Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

Defence of the realm – politicalbetting.com

123578

Comments

  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,495

    Mrs J made a comment about the Greggggg's 'excuse' that interested me. The reason why the complaints might be coming from middle-class women of a 'certain age' might be because they had had decades of putting up with this sort of shite from men, and may have the finances and support to survive if they never work in the industry again.

    Younger women might be much more frightened of what a backlash might do to their formative careers to speak out.

    I reckon there might be something to that.

    Have you seen who was complaining , more likely he was frightened of them
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,112
    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    Is Coke any worse than Cake?
  • AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 1,500
    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    And it's subsidised to the hilt - attacking HFCS is a proxy for attacking agricultural subsidies, which seems to be an odd choice for Trump's rural voter base.

    It's not really used in the UK, apart from in some low-volume imports, but Rishi clambered on board the anti-HFCS bandwagon when he went on about preferring Mexican Coke to those A-Level students a few years back (not sure why - Coke in the UK uses sugar beet).
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,972

    Taz said:

    Pretty brutal from the sage of Strathclyde.

    Transform Politics 🦋
    @tf_politics
    Damning verdict on Starmer’s government from pollster Sir John Curtice.

    “The fundamental question is whether a politician who has shown so far absolutely no ability to construct a narrative can suddenly construct a narrative”.

    Well he’s giving it a go

    https://x.com/keir_starmer/status/1863174257821245951?s=61
    I challenge ANY PM to build a narrative when 90% of the MSM Print and TV media will steadfastly refuse to report it let alone pass impartial comment on it..

    For those who ARE discecting fact from Fiction Labour are in the process of some significant improvements and enhancements across all of the main Sectors of State

    Immigration, Health, Transport, Defence, Environment, Economy, etc

    Meanwhile MSM are fixated on suits, Tickets and lost phones.
    You're simply complaining that SKS is a total twat.

    I was pointed out on here that running a campaign where he said zilch, would come to bite him in the arse as he had built no positions on which to define his government. He still hasn't and has no ideas.

    So unsurprisingly the media run with the story SKS is an arse.
    He is pretty ineffectual so far. The link to a comment from John Curtice that TUD posted was very damning.

    The trend from the start of the election to polling day was labours vote share fell. That has continued since.

    How does he turn it around from here ? Complaining about how the press report it, well that’s politics. It was no different when the Tories were in charge. It’s how things are and if they deliver rather than just worry about presentation then I expect things to come good for them. If not it’s over.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807
    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,934

    MattW said:

    They are actually weighing bundles of votes in Cavan-Monaghan. I always thought that was a joke.

    https://x.com/SeaninGraham22/status/1863184150666092887

    Those are postal scales.

    An eg A5 sheet of 100gsm paper is 2^5 = 32 sheets per 100g (A0 is 0.9995 sqm), so it is a good weigh (sorry) to measure. And being therefore 3g each at that size, it is a big enough margin to judge quantity on cheapish scales.

    And every Council in the land has them by the dozen.

    Pity the left over Imperial countries measuring Junior Tabloid voting slips in Pounds and Ounces.
    The ballot papers aren't A5. In Cavan-Monaghan they had 20 candidates, and the ballot papers have a photo for every one of them.

    But, yes. It's probably surprisingly practical.
    Given that politics is show business for ugly people - is it wise to have photos of them on the ballot papers?
    My wife did say that the photo of one of the independent candidates ruled him out straight away. He ended up with 29 votes.

    But for some candidates it will help voters see the all-important familial resemblance.
    "He's got our nose!" *ticks box*
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,826
    edited December 1
    I bet Mandleson told him to say nothing bar promising no council tax increases (which has proved to be
    a straightforward lie...]
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,934
    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    I'm sure some of the proponents still think that slaves produce the cane sugar...
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,972
    Blairites in despair at Starmer’s flailing leadership.

    https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/starmer-leadership-blairites-despair-b2656483.html
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,161

    MattW said:

    They are actually weighing bundles of votes in Cavan-Monaghan. I always thought that was a joke.

    https://x.com/SeaninGraham22/status/1863184150666092887

    Those are postal scales.

    An eg A5 sheet of 100gsm paper is 2^5 = 32 sheets per 100g (A0 is 0.9995 sqm), so it is a good weigh (sorry) to measure. And being therefore 3g each at that size, it is a big enough margin to judge quantity on cheapish scales.

    And every Council in the land has them by the dozen.

    Pity the left over Imperial countries measuring Junior Tabloid voting slips in Pounds and Ounces.
    The ballot papers aren't A5. In Cavan-Monaghan they had 20 candidates, and the ballot papers have a photo for every one of them.

    But, yes. It's probably surprisingly practical.
    Given that politics is show business for ugly people - is it wise to have photos of them on the ballot papers?
    My wife did say that the photo of one of the independent candidates ruled him out straight away. He ended up with 29 votes.

    But for some candidates it will help voters see the all-important familial resemblance.
    What about the candidates wearing black balaclavas?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,330

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
    I fear the two of you are under a misapprehension.

    Cane sugar is pretty much all sucrose. Sucrose is a disaccharide - a fructose molecule joined to a glucose molecule.

    HFCS is a mix of fructose and glucose in water. Actually, starch thta has been processed. Originally starch, hydrolysed to glucose which is partly converted to fructose, it seems.

    https://www.fda.gov/food/food-additives-petitions/high-fructose-corn-syrup-questions-and-answers

    Quite different, except insofar as various mono- and disaccharides tend to be water soluble, sticky and (if not toxic) quite calorific. The sucrose molecule, for one thing, is as it came out of tbe beetroot, albeit purified.
  • Taz said:
    Hard to disagree with that analysis
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,379
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    Pretty brutal from the sage of Strathclyde.

    Transform Politics 🦋
    @tf_politics
    Damning verdict on Starmer’s government from pollster Sir John Curtice.

    “The fundamental question is whether a politician who has shown so far absolutely no ability to construct a narrative can suddenly construct a narrative”.

    Well he’s giving it a go

    https://x.com/keir_starmer/status/1863174257821245951?s=61
    I challenge ANY PM to build a narrative when 90% of the MSM Print and TV media will steadfastly refuse to report it let alone pass impartial comment on it..

