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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Betting on who will win the US Presidential race in 2020

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  • Options
    glwglw Posts: 9,549
    alex. said:

    There must surely be a small subset of voters for who ongoing FBI investigations are good news for Clinton? Vote Clinton, get Kaine ;)

    America's last best hope is just that.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Bruce Porter Jnr
    So many emails not turned over. @NetworksManager https://t.co/V5AlmZTiUA

    These related to DOD, just declassified
  • Options
    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    alex. said:

    Re: England - big collapses are always possible on spinning pitches in the subcontinent. The number one rule on these sorts of pitches is that when you get in, you have to make it count - the biggest crime is not getting out for a very low score, it is getting out for a middling score. A lot of the pundits seem to have forgotten that - it is perfectly normal on these sorts of pitches to see scorecards where two or three players massively outscore the rest of the team combined. It is rarely like in England where a good score can often be put together on the back of a lot of 40s and 50s. And if nobody gets the big scores then what we had to day is the sort of thing that results. Unless a batsman shows a capacity to bat long, then they are no use.

    As an aside - pet peeve when describing batting collapses. England did not lose "10 for 64", they lost "9 for 64". You can't include the first wicket because then every wicket would be lost for no runs. Not that it makes it sound much better.

    It was 100-0, so England lost all ten wickets for 64.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,249

    DavidL said:

    Surely that is the last we will see of Ballance for a while.

    Not been a success this tour, has he! Interestingly he’s probably the last of the “overseas” players.
    Ben Stokes is a New Zealander.
  • Options
    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    Whilst we're on sporting nomenclature, can one of our F1 experts enlighten me as to why Verstappen is abbreviated as VES not VER?
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,249
    edited October 2016
    Double post deleted.

    What will be really entertaining is if England now beat India, which they are probably slight favourites to do even after this - does that give Bangladesh bragging rights over their neighbours?
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,984
    Mr. Quidder, may be because of Jean-Eric Vergne.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125

    alex. said:

    Re: England - big collapses are always possible on spinning pitches in the subcontinent. The number one rule on these sorts of pitches is that when you get in, you have to make it count - the biggest crime is not getting out for a very low score, it is getting out for a middling score. A lot of the pundits seem to have forgotten that - it is perfectly normal on these sorts of pitches to see scorecards where two or three players massively outscore the rest of the team combined. It is rarely like in England where a good score can often be put together on the back of a lot of 40s and 50s. And if nobody gets the big scores then what we had to day is the sort of thing that results. Unless a batsman shows a capacity to bat long, then they are no use.

    As an aside - pet peeve when describing batting collapses. England did not lose "10 for 64", they lost "9 for 64". You can't include the first wicket because then every wicket would be lost for no runs. Not that it makes it sound much better.

    It was 100-0, so England lost all ten wickets for 64.
    Was going to say the England team must have a nice day trip planned for tomorrow - but having visited Bangladesh a good few times, there really aren't that many options for a nice day trip!
  • Options
    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133

    Pulpstar said:

    Who becomes president if it is a 269-269 tie ?

    http://www.270towin.com/maps/W3RkZ <- "Possible" imo</p>

    Assuming no faithless electors break the tie the House votes, but in a weird way by state delegation. They probably choose Trump, but it's possible there would be defections and you'd end up with a compromise candidate. If they can't get a majority for one candidate then the VP gets the job, who is picked by The Senate. If they can't decide either, the Speaker of the House gets the job.
    In a 269-269 tie, there would have to be at least one faithless elector to get a compromise candidate to the House, which can only pick from the top three ECV-getters.

    What the Twelfth Amendment doesn't seem to say, however, is what happens if there's no majority and there is a tie for third.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031

    Mr. Quidder, may be because of Jean-Eric Vergne.

    Wasn't Michael Schuamcher 'MSC' and Ralf 'RSC' ?

    I always wondered if Ralf would perform the Scottish Play.
  • Options
    alex.alex. Posts: 4,658

    alex. said:

    Re: England - big collapses are always possible on spinning pitches in the subcontinent. The number one rule on these sorts of pitches is that when you get in, you have to make it count - the biggest crime is not getting out for a very low score, it is getting out for a middling score. A lot of the pundits seem to have forgotten that - it is perfectly normal on these sorts of pitches to see scorecards where two or three players massively outscore the rest of the team combined. It is rarely like in England where a good score can often be put together on the back of a lot of 40s and 50s. And if nobody gets the big scores then what we had to day is the sort of thing that results. Unless a batsman shows a capacity to bat long, then they are no use.

    As an aside - pet peeve when describing batting collapses. England did not lose "10 for 64", they lost "9 for 64". You can't include the first wicket because then every wicket would be lost for no runs. Not that it makes it sound much better.

    It was 100-0, so England lost all ten wickets for 64.
    And so logically they lost the first wicket for 0, and the second wicket for 0, and the third wicket for 0, and... so they lost all 10 wickets for 0!
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,997
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    Surely that is the last we will see of Ballance for a while.

    Not been a success this tour, has he! Interestingly he’s probably the last of the “overseas” players.
    Ben Stokes is a New Zealander.
    Ah yes. Started playing cricket in Cumberland though.
  • Options
    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133

    Mr. Quidder, may be because of Jean-Eric Vergne.

    Wasn't Michael Schuamcher 'MSC' and Ralf 'RSC' ?

    I always wondered if Ralf would perform the Scottish Play.
    I've never heard of Vergne which perhaps shows how closely I follow F1!

    I remember RSC and MSC, but I don't generally get the need to abbreviate, it doesn't take up that much screen space.
  • Options
    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    alex. said:

    alex. said:

    Re: England - big collapses are always possible on spinning pitches in the subcontinent. The number one rule on these sorts of pitches is that when you get in, you have to make it count - the biggest crime is not getting out for a very low score, it is getting out for a middling score. A lot of the pundits seem to have forgotten that - it is perfectly normal on these sorts of pitches to see scorecards where two or three players massively outscore the rest of the team combined. It is rarely like in England where a good score can often be put together on the back of a lot of 40s and 50s. And if nobody gets the big scores then what we had to day is the sort of thing that results. Unless a batsman shows a capacity to bat long, then they are no use.

    As an aside - pet peeve when describing batting collapses. England did not lose "10 for 64", they lost "9 for 64". You can't include the first wicket because then every wicket would be lost for no runs. Not that it makes it sound much better.

    It was 100-0, so England lost all ten wickets for 64.
    And so logically they lost the first wicket for 0, and the second wicket for 0, and the third wicket for 0, and... so they lost all 10 wickets for 0!
    A strange use of the word "logically"...

