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How long will Trump last today? – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,261
edited January 20 in General
imageHow long will Trump last today? – politicalbetting.com

Ladbrokes have a market on the length of Trump’s speech today. In 2017 Trump delivered a 15 minute 1,433 word speech and he delivers a similar speech then the value is on the 14 to 16 minute market at 7/1 but if you expect him to ramble on and on then you might be interested in the 6/5 on 20 minutes or over.

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Comments

  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Not that up on US stuff or speeches but even if I were the tightness of the time bands would put me off.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,768
    Like Father Ted and his speech receiving a Golden Cleric award.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,369
    Was Musk’s stumbling, stuttering speech down to too much Ket or not enough?

    https://x.com/adamjschwarz/status/1881112679143948640?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,768

    ..
  • MattWMattW Posts: 24,349
    edited January 20
    5th Column. Again.

    On those odds I'd go for a fiver on 12-14.

    Fpt:
    Foxy said:

    DavidL said:

    9% is of course a terrible score for leader of the Tory party who like to think themselves the natural party of government but it is of course worth remembering that the choice given to the members was her or Robert Jenrick. It's not as if the party membership turned their noses up at a Thatcher or a Cameron. Personally, I have no doubt that, for once, the membership made the right choice. The party is deeply diminished and not just in its number of MPs.

    He's not gone away.

    ConHome just voted Jenrick MP of the year 2024.

    https://conservativehome.com/2025/01/19/our-survey-jenrick-is-conservativehome-readers-2024-mp-of-the-year/
    It's interesting that the winning number of votes cast Jenrick 127, Kemi 121, Cleverley 27.

    The total number of surveys done by readers is around 540 (from the numbers in the article), rather than the approximately 750-800 it was a few years ago.

  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,675
    Read the headline and wondered if someone knew something about his health or a shooter.

    Would certainly make it a busy day on PB..
  • Test
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 123

    Was Musk’s stumbling, stuttering speech down to too much Ket or not enough?

    https://x.com/adamjschwarz/status/1881112679143948640?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Perhaps this might explain. Daughter did a lot a Ket when at Uni - mainly applying it to rats brains to see the effect. The (rat) brain can take quite a lot apparently. Other brains are available.

    https://embrace-autism.com/ketamine-could-diminish-autistic-distreas/
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,530
    I think he goes long today.

    But we need to be clear about which speech we are talking. He’s not going to care much for his audience of Congress in the Rotunda, will save his best words for the later speech to the crowd of supporters at the arena to where he will go after the formalities.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,576
    edited January 20
    Trump’s first inauguration speech in 2017 was a disgrace. I suspect today’s will be less menacing, more crowing. I don’t plan to watch him.

    The sight of Hamas fighters looking equally jubilant in Gaza yesterday, guns in hand, is not such great optics for the genius peacemaker. He made a big play to get credit for a ceasefire that had been 8 months in the planning.

  • The speech won't be long:
    a) Its going to be biting cold with a colder wind. He doesn;'t want his hair to be blown off
    b) He has a stack of Executive Orders to sign. The ones where he commissions the now pardoned insurrectionists to round up American citizens for deportation can't be held up by a rambling speech about sharks
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,570

    The speech won't be long:
    a) Its going to be biting cold with a colder wind. He doesn;'t want his hair to be blown off
    b) He has a stack of Executive Orders to sign. The ones where he commissions the now pardoned insurrectionists to round up American citizens for deportation can't be held up by a rambling speech about sharks

    It's indoors isn't it?

    And since when has Trump ever been concise?
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,978
    The Trump memecoin has over quintupled Trump’s wealth. Biggest grift ever.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075

    The Trump memecoin has over quintupled Trump’s wealth. Biggest grift ever.

    We live in strange times.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,887
    Foxy said:

    The speech won't be long:
    a) Its going to be biting cold with a colder wind. He doesn;'t want his hair to be blown off
    b) He has a stack of Executive Orders to sign. The ones where he commissions the now pardoned insurrectionists to round up American citizens for deportation can't be held up by a rambling speech about sharks

    It's indoors isn't it?

    And since when has Trump ever been concise?
    Morning all!

    I suspect it'll be quite long, and full of threatening plans.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 29,469
    ...

    The speech won't be long:
    a) Its going to be biting cold with a colder wind. He doesn;'t want his hair to be blown off
    b) He has a stack of Executive Orders to sign. The ones where he commissions the now pardoned insurrectionists to round up American citizens for deportation can't be held up by a rambling speech about sharks

    How long does a dumpster fire normally last?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,991
    edited January 20

    The speech won't be long:
    a) Its going to be biting cold with a colder wind. He doesn;'t want his hair to be blown off
    b) He has a stack of Executive Orders to sign. The ones where he commissions the now pardoned insurrectionists to round up American citizens for deportation can't be held up by a rambling speech about sharks

    What if he signs them during the speech ?

