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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » It looks as though we’ll get an IndyRef poll from the firm that got the AV referendum right to within a fraction of a percent

Massive polling weekend to come from @ICMResearch in advance of defining week for British constitution. Maybe even something on #indyref

Read the full story here

Alistair

Big wodge of cash (8 grand plus), has appeared at 2/1 on Betfair for a Yes vote.

[Deleted User]

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

Neil

They described their last poll as their penultimate one for Scotland on Sunday so it shouldnt be a surprise? I cant see why they'd suddenly change their methodology now though.

Neil

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

I think 'yes' 55%+ would be very bad for Shadsy!

TheScreamingEagles

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

No, a very narrow Yes, and Salmond unable to deliver on the promises he made

rcs1000

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

Worse result for who?

TheScreamingEagles

What do we want? We want a phone poll from ICM.

When do we want it? Now

Scrapheap_as_was

Bread actor to toast Carswell?

Bring it on...

TheScreamingEagles

Actually I want a Florida 2000/Winchester 1997 style result.

Think of the court cases.

And the argument over which court has the final say.

TheScreamingEagles

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Bread actor to toast Carswell?

Bring it on...

Which Bread actor?

Please say Lilo Lil, she is a tart.

rcs1000

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/international/americans-warn-scotland-about-hope-change-bullshit-2014091090404

CarlottaVance

FPT;

SeanT said:

Plato said:

The petrol station near me has put up signs saying they won't accept Scottish notes. A small but significant little message to visiting tourists.

I've just been chatting to a friend who said that the Saltire lifted above Number 10 fell down in true Omen style - is this true? He was laughing so much that I couldn't tell if he was pulling my leg.

Scott_P said:

@cathynewman: My Scottish £20 note got rejected at City Airport on landing from Edinburgh. Might as well have returned from a foreign country #indyref

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT I PREDICTED A WEEK AGO.

Scottish £ notes will become worthless in England as of September 19, if it is a YES. People will not take them, unless on pain of prison. Cabs and small shops and other small enterprises will simply refuse

We live with this in the Channel Islands where UK and Channel Island notes are interchangeable, but Channel Island notes are not accepted in the UK - so we have two sets of ATMs marked clearly "Local Notes" and "UK Notes". Taxis dropping you at the airport routinely ask if you want your change "local or UK".

Scrapheap_as_was

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Bread actor to toast Carswell?

Bring it on...

Which Bread actor?

Please say Lilo Lil, she is a tart.

Sadly no...he appealed to a higher authority and was a Proddy I believe...

rcs1000

CarlottaVance said:

FPT;

SeanT said:

Plato said:

The petrol station near me has put up signs saying they won't accept Scottish notes. A small but significant little message to visiting tourists.

I've just been chatting to a friend who said that the Saltire lifted above Number 10 fell down in true Omen style - is this true? He was laughing so much that I couldn't tell if he was pulling my leg.

Scott_P said:

@cathynewman: My Scottish £20 note got rejected at City Airport on landing from Edinburgh. Might as well have returned from a foreign country #indyref

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT I PREDICTED A WEEK AGO.

Scottish £ notes will become worthless in England as of September 19, if it is a YES. People will not take them, unless on pain of prison. Cabs and small shops and other small enterprises will simply refuse

We live with this in the Channel Islands where UK and Channel Island notes are interchangeable, but Channel Island notes are not accepted in the UK - so we have two sets of ATMs marked clearly "Local Notes" and "UK Notes". Taxis dropping you at the airport routinely ask if you want your change "local or UK".

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

TheWatcher

rcs1000 said:

CarlottaVance said:

FPT;

SeanT said:

Plato said:

The petrol station near me has put up signs saying they won't accept Scottish notes. A small but significant little message to visiting tourists.

I've just been chatting to a friend who said that the Saltire lifted above Number 10 fell down in true Omen style - is this true? He was laughing so much that I couldn't tell if he was pulling my leg.

Scott_P said:

@cathynewman: My Scottish £20 note got rejected at City Airport on landing from Edinburgh. Might as well have returned from a foreign country #indyref

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT I PREDICTED A WEEK AGO.

Scottish £ notes will become worthless in England as of September 19, if it is a YES. People will not take them, unless on pain of prison. Cabs and small shops and other small enterprises will simply refuse

We live with this in the Channel Islands where UK and Channel Island notes are interchangeable, but Channel Island notes are not accepted in the UK - so we have two sets of ATMs marked clearly "Local Notes" and "UK Notes". Taxis dropping you at the airport routinely ask if you want your change "local or UK".

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

What's wrong with Andrex?

TheScreamingEagles

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Bread actor to toast Carswell?

Bring it on...

Which Bread actor?

Please say Lilo Lil, she is a tart.

Sadly no...he appealed to a higher authority and was a Proddy I believe...

The Proddy Vicar? Nearly as good

The great thing about that show was, Freddie Boswell looked like Liverpool's owner, David Moores

David Moores here http://static.bbc.co.uk/programmeimages/608xn/images/p024bzxv.jpg

Freddie Boswell here http://theoriginalwinger.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/David-Moores.jpg

eek

TheScreamingEagles said:

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

No, a very narrow Yes, and Salmond unable to deliver on the promises he made

Why? While it would be a very bad result for Scotland (regardless of the fact Salmond will be unable to deliver his promises with 50.01% or 99.99% of the vote) it wouldn't be the worst result for the rUK.

A narrow No vote, additional devolution given to Scotland and No answer to the West Lothian question would be a far, far worse result for rUK...

Life_ina_market_town

TheScreamingEagles said:

And the argument over which court has the final say.

The law is clear, and is set out in section 34 of the Scottish Independence Referendum Act 2013, 2013 asp 14. A challenge to a certification by a counting officer or chief counting officer must be brought within six weeks of the certification. The challenge must be brought by way of a petition for judicial review. The Court of Session has the power to reduce a certificate. As the Courts Reform (Scotland) Bill has yet to pass stage 3 in the Scottish Parliament, the permission of the Court of Session is not required to bring such a petition before the Outer House. A reclaiming motion may be made to the Inner House from any decision of the Outer House. An appeal lies as of right from the Outer House to the Supreme Court, and an appellant does requires not require permission to bring such an appeal, only the signature of two members of the Faculty of Advocates.

