Mr. surbiton, you could ask how many speak English. The Casey Report indicates 16% of Muslims struggle to speak it.
The burkha ban talk irks me a bit because I keep vacillating between positions, and can see the arguments on both sides. Much more comfortable just having a settled view. Not unlike betting (although the more confident I was this year, the likelier the bets were to be wrong).
Mr. H, I agree entirely. Je Suis Charlie, except for when it actually comes to taking the piss. Then you get Newsnight haranguing an atheist cartoonist for having the temerity to contravene the rules of a religion to which he does not belong.
Mr. Sandpit, it would be nice to bet against Wehrlein (especially as I backed and tipped him at 3). However, I think Verstappen may be value there. New aerodynamic rules give substantial potential for McLaren and Red Bull.
What specious twaddle - wearing a Tony The Tiger furry costume covers your face whilst promoting Frosties on a street corner or playing a Disney Mickey Mouse host - this is about the routine public wearing of face coverings to oppress or deny female identity.
I rarely get irritated on behalf of females - this is one of them. It's the whole Your Fault For Getting Raped Because You Wore A Short Skirt stupidity. Just stop and think what you're doing to appease exactly this sort of cultural mindset.
Men would never think of wearing long sleeves to cover their biceps or trousers their thighs in case women accosted them.
Argh.
It's nothing like the "Your Fault For Getting Raped Because You Wore A Short Skirt stupidity".
And again, you seem to ignore that some women *want* to wear them, and the consequences a ban would have on them.
They should be reminded that it is the Will of Allah (He wot should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked!
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
While there is some truth in what you say, most people born in Germany who migrate to Britain are the children of British Servicemen and women, indeed one of my cousins counts as a Hong Kong migrant for the same reason.
Yes, the immigration statistics need to be more nuanced as people move and travel more than they ever did before. My two nephews were born in Dubai, but they will will never be allowed to be Emirati and will always see the UK as 'home'. It would be interesting to see how they reflect in the various statistics, especially when compared to, for example, those who were born in Canada or Australia of British parents.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Thank God we are leaving the EU so we can keep cease Free Movement of vile, radical Islam into our land, thus moderating further damage to our liberal way of life.
Hopefully and assuredly the populist revolution will continue. Soon we we will be encouraging Islamists and fellow travellers like you to actively leave.
Hang on, I thought the current view of the right was that liberalism had been defeated?
For your second point: as far as I'm aware, there isn't a long-standing religion that involves going about naked. .
You mean to say you never heard of the Former Soviet Republic of Nudistan??
Don't some Jaines go for nudism? As a religion, they've some gorgeous temples and interesting beliefs.
There's a big temple up the road from me. Will take a drive by.
There are very few Jain temples outside India, but we have one in Leicester, converted from an old Victorian Chapel. Lovely people and a very tolerant religion, but I cannot recall one insisting on going naked about the city!
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
Yes they are, but the fact that men don't have to wear them means men would not in any way suffer from them being banned. If anything, many of them probably want their wives to stay at home all the time.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
What specious twaddle - wearing a Tony The Tiger furry costume covers your face whilst promoting Frosties on a street corner or playing a Disney Mickey Mouse host - this is about the routine public wearing of face coverings to oppress or deny female identity.
I rarely get irritated on behalf of females - this is one of them. It's the whole Your Fault For Getting Raped Because You Wore A Short Skirt stupidity. Just stop and think what you're doing to appease exactly this sort of cultural mindset.
Men would never think of wearing long sleeves to cover their biceps or trousers their thighs in case women accosted them.
Argh.
It's nothing like the "Your Fault For Getting Raped Because You Wore A Short Skirt stupidity".
And again, you seem to ignore that some women *want* to wear them, and the consequences a ban would have on them.
Scary, JosiasJessop and I agreeing on something. End times stuff.
''It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.''
No its not western ideology its western law. BY discriminating you are breaking our law.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
I'm not exactly Theresa May's biggest fan but her "red white and blue Brexit" seems a harmless enough way of deflecting the masses while she has nothing in particular to say. Some people are determined to be upset by anything.
She's thinking of creative ways of saying nothing. Brexit is Brexit and it's colourful.
I think this is the real problem (from a UK traditional freedoms/tolerance point of view): even if the burqa is a cultural rather than genuinely religious dictate, banning it is tantamount to religious persecution (unless, I guess, we also ban scarves, balaclavas, ski masks and any other face coverings - not sensible, let alone practical). That's not a step we should be contemplating in this country.
snip
A ban of the burqa does not need to be just of that item - it could be presented as a ban of all clothing that prevents identification - hoodies with ski masks should be included.
A blanket ban of face-coverings in public spaces is certainly more equitable, but a.) puts the law in a very intrusive place (perhaps this is something a US citizen is more comfortable with?) and b.) creates complications about how you define a "public space". Must we ban people from wearing scarves over their face walking down the high street in winter? Or are "public spaces" simply those indoors, with air conditioning?
I certainly want to be able to wear my balaklava if it's really cold (though I generally, if not always, take it off in buildings).
Yeah, thinking of Alaska, it is not simple outside.
Halloween also a potential problem, I'd suggest.
What specious twaddle - wearing a Tony The Tiger furry costume covers your face whilst promoting Frosties on a street corner or playing a Disney Mickey Mouse host - this is about the routine public wearing of face coverings to oppress or deny female identity.
I rarely get irritated on behalf of females - this is one of them. It's the whole Your Fault For Getting Raped Because You Wore A Short Skirt stupidity. Just stop and think what you're doing to appease exactly this sort of cultural mindset.
Men would never think of wearing long sleeves to cover their biceps or trousers their thighs in case women accosted them.
Argh.
No, not appeasement at all - just the even-handed application of the law to all granted its protection. I carry no brief for the frankly ludicrous dictates of the Umma, but one cannot set laws that discriminate against a minority simply because their beliefs are distasteful. If their actions or even incitement to actions harm or threaten harm to others, use the full weight of the law against them. Beyond that, they are subjects of the Crown, as are you or I, and are entitled to the free licence that entails.