    Though he's probably saving that for the MAGA crowd one.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,991
    edited January 20

    The Trump memecoin has over quintupled Trump’s wealth. Biggest grift ever.

    Those who are left holding the bag can't say they weren't warned.
    https://x.com/VolodyaTretyak/status/1881163884062765368
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 29,469

    The Trump memecoin has over quintupled Trump’s wealth. Biggest grift ever.

    Hawk Tuah probably winds up doing four years in a Federal penitentiary (she won't be doing much hawk tuahing there) whilst Trump spends another four years in the Whitehouse.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 19,090

    The Trump memecoin has over quintupled Trump’s wealth. Biggest grift ever.

    On paper. He's never going to be able to sell all the coins he holds without crashing the market price.

    But still. It's either a convenient way for people to funnel donations to him off the books, or a demonstration of the limitless capacity for dupes to be duped.

    The one saving grace about Trump is that he's definitely in it for the money first and foremost. If he was actually ideologically motivated he would be a lot more dangerous.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 53,257

    ...

    The speech won't be long:
    a) Its going to be biting cold with a colder wind. He doesn;'t want his hair to be blown off
    b) He has a stack of Executive Orders to sign. The ones where he commissions the now pardoned insurrectionists to round up American citizens for deportation can't be held up by a rambling speech about sharks

    How long does a dumpster fire normally last?
    Depends where it is.

    In LA, they have no water to put it out...
  • MattWMattW Posts: 24,349

    The speech won't be long:
    a) Its going to be biting cold with a colder wind. He doesn;'t want his hair to be blown off
    b) He has a stack of Executive Orders to sign. The ones where he commissions the now pardoned insurrectionists to round up American citizens for deportation can't be held up by a rambling speech about sharks

    AIUI it's been moved inside.

  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 61,253
    The value here is on 12 minutes or less, with stakes that average out at about 40/1.

    Yes, that's much less likely than a long rambling speech, but not that unlikely.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,530

    The Trump memecoin has over quintupled Trump’s wealth. Biggest grift ever.

    Hawk Tuah probably winds up doing four years in a Federal penitentiary (she won't be doing much hawk tuahing there) whilst Trump spends another four years in the Whitehouse.
    With the exception of Bitcoin and Etherium, for which there’s an actual demand, pretty much any cryptocurrency is worth precisely zero and those promoting are trying to make money at everyone else’s expense.

    People buying Trump Coin are just as silly as those buying Hawk Tuah Coin, although Trump didn’t keep back millions of coins to dump on the market right after the launch.
  • pm215pm215 Posts: 1,180

    The Trump memecoin has over quintupled Trump’s wealth. Biggest grift ever.

    On paper. He's never going to be able to sell all the coins he holds without crashing the market price.

    But still. It's either a convenient way for people to funnel donations to him off the books, or a demonstration of the limitless capacity for dupes to be duped.

    The one saving grace about Trump is that he's definitely in it for the money first and foremost. If he was actually ideologically motivated he would be a lot more dangerous.
    I think he's in it for the attention first and the money second, but you're right about the lack of ideology. He does have some things he genuinely believes are right (e.g. on tariffs and immigration), but I don't think those add up to an ideological position. And of course there is also a massive array of policy areas where he really doesn't care at all.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 29,469

    ...

    The speech won't be long:
    a) Its going to be biting cold with a colder wind. He doesn;'t want his hair to be blown off
    b) He has a stack of Executive Orders to sign. The ones where he commissions the now pardoned insurrectionists to round up American citizens for deportation can't be held up by a rambling speech about sharks

    How long does a dumpster fire normally last?
    Depends where it is.

    In LA, they have no water to put it out...
    So maybe exactly four years?
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,409
    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 13,064
    It will be an interesting day, but not WRT length of speech. Looking ahead, two thoughts:

    Trump's success or failure 2025-2029 is viewable from multiple perspectives. Looking only from a USA voter one, Trump will be seen by most to either succeed (economic growth, no stupid wars, migration under control, lower taxes, fewer annoying woke people around etc) or fail (lots of options).

