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Today is the day of crossover – politicalbetting.com

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  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,978

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    I thought Drakeford was off to spend more time in his definitely not a second home home?
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,496
    Omnium said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Omnium said:

    Dopermean said:

    Omnium said:

    Andy_JS said:

    You can make 6% profit betting on both Trump and Harris atm. Unusual situation.

    https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/politics/market/1.176878927

    Yeah, but Trump could just pull out if he feels he's sure to lose. No doubt causing all sorts of trouble at the same time. Hopefully some time soon though his trouble making days will be firmly on the wane.

    Edit: I actually backed Vance at 290s this morning for that reason - admittedly only risking one of my highly polished Omnium pounds.
    Betfair take 5% of winnings though
    Sure but it's only 5% of the 6% you make if you think backing both Trump and Harris is safe. (I don't). And also I think you can choose options on BF that reduce the commission, but lose any freebies. (In fact you can and their 'basic' option means you pay 2%)
    Your username is remarkably adroit just now considering we just won the points race portion in the velodrome
    Well my username was chosen after the 'Duke of Omnium' in Trollope's Palliser series (who I think is the most fabulous political character), so no cycling claims.
    The DoO also pops up in the Barchester novels.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,643
    edited August 8

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    She's previously been disqualified from driving for speeding in 30mph areas, so this is just self-preservation.

    It's like a convicted burglar making shoplifting legal.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,362
    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,213
    edited August 8

    Phil said:

    viewcode said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Phil said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Kaye Hoey being extremely dishonest here.


    Kate Hoey
    @CatharineHoey
    Still no answer to why it will take to next year before Alex Rudakubana the alleged murderer of the 3 young girls in South
    Oct will stand trial ?

    Community notes can be very entertaining sometimes. A genuinely great idea.
    People dis Twitter* under Musk, but he has implemented two genuinely useful features:

    (1) Community notes
    (2) People I follow

    It means I see fewer Marjorie Taylor Greene posts. Which is good.

    * I refuse to call it "X"
    Community Notes predates Musk
    Sort of.

    There was a program that created Notes that predated Musk, but it wasn't very widespread nor was it open source - and it had a different name.

    The current version dates from Musk.
    The story I’ve seen elsewhere is that the current version was in development before Musk bought the company. He just happened to be in charge when it was finished up & pushed to production.

    Always remember the six stages of a project:

    1. Enthusiasm
    2. Disillusionment
    3. Panic
    4. Search for the Guilty
    5. Punishment of the Innocent
    6. Praise for those not involved
    There are some interesting horror stories out there about the Twitter code base and what was going on before the takeover. There was a reason that features were simply not appearing in production...
    Given Musk is apparently not a good coder, I wouldn't assume he's made the codebase any better... ;)
    You're not say that he does all the coding for his companies, are you?
    No. But I can guarantee that he will hire coders that match his image of a good coder... i.e. him. And the recruitment staff will be recruited on the same basis (I *still* see the old story of him personally interviewing all SpaceX staff...) (fx: hits head on wall.)

    SpaceX is actually different, as space and NASA demand certain boxes ticked. I bet he hates those boxes.
    Nope - long before SpaceX got a NASA contract, they were racing ahead of the rest of the Space Industry on the software side. Simply because they hired top engineers without legacy “we don’t do that here” to tell them *not do modern software development*.

    When they got a NASA contract, their system for tracking parts got all kinds of wow reviews. All they had done was implement a single logical system, using standard stuff (bar codes etc), rather than a pile of paperwork multiples by several incompatible legacy systems.

    The usage of FPGAs emulating PowerPC architecture wasn’t invented by SpaceX either. But they were one of the first to apply it to aerospace. Just as doing radiation tolerance at the macro, rather than micro level. Both were in place before NASA started audits etc. Both took a bit of convincing before they were cleared for Human Rated flight.

    The initial review of the Dragon control interface was a bit hilarious - instead of taking the “fake an aircraft dash”, the SpaceX engineers created a system of context driven, intuitive menus and screen controls, using industrial psychologists, former astronauts etc.

    The NASA reviewers initially had an Out Of Context problem - they couldn’t understand why it didn’t just have an aircraft dashboard. But once they dug into it, they really liked the concept. Which was to align the interface with the checklists and procedures, rather than have a translation layer from procedure to switches.

    On Tesla - a friend worked for Tata, in their outfit tearing down rival cars. He was a software engineer / electronics guy and his comment was that Tesla simply implemented modern software and hardware practise in an industry full of appalling IT. The mechanicals he thought were pretty poor, by comparison.

    One amusing story he told me - he was debugging a certain car. A whole pile of different computers talking to each other via a mess of cables. He eliminated a stream of errors that one computer was polluting the system with. Which caused another part of the system to crash. Turned out that the stream of errors was preventing a condition in one of the other computers. Luxury car, on the road and in production.

    There are times when I think you haven't drunk the Musk Kool-Aid, then you produce something like that.

    Musk is one man. He does not, Bill Gates-like, read every line of code. He does not do everything inside the organisation. SpaceX is different, because it took people from other space companies, who knew how to do things in space. Musk knew how to code a game. And code some of Paypal's predecessor. Badly.

    I'd strongly argue that Tesla's inability to drive from one side of the US to another - as promised by Musk in 2016 - is a sign that they're not as strong in software as you would like to think.

    I've got a counter-example for your amusing story. A German car company developed a concept car that had no direct mechanical link between steering wheel and steering, as required by law. everything in the car used the same control/data bus. It worked really well.

    Until someone changed the CD in the CD multi-changer, and so much data was sent over the bus that the steering locked up for a few seconds.

    The result: a separate bus for 'critical' functions like steering and braking. And another for non-critical functions.

    The *mess of cables* you decry might actually have sensible purposes. And this is something that *anybody* reverse-engineering anything needs to consider: if you think the people who designed the thing you're reverse-engineering was stupid; perhaps you don't understand it fully, and it is *you* who is being stupid.
    What I was saying is that Tesla and SpaceX seem to use modern IT. There is no otherworldly stuff. Just the things you'd get from hiring top end people and them having a clean slate to work on.

    The "bus" story you mention sounds like a classic of someone using technology without understanding limitations and, most importantly, best practice.

    Guaranteed delivery of data within a specified time frame has long been a thing on critical systems. IIRC it was first implemented, long ago (70s IIRC) for digital fly-by-wire aircraft. There are a number of standards now. IIRC SpaceX uses one of them for the Ethernet(ish) network it runs on its rockets.

    EDIT: another friend when to work for a satellite maker. And discovered their approach to the security *of the control of the satellites* was home rolled, insane, and decades behind basic IT security rules. At a guess, a number of legacy industries haven't adapted well to the IT revolution.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,549
    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    Why?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,978
    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,362

    Hartlepool lad gets 16 months for throwing an egg.

    On the face of it, that does sound rather harsh.

    I’m sure the Stans for the #wholetruthfive will be as outraged about this as they were about the so called whole truth five.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,027
    Eabhal said:

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    She's previously been disqualified from driving for speeding in 30mph areas, so this is just self-preservation.
    Or actually supported by her government and the Senedd
  • AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 1,457

    More thoughtfully:

    Worst for the Tories/best for us (LDs): Badenoch, Jenrick
    Maybe bad, maybe good: Patel, Tugendhat
    Best for Tores/worst for us: Cleverly
    Who?: Stride

    I'm genuinely surprised to see Stride being regarded as an also-ran. He was almost the only MP who turned up for the national election campaign - in fact, it often seemed like he was out in the media all day, every day. By contrast, the likes of Badenoch were nowhere to be seen.

    I guess he's seen as being too much of a wet, but he is at least up for the job, and we have a decent amount of evidence to suggest that he'd actually be good at the core holding-the-government-to-account part of it.

    There's likely to be a lot of in-fighting over the next few years, while the party works out how to reconfigure itself for the future. We saw that under Hague and IDS, and it essentially removed the Tories from the field of play for half a decade.

    Stride could plausibly act as a front-man, spending his time talking to the country (or, at least, the media) and bashing whatever the govt happens to be doing. In the meantime, the rest of the party could sort itself out without that becoming the focus of the story. You'd want to replace him ahead of the next election but, with luck, the best choice for leader should be obvious by then.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,027

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    I thought Drakeford was off to spend more time in his definitely not a second home home?
    It is temporary apparently
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,362

    Has Russia surrendered yet ?

    It will all be over by Christmas.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,620
    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    It really isn't.

    At work (and in the wider industry) so many of our Tweets have ads underneath them as the first reply things like promoting scams, drop shipping scams, and racist posts, and follow all sorts of undesirables.

    The fact is with verified taking away trust, we were ahead of the RNOH.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,027
    edited August 8
    Eabhal said:

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    She's previously been disqualified from driving for speeding in 30mph areas, so this is just self-preservation.

    It's like a convicted burglar making shoplifting legal.
    You really are struggling to accept that the Welsh government and Senedd has accepted this decision

    I would add it makes it difficult for Starmer to try to implement it in England
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,239
    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    More thoughtfully:

    Worst for the Tories/best for us (LDs): Badenoch, Jenrick
    Maybe bad, maybe good: Patel, Tugendhat
    Best for Tores/worst for us: Cleverly
    Who?: Stride

    I think Patel would be worst, she has by far the highest negatives of the above in polls albeit she has an aggressive semi charisma.

    Any of the above could win though if Labour muck up the economy and fail to stop the boats
    Patel is a roll of the dice, in my opinion.
    She certainly has negatives, and she really didn't come across as any too bright when trying to debate on the death penalty that time, but she's almost unencumbered by the recent Tory disasters, leaving Cabinet in 2022. She'd be attractive to some on the Reform side (albeit putting off a few of the most hardcore racists and bigots due to her race and sex) with her long record of right-wingery. It remains to be seen how off-putting (or not) she'd be to the more liberal and one-nation voters lost by the Tories this year.
    She’s also rather attractive. Shouldn’t matter, but it kinda does - a tiny bit. If you’re forced to look at someone for five years then it helps if looking at them is pleasing

    Same applies to Starmer’s nasal voice. It’s deeply grating - to me. Such a trivial thing should not be salient but I do find myself avoiding his speeches and statements simply because of his voice-tone

    I am clearly a very superficial person
    I find it quite remarkable how many entirely unfounded grudges (wrong word, I just mean disapprovals, but can't think of the right word) I have against various people in public life just because of some mannerism, whether real or simply erroneously perceived by me.

    I start the day listening to the Today programme on R4 - I'm annoyed by Emma Barnett's 'but what do you think' style, and infuriated by the idiocy of Sean Farrington. (I concede that 6am might not be my most friendly time)

    I also have other non-morning hated people - Fred Seirax (I think that's his name) = I despise the man, but I have no good reason for doing so.

    And I don't like Wes Streeting, even though I think he's really quite good.

    My views do change sometimes though. I didn't like Chris Packham when he first appeared on TV, but I now certainly do - I even bought his book.
    Yes it can be quite capricious and unpredictable

    I disliked Gareth Southgate out of all proportion to his tepid Wokeness and lack of ideas. Just something about the man narked me

    Even more interesting are people you LIKE or tolerate despite reviling their attitudes, opinions, actions

    I find Xi Jinping curiously acceptable despite loathing him and his cruel autocracy. He’s got a soothingly calm face. Good hair

    Chapo “shorty” Guzman the Mexican cartel leader, responsible for the death and torture of thousands - a lovable rogue. Peppy. Underdog made good

    Ivan the Terrible. Just love his name. Would deffo stand him a pint. Bet he’d have great stories

    Caligula. I mean - the horse. Superb trolling

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,978
    What gets me about cut their throats video, .the likes od the woman wearing her amenesty international bib is there clapping away in support......
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,895
    As we're talking about TwiX, any thoughts on the madcap plan to sue businesses who refuse to advertise on the platform?

    I believe the allegation is some kind of secret cabal that plotted apparently illegally to not spend money on their service. Not convinced there is a case to answer - if advertising on TwiX annoys your customers and thus damages your business, or even delivers poor ROI, how is choosing not to lose money illegal?
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,656
    Taz said:

    Has Russia surrendered yet ?

    It will all be over by Christmas.
    Which Christmas?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,620

    As we're talking about TwiX, any thoughts on the madcap plan to sue businesses who refuse to advertise on the platform?

    I believe the allegation is some kind of secret cabal that plotted apparently illegally to not spend money on their service. Not convinced there is a case to answer - if advertising on TwiX annoys your customers and thus damages your business, or even delivers poor ROI, how is choosing not to lose money illegal?

    He can sue, he ain't winning.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,773

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Sandpit said:

    ...

    Sandpit said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Ah, so should the public sector be trying to work with the largest audience possible, or be partaking in performative wokery choosing one platform over another?
    Encouraging Zuckerberg is not great either.

    Why not go back to just having a public website? I hear forums still work if you want to encourage public discussion.
    Oh indeed.

    One of my major projects at work at the moment, is trying to get everyone using Teams instead of a whole bunch of ad-hoc WhatsApp groups for discussions that have a financial impact on the company.
    I my last place of employ they really tried hard to get everyone to use Teams. You knew though that you were in conversations with the senior team when you got a whatsapp message though :)

    I made a point of not having WhatsApp on my own phone (my phone, not their phone) from the day I was hired.

    One very senior manager didn’t understand that iMessage was a data message rather than an SMS, and wondered why I didn’t have WA on my phone.

    I used to deliver a talk to schools and parents about IT security, called “Why I’m not on Facebook”.
    Excellent.

    I used to have that ranty all the time but have just about given up. I just tell people that if you insist on using Facebook then I won't see any of it.

    My employer encourages everyone to post crap on Workplace and LinkedIn but I don't feel I'm missing out on anything by ignoring them...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZfQymnABxQ
    Entirely off thread, but to add to our conversation last night about why Holland - it is striking how many British families holidaying here have three or more children. Indeed, it seems more common than not. I suspect this is a feature of the affotdability of a North Sea ferry over five school holiday return plane tickets.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,549
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    MattW said:

    Sandpit said:

    Seems to be a degree of panic among the Russian milibloggers over events in Kursk Oblast. Massive confusion about where Ukrainian forces are, and whether forces encountered are part of the main body of troops or sabotage/reconnaissance groups.