He is completely right. See 'safe spaces' and the Danish cartoons no-one dared publish as good examples of Popper's theory in practice.
Tolerance only works as long as everyone is tolerant. If a particular group wish to be intolerant, then that group will end up dominating and intolerance will become the norm.
I'm not exactly Theresa May's biggest fan but her "red white and blue Brexit" seems a harmless enough way of deflecting the masses while she has nothing in particular to say. Some people are determined to be upset by anything.
She's thinking of creative ways of saying nothing. Brexit is Brexit and it's colourful.
Exactly, it's not a new mistake. Once you accept that she has failed to set a clear direction, you can't complain that she has found a new way to avoid setting a clear direction.
I think this is the real problem (from a UK traditional freedoms/tolerance point of view): even if the burqa is a cultural rather than genuinely religious dictate, banning it is tantamount to religious persecution (unless, I guess, we also ban scarves, balaclavas, ski masks and any other face coverings - not sensible, let alone practical). That's not a step we should be contemplating in this country.
The closest I can see a free nation being able to come to this might be a requirement that, if requested by a representative of the state (policeman?), any individual must uncover their face for identification purposes (I think this would, to be fair, require a re-design of most burqas). One might also amend legislation to permit shopholders (for example) to request de-veiling as a condition of service without being potentially guilty of hate crimes/discrimination. Any further, and we're getting into really dangerous territory.
I disagree. I think it is reasonable to require all people in public spaces to be identifiable in a timeframe that is consistent with public safety and security. A stop and reveal process does not accomplish that.
In the same vein, in stores de-veiling would have to be a condition of entry into the store, not of service.
Religion is not a carte blanche for everything. Polygamy is banned in the US, despite Mormonism. It is unthinkable in modern society to permit a religion that espouses human sacrifice, as some religions did historically.
A ban of the burqa does not need to be just of that item - it could be presented as a ban of all clothing that prevents identification - hoodies with ski masks should be included.
A blanket ban of face-coverings in public spaces is certainly more equitable, but a.) puts the law in a very intrusive place (perhaps this is something a US citizen is more comfortable with?) and b.) creates complications about how you define a "public space". Must we ban people from wearing scarves over their face walking down the high street in winter? Or are "public spaces" simply those indoors, with air conditioning?
I certainly want to be able to wear my balaklava if it's really cold (though I generally, if not always, take it off in buildings).
There would need to be an exception for coverings required by health and safety; motorcycle helmets being one of the more obvious. That would introduce a pretty big loophole although presumably the burden would be on the person covering their face to prove that the covering was needed in the circumstances.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
I'm not exactly Theresa May's biggest fan but her "red white and blue Brexit" seems a harmless enough way of deflecting the masses while she has nothing in particular to say. Some people are determined to be upset by anything.
She's thinking of creative ways of saying nothing. Brexit is Brexit and it's colourful.
What specious twaddle - wearing a Tony The Tiger furry costume covers your face whilst promoting Frosties on a street corner or playing a Disney Mickey Mouse host - this is about the routine public wearing of face coverings to oppress or deny female identity.
I rarely get irritated on behalf of females - this is one of them. It's the whole Your Fault For Getting Raped Because You Wore A Short Skirt stupidity. Just stop and think what you're doing to appease exactly this sort of cultural mindset.
Men would never think of wearing long sleeves to cover their biceps or trousers their thighs in case women accosted them.
Argh.
It's nothing like the "Your Fault For Getting Raped Because You Wore A Short Skirt stupidity".
And again, you seem to ignore that some women *want* to wear them, and the consequences a ban would have on them.
Scary, JosiasJessop and I agreeing on something. End times stuff.
Nah, I bet we'd agree on lots of things if we sat down for a pint together. t'Internet tends to being out differences rather than agreement.
I'm not exactly Theresa May's biggest fan but her "red white and blue Brexit" seems a harmless enough way of deflecting the masses while she has nothing in particular to say. Some people are determined to be upset by anything.
She's thinking of creative ways of saying nothing. Brexit is Brexit and it's colourful.
She's doing a bloody good job of saying nothing so far, while allowing all and sundry to spout off their own opening gambits and red lines for negotiation.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
Do you accept that it is the Will of Allah (SWT) that you were born?
Switched on SKY earlier to watch the Supreme Court and heard Joshua Rozenberg singing the praises of Lord Pannick and commenting that "Gina Miller was extremely lucky to have obtained his services." He also commented that James Eadie and team were looking slightly uncomfortable. Hardly impartial comments!
Lord Pannick has a quiet aggression, that James Eadie, unfortunately didn't display.
"We seemed to have reached a meta phase whereby we all comment on the assumed outrage of other people, thus generating all the smoke regardless of heat."
True, it's always best to comment on your own feelings. Taking offence on behalf of another group entirely is ludicrous.
So Brexit ... I believed the polling and had already congratulated a Remainer late on June 23rd. But now, if the vote was overturned by Establishment dirty tricks, I'd be really annoyed. And I'd say I'm relatively easy-going about politics.
What is worrying is that I voted LD up to 2015 (Labour from the 70's to late 90s)
I doubt if they can disrupt things now, but the even the threat makes me irritated. So come on, Theresa call their bluff and if you cock up the negotiations, I can happily vote you out.
Mr. T, doubt it'll be banned here any time soon. Labour definitely won't propose it. Conservatives would fear being branded as toxic or suchlike (or racist, although that term's rather lost its potency seeing as it's sprayed about so liberally).
At least one of the two major parties must back it for it to become law.
Mr. Sandpit, yeah... it's really quite depressing. My comedy's all fantastical stuff so it isn't really affected in any way, but I do quite like the two banners outside the Acrozeno in The Adventures of Sir Edric. The first proclaims Zeno's benevolence. The second shows an unbeliever being burnt alive.
Faisal Islam 'Pannick might be winning some potential business here'
Faisal Islam long ago lost all independence over the EU and will no doubt be appointed a Commissioner at some time in the future
Speaking to several people while shopping today there was a universal rejection of the Judges involvement and frustration that the Country has voted and must get on with it.