    A USA Democrat/liberal, it seems to me, has little to hope for at the moment. If Trump is seen by most to 'succeed', other politics are dormant for now, in cluding Democrat politics. If the project fails then the chance of an ever increasing non democratic Post-Trump autocracy in the USA becomes extremely likely.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 29,469
    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    The economy heading in the right direction and World crises contained if not resolved, and then today, boom...
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,768

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    The economy heading in the right direction and World crises contained if not resolved, and then today, boom...
    A lesson in the role luck plays in politics. In another universe, Trump’s age caught up with him first.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 29,469
    edited January 20
    algarkirk said:

    It will be an interesting day, but not WRT length of speech. Looking ahead, two thoughts:

    Trump's success or failure 2025-2029 is viewable from multiple perspectives. Looking only from a USA voter one, Trump will be seen by most to either succeed (economic growth, no stupid wars, migration under control, lower taxes, fewer annoying woke people around etc) or fail (lots of options).

    A USA Democrat/liberal, it seems to me, has little to hope for at the moment. If Trump is seen by most to 'succeed', other politics are dormant for now, in cluding Democrat politics. If the project fails then the chance of an ever increasing non democratic Post-Trump autocracy in the USA becomes extremely likely.

    John Bolton was on with Lewis Goodall this weekend. Goodall asked for Bolton's opinion on what a good and bad Trump term looked like. Bolton suggested good was if he did very little so his mess could be cleared up in four years time. Bad he thought would mean irretrievable World chaos.

    Bolton explained Trump's view on China, re: Taiwan. Trump demonstrated this by pointing at the Oval Office table to mean China and his Sharpie pen tip to represent Taiwan, meaning Bolton suggested, that he saw China taking Taiwan as an example of David versus Goliath natural order.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,636
    Are the democrats just better at hiding the grift or what?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,284
    Any odds offered on what leads the BBC Six O'Clock News today?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 29,469
    Jonathan said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    The economy heading in the right direction and World crises contained if not resolved, and then today, boom...
    A lesson in the role luck plays in politics. In another universe, Trump’s age caught up with him first.
    The assassination attempt could have been the most important sliding door moment for humanity.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,284

    Jonathan said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    The economy heading in the right direction and World crises contained if not resolved, and then today, boom...
    A lesson in the role luck plays in politics. In another universe, Trump’s age caught up with him first.
    The assassination attempt could have been the most important sliding door moment for humanity.
    If he'd been killed, there probably wouldn't be a United States of America now.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 13,064

    algarkirk said:

    It will be an interesting day, but not WRT length of speech. Looking ahead, two thoughts:

    Trump's success or failure 2025-2029 is viewable from multiple perspectives. Looking only from a USA voter one, Trump will be seen by most to either succeed (economic growth, no stupid wars, migration under control, lower taxes, fewer annoying woke people around etc) or fail (lots of options).

    A USA Democrat/liberal, it seems to me, has little to hope for at the moment. If Trump is seen by most to 'succeed', other politics are dormant for now, in cluding Democrat politics. If the project fails then the chance of an ever increasing non democratic Post-Trump autocracy in the USA becomes extremely likely.

    John Bolton was on with Lewis Goodall this weekend. Goodall asked for Bolton's opinion on what a good and bad Trump term looked like. Bolton suggested good was if he did very little so his mess could be cleared up in four years time. Bad he thought would mean irretrievable World chaos.

    Bolton explained Trump's view on China, re: Taiwan. Trump demonstrated this by pointing at the Oval Office table to mean China and his Sharpie pen tip to represent Taiwan, meaning Bolton suggested, that he saw China taking Taiwan as an example of David versus Goliath natural order.
    Interesting. I agree that world chaos and doing little are both real possibilities. There is a third strange option also. America has voted for the Hobbesian 'strong man' idea of government. The biggest problem with most 'strong men' from Putin to Pompey is that they are fond of external wars. The single most interesting thing about Putin is that (so far) he shows every sign of not being fond of the death of USA military in wars.

    A 'strong man' as POTUS who is unpredictable but loves/thinks there are votes in peace and carries a big stick while keeping his powder dry? There are possibilities on the upside.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,856
    tlg86 said:

    Jonathan said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    The economy heading in the right direction and World crises contained if not resolved, and then today, boom...
    A lesson in the role luck plays in politics. In another universe, Trump’s age caught up with him first.
    The assassination attempt could have been the most important sliding door moment for humanity.
    If he'd been killed, there probably wouldn't be a United States of America now.
    Win win.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,991

    The Trump memecoin has over quintupled Trump’s wealth. Biggest grift ever.

    On paper. He's never going to be able to sell all the coins he holds without crashing the market price.

    But still. It's either a convenient way for people to funnel donations to him off the books, or a demonstration of the limitless capacity for dupes to be duped.