    164/10 - 100/0 = 64/10.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,984
    Mr. Quidder, former Toro Rosso driver. Think he left the year Verstappen joined but that may be the reason.

    It's also possible his father was VES (not sure, can't remember).

    Mr. Jessop, yes, that's correct.

    I'm off now. I'll be back in the early evening, but in case you missed it, my triple tip pre-race piece is here:
    http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2016/10/mexico-pre-race-2016.html
  • Options
    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031

    Mr. Quidder, may be because of Jean-Eric Vergne.

    Wasn't Michael Schuamcher 'MSC' and Ralf 'RSC' ?

    I always wondered if Ralf would perform the Scottish Play.
    I've never heard of Vergne which perhaps shows how closely I follow F1!

    I remember RSC and MSC, but I don't generally get the need to abbreviate, it doesn't take up that much screen space.
    It's much more compact when displaying all the times as an overlay over the action. What annoys me more are the anonymous colour bands they now use to display the driver's team.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
  • Options
    alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    edited October 2016

    alex. said:

    alex. said:

    Re: England - big collapses are always possible on spinning pitches in the subcontinent. The number one rule on these sorts of pitches is that when you get in, you have to make it count - the biggest crime is not getting out for a very low score, it is getting out for a middling score. A lot of the pundits seem to have forgotten that - it is perfectly normal on these sorts of pitches to see scorecards where two or three players massively outscore the rest of the team combined. It is rarely like in England where a good score can often be put together on the back of a lot of 40s and 50s. And if nobody gets the big scores then what we had to day is the sort of thing that results. Unless a batsman shows a capacity to bat long, then they are no use.

    As an aside - pet peeve when describing batting collapses. England did not lose "10 for 64", they lost "9 for 64". You can't include the first wicket because then every wicket would be lost for no runs. Not that it makes it sound much better.

    It was 100-0, so England lost all ten wickets for 64.
    And so logically they lost the first wicket for 0, and the second wicket for 0, and the third wicket for 0, and... so they lost all 10 wickets for 0!
    A strange use of the word "logically"...

    164/10 - 100/0 = 64/10.
    Both factually correct and meaningless/misleading in cricketing terms. IMO. The implication is that they lost BOTH 10 wickets for 64 and 10 wickets for 164 (and most of the numbers in between).

    But as it's factually correct, it will have to just remain my own pet peeve...


  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,980
    edited October 2016

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Now you are being silly. 100 years of innovations, most patents in the world , blah blah , blah. Men against boys.
    :smiley:
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Over 1m early voters in Texas, last time 600k - live from Fox
  • Options
    weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    edited October 2016
    With all the overnight Florida votes in:

    By Mail: Republicans + 65400 (about 3.3%)
    In Person: Democrats + 42000 (about 2.6%)

    Compared to archives on the website, these are NOT good for the Republicans.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Now you are being silly. 100 years of innovations, most patents in the world , blah blah , blah. Men against boys.
    :smiley:
    Patents smatents. ;)
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,980

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
    Down to about $20 Billion profit , on their uppers for sure.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,980
    edited October 2016

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Now you are being silly. 100 years of innovations, most patents in the world , blah blah , blah. Men against boys.
    :smiley:
    Patents smatents. ;)
    Is that Acorn an oak tree yet or did it get recycled. :)
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.
    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    It does not speak much for the abilities of the FBI that once becoming aware of thousands of missing emails they did not widen the net into Hilary Clinton's close advisors and workers to see what they held.
    Judicial Watch knew Huma had emails months ago, she testified at a case they brought. They're really not impressed by FBI initial investigation.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Now you are being silly. 100 years of innovations, most patents in the world , blah blah , blah. Men against boys.
    :smiley:
    Patents smatents. ;)
    Is that Acorn an oak tree yet or did it get recycled. :)
    The Acorn got recycled into an ARM. Now that was one heck of a genetic experiment!

    When Acorn and Apple had a joint venture, the internal code name was "Fruit and nut" :)
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,793

    OT: Does anyone here work as a computer programmer? I'm considering going back to university to study a computer science conversion MSc but the whole course uses the Java programming language. Is this a good language to learn or is it 'the past'?

    I don't know the answer to your question but I do know how to find out.

    1) Look at job sites (indeed, reed, cwjobs, etc). Note the salary for jobs requiring Java and the accompanying skills.
    2) Check with your university on whether they provide the accompanying skills, since the language alone is not enough
  • Options
    alex. said:

    alex. said:

    alex. said:

    Re: England - big collapses are always possible on spinning pitches in the subcontinent. The number one rule on these sorts of pitches is that when you get in, you have to make it count - the biggest crime is not getting out for a very low score, it is getting out for a middling score. A lot of the pundits seem to have forgotten that - it is perfectly normal on these sorts of pitches to see scorecards where two or three players massively outscore the rest of the team combined. It is rarely like in England where a good score can often be put together on the back of a lot of 40s and 50s. And if nobody gets the big scores then what we had to day is the sort of thing that results. Unless a batsman shows a capacity to bat long, then they are no use.

    As an aside - pet peeve when describing batting collapses. England did not lose "10 for 64", they lost "9 for 64". You can't include the first wicket because then every wicket would be lost for no runs. Not that it makes it sound much better.

    It was 100-0, so England lost all ten wickets for 64.
    And so logically they lost the first wicket for 0, and the second wicket for 0, and the third wicket for 0, and... so they lost all 10 wickets for 0!
    A strange use of the word "logically"...

    164/10 - 100/0 = 64/10.
    Both factually correct and meaningless/misleading in cricketing terms. IMO. The implication is that they lost BOTH 10 wickets for 64 and 10 wickets for 164 (and most of the numbers in between).

    But as it's factually correct, it will have to just remain my own pet peeve...


    It's not meaningless, its a common (and well understood) way of referring to the difference between the first and last of the mentioned falls of wicket. EG if we say England lost 5 wickets for 9 runs it doesn't mean that the score was at any stage 9/5.

    It's the same as saying that there were 3 goals in 5 minutes in yesterday's Liverpool game. It wasn't the first 5 minutes but there was a 5 minute period which had 3 goals scored in.

    It's a phrase that only makes sense when referring to multiples so your first for 0 and second for 0 doesn't work. But you can have two wickets for zero runs if the incoming batsman goes out on a duck immediately after the last fall of wicket.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
    Down to about $20 Billion profit , on their uppers for sure.
    Could be worse, could be Twitter. ;)
  • Options
    nunununu Posts: 6,024
    weejonnie said:

    With all the overnight Florida votes in:

    By Mail: Republicans + 65400 (about 3.3%)
    In Person: Democrats + 42000 (about 2.6%)

    Compared to archives on the website, these are NOT good for the Republicans.

