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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » After being a polling phenomenon Boris Johnson joins the ne

SystemSystem Posts: 12,265
edited August 2016 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » After being a polling phenomenon Boris Johnson joins the negative ratings club

One of the PB YouGov Favourability Ratings that hasn’t attracted much attention is that for the former longstanding favourite to succeed Cameron, the ex-Mayor and current Foreign Secretary, Boris Johnson.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,158
    First like Boris?
  • nunununu Posts: 6,024
    silver!
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 29,261
    Bleary eyed bronze
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,158
    Fourth like a PB Tory competing in the pool!
  • JohnLoonyJohnLoony Posts: 1,790
    Ban This Sick Fifth Now!
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?
  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    edited August 2016
    Morning all.

    Boris’ popularity crossed party lines, it probably still does, but he has lost the support of Remainers - there’s not much more to add really.

    O/T – I’m glad the velodrome has finished, I couldn’t handle another booze fuelled late night.
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    How is your partner? I hope he is progressing well.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,158
    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    I'm not actually sure the depth of feeling from the referendum is persisting beyond the Olympics. Spent the weekend with the Remain in-laws. Two out of four now wished they'd voted Leave, others not unhappy enough to say much negative about anyone but Gove.

    Boris just is more teflony than other pols.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Mortimer said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    I'm not actually sure the depth of feeling from the referendum is persisting beyond the Olympics. Spent the weekend with the Remain in-laws. Two out of four now wished they'd voted Leave, others not unhappy enough to say much negative about anyone but Gove.

    Boris just is more teflony than other pols.
    The fieldwork for this polling is from 11/12 August.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 72,169
    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    A lot of Conservative areas voted remain, while Leave was swung by Labour areas. I would have said Boris has shot his bolt as far as leadership is concerned because of this demographic split.

    Not that I ever thought he could command sufficient support in the PCP to become leader anyway, but it might force him to accept it.

    I hope he does anyway, unlike Gordon Brown who went on a 13 year sulk after being forced to withdraw from a leadership contest just because nobody was going to vote for him. With hindsight, that temper tantrum from Brown has destroyed the Labour Party.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    SquareRoot said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    How is your partner? I hope he is progressing well.
    It's a bumpy road. Things are generally going in the right direction.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,158
    AlastairMeeks said:

    Mortimer said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    I'm not actually sure the depth of feeling from the referendum is persisting beyond the Olympics. Spent the weekend with the Remain in-laws. Two out of four now wished they'd voted Leave, others not unhappy enough to say much negative about anyone but Gove.

    Boris just is more teflony than other pols.
    The fieldwork for this polling is from 11/12 August.
    Oh, we're believing polls again are we?

    More seriously, the level of political discussion on social media and at social events seems to have reached normality again. Even my most ardent Remoaner mates are too preoccupied deciding whether to support Corbyn or Smith. Talk about fiddling whilst their electoral hopes burn....
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,755
    Once Boris took a side, his popularity waned with those who took the opposite side.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 72,169
    AlastairMeeks said:

    SquareRoot said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    How is your partner? I hope he is progressing well.
    It's a bumpy road. Things are generally going in the right direction.
    Fingers crossed it stays that way.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    Boris is, was, and always will be a dick.

    Pre-, during-, post-Brexit.

    In the morning. In the afternoon. As the sun goes down.

    Always, everywhere.

    A dick.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Mortimer said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    Mortimer said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    I'm not actually sure the depth of feeling from the referendum is persisting beyond the Olympics. Spent the weekend with the Remain in-laws. Two out of four now wished they'd voted Leave, others not unhappy enough to say much negative about anyone but Gove.

    Boris just is more teflony than other pols.
    The fieldwork for this polling is from 11/12 August.
    Oh, we're believing polls again are we?

    More seriously, the level of political discussion on social media and at social events seems to have reached normality again. Even my most ardent Remoaner mates are too preoccupied deciding whether to support Corbyn or Smith. Talk about fiddling whilst their electoral hopes burn....
    Nothing is happening so no one is talking about it. Happy Leavers should not assume that the country is uniting behind them. It is waiting to see what they are going to propose and how they handle it.

    Views have not changed, the subject has merely been put to one side pending developments.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,755
    ydoethur said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    A lot of Conservative areas voted remain, while Leave was swung by Labour areas. I would have said Boris has shot his bolt as far as leadership is concerned because of this demographic split.

    Not that I ever thought he could command sufficient support in the PCP to become leader anyway, but it might force him to accept it.

    I hope he does anyway, unlike Gordon Brown who went on a 13 year sulk after being forced to withdraw from a leadership contest just because nobody was going to vote for him. With hindsight, that temper tantrum from Brown has destroyed the Labour Party.
    Overall, though, about 60% of Conservatives, and about 270 Conservative constituencies, voted Leave.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Sean_F said:

    Once Boris took a side, his popularity waned with those who took the opposite side.

    We need a stronger word than "waned" for a descent to -63%.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 72,169
    Sean_F said:


    Overall, though, about 60% of Conservatives, and about 270 Conservative constituencies, voted Leave.