Scrapheap_as_was

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Bread actor to toast Carswell?

Bring it on...

Which Bread actor?

Please say Lilo Lil, she is a tart.

Sadly no...he appealed to a higher authority and was a Proddy I believe...

The Proddy Vicar? Nearly as good

The great thing about that show was, Freddie Boswell looked like Liverpool's owner, David Moores

David Moores here http://static.bbc.co.uk/programmeimages/608xn/images/p024bzxv.jpg

Freddie Boswell here http://theoriginalwinger.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/David-Moores.jpg

Correct.

You seen Spurs are going to play a season away from the Lane - looking to share a ground....

Stuart_Dickson

Neil said:

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

I think 'yes' 55%+ would be very bad for Shadsy!

Indeed.

Hope he's brushed up his CV.

Plato

Yup. Only an AV style result for No would be enough to temporarily shut the Nats up.

As there's no chance of that now, I'd rather a narrow Yes win - and hoist Salmond on his own petard.

eek said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

No, a very narrow Yes, and Salmond unable to deliver on the promises he made

Why? While it would be a very bad result for Scotland (regardless of the fact Salmond will be unable to deliver his promises with 50.01% or 99.99% of the vote) it wouldn't be the worst result for the rUK.

A narrow No vote, additional devolution given to Scotland and No answer to the West Lothian question would be a far, far worse result for rUK...

Lennon

rcs1000 said:

CarlottaVance said:

FPT;

SeanT said:

Plato said:

The petrol station near me has put up signs saying they won't accept Scottish notes. A small but significant little message to visiting tourists.

I've just been chatting to a friend who said that the Saltire lifted above Number 10 fell down in true Omen style - is this true? He was laughing so much that I couldn't tell if he was pulling my leg.

Scott_P said:

@cathynewman: My Scottish £20 note got rejected at City Airport on landing from Edinburgh. Might as well have returned from a foreign country #indyref

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT I PREDICTED A WEEK AGO.

Scottish £ notes will become worthless in England as of September 19, if it is a YES. People will not take them, unless on pain of prison. Cabs and small shops and other small enterprises will simply refuse

We live with this in the Channel Islands where UK and Channel Island notes are interchangeable, but Channel Island notes are not accepted in the UK - so we have two sets of ATMs marked clearly "Local Notes" and "UK Notes". Taxis dropping you at the airport routinely ask if you want your change "local or UK".

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

I'll pay 98p in the pound, but delivery has to be to me (outside the Bank of England) :-)

TheScreamingEagles

eek said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

No, a very narrow Yes, and Salmond unable to deliver on the promises he made

Why? While it would be a very bad result for Scotland (regardless of the fact Salmond will be unable to deliver his promises with 50.01% or 99.99% of the vote) it wouldn't be the worst result for the rUK.

A narrow No vote, additional devolution given to Scotland and No answer to the West Lothian question would be a far, far worse result for rUK...

My scenario would lead to

1) Currency and capital flight

2) Prolonged legal action in the courts, I voted for Yes because Alex Salmond we would get x, y and z, we haven't, we need a new referendum

3) We'd suffer economic instability in the interregnum whilst 2) was ongoing.

Beverley_C

TheWatcher said:

rcs1000 said:

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

What's wrong with Andrex?

Possibly Andrex is more valuable. Softer too....

Theuniondivvie

Malcolm Tucker ‏@Tucker5law 25 mins
That @patrickharvie is far too fucking good. Why am I saddled with a team that stammer more than porky pig in a bacon factory? #indyref

TheWatcher

Stuart_Dickson said:

Neil said:

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

I think 'yes' 55%+ would be very bad for Shadsy!

Indeed.

Hope he's brushed up his CV.

Perhaps he could be Finance Minister in an independent Scotland?

rcs1000

SeanT said:

rcs1000 said:

CarlottaVance said:

FPT;

SeanT said:

Plato said:

The petrol station near me has put up signs saying they won't accept Scottish notes. A small but significant little message to visiting tourists.

I've just been chatting to a friend who said that the Saltire lifted above Number 10 fell down in true Omen style - is this true? He was laughing so much that I couldn't tell if he was pulling my leg.

Scott_P said:

@cathynewman: My Scottish £20 note got rejected at City Airport on landing from Edinburgh. Might as well have returned from a foreign country #indyref

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT I PREDICTED A WEEK AGO.

Scottish £ notes will become worthless in England as of September 19, if it is a YES. People will not take them, unless on pain of prison. Cabs and small shops and other small enterprises will simply refuse

We live with this in the Channel Islands where UK and Channel Island notes are interchangeable, but Channel Island notes are not accepted in the UK - so we have two sets of ATMs marked clearly "Local Notes" and "UK Notes". Taxis dropping you at the airport routinely ask if you want your change "local or UK".

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

Generous. I expect a Scottish £ to be worth, in effect, about 85p during the "smooth transitional period".

Yeah: but - for millionth time - the Scottish banks are required to deposit with the Bank of England pounds sterling equivalent to their currency in circulation. IIRC, you can turn up at Threadneedle Street and hand a Clydesdale Bank £10 to the cashier, and then will hand you a crisp new Bank of England £10 note. They will then knock £10 off the sum that they have in the Clydesdale credit account.

That will not change. Every Scottish bank note is backed by a BoE one. (Obviously post official independence that will change. But on 19 September 2014 they will still legally be transferable to BoE notes.)

So: I repeat my offer to PBers, and anyone who wants to take me up.

rcs1000

Lennon said:

rcs1000 said:

CarlottaVance said:

FPT;

SeanT said:

Plato said:

The petrol station near me has put up signs saying they won't accept Scottish notes. A small but significant little message to visiting tourists.

I've just been chatting to a friend who said that the Saltire lifted above Number 10 fell down in true Omen style - is this true? He was laughing so much that I couldn't tell if he was pulling my leg.

