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    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    watford30 said:

    Dair said:

    HYUFD said:

    Dair said:

    HYUFD said:

    GeoffM said:

    GeoffM said:

    In other election news tonight, I'm at the Gibraltar General Election count.

    It's looking like the expected GSLP triumph with the exit poll showing a landslide win for GSLP-Liberals: 72% for GSLP-Liberals, 28% for GSD.

    Aren't all the Gibraltar parties (varying degrees of) Lefties, though?
    Yes, the Gibraltar Socialist Labour Party is going to win.

    The Social Democrats used to be centre-right under Sir Peter Caruana but he was succeeded by Daniel Feetham who used to lead the now defunct Labour Party. They are soft left now.

    The soft-right PDP folded after the last election after they won no MPs. So I'm politically homeless.

    Live coverage on GBC right now if anyone fancies a quick look:
    http://www.gbc.gi/tv/watch-live
    They all want to stay British though, which is the main thing
    And why not.

    We pay for their security.

    They pay no tax.

    Cushtie.
    Most of those speaking on that Gibralter broadcast spoke with British accents and seemed to be expats anyway
    Whether they are Gibraltar citizens or British citizens they still pay NO tax to the UK exchequer, get full cover from UK Taxpayers for their defence, get significant subsidies for UK Universities, etc, etc. etc.

    All Crown dependencies should be given a choice, much like France gave their colonies. Become part of the state or leave. No more subsidies.
    With Brent Crude at $45 a barrel, Scotland's being massively subsidised by the rest of us.

    Go ahead and hike up Scottish taxes to make up the loss or Foxtrot Oscar.
    How much is a barrel of monkeys or TT deaths or tax avoidance schemes?
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    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,794
    HYUFD said:

    viewcode said:

    What I don't get, is how come John McDonnell at least, and perhaps Jeremy Corbyn as well, weren't thrown out of the Labour Party years ago. No self-respecting social democratic party would tolerate extremist terrorist-apologists like this, over a period of decades.

    Why do you think Labour is a social democratic party? I'm sure it has (a rapidly declining number of) social democrats in it, but that's not the same thing. Britain, like every other country, does politics slightly differently. We don't really have Christian Democrats (except arguably Cameron & Osborne!) we have Conservatives, with a greater emphasis on Atlanticism and free trade. We don't have a social democratic party, we have Labour, with a greater emphasis on organised labour and trade unions. Corbyn fitted, and still fits, perfectly well in the Labour party. Which is the problem, when you think about it...
    Australia and New Zealand also have a Labour Party, France and Spain Socialist, not Social Democratic, parties. In terms of European Christian Democratic parties, they are only really found now in Germany, Scandinavia and Benelux nations, Forza Italia in Italy, the Popular Party in Spain, the UMP in France and Eastern European right of centre parties tend to be more conservative
    I know.
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    Moses_ said:

    AndyJS said:

    Interesting how Thanksgiving hasn't caught on at all in the UK, unlike Halloween.

    Tim_B said:

    Happy Thanksgiving.

    They say it's about giving thanks, food, family, and football.

    Surprise, surprise, Yahoo Food has done a poll on it -

    44% will host a Thanksgiving dinner
    24% will go to someone else's house
    44% of millennials will serve ham instead of turkey

    43% say turkey is their favorite part of the meal
    18% stuffing
    7% sweet potato casserole
    7% pie
    7% ham
    7% mashed potatoes
    4% green bean casserole
    3% cranberry sauce

    We do to a point it's just called "harvest festival" and if I recollect celebrated slightly earlier.
    Thats how it started in the Americas too......

    http://www.todayifoundout.com/index.php/2010/11/10-thanksgiving-myths-dispelled/
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.
    AndyJS said:

    Interesting how Thanksgiving hasn't caught on at all in the UK, unlike Halloween.

    Tim_B said:

    Happy Thanksgiving.

    They say it's about giving thanks, food, family, and football.

