politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » LD Newswire survey has Tim Farron heading for 58-42% victory over Norman Lamb for next party leader
The results will be announced on Thursday and given the fact that second class reply envelopes have been used then virtually every party member planning to vote will probably have done so.
Why? What it mostly shows is that Varouakis might be a nice guy and be good on economic theory, but he's exceptionally naive. He doesn't even seem to have understood Greek politics or the government he was a part of, let alone the wider picture.
Still, it's a very interesting article - I agree with @handandmouse that it's a must-read. You don't often get a guileless, child-like account of international negotiations.
The section on "What is the greatest problem with the general way the Eurogroup functions?" is particularly relevant to our renegotiation. It's one of the key issues - the Eurozone needs a more formal structure (if the Greek crisis has proven one thing, it is that), and we need more protection. There's a deal to be done there.
Why? What it mostly shows is that Varouakis might be a nice guy and be good on economic theory, but he's exceptionally naive. He doesn't even seem to have understood Greek politics or the government he was a part of, let alone the wider picture.
Still, it's a very interesting article - I agree with @handandmouse that it's a must-read. You don't often get a guileless, child-like account of international negotiations.
The section on "What is the greatest problem with the general way the Eurogroup functions?" is particularly relevant to our renegotiation. It's one of the key issues - the Eurozone needs a more formal structure (if the Greek crisis has proven one thing, it is that), and we need more protection. There's a deal to be done there.
The breathtaking part of the article is the disgraceful lack of transparency and accountability at the highest level
There is a convention that communiqués must be unanimous, and the President can’t just convene a meeting of the Eurozone and exclude a member state. And he said, “Oh I’m sure I can do that.” So I asked for a legal opinion. It created a bit of a kerfuffle. For about 5-10 minutes the meeting stopped, clerks, officials were talking to one another, on their phone, and eventually some official, some legal expert addressed me, and said the following words, that “Well, the Eurogroup does not exist in law, there is no treaty which has convened this group.”
So what we have is a non-existent group that has the greatest power to determine the lives of Europeans. It’s not answerable to anyone, given it doesn’t exist in law; no minutes are kept; and it’s confidential. So no citizen ever knows what is said within. … These are decisions of almost life and death, and no member has to answer to anybody.
@ScottyNational: Letters: 'Where did Syriza get the idea to promise no austerity within a larger currency union that wants it?' - writes Alex from Gordon
The breathtaking part of the article is the disgraceful lack of transparency and accountability at the highest level
Why? It's no different from any other international meeting.
If you're arguing that the Eurozone should have a formal structure, ruled by strictly-enforecable rules, under direct Eurozone-wide democratic control, with its own bureaucracy and so on, making it more like a federal state, then, yes, that is a view widely held in EU countries. It probably is a precondition for making the Euro work properly, and it's the next logical step of ever-closer union. The trick for us, outside the Eurozone, is to ensure we have protection from it built into the EU treaties.
Labour's David Lammy has surged into second place in the race to become the party’s candidate for London Mayor.
A YouGov poll published today shows that backing among Labour supporters for the Tottenham MP has crept ahead of former shadow justice secretary Sadiq Khan.
Before Mr Lammy’s rise, Tooting MP Mr Khan was the main challenger to frontrunner Tessa Jowell. Her backing from Labour supporters remains solid in the new poll — at 37 per cent — and she has led the race since the series of polls began.
Labour's David Lammy has surged into second place in the race to become the party’s candidate for London Mayor.
A YouGov poll published today shows that backing among Labour supporters for the Tottenham MP has crept ahead of former shadow justice secretary Sadiq Khan.
Before Mr Lammy’s rise, Tooting MP Mr Khan was the main challenger to frontrunner Tessa Jowell. Her backing from Labour supporters remains solid in the new poll — at 37 per cent — and she has led the race since the series of polls began.
Farron looks to have it, though Lamb has gained quite a bit of ground, it was 71/29 in May before hustings, endorsements etc. Probably not enough to see him through, but enough to give him a high profile position.
Guilty, M'Lud (average 38.15). I'd hitherto completely discounted Lammy, and TBH I still do, but it was cheap insurance to cover a fairly whopping red.
Farron looks to have it, though Lamb has gained quite a bit of ground, it was 71/29 in May before hustings, endorsements etc. Probably not enough to see him through, but enough to give him a high profile position.
Guilty, M'Lud (average 38.15). I'd hitherto completely discounted Lammy, and TBH I still do, but it was cheap insurance to cover a fairly whopping red.
