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Oh dear, how sad, never mind – politicalbetting.com

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  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876
    30cm of rain in 12 hours over Taiwan.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/ce98pq4e3d1t

    The typhoon had earlier capsized and sunk a fuel tanker, off Manila bay in the Philippines.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,660
    moonshine said:

    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Hadn’t seen anything of Kamala until this week. I’ve always thought she can’t be as bad as made out but never been sufficiently interested to look her up. Until now. Goodness me she’s bad.

    Grating personality, cackles at peculiar moments in interviews, gaffe prone, seems fairly awkward, shallow. How on earth have they decided it’s best to go with her rather than open the field?

    Lost in all the mania that Trump must be defeated at all costs and the haze of excitable polling, how many of her rampers are stopping to ask whether she’d be a good president? It’s quite a disastrous in-tray she’s inheriting. A structural deficit of ~7% going into what might be a fierce recession and market correction, a real rather than rhetorical Axis of Evil aligning their military industrial activities and attempting to unwind Western hegemony, and a less socially cohesive population in more than a century.

    Rather lost in all of that is the question of whether she's a better candidate than a 78-year-old felon with a history of sexual assaults, a penchant for rigging courts, a disastrous record as a President and businessman and questions to answer about a failed coup.

    Which it seems the American people so far think she might be.
    The problem with all that, is that I don’t think it easy to say Biden’s was an objectively superior presidency to Trump’s. Trump ballooned the deficit even prior to covid but Biden has taken it to new levels at a time of full employment.

    You might say that were it not for Trump killing Soleimani, the Iranian nuclear deal may have held. Maybe but that’s not verifiable. Instead we live in a world where Iran has shut the suez, is flouting sanctions to arm our enemies and has fermented a catastrophic Middle Eastern conflict.

    For all the column inches on Trump and Putin, it was under Obama and then Biden that Putin invaded Ukraine. Trump could arguably have done more after Salisbury, but credibly how could he given Europe’s position on Russia at the time?

    Jan 6th is of course the key black mark against trump and for many understandably disqualifies him on its own. But even on matters of democracy, we can’t give this government a free pass given its insidious use of censorship, and puppet-like executive for goodness knows how long.

    It’s hard to sensibly discuss these things because you get painted as a trump apologist, fascist or whatever else. But if your goal is prediction, it pays to consider whether a swing voter flips (or stays at home), because the idea of this government continuing feels in many ways less attractive to them than reverting to the one that preceded it. Kamala is the ultimate continuity candidate, given she would likely be a weak executive and keep the band more or less together.

    Obama was dead right on this. It’s a change election and they should have looked elsewhere
    (so too should the GOP of course).


    Again, you’re missing the point. If Trump is the candidate it won’t be a change election.

    We keep seeing this claim about Ukraine. But it’s bollocks. It was Trump’s foreign policy, particularly his isolationism and the fact Biden was unable to overtly reverse it, that led Putin to think it would be feasible. It is Trump’s ongoing efforts to stymie aid to Ukraine that means the war is still going on.

    And any actions committed by Iran and their proxies, read Russia. Whom Trump wants to work with. (They haven’t shut the Suez Canal although traffic has dropped.)

    The deficit is a black mark, but much is to do with trying to sort out the problems Trump left, and he’s proposing actions to make it worse.

    If you fear coming across as a Trump apologist, maybe don’t write apologias for him?
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,254
    johnt said:

    Problem for the Tories is that her views are widespread in the party. So even if she cannot stand as leader any new leader will need to seek to rid the party of its toxic element. I don’t see that as a ‘one parliament’ job. It is likely to take longer than that.

    Oh she's the doyen of the Daily Mail doozies, for sure.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876

    ydoethur said:

    FF43 said:

    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Hadn’t seen anything of Kamala until this week. I’ve always thought she can’t be as bad as made out but never been sufficiently interested to look her up. Until now. Goodness me she’s bad.

    Grating personality, cackles at peculiar moments in interviews, gaffe prone, seems fairly awkward, shallow. How on earth have they decided it’s best to go with her rather than open the field?

    Lost in all the mania that Trump must be defeated at all costs and the haze of excitable polling, how many of her rampers are stopping to ask whether she’d be a good president? It’s quite a disastrous in-tray she’s inheriting. A structural deficit of ~7% going into what might be a fierce recession and market correction, a real rather than rhetorical Axis of Evil aligning their military industrial activities and attempting to unwind Western hegemony, and a less socially cohesive population in more than a century.

    Rather lost in all of that is the question of whether she's a better candidate than a 78-year-old felon with a history of sexual assaults, a penchant for rigging courts, a disastrous record as a President and businessman and questions to answer about a failed coup.

    Which it seems the American people so far think she might be.
    Everyone is clearly a better candidate than Donald Trump - Harris, Clinton, Hayley, Jeb Bush ... even Biden. It's perverse to talk about Harris' competence against the looming spectre of another Trump presidency.

    What she is, what she has always been, and what she will be as your next President, is Not Donald Trump.

    And that is what makes Kamala Harris Acceptable Under the Circumstances.
    Yes but you like most here likely wouldn't vote Trump if the alternative was Pol Pot or Ghengis Khan (and like most here don't have a vote anyway).

    It is how well she goes down with those 100,000 voters in Wisconsin etc that actually get to decide the election that matters, and we really don't know yet how they are viewing things, whatever the rampers on both sides say and wont for about six weeks until the dust settles, she gets on TV a lot and they start to firm up a view.
    The problem is more those who would vote for Pol Pot or Ghengis Khan, were either the GOP nominee.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,600
    Well.

    Revolut finally receives UK banking licence after three-year wait

    Move paves way for fintech firm to hold customers’ deposits and offer own-branded loans, including mortgages

    https://theguardian.com/business/article/2024/jul/25/revolut-receives-uk-banking-licence-after-three-year-wait
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,639

    DavidL said:

    The Democrats having finally, if belatedly, bitten the bullet with Biden, attention now turns to the other senile dinosaur in the race. And Trump reacts by describing himself as a "fine and brilliant young man" to general derision:
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/crazy-town-trump-s-baffling-midnight-meltdown-leaves-everyone-confused/ar-BB1qt0iH?ocid=BingNewsSerp&cvid=3699b57ec3854adea4301e04e864bf58&ei=23

    We are going to see a lot more of this. Trump says many truly bizarre and delusional things but Biden gave him cover by consistently losing the plot. He's going to find taking on someone 19 years his junior a lot tougher, not because of anything she says or does, but because he will be far more exposed.

    I can't stand Trump, but his opponents do need to understand that sort of thing is him joking - and it's not a bad little one liner. He knows his own well-deserved reputation for braggadocio, and leans into it for comic effect. Opponents do risk appearing humourless by getting up in arms about it.
    True, but the voters are Americans, after all.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876
    moonshine said:

    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Hadn’t seen anything of Kamala until this week. I’ve always thought she can’t be as bad as made out but never been sufficiently interested to look her up. Until now. Goodness me she’s bad.

    Grating personality, cackles at peculiar moments in interviews, gaffe prone, seems fairly awkward, shallow. How on earth have they decided it’s best to go with her rather than open the field?

    Lost in all the mania that Trump must be defeated at all costs and the haze of excitable polling, how many of her rampers are stopping to ask whether she’d be a good president? It’s quite a disastrous in-tray she’s inheriting. A structural deficit of ~7% going into what might be a fierce recession and market correction, a real rather than rhetorical Axis of Evil aligning their military industrial activities and attempting to unwind Western hegemony, and a less socially cohesive population in more than a century.