    The one saving grace about Trump is that he's definitely in it for the money first and foremost. If he was actually ideologically motivated he would be a lot more dangerous.
    I'd guess he, and other insiders sold a fair chunk on the first day.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,635

    The speech won't be long:
    a) Its going to be biting cold with a colder wind. He doesn;'t want his hair to be blown off
    b) He has a stack of Executive Orders to sign. The ones where he commissions the now pardoned insurrectionists to round up American citizens for deportation can't be held up by a rambling speech about sharks

    On a) won't the speech be indoors ?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,635
    edited January 20

    Was Musk’s stumbling, stuttering speech down to too much Ket or not enough?

    https://x.com/adamjschwarz/status/1881112679143948640?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    He isn't a particularly good public speaker style wise.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,635

    The Trump memecoin has over quintupled Trump’s wealth. Biggest grift ever.

    Willing buyers, willing sellers.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,635

    Are the democrats just better at hiding the grift or what?

    Pelosi has an extraordinary record at picking stocks.
  • They moved the speech inside? He is a big girl's blouse
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,773
    tlg86 said:

    Jonathan said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    The economy heading in the right direction and World crises contained if not resolved, and then today, boom...
    A lesson in the role luck plays in politics. In another universe, Trump’s age caught up with him first.
    The assassination attempt could have been the most important sliding door moment for humanity.
    If he'd been killed, there probably wouldn't be a United States of America now.
    I think that's overblown. Hollywood isn't real life.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683
    Of course Castro was the president most famous for making long and rambling speeches. Probably not a comparison Trump would like on his big day today
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,108
    edited January 20
    tlg86 said:

    Any odds offered on what leads the BBC Six O'Clock News today?

    Good morning

    If it is anything like last night complete uninterrupted coverage with no 6 o clock news but rolling news all day

    Trump's one and a half hour speech last night was played live on both BBC and Sky

    On Trump's speech I expect it will be around 15 minutes before he moves to sign his executive orders

    I expect our media to be consumed by this for the rest of the week, and most probably the next 4 years
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683

    algarkirk said:

    It will be an interesting day, but not WRT length of speech. Looking ahead, two thoughts:

    Trump's success or failure 2025-2029 is viewable from multiple perspectives. Looking only from a USA voter one, Trump will be seen by most to either succeed (economic growth, no stupid wars, migration under control, lower taxes, fewer annoying woke people around etc) or fail (lots of options).

    A USA Democrat/liberal, it seems to me, has little to hope for at the moment. If Trump is seen by most to 'succeed', other politics are dormant for now, in cluding Democrat politics. If the project fails then the chance of an ever increasing non democratic Post-Trump autocracy in the USA becomes extremely likely.

    John Bolton was on with Lewis Goodall this weekend. Goodall asked for Bolton's opinion on what a good and bad Trump term looked like. Bolton suggested good was if he did very little so his mess could be cleared up in four years time. Bad he thought would mean irretrievable World chaos.

    Bolton explained Trump's view on China, re: Taiwan. Trump demonstrated this by pointing at the Oval Office table to mean China and his Sharpie pen tip to represent Taiwan, meaning Bolton suggested, that he saw China taking Taiwan as an example of David versus Goliath natural order.
    Trump is more interested in an economic war with China than a military one. Hence his pledge to impose 60% tariffs on Chinese imports once he takes office
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683
    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    He was also the only Democrat to beat Trump. It was the Democrats who removed him effectively in favour of Harris as their nominee. Though his dementia meant a second term for Biden was near impossible
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,899
    edited January 20
    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,536
    tlg86 said:

    Any odds offered on what leads the BBC Six O'Clock News today?

    Gary Lineker has changed the colour of his socks?
  • They moved the speech inside? He is a big girl's blouse

    To be fair the weather is freezing cold and snow predicted

    The Sky reporter just now said that it was getting even colder and going indoors was the only option

    There is so much you can attack Trump for, but this is not one of them
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,284

    tlg86 said:

    Any odds offered on what leads the BBC Six O'Clock News today?

    Good morning

    If it is anything like last night complete uninterrupted coverage with no 6 o clock news but rolling news all day

    Trump's one and a half hour speech last night was played live on both BBC and Sky

    On Trump's speech I expect it will be around 15 minutes before he moves to sign his executive orders

    I expect our media to be consumed by this for the rest of the week, and most probably the next 4 years
    I think the BBC will be making a big mistake if they do that. They'll be accused of helping the powers that be to bury bad news.
  • Pulpstar said:

    Was Musk’s stumbling, stuttering speech down to too much Ket or not enough?

    https://x.com/adamjschwarz/status/1881112679143948640?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    He isn't a particularly good public speaker style wise.
    He was awful last night
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,536
    HYUFD said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    He was also the only Democrat to beat Trump. It was the Democrats who removed him effectively in favour of Harris as their nominee. Though his dementia meant a second term for Biden was near impossible
    With hindsight there is now no doubt Biden should have declined to run two summers ago and allowed a full primary season.