I would expect that to be a majority view and not sure this whole performance will gain public support and will only emphasize the elite and liberal left are removed from ordinary people's lives
''Mr. T, doubt it'll be banned here any time soon.''
Again, its the reason UKIP exist. UKIP will adopt a ban as policy, they'll start edging up in the polls and the main parties will consider a move to placate the electorate.
Mr. (Miss?) Pinkrose, I'm curious: suppose the Government enacted a burkha ban here*. Would you comply with it as the law of the land, or refuse, as you'd consider the will of Allah to override man-made laws?
''Mr. T, doubt it'll be banned here any time soon.''
Again, its the reason UKIP exist. UKIP will adopt a ban as policy, they'll start edging up in the polls and the main parties will consider a move to placate the electorate.
I recon that's how politics works these days.
Why don't the EU adopt it as a policy. That would be fun
Mr. Taffys, UKIP's in trouble and could easily become extinct. It's current situation is poor. I agree the strategic position is lovely but it has to survive its present problems first.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Nah they wont be banned in the UK, too many Muslim women wear them, impossible to enforce and will radicalise many people if you try. If anything a ban will encourage more women to see the purpose of wearing niqab and the reward of sacrificing in the way of Allah swt vanity in this world for beauty in the Hereafter.
Remember before 9/11 and the war on terror, even hijabs were a minority, now hijabs are common and niqabs are a growing minority. Any crackdowns or persecution just produces a further deepening of religious observance.
Oh and Muslims are not going anywhere, don't you worry, we are here to stay. Islam is part of the UK and Europe, indeed it's the youngest and fastest growing part of the population. The Continent of Europe will never again be only for white Xtians.
"I would expect that to be a majority view and not sure this whole performance will gain public support and will only emphasize the elite and liberal left are removed from ordinary people's lives."
It's not an edifying spectacle. However Pannick has more get up and go about him. the two government speakers were dire.
I've a sneaky suspicion that judges might just overturn things. They do have a feel for how they are portrayed. And the more I see of the proceedings, the more I can see where personal bias could be important. By comparison, science is far more objective.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
I've always thought the Sunnah is really rocky ground on which to base a culture. The Quran - the written word; fair enough. The hadith - the preachings. Okay, I can see that, though spoken words can obviously be twisted.
But the Sunnah? Copying the way he lived his life? No, goodness no. If you want to do that, then surely you need to go and live in a tent in the desert.
Switched on SKY earlier to watch the Supreme Court and heard Joshua Rozenberg singing the praises of Lord Pannick and commenting that "Gina Miller was extremely lucky to have obtained his services." He also commented that James Eadie and team were looking slightly uncomfortable. Hardly impartial comments!
Lord Pannick has a quiet aggression, that James Eadie, unfortunately didn't display.
The Supreme Court don't need aggression, they need persuasion. For the little that it's worth, I thought James Eadie did well. Greg Callus (formerly Morus of this parish) put it well on twitter:
Any betting the definition of "extremist content" will not only vary from country to country, but also expand over time?
The DNS and routing blocks for child exploitation images have been used for anti-piracy, and the techniques used for creating databases for child exploitation images are now also used for filtering pornography. It is almost guaranteed that there will be mission creep with these sorts of filters.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
I've always thought the Sunnah is really rocky ground on which to base a culture. The Quran - the written word; fair enough. The hadith - the preachings. Okay, I can see that, though spoken words can obviously be twisted.
But the Sunnah? Copying the way he lived his life? No, goodness no. If you want to do that, then surely you need to go and live in a tent in the desert.
And those who once lived in tents in the desert, found some black stuff under it - now they choose to live in 100 storey tower blocks or 30,000 sq ft villas on artificial islands!
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Nah they wont be banned in the UK, too many Muslim women wear them, impossible to enforce and will radicalise many people if you try. If anything a ban will encourage more women to see the purpose of wearing niqab and the reward of sacrificing in the way of Allah swt vanity in this world for beauty in the Hereafter.
Remember before 9/11 and the war on terror, even hijabs were a minority, now hijabs are common and niqabs are a growing minority. Any crackdowns or persecution just produces a further deepening of religious observance.
Oh and Muslims are not going anywhere, don't you worry, we are here to stay. Islam is part of the UK and Europe, indeed it's the youngest and fastest growing part of the population. The Continent of Europe will never again be only for white Xtians.
Which is why eventually the UK and Europe will begin to nudge Muslims out, small moves like banning the burka and banning halal slaughter or importation of halal meat. The secularisation of Muslims in Europe is going to happen sooner rather than later, the ones who don't wish to comply will have to leave.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
I've always thought the Sunnah is really rocky ground on which to base a culture. The Quran - the written word; fair enough. The hadith - the preachings. Okay, I can see that, though spoken words can obviously be twisted.
But the Sunnah? Copying the way he lived his life? No, goodness no. If you want to do that, then surely you need to go and live in a tent in the desert.
Josias - with respect, please do not feed the troll
Mr. T, well, we've got a little wait (probably) before the next election, though there's an off-chance it'll be next year. We'll see. I'd be very surprised.
Consider how supine the media and politicians were over Danish cartoons, or Jesus and Mo, or Charlie Hebdo, or Louis Smith[sp].
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Oh and Muslims are not going anywhere, don't you worry, we are here to stay. Islam is part of the UK and Europe, indeed it's the youngest and fastest growing part of the population. The Continent of Europe will never again be only for white Xtians.
You completely misunderstand what is happening. See The Recent Election of Donald Trump, who has actually promised to REGISTER Muslims. The pendulum has swung.
What's more is that other minorities are not being targeted because no one gives a shit what Indians, blacks or East Asians do, on the whole we don't blow up innocent people and treat people equally.
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
Are you sure the will of Allah is entirely on your side? I wonder if him and the Prophet are secretly having a laugh at your funny dresses and creepy beards, as most of you seem to have ended up living in the worst parts of Bradford.
lol you bring out all the cliches
Bradford? Nah I live in Bush (Shepherd's Bush). My family live in the North West of England and I visit them regularly, but ive never been to Bradford. My husband and I have lovely holidays in beautiful Algeria (his homeland) though, Muslims we are diverse...who knew?