    Rather lost in all of that is the question of whether she's a better candidate than a 78-year-old felon with a history of sexual assaults, a penchant for rigging courts, a disastrous record as a President and businessman and questions to answer about a failed coup.

    Which it seems the American people so far think she might be.
    The problem with all that, is that I don’t think it easy to say Biden’s was an objectively superior presidency to Trump’s. Trump ballooned the deficit even prior to covid but Biden has taken it to new levels at a time of full employment.

    You might say that were it not for Trump killing Soleimani, the Iranian nuclear deal may have held. Maybe but that’s not verifiable. Instead we live in a world where Iran has shut the suez, is flouting sanctions to arm our enemies and has fermented a catastrophic Middle Eastern conflict.

    For all the column inches on Trump and Putin, it was under Obama and then Biden that Putin invaded Ukraine. Trump could arguably have done more after Salisbury, but credibly how could he given Europe’s position on Russia at the time?

    Jan 6th is of course the key black mark against trump and for many understandably disqualifies him on its own. But even on matters of democracy, we can’t give this government a free pass given its insidious use of censorship, and puppet-like executive for goodness knows how long.

    It’s hard to sensibly discuss these things because you get painted as a trump apologist, fascist or whatever else. But if your goal is prediction, it pays to consider whether a swing voter flips (or stays at home), because the idea of this government continuing feels in many ways less attractive to them than reverting to the one that preceded it. Kamala is the ultimate continuity candidate, given she would likely be a weak executive and keep the band more or less together.

    Obama was dead right on this. It’s a change election and they should have looked elsewhere
    (so too should the GOP of course).


    A large proportion of the Democratic 'elite' - Pelosi; Schumer; Jeffries; Obama too - wanted to "look elsewhere". They didn't explain how that might happen, and within 36 hours, Harris was the presumptive nominee.

    How do you think it could have happened ?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,453

    Well.

    Revolut finally receives UK banking licence after three-year wait

    Move paves way for fintech firm to hold customers’ deposits and offer own-branded loans, including mortgages

    https://theguardian.com/business/article/2024/jul/25/revolut-receives-uk-banking-licence-after-three-year-wait

    Are they FSCS protected now ?

    As 'Regulated by the FCA' doesn't mean a jot of beans
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405
    https://www.npr.org/2024/07/24/g-s1-12918/kamala-harris-vice-president-senator-ag-california-first

    5 key things to know about Kamala

    NPR said to lean left but looks balanced to me. Good news is she struggles over her inconsistent and error prone history as a prosecutor but seems to have improved as a politician
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,106
    If Braverman doesn't get enough support to stand that slightly increases the chances of Badenoch or Patel getting to the final two as the ERG MPs would be less divided
  • Sandpit said:

    Another week, another young female prison guard convicted of misconduct involving a sexual relationship with a prisoner.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/07/24/prison-guard-affair-with-armed-robber-spared-jail/

    Why are men’s prisons still employing these young women in the first place?

    It’s hard to find the staff.

    Something that is barely above minimum wage, you’re working below the ideal staff ratio.

    Threats of violence etc.

    Also as we’ve discussed before, a significant number of men cannot pass the (enhanced) DBS check.
    Given that the enhanced one shows things like juvenile cautions and allegations (including malicious allegations) that is hardly surprising.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 53,391
    Nigelb said:

    .

    Taz said:

    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a racial nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    Approx 7.38

    GMB did the same this morning. A narrative is being built here.

    We need to know the full facts. In isolation its looks awful.
    They have provided some context.
    But it does look rather like retaliation after the subject had been subdued.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw9y2ry3dldo
    ..GMP said its officers had been called to Terminal 2 of the airport at 20:25 BST on Tuesday following reports of a fight.
    It said while trying to arrest a suspect, three of its officers were violently attacked and punched to the ground. One officer suffered a broken nose and all three needed hospital treatment.
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them," a spokesman for the force said.
    Four men were arrested at the scene for affray and assault on emergency service workers...


    I can't claim much, if any sympathy for the arrestee, but the police ought not to behave like that.
    If you violently attack an armed police officer AT AN AIRPORT you should count yourself lucky you are not shot dead, rather than merely kicked

    Indeed, Britain might be the only country where you would survive such a stupid and self destructive assault
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876
    Sartorial advice guy debunks the latest (rather pointless) MAGA conspiracy theory.
    https://x.com/dieworkwear/status/1816348629252346083
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 48,464
    Nigelb said:

    moonshine said:

    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Hadn’t seen anything of Kamala until this week. I’ve always thought she can’t be as bad as made out but never been sufficiently interested to look her up. Until now. Goodness me she’s bad.

    Grating personality, cackles at peculiar moments in interviews, gaffe prone, seems fairly awkward, shallow. How on earth have they decided it’s best to go with her rather than open the field?

    Lost in all the mania that Trump must be defeated at all costs and the haze of excitable polling, how many of her rampers are stopping to ask whether she’d be a good president? It’s quite a disastrous in-tray she’s inheriting. A structural deficit of ~7% going into what might be a fierce recession and market correction, a real rather than rhetorical Axis of Evil aligning their military industrial activities and attempting to unwind Western hegemony, and a less socially cohesive population in more than a century.

    Rather lost in all of that is the question of whether she's a better candidate than a 78-year-old felon with a history of sexual assaults, a penchant for rigging courts, a disastrous record as a President and businessman and questions to answer about a failed coup.

    Which it seems the American people so far think she might be.
    The problem with all that, is that I don’t think it easy to say Biden’s was an objectively superior presidency to Trump’s. Trump ballooned the deficit even prior to covid but Biden has taken it to new levels at a time of full employment.

    You might say that were it not for Trump killing Soleimani, the Iranian nuclear deal may have held. Maybe but that’s not verifiable. Instead we live in a world where Iran has shut the suez, is flouting sanctions to arm our enemies and has fermented a catastrophic Middle Eastern conflict.

    For all the column inches on Trump and Putin, it was under Obama and then Biden that Putin invaded Ukraine. Trump could arguably have done more after Salisbury, but credibly how could he given Europe’s position on Russia at the time?

    Jan 6th is of course the key black mark against trump and for many understandably disqualifies him on its own. But even on matters of democracy, we can’t give this government a free pass given its insidious use of censorship, and puppet-like executive for goodness knows how long.

    It’s hard to sensibly discuss these things because you get painted as a trump apologist, fascist or whatever else. But if your goal is prediction, it pays to consider whether a swing voter flips (or stays at home), because the idea of this government continuing feels in many ways less attractive to them than reverting to the one that preceded it. Kamala is the ultimate continuity candidate, given she would likely be a weak executive and keep the band more or less together.

    Obama was dead right on this. It’s a change election and they should have looked elsewhere
    (so too should the GOP of course).


    A large proportion of the Democratic 'elite' - Pelosi; Schumer; Jeffries; Obama too - wanted to "look elsewhere". They didn't explain how that might happen, and within 36 hours, Harris was the presumptive nominee.

    How do you think it could have happened ?
    The issue was the lack of candidates noticeably better than Harris. There's no one who shows any signs of leaping to 10 points clear of Trump or anything.

    Without a clearly better alternative, Harris is the obvious choice for a number of reasons.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,600
    Pulpstar said:

    Well.

    Revolut finally receives UK banking licence after three-year wait

    Move paves way for fintech firm to hold customers’ deposits and offer own-branded loans, including mortgages

    https://theguardian.com/business/article/2024/jul/25/revolut-receives-uk-banking-licence-after-three-year-wait

    Are they FSCS protected now ?