I'll need to double check my overall position for mayor, as I've up till this point done it through "traditional" bookies, but after Corbyn, who never discount (realistic) long odds contenders. I still can't get my head round the David Miliband backers on Betfair mind, other than seeing a big green number - really what is the point !
Are you talking about Tim Farron (when will I be famous) or Yanis Varouakis (I owe you nothing)?
Should have known we would have a Bros expert on the site...
My local radio station does 80's playlists on Bank holidays, but none of the DJs were born in the 80's so they pronounce it Brose, not Bross
There's more than one Bros fan on PB
So many of their titles seem appropriate to the Greek debacle: Varoufakis (I Quit); Germany to Greece (Are you mine?); IMF on Greek Debt (Too Much); EZ to Greece (It's A Jungle Out There, Try, Don't Bite the Hand); Greek electorate to Tspiras (Shocked, Shot in the Back)
Farron looks to have it, though Lamb has gained quite a bit of ground, it was 71/29 in May before hustings, endorsements etc. Probably not enough to see him through, but enough to give him a high profile position.
Umm. Given how few LD MPs there are, don't they *all* have to have a high profile position? (Inasmuch as any LD-related thing is high profile anymore)
To an extent! But apart from Nick Clegg only Carmichael has a public profile, and that mostly for the wrong reasons.
I can see that Norman will get on well with Tim, whoever wins, they seemed to have quite a positive relationship at the hustings, much more than the Labour candidates seem to do.
HL: You must have been thinking about a Grexit from day one...
YV: Yes, absolutely.
The obvious next question: "then why have you prepared neither the government nor the people for it?"
HL: ...have preparations been made? YV: The answer is yes and no. We had a small group, a ‘war cabinet’ within the ministry, of about five people that were doing this: so we worked out in theory, on paper, everything that had to be done [to prepare for/in the event of a Grexit]. But it’s one thing to do that at the level of 4-5 people, it’s quite another to prepare the country for it. To prepare the country an executive decision had to be taken, and that decision was never taken.
HL: And in the past week, was that a decision you felt you were leaning towards [preparing for Grexit]? YV: My view was, we should be very careful not to activate it. I didn’t want this to become a self-fulfilling prophecy. I didn’t want this to be like Nietzsche’s famous dictum that if you stare into the abyss long enough, the abyss will stare back at you. But I also believed that at the moment the Eurogroup shut out banks down, we should energise this process.
HL: Right. So there were two options as far as I can see – an immediate Grexit, or printing IOUs and taking bank control of the Bank of Greece [potentially but not necessarily precipitating a Grexit]? YV: Sure, sure. I never believed we should go straight to a new currency. My view was – and I put this to the government – that if they dared shut our banks down, which I considered to be an aggressive move of incredible potency, we should respond aggressively but without crossing the point of no return. We should issue our own IOUs, or even at least announce that we’re going to issue our own euro-denominated liquidity; we should haircut the Greek 2012 bonds that the ECB held, or announce we were going to do it; and we should take control of the Bank of Greece. This was the triptych, the three things, which I thought we should respond with if the ECB shut down our banks. … I was warning the Cabinet this was going to happen [the ECB shut our banks] for a month, in order to drag us into a humiliating agreement. When it happened – and many of my colleagues couldn’t believe it happened – my recommendation for responding “energetically”, let’s say, was voted down.
HL: You must have been thinking about a Grexit from day one...
YV: Yes, absolutely.
The obvious next question: "then why have you prepared neither the government nor the people for it?"
HL: ...have preparations been made? YV: The answer is yes and no. We had a small group, a ‘war cabinet’ within the ministry, of about five people that were doing this: so we worked out in theory, on paper, everything that had to be done [to prepare for/in the event of a Grexit]. But it’s one thing to do that at the level of 4-5 people, it’s quite another to prepare the country for it. To prepare the country an executive decision had to be taken, and that decision was never taken.
HL: And in the past week, was that a decision you felt you were leaning towards [preparing for Grexit]? YV: My view was, we should be very careful not to activate it. I didn’t want this to become a self-fulfilling prophecy. I didn’t want this to be like Nietzsche’s famous dictum that if you stare into the abyss long enough, the abyss will stare back at you. But I also believed that at the moment the Eurogroup shut out banks down, we should energise this process.