    No sign yet of Russian reinforcements stabilizing the situation, though there are videos of lots of Ukrainian equipment being taken out by Lancet drones.

    Still not sure whether this is just a raid, or the start of a large effort to seize Russian territory for use in bargaining during peace negotiations, or a strategy to lengthen the front line to weaken the Russian defence of occupied Ukrainian territory.

    It’s all very weird. There’s a suggestion that the Russian town of Sudzha (highlighted) is about to fall to Ukrainian troops, who have already made several km of progress into Russia. The Russians appear to be totally flat-footed, with no spare troops anywhere to come to their aid.



    Source: https://liveuamap.com/
    Reports I've heard point out that troops in Russia are likely to be wet-behind-the-ears conscripts, who are not sent to Ukraine.

    I've no idea on the UA tactics, unless they expect it to draw Russian troops away from frontlines in quantities justifying the 2-3k UA troops who are reported to be involved.
    The UA troops involved are presumably some of the best they have, who must know that they are on a suicide mission if they can’t extract themselves.

    But it does highlight that Russia can’t defend its own border, with their forces spread thinly to allow deployments further South.

    If this is a successful raid by UA troops, we might well see this as a regular occurrence. I can’t imagine that the UA army can actually hold any Russian territory for more than a few days, but they’ve shown they can do it and draw what’s likely to be a massive redeployment of Russian troops from more important (to UA) places.
    The folk looking at this escapade with greatest interest will be in Beijing.

    Everything east of the Urals is yours for the taking, guys...
    Oh indeed, if the Russians can’t defend their border with Ukraine 100km North of the conflict zone, what chance they can defend 10,000km of border anywhere else?
    America might quietly suggest they would be rather more relaxed about Chinese ambitions of empire being manifested in that direction rather than in acquiring Taiwan.
    You’re an excellent commenter, and properly respected, but this whole “China should invade Russia” discourse is a big pipe of crazy copium. Which you smoke every tine you worry about Ukraine

    China is not going to invade Russia. It’s not going to annexe Siberia. It’s not going to do anything remotely like this because to do so would be instant world war 3 and Beijing would be a heap of radioactive ruins within 43 minutes

    Nor is America about to “encourage” China to invade Russia, for the same reasons
    It isn't just that. It's also that it doesn't really need to. What's it going to do with its new colony of Russia? Extract cheap oil from it? It's doing that already. Vs. having to invade and defend it. You don't invade somewhere you don't need to. Taiwan is personal - that's different.
    Yes. Russia will become a feudal state, subject to China, like 13th century Brittany paying obeisance to France. Or Scotland at any time

    Bit of a bummer for the ultra-nationalist Russian philosophes who envisaged China subservient to Moscow
    I have no particular background or insight into Russian political culture, but it does occur to me that some of the explanation for Putin’s behaviour/Russian nationalism in the recent couple of decades is their cultural, economic and military threat from the south.

    They feel insecure as hell.
    Yes. They are almost certain to be dominated by China - an economy six times the size - and they won’t like it at all. It inverts their experience of the last 250 years at least, when Russia/USSR was superior
    Look at how South Korea picked itself up after the Korean war to become a world economic powerhouse. Russia in 2000 was starting from a *much* superior position - more resources; a better industrial base; a well-educated population - and has gone backwards over 25-odd years.

    This is due to the decisions of the leadership; i.e. one Vladimir Putin. He could have taken the country down the hard path, one that would use those advantages and built them up. Instead, he took the easy path and allowed his cronies to steal. In the same way he stole parts of Georgia in 2008; Crimea and the Donbass in 2014; and he tried to steal Ukraine in 2022.

    Russia could have taken China or South Korea's path. Instead it took the easy route, and inevitably failed.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    Legally, a riot defined as twelve or more people present together who used or threatened unlawful violence for a common purpose, and that the conduct of them was such as to cause a present person of reasonable firmness to fear for his/her personal safety.

    So, fails to be a riot either on; number of people; lack of common purpose; no fear for personal safety; or all of the above
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,978
    edited August 8
    Are they suing the actual companies or these middle man rating agencies that basically tell middle man ad bookers working on behalf of the big companies who are acceptable adverisers?

    Unherd have reported on these, after bascially getting put on the naughty list of spreaders of dangerous disinformation, which us a huge stretch about their content.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Leon said:

    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    More thoughtfully:

    Worst for the Tories/best for us (LDs): Badenoch, Jenrick
    Maybe bad, maybe good: Patel, Tugendhat
    Best for Tores/worst for us: Cleverly
    Who?: Stride

    I think Patel would be worst, she has by far the highest negatives of the above in polls albeit she has an aggressive semi charisma.

    Any of the above could win though if Labour muck up the economy and fail to stop the boats
    Patel is a roll of the dice, in my opinion.
    She certainly has negatives, and she really didn't come across as any too bright when trying to debate on the death penalty that time, but she's almost unencumbered by the recent Tory disasters, leaving Cabinet in 2022. She'd be attractive to some on the Reform side (albeit putting off a few of the most hardcore racists and bigots due to her race and sex) with her long record of right-wingery. It remains to be seen how off-putting (or not) she'd be to the more liberal and one-nation voters lost by the Tories this year.
    She’s also rather attractive. Shouldn’t matter, but it kinda does - a tiny bit. If you’re forced to look at someone for five years then it helps if looking at them is pleasing

    Same applies to Starmer’s nasal voice. It’s deeply grating - to me. Such a trivial thing should not be salient but I do find myself avoiding his speeches and statements simply because of his voice-tone

    I am clearly a very superficial person
    I find it quite remarkable how many entirely unfounded grudges (wrong word, I just mean disapprovals, but can't think of the right word) I have against various people in public life just because of some mannerism, whether real or simply erroneously perceived by me.

    I start the day listening to the Today programme on R4 - I'm annoyed by Emma Barnett's 'but what do you think' style, and infuriated by the idiocy of Sean Farrington. (I concede that 6am might not be my most friendly time)

    I also have other non-morning hated people - Fred Seirax (I think that's his name) = I despise the man, but I have no good reason for doing so.

    And I don't like Wes Streeting, even though I think he's really quite good.

    My views do change sometimes though. I didn't like Chris Packham when he first appeared on TV, but I now certainly do - I even bought his book.
    Yes it can be quite capricious and unpredictable

    I disliked Gareth Southgate out of all proportion to his tepid Wokeness and lack of ideas. Just something about the man narked me

    Even more interesting are people you LIKE or tolerate despite reviling their attitudes, opinions, actions

    I find Xi Jinping curiously acceptable despite loathing him and his cruel autocracy. He’s got a soothingly calm face. Good hair

    Chapo “shorty” Guzman the Mexican cartel leader, responsible for the death and torture of thousands - a lovable rogue. Peppy. Underdog made good

    Ivan the Terrible. Just love his name. Would deffo stand him a pint. Bet he’d have great stories

    Caligula. I mean - the horse. Superb trolling

    That mugshot of Young Stalin has made straight men turn gay
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    As we're talking about TwiX, any thoughts on the madcap plan to sue businesses who refuse to advertise on the platform?

    I believe the allegation is some kind of secret cabal that plotted apparently illegally to not spend money on their service. Not convinced there is a case to answer - if advertising on TwiX annoys your customers and thus damages your business, or even delivers poor ROI, how is choosing not to lose money illegal?

    He can sue, he ain't winning.
    Mad. The shit they’d have to give over on discovery. They’d do well to pull the plug on it now.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,978
    edited August 8
    DougSeal said:

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    Legally, a riot defined as twelve or more people present together who used or threatened unlawful violence for a common purpose, and that the conduct of them was such as to cause a present person of reasonable firmness to fear for his/her personal safety.

    So, fails to be a riot either on; number of people; lack of common purpose; no fear for personal safety; or all of the above
    12 seems a very random number.

    So if me and 10 of my mates do rioty type activities i can't be done strictly for rioting, but if an extra mate joins us, we are buggered.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,895

    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    It really isn't.

    At work (and in the wider industry) so many of our Tweets have ads underneath them as the first reply things like promoting scams, drop shipping scams, and racist posts, and follow all sorts of undesirables.

    The fact is with verified taking away trust, we were ahead of the RNOH.
    I use Twix on 2 accounts:
    1) My personal account. For politics stuff (as followed by various senior party people) or rants about how difficultJet seem to cancel practically Every Flight I book
    2) My JustGetATesla account which increasingly is there just to keep track on Tesla stuff. Have now blocked Musk as he's a wazzock, but still see his stuff as others repost it

    It is an absolute cesspool. I know that meta tried to launch an alternative Try Harder. Then we can all quit TwiX (and probably get sued for conspiracy to cancel Elon)
  • AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 1,457

    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    It really isn't.

    At work (and in the wider industry) so many of our Tweets have ads underneath them as the first reply things like promoting scams, drop shipping scams, and racist posts, and follow all sorts of undesirables.

    The fact is with verified taking away trust, we were ahead of the RNOH.
    For people who haven't logged in, there's now no guarantee that a direct link to an individual tweet will work. Threads are impossible to view. Timelines are muddled up, usually with stuff from years ago presented at the top.

    This all kills the old "town square" aspect of Twitter. Why would an organisation bother tweeting stuff when there's a good chance that it will prove impossible for people to view?

    The only reason anyone continues to do so is that they're usually posting to multiple platforms at the same time. But for organisations like this, Twitter has become a nice-to-have, not a must-have.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,213
    DougSeal said:

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    Legally, a riot defined as twelve or more people present together who used or threatened unlawful violence for a common purpose, and that the conduct of them was such as to cause a present person of reasonable firmness to fear for his/her personal safety.

    So, fails to be a riot either on; number of people; lack of common purpose; no fear for personal safety; or all of the above
    At a random guess - some twats who thought a bit of smashing stuff up and being a jerk was the new street fashion. And thought - "I'll be having some of that".
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    DougSeal said:

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    Legally, a riot defined as twelve or more people present together who used or threatened unlawful violence for a common purpose, and that the conduct of them was such as to cause a present person of reasonable firmness to fear for his/her personal safety.

    So, fails to be a riot either on; number of people; lack of common purpose; no fear for personal safety; or all of the above
    12 seems a very random number.
    Yes. It’s in the Public Order Act 1986 but I think 12 predates that and was part of the Common Law offence. Some medieval reason maybe. I could be wrong.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    Legally, a riot defined as twelve or more people present together who used or threatened unlawful violence for a common purpose, and that the conduct of them was such as to cause a present person of reasonable firmness to fear for his/her personal safety.

    So, fails to be a riot either on; number of people; lack of common purpose; no fear for personal safety; or all of the above
    12 seems a very random number.
    Yes. It’s in the Public Order Act 1986 but I think 12 predates that and was part of the Common Law offence. Some medieval reason maybe. I could be wrong.
    EDIT: it was 12 people in the old Riot Act.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,643
    edited August 8

    Eabhal said:

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    She's previously been disqualified from driving for speeding in 30mph areas, so this is just self-preservation.

    It's like a convicted burglar making shoplifting legal.
    You really are struggling to accept that the Welsh government and Senedd has accepted this decision

    I would add it makes it difficult for Starmer to try to implement it in England
    Not at all - will be interesting to see which councils increase speed limits on their roads and increase casualty rates. Consultations start in September, in the usual central government exercise of offloading uncomfortable decisions to local government.

    Not sure why it would make its difficult for Starmer in England. He has an enormous majority, a manifesto commitment to making the roads safe, and plenty of evidence from Scotland and Wales that it works.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,549
    edited August 8

    Phil said:

    viewcode said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Phil said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Kaye Hoey being extremely dishonest here.


    Kate Hoey
    @CatharineHoey
    Still no answer to why it will take to next year before Alex Rudakubana the alleged murderer of the 3 young girls in South
    Oct will stand trial ?

    Community notes can be very entertaining sometimes. A genuinely great idea.
    People dis Twitter* under Musk, but he has implemented two genuinely useful features:

    (1) Community notes
    (2) People I follow

    It means I see fewer Marjorie Taylor Greene posts. Which is good.

    * I refuse to call it "X"
    Community Notes predates Musk
    Sort of.

    There was a program that created Notes that predated Musk, but it wasn't very widespread nor was it open source - and it had a different name.

    The current version dates from Musk.
    The story I’ve seen elsewhere is that the current version was in development before Musk bought the company. He just happened to be in charge when it was finished up & pushed to production.

    Always remember the six stages of a project:

    1. Enthusiasm
    2. Disillusionment
    3. Panic
    4. Search for the Guilty
    5. Punishment of the Innocent
    6. Praise for those not involved
    There are some interesting horror stories out there about the Twitter code base and what was going on before the takeover. There was a reason that features were simply not appearing in production...
    Given Musk is apparently not a good coder, I wouldn't assume he's made the codebase any better... ;)
    You're not say that he does all the coding for his companies, are you?
    No. But I can guarantee that he will hire coders that match his image of a good coder... i.e. him. And the recruitment staff will be recruited on the same basis (I *still* see the old story of him personally interviewing all SpaceX staff...) (fx: hits head on wall.)

    SpaceX is actually different, as space and NASA demand certain boxes ticked. I bet he hates those boxes.
    Nope - long before SpaceX got a NASA contract, they were racing ahead of the rest of the Space Industry on the software side. Simply because they hired top engineers without legacy “we don’t do that here” to tell them *not do modern software development*.

    When they got a NASA contract, their system for tracking parts got all kinds of wow reviews. All they had done was implement a single logical system, using standard stuff (bar codes etc), rather than a pile of paperwork multiples by several incompatible legacy systems.

    The usage of FPGAs emulating PowerPC architecture wasn’t invented by SpaceX either. But they were one of the first to apply it to aerospace. Just as doing radiation tolerance at the macro, rather than micro level. Both were in place before NASA started audits etc. Both took a bit of convincing before they were cleared for Human Rated flight.

