Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

Options

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Polling boost for May ahead of the 2nd round of MP voting –

12346

Comments

  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,027
    MaxPB said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Mr. Eagles, what have the Lib Dems done?

    Tried to stop Brexit, the Iraq war and joined a coalition that provided excellent government from 2010-2015 ?

    Guilty as charged !
    Is that why TSE wants them destroyed?
    God no. This is an article in praise of the Lib Dems.
    I had a conversation with someone yesterday evening, he asked whether I think Dave regrets hiring Sir Lynton Crosby for the election and wiping out the Lib Dems. If we hadn't won a majority he would very likely still be PM.
    Bollocks. That's my thread for Sunday.
  • Options
    David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506
    Scott_P said:

    IMF says £ still overvalued.

    £ needed to fall to help our export competitiveness and close the trade gap.
  • Options
    FensterFenster Posts: 2,115
    PlatoSaid said:

    Fenster said:

    John Rentoul looks like he's been up all night crying.

    He's getting a total pasting from the lady. Who is she?
    Some Stop the War activist.
  • Options
    dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,291
    @indigo +1.
  • Options
    LennonLennon Posts: 1,747

    Indigo said:

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Are we listening to experts now?
    Possibly evidence. You are starting to sound like a sore loser.
    I'm loving Brexit, got a pay rise out of it already.
    Is that danger money for having to go to France?
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,068

    Scott_P said:

    IMF says £ still overvalued.

    £ needed to fall to help our export competitiveness and close the trade gap.
    Our exports are mainly price inelastic though...
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,684
    felix said:

    More terrible facts for Project Fear

    Samuel Coates Retweeted
    The Int'l Spectator @intlspectator
    Stocks, past month.
    UK: +4.4%

    Russia: -2.7%
    Poland: -4.6%
    Netherlands: -5%
    France: -7.4%
    Germany: -8%
    Spain: -10%
    Italy: -13%
    Greece: -19%

    Can you put them up when they take into effect the devaluation in sterling?
    Taking into account the 13% devaluation on Sterling puts the FTSE 100 down about 8%.
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,125

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    "While the Brexit result caused some to pull out of transactions and a number of purchasers’ chains to collapse, “the majority” of deals agreed before the referendum are going through, conveyancers say."
    People whose livelihood depend on housing sales talk up housing sales. I'm shocked.
  • Options
    John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    edited July 2016
    I know this is dull (it's so much more fun to take an extreme position) but we need to strike a mature balance between "'Everything's great!" and "It's the End of Days".

    If I were a Remainer, hearing Leadsom dismiss sterling movements and warbling about 'prosperity not austerity' I'd be weeping tears of frustration, in the same way that Remainers shrieking about depressions and mass unemployment piss me off.

    Leave is often mocked for not listening to experts, but I find Remainers equally guilty. Before the referendum there were fourteen publically available economic forecasts that covered all the common scenarios for Brexit (WTO, EEA, FTA+). None of them forecast Armageddon.

    The only publicly available summary I've seen post referendum was from S&P. It called Brexit as a drag of 2.2% by 2018. That is, if you assume trend growth of around 2.2% p.a. we're going to grow by 4.4% rather than 6.6%. The IMF report (issued on the 18th June) forecast a technical recession of about -.8% in 2017, and a growth of around 4% to 2018 (iirc).

    Our risk is that Brexit unwinds something else, like a rock caroming down a hillside. There are the Italian banks. Deutsche Bank. The Chinese. Then we could be in trouble.
  • Options
    chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    There is a desire, not just among Remoaners, but among certain european players to portray the UK as in some kind of chaos.

    Well, they have to, don't they?

    If they tell the truth, the euro-plebs might get a bit uppity as well. And that would never do for the project.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,027
    Lennon said:

    Indigo said:

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Are we listening to experts now?
    Possibly evidence. You are starting to sound like a sore loser.
    I'm loving Brexit, got a pay rise out of it already.
    Is that danger money for having to go to France?
    Yup. Turns out Brexit is great for working class Northerners like me.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,068
    MaxPB said:

    felix said:

    More terrible facts for Project Fear

    Samuel Coates Retweeted
    The Int'l Spectator @intlspectator
    Stocks, past month.
    UK: +4.4%

    Russia: -2.7%
    Poland: -4.6%
    Netherlands: -5%
    France: -7.4%
    Germany: -8%
    Spain: -10%
    Italy: -13%
    Greece: -19%

    Can you put them up when they take into effect the devaluation in sterling?
    Taking into account the 13% devaluation on Sterling puts the FTSE 100 down about 8%.
    Come now @MaxPB that's just talking down Britain to the end of days.
  • Options
    CD13CD13 Posts: 6,352
    For Jezza, the true faith people can call themselves 'The Labour Party', the Blairites and soft-left can be the 'The Tory Party', the Conservatives can be "The Nazi Party", and Ukip can be "The Untouchable Racist Scum Party.'

    As for the LDs? 'The Pinko Trash Party.'
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,684
    Pulpstar said:

    Scott_P said:

    IMF says £ still overvalued.

    £ needed to fall to help our export competitiveness and close the trade gap.
    Our exports are mainly price inelastic though...
    There will be some level of import substitution though and many of our exports are finished manufactured goods which are relatively elastic. Import substitution is also important in in onshoring supply chains.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @GdnPolitics: Andrea Leadsom speech verdict: buy shares in Michael Gove https://t.co/TJF6LAwVUp
  • Options
    OllyTOllyT Posts: 4,935

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Your relentlessly upbeat posts are reminding me more and more of Comical Ali as each day passes. Can't wait for the next instalment, they are going to get ever more hilarious as the months pass and we slide into recession.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    chestnut said:

    There is a desire, not just among Remoaners, but among certain european players to portray the UK as in some kind of chaos.

    Well, they have to, don't they?

    If they tell the truth, the euro-plebs might get a bit uppity as well. And that would never do for the project.

    :lol:
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    MaxPB said:

    felix said:

    More terrible facts for Project Fear

    Samuel Coates Retweeted
    The Int'l Spectator @intlspectator
    Stocks, past month.
    UK: +4.4%

    Russia: -2.7%
    Poland: -4.6%
    Netherlands: -5%
    France: -7.4%
    Germany: -8%
    Spain: -10%
    Italy: -13%
    Greece: -19%

    Can you put them up when they take into effect the devaluation in sterling?
    Taking into account the 13% devaluation on Sterling puts the FTSE 100 down about 8%.
    If we are going to do that we should also take account of the devaluations of the other currencies. The Euro has dropped 3% or so against the USD in the same time frame.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @PickardJE: Leadsom ally: "Apparently we might have breached the law by holding an illegal protest in Parliament Square. Shouldn't be a problem though."
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,068
    PlatoSaid said:

    Uncle Len meeting now with Watson and Winterton. 'negotiations are ongoing' - over the weekend...

