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Inevitability, even the MRP says it is too close to call – politicalbetting.com

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  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,277
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIIHF3L_Y6c

    They're Eating The Dogs; They're Eating The Cats.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,486
    edited September 27

    Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Labour will spin next year’s locals as good for Labour as they were last held in 2021 which was peak Boris.
    The 2025 locals will be greatly impacted by how many candidates Reform are able to field.
    Partly that would be about having that sort of party organsiation on the ground. But also- how far are Reform supporters motivated by the sort of responsibiliites that local councils have?

    The one to watch for Reform might be the new Linconshire mayorality. (How can counties have Mayors? They should be called Sheriffs, or if you want proper romanticism, Counts.)
    'Counts' is what they are called in abroadland, where they are usually fictional villains. Here they are earls, and the clue is that an earl's wife is a countess. And these positions are already mostly occupied, and if not by earls then by Dukes, and if not by modern incumbents, by Shakespeare.

    Sheriffs are already taken, and appointed regularly IIRC by HMKCIII from among the great and good.

    Counties of course can't possibly have mayors. What about County Customer Services Czar?
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273

    Russia appears to have successfully deterred the US from allowing Ukraine to use Western weaponry to strike military targets deep inside Russia.

    Meanwhile, NATO member Hungary has said that they would not have resisted a Russian invasion of their country, and Ukraine shouldn't have done so either.

    Today does not feel like a good day for the collective defence of democracies against authoritarians.

    Thanks are shit scared, they prefer easy targets
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,316

    maxh said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "The NHS must no longer “nick” people from abroad to staff the health service, Wes Streeting has said.

    The Health Secretary has pledged that he will reduce the NHS’ “overreliance” on migrants to staff the health service and will train “our own homegrown talent”."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/09/27/politics-latest-news-starmer-labour-us-trump/

    This seems the right thing to do on so many levels. I wonder what the funding implications are, though.
    The biggest cost will be providing training places within the NHS. The degrees are a fraction of that.
    Don't we need to have a load more doctors in order to train a load more doctors?
    Training places (placements) will always be a challenge. It is for pharmacy too. Ultimately you need to have the capacity to train the next generation, and frankly that capacity equals money invested.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,909

    Russia appears to have successfully deterred the US from allowing Ukraine to use Western weaponry to strike military targets deep inside Russia.

    Meanwhile, NATO member Hungary has said that they would not have resisted a Russian invasion of their country, and Ukraine shouldn't have done so either.

    Today does not feel like a good day for the collective defence of democracies against authoritarians.

    Hungary under Orban is interested only in its own advantage, and Orban currently sees being a Russian poodle as part of that.
    His advice for anyone else is less than worthless.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,482
    Morning Consult poll of swing states (26th September):

    Arizona - Harris by 3%
    Georgia* - tied
    North Carolina - Harris by 2%
    Nevada - Harris by 7%
    Michigan - Harris by 3%
    Wisconsin - Harris by 3%
    Pennsylvania - Harris by 5%

    *Note on Georgia - a Fox News poll just released has Harris +3 (conduted 20th-24th September).

    That Penn number is very good for Harris. I wonder if playing the "Trump hates Ukraine" card there to the huge Polish community is showing through in the polling?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987
    algarkirk said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Quite a lot of people like our climate because they dislike heat. This is not a fashionable view, perhaps because it isn't possible to commercialise or advertise the concept of liking rather boring middling weather - outside temperature at say 16-21 C.
    Indeed, and I can understand that - my recent month in France was an eye-opener. As I say I've always loved Mediterranean summer weather, but this year in Provence it felt TOO hot. It was 36-38C day after day and weirdly stifling. YUK. If this is the new Med summer they can shove it

    Up in l'Aveyron (where we fled) it was 26-30C and just as sunny and that's perfect, for me, also the nights are cooler and so much more comfortable

    At the other end of the scale we have London, right now, where it is 10C -Ten fucking Centigrade - and wet and windy, at 1pm in late September, that's eight degrees BELOW average. Ugh!
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,567
    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,960
    algarkirk said:

    Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Labour will spin next year’s locals as good for Labour as they were last held in 2021 which was peak Boris.
    The 2025 locals will be greatly impacted by how many candidates Reform are able to field.
    Partly that would be about having that sort of party organsiation on the ground. But also- how far are Reform supporters motivated by the sort of responsibiliites that local councils have?

    The one to watch for Reform might be the new Linconshire mayorality. (How can counties have Mayors? They should be called Sheriffs, or if you want proper romanticism, Counts.)
    'Counts' is what they are called in abroadland, where they are usually fictional villains. Here they are earls, and the clue is that an earl's wife is a countess. And these positions are already mostly occupied, and if not by earls then by Dukes, and if not by modern incumbents, by Shakespeare.

    Sheriffs are already taken, and appointed regularly IIRC by HMKCIII from among the great and good.

    Counties of course can't possibly have mayors. What about County Customer Services Czar?
    Czar for County Customer Protection, СССР
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    I’d have more time for your baleful meteorological vignettes did you post when the English weather was good. As it was, for instance, for much of the earlier part of this month. It changed pretty much on the equinox, as the season itself changed from summer to autumn. Yet all we heard from you at the time was VANCOUVER.

    The idea that a green and pleasant land exposed to the whims of the North Atlantic should have the climate of the south of France is, er, somewhat niche.
    That's probably coz I was in..... VANCOUVER??
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273

    eek said:

    Telstar said:

    FF43 said:

    Despite his many problems its good to see SKS has the full support of Donald Trump.

    "Donald Trump heaped praise on “popular” Sir Keir Starmer ahead of the first meeting between the pair on Thursday night."

    Some cheer for the PB Left

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/09/26/starmer-talks-trump-unavailable-harris/

    At last some good news for SKS!
    He approves of his embezzlement!
    Point of order. Starmer hasn't embezzled anything. Unlike people associated with the Conservative Party who stole £15 billion from the State in dodgy Covid contracts.
    No journalists (to my knowledge) have pointed out that if you run a business and received £100k worth of freebies you might be in trouble under the Bribery Act and you almost certainly would have top pay Benefit in Kind tax. As he is already in the 45% bracket it means he ought to get a tax bill of £45k

    Any accountants in that want to comment? Am I right?

    FF43 said:

    Despite his many problems its good to see SKS has the full support of Donald Trump.

    "Donald Trump heaped praise on “popular” Sir Keir Starmer ahead of the first meeting between the pair on Thursday night."

    Some cheer for the PB Left

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/09/26/starmer-talks-trump-unavailable-harris/

    At last some good news for SKS!
    He approves of his embezzlement!
    Point of order. Starmer hasn't embezzled anything. Unlike people associated with the Conservative Party who stole £15 billion from the State in dodgy Covid contracts.
    No journalists (to my knowledge) have pointed out that if you run a business and received £100k worth of freebies you might be in trouble under the Bribery Act and you almost certainly would have top pay Benefit in Kind tax. As he is already in the 45% bracket it means he ought to get a tax bill of £45k

    Any accountants in that want to comment? Am I right?
    I could quote you the relevant tax rules issued by HMRC but as a broad rule, if you are not an employee of the hospitality provider there is no BIK arising.

    Why ale house accountants continue to post such rubbish is beyond me.

    The provision of 10 Downing Street as accommodation is a BIK and if you google it you will find Sunaks broad tax details

    Thanks for your clarification but no need to be a partisan pompous dick about it.

    In my view BIK or capital gains or some sort of tax on this type of value, particularly when it relates to a gift that is given because someone is a minister of state, should apply. If I attempted to claim clothing through my business on the dubious claim I needed to "look smart for my work" I would pay BIK. Starmer's view (and perhaps yours) is clearly that all those in the public sector, including himself, should be given special treatment.

    Anyhow, I think I'd rather be "an ale house account" than a real one!! In the words of John Cleese: "Well, er, yes Mr. Anchovy, but you see your report here says that you are an extremely dull person. You see, our experts describe you as an appallingly dull fellow, unimaginative, timid, lacking in initiative, spineless, easily dominated, no sense of humour, tedious company and irrepressibly drab and awful. And whereas in most professions these would be considerable drawbacks, in chartered accountancy they are a positive boon."
    In your view != what the law says.
    Is this not a site where people give opinions? It might be a loophole that Starmer wriggles his hypocritical, but nontheless well dressed person through. If a business person would get hammered for BIK for trying to put his/her suits through the books, the same should apply to our politicians. Personally I couldn't give a shit about the football attendance (politicians go to these types of events), it is the greedy tasteless extravagance on clothjng and the double standard that is clearly being demonstrated.
    law you don't like != loophole
    Erm - the whole idea of being in a parliamentary democracy is that laws that are inequitable can and should be changed. Politicians believing that different rules apply to them then those of us that they apply laws to, is not a good look for said democracy.
    People in this thread have been explaining to you that the same rules do apply to politicians, and that you’re erroneously convinced that the rules are something other than they are,
    Absolute bollox, how many on here would still be employed if they had trousers 120k as part of their job with extremely tenuous connections to that employment and handed out favours to the donor. Totally barking trying to pretend it is normal.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,271
    algarkirk said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Quite a lot of people like our climate because they dislike heat. This is not a fashionable view, perhaps because it isn't possible to commercialise or advertise the concept of liking rather boring middling weather - outside temperature at say 16-21 C.
    18C was hot enough for Newton - "the heat at midday about the month of July" - and so it's hot enough for me.

    Very pleasant outside this lunchtime in the Barony of West Carbery. 14C, 400W/sqm and 5kph wind.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273
    malcolmg said:

    Russia appears to have successfully deterred the US from allowing Ukraine to use Western weaponry to strike military targets deep inside Russia.

    Meanwhile, NATO member Hungary has said that they would not have resisted a Russian invasion of their country, and Ukraine shouldn't have done so either.

    Today does not feel like a good day for the collective defence of democracies against authoritarians.

    Thanks are shit scared, they prefer easy targets
    Fecking autocorrect should have been yanks,
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,039
    edited September 27
    Nigelb said:

    Russia appears to have successfully deterred the US from allowing Ukraine to use Western weaponry to strike military targets deep inside Russia.

    Meanwhile, NATO member Hungary has said that they would not have resisted a Russian invasion of their country, and Ukraine shouldn't have done so either.

    Today does not feel like a good day for the collective defence of democracies against authoritarians.

    Hungary under Orban is interested only in its own advantage, and Orban currently sees being a Russian poodle as part of that.
    His advice for anyone else is less than worthless.
    It would be interesting to use a Time Machine to introduce Orban to Admiral Horthy

    A night at the Opera….