    This poll is good tho, before the reopening of the email case.

    Nate Cohn ‏@Nate_Cohn
    The last Upshot/Siena poll of Florida gives Trump a 4 point lead, 46-42 http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/10/30/upshot/florida-poll.html

    But caution just 7 black voters give him the lead.
  • Options
    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
    It is more than 20 years since I had to worry about IT and procurement and I was surprised to find IBM were still going. Many of the old big names have either gone under or been bought out. DEC, Sun, ICL to name but three; they were all big players in their day and now all gone.
  • Options
    ChrisChris Posts: 11,128
    weejonnie said:

    With all the overnight Florida votes in:

    By Mail: Republicans + 65400 (about 3.3%)
    In Person: Democrats + 42000 (about 2.6%)

    Compared to archives on the website, these are NOT good for the Republicans.

    Not as good for the Republicans as 2014, but it seems from the figures posted here that there are huge variations in these leads from year to year. I doubt much can be made of them.
  • Options
    weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    PlatoSaid said:

    Over 1m early voters in Texas, last time 600k - live from Fox

    That is funny - http://www.harrisvotes.com/EarlyVoting/EVPA.aspx?L=E seems to be from one County and is recording 570000
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,980

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Now you are being silly. 100 years of innovations, most patents in the world , blah blah , blah. Men against boys.
    :smiley:
    Patents smatents. ;)
    Is that Acorn an oak tree yet or did it get recycled. :)
    The Acorn got recycled into an ARM. Now that was one heck of a genetic experiment!

    When Acorn and Apple had a joint venture, the internal code name was "Fruit and nut" :)
    LOL
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
    It is more than 20 years since I had to worry about IT and procurement and I was surprised to find IBM were still going. Many of the old big names have either gone under or been bought out. DEC, Sun, ICL to name but three; they were all big players in their day and now all gone.
    As I say, I haven't been following IBM recently. But IBM has always had a supreme ability to reinvent itself, from tabulating machines to mainframes, to desktops, and now business services. I reckon they'll still be a major player in another couple of centuries. Its odd considering their rather staid and boring image.

    It seems MS are doing the same, and Apple to a lesser extent from desktops to portables of various types.

    There's surely a book (or thesis) in the way tech companies plan (or react) to the fast pace of change. MS and the Internet being an example of how not to react; their recovery in that area being the opposite.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,980

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
    It is more than 20 years since I had to worry about IT and procurement and I was surprised to find IBM were still going. Many of the old big names have either gone under or been bought out. DEC, Sun, ICL to name but three; they were all big players in their day and now all gone.
    Hurst, looking at them , it is 100 billion company , 400,000 employees . so seems to still be going despite rumours of its death over the years. Wish I had bought some of their shares years ago, over $150.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,071

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
    It is more than 20 years since I had to worry about IT and procurement and I was surprised to find IBM were still going. Many of the old big names have either gone under or been bought out. DEC, Sun, ICL to name but three; they were all big players in their day and now all gone.
    As I say, I haven't been following IBM recently. But IBM has always had a supreme ability to reinvent itself, from tabulating machines to mainframes, to desktops, and now business services.
    IBM's current reinvention attempt is centred on machine learning, AI, Watson, etc.
  • Options

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
    It is more than 20 years since I had to worry about IT and procurement and I was surprised to find IBM were still going. Many of the old big names have either gone under or been bought out. DEC, Sun, ICL to name but three; they were all big players in their day and now all gone.
    As I say, I haven't been following IBM recently. But IBM has always had a supreme ability to reinvent itself, from tabulating machines to mainframes, to desktops, and now business services.
    IBM's current reinvention attempt is centred on machine learning, AI, Watson, etc.
    Good article on this...

    http://www.infoworld.com/article/3039052/cloud-computing/how-ibm-google-microsoft-and-amazon-do-machine-learning-in-the-cloud.html
  • Options
    timmotimmo Posts: 1,469

    alex. said:

    Re: England - big collapses are always possible on spinning pitches in the subcontinent. The number one rule on these sorts of pitches is that when you get in, you have to make it count - the biggest crime is not getting out for a very low score, it is getting out for a middling score. A lot of the pundits seem to have forgotten that - it is perfectly normal on these sorts of pitches to see scorecards where two or three players massively outscore the rest of the team combined. It is rarely like in England where a good score can often be put together on the back of a lot of 40s and 50s. And if nobody gets the big scores then what we had to day is the sort of thing that results. Unless a batsman shows a capacity to bat long, then they are no use.

    As an aside - pet peeve when describing batting collapses. England did not lose "10 for 64", they lost "9 for 64". You can't include the first wicket because then every wicket would be lost for no runs. Not that it makes it sound much better.

    It was 100-0, so England lost all ten wickets for 64.
    They were all out for 164 so therefore they lost all 10 wickets for 165
  • Options
    timmotimmo Posts: 1,469
    timmo said:

    alex. said:

    Re: England - big collapses are always possible on spinning pitches in the subcontinent. The number one rule on these sorts of pitches is that when you get in, you have to make it count - the biggest crime is not getting out for a very low score, it is getting out for a middling score. A lot of the pundits seem to have forgotten that - it is perfectly normal on these sorts of pitches to see scorecards where two or three players massively outscore the rest of the team combined. It is rarely like in England where a good score can often be put together on the back of a lot of 40s and 50s. And if nobody gets the big scores then what we had to day is the sort of thing that results. Unless a batsman shows a capacity to bat long, then they are no use.

    As an aside - pet peeve when describing batting collapses. England did not lose "10 for 64", they lost "9 for 64". You can't include the first wicket because then every wicket would be lost for no runs. Not that it makes it sound much better.

    It was 100-0, so England lost all ten wickets for 64.
    They were all out for 164 so therefore they lost all 10 wickets for 165
    164 apols
  • Options
    OllyTOllyT Posts: 4,913
    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
  • Options

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.


    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.


    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
    It is more than 20 years since I had to worry about IT and procurement and I was surprised to find IBM were still going. Many of the old big names have either gone under or been bought out. DEC, Sun, ICL to name but three; they were all big players in their day and now all gone.
    As I say, I haven't been following IBM recently. But IBM has always had a supreme ability to reinvent itself, from tabulating machines to mainframes, to desktops, and now business services. I reckon they'll still be a major player in another couple of centuries. Its odd considering their rather staid and boring image.