    The answer to Labour's question is so blindlingly obviously Clive Lewis.
  • Options
    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    "While the Brexit result caused some to pull out of transactions and a number of purchasers’ chains to collapse, “the majority” of deals agreed before the referendum are going through, conveyancers say."
    From the same article:

    “Only two out of the six hundred sales that we’re currently processing have fallen apart. That’s lower than we would expect usually.”

    As I posted last night a bungalow up the road from me sold yesterday, less than a week after it was put on the market and for only just under the original asking price of £500k. Not much sign of a slump in the property market around here.

    As I also posted last night I think that is a bad thing and we need a severe correction in housing prices to bring them back into line with long term trends and peoples earnings.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,684
    Pulpstar said:

    MaxPB said:

    felix said:

    More terrible facts for Project Fear

    Samuel Coates Retweeted
    The Int'l Spectator @intlspectator
    Stocks, past month.
    UK: +4.4%

    Russia: -2.7%
    Poland: -4.6%
    Netherlands: -5%
    France: -7.4%
    Germany: -8%
    Spain: -10%
    Italy: -13%
    Greece: -19%

    Can you put them up when they take into effect the devaluation in sterling?
    Taking into account the 13% devaluation on Sterling puts the FTSE 100 down about 8%.
    Come now @MaxPB that's just talking down Britain to the end of days.
    Well the facts are the facts. I don't like the fall in the stock market much since I took options last year. The company share price isn't looking too hot at the moment!
  • Options
    Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664

    For my fellow experts in Latin, the classics, and Morris Dancer, is 'Liberal Democrat delenda est' the correct term?

    Delendum est, if you regard LD as a singular thing. If you pluralise them you have to give them gender - a sensitive area for LDs. delendi sunt if you think they are predominantly male (as they are), delendae sunt for feminine, delenda sunt for neuter (which they also are, in a sense).

    Experts are fine for diagnosis, less so for prognosis.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,065
    Dr. Spyn, that's dereliction of duty from Hammond.

    In unrelated news, the PLP are doing their damnedest to ensure my wolves, sheep and high students analogy of the Conservatives, Labour and Lib Dems remains accurate.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,089
    Best quote of the campaign:-

    "Mr Boles added that Mr Gove would be prepared to spend “two months taking a good thrashing from Theresa if that’s what it takes”.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,684
    Indigo said:

    MaxPB said:

    felix said:

    More terrible facts for Project Fear

    Samuel Coates Retweeted
    The Int'l Spectator @intlspectator
    Stocks, past month.
    UK: +4.4%

    Russia: -2.7%
    Poland: -4.6%
    Netherlands: -5%
    France: -7.4%
    Germany: -8%
    Spain: -10%
    Italy: -13%
    Greece: -19%

    Can you put them up when they take into effect the devaluation in sterling?
    Taking into account the 13% devaluation on Sterling puts the FTSE 100 down about 8%.
    If we are going to do that we should also take account of the devaluations of the other currencies. The Euro has dropped 3% or so against the USD in the same time frame.
    Yes we should. Though the DAX is slightly less foreign than the FTSE or CAC.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,684
    Sean_F said:

    Best quote of the campaign:-

    "Mr Boles added that Mr Gove would be prepared to spend “two months taking a good thrashing from Theresa if that’s what it takes”.

    What do they say about Tories and dominant women?
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,027
    Ishmael_X said:

    For my fellow experts in Latin, the classics, and Morris Dancer, is 'Liberal Democrat delenda est' the correct term?

    Delendum est, if you regard LD as a singular thing. If you pluralise them you have to give them gender - a sensitive area for LDs. delendi sunt if you think they are predominantly male (as they are), delendae sunt for feminine, delenda sunt for neuter (which they also are, in a sense).

    Experts are fine for diagnosis, less so for prognosis.
    Thank you.
  • Options
    Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 4,909
    Indigo said:

    TGOHF said:

    Cons should go for Gove - there are 4 years until an election and the opposition is a rabble.

    The country needs a "will do" PM with vision who is prepared to be radical - not some dreary technocrat manager or a Kipper with a fake CV.

    I am not sure a "will do someone in" PM is what we need.
    Why not. Ruthlessness is a valuable attribute in a national leader.
    In Boris, Gove assailed someone who was almost supernaturally assailable, an inverse Achilles protected only on one heel. Gove's knife would have simply bounced off almost any other candidate in the history of history.

    If that counts to you as ruthlessness, I don't quite see it. Gove is so not some Putin character, fighting his enemies in the same way as he fights bears half naked in the Volga.
  • Options
    John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Sean_F said:

    Best quote of the campaign:-

    "Mr Boles added that Mr Gove would be prepared to spend “two months taking a good thrashing from Theresa if that’s what it takes”.

    One element to Gove vs May is that he'll push very hard Brexitward.
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    OllyT said:

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Your relentlessly upbeat posts are reminding me more and more of Comical Ali as each day passes. Can't wait for the next instalment, they are going to get ever more hilarious as the months pass and we slide into recession.
    This would be the -0.8% one year technical recession that is forecast before returning to growth ? Remind me what happened to GDP/Capita under Gordon Brown's premiership again ?
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,065
    Mr. Eagles, has the price of lime-green trainers and salmon pink striped shirts declined? :p
  • Options
    felixfelix Posts: 15,125
    OllyT said:

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Your relentlessly upbeat posts are reminding me more and more of Comical Ali as each day passes. Can't wait for the next instalment, they are going to get ever more hilarious as the months pass and we slide into recession.
    Between TC and Plato it's very difficult to choose - you can imagine them on the Titanic telling people not to panic...glug..glug...glug..
  • Options
    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    Indigo said:

    dr_spyn said:


    Risk of Brexit was there, so Hammond ignores it? Though he also claims that there was a risk that any study would have been leaked.

    I would have thought that HMG would have gamed or discussed implications of Brexit occuring, but then planning for an end game does seem rather out of fashion since 2003.

    They were concerned that if they gamed and planned it in detail they might find that the world was actually not going to end, and that after some initial bumps it would be completely manageable... if that leaked out it would be curtains for Project Bollocks, so they threw away responsible national contingency planning for short terms political reasons.

    Sounds about right.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,027
    Just think, this time last week Boris was the favourite to be the next Prime Minister.