    For those who ARE discecting fact from Fiction Labour are in the process of some significant improvements and enhancements across all of the main Sectors of State

    Immigration, Health, Transport, Defence, Environment, Economy, etc

    Meanwhile MSM are fixated on suits, Tickets and lost phones.
    You're simply complaining that SKS is a total twat.

    I was pointed out on here that running a campaign where he said zilch, would come to bite him in the arse as he had built no positions on which to define his government. He still hasn't and has no ideas.

    So unsurprisingly the media run with the story SKS is an arse.
    He is pretty ineffectual so far. The link to a comment from John Curtice that TUD posted was very damning.

    The trend from the start of the election to polling day was labours vote share fell. That has continued since.

    How does he turn it around from here ? Complaining about how the press report it, well that’s politics. It was no different when the Tories were in charge. It’s how things are and if they deliver rather than just worry about presentation then I expect things to come good for them. If not it’s over.
    My response to the bit on bold is...unfortunately not. "Deliverism" may not work, see this link[1]. Harris's campaign eschewed deliverism in favour of vibes and "joy!", which failed, so we don't know how deliverism would have worked in practice, but I suspect it would have failed also.

    I referred to myself earlier as politically homeless, and I am forced to concede I don't know how politics works any more. I'm pretty sure that neoliberalism and the Sixth Party System has died, and I'm very sure I won't like what's coming next, but I don't know what it is. I suspect the answer will be found in gut instinct (one of the reasons why I biught up religion in the "Hell" article) and hindbrain stuff, instead of rationalisation. When you find out what is happening, let me know... :(

    [1]: https://democracyjournal.org/arguments/the-death-of-deliverism/
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,144
    edited December 1
    Taz said:
    They’d have been better sticking 2p on income tax, telling us straight what a mess we are all in, and used that shedload of money to go achieve something worthwhile.

    Instead they’ve tried to raise some small change by annoying those singled out to contribute, and tried to raise some more by lumping extra tax on employers, which will simply come back to bite consumers through higher prices for this and that and that.

    They should have realised they were destined to win the election anyway, given the abject failure of the Tories, and not boxed themselves in for a term with a bunch of idiotic promises.

    Like Blair, they risk under performing during their first term, through timidity. Unlike Blair, a second term isn’t by any means guaranteed.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807
    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
    I fear the two of you are under a misapprehension.

    Cane sugar is pretty much all sucrose. Sucrose is a disaccharide - a fructose molecule joined to a glucose molecule.

    HFCS is a mix of fructose and glucose in water. Actually, starch thta has been processed. Originally starch, hydrolysed to glucose which is partly converted to fructose, it seems.

    https://www.fda.gov/food/food-additives-petitions/high-fructose-corn-syrup-questions-and-answers

    Quite different, except insofar as various mono- and disaccharides tend to be water soluble, sticky and (if not toxic) quite calorific. The sucrose molecule, for one thing, is as it came out of tbe beetroot, albeit purified.
    How does what I've posted indicate a misapprehension on my part? I haven't stated anything about either substance.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,330
    edited December 1

    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
    I fear the two of you are under a misapprehension.

    Cane sugar is pretty much all sucrose. Sucrose is a disaccharide - a fructose molecule joined to a glucose molecule.

    HFCS is a mix of fructose and glucose in water. Actually, starch thta has been processed. Originally starch, hydrolysed to glucose which is partly converted to fructose, it seems.

    https://www.fda.gov/food/food-additives-petitions/high-fructose-corn-syrup-questions-and-answers

    Quite different, except insofar as various mono- and disaccharides tend to be water soluble, sticky and (if not toxic) quite calorific. The sucrose molecule, for one thing, is as it came out of tbe beetroot, albeit purified.
    How does what I've posted indicate a misapprehension on my part? I haven't stated anything about either substance.
    Apologies - had been muddled by your general approval of anti-processed food policies. Anyway, your question is now answered.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,934
    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,632

    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
    I fear the two of you are under a misapprehension.

    Cane sugar is pretty much all sucrose. Sucrose is a disaccharide - a fructose molecule joined to a glucose molecule.

    HFCS is a mix of fructose and glucose in water. Actually, starch thta has been processed. Originally starch, hydrolysed to glucose which is partly converted to fructose, it seems.

    https://www.fda.gov/food/food-additives-petitions/high-fructose-corn-syrup-questions-and-answers

    Quite different, except insofar as various mono- and disaccharides tend to be water soluble, sticky and (if not toxic) quite calorific. The sucrose molecule, for one thing, is as it came out of tbe beetroot, albeit purified.
    How does what I've posted indicate a misapprehension on my part? I haven't stated anything about either substance.
    I think there's an assumption you'd have been wrong.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,934
    edited December 1
    Liverpool all over Man City in the first 10 minutes - just had a shot rebound off the post.

    EDIT Now 1 - 0!
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,879
    IanB2 said:

    Taz said:
    They’d have been better sticking 2p on income tax, telling us straight what a mess we are all in, and used that shedload of money to go achieve something worthwhile.
    I make 2p on income tax as raising a little under £10bn per annum.

    AFAICS that's a scratch on the surface of what is needed in extra revenue.

    That would just about do an uptick in Defence spending to 2.5% of GDP, assuming we are starting from 2.1%.
  • Liverpool all over Man City in the first 10 minutes - just had a shot rebound off the post.

    EDIT Now 1 - 0!

    City look a shambles
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,934

    Liverpool all over Man City in the first 10 minutes - just had a shot rebound off the post.

    EDIT Now 1 - 0!

    City look a shambles
    They just look shell-shocked. They could be three down after 20 minutes.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,112

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    "Since I have been manager, I am proud to say there have only been twenty-three deaths. And not one of them was a staff member."
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,668

    Liverpool all over Man City in the first 10 minutes - just had a shot rebound off the post.

    EDIT Now 1 - 0!

    City look a shambles
    I agree. People just don't know how to handle dress-down Fridays.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,857
    viewcode said:

    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    Pretty brutal from the sage of Strathclyde.

    Transform Politics 🦋
    @tf_politics
    Damning verdict on Starmer’s government from pollster Sir John Curtice.