    “.. two or three men were on the floor and he [Horthy] had another by the throat, slapping his face and shouting what I learned afterward was: "So you would betray your country, would you?" The Regent was alone, but he had the situation in hand.... The whole incident was typical not only of the Regent's deep hatred of alien doctrine, but of the kind of man he is. Although he was around seventy-two years of age, it did not occur to him to ask for help; he went right ahead like a skipper with a mutiny on his hands.”
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 10,960
    algarkirk said:

    maxh said:

    maxh said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "The NHS must no longer “nick” people from abroad to staff the health service, Wes Streeting has said.

    The Health Secretary has pledged that he will reduce the NHS’ “overreliance” on migrants to staff the health service and will train “our own homegrown talent”."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/09/27/politics-latest-news-starmer-labour-us-trump/

    This seems the right thing to do on so many levels. I wonder what the funding implications are, though.
    The biggest cost will be providing training places within the NHS. The degrees are a fraction of that.
    Don't we need to have a load more doctors in order to train a load more doctors?
    Probably. There are quite a few bits of the British state where the old "well, if you're wanting to go to Dublin, I wouldn't be starting from here" joke applies.
    It strikes me as an ambitious thing for Streeting to be announcing with the finances as they are.

    I think in the long run this is the sort of thing this government will be judged on. They are promising two sets of things: serious, accountable government; and providing (imo sensible) long term solutions to thorny problems.

    Based on experiences of the last generation of governments I believe this one is over promising and will underdeliver. If they prove me wrong then I think they deserve to be in power for a generation.

    If they fail I think we'll just slide further into the cheap political wins of populist politics such as that of Reform and the Greens (SLORG if you will).
    Streeting is in good company. It has been announced several times before.

    It is one of the extraordinary post-war scandals that a country as wealthy as the UK has for decades had to steal well qualified medical staff from countries in far greater need than ours. Countries like us should be training a small surplus of our own and also some from poorer countries in order to help their development. The reverse is the case. It is utterly immoral.
    Without wishing to defend the policy, I would just point out that the UK is not alone in this. This has been routine in much of the Western world.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273
    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
    If measured only on that,greener friendlier I could go on
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    I’d have more time for your baleful meteorological vignettes did you post when the English weather was good. As it was, for instance, for much of the earlier part of this month. It changed pretty much on the equinox, as the season itself changed from summer to autumn. Yet all we heard from you at the time was VANCOUVER.

    The idea that a green and pleasant land exposed to the whims of the North Atlantic should have the climate of the south of France is, er, somewhat niche.
    That's probably coz I was in..... VANCOUVER??
    Can only speak for West Scotland but summer never turned up this year
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,039
    edited September 27
    Nigelb said:

    Russia appears to have successfully deterred the US from allowing Ukraine to use Western weaponry to strike military targets deep inside Russia.

    Meanwhile, NATO member Hungary has said that they would not have resisted a Russian invasion of their country, and Ukraine shouldn't have done so either.

    Today does not feel like a good day for the collective defence of democracies against authoritarians.

    Hungary under Orban is interested only in its own advantage, and Orban currently sees being a Russian poodle as part of that.
    His advice for anyone else is less than worthless.
    It would be interesting to use a Time Machine to introduce Orban to Admiral Horthy

    A night at the Opera….


    “.. two or three men were on the floor and he [Horthy] had another by the throat, slapping his face and shouting what I learned afterward was: "So you would betray your country, would you?" The Regent was alone, but he had the situation in hand.... The whole incident was typical not only of the Regent's deep hatred of alien doctrine, but of the kind of man he is. Although he was around seventy-two years of age, it did not occur to him to ask for help; he went right ahead like a skipper with a mutiny on his hands.”
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,755
    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Not being funny, but have you ever been tested for Seasonal Affective Disorder?
    My daughter suffers from this and her mood can dip alarmingly. This normally happens about November but it seems to have come earlier this year, possibly because we had such a crap and overcast summer. It may be that your travels have increased any initial sensitivity that you might have had.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,728
    algarkirk said:

    Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Labour will spin next year’s locals as good for Labour as they were last held in 2021 which was peak Boris.
    The 2025 locals will be greatly impacted by how many candidates Reform are able to field.
    Partly that would be about having that sort of party organsiation on the ground. But also- how far are Reform supporters motivated by the sort of responsibiliites that local councils have?

    The one to watch for Reform might be the new Linconshire mayorality. (How can counties have Mayors? They should be called Sheriffs, or if you want proper romanticism, Counts.)
    'Counts' is what they are called in abroadland, where they are usually fictional villains. Here they are earls, and the clue is that an earl's wife is a countess. And these positions are already mostly occupied, and if not by earls then by Dukes, and if not by modern incumbents, by Shakespeare.

    Sheriffs are already taken, and appointed regularly IIRC by HMKCIII from among the great and good.

    Counties of course can't possibly have mayors. What about County Customer Services Czar?
    Well mayors were already taken when elected mayors came along. They wore gold chains and funny hats. So I don't see why we can't have elected sherrifs for counties.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273
    At least as we approach October , share prices seem to finally be creeping up
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987
    malcolmg said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    I’d have more time for your baleful meteorological vignettes did you post when the English weather was good. As it was, for instance, for much of the earlier part of this month. It changed pretty much on the equinox, as the season itself changed from summer to autumn. Yet all we heard from you at the time was VANCOUVER.

    The idea that a green and pleasant land exposed to the whims of the North Atlantic should have the climate of the south of France is, er, somewhat niche.
    That's probably coz I was in..... VANCOUVER??
    Can only speak for West Scotland but summer never turned up this year
    I heard. I do fear that our climate has transitioned into something worse - greyer and wetter (yet milder because of useless warm evenings in winter). It seemed to happen after that amazing lockdown spring

    Just a hunch. Is all
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,567
    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
    If measured only on that,greener friendlier I could go on
    Edinburgh is the UK's greenest city, with the highest proportion of trees:people and 49% of the city is classified as green space.

    Glasgow has a motorway through the middle of it.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,271
    edited September 27
    Cookie said:

    algarkirk said:

    Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Labour will spin next year’s locals as good for Labour as they were last held in 2021 which was peak Boris.
    The 2025 locals will be greatly impacted by how many candidates Reform are able to field.
    Partly that would be about having that sort of party organsiation on the ground. But also- how far are Reform supporters motivated by the sort of responsibiliites that local councils have?

    The one to watch for Reform might be the new Linconshire mayorality. (How can counties have Mayors? They should be called Sheriffs, or if you want proper romanticism, Counts.)
    'Counts' is what they are called in abroadland, where they are usually fictional villains. Here they are earls, and the clue is that an earl's wife is a countess. And these positions are already mostly occupied, and if not by earls then by Dukes, and if not by modern incumbents, by Shakespeare.

    Sheriffs are already taken, and appointed regularly IIRC by HMKCIII from among the great and good.

    Counties of course can't possibly have mayors. What about County Customer Services Czar?
    Well mayors were already taken when elected mayors came along. They wore gold chains and funny hats. So I don't see why we can't have elected sherrifs for counties.
    I'd go for elected Earls, or Lords Lieutenant.

    There's an Earl of Lincoln, but you could call the elected one the Earl of Lincolnshire.

    Edit: This could feed into reform of the House of Lords if you actually made them Earls. An incremental way to achieve the idea of a second house of the nations and regions, by having elected Earls sit in the House of Lords.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,486
    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Not being funny, but have you ever been tested for Seasonal Affective Disorder?
    My daughter suffers from this and her mood can dip alarmingly. This normally happens about November but it seems to have come earlier this year, possibly because we had such a crap and overcast summer. It may be that your travels have increased any initial sensitivity that you might have had.
    Good point. This is pretty common. IMHO things which help (and can do no harm even if not) are vitamin D, and being outside in daytime deliberately and consciously looking up at the sky even if it is grey and cloudy, for a few minutes a day. The latter is excellent for the soul too, even, maybe especially, in Jan/Feb.

    Some say Omega 3 helps too.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987
    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Not being funny, but have you ever been tested for Seasonal Affective Disorder?
    My daughter suffers from this and her mood can dip alarmingly. This normally happens about November but it seems to have come earlier this year, possibly because we had such a crap and overcast summer. It may be that your travels have increased any initial sensitivity that you might have had.
    Never been tested but I am almost certain that I have SAD. If I can't escape the British winter I go mad (eg the third lockdown of winter 2021, OMFG)

    Not sure if my travels have accentuated it. They certainly AMELIORATE it when I CAN escape

    SAD is a very real thing and can be brutal. Mine is depressing but for some it is crippling, a good friend of mine split from his long term partner because her SAD made her unbearably bitchy and moody. He tolerated it for a while but when it inevitably came round every year...
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    West coast is very special though. Aran. Bute. Cowal Peninsula. You don't mind the showers every 5 minutes - it's part of the magic.
    Totally agree, we always say if you see Arran it is going to rain and if you cannot see it then it is raining. Beaches are beautiful looking out to those and aids craig, when you get nice days it is perfection
  • eek said:

    Telstar said:

    FF43 said:

    Despite his many problems its good to see SKS has the full support of Donald Trump.

    "Donald Trump heaped praise on “popular” Sir Keir Starmer ahead of the first meeting between the pair on Thursday night."

    Some cheer for the PB Left

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/09/26/starmer-talks-trump-unavailable-harris/

    At last some good news for SKS!
    He approves of his embezzlement!
    Point of order. Starmer hasn't embezzled anything. Unlike people associated with the Conservative Party who stole £15 billion from the State in dodgy Covid contracts.
    No journalists (to my knowledge) have pointed out that if you run a business and received £100k worth of freebies you might be in trouble under the Bribery Act and you almost certainly would have top pay Benefit in Kind tax. As he is already in the 45% bracket it means he ought to get a tax bill of £45k

    Any accountants in that want to comment? Am I right?

    FF43 said:

    Despite his many problems its good to see SKS has the full support of Donald Trump.

    "Donald Trump heaped praise on “popular” Sir Keir Starmer ahead of the first meeting between the pair on Thursday night."

    Some cheer for the PB Left

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/09/26/starmer-talks-trump-unavailable-harris/

    At last some good news for SKS!
    He approves of his embezzlement!
    Point of order. Starmer hasn't embezzled anything. Unlike people associated with the Conservative Party who stole £15 billion from the State in dodgy Covid contracts.
    No journalists (to my knowledge) have pointed out that if you run a business and received £100k worth of freebies you might be in trouble under the Bribery Act and you almost certainly would have top pay Benefit in Kind tax. As he is already in the 45% bracket it means he ought to get a tax bill of £45k

    Any accountants in that want to comment? Am I right?
    I could quote you the relevant tax rules issued by HMRC but as a broad rule, if you are not an employee of the hospitality provider there is no BIK arising.