    #AWeekIsALongTimeInPoliticsInnit
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,089
    MaxPB said:

    Sean_F said:

    Best quote of the campaign:-

    "Mr Boles added that Mr Gove would be prepared to spend “two months taking a good thrashing from Theresa if that’s what it takes”.

    What do they say about Tories and dominant women?
    Some people pay a great deal of money for that sort of thing.
  • Options
    David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506
    midwinter said:

    eek said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    I suspect that when May is installed as PM some of the useless idiots supporting Leadweight will find their careers permanently retarded.

    Well I think Leadsom is going to be made Minister for Brexit after this showing. Gove will get off easy.
    Oh no doubt but the likes of Villiers and Mordaunt will not prosper. Plus the thing with the Brexit ministry is that Andrea will probably rub up the EU negotiators so badly she'll be sacked by Xmas
    Agreed. I think her association with outside forces (Banks, UKIP, Farage, Leave.EU etc...) and not having any backing from remain supporters is going to make her easy to box assuming a May victory.

    What's scary is that I'm beginning to come around to the idea of Gove as PM such is my dislike of Leadsom. She represents the God-bothering, gay-bashing, Tombstone group wing of the party. I can't wait for them all to die in the next 10 years.
    Trouble is the most enthusiastic support is from the CWF/YBF/Mark Clarke Style libertarian moron youth wing.
    Because she is New and Shiny. Neither of which are a reason to vote for her...
    No. Because she knows her stuff when challenged and has excellent communication skills. She can connect with the public very effectively.
    She didn't today. Just walked off with no questions. Very poor
    She was poor in the second debate too. She was ineffectual and cold which isn't a great combination.
    Leadsom is way warmer than May.

    May is old and tired, which is probably why she made the mistake of saying she woud use EU residents in the UK as a negotiating ploy and not guarantee their continued residence in the UK.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,089

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    "While the Brexit result caused some to pull out of transactions and a number of purchasers’ chains to collapse, “the majority” of deals agreed before the referendum are going through, conveyancers say."
    From the same article:

    “Only two out of the six hundred sales that we’re currently processing have fallen apart. That’s lower than we would expect usually.”

    As I posted last night a bungalow up the road from me sold yesterday, less than a week after it was put on the market and for only just under the original asking price of £500k. Not much sign of a slump in the property market around here.

    As I also posted last night I think that is a bad thing and we need a severe correction in housing prices to bring them back into line with long term trends and peoples earnings.
    I'm not expecting either Sunlit Uplands, or the Great Depression over the next few years.
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,741
    Scott_P said:

    @GdnPolitics: Andrea Leadsom speech verdict: buy shares in Michael Gove https://t.co/TJF6LAwVUp

    "People who put themselves forward as a future prime minister normally have clear ideas of what they want to do. Leadsom had an opportunity to reveal her own ideas today, but the cupboard seemed empty.

    It is not just me saying this. This is from ITV’s Chris Ship."

    Chris Ship ✔ @chrisshipitv
    That was *not* as billed a 'major speech on the economy' by @andrealeadsom. More a series of optimistic hopes and soundbites
  • Options
    John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    I see the EC has decided, with impeccable timing, to begin the process of sanctioning Spain and Portugal for breaching EU fiscal rules. Add that to Renzi's comments yesterday and I think we're seeing signs that the PIGS are getting restive.
  • Options
    Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 4,825
    JackW said:

    If there is no members vote, you need a general election. She has to be elected beyond the MPs in some fashion.

    Since WWII none of the six Prime Ministers who have succeeded in term have opted for a General Election.

    The Conservatives had a manifesto commitment to hold a referendum and abide by the result. There is no requirement for PM May to go to the country.

    Anthony Eden called an immediate election on his succession 18 months before one was due (before the 4-years tendency became established) and increased the Tory majority from 17 to 60.
  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Thought experiment:

    Theresa May calls Andrea Leadsom into her office and gives her the choice of finishing 2nd today and gracefully withdrawing, or finishing 3rd.

    What does Andrea do?
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,068

    Indigo said:

    dr_spyn said:


    Risk of Brexit was there, so Hammond ignores it? Though he also claims that there was a risk that any study would have been leaked.

    I would have thought that HMG would have gamed or discussed implications of Brexit occuring, but then planning for an end game does seem rather out of fashion since 2003.

    They were concerned that if they gamed and planned it in detail they might find that the world was actually not going to end, and that after some initial bumps it would be completely manageable... if that leaked out it would be curtains for Project Bollocks, so they threw away responsible national contingency planning for short terms political reasons.

    Sounds about right.
    Regardless of the result the failure to do any sort of contingency planning is/was mind bogglingly irresponsible.
  • Options
    wasdwasd Posts: 276

    Thought experiment:

    Theresa May calls Andrea Leadsom into her office and gives her the choice of finishing 2nd today and gracefully withdrawing, or finishing 3rd.

    What does Andrea do?

    Leak it?
  • Options
    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    MaxPB said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MaxPB said:

    felix said:

    More terrible facts for Project Fear

    Samuel Coates Retweeted
    The Int'l Spectator @intlspectator
    Stocks, past month.
    UK: +4.4%

    Russia: -2.7%
    Poland: -4.6%
    Netherlands: -5%
    France: -7.4%
    Germany: -8%
    Spain: -10%
    Italy: -13%
    Greece: -19%

    Can you put them up when they take into effect the devaluation in sterling?
    Taking into account the 13% devaluation on Sterling puts the FTSE 100 down about 8%.
    Come now @MaxPB that's just talking down Britain to the end of days.
    Well the facts are the facts. I don't like the fall in the stock market much since I took options last year. The company share price isn't looking too hot at the moment!
    Relax, Mr Max. The Stock market always bumps up and down. In the early seventies the main FT index went down to 150. Individual companies may go bust but the market as a whole will always do OK, if you hang on.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    "People who put themselves forward as a future prime minister normally have clear ideas of what they want to do. Leadsom had an opportunity to reveal her own ideas today, but the cupboard seemed empty.

    It is not just me saying this. This is from ITV’s Chris Ship."

    Chris Ship ✔ @chrisshipitv
    That was *not* as billed a 'major speech on the economy' by @andrealeadsom. More a series of optimistic hopes and soundbites

    Looks like some MPs are having second thoughts

    @RuthDavidsonMSP: .@jimwaterson is that Theresa Villiers *actually* clutching her pearls with discomfort at 4 secs from end? I thought that was just a saying.
  • Options
    David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506
    The Labour party is no longer labour
    (UKIP is the party for labour)

    The Conservative party is no longer conservative
    (with radical policies) and

    The Liberal Democrat party is no longer liberal
    (supporting protectionist EU).
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,068

    Thought experiment:

    Theresa May calls Andrea Leadsom into her office and gives her the choice of finishing 2nd today and gracefully withdrawing, or finishing 3rd.