    “The fundamental question is whether a politician who has shown so far absolutely no ability to construct a narrative can suddenly construct a narrative”.

    Well he’s giving it a go

    https://x.com/keir_starmer/status/1863174257821245951?s=61
    I challenge ANY PM to build a narrative when 90% of the MSM Print and TV media will steadfastly refuse to report it let alone pass impartial comment on it..

    For those who ARE discecting fact from Fiction Labour are in the process of some significant improvements and enhancements across all of the main Sectors of State

    Immigration, Health, Transport, Defence, Environment, Economy, etc

    Meanwhile MSM are fixated on suits, Tickets and lost phones.
    You're simply complaining that SKS is a total twat.

    I was pointed out on here that running a campaign where he said zilch, would come to bite him in the arse as he had built no positions on which to define his government. He still hasn't and has no ideas.

    So unsurprisingly the media run with the story SKS is an arse.
    He is pretty ineffectual so far. The link to a comment from John Curtice that TUD posted was very damning.

    The trend from the start of the election to polling day was labours vote share fell. That has continued since.

    How does he turn it around from here ? Complaining about how the press report it, well that’s politics. It was no different when the Tories were in charge. It’s how things are and if they deliver rather than just worry about presentation then I expect things to come good for them. If not it’s over.
    My response to the bit on bold is...unfortunately not. "Deliverism" may not work, see this link[1]. Harris's campaign eschewed deliverism in favour of vibes and "joy!", which failed, so we don't know how deliverism would have worked in practice, but I suspect it would have failed also.

    I referred to myself earlier as politically homeless, and I am forced to concede I don't know how politics works any more. I'm pretty sure that neoliberalism and the Sixth Party System has died, and I'm very sure I won't like what's coming next, but I don't know what it is. I suspect the answer will be found in gut instinct (one of the reasons why I biught up religion in the "Hell" article) and hindbrain stuff, instead of rationalisation. When you find out what is happening, let me know... :(

    [1]: https://democracyjournal.org/arguments/the-death-of-deliverism/
    Rare but never out of fashion is the combination of competence, humility, delivery without triumphalism, first class communication, answering questions, admitting you don't know, honesty and simplicity of narrative. Worth a try. Oddly all the other routes seem to be failing, and I don't want to sample Reform's approach.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,835
    Update on the Groucho.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c5y8dddpwd2o

    Does a credible rape accusation normally result in an immediate license suspension? Suspect the details will be unusually serious.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,172
    .
    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
    I fear the two of you are under a misapprehension.

    Cane sugar is pretty much all sucrose. Sucrose is a disaccharide - a fructose molecule joined to a glucose molecule.

    HFCS is a mix of fructose and glucose in water. Actually, starch thta has been processed. Originally starch, hydrolysed to glucose which is partly converted to fructose, it seems.

    https://www.fda.gov/food/food-additives-petitions/high-fructose-corn-syrup-questions-and-answers

    Quite different, except insofar as various mono- and disaccharides tend to be water soluble, sticky and (if not toxic) quite calorific. The sucrose molecule, for one thing, is as it came out of tbe beetroot, albeit purified.
    Sucrose is broken down into its fructose and glucose components by stomach acid.
    (And possibly also by the acidity of Coke itself ?)
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,972

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,434

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    "Since I have been manager, I am proud to say there have only been twenty-three deaths. And not one of them was a staff member."
    Not of strict relevance, and being somewhat bemused by my leisure centre's incompetence in some matters, when a swimmer had a heart attack in the changing rooms earlier in the year, the staff were absolutely 100% brilliant in both managing the casualty and the other people present.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,857
    MattW said:

    IanB2 said:

    Taz said:
    They’d have been better sticking 2p on income tax, telling us straight what a mess we are all in, and used that shedload of money to go achieve something worthwhile.
    I make 2p on income tax as raising a little under £10bn per annum.

    AFAICS that's a scratch on the surface of what is needed in extra revenue.

    That would just about do an uptick in Defence spending to 2.5% of GDP, assuming we are starting from 2.1%.
    Yes. In very rough figures it seems to me that to be reasonably relaxed about expenditure and contingencies (there will be some) we need to either increase government income by about £100bn or decrease government commitments by about £100bn. A 70% rise in VAT might do it, or about 18p on IT. Neither are cheering prospects.

    The alternative is to carry on borrowing until UK plc belongs to Karloans and Wonga Ltd following a CCJ.

    Pick any one. I don't think others exist.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,934
    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    To be fair, you'd find any reason not to spend an early morning with Piers Morgan.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,972

    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    To be fair, you'd find any reason not to spend an early morning with Piers Morgan.
    Indeed, or for that matter any other time of day.
  • Shecorns88Shecorns88 Posts: 279
    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    We'll done Team Starmer.

    If someone refuses to engage in grown up politics, spreads lies and disinformation and always reports negatively there is a very simple solution.

    Cut off their oxygen. Refuse to cooperate. I'm staggered any self respecting politician gives the like of GBNews / Times etc a second of their time.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,826

    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    We'll done Team Starmer.

    If someone refuses to engage in grown up politics, spreads lies and disinformation and always reports negatively there is a very simple solution.

    Cut off their oxygen. Refuse to cooperate. I'm staggered any self respecting politician gives the like of GBNews / Times etc a second of their time.
    How do you feel about Grant Shapps...
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,125
    edited December 1

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Actually, Starmer's ministers and advisors are very typical of the pool from which they are drawn - middle management public sector, trade union, third sector and second-rate lawyers.

    Plenty of obsessive single-issue causes, from net zero to releasing criminals early to decolonising education to boosting public sector pay. But no experience in business or the armed forces, so no understanding of how to generate economic growth to pay for their fantasies or how to defend the country.

    So we get what 20% of us, anyway, voted for in July - five years of depressing stagnation and increasingly fractious relative decline.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,826

    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    We'll done Team Starmer.

    If someone refuses to engage in grown up politics, spreads lies and disinformation and always reports negatively there is a very simple solution.