    Why ale house accountants continue to post such rubbish is beyond me.

    The provision of 10 Downing Street as accommodation is a BIK and if you google it you will find Sunaks broad tax details

    Thanks for your clarification but no need to be a partisan pompous dick about it.

    In my view BIK or capital gains or some sort of tax on this type of value, particularly when it relates to a gift that is given because someone is a minister of state, should apply. If I attempted to claim clothing through my business on the dubious claim I needed to "look smart for my work" I would pay BIK. Starmer's view (and perhaps yours) is clearly that all those in the public sector, including himself, should be given special treatment.

    Anyhow, I think I'd rather be "an ale house account" than a real one!! In the words of John Cleese: "Well, er, yes Mr. Anchovy, but you see your report here says that you are an extremely dull person. You see, our experts describe you as an appallingly dull fellow, unimaginative, timid, lacking in initiative, spineless, easily dominated, no sense of humour, tedious company and irrepressibly drab and awful. And whereas in most professions these would be considerable drawbacks, in chartered accountancy they are a positive boon."
    In your view != what the law says.
    Is this not a site where people give opinions? It might be a loophole that Starmer wriggles his hypocritical, but nontheless well dressed person through. If a business person would get hammered for BIK for trying to put his/her suits through the books, the same should apply to our politicians. Personally I couldn't give a shit about the football attendance (politicians go to these types of events), it is the greedy tasteless extravagance on clothjng and the double standard that is clearly being demonstrated.
    law you don't like != loophole
    Erm - the whole idea of being in a parliamentary democracy is that laws that are inequitable can and should be changed. Politicians believing that different rules apply to them then those of us that they apply laws to, is not a good look for said democracy.
    People in this thread have been explaining to you that the same rules do apply to politicians, and that you’re erroneously convinced that the rules are something other than they are,
    Er no! In your partisan desire to defend the indefensible you are either being stupid, disingenuous or perhaps both.

    The parallel I drew was between anyone in business who attempted to claim that they wanted clothing to be part of their requirement for their job, e.g. a suit,. this would not be allowed by HMRC. I guess you have never owned a business or else you would grasp this parallel very easily.

    Starmer and his wife have clearly been given gifts that relate to his job. If he were not in that job he would not be given them. I simply stated that if this is not covered by HMRC rules it fucking well should be.

    I have a suggestion for you: Being pleased that a particular party is in government is fine. Being an apologist for hypocritical behaviour (my party right or wrong attitude) just makes you look like an unthinking moron. You are the HYUFD for the current government.

  • theakestheakes Posts: 929
    Latest polling from Morning Consult gives Harris a clean sweep of every swing state plus North Carolina. Closest is Georgia plus 1 but surprising Arizona plus 4, same with Nevada and Pennsylvania. Wisconsin plus 2 Michigan better.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,479
    algarkirk said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Quite a lot of people like our climate because they dislike heat. This is not a fashionable view, perhaps because it isn't possible to commercialise or advertise the concept of liking rather boring middling weather - outside temperature at say 16-21 C.
    Yes. I once met a Middle Eastern prince in St James’ Park. Just got talking to this guy randomly. He said: “I cannot understand why the English complain about their weather. The weather here is absolutely lovely. I wish we had it.”
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,755
    algarkirk said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Not being funny, but have you ever been tested for Seasonal Affective Disorder?
    My daughter suffers from this and her mood can dip alarmingly. This normally happens about November but it seems to have come earlier this year, possibly because we had such a crap and overcast summer. It may be that your travels have increased any initial sensitivity that you might have had.
    Good point. This is pretty common. IMHO things which help (and can do no harm even if not) are vitamin D, and being outside in daytime deliberately and consciously looking up at the sky even if it is grey and cloudy, for a few minutes a day. The latter is excellent for the soul too, even, maybe especially, in Jan/Feb.

    Some say Omega 3 helps too.
    She gets prescribed vitamin D. Actually, through the miserable climate and diet vitamin D deficiency is very common in Scotland. Not heard about the Omega 3 though. I will recommend that she gives it a go.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273
    Leon said:

    malcolmg said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    I’d have more time for your baleful meteorological vignettes did you post when the English weather was good. As it was, for instance, for much of the earlier part of this month. It changed pretty much on the equinox, as the season itself changed from summer to autumn. Yet all we heard from you at the time was VANCOUVER.

    The idea that a green and pleasant land exposed to the whims of the North Atlantic should have the climate of the south of France is, er, somewhat niche.
    That's probably coz I was in..... VANCOUVER??
    Can only speak for West Scotland but summer never turned up this year
    I heard. I do fear that our climate has transitioned into something worse - greyer and wetter (yet milder because of useless warm evenings in winter). It seemed to happen after that amazing lockdown spring

    Just a hunch. Is all
    For sure, we don,t get snow nowadays just wet, crisp frosty winters were great years ago
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,999
    Eabhal said:

    Hello MattW - interested in your take on this:

    BBC News - Lorry driver who ran over sleeping woman jailed
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ced02qpe1j8o

    My instinct here is that such a long sentence is disproportionate (particularly given much worse driving is often let off - see Emma Newman in Glasgow) , but again the driving ban is too short.

    It's a fascinating case. Summary is: Spar HGV delivery driver, 52, in Liverpool did a sharp turn into a petrol station made difficult because a car (Audi obvs) was parked on the pavement, so his rear wheels ran over the pavement killing a sleeping homeless woman he says he thought was a bin bag and a folded duvet.

    Causing Death by Careless Driving. Guilty plea. 12 month prison sentence (ie out in 5 months I think). 12 month ban starting on release.

    I think the most important points are cultural: intrusion by drivers into pedestrian space (here esp. the dangerous parker) is treated as a casual right ignoring consequences, the duty of care for vulnerable road users is routinely ignored, and zero consideration for others is the normal routine, and how our streets are designed and built to allow pedestrians to be treated with contempt.

    There is also stuff about poor driving standards even amongst professional drivers, and time pressure - the same as incentivise food delivery riders to use e-mopeds not cycles, hack their pedelecs, and rush everywhere at unsafe speeds.

    Here the offender should have got out and checked given the tight manoeuvre, but he chose not to do so. He stated that he assumes that some obstacles (quoted wheelie bins) would move when he hit them with his trailer.

    An important aspect missed here is that part of the responsibility for the death lies with the person who parked blocking the entrance by parking to block it. For a petrol station it is obvious that vehicles will need to turn in. That one seems to have walked away.

    This is the location of the turn:
    https://www.google.com/maps/@53.4210831,-2.9815884,3a,29.3y,66.35h,76.49t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sB9SatvRce-uDrjZhtWTyDQ!2e0!5s20220901T000000!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409

    Look through the many previous dates and you can see how many times the wall has been demolished, how bollards are omitted to allow vehicles across the pavement, and how the 2Y lines have been unmaintained for 10-12 years.

    Clearly an HGV is crazy for deliveries there. They should be using a transit or a Luton.

    I'd need to see the sentencing remarks. I've linked a better report below which shows the driver did not indicate, so his cab safety cameras which would have displayed the sleeping woman were not activated.

    I think the sentence is perhaps OK in that context, and reflects the importance of "deterrence for others". It is nuts that there is no re-education requirement. I also think perhaps 25% of the responsibility should lie with the dangerous parker, who should also have been in court. Plus obviously lots of institutional failure around ASB parking not being tackled, where Liverpool is especially poor - one for the Govt.

    The only way of tackling the entrance I can see is big strong bollards on the corners preventing access by HGVs.

    https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/the-day-you-took-baby-30015823

  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273
    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
    If measured only on that,greener friendlier I could go on
    Edinburgh is the UK's greenest city, with the highest proportion of trees:people and 49% of the city is classified as green space.

    Glasgow has a motorway through the middle of it.
    You cannot compare the.people though and Edinburgh is invested with tourists
  • bigglesbiggles Posts: 5,937
    Looking at the 2025 elections, the county and unitary elections look like non-events at they start Tory anyway based on 2021 elections, but the mayoralties might be fun, if the Gvt devolves powers as it says it will.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,479
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    I’d have more time for your baleful meteorological vignettes did you post when the English weather was good. As it was, for instance, for much of the earlier part of this month. It changed pretty much on the equinox, as the season itself changed from summer to autumn. Yet all we heard from you at the time was VANCOUVER.

    The idea that a green and pleasant land exposed to the whims of the North Atlantic should have the climate of the south of France is, er, somewhat niche.
    That's probably coz I was in..... VANCOUVER??
    Well if you will disappear during the English summer and return during the English autumn, you can’t really moan about autumnal weather!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987

    algarkirk said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Quite a lot of people like our climate because they dislike heat. This is not a fashionable view, perhaps because it isn't possible to commercialise or advertise the concept of liking rather boring middling weather - outside temperature at say 16-21 C.
    Yes. I once met a Middle Eastern prince in St James’ Park. Just got talking to this guy randomly. He said: “I cannot understand why the English complain about their weather. The weather here is absolutely lovely. I wish we had it.”
    That's because they come to southern England in summer, when it is indeed often pleasant, and sometimes gorgeous - to the point of perfection. Green and Edenic

    They don't come here in Feb

    But SAD definitely works the other way. In Luxor they hate the summer, and loathe the relentless sun, and it causes depression. 40C+ for endless weeks, and often they are too poor to have aircon. Yikes

  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,486

    algarkirk said:

    maxh said:

    maxh said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "The NHS must no longer “nick” people from abroad to staff the health service, Wes Streeting has said.

    The Health Secretary has pledged that he will reduce the NHS’ “overreliance” on migrants to staff the health service and will train “our own homegrown talent”."

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/09/27/politics-latest-news-starmer-labour-us-trump/

    This seems the right thing to do on so many levels. I wonder what the funding implications are, though.
    The biggest cost will be providing training places within the NHS. The degrees are a fraction of that.
    Don't we need to have a load more doctors in order to train a load more doctors?
    Probably. There are quite a few bits of the British state where the old "well, if you're wanting to go to Dublin, I wouldn't be starting from here" joke applies.
    It strikes me as an ambitious thing for Streeting to be announcing with the finances as they are.

    I think in the long run this is the sort of thing this government will be judged on. They are promising two sets of things: serious, accountable government; and providing (imo sensible) long term solutions to thorny problems.

    Based on experiences of the last generation of governments I believe this one is over promising and will underdeliver. If they prove me wrong then I think they deserve to be in power for a generation.