Scott_P said:

@cathynewman: My Scottish £20 note got rejected at City Airport on landing from Edinburgh. Might as well have returned from a foreign country #indyref

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT I PREDICTED A WEEK AGO.

Scottish £ notes will become worthless in England as of September 19, if it is a YES. People will not take them, unless on pain of prison. Cabs and small shops and other small enterprises will simply refuse

We live with this in the Channel Islands where UK and Channel Island notes are interchangeable, but Channel Island notes are not accepted in the UK - so we have two sets of ATMs marked clearly "Local Notes" and "UK Notes". Taxis dropping you at the airport routinely ask if you want your change "local or UK".

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

I'll pay 98p in the pound, but delivery has to be to me (outside the Bank of England) :-)

:-)

Stuart_Dickson

Neil said:

They described their last poll as their penultimate one for Scotland on Sunday so it shouldnt be a surprise? I cant see why they'd suddenly change their methodology now though.

Thank goodness. I don't have much time for online panel based polls.

Plato

I'm sure some wag with make bog roll paper printed with spoof Salmond currency post 18th.

Or perhaps Rizla will produce some commemorative roll-up papers?

They used to do Dollar Bill ones. I haven't seen Rizla papers in years.

Beverley_C said:

TheWatcher said:

rcs1000 said:

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

What's wrong with Andrex?

Possibly Andrex is more valuable. Softer too....

TheWatcher

TheScreamingEagles said:

eek said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

No, a very narrow Yes, and Salmond unable to deliver on the promises he made

Why? While it would be a very bad result for Scotland (regardless of the fact Salmond will be unable to deliver his promises with 50.01% or 99.99% of the vote) it wouldn't be the worst result for the rUK.

A narrow No vote, additional devolution given to Scotland and No answer to the West Lothian question would be a far, far worse result for rUK...

2) Prolonged legal action in the courts, I voted for Yes because Alex Salmond we would get x, y and z, we haven't, we need a new referendum

I'd love to see how well that went.

TheScreamingEagles

Life_ina_market_town said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

And the argument over which court has the final say.

The law is clear, and is set out in section 34 of the Scottish Independence Referendum Act 2013, 2013 asp 14. A challenge to a certification by a counting officer or chief counting officer must be brought within six weeks of the certification. The challenge must be brought by way of a petition for judicial review. The Court of Session has the power to reduce a certificate. As the Courts Reform (Scotland) Bill has yet to pass stage 3 in the Scottish Parliament, the permission of the Court of Session is not required to bring such a petition before the Outer House. A reclaiming motion may be made to the Inner House from any decision of the Outer House. An appeal lies as of right from the Outer House to the Supreme Court, and an appellant does requires not require permission to bring such an appeal, only the signature of two members of the Faculty of Advocates.

Yeah but Alex Salmond has a history of attacking the Supreme Court for interfering in Scottish affairs.

TheScreamingEagles

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Bread actor to toast Carswell?

Bring it on...

Which Bread actor?

Please say Lilo Lil, she is a tart.

Sadly no...he appealed to a higher authority and was a Proddy I believe...

The Proddy Vicar? Nearly as good

The great thing about that show was, Freddie Boswell looked like Liverpool's owner, David Moores

David Moores here http://static.bbc.co.uk/programmeimages/608xn/images/p024bzxv.jpg

Freddie Boswell here http://theoriginalwinger.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/David-Moores.jpg

Correct.

You seen Spurs are going to play a season away from the Lane - looking to share a ground....

Ask Arsenal nicely? Wembley probably seems the best and logical place

Beverley_C

Plato said:

I'm sure some wag with make bog roll paper printed with spoof Salmond currency post 18th.

It will never sell... I would not even wipe my bottom with it! The thought of sharing a toilet moment with Alex... ugh!

TheScreamingEagles

Someone replied to Martin Boon's tweet

roger scully ‏@roger_scully 27m

@martinboon @ICMResearch Just 'maybe'?!

Martin Boon

@roger_scully @ICMResearch oh all right, a shed load....

roger scully ‏@roger_scully 24m

@martinboon @ICMResearch So, voting intention, plus..?

Martin Boon ‏@martinboon 22m

@roger_scully @ICMResearch A sumptuous feast of questions. You'll have to wait and see!

Jumbopopo

With it looking this close, anyone else thought about what happens (politically, not constitutionally) if mainland Scotland votes Yes but Orkney and/or Shetland tip the overall result over to No? Deadlock, and a neverendum, I would have thought.

Tykejohnno

Scottish Independence: Don't vote Yes just to give the 'effing Tories' a kick, says David Cameron

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scottish-independence/11086917/Scottish-Independence-Dont-vote-Yes-just-to-give-the-effing-Tories-a-kick-says-David-Cameron.html

Language timothy ;-)

__Bobajob__

Plato said:

I'm sure some wag with make bog roll paper printed with spoof Salmond currency post 18th.

Or perhaps Rizla will produce some commemorative roll-up papers?

They used to do Dollar Bill ones. I haven't seen Rizla papers in years.

Beverley_C said:

TheWatcher said:

rcs1000 said:

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

What's wrong with Andrex?

Possibly Andrex is more valuable. Softer too....

Odd indeed seeing as Rizla papers are on open sale in every newsagent.

Neil

Stuart_Dickson said:

Neil said:

They described their last poll as their penultimate one for Scotland on Sunday so it shouldnt be a surprise? I cant see why they'd suddenly change their methodology now though.

Thank goodness. I don't have much time for online panel based polls.

By that I meant they'll surely stick to the online methodology they've been using for their SoS polls to date?

eek

TheScreamingEagles said:

eek said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

No, a very narrow Yes, and Salmond unable to deliver on the promises he made

Why? While it would be a very bad result for Scotland (regardless of the fact Salmond will be unable to deliver his promises with 50.01% or 99.99% of the vote) it wouldn't be the worst result for the rUK.

A narrow No vote, additional devolution given to Scotland and No answer to the West Lothian question would be a far, far worse result for rUK...

My scenario would lead to

1) Currency and capital flight

2) Prolonged legal action in the courts, I voted for Yes because Alex Salmond we would get x, y and z, we haven't, we need a new referendum

3) We'd suffer economic instability in the interregnum whilst 2) was ongoing.