    Surprise, surprise, Yahoo Food has done a poll on it -

    44% will host a Thanksgiving dinner
    24% will go to someone else's house
    44% of millennials will serve ham instead of turkey

    43% say turkey is their favorite part of the meal
    18% stuffing
    7% sweet potato casserole
    7% pie
    7% ham
    7% mashed potatoes
    4% green bean casserole
    3% cranberry sauce

  • Options
    notmenotme Posts: 3,293
    kle4 said:

    AndyJS said:

    Livingstone was getting moderate applause in Manchester, which seemed not too bad considering — but then you remember this is a council area where Labour holds 100% of the seats, 96 out of 96.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-32664390

    Christ. That cannot be healthy for local democratic accountability can it? I know there are some 100% Tory councils, but 96 out of 96? How can not a single one of the wards not have a non-Labour majority when there are that many wards? Pure chance should have a few hundred weird Tory or LD voters agglomerate in one of them I'd have thought.
    Ironically though, Manchester City Council *is* a well run Council, and it is for that reason that the Government has built the first English Devolution settlement around them.

    Both the Council Leader and Chief Executive of the Council are respected as forward thinking and people who the Government can 'do business with'.
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    @NicolaSturgeon Though these by elections described as @theSNP holds, Lab won them on first preferences in 2012 - SNP won both on first preferences tonight
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,780
    notme said:

    kle4 said:

    AndyJS said:

    Livingstone was getting moderate applause in Manchester, which seemed not too bad considering — but then you remember this is a council area where Labour holds 100% of the seats, 96 out of 96.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-32664390

    Christ. That cannot be healthy for local democratic accountability can it? I know there are some 100% Tory councils, but 96 out of 96? How can not a single one of the wards not have a non-Labour majority when there are that many wards? Pure chance should have a few hundred weird Tory or LD voters agglomerate in one of them I'd have thought.
    Ironically though, Manchester City Council *is* a well run Council, and it is for that reason that the Government has built the first English Devolution settlement around them.

    Both the Council Leader and Chief Executive of the Council are respected as forward thinking and people who the Government can 'do business with'.
    I applaud them then, it seems like it would be easy to descend into internal party farce in such an environment.

    Good night all.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    The funniest thing about Lammy is when he did Mastermind he was a minster in the department responsible for university education...

    I'm not sure that funny is the appropriate word.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    notme said:

    kle4 said:

    AndyJS said:

    Livingstone was getting moderate applause in Manchester, which seemed not too bad considering — but then you remember this is a council area where Labour holds 100% of the seats, 96 out of 96.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-32664390

    Christ. That cannot be healthy for local democratic accountability can it? I know there are some 100% Tory councils, but 96 out of 96? How can not a single one of the wards not have a non-Labour majority when there are that many wards? Pure chance should have a few hundred weird Tory or LD voters agglomerate in one of them I'd have thought.
    Ironically though, Manchester City Council *is* a well run Council, and it is for that reason that the Government has built the first English Devolution settlement around them.

    Both the Council Leader and Chief Executive of the Council are respected as forward thinking and people who the Government can 'do business with'.
    Last time I was in Manchester it was a 'nuclear free zone'.
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    The Indie has already picked up Ken's 'gave their lives' comment:

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/ken-livingstone-says-terrorists-gave-their-lives-in-protest-against-our-invasion-of-iraq-on-question-a6750836.html

    Wait until the Mail gets a hold of it.....
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    Swingy. Local factors? Or a genuine Green surge?

