer the question 'Do you intend to commit a terrorist act in the United States?'
    And don't repeat the crack about how many guns do they want?

    So basically its a rigged market.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,333
    CD13 said:

    Mr Isam,

    You really don't need to be upset by the bitter Remainers on here. They are few in number, are probably fervent Internationalists and have seen their world dissolve before their eyes. They are also in a small minority even among the Remain voters. And to make it worse, probably live in London,

    Have some sympathy, man. Think how you'd feel in those circumstances.

    " We have long been a strong supporter of global trade liberalisation and of the rules based system for trade. An international rules based system is crucial for underpinning free trade and to ward off protectionism."

    What the fuck is that if not internationalist?
  • Options

    You all want a good giggle?

    I'm flying to New York for a short visit at the end of the month.

    What would me the mid price of how long I'm questioned for by the authorities at the airport?

    If you tell us your full name we can ensure that your wait is more than 2 hours.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    edited February 2017
    Fox video
    President Trump: “America must forever remain a tolerant society where all faiths are respected… We have to feel safe and secure.” https://t.co/Qauhk9RmZm

    President Trump on immigration executive order: “We want people to come into our nation but we want people to love us...” https://t.co/yaMSux7LGP
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @jameskirkup: Unless I'm missing something, Brexit White Paper does *not* rule out CJEU being forum for dispute resolution in UK:EU trade relations.
  • Options
    Been busy all day, which country has Trump threatened this morning?
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,329
    geoffw said:

    A very interesting and forceful response by Mark Carney in response to a French journalist's question about banks moving to the EU27. It's worth reading in full (13:35)

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/live/2017/feb/02/bank-of-england-interest-rates-quarterly-inflation-report-brexit-live

    "Black box risk" (© M. Carney) has the subtle implication that the European blowhards trying to get financial stuff from the City don't understand what they are trying to do.
    Don't think it is all that subtle. The fact is that both sides of the skill set are here and not there. If they take the business without adequate regulatory oversight they would indeed be storing up trouble. He's right of course. After all we have @Cyclefree and they don't.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,933
    rkrkrk said:

    isam said:

    rkrkrk said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I hope Big G's fishy inlaw who opposes independence & supports Brexit but is a lifelong member of the SNP is looking in.

    https://twitter.com/PaulaHoneyRose/status/827150097502830592

    Tis interesting that we gain more from common fisheries than we lose...
    Wait, they catch more in our waters...
    misread it. need new readers....
    One apology point to you sir!
    I don't think so! That's an acknowledgement of a mistake (rare, I grant you) swiftly followed by a blame shift (classic PB)
    Controversy already!
    You're right though and I apologize.
    :smile:
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,333
    Scott_P said:

    @jameskirkup: Unless I'm missing something, Brexit White Paper does *not* rule out CJEU being forum for dispute resolution in UK:EU trade relations.

    Well...it says there will be a panel for dispute resolution. But who if not CJEU will opine on single market matters? Not much room for a joint panel there..
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    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Oh my

    Guido
    WATCH Corbyn: People Choose to Be Gay [VIDEO] https://t.co/D9ZxaxF3yu https://t.co/vBtBTPJiyR
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    Been busy all day, which country has Trump threatened this morning?

    Might be easier to list the ones he hasn't.

    Iran is the main one today.
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    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,748

    The most interesting thing about the White Paper is the fact that they carefully include graphs by country, as a not-very-subtle hint that if they play nasty, some of the little guys amongst the EU27 are gonna get hurt. That's quite smart.

    Pity about the screw-up on Chart 7.1, though!

    There seems to be a consensus in Europe as well as the UK that a precipitous shift to the Eurozone is not in the interests of the rEU. My take is that those same risks make an orderly move more, not less pressing, as the EU will want to have control and not be beholden to a foreign regime. This is regardless of any commercial benefits coming from a domestic financial services industry.
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    CD13 said:

    Mr Isam,

    You really don't need to be upset by the bitter Remainers on here. They are few in number, are probably fervent Internationalists and have seen their world dissolve before their eyes. They are also in a small minority even among the Remain voters. And to make it worse, probably live in London,

    Have some sympathy, man. Think how you'd feel in those circumstances.

    Nah. I am reasonably chilled about it all. I am in secure employment with as much overtime as I choose to do and a gold plated pension, just a couple of years away. It is not me that faces redundancy, and if it all goes tits up then I can buy up assets on the cheap, or go to work in the Gulf.

    Let the Leavers enjoy their sovereignty
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,760
    edited February 2017
    ..... financial services passports. Both UK and EU firms benefit from these arrangements – there are over 5,000 UK firms that utilise passports to provide services across the rest of the EU, but around 8,000 European firms that use passports to provide services into the UK.

    "but" around 8,000 EU firms.....
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