    The initial review of the Dragon control interface was a bit hilarious - instead of taking the “fake an aircraft dash”, the SpaceX engineers created a system of context driven, intuitive menus and screen controls, using industrial psychologists, former astronauts etc.

    The NASA reviewers initially had an Out Of Context problem - they couldn’t understand why it didn’t just have an aircraft dashboard. But once they dug into it, they really liked the concept. Which was to align the interface with the checklists and procedures, rather than have a translation layer from procedure to switches.

    On Tesla - a friend worked for Tata, in their outfit tearing down rival cars. He was a software engineer / electronics guy and his comment was that Tesla simply implemented modern software and hardware practise in an industry full of appalling IT. The mechanicals he thought were pretty poor, by comparison.

    One amusing story he told me - he was debugging a certain car. A whole pile of different computers talking to each other via a mess of cables. He eliminated a stream of errors that one computer was polluting the system with. Which caused another part of the system to crash. Turned out that the stream of errors was preventing a condition in one of the other computers. Luxury car, on the road and in production.

    There are times when I think you haven't drunk the Musk Kool-Aid, then you produce something like that.

    Musk is one man. He does not, Bill Gates-like, read every line of code. He does not do everything inside the organisation. SpaceX is different, because it took people from other space companies, who knew how to do things in space. Musk knew how to code a game. And code some of Paypal's predecessor. Badly.

    I'd strongly argue that Tesla's inability to drive from one side of the US to another - as promised by Musk in 2016 - is a sign that they're not as strong in software as you would like to think.

    I've got a counter-example for your amusing story. A German car company developed a concept car that had no direct mechanical link between steering wheel and steering, as required by law. everything in the car used the same control/data bus. It worked really well.

    Until someone changed the CD in the CD multi-changer, and so much data was sent over the bus that the steering locked up for a few seconds.

    The result: a separate bus for 'critical' functions like steering and braking. And another for non-critical functions.

    The *mess of cables* you decry might actually have sensible purposes. And this is something that *anybody* reverse-engineering anything needs to consider: if you think the people who designed the thing you're reverse-engineering was stupid; perhaps you don't understand it fully, and it is *you* who is being stupid.
    What I was saying is that Tesla and SpaceX seem to use modern IT. There is no otherworldly stuff. Just the things you'd get from hiring top end people and them having a clean slate to work on.

    The "bus" story you mention sounds like a classic of someone using technology without understanding limitations and, most importantly, best practice.

    (Snip)
    SpaceX; yes. I see zero evidence that Tesla is doing that. Closing doors/frunks that can cut carrots being an example... ;)

    The 'bus' story might also be a case of people having to get a prototype concept car out of the door quickly. I've done prototypes where (ahem) things are not quite as I would want them..
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,758

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    'Eluned' should be a word - dancing in the moonlight perhaps? (Admittedly she doesn't quite look that type)
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,814
    edited August 8

    DougSeal said:

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    Legally, a riot defined as twelve or more people present together who used or threatened unlawful violence for a common purpose, and that the conduct of them was such as to cause a present person of reasonable firmness to fear for his/her personal safety.

    So, fails to be a riot either on; number of people; lack of common purpose; no fear for personal safety; or all of the above
    12 seems a very random number.

    So if me and 10 of my mates do rioty type activities i can't be done strictly for rioting, but if an extra mate joins us, we are buggered.
    If it was good enough for J. Christ and (separately) for the legal system of jury trial, then why not? All have the same basic element of a committee/group quorum.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,362

    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    It really isn't.

    At work (and in the wider industry) so many of our Tweets have ads underneath them as the first reply things like promoting scams, drop shipping scams, and racist posts, and follow all sorts of undesirables.

    The fact is with verified taking away trust, we were ahead of the RNOH.
    I don’t get that but I’m a follower and I have it set to ‘following’ not ‘for you’.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,213

    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    It really isn't.

    At work (and in the wider industry) so many of our Tweets have ads underneath them as the first reply things like promoting scams, drop shipping scams, and racist posts, and follow all sorts of undesirables.

    The fact is with verified taking away trust, we were ahead of the RNOH.
    I use Twix on 2 accounts:
    1) My personal account. For politics stuff (as followed by various senior party people) or rants about how difficultJet seem to cancel practically Every Flight I book
    2) My JustGetATesla account which increasingly is there just to keep track on Tesla stuff. Have now blocked Musk as he's a wazzock, but still see his stuff as others repost it

    It is an absolute cesspool. I know that meta tried to launch an alternative Try Harder. Then we can all quit TwiX (and probably get sued for conspiracy to cancel Elon)
    I'm not sure that anything proposed by Meta would be much better. Just have a different kind of shittiness, probably.

    Something on the lines of the Signal non-profit structure would be a good basis, probably.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,354

    DougSeal said:

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    Legally, a riot defined as twelve or more people present together who used or threatened unlawful violence for a common purpose, and that the conduct of them was such as to cause a present person of reasonable firmness to fear for his/her personal safety.

    So, fails to be a riot either on; number of people; lack of common purpose; no fear for personal safety; or all of the above
    12 seems a very random number.

    So if me and 10 of my mates do rioty type activities i can't be done strictly for rioting, but if an extra mate joins us, we are buggered.
    I think it's because dozens were the favoured unit of counting in medieval England.

    See also twelve pennies in the shilling, twelve inches in the foot, etc.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,978
    Carnyx said:

    DougSeal said:

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    Legally, a riot defined as twelve or more people present together who used or threatened unlawful violence for a common purpose, and that the conduct of them was such as to cause a present person of reasonable firmness to fear for his/her personal safety.

    So, fails to be a riot either on; number of people; lack of common purpose; no fear for personal safety; or all of the above
    12 seems a very random number.

    So if me and 10 of my mates do rioty type activities i can't be done strictly for rioting, but if an extra mate joins us, we are buggered.
    If it was good enough for J. Christ and (separately) for the legal system of jury trial, then why not? All have the same basic element of a committee/group quorum.
    Goos point, i presume its all connected back in history. But given a much more recent act, interesting that still in there.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,549
    There hasn't been much fuss about India becoming more populous than China.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,417

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    I thought that the other she said on TV that she approved of it?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,239
    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    HYUFD said:

    More thoughtfully:

    Worst for the Tories/best for us (LDs): Badenoch, Jenrick
    Maybe bad, maybe good: Patel, Tugendhat
    Best for Tores/worst for us: Cleverly
    Who?: Stride

    I think Patel would be worst, she has by far the highest negatives of the above in polls albeit she has an aggressive semi charisma.

    Any of the above could win though if Labour muck up the economy and fail to stop the boats
    Patel is a roll of the dice, in my opinion.
    She certainly has negatives, and she really didn't come across as any too bright when trying to debate on the death penalty that time, but she's almost unencumbered by the recent Tory disasters, leaving Cabinet in 2022. She'd be attractive to some on the Reform side (albeit putting off a few of the most hardcore racists and bigots due to her race and sex) with her long record of right-wingery. It remains to be seen how off-putting (or not) she'd be to the more liberal and one-nation voters lost by the Tories this year.
    She’s also rather attractive. Shouldn’t matter, but it kinda does - a tiny bit. If you’re forced to look at someone for five years then it helps if looking at them is pleasing

    Same applies to Starmer’s nasal voice. It’s deeply grating - to me. Such a trivial thing should not be salient but I do find myself avoiding his speeches and statements simply because of his voice-tone

    I am clearly a very superficial person
    I find it quite remarkable how many entirely unfounded grudges (wrong word, I just mean disapprovals, but can't think of the right word) I have against various people in public life just because of some mannerism, whether real or simply erroneously perceived by me.

    I start the day listening to the Today programme on R4 - I'm annoyed by Emma Barnett's 'but what do you think' style, and infuriated by the idiocy of Sean Farrington. (I concede that 6am might not be my most friendly time)

    I also have other non-morning hated people - Fred Seirax (I think that's his name) = I despise the man, but I have no good reason for doing so.

    And I don't like Wes Streeting, even though I think he's really quite good.

    My views do change sometimes though. I didn't like Chris Packham when he first appeared on TV, but I now certainly do - I even bought his book.
    Yes it can be quite capricious and unpredictable

    I disliked Gareth Southgate out of all proportion to his tepid Wokeness and lack of ideas. Just something about the man narked me

    Even more interesting are people you LIKE or tolerate despite reviling their attitudes, opinions, actions

    I find Xi Jinping curiously acceptable despite loathing him and his cruel autocracy. He’s got a soothingly calm face. Good hair

    Chapo “shorty” Guzman the Mexican cartel leader, responsible for the death and torture of thousands - a lovable rogue. Peppy. Underdog made good

    Ivan the Terrible. Just love his name. Would deffo stand him a pint. Bet he’d have great stories

    Caligula. I mean - the horse. Superb trolling

    That mugshot of Young Stalin has made straight men turn gay
    Yes! I nearly included him coz of his swoony looks as a young trainee priest

    Happily, he became pockmarked and more superficially dislikeable as he aged. But am I being unfair on him?

    Hitler is interesting. Imagine if he’d had the good looks of a young JFK? That would have been truly dissonant

    Luckily he was a short arse weirdo with that ridiculous moustache
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,549

    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    It really isn't.

    At work (and in the wider industry) so many of our Tweets have ads underneath them as the first reply things like promoting scams, drop shipping scams, and racist posts, and follow all sorts of undesirables.

    The fact is with verified taking away trust, we were ahead of the RNOH.
    I use Twix on 2 accounts:
    1) My personal account. For politics stuff (as followed by various senior party people) or rants about how difficultJet seem to cancel practically Every Flight I book
    2) My JustGetATesla account which increasingly is there just to keep track on Tesla stuff. Have now blocked Musk as he's a wazzock, but still see his stuff as others repost it

    It is an absolute cesspool. I know that meta tried to launch an alternative Try Harder. Then we can all quit TwiX (and probably get sued for conspiracy to cancel Elon)
    Incidentally, I've started getting lots of hardcore pornography on Twitter again today, after a relative absence of a few months.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,549

    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    It really isn't.

    At work (and in the wider industry) so many of our Tweets have ads underneath them as the first reply things like promoting scams, drop shipping scams, and racist posts, and follow all sorts of undesirables.

    The fact is with verified taking away trust, we were ahead of the RNOH.
    I use Twix on 2 accounts:
    1) My personal account. For politics stuff (as followed by various senior party people) or rants about how difficultJet seem to cancel practically Every Flight I book
    2) My JustGetATesla account which increasingly is there just to keep track on Tesla stuff. Have now blocked Musk as he's a wazzock, but still see his stuff as others repost it

    It is an absolute cesspool. I know that meta tried to launch an alternative Try Harder. Then we can all quit TwiX (and probably get sued for conspiracy to cancel Elon)
    Incidentally, I've started getting lots of hardcore pornography on Twitter again today, after a relative absence of a few months.
    (And yes, that is a complaint... ;) )
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,620
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    It really isn't.

    At work (and in the wider industry) so many of our Tweets have ads underneath them as the first reply things like promoting scams, drop shipping scams, and racist posts, and follow all sorts of undesirables.

    The fact is with verified taking away trust, we were ahead of the RNOH.
    I don’t get that but I’m a follower and I have it set to ‘following’ not ‘for you’.
    It's actually on when you click on the specific tweet when those things happen.

    It's also slightly different on the App than the website.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,549

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    Two tier.
  • Break dancing. An Olympic event. FFS.

    What's wrong with that?

    How's it different to gymnastics?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,027
    edited August 8
    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    She's previously been disqualified from driving for speeding in 30mph areas, so this is just self-preservation.

    It's like a convicted burglar making shoplifting legal.
    You really are struggling to accept that the Welsh government and Senedd has accepted this decision

    I would add it makes it difficult for Starmer to try to implement it in England
    Not at all - will be interesting to see which councils increase speed limits on their roads and increase casualty rates. Consultations start in September, in the usual central government exercise of offloading uncomfortable decisions to local government.

    Not sure why it would make its difficult for Starmer in England. He has an enormous majority, a manifesto commitment to making the roads safe, and plenty of evidence from Scotland and Wales that it works.
    As labour in Wales have tried and eventually rejected the blanket policy then Starmer would need to explain why Wales abandoned it and he wants to impose it

    The consultations are already on going and many of us have responded to the requests and the changes will happen in September
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,354

    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    It really isn't.

    At work (and in the wider industry) so many of our Tweets have ads underneath them as the first reply things like promoting scams, drop shipping scams, and racist posts, and follow all sorts of undesirables.

    The fact is with verified taking away trust, we were ahead of the RNOH.
    I use Twix on 2 accounts:
    1) My personal account. For politics stuff (as followed by various senior party people) or rants about how difficultJet seem to cancel practically Every Flight I book
    2) My JustGetATesla account which increasingly is there just to keep track on Tesla stuff. Have now blocked Musk as he's a wazzock, but still see his stuff as others repost it

    It is an absolute cesspool. I know that meta tried to launch an alternative Try Harder. Then we can all quit TwiX (and probably get sued for conspiracy to cancel Elon)
    Incidentally, I've started getting lots of hardcore pornography on Twitter again today, after a relative absence of a few months.
    (And yes, that is a complaint... ;) )
    They obviously misunderstood your references to the triathlon being a stiff challenge.
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,580
    Omnium said:

    Andy_JS said:

    You can make 6% profit betting on both Trump and Harris atm. Unusual situation.

    https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/politics/market/1.176878927

    Yeah, but Trump could just pull out if he feels he's sure to lose. No doubt causing all sorts of trouble at the same time. Hopefully some time soon though his trouble making days will be firmly on the wane.

    Edit: I actually backed Vance at 290s this morning for that reason - admittedly only risking one of my highly polished Omnium pounds.
    I've done the same at 280 for a quid.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541

    Carnyx said:

    DougSeal said:

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    Legally, a riot defined as twelve or more people present together who used or threatened unlawful violence for a common purpose, and that the conduct of them was such as to cause a present person of reasonable firmness to fear for his/her personal safety.