    The message 'vote Boris and alienate nearly half your voters' doesn't sound an inspiring one to me.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    edited August 2016
    On NPXMPX2's favourite topic, the Olympics, it looks like the experts might be right.

    They predicted we would win 62 medals, vs our own target of 48.

    Repeated link, apologies - factors include whether a country is currently, just has or is about to host the games; GDP; medal total at last Olympics; population; political system (command economies spend more on sport: NPXMPX2 pls note medals are a good thing for the kind of far left repressive economies you admire); and do women compete.

    Although even they initially underestimated our standing (there was an unknown because of the Russian ban). Adjusted for this, they had 1. USA 2. China 3. UK. We shall see.

    Go Team GB!
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    edited August 2016
    TOPPING said:

    On NPXMPX2's favourite topic, the Olympics, it looks like the experts might be right.

    They predicted we would win 62 medals, vs our own target of 48.

    Repeated link, apologies - factors include whether a country is currently, just has or is about to host the games; GDP; medal total at last Olympics; population; political system (command economies spend more on sport: NPXMPX2 pls note medals are a good thing for the kind of far left repressive economies you admire); and do women compete.

    Although even they underestimated our standing (there was an unknown because of the Russian ban). Adjusted for this, they had 1. USA 2. China 3. UK.

    UK Sport's target was not 48 medals, it was "at least 48" and more accurately 47-79:

    http://www.uksport.gov.uk/news/2016/07/14/medal-target-announcement
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 72,169
    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Mortimer said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    Mortimer said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    I'm not actually sure the depth of feeling from the referendum is persisting beyond the Olympics. Spent the weekend with the Remain in-laws. Two out of four now wished they'd voted Leave, others not unhappy enough to say much negative about anyone but Gove.

    Boris just is more teflony than other pols.
    The fieldwork for this polling is from 11/12 August.
    Oh, we're believing polls again are we?

    More seriously, the level of political discussion on social media and at social events seems to have reached normality again. Even my most ardent Remoaner mates are too preoccupied deciding whether to support Corbyn or Smith. Talk about fiddling whilst their electoral hopes burn....
    We are still in the phoney war. Apart from British tourists getting €1.15 rather than €1.35 for their holiday pound, nothing has changed. We are a full member of the EU. If ever there was a PM full of masterly inactivity it is Mrs May.

    Increasingly we are getting hints that we will not Brexit until at least 2019. It is becoming like TSE's AV thread, always jam tommorow never jam today.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    AlastairMeeks said:

    TOPPING said:

    On NPXMPX2's favourite topic, the Olympics, it looks like the experts might be right.

    They predicted we would win 62 medals, vs our own target of 48.

    Repeated link, apologies - factors include whether a country is currently, just has or is about to host the games; GDP; medal total at last Olympics; population; political system (command economies spend more on sport: NPXMPX2 pls note medals are a good thing for the kind of far left repressive economies you admire); and do women compete.

    Although even they underestimated our standing (there was an unknown because of the Russian ban). Adjusted for this, they had 1. USA 2. China 3. UK.

    UK Sport's target was not 48 medals, it was "at least 48" and more accurately 47-79:

    http://www.uksport.gov.uk/news/2016/07/14/medal-target-announcement
    Ah interesting. Didn't see that.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    TOPPING said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    TOPPING said:

    On NPXMPX2's favourite topic, the Olympics, it looks like the experts might be right.

    They predicted we would win 62 medals, vs our own target of 48.

    Repeated link, apologies - factors include whether a country is currently, just has or is about to host the games; GDP; medal total at last Olympics; population; political system (command economies spend more on sport: NPXMPX2 pls note medals are a good thing for the kind of far left repressive economies you admire); and do women compete.

    Although even they underestimated our standing (there was an unknown because of the Russian ban). Adjusted for this, they had 1. USA 2. China 3. UK.

    UK Sport's target was not 48 medals, it was "at least 48" and more accurately 47-79:

    http://www.uksport.gov.uk/news/2016/07/14/medal-target-announcement
    Ah interesting. Didn't see that.
    It was much misreported so it isn't your fault.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,721
    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Only the teaboy , he gets to phone her if there is trouble. How humbling for the idiot, a lackey to May.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    So only the Prime Minister has a positive rating, and that by dint of expressing no firm opinion about anything at all (Yes Minister, Party Games).
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    DecrepitJohnL said:

    So only the Prime Minister has a positive rating, and that by dint of expressing no firm opinion about anything at all (Yes Minister, Party Games).

    Already negative with Remainers. She had better not disappoint any Leavers.
  • ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    Morning all,

    Completely off topic, but the odd Corbynista is waking from their dreaming and realising it was all a mistake that is sending Labour to the abyss. Will enough wake up before 2020?