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Do you see yourself as Islamophobic?
Phobias are irrational, fear of Islam is perfectly rational. War and death follows the religion everywhere it lands in the world.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Do you see yourself as Islamophobic?
Did you see yourself as Irish Republicanismphobic when Manchester/Warrington/Canary Wharf were bombed?
Mr. Max, secularisation? Sixteen percent of British Muslims struggle to speak English. Enclaves are numerous and growing.
We're a very long way away from that. The situation (isolation, radicalisation, failure to integrate etc etc) will only get worse, at least in the short term. Politicians and media are still afraid to call a spade a spade.
The BBC (at ten) buried the Casey Report well down the running order, then cited the Satanic Verses as a cause for lack of integration, before implying native Britons were as much at fault for failure to integrate.
On a betting site we are focused on results, but polling is always a statistical probability. Even if they get the sampling right, a 52% Remain / 48% Leave is nearly as accurate a poll estimate as the other way round: 48% Remain / 52% Leave, which was the actual result. A poll that said 45% Remain / 55% Leave would, in fact, be less accurate.
''Bradford? Nah I live in Bush (Shepherd's Bush). My family live in the North West of England and I visit them regularly, but ive never been to Bradford. My husband and I have lovely holidays in beautiful Algeria (his homeland) though, Muslims we are diverse...who knew? ''
Is that why you are killing so many of the non-muslims in the countries where you dominate?
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
Are you sure the will of Allah is entirely on your side? I wonder if him and the Prophet are secretly having a laugh at your funny dresses and creepy beards, as most of you seem to have ended up living in the worst parts of Bradford.
lol you bring out all the cliches
Bradford? Nah I live in Bush (Shepherd's Bush). My family live in the North West of England and I visit them regularly, but ive never been to Bradford. My husband and I have lovely holidays in beautiful Algeria (his homeland) though, Muslims we are diverse...who knew?
top trolling!
The forthcoming Channel 4 programme about diverse British Muslims living together, sounds interesting. Worth noting that nearly half of British Muslims never go to Mosque. Many are completely secular, and my Iranian barber loathes the clerics.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Do you see yourself as Islamophobic?
Phobias are irrational, fear of Islam is perfectly rational. War and death follows the religion everywhere it lands in the world.
Wikipedia defines as:
fear, prejudice, hatred or dislike directed against Islam or Muslims, or towards Islamic politics or culture
If you accepted that definition for now... Would you say yes to that question?
Merkel and the Germans appear to be doing the full about turn on everything related to immigration and FoM.
The Burqa ban follows on from her comments last week about redefining the meaning of FoM, and earlier moves to station gunboats in the med and impose 'Canada-style' immigration rules.
No. Islamophobic means "an irrational fear of Islam". I have a rational dislike and abhorrence of the more fundamentalist forms of Islam that have grown in strength in the last 30-40 years, from Wahhabism to Salafism etc.
Ironically, I used to have a sincere admiration for the moderate forms of Islam I encountered when I travelled the middle East in the 1980s and 90s. All gone now.
Syria in particular was a wonderfully welcoming and hospitable country, despite its nasty dictator. Christians could live there in peace.
The evolution of much of Islam into this dark, grotesque, self-mutilating monster is the great tragedy of our age.
I believe Maajid Nawaz now has to have round the clock security for simply stating basically this.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
I've always thought the Sunnah is really rocky ground on which to base a culture. The Quran - the written word; fair enough. The hadith - the preachings. Okay, I can see that, though spoken words can obviously be twisted.
But the Sunnah? Copying the way he lived his life? No, goodness no. If you want to do that, then surely you need to go and live in a tent in the desert.
The extent to which *any* of the teachings are based on anything remotely historically provable is extremely limited. I'd recommend Tom Holland's Shadow of the Sword as an eye-opener into the religion's roots (which are largely pagan Arab, Zoroastrian, Jewish and Christian). The first review says more.
No. Islamophobic means "an irrational fear of Islam". I have a rational dislike and abhorrence of the more fundamentalist forms of Islam that have grown in strength in the last 30-40 years, from Wahhabism to Salafism etc.
Ironically, I used to have a sincere admiration for the moderate forms of Islam I encountered when I travelled the middle East in the 1980s and 90s. All gone now.
Syria in particular was a wonderfully welcoming and hospitable country, despite its nasty dictator. Christians could live there in peace.
The evolution of much of Islam into this dark, grotesque, self-mutilating monster is the great tragedy of our age.
There is no such thing as "wahhabism". If it's in the Quran, Sunnah and the Hadiths of the Prophet saws, it's not wahhabism it's Islam.
Muhammad ibn Abdul Wahhab called for purification of the Religion to rid it of bidah (innovations) that had crept in over time.
The Channel 4 programme about diverse British Muslims living together, sounds interesting. Worth noting that nearly half of British Muslims never go to Mosque. Many are completely secular, and my Iranian barbar loathes the clerics.
Which is why we need to promote secularisation of Islam in Europe. From all of the polls we can see around 25-30% of Muslims will never integrate into British or European society. We need to find a way of nudging them back to Muslim countries. Clamping down on benefits for non-english speakers, banking halal, banning the burka etc...
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
Are you sure the will of Allah is entirely on your side? I wonder if him and the Prophet are secretly having a laugh at your funny dresses and creepy beards, as most of you seem to have ended up living in the worst parts of Bradford.
lol you bring out all the cliches
Bradford? Nah I live in Bush (Shepherd's Bush). My family live in the North West of England and I visit them regularly, but ive never been to Bradford. My husband and I have lovely holidays in beautiful Algeria (his homeland) though, Muslims we are diverse...who knew?
top trolling!
The forthcoming Channel 4 programme about diverse British Muslims living together, sounds interesting. Worth noting that nearly half of British Muslims never go to Mosque. Many are completely secular, and my Iranian barber loathes the clerics.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Do you see yourself as Islamophobic?
Did you see yourself as Irish Republicanismphobic when Manchester/Warrington/Canary Wharf were bombed?