    So, fails to be a riot either on; number of people; lack of common purpose; no fear for personal safety; or all of the above
    12 seems a very random number.

    So if me and 10 of my mates do rioty type activities i can't be done strictly for rioting, but if an extra mate joins us, we are buggered.
    If it was good enough for J. Christ and (separately) for the legal system of jury trial, then why not? All have the same basic element of a committee/group quorum.
    Goos point, i presume its all connected back in history. But given a much more recent act, interesting that still in there.
    A bit of Googling suggests that the common law offence of riot needed only 3 people (!) and I guess 12 came about in the Riot Act sand it just stuck through various statutory re-enactments of the offence.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,213

    Phil said:

    viewcode said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Phil said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Kaye Hoey being extremely dishonest here.


    Kate Hoey
    @CatharineHoey
    Still no answer to why it will take to next year before Alex Rudakubana the alleged murderer of the 3 young girls in South
    Oct will stand trial ?

    Community notes can be very entertaining sometimes. A genuinely great idea.
    People dis Twitter* under Musk, but he has implemented two genuinely useful features:

    (1) Community notes
    (2) People I follow

    It means I see fewer Marjorie Taylor Greene posts. Which is good.

    * I refuse to call it "X"
    Community Notes predates Musk
    Sort of.

    There was a program that created Notes that predated Musk, but it wasn't very widespread nor was it open source - and it had a different name.

    The current version dates from Musk.
    The story I’ve seen elsewhere is that the current version was in development before Musk bought the company. He just happened to be in charge when it was finished up & pushed to production.

    Always remember the six stages of a project:

    1. Enthusiasm
    2. Disillusionment
    3. Panic
    4. Search for the Guilty
    5. Punishment of the Innocent
    6. Praise for those not involved
    There are some interesting horror stories out there about the Twitter code base and what was going on before the takeover. There was a reason that features were simply not appearing in production...
    Given Musk is apparently not a good coder, I wouldn't assume he's made the codebase any better... ;)
    You're not say that he does all the coding for his companies, are you?
    No. But I can guarantee that he will hire coders that match his image of a good coder... i.e. him. And the recruitment staff will be recruited on the same basis (I *still* see the old story of him personally interviewing all SpaceX staff...) (fx: hits head on wall.)

    SpaceX is actually different, as space and NASA demand certain boxes ticked. I bet he hates those boxes.
    Nope - long before SpaceX got a NASA contract, they were racing ahead of the rest of the Space Industry on the software side. Simply because they hired top engineers without legacy “we don’t do that here” to tell them *not do modern software development*.

    When they got a NASA contract, their system for tracking parts got all kinds of wow reviews. All they had done was implement a single logical system, using standard stuff (bar codes etc), rather than a pile of paperwork multiples by several incompatible legacy systems.

    The usage of FPGAs emulating PowerPC architecture wasn’t invented by SpaceX either. But they were one of the first to apply it to aerospace. Just as doing radiation tolerance at the macro, rather than micro level. Both were in place before NASA started audits etc. Both took a bit of convincing before they were cleared for Human Rated flight.

    The initial review of the Dragon control interface was a bit hilarious - instead of taking the “fake an aircraft dash”, the SpaceX engineers created a system of context driven, intuitive menus and screen controls, using industrial psychologists, former astronauts etc.

    The NASA reviewers initially had an Out Of Context problem - they couldn’t understand why it didn’t just have an aircraft dashboard. But once they dug into it, they really liked the concept. Which was to align the interface with the checklists and procedures, rather than have a translation layer from procedure to switches.

    On Tesla - a friend worked for Tata, in their outfit tearing down rival cars. He was a software engineer / electronics guy and his comment was that Tesla simply implemented modern software and hardware practise in an industry full of appalling IT. The mechanicals he thought were pretty poor, by comparison.

    One amusing story he told me - he was debugging a certain car. A whole pile of different computers talking to each other via a mess of cables. He eliminated a stream of errors that one computer was polluting the system with. Which caused another part of the system to crash. Turned out that the stream of errors was preventing a condition in one of the other computers. Luxury car, on the road and in production.

    There are times when I think you haven't drunk the Musk Kool-Aid, then you produce something like that.

    Musk is one man. He does not, Bill Gates-like, read every line of code. He does not do everything inside the organisation. SpaceX is different, because it took people from other space companies, who knew how to do things in space. Musk knew how to code a game. And code some of Paypal's predecessor. Badly.

    I'd strongly argue that Tesla's inability to drive from one side of the US to another - as promised by Musk in 2016 - is a sign that they're not as strong in software as you would like to think.

    I've got a counter-example for your amusing story. A German car company developed a concept car that had no direct mechanical link between steering wheel and steering, as required by law. everything in the car used the same control/data bus. It worked really well.

    Until someone changed the CD in the CD multi-changer, and so much data was sent over the bus that the steering locked up for a few seconds.

    The result: a separate bus for 'critical' functions like steering and braking. And another for non-critical functions.

    The *mess of cables* you decry might actually have sensible purposes. And this is something that *anybody* reverse-engineering anything needs to consider: if you think the people who designed the thing you're reverse-engineering was stupid; perhaps you don't understand it fully, and it is *you* who is being stupid.
    What I was saying is that Tesla and SpaceX seem to use modern IT. There is no otherworldly stuff. Just the things you'd get from hiring top end people and them having a clean slate to work on.

    The "bus" story you mention sounds like a classic of someone using technology without understanding limitations and, most importantly, best practice.

    (Snip)
    SpaceX; yes. I see zero evidence that Tesla is doing that. Closing doors/frunks that can cut carrots being an example... ;)

    The 'bus' story might also be a case of people having to get a prototype concept car out of the door quickly. I've done prototypes where (ahem) things are not quite as I would want the,..
    Using a bus that doesn't implement time criticality in the steering for a car would make it un roadworthy, IMHO.

    IIRC the time criticality thing was found and fixed in a NASA test aircraft - the pilot was making lots of stick movements to fly, exactly, the profile. He noticed that after a while, the plan started showing signs of PIO and seemed to be getting slow to react. Turned out that, with the electronics of the time, he was piling up commands on system.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,549

    Hartlepool lad gets 16 months for throwing an egg.

    On the face of it, that does sound rather harsh.

    Leaves a bad smell.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,643
    edited August 8

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    I thought that the other she said on TV that she approved of it?
    It's not a blanket 20mph anyway - fake news.

    Here, for example, is a list of exceptions that are already in place, and have stuck at 30mph: https://www.conwy.gov.uk/en/Resident/Parking-Roads-and-Travel/Roads-and-Pavements/20mph-speed-limit.aspx

    That's similar to how it was first rolled out in Edinburgh (though we are adding more streets to the 20 zone now).
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,870

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    There is a pattern in antisocial media bullshit.

    A tag line and the apparent evidence - "@TheScreamingEagles interview - Pineapple pizza awesome, Radiohead and Python awful. https://youtu.be/GarbageLink"

    It works because about 90% off people never click the link or try and find actual evidence.

    Python is awful - don't use whitespace to represent significancy...
    It is no more ridiculous than using lots of brackets (of varying types).

    Python has fantastic, clean syntax. It has incredible data science libraries. And these days, computers (and computing power) is cheap.

    Other than occasional bits of Javascript, when I have a need to do something webby, I wouldn't use anything else. There's simply no point, because quick to write, readable code, is worth a lot more than a few processor cycles.
    oh I just have a dislike of Python but I started off when Javascript was Livescript and Perl was the in thing.

    I personally prefer the latest version of Delphi (i.e. C# )..
    99% of my "coding" these days is data analysis, where Python + Pandas + Jupyter is absolutely superb, especially if you use Google's hosted Colab service. I'm playing around with massive datasets and running analyses in seconds that would historically have taken days. (And also required a team of people.)
    You use whatever has the best libraries for whatever it is you want to do. If that's Python, then great. And if it's JavaScript, for God's sake use TypeScript!
    The real problem with Python and JavaScript is the large numbers of self taught people.

    Who haven’t heard of code structure, testing pyramids or even code versioning tools.

    “No, Quant Boy, the Python file you emailed me isn’t going directly into production. Aside from the fact it doesn’t actually run, we need tests. And test data. And some QA. and running on all the non-prod environments first…. Also, where is the specification? ‘cause Compliance will quite interested in how we are pricing stuff.”
    While I largely agree with what you say, it is also great to have the freedom to implement stuff as you see fit without having to specify every last widget to the n-th degree. Obviously that's easier when working iteratively as a sole developer on small projects.

    Also, bad code implemented by self-taught developers is by no means restricted to Python and JavaScript. The codebase at my last workplace was a tangled mess of undocumented C++ dating back decades and presided over by an old-school self-taught coder with a pathological hatred of whitespace and line breaks. That was the last straw for me.
    Indeed

    Just that these days the self taught types are hacking in Python.

    There was this mad guy who was going to replace Excel with a spreadsheet backed by Python as the scripting language. Whatever happened to him?
    As someone who has been in software since the 90's and for many companies....assuming you pick right I think self taught tend to be better than those that have degrees, The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,293
    I've had a little nibble on Vance at 319/1 to be next President. It's just possible Trump might pull out... ill health perhaps.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,213
    Pagan2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    There is a pattern in antisocial media bullshit.

    A tag line and the apparent evidence - "@TheScreamingEagles interview - Pineapple pizza awesome, Radiohead and Python awful. https://youtu.be/GarbageLink"

    It works because about 90% off people never click the link or try and find actual evidence.

    Python is awful - don't use whitespace to represent significancy...
    It is no more ridiculous than using lots of brackets (of varying types).

    Python has fantastic, clean syntax. It has incredible data science libraries. And these days, computers (and computing power) is cheap.

    Other than occasional bits of Javascript, when I have a need to do something webby, I wouldn't use anything else. There's simply no point, because quick to write, readable code, is worth a lot more than a few processor cycles.
    oh I just have a dislike of Python but I started off when Javascript was Livescript and Perl was the in thing.

    I personally prefer the latest version of Delphi (i.e. C# )..
    99% of my "coding" these days is data analysis, where Python + Pandas + Jupyter is absolutely superb, especially if you use Google's hosted Colab service. I'm playing around with massive datasets and running analyses in seconds that would historically have taken days. (And also required a team of people.)
    You use whatever has the best libraries for whatever it is you want to do. If that's Python, then great. And if it's JavaScript, for God's sake use TypeScript!
    The real problem with Python and JavaScript is the large numbers of self taught people.

    Who haven’t heard of code structure, testing pyramids or even code versioning tools.

    “No, Quant Boy, the Python file you emailed me isn’t going directly into production. Aside from the fact it doesn’t actually run, we need tests. And test data. And some QA. and running on all the non-prod environments first…. Also, where is the specification? ‘cause Compliance will quite interested in how we are pricing stuff.”
    While I largely agree with what you say, it is also great to have the freedom to implement stuff as you see fit without having to specify every last widget to the n-th degree. Obviously that's easier when working iteratively as a sole developer on small projects.

    Also, bad code implemented by self-taught developers is by no means restricted to Python and JavaScript. The codebase at my last workplace was a tangled mess of undocumented C++ dating back decades and presided over by an old-school self-taught coder with a pathological hatred of whitespace and line breaks. That was the last straw for me.
    Indeed

    Just that these days the self taught types are hacking in Python.

    There was this mad guy who was going to replace Excel with a spreadsheet backed by Python as the scripting language. Whatever happened to him?
    As someone who has been in software since the 90's and for many companies....assuming you pick right I think self taught tend to be better than those that have degrees, The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree
    "The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree"

    So they have failed at the most basic thing a degree is supposed to teach.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,814
    edited August 8

    Eabhal said:

    Eabhal said:

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    She's previously been disqualified from driving for speeding in 30mph areas, so this is just self-preservation.

    It's like a convicted burglar making shoplifting legal.
    You really are struggling to accept that the Welsh government and Senedd has accepted this decision

    I would add it makes it difficult for Starmer to try to implement it in England
    Not at all - will be interesting to see which councils increase speed limits on their roads and increase casualty rates. Consultations start in September, in the usual central government exercise of offloading uncomfortable decisions to local government.

    Not sure why it would make its difficult for Starmer in England. He has an enormous majority, a manifesto commitment to making the roads safe, and plenty of evidence from Scotland and Wales that it works.
    As labour in Wales have tried and eventually rejected the blanket policy then Starmer would need to explain why Wales abandoned it and he wants to impose it

    The consultations are already on going and many of us have responded to the requests and the changes will happen in September
    Last thing SKS will do is even *mention* that Llafur wanted to do things differently; see also Slab and the two child policy, Gaza, etc, etc. He's a Unionist, and in charge in London. A few Welsh MPs don't signify.

    Also: given how much the Tories have been complaining about the 20 mph speed limits, a bit odd if any of them suddenly claim how much they loved them. But I expect they'd probably blame SKS for implementing them in Wales while criticising him for not implementing them in England, given their record over the last 5 weeks or so.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,620
    Makes me proud to be British and is further proof that we live rent free in the minds of the Russians.

    Russian pundit Alexander Kazakov says that the UK - "our worst enemy" - is behind Ukraine’s advance into Kursk Region

    "This is a London story and [Ukrainian military intelligence chief] Budanov is London’s man!"


    https://x.com/francis_scarr/status/1821531460647727516
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    rkrkrk said:

    I've had a little nibble on Vance at 319/1 to be next President. It's just possible Trump might pull out... ill health perhaps.

    As if he’d ever admit he was ill…
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,174
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1k37dm9e0eo

    They also revealed that the main suspect - an Austrian citizen who was born there but who had North Macedonian parents - had recently changed his appearance and "adapted it to Islamic State propaganda", and had been consuming and sharing Islamist propaganda online.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,293

    Taz said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Pathetic.
    It really isn't.

    At work (and in the wider industry) so many of our Tweets have ads underneath them as the first reply things like promoting scams, drop shipping scams, and racist posts, and follow all sorts of undesirables.