  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,145

    HYUFD said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    He was also the only Democrat to beat Trump. It was the Democrats who removed him effectively in favour of Harris as their nominee. Though his dementia meant a second term for Biden was near impossible
    With hindsight there is now no doubt Biden should have declined to run two summers ago and allowed a full primary season.

    I thought that was the plan all along.
  • tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Any odds offered on what leads the BBC Six O'Clock News today?

    Good morning

    If it is anything like last night complete uninterrupted coverage with no 6 o clock news but rolling news all day

    Trump's one and a half hour speech last night was played live on both BBC and Sky

    On Trump's speech I expect it will be around 15 minutes before he moves to sign his executive orders

    I expect our media to be consumed by this for the rest of the week, and most probably the next 4 years
    I think the BBC will be making a big mistake if they do that. They'll be accused of helping the powers that be to bury bad news.
    This story, and the hostages, are the only ones the media will cover today as continuous running news
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,635
    All muscle.


  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 43,257
    RobD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    He was also the only Democrat to beat Trump. It was the Democrats who removed him effectively in favour of Harris as their nominee. Though his dementia meant a second term for Biden was near impossible
    With hindsight there is now no doubt Biden should have declined to run two summers ago and allowed a full primary season.

    I thought that was the plan all along.
    A bridge. He said it. And he didn't mean between Trump and more Trump.
  • FossFoss Posts: 1,112
    If you've not actually seen it yet, the Trump to Village People transition is fantastically surreal.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,991
    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    His first two years in office certainly match that description.
    But the next two not so much - and the decision not to declare before the primaries that he wouldn't run again set the stage for the electoral disaster.

    Whether a candidate other than him, who won a fully contested set of primaries (even if it were still Harris), would have then gone on to win is of course unknowable. But I think they'd have stood a far better chance.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 19,090
    pm215 said:

    The Trump memecoin has over quintupled Trump’s wealth. Biggest grift ever.

    On paper. He's never going to be able to sell all the coins he holds without crashing the market price.

    But still. It's either a convenient way for people to funnel donations to him off the books, or a demonstration of the limitless capacity for dupes to be duped.

    The one saving grace about Trump is that he's definitely in it for the money first and foremost. If he was actually ideologically motivated he would be a lot more dangerous.
    I think he's in it for the attention first and the money second, but you're right about the lack of ideology. He does have some things he genuinely believes are right (e.g. on tariffs and immigration), but I don't think those add up to an ideological position. And of course there is also a massive array of policy areas where he really doesn't care at all.
    The depth and breadth of the money-making efforts - shoes, watches, Bibles, etc - are what convince me that the money edges it.

    On the ideology, I do not doubt that Trump believes in political things, but my point is that these do not provide his main (or Indeed secondary) motivation. So if something proves to be too difficult, or annoying, or gets in the way of money-making or attention-seeking, then he's likely to drop it. He doesn't have the ideological fervour to push something through.

    That kind of hard work is for shmucks.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 52,081
    An article on American demagoguery without mentioning Huey Long?
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,924

    HYUFD said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    He was also the only Democrat to beat Trump. It was the Democrats who removed him effectively in favour of Harris as their nominee. Though his dementia meant a second term for Biden was near impossible
    With hindsight there is now no doubt Biden should have declined to run two summers ago and allowed a full primary season.

    With hindsight it looks like that Biden surrounded himself with weak people who would not challenge his inability to have a second term.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,220
    edited January 20

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,145

    HYUFD said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    He was also the only Democrat to beat Trump. It was the Democrats who removed him effectively in favour of Harris as their nominee. Though his dementia meant a second term for Biden was near impossible
    With hindsight there is now no doubt Biden should have declined to run two summers ago and allowed a full primary season.

    With hindsight it looks like that Biden surrounded himself with weak people who would not challenge his inability to have a second term.
    They aren’t necessarily weak. Perhaps they wanted someone pliable in the Oval Office?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,991
    RobD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    He was also the only Democrat to beat Trump. It was the Democrats who removed him effectively in favour of Harris as their nominee. Though his dementia meant a second term for Biden was near impossible
    With hindsight there is now no doubt Biden should have declined to run two summers ago and allowed a full primary season.

    I thought that was the plan all along.
    So did everyone.
    I think what changed it was the Dems outperforming expectations in the midterms. At which point hubris set in.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 24,349
    Pulpstar said:

    All muscle.