    If they fail I think we'll just slide further into the cheap political wins of populist politics such as that of Reform and the Greens (SLORG if you will).
    Streeting is in good company. It has been announced several times before.

    It is one of the extraordinary post-war scandals that a country as wealthy as the UK has for decades had to steal well qualified medical staff from countries in far greater need than ours. Countries like us should be training a small surplus of our own and also some from poorer countries in order to help their development. The reverse is the case. It is utterly immoral.
    Without wishing to defend the policy, I would just point out that the UK is not alone in this. This has been routine in much of the Western world.
    Yes, apart from anything else, it is a shameful waste of the idealism and enthusiasm of thousands of talented young people who never got into medical school so that we could have a shortage of doctors and steal others'.
  • Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
    If measured only on that,greener friendlier I could go on
    Edinburgh is the UK's greenest city, with the highest proportion of trees:people and 49% of the city is classified as green space.

    Glasgow has a motorway through the middle of it.
    Glasgow is FAR FAR more interesting for train-geeks :lol:
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,342
    Pulpstar said:

    End of an era arriving - final UK coal power station to close (Ratcliffe on Soar) on 30th September. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/cq5e4n5z888t

    We still have (at least one) coal mine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberpergwm

    Happily, they're very easy to build.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,271

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
    If measured only on that,greener friendlier I could go on
    Edinburgh is the UK's greenest city, with the highest proportion of trees:people and 49% of the city is classified as green space.

    Glasgow has a motorway through the middle of it.
    Glasgow is FAR FAR more interesting for train-geeks :lol:
    Is that so? I was always fascinated that Edinburgh Waverley was the agglomeration of three separate stations.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,755
    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Not being funny, but have you ever been tested for Seasonal Affective Disorder?
    My daughter suffers from this and her mood can dip alarmingly. This normally happens about November but it seems to have come earlier this year, possibly because we had such a crap and overcast summer. It may be that your travels have increased any initial sensitivity that you might have had.
    Never been tested but I am almost certain that I have SAD. If I can't escape the British winter I go mad (eg the third lockdown of winter 2021, OMFG)

    Not sure if my travels have accentuated it. They certainly AMELIORATE it when I CAN escape

    SAD is a very real thing and can be brutal. Mine is depressing but for some it is crippling, a good friend of mine split from his long term partner because her SAD made her unbearably bitchy and moody. He tolerated it for a while but when it inevitably came round every year...
    My daughter would try to get a boost of sun by a holiday during the winter months, January ideally but that is going to be a bit complicated this year because she is expecting in February.

    It can indeed be a seriously debilitating condition but there are things that can help like vitamin D or a blue ray lamp. I have noticed that when you are in this country, particularly in the winter months, you can get quite morose. Up to you but a check would not do any harm.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,278
    Taz said:

    Time to stop playing the working class card Angela.

    Rayner seems to be the ideal working class person for the upper and middle class to use to show they are not class prejudiced. I cannot hate the working class. I like Ange.

    Of course working class people who rioted, many of whom were not motivated by race, but deprivation, poverty or wanting a ruck with Plod are looked down on as are the areas they come from. Good piece in the Guardian on this today.

    "Angela Rayner makes a lot of being working class. In fact when those grisly images came back from Ibiza this summer of Ange in a rave, she said it was because she was working class, and the working classes like to party. No, Ange; we’re conflating two things here. There are your personal proclivities and there are the attributes of the working class and they’re not the same. In fact, the Deputy PM is getting away with murder on the back of her self-description as working class. It’s a way of seeing off criticism of her personal judgment as class-based snobbiness."

    Absolutely the above, and I care nothing for her dancing badly in Ibiza.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/opinion-angela-rayner-stop-playing-the-working-class-card/ar-AA1rbLO1?ocid=entnewsntp&pc=U531&cvid=43c9aae1777b424f9d3b4b0fe885777c&ei=9

    To be fair, I thought her dancing was quite good. But I agree with the rest of it.

    Don't much care for her or her politics.
  • Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Labour will spin next year’s locals as good for Labour as they were last held in 2021 which was peak Boris.
    The 2025 locals will be greatly impacted by how many candidates Reform are able to field.
    Partly that would be about having that sort of party organsiation on the ground. But also- how far are Reform supporters motivated by the sort of responsibiliites that local councils have?

    The one to watch for Reform might be the new Linconshire mayorality. (How can counties have Mayors? They should be called Sheriffs, or if you want proper romanticism, Counts.)
    Nothing sucks the joy out of a people's revolution than having to listen to a 45 minute presentation about the hierarchy of waste.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,486
    DavidL said:

    algarkirk said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Not being funny, but have you ever been tested for Seasonal Affective Disorder?
    My daughter suffers from this and her mood can dip alarmingly. This normally happens about November but it seems to have come earlier this year, possibly because we had such a crap and overcast summer. It may be that your travels have increased any initial sensitivity that you might have had.
    Good point. This is pretty common. IMHO things which help (and can do no harm even if not) are vitamin D, and being outside in daytime deliberately and consciously looking up at the sky even if it is grey and cloudy, for a few minutes a day. The latter is excellent for the soul too, even, maybe especially, in Jan/Feb.

    Some say Omega 3 helps too.
    She gets prescribed vitamin D. Actually, through the miserable climate and diet vitamin D deficiency is very common in Scotland. Not heard about the Omega 3 though. I will recommend that she gives it a go.
    Best of luck. Don't miss out the looking at the sky. For me it's the number one treatment.
  • Leon said:

    algarkirk said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Quite a lot of people like our climate because they dislike heat. This is not a fashionable view, perhaps because it isn't possible to commercialise or advertise the concept of liking rather boring middling weather - outside temperature at say 16-21 C.
    Yes. I once met a Middle Eastern prince in St James’ Park. Just got talking to this guy randomly. He said: “I cannot understand why the English complain about their weather. The weather here is absolutely lovely. I wish we had it.”
    That's because they come to southern England in summer, when it is indeed often pleasant, and sometimes gorgeous - to the point of perfection. Green and Edenic

    They don't come here in Feb

    But SAD definitely works the other way. In Luxor they hate the summer, and loathe the relentless sun, and it causes depression. 40C+ for endless weeks, and often they are too poor to have aircon. Yikes

    I think mood is definitely affected by daylight. The Nordic countries are amazing in summer, but I would not want to live there in wintertime. Apparently the suicide rate is proportional to the time of year.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,482
    malcolmg said:

    Leon said:

    malcolmg said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    I’d have more time for your baleful meteorological vignettes did you post when the English weather was good. As it was, for instance, for much of the earlier part of this month. It changed pretty much on the equinox, as the season itself changed from summer to autumn. Yet all we heard from you at the time was VANCOUVER.

    The idea that a green and pleasant land exposed to the whims of the North Atlantic should have the climate of the south of France is, er, somewhat niche.
    That's probably coz I was in..... VANCOUVER??
    Can only speak for West Scotland but summer never turned up this year
    I heard. I do fear that our climate has transitioned into something worse - greyer and wetter (yet milder because of useless warm evenings in winter). It seemed to happen after that amazing lockdown spring

    Just a hunch. Is all
    For sure, we don,t get snow nowadays just wet, crisp frosty winters were great years ago
    Beast from the East waves hello...
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,278

    Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Sir Keir is left with no choice but to console himself with a parliamentary majority of 174.
    Boy oh boy I'm going to bookmark this and buy some massive popcorn to see your reaction come GE2029.

    That's if you've got the bollocks to come on here on election night.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,482

    Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Labour will spin next year’s locals as good for Labour as they were last held in 2021 which was peak Boris.
    The 2025 locals will be greatly impacted by how many candidates Reform are able to field.
    Partly that would be about having that sort of party organsiation on the ground. But also- how far are Reform supporters motivated by the sort of responsibiliites that local councils have?

    The one to watch for Reform might be the new Linconshire mayorality. (How can counties have Mayors? They should be called Sheriffs, or if you want proper romanticism, Counts.)
    On their way to being voted out they wouldn't be known as a Count...
  • Jim_MillerJim_Miller Posts: 2,994
    A little bit of data, on topic. In recent years, I often walked by what I took to calling the "MAGA house". In October 2020, I took this picture, as some work was being done on the house.



    (My apologies for the quality. I just took the picture for my own amusement at the time. The third flag from the left is a Gadsden flag.)

    At the time, there appeared to be four men, no women, and no children living in the house. (They were so unfriendly, I never got to know them, which is why I am tentative about the inhabitants.)

    In this last year, all the MAGA stuff has disappeared. Instead I see Teslas parked outside, and, recently, a young woman, who appears to live there.

    In my general neighborhood, I see very few political signs, fewer than I can remember in any previous presidential year, since I moved here about 1996. On a recent Metro bus trip through the Google and Microsoft areas, I spotted just two small Trump signs.

    So I suspect enthusiasm for the hotelier is down, at least in this area.

    (Tomorrow, I'll post another picture showing one of the few true believers, willing to put up a sing for him.)
  • Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Sir Keir is left with no choice but to console himself with a parliamentary majority of 174.
    Boy oh boy I'm going to bookmark this and buy some massive popcorn to see your reaction come GE2029.

    That's if you've got the bollocks to come on here on election night.
    Even after Blair's win in 1997 council by elections started to come back to the Tories. They're the equivalent of opinion polls on Teletext, if anyone remembers them.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,479
    Leon said:

    algarkirk said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Quite a lot of people like our climate because they dislike heat. This is not a fashionable view, perhaps because it isn't possible to commercialise or advertise the concept of liking rather boring middling weather - outside temperature at say 16-21 C.
    Yes. I once met a Middle Eastern prince in St James’ Park. Just got talking to this guy randomly. He said: “I cannot understand why the English complain about their weather. The weather here is absolutely lovely. I wish we had it.”
    That's because they come to southern England in summer, when it is indeed often pleasant, and sometimes gorgeous - to the point of perfection. Green and Edenic

    They don't come here in Feb

    But SAD definitely works the other way. In Luxor they hate the summer, and loathe the relentless sun, and it causes depression. 40C+ for endless weeks, and often they are too poor to have aircon. Yikes

    Actually this conversation took place in spring (late March or April as I recall) but it was a mild day and point very much taken. But I stand by my main point: We can’t all have the climate of the south of France, as much as you crave it. One of the reasons it is so expensive is that it has probably the ‘best’ climate in the world. The Côte d’Azur rarely gets too hot even in the height of summer - unlike much of the French interior and points south west around Bordeaux, which can cook.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987
    This doesn't sound so promising, does it? On Labour's new housing plans


    "the [new Labour] steer away from simplistic ideas of ‘beauty’, fostered by the previous government, at the very least allows us to think about housing as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste."