1) where will the currency flight go to (a large proportion would be to rUK). Jobs will definitely flow from Scotland to the North East and Yorkshire.

2) That would be an internal Scottish issue. Thankfully they have their own courts so would never reach rUK courts. The real problem will be that even if Scotland wanted to come back would rUK accept them (and once the divorce begins there is zero chance of that occurring).

Salmond has created a time-bombed mess, in the same way that Brown and Blair did in their own ways back in 1997... While we know it may be a problem for rUK its going to be far worse north of the border and I think we will take enough satisfaction from their additional pain to happily absorb the pain we receive...

__Bobajob__

Plato said:

Yup. Only an AV style result for No would be enough to temporarily shut the Nats up.

As there's no chance of that now, I'd rather a narrow Yes win - and hoist Salmond on his own petard.

eek said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Patrick said:

Is the worst result now a very narrow NO?

No, a very narrow Yes, and Salmond unable to deliver on the promises he made

Why? While it would be a very bad result for Scotland (regardless of the fact Salmond will be unable to deliver his promises with 50.01% or 99.99% of the vote) it wouldn't be the worst result for the rUK.

A narrow No vote, additional devolution given to Scotland and No answer to the West Lothian question would be a far, far worse result for rUK...

Like many on here, you utterly fail to grasp the psyche of Salmond. If he gets 50%+1 vote he will die happy, his life's work complete. Independent Scotland uber alles.

Plato

Dan Hodges WTFery post from earlier really is excellent. I'm in denial about what our Westminster bods are playing at:

In their desperation to save it, the Union’s defenders are starting to resemble that US army officer who explained during the Vietnam War that “we had to destroy the village in order to save it”. If – as Gordon Brown says – a new Union is indeed being forged in the heat of debate, then everyone who is a part of that Union must participate in that debate. And if we can’t, then we’re not a Union at all.

I’d assumed that if the Scots voted “No” then each of the major parties would then come up with their own ideas for a new framework for Scottish devolution, and put those ideas to the British people at the next election. Crazy, old-fashioned stuff like securing a democratic mandate...

Does no one in Westminster understand how this looks to people outside of Westminster? The spectacle of the man who was overwhelmingly rejected at the ballot box four years ago suddenly emerging to unilaterally rewrite the British constitution because he and the rest of his political chums have decided a democratic referendum is not going the way they think it should.

blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100285785/scottish-independence-what-does-the-political-establishment-think-its-playing-at/

Richard_Nabavi

The massive errors on some of the AV referendum polls (yes, I'm looking at YOU, Mr Kellner!) certainly mean that we should be cautious in interpreting IndyRef polls. However, there is one big difference which in principle should make the pollsters' task a bit easier, namely turnout will be high. I'd be surprised therefore if the IndyRef polls are out by as much as the AV one were.

I do think, however, that there may be some truth in the 'drunken crowd effect' post by SeanT on the previous thread. In particular, the last-minute surge towards Yes, for no particular reason (it's not as though Salmond has actually answered any of the big questions), does look rather like the Cleggasm, and perhaps will dematerialise in a similar way.

On balance I think No will win by a reasonable margin, but who knows?

__Bobajob__

@RCS1000 @SeanT

There will be something of an inconvenience premium if everyone who wants to spend a McPound has to take a trip to Bank tube before they can cash them in

eek

Jumbopopo said:

With it looking this close, anyone else thought about what happens (politically, not constitutionally) if mainland Scotland votes Yes but Orkney and/or Shetland tip the overall result over to No? Deadlock, and a neverendum, I would have thought.

I actually wonder what happens if Orkney and Shetland vote no and Scotland as a whole votes Yes. Could rUK insist on a second referendum there with the option stay in the UK or go with Scotland while offering them a larger proportion of their oil income to reflect additional costs.. (yes its a bribe but all is fair in love and war)...

TheScreamingEagles

James Forsyth ‏@JGForsyth 3m

Hear that there'll be some much needed morale boosting news for the Union side this afternoon

Scrapheap_as_was

TheScreamingEagles said:

James Forsyth ‏@JGForsyth 3m

Hear that there'll be some much needed morale boosting news for the Union side this afternoon

X--factor on 3 times at the weekend?

TheScreamingEagles

SeanT said:

Plato said:

Dan Hodges WTFery post from earlier really is excellent. I'm in denial about what our Westminster bods are playing at:

In their desperation to save it, the Union’s defenders are starting to resemble that US army officer who explained during the Vietnam War that “we had to destroy the village in order to save it”. If – as Gordon Brown says – a new Union is indeed being forged in the heat of debate, then everyone who is a part of that Union must participate in that debate. And if we can’t, then we’re not a Union at all.

I’d assumed that if the Scots voted “No” then each of the major parties would then come up with their own ideas for a new framework for Scottish devolution, and put those ideas to the British people at the next election. Crazy, old-fashioned stuff like securing a democratic mandate...

Does no one in Westminster understand how this looks to people outside of Westminster? The spectacle of the man who was overwhelmingly rejected at the ballot box four years ago suddenly emerging to unilaterally rewrite the British constitution because he and the rest of his political chums have decided a democratic referendum is not going the way they think it should.

blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100285785/scottish-independence-what-does-the-political-establishment-think-its-playing-at/

I hate to say this of a fellow Telegraph blogger, but Dan Hodges is an idiot on this issue (a brave, well-meaning idiot, but an idiot). He's one of the pundits who has been blithely saying YES has no chance, all the way through, showing a total lack of insight or understanding. Andf adding to the dangerous complacency of NO. His idiocy has been dangerous.

Only in the last two days - TWO DAYS - as he acknowledged that he might have been wrong.

So his latest startling insights on indyref are utterly valueless, whatever his angle. Ignore. He is badly damaged as a commentator, and he knows it.


If only the telegraph had a blogger that was right on the indyref eh?

Scott_P

@dlknowles: NPR reporting on the Scottish referendum: "In London, which is in England by the way".