What a stupid non-argument.
It was a question not an argument! I'm interested becayse I've observed that these labels have a power with people you might not expect.
E.g. I know people who would say they are not homophobic. But would happily say they hate gay people/are afraid of gay people/are prejudiced against gay people.
The label has a bad connotation even though they would agree with what defines it.
I was wondering if the same holds true with Islamophobic...
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Do you see yourself as Islamophobic?
No. Islamophobic means "an irrational fear of Islam". I have a rational dislike and abhorrence of the more fundamentalist forms of Islam that have grown in strength in the last 30-40 years, from Wahhabism to Salafism etc.
Ironically, I used to have a sincere admiration for the moderate forms of Islam I encountered when I travelled the middle East in the 1980s and 90s. All gone now.
Syria in particular was a wonderfully welcoming and hospitable country, despite its nasty dictator. Christians could live there in peace.
The evolution of much of Islam into this dark, grotesque, self-mutilating monster is the great tragedy of our age.
Difficult to argue with. However, it might be worth noting that we may be drifting close to an infringement of the UK's badly drafted hate laws. Possibly the odd conditional clause might be worth inserting into some of these assertions, however much force there might be behind them, if only for Mike's sake.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Do you see yourself as Islamophobic?
Phobias are irrational, fear of Islam is perfectly rational. War and death follows the religion everywhere it lands in the world.
Wikipedia defines as:
fear, prejudice, hatred or dislike directed against Islam or Muslims, or towards Islamic politics or culture
If you accepted that definition for now... Would you say yes to that question?
Wikipedia. Did you edit that just now?
A phobia is an irrational fear. Islamophobia is an irrational fear if Islam. I have a very rational fear if Islam, war and death follows it around wherever it goes.
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
Are you sure the will of Allah is entirely on your side? I wonder if him and the Prophet are secretly having a laugh at your funny dresses and creepy beards, as most of you seem to have ended up living in the worst parts of Bradford.
lol you bring out all the cliches
Bradford? Nah I live in Bush (Shepherd's Bush). My family live in the North West of England and I visit them regularly, but ive never been to Bradford. My husband and I have lovely holidays in beautiful Algeria (his homeland) though, Muslims we are diverse...who knew?
No, but one of what was once one of the best parts of Bradford (Manningham) is now one of the worst. How did that happen?
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles...
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles...
That sounds more like a Hipster dress code.
Not sure you will find both drinking over priced craft IPAs with witty names though.
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
Are you sure the will of Allah is entirely on your side? I wonder if him and the Prophet are secretly having a laugh at your funny dresses and creepy beards, as most of you seem to have ended up living in the worst parts of Bradford.
lol you bring out all the cliches
Bradford? Nah I live in Bush (Shepherd's Bush). My family live in the North West of England and I visit them regularly, but ive never been to Bradford. My husband and I have lovely holidays in beautiful Algeria (his homeland) though, Muslims we are diverse...who knew?
If Islam is so wonderful surely you would want to be surrounded entirely by other Muslim people in a happy Muslim country, why would you want to be in some ghetto, in a land of unbelievers, surrounded by heathens, many of whom cordially dislike you?
It is very odd behaviour, Methinks you aren't quite as Muslim as you say.
No. Islamophobic means "an irrational fear of Islam". I have a rational dislike and abhorrence of the more fundamentalist forms of Islam that have grown in strength in the last 30-40 years, from Wahhabism to Salafism etc.
Ironically, I used to have a sincere admiration for the moderate forms of Islam I encountered when I travelled the middle East in the 1980s and 90s. All gone now.
Syria in particular was a wonderfully welcoming and hospitable country, despite its nasty dictator. Christians could live there in peace.
The evolution of much of Islam into this dark, grotesque, self-mutilating monster is the great tragedy of our age.
A bit like Patrick Leigh Fermor's book A Time of Gifts, he found much to admire in Germany in 1933, despite early worrying signs. If he had travelled a few years later it would have resulted in a much different book — assuming he could even make the journey — with the old German values all but swept away by Nazism.
Militant hard-line Islam has been an utter catastrophe for the Middle East and North Africa.
1. Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
I've always thought the Sunnah is really rocky ground on which to base a culture. The Quran - the written word; fair enough. The hadith - the preachings. Okay, I can see that, though spoken words can obviously be twisted.
But the Sunnah? Copying the way he lived his life? No, goodness no. If you want to do that, then surely you need to go and live in a tent in the desert.
The extent to which *any* of the teachings are based on anything remotely historically provable is extremely limited. I'd recommend Tom Holland's Shadow of the Sword as an eye-opener into the religion's roots (which are largely pagan Arab, Zoroastrian, Jewish and Christian). The first review says more.
"Wikipedia defines" Exactly. What the texting generation believe because words have been devalued. A Nazi - someone you disagree with. A racist = someone who looked at you funny. It's worse than murder = a word causing offence.
A phobia has always been an irrational fear.
They all seem to be grammarphobic - an irrational fear of learning to do joined-up writing.
I see May has had her self photographed giving a speech to troops with the lectern between two gun turrets with something drapped in a huge Union Flag on one side. The whole thing is staged on a warship. #Mayday
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Do you see yourself as Islamophobic?
No. Islamophobic means "an irrational fear of Islam". I have a rational dislike and abhorrence of the more fundamentalist forms of Islam that have grown in strength in the last 30-40 years, from Wahhabism to Salafism etc.
Ironically, I used to have a sincere admiration for the moderate forms of Islam I encountered when I travelled the middle East in the 1980s and 90s. All gone now.
Syria in particular was a wonderfully welcoming and hospitable country, despite its nasty dictator. Christians could live there in peace.
The evolution of much of Islam into this dark, grotesque, self-mutilating monster is the great tragedy of our age.
Okay... But if you accepted the Wikipedia definition for now... Would you feel you come inder that category? My reason for asking is explained in anither post...
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal, we are different and in rights, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Do you see yourself as Islamophobic?
No. Islamophobic means "an irrational fear of Islam". I have a rational dislike and abhorrence of the more fundamentalist forms of Islam that have grown in strength in the last 30-40 years, from Wahhabism to Salafism etc.