    The fact is with verified taking away trust, we were ahead of the RNOH.
    I use Twix on 2 accounts:
    1) My personal account. For politics stuff (as followed by various senior party people) or rants about how difficultJet seem to cancel practically Every Flight I book
    2) My JustGetATesla account which increasingly is there just to keep track on Tesla stuff. Have now blocked Musk as he's a wazzock, but still see his stuff as others repost it

    It is an absolute cesspool. I know that meta tried to launch an alternative Try Harder. Then we can all quit TwiX (and probably get sued for conspiracy to cancel Elon)
    Incidentally, I've started getting lots of hardcore pornography on Twitter again today, after a relative absence of a few months.
    I'm giving blue-sky a try... seems to have many of the accounts I previously enjoyed and so far less bullshit..
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,129
    Omnium said:

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Sandpit said:

    ...

    Sandpit said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Due to significant changes on this platform in recent months, X is no longer consistent with our Trust values. Therefore RNOH is closing its account. Please follow us on Facebook, Instagram & LinkedIn. Thanks to everyone who has followed & supported us for the last 13 years.

    https://x.com/RNOHnhs/status/1821456025553076606

    I wonder if many other public bodies will follow suit

    Ah, so should the public sector be trying to work with the largest audience possible, or be partaking in performative wokery choosing one platform over another?
    Encouraging Zuckerberg is not great either.

    Why not go back to just having a public website? I hear forums still work if you want to encourage public discussion.
    Oh indeed.

    One of my major projects at work at the moment, is trying to get everyone using Teams instead of a whole bunch of ad-hoc WhatsApp groups for discussions that have a financial impact on the company.
    I my last place of employ they really tried hard to get everyone to use Teams. You knew though that you were in conversations with the senior team when you got a whatsapp message though :)

    I made a point of not having WhatsApp on my own phone (my phone, not their phone) from the day I was hired.

    One very senior manager didn’t understand that iMessage was a data message rather than an SMS, and wondered why I didn’t have WA on my phone.

    I used to deliver a talk to schools and parents about IT security, called “Why I’m not on Facebook”.
    I suspect you're fighting a bit of an uphill battle. (I didn't mention Slack, but there's Slack. And then the lawyers will use some allegdgy super-secure thing, and HR have to use their new system which they spent a fortune on and will really start to deliver in another two or three years once the bugs have been addressed)

    Why not simply host your own system like Rocket.chat or Mattermost?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,354
    DougSeal said:

    rkrkrk said:

    I've had a little nibble on Vance at 319/1 to be next President. It's just possible Trump might pull out... ill health perhaps.

    As if he’d ever admit he was ill…
    He might get electrocuted by a sinking boat while trying to escape a shark though.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,865
    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    This is grim. And I fear it is the future


    “Pray for S, one of the asylum seekers I worked with in Gateshead, beaten up by 2 men with iron bars last night.”

    https://x.com/meggilley1/status/1821455725656240585?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    The riots have stopped but a lower level violence will now replace it. Smaller acts. Local “events”

    Bleak as bleh. I may actually move to lovely Pristina

    Another example of this sort of thing.

    "Suspended Labour councillor arrested over video ‘urging people to cut throats’
    Ricky Jones arrested after video emerged in which he appeared to call for violence against ‘Nazi fascists’"

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/aug/08/labour-suspends-councillor-video-far-right-protesters
    Stupid man. Old enough to know a lot better

    His problem is that he is surely going to get a significant jail term, because he called for actual murder and people are getting 30 months for simply “shouting at policemen”
    On the one hand, no-one's throat will be cut. No-one is taking it seriously as a call to arms.

    On the other hand, how stupid are our elected representatives? WTF was he thinking? As you say, he will go down.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,700
    DougSeal said:

    rkrkrk said:

    I've had a little nibble on Vance at 319/1 to be next President. It's just possible Trump might pull out... ill health perhaps.

    As if he’d ever admit he was ill…
    It would be my biggest pay day ever - a high four figure £ win if this happens.

    Trump flounces at the last minute as he knows he will lose? Seems biggly unlikely...but...
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,895
    I have seen a lot of the hard right / Farage / Musk "Two Tier" complaints. Why has x got a lengthy sentence when y didn't.

    Its all down to whether its a riot or not. Individual / small numbers doing something bad? Looked at individually. A riot? Book thrown at an infraction. As the miners found out unjustly at Orgreave.

    I don't think there is much debate about whether - unlike Orgreave - these are riots or not. The underlying complaint about the sentences feels primarily that the "patriots" are being sentenced at all.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,549

    Pagan2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    There is a pattern in antisocial media bullshit.

    A tag line and the apparent evidence - "@TheScreamingEagles interview - Pineapple pizza awesome, Radiohead and Python awful. https://youtu.be/GarbageLink"

    It works because about 90% off people never click the link or try and find actual evidence.

    Python is awful - don't use whitespace to represent significancy...
    It is no more ridiculous than using lots of brackets (of varying types).

    Python has fantastic, clean syntax. It has incredible data science libraries. And these days, computers (and computing power) is cheap.

    Other than occasional bits of Javascript, when I have a need to do something webby, I wouldn't use anything else. There's simply no point, because quick to write, readable code, is worth a lot more than a few processor cycles.
    oh I just have a dislike of Python but I started off when Javascript was Livescript and Perl was the in thing.

    I personally prefer the latest version of Delphi (i.e. C# )..
    99% of my "coding" these days is data analysis, where Python + Pandas + Jupyter is absolutely superb, especially if you use Google's hosted Colab service. I'm playing around with massive datasets and running analyses in seconds that would historically have taken days. (And also required a team of people.)
    You use whatever has the best libraries for whatever it is you want to do. If that's Python, then great. And if it's JavaScript, for God's sake use TypeScript!
    The real problem with Python and JavaScript is the large numbers of self taught people.

    Who haven’t heard of code structure, testing pyramids or even code versioning tools.

    “No, Quant Boy, the Python file you emailed me isn’t going directly into production. Aside from the fact it doesn’t actually run, we need tests. And test data. And some QA. and running on all the non-prod environments first…. Also, where is the specification? ‘cause Compliance will quite interested in how we are pricing stuff.”
    While I largely agree with what you say, it is also great to have the freedom to implement stuff as you see fit without having to specify every last widget to the n-th degree. Obviously that's easier when working iteratively as a sole developer on small projects.

    Also, bad code implemented by self-taught developers is by no means restricted to Python and JavaScript. The codebase at my last workplace was a tangled mess of undocumented C++ dating back decades and presided over by an old-school self-taught coder with a pathological hatred of whitespace and line breaks. That was the last straw for me.
    Indeed

    Just that these days the self taught types are hacking in Python.

    There was this mad guy who was going to replace Excel with a spreadsheet backed by Python as the scripting language. Whatever happened to him?
    As someone who has been in software since the 90's and for many companies....assuming you pick right I think self taught tend to be better than those that have degrees, The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree
    "The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree"

    So they have failed at the most basic thing a degree is supposed to teach.
    IMV the best tend to be people who had degrees in subjects other than computers. So they were intelligent and knew the academic process, but did not think they knew everything about 'pooters.

    But the best of all were those who had no degrees and were utterly self-taught. I wonder if anyone here was in that category... ;)
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,865

    rcs1000 said:

    viewcode said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    There is a pattern in antisocial media bullshit.

    A tag line and the apparent evidence - "@TheScreamingEagles interview - Pineapple pizza awesome, Radiohead and Python awful. https://youtu.be/GarbageLink"

    It works because about 90% off people never click the link or try and find actual evidence.

    Python is awful - don't use whitespace to represent significancy...
    It is no more ridiculous than using lots of brackets (of varying types).

    Python has fantastic, clean syntax. It has incredible data science libraries. And these days, computers (and computing power) is cheap.

    Other than occasional bits of Javascript, when I have a need to do something webby, I wouldn't use anything else. There's simply no point, because quick to write, readable code, is worth a lot more than a few processor cycles.
    oh I just have a dislike of Python but I started off when Javascript was Livescript and Perl was the in thing.

    I personally prefer the latest version of Delphi (i.e. C# )..
    99% of my "coding" these days is data analysis, where Python + Pandas + Jupyter is absolutely superb, especially if you use Google's hosted Colab service. I'm playing around with massive datasets and running analyses in seconds that would historically have taken days. (And also required a team of people.)
    You use whatever has the best libraries for whatever it is you want to do. If that's Python, then great. And if it's JavaScript, for God's sake use TypeScript!
    The real problem with Python and JavaScript is the large numbers of self taught people.

    Who haven’t heard of code structure, testing pyramids or even code versioning tools.

    “No, Quant Boy, the Python file you emailed me isn’t going directly into production. Aside from the fact it doesn’t actually run, we need tests. And test data. And some QA. and running on all the non-prod environments first…. Also, where is the specification? ‘cause Compliance will quite interested in how we are pricing stuff.”
    While I largely agree with what you say, it is also great to have the freedom to implement stuff as you see fit without having to specify every last widget to the n-th degree. Obviously that's easier when working iteratively as a sole developer on small projects.

    Also, bad code implemented by self-taught developers is by no means restricted to Python and JavaScript. The codebase at my last workplace was a tangled mess of undocumented C++ dating back decades and presided over by an old-school self-taught coder with a pathological hatred of whitespace and line breaks. That was the last straw for me.
    Indeed

    Just that these days the self taught types are hacking in Python.

    There was this mad guy who was going to replace Excel with a spreadsheet backed by Python as the scripting language. Whatever happened to him?
    It's funny you ask... because that company (Resolver Systems) ended up becoming PythonAnywhere, which was acquired by Anaconda, and which has just launched Python in Excel (https://docs.anaconda.com/excel/).
    Python, Anaconda, GitHub, Jupyter, Pandas, NumPy, Matplotlib... you have no idea how happy it makes me that I no longer have to worry about those things. :)
    Matplotlib needs taking round the back of the barn and put out of its misery.
    I use Plotly.

    But you know what Matplotlib has that I genuinely love: the ability to produce charts in XKCD style.
    There are some niche things that the likes of plotly can't do or is very difficult, but the renderimg engine for matplotlib by modern standards is so poor. I am surprised a google, who love to make 27 different solutions to the same problem haven't produced some sort of plotting library.
    I've no idea what you lot are talking about. My racing system is a bunch of shellscripts, a few lines of sed and perl, a lot of awk, with output via troff and, for graphs, grap. Nothing less than 30 years old, and possibly 40 or 50.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,576
    Nigelb said:

    The Russians are a lot more complimentary about our government than I am.

    Russian pundit Alexander Kazakov says that the UK - "our worst enemy" - is behind Ukraine’s advance into Kursk Region

    "This is a London story and [Ukrainian military intelligence chief] Budanov is London’s man!"

    https://x.com/francis_scarr/status/1821531460647727516

    Watching the Russians react to Ukranian soldiers raiding their own border region, is possibly the most amusing event of the past 29 months.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,496
    edited August 8

    What's the difference between a riot and this kind of anti-social behaviour?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/08/08/ten-arrested-antisocial-behaviour-croydon-not-linked-riots/

    You have to be able to count and to discern common purposes:

    Start at the Public Order Act 1986 sec 1:

    Riot.
    (1)Where 12 or more persons who are present together use or threaten unlawful violence for a common purpose and the conduct of them (taken together) is such as would cause a person of reasonable firmness present at the scene to fear for his personal safety, each of the persons using unlawful violence for the common purpose is guilty of riot.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,700

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    This is grim. And I fear it is the future


    “Pray for S, one of the asylum seekers I worked with in Gateshead, beaten up by 2 men with iron bars last night.”

    https://x.com/meggilley1/status/1821455725656240585?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    The riots have stopped but a lower level violence will now replace it. Smaller acts. Local “events”

    Bleak as bleh. I may actually move to lovely Pristina

    Another example of this sort of thing.

    "Suspended Labour councillor arrested over video ‘urging people to cut throats’
    Ricky Jones arrested after video emerged in which he appeared to call for violence against ‘Nazi fascists’"

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/aug/08/labour-suspends-councillor-video-far-right-protesters
    Stupid man. Old enough to know a lot better

    His problem is that he is surely going to get a significant jail term, because he called for actual murder and people are getting 30 months for simply “shouting at policemen”
    On the one hand, no-one's throat will be cut. No-one is taking it seriously as a call to arms.

    On the other hand, how stupid are our elected representatives? WTF was he thinking? As you say, he will go down.
    "I may actually move to lovely Pristina"

    Yeh. Kosovo. No low level violence going on there with Serbia separatists and Russian meddling.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,239

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    This is grim. And I fear it is the future


    “Pray for S, one of the asylum seekers I worked with in Gateshead, beaten up by 2 men with iron bars last night.”

    https://x.com/meggilley1/status/1821455725656240585?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    The riots have stopped but a lower level violence will now replace it. Smaller acts. Local “events”

    Bleak as bleh. I may actually move to lovely Pristina

    Another example of this sort of thing.

    "Suspended Labour councillor arrested over video ‘urging people to cut throats’
    Ricky Jones arrested after video emerged in which he appeared to call for violence against ‘Nazi fascists’"

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/aug/08/labour-suspends-councillor-video-far-right-protesters
    Stupid man. Old enough to know a lot better

    His problem is that he is surely going to get a significant jail term, because he called for actual murder and people are getting 30 months for simply “shouting at policemen”
    On the one hand, no-one's throat will be cut. No-one is taking it seriously as a call to arms.

    On the other hand, how stupid are our elected representatives? WTF was he thinking? As you say, he will go down.
    I’ve had a look at his social media and he seems quite sensible. So this is one moment of madness that will ruin his career and possibly the rest of his life. Sad

    But they will have to send him down because they’re being severe on everyone on t’other side

    One has to wonder about the onlookers as well. You can see a couple of them react with dismay and concern - wtf did he just say - most are mildly surprised or even amused. Tsk
  • MightyAlexMightyAlex Posts: 1,660
    Pagan2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    There is a pattern in antisocial media bullshit.