TheScreamingEagles

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

James Forsyth ‏@JGForsyth 3m

Hear that there'll be some much needed morale boosting news for the Union side this afternoon

X--factor on 3 times at the weekend?

Dave resigning.

CarlottaVance

rcs1000 said:

CarlottaVance said:

FPT;

SeanT said:

Plato said:

The petrol station near me has put up signs saying they won't accept Scottish notes. A small but significant little message to visiting tourists.

I've just been chatting to a friend who said that the Saltire lifted above Number 10 fell down in true Omen style - is this true? He was laughing so much that I couldn't tell if he was pulling my leg.

Scott_P said:

@cathynewman: My Scottish £20 note got rejected at City Airport on landing from Edinburgh. Might as well have returned from a foreign country #indyref

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT I PREDICTED A WEEK AGO.

Scottish £ notes will become worthless in England as of September 19, if it is a YES. People will not take them, unless on pain of prison. Cabs and small shops and other small enterprises will simply refuse

We live with this in the Channel Islands where UK and Channel Island notes are interchangeable, but Channel Island notes are not accepted in the UK - so we have two sets of ATMs marked clearly "Local Notes" and "UK Notes". Taxis dropping you at the airport routinely ask if you want your change "local or UK".

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

Just don't change them at Dehli airport where you'll get 90p for the Scottish ones...or City Airport where you'll get 0p....

TheScreamingEagles

The Independent ‏@Independent 1m

Mike Tyson brands Rob Ford 'the best mayor in Toronto’s history'

http://ind.pn/1oshE9c

Financier

FPT

Plato said:

This is cheering me up a lot today.

» show previous quotes

We have just had a visit from a geologist who works with the oil majors on new oil and gas fields.

Currently he is working with the Russians who wish to exploit the potential fields around the islands in the Caribbean.

Somehow I don't think Uncle Sam will be happy with that situation - another potential Cuba crisis but economics instead of IBMs? - let alone environmental and tourism considerations. Apparently the Russian believe that the rustle of money will sway many of the governments there.

TheWatcher

__Bobajob__ said:

@RCS1000 @SeanT

There will be something of an inconvenience premium if everyone who wants to spend a McPound has to take a trip to Bank tube before they can cash them in

100's of cabbies parked up in Threadneedle Street to exchange their notes.

Let's face it, no one of sound mind is going to accept them outside Scotland now.

Sean_F

TheScreamingEagles said:

James Forsyth ‏@JGForsyth 3m

Hear that there'll be some much needed morale boosting news for the Union side this afternoon

Gordon Brown will offer to strip for anyone who agrees to vote No?

Theuniondivvie

eek said:

Jumbopopo said:

With it looking this close, anyone else thought about what happens (politically, not constitutionally) if mainland Scotland votes Yes but Orkney and/or Shetland tip the overall result over to No? Deadlock, and a neverendum, I would have thought.

I actually wonder what happens if Orkney and Shetland vote no and Scotland as a whole votes Yes. Could rUK insist on a second referendum there with the option stay in the UK or go with Scotland while offering them a larger proportion of their oil income to reflect additional costs..

Since as an enclave of the rUK their territorial limits would be reduced to 12 miles, it wouldn't be worth the candle.

Neil

TheScreamingEagles said:

The Independent ‏@Independent 1m

Mike Tyson brands Rob Ford 'the best mayor in Toronto’s history'

http://ind.pn/1oshE9c

*That* Mike Tyson?

Sweet Lord above but Ford is the gift that keeps on giving.

__Bobajob__

TheWatcher said:

__Bobajob__ said:

@RCS1000 @SeanT

There will be something of an inconvenience premium if everyone who wants to spend a McPound has to take a trip to Bank tube before they can cash them in

100's of cabbies parked up in Threadneedle Street to exchange their notes.

Let's face it, no one of sound mind is going to accept them outside Scotland now.

but little change in London - you can't spend the bloody things down here anyway!!

Financier

eek said:

Jumbopopo said:

With it looking this close, anyone else thought about what happens (politically, not constitutionally) if mainland Scotland votes Yes but Orkney and/or Shetland tip the overall result over to No? Deadlock, and a neverendum, I would have thought.

I actually wonder what happens if Orkney and Shetland vote no and Scotland as a whole votes Yes. Could rUK insist on a second referendum there with the option stay in the UK or go with Scotland while offering them a larger proportion of their oil income to reflect additional costs.. (yes its a bribe but all is fair in love and war)...

O & S would want to link with Norway, Iceland and Greenland

Scrapheap_as_was

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Bread actor to toast Carswell?

Bring it on...

Which Bread actor?

Please say Lilo Lil, she is a tart.

Sadly no...he appealed to a higher authority and was a Proddy I believe...

The Proddy Vicar? Nearly as good

The great thing about that show was, Freddie Boswell looked like Liverpool's owner, David Moores

David Moores here http://static.bbc.co.uk/programmeimages/608xn/images/p024bzxv.jpg

Freddie Boswell here http://theoriginalwinger.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/David-Moores.jpg

Correct.

You seen Spurs are going to play a season away from the Lane - looking to share a ground....

Ask Arsenal nicely? Wembley probably seems the best and logical place

I'll need SatNav if it's a season at Wembley. That's not so near to Walthamstow dog track but has it's own dog track right (I won shed loads there one night when at Uni) and close to White City Stadium?

HurstLlama

__Bobajob__ said:

Plato said:

I'm sure some wag with make bog roll paper printed with spoof Salmond currency post 18th.

Or perhaps Rizla will produce some commemorative roll-up papers?

They used to do Dollar Bill ones. I haven't seen Rizla papers in years.

Beverley_C said:

TheWatcher said:

rcs1000 said:

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

What's wrong with Andrex?

Possibly Andrex is more valuable. Softer too....

Odd indeed seeing as Rizla papers are on open sale in every newsagent.

Bob, I think Miss Plato might have been referring to Rizla papers that were meant for really big fags. You know those with really added ooomph. The sort that Rizla brought out to save people having to glue three normal papers together.

Damn, this might give you a clue:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ip5e9NUvX6A

Life_ina_market_town

TheScreamingEagles said:

Yeah but Alex Salmond has a history of attacking the Supreme Court for interfering in Scottish affairs.