    Cut off their oxygen. Refuse to cooperate. I'm staggered any self respecting politician gives the like of GBNews / Times etc a second of their time.
    It's not as though Andrew Neil is wrong. It shows major weakness to boycott Times Radio ..who next....
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,082

    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    We'll done Team Starmer.

    If someone refuses to engage in grown up politics, spreads lies and disinformation and always reports negatively there is a very simple solution.

    Cut off their oxygen. Refuse to cooperate. I'm staggered any self respecting politician gives the like of GBNews / Times etc a second of their time.
    Boycotting the media is always a measure of success or failure in government….

    A plane crashes on the Ukraine/Republic of China border. Which side do you bury the survivors?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,172

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Still, he hasn't invaded Iraq yet.

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,082
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    To be fair, you'd find any reason not to spend an early morning with Piers Morgan.
    Indeed, or for that matter any other time of day.
    Which is why the ultimate sanction on PB is to be locked in a room with Piers Morgan, Piers Corbyn and Julian Assange.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,668

    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    We'll done Team Starmer.

    If someone refuses to engage in grown up politics, spreads lies and disinformation and always reports negatively there is a very simple solution.

    Cut off their oxygen. Refuse to cooperate. I'm staggered any self respecting politician gives the like of GBNews / Times etc a second of their time.
    Hello @Heathener
  • AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 1,500
    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Still, he hasn't invaded Iraq yet.

    Honestly, the reaction of the old Blairites to their not automatically being treated as founts of wisdom by the new govt is fairly hilarious. You'd think that, more than 20 years on from trashing their own legacies, they'd have made their peace with ending their days in irrelevance and ignominy, but clearly not all of them have got the message.

    Does anyone know if it's just "gizza job" Mandelson behind these comments, or is it Blair himself who's feeling butthurt?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,172
    ... who must not be named.

    ChatGPT refuses to say the name “David Mayer,” and no one knows why.

    If you try to get it to write the name, the chat immediately ends.

    People have attempted all sorts of things - ciphers, riddles, tricks - and nothing works.

    https://x.com/venturetwins/status/1862910201113739328
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,330
    Nigelb said:

    .

    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
    I fear the two of you are under a misapprehension.

    Cane sugar is pretty much all sucrose. Sucrose is a disaccharide - a fructose molecule joined to a glucose molecule.

    HFCS is a mix of fructose and glucose in water. Actually, starch thta has been processed. Originally starch, hydrolysed to glucose which is partly converted to fructose, it seems.

    https://www.fda.gov/food/food-additives-petitions/high-fructose-corn-syrup-questions-and-answers

    Quite different, except insofar as various mono- and disaccharides tend to be water soluble, sticky and (if not toxic) quite calorific. The sucrose molecule, for one thing, is as it came out of tbe beetroot, albeit purified.
    Sucrose is broken down into its fructose and glucose components by stomach acid.
    (And possibly also by the acidity of Coke itself ?)
    Not what I was taught. You need enzymes. A little happens in the mouth but most in the small intestine.

    So the two products are digested differently.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,172
    edited December 1
    AlsoLei said:

    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Still, he hasn't invaded Iraq yet.

    Honestly, the reaction of the old Blairites to their not automatically being treated as founts of wisdom by the new govt is fairly hilarious. You'd think that, more than 20 years on from trashing their own legacies, they'd have made their peace with ending their days in irrelevance and ignominy, but clearly not all of them have got the message.

    Does anyone know if it's just "gizza job" Mandelson behind these comments, or is it Blair himself who's feeling butthurt?
    To be fair to Blair, his 'institute' has some not ridiculous ideas for government.
    But he offers no much more coherent national plan than does Starmer.

    And as you say, no acknowledgement of his own failures.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,972
    AlsoLei said:

    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Still, he hasn't invaded Iraq yet.

    Honestly, the reaction of the old Blairites to their not automatically being treated as founts of wisdom by the new govt is fairly hilarious. You'd think that, more than 20 years on from trashing their own legacies, they'd have made their peace with ending their days in irrelevance and ignominy, but clearly not all of them have got the message.

    Does anyone know if it's just "gizza job" Mandelson behind these comments, or is it Blair himself who's feeling butthurt?
    People may not like the message but they’re not exactly wrong. This is a govt relaunching after a meagre 5 months after all.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,442
    AlsoLei said:

    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Still, he hasn't invaded Iraq yet.

    Honestly, the reaction of the old Blairites to their not automatically being treated as founts of wisdom by the new govt is fairly hilarious. You'd think that, more than 20 years on from trashing their own legacies, they'd have made their peace with ending their days in irrelevance and ignominy, but clearly not all of them have got the message.

    Does anyone know if it's just "gizza job" Mandelson behind these comments, or is it Blair himself who's feeling butthurt?
    I suspect they're both bright enough to know that mithering to the press like that has no upside and considerable downside.

    It's a very human thing to do- see most retired sportsmen who go on to do commentary in their twilight years.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,826
    edited December 1
    Nigelb said:

    AlsoLei said:

    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Still, he hasn't invaded Iraq yet.

    Honestly, the reaction of the old Blairites to their not automatically being treated as founts of wisdom by the new govt is fairly hilarious. You'd think that, more than 20 years on from trashing their own legacies, they'd have made their peace with ending their days in irrelevance and ignominy, but clearly not all of them have got the message.

    Does anyone know if it's just "gizza job" Mandelson behind these comments, or is it Blair himself who's feeling butthurt?
    To be fair to Blair, his 'institute' has some not ridiculous ideas for government.
    But he offers no much more coherent national plan than does Starmer.

    And as you say, no acknowledgement of

    his own failures.



    What plans does Blair have?Who does he want to invade now?
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,972
    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
    I fear the two of you are under a misapprehension.

    Cane sugar is pretty much all sucrose. Sucrose is a disaccharide - a fructose molecule joined to a glucose molecule.

    HFCS is a mix of fructose and glucose in water. Actually, starch thta has been processed. Originally starch, hydrolysed to glucose which is partly converted to fructose, it seems.

    https://www.fda.gov/food/food-additives-petitions/high-fructose-corn-syrup-questions-and-answers

    Quite different, except insofar as various mono- and disaccharides tend to be water soluble, sticky and (if not toxic) quite calorific. The sucrose molecule, for one thing, is as it came out of tbe beetroot, albeit purified.
    Sucrose is broken down into its fructose and glucose components by stomach acid.
    (And possibly also by the acidity of Coke itself ?)
    Not what I was taught. You need enzymes. A little happens in the mouth but most in the small intestine.