    As 'Regulated by the FCA' doesn't mean a jot of beans
    A UK licence will allow it to hold customer deposits, opening the door to new income streams, since it can start funding own-branded loans and mortgages. However, it will also face more stringent regulations and have to guarantee customer deposits up to £85,000.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,453

    DavidL said:

    The Democrats having finally, if belatedly, bitten the bullet with Biden, attention now turns to the other senile dinosaur in the race. And Trump reacts by describing himself as a "fine and brilliant young man" to general derision:
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/crazy-town-trump-s-baffling-midnight-meltdown-leaves-everyone-confused/ar-BB1qt0iH?ocid=BingNewsSerp&cvid=3699b57ec3854adea4301e04e864bf58&ei=23

    We are going to see a lot more of this. Trump says many truly bizarre and delusional things but Biden gave him cover by consistently losing the plot. He's going to find taking on someone 19 years his junior a lot tougher, not because of anything she says or does, but because he will be far more exposed.

    I can't stand Trump, but his opponents do need to understand that sort of thing is him joking - and it's not a bad little one liner. He knows his own well-deserved reputation for braggadocio, and leans into it for comic effect. Opponents do risk appearing humourless by getting up in arms about it.
    He is good at golf for his age though.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,106

    England would have qualified for the Olympics men’s football, except for the lack of agreement over how to represent the UK when there are English, Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish teams.

    There was a UK team in 2012
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876

    Nigelb said:

    moonshine said:

    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Hadn’t seen anything of Kamala until this week. I’ve always thought she can’t be as bad as made out but never been sufficiently interested to look her up. Until now. Goodness me she’s bad.

    Grating personality, cackles at peculiar moments in interviews, gaffe prone, seems fairly awkward, shallow. How on earth have they decided it’s best to go with her rather than open the field?

    Lost in all the mania that Trump must be defeated at all costs and the haze of excitable polling, how many of her rampers are stopping to ask whether she’d be a good president? It’s quite a disastrous in-tray she’s inheriting. A structural deficit of ~7% going into what might be a fierce recession and market correction, a real rather than rhetorical Axis of Evil aligning their military industrial activities and attempting to unwind Western hegemony, and a less socially cohesive population in more than a century.

    Rather lost in all of that is the question of whether she's a better candidate than a 78-year-old felon with a history of sexual assaults, a penchant for rigging courts, a disastrous record as a President and businessman and questions to answer about a failed coup.

    Which it seems the American people so far think she might be.
    The problem with all that, is that I don’t think it easy to say Biden’s was an objectively superior presidency to Trump’s. Trump ballooned the deficit even prior to covid but Biden has taken it to new levels at a time of full employment.

    You might say that were it not for Trump killing Soleimani, the Iranian nuclear deal may have held. Maybe but that’s not verifiable. Instead we live in a world where Iran has shut the suez, is flouting sanctions to arm our enemies and has fermented a catastrophic Middle Eastern conflict.

    For all the column inches on Trump and Putin, it was under Obama and then Biden that Putin invaded Ukraine. Trump could arguably have done more after Salisbury, but credibly how could he given Europe’s position on Russia at the time?

    Jan 6th is of course the key black mark against trump and for many understandably disqualifies him on its own. But even on matters of democracy, we can’t give this government a free pass given its insidious use of censorship, and puppet-like executive for goodness knows how long.

    It’s hard to sensibly discuss these things because you get painted as a trump apologist, fascist or whatever else. But if your goal is prediction, it pays to consider whether a swing voter flips (or stays at home), because the idea of this government continuing feels in many ways less attractive to them than reverting to the one that preceded it. Kamala is the ultimate continuity candidate, given she would likely be a weak executive and keep the band more or less together.

    Obama was dead right on this. It’s a change election and they should have looked elsewhere
    (so too should the GOP of course).


    A large proportion of the Democratic 'elite' - Pelosi; Schumer; Jeffries; Obama too - wanted to "look elsewhere". They didn't explain how that might happen, and within 36 hours, Harris was the presumptive nominee.

    How do you think it could have happened ?
    The issue was the lack of candidates noticeably better than Harris. There's no one who shows any signs of leaping to 10 points clear of Trump or anything.

    Without a clearly better alternative, Harris is the obvious choice for a number of reasons.
    Sure.

    But what slightly irritates me is all the opinions on how the Democrats ought to have picked a different replacement, when no one expressing them (Obama included) has the faintest clue as to how that might have happened.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 61,539
    Good news on Braverman for me as I am pretty red on her on BF. I was reasonably sure tory mps would not risk putting her forward as one of the two for membership.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 21,922
    edited July 25
    Pulpstar said:

    DavidL said:

    The Democrats having finally, if belatedly, bitten the bullet with Biden, attention now turns to the other senile dinosaur in the race. And Trump reacts by describing himself as a "fine and brilliant young man" to general derision:
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/crazy-town-trump-s-baffling-midnight-meltdown-leaves-everyone-confused/ar-BB1qt0iH?ocid=BingNewsSerp&cvid=3699b57ec3854adea4301e04e864bf58&ei=23

    We are going to see a lot more of this. Trump says many truly bizarre and delusional things but Biden gave him cover by consistently losing the plot. He's going to find taking on someone 19 years his junior a lot tougher, not because of anything she says or does, but because he will be far more exposed.

    I can't stand Trump, but his opponents do need to understand that sort of thing is him joking - and it's not a bad little one liner. He knows his own well-deserved reputation for braggadocio, and leans into it for comic effect. Opponents do risk appearing humourless by getting up in arms about it.
    He is good at golf for his age though.
    I hope that's a quip :smile: .

    Just as owning the pageant 'allows' him to wander around inspecting the teenage girls getting dressed in the back, owning the golf-club lets him nobble the tournament - usually by creating a one man category.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 53,391

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 121,106
    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 61,539

    Nigelb said:

    moonshine said:

    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Hadn’t seen anything of Kamala until this week. I’ve always thought she can’t be as bad as made out but never been sufficiently interested to look her up. Until now. Goodness me she’s bad.

    Grating personality, cackles at peculiar moments in interviews, gaffe prone, seems fairly awkward, shallow. How on earth have they decided it’s best to go with her rather than open the field?

    Lost in all the mania that Trump must be defeated at all costs and the haze of excitable polling, how many of her rampers are stopping to ask whether she’d be a good president? It’s quite a disastrous in-tray she’s inheriting. A structural deficit of ~7% going into what might be a fierce recession and market correction, a real rather than rhetorical Axis of Evil aligning their military industrial activities and attempting to unwind Western hegemony, and a less socially cohesive population in more than a century.

    Rather lost in all of that is the question of whether she's a better candidate than a 78-year-old felon with a history of sexual assaults, a penchant for rigging courts, a disastrous record as a President and businessman and questions to answer about a failed coup.

    Which it seems the American people so far think she might be.
    The problem with all that, is that I don’t think it easy to say Biden’s was an objectively superior presidency to Trump’s. Trump ballooned the deficit even prior to covid but Biden has taken it to new levels at a time of full employment.

    You might say that were it not for Trump killing Soleimani, the Iranian nuclear deal may have held. Maybe but that’s not verifiable. Instead we live in a world where Iran has shut the suez, is flouting sanctions to arm our enemies and has fermented a catastrophic Middle Eastern conflict.

    For all the column inches on Trump and Putin, it was under Obama and then Biden that Putin invaded Ukraine. Trump could arguably have done more after Salisbury, but credibly how could he given Europe’s position on Russia at the time?

    Jan 6th is of course the key black mark against trump and for many understandably disqualifies him on its own. But even on matters of democracy, we can’t give this government a free pass given its insidious use of censorship, and puppet-like executive for goodness knows how long.