Indeed, but he was attacking the exercise of criminal jurisdiction by the court in Fraser, which was contentious, given section 124 of the Criminal Procedure (Scotland) Act 1995. No one has disputed since the nineteenth century that the House of Lords and the court as its successor has jurisdiction to hear and determine appeals from the Inner House of the Court of Session.

TheScreamingEagles

Neil said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

The Independent ‏@Independent 1m

Mike Tyson brands Rob Ford 'the best mayor in Toronto’s history'

http://ind.pn/1oshE9c

*That* Mike Tyson?

Sweet Lord above but Ford is the gift that keeps on giving.

Yes, *that* Mike Tyson

Sean_F

TheScreamingEagles said:

The Independent ‏@Independent 1m

Mike Tyson brands Rob Ford 'the best mayor in Toronto’s history'

http://ind.pn/1oshE9c

He is.

TheScreamingEagles

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Bread actor to toast Carswell?

Bring it on...

Which Bread actor?

Please say Lilo Lil, she is a tart.

Sadly no...he appealed to a higher authority and was a Proddy I believe...

The Proddy Vicar? Nearly as good

The great thing about that show was, Freddie Boswell looked like Liverpool's owner, David Moores

David Moores here http://static.bbc.co.uk/programmeimages/608xn/images/p024bzxv.jpg

Freddie Boswell here http://theoriginalwinger.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/David-Moores.jpg

Correct.

You seen Spurs are going to play a season away from the Lane - looking to share a ground....

Ask Arsenal nicely? Wembley probably seems the best and logical place

I'll need SatNav if it's a season at Wembley. That's not so near to Walthamstow dog track but has it's own dog track right (I won shed loads there one night when at Uni) and close to White City Stadium?

Could be worse, you could be a West Ham or Chelsea fan, they are teams who don't, and soon will not play in their own area.

logical_song

Jumbopopo said:

With it looking this close, anyone else thought about what happens (politically, not constitutionally) if mainland Scotland votes Yes but Orkney and/or Shetland tip the overall result over to No? Deadlock, and a neverendum, I would have thought.

Orkney and Shetland as the Channel Islands of the North?

Scrapheap_as_was

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

James Forsyth ‏@JGForsyth 3m

Hear that there'll be some much needed morale boosting news for the Union side this afternoon

X--factor on 3 times at the weekend?

Dave resigning.

Prefer it to be Ed with Yvette taking over, although still not sure who the bet is with it's been so long now... memory fading, it's probably winnings of nearly 1/2 million quid now when that comes in for me - ish.

Neil

TheScreamingEagles said:

Neil said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

The Independent ‏@Independent 1m

Mike Tyson brands Rob Ford 'the best mayor in Toronto’s history'

http://ind.pn/1oshE9c

*That* Mike Tyson?

Sweet Lord above but Ford is the gift that keeps on giving.

Yes, *that* Mike Tyson

Was Ray Rice too busy to offer his endorsement?

Tykejohnno

'No one should weep for Labour if Scotland votes for independence': Former PM John Major says 'divisive' attacks on the Tories have fuelled the nationalist campaign

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2750517/No-one-weep-Labour-Scotland-votes-independence-Former-PM-John-Major-says-divisive-attacks-Tories-fuelled-nationalist-campaign.html

TheScreamingEagles

Life_ina_market_town said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Yeah but Alex Salmond has a history of attacking the Supreme Court for interfering in Scottish affairs.

Indeed, but he was attacking the exercise of criminal jurisdiction by the court in Fraser, which was contentious, given section 124 of the Criminal Procedure (Scotland) Act 1995. No one has disputed since the nineteenth century that the House of Lords and the court as its successor has jurisdiction to hear and determine appeals from the Inner House of the Court of Session.

And you don't think any legal disputes concerning the referendum won't be contentious?

Danny565

The "morale-boosting news" is the poll presumably? Although that wouldn't really fit in well with someone with Survation hyping it up on Twitter...

peter_from_putney

Thread header: " We’ll get an IndyRef poll from the firm that got the AV referendum right to within a fraction of a percent"

You must surely be referring to Angus Reid?

(Only joking)

JonathanD

logical_song said:

Jumbopopo said:

With it looking this close, anyone else thought about what happens (politically, not constitutionally) if mainland Scotland votes Yes but Orkney and/or Shetland tip the overall result over to No? Deadlock, and a neverendum, I would have thought.

Orkney and Shetland as the Channel Islands of the North?

Population of Shetlands is about 22,000. Declare Independence and become an oil millionaire. I'm tempted to move there myself just in case...

Plato

Oooh. My only experience of the politics of the Caribbean is once meeting the PM of the Bahamas. He was BFF with a mate of mine and we got sloshed in a Mayfair hotel. Charming chappy. Not exactly up to dealing with the Ruskies though.

I suppose the Yardies in Jamaica might give some Putin gangsters a run for their money...

Financier said:

FPT

Plato said:

This is cheering me up a lot today.

» show previous quotes

We have just had a visit from a geologist who works with the oil majors on new oil and gas fields.

Currently he is working with the Russians who wish to exploit the potential fields around the islands in the Caribbean.

Somehow I don't think Uncle Sam will be happy with that situation - another potential Cuba crisis but economics instead of IBMs? - let alone environmental and tourism considerations. Apparently the Russian believe that the rustle of money will sway many of the governments there.

SouthamObserver

Danny565 said:

The "morale-boosting news" is the poll presumably? Although that wouldn't really fit in well with someone with Survation hyping it up on Twitter...

Not sure that's right. The poll is being released this evening, not this afternoon. More ikely to be an endorsement or another big name from somewhere saying SNP claims are all nonsense.

TheScreamingEagles

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

James Forsyth ‏@JGForsyth 3m

Hear that there'll be some much needed morale boosting news for the Union side this afternoon

X--factor on 3 times at the weekend?

Dave resigning.

Prefer it to be Ed with Yvette taking over, although still not sure who the bet is with it's been so long now... memory fading, it's probably winnings of nearly 1/2 million quid now when that comes in for me - ish.