HL: Right. So there were two options as far as I can see – an immediate Grexit, or printing IOUs and taking bank control of the Bank of Greece [potentially but not necessarily precipitating a Grexit]? YV: Sure, sure. I never believed we should go straight to a new currency. My view was – and I put this to the government – that if they dared shut our banks down, which I considered to be an aggressive move of incredible potency, we should respond aggressively but without crossing the point of no return. We should issue our own IOUs, or even at least announce that we’re going to issue our own euro-denominated liquidity; we should haircut the Greek 2012 bonds that the ECB held, or announce we were going to do it; and we should take control of the Bank of Greece. This was the triptych, the three things, which I thought we should respond with if the ECB shut down our banks. … I was warning the Cabinet this was going to happen [the ECB shut our banks] for a month, in order to drag us into a humiliating agreement. When it happened – and many of my colleagues couldn’t believe it happened – my recommendation for responding “energetically”, let’s say, was voted down.
Corbyn becomes Labour leader, Kendall defects to the Tories, she then becomes Tory leader when Dave steps down...
I don't think so. She would sit tight for Corbyns defenestration, though if the LDs make a strong recovery and Corbyn intolerable then a breakaway SDP Mk2 is not impossible.
The problem was that the Greek banks were insolvent. He wanted the ECB to continue to fund insolvent banks indefinitely - something that was clearly not possible.
Why Greece didn't leave the Eurozone in January with solvent banks, and negotiate debt relief from a position of strength is one of those questions that will be asked for decades.
One thing I think harmed Greece from day one was that their negotiator was a game theory expert. I think it led everyone else to question his every move, and assume everything was planned as part of some game theory exercise. When, in fact, it was not.
The second issue was that the Greek government underestimated the effect of their negotiations on the Greek economy. The problem was that the threat of Grexit caused people to withdraw capital from the country, meaning that the Greek negotiating team was - with every day that passed - negotiating from a weaker, and weaker position.
The problem was that the Greek banks were insolvent. He wanted the ECB to continue to fund insolvent banks indefinitely - something that was clearly not possible.
Why Greece didn't leave the Eurozone in January with solvent banks, and negotiate debt relief from a position of strength is one of those questions that will be asked for decades.
One thing I think harmed Greece from day one was that their negotiator was a game theory expert. I think it led everyone else to question his every move, and assume everything was planned as part of some game theory exercise. When, in fact, it was not.
The second issue was that the Greek government underestimated the effect of their negotiations on the Greek economy. The problem was that the threat of Grexit caused people to withdraw capital from the country, meaning that the Greek negotiating team was - with every day that passed - negotiating from a weaker, and weaker position.
Let's not forget the fundamental Greek miscalculation: they thought that the EU would do a deal at any price, whereas in fact 14 of the 18 other EZ countries were in the 'do a deal, but not at any price' camp, and perhaps most importantly, that was not Germany's starting bid but its maximum price.
@rcs1000 Whoa! Hold your horses here! :-) I'm just reporting the relevant bits of YV's interview back to Mr Fox - don't assume that I agree or disagree with YV or Syriza.
The only thing that I would say on the Greek crisis (and here you can shoot me down if you disagree with me) is that I think the best thing for Greece would have been to leave the Euro in a managed fashion with the help of the IMF years ago, when it became clear that the EU plan wasn't working.
There is no doubt that the illegal Greek capital controls will have caused a lot of people in Greece a lot of quantifiable economic loss. There is also no doubt that, as EU law currently stands, those who have been caused loss by the Greek government's actions have a right to recover compensation. There is also little doubt that none of those persons will ever recover a euro cent from the Greek government should they chose to sue it. It does make one wonder why we regularly pay out millions of pounds in damages to claimants for breaches of EU law when we act in good faith and on the best legal advice. What is the point of being part of a club when you are the only one who obeys the rules?
@rcs1000 Whoa! Hold your horses here! :-) I'm just reporting the relevant bits of YV's interview back to Mr Fox - don't assume that I agree or disagree with YV or Syriza. when it became clear that the EU plan wasn't working.
The structural reforms, meant that in the long term the EU plan would have worked. However, since the Greek people did not want to implement them and face the pain (possibly a perfectly reasonable preference) then as you say an early managed exit from the Euro would have been best.
Why? What it mostly shows is that Varouakis might be a nice guy and be good on economic theory, but he's exceptionally naive. He doesn't even seem to have understood Greek politics or the government he was a part of, let alone the wider picture.
Still, it's a very interesting article - I agree with @handandmouse that it's a must-read. You don't often get a guileless, child-like account of international negotiations.
The section on "What is the greatest problem with the general way the Eurogroup functions?" is particularly relevant to our renegotiation. It's one of the key issues - the Eurozone needs a more formal structure (if the Greek crisis has proven one thing, it is that), and we need more protection. There's a deal to be done there.