    It’s hard to sensibly discuss these things because you get painted as a trump apologist, fascist or whatever else. But if your goal is prediction, it pays to consider whether a swing voter flips (or stays at home), because the idea of this government continuing feels in many ways less attractive to them than reverting to the one that preceded it. Kamala is the ultimate continuity candidate, given she would likely be a weak executive and keep the band more or less together.

    Obama was dead right on this. It’s a change election and they should have looked elsewhere
    (so too should the GOP of course).


    A large proportion of the Democratic 'elite' - Pelosi; Schumer; Jeffries; Obama too - wanted to "look elsewhere". They didn't explain how that might happen, and within 36 hours, Harris was the presumptive nominee.

    How do you think it could have happened ?
    The issue was the lack of candidates noticeably better than Harris. There's no one who shows any signs of leaping to 10 points clear of Trump or anything.

    Without a clearly better alternative, Harris is the obvious choice for a number of reasons.
    In suspect the key candidates decided there just wasn't time to try and run. For example there was the whole funding situation.

    Better to sit this one out and see what happens for 2028.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 48,464
    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Taz said:

    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a racial nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    Approx 7.38

    GMB did the same this morning. A narrative is being built here.

    We need to know the full facts. In isolation its looks awful.
    They have provided some context.
    But it does look rather like retaliation after the subject had been subdued.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw9y2ry3dldo
    ..GMP said its officers had been called to Terminal 2 of the airport at 20:25 BST on Tuesday following reports of a fight.
    It said while trying to arrest a suspect, three of its officers were violently attacked and punched to the ground. One officer suffered a broken nose and all three needed hospital treatment.
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them," a spokesman for the force said.
    Four men were arrested at the scene for affray and assault on emergency service workers...


    I can't claim much, if any sympathy for the arrestee, but the police ought not to behave like that.
    If you violently attack an armed police officer AT AN AIRPORT you should count yourself lucky you are not shot dead, rather than merely kicked

    Indeed, Britain might be the only country where you would survive such a stupid and self destructive assault
    They should certainly look at providing better non-lethal (really semi lethal) weapons.
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405
    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Taz said:

    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a racial nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    Approx 7.38

    GMB did the same this morning. A narrative is being built here.

    We need to know the full facts. In isolation its looks awful.
    They have provided some context.
    But it does look rather like retaliation after the subject had been subdued.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw9y2ry3dldo
    ..GMP said its officers had been called to Terminal 2 of the airport at 20:25 BST on Tuesday following reports of a fight.
    It said while trying to arrest a suspect, three of its officers were violently attacked and punched to the ground. One officer suffered a broken nose and all three needed hospital treatment.
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them," a spokesman for the force said.
    Four men were arrested at the scene for affray and assault on emergency service workers...


    I can't claim much, if any sympathy for the arrestee, but the police ought not to behave like that.
    If you violently attack an armed police officer AT AN AIRPORT you should count yourself lucky you are not shot dead, rather than merely kicked

    Indeed, Britain might be the only country where you would survive such a stupid and self destructive assault
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them" ... seems to devalue the point of being a firearms officer. Like not being able to shoot from a sloping roof.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 4,777
    edited July 25
    FPT:
    Andy_JS said:

    "Kamala Harris' great-great-great-great grandfather was 'notorious' Irish slave owner who bought Jamaican plantation and travelled to London to fight abolition, historian claims"

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13662555/Kamala-Harris-great-great-great-great-grandfather-notorious-Irish-slave-owner.html

    As a good California liberal I hope she has paid substantial reparations to herself and others.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 31,412
    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    Paris and Lille are the only places I've visited in France, not including a train journey from Barcelona to Paris.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,451
    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Eroding US democracy, betraying Ukraine, enabling Putin and inflicting massive harm on fundamental UK security, defence and economic interests to wind up the lefties. What larks we will have!!

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,425
    edited July 25
    MattW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    DavidL said:

    The Democrats having finally, if belatedly, bitten the bullet with Biden, attention now turns to the other senile dinosaur in the race. And Trump reacts by describing himself as a "fine and brilliant young man" to general derision:
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/crazy-town-trump-s-baffling-midnight-meltdown-leaves-everyone-confused/ar-BB1qt0iH?ocid=BingNewsSerp&cvid=3699b57ec3854adea4301e04e864bf58&ei=23

    We are going to see a lot more of this. Trump says many truly bizarre and delusional things but Biden gave him cover by consistently losing the plot. He's going to find taking on someone 19 years his junior a lot tougher, not because of anything she says or does, but because he will be far more exposed.

    I can't stand Trump, but his opponents do need to understand that sort of thing is him joking - and it's not a bad little one liner. He knows his own well-deserved reputation for braggadocio, and leans into it for comic effect. Opponents do risk appearing humourless by getting up in arms about it.
    He is good at golf for his age though.
    I hope that's a quip :smile: .

    Just as owning the pageant 'allows' him to wander around inspecting the teenage girls getting dressed in the back, owning the golf-club lets him nobble the tournament - usually by creating a one man category.
    I watched the DeChambeau video, Trump has a nasty swing, but he can play for reals, particularly for somebody pushing 80. I think his biglyness at golf is probably on the lesser side of his bullshitery.
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Taz said:

    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a racial nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    Approx 7.38

    GMB did the same this morning. A narrative is being built here.

    We need to know the full facts. In isolation its looks awful.
    They have provided some context.
    But it does look rather like retaliation after the subject had been subdued.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw9y2ry3dldo
    ..GMP said its officers had been called to Terminal 2 of the airport at 20:25 BST on Tuesday following reports of a fight.
    It said while trying to arrest a suspect, three of its officers were violently attacked and punched to the ground. One officer suffered a broken nose and all three needed hospital treatment.
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them," a spokesman for the force said.
    Four men were arrested at the scene for affray and assault on emergency service workers...


    I can't claim much, if any sympathy for the arrestee, but the police ought not to behave like that.
    If you violently attack an armed police officer AT AN AIRPORT you should count yourself lucky you are not shot dead, rather than merely kicked

    Indeed, Britain might be the only country where you would survive such a stupid and self destructive assault
    They should certainly look at providing better non-lethal (really semi lethal) weapons.
    Australia has yet to try the cop who tasered to death a demented 95 year old woman.

    I have a lot of sympathy for him. Dementia is dementia and a steak knife is a steak knife.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 48,464

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Taz said:

    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a racial nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    Approx 7.38

    GMB did the same this morning. A narrative is being built here.

    We need to know the full facts. In isolation its looks awful.
    They have provided some context.
    But it does look rather like retaliation after the subject had been subdued.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw9y2ry3dldo
    ..GMP said its officers had been called to Terminal 2 of the airport at 20:25 BST on Tuesday following reports of a fight.
    It said while trying to arrest a suspect, three of its officers were violently attacked and punched to the ground. One officer suffered a broken nose and all three needed hospital treatment.
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them," a spokesman for the force said.
    Four men were arrested at the scene for affray and assault on emergency service workers...


    I can't claim much, if any sympathy for the arrestee, but the police ought not to behave like that.
    If you violently attack an armed police officer AT AN AIRPORT you should count yourself lucky you are not shot dead, rather than merely kicked

    Indeed, Britain might be the only country where you would survive such a stupid and self destructive assault
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them" ... seems to devalue the point of being a firearms officer. Like not being able to shoot from a sloping roof.
    There are various devices used by police officers in other countries, to prevent weapons being snatched from them. Don't the UK armed police have them?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 80,425
    edited July 25
    Tagging all historical structures in sight will definitely win over people to your cause...

    https://twitter.com/Osint613/status/1816206347970699264
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 31,412
    This still looks pretty encouraging for Harris at this early stage.