    Britain Elects ‏@britainelects

    Salisbury St Edmund (Wiltshire) result:
    CON: 36.0% (+13.1)
    LDEM: 22.2% (-20.8)
    LAB: 19.7% (+5.2)
    GRN: 18.2% (+10.7)
    IND: 3.8% (+3.8)
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    notme said:

    kle4 said:

    AndyJS said:

    Livingstone was getting moderate applause in Manchester, which seemed not too bad considering — but then you remember this is a council area where Labour holds 100% of the seats, 96 out of 96.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-32664390

    Christ. That cannot be healthy for local democratic accountability can it? I know there are some 100% Tory councils, but 96 out of 96? How can not a single one of the wards not have a non-Labour majority when there are that many wards? Pure chance should have a few hundred weird Tory or LD voters agglomerate in one of them I'd have thought.
    Ironically though, Manchester City Council *is* a well run Council, and it is for that reason that the Government has built the first English Devolution settlement around them.

    Both the Council Leader and Chief Executive of the Council are respected as forward thinking and people who the Government can 'do business with'.
    One of the Northern councils was given a telling off by Balls for daring to cooperate with the Tories. He was told where he could go in no uncertain terms.
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    'Mao did more good than harm'


    https://vine.co/v/iamVnD9A1Xg
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    Your 'Thanksgiving' started as a 'Harvest Festival'......
    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    AndyJS said:

    Interesting how Thanksgiving hasn't caught on at all in the UK, unlike Halloween.

    Tim_B said:

    Happy Thanksgiving.

    They say it's about giving thanks, food, family, and football.

    Surprise, surprise, Yahoo Food has done a poll on it -

    44% will host a Thanksgiving dinner
    24% will go to someone else's house
    44% of millennials will serve ham instead of turkey

    43% say turkey is their favorite part of the meal
    18% stuffing
    7% sweet potato casserole
    7% pie
    7% ham
    7% mashed potatoes
    4% green bean casserole
    3% cranberry sauce

  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,011
    viewcode said:

    HYUFD said:

    viewcode said:

    What I don't get, is how come John McDonnell at least, and perhaps Jeremy Corbyn as well, weren't thrown out of the Labour Party years ago. No self-respecting social democratic party would tolerate extremist terrorist-apologists like this, over a period of decades.

    Why do you think Labour is a social democratic party? I'm sure it has (a rapidly declining number of) social democrats in it, but that's not the same thing. Britain, like every other country, does politics slightly differently. We don't really have Christian Democrats (except arguably Cameron & Osborne!) we have Conservatives, with a greater emphasis on Atlanticism and free trade. We don't have a social democratic party, we have Labour, with a greater emphasis on organised labour and trade unions. Corbyn fitted, and still fits, perfectly well in the Labour party. Which is the problem, when you think about it...
    Australia and New Zealand also have a Labour Party, France and Spain Socialist, not Social Democratic, parties. In terms of European Christian Democratic parties, they are only really found now in Germany, Scandinavia and Benelux nations, Forza Italia in Italy, the Popular Party in Spain, the UMP in France and Eastern European right of centre parties tend to be more conservative
    I know.
    Good to clarify that then, goodnight
  • Options

    'Mao did more good than harm'


    https://vine.co/v/iamVnD9A1Xg

    Just WTF...
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    oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,831

    'Mao did more good than harm'


    https://vine.co/v/iamVnD9A1Xg

    Is that from tonight's episode?
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,969

    'Mao did more good than harm'


    https://vine.co/v/iamVnD9A1Xg

    Is that from tonight's episode?
    No, from the "This Week" archives....
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    oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,831
    RobD said:

    'Mao did more good than harm'


    https://vine.co/v/iamVnD9A1Xg

    Is that from tonight's episode?
    No, from the "This Week" archives....
    Ah. Ok.

    It is still a massively warped world view
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    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Labour lost both their council seats to the SNP.

    The fright they face gets more worrying.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Probably so, but it has evolved much since then. It is a curious holiday - not a religious one (although it apparently started that way), and you don't do presents. It's mainly a family get together, and is the largest holiday of the year in terms of travel. Think of Abner Doubleday and baseball and you will get an idea how Thanksgiving evolved the way it did.

    Your 'Thanksgiving' started as a 'Harvest Festival'......