    "Momentum, like the Corbyn leadership, is a body on the brink of self destruction; unable to listen, blindly pushing out ideology while local groups flounder unsupported, and just a few unpopular decisions away from collapse."

    https://leftfootforward.org/2016/08/i-founded-a-momentum-branch-but-will-be-supporting-owen-smith/
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,158
    edited August 2016
    Danny Finkelstein's piece in today's Times is well worth a read. Reminds us that Labour used to be culturally sensitive, suspicious of immigration and eurosceptic.

    And also leads me to the fundamental conclusion that splitting Labour won't work - because the centrists are too metropolitan to be taken seriously outside of Westminster, and the hard left leadership not bothered about parliamentary power. Instead I predict steady decline. 15 seats an election for the next 4 or 5; the demography of many seats is going to change, helping Tories and others, and tribal Labour areas might, like Scotland, find solace in the arms of another populist anti Tory party.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,291
    TOPPING said:

    Boris is, was, and always will be a dick.

    Pre-, during-, post-Brexit.

    In the morning. In the afternoon. As the sun goes down.

    Always, everywhere.

    A dick.

    But he was put in the FCO as rehab...
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    edited August 2016
    Mortimer said:

    Danny Finkelstein's piece in today's Times is well worth a read. Reminds us that Labour used to be culturally sensitive, suspicious of immigration and eurosceptic.

    And also leads me to the fundamental conclusion that splitting Labour won't work - because the centrists are too metropolitan to be taken seriously outside of Westminster, and the hard left leadership not bothered about parliamentary power. Instead I predict steady decline. 15 seats an election for the next 4 or 5; the demography of many seats is going to change, helping Tories and others, and tribal Labour areas might, like Scotland, find solace in the arms of another populist anti Tory party.

    Not quite right. Not as many hard left Lab voters in the north/north-east, etc as in N1. Plenty of poor, aspirational workers, trying to better themselves and do well for their families, in the wider country. Perhaps as the Times article says also not as, um, internationalist.

    Something that M Thatcher got instinctively, but J Corbyn has little clue about.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    ThreeQuidder said:

    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
    Yep. Desperate editors trying to fill a space in the papers. The best one was John Prescott who ended up in front of the cameras with a crab in a glass jar saying its name was 'Peter'. No idea what he was supposed to be doing.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,291
    foxinsoxuk said:

    Mortimer said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    Mortimer said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    One of the drawbacks of a favourability index is that it doesn't measure intensity of feeling. It would be interesting to know how many Remainers can't stand Boris Johnson and how many merely don't particularly like him (and the opposite with Leavers).

    The divide between Leavers' and Remainers' responses is going to be a vital one for years ahead. Does it actually matter that Remainers don't like Boris Johnson when he is looking to Leavers as his constituency of support?

    I'm not actually sure the depth of feeling from the referendum is persisting beyond the Olympics. Spent the weekend with the Remain in-laws. Two out of four now wished they'd voted Leave, others not unhappy enough to say much negative about anyone but Gove.

    Boris just is more teflony than other pols.
    The fieldwork for this polling is from 11/12 August.
    Oh, we're believing polls again are we?

    More seriously, the level of political discussion on social media and at social events seems to have reached normality again. Even my most ardent Remoaner mates are too preoccupied deciding whether to support Corbyn or Smith. Talk about fiddling whilst their electoral hopes burn....
    We are still in the phoney war. Apart from British tourists getting €1.15 rather than €1.35 for their holiday pound, nothing has changed. We are a full member of the EU. If ever there was a PM full of masterly inactivity it is Mrs May.

    Increasingly we are getting hints that we will not Brexit until at least 2019. It is becoming like TSE's AV thread, always jam tommorow never jam today.
    There is a difference between jam tomorrow, and a promise of jam tomorrow.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,721
    ThreeQuidder said:

    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
    She was doing nothing when she was here, who would notice any difference.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Good morning, everyone.

    Tense cycling last night, but more medals for Blighty. Huzzah!
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,291
    TOPPING said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    TOPPING said:

    On NPXMPX2's favourite topic, the Olympics, it looks like the experts might be right.

    They predicted we would win 62 medals, vs our own target of 48.

    Repeated link, apologies - factors include whether a country is currently, just has or is about to host the games; GDP; medal total at last Olympics; population; political system (command economies spend more on sport: NPXMPX2 pls note medals are a good thing for the kind of far left repressive economies you admire); and do women compete.

    Although even they underestimated our standing (there was an unknown because of the Russian ban). Adjusted for this, they had 1. USA 2. China 3. UK.

    UK Sport's target was not 48 medals, it was "at least 48" and more accurately 47-79:

    http://www.uksport.gov.uk/news/2016/07/14/medal-target-announcement
    Ah interesting. Didn't see that.
    Given that their press release says both "47-79" and "at least 48" are the agreed targets, I guess we gave up early on a medal for mathematics.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,797
    ThreeQuidder said:

    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
    Even if anything occurred, it wouldn't make the news due to the wall to wall olympics coverage...
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,587
    Boris was good at being Mayor (and I say that as someone who thought he'd be awful), which is primarily seen as a representational function. His laziness and difficulty in actually making consistent decisions, familiar to those who know him, only became apparent when he got into national politics.