    Winning party, BE

    Rep 1.64
    Dem 2.64

    https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/politics/market/1.178176964
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,251
    HYUFD said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
    I agree with you: I don't think Kelly would hold AZ for Harris, but I do think Shapiro wins Pennsylvania.

    And Pennsylvania is a big state; it means that Trump has to nearly sweep the board of the other in play states.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,251
    Andy_JS said:

    This still looks pretty encouraging for Harris at this early stage.

    Winning party, BE

    Rep 1.64
    Dem 2.64

    https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/politics/market/1.178176964

    Those odds feel broadly right: DJT as favorite, but not an overwhelming one.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 53,410

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Taz said:

    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a racial nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    Approx 7.38

    GMB did the same this morning. A narrative is being built here.

    We need to know the full facts. In isolation its looks awful.
    They have provided some context.
    But it does look rather like retaliation after the subject had been subdued.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw9y2ry3dldo
    ..GMP said its officers had been called to Terminal 2 of the airport at 20:25 BST on Tuesday following reports of a fight.
    It said while trying to arrest a suspect, three of its officers were violently attacked and punched to the ground. One officer suffered a broken nose and all three needed hospital treatment.
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them," a spokesman for the force said.
    Four men were arrested at the scene for affray and assault on emergency service workers...


    I can't claim much, if any sympathy for the arrestee, but the police ought not to behave like that.
    If you violently attack an armed police officer AT AN AIRPORT you should count yourself lucky you are not shot dead, rather than merely kicked

    Indeed, Britain might be the only country where you would survive such a stupid and self destructive assault
    They should certainly look at providing better non-lethal (really semi lethal) weapons.
    Presumably the armed police still have the option of using a baton or a pepper spray, as well as the firearm?

    The perps can still consider themselves bloody lucky not to be shot, well done to the police involved for their restraint.
  • Fishing said:

    FPT:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Kamala Harris' great-great-great-great grandfather was 'notorious' Irish slave owner who bought Jamaican plantation and travelled to London to fight abolition, historian claims"

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13662555/Kamala-Harris-great-great-great-great-grandfather-notorious-Irish-slave-owner.html

    As a good California liberal I hope she has paid substantial reparations to herself and others.
    Have you stopped to consider briefly the circumstances that are likely to have led to a black woman being the great great great great grandaughter of a slave owner, and the extent to which her great great great great grandmother was likely to have had a say in the matter?

    Pillock.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876
    .
    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    England is around 130k square km; Metropolitan France around 550k.
    That's half of the answer, I think ?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,251
    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    Your daughter has clearly never woken up hungover in Bedford to grey drizzle.
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Taz said:

    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a racial nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    Approx 7.38

    GMB did the same this morning. A narrative is being built here.

    We need to know the full facts. In isolation its looks awful.
    They have provided some context.
    But it does look rather like retaliation after the subject had been subdued.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw9y2ry3dldo
    ..GMP said its officers had been called to Terminal 2 of the airport at 20:25 BST on Tuesday following reports of a fight.
    It said while trying to arrest a suspect, three of its officers were violently attacked and punched to the ground. One officer suffered a broken nose and all three needed hospital treatment.
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them," a spokesman for the force said.
    Four men were arrested at the scene for affray and assault on emergency service workers...


    I can't claim much, if any sympathy for the arrestee, but the police ought not to behave like that.
    If you violently attack an armed police officer AT AN AIRPORT you should count yourself lucky you are not shot dead, rather than merely kicked

    Indeed, Britain might be the only country where you would survive such a stupid and self destructive assault
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them" ... seems to devalue the point of being a firearms officer. Like not being able to shoot from a sloping roof.
    There are various devices used by police officers in other countries, to prevent weapons being snatched from them. Don't the UK armed police have them?
    I was thinking that but a lanyard long enough to make the gun usable is long enough to turn it on its owner

    They should have those weapons which recognise the owner's DNA and don't work for other people. I know they exist because I read lots of sci fi.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 53,410
    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    You’re taking her to the Olympics?

    There’s women’s football and handball on today, as well as men’s rugby 7s.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876
    rcs1000 said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    On paper, it's very close, with only two of those (AZ and NV) being highly likely to flip, while GA is leans Republican.

    I would make the Democrats the very narrow favorite in PA, MI and WI.

    So, I'm going with my call of "Trump favorite, but it's still anyone's game."

    It is - but I'm going with 'let's see what the polls say next week'.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,251

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Taz said:

    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a racial nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    Approx 7.38

    GMB did the same this morning. A narrative is being built here.

    We need to know the full facts. In isolation its looks awful.
    They have provided some context.
    But it does look rather like retaliation after the subject had been subdued.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw9y2ry3dldo
    ..GMP said its officers had been called to Terminal 2 of the airport at 20:25 BST on Tuesday following reports of a fight.
    It said while trying to arrest a suspect, three of its officers were violently attacked and punched to the ground. One officer suffered a broken nose and all three needed hospital treatment.
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them," a spokesman for the force said.
    Four men were arrested at the scene for affray and assault on emergency service workers...


    I can't claim much, if any sympathy for the arrestee, but the police ought not to behave like that.
    If you violently attack an armed police officer AT AN AIRPORT you should count yourself lucky you are not shot dead, rather than merely kicked

    Indeed, Britain might be the only country where you would survive such a stupid and self destructive assault
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them" ... seems to devalue the point of being a firearms officer. Like not being able to shoot from a sloping roof.
    There are various devices used by police officers in other countries, to prevent weapons being snatched from them. Don't the UK armed police have them?
    I was thinking that but a lanyard long enough to make the gun usable is long enough to turn it on its owner

    They should have those weapons which recognise the owner's DNA and don't work for other people. I know they exist because I read lots of sci fi.
    Bah, all you need is some kind of palm print reader, then you get less of a random killing machine, more of a personal statement.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,534
    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    ydoethur said:

    moonshine said:

    Hadn’t seen anything of Kamala until this week. I’ve always thought she can’t be as bad as made out but never been sufficiently interested to look her up. Until now. Goodness me she’s bad.

    Grating personality, cackles at peculiar moments in interviews, gaffe prone, seems fairly awkward, shallow. How on earth have they decided it’s best to go with her rather than open the field?

    Lost in all the mania that Trump must be defeated at all costs and the haze of excitable polling, how many of her rampers are stopping to ask whether she’d be a good president? It’s quite a disastrous in-tray she’s inheriting. A structural deficit of ~7% going into what might be a fierce recession and market correction, a real rather than rhetorical Axis of Evil aligning their military industrial activities and attempting to unwind Western hegemony, and a less socially cohesive population in more than a century.

    Rather lost in all of that is the question of whether she's a better candidate than a 78-year-old felon with a history of sexual assaults, a penchant for rigging courts, a disastrous record as a President and businessman and questions to answer about a failed coup.

    Which it seems the American people so far think she might be.
    The problem with all that, is that I don’t think it easy to say Biden’s was an objectively superior presidency to Trump’s. Trump ballooned the deficit even prior to covid but Biden has taken it to new levels at a time of full employment.

    You might say that were it not for Trump killing Soleimani, the Iranian nuclear deal may have held. Maybe but that’s not verifiable. Instead we live in a world where Iran has shut the suez, is flouting sanctions to arm our enemies and has fermented a catastrophic Middle Eastern conflict.

    For all the column inches on Trump and Putin, it was under Obama and then Biden that Putin invaded Ukraine. Trump could arguably have done more after Salisbury, but credibly how could he given Europe’s position on Russia at the time?