Ironically, I used to have a sincere admiration for the moderate forms of Islam I encountered when I travelled the middle East in the 1980s and 90s. All gone now.
Syria in particular was a wonderfully welcoming and hospitable country, despite its nasty dictator. Christians could live there in peace.
The evolution of much of Islam into this dark, grotesque, self-mutilating monster is the great tragedy of our age.
Okay... But if you accepted the Wikipedia definition for now... Would you feel you come inder that category? My reason for asking is explained in anither post...
Wikipedia is not an authority on anything. It is a bloody user edited website.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How European immigration works.....
1. Europeans let in loads of muslims.
2. They in time become European citizens.
3. There's a clampdown and they decamp to Britain.
LOL this^^^^ is soooooo true!
There are lots of Belgian-Moroccans, Dutch-Somalis, French-Algerians etc who come to the UK because its not as Islamophic as the rest of Europe and because we have faith schools and a more relaxed attitude to Mosques, Islamic clothing etc. It's interesting that German migrants are second only to eastern europeans in terms of the high numbers coming to the UK. I cant believe that Germans have suddenly decided to move to the uk en masse, maybe it's the "new" Germans, and this might increase if Merkel starts to persecute Muslims in order to get re-elected.
Im proud the UK allows Muslim women to wear the burqa or the niqab and I hope that those in continental Europe who do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles...
That sounds more like a Hipster dress code.
Do Hipsters base their beard style on Tsar Nicholas II or on King George V?
The Channel 4 programme about diverse British Muslims living together, sounds interesting. Worth noting that nearly half of British Muslims never go to Mosque. Many are completely secular, and my Iranian barbar loathes the clerics.
Which is why we need to promote secularisation of Islam in Europe. From all of the polls we can see around 25-30% of Muslims will never integrate into British or European society. We need to find a way of nudging them back to Muslim countries. Clamping down on benefits for non-english speakers, banking halal, banning the burka etc...
'Clamping down' on things that do no real harm will just create more extremism (though I agree that both halal and kosher should be addressed - a a minimum with labelling, if not outright banning).
Better to sell our values, and to allow them to be sold. That means that schooling needs to be addressed.
And where there is conflict between tradition of immigrant communities and members of that community, we back the individual, not the community. Too often at the moment we're doing the opposite.
We say our culture is better, our values are better. I'm not convinced banning the burka is in line with the values we espouse.
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
Are you sure the will of Allah is entirely on your side? I wonder if him and the Prophet are secretly having a laugh at your funny dresses and creepy beards, as most of you seem to have ended up living in the worst parts of Bradford.
lol you bring out all the cliches
Bradford? Nah I live in Bush (Shepherd's Bush). My family live in the North West of England and I visit them regularly, but ive never been to Bradford. My husband and I have lovely holidays in beautiful Algeria (his homeland) though, Muslims we are diverse...who knew?
If Islam is so wonderful surely you would want to be surrounded entirely by other Muslim people in a happy Muslim country, why would you want to be in some ghetto, in a land of unbelievers, surrounded by heathens, many of whom cordially dislike you?
It is very odd behaviour, Methinks you aren't quite as Muslim as you say.
Me personally, I am white, English, European and a convert to Islam alhamdulillah, so England is my "homeland", but anyway where we live in this Dunya is down to the Qadr of Allah swt.
As a Muslim I believe Islam is the best solution for mankind and whilst living in the land of kafirs is a challenge, a test from Allah swt, it's also an opportunity for Dawah and to show the unbelievers a better way and spread the truth of Islam.
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
Are you sure the will of Allah is entirely on your side? I wonder if him and the Prophet are secretly having a laugh at your funny dresses and creepy beards, as most of you seem to have ended up living in the worst parts of Bradford.
lol you bring out all the cliches
Bradford? Nah I live in Bush (Shepherd's Bush). My family live in the North West of England and I visit them regularly, but ive never been to Bradford. My husband and I have lovely holidays in beautiful Algeria (his homeland) though, Muslims we are diverse...who knew?
If Islam is so wonderful surely you would want to be surrounded entirely by other Muslim people in a happy Muslim country, why would you want to be in some ghetto, in a land of unbelievers, surrounded by heathens, many of whom cordially dislike you?
It is very odd behaviour, Methinks you aren't quite as Muslim as you say.
Me personally, I am white, English, European and a convert to Islam alhamdulillah, so England is my "homeland", but anyway where we live in this Dunya is down to the Qadr of Allah swt.
As a Muslim I believe Islam is the best solution for mankind and whilst living in the land of kafirs is a challenge, a test from Allah swt, it's also an opportunity for Dawah and to show the unbelievers a better way and spread the truth of Islam.
I'm not sure your approach to posting here is doing a great job of that, to be honest. But God loves a trier.
No niqabs and burkas are not sexist and in Islam men and women are not the same/equal etc, we are different and in right's, responsibilites, dress code etc this is recognised. It's western ideology that promotes the myth that we are the same. In fact in Islam it's strictly forbidden for men to imitate women and vice versa, it's a sin.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
"Is it not the Will of Allah (He who should be exalted!) that we are all born stark, raving naked?"
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
Are you sure the will of Allah is entirely on your side? I wonder if him and the Prophet are secretly having a laugh at your funny dresses and creepy beards, as most of you seem to have ended up living in the worst parts of Bradford.
lol you bring out all the cliches
Bradford? Nah I live in Bush (Shepherd's Bush). My family live in the North West of England and I visit them regularly, but ive never been to Bradford. My husband and I have lovely holidays in beautiful Algeria (his homeland) though, Muslims we are diverse...who knew?
If Islam is so wonderful surely you would want to be surrounded entirely by other Muslim people in a happy Muslim country, why would you want to be in some ghetto, in a land of unbelievers, surrounded by heathens, many of whom cordially dislike you?
It is very odd behaviour, Methinks you aren't quite as Muslim as you say.
Me personally, I am white, English, European and a convert to Islam alhamdulillah, so England is my "homeland", but anyway where we live in this Dunya is down to the Qadr of Allah swt.