Mainly where he says nobody cares about the economics - only about the optics and process.
Quick question - When full capital withdrawal is allowed from Greek banks, will there be a full on run ?
Yes, and then some! Which is why the controls will remain in place for quite a while yet (probably months), no matter what 'deal' is cooked up in the coming days.
"His diagnosis will also increase the focus on Armstrong's arrival in France next week to ride two stages of the Tour with ex-England footballer Geoff Thomas - a day ahead of the race - to raise money for a cancer charity."
WTF...I have a lot of time for Geoff Thomas and all the good work he does, but why is he hitching his ride to Armstrong.
Great interview, the sort of frankness you usually only get in memoirs years after the event. But he does sound a bit like an academic accidentally parachuted into political wheeler-dealing.
New Democracy, PASOK and Potami will likely be voting for the deal. That looks like enough to ensure it passes, even if the Coalition of the Radical Left fractures into sects of schismatics in the process.
Corbyn becomes Labour leader, Kendall defects to the Tories, she then becomes Tory leader when Dave steps down...
I don't think so. She would sit tight for Corbyns defenestration, though if the LDs make a strong recovery and Corbyn intolerable then a breakaway SDP Mk2 is not impossible.
If Corbyn becomes leader, there's no longer any point in anyone vaguely sensible - such as me, of course :-) - bothering with Labour anymore.
@rcs1000 Whoa! Hold your horses here! :-) I'm just reporting the relevant bits of YV's interview back to Mr Fox - don't assume that I agree or disagree with YV or Syriza. when it became clear that the EU plan wasn't working.
The structural reforms, meant that in the long term the EU plan would have worked. However, since the Greek people did not want to implement them and face the pain (possibly a perfectly reasonable preference) then as you say an early managed exit from the Euro would have been best.
No they didn't, it was forecast that Greece would run out of money by 2030 under the terms of the initial agreement.
New Democracy, PASOK and Potami will likely be voting for the deal. That looks like enough to ensure it passes, even if the Coalition of the Radical Left fractures into sects of schismatics in the process.
I think you are right - that post must refer to the stability of the government rather than the deal itself.
Why? What it mostly shows is that Varouakis might be a nice guy and be good on economic theory, but he's exceptionally naive. He doesn't even seem to have understood Greek politics or the government he was a part of, let alone the wider picture.
Still, it's a very interesting article - I agree with @handandmouse that it's a must-read. You don't often get a guileless, child-like account of international negotiations.
The section on "What is the greatest problem with the general way the Eurogroup functions?" is particularly relevant to our renegotiation. It's one of the key issues - the Eurozone needs a more formal structure (if the Greek crisis has proven one thing, it is that), and we need more protection. There's a deal to be done there.
Mainly where he says nobody cares about the economics - only about the optics and process.
Madness writ large.
It may just be that they did not care for a lecture in marxist economics by Varoufakis!
There is no doubt that the illegal Greek capital controls will have caused a lot of people in Greece a lot of quantifiable economic loss. There is also no doubt that, as EU law currently stands, those who have been caused loss by the Greek government's actions have a right to recover compensation. There is also little doubt that none of those persons will ever recover a euro cent from the Greek government should they chose to sue it. It does make one wonder why we regularly pay out millions of pounds in damages to claimants for breaches of EU law when we act in good faith and on the best legal advice. What is the point of being part of a club when you are the only one who obeys the rules?
But hang on: if the ECB had cut off funding to Greek banks, as they were insolvent, then it would have had the effect of a disorganised and indiscriminate capital controls.
There is no right answer. Only degrees of wrong ones.
Corbyn becomes Labour leader, Kendall defects to the Tories, she then becomes Tory leader when Dave steps down...
I don't think so. She would sit tight for Corbyns defenestration, though if the LDs make a strong recovery and Corbyn intolerable then a breakaway SDP Mk2 is not impossible.
If Corbyn becomes leader, there's no longer any point in anyone vaguely sensible - such as me, of course :-) - bothering with Labour anymore.
Wouldn't you say there is no labour candidate worthy of leading the party? I can't think of one
It's best they start again from scratch, they represent no one and have no charisma or star quality to hide that
Quick question - When full capital withdrawal is allowed from Greek banks, will there be a full on run ?
Yes, and then some! Which is why the controls will remain in place for quite a while yet (probably months), no matter what 'deal' is cooked up in the coming days.
I think that's absolutely right. It will be Cyprus, mark two.
@tnewtondunn: Harman about to go on TV to wobble on her backing for child tax credits limit. Her 24 hours shows what a grim job next Labour leader has.