    So the two products are digested differently.
    Are they used for the cola zero as artificial sweetener or the ‘full fat’ version.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,172
    Tiffany Trump’s father-in-law Massad Boulos to become senior presidential adviser on Arab affairs
    https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/5016398-president-elect-trump-appoints-massad-boulos/
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,114

    Republicans against Trump
    @RpsAgainstTrump

    More nepotism and corruption in the Trump administration.

    Donald Trump just announced that Massad Boulos , a Lebanese-born businessman and Tiffany Trump’s father-in-law will be appointed as a senior advisor for the Middle East:

    “He has been a longtime proponent of Republican and Conservative values, an asset to my Campaign,” says Trump.

    https://x.com/RpsAgainstTrump/status/1863255682306212274
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,807
    kinabalu said:

    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
    I fear the two of you are under a misapprehension.

    Cane sugar is pretty much all sucrose. Sucrose is a disaccharide - a fructose molecule joined to a glucose molecule.

    HFCS is a mix of fructose and glucose in water. Actually, starch thta has been processed. Originally starch, hydrolysed to glucose which is partly converted to fructose, it seems.

    https://www.fda.gov/food/food-additives-petitions/high-fructose-corn-syrup-questions-and-answers

    Quite different, except insofar as various mono- and disaccharides tend to be water soluble, sticky and (if not toxic) quite calorific. The sucrose molecule, for one thing, is as it came out of tbe beetroot, albeit purified.
    How does what I've posted indicate a misapprehension on my part? I haven't stated anything about either substance.
    I think there's an assumption you'd have been wrong.
    Lazy assumptions of that sort tend to make the assumer look like a prat. Sorry, more of a prat.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,835

    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    We'll done Team Starmer.

    If someone refuses to engage in grown up politics, spreads lies and disinformation and always reports negatively there is a very simple solution.

    Cut off their oxygen. Refuse to cooperate. I'm staggered any self respecting politician gives the like of GBNews / Times etc a second of their time.
    Hello @Heathener
    This is the new version which doesn't use personal details so doesn't get caught in contradictions.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,268


    Republicans against Trump
    @RpsAgainstTrump

    More nepotism and corruption in the Trump administration.

    Donald Trump just announced that Massad Boulos , a Lebanese-born businessman and Tiffany Trump’s father-in-law will be appointed as a senior advisor for the Middle East:

    “He has been a longtime proponent of Republican and Conservative values, an asset to my Campaign,” says Trump.

    https://x.com/RpsAgainstTrump/status/1863255682306212274

    Say "Republicans against Trump"? I'm sure the Bushes and the Cheneys find the idea of appointing a family member incomprehensible.
  • Liverpool 2 City 0

    77 mins
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,934
    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Still, he hasn't invaded Iraq yet.

    He's probably rich enough to fund a private army these days....
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,122


    Republicans against Trump
    @RpsAgainstTrump

    More nepotism and corruption in the Trump administration.

    Donald Trump just announced that Massad Boulos , a Lebanese-born businessman and Tiffany Trump’s father-in-law will be appointed as a senior advisor for the Middle East:

    “He has been a longtime proponent of Republican and Conservative values, an asset to my Campaign,” says Trump.

    https://x.com/RpsAgainstTrump/status/1863255682306212274

    Say "Republicans against Trump"? I'm sure the Bushes and the Cheneys find the idea of appointing a family member incomprehensible.
    Well to be fair, the voters appointed Cheney and Bush Junior, not their fathers. Or indeed fathers in law.

    Once again, it seems that Trump intends to preside over an administration that is even more blackguardly unscrupulous and disreputable than Warren Harding´s teapot dome cronies.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,632
    Nigelb said:

    Tiffany Trump’s father-in-law Massad Boulos to become senior presidential adviser on Arab affairs
    https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/5016398-president-elect-trump-appoints-massad-boulos/

    Nothing for Tiffany?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,172
    edited December 1
    kinabalu said:

    Nigelb said:

    Tiffany Trump’s father-in-law Massad Boulos to become senior presidential adviser on Arab affairs
    https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/5016398-president-elect-trump-appoints-massad-boulos/

    Nothing for Tiffany?
    Is she not being lined up for the Florida governorship ?

    That at least is in the Bush tradition.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,984
    Just noting turnout in the Irish General Election very similar to the UK turnout in July.

  • "If you could win an Olympic medal for causing offence, then 60-year-old Gregg Wallace would be on track for gold"

    https://x.com/Telegraph/status/1863279248112283706

    There is no such thing as offence, as the Telegraph reports day after day. So something clearly has gone wrong.
  • I am sure the Blairites would not have done what SKS has done but it is undeniable they came into a much easier environment than Labour has now.
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,990

    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    We'll done Team Starmer.

    If someone refuses to engage in grown up politics, spreads lies and disinformation and always reports negatively there is a very simple solution.

    Cut off their oxygen. Refuse to cooperate. I'm staggered any self respecting politician gives the like of GBNews / Times etc a second of their time.
    Hello @Heathener
    A self respecting politician is obviously deluded
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,934
    2 - 0 final score.

    Liverpool 11 points ahead of City, 9 ahead of the chasing pack.

    To stop TSE being insufferable I will have to remind him of Forest winning at Anfield this season...
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,082
    Cicero said:


    Republicans against Trump
    @RpsAgainstTrump

    More nepotism and corruption in the Trump administration.

    Donald Trump just announced that Massad Boulos , a Lebanese-born businessman and Tiffany Trump’s father-in-law will be appointed as a senior advisor for the Middle East:

    “He has been a longtime proponent of Republican and Conservative values, an asset to my Campaign,” says Trump.

    https://x.com/RpsAgainstTrump/status/1863255682306212274

    Say "Republicans against Trump"? I'm sure the Bushes and the Cheneys find the idea of appointing a family member incomprehensible.
    Well to be fair, the voters appointed Cheney and Bush Junior, not their fathers. Or indeed fathers in law.