    He'd be ideally suited to being party Chairman (lost track, is it still Feldman?). As Foreign Secretary co-responsible for Brexit it won't end well.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    NickPalmer said:

    Boris was good at being Mayor (and I say that as someone who thought he'd be awful), which is primarily seen as a representational function. His laziness and difficulty in actually making consistent decisions, familiar to those who know him, only became apparent when he got into national politics.

    He'd be ideally suited to being party Chairman (lost track, is it still Feldman?). As Foreign Secretary co-responsible for Brexit it won't end well.

    Patrick McLoughlin is now chair. Feldman was one of Cam's public skool cronies, so he had to go iirc.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    edited August 2016
    AlastairMeeks said:

    DecrepitJohnL said:

    So only the Prime Minister has a positive rating, and that by dint of expressing no firm opinion about anything at all (Yes Minister, Party Games).

    Already negative with Remainers. She had better not disappoint any Leavers.
    May has better ratings with Remainers than both Boris and Cameron and she is only just behind Corbyn with pro EU voters. Combined with her topping the poll with Leavers amongst whom Corbyn's ratings are abysmal she has enough political capital for the BREXIT negotiations
  • ThreeQuidderThreeQuidder Posts: 6,133
    edited August 2016
    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    TOPPING said:

    On NPXMPX2's favourite topic, the Olympics, it looks like the experts might be right.

    They predicted we would win 62 medals, vs our own target of 48.

    Repeated link, apologies - factors include whether a country is currently, just has or is about to host the games; GDP; medal total at last Olympics; population; political system (command economies spend more on sport: NPXMPX2 pls note medals are a good thing for the kind of far left repressive economies you admire); and do women compete.

    Although even they underestimated our standing (there was an unknown because of the Russian ban). Adjusted for this, they had 1. USA 2. China 3. UK.

    UK Sport's target was not 48 medals, it was "at least 48" and more accurately 47-79:

    http://www.uksport.gov.uk/news/2016/07/14/medal-target-announcement
    Ah interesting. Didn't see that.
    Given that their press release says both "47-79" and "at least 48" are the agreed targets, I guess we gave up early on a medal for mathematics.
    48 is for the Olympics as a whole, 47-79 is the sum of the target ranges for each sport. So a "bare pass" for every sport would have been an overall marginal failure.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    edited August 2016
    NickPalmer said:

    Boris was good at being Mayor (and I say that as someone who thought he'd be awful), which is primarily seen as a representational function. His laziness and difficulty in actually making consistent decisions, familiar to those who know him, only became apparent when he got into national politics.

    He'd be ideally suited to being party Chairman (lost track, is it still Feldman?). As Foreign Secretary co-responsible for Brexit it won't end well.

    Patrick McLoughlin is party Chairman, Feldman went with Cameron
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,783
    AlastairMeeks said:

    DecrepitJohnL said:

    So only the Prime Minister has a positive rating, and that by dint of expressing no firm opinion about anything at all (Yes Minister, Party Games).

    Already negative with Remainers. She had better not disappoint any Leavers.

    At some stage decisions will have to be made. That's when it will get interesting again. But even in the short time they've had Johnson, Fox and Davis have been less than impressive.

  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    malcolmg said:

    ThreeQuidder said:

    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
    She was doing nothing when she was here, who would notice any difference.
    Really Malc.. unlike your First Minister who does a lot of shrieking but is in fact completely impotent.. Mrs May has had a blinder.. I doubt she will be bothering to include Ms Sturgeon on her tour to greet world leaders..
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    SquareRoot said:

    malcolmg said:

    ThreeQuidder said:

    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
    She was doing nothing when she was here, who would notice any difference.
    Really Malc.. unlike your First Minister who does a lot of shrieking but is in fact completely impotent.. Mrs May has had a blinder.. I doubt she will be bothering to include Ms Sturgeon on her tour to greet world leaders..
    Actually May's first trip was to visit Sturgeon
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,291
    edited August 2016
    ThreeQuidder said:

    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    TOPPING said:

    On NPXMPX2's favourite topic, the Olympics, it looks like the experts might be right.

    They predicted we would win 62 medals, vs our own target of 48.

    Repeated link, apologies - factors include whether a country is currently, just has or is about to host the games; GDP; medal total at last Olympics; population; political system (command economies spend more on sport: NPXMPX2 pls note medals are a good thing for the kind of far left repressive economies you admire); and do women compete.

    Although even they underestimated our standing (there was an unknown because of the Russian ban). Adjusted for this, they had 1. USA 2. China 3. UK.

    UK Sport's target was not 48 medals, it was "at least 48" and more accurately 47-79:

    http://www.uksport.gov.uk/news/2016/07/14/medal-target-announcement
    Ah interesting. Didn't see that.
    Given that their press release says both "47-79" and "at least 48" are the agreed targets, I guess we gave up early on a medal for mathematics.
    48 is for the Olympics as a whole, 47-79 is the sum of the target ranges for each sport. So a "bare pass" for every sport would have been an overall marginal failure.
    Fine, but that doesn't really make sense. Every sporting team gets a target for minimum medals, and every team delivers that target. Yet apparently we would then fail the overall target, for which no-one appears accountable for its delivery.