As a Muslim I believe Islam is the best solution for mankind and whilst living in the land of kafirs is a challenge, a test from Allah swt, it's also an opportunity for Dawah and to show the unbelievers a better way and spread the truth of Islam.
I'm not sure your approach to posting here is doing a great job of that, to be honest. But God loves a trier.
"Wikipedia defines" Exactly. What the texting generation believe because words have been devalued. A Nazi - someone you disagree with. A racist = someone who looked at you funny. It's worse than murder = a word causing offence.
A phobia has always been an irrational fear.
They all seem to be grammarphobic - an irrational fear of learning to do joined-up writing.
Would you accept an Oxford dictionary definition?
"Dislike of or prejudice against Islam or Muslims, especially as a political force."
The Channel 4 programme about diverse British Muslims living together, sounds interesting. Worth noting that nearly half of British Muslims never go to Mosque. Many are completely secular, and my Iranian barbar loathes the clerics.
Which is why we need to promote secularisation of Islam in Europe. From all of the polls we can see around 25-30% of Muslims will never integrate into British or European society. We need to find a way of nudging them back to Muslim countries. Clamping down on benefits for non-english speakers, banking halal, banning the burka etc...
'Clamping down' on things that do no real harm will just create more extremism (though I agree that both halal and kosher should be addressed - a a minimum with labelling, if not outright banning).
Better to sell our values, and to allow them to be sold. That means that schooling needs to be addressed.
And where there is conflict between tradition of immigrant communities and members of that community, we back the individual, not the community. Too often at the moment we're doing the opposite.
We say our culture is better, our values are better. I'm not convinced banning the burka is in line with the values we espouse.
As I said, the polling has constantly showed 25-30% of Muslims have no will to integrate into British society. They cannot be sold on our way of life, so why not try and make sure the 70-75% are nudged towards secularism and the rest leave over time. Being a hard line Muslim should not be possible in Europe by the end of 2020, if anyone feels the need to practice it there is a part of the world where it is acceptable. The report showed just what kind of inequalities we've been putting up with.
''Merkel's burqa ban is really quite something. What was once seen as extreme hard right policy is now suggested by the darling Mutti of European centrist liberalism.
How Eurthey decamp to Britain.
LOL thwho do not want to uncover use EU free movement while they still can and migrate here.
Aren't burqas and niqabs sexist? I mean the men don't have to wear them?
No niq Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
Yes they are vile, and deeply sexist, they will be banned in the UK, as they are being banned across Europe. We will gradually make it impossible for you to practise your repulsive faith and then you will have to leave.
Do you see yourself as Islamophobic?
No. Islamophobic means "an irrational fear of Islam". I have a rational dislike and abhorrence of the more fundamentalist forms of Islam that have grown in strength in the last 30-40 years, from Wahhabism to Salafism etc.
Ironically, I used to have a sincere admiration for the moderate forms of Islam I encountered when I travelled the middle East in the 1980s and 90s. All gone now.
Syria in particular was a wonderfully welcoming and hospitable country, despite its nasty dictator. Christians could live there in peace.
The evolution of much of Islam into this dark, grotesque, self-mutilating monster is the great tragedy of our age.
Okay... But if you accepted the Wikipedia definition for now... Would you feel you come inder that category? My reason for asking is explained in anither post...
I do not accept the definition. The wider definition is used simply to silence criticism of Islam. Bollocks to that.
A phobia, according to the OED, is an "extreme or irrational fear or aversion". My dislike of radical Islam is neither extreme, nor irrational. e.g. I do not wish to deport anyone. I simply recognise that ultra conservative Islam is incompatible with liberal democracy, and eventually we will be forced to acknowledge this, and - as MaxPB has said - it will be done by restricting the ability of conservative Muslims to practise their faith, as they wish to do it, in the West.
Eventually they will leave and the nice secular Muslims, of which there are many millions - hopefully the majority - will be welcome to stay.
Now I'm gonna stop arguing about Islam and write about Bolivia. Later.
Comments
"Beautiful. Lord Pannick is citing Henry VIII."
Are we planning on closing the monasteries in Scotland now?
The burkha ban talk irks me a bit because I keep vacillating between positions, and can see the arguments on both sides. Much more comfortable just having a settled view. Not unlike betting (although the more confident I was this year, the likelier the bets were to be wrong).
Mr. H, I agree entirely. Je Suis Charlie, except for when it actually comes to taking the piss. Then you get Newsnight haranguing an atheist cartoonist for having the temerity to contravene the rules of a religion to which he does not belong.
Mr. Sandpit, it would be nice to bet against Wehrlein (especially as I backed and tipped him at 3). However, I think Verstappen may be value there. New aerodynamic rules give substantial potential for McLaren and Red Bull.
This is why UKIP's prospects are still pretty bright.
Nuttall would be canny to propose a burkha ban, and bang on about it.
Men do have a dress code in Islam: Beards, garments must be above the ankles, thobe/qamis/djellaba
No its not western ideology its western law. BY discriminating you are breaking our law.
"in Islam men and women are not equal"
That would be the problem.
- Grand Ayatollah Nudistani.
Brexit is Brexit and it's colourful.
Tolerance only works as long as everyone is tolerant. If a particular group wish to be intolerant, then that group will end up dominating and intolerance will become the norm.
Lord Pannick says there's "irony" to the case- Brexiters want to 'take back control' to Westminster except if it means MPs voting on Brexit
you can mock, but the will of Allah swt is to cover ourselves as commanded in Quran and Sunnah.
Round 1 to Mrs May.
What were you wearing when you were born?
Lord Pannick has a quiet aggression, that James Eadie, unfortunately didn't display.
"We seemed to have reached a meta phase whereby we all comment on the assumed outrage of other people, thus generating all the smoke regardless of heat."
True, it's always best to comment on your own feelings. Taking offence on behalf of another group entirely is ludicrous.
So Brexit ... I believed the polling and had already congratulated a Remainer late on June 23rd. But now, if the vote was overturned by Establishment dirty tricks, I'd be really annoyed. And I'd say I'm relatively easy-going about politics.