    Once again, it seems that Trump intends to preside over an administration that is even more blackguardly unscrupulous and disreputable than Warren Harding´s teapot dome cronies.
    That’s a disgraceful comparison. Warren Harding appointed a number of excellent subordinates (Hoover etc) got on well with nearly everyone and every nation, negotiated the Naval Treaty that engaged the whole world in cooperation and ended the rather bizarre persecution of anti-war (WWI) activists.

    The corruption under his administration was rather conventional, as compared with tearing up democracy..
  • Shecorns88Shecorns88 Posts: 279
    An excellent and very balanced article of about 10 minutes on BBC Countryfile on the Farming IHT issue.

    More fact based in terms of the actual proposals, tax experts and viewpoints from Farmers for and against the proposals.

    Steve Reed and Tom Bradshaw NFU also interviewed.

    The Clarksons of this world will hate it but I'm sure the silent majority will be much better informed having seen it.
  • Shecorns88Shecorns88 Posts: 279

    Taz said:

    Taz said:
    "Someone close to Tony Blair says that Keir Starmer’s problem, apart from the fact that his ministers and aides are not very good, is that they are “a bunch of librarians and academics in charge of a government”."

    Or indeed, a leisure centre manager. We did try to warn you...

    ""The Brittas Empire" was an often bizarre journey through a world filled with disaster... Gordon Brittas, the well-intentioned but hugely incompetent manager..."
    Team Starmer have the same thin skin as Team Boris. Andrew Neil reports after describing the labour front team as second rate they have boycotted his Times Radio show in a fit of pique in the same was Boris boycotted Piers Morgan on GMB,
    We'll done Team Starmer.

    If someone refuses to engage in grown up politics, spreads lies and disinformation and always reports negatively there is a very simple solution.

    Cut off their oxygen. Refuse to cooperate. I'm staggered any self respecting politician gives the like of GBNews / Times etc a second of their time.
    How do you feel about Grant Shapps...
    Which one??
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,330
    Taz said:

    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
    I fear the two of you are under a misapprehension.

    Cane sugar is pretty much all sucrose. Sucrose is a disaccharide - a fructose molecule joined to a glucose molecule.

    HFCS is a mix of fructose and glucose in water. Actually, starch thta has been processed. Originally starch, hydrolysed to glucose which is partly converted to fructose, it seems.

    https://www.fda.gov/food/food-additives-petitions/high-fructose-corn-syrup-questions-and-answers

    Quite different, except insofar as various mono- and disaccharides tend to be water soluble, sticky and (if not toxic) quite calorific. The sucrose molecule, for one thing, is as it came out of tbe beetroot, albeit purified.
    Sucrose is broken down into its fructose and glucose components by stomach acid.
    (And possibly also by the acidity of Coke itself ?)
    Not what I was taught. You need enzymes. A little happens in the mouth but most in the small intestine.

    So the two products are digested differently.
    Are they used for the cola zero as artificial sweetener or the ‘full fat’ version.
    No idea. They wouldn't be regarded as artificial sweetener, though, as they're just plain sugars per se.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,972

    2 - 0 final score.

    Liverpool 11 points ahead of City, 9 ahead of the chasing pack.

    To stop TSE being insufferable I will have to remind him of Forest winning at Anfield this season...

    Someone here, Kinabalu IIRC is on Liverpool at 8/1 to win the league. As much as I don’t like Liverpool it would be nice to see him win that.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,420
    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m0025gqs/irresistible-why-we-cant-stop-eating on iPlayer is very good on how the food industry has very carefully made food irresistible, so we'll buy more, with the result that obesity and diabetes levels are soaring.

    What it doesn't do is note that this is the result of capitalism. Companies use modern techniques to maximise profits and, too often, care little about the consequences. The question is how do we balance the good parts of capitalism with these excesses. The programme does talk about possible government regulation around food, drawing inspiration from Latin American policies like clear labelling and taxes on ultraprocessed food. I'd like to see politicians make that case more widely.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,632
    Taz said:

    2 - 0 final score.

    Liverpool 11 points ahead of City, 9 ahead of the chasing pack.

    To stop TSE being insufferable I will have to remind him of Forest winning at Anfield this season...

    Someone here, Kinabalu IIRC is on Liverpool at 8/1 to win the league. As much as I don’t like Liverpool it would be nice to see him win that.
    Yes, thank you. It's a bet I'm really proud of because my reasoning (the Klopp to Slot switch would help not hinder them) was a little bit out of the box.
  • An excellent and very balanced article of about 10 minutes on BBC Countryfile on the Farming IHT issue.

    More fact based in terms of the actual proposals, tax experts and viewpoints from Farmers for and against the proposals.

    Steve Reed and Tom Bradshaw NFU also interviewed.

    The Clarksons of this world will hate it but I'm sure the silent majority will be much better informed having seen it.

    The same Steve Reed who opposed this tax on record before the election
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,609
    edited December 1
    kinabalu said:

    Taz said:

    2 - 0 final score.

    Liverpool 11 points ahead of City, 9 ahead of the chasing pack.

    To stop TSE being insufferable I will have to remind him of Forest winning at Anfield this season...

    Someone here, Kinabalu IIRC is on Liverpool at 8/1 to win the league. As much as I don’t like Liverpool it would be nice to see him win that.
    Yes, thank you. It's a bet I'm really proud of because my reasoning (the Klopp to Slot switch would help not hinder them) was a little bit out of the box.
    Good luck and it looks inspired, but I am sure you are not taking it for granted
  • carnforth said:

    We have seen a government with a majority of 80 fail to govern, and one with a majority of 160 get bogged down and have to relaunch after five months.

    Are big majorities overrated?

    I think they are and they lead to poor governance as we have seen and are now witnessing
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,632
    edited December 1

    kinabalu said:

    Carnyx said:

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    What information to you have about the relative merits of the biochemical make up of cane sugar vs. high fructose corn syrup? It's not something we've seen much posting from you on before.
    I fear the two of you are under a misapprehension.

    Cane sugar is pretty much all sucrose. Sucrose is a disaccharide - a fructose molecule joined to a glucose molecule.