    Anyhow let's celebrate our stunning over-achievement instead!
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,944
    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,721
    SquareRoot said:

    malcolmg said:

    ThreeQuidder said:

    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
    She was doing nothing when she was here, who would notice any difference.
    Really Malc.. unlike your First Minister who does a lot of shrieking but is in fact completely impotent.. Mrs May has had a blinder.. I doubt she will be bothering to include Ms Sturgeon on her tour to greet world leaders..
    Dream on SR , another Tory dud, she will be famous for doing nothing, Nicola has a far higher profile.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Mr. Observer, the three chaps may well be human shields/lightning conductors for negativity. When our departure is either done or well underway, May can safely throw them in the Thames and carry on without them.

    Also, by choosing discordant voices she's prevented them from uniting on a stance she may disagree with. Each will individually appeal to her authority and she can play them off against one another.

    Of course, division can create problems, but there are sound reasons why she may have appointed them. [I wouldn't've appointed Fox].
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,291
    edited August 2016
    SouthamObserver said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    DecrepitJohnL said:

    So only the Prime Minister has a positive rating, and that by dint of expressing no firm opinion about anything at all (Yes Minister, Party Games).

    Already negative with Remainers. She had better not disappoint any Leavers.

    At some stage decisions will have to be made. That's when it will get interesting again. But even in the short time they've had Johnson, Fox and Davis have been less than impressive.

    Which is why May has made a committee of the three of them and then appointed herself as chair. So she wins every vote except where the three of them are united.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    SouthamObserver said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    DecrepitJohnL said:

    So only the Prime Minister has a positive rating, and that by dint of expressing no firm opinion about anything at all (Yes Minister, Party Games).

    Already negative with Remainers. She had better not disappoint any Leavers.

    At some stage decisions will have to be made. That's when it will get interesting again. But even in the short time they've had Johnson, Fox and Davis have been less than impressive.

    Difficult to formulate coherent policy when you are fighting like cats in a sack.

    And not the brightest cats, either.
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    malcolmg said:

    SquareRoot said:

    malcolmg said:

    ThreeQuidder said:

    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
    She was doing nothing when she was here, who would notice any difference.
    Really Malc.. unlike your First Minister who does a lot of shrieking but is in fact completely impotent.. Mrs May has had a blinder.. I doubt she will be bothering to include Ms Sturgeon on her tour to greet world leaders..
    Dream on SR , another Tory dud, she will be famous for doing nothing, Nicola has a far higher profile.
    No Malc not higher profile but higher vocal register, she stamps her feet like a little girl who doesn't get her way. Politically impotent now , and will always be so.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    @IanB2 The midpoint of UK Sport's range is 63, which is almost exactly the same as the 62 that the academics came up with as the par result for Britain.

    I don't really blame UK Sport for letting the press focus on a lower figure to lighten the pressure a bit on the athletes. 62-63 does seem to be a better figure to use as a par result than 48 though.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    Good morning folks.

    Liam Fox is ghastly. That is all.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,291
    edited August 2016
    AlastairMeeks said:

    @IanB2 The midpoint of UK Sport's range is 63, which is almost exactly the same as the 62 that the academics came up with as the par result for Britain.

    I don't really blame UK Sport for letting the press focus on a lower figure to lighten the pressure a bit on the athletes. 62-63 does seem to be a better figure to use as a par result than 48 though.

    Agreed. The radio programme about the academics' model was an interesting listen. I did however think that using the medal tally from the olympics prior as the 'base' for the forecast, whilst pragmatic, was a bit of a cop out since this doesn't really explain anything. It also wasn't clear how the other factors - the government system, participation of women etc. - in the model interact with the base figure, since many of these are long term and therefore already built into the previous results.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    @Morris_Dancer I understand that Liam Fox and Theresa May are regular dining companions:

    https://twitter.com/ShippersUnbound/status/750389907231735809?ref_src=twsrc^tfw

    So she may well rate him. In any case, he covers a wing of the party that she will be very happy to have covered in Cabinet.
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    edited August 2016
    HYUFD said:

    SquareRoot said:

    malcolmg said:

    ThreeQuidder said:

    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
    She was doing nothing when she was here, who would notice any difference.
    Really Malc.. unlike your First Minister who does a lot of shrieking but is in fact completely impotent.. Mrs May has had a blinder.. I doubt she will be bothering to include Ms Sturgeon on her tour to greet world leaders..
    Actually May's first trip was to visit Sturgeon
    I said visit to meet world leaders, Sturgeon is in charge of not a lot and has little or no influence..
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Mr. Meeks, hmm. Interesting.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,925
    Spare a thought for Jessica Varnish.

    By reckoning 24/25 British track cyclists from the last three Olympics have won medals.