    It seems MS are doing the same, and Apple to a lesser extent from desktops to portables of various types.

    There's surely a book (or thesis) in the way tech companies plan (or react) to the fast pace of change. MS and the Internet being an example of how not to react; their recovery in that area being the opposite.
    Yes, IBM had the good sense to sell their PC division to the Chinese (Lenovo), just as desktops were becoming a commodity item. Sony, Samsung and others have also exited this market.
    It's surprising Dell have survived for so long and so well, although I guess these days it's all about marketing Chinese product bearing a reassuring all-American badge.
  • Options
    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Alistair said:

    Blimey Emerson's Likely Voter screen is brutal. Didn't vote in 2012? Discarded. If other pollsters use an equally brutal screen then a non voter surge wpuld be completely missed.

    It was claimed somewhere (538 maybe) that it was Bernie and not Trump who attracted the non-voters. If so, then presumably they will either stay at home or turn out for Hillary.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,898

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
    It is more than 20 years since I had to worry about IT and procurement and I was surprised to find IBM were still going. Many of the old big names have either gone under or been bought out. DEC, Sun, ICL to name but three; they were all big players in their day and now all gone.
    As I say, I haven't been following IBM recently. But IBM has always had a supreme ability to reinvent itself, from tabulating machines to mainframes, to desktops, and now business services.
    IBM's current reinvention attempt is centred on machine learning, AI, Watson, etc.
    Good article on this...

    http://www.infoworld.com/article/3039052/cloud-computing/how-ibm-google-microsoft-and-amazon-do-machine-learning-in-the-cloud.html
    That's a good summary of the different approaches. I've followed the IBM Watson since they got it playing (and winning at) Jeopardy a few years back - a brilliant demonstration of using plain-language queries against a massive database. It has massive potential in areas like healthcare, where it would be possible to assemble a worldwide-scale database of symptoms and diagnoses.
  • Options
    weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820

    Alistair said:

    Blimey Emerson's Likely Voter screen is brutal. Didn't vote in 2012? Discarded. If other pollsters use an equally brutal screen then a non voter surge wpuld be completely missed.

    It was claimed somewhere (538 maybe) that it was Bernie and not Trump who attracted the non-voters. If so, then presumably they will either stay at home or turn out for Hillary.
    But Bernie voters would identify themselves as Democrats - which means the polls with a +7 or +8 Democrat weighting are hopelessly flawed.
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    The reality is, of course, if she wins then it will be rapidly swrpt under the carpet and the Director of the FBI replace (no doubt after a dignified period so it doesn't look entirely vindictive). After the optics of the President replacing the Director while under active investigation wouldn't be good.

    He should never have swayed to Lynch's pressure to announce the investigation closed.
  • Options
    619619 Posts: 1,784
    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy
  • Options
    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    malcolmg said:



    Hurst, looking at them , it is 100 billion company , 400,000 employees . so seems to still be going despite rumours of its death over the years. Wish I had bought some of their shares years ago, over $150.

    Fair go, Mr. G., but in the mid 1990s when I last had cause to look at them they were losing money hand over fist. As Mr. Jessop says, it would seem they reinvented themselves into a different type of company. Something that Dec etc. couldn't do, probably something to do with company culture and the quality of the management I would guess.

    IBM used to have two huge buildings alongside the A27 just outside Portsmouth (went to their social club a couple of times for Bridge matches*), both long gone which I suppose subliminally inferred to me that IBM had gone too.

    Oh, by the way The Grouse is back up to £16 down here and there have been similar increases in the single Malts. Bloody Brexit!

    *For a computer company their players were OK but not very scientific in bidding or in card play. I was disappointed. In those days the most fearsome Bridge team I ever came across was the actuaries from the Prudential Insurance Company - those guys and gels had the odds of any card distribution down pat and the killer instinct of a homicidal maniac on speed.
  • Options
    619619 Posts: 1,784
    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    its looking like the early voting and GOTV is helping Clinton at the moment
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,247
    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    Clinton can live without FL.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,426
    tyson said:

    @Malmesbury

    The email server story is pathetic...it really is. If it had been a leading GOP candidate, I would have equally thought what erghhhhh....where is the story? Oh yes, then we find other Secretaries of State used their private email server...Colin Powell. And do I care that Colin Powell used a private email server...no..do I care that Hillary Clinton used a private email server....no.

    :

    :

    The problem is the right cannot win the Presidency on their terms. America has changed...it's got educated, and more diverse. The right only wins the congress through gerrymandering....but how long that will last? The right needs to offer an electoral program that appeals to enough of the population to win an election. It needs to do what Cameron did and re-brand the party.

    Sure, the Democrats could have selected a candidate with less baggage than Hillary? But GOP's unruly base has made it almost impossible for them to select a candidate that is capable of winning, even against a tarnished, tired and tainted Hillary.

    All of the above strongly suggests you don't actually know about the subject in any depth - repeating the Clinton talking points isn't especially impressive.

    Clinton is the inspiration for our very own Tony Blair - the same war mongering, all the same scumbaggery. The claim that being unconvicted of a crime is a vindication is straight from Blair.

    The dearth of decent candidates in the Democratic Party is directly due to scorched earth policy by Clinton - like Gordon Brown, she methodically destroyed anyone who could challenge her. This is why my American relatives (Democrats since before FDR) can't stand her and what she has done to the party.

    Why do you think Obama happened? Clinton thought she'd destroyed all the opposition - but the moment a semi decent opponent appeared, the party raced in his direction. Among her responses, by the way, was the origination of the "Birther" story... It was only to preserve party unity that Obama gave her a job.

    The joke is, that given your own politics, you should actually find her pretty repellent. She fully believes in bombing the middle east to stability, has no problem destroying civil liberties (a fan of Guantanamo Bay) and is a big friend to the very worst in big capitalism - a mixture of Goldman Sachs and weird mini-Trump scumbags from around the world.