    What does Andrea do?

    Finish 2nd and run.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @BuzzFeedUKPol: Andrea Leadsom’s charity is bankrolled by her offshore banker brother-in-law
    https://t.co/73y5RyO6iN https://t.co/F3zTFwf0Nv
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    HA!

    @charlotteahenry: This coup is wrong at a time when negotiations are still ongoing?! https://t.co/CxtVyEF74e
  • Options
    PaulyPauly Posts: 897

    The Labour party is no longer labour
    (UKIP is the party for labour)

    The Conservative party is no longer conservative
    (with radical policies) and

    The Liberal Democrat party is no longer liberal
    (supporting protectionist EU).

    I think you were too kind on the LIberal Democrats, they are the party of European Nationalism.
  • Options
    BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,037
    edited July 2016
    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pauly said:

    @rottenborough There is a strand of opinion on pb that gets upset when it is suggested that Leavers are batshit mental. Andrea Leadsom being a serious contender in this leadership election race is all the proof that is needed of the truth of that suggestion.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-betting-idUSKCN0YF16B
    This article demonstrates your wisdom perfectly:
    "Alastair Meeks, a 48-year-old lawyer, is going with the flow; he plans to put several thousand pounds on Britain staying in the EU."
    Hah ! If only they knew...
    Alastair Meeks, a 48-year-old lawyer, is going with the flow; he plans to put several thousand pounds on Britain staying in the EU. "I got into gambling through politics, rather than into politics through gambling," he said. "I will increase my commitments as we get closer (to the vote)."

    It was all those silly people that cost him.
    How much did you pile on to Brexit for ?
    Not a penny as I stated at the time, I couldn't be objective.

    Love the posed photo of a self satisfied individual sat in a bookies telling us how he'd invested thousands. And now we're all batshit crazy.

    It goes on in bookies every afternoon, blokes losing money on short favourites then throwing betting slips around and swearing.
    Ah shame that, at about 2 am Brexit was possibly the biggest 4-5 shot or so there had ever been in the history of betting.
    Yep. After the lesson of the May 15 GE, some of us were ready this time, spreadsheets open, ready to pounce after the two or three results.

    I've put all my Brexit winnings on Theresa at an average Betfair price of 1.91 and hope to nearly double my winnings. Smug or what?
  • Options
    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Indigo said:

    OllyT said:

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Your relentlessly upbeat posts are reminding me more and more of Comical Ali as each day passes. Can't wait for the next instalment, they are going to get ever more hilarious as the months pass and we slide into recession.
    This would be the -0.8% one year technical recession that is forecast before returning to growth ? Remind me what happened to GDP/Capita under Gordon Brown's premiership again ?
    OK. GDP per capita fell due to the global financial meltdown but was still higher than that inherited from the Conservatives, and then it rose again until Osborne flatlined the economy.
  • Options
    LennonLennon Posts: 1,747

    Thought experiment:

    Theresa May calls Andrea Leadsom into her office and gives her the choice of finishing 2nd today and gracefully withdrawing, or finishing 3rd.

    What does Andrea do?

    Say 2nd, but then not withdraw? ("On reflection, it is right to give the members the choice etc. etc.")
  • Options
    Scott_P said:

    @BuzzFeedUKPol: Andrea Leadsom’s charity is bankrolled by her offshore banker brother-in-law
    https://t.co/73y5RyO6iN https://t.co/F3zTFwf0Nv

    I've said on here - she's toxic
  • Options
    dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,291
    Buzzfeed have piece on interesting financial arrangements of Andrea Leadsom's charity.

    https://www.buzzfeed.com/jamesball/andrea-leadsoms-charity-is-bankrolled-by-her-offshore-banker?utm_term=.tf5Xrje5La#.kgZw78MAEZ

    Pure coincidence that it has just been released.

    Perhaps a can of worms has been spilt.
  • Options
    John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503

    Indigo said:

    dr_spyn said:


    Risk of Brexit was there, so Hammond ignores it? Though he also claims that there was a risk that any study would have been leaked.

    I would have thought that HMG would have gamed or discussed implications of Brexit occuring, but then planning for an end game does seem rather out of fashion since 2003.

    They were concerned that if they gamed and planned it in detail they might find that the world was actually not going to end, and that after some initial bumps it would be completely manageable... if that leaked out it would be curtains for Project Bollocks, so they threw away responsible national contingency planning for short terms political reasons.

    Sounds about right.
    It's hard to do the IFS conclusions justice briefly. They concluded that it would cost the UK between £20-40 billion by 2019 (they plumped for the NIESR models). That means one-two years more 'austerity'. Basically, yes we can do it, but on a purely economic basis, it's not worth it.

    Which is fair enough. Both Leave campaigns saw it was funded by a pro-Europe group, screamed in anger and threw the baby out with the bathwater.
  • Options
    Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,661

    PlatoSaid said:

    Holy Moly

    Momentum
    INCREDIBLE NEWS. 200,000 people have joined @UKLabour in 10 days. Join the movement to say #CorbynStays https://t.co/aqDGqwZCL0

    I'm not sure the labour party is the labour party anymore.....
    I'm sure that it isn't.
  • Options
    John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503

    Indigo said:

    OllyT said:

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Your relentlessly upbeat posts are reminding me more and more of Comical Ali as each day passes. Can't wait for the next instalment, they are going to get ever more hilarious as the months pass and we slide into recession.
    This would be the -0.8% one year technical recession that is forecast before returning to growth ? Remind me what happened to GDP/Capita under Gordon Brown's premiership again ?
    OK. GDP per capita fell due to the global financial meltdown but was still higher than that inherited from the Conservatives, and then it rose again until Osborne flatlined the economy.
    GDP/capita has been flat since 2007. We just make ourselves look good by importing more people.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,065
    Mr. P, heard that on Sky. Did make me think back to Milibot's rinse and repeat interview.
  • Options
    midwintermidwinter Posts: 1,112

    midwinter said:

    eek said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    I suspect that when May is installed as PM some of the useless idiots supporting Leadweight will find their careers permanently retarded.

    Well I think Leadsom is going to be made Minister for Brexit after this showing. Gove will get off easy.
    Oh no doubt but the likes of Villiers and Mordaunt will not prosper. Plus the thing with the Brexit ministry is that Andrea will probably rub up the EU negotiators so badly she'll be sacked by Xmas
    Agreed. I think her association with outside forces (Banks, UKIP, Farage, Leave.EU etc...) and not having any backing from remain supporters is going to make her easy to box assuming a May victory.