    A tag line and the apparent evidence - "@TheScreamingEagles interview - Pineapple pizza awesome, Radiohead and Python awful. https://youtu.be/GarbageLink"

    It works because about 90% off people never click the link or try and find actual evidence.

    Python is awful - don't use whitespace to represent significancy...
    It is no more ridiculous than using lots of brackets (of varying types).

    Python has fantastic, clean syntax. It has incredible data science libraries. And these days, computers (and computing power) is cheap.

    Other than occasional bits of Javascript, when I have a need to do something webby, I wouldn't use anything else. There's simply no point, because quick to write, readable code, is worth a lot more than a few processor cycles.
    oh I just have a dislike of Python but I started off when Javascript was Livescript and Perl was the in thing.

    I personally prefer the latest version of Delphi (i.e. C# )..
    99% of my "coding" these days is data analysis, where Python + Pandas + Jupyter is absolutely superb, especially if you use Google's hosted Colab service. I'm playing around with massive datasets and running analyses in seconds that would historically have taken days. (And also required a team of people.)
    You use whatever has the best libraries for whatever it is you want to do. If that's Python, then great. And if it's JavaScript, for God's sake use TypeScript!
    The real problem with Python and JavaScript is the large numbers of self taught people.

    Who haven’t heard of code structure, testing pyramids or even code versioning tools.

    “No, Quant Boy, the Python file you emailed me isn’t going directly into production. Aside from the fact it doesn’t actually run, we need tests. And test data. And some QA. and running on all the non-prod environments first…. Also, where is the specification? ‘cause Compliance will quite interested in how we are pricing stuff.”
    While I largely agree with what you say, it is also great to have the freedom to implement stuff as you see fit without having to specify every last widget to the n-th degree. Obviously that's easier when working iteratively as a sole developer on small projects.

    Also, bad code implemented by self-taught developers is by no means restricted to Python and JavaScript. The codebase at my last workplace was a tangled mess of undocumented C++ dating back decades and presided over by an old-school self-taught coder with a pathological hatred of whitespace and line breaks. That was the last straw for me.
    Indeed

    Just that these days the self taught types are hacking in Python.

    There was this mad guy who was going to replace Excel with a spreadsheet backed by Python as the scripting language. Whatever happened to him?
    As someone who has been in software since the 90's and for many companies....assuming you pick right I think self taught tend to be better than those that have degrees, The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree
    Yes. The self motivation to sit down and educate yourself should be appreciated by recruiters. For simillar reasons I feel OU degrees should be ranked highly
  • Tim_in_RuislipTim_in_Ruislip Posts: 435
    edited August 8
    rkrkrk said:

    I've had a little nibble on Vance at 319/1 to be next President. It's just possible Trump might pull out... ill health perhaps.

    If you like spectacularly long odds trading/punts, the real value may well be on the other side of that bet. Not so much laying at such long odds, but betting on a replacement Trump VP.

    I've been thinking along the same lines as Mr Herdson/Domenech, although as I've quit betting, I haven't got the time/inclination to do the deep research needed to estimate tiny probabilities;

    --

    David Herdson
    @DavidHerdson
    ·
    8m
    Given how Trump got through administration members in 2017-21, I could well believe he might dump Vance. But there'd be a cost involved. Admitting the mistake plays to charges of poor judgement.

    Either way, he doesn't have long to think about it.

    --

    David Herdson was retweeting;

    Ben Domenech
    @bdomenech
    There is a non-zero possibility that Donald Trump could decide to move on from J.D. Vance.

    https://thespectator.com/newsletter/who-will-wish-they-chose-a-different-running-mate-thunderdome-08-08-2024/

    --

    There's a lot of money to be made in the difference between 0% & 1%.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,871
    Evening all :)

    Back to more mundane matters and another dimension to the housing question:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxr2rnx4rk9o

    Over 60,000 households in temporary accommodation - how much of this will be resolved simply by more building? How many of these new flats and houses can and should be set aside for those in temporary accommodation? Perhaps we should force developers to allocate a proportion of every site to the provision of housing for those in temporary accommodation at discounted rents?

    I'm also intrigued by this from the Evening Standard article on the same issue:

    Former Chancellor Philip Hammond also warned that a housebuilding boom is unlikely to happen without an increase in foreign labour.

    He told Sky News: “ You can’t build houses without builders. If the government thinks relaxing the planning rules while tightening the migration rules is going to get houses built they have another thing coming.”
  • eekeek Posts: 28,366

    I have seen a lot of the hard right / Farage / Musk "Two Tier" complaints. Why has x got a lengthy sentence when y didn't.

    Its all down to whether its a riot or not. Individual / small numbers doing something bad? Looked at individually. A riot? Book thrown at an infraction. As the miners found out unjustly at Orgreave.

    I don't think there is much debate about whether - unlike Orgreave - these are riots or not. The underlying complaint about the sentences feels primarily that the "patriots" are being sentenced at all.

    It's also down to the fact all the rioters being sentenced have pleaded guilty so their sentences have a third knocked off for an early guilty plea.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,027

    Welsh politics

    The new first minister of Wales, Eluned Morgan, ends the blanket 20mph change and at the same time appoints Drakeford, who bought it in, temporary Minister of Health for Wales

    I thought that the other she said on TV that she approved of it?
    On her appointment she confirmed the end of the blanket policy but did say, which mot everyone supports, that the20mph zones are needed around schools and hospitals
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,549

    Phil said:

    viewcode said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Phil said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Kaye Hoey being extremely dishonest here.


    Kate Hoey
    @CatharineHoey
    Still no answer to why it will take to next year before Alex Rudakubana the alleged murderer of the 3 young girls in South
    Oct will stand trial ?

    Community notes can be very entertaining sometimes. A genuinely great idea.
    People dis Twitter* under Musk, but he has implemented two genuinely useful features:

    (1) Community notes
    (2) People I follow

    It means I see fewer Marjorie Taylor Greene posts. Which is good.

    * I refuse to call it "X"
    Community Notes predates Musk
    Sort of.

    There was a program that created Notes that predated Musk, but it wasn't very widespread nor was it open source - and it had a different name.

    The current version dates from Musk.
    The story I’ve seen elsewhere is that the current version was in development before Musk bought the company. He just happened to be in charge when it was finished up & pushed to production.

    Always remember the six stages of a project:

    1. Enthusiasm
    2. Disillusionment
    3. Panic
    4. Search for the Guilty
    5. Punishment of the Innocent
    6. Praise for those not involved
    There are some interesting horror stories out there about the Twitter code base and what was going on before the takeover. There was a reason that features were simply not appearing in production...
    Given Musk is apparently not a good coder, I wouldn't assume he's made the codebase any better... ;)
    You're not say that he does all the coding for his companies, are you?
    No. But I can guarantee that he will hire coders that match his image of a good coder... i.e. him. And the recruitment staff will be recruited on the same basis (I *still* see the old story of him personally interviewing all SpaceX staff...) (fx: hits head on wall.)

    SpaceX is actually different, as space and NASA demand certain boxes ticked. I bet he hates those boxes.
    Nope - long before SpaceX got a NASA contract, they were racing ahead of the rest of the Space Industry on the software side. Simply because they hired top engineers without legacy “we don’t do that here” to tell them *not do modern software development*.

    When they got a NASA contract, their system for tracking parts got all kinds of wow reviews. All they had done was implement a single logical system, using standard stuff (bar codes etc), rather than a pile of paperwork multiples by several incompatible legacy systems.

    The usage of FPGAs emulating PowerPC architecture wasn’t invented by SpaceX either. But they were one of the first to apply it to aerospace. Just as doing radiation tolerance at the macro, rather than micro level. Both were in place before NASA started audits etc. Both took a bit of convincing before they were cleared for Human Rated flight.

    The initial review of the Dragon control interface was a bit hilarious - instead of taking the “fake an aircraft dash”, the SpaceX engineers created a system of context driven, intuitive menus and screen controls, using industrial psychologists, former astronauts etc.

    The NASA reviewers initially had an Out Of Context problem - they couldn’t understand why it didn’t just have an aircraft dashboard. But once they dug into it, they really liked the concept. Which was to align the interface with the checklists and procedures, rather than have a translation layer from procedure to switches.

    On Tesla - a friend worked for Tata, in their outfit tearing down rival cars. He was a software engineer / electronics guy and his comment was that Tesla simply implemented modern software and hardware practise in an industry full of appalling IT. The mechanicals he thought were pretty poor, by comparison.

    One amusing story he told me - he was debugging a certain car. A whole pile of different computers talking to each other via a mess of cables. He eliminated a stream of errors that one computer was polluting the system with. Which caused another part of the system to crash. Turned out that the stream of errors was preventing a condition in one of the other computers. Luxury car, on the road and in production.

    There are times when I think you haven't drunk the Musk Kool-Aid, then you produce something like that.

    Musk is one man. He does not, Bill Gates-like, read every line of code. He does not do everything inside the organisation. SpaceX is different, because it took people from other space companies, who knew how to do things in space. Musk knew how to code a game. And code some of Paypal's predecessor. Badly.

    I'd strongly argue that Tesla's inability to drive from one side of the US to another - as promised by Musk in 2016 - is a sign that they're not as strong in software as you would like to think.

    I've got a counter-example for your amusing story. A German car company developed a concept car that had no direct mechanical link between steering wheel and steering, as required by law. everything in the car used the same control/data bus. It worked really well.

    Until someone changed the CD in the CD multi-changer, and so much data was sent over the bus that the steering locked up for a few seconds.

    The result: a separate bus for 'critical' functions like steering and braking. And another for non-critical functions.

    The *mess of cables* you decry might actually have sensible purposes. And this is something that *anybody* reverse-engineering anything needs to consider: if you think the people who designed the thing you're reverse-engineering was stupid; perhaps you don't understand it fully, and it is *you* who is being stupid.
    What I was saying is that Tesla and SpaceX seem to use modern IT. There is no otherworldly stuff. Just the things you'd get from hiring top end people and them having a clean slate to work on.

    The "bus" story you mention sounds like a classic of someone using technology without understanding limitations and, most importantly, best practice.

    (Snip)
    SpaceX; yes. I see zero evidence that Tesla is doing that. Closing doors/frunks that can cut carrots being an example... ;)

    The 'bus' story might also be a case of people having to get a prototype concept car out of the door quickly. I've done prototypes where (ahem) things are not quite as I would want the,..
    Using a bus that doesn't implement time criticality in the steering for a car would make it un roadworthy, IMHO.

    IIRC the time criticality thing was found and fixed in a NASA test aircraft - the pilot was making lots of stick movements to fly, exactly, the profile. He noticed that after a while, the plan started showing signs of PIO and seemed to be getting slow to react. Turned out that, with the electronics of the time, he was piling up commands on system.
    How many concept cars sniff public roads?

    This sort of issue is one of the reasons concept cars exist.

    Incidentally, I know someone who used to work for Lucas. She saw the 'new' Discovery S2 in the mid-80s when it was under development. Apparently to access the computer debug ports in the prototypes, you pulled out one of the heater/vent ports in the dashboard, which would then cause the windscreen wipers to go...
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,213

    I have seen a lot of the hard right / Farage / Musk "Two Tier" complaints. Why has x got a lengthy sentence when y didn't.

    Its all down to whether its a riot or not. Individual / small numbers doing something bad? Looked at individually. A riot? Book thrown at an infraction. As the miners found out unjustly at Orgreave.

    I don't think there is much debate about whether - unlike Orgreave - these are riots or not. The underlying complaint about the sentences feels primarily that the "patriots" are being sentenced at all.

    I'd add that, just as with every episode of mass disorder that I've seen, going back to the 80s, the police will be arresting lots of people later.

    Because there are too many to arrest while trying to do something about public order, too many to arrest in a pitch battle/provoking a pitch battle etc etc.

    The ones they've arrested so far are the easy pickings and the immediate problems on the day.

    Time and again, people complain "why aren't they dragged *all* of X off?"

    Then, over days and weeks, the police go round and collect them from their mums basements and attics. One by one.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,813

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    This is grim. And I fear it is the future


    “Pray for S, one of the asylum seekers I worked with in Gateshead, beaten up by 2 men with iron bars last night.”

    https://x.com/meggilley1/status/1821455725656240585?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw

    The riots have stopped but a lower level violence will now replace it. Smaller acts. Local “events”

    Bleak as bleh. I may actually move to lovely Pristina

    Another example of this sort of thing.

    "Suspended Labour councillor arrested over video ‘urging people to cut throats’
    Ricky Jones arrested after video emerged in which he appeared to call for violence against ‘Nazi fascists’"

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/aug/08/labour-suspends-councillor-video-far-right-protesters
    Stupid man. Old enough to know a lot better

    His problem is that he is surely going to get a significant jail term, because he called for actual murder and people are getting 30 months for simply “shouting at policemen”
    On the one hand, no-one's throat will be cut. No-one is taking it seriously as a call to arms.

    On the other hand, how stupid are our elected representatives? WTF was he thinking? As you say, he will go down.
    There seem to be a few people who speak at demonstrations who think that because they’re among ‘friends’ it gives them the ability to say whatever they want. Which is utterly bizarre because it is in exactly in these types of situations where the law around incitement etc is so closely hanging over a speaker.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,213

    Phil said:

    viewcode said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Phil said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Kaye Hoey being extremely dishonest here.


    Kate Hoey
    @CatharineHoey
    Still no answer to why it will take to next year before Alex Rudakubana the alleged murderer of the 3 young girls in South
    Oct will stand trial ?

    Community notes can be very entertaining sometimes. A genuinely great idea.
    People dis Twitter* under Musk, but he has implemented two genuinely useful features:

    (1) Community notes
    (2) People I follow

    It means I see fewer Marjorie Taylor Greene posts. Which is good.

    * I refuse to call it "X"
    Community Notes predates Musk
    Sort of.

    There was a program that created Notes that predated Musk, but it wasn't very widespread nor was it open source - and it had a different name.

    The current version dates from Musk.
    The story I’ve seen elsewhere is that the current version was in development before Musk bought the company. He just happened to be in charge when it was finished up & pushed to production.