Ed could be resigning soon, if Scotland votes Yes

TheWatcher

Perhaps 'Michael Green' has been polling voters?

TheScreamingEagles

Neil said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Neil said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

The Independent ‏@Independent 1m

Mike Tyson brands Rob Ford 'the best mayor in Toronto’s history'

http://ind.pn/1oshE9c

*That* Mike Tyson?

Sweet Lord above but Ford is the gift that keeps on giving.

Yes, *that* Mike Tyson

Was Ray Rice too busy to offer his endorsement?

Give it time.

__Bobajob__

@TSE

None of Chelsea, West Ham, QPR or Millwall play in the areas after which they are named. Neither do Everton or Forest for that matter.

Danny565

Tykejohnno said:

'No one should weep for Labour if Scotland votes for independence': Former PM John Major says 'divisive' attacks on the Tories have fuelled the nationalist campaign

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2750517/No-one-weep-Labour-Scotland-votes-independence-Former-PM-John-Major-says-divisive-attacks-Tories-fuelled-nationalist-campaign.html

Again, I just love this state of denial from the Tories that it's not their policies themselves that have caused this, it's the way Labour have been presenting them. Apart from anything else, they must have a much higher opinion of the current Labour frontbench's political/campaigning skills than even most Labour members (including me).

Scrapheap_as_was

Labour finally gets it.. via Guido


Paul Hutcheon@paulhutcheon · 23m
Senior Labour source: 'John Prescott is a f****** moron.'
#indyref


Paul Hutcheon@paulhutcheon · 10m

Why on earth did @uk_together think inviting Prescott was a good idea?
https://skynews.grabyo.com/g/v/9mDFHtctx8O

Sky News

Play

TheScreamingEagles

For all those Lab supporters that criticised Dave for not debating with the SNP head to head.

Nicola Sturgeon ‏@NicolaSturgeon 1m

Asked by @ScotlandTonight to debate live with @Ed_Miliband tonight. I said yes. Seems he's said no. #indyref

__Bobajob__

@Danny

Indeed it is truly laughable - an argument you often also witness on here.

Theuniondivvie

SouthamObserver said:

Danny565 said:

The "morale-boosting news" is the poll presumably? Although that wouldn't really fit in well with someone with Survation hyping it up on Twitter...

Not sure that's right. The poll is being released this evening, not this afternoon. More ikely to be an endorsement or another big name from somewhere saying SNP claims are all nonsense.

Perhaps this is it. Or not.

Thom ‏@MrMoth 5 hrs
Bono promises to "shower Scotland with free albums if they vote Yes", making it unclear whose side he is on.

Plato

Indeed Mr @HurstLlama‌! I'd forgotten about trying to glue them to each other. Some people [cough] are very accomplished at rolling these.

Others end up with results that look more like a Toblerone or a sweet wrapper. Not cool.

HurstLlama said:

__Bobajob__ said:

Plato said:

I'm sure some wag with make bog roll paper printed with spoof Salmond currency post 18th.

Or perhaps Rizla will produce some commemorative roll-up papers?

They used to do Dollar Bill ones. I haven't seen Rizla papers in years.

Beverley_C said:

TheWatcher said:

rcs1000 said:

For the record, I will pay 96p in the pound for Scottish notes on 19 September in the event of a yes. Unlimited volumes :-)

What's wrong with Andrex?

Possibly Andrex is more valuable. Softer too....

Odd indeed seeing as Rizla papers are on open sale in every newsagent.

Bob, I think Miss Plato might have been referring to Rizla papers that were meant for really big fags. You know those with really added ooomph. The sort that Rizla brought out to save people having to glue three normal papers together.

Damn, this might give you a clue

Scrapheap_as_was

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Bread actor to toast Carswell?

Bring it on...

Which Bread actor?

Please say Lilo Lil, she is a tart.

Sadly no...he appealed to a higher authority and was a Proddy I believe...

The Proddy Vicar? Nearly as good

The great thing about that show was, Freddie Boswell looked like Liverpool's owner, David Moores

David Moores here http://static.bbc.co.uk/programmeimages/608xn/images/p024bzxv.jpg

Freddie Boswell here http://theoriginalwinger.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/David-Moores.jpg

Correct.

You seen Spurs are going to play a season away from the Lane - looking to share a ground....

Ask Arsenal nicely? Wembley probably seems the best and logical place

I'll need SatNav if it's a season at Wembley. That's not so near to Walthamstow dog track but has it's own dog track right (I won shed loads there one night when at Uni) and close to White City Stadium?

Could be worse, you could be a West Ham or Chelsea fan, they are teams who don't, and soon will not play in their own area.

Harpenden village green would be handy and my daughter wouldn't be scared of getting to the ground as much as when I took her along Tottenham high road....

Tykejohnno

Just seen john Prescott on the news in Scotland on a soap box giving it big about the big bad tories.

Christ,the no campaign should lock this guy away,if I was a undecided,he would send me to the yes camp.

TheScreamingEagles

Theuniondivvie said:

SouthamObserver said:

Danny565 said:

The "morale-boosting news" is the poll presumably? Although that wouldn't really fit in well with someone with Survation hyping it up on Twitter...

Not sure that's right. The poll is being released this evening, not this afternoon. More ikely to be an endorsement or another big name from somewhere saying SNP claims are all nonsense.

Perhaps this is it. Or not.

Thom ‏@MrMoth 5 hrs
Bono promises to "shower Scotland with free albums if they vote Yes", making it unclear whose side he is on.

Cue a load of subtle u2 pop references in my next post.

Danny565

SouthamObserver said:

Danny565 said:

The "morale-boosting news" is the poll presumably? Although that wouldn't really fit in well with someone with Survation hyping it up on Twitter...

Not sure that's right. The poll is being released this evening, not this afternoon. More ikely to be an endorsement or another big name from somewhere saying SNP claims are all nonsense.

If it is, then they must be really grasping at straws to think it would be morale-boosting. It's not like endorsements, or critiques of Scottish independence from supposedly "credible" institutions, have helped the No campaign thus far.