    And she was publicly told she had a fat arse.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,783
    Morris_Dancer said:

    Mr. Observer, the three chaps may well be human shields/lightning conductors for negativity. When our departure is either done or well underway, May can safely throw them in the Thames and carry on without them.

    Also, by choosing discordant voices she's prevented them from uniting on a stance she may disagree with. Each will individually appeal to her authority and she can play them off against one another.

    Of course, division can create problems, but there are sound reasons why she may have appointed them. [I wouldn't've appointed Fox].

    I am sure there is something in that. But whichever way you look at it, May has one hell of a job on her hands to square the Brexit circle. She's lucky not to have an opposition to deal with, though I'd argue that is actually not very good from the country's perspective.

  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,944
    Trump overhauls campaign team again
    "Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump has overhauled his election campaign team for the second time in two months, bringing in a new manager and CEO.
    Pollster Kellyanne Conway becomes campaign manager and Stephen Bannon of Breitbart News the CEO. Paul Manafort remains as campaign chairman."
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-us-2016-37104688
    This is a good reason for not posting articles from Breitbart in support of Trump.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,591
    another_richard said:

    Spare a thought for Jessica Varnish.

    By reckoning 24/25 British track cyclists from the last three Olympics have won medals.

    And she was publicly told she had a fat arse.

    Ouch! Although one could say the 96% success rate shows how brutal the programme is to get on the team in the first place - let's cheer all the medals!
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    SquareRoot said:

    HYUFD said:

    SquareRoot said:

    malcolmg said:

    ThreeQuidder said:

    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
    She was doing nothing when she was here, who would notice any difference.
    Really Malc.. unlike your First Minister who does a lot of shrieking but is in fact completely impotent.. Mrs May has had a blinder.. I doubt she will be bothering to include Ms Sturgeon on her tour to greet world leaders..
    Actually May's first trip was to visit Sturgeon
    I said visit to meet world leaders, Sturgeon is in charge of not a lot and has little or no influence..
    She is in charge of most Scottish domestic policy and she and May have something in common, they are both strong women who became leader succeeding men with big egos after they lost a referendum
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    HYUFD said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
    I'm sure his £135,527 salary + other engagements will enable him to struggle on through that vale of tears.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
    I'm sure his £135,527 salary + other engagements will enable him to struggle on through that vale of tears.
    Mind you he earnt more than that from his columns
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,591
    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
    I'm sure his £135,527 salary + other engagements will enable him to struggle on through that vale of tears.
    Not that he's short of a bob or two, but from a financial point of view he'll be more worried that he had to quit his £5k a week column in the Telegraph when he joined the Cabinet.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Sandpit said:

    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
    I'm sure his £135,527 salary + other engagements will enable him to struggle on through that vale of tears.
    Not that he's short of a bob or two, but from a financial point of view he'll be more worried that he had to quit his £5k a week column in the Telegraph when he joined the Cabinet.
    Book royalties will keep Boris's head above water.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    HYUFD said:

    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
    I'm sure his £135,527 salary + other engagements will enable him to struggle on through that vale of tears.
    Mind you he earnt more than that from his columns
    It's merely earnings deferred. All public figures now know that the lecture & after-dinner circuit beckons once they've relinquished office.

    Boris is doing his stretch in the well remunerated salt mines of the FCO, confident that his market value will be astronomical once he's released back into the wild.
  • GadflyGadfly Posts: 1,193
    Corbyn vs Smith on Victoria Live.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    HYUFD said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
    Cost him what? Boris has moved from the back benches under Cameron to Foreign Secretary.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,894
    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
    I'm sure his £135,527 salary + other engagements will enable him to struggle on through that vale of tears.
    I refer you to Othello: Act 3, scene 3, 155–161
    Good name in man and woman, dear my lord,
    Is the immediate jewel of their souls.
    Who steals my purse steals trash; 'tis something, nothing;
    'Twas mine, 'tis his, and has been slave to thousands;
    But he that filches from me my good name
    Robs me of that which not enriches him,
    And makes me poor indeed.

    And, I suggest, many, many more people see Boris as untrustworthy.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,591
    edited August 2016
    Gadfly said:

    Corbyn vs Smith on Victoria Live.

    That or last night's Olympics recording. Tough decisions... ;)
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    another_richard said:

    Spare a thought for Jessica Varnish.

    By reckoning 24/25 British track cyclists from the last three Olympics have won medals.

    And she was publicly told she had a fat arse.

    Very impressive track CV, and she can bake a decent cake it seems:

    http://www.jessicavarnish.com/blog/1498/chocolate-mousse-cake
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
    I'm sure his £135,527 salary + other engagements will enable him to struggle on through that vale of tears.
    Mind you he earnt more than that from his columns
    It's merely earnings deferred. All public figures now know that the lecture & after-dinner circuit beckons once they've relinquished office.