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    AndyJS said:

    Interesting how Thanksgiving hasn't caught on at all in the UK, unlike Halloween.

    Tim_B said:

    Happy Thanksgiving.

    They say it's about giving thanks, food, family, and football.

    Surprise, surprise, Yahoo Food has done a poll on it -

    44% will host a Thanksgiving dinner
    24% will go to someone else's house
    44% of millennials will serve ham instead of turkey

    43% say turkey is their favorite part of the meal
    18% stuffing
    7% sweet potato casserole
    7% pie
    7% ham
    7% mashed potatoes
    4% green bean casserole
    3% cranberry sauce

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    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    SeanT said:

    AndyJS said:

    Livingstone was getting moderate applause in Manchester, which seemed not too bad considering — but then you remember this is a council area where Labour holds 100% of the seats, 96 out of 96.

    I am certain the Beeb is still resolutely selecting the audience for "balance" - i.e. half Labour half Tory, with a few eccentrics.

    Trouble is, the public is now about 60-70% "anti-Corbyn".

    BBC Question Time audience are not even remotely balanced, even by your rhetoric,. They are predominantly hand wringing lefties, although in Scotland they ensure that the balance of the audience is anti-Scottish and pro-Loyalist.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    RobD said:

    'Mao did more good than harm'


    https://vine.co/v/iamVnD9A1Xg

    Is that from tonight's episode?
    No, from the "This Week" archives....
    Ah. Ok.

    It is still a massively warped world view
    How does it compare to Obama's?
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    DairDair Posts: 6,108

    And the brace.

    Jonathan Watson ‏@C_JWatson 2 mins2 minutes ago
    BREAKING NEWS #snp win #dunfnorth byelection

    Two massive Labour majorities, destroyed. And once again by enough votes to ensure that tactical voting will be pointless.
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    Dair said:

    SeanT said:

    AndyJS said:

    Livingstone was getting moderate applause in Manchester, which seemed not too bad considering — but then you remember this is a council area where Labour holds 100% of the seats, 96 out of 96.

    I am certain the Beeb is still resolutely selecting the audience for "balance" - i.e. half Labour half Tory, with a few eccentrics.

    Trouble is, the public is now about 60-70% "anti-Corbyn".

    anti-Scottish and pro-Loyalist.
    Good.

    The longer you confuse 'anti-Scottish' with 'pro-loyalist' the longer it will take you to persuade the 55.....
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    DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Dair said:


    That is my point.

    It is 20 years ago.

    I was in London a few times in the late 90s and it was still very focuseed on potential IRA terrorism. I found it laughable, mainly because the whole thing was beyond my comprehension. (Especially the whole "just drop rubbish in the street because bins are too dangerous").

    That's my point. Anyone under 20 doesnt care about the IRA and lots of people from non threatened parts of the UK dont care regardless of age.

    A child was killed in Warrington when the IRA planted a bomb in a waste bin. You may have noticed a slight lack if left luggage boxes at railway stations too.
    Actually to be honest no. I doubt you notice anything very much.
    I wan't commenting on the necessity of the rule.

    I was commenting on how it came across to someone who came from a country where there has never been a terrorist incident (at the time) and has still never suffered a successful terrorist incident.

    Whether it is right or wrong, it just seems bizarre. It is not comprehensible when you have no reference point.
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    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    scotslass said:

    These seem pretty comfy wins for the NATS tonight.

    Huge swings of 10% percent. Very good results.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,682
    edited November 2015
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    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    Halloween hasn;t "Caught on". It has always been a major festival. It only exists in the US because it was a major festival in Scotland and Ireland and it remain the same today.

    It is, perhaps, disappointing that the English media has tried to "import" a US festival into the UK on US terms and replaced Guising with Trick or Treating. I hope Ireland has been less effected. But it is another reason why Scotland needs to cut link with England before the culture of Scotand is completely destroyed.
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    DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Swingy. Local factors? Or a genuine Green surge?