    HFCS is a mix of fructose and glucose in water. Actually, starch thta has been processed. Originally starch, hydrolysed to glucose which is partly converted to fructose, it seems.

    https://www.fda.gov/food/food-additives-petitions/high-fructose-corn-syrup-questions-and-answers

    Quite different, except insofar as various mono- and disaccharides tend to be water soluble, sticky and (if not toxic) quite calorific. The sucrose molecule, for one thing, is as it came out of tbe beetroot, albeit purified.
    How does what I've posted indicate a misapprehension on my part? I haven't stated anything about either substance.
    I think there's an assumption you'd have been wrong.
    Lazy assumptions of that sort tend to make the assumer look like a prat. Sorry, more of a prat.
    Prat? You're surely not meaning me there. No, it's fine, you can't be. All ok.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,632

    kinabalu said:

    Taz said:

    2 - 0 final score.

    Liverpool 11 points ahead of City, 9 ahead of the chasing pack.

    To stop TSE being insufferable I will have to remind him of Forest winning at Anfield this season...

    Someone here, Kinabalu IIRC is on Liverpool at 8/1 to win the league. As much as I don’t like Liverpool it would be nice to see him win that.
    Yes, thank you. It's a bet I'm really proud of because my reasoning (the Klopp to Slot switch would help not hinder them) was a little bit out of the box.
    Good luck and it looks inspired, but I am sure you are not taking it for granted
    Oh no. Long way to go.
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,352
    edited December 1

    2 - 0 final score.

    Liverpool 11 points ahead of City, 9 ahead of the chasing pack.

    To stop TSE being insufferable I will have to remind him of Forest winning at Anfield this season...

    The slight but important difference for the chasing pack is that they are only hunting down one team. If one of them puts a run together only Liverpool have to falter.

    This is materially different to sort of falling behind a United or a Chelsea or an Arsenal have often done at this stage in the last decade, where a tighter race at the top leaves them 10 points behind not one, but two, three or maybe even four teams and those teams ALL have to falter for the race to open up to the laggard.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,082
    carnforth said:

    We have seen a government with a majority of 80 fail to govern, and one with a majority of 160 get bogged down and have to relaunch after five months.

    Are big majorities overrated?

    In neither case was (or is) the problem the majority.

    Both government could (and can) pass legislation easily. Coming up with a joined plan of implementable policies is a different thing.

    For example - if Starmer went to the Commons with a plan to increase training places in the NHS, over the next decade, to 100% of planned requirements, he would get the votes of 100% of his MPs, probably without bothering to whip.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,945
    Quote of the moment has to be: "A handful of middle-class women of a certain age".
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,399


    Republicans against Trump
    @RpsAgainstTrump

    More nepotism and corruption in the Trump administration.

    Donald Trump just announced that Massad Boulos , a Lebanese-born businessman and Tiffany Trump’s father-in-law will be appointed as a senior advisor for the Middle East:

    “He has been a longtime proponent of Republican and Conservative values, an asset to my Campaign,” says Trump.

    https://x.com/RpsAgainstTrump/status/1863255682306212274

    Does Trump's entire government consist of his own relatives and people he has seen on telly?
  • Andy_JS said:

    Quote of the moment has to be: "A handful of middle-class women of a certain age".

    How to become the most unpopular and unpleasant male in one moments madness of thought
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,112
    carnforth said:

    We have seen a government with a majority of 80 fail to govern, and one with a majority of 160 get bogged down and have to relaunch after five months.

    Are big majorities overrated?

    I think the biggest problem is the turnover of MPs. Half the government MPs have only been in for 4 months, and with the cull of 2015 and 2019 all parties have a shortage of veterans, and particularly a shortage of those with ministerial experience. It is very likely to be so again next GE.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,112

    Andy_JS said:

    Quote of the moment has to be: "A handful of middle-class women of a certain age".

    How to become the most unpopular and unpleasant male in one moments madness of thought
    Particularly as middle class women of a certain age are his audience, including Mrs Foxy!
  • Penddu2Penddu2 Posts: 717

    AlsoLei said:

    mwadams said:

    MattW said:

    We need to rearm, I'm afraid.

    Preparing for a war is the best way to stop a war from ever happening.

    I'm very inclined to agree there, that yes we do need to rearm in significant measure.

    I'd quite appreciate a header, comparing rearmament in the 1930s vs now, with costs and with respect to the economic background. I'll make this chart of Defence Expenditure from 1900 to present. It's a surprise how low it was right up to 1914, and ramping up in the 1930s was a little earlier - from around 1936.

    But the numbers are deceptive due to the British Empire being dominant in the world economy in the early years (from WIki - 1870: 24%; 1913: 20%, USA: 9% and 19%), as the USA has been recently - whilst also being in relative decline.


    I do think we need to be "correctly armed". Which, AFAICT means determining what we can possibly do independently (i.e. what we actually need to defend our own population; mainly anti-drone and missile tech), what we want to stockpile to support others on actual frontlines (artillery, air defence, medium range missile systems) and what forces we will need to act in concert with various permutations of allies to be able to put a coherent army into the field that is a serious deterrent to conventional attack of those allies.

    In the current climate most of that hinges on what close cooperation we can develop with Poland, France, and the Scandinavian/Baltics countries.
    The new government is gearing up for a new Strategic Defence Review process, which should give us a better basis for discussion.

    The last one, published in March 2021 (after having been delayed for over a year by Brexit and the pandemic) was outdated almost from the start, and has been revised piecemeal since then to account for the changed threat environment with Russia and Iran coming to the fore and our withdrawal from Afghanistan.

    I do think we need to be very sceptical about some of our current spending - are our aircraft carriers really worth it if we're worried primarily about Russia and their proxies? Would the £1bn or so that we pay each year just to keep them floating not be better spent on the likes of NCSA, or on turning the NPSA into a real agency rather than a slightly-pathetic front for the Security Service?
    You surrender the carriers you end, in one fell swoop, any ability of ours to launch an expeditionary operation worldwide.

    No.
    But why would you want to..?
  • Shecorns88Shecorns88 Posts: 279

    An excellent and very balanced article of about 10 minutes on BBC Countryfile on the Farming IHT issue.