    Jan 6th is of course the key black mark against trump and for many understandably disqualifies him on its own. But even on matters of democracy, we can’t give this government a free pass given its insidious use of censorship, and puppet-like executive for goodness knows how long.

    It’s hard to sensibly discuss these things because you get painted as a trump apologist, fascist or whatever else. But if your goal is prediction, it pays to consider whether a swing voter flips (or stays at home), because the idea of this government continuing feels in many ways less attractive to them than reverting to the one that preceded it. Kamala is the ultimate continuity candidate, given she would likely be a weak executive and keep the band more or less together.

    Obama was dead right on this. It’s a change election and they should have looked elsewhere
    (so too should the GOP of course).


    Again, you’re missing the point. If Trump is the candidate it won’t be a change election.

    We keep seeing this claim about Ukraine. But it’s bollocks. It was Trump’s foreign policy, particularly his isolationism and the fact Biden was unable to overtly reverse it, that led Putin to think it would be feasible. It is Trump’s ongoing efforts to stymie aid to Ukraine that means the war is still going on.

    And any actions committed by Iran and their proxies, read Russia. Whom Trump wants to work with. (They haven’t shut the Suez Canal although traffic has dropped.)

    The deficit is a black mark, but much is to do with trying to sort out the problems Trump left, and he’s proposing actions to make it worse.

    If you fear coming across as a Trump apologist, maybe don’t write apologias for him?
    Trump as the motivation of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine? Not Obama’s “red lines”, or Biden’s “it depends what sort of invasion”?

    Don’t overlook too Biden’s withholding of key pieces of kit at crucial times, the lapsing of Lend Lease unused, restrictive rules of engagement.

    And ultimately there would have been no second invasion if in autumn 2021, Biden had firmly said the US unreservedly stands by its Budapest Memorandum commitments and sent a squadron of jets to Ukrainian soil.

    Trump wouldn’t have done that either of course but it’s unknowable whether Putin would have amassed his army on the border with trump in place. Don’t too overlook that Trump was one of the few world leaders pointing out the danger of Germany’s energy dependency on Russia.

    Take the emotive figure of trump out of the equation, it’s really been a catastrophic 4 years of American leadership. And for many Americans, the issues that trump makes you emotive over don’t stick. They don’t care about Slavs fighting in the Donbass, so what if abortion laws get set at state level, the supreme courts have always been politicised, rather a bastard in charge than a weak willed committee etc… they also don’t feel the economic benefit from the supposed Biden jobs miracle (which might soon come crashing down anyway).

    Ps
    On the Suez, it is as close as can be reasonably said to be to shut to western traffic, particularly container. Saudi and “Indian” crude vessels still
    go through unimpeded.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,023

    HYUFD said:

    England would have qualified for the Olympics men’s football, except for the lack of agreement over how to represent the UK when there are English, Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish teams.

    There was a UK team in 2012
    There was a one-off fudge that was just about acceptable to the FA, which is terrified that the emergence of a UK national side would mean an end to the racket that enables us to send four separate teams to international competitions.

    Four teams means of course four sets of hangers-on, timeservers, unnecessary officials and gravy train deals, so you see the problem.
    Is it a racket? San Marino, Liechtenstein and Gibraltar, now there's a racket.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876
    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
    I agree with you: I don't think Kelly would hold AZ for Harris, but I do think Shapiro wins Pennsylvania.

    And Pennsylvania is a big state; it means that Trump has to nearly sweep the board of the other in play states.
    Do you think Shapiro will make all the difference between her taking, or not taking PA ?
    I'm still unconvinced by that kind of argument.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876

    Fishing said:

    FPT:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Kamala Harris' great-great-great-great grandfather was 'notorious' Irish slave owner who bought Jamaican plantation and travelled to London to fight abolition, historian claims"

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13662555/Kamala-Harris-great-great-great-great-grandfather-notorious-Irish-slave-owner.html

    As a good California liberal I hope she has paid substantial reparations to herself and others.
    Have you stopped to consider briefly the circumstances that are likely to have led to a black woman being the great great great great grandaughter of a slave owner, and the extent to which her great great great great grandmother was likely to have had a say in the matter?
    By his own words, Fishing is a good California liberal, so I'm sure he has.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,522
    edited July 25
    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Taz said:

    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a racial nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    Approx 7.38

    GMB did the same this morning. A narrative is being built here.

    We need to know the full facts. In isolation its looks awful.
    They have provided some context.
    But it does look rather like retaliation after the subject had been subdued.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw9y2ry3dldo
    ..GMP said its officers had been called to Terminal 2 of the airport at 20:25 BST on Tuesday following reports of a fight.
    It said while trying to arrest a suspect, three of its officers were violently attacked and punched to the ground. One officer suffered a broken nose and all three needed hospital treatment.
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them," a spokesman for the force said.
    Four men were arrested at the scene for affray and assault on emergency service workers...


    I can't claim much, if any sympathy for the arrestee, but the police ought not to behave like that.
    If you violently attack an armed police officer AT AN AIRPORT you should count yourself lucky you are not shot dead, rather than merely kicked

    Indeed, Britain might be the only country where you would survive such a stupid and self destructive assault
    They should certainly look at providing better non-lethal (really semi lethal) weapons.
    Presumably the armed police still have the option of using a baton or a pepper spray, as well as the firearm?

    The perps can still consider themselves bloody lucky not to be shot, well done to the police involved for their restraint.
    Phew, just think how bad things could have got if the officer booting and stamping on a prone suspect’s head hadn’t shown restraint.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876
    edited July 25
    Had a small bet on Hamilton being fastest in FP1 at Spa (at 9/1 looks the best value of the top drivers).
    The track ought to suit the improved Mercedes.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 53,391
    Nigelb said:

    .

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    England is around 130k square km; Metropolitan France around 550k.
    That's half of the answer, I think ?
    Yes. Plus the Industrial Revolution. Plus the Luftwaffe

    But we have done an awful lot of it to ourselves. Far too much immigration adding to the overcrowding. Hideous post war architecture now compounded by hideous new town red brick Barratt home horrors. An apparent inability to make town centres “nice”.

    Also an absurd political aversion to rebuilding bombed towns because “that’s pastiche”. Yet the French did it in st Malo and the poles in Warsaw and now we marvel at how beautiful they are

    Britain has been governed by cretins (of all stripes) since about 1910
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,124
    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    (At approx 7.38)

    Perhaps one side-effect of the BBC's forced move to Manchester is that staff at this northern outpost take provincial news more seriously.
  • MuesliMuesli Posts: 202
    FF43 said:

    None of the candidates for leadership of the Conservative Party are being sensible. I hope whoever gets selected is a little bit serious once in post. I don't think the Party realises just what a bad place it's in. It can definitely can go backwards in 2029, compared with the 2024 disaster.

    Tugendhat’s leadership pitch in the Telegraph is a real disappointment for those of us who believe our democracy works best with sensible, credible leadership of the main opposition party.

    One could hope that he’s just doing a Starmer by showing a bit of leg to his party’s wingnuts to get their support before kicking them to the kerb when becoming leader but it’s just so transparently desperate… and I find it difficult to believe that those looking for an authentic anti-ECHR, climate change denying transphobe won’t go for one of the other options on offer instead.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,451
    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”

    Did you explain the French surrender in 1940 and the Vichy regime to your daughter?

  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,342
    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
    I agree with you: I don't think Kelly would hold AZ for Harris, but I do think Shapiro wins Pennsylvania.