    Britain Elects ‏@britainelects

    Salisbury St Edmund (Wiltshire) result:
    CON: 36.0% (+13.1)
    LDEM: 22.2% (-20.8)
    LAB: 19.7% (+5.2)
    GRN: 18.2% (+10.7)
    IND: 3.8% (+3.8)

    The Dead Parrot Party just split their vote between Orange Bookers who went Tory and the rest who went Green.
  • Options
    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    Halloween hasn;t "Caught on". It has always been a major festival. It only exists in the US because it was a major festival in Scotland and Ireland and it remain the same today.

    It is, perhaps, disappointing that the English media has tried to "import" a US festival into the UK on US terms and replaced Guising with Trick or Treating. I hope Ireland has been less effected. But it is another reason why Scotland needs to cut link with England before the culture of Scotand is completely destroyed.
    Speaking of "US Festivals" don't you have "Black Friday" (and presumably cyber Monday) over there now? What's wrong with that?
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    Halloween hasn;t "Caught on". It has always been a major festival. It only exists in the US because it was a major festival in Scotland and Ireland and it remain the same today.

    It is, perhaps, disappointing that the English media has tried to "import" a US festival into the UK on US terms and replaced Guising with Trick or Treating. I hope Ireland has been less effected. But it is another reason why Scotland needs to cut link with England before the culture of Scotand is completely destroyed.
    Speaking of "US Festivals" don't you have "Black Friday" (and presumably cyber Monday) over there now? What's wrong with that?
    I'm pretty sure that only an American could compare a festival like Halloween, which is hundreds of years old, with Black Friday.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    edited November 2015
    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    Halloween hasn;t "Caught on". It has always been a major festival. It only exists in the US because it was a major festival in Scotland and Ireland and it remain the same today.

    It is, perhaps, disappointing that the English media has tried to "import" a US festival into the UK on US terms and replaced Guising with Trick or Treating. I hope Ireland has been less effected. But it is another reason why Scotland needs to cut link with England before the culture of Scotand is completely destroyed.
    Speaking of "US Festivals" don't you have "Black Friday" (and presumably cyber Monday) over there now? What's wrong with that?
    I'm pretty sure that only an American could compare a festival like Halloween, which is hundreds of years old, with Black Friday.
    Err.....Black Friday is BECAUSE of Halloween.

    - and I'm a brit as well as an american
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    Halloween hasn;t "Caught on". It has always been a major festival. It only exists in the US because it was a major festival in Scotland and Ireland and it remain the same today.

    It is, perhaps, disappointing that the English media has tried to "import" a US festival into the UK on US terms and replaced Guising with Trick or Treating. I hope Ireland has been less effected. But it is another reason why Scotland needs to cut link with England before the culture of Scotand is completely destroyed.
    Speaking of "US Festivals" don't you have "Black Friday" (and presumably cyber Monday) over there now? What's wrong with that?
    I'm pretty sure that only an American could compare a festival like Halloween, which is hundreds of years old, with Black Friday.
    Err.....Black Friday is BECAUSE of Halloween.

    - and I'm a brit as well as an american
    Black Friday is the day after Thanksgiving. Halloween was a month ago.
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,682
    edited November 2015
    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    Halloween hasn;t "Caught on". It has always been a major festival. It only exists in the US because it was a major festival in Scotland and Ireland and it remain the same today.

    It is, perhaps, disappointing that the English media has tried to "import" a US festival into the UK on US terms and replaced Guising with Trick or Treating. I hope Ireland has been less effected. But it is another reason why Scotland needs to cut link with England before the culture of Scotand is completely destroyed.
    Speaking of "US Festivals" don't you have "Black Friday" (and presumably cyber Monday) over there now? What's wrong with that?
    I'm pretty sure that only an American could compare a festival like Halloween, which is hundreds of years old, with Black Friday.
    Err.....Black Friday is BECAUSE of Halloween.