    To support her against Trump - fine. Indeed that is what I am doing. To lionise her means that you share her moral level. If that is the company you want to keep, I have some Domaine Ponsot Clos St. Denis 1959 you deserve to buy....
  • Options
    Haven't scrolled so not sure if it's been covered, but the final results of the Icelandic general election show that opinion polls there are as dodgy as they are here. The Pirate party finished a long way from power:

    http://icelandmonitor.mbl.is/elections2016/
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,247
    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    FBI Director will be looking to clear his desk on day one of the Clinton presidency after this outrage.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Fox News Sunday
    Breaking now on #FNS per @BretBaier -- Anthony Weiner is said to be cooperating with the FBI investigation.
  • Options
    weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    Which suggests that it is TCTC

    1000 voters :
    360 already voted : 194 Clinton 133 Trump (54 - 37)
    640 not yet voted : 269 Clinton 333 Trump (41 - 52)

    Total : 463 Clinton : 466 Trump.
  • Options
    619619 Posts: 1,784

    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    Clinton can live without FL.
    tbh, if she builds up that big a lead in Florida, its over. That big a lead in NC is fatal for Trump. He needs it
  • Options
    weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    PlatoSaid said:

    Fox News Sunday
    Breaking now on #FNS per @BretBaier -- Anthony Weiner is said to be cooperating with the FBI investigation.

    Not surprised - the future of an alleged sexual pervert in a penitentiary is not necessarily one to be recommended.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,426

    malcolmg said:

    "They'd turn to me and ask: "So, what do you do?"

    "I'm a programmer."

    I'm amazed I ever pulled in his company ..."


    They probably thought you were up to date a regards all the TV Soaps and therefore good company.

    :)

    (I always forget if it should be computer 'program' or 'programme'. A bit like 'disc' versus 'disk').

    I was climbing up Lose Hill in Derbyshire one day whilst I was still single. I met two beautiful girls near the summit, when they were taking a breather after completing the Limestone Way. We started chatting, and I was amazed to discover they were computer programmers.

    So, two young, attractive, female, hikers, who were programmers. A heavenly opportunity.

    "Who do you work for?" one asked.
    "Acorn," I replied with pride.
    "Oh, we work for IBM," she said. "A proper computer company.

    I soon bid them goodbye and left. The cheek of them!
    They were correct though
    Ooooh, them's fighting words! :)

    Given I was working with one of the designers of the ARM chip, and for the company that designed it, I rather think that Acorn has had more influence to consumers than IBM!
    Iremember at a conference in the mid-nineties the owner of a start-up software company announcing that in the previous year his firm made more money than IBM, which I though was a rather good line. IBM having, for the first time, made a loss.
    I was surprised to discover the other day that Microsoft are doing rather well - apparently due to their Azure cloud services. IBM don't seem to be doing as well this year, though I haven't been following them.
    It is more than 20 years since I had to worry about IT and procurement and I was surprised to find IBM were still going. Many of the old big names have either gone under or been bought out. DEC, Sun, ICL to name but three; they were all big players in their day and now all gone.
    As I say, I haven't been following IBM recently. But IBM has always had a supreme ability to reinvent itself, from tabulating machines to mainframes, to desktops, and now business services.
    IBM's current reinvention attempt is centred on machine learning, AI, Watson, etc.
    IBM are *the* players in the backend systems that keep big organisations rolling - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_System_i etc
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,010
    edited October 2016
    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    If the FBI has new things to investigate so be it, did not notice you complaining when decade old groping allegations against Trump were brought up just over a month before polling
  • Options
    alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    edited October 2016

    tyson said:

    @Malmesbury

    The email server story is pathetic...it really is. If it had been a leading GOP candidate, I would have equally thought what erghhhhh....where is the story? Oh yes, then we find other Secretaries of State used their private email server...Colin Powell. And do I care that Colin Powell used a private email server...no..do I care that Hillary Clinton used a private email server....no.

    :

    :



    Sure, the Democrats could have selected a candidate with less baggage than Hillary? But GOP's unruly base has made it almost impossible for them to select a candidate that is capable of winning, even against a tarnished, tired and tainted Hillary.

    All of the above strongly suggests you don't actually know about the subject in any depth - repeating the Clinton talking points isn't especially impressive.

    Clinton is the inspiration for our very own Tony Blair - the same war mongering, all the same scumbaggery. The claim that being unconvicted of a crime is a vindication is straight from Blair.

    The dearth of decent candidates in the Democratic Party is directly due to scorched earth policy by Clinton - like Gordon Brown, she methodically destroyed anyone who could challenge her. This is why my American relatives (Democrats since before FDR) can't stand her and what she has done to the party.

    Why do you think Obama happened? Clinton thought she'd destroyed all the opposition - but the moment a semi decent opponent appeared, the party raced in his direction. Among her responses, by the way, was the origination of the "Birther" story... It was only to preserve party unity that Obama gave her a job.

    The joke is, that given your own politics, you should actually find her pretty repellent. She fully believes in bombing the middle east to stability, has no problem destroying civil liberties (a fan of Guantanamo Bay) and is a big friend to the very worst in big capitalism - a mixture of Goldman Sachs and weird mini-Trump scumbags from around the world.

    To support her against Trump - fine. Indeed that is what I am doing. To lionise her means that you share her moral level. If that is the company you want to keep, I have some Domaine Ponsot Clos St. Denis 1959 you deserve to buy....
    Was he lionising her? I thought that Tyson's point wasn't that Clinton didn't have huge amounts wrong with her and her candidacy, but that of all the things to potentially bring her down, the email issue was a pretty weak one.

    Although of course that's often the way in politics. It's the apparently minor issues that the politicians think won't bother them, that are often the most deadly. Often because they DON'T spend enough time trying to effectively head them off.

  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,247
    PlatoSaid said:

    Over 1m early voters in Texas, last time 600k - live from Fox

    2.17m - 22% of voters by end of play friday according to Sec of State:

    http://www.sos.state.tx.us/ELECTIONS/earlyvoting/2016/oct28.shtml
  • Options
    619619 Posts: 1,784
    weejonnie said:

    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    Which suggests that it is TCTC

    1000 voters :
    360 already voted : 194 Clinton 133 Trump (54 - 37)
    640 not yet voted : 269 Clinton 333 Trump (41 - 52)

    Total : 463 Clinton : 466 Trump.
    ummmm

    id say that a banked vote is worth more than a maybe vote.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,247
    619 said:

    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    Clinton can live without FL.
    tbh, if she builds up that big a lead in Florida, its over. That big a lead in NC is fatal for Trump. He needs it
    Unless he pulls off something in Michigan.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,010
    edited October 2016
    619 said:

    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    Clinton can live without FL.
    tbh, if she builds up that big a lead in Florida, its over. That big a lead in NC is fatal for Trump. He needs it
    Wrong, Trump would still lose if he won North Carolina but lost Pennsylvania, he would win if he won Pennsylvania but lost North Carolina. The key states are Ohio, Florida and Pennsylvania. As WeeJonnie suggests Trump may have a fractional edge in Florida especially as most of these polls were taken before the latest emailgate revelations
  • Options
    nunununu Posts: 6,024

    Haven't scrolled so not sure if it's been covered, but the final results of the Icelandic general election show that opinion polls there are as dodgy as they are here. The Pirate party finished a long way from power:

    http://icelandmonitor.mbl.is/elections2016/

    Likely graduates are overstating their likelihood to vote, Clinton should worry.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,898
    PlatoSaid said:

    Fox News Sunday
    Breaking now on #FNS per @BretBaier -- Anthony Weiner is said to be cooperating with the FBI investigation.