    Michelin Man chic is not impressive, imo.
  • theakestheakes Posts: 941
    We are entering a period in US history that will deny the fundamental and basic rights laid down by the forefathers. There will probably not be another Presidential election and a one party state will emerge.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,924
    RobD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    He was also the only Democrat to beat Trump. It was the Democrats who removed him effectively in favour of Harris as their nominee. Though his dementia meant a second term for Biden was near impossible
    With hindsight there is now no doubt Biden should have declined to run two summers ago and allowed a full primary season.

    With hindsight it looks like that Biden surrounded himself with weak people who would not challenge his inability to have a second term.
    They aren’t necessarily weak. Perhaps they wanted someone pliable in the Oval Office?
    Perhaps both.

    Weak people who wanted an even weaker person nominally in charge of them.

    Garland and Mayorkas must be candidates for the most inept cabinet ministers the USA has ever had.

    If I was Trump I would give them a huge reward for helping make him President again - it would also drive the Dems into conspiracy theorising madness.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,887
    edited January 20
    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    Trump would have to have trust in someone to do that. Is he likely to trust anyone that much?

    Further he'll be 79 in June which of course means that at the close of his term he'll be over 80. Will he still be composed mantis then? Biden was OK when he was elected, but he's unquestionably gone downhill, mentally, in the past couple of years.

    Thee's also the question as to whether the Republicans will hold either House of Congress after the mid-terms.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,369
    A Trump eulogy from Lammy on R4 this morning.
    He's the definition of vacuous, glibly expressing whatever principles he's decided he has on any given day.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,635
    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    12th

    ... But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,924
    theakes said:

    We are entering a period in US history that will deny the fundamental and basic rights laid down by the forefathers. There will probably not be another Presidential election and a one party state will emerge.

    Want to bet ?

    The bookies will give you very good odds for your prediction.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,145
    Pulpstar said:

    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    12th

    ... But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.
    But he isn’t ineligible to the office of the president, only ineligible to be elected. ;)
  • MattWMattW Posts: 24,349
    edited January 20
    Brains Trust.

    Does anyone have a good idea for a platform to drop short notes onto, so I can find them again and link to for friends to see, and for me to find again.

    I'm think of the longish comments I occasionally make here, that I do want to refer back to sometimes.

    In my head I'd probably use the free not self-managed version of Wordpress ie wordpress.com, or possibly Substack.

    Does anyone have any thought / suggestions.

    I do quite like public version of Substack.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 19,090
    edited January 20
    Nigelb said:

    RobD said:

    HYUFD said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    He was also the only Democrat to beat Trump. It was the Democrats who removed him effectively in favour of Harris as their nominee. Though his dementia meant a second term for Biden was near impossible
    With hindsight there is now no doubt Biden should have declined to run two summers ago and allowed a full primary season.

    I thought that was the plan all along.
    So did everyone.
    I think what changed it was the Dems outperforming expectations in the midterms. At which point hubris set in.
    Also the realisation that Trump was running again, that Biden had stood aside in 2016 and watched Trump win and he didn't want to do that again.

    We all agree that Biden's mistake was not to have stood aside before the Primaries, but he's convinced that his mistake was standing aside at all. Biden's record is to be the only person to defeat Trump in a Presidential election, and to have stood aside twice and watched the Democrats lose those two times.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,220
    Pulpstar said:

    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    12th

    ... But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.
    But he isn't constitutionally ineligible to the office of President, he's just constitutionally ineligible to be ELECTED to it.

    Given the pro-Trump tilt on the Supreme Court, I think he'd have a fair shot at succeeding.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 43,257
    Anyway this is why I don't like Mondays. It's the sort of day when the world’s wealthiest most influential nation and biggest military arsenal tends to get delivered into the hands of an unstable malevolent despot who cares only for his own enrichment and glorification. The big question, which I'm finding impossible to answer right now, is will I watch it? Revulsion is going head to head with fascination and it's too close to call.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 29,469

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again...

    You reckon?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,530

    HYUFD said:

    FF43 said:

    Biden's last day in office and everyone's forgotten about him. One of the most effective presidents of my lifetime in many ways but he ultimately failed at the one thing he absolutely had to do: keep Trump out of office.

    He was also the only Democrat to beat Trump. It was the Democrats who removed him effectively in favour of Harris as their nominee. Though his dementia meant a second term for Biden was near impossible
    With hindsight there is now no doubt Biden should have declined to run two summers ago and allowed a full primary season.

    With hindsight it looks like that Biden surrounded himself with weak people who would not challenge his inability to have a second term.
    There’s definitely books to be written about the Biden White House in the past couple of years.