    Yeah, fuck choice and taste, and fuck beauty. Let's reduce housing to a" necessary industrial process"

    https://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/opinion/were-not-short-of-great-housing-architects-why-isnt-one-on-the-new-towns-taskforce
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273

    malcolmg said:

    Leon said:

    malcolmg said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    I’d have more time for your baleful meteorological vignettes did you post when the English weather was good. As it was, for instance, for much of the earlier part of this month. It changed pretty much on the equinox, as the season itself changed from summer to autumn. Yet all we heard from you at the time was VANCOUVER.

    The idea that a green and pleasant land exposed to the whims of the North Atlantic should have the climate of the south of France is, er, somewhat niche.
    That's probably coz I was in..... VANCOUVER??
    Can only speak for West Scotland but summer never turned up this year
    I heard. I do fear that our climate has transitioned into something worse - greyer and wetter (yet milder because of useless warm evenings in winter). It seemed to happen after that amazing lockdown spring

    Just a hunch. Is all
    For sure, we don,t get snow nowadays just wet, crisp frosty winters were great years ago
    Beast from the East waves hello...
    Did not affect us one bit
  • eekeek Posts: 28,264

    Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Sir Keir is left with no choice but to console himself with a parliamentary majority of 174.
    Boy oh boy I'm going to bookmark this and buy some massive popcorn to see your reaction come GE2029.

    That's if you've got the bollocks to come on here on election night.
    I'm at a loss as to the point of that quote - the odds of Labour having a majority anything like 174 in 2028 is about zero.

    As the newly elected Labour MPs are finding out they are really social workers fixing things where people have fallen through the gaps because they have zero chance of becoming a minister due to the number of other MPs in the exact same position..
  • Taz said:

    Time to stop playing the working class card Angela.

    Rayner seems to be the ideal working class person for the upper and middle class to use to show they are not class prejudiced. I cannot hate the working class. I like Ange.

    Of course working class people who rioted, many of whom were not motivated by race, but deprivation, poverty or wanting a ruck with Plod are looked down on as are the areas they come from. Good piece in the Guardian on this today.

    "Angela Rayner makes a lot of being working class. In fact when those grisly images came back from Ibiza this summer of Ange in a rave, she said it was because she was working class, and the working classes like to party. No, Ange; we’re conflating two things here. There are your personal proclivities and there are the attributes of the working class and they’re not the same. In fact, the Deputy PM is getting away with murder on the back of her self-description as working class. It’s a way of seeing off criticism of her personal judgment as class-based snobbiness."

    Absolutely the above, and I care nothing for her dancing badly in Ibiza.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/opinion-angela-rayner-stop-playing-the-working-class-card/ar-AA1rbLO1?ocid=entnewsntp&pc=U531&cvid=43c9aae1777b424f9d3b4b0fe885777c&ei=9

    To be fair, I thought her dancing was quite good. But I agree with the rest of it.

    Don't much care for her or her politics.
    The Labour Party are obsessed by class. It is time people stopped talking about this archaic concept and think about people as individuals. I also can't help thinking that what people like Rayner are saying is "look how clever I am because I come from a working class background and I am better than all of the rest of you". Nobody fucking cares. Well if they do, they shouldn't.
  • Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Sir Keir is left with no choice but to console himself with a parliamentary majority of 174.
    Boy oh boy I'm going to bookmark this and buy some massive popcorn to see your reaction come GE2029.

    That's if you've got the bollocks to come on here on election night.
    LDs 411 seats
    Reform 121 seats

    :innocent:
  • Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
    If measured only on that,greener friendlier I could go on
    Edinburgh is the UK's greenest city, with the highest proportion of trees:people and 49% of the city is classified as green space.

    Glasgow has a motorway through the middle of it.
    Glasgow is FAR FAR more interesting for train-geeks :lol:
    Is that so? I was always fascinated that Edinburgh Waverley was the agglomeration of three separate stations.
    Glasgow has TWO main termini, the Subway, and loads of suburban lines/stations.
  • Taz said:

    Time to stop playing the working class card Angela.

    Rayner seems to be the ideal working class person for the upper and middle class to use to show they are not class prejudiced. I cannot hate the working class. I like Ange.

    Of course working class people who rioted, many of whom were not motivated by race, but deprivation, poverty or wanting a ruck with Plod are looked down on as are the areas they come from. Good piece in the Guardian on this today.

    "Angela Rayner makes a lot of being working class. In fact when those grisly images came back from Ibiza this summer of Ange in a rave, she said it was because she was working class, and the working classes like to party. No, Ange; we’re conflating two things here. There are your personal proclivities and there are the attributes of the working class and they’re not the same. In fact, the Deputy PM is getting away with murder on the back of her self-description as working class. It’s a way of seeing off criticism of her personal judgment as class-based snobbiness."

    Absolutely the above, and I care nothing for her dancing badly in Ibiza.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/opinion-angela-rayner-stop-playing-the-working-class-card/ar-AA1rbLO1?ocid=entnewsntp&pc=U531&cvid=43c9aae1777b424f9d3b4b0fe885777c&ei=9

    To be fair, I thought her dancing was quite good. But I agree with the rest of it.

    Don't much care for her or her politics.
    The Labour Party are obsessed by class. It is time people stopped talking about this archaic concept and think about people as individuals. I also can't help thinking that what people like Rayner are saying is "look how clever I am because I come from a working class background and I am better than all of the rest of you". Nobody fucking cares. Well if they do, they shouldn't.
    I would say they're post class now, its all about identities, whether that is sexuality, gender or race.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,264
    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
    If measured only on that,greener friendlier I could go on
    Edinburgh is the UK's greenest city, with the highest proportion of trees:people and 49% of the city is classified as green space.

    Glasgow has a motorway through the middle of it.
    You cannot compare the.people though and Edinburgh is invested with tourists
    Don't you mean infested?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,999
    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Not being funny, but have you ever been tested for Seasonal Affective Disorder?
    My daughter suffers from this and her mood can dip alarmingly. This normally happens about November but it seems to have come earlier this year, possibly because we had such a crap and overcast summer. It may be that your travels have increased any initial sensitivity that you might have had.
    Never been tested but I am almost certain that I have SAD. If I can't escape the British winter I go mad (eg the third lockdown of winter 2021, OMFG)

    Not sure if my travels have accentuated it. They certainly AMELIORATE it when I CAN escape

    SAD is a very real thing and can be brutal. Mine is depressing but for some it is crippling, a good friend of mine split from his long term partner because her SAD made her unbearably bitchy and moody. He tolerated it for a while but when it inevitably came round every year...
    My daughter would try to get a boost of sun by a holiday during the winter months, January ideally but that is going to be a bit complicated this year because she is expecting in February.

    It can indeed be a seriously debilitating condition but there are things that can help like vitamin D or a blue ray lamp. I have noticed that when you are in this country, particularly in the winter months, you can get quite morose. Up to you but a check would not do any harm.
    You can get lightboxes designed to put out "summer" light.

    One further easily available fix now we have different types of light bulbs is to get ones that are a colour temperature which is like outdoor light in summer.

    There are also tunable ones.
  • Leon said:

    This doesn't sound so promising, does it? On Labour's new housing plans


    "the [new Labour] steer away from simplistic ideas of ‘beauty’, fostered by the previous government, at the very least allows us to think about housing as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste."

    Yeah, fuck choice and taste, and fuck beauty. Let's reduce housing to a" necessary industrial process"

    https://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/opinion/were-not-short-of-great-housing-architects-why-isnt-one-on-the-new-towns-taskforce

    Well it worked wonderfully in eastern Europe lol. Bet you won't find Ange or His Sartorial Starmerness living in a brutalist tower block in Stockport.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,278
    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
    If measured only on that,greener friendlier I could go on
    Edinburgh is the UK's greenest city, with the highest proportion of trees:people and 49% of the city is classified as green space.

    Glasgow has a motorway through the middle of it.
    Uh-oh.

    Shots fired.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,271
    Leon said:

    This doesn't sound so promising, does it? On Labour's new housing plans


    "the [new Labour] steer away from simplistic ideas of ‘beauty’, fostered by the previous government, at the very least allows us to think about housing as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste."

    Yeah, fuck choice and taste, and fuck beauty. Let's reduce housing to a" necessary industrial process"

    https://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/opinion/were-not-short-of-great-housing-architects-why-isnt-one-on-the-new-towns-taskforce

    That does sound like something for pseuds corner, and I hope that the writer is nowhere near the design of any building, anywhere, ever.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,567
    edited September 27
    MattW said:

    Eabhal said:

    Hello MattW - interested in your take on this:

    BBC News - Lorry driver who ran over sleeping woman jailed
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ced02qpe1j8o

    My instinct here is that such a long sentence is disproportionate (particularly given much worse driving is often let off - see Emma Newman in Glasgow) , but again the driving ban is too short.

    It's a fascinating case. Summary is: Spar HGV delivery driver, 52, in Liverpool did a sharp turn into a petrol station made difficult because a car (Audi obvs) was parked on the pavement, so his rear wheels ran over the pavement killing a sleeping homeless woman he says he thought was a bin bag and a folded duvet.

    Causing Death by Careless Driving. Guilty plea. 12 month prison sentence (ie out in 5 months I think). 12 month ban starting on release.

    I think the most important points are cultural: intrusion by drivers into pedestrian space (here esp. the dangerous parker) is treated as a casual right ignoring consequences, the duty of care for vulnerable road users is routinely ignored, and zero consideration for others is the normal routine, and how our streets are designed and built to allow pedestrians to be treated with contempt.

    There is also stuff about poor driving standards even amongst professional drivers, and time pressure - the same as incentivise food delivery riders to use e-mopeds not cycles, hack their pedelecs, and rush everywhere at unsafe speeds.

    Here the offender should have got out and checked given the tight manoeuvre, but he chose not to do so. He stated that he assumes that some obstacles (quoted wheelie bins) would move when he hit them with his trailer.

    An important aspect missed here is that part of the responsibility for the death lies with the person who parked blocking the entrance by parking to block it. For a petrol station it is obvious that vehicles will need to turn in. That one seems to have walked away.

    This is the location of the turn:
    https://www.google.com/maps/@53.4210831,-2.9815884,3a,29.3y,66.35h,76.49t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sB9SatvRce-uDrjZhtWTyDQ!2e0!5s20220901T000000!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409

    Look through the many previous dates and you can see how many times the wall has been demolished, how bollards are omitted to allow vehicles across the pavement, and how the 2Y lines have been unmaintained for 10-12 years.

    Clearly an HGV is crazy for deliveries there. They should be using a transit or a Luton.