    More fact based in terms of the actual proposals, tax experts and viewpoints from Farmers for and against the proposals.

    Steve Reed and Tom Bradshaw NFU also interviewed.

    The Clarksons of this world will hate it but I'm sure the silent majority will be much better informed having seen it.

    The same Steve Reed who opposed this tax on record before the election
    The same Steve Teed who wasn't aware the Tories had spent the emergency find 3x over and made huge unfounded tax cuts 3 months before the GE

    The same Steve Reed who persuaded the Chancellor to give real Farmers a £5, 000,000,000 increase in funding over the next 2 years.

    Watch the article you might learn something.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,744
    edited December 1
    carnforth said:

    We have seen a government with a majority of 80 fail to govern, and one with a majority of 160 get bogged down and have to relaunch after five months.

    Are big majorities overrated?

    I suspect with Labour your average person would be hard-pressed to say what they'd actually done with it so far other than removing winter fuel allowance, and farmer's IHT.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,945
    You couldn't get two more different presenters of a show like Masterchef than Loyd Grossman and Greg Wallace. When they changed the format it was almost as if they wanted to make as big a change as possible in terms of presenters.
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,352

    Andy_JS said:

    Quote of the moment has to be: "A handful of middle-class women of a certain age".

    How to become the most unpopular and unpleasant male in one moments madness of thought
    Given it's Greg Wallace we can only be thankful he didn't follow it up with '...and anything more than a handful's a waste'.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    So. Here I go again - on my own. Basically going down the only road I’ve ever known

    Occurs to me I’m like a drifter: born to walk alone
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,112

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m0025gqs/irresistible-why-we-cant-stop-eating on iPlayer is very good on how the food industry has very carefully made food irresistible, so we'll buy more, with the result that obesity and diabetes levels are soaring.

    What it doesn't do is note that this is the result of capitalism. Companies use modern techniques to maximise profits and, too often, care little about the consequences. The question is how do we balance the good parts of capitalism with these excesses. The programme does talk about possible government regulation around food, drawing inspiration from Latin American policies like clear labelling and taxes on ultraprocessed food. I'd like to see politicians make that case more widely.
    The rules about corporations effectively guarantee that they act like sociopaths, caring only about their own interests rather than wider society. It's a fundamental flaw in the system.
  • Penddu2Penddu2 Posts: 717

    Nunu3 said:

    Bombshell poll in Wales:

    Welsh Parliament / Senedd Voting Intention: PLC: 24% (+3) LAB: 23% (-13) RFM: 23% (+22) CON: 19% (-6) GRN: 6% (+2) LDM: 5% (+1) Via

    @YouGov

    , 25-29 Nov. Changes w/ 2021 List Vote.

    I would say this poll is as bad for the tories as it is for Labour, as the biggest beneficiary of midterm blues are REFORM not HM official opposition.

    https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/yougov-poll-wales-plaid-labour-30489604

    Reform could easily overtake the Tories in Wales.

    If I were the Conservatives I'd be very worried.
    uhh....according to this poll they just have!
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,945
    edited December 1
    Leon said:

    So. Here I go again - on my own. Basically going down the only road I’ve ever known

    Occurs to me I’m like a drifter: born to walk alone

    Where are you off to this time?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    So. Here I go again - on my own. Basically going down the only road I’ve ever known

    Occurs to me I’m like a drifter: born to walk alone

    Where are you off to this time?
    Heathrow
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,352
    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    So. Here I go again - on my own. Basically going down the only road I’ve ever known

    Occurs to me I’m like a drifter: born to walk alone

    Where are you off to this time?
    Heathrow
    The 'I ain't wasting no more time' line doesn't apply, then.
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,676
    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    From the guys who want to abolish regulation.

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. allegedly intends to require Coca-Cola to begin using Cane Sugar instead of High-Fructose Syrup as HHS Secretary.
    https://x.com/realTrumpNewsX/status/1862630636126687702

    Note that the HFCS used in Coke is barely different in chemical terms from cane sugar extract. They're both around 50/50 fructose/glucose.

    Coke (including the diet version, though that's nit quite as bad) is just bad for you, and will be just as bad after Kennedy's bit of nonsense.

    The problem with HFCS is not that it's worse than cane sugar; it's that the US food industry put it in almost everything.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m0025gqs/irresistible-why-we-cant-stop-eating on iPlayer is very good on how the food industry has very carefully made food irresistible, so we'll buy more, with the result that obesity and diabetes levels are soaring.

    What it doesn't do is note that this is the result of capitalism. Companies use modern techniques to maximise profits and, too often, care little about the consequences. The question is how do we balance the good parts of capitalism with these excesses. The programme does talk about possible government regulation around food, drawing inspiration from Latin American policies like clear labelling and taxes on ultraprocessed food. I'd like to see politicians make that case more widely.
    The rules about corporations effectively guarantee that they act like sociopaths, caring only about their own interests rather than wider society. It's a fundamental flaw in the system.
    That's a really powerful observation.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,082
    Andy_JS said:

    Quote of the moment has to be: "A handful of middle-class women of a certain age".

    When on fire, Uncle Malmesbury’s tip is not to pour a jerrycan of petrol over your head.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,496
    Pro_Rata said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    So. Here I go again - on my own. Basically going down the only road I’ve ever known

    Occurs to me I’m like a drifter: born to walk alone

    Where are you off to this time?
    Heathrow
    The 'I ain't wasting no more time' line doesn't apply, then.
    lol. Spotted!
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,676
    Leon said:

    So. Here I go again - on my own. Basically going down the only road I’ve ever known

    Occurs to me I’m like a drifter: born to walk alone

    Yet you need the stimulation of intelligent company.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,112
    Leon said:

    So. Here I go again - on my own. Basically going down the only road I’ve ever known

    Occurs to me I’m like a drifter: born to walk alone

    There's a voice, that keeps on calling me
    Down the road, that's where I'll always be
    Every stop I make, I make a new friend
    Can't stay for long, Just turn around
    and I'm gone again
    Maybe tomorrow, I'll want to settle down
    Until tomorrow, I'll just keep moving on
This discussion has been closed.