    What's scary is that I'm beginning to come around to the idea of Gove as PM such is my dislike of Leadsom. She represents the God-bothering, gay-bashing, Tombstone group wing of the party. I can't wait for them all to die in the next 10 years.
    Trouble is the most enthusiastic support is from the CWF/YBF/Mark Clarke Style libertarian moron youth wing.
    Because she is New and Shiny. Neither of which are a reason to vote for her...
    No. Because she knows her stuff when challenged and has excellent communication skills. She can connect with the public very effectively.
    She didn't today. Just walked off with no questions. Very poor
    She was poor in the second debate too. She was ineffectual and cold which isn't a great combination.
    Leadsom is way warmer than May.

    May is old and tired, which is probably why she made the mistake of saying she woud use EU residents in the UK as a negotiating ploy and not guarantee their continued residence in the UK.
    One mans older is another mans more experienced. Either way Leadsom and her supporters are a branch of politicians the Tory party would, in many cases, be well rid of. Electorally at least they are a nightmare waiting to happen.
  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Isn't it something to behold the destruction of Andrea Leadsom's case for leader by both pro- and anti-Tory media? And by her colleagues, both former and current.

    The contrast with Corbyn's election - in which practically no-one on the Labour side actually took him to task for his former views; any action was restricted to worrying about how they might be presented - is once again absolutely glaring.
  • Options
    Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,661
    Lennon said:

    Thought experiment:

    Theresa May calls Andrea Leadsom into her office and gives her the choice of finishing 2nd today and gracefully withdrawing, or finishing 3rd.

    What does Andrea do?

    Say 2nd, but then not withdraw? ("On reflection, it is right to give the members the choice etc. etc.")
    Finish 2nd, withdraw, and then in doing so issuing the proviso that if Article 50 is not invoked within 6 months she will either lead or support another's challenge to May's leadership.
  • Options
    PaulyPauly Posts: 897
    John_M said:

    Indigo said:

    OllyT said:

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Your relentlessly upbeat posts are reminding me more and more of Comical Ali as each day passes. Can't wait for the next instalment, they are going to get ever more hilarious as the months pass and we slide into recession.
    This would be the -0.8% one year technical recession that is forecast before returning to growth ? Remind me what happened to GDP/Capita under Gordon Brown's premiership again ?
    OK. GDP per capita fell due to the global financial meltdown but was still higher than that inherited from the Conservatives, and then it rose again until Osborne flatlined the economy.
    GDP/capita has been flat since 2007. We just make ourselves look good by importing more people.
    And we make Europe look good (better than terrible, at least) by allowing them to export their (potential) unemployment.
  • Options
    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Just think, this time last week Boris was the favourite to be the next Prime Minister.

    #AWeekIsALongTimeInPoliticsInnit

    And this time last month it was beyond the pale to question the financial arrangements of the PM's family.
  • Options
    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    Pulpstar said:

    Indigo said:

    dr_spyn said:


    Risk of Brexit was there, so Hammond ignores it? Though he also claims that there was a risk that any study would have been leaked.

    I would have thought that HMG would have gamed or discussed implications of Brexit occuring, but then planning for an end game does seem rather out of fashion since 2003.

    They were concerned that if they gamed and planned it in detail they might find that the world was actually not going to end, and that after some initial bumps it would be completely manageable... if that leaked out it would be curtains for Project Bollocks, so they threw away responsible national contingency planning for short terms political reasons.

    Sounds about right.
    Regardless of the result the failure to do any sort of contingency planning is/was mind bogglingly irresponsible.
    I agree, but that was the decision of Cameron and Osborne. As usual they let short term political considerations trump responsible government.

    Yesterday Blair and co got a kicking for failing to plan for what happened after they toppled Saddam, and rightly so. Cameron also had no plan for what would happen in Libya after he helped to topple the government their after his unnecessary war. What stopped him learning the lessons from Iraq?

    Why some think that Cameron was a good PM is quite beyond me.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,027

    Isn't it something to behold the destruction of Andrea Leadsom's case for leader by both pro- and anti-Tory media? And by her colleagues, both former and current.

    The contrast with Corbyn's election - in which practically no-one on the Labour side actually took him to task for his former views; any action was restricted to worrying about how they might be presented - is once again absolutely glaring.

    Indeed. We're a ruthless bunch of bastards and proud.
  • Options
    NormNorm Posts: 1,251
    Amidst all the anti-Leadsom hysteria it is worth pointing out some May backers have always viewed a recovering Gove as the more dangerous opponent over a long members campaign. Andrea will either prosper or crash under the spotlight. You takes your choices.
  • Options
    MonikerDiCanioMonikerDiCanio Posts: 5,792
    edited July 2016
    I see that, post-Brexit, Tata Steel has had a rethink and decided to maintain its British investments.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/business-36730759
  • Options
    David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506
    midwinter said:

    midwinter said:

    eek said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    I suspect that when May is installed as PM some of the useless idiots supporting Leadweight will find their careers permanently retarded.

    Well I think Leadsom is going to be made Minister for Brexit after this showing. Gove will get off easy.
    Oh no doubt but the likes of Villiers and Mordaunt will not prosper. Plus the thing with the Brexit ministry is that Andrea will probably rub up the EU negotiators so badly she'll be sacked by Xmas
    Agreed. I think her association with outside forces (Banks, UKIP, Farage, Leave.EU etc...) and not having any backing from remain supporters is going to make her easy to box assuming a May victory.

    What's scary is that I'm beginning to come around to the idea of Gove as PM such is my dislike of Leadsom. She represents the God-bothering, gay-bashing, Tombstone group wing of the party. I can't wait for them all to die in the next 10 years.
    Trouble is the most enthusiastic support is from the CWF/YBF/Mark Clarke Style libertarian moron youth wing.
    Because she is New and Shiny. Neither of which are a reason to vote for her...
    No. Because she knows her stuff when challenged and has excellent communication skills. She can connect with the public very effectively.
    She didn't today. Just walked off with no questions. Very poor
    She was poor in the second debate too. She was ineffectual and cold which isn't a great combination.
    Leadsom is way warmer than May.

    May is old and tired, which is probably why she made the mistake of saying she woud use EU residents in the UK as a negotiating ploy and not guarantee their continued residence in the UK.
    One mans older is another mans more experienced. Either way Leadsom and her supporters are a branch of politicians the Tory party would, in many cases, be well rid of. Electorally at least they are a nightmare waiting to happen.
    Radical thinking sometimes trumps conventional thinking eg Margaret Thatcher.