    - and I'm a brit as well as an american
    According to Wiki its because of Thanksgiving

    "Black Friday is the day following Thanksgiving Day in the United States"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Friday_(shopping)
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    Halloween hasn;t "Caught on". It has always been a major festival. It only exists in the US because it was a major festival in Scotland and Ireland and it remain the same today.

    It is, perhaps, disappointing that the English media has tried to "import" a US festival into the UK on US terms and replaced Guising with Trick or Treating. I hope Ireland has been less effected. But it is another reason why Scotland needs to cut link with England before the culture of Scotand is completely destroyed.
    Speaking of "US Festivals" don't you have "Black Friday" (and presumably cyber Monday) over there now? What's wrong with that?
    I'm pretty sure that only an American could compare a festival like Halloween, which is hundreds of years old, with Black Friday.
    Err.....Black Friday is BECAUSE of Halloween.

    - and I'm a brit as well as an american
    Black Friday is the day after Thanksgiving. Halloween was a month ago.
    I apologize, my brain is non-functional. I'm stuffed with food and alcohol - what I meant to say is that Black Friday is because of Thanksgiving, not Halloween.
  • Options
    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    Halloween hasn;t "Caught on". It has always been a major festival. It only exists in the US because it was a major festival in Scotland and Ireland and it remain the same today.

    It is, perhaps, disappointing that the English media has tried to "import" a US festival into the UK on US terms and replaced Guising with Trick or Treating. I hope Ireland has been less effected. But it is another reason why Scotland needs to cut link with England before the culture of Scotand is completely destroyed.
    Speaking of "US Festivals" don't you have "Black Friday" (and presumably cyber Monday) over there now? What's wrong with that?
    Halloween, which is hundreds of years old
    Or older......


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/christianity/holydays/halloween_1.shtml
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    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    edited November 2015

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    Halloween hasn;t "Caught on". It has always been a major festival. It only exists in the US because it was a major festival in Scotland and Ireland and it remain the same today.

    It is, perhaps, disappointing that the English media has tried to "import" a US festival into the UK on US terms and replaced Guising with Trick or Treating. I hope Ireland has been less effected. But it is another reason why Scotland needs to cut link with England before the culture of Scotand is completely destroyed.
    Speaking of "US Festivals" don't you have "Black Friday" (and presumably cyber Monday) over there now? What's wrong with that?
    Halloween, which is hundreds of years old
    Or older......


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/christianity/holydays/halloween_1.shtml
    The pre 16th century roots of Halloween are pretty much irrelevant. It is a Scottish and Irish festival that the US uses to pretend to be secular. Not that that, in itself is a bad thing.

    Additionally Samhain is almost certainly linked to the Sweeny Todd myth given that they are pronounced the same.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,682
    edited November 2015
    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    Halloween hasn;t "Caught on". It has always been a major festival. It only exists in the US because it was a major festival in Scotland and Ireland and it remain the same today.

    It is, perhaps, disappointing that the English media has tried to "import" a US festival into the UK on US terms and replaced Guising with Trick or Treating. I hope Ireland has been less effected. But it is another reason why Scotland needs to cut link with England before the culture of Scotand is completely destroyed.
    Speaking of "US Festivals" don't you have "Black Friday" (and presumably cyber Monday) over there now? What's wrong with that?
    Halloween, which is hundreds of years old
    Or older......


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/christianity/holydays/halloween_1.shtml
    The pre 16th century roots of Halloween are pretty much irrelevant. It is a Scottish and Irish festival that the US uses to pretend to be secular. Not that that, in itself is a bad thing.