    If that's true, this could be about to blow up in Hillary's face.

    Weiner is looking at a long stretch for his sexual proclivities, and has a revenge motive in the form of his estranged wife, who is a senior staffer with Hilary. If he has serious evidence against the candidate, he will be desperate to get a plea deal for himself.
  • Options
    nunununu Posts: 6,024
    weejonnie said:

    Alistair said:

    Blimey Emerson's Likely Voter screen is brutal. Didn't vote in 2012? Discarded. If other pollsters use an equally brutal screen then a non voter surge wpuld be completely missed.

    It was claimed somewhere (538 maybe) that it was Bernie and not Trump who attracted the non-voters. If so, then presumably they will either stay at home or turn out for Hillary.
    But Bernie voters would identify themselves as Democrats - which means the polls with a +7 or +8 Democrat weighting are hopelessly flawed.
    Why? That is the lead Dems have over Republicans. Many registered Republicans I.d as independent.
  • Options
    619619 Posts: 1,784
    HYUFD said:

    619 said:

    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    Clinton can live without FL.
    tbh, if she builds up that big a lead in Florida, its over. That big a lead in NC is fatal for Trump. He needs it
    Wrong, Trump would still lose if he won North Carolina but lost Pennsylvania, he would win if he won Pennsylvania but lost North Carolina. The key states are Ohio, Florida and Pennsylvania. As WeeJonnie suggests Trump may have a fractional edge in Florida especially as most of these polls were taken before the latest emailgate revelations
    i have doubts that Trump will get anything from Pen or Michigan.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,426
    viewcode said:

    OT: Does anyone here work as a computer programmer? I'm considering going back to university to study a computer science conversion MSc but the whole course uses the Java programming language. Is this a good language to learn or is it 'the past'?

    I don't know the answer to your question but I do know how to find out.

    1) Look at job sites (indeed, reed, cwjobs, etc). Note the salary for jobs requiring Java and the accompanying skills.
    2) Check with your university on whether they provide the accompanying skills, since the language alone is not enough
    I make a very, very good living as a Java consultant/developer.

    Things to consider -

    - Java is king on server side (currently)
    - C++/C is useful to know, but the jobs are fading away
    - Javascript is totally different, despite the name
    - Android phones use Java for the applications
    - iOS apps are written in Objective C
    - Python is useful for certain tasks - not as many jobs just doing Python all the time
    - Most jobs will require multiple skills. Java/Maven/Spring/JPA (say) on the backend and knowing Angular2 for Javascript frontend would combine to make you very, very marketable.

    Whatever programming language you learn, learn about -

    - Testing
    - Design patterns
    - Quality control/assessment of code
    - Source control
    - Application servers
    - Build tools - the systems that turn the code you write into applications that run. For Java look at Maven/Gradle
    - The frameworks that are used to build real applications - in no programming job will you just be using the language. There will be a huge array of tools (written in the language) that you will need to know/use. The classic is Spring, in Java. In Javascript, the hot topic is Angular 2.

    The most important point is (as above) - check that the course covers some of this stuff. If it is simply learn to code Java and get marks for producing the right result, then it is not useful. You want a course that teaches you to code with good practices (design patterns, testing, libraries etc) and marks you on that basis.



  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,050
    HYUFD said:

    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    If the FBI has new things to investigate so be it, did not notice you complaining when decade old groping allegations against Trump were brought up just over a month before polling
    Do you really think the two are equivalent...one are random allegations that are brought up by randomers; the other is raised by a public official against the advice of the AG? Both may be damaging, but there is an etiquette that public offices stay out of elections.
  • Options
    weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    619 said:

    weejonnie said:

    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    Which suggests that it is TCTC

    1000 voters :
    360 already voted : 194 Clinton 133 Trump (54 - 37)
    640 not yet voted : 269 Clinton 333 Trump (41 - 52)

    Total : 463 Clinton : 466 Trump.
    ummmm

    id say that a banked vote is worth more than a maybe vote.
    Maybe - but they all count - and it indicates that late voting is going to help Trump, not Clinton - which could be very important in other states.

    Put it like this - late voting in Florida is going to turn a 17% Clinton lead into a narrow Trump victory - and she is only a ahead by 6% in NC.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,010
    tyson said:

    HYUFD said:

    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    If the FBI has new things to investigate so be it, did not notice you complaining when decade old groping allegations against Trump were brought up just over a month before polling
    Do you really think the two are equivalent...one are random allegations that are brought up by randomers; the other is raised by a public official against the advice of the AG? Both may be damaging, but there is an etiquette that public offices stay out of elections.
    The FBI is doing its job simply disclosing it has new material to investigate, the groping allegations were seized on by the liberal media and the Clinton campaign for their own purposes before anything was proved there too
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,426
    alex. said:

    tyson said:

    @Malmesbury

    :

    :

    :



    Sure, the Democrats could have selected a candidate with less baggage than Hillary? But GOP's unruly base has made it almost impossible for them to select a candidate that is capable of winning, even against a tarnished, tired and tainted Hillary.

    All of the above strongly suggests you don't actually know about the subject in any depth - repeating the Clinton talking points isn't especially impressive.

    Clinton is the inspiration for our very own Tony Blair - the same war mongering, all the same scumbaggery. The claim that being unconvicted of a crime is a vindication is straight from Blair.

    The dearth of decent candidates in the Democratic Party is directly due to scorched earth policy by Clinton - like Gordon Brown, she methodically destroyed anyone who could challenge her. This is why my American relatives (Democrats since before FDR) can't stand her and what she has done to the party.

    Why do you think Obama happened? Clinton thought she'd destroyed all the opposition - but the moment a semi decent opponent appeared, the party raced in his direction. Among her responses, by the way, was the origination of the "Birther" story... It was only to preserve party unity that Obama gave her a job.

    The joke is, that given your own politics, you should actually find her pretty repellent. She fully believes in bombing the middle east to stability, has no problem destroying civil liberties (a fan of Guantanamo Bay) and is a big friend to the very worst in big capitalism - a mixture of Goldman Sachs and weird mini-Trump scumbags from around the world.