    I'd need to see the sentencing remarks. I've linked a better report below which shows the driver did not indicate, so his cab safety cameras which would have displayed the sleeping woman were not activated.

    I think the sentence is perhaps OK in that context, and reflects the importance of "deterrence for others". It is nuts that there is no re-education requirement. I also think perhaps 25% of the responsibility should lie with the dangerous parker, who should also have been in court. Plus obviously lots of institutional failure around ASB parking not being tackled, where Liverpool is especially poor - one for the Govt.

    The only way of tackling the entrance I can see is big strong bollards on the corners preventing access by HGVs.

    https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/the-day-you-took-baby-30015823

    Cheers.

    Obviously speaking in ignorance of exactly what happened but still think the length of the jail sentence is a bit unfair. A few weeks + 5 year driving ban would be an effective deterrent with much lower costs to all parties involved.

    Still, HGV stats are appalling for pedestrian and cyclist fatalities, and HGVs driving on pavements is explicitly prohibited in the Highway Code so no excuses for it. Interested to see London is doing quite a bit better with their direct vision standard coming in.

    The pavement parking ban in Edinburgh is silly because it allows for some loading from pavements for LCVs. Crazy that the one exception we have is for the type of vehicle more likely to kill people.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987

    Leon said:

    This doesn't sound so promising, does it? On Labour's new housing plans


    "the [new Labour] steer away from simplistic ideas of ‘beauty’, fostered by the previous government, at the very least allows us to think about housing as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste."

    Yeah, fuck choice and taste, and fuck beauty. Let's reduce housing to a" necessary industrial process"

    https://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/opinion/were-not-short-of-great-housing-architects-why-isnt-one-on-the-new-towns-taskforce

    That does sound like something for pseuds corner, and I hope that the writer is nowhere near the design of any building, anywhere, ever.
    The writer is an architect. And what this really means is "Let us design houses that mean we can win awards for our daringly functional modernism", not houses that people actually want, like that awful Poundbury pastiche stuff
  • Taz said:

    Time to stop playing the working class card Angela.

    Rayner seems to be the ideal working class person for the upper and middle class to use to show they are not class prejudiced. I cannot hate the working class. I like Ange.

    Of course working class people who rioted, many of whom were not motivated by race, but deprivation, poverty or wanting a ruck with Plod are looked down on as are the areas they come from. Good piece in the Guardian on this today.

    "Angela Rayner makes a lot of being working class. In fact when those grisly images came back from Ibiza this summer of Ange in a rave, she said it was because she was working class, and the working classes like to party. No, Ange; we’re conflating two things here. There are your personal proclivities and there are the attributes of the working class and they’re not the same. In fact, the Deputy PM is getting away with murder on the back of her self-description as working class. It’s a way of seeing off criticism of her personal judgment as class-based snobbiness."

    Absolutely the above, and I care nothing for her dancing badly in Ibiza.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/opinion-angela-rayner-stop-playing-the-working-class-card/ar-AA1rbLO1?ocid=entnewsntp&pc=U531&cvid=43c9aae1777b424f9d3b4b0fe885777c&ei=9

    To be fair, I thought her dancing was quite good. But I agree with the rest of it.

    Don't much care for her or her politics.
    The Labour Party are obsessed by class. It is time people stopped talking about this archaic concept and think about people as individuals. I also can't help thinking that what people like Rayner are saying is "look how clever I am because I come from a working class background and I am better than all of the rest of you". Nobody fucking cares. Well if they do, they shouldn't.
    I would say they're post class now, its all about identities, whether that is sexuality, gender or race.
    Well yes, but they are still obsessed by it. The toolmaker's son and all that shit. He has now said that he is no longer "working class" but I think it is since the extravagant clothing costs came to light.
  • Taz said:

    Time to stop playing the working class card Angela.

    Rayner seems to be the ideal working class person for the upper and middle class to use to show they are not class prejudiced. I cannot hate the working class. I like Ange.

    Of course working class people who rioted, many of whom were not motivated by race, but deprivation, poverty or wanting a ruck with Plod are looked down on as are the areas they come from. Good piece in the Guardian on this today.

    "Angela Rayner makes a lot of being working class. In fact when those grisly images came back from Ibiza this summer of Ange in a rave, she said it was because she was working class, and the working classes like to party. No, Ange; we’re conflating two things here. There are your personal proclivities and there are the attributes of the working class and they’re not the same. In fact, the Deputy PM is getting away with murder on the back of her self-description as working class. It’s a way of seeing off criticism of her personal judgment as class-based snobbiness."

    Absolutely the above, and I care nothing for her dancing badly in Ibiza.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/opinion-angela-rayner-stop-playing-the-working-class-card/ar-AA1rbLO1?ocid=entnewsntp&pc=U531&cvid=43c9aae1777b424f9d3b4b0fe885777c&ei=9

    To be fair, I thought her dancing was quite good. But I agree with the rest of it.

    Don't much care for her or her politics.
    The Labour Party are obsessed by class. It is time people stopped talking about this archaic concept and think about people as individuals. I also can't help thinking that what people like Rayner are saying is "look how clever I am because I come from a working class background and I am better than all of the rest of you". Nobody fucking cares. Well if they do, they shouldn't.
    I thought TSE repeatedly says that too :lol:
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,509
    TimS said:

    Shit weather isn't it?

    Yep, still too damn hot in the middle of the day, and too humid in the mornings and evenings.

    Another month until the good weather arrives.
  • FossFoss Posts: 1,013
    Andy_JS said:

    O/T

    If you want to see something Nostradamus-like, watch this BBC programme from 1979 about the effect of computers on society, especially the last few minutes.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bo5QF_Rz4TM

    "The Mighty Micro Episode 4 The Introverted Society"

    If you're into that kind of thing then I'd also suggest 'Now The Chips Are Down' from 1978.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273
    eek said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
    If measured only on that,greener friendlier I could go on
    Edinburgh is the UK's greenest city, with the highest proportion of trees:people and 49% of the city is classified as green space.

    Glasgow has a motorway through the middle of it.
    You cannot compare the.people though and Edinburgh is invested with tourists
    Don't you mean infested?
    I did indeed, the curse of autocorrect and not proof reading
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987
    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Not being funny, but have you ever been tested for Seasonal Affective Disorder?
    My daughter suffers from this and her mood can dip alarmingly. This normally happens about November but it seems to have come earlier this year, possibly because we had such a crap and overcast summer. It may be that your travels have increased any initial sensitivity that you might have had.
    Never been tested but I am almost certain that I have SAD. If I can't escape the British winter I go mad (eg the third lockdown of winter 2021, OMFG)

    Not sure if my travels have accentuated it. They certainly AMELIORATE it when I CAN escape

    SAD is a very real thing and can be brutal. Mine is depressing but for some it is crippling, a good friend of mine split from his long term partner because her SAD made her unbearably bitchy and moody. He tolerated it for a while but when it inevitably came round every year...
    My daughter would try to get a boost of sun by a holiday during the winter months, January ideally but that is going to be a bit complicated this year because she is expecting in February.

    It can indeed be a seriously debilitating condition but there are things that can help like vitamin D or a blue ray lamp. I have noticed that when you are in this country, particularly in the winter months, you can get quite morose. Up to you but a check would not do any harm.
    Kind of you, but I don't think I need a check, I am pretty sure I have it. And indeed how can they check it other than by asking for mental symptoms? I would tick nearly all of them

    Sympathies for your daughter, that's going to be especially tough if she's expecting, she might get PND as well as SAD! I am sure you will be attendant

    I have tried all the known remedies, from Vitamin D to the lamps, they simply didn't work for me (and I really tried - perhaps they work for others). And yet I know that if I fly to Bangkok on December 31, the moment the airplane door opens and I step out in the soft tropical warmth and sun - bingo, my morosity disappears

  • Taz said:

    Time to stop playing the working class card Angela.

    Rayner seems to be the ideal working class person for the upper and middle class to use to show they are not class prejudiced. I cannot hate the working class. I like Ange.

    Of course working class people who rioted, many of whom were not motivated by race, but deprivation, poverty or wanting a ruck with Plod are looked down on as are the areas they come from. Good piece in the Guardian on this today.

    "Angela Rayner makes a lot of being working class. In fact when those grisly images came back from Ibiza this summer of Ange in a rave, she said it was because she was working class, and the working classes like to party. No, Ange; we’re conflating two things here. There are your personal proclivities and there are the attributes of the working class and they’re not the same. In fact, the Deputy PM is getting away with murder on the back of her self-description as working class. It’s a way of seeing off criticism of her personal judgment as class-based snobbiness."

    Absolutely the above, and I care nothing for her dancing badly in Ibiza.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/opinion-angela-rayner-stop-playing-the-working-class-card/ar-AA1rbLO1?ocid=entnewsntp&pc=U531&cvid=43c9aae1777b424f9d3b4b0fe885777c&ei=9

    To be fair, I thought her dancing was quite good. But I agree with the rest of it.

    Don't much care for her or her politics.
    The Labour Party are obsessed by class. It is time people stopped talking about this archaic concept and think about people as individuals. I also can't help thinking that what people like Rayner are saying is "look how clever I am because I come from a working class background and I am better than all of the rest of you". Nobody fucking cares. Well if they do, they shouldn't.
    I would say they're post class now, its all about identities, whether that is sexuality, gender or race.
    Well yes, but they are still obsessed by it. The toolmaker's son and all that shit. He has now said that he is no longer "working class" but I think it is since the extravagant clothing costs came to light.
    The fetishisation of working class identities is as old as the hills. Somehow you are more real and salt of the earth if you are working class, or when you were younger. Of course its all bollocks, and almost every person in Parliament is some form of middle class, just as much as for Labour as the Cons.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,954
    SandraMc said:

    Not necessarily. If it folded owing a lot of money, the creditors might have ripped the kitchen fittings out for resale. That happened to a restaurant near me.

    I think it might have been Anthony Bourdain who suggested if you want really good cookware at home, look for a restaurant that just went out of business selling everything
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,999
    edited September 27
    Eabhal said:

    MattW said:

    Eabhal said:

    Hello MattW - interested in your take on this:

    BBC News - Lorry driver who ran over sleeping woman jailed
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ced02qpe1j8o

    My instinct here is that such a long sentence is disproportionate (particularly given much worse driving is often let off - see Emma Newman in Glasgow) , but again the driving ban is too short.

    It's a fascinating case. Summary is: Spar HGV delivery driver, 52, in Liverpool did a sharp turn into a petrol station made difficult because a car (Audi obvs) was parked on the pavement, so his rear wheels ran over the pavement killing a sleeping homeless woman he says he thought was a bin bag and a folded duvet.