    Additionally Samhain is almost certainly linked to the Sweeny Todd myth given that they are pronounced the same.
    What ever its source, it was a setting for one of the finest poems:

    http://www.robertburns.org.uk/Assets/Poems_Songs/tamoshanter.htm

    (complete with translation)
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    "Tradition"

    In 1939, President Franklin D. Roosevelt moved up Thanksgiving. Traditionally it had been celebrated on the last Thursday of November, but the nation’s largest retailers contended that there weren’t enough days between Thanksgiving and Christmas to allow everyone to complete their holiday shopping. The holiday now falls on the fourth Thursday, even when there are five in the month.

    http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/projects/cp/business/black-friday-holiday-shopping-2015/why-thanksgiving-is-today?smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur
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    Everything's going so well

    Jeremy Corbyn faces threat of shadow cabinet resignations

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34940728
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,969

    Everything's going so well

    Jeremy Corbyn faces threat of shadow cabinet resignations

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34940728

    PB Tories 4 Corbyn, unite!
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    Everything's going so well

    Jeremy Corbyn faces threat of shadow cabinet resignations

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34940728

    Everything's going so well

    Jeremy Corbyn faces threat of shadow cabinet resignations

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34940728

    It now looks like fixing the labour party is a more difficult task than fixing Syria...

    I probably missed the debate on here, but was that consensus that Dave has a coherent plan beyond bombing because it makes us feel better and will keep the French happy?

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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031

    Everything's going so well

    Jeremy Corbyn faces threat of shadow cabinet resignations

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34940728

    Can I be the first to say ...

    tick tock!
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    PongPong Posts: 4,693
    So, Corbyn's cancelled his trip to Oldham...

    If Dave had any sense, he'd put on his best union Jack underpants and get up there, pronto.

    The last thing he wants is UKIP actually winning.
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    Pong said:

    So, Corbyn's cancelled his trip to Oldham...

    If Dave had any sense, he'd put on his best union Jack underpants and get up there, pronto.

    The last thing he wants is UKIP actually winning.

    I think you are wrong on both counts.
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    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    Gib General Election victory/defeat speeches from the leaders live on GBC right now:
    http://www.gbc.gi/tv/watch-live
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,031
    edited November 2015
    We must always remember the names of Mohammad Sidique Khan, Shehzad Tanweer, Germaine Lindsay and Hasib Hussain, the four young men who died on 7/7.

    They gave their lives so others might die.

    The bastards.
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Tim_B said:

    Probably so, but it has evolved much since then. It is a curious holiday - not a religious one (although it apparently started that way), and you don't do presents. It's mainly a family get together, and is the largest holiday of the year in terms of travel. Think of Abner Doubleday and baseball and you will get an idea how Thanksgiving evolved the way it did.

    Your 'Thanksgiving' started as a 'Harvest Festival'......

    Tim_B said:

    Halloween is religion based, and the US and UK have common religions.

    Thanksgiving is history based (Pilgrims and Indians), and the UK doesn't have that history.

    But you do have a rough equivalent in the 'harvest festival'.

    AndyJS said:

    Interesting how Thanksgiving hasn't caught on at all in the UK, unlike Halloween.

    Tim_B said:

    Happy Thanksgiving.

    They say it's about giving thanks, food, family, and football.

    Surprise, surprise, Yahoo Food has done a poll on it -

    44% will host a Thanksgiving dinner
    24% will go to someone else's house
    44% of millennials will serve ham instead of turkey

    43% say turkey is their favorite part of the meal
    18% stuffing
    7% sweet potato casserole
    7% pie
    7% ham
    7% mashed potatoes
    4% green bean casserole
    3% cranberry sauce

    I have always liked Thanksgiving. Very much a positive festival for family and friends. For some years after returning from the USA my family celebrated it here. Turkey and all.
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    MattWMattW Posts: 18,567
    Worth noting that Mansfield near Selston is now in its fourth continuous term of having an Independent Mayor, though Indies only had the Council for 2 terms.
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    @NicolaSturgeon Though these by elections described as @theSNP holds, Lab won them on first preferences in 2012 - SNP won both on first preferences tonight

    The perils of trying to make sense of single seat by-election under STV.
This discussion has been closed.