    Now is the time to think radically and act conservatively.

    Vote Leadsom.
  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Lennon said:

    Thought experiment:

    Theresa May calls Andrea Leadsom into her office and gives her the choice of finishing 2nd today and gracefully withdrawing, or finishing 3rd.

    What does Andrea do?

    Say 2nd, but then not withdraw? ("On reflection, it is right to give the members the choice etc. etc.")
    It's Northern Ireland for her if she does that :)
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,671
    Scott_P said:

    @BuzzFeedUKPol: Andrea Leadsom’s charity is bankrolled by her offshore banker brother-in-law
    https://t.co/73y5RyO6iN https://t.co/F3zTFwf0Nv

    LOL

    "Nonetheless, they decided to make a very big launch event, that I could only describe as one third professional conference, one third stately home wedding and one third party political broadcast for the blue party.”

  • Options
    Animal_pbAnimal_pb Posts: 608

    Thought experiment:

    Theresa May calls Andrea Leadsom into her office and gives her the choice of finishing 2nd today and gracefully withdrawing, or finishing 3rd.

    What does Andrea do?

    Negotiate a better deal. If she can't do that, well, then....
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,027
    @MSmithsonPB: Andrea Leadsom could end up being a Tory Jeremy Corbyn but without an allotment
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383

    Isn't it something to behold the destruction of Andrea Leadsom's case for leader by both pro- and anti-Tory media? And by her colleagues, both former and current.

    The contrast with Corbyn's election - in which practically no-one on the Labour side actually took him to task for his former views; any action was restricted to worrying about how they might be presented - is once again absolutely glaring.

    It certainly is, the Labour candidates were all scared of their left-wing.
  • Options
    dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,291

    Pulpstar said:

    Indigo said:

    dr_spyn said:


    Risk of Brexit was there, so Hammond ignores it? Though he also claims that there was a risk that any study would have been leaked.

    I would have thought that HMG would have gamed or discussed implications of Brexit occuring, but then planning for an end game does seem rather out of fashion since 2003.

    They were concerned that if they gamed and planned it in detail they might find that the world was actually not going to end, and that after some initial bumps it would be completely manageable... if that leaked out it would be curtains for Project Bollocks, so they threw away responsible national contingency planning for short terms political reasons.

    Sounds about right.
    Regardless of the result the failure to do any sort of contingency planning is/was mind bogglingly irresponsible.
    I agree, but that was the decision of Cameron and Osborne. As usual they let short term political considerations trump responsible government.

    Yesterday Blair and co got a kicking for failing to plan for what happened after they toppled Saddam, and rightly so. Cameron also had no plan for what would happen in Libya after he helped to topple the government their after his unnecessary war. What stopped him learning the lessons from Iraq?

    Why some think that Cameron was a good PM is quite beyond me.
    heir to Blair's methods of government.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383

    I see that, post-Brexit, Tata Steel has had a rethink and decided to maintain its British investments.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/business-36730759

    And Amazon.
  • Options
    David_EvershedDavid_Evershed Posts: 6,506
    John_M said:

    Indigo said:

    OllyT said:

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Your relentlessly upbeat posts are reminding me more and more of Comical Ali as each day passes. Can't wait for the next instalment, they are going to get ever more hilarious as the months pass and we slide into recession.
    This would be the -0.8% one year technical recession that is forecast before returning to growth ? Remind me what happened to GDP/Capita under Gordon Brown's premiership again ?
    OK. GDP per capita fell due to the global financial meltdown but was still higher than that inherited from the Conservatives, and then it rose again until Osborne flatlined the economy.
    GDP/capita has been flat since 2007. We just make ourselves look good by importing more people.

    The media would do well to report GDP per head rather than GDP.

    Increased productivity is the way to increased wealth rather than increased population.
  • Options
    MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034

    midwinter said:

    midwinter said:

    eek said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    I suspect that when May is installed as PM some of the useless idiots supporting Leadweight will find their careers permanently retarded.

    Well I think Leadsom is going to be made Minister for Brexit after this showing. Gove will get off easy.
    Oh no doubt but the likes of Villiers and Mordaunt will not prosper. Plus the thing with the Brexit ministry is that Andrea will probably rub up the EU negotiators so badly she'll be sacked by Xmas
    Agreed. I think her association with outside forces (Banks, UKIP, Farage, Leave.EU etc...) and not having any backing from remain supporters is going to make her easy to box assuming a May victory.

    What's scary is that I'm beginning to come around to the idea of Gove as PM such is my dislike of Leadsom. She represents the God-bothering, gay-bashing, Tombstone group wing of the party. I can't wait for them all to die in the next 10 years.
    Trouble is the most enthusiastic support is from the CWF/YBF/Mark Clarke Style libertarian moron youth wing.
    Because she is New and Shiny. Neither of which are a reason to vote for her...
    No. Because she knows her stuff when challenged and has excellent communication skills. She can connect with the public very effectively.
    She didn't today. Just walked off with no questions. Very poor
    She was poor in the second debate too. She was ineffectual and cold which isn't a great combination.
    Leadsom is way warmer than May.

    May is old and tired, which is probably why she made the mistake of saying she woud use EU residents in the UK as a negotiating ploy and not guarantee their continued residence in the UK.
    One mans older is another mans more experienced. Either way Leadsom and her supporters are a branch of politicians the Tory party would, in many cases, be well rid of. Electorally at least they are a nightmare waiting to happen.
    Radical thinking sometimes trumps conventional thinking eg Margaret Thatcher.

    Now is the time to think radically and act conservatively.

    Vote Leadsom.
    Indeed, this is not a time for 'steady as she goes', but for someone with a vision of where to aim for from here and the skills to chart a viable course. A PhD in keeping your head below the parapet is not a positive indicator ...
  • Options
    chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    London-banker-centric yet again.

    There is a nation beyond.
  • Options
    eekeek Posts: 25,334
    Animal_pb said:

    Thought experiment:

    Theresa May calls Andrea Leadsom into her office and gives her the choice of finishing 2nd today and gracefully withdrawing, or finishing 3rd.

    What does Andrea do?

    Negotiate a better deal. If she can't do that, well, then....
    Go for 2nd then deny all knowledge of such a conversation....

    If Theresa is playing such games (and she wouldn't be that stupid) you just give Gove the votes...
  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    Love Ruth:

    @RuthDavidsonMSP .@jimwaterson is that Theresa Villiers *actually* clutching her pearls with discomfort at 4 secs from end? I thought that was just a saying.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    MTimT said:

    midwinter said:

    midwinter said:

    eek said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    I suspect that when May is installed as PM some of the useless idiots supporting Leadweight will find their careers permanently retarded.