    Always remember the six stages of a project:

    1. Enthusiasm
    2. Disillusionment
    3. Panic
    4. Search for the Guilty
    5. Punishment of the Innocent
    6. Praise for those not involved
    There are some interesting horror stories out there about the Twitter code base and what was going on before the takeover. There was a reason that features were simply not appearing in production...
    Given Musk is apparently not a good coder, I wouldn't assume he's made the codebase any better... ;)
    You're not say that he does all the coding for his companies, are you?
    No. But I can guarantee that he will hire coders that match his image of a good coder... i.e. him. And the recruitment staff will be recruited on the same basis (I *still* see the old story of him personally interviewing all SpaceX staff...) (fx: hits head on wall.)

    SpaceX is actually different, as space and NASA demand certain boxes ticked. I bet he hates those boxes.
    Nope - long before SpaceX got a NASA contract, they were racing ahead of the rest of the Space Industry on the software side. Simply because they hired top engineers without legacy “we don’t do that here” to tell them *not do modern software development*.

    When they got a NASA contract, their system for tracking parts got all kinds of wow reviews. All they had done was implement a single logical system, using standard stuff (bar codes etc), rather than a pile of paperwork multiples by several incompatible legacy systems.

    The usage of FPGAs emulating PowerPC architecture wasn’t invented by SpaceX either. But they were one of the first to apply it to aerospace. Just as doing radiation tolerance at the macro, rather than micro level. Both were in place before NASA started audits etc. Both took a bit of convincing before they were cleared for Human Rated flight.

    The initial review of the Dragon control interface was a bit hilarious - instead of taking the “fake an aircraft dash”, the SpaceX engineers created a system of context driven, intuitive menus and screen controls, using industrial psychologists, former astronauts etc.

    The NASA reviewers initially had an Out Of Context problem - they couldn’t understand why it didn’t just have an aircraft dashboard. But once they dug into it, they really liked the concept. Which was to align the interface with the checklists and procedures, rather than have a translation layer from procedure to switches.

    On Tesla - a friend worked for Tata, in their outfit tearing down rival cars. He was a software engineer / electronics guy and his comment was that Tesla simply implemented modern software and hardware practise in an industry full of appalling IT. The mechanicals he thought were pretty poor, by comparison.

    One amusing story he told me - he was debugging a certain car. A whole pile of different computers talking to each other via a mess of cables. He eliminated a stream of errors that one computer was polluting the system with. Which caused another part of the system to crash. Turned out that the stream of errors was preventing a condition in one of the other computers. Luxury car, on the road and in production.

    There are times when I think you haven't drunk the Musk Kool-Aid, then you produce something like that.

    Musk is one man. He does not, Bill Gates-like, read every line of code. He does not do everything inside the organisation. SpaceX is different, because it took people from other space companies, who knew how to do things in space. Musk knew how to code a game. And code some of Paypal's predecessor. Badly.

    I'd strongly argue that Tesla's inability to drive from one side of the US to another - as promised by Musk in 2016 - is a sign that they're not as strong in software as you would like to think.

    I've got a counter-example for your amusing story. A German car company developed a concept car that had no direct mechanical link between steering wheel and steering, as required by law. everything in the car used the same control/data bus. It worked really well.

    Until someone changed the CD in the CD multi-changer, and so much data was sent over the bus that the steering locked up for a few seconds.

    The result: a separate bus for 'critical' functions like steering and braking. And another for non-critical functions.

    The *mess of cables* you decry might actually have sensible purposes. And this is something that *anybody* reverse-engineering anything needs to consider: if you think the people who designed the thing you're reverse-engineering was stupid; perhaps you don't understand it fully, and it is *you* who is being stupid.
    What I was saying is that Tesla and SpaceX seem to use modern IT. There is no otherworldly stuff. Just the things you'd get from hiring top end people and them having a clean slate to work on.

    The "bus" story you mention sounds like a classic of someone using technology without understanding limitations and, most importantly, best practice.

    (Snip)
    SpaceX; yes. I see zero evidence that Tesla is doing that. Closing doors/frunks that can cut carrots being an example... ;)

    The 'bus' story might also be a case of people having to get a prototype concept car out of the door quickly. I've done prototypes where (ahem) things are not quite as I would want the,..
    Using a bus that doesn't implement time criticality in the steering for a car would make it un roadworthy, IMHO.

    IIRC the time criticality thing was found and fixed in a NASA test aircraft - the pilot was making lots of stick movements to fly, exactly, the profile. He noticed that after a while, the plan started showing signs of PIO and seemed to be getting slow to react. Turned out that, with the electronics of the time, he was piling up commands on system.
    How many concept cars sniff public roads?

    This sort of issue is one of the reasons concept cars exist.

    Incidentally, I know someone who used to work for Lucas. She saw the 'new' Discovery S2 in the mid-80s when it was under development. Apparently to access the computer debug ports in the prototypes, you pulled out one of the heater/vent ports in the dashboard, which would then cause the windscreen wipers to go...
    Once you types "Lucas" in the context of electronics, everything else is pointless. Because everyone is laughing too hard to read the rest.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,895
    Khan - Tories Online Safety Act not fit for purpose https://www.theguardian.com/media/article/2024/aug/08/online-safety-act-not-fit-for-purpose-far-right-riots-sadiq-khan

    Isn't the truth that too many Tories have provided succour to the rioters?

    Its Tory slogans being chanted by the rioters. Its Tory foreign shaming being hurled about by morons as justification.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,576

    As we're talking about TwiX, any thoughts on the madcap plan to sue businesses who refuse to advertise on the platform?

    I believe the allegation is some kind of secret cabal that plotted apparently illegally to not spend money on their service. Not convinced there is a case to answer - if advertising on TwiX annoys your customers and thus damages your business, or even delivers poor ROI, how is choosing not to lose money illegal?

    There’s basically a monopoly organisation now running online advertising in the US, that’s the specific complaint from Twitter and Rumble.

    The organisation, known as GARM, has today shut down.

    https://thepostmillennial.com/breaking-world-federation-of-advertisers-shuts-down-garm-project-after-elon-musk-rumble-sue-over-ad-boycott
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,061

    Phil said:

    viewcode said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Phil said:

    Nunu5 said:

    Kaye Hoey being extremely dishonest here.


    Kate Hoey
    @CatharineHoey
    Still no answer to why it will take to next year before Alex Rudakubana the alleged murderer of the 3 young girls in South
    Oct will stand trial ?

    Community notes can be very entertaining sometimes. A genuinely great idea.
    People dis Twitter* under Musk, but he has implemented two genuinely useful features:

    (1) Community notes
    (2) People I follow

    It means I see fewer Marjorie Taylor Greene posts. Which is good.

    * I refuse to call it "X"
    Community Notes predates Musk
    Sort of.

    There was a program that created Notes that predated Musk, but it wasn't very widespread nor was it open source - and it had a different name.

    The current version dates from Musk.
    The story I’ve seen elsewhere is that the current version was in development before Musk bought the company. He just happened to be in charge when it was finished up & pushed to production.

    Always remember the six stages of a project:

    1. Enthusiasm
    2. Disillusionment
    3. Panic
    4. Search for the Guilty
    5. Punishment of the Innocent
    6. Praise for those not involved
    There are some interesting horror stories out there about the Twitter code base and what was going on before the takeover. There was a reason that features were simply not appearing in production...
    Given Musk is apparently not a good coder, I wouldn't assume he's made the codebase any better... ;)
    You're not say that he does all the coding for his companies, are you?
    No. But I can guarantee that he will hire coders that match his image of a good coder... i.e. him. And the recruitment staff will be recruited on the same basis (I *still* see the old story of him personally interviewing all SpaceX staff...) (fx: hits head on wall.)

    SpaceX is actually different, as space and NASA demand certain boxes ticked. I bet he hates those boxes.
    Nope - long before SpaceX got a NASA contract, they were racing ahead of the rest of the Space Industry on the software side. Simply because they hired top engineers without legacy “we don’t do that here” to tell them *not do modern software development*.

    When they got a NASA contract, their system for tracking parts got all kinds of wow reviews. All they had done was implement a single logical system, using standard stuff (bar codes etc), rather than a pile of paperwork multiples by several incompatible legacy systems.

    The usage of FPGAs emulating PowerPC architecture wasn’t invented by SpaceX either. But they were one of the first to apply it to aerospace. Just as doing radiation tolerance at the macro, rather than micro level. Both were in place before NASA started audits etc. Both took a bit of convincing before they were cleared for Human Rated flight.

    The initial review of the Dragon control interface was a bit hilarious - instead of taking the “fake an aircraft dash”, the SpaceX engineers created a system of context driven, intuitive menus and screen controls, using industrial psychologists, former astronauts etc.

    The NASA reviewers initially had an Out Of Context problem - they couldn’t understand why it didn’t just have an aircraft dashboard. But once they dug into it, they really liked the concept. Which was to align the interface with the checklists and procedures, rather than have a translation layer from procedure to switches.

    On Tesla - a friend worked for Tata, in their outfit tearing down rival cars. He was a software engineer / electronics guy and his comment was that Tesla simply implemented modern software and hardware practise in an industry full of appalling IT. The mechanicals he thought were pretty poor, by comparison.

    One amusing story he told me - he was debugging a certain car. A whole pile of different computers talking to each other via a mess of cables. He eliminated a stream of errors that one computer was polluting the system with. Which caused another part of the system to crash. Turned out that the stream of errors was preventing a condition in one of the other computers. Luxury car, on the road and in production.

    There are times when I think you haven't drunk the Musk Kool-Aid, then you produce something like that.

    Musk is one man. He does not, Bill Gates-like, read every line of code. He does not do everything inside the organisation. SpaceX is different, because it took people from other space companies, who knew how to do things in space. Musk knew how to code a game. And code some of Paypal's predecessor. Badly.

    I'd strongly argue that Tesla's inability to drive from one side of the US to another - as promised by Musk in 2016 - is a sign that they're not as strong in software as you would like to think.

    I've got a counter-example for your amusing story. A German car company developed a concept car that had no direct mechanical link between steering wheel and steering, as required by law. everything in the car used the same control/data bus. It worked really well.

    Until someone changed the CD in the CD multi-changer, and so much data was sent over the bus that the steering locked up for a few seconds.

    The result: a separate bus for 'critical' functions like steering and braking. And another for non-critical functions.

    The *mess of cables* you decry might actually have sensible purposes. And this is something that *anybody* reverse-engineering anything needs to consider: if you think the people who designed the thing you're reverse-engineering was stupid; perhaps you don't understand it fully, and it is *you* who is being stupid.
    What I was saying is that Tesla and SpaceX seem to use modern IT. There is no otherworldly stuff. Just the things you'd get from hiring top end people and them having a clean slate to work on.

    The "bus" story you mention sounds like a classic of someone using technology without understanding limitations and, most importantly, best practice.

    Guaranteed delivery of data within a specified time frame has long been a thing on critical systems. IIRC it was first implemented, long ago (70s IIRC) for digital fly-by-wire aircraft. There are a number of standards now. IIRC SpaceX uses one of them for the Ethernet(ish) network it runs on its rockets.

    EDIT: another friend when to work for a satellite maker. And discovered their approach to the security *of the control of the satellites* was home rolled, insane, and decades behind basic IT security rules. At a guess, a number of legacy industries haven't adapted well to the IT revolution.
    Another example - Neuralink is still grappling with the fiddly task of managing latencies over Bluetooth.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,399
    KJT a PB by half a metre in the Shot Put.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,576
    KJT just got a massive personal best in the shot put. Looking good in the heptathlon.
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,938
    stodge said:

    Evening all :)

    Back to more mundane matters and another dimension to the housing question:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cxr2rnx4rk9o

    Over 60,000 households in temporary accommodation - how much of this will be resolved simply by more building? How many of these new flats and houses can and should be set aside for those in temporary accommodation? Perhaps we should force developers to allocate a proportion of every site to the provision of housing for those in temporary accommodation at discounted rents?

    I'm also intrigued by this from the Evening Standard article on the same issue:

    Former Chancellor Philip Hammond also warned that a housebuilding boom is unlikely to happen without an increase in foreign labour.

    He told Sky News: “ You can’t build houses without builders. If the government thinks relaxing the planning rules while tightening the migration rules is going to get houses built they have another thing coming.”

    If it was me, I'd declare it a national emergency and set aside huge areas that could be designated as plots for shipping container homes. Allow them on land that's not designated for permanent housing, thus getting over the 'land is too expensive' problem. They don't have foundations and are moveable, so let people put them down more or less anywhere within designated 'mobile' home areas. Build roads and water/electricity connection points.

    Not ideal, but better than what we have at the minute. Model it on the Australian 'quarantine villages' they managed to build en masse in a matter of a few months - https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-05-09/mining-camp-designers-plan-covid-19-quarantine-hub-in-wa/100119364

  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,549
    What is going on in Kursk?

    Apparently Ukraine is now operating helicopters *within* Russia, and Russia have destroyed a Ukrainian air-defence asset - which means Ukraine were expecting to need valuable AD coverage further forward.

    Yesterday I was expecting this to be a larger version of Ukraine's previous incursions into Russia. Now, after a couple of days, it is looking significantly more strategic. I just cannot fathom what that strategy is.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,213
    DougSeal said:

    Pagan2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    There is a pattern in antisocial media bullshit.

    A tag line and the apparent evidence - "@TheScreamingEagles interview - Pineapple pizza awesome, Radiohead and Python awful. https://youtu.be/GarbageLink"

    It works because about 90% off people never click the link or try and find actual evidence.

    Python is awful - don't use whitespace to represent significancy...
    It is no more ridiculous than using lots of brackets (of varying types).

    Python has fantastic, clean syntax. It has incredible data science libraries. And these days, computers (and computing power) is cheap.

    Other than occasional bits of Javascript, when I have a need to do something webby, I wouldn't use anything else. There's simply no point, because quick to write, readable code, is worth a lot more than a few processor cycles.
    oh I just have a dislike of Python but I started off when Javascript was Livescript and Perl was the in thing.