    Causing Death by Careless Driving. Guilty plea. 12 month prison sentence (ie out in 5 months I think). 12 month ban starting on release.

    I think the most important points are cultural: intrusion by drivers into pedestrian space (here esp. the dangerous parker) is treated as a casual right ignoring consequences, the duty of care for vulnerable road users is routinely ignored, and zero consideration for others is the normal routine, and how our streets are designed and built to allow pedestrians to be treated with contempt.

    There is also stuff about poor driving standards even amongst professional drivers, and time pressure - the same as incentivise food delivery riders to use e-mopeds not cycles, hack their pedelecs, and rush everywhere at unsafe speeds.

    Here the offender should have got out and checked given the tight manoeuvre, but he chose not to do so. He stated that he assumes that some obstacles (quoted wheelie bins) would move when he hit them with his trailer.

    An important aspect missed here is that part of the responsibility for the death lies with the person who parked blocking the entrance by parking to block it. For a petrol station it is obvious that vehicles will need to turn in. That one seems to have walked away.

    This is the location of the turn:
    https://www.google.com/maps/@53.4210831,-2.9815884,3a,29.3y,66.35h,76.49t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sB9SatvRce-uDrjZhtWTyDQ!2e0!5s20220901T000000!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409

    Look through the many previous dates and you can see how many times the wall has been demolished, how bollards are omitted to allow vehicles across the pavement, and how the 2Y lines have been unmaintained for 10-12 years.

    Clearly an HGV is crazy for deliveries there. They should be using a transit or a Luton.

    I'd need to see the sentencing remarks. I've linked a better report below which shows the driver did not indicate, so his cab safety cameras which would have displayed the sleeping woman were not activated.

    I think the sentence is perhaps OK in that context, and reflects the importance of "deterrence for others". It is nuts that there is no re-education requirement. I also think perhaps 25% of the responsibility should lie with the dangerous parker, who should also have been in court. Plus obviously lots of institutional failure around ASB parking not being tackled, where Liverpool is especially poor - one for the Govt.

    The only way of tackling the entrance I can see is big strong bollards on the corners preventing access by HGVs.

    https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/the-day-you-took-baby-30015823

    Cheers.

    Obviously speaking in ignorance of exactly what happened but still think the length of the jail sentence is a bit unfair. A few weeks + 5 year driving ban would be an effective deterrent with much lower costs to all parties involved.

    Still, HGV stats are appalling for pedestrian and cyclist fatalities, and HGVs driving on pavements is explicitly prohibited in the Highway Code so no excuses for it. Interested to see London is doing quite a bit better with their direct vision standard coming in.
    On the Google link, you can also see how the pavement is smashed up.

    On area, it's about devolution giving stability of governance, and Liverpool City Region needing to catch up, and Not Invented Here.

    They also cocked up their first Cyclops junction by messing up the light sequencing - all they had to do was ask Manchester next door, who have been doing them since 2020.

    Here's a video Ashley Neal did about it, where he got frustrated about the traffic lights on the cycle track after waiting for a long time and it not noticing him. He likes attention !
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3roS0jvksw

    Also note the designed in unicycle-radius U-turn required to get onto the one way track where Ashley had to do a 3 point turn even on his standard pedal-cycle.

    The Active Travel England Capacity to Deliver rating are a useful measure:
    https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/66d959112bc43c72b08264a0/local-authority-active-travel-capability-ratings-2024.pdf

    (Obviously Notts is about the only one in the whole bloody country that has gone backwards, FFS.)
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,755
    eek said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    malcolmg said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    Bollox, only a test from Edinburgh would come out with that tosh
    pS. I am not from Glasgow so no bias
    50 inches of rain v 29 in Edinburgh. No getting round that.
    If measured only on that,greener friendlier I could go on
    Edinburgh is the UK's greenest city, with the highest proportion of trees:people and 49% of the city is classified as green space.

    Glasgow has a motorway through the middle of it.
    You cannot compare the.people though and Edinburgh is invested with tourists
    Don't you mean infested?
    Could be both in fairness.
  • Leon said:

    This doesn't sound so promising, does it? On Labour's new housing plans


    "the [new Labour] steer away from simplistic ideas of ‘beauty’, fostered by the previous government, at the very least allows us to think about housing as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste."

    Yeah, fuck choice and taste, and fuck beauty. Let's reduce housing to a" necessary industrial process"

    https://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/opinion/were-not-short-of-great-housing-architects-why-isnt-one-on-the-new-towns-taskforce

    Well it worked wonderfully in eastern Europe lol. Bet you won't find Ange or His Sartorial Starmerness living in a brutalist tower block in Stockport.
    Alli Towers..
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987
    I don't want to be Old Mister Gloomy-gusset, but this is also quite depressing, and absolutely crucial:

    "Yesterday's data dump from the Government also showed we have the highest domestic electricity prices in the IEA. On a par with Germany, but ~80% above the IEA median, 3.5X Korea and 2.8X USA. Prices like these are an existential threat to the economy. (1/2)"

    https://x.com/7Kiwi/status/1839569654366216407

    Britain is deliberately setting itelf on a path of absolute economic decline. We cannot compete when we cripple outselves like this. Labour will helplessly preside over a stagnant economy (or actually make it worse thanks to Ed Miliband), so they will get booted out in 2029 and we will probably get Farage as PM
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,496

    Leon said:

    This doesn't sound so promising, does it? On Labour's new housing plans


    "the [new Labour] steer away from simplistic ideas of ‘beauty’, fostered by the previous government, at the very least allows us to think about housing as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste."

    Yeah, fuck choice and taste, and fuck beauty. Let's reduce housing to a" necessary industrial process"

    https://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/opinion/were-not-short-of-great-housing-architects-why-isnt-one-on-the-new-towns-taskforce

    That does sound like something for pseuds corner, and I hope that the writer is nowhere near the design of any building, anywhere, ever.
    It has universal applicablity:

    Let us think about food as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste.

    Let us think about clothing as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste.

    Let us think about procreation as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,954
    Eabhal said:

    Edinburgh is the UK's greenest city, with the highest proportion of trees:people and 49% of the city is classified as green space.

    Before or after they cut down all the trees in the East gardens?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,509

    algarkirk said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Quite a lot of people like our climate because they dislike heat. This is not a fashionable view, perhaps because it isn't possible to commercialise or advertise the concept of liking rather boring middling weather - outside temperature at say 16-21 C.
    Yes. I once met a Middle Eastern prince in St James’ Park. Just got talking to this guy randomly. He said: “I cannot understand why the English complain about their weather. The weather here is absolutely lovely. I wish we had it.”
    That’s because you met him in summer, when half the Middle East decamps to London.

    They don’t know that London has three other seasons.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,271
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    This doesn't sound so promising, does it? On Labour's new housing plans


    "the [new Labour] steer away from simplistic ideas of ‘beauty’, fostered by the previous government, at the very least allows us to think about housing as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste."

    Yeah, fuck choice and taste, and fuck beauty. Let's reduce housing to a" necessary industrial process"

    https://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/opinion/were-not-short-of-great-housing-architects-why-isnt-one-on-the-new-towns-taskforce

    That does sound like something for pseuds corner, and I hope that the writer is nowhere near the design of any building, anywhere, ever.
    The writer is an architect. And what this really means is "Let us design houses that mean we can win awards for our daringly functional modernism", not houses that people actually want, like that awful Poundbury pastiche stuff
    There have been a few interesting houses built around abouts over the years by architects with ideas, but there's a lot that you can do that isn't actively hostile to the people who end up living in the place.

    I quite like this house, but somewhat beyond my modest means.
    https://www.irishexaminer.com/property/residential/arid-40705196.html
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987
    On the other hand I just made £10k. That's cheered me up. Fuck the weather
  • Taz said:

    Time to stop playing the working class card Angela.

    Rayner seems to be the ideal working class person for the upper and middle class to use to show they are not class prejudiced. I cannot hate the working class. I like Ange.

    Of course working class people who rioted, many of whom were not motivated by race, but deprivation, poverty or wanting a ruck with Plod are looked down on as are the areas they come from. Good piece in the Guardian on this today.

    "Angela Rayner makes a lot of being working class. In fact when those grisly images came back from Ibiza this summer of Ange in a rave, she said it was because she was working class, and the working classes like to party. No, Ange; we’re conflating two things here. There are your personal proclivities and there are the attributes of the working class and they’re not the same. In fact, the Deputy PM is getting away with murder on the back of her self-description as working class. It’s a way of seeing off criticism of her personal judgment as class-based snobbiness."

    Absolutely the above, and I care nothing for her dancing badly in Ibiza.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/opinion-angela-rayner-stop-playing-the-working-class-card/ar-AA1rbLO1?ocid=entnewsntp&pc=U531&cvid=43c9aae1777b424f9d3b4b0fe885777c&ei=9

    To be fair, I thought her dancing was quite good. But I agree with the rest of it.

    Don't much care for her or her politics.
    The Labour Party are obsessed by class. It is time people stopped talking about this archaic concept and think about people as individuals. I also can't help thinking that what people like Rayner are saying is "look how clever I am because I come from a working class background and I am better than all of the rest of you". Nobody fucking cares. Well if they do, they shouldn't.
    I would say they're post class now, its all about identities, whether that is sexuality, gender or race.
    Well yes, but they are still obsessed by it. The toolmaker's son and all that shit. He has now said that he is no longer "working class" but I think it is since the extravagant clothing costs came to light.
    The fetishisation of working class identities is as old as the hills. Somehow you are more real and salt of the earth if you are working class, or when you were younger. Of course its all bollocks, and almost every person in Parliament is some form of middle class, just as much as for Labour as the Cons.
    Indeed. The irony also is that being "working class" does not automatically mean you had a tough life. I think the aristocratic Winston Churchill had a somewhat more traumatic early life than Sir Keir Boring, the latter of whom, by the sound of things, was brought up in a pretty secure loving home.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,007
    edited September 27
    Sandpit said:

    algarkirk said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Quite a lot of people like our climate because they dislike heat. This is not a fashionable view, perhaps because it isn't possible to commercialise or advertise the concept of liking rather boring middling weather - outside temperature at say 16-21 C.
    Yes. I once met a Middle Eastern prince in St James’ Park. Just got talking to this guy randomly. He said: “I cannot understand why the English complain about their weather. The weather here is absolutely lovely. I wish we had it.”
    That’s because you met him in summer, when half the Middle East decamps to London.

    They don’t know that London has three other seasons.
    Partly that.

    Partly because our houses are very old and poorly insulated so the weather often seems worse than it is.