    Boris is doing his stretch in the well remunerated salt mines of the FCO, confident that his market value will be astronomical once he's released back into the wild.
    Also think of the memoirs of a former mayor of London, the man who took us out of the EU and former Foreign Secretary. He will get a massive book deal that would make our own SeanT green with envy.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    OldKingCole said:

    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
    I'm sure his £135,527 salary + other engagements will enable him to struggle on through that vale of tears.
    I refer you to Othello: Act 3, scene 3, 155–161
    Good name in man and woman, dear my lord,
    Is the immediate jewel of their souls.
    Who steals my purse steals trash; 'tis something, nothing;
    'Twas mine, 'tis his, and has been slave to thousands;
    But he that filches from me my good name
    Robs me of that which not enriches him,
    And makes me poor indeed.

    And, I suggest, many, many more people see Boris as untrustworthy.
    I take your point (and have used that quote many times). However, Boris doesn't have to associate with all the 'haters' (to use my daughter's term). He's certainly Marmite, but those that like him, really like him.

    Personally, while I'd count my fingers after shaking hands, I would love to have a few drinks with BoJo. It would be entertaining.
  • Greenwich_FloaterGreenwich_Floater Posts: 389
    malcolmg said:

    SquareRoot said:

    malcolmg said:

    ThreeQuidder said:

    ydoethur said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    SquareRoot said:

    I am not even sure what Job Boris has, I think he is F sec, but I wouldn't swear to it.. I haven't heard a peep out of him of late. Why would anyone trust Boris after his about turn.

    He is acting PM this week, while May is on holiday.

    Cripes!
    Her refusal to appoint an official deputy could just be her most serious mistake since taking office.

    That said, unless she and Hammond conspired to take holidays at different times, which also wouldn't look good to Leavers, it's hard to see how Boris week could have been avoided.
    It's in the middle of the summer, nothing is happening - and if anything major happens she'll be on the first plane back.

    These stories every year about "who is running the country" when the PM has a holiday are the epitome of silly season.
    She was doing nothing when she was here, who would notice any difference.
    Really Malc.. unlike your First Minister who does a lot of shrieking but is in fact completely impotent.. Mrs May has had a blinder.. I doubt she will be bothering to include Ms Sturgeon on her tour to greet world leaders..
    Dream on SR , another Tory dud, she will be famous for doing nothing, Nicola has a far higher profile.
    Largely due to her success as one half of the krankies?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    MaxPB said:

    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    John_M said:

    HYUFD said:

    logical_song said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ironically it was the referendum that killed Boris in the popularity stakes, Leave won but by a narrow enough margin to leave many bitter Remainers who will never forgive him for leading the Leave campaign. By contrast May remaining effectively neutral meant she was best placed to appeal to both the Leave and Remain camps. Boris still has an important role as Foreign Secretary now nonetheless and should focus on that.

    Boris was playing student politics with his fellow Bullingdon club member. In his own words he's 'not an outer' and didn't expect to win. He deserves to be unpopular.
    His political gameplaying has cost him certainly
    I'm sure his £135,527 salary + other engagements will enable him to struggle on through that vale of tears.
    Mind you he earnt more than that from his columns
    It's merely earnings deferred. All public figures now know that the lecture & after-dinner circuit beckons once they've relinquished office.

    Boris is doing his stretch in the well remunerated salt mines of the FCO, confident that his market value will be astronomical once he's released back into the wild.
    Also think of the memoirs of a former mayor of London, the man who took us out of the EU and former Foreign Secretary. He will get a massive book deal that would make our own SeanT green with envy.
    Boris has already deferred a book on Shakespeare which had an humungous advance.
  • GadflyGadfly Posts: 1,193
    Sandpit said:

    Gadfly said:

    Corbyn vs Smith on Victoria Live.

    That or last night's Olympics recording. Tough decisions... ;)
    Having just seen JC offer to share his allotment with OS I recommend that you stick to the olympics :-)
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    IanB2 said:

    ThreeQuidder said:

    IanB2 said:

    TOPPING said:

    AlastairMeeks said:

    TOPPING said:

    On NPXMPX2's favourite topic, the Olympics, it looks like the experts might be right.

    They predicted we would win 62 medals, vs our own target of 48.

    Repeated link, apologies - factors include whether a country is currently, just has or is about to host the games; GDP; medal total at last Olympics; population; political system (command economies spend more on sport: NPXMPX2 pls note medals are a good thing for the kind of far left repressive economies you admire); and do women compete.

    Although even they underestimated our standing (there was an unknown because of the Russian ban). Adjusted for this, they had 1. USA 2. China 3. UK.

    UK Sport's target was not 48 medals, it was "at least 48" and more accurately 47-79:

    http://www.uksport.gov.uk/news/2016/07/14/medal-target-announcement
    Ah interesting. Didn't see that.
    Given that their press release says both "47-79" and "at least 48" are the agreed targets, I guess we gave up early on a medal for mathematics.
    48 is for the Olympics as a whole, 47-79 is the sum of the target ranges for each sport. So a "bare pass" for every sport would have been an overall marginal failure.
    Fine, but that doesn't really make sense. Every sporting team gets a target for minimum medals, and every team delivers that target. Yet apparently we would then fail the overall target, for which no-one appears accountable for its delivery.