    I personally prefer the latest version of Delphi (i.e. C# )..
    99% of my "coding" these days is data analysis, where Python + Pandas + Jupyter is absolutely superb, especially if you use Google's hosted Colab service. I'm playing around with massive datasets and running analyses in seconds that would historically have taken days. (And also required a team of people.)
    You use whatever has the best libraries for whatever it is you want to do. If that's Python, then great. And if it's JavaScript, for God's sake use TypeScript!
    The real problem with Python and JavaScript is the large numbers of self taught people.

    Who haven’t heard of code structure, testing pyramids or even code versioning tools.

    “No, Quant Boy, the Python file you emailed me isn’t going directly into production. Aside from the fact it doesn’t actually run, we need tests. And test data. And some QA. and running on all the non-prod environments first…. Also, where is the specification? ‘cause Compliance will quite interested in how we are pricing stuff.”
    While I largely agree with what you say, it is also great to have the freedom to implement stuff as you see fit without having to specify every last widget to the n-th degree. Obviously that's easier when working iteratively as a sole developer on small projects.

    Also, bad code implemented by self-taught developers is by no means restricted to Python and JavaScript. The codebase at my last workplace was a tangled mess of undocumented C++ dating back decades and presided over by an old-school self-taught coder with a pathological hatred of whitespace and line breaks. That was the last straw for me.
    Indeed

    Just that these days the self taught types are hacking in Python.

    There was this mad guy who was going to replace Excel with a spreadsheet backed by Python as the scripting language. Whatever happened to him?
    As someone who has been in software since the 90's and for many companies....assuming you pick right I think self taught tend to be better than those that have degrees, The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree
    "The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree"

    So they have failed at the most basic thing a degree is supposed to teach.
    IMV the best tend to be people who had degrees in subjects other than computers. So they were intelligent and knew the academic process, but did not think they knew everything about 'pooters.

    But the best of all were those who had no degrees and were utterly self-taught. I wonder if anyone here was in that category... ;)
    I’m basically a self taught lawyer. After university I went to law school in York to do the conversion course. Some of the teachers were shite and I was facing an equity and trusts exam within weeks I was 100% sure I’d fail.

    Anyway, there was no washing machine in my house so I went to a laundrette on the Bishopthorpe Road, with weeks of washing to do. Pretty disgusting. I spent all of one April 1997 Saturday in there reading a short trusts textbook I still have cover to cover. At about 3pm (the football was kicking off on Radio 5) it started to make sense, and by the time I left with my newly washed clothes I knew enough
    to pass. I’ve kept the book ever since. A year at law school when a day ar a laundrette would do.
    I'm trying to remember the details, but there were some states in the US, where you could just rock up and take the bar exam.

    They have been reduced (maybe eliminated by now) by very heavy lobbying by the universities.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,643

    I have seen a lot of the hard right / Farage / Musk "Two Tier" complaints. Why has x got a lengthy sentence when y didn't.

    Its all down to whether its a riot or not. Individual / small numbers doing something bad? Looked at individually. A riot? Book thrown at an infraction. As the miners found out unjustly at Orgreave.

    I don't think there is much debate about whether - unlike Orgreave - these are riots or not. The underlying complaint about the sentences feels primarily that the "patriots" are being sentenced at all.

    I'd add that, just as with every episode of mass disorder that I've seen, going back to the 80s, the police will be arresting lots of people later.

    Because there are too many to arrest while trying to do something about public order, too many to arrest in a pitch battle/provoking a pitch battle etc etc.

    The ones they've arrested so far are the easy pickings and the immediate problems on the day.

    Time and again, people complain "why aren't they dragged *all* of X off?"

    Then, over days and weeks, the police go round and collect them from their mums basements and attics. One by one.
    The guy jailed for throwing an egg was only nicked because he walked past the egged constable the next day.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,496

    Pagan2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    There is a pattern in antisocial media bullshit.

    A tag line and the apparent evidence - "@TheScreamingEagles interview - Pineapple pizza awesome, Radiohead and Python awful. https://youtu.be/GarbageLink"

    It works because about 90% off people never click the link or try and find actual evidence.

    Python is awful - don't use whitespace to represent significancy...
    It is no more ridiculous than using lots of brackets (of varying types).

    Python has fantastic, clean syntax. It has incredible data science libraries. And these days, computers (and computing power) is cheap.

    Other than occasional bits of Javascript, when I have a need to do something webby, I wouldn't use anything else. There's simply no point, because quick to write, readable code, is worth a lot more than a few processor cycles.
    oh I just have a dislike of Python but I started off when Javascript was Livescript and Perl was the in thing.

    I personally prefer the latest version of Delphi (i.e. C# )..
    99% of my "coding" these days is data analysis, where Python + Pandas + Jupyter is absolutely superb, especially if you use Google's hosted Colab service. I'm playing around with massive datasets and running analyses in seconds that would historically have taken days. (And also required a team of people.)
    You use whatever has the best libraries for whatever it is you want to do. If that's Python, then great. And if it's JavaScript, for God's sake use TypeScript!
    The real problem with Python and JavaScript is the large numbers of self taught people.

    Who haven’t heard of code structure, testing pyramids or even code versioning tools.

    “No, Quant Boy, the Python file you emailed me isn’t going directly into production. Aside from the fact it doesn’t actually run, we need tests. And test data. And some QA. and running on all the non-prod environments first…. Also, where is the specification? ‘cause Compliance will quite interested in how we are pricing stuff.”
    While I largely agree with what you say, it is also great to have the freedom to implement stuff as you see fit without having to specify every last widget to the n-th degree. Obviously that's easier when working iteratively as a sole developer on small projects.

    Also, bad code implemented by self-taught developers is by no means restricted to Python and JavaScript. The codebase at my last workplace was a tangled mess of undocumented C++ dating back decades and presided over by an old-school self-taught coder with a pathological hatred of whitespace and line breaks. That was the last straw for me.
    Indeed

    Just that these days the self taught types are hacking in Python.

    There was this mad guy who was going to replace Excel with a spreadsheet backed by Python as the scripting language. Whatever happened to him?
    As someone who has been in software since the 90's and for many companies....assuming you pick right I think self taught tend to be better than those that have degrees, The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree
    "The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree"

    So they have failed at the most basic thing a degree is supposed to teach.
    IMV the best tend to be people who had degrees in subjects other than computers. So they were intelligent and knew the academic process, but did not think they knew everything about 'pooters.

    But the best of all were those who had no degrees and were utterly self-taught. I wonder if anyone here was in that category... ;)
    Any decent first degree should leave you aware that you know a bit, which is reasonably concrete and precise, about something and that you know almost nothing about nearly everything but that there are ways of finding out if you really want to. Socratic and humble perhaps.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,895

    I have seen a lot of the hard right / Farage / Musk "Two Tier" complaints. Why has x got a lengthy sentence when y didn't.

    Its all down to whether its a riot or not. Individual / small numbers doing something bad? Looked at individually. A riot? Book thrown at an infraction. As the miners found out unjustly at Orgreave.

    I don't think there is much debate about whether - unlike Orgreave - these are riots or not. The underlying complaint about the sentences feels primarily that the "patriots" are being sentenced at all.

    I'd add that, just as with every episode of mass disorder that I've seen, going back to the 80s, the police will be arresting lots of people later.

    Because there are too many to arrest while trying to do something about public order, too many to arrest in a pitch battle/provoking a pitch battle etc etc.

    The ones they've arrested so far are the easy pickings and the immediate problems on the day.

    Time and again, people complain "why aren't they dragged *all* of X off?"

    Then, over days and weeks, the police go round and collect them from their mums basements and attics. One by one.
    I have enjoyed some of the reportage of these people crying in the dock as they are led down. Bless. Did they really think they could act as they wanted with no repercussions?
  • ManOfGwentManOfGwent Posts: 92

    What is going on in Kursk?

    Apparently Ukraine is now operating helicopters *within* Russia, and Russia have destroyed a Ukrainian air-defence asset - which means Ukraine were expecting to need valuable AD coverage further forward.

    Yesterday I was expecting this to be a larger version of Ukraine's previous incursions into Russia. Now, after a couple of days, it is looking significantly more strategic. I just cannot fathom what that strategy is.

    Apparently to hold in order to use as bargaining chip in the event of negotiations. Seems a bit optimistic to believe they could hold it though.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,549

    I have seen a lot of the hard right / Farage / Musk "Two Tier" complaints. Why has x got a lengthy sentence when y didn't.

    Its all down to whether its a riot or not. Individual / small numbers doing something bad? Looked at individually. A riot? Book thrown at an infraction. As the miners found out unjustly at Orgreave.

    I don't think there is much debate about whether - unlike Orgreave - these are riots or not. The underlying complaint about the sentences feels primarily that the "patriots" are being sentenced at all.

    Why don't disturbances in Croydon count as a riot?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    edited August 8
    ...

    Khan - Tories Online Safety Act not fit for purpose https://www.theguardian.com/media/article/2024/aug/08/online-safety-act-not-fit-for-purpose-far-right-riots-sadiq-khan

    Isn't the truth that too many Tories have provided succour to the rioters?

    Its Tory slogans being chanted by the rioters. Its Tory foreign shaming being hurled about by morons as justification.

    Nigel's had a big win tonight getting this Dartford Councillor (quite rightly) banged up, yet the most prolific online agent provocateur over the last fortnight has been er, let me think...
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,213
    algarkirk said:

    Pagan2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    There is a pattern in antisocial media bullshit.

    A tag line and the apparent evidence - "@TheScreamingEagles interview - Pineapple pizza awesome, Radiohead and Python awful. https://youtu.be/GarbageLink"

    It works because about 90% off people never click the link or try and find actual evidence.

    Python is awful - don't use whitespace to represent significancy...
    It is no more ridiculous than using lots of brackets (of varying types).

    Python has fantastic, clean syntax. It has incredible data science libraries. And these days, computers (and computing power) is cheap.

    Other than occasional bits of Javascript, when I have a need to do something webby, I wouldn't use anything else. There's simply no point, because quick to write, readable code, is worth a lot more than a few processor cycles.
    oh I just have a dislike of Python but I started off when Javascript was Livescript and Perl was the in thing.

    I personally prefer the latest version of Delphi (i.e. C# )..
    99% of my "coding" these days is data analysis, where Python + Pandas + Jupyter is absolutely superb, especially if you use Google's hosted Colab service. I'm playing around with massive datasets and running analyses in seconds that would historically have taken days. (And also required a team of people.)
    You use whatever has the best libraries for whatever it is you want to do. If that's Python, then great. And if it's JavaScript, for God's sake use TypeScript!
    The real problem with Python and JavaScript is the large numbers of self taught people.

    Who haven’t heard of code structure, testing pyramids or even code versioning tools.

    “No, Quant Boy, the Python file you emailed me isn’t going directly into production. Aside from the fact it doesn’t actually run, we need tests. And test data. And some QA. and running on all the non-prod environments first…. Also, where is the specification? ‘cause Compliance will quite interested in how we are pricing stuff.”
    While I largely agree with what you say, it is also great to have the freedom to implement stuff as you see fit without having to specify every last widget to the n-th degree. Obviously that's easier when working iteratively as a sole developer on small projects.

    Also, bad code implemented by self-taught developers is by no means restricted to Python and JavaScript. The codebase at my last workplace was a tangled mess of undocumented C++ dating back decades and presided over by an old-school self-taught coder with a pathological hatred of whitespace and line breaks. That was the last straw for me.
    Indeed

    Just that these days the self taught types are hacking in Python.

    There was this mad guy who was going to replace Excel with a spreadsheet backed by Python as the scripting language. Whatever happened to him?
    As someone who has been in software since the 90's and for many companies....assuming you pick right I think self taught tend to be better than those that have degrees, The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree
    "The latter tend to be you can't teach me anything I have a degree"

    So they have failed at the most basic thing a degree is supposed to teach.
    IMV the best tend to be people who had degrees in subjects other than computers. So they were intelligent and knew the academic process, but did not think they knew everything about 'pooters.

    But the best of all were those who had no degrees and were utterly self-taught. I wonder if anyone here was in that category... ;)
    Any decent first degree should leave you aware that you know a bit, which is reasonably concrete and precise, about something and that you know almost nothing about nearly everything but that there are ways of finding out if you really want to. Socratic and humble perhaps.
    Exactly - the first degree is when they (should) tell you that the essentially Newtonian, defined and completely understood system they gave you at school is a corner of the truth.

    What the line? “I do not know what I may appear to the world, but to myself I seem to have been only like a boy playing on the seashore, and diverting myself in now and then finding a smoother pebble or a prettier shell than ordinary, whilst the great ocean of truth lay all undiscovered before me.”
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,071
    edited August 8

    Makes me proud to be British and is further proof that we live rent free in the minds of the Russians.

    Russian pundit Alexander Kazakov says that the UK - "our worst enemy" - is behind Ukraine’s advance into Kursk Region

    "This is a London story and [Ukrainian military intelligence chief] Budanov is London’s man!"


    https://x.com/francis_scarr/status/1821531460647727516

    I assume by the way they single out the UK sometimes that they are wary of constantly blaming the USA for everything, so if they want a particularly unhinged rant they go for us.

    Though since only one party in the US still wants to support Ukraine it might be a genuine comment, since both main ones do here.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Andy_JS said:

    I have seen a lot of the hard right / Farage / Musk "Two Tier" complaints. Why has x got a lengthy sentence when y didn't.

    Its all down to whether its a riot or not. Individual / small numbers doing something bad? Looked at individually. A riot? Book thrown at an infraction. As the miners found out unjustly at Orgreave.

    I don't think there is much debate about whether - unlike Orgreave - these are riots or not. The underlying complaint about the sentences feels primarily that the "patriots" are being sentenced at all.

    Why don't disturbances in Croydon count as a riot?
    See my previous post on the legal definition of riot. It doesn’t meet the threshold.
This discussion has been closed.