    One story coming out this week, is that it was Sen. Schumer who was given the job (by Obama) of telling Biden he couldn’t win and needed to stand aside.

    There’s definitely some bad blood between the Biden and Harris camps too, Harris and Mrs Biden have blanked each other at a number of social occasions since the election.

    Yes the correct thing to do with hindsight was to run a full primary season, with or without the incumbent, but Biden’s team was convinced he was the only person who could beat Trump.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,369
    Welcome back, I was worried about you!
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,565
    edited January 20
    kinabalu said:

    Anyway this is why I don't like Mondays. It's the sort of day when the world’s wealthiest most influential nation and biggest military arsenal tends to get delivered into the hands of an unstable malevolent despot who cares only for his own enrichment and glorification. The big question, which I'm finding impossible to answer right now, is will I watch it? Revulsion is going head to head with fascination and it's too close to call.

    I think you'd find it better for your personal well-being to re-watch the UK election special from 4 July 2024, or, if that's too recent, the one from 1 May 1997, instead.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,576
    kinabalu said:

    Anyway this is why I don't like Mondays. It's the sort of day when the world’s wealthiest most influential nation and biggest military arsenal tends to get delivered into the hands of an unstable malevolent despot who cares only for his own enrichment and glorification. The big question, which I'm finding impossible to answer right now, is will I watch it? Revulsion is going head to head with fascination and it's too close to call.

    Blue Monday today isn't it?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,635
    Fishing said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    12th

    ... But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.
    But he isn't constitutionally ineligible to the office of President, he's just constitutionally ineligible to be ELECTED to it.

    Given the pro-Trump tilt on the Supreme Court, I think he'd have a fair shot at succeeding.
    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    Your premise implies he is eligible to be elected to the office of VP. That is not the case.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,576
    Fishing said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    12th

    ... But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.
    But he isn't constitutionally ineligible to the office of President, he's just constitutionally ineligible to be ELECTED to it.

    Given the pro-Trump tilt on the Supreme Court, I think he'd have a fair shot at succeeding.
    The question is who will be his Medvedev? Needs to be someone pliable enough that they won't get ideas above their station.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,635
    People who will absolutely not be president in 2030.

    1) Donald Trump.
    2) Elon Musk.
  • Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    Trump would have to have trust in someone to do that. Is he likely to trust anyone that much?

    Further he'll be 79 in June which of course means that at the close of his term he'll be over 80. Will he still be composed mantis then? Biden was OK when he was elected, but he's unquestionably gone downhill, mentally, in the past couple of years.

    Thee's also the question as to whether the Republicans will hold either House of Congress after the mid-terms.
    I cannot see any way Trump will stand again, not least for the reasons you mention

    The wider problem for the Democrats is how do they find an inspiring Obama style candidate to take on Republicans in 2029
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,954
    MattW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    All muscle.


    Michelin Man chic is not impressive, imo.
    Gym-based musclemen tend to be fairly pants at manual labour. The wrong muscle groups developed for the wrong tasks. They can be pretty awful with a shovel when down in a trench.

    (I do not mean 'average' muscles; just the ones that develop muscles for show.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,635
    TimS said:

    Fishing said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    12th

    ... But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.
    But he isn't constitutionally ineligible to the office of President, he's just constitutionally ineligible to be ELECTED to it.

    Given the pro-Trump tilt on the Supreme Court, I think he'd have a fair shot at succeeding.
    The question is who will be his Medvedev? Needs to be someone pliable enough that they won't get ideas above their station.
    Vance.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,924
    Fishing said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    12th

    ... But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.
    But he isn't constitutionally ineligible to the office of President, he's just constitutionally ineligible to be ELECTED to it.

    Given the pro-Trump tilt on the Supreme Court, I think he'd have a fair shot at succeeding.
    He hasn't and he's not even going to try.
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 5,067
    kinabalu said:

    Anyway this is why I don't like Mondays. It's the sort of day when the world’s wealthiest most influential nation and biggest military arsenal tends to get delivered into the hands of an unstable malevolent despot who cares only for his own enrichment and glorification. The big question, which I'm finding impossible to answer right now, is will I watch it? Revulsion is going head to head with fascination and it's too close to call.

    It's a bit unfair blaming all this on Mondays!
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 29,469

    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    Trump would have to have trust in someone to do that. Is he likely to trust anyone that much?

    Further he'll be 79 in June which of course means that at the close of his term he'll be over 80. Will he still be composed mantis then? Biden was OK when he was elected, but he's unquestionably gone downhill, mentally, in the past couple of years.