    Anyhow let's celebrate our stunning over-achievement instead!
    I'd assume that every discipline gets a minimum target and a stretch targer. Some numpty has just added them all up to give a range when it isn't really.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    Claimaint count for July (first full post referendum data) is down by 8k, that's right, in the uncertainty of the post referendum climate, 8,000 fewer people claimed unemployment benefits (JSA/UC) than in the previous month. Again, this points to a downturn being largely sentiment based rather than anything that might trouble us in the long term.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    John_M said:

    Good morning folks.

    Liam Fox is ghastly. That is all.

    Worse than that: he's dull. I had dinner with him once and it was excruciating
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    MaxPB said:

    Claimaint count for July (first full post referendum data) is down by 8k, that's right, in the uncertainty of the post referendum climate, 8,000 fewer people claimed unemployment benefits (JSA/UC) than in the previous month. Again, this points to a downturn being largely sentiment based rather than anything that might trouble us in the long term.

    Seasonal?
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    rottenborough said:

    MaxPB said:

    Claimaint count for July (first full post referendum data) is down by 8k, that's right, in the uncertainty of the post referendum climate, 8,000 fewer people claimed unemployment benefits (JSA/UC) than in the previous month. Again, this points to a downturn being largely sentiment based rather than anything that might trouble us in the long term.

    Seasonal?
    It's possible, but claimant count doesn't tend to be seasonal since most of the people who take up temporary work in the summer months are students and not eligible for unemployment benefits.
  • PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    "In order to comprehend the mystical core of Corbynism, it is necessary to understand this mixture of theology and historical analysis and how it dominated its followers’ personal lives. Above all, it is crucial to see that the assassinated Leon Trotsky was a renegade, not an innocent. He had led the Red Army during the Bolshevik revolution, and was as determined as Lenin had been to wipe out the Mensheviks, whose more moderate democratic socialism had first succeeded the Tsarist autocracy."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/08/16/leon-trotsky-was-our-hero-once--but-he-was-a-ruthless-warlord-no/
  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Make of it what you will.....

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3744370/Britain-given-special-status-EU-Germans-admit-Minister-says-UK-s-size-significance-means-treated-differently.html
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @IsabelHardman: Nearly an hour in and this hustings hasn't yet finished talking about Labour's internal misery to move on to discuss policy.

    The Corbyn virus may be terminal for Labour
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,554
    edited August 2016
    Moses_ said:

    Make of it what you will.....

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3744370/Britain-given-special-status-EU-Germans-admit-Minister-says-UK-s-size-significance-means-treated-differently.html

    Back of the queue.....
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Miss Plato, that makes it sound like a Menshevik victory could've made history rather better than it was.

    Videogame rambling: apparently a Mass Effect trilogy remaster could be happening. On the other hand, the utterances of Bioware gameplay designer Manveer Heir on Twitter about white people rather puts me off both that and Andromeda [which I was going to wait and see about anyway, given Bioware's dodgy track record when it comes to DLC which should've been included in the main game].
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,407
    edited August 2016
    Moses_ said:

    Make of it what you will.....

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3744370/Britain-given-special-status-EU-Germans-admit-Minister-says-UK-s-size-significance-means-treated-differently.html

    Odd the Mail and others haven't picked up on what Mr Roth said about that article

    https://twitter.com/MiRo_SPD/status/765668555673272320

    https://twitter.com/MiRo_SPD/status/765669276997025792
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,591
    Gadfly said:

    Sandpit said:

    Gadfly said:

    Corbyn vs Smith on Victoria Live.

    That or last night's Olympics recording. Tough decisions... ;)
    Having just seen JC offer to share his allotment with OS I recommend that you stick to the olympics :-)
    Athletics and cycling, or a disfunctional opposition party leadership hustings. Pretty sure I made the right choice!
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,944
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Moses_ said:

    Make of it what you will.....

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3744370/Britain-given-special-status-EU-Germans-admit-Minister-says-UK-s-size-significance-means-treated-differently.html

    Back of the queue.....
    But Michael Roth warned the UK could not 'cherry pick' their status
    He repeated no single market access without free movement of people
    Brexit negotiations should be over in time for 2019 MEP elections
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,407
    On topic, Boris is like a phoenix.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,407
    MaxPB said:

    rottenborough said:

    MaxPB said:

    Claimaint count for July (first full post referendum data) is down by 8k, that's right, in the uncertainty of the post referendum climate, 8,000 fewer people claimed unemployment benefits (JSA/UC) than in the previous month. Again, this points to a downturn being largely sentiment based rather than anything that might trouble us in the long term.

    Seasonal?
    It's possible, but claimant count doesn't tend to be seasonal since most of the people who take up temporary work in the summer months are students and not eligible for unemployment benefits.
    It is testament to George Osborne's jobs miracle.

    Let us hope Phil Hammond continues the good work of Osborne.
This discussion has been closed.