    Oh no doubt but the likes of Villiers and Mordaunt will not prosper. Plus the thing with the Brexit ministry is that Andrea will probably rub up the EU negotiators so badly she'll be sacked by Xmas
    Agreed. I think her association with outside forces (Banks, UKIP, Farage, Leave.EU etc...) and not having any backing from remain supporters is going to make her easy to box assuming a May victory.

    What's scary is that I'm beginning to come around to the idea of Gove as PM such is my dislike of Leadsom. She represents the God-bothering, gay-bashing, Tombstone group wing of the party. I can't wait for them all to die in the next 10 years.
    Trouble is the most enthusiastic support is from the CWF/YBF/Mark Clarke Style libertarian moron youth wing.
    Because she is New and Shiny. Neither of which are a reason to vote for her...
    No. Because she knows her stuff when challenged and has excellent communication skills. She can connect with the public very effectively.
    She didn't today. Just walked off with no questions. Very poor
    She was poor in the second debate too. She was ineffectual and cold which isn't a great combination.
    Leadsom is way warmer than May.

    May is old and tired, which is probably why she made the mistake of saying she woud use EU residents in the UK as a negotiating ploy and not guarantee their continued residence in the UK.
    One mans older is another mans more experienced. Either way Leadsom and her supporters are a branch of politicians the Tory party would, in many cases, be well rid of. Electorally at least they are a nightmare waiting to happen.
    Radical thinking sometimes trumps conventional thinking eg Margaret Thatcher.

    Now is the time to think radically and act conservatively.

    Vote Leadsom.
    Indeed, this is not a time for 'steady as she goes', but for someone with a vision of where to aim for from here and the skills to chart a viable course. A PhD in keeping your head below the parapet is not a positive indicator ...
    I'm voting for Gove if I can.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,065
    Corbyn's saviour speaks again:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36733979
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,741

    eek said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    I suspect that when May is installed as PM some of the useless idiots supporting Leadweight will find their careers permanently retarded.

    Well I think Leadsom is going to be made Minister for Brexit after this showing. Gove will get off easy.
    Oh no doubt but the likes of Villiers and Mordaunt will not prosper. Plus the thing with the Brexit ministry is that Andrea will probably rub up the EU negotiators so badly she'll be sacked by Xmas
    Agreed. I think her association with outside forces (Banks, UKIP, Farage, Leave.EU etc...) and not having any backing from remain supporters is going to make her easy to box assuming a May victory.

    What's scary is that I'm beginning to come around to the idea of Gove as PM such is my dislike of Leadsom. She represents the God-bothering, gay-bashing, Tombstone group wing of the party. I can't wait for them all to die in the next 10 years.
    Trouble is the most enthusiastic support is from the CWF/YBF/Mark Clarke Style libertarian moron youth wing.
    Because she is New and Shiny. Neither of which are a reason to vote for her...
    No. Because she knows her stuff when challenged and has excellent communication skills. She can connect with the public very effectively.
    She didn't today. Just walked off with no questions. Very poor
    Leadsom is better answering questions than reading out her speech.

    Perhaps today she did't have the time since she is a minister and an MP with Department and Constituency affairs to run as well as the leadership campaign.

    So perhaps she's "just getting on with the job" ?
    She is hiding from the revelations on her cv and tax affairs. She has got some explaining to do and if she can then fine but at present it looks shifty
    A former colleague at investment firm Invesco Perpetual, Robert Stephens, has said "she didn't manage any teams, large or small and certainly did not manage any funds."
    That was after a friendly MP, Bernard Jenkin, spoke of her history managing "hundreds of people and billions of pounds".
    A CV listing the post Financial Institutions Director at Barclays later added the word "deputy".
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36730216
  • Options
    LennonLennon Posts: 1,747

    Lennon said:

    Thought experiment:

    Theresa May calls Andrea Leadsom into her office and gives her the choice of finishing 2nd today and gracefully withdrawing, or finishing 3rd.

    What does Andrea do?

    Say 2nd, but then not withdraw? ("On reflection, it is right to give the members the choice etc. etc.")
    It's Northern Ireland for her if she does that :)
    Or PM if the members don't take kindly to May trying to avoid them... it's the all or nothing approach I grant you...
  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    dr_spyn said:
    That takes reporting on price moves to a new low. NB bet365 have just pushed her out from 9/2 to 5/1 :)
  • Options
    John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503

    John_M said:

    Indigo said:

    OllyT said:

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Your relentlessly upbeat posts are reminding me more and more of Comical Ali as each day passes. Can't wait for the next instalment, they are going to get ever more hilarious as the months pass and we slide into recession.
    This would be the -0.8% one year technical recession that is forecast before returning to growth ? Remind me what happened to GDP/Capita under Gordon Brown's premiership again ?
    OK. GDP per capita fell due to the global financial meltdown but was still higher than that inherited from the Conservatives, and then it rose again until Osborne flatlined the economy.
    GDP/capita has been flat since 2007. We just make ourselves look good by importing more people.

    The media would do well to report GDP per head rather than GDP.

    Increased productivity is the way to increased wealth rather than increased population.
    My view is that it's just a shit measure all round. It appeals to technocrats and makes very little difference to peoples lives. Love and obsession with those high level measures are partly why I feel our politicians have become disengaged from ordinary people, and partly why all the economic arguments failed to resonate in the referendum campaign.

    My current preference is for measures around disposable income. People measure prosperity (I assert!) by how much they've left to spend after paying their bills. It means you can't frig it as easily as inflation figures, average wage rises and so forth. It also takes into account some of the beneficial changes like personal allowance increases.
  • Options
    PongPong Posts: 4,693
    edited July 2016

    Isn't it something to behold the destruction of Andrea Leadsom's case for leader by both pro- and anti-Tory media? And by her colleagues, both former and current.

    The contrast with Corbyn's election - in which practically no-one on the Labour side actually took him to task for his former views; any action was restricted to worrying about how they might be presented - is once again absolutely glaring.

    The danger here is that May is getting a free ride.
  • Options
    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    John_M said:

    Indigo said:

    dr_spyn said:


    Risk of Brexit was there, so Hammond ignores it? Though he also claims that there was a risk that any study would have been leaked.

    I would have thought that HMG would have gamed or discussed implications of Brexit occuring, but then planning for an end game does seem rather out of fashion since 2003.

    They were concerned that if they gamed and planned it in detail they might find that the world was actually not going to end, and that after some initial bumps it would be completely manageable... if that leaked out it would be curtains for Project Bollocks, so they threw away responsible national contingency planning for short terms political reasons.