    Thee's also the question as to whether the Republicans will hold either House of Congress after the mid-terms.
    I cannot see any way Trump will stand again, not least for the reasons you mention

    The wider problem for the Democrats is how do they find an inspiring Obama style candidate to take on Republicans in 2029
    Not so fast, 2028. Our election for the Farage/Yaxley-Lennon/Tate/Braverman dream ticket is pencilled in for 2029.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,576
    Pulpstar said:

    TimS said:

    Fishing said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    12th

    ... But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.
    But he isn't constitutionally ineligible to the office of President, he's just constitutionally ineligible to be ELECTED to it.

    Given the pro-Trump tilt on the Supreme Court, I think he'd have a fair shot at succeeding.
    The question is who will be his Medvedev? Needs to be someone pliable enough that they won't get ideas above their station.
    Vance.
    They might have fallen out by then. 4 long years.

    I think more likely Trump won't stand again as he'll be too old, but he will want to kick-start a family succession, Kim-style.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,530
    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    Anyway this is why I don't like Mondays. It's the sort of day when the world’s wealthiest most influential nation and biggest military arsenal tends to get delivered into the hands of an unstable malevolent despot who cares only for his own enrichment and glorification. The big question, which I'm finding impossible to answer right now, is will I watch it? Revulsion is going head to head with fascination and it's too close to call.

    Blue Monday today isn't it?
    Start of the New Order.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,576

    Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    Trump would have to have trust in someone to do that. Is he likely to trust anyone that much?

    Further he'll be 79 in June which of course means that at the close of his term he'll be over 80. Will he still be composed mantis then? Biden was OK when he was elected, but he's unquestionably gone downhill, mentally, in the past couple of years.

    Thee's also the question as to whether the Republicans will hold either House of Congress after the mid-terms.
    I cannot see any way Trump will stand again, not least for the reasons you mention

    The wider problem for the Democrats is how do they find an inspiring Obama style candidate to take on Republicans in 2029
    Not so fast, 2028. Our election for the Farage/Yaxley-Lennon/Tate/Braverman dream ticket is pencilled in for 2029.
    That's what makes our next election even harder to call than it would otherwise be. By 2029 Trump's second term will be over, the next French presidential election will have been and gone and the world will be a very different place, for better or worse.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,635
    edited January 20

    MattW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    All muscle.


    Michelin Man chic is not impressive, imo.
    Gym-based musclemen tend to be fairly pants at manual labour. The wrong muscle groups developed for the wrong tasks. They can be pretty awful with a shovel when down in a trench.

    (I do not mean 'average' muscles; just the ones that develop muscles for show.
    Apologies for superimposing Trump's head onto Boris' torso ;)

    My colleague has a son who can is heavily into powerlifting. He wants to try and break the all time world record for squat of 380 kg at or under 75 kg bodyweight. He's slightly over that weight and can do 370. He isn't yet 18 !
  • Fishing said:

    The saving grace is that Trump can't be President again.. but which loon is going to follow him.....

    Not necessarily. The 22nd amendment only says that nobody can be ELECTED President twice.

    So Trump could have one of those loons run for President, with himself as Vice President. Then the new President resigns on his first day in office, and, bingo, another four years of Trump as President, maybe with the loon as his VP as reward.

    I've been having nightmares recently...
    Trump would have to have trust in someone to do that. Is he likely to trust anyone that much?

    Further he'll be 79 in June which of course means that at the close of his term he'll be over 80. Will he still be composed mantis then? Biden was OK when he was elected, but he's unquestionably gone downhill, mentally, in the past couple of years.

    Thee's also the question as to whether the Republicans will hold either House of Congress after the mid-terms.
    I cannot see any way Trump will stand again, not least for the reasons you mention

    The wider problem for the Democrats is how do they find an inspiring Obama style candidate to take on Republicans in 2029
    Not so fast, 2028. Our election for the Farage/Yaxley-Lennon/Tate/Braverman dream ticket is pencilled in for 2029.
    Indeed and what happens in 2029 is anyone's guess
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 43,257

    kinabalu said:

    Anyway this is why I don't like Mondays. It's the sort of day when the world’s wealthiest most influential nation and biggest military arsenal tends to get delivered into the hands of an unstable malevolent despot who cares only for his own enrichment and glorification. The big question, which I'm finding impossible to answer right now, is will I watch it? Revulsion is going head to head with fascination and it's too close to call.

    I think you'd find it better for your personal well-being to re-watch the UK election special from 4 July 2024, or, if that's too recent, the one from 1 May 1997, instead.
    Now there's a plan! But I must admit I'd trade the big Lab majority for a small one if I could have a Nov 5th rerun where Harris edges it.
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