    And partly because where he's from is basically uninhabitable eight months of the year, so his standards are low.

    Also partly because London has about the best weather in the country - other English people have more of a reason to complain.

    And finally because the English standard of comparison tends to be where they go on holiday, e.g. the south of France, Italy, Spain or Florida in the winter, not some ghastly parched desert.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,842
    Who was that fucker fancy chef Tom someone or other who did a pre-pack, binned off all the bills from his suppliers and then opened the next day or so as a new business.

    Around Westbourne something.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,273
    Leon said:

    On the other hand I just made £10k. That's cheered me up. Fuck the weather

    Is that a Starmer 10k or an earned 10k
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,842
    Leon said:

    On the other hand I just made £10k. That's cheered me up. Fuck the weather

    Delighted you have had (or given?) a happy ending.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987
    malcolmg said:

    Leon said:

    On the other hand I just made £10k. That's cheered me up. Fuck the weather

    Is that a Starmer 10k or an earned 10k
    Earned. Sold a new flint design to Finland
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,396

    Cookie said:

    algarkirk said:

    Pulpstar said:

    All the council by-elections looking piss poor for Labour. Now it's obviously normal for a Gov't to go backwards in mid-term (And we haven't reached those) council elections, but Starmer clearly wanted to get to mid term unpopularity early :D

    Labour will spin next year’s locals as good for Labour as they were last held in 2021 which was peak Boris.
    The 2025 locals will be greatly impacted by how many candidates Reform are able to field.
    Partly that would be about having that sort of party organsiation on the ground. But also- how far are Reform supporters motivated by the sort of responsibiliites that local councils have?

    The one to watch for Reform might be the new Linconshire mayorality. (How can counties have Mayors? They should be called Sheriffs, or if you want proper romanticism, Counts.)
    'Counts' is what they are called in abroadland, where they are usually fictional villains. Here they are earls, and the clue is that an earl's wife is a countess. And these positions are already mostly occupied, and if not by earls then by Dukes, and if not by modern incumbents, by Shakespeare.

    Sheriffs are already taken, and appointed regularly IIRC by HMKCIII from among the great and good.

    Counties of course can't possibly have mayors. What about County Customer Services Czar?
    Well mayors were already taken when elected mayors came along. They wore gold chains and funny hats. So I don't see why we can't have elected sherrifs for counties.
    I'd go for elected Earls, or Lords Lieutenant.

    There's an Earl of Lincoln, but you could call the elected one the Earl of Lincolnshire.

    Edit: This could feed into reform of the House of Lords if you actually made them Earls. An incremental way to achieve the idea of a second house of the nations and regions, by having elected Earls sit in the House of Lords.
    Allegedly…. I read it somewhere but can’t recall where ….. the Norman kings were going to appoint Counts ti various counties, but desisted when they heard how Count was pronounced in several Saxon accents. It’s why an Earl’s wife is a Countess.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,755
    algarkirk said:

    DavidL said:

    algarkirk said:

    DavidL said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    Eabhal said:

    Leon said:

    I’m going to refine my “London is the new Anchorage” meteorological meme. It’s hyperbolic, something I abhor. We don’t get the snows of Alaskan winters

    I think we’ve now got the climate of somewhere about 500-1000km north of Vancouver. Somewhere like Haida Gwaii or Dawsons Landing or Whaletown

    London: the Canadian Pacific sub-Arctic of the east

    Not as catchy but closer to the truth. We now have a cold rainforest climate


    This is just wrong, sorry. London has only 40% of the precipitation of Haida Gwell.
    But we’re catching up, aren’t we?

    *stares outside*
    East coast of the UK is frankly rather pleasant. Even Edinburgh has less rain than Lisbon, Rome, Palermo, Geneva. It's the dark winters and cloudy skies that can cause issues, but then we get these glorious weeks in May and June.

    Glasgow is grim though.
    OTOH, 'cos of the rain, our island is gloriously verdant. Bill Bryson once said of Devon that you could be forgiven for thinking its chief industry was the manufacture of chlorophyll.
    And there is a moment when, after a week in Southern Europe when you've gradually become accustomed to the pale washed-out beige and the brightness, that your plane descends through the clouds above Kinder on its descent into Manchester Airport, and you're peering keenly out the window looking for familiar landmarks because your family know how much you love doing that and they always indulge this one, one time where your wants take precedence over those of your children who are in any case plugged into electronic devices and they let you have the window seat, and suddenly there is Tameside; sweet, unremarkable, uninteresting Tameside below you, startlingly close, and the force of the GREEN hits you almost bodily - and the urban form suddenly makes sense again, and everything is familiar, and there's the M60, that must be Bredbury, and look, there's the Pyramid, there's Edgeley Park, there's John Lewis at Cheadle (see? they're not interested; the window seat would have been wasted on them anyway), there's the Heald Green line and we're inches over Moss Nook and the world is green and subtle and British right to the horizon, and man, it's good to be home and as the tears slightly well with the hiraeth that you didn't know you had been feeling but has now been gloriously blown away, that you reflect - actually, there's a lot to be said for grey, damp and mild.
    Beautifully put and so sadly untrue
    I do genuinely enjoy arriving back to a dull grey mild day, and I wouldn't want it any less wet, because I do genuinely love the greenness of the UK and the west of it in particular. But I will quietly concede I wouldn't mind a bit more blue sky - just as much rain, but rather more concentrated.
    I'd also like a bit more snow in winter. Britain never looks better than when covered in snow.
    I genuinely envy your ability to enjoy our weather

    I sometimes wonder if my endless pro travel has spoiled me. ie I’ve been to so many lovely places with lovely climates it’s made me overly critical of British damp and grey, which isn’t THAT bad

    But then I remember my first Mediterranean holiday aged about seven and how that warm consistent sun made me instantly happier, and how I felt - even aged seven - “my God, this is what weather is meant to be like, this is my kind of world” - so maybe I was born in the wrong climate and all my travels since have been at attempt to escape it
    Not being funny, but have you ever been tested for Seasonal Affective Disorder?
    My daughter suffers from this and her mood can dip alarmingly. This normally happens about November but it seems to have come earlier this year, possibly because we had such a crap and overcast summer. It may be that your travels have increased any initial sensitivity that you might have had.
    Good point. This is pretty common. IMHO things which help (and can do no harm even if not) are vitamin D, and being outside in daytime deliberately and consciously looking up at the sky even if it is grey and cloudy, for a few minutes a day. The latter is excellent for the soul too, even, maybe especially, in Jan/Feb.

    Some say Omega 3 helps too.
    She gets prescribed vitamin D. Actually, through the miserable climate and diet vitamin D deficiency is very common in Scotland. Not heard about the Omega 3 though. I will recommend that she gives it a go.
    Best of luck. Don't miss out the looking at the sky. For me it's the number one treatment.
    She actually works in a photobiology lab that is focused on those who are exceptionally sensitive to the sun but the tech they have does allow the amount of sunlight the person is exposed to to be monitored.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,541
    TOPPING said:

    Who was that fucker fancy chef Tom someone or other who did a pre-pack, binned off all the bills from his suppliers and then opened the next day or so as a new business.

    Around Westbourne something.

    https://amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2010/sep/09/chef-tom-aikens-returns
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,271
    TOPPING said:

    Who was that fucker fancy chef Tom someone or other who did a pre-pack, binned off all the bills from his suppliers and then opened the next day or so as a new business.

    Around Westbourne something.

    Tom Aikens. Back before Cameron was PM.
    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2010/mar/19/crackdown-insolvency-prepack-deals
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,987

    Leon said:

    I don't want to be Old Mister Gloomy-gusset, but this is also quite depressing, and absolutely crucial:

    "Yesterday's data dump from the Government also showed we have the highest domestic electricity prices in the IEA. On a par with Germany, but ~80% above the IEA median, 3.5X Korea and 2.8X USA. Prices like these are an existential threat to the economy. (1/2)"

    https://x.com/7Kiwi/status/1839569654366216407

    Britain is deliberately setting itelf on a path of absolute economic decline. We cannot compete when we cripple outselves like this. Labour will helplessly preside over a stagnant economy (or actually make it worse thanks to Ed Miliband), so they will get booted out in 2029 and we will probably get Farage as PM

    Our nuclear prices are 4 - 6 times those of South Korea.

    We could, however, still build ten tidal lagoon power statons in the next 10 years. They will still be producing power for 180 years.

    Apparently everything in Britain - from rails to trams to houses to power stations - to domestic heating - must cost 5 times what it costs everywhere else, meaning we will get poorer and poorer as we can't afford it, and all the rich people therefore flee the chilly, darkening nightmare

    We need a revolutionary government to break us out of this deathly doom loop. Starmer's Labour is certainly not that
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,305
    In important news:

    Lalit Modi implicitly accuses the ECB of fraud.

    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/the-hundred-premium/ipl_founder_casts_doubt_on_hundred_projections.html?t=638630421707736518

    When even Lalit Modi thinks you're being dishonest, something is wrong.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,039
    Leon said:

    This doesn't sound so promising, does it? On Labour's new housing plans


    "the [new Labour] steer away from simplistic ideas of ‘beauty’, fostered by the previous government, at the very least allows us to think about housing as a necessary industrial process, instead of one of choice and taste."

    Yeah, fuck choice and taste, and fuck beauty. Let's reduce housing to a" necessary industrial process"

    https://www.architectsjournal.co.uk/news/opinion/were-not-short-of-great-housing-architects-why-isnt-one-on-the-new-towns-taskforce

    Each time I hear someone advocate Brutalism for other people to live in, I feel a strong desire to see Brutalism practiced upon them.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,909

    Leon said:

    I don't want to be Old Mister Gloomy-gusset, but this is also quite depressing, and absolutely crucial:

    "Yesterday's data dump from the Government also showed we have the highest domestic electricity prices in the IEA. On a par with Germany, but ~80% above the IEA median, 3.5X Korea and 2.8X USA. Prices like these are an existential threat to the economy. (1/2)"

    https://x.com/7Kiwi/status/1839569654366216407

    Britain is deliberately setting itelf on a path of absolute economic decline. We cannot compete when we cripple outselves like this. Labour will helplessly preside over a stagnant economy (or actually make it worse thanks to Ed Miliband), so they will get booted out in 2029 and we will probably get Farage as PM

    Our nuclear prices are 4 - 6 times those of South Korea.

    We could, however, still build ten tidal lagoon power statons in the next 10 years. They will still be producing power for 180 years.

    And get S Korea to build our nuclear reactors.
    Negotiate some subcontracting for UK plc; they might learn something.
This discussion has been closed.