    Sounds about right.
    It's hard to do the IFS conclusions justice briefly. They concluded that it would cost the UK between £20-40 billion by 2019 (they plumped for the NIESR models). That means one-two years more 'austerity'. Basically, yes we can do it, but on a purely economic basis, it's not worth it.

    Which is fair enough. Both Leave campaigns saw it was funded by a pro-Europe group, screamed in anger and threw the baby out with the bathwater.
    Mr. M., I am not sure what that has to do with the idea of HMG contingency planning is actually a good idea.

    The IFS figures may or may not be valid but they should have been a factor to take into account in the making the contingency plans, not an excuse for not doing any planning.

    P.S. £20-40bn by 2019 when government expenditure will be in excess of £2,100bn over the same period? That looks bloody close to a rounding error to me.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    John_M said:

    John_M said:

    Indigo said:

    OllyT said:

    Terrible news for .......Project fear. Please do not show to SeanT as the shock may be too much.

    "Britain’s housing market is “back to business as usual”, according to mortgage brokers, conveyancers, estate agents – and buyers and sellers."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/personal-banking/mortgages/business-as-usual-as-housing-and-mortgage-markets-crank-back-to/?WT.mc_id=e_DM136925&WT.tsrc=email&etype=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon&utm_source=email&utm_medium=Edi_Pfi_New_Mon_2016_07_06&utm_campaign=DM136925

    Your relentlessly upbeat posts are reminding me more and more of Comical Ali as each day passes. Can't wait for the next instalment, they are going to get ever more hilarious as the months pass and we slide into recession.
    This would be the -0.8% one year technical recession that is forecast before returning to growth ? Remind me what happened to GDP/Capita under Gordon Brown's premiership again ?
    OK. GDP per capita fell due to the global financial meltdown but was still higher than that inherited from the Conservatives, and then it rose again until Osborne flatlined the economy.
    GDP/capita has been flat since 2007. We just make ourselves look good by importing more people.

    The media would do well to report GDP per head rather than GDP.

    Increased productivity is the way to increased wealth rather than increased population.
    My view is that it's just a shit measure all round. It appeals to technocrats and makes very little difference to peoples lives. Love and obsession with those high level measures are partly why I feel our politicians have become disengaged from ordinary people, and partly why all the economic arguments failed to resonate in the referendum campaign.

    My current preference is for measures around disposable income. People measure prosperity (I assert!) by how much they've left to spend after paying their bills. It means you can't frig it as easily as inflation figures, average wage rises and so forth. It also takes into account some of the beneficial changes like personal allowance increases.
    Well said.
  • Options
    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @BBCNormanS: I was never a fund manger - @andrealeadsom on her CV
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,027

    dr_spyn said:
    That takes reporting on price moves to a new low. NB bet365 have just pushed her out from 9/2 to 5/1 :)
    Clearly bet365 are the Jon Snow of political betting. They know nothing.
  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    eek said:

    Animal_pb said:

    Thought experiment:

    Theresa May calls Andrea Leadsom into her office and gives her the choice of finishing 2nd today and gracefully withdrawing, or finishing 3rd.

    What does Andrea do?

    Negotiate a better deal. If she can't do that, well, then....
    Go for 2nd then deny all knowledge of such a conversation....

    If Theresa is playing such games (and she wouldn't be that stupid) you just give Gove the votes...
    I agree she wouldn't though I expect the MPs to. Gove to finish 2nd looks a bet.
  • Options
    Mr Dimon said that they "could... if ... might ...likely would not ....."
    fly a kite.... if we see flying pink elephants .....
  • Options
    JonCisBackJonCisBack Posts: 911
    edited July 2016
    MaxPB said:

    felix said:

    More terrible facts for Project Fear

    Samuel Coates Retweeted
    The Int'l Spectator @intlspectator
    Stocks, past month.
    UK: +4.4%

    Russia: -2.7%
    Poland: -4.6%
    Netherlands: -5%
    France: -7.4%
    Germany: -8%
    Spain: -10%
    Italy: -13%
    Greece: -19%

    Can you put them up when they take into effect the devaluation in sterling?
    Taking into account the 13% devaluation on Sterling puts the FTSE 100 down about 8%.
    I am British and buy things in £.

    If I sell shares I will get £ back

    The value in £ has gone up.

    Sure some imported goods I might want to spend my £ on may soon go up in price, but many are not imported, and crucially the main expenditure I have is a mortgage. Which is in £, and is fixed.

    So OK, converting the FTSE into another currency is not completely irrelevant, but it is more important that it has gone up in £.

    I will mark you down as "Remain/hysterical"

  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,581

    midwinter said:

    midwinter said:

    eek said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    MaxPB said:

    ToryJim said:

    I suspect that when May is installed as PM some of the useless idiots supporting Leadweight will find their careers permanently retarded.

    Well I think Leadsom is going to be made Minister for Brexit after this showing. Gove will get off easy.
    Oh no doubt but the likes of Villiers and Mordaunt will not prosper. Plus the thing with the Brexit ministry is that Andrea will probably rub up the EU negotiators so badly she'll be sacked by Xmas
    Agreed. I think her association with outside forces (Banks, UKIP, Farage, Leave.EU etc...) and not having any backing from remain supporters is going to make her easy to box assuming a May victory.

    What's scary is that I'm beginning to come around to the idea of Gove as PM such is my dislike of Leadsom. She represents the God-bothering, gay-bashing, Tombstone group wing of the party. I can't wait for them all to die in the next 10 years.
    Trouble is the most enthusiastic support is from the CWF/YBF/Mark Clarke Style libertarian moron youth wing.
    Because she is New and Shiny. Neither of which are a reason to vote for her...
    No. Because she knows her stuff when challenged and has excellent communication skills. She can connect with the public very effectively.
    She didn't today. Just walked off with no questions. Very poor
    She was poor in the second debate too. She was ineffectual and cold which isn't a great combination.
    Leadsom is way warmer than May.

    May is old and tired, which is probably why she made the mistake of saying she woud use EU residents in the UK as a negotiating ploy and not guarantee their continued residence in the UK.
    One mans older is another mans more experienced. Either way Leadsom and her supporters are a branch of politicians the Tory party would, in many cases, be well rid of. Electorally at least they are a nightmare waiting to happen.
    Radical thinking sometimes trumps conventional thinking eg Margaret Thatcher.

    Now is the time to think radically and act conservatively.

    Vote Leadsom.
    I agree but Andrea doesn't do thinking. Her presentation this morning was vacuous and absolutely not Prime Ministerial. If she wins she will be overwhelmed within six months
This discussion has been closed.