Financier

Danny565 said:

Tykejohnno said:

'No one should weep for Labour if Scotland votes for independence': Former PM John Major says 'divisive' attacks on the Tories have fuelled the nationalist campaign

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2750517/No-one-weep-Labour-Scotland-votes-independence-Former-PM-John-Major-says-divisive-attacks-Tories-fuelled-nationalist-campaign.html

Again, I just love this state of denial from the Tories that it's not their policies themselves that have caused this, it's the way Labour have been presenting them. Apart from anything else, they must have a much higher opinion of the current Labour frontbench's political/campaigning skills than even most Labour members (including me).

Just the usual Labour problem of thinking and acting for the short term without thinking ahead of the long term effects (e.g. Iraq 2).

Lennon

__Bobajob__ said:

@TSE

None of Chelsea, West Ham, QPR or Millwall play in the areas after which they are named. Neither do Everton or Forest for that matter.

Or (Woolwich) Arsenal if you go back far enough...

TheScreamingEagles

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Scrapheap_as_was said:

Bread actor to toast Carswell?

Bring it on...

Which Bread actor?

Please say Lilo Lil, she is a tart.

Sadly no...he appealed to a higher authority and was a Proddy I believe...

The Proddy Vicar? Nearly as good

The great thing about that show was, Freddie Boswell looked like Liverpool's owner, David Moores

David Moores here http://static.bbc.co.uk/programmeimages/608xn/images/p024bzxv.jpg

Freddie Boswell here http://theoriginalwinger.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/David-Moores.jpg

Correct.

You seen Spurs are going to play a season away from the Lane - looking to share a ground....

Ask Arsenal nicely? Wembley probably seems the best and logical place

I'll need SatNav if it's a season at Wembley. That's not so near to Walthamstow dog track but has it's own dog track right (I won shed loads there one night when at Uni) and close to White City Stadium?

Could be worse, you could be a West Ham or Chelsea fan, they are teams who don't, and soon will not play in their own area.

Harpenden village green would be handy and my daughter wouldn't be scared of getting to the ground as much as when I took her along Tottenham high road....

I can beat that, I went to an England v Turkey qualifier at the Stadium of Light in 2003, the crowd near me started chanting

"I'd rather be a Paki than a Turk"

SouthamObserver

Danny565 said:

SouthamObserver said:

Danny565 said:

The "morale-boosting news" is the poll presumably? Although that wouldn't really fit in well with someone with Survation hyping it up on Twitter...

Not sure that's right. The poll is being released this evening, not this afternoon. More ikely to be an endorsement or another big name from somewhere saying SNP claims are all nonsense.

If it is, then they must be really grasping at straws to think it would be morale-boosting. It's not like endorsements, or critiques of Scottish independence from supposedly "credible" institutions, have helped the No campaign thus far.

I agree.

MarkHopkins

Theuniondivvie said:

SouthamObserver said:

Danny565 said:

The "morale-boosting news" is the poll presumably? Although that wouldn't really fit in well with someone with Survation hyping it up on Twitter...

Not sure that's right. The poll is being released this evening, not this afternoon. More ikely to be an endorsement or another big name from somewhere saying SNP claims are all nonsense.

Perhaps this is it. Or not.

Thom ‏@MrMoth 5 hrs
Bono promises to "shower Scotland with free albums if they vote Yes", making it unclear whose side he is on.

Offering to bribe voters? Not a wise move.

Pong

Tykejohnno said:

Just seen john Prescott on the news in Scotland on a soap box giving it big about the big bad tories.

Christ,the no campaign should lock this guy away,if I was a undecided,he would send me to the yes camp.

What, undecided C2DE Labour voters?

A bit of tory-bashing from Prescott, surrounded by no posters is an excellent idea. It's probably been choreographed to coincide with dave's 'effing-tories' comments.

HurstLlama

Financier said:

FPT

Plato said:

This is cheering me up a lot today.

» show previous quotes

We have just had a visit from a geologist who works with the oil majors on new oil and gas fields.

Currently he is working with the Russians who wish to exploit the potential fields around the islands in the Caribbean.

Somehow I don't think Uncle Sam will be happy with that situation - another potential Cuba crisis but economics instead of IBMs? - let alone environmental and tourism considerations. Apparently the Russian believe that the rustle of money will sway many of the governments there.

Mr. Financier, Having worked out in the Caribbean, I am sure that someone who rolls up with a truck-load of cash will be able to get anything he/she wants. However, are there any reserves of economically recoverable oil around those islands? If there are then the Sovs will face competition from the Septics, if there aren't the Sovs cash will evaporate and who cares.

manofkent2014

Tykejohnno said:

Just seen john Prescott on the news in Scotland on a soap box giving it big about the big bad tories.

Christ,the no campaign should lock this guy away,if I was a undecided,he would send me to the yes camp.

The senile old fool was chuntering on about merging the English and Scottish Football teams earlier on. He's utterly deranged! What moron thinks that suggesting to merge the two football teams would be a popular idea north of the border or south of the border for that matter?

What he should have done was suggest the reinstatement of the Home International Championship. I'm sure the idea of ripping up Wembley and taking home chunks of Wembley goalpost would have persuaded some in the Tartan Army to vote 'No'

Socrates

Danny565 said:

Tykejohnno said:

'No one should weep for Labour if Scotland votes for independence': Former PM John Major says 'divisive' attacks on the Tories have fuelled the nationalist campaign

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2750517/No-one-weep-Labour-Scotland-votes-independence-Former-PM-John-Major-says-divisive-attacks-Tories-fuelled-nationalist-campaign.html

Again, I just love this state of denial from the Tories that it's not their policies themselves that have caused this, it's the way Labour have been presenting them. Apart from anything else, they must have a much higher opinion of the current Labour frontbench's political/campaigning skills than even most Labour members (including me).

Oh come on. If you read the Guardian you get the impression that the children of Britain are walking the streets unclothed and starving.

__Bobajob__

Apparently Bono has endorsed Yes. What he has to do with anything I do not know

__Bobajob__

Wings Over Scotland ramping a "very surprising" "good" rumour.