    To support her against Trump - fine. Indeed that is what I am doing. To lionise her means that you share her moral level. If that is the company you want to keep, I have some Domaine Ponsot Clos St. Denis 1959 you deserve to buy....
    Was he lionising her? I thought that Tyson's point wasn't that Clinton didn't have huge amounts wrong with her and her candidacy, but that of all the things to potentially bring her down, the email issue was a pretty weak one.

    Although of course that's often the way in politics. It's the apparently minor issues that the politicians think won't bother them, that are often the most deadly. Often because they DON'T spend enough time trying to effectively head them off.

    Maybe not - but I have got very tired of the people who swallow the poor-innocent-me stuff from Clinton - and then vomit it back up over other people. I find the they-are-all-just-as-bad thing just as repellent.. The attitudes that enabled Tony Blair to do his worst.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,010
    619 said:

    HYUFD said:

    619 said:

    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    Clinton can live without FL.
    tbh, if she builds up that big a lead in Florida, its over. That big a lead in NC is fatal for Trump. He needs it
    Wrong, Trump would still lose if he won North Carolina but lost Pennsylvania, he would win if he won Pennsylvania but lost North Carolina. The key states are Ohio, Florida and Pennsylvania. As WeeJonnie suggests Trump may have a fractional edge in Florida especially as most of these polls were taken before the latest emailgate revelations
    i have doubts that Trump will get anything from Pen or Michigan.
    We will see but given the latest rrevelation, African American turnout in Detroit and Philadelphia below 2012 and Trump's big lead in the white working class rural and small town parts of the states anything could happen
    As for North Carolina the Democrats had a double digit lead in early voting there in 2012 but Romney won it
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,850
    619 said:

    weejonnie said:

    619 said:

    In FL, 36% of likely voters say they have already voted, and they are breaking for Clinton, 54-37

    Among those who haven't, Trump up 51-42

    In NC, 29% of likely voters say they have already voted and they are breaking for Clinton, 61-33, per new NBC/WSJ/Marist poll

    New NBC polls:

    North Carolina:

    Clinton 47
    Trump 41

    Florida:

    Clinton 45
    Trump 44

    https://t.co/gRxLs9ADfy

    Which suggests that it is TCTC

    1000 voters :
    360 already voted : 194 Clinton 133 Trump (54 - 37)
    640 not yet voted : 269 Clinton 333 Trump (41 - 52)

    Total : 463 Clinton : 466 Trump.
    ummmm

    id say that a banked vote is worth more than a maybe vote.
    All the polling now points to yet another very close contest in Florida. But, Clinton can afford to lose Florida, especially if she gains North Carolina.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,426
    weejonnie said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    Fox News Sunday
    Breaking now on #FNS per @BretBaier -- Anthony Weiner is said to be cooperating with the FBI investigation.

    Not surprised - the future of an alleged sexual pervert in a penitentiary is not necessarily one to be recommended.
    He will end up in one of the country club prisons. After lunch golf is the deal there. Remember he is a member of the upper 10,000

    He won't be mixing with super predators that the Clintons ensured got life-means-life for a couple of ounces of crack plus a knife.
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    If the FBI has new things to investigate so be it, did not notice you complaining when decade old groping allegations against Trump were brought up just over a month before polling
    Not quite directly comparable, unless there's some footage of Clinton saying she didn't give a flying fuck about government e-mail security and following protocols for classified info was for pussies.
  • Options
    weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    tyson said:

    HYUFD said:

    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    If the FBI has new things to investigate so be it, did not notice you complaining when decade old groping allegations against Trump were brought up just over a month before polling
    Do you really think the two are equivalent...one are random allegations that are brought up by randomers; the other is raised by a public official against the advice of the AG? Both may be damaging, but there is an etiquette that public offices stay out of elections.
    Well one person's pecadillos has affected a maximum of 20 people - the other's could have affected 200,000,000.
  • Options
    nunununu Posts: 6,024
    edited October 2016
    Sandpit said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    Fox News Sunday
    Breaking now on #FNS per @BretBaier -- Anthony Weiner is said to be cooperating with the FBI investigation.

    If that's true, this could be about to blow up in Hillary's face.

    Ewwww thanx for that image.....yuck
  • Options
    nunununu Posts: 6,024
    A bit late.

    Nate Cohn ‏@Nate_Cohn
    For the third straight election, we're going to spend the last week talking about a last-ditch GOP effort in PA, aren't we?
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    alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    Am I failing to understand something here? If she were, hypothetically, to step aside then surely Trump would win by default?
  • Options
    alex.alex. Posts: 4,658
    Sandpit said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    Fox News Sunday
    Breaking now on #FNS per @BretBaier -- Anthony Weiner is said to be cooperating with the FBI investigation.

    If that's true, this could be about to blow up in Hillary's face.

    Weiner is looking at a long stretch for his sexual proclivities, and has a revenge motive in the form of his estranged wife, who is a senior staffer with Hilary. If he has serious evidence against the candidate, he will be desperate to get a plea deal for himself.
    Hillary could promise him a Presidential Pardon.
  • Options
    weejonnieweejonnie Posts: 3,820
    edited October 2016
    Some results you WONT see

    http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/election-results/

    (CBS forecast Clinton to win Florida by 86 million votes.)
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,050
    @Malmesbury
    Jeez...if I'm lionising someone (Hillary) whom I called tainted, tired and tarnished (albeit one and three are quite similar), I'd hate to think what I'd say about someone I disliked.

    GOP needs to win the election fighting on policy and drawing together a sufficiently electoral coalition that can deliver it 270 EV's...that was my point. The Clinton email stuff is a massive diversion from the dismal electoral appeal of the present day Republicans.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,898
    alex. said:

    Am I failing to understand something here? If she were, hypothetically, to step aside then surely Trump would win by default?
    The thinking is that she would be effectively replaced by Tim Kaine, who against Trump is probably looking at a landslide.

    As someone else here said though, she's not going to quit while her heart is beating and she has her liberty.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,071
    The Washington Post continues to bring 'fact checking' into disrepute by rating this statement from Trump as a 'four Pinocchios' falsehood: “This is bigger than Watergate, in my opinion."

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/10/30/trumps-bizarre-claim-that-the-clinton-email-controversy-is-bigger-than-watergate/
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,898
    alex. said:

    Sandpit said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    Fox News Sunday
    Breaking now on #FNS per @BretBaier -- Anthony Weiner is said to be cooperating with the FBI investigation.

    If that's true, this could be about to blow up in Hillary's face.