That Varoufakis transcript is stunning. When the EU says things like this, how can there be any national sovereignty or democracy?
“No, no, no, this has to be a comprehensive review. Nothing will be implemented if you dare introduce any legislation. It will be considered unilateral action inimical to the process of reaching an agreement.”
There is no doubt that the illegal Greek capital controls will have caused a lot of people in Greece a lot of quantifiable economic loss. There is also no doubt that, as EU law currently stands, those who have been caused loss by the Greek government's actions have a right to recover compensation. There is also little doubt that none of those persons will ever recover a euro cent from the Greek government should they chose to sue it. It does make one wonder why we regularly pay out millions of pounds in damages to claimants for breaches of EU law when we act in good faith and on the best legal advice. What is the point of being part of a club when you are the only one who obeys the rules?
"Harman about to go on TV to wobble on her backing for child tax credits limit."
A pointless exercise. She either believes what she said and sticks to it - splitter, splitter, splitter. Or she was lying yesterday - liar, liar, pants on fire.
Corbyn becomes Labour leader, Kendall defects to the Tories, she then becomes Tory leader when Dave steps down...
I don't think so. She would sit tight for Corbyns defenestration, though if the LDs make a strong recovery and Corbyn intolerable then a breakaway SDP Mk2 is not impossible.
If Corbyn becomes leader, there's no longer any point in anyone vaguely sensible - such as me, of course :-) - bothering with Labour anymore.
He won't win but could well be second and even that sends a pretty dire message to those remaining small towns which might otherwise flirt with Labour. The inner cities will however remain strong...and isolated.
@tnewtondunn: Harman about to go on TV to wobble on her backing for child tax credits limit. Her 24 hours shows what a grim job next Labour leader has.
I think I read that the PLP although reduced in number may have a higher proportion of left-wingers and union hacks - thanks again Ed and Len.
That Varoufakis transcript is stunning. When the EU says things like this, how can there be any national sovereignty or democracy?
“No, no, no, this has to be a comprehensive review. Nothing will be implemented if you dare introduce any legislation. It will be considered unilateral action inimical to the process of reaching an agreement.”
It was Syriza/Varoufakis who wanted to reopen negotiations in the first place so I think that that, while not painting the Eurogroup in a good light, is taken out of the context of the course of the discussions.
Off topic: US Presidentials primaries. For those betting on the primaries and the election, here is an interesting piece from Douglas E Schoen, a top Democratic campaign adviser. So even though he is a commentator for Fox, he is not a rabid right-winger. He posits that it is possible that Clinton could lose Iowa and New Hampshire, or not win well enough, and open up the door for a new candidate (Warren) to enter a la Bobby Kennedy after the early results are in:
That Varoufakis transcript is stunning. When the EU says things like this, how can there be any national sovereignty or democracy?
“No, no, no, this has to be a comprehensive review. Nothing will be implemented if you dare introduce any legislation. It will be considered unilateral action inimical to the process of reaching an agreement.”
It was Syriza/Varoufakis who wanted to reopen negotiations in the first place so I think that that, while not painting the Eurogroup in a good light, is taken out of the context of the course of the discussions.
It's not taken out of context at all. Yes, SYRIZA re-opened negotiations because the previous deal was unworkable, as even the IMF have admitted. The EU agreed to those renegotiations. And then they proved utterly unwilling to actually negotiate.
"Schäuble was consistent throughout. His view was “I’m not discussing the programme – this was accepted by the previous government and we can’t possibly allow an election to change anything. Because we have elections all the time, there are 19 of us, if every time there was an election and something changed, the contracts between us wouldn’t mean anything.”
So at that point I had to get up and say “Well perhaps we should simply not hold elections anymore for indebted countries”, and there was no answer. The only interpretation I can give [of their view] is “Yes, that would be a good idea, but it would be difficult to do. So you either sign on the dotted line or you are out.”
That Varoufakis transcript is stunning. When the EU says things like this, how can there be any national sovereignty or democracy?
To be fair, which delinquent debtor ever says they were well treated by their lenders? listen to them and the lender is always a callous villain.
Except Varoufakis seems to be exceptionally honest rather than having an axe to grind. He was asked about Merkel, and he could have painted her as the wicked witch of the West. But instead he just said his honest view: that he never interacted with her as finance ministers don't speak to prime ministers.
@garypepworth: The trouble with Burnham & Cooper being so ready to dump on their leader in public is that they can't complain when the same happens to them
@schofieldkevin: Senior Labour source on child tax credit row: "There's no point saying you'll take difficult decisions then not taking difficult decisions."