    And Pennsylvania is a big state; it means that Trump has to nearly sweep the board of the other in play states.
    Pennsylvania has basically taken over from Ohio and Florida as the swing state. It is very difficult to see a Harris win without it.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876
    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    England is around 130k square km; Metropolitan France around 550k.
    That's half of the answer, I think ?
    Yes. Plus the Industrial Revolution. Plus the Luftwaffe

    But we have done an awful lot of it to ourselves. Far too much immigration adding to the overcrowding. Hideous post war architecture now compounded by hideous new town red brick Barratt home horrors. An apparent inability to make town centres “nice”.

    Also an absurd political aversion to rebuilding bombed towns because “that’s pastiche”. Yet the French did it in st Malo and the poles in Warsaw and now we marvel at how beautiful they are

    Britain has been governed by cretins (of all stripes) since about 1910
    Postwar town planning was awful, and has never really been corrected.
    There's also British weather; bright sunshine makes anywhere look at least 2x nicer.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,124
    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    The trouble is that while overseas investment is to be welcomed, a bunch of foreigners buying up our productive assets and exporting dividends, intellectual property and jobs is ruinous in the long term. And that is what has happened in recent years, and is likely to continue.
  • franklynfranklyn Posts: 318
    I am not a Conservative voter under normal circumstances, although I have voted for them in the past, very much as a personal vote for our former, and much missed, MP, Alistair Burt.

    I am delighted by the chaos of the Conservative leadership battle; whoever is chosen seems destined to lead the Conservatives into oblivion, which is what they deserve, having trashed the country for 14 years. I am sure that the Lib Dems will provide a very adequate opposition.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,342
    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
    I agree with you: I don't think Kelly would hold AZ for Harris, but I do think Shapiro wins Pennsylvania.

    And Pennsylvania is a big state; it means that Trump has to nearly sweep the board of the other in play states.
    Do you think Shapiro will make all the difference between her taking, or not taking PA ?
    I'm still unconvinced by that kind of argument.
    I think the last VP that managed to deliver their state in a close election was LBJ in 1960. A lot of VPs have disappointed since then.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,522

    Fishing said:

    FPT:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Kamala Harris' great-great-great-great grandfather was 'notorious' Irish slave owner who bought Jamaican plantation and travelled to London to fight abolition, historian claims"

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13662555/Kamala-Harris-great-great-great-great-grandfather-notorious-Irish-slave-owner.html

    As a good California liberal I hope she has paid substantial reparations to herself and others.
    Have you stopped to consider briefly the circumstances that are likely to have led to a black woman being the great great great great grandaughter of a slave owner, and the extent to which her great great great great grandmother was likely to have had a say in the matter?

    Pillock.
    Of course the only person in this anecdote likely to have been paid actual reparations would be Kamala’s great-great-great-great grandfather. I’d be very surprised if any of that wealth had come down to KH through the generations.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 48,464
    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Taz said:

    Roger said:

    Interesting interview with an ex chief constable of the Met putting the boot into the Manchester police and seeming to be trying to create a racial nasty racial incident. What are the BBC up to?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

    Approx 7.38

    GMB did the same this morning. A narrative is being built here.

    We need to know the full facts. In isolation its looks awful.
    They have provided some context.
    But it does look rather like retaliation after the subject had been subdued.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw9y2ry3dldo
    ..GMP said its officers had been called to Terminal 2 of the airport at 20:25 BST on Tuesday following reports of a fight.
    It said while trying to arrest a suspect, three of its officers were violently attacked and punched to the ground. One officer suffered a broken nose and all three needed hospital treatment.
    "As the attending officers were firearms officers, there was a clear risk during this assault of their firearms being taken from them," a spokesman for the force said.
    Four men were arrested at the scene for affray and assault on emergency service workers...


    I can't claim much, if any sympathy for the arrestee, but the police ought not to behave like that.
    If you violently attack an armed police officer AT AN AIRPORT you should count yourself lucky you are not shot dead, rather than merely kicked

    Indeed, Britain might be the only country where you would survive such a stupid and self destructive assault
    They should certainly look at providing better non-lethal (really semi lethal) weapons.
    Presumably the armed police still have the option of using a baton or a pepper spray, as well as the firearm?

    The perps can still consider themselves bloody lucky not to be shot, well done to the police involved for their restraint.
    The pepper spray is often ineffective against the truly raged up.

    The shotgun delivered taser rounds are effective apparently. But after the Raul Scroat comedy, no one in the UK wants to supply to them to the police.
  • xyzxyzxyzxyzxyzxyz Posts: 44
    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    England is around 130k square km; Metropolitan France around 550k.
    That's half of the answer, I think ?
    Yes. Plus the Industrial Revolution. Plus the Luftwaffe

    But we have done an awful lot of it to ourselves. Far too much immigration adding to the overcrowding. Hideous post war architecture now compounded by hideous new town red brick Barratt home horrors. An apparent inability to make town centres “nice”.

    Also an absurd political aversion to rebuilding bombed towns because “that’s pastiche”. Yet the French did it in st Malo and the poles in Warsaw and now we marvel at how beautiful they are

    Britain has been governed by cretins (of all stripes) since about 1910
    Residents of this modernist Paris suburb rejected the communist local authority in 1979, replacing them with a Republican administration who beautified the area.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfonhlM6I7w
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,534
    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
    I agree with you: I don't think Kelly would hold AZ for Harris, but I do think Shapiro wins Pennsylvania.

    And Pennsylvania is a big state; it means that Trump has to nearly sweep the board of the other in play states.
    Pennsylvania has basically taken over from Ohio and Florida as the swing state. It is very difficult to see a Harris win without it.
    What issue will most vex a swing voter in Pennsylvania two months from now? Or rather, make them turn out rather than sit at home.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677
    Muesli said:

    FF43 said:

    None of the candidates for leadership of the Conservative Party are being sensible. I hope whoever gets selected is a little bit serious once in post. I don't think the Party realises just what a bad place it's in. It can definitely can go backwards in 2029, compared with the 2024 disaster.

    Tugendhat’s leadership pitch in the Telegraph is a real disappointment for those of us who believe our democracy works best with sensible, credible leadership of the main opposition party.

    One could hope that he’s just doing a Starmer by showing a bit of leg to his party’s wingnuts to get their support before kicking them to the kerb when becoming leader but it’s just so transparently desperate… and I find it difficult to believe that those looking for an authentic anti-ECHR, climate change denying transphobe won’t go for one of the other options on offer instead.
    The Glennesque conversion of Tommy Tugz from the Remainer's Remainer to let's wipe our arses on the ECHR is truly something to behold.

    Do tories really think that another, lesser brexit is the answer to their problems? The first one was fucking shit and everyone either hates us for doing it or are not remotely grateful for it so let's do another one.

    What a pack of deluded ****s they are.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 61,539
    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
    I agree with you: I don't think Kelly would hold AZ for Harris, but I do think Shapiro wins Pennsylvania.

    And Pennsylvania is a big state; it means that Trump has to nearly sweep the board of the other in play states.
    Pennsylvania has basically taken over from Ohio and Florida as the swing state. It is very difficult to see a Harris win without it.
    NH seems to also be in the mix this time around.
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”

    Did you explain the French surrender in 1940 and the Vichy regime to your daughter?