What is worrying is that I voted LD up to 2015 (Labour from the 70's to late 90s)
I doubt if they can disrupt things now, but the even the threat makes me irritated. So come on, Theresa call their bluff and if you cock up the negotiations, I can happily vote you out.
Perhaps you should stop taking anti-biotics as they were invented and manufactured by godless infidels.
At least one of the two major parties must back it for it to become law.
Mr. Sandpit, yeah... it's really quite depressing. My comedy's all fantastical stuff so it isn't really affected in any way, but I do quite like the two banners outside the Acrozeno in The Adventures of Sir Edric. The first proclaims Zeno's benevolence. The second shows an unbeliever being burnt alive.
Faisal Islam long ago lost all independence over the EU and will no doubt be appointed a Commissioner at some time in the future
Speaking to several people while shopping today there was a universal rejection of the Judges involvement and frustration that the Country has voted and must get on with it.
I would expect that to be a majority view and not sure this whole performance will gain public support and will only emphasize the elite and liberal left are removed from ordinary people's lives
Again, its the reason UKIP exist. UKIP will adopt a ban as policy, they'll start edging up in the polls and the main parties will consider a move to placate the electorate.
I recon that's how politics works these days.
*I don't think this will happen, incidentally.
Remember before 9/11 and the war on terror, even hijabs were a minority, now hijabs are common and niqabs are a growing minority. Any crackdowns or persecution just produces a further deepening of religious observance.
Oh and Muslims are not going anywhere, don't you worry, we are here to stay. Islam is part of the UK and Europe, indeed it's the youngest and fastest growing part of the population. The Continent of Europe will never again be only for white Xtians.
"I would expect that to be a majority view and not sure this whole performance will gain public support and will only emphasize the elite and liberal left are removed from ordinary people's lives."
It's not an edifying spectacle. However Pannick has more get up and go about him. the two government speakers were dire.
I've a sneaky suspicion that judges might just overturn things. They do have a feel for how they are portrayed. And the more I see of the proceedings, the more I can see where personal bias could be important. By comparison, science is far more objective.
But the Sunnah? Copying the way he lived his life? No, goodness no. If you want to do that, then surely you need to go and live in a tent in the desert.
https://twitter.com/Greg_Callus/status/806104173880246272
And he observed earlier:
https://twitter.com/Greg_Callus/status/806124268169949184
https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/806168566290665472
https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/806169043245891584
https://twitter.com/IanDunt/status/806164245280919552
Consider how supine the media and politicians were over Danish cartoons, or Jesus and Mo, or Charlie Hebdo, or Louis Smith[sp].
lol you bring out all the cliches
Bradford? Nah I live in Bush (Shepherd's Bush). My family live in the North West of England and I visit them regularly, but ive never been to Bradford. My husband and I have lovely holidays in beautiful Algeria (his homeland) though, Muslims we are diverse...who knew?
What a stupid non-argument.
Oooh sounds like there's a threat of violence in there. You know what? F8ck you.
We're a very long way away from that. The situation (isolation, radicalisation, failure to integrate etc etc) will only get worse, at least in the short term. Politicians and media are still afraid to call a spade a spade.
The BBC (at ten) buried the Casey Report well down the running order, then cited the Satanic Verses as a cause for lack of integration, before implying native Britons were as much at fault for failure to integrate.
Is that why you are killing so many of the non-muslims in the countries where you dominate?
The forthcoming Channel 4 programme about diverse British Muslims living together, sounds interesting. Worth noting that nearly half of British Muslims never go to Mosque. Many are completely secular, and my Iranian barber loathes the clerics.
fear, prejudice, hatred or dislike directed against Islam or Muslims, or towards Islamic politics or culture
If you accepted that definition for now... Would you say yes to that question?
"Meanwhile, watch the birdie. The government is quietly backtracking on its vow of silence over Brexit"
Daftness. Tell them to get lost, and threaten a GE. See them scatter.
The Burqa ban follows on from her comments last week about redefining the meaning of FoM, and earlier moves to station gunboats in the med and impose 'Canada-style' immigration rules.
http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-europe-migrants-germany-idUKKBN13103Q?il=0
http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-germany-migrants-spd-idUKKBN1310KH?il=0
I see these as broadly positive negotiating developments in terms of Brexit.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Shadow-Sword-Battle-Global-Ancient/dp/0349122350
I'm interested becayse I've observed that these labels have a power with people you might not expect.
E.g. I know people who would say they are not homophobic. But would happily say they hate gay people/are afraid of gay people/are prejudiced against gay people.
The label has a bad connotation even though they would agree with what defines it.
I was wondering if the same holds true with Islamophobic...
A phobia is an irrational fear. Islamophobia is an irrational fear if Islam. I have a very rational fear if Islam, war and death follows it around wherever it goes.
Militant hard-line Islam has been an utter catastrophe for the Middle East and North Africa.
"Wikipedia defines" Exactly. What the texting generation believe because words have been devalued. A Nazi - someone you disagree with. A racist = someone who looked at you funny. It's worse than murder = a word causing offence.
A phobia has always been an irrational fear.
They all seem to be grammarphobic - an irrational fear of learning to do joined-up writing.
Tomorrow will be interesting.
http://rarehistoricalphotos.com/king-george-tsar-nicholas-1913/
https://twitter.com/Sean__Clare/status/806132017242972161
Better to sell our values, and to allow them to be sold. That means that schooling needs to be addressed.
And where there is conflict between tradition of immigrant communities and members of that community, we back the individual, not the community. Too often at the moment we're doing the opposite.
We say our culture is better, our values are better. I'm not convinced banning the burka is in line with the values we espouse.
As a Muslim I believe Islam is the best solution for mankind and whilst living in the land of kafirs is a challenge, a test from Allah swt, it's also an opportunity for Dawah and to show the unbelievers a better way and spread the truth of Islam.
Of course, most Muslims are relatively easy-going, but the small minority are very dangerous. And there's a few more who are very intolerant.
"Dislike of or prejudice against Islam or Muslims, especially as a political force."
https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/islamophobia