Corbyn becomes Labour leader, Kendall defects to the Tories, she then becomes Tory leader when Dave steps down...
I don't think so. She would sit tight for Corbyns defenestration, though if the LDs make a strong recovery and Corbyn intolerable then a breakaway SDP Mk2 is not impossible.
If Corbyn becomes leader, there's no longer any point in anyone vaguely sensible - such as me, of course :-) - bothering with Labour anymore.
JC has a definite lead from those who have expressed a preference with my Facebook contacts.
I knew I had a vast number of lefty air headed friends on facebook, but it is interesting how many intelligent well meaning educated late middle aged prosperous people are expressing support for him.
Ultimately Greece wasn't prepared to countenance leaving the Eurozone, and Germany (Schauble in particular) was. He called their bluff. If they'd have been prepared to leave, they may have been able to get a better deal... or left. But they were bluffing, Germany rightly called them out.
Corbyn becomes Labour leader, Kendall defects to the Tories, she then becomes Tory leader when Dave steps down...
I don't think so. She would sit tight for Corbyns defenestration, though if the LDs make a strong recovery and Corbyn intolerable then a breakaway SDP Mk2 is not impossible.
If Corbyn becomes leader, there's no longer any point in anyone vaguely sensible - such as me, of course :-) - bothering with Labour anymore.
JC has a definite lead from those who have expressed a preference with my Facebook contacts.
I knew I had a vast number of lefty air headed friends on facebook, but it is interesting how many intelligent well meaning educated late middle aged prosperous people are expressing support for him.
That was what I was taught to expect in my lifetime when I was at primary school in the 1960s ... I have since learnt to take such predictions on advisement ...
@garypepworth: The trouble with Burnham & Cooper being so ready to dump on their leader in public is that they can't complain when the same happens to them
@schofieldkevin: Senior Labour source on child tax credit row: "There's no point saying you'll take difficult decisions then not taking difficult decisions."
Actually I think Burnham & Cooper have a point. Irrespective of whether Harriet is right or wrong, surely as an interim leader she shouldn't be taking any positions on Labour's direction and policy positioning? It's only a few before the new leader is in place.
That Varoufakis transcript is stunning. When the EU says things like this, how can there be any national sovereignty or democracy?
“No, no, no, this has to be a comprehensive review. Nothing will be implemented if you dare introduce any legislation. It will be considered unilateral action inimical to the process of reaching an agreement.”
Of course there is no need whatsoever to doubt the 100% accuracy of the Varoufakis recollections. None at all. Honesty and integrity are his middle names - after all he is a communist.
@garypepworth: The trouble with Burnham & Cooper being so ready to dump on their leader in public is that they can't complain when the same happens to them
@schofieldkevin: Senior Labour source on child tax credit row: "There's no point saying you'll take difficult decisions then not taking difficult decisions."
Actually I think Burnham & Cooper have a point. Irrespective of whether Harriet is right or wrong, surely as an interim leader she shouldn't be taking any positions on Labour's direction and policy positioning? It's only a few before the new leader is in place.
Actually I think Burnham & Cooper have a point. Irrespective of whether Harriet is right or wrong, surely as an interim leader she shouldn't be taking any positions on Labour's direction and policy positioning? It's only a few before the new leader is in place.
Except there's a vote.
"Our official policy is that we have no official policy until after the leader is elected so we will vote for/against/abstain after 3 rounds of rock/paper/scissors/lizard/spock..."
And what is the value of an interim leader if they can't actually do any leading?
Corbyn becomes Labour leader, Kendall defects to the Tories, she then becomes Tory leader when Dave steps down...
I don't think so. She would sit tight for Corbyns defenestration, though if the LDs make a strong recovery and Corbyn intolerable then a breakaway SDP Mk2 is not impossible.
If Corbyn becomes leader, there's no longer any point in anyone vaguely sensible - such as me, of course :-) - bothering with Labour anymore.
JC has a definite lead from those who have expressed a preference with my Facebook contacts.
I knew I had a vast number of lefty air headed friends on facebook, but it is interesting how many intelligent well meaning educated late middle aged prosperous people are expressing support for him.
My Facebook ex-teacher colleagues are much the same - you'd need more than all the salt in the Dead sea to rely on them being representative though. Facebook and twitter are two sides of the same coin in this respect. It's refreshing to note how much the guardianistas believe in them though.
Corbyn becomes Labour leader, Kendall defects to the Tories, she then becomes Tory leader when Dave steps down...