    Weiner is looking at a long stretch for his sexual proclivities, and has a revenge motive in the form of his estranged wife, who is a senior staffer with Hilary. If he has serious evidence against the candidate, he will be desperate to get a plea deal for himself.
    Hillary could promise him a Presidential Pardon.
    He'd rather see his ex wife and her boss in prison, than in power.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,850
    tyson said:

    @Malmesbury
    Jeez...if I'm lionising someone (Hillary) whom I called tainted, tired and tarnished (albeit one and three are quite similar), I'd hate to think what I'd say about someone I disliked.

    GOP needs to win the election fighting on policy and drawing together a sufficiently electoral coalition that can deliver it 270 EV's...that was my point. The Clinton email stuff is a massive diversion from the dismal electoral appeal of the present day Republicans.

    Both parties seem likely to win close to 50% of the two-party vote, suggesting they're both close to the mid-point, although that demonstrates just how partisan the US is.
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,050
    @Malmesbury
    Let's not go down Tony Blair....the Tories were as hawkish on Iraq, nothing would have changed, and Bush was committed to going in anyhow. Tony Blair has paid a huge price for something that would have happened, with or without the UK intervention.

    The left struggle with foreign policy...to become electable they literally have to prove to the right wing press that they have bigger bollox...led to Kennedy's escalation in Vietnam, and the Labour party giving Blair a free ride over Iraq.
  • Options
    ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133

    HYUFD said:

    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    If the FBI has new things to investigate so be it, did not notice you complaining when decade old groping allegations against Trump were brought up just over a month before polling
    Not quite directly comparable, unless there's some footage of Clinton saying she didn't give a flying fuck about government e-mail security and following protocols for classified info was for pussies.
    Actions speak louder than words...
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,071
    edited October 2016
    http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/10/30/upshot/florida-poll.html

    Trump +4 in Florida.

    Amazingly he has 32% of the vote among white registered Democrats without a degree, to Clinton's 55%.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,010
    edited October 2016

    HYUFD said:

    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    If the FBI has new things to investigate so be it, did not notice you complaining when decade old groping allegations against Trump were brought up just over a month before polling
    Not quite directly comparable, unless there's some footage of Clinton saying she didn't give a flying fuck about government e-mail security and following protocols for classified info was for pussies.
    Given the 1000s of emails she failed to protect properly it certainly suggests it may have been more than mere carelessness
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    tyson said:

    HYUFD said:

    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    If the FBI has new things to investigate so be it, did not notice you complaining when decade old groping allegations against Trump were brought up just over a month before polling
    Do you really think the two are equivalent...one are random allegations that are brought up by randomers; the other is raised by a public official against the advice of the AG? Both may be damaging, but there is an etiquette that public offices stay out of elections.
    Given the AG had refused herself why was she expressing a view at all?
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    If the FBI has new things to investigate so be it, did not notice you complaining when decade old groping allegations against Trump were brought up just over a month before polling
    Not quite directly comparable, unless there's some footage of Clinton saying she didn't give a flying fuck about government e-mail security and following protocols for classified info was for pussies.
    Given the 1000s of emails she failed to protect properly it certainly suggests it may have been more than mere carelessness
    It's 'suggests it may have been' versus 'Grab 'em by the pussy'.

    One provides (barely) plausible deniability, the other doesn't.
  • Options
    MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584
    HYUFD said:

    Given the 1000s of emails she failed to protect properly it certainly suggests it may have been more than mere carelessness


    Clinton walks into a bank and passes over a note saying she has a gun and they need to hand over all the cash.

    The bank teller hands over the money and presses the silent alarm.

    Outside Clinton is arrested and taken for questioning by the FBI.

    FBI: So you were robbing a bank.

    Clinton: No, I had a note asking for a loan in my other pocket, I just handed over the wrong one.

    FBI: But the wrong note changed everything you were doing in there.

    Clinton: Well I was just a bit careless.

    FBI: This is the 50th time you've done this.

    Clinton: I'm very careless.

    FBI: OK off you go then.

  • Options

    NEW THREAD

  • Options
    JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Pennsylvania - North Carolina - Colorado - Arizona - YouGov/CBS - Total Sample 4,074 - 26-28 Oct

    PA - Clinton 48 .. Trump 40
    NC - Clinton 48 .. Trump 45
    CO - Clinton 42 .. Trump 39
    AZ - Clinton 42 .. Trump 44

    http://www.cbsnews.com/news/cbs-battleground-poll-partisans-divide-on-news-of-fbi-emails/
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195

    HYUFD said:

    OllyT said:

    Charles said:

    OllyT said:

    Nigelb said:

    Apparently, the FBI did not have a warrant to view the emails when Comey wrote his letter, which is why he has no idea what is in them:
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/comey-wrote-bombshell-letter-to-congress-before-fbi-had-reviewed-new-emails-220219586.html

    Assuming this is true (& I don't take the Platonic view of uncorroborated sources), the decision to write the letter is pretty extraordinary.

    If this does swing the election and there is ultimately nothing of substance in the emails then the FBI will be seen to have directly interfered in the election.

    I am 100% behind Clinton getting what is due to her if she has committed a crime. But this is wrong because it has been raised too close to the election for voters to know whether there is any truth in it before voting. It will therefore do her harm whether there is anything in the emails or not. The FBI knew this and have therefore taken a decision that they know will impact on the election against all previous conventions.

    When we get to the bottom of this there will be political intent somewhere down the line. Doesn't bode well for US democracy when Trump is already claiming the election is "rigged".
    And if they had done nothing, and it turned out there *was* a bombshell in those emails they would have impacted on the election.

    The mistake was the press conference in July, not this.
    If there was a "bombshell" then the legal process would have taken its course and Clinton would be removed from office. As it is she is damned without any evidence prior to polling day either way. I can understand why right wingers who secretly want Trump to win (but are too cowardly to say so) are pleased with this turn of events but that doesn't make it right.
    If the FBI has new things to investigate so be it, did not notice you complaining when decade old groping allegations against Trump were brought up just over a month before polling
    Not quite directly comparable, unless there's some footage of Clinton saying she didn't give a flying fuck about government e-mail security and following protocols for classified info was for pussies.
    Nothing to see here, move along....

    Leaving aside certain other issues Clinton deliberately used non secure means of communication.

    apart from other reasons this was because she was trying to hide what she was doing.

    Then a lot of e mails somehow got deleted and she was less than honest with the investigation.

    Apart from that shes great.

    And no, I am not a fan of Trump.

This discussion has been closed.