I don't think so. She would sit tight for Corbyns defenestration, though if the LDs make a strong recovery and Corbyn intolerable then a breakaway SDP Mk2 is not impossible.
If Farron becomes LD leader he is arguably leftwing of Burnham and Cooper let alone Kendall. He is right of Corbyn, but not by much!
@schofieldkevin: Harriet Harman also sticking to her guns on child tax credit - Labour MPs will be whipped to abstain on welfare bill next week, not block it
Comments
http://www.bristolpost.co.uk/Mini-driver-smashes-fish-van-pleasuring-sex-toy/story-26891651-detail/story.html
This interview with Yanis Varoufakis contains some astonishing revelations from behind the scenes of the Greek negotiations. A must-read...
http://www.newstatesman.com/world-affairs/2015/07/yanis-varoufakis-full-transcript-our-battle-save-greece
Still, it's a very interesting article - I agree with @handandmouse that it's a must-read. You don't often get a guileless, child-like account of international negotiations.
The section on "What is the greatest problem with the general way the Eurogroup functions?" is particularly relevant to our renegotiation. It's one of the key issues - the Eurozone needs a more formal structure (if the Greek crisis has proven one thing, it is that), and we need more protection. There's a deal to be done there.
If you're arguing that the Eurozone should have a formal structure, ruled by strictly-enforecable rules, under direct Eurozone-wide democratic control, with its own bureaucracy and so on, making it more like a federal state, then, yes, that is a view widely held in EU countries. It probably is a precondition for making the Euro work properly, and it's the next logical step of ever-closer union. The trick for us, outside the Eurozone, is to ensure we have protection from it built into the EU treaties.
Labour's David Lammy has surged into second place in the race to become the party’s candidate for London Mayor.
A YouGov poll published today shows that backing among Labour supporters for the Tottenham MP has crept ahead of former shadow justice secretary Sadiq Khan.
Before Mr Lammy’s rise, Tooting MP Mr Khan was the main challenger to frontrunner Tessa Jowell. Her backing from Labour supporters remains solid in the new poll — at 37 per cent — and she has led the race since the series of polls began.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/mayor/lammy-leaps-to-second-place-in-labours-mayoral-candidate-race-10384863.html
Or do I need a visit to specsavers ?
My local radio station does 80's playlists on Bank holidays, but none of the DJs were born in the 80's so they pronounce it Brose, not Bross
http://www.libdemvoice.org/who-lib-dem-voice-members-think-should-be-the-next-leader-46010.html
I'm not backing Abbott at any price though ;p
I can see that Norman will get on well with Tim, whoever wins, they seemed to have quite a positive relationship at the hustings, much more than the Labour candidates seem to do.
HL: You must have been thinking about a Grexit from day one...
YV: Yes, absolutely.
YV: The answer is yes and no. We had a small group, a ‘war cabinet’ within the ministry, of about five people that were doing this: so we worked out in theory, on paper, everything that had to be done [to prepare for/in the event of a Grexit]. But it’s one thing to do that at the level of 4-5 people, it’s quite another to prepare the country for it. To prepare the country an executive decision had to be taken, and that decision was never taken.
HL: And in the past week, was that a decision you felt you were leaning towards [preparing for Grexit]?
YV: My view was, we should be very careful not to activate it. I didn’t want this to become a self-fulfilling prophecy. I didn’t want this to be like Nietzsche’s famous dictum that if you stare into the abyss long enough, the abyss will stare back at you. But I also believed that at the moment the Eurogroup shut out banks down, we should energise this process.
HL: Right. So there were two options as far as I can see – an immediate Grexit, or printing IOUs and taking bank control of the Bank of Greece [potentially but not necessarily precipitating a Grexit]?
YV: Sure, sure. I never believed we should go straight to a new currency. My view was – and I put this to the government – that if they dared shut our banks down, which I considered to be an aggressive move of incredible potency, we should respond aggressively but without crossing the point of no return.
We should issue our own IOUs, or even at least announce that we’re going to issue our own euro-denominated liquidity; we should haircut the Greek 2012 bonds that the ECB held, or announce we were going to do it; and we should take control of the Bank of Greece. This was the triptych, the three things, which I thought we should respond with if the ECB shut down our banks.
… I was warning the Cabinet this was going to happen [the ECB shut our banks] for a month, in order to drag us into a humiliating agreement. When it happened – and many of my colleagues couldn’t believe it happened – my recommendation for responding “energetically”, let’s say, was voted down.
This from last year
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2674736/ISIS-militants-declare-formation-caliphate-Syria-Iraq-demand-Muslims-world-swear-allegiance.html
The problem was that the Greek banks were insolvent. He wanted the ECB to continue to fund insolvent banks indefinitely - something that was clearly not possible.
Why Greece didn't leave the Eurozone in January with solvent banks, and negotiate debt relief from a position of strength is one of those questions that will be asked for decades.
One thing I think harmed Greece from day one was that their negotiator was a game theory expert. I think it led everyone else to question his every move, and assume everything was planned as part of some game theory exercise. When, in fact, it was not.
The second issue was that the Greek government underestimated the effect of their negotiations on the Greek economy. The problem was that the threat of Grexit caused people to withdraw capital from the country, meaning that the Greek negotiating team was - with every day that passed - negotiating from a weaker, and weaker position.
Yes: 9.4 / 9.8
No: 1.11 / 1.12
https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/#/politics/market/1.117087478
Maybe the progressives will be spurred into action against ISIS when they see women workers exploited by being paid less than the living wage?
https://twitter.com/mailonline/status/620598760847077376
Whoa! Hold your horses here! :-)
I'm just reporting the relevant bits of YV's interview back to Mr Fox - don't assume that I agree or disagree with YV or Syriza.
The only thing that I would say on the Greek crisis (and here you can shoot me down if you disagree with me) is that I think the best thing for Greece would have been to leave the Euro in a managed fashion with the help of the IMF years ago, when it became clear that the EU plan wasn't working.
See post at 15.26:
http://www.theguardian.com/business/live/2015/jul/13/greek-crisis-tsipras-battle-bailout-deal-backlash-live
The structural reforms, meant that in the long term the EU plan would have worked. However, since the Greek people did not want to implement them and face the pain (possibly a perfectly reasonable preference) then as you say an early managed exit from the Euro would have been best.
Madness writ large.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3159037/Teenage-rape-victim-used-bait-bid-lure-attackers-raped-bungling-Indian-police-failed-follow-meeting-point.html
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cycling/33509974
Another drugs cheat gets testicular cancer.
Also...
"His diagnosis will also increase the focus on Armstrong's arrival in France next week to ride two stages of the Tour with ex-England footballer Geoff Thomas - a day ahead of the race - to raise money for a cancer charity."
WTF...I have a lot of time for Geoff Thomas and all the good work he does, but why is he hitching his ride to Armstrong.
I see that we have nesting back.
There is no right answer. Only degrees of wrong ones.
It's best they start again from scratch, they represent no one and have no charisma or star quality to hide that
“No, no, no, this has to be a comprehensive review. Nothing will be implemented if you dare introduce any legislation. It will be considered unilateral action inimical to the process of reaching an agreement.”
"Harman about to go on TV to wobble on her backing for child tax credits limit."
A pointless exercise. She either believes what she said and sticks to it - splitter, splitter, splitter. Or she was lying yesterday - liar, liar, pants on fire.
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2015/07/09/potentially-mortal-threat-to-hillary-s-candidacy.html
To be fair, which delinquent debtor ever says they were well treated by their lenders? listen to them and the lender is always a callous villain.
"Schäuble was consistent throughout. His view was “I’m not discussing the programme – this was accepted by the previous government and we can’t possibly allow an election to change anything. Because we have elections all the time, there are 19 of us, if every time there was an election and something changed, the contracts between us wouldn’t mean anything.”
So at that point I had to get up and say “Well perhaps we should simply not hold elections anymore for indebted countries”, and there was no answer. The only interpretation I can give [of their view] is “Yes, that would be a good idea, but it would be difficult to do. So you either sign on the dotted line or you are out.”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/labour/11735544/labour-in-crisis-over-welfare-cuts-live.html
http://mobile.news.com.au/technology/environment/earth-heading-for-mini-ice-age-within-15-years/story-e6frflp0-1227439329592
@schofieldkevin: Senior Labour source on child tax credit row: "There's no point saying you'll take difficult decisions then not taking difficult decisions."
I knew I had a vast number of lefty air headed friends on facebook, but it is interesting how many intelligent well meaning educated late middle aged prosperous people are expressing support for him.
[kicks EU messenger down the well!]
If they'd have been prepared to leave, they may have been able to get a better deal... or left. But they were bluffing, Germany rightly called them out.
mathematician predicts sun to go quiet for ten years from 2030
But new "Maunder Minimum" stories are not exactly new...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/06/14/ice_age/
"Our official policy is that we have no official policy until after the leader is elected so we will vote for/against/abstain after 3 rounds of rock/paper/scissors/lizard/spock..."
And what is the value of an interim leader if they can't actually do any leading?