    That's vile, actually, and anyone with such a misunderstanding of history should mark their own citizenship test a fail and voluntarily relocate to Rwanda. The surrender monkeys of 1940 were the Belgians (see a well known address to HoC by Churchill, W for details); the French hung in there while we did our run away monkey thing. And you think we wouldn't have had a Vichy? The English channel is a good thing but doesn't confer moral superiority.
  • TazTaz Posts: 13,670

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    The trouble is that while overseas investment is to be welcomed, a bunch of foreigners buying up our productive assets and exporting dividends, intellectual property and jobs is ruinous in the long term. And that is what has happened in recent years, and is likely to continue.
    If we don't value these businesses, as we have not, then that will happen given how undervalued they have been.
  • TazTaz Posts: 13,670

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    The trouble is that while overseas investment is to be welcomed, a bunch of foreigners buying up our productive assets and exporting dividends, intellectual property and jobs is ruinous in the long term. And that is what has happened in recent years, and is likely to continue.
    If we don't value these businesses, as we have not, then that will happen given how undervalued they have been.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,342

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
    I agree with you: I don't think Kelly would hold AZ for Harris, but I do think Shapiro wins Pennsylvania.

    And Pennsylvania is a big state; it means that Trump has to nearly sweep the board of the other in play states.
    Pennsylvania has basically taken over from Ohio and Florida as the swing state. It is very difficult to see a Harris win without it.
    NH seems to also be in the mix this time around.
    Its been a fairly reliable blue state for a while now. The last republican to win it was GWB in 2000. Even Hilary won it in a losing cause. I would be reasonably confident that it will be in the blue column at the end of the day.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 53,410

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    The trouble is that while overseas investment is to be welcomed, a bunch of foreigners buying up our productive assets and exporting dividends, intellectual property and jobs is ruinous in the long term. And that is what has happened in recent years, and is likely to continue.
    Well unless we all stop buying Chinese tat and German cars, and stop spending so much on foreign holidays, the balance of payments has to balance somehow.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 61,539
    Biased but amusing...


    Ian Dunt
    @IanDunt
    ·
    22m
    The Tory leadership contest this summer is going to be a delight. Just the dumbest most dreadful people saying the dumbest most dreadful things. But this time, none of it will matter. It'll be of no pertinence whatsoever. A shrivelled balloon, slowly deflating in an empty room.

    https://x.com/IanDunt
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 53,410
    Nigelb said:

    Had a small bet on Hamilton being fastest in FP1 at Spa (at 9/1 looks the best value of the top drivers).
    The track ought to suit the improved Mercedes.

    Although anything can happen with the weather at Spa. Fingers crossed for no serious delays or cancellations during the weekend.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,101
    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
    I agree with you: I don't think Kelly would hold AZ for Harris, but I do think Shapiro wins Pennsylvania.

    And Pennsylvania is a big state; it means that Trump has to nearly sweep the board of the other in play states.
    Do you think Shapiro will make all the difference between her taking, or not taking PA ?
    I'm still unconvinced by that kind of argument.
    I think the last VP that managed to deliver their state in a close election was LBJ in 1960. A lot of VPs have disappointed since then.
    Romney chose Paul Ryan as his running mate so he could deliver Wisconsin. He didn't.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 53,410

    Biased but amusing...


    Ian Dunt
    @IanDunt
    ·
    22m
    The Tory leadership contest this summer is going to be a delight. Just the dumbest most dreadful people saying the dumbest most dreadful things. But this time, none of it will matter. It'll be of no pertinence whatsoever. A shrivelled balloon, slowly deflating in an empty room.

    https://x.com/IanDunt

    Perhaps the famous BBC mispronunciation should apply to this guy’s surname as well?
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,235
    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    England is around 130k square km; Metropolitan France around 550k.
    That's half of the answer, I think ?
    Yes. Plus the Industrial Revolution. Plus the Luftwaffe

    But we have done an awful lot of it to ourselves. Far too much immigration adding to the overcrowding. Hideous post war architecture now compounded by hideous new town red brick Barratt home horrors. An apparent inability to make town centres “nice”.

    Also an absurd political aversion to rebuilding bombed towns because “that’s pastiche”. Yet the French did it in st Malo and the poles in Warsaw and now we marvel at how beautiful they are

    Britain has been governed by cretins (of all stripes) since about 1910
    It was the industrial revolution which created the wealth that led to Victorian town halls, market places, museums and banks being built.

    All those greco-roman style civic buildings which still look impressive in town centres.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 16,603
    Muesli said:

    FF43 said:

    None of the candidates for leadership of the Conservative Party are being sensible. I hope whoever gets selected is a little bit serious once in post. I don't think the Party realises just what a bad place it's in. It can definitely can go backwards in 2029, compared with the 2024 disaster.

    Tugendhat’s leadership pitch in the Telegraph is a real disappointment for those of us who believe our democracy works best with sensible, credible leadership of the main opposition party.

    One could hope that he’s just doing a Starmer by showing a bit of leg to his party’s wingnuts to get their support before kicking them to the kerb when becoming leader but it’s just so transparently desperate… and I find it difficult to believe that those looking for an authentic anti-ECHR, climate change denying transphobe won’t go for one of the other options on offer instead.
    Not just that.

    Starmer was able to pull the switcheroo on his party because it's not easy to depose a Labour leader. A Conservative leader trying the same scam would be much more vulnerable when things went wrong. Bob Blackman's letterbox does not need to be big.

    A Conservative leader is only going to be able to change the party if it wants to change. That might take a defeat or two more.
  • TazTaz Posts: 13,670
    Dura_Ace said:

    Muesli said:

    FF43 said:

    None of the candidates for leadership of the Conservative Party are being sensible. I hope whoever gets selected is a little bit serious once in post. I don't think the Party realises just what a bad place it's in. It can definitely can go backwards in 2029, compared with the 2024 disaster.

    Tugendhat’s leadership pitch in the Telegraph is a real disappointment for those of us who believe our democracy works best with sensible, credible leadership of the main opposition party.

    One could hope that he’s just doing a Starmer by showing a bit of leg to his party’s wingnuts to get their support before kicking them to the kerb when becoming leader but it’s just so transparently desperate… and I find it difficult to believe that those looking for an authentic anti-ECHR, climate change denying transphobe won’t go for one of the other options on offer instead.
    The Glennesque conversion of Tommy Tugz from the Remainer's Remainer to let's wipe our arses on the ECHR is truly something to behold.

    Do tories really think that another, lesser brexit is the answer to their problems? The first one was fucking shit and everyone either hates us for doing it or are not remotely grateful for it so let's do another one.

    What a pack of deluded ****s they are.
    They're fighting yesterdays battles if they think this is a vote winner with the public.

    I suspect TT knows that and this is purely to get votes from the members as it is caveated.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,101
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    The trouble is that while overseas investment is to be welcomed, a bunch of foreigners buying up our productive assets and exporting dividends, intellectual property and jobs is ruinous in the long term. And that is what has happened in recent years, and is likely to continue.
    If we don't value these businesses, as we have not, then that will happen given how undervalued they have been.
    Then we should just stop selling them to foreigners and limit the buyers to Brits. 😃
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 68,876
    This remains the best pair of opinions to be expressed about Harris.
    https://x.com/nycsouthpaw/status/1816199001688965381
  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,710
    franklyn said:

    I am not a Conservative voter under normal circumstances, although I have voted for them in the past, very much as a personal vote for our former, and much missed, MP, Alistair Burt.

    I am delighted by the chaos of the Conservative leadership battle; whoever is chosen seems destined to lead the Conservatives into oblivion, which is what they deserve, having trashed the country for 14 years. I am sure that the Lib Dems will provide a very adequate opposition.

    The Lib Dems, of course, were in government for five of the last 14 years.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,659
    Morning all :)

    I've no particular regard for Tugendhat (indeed, I don't think anything of him at all, he's a complete vacuum) but at least he's recognised the most important adage in politics (known as Stodge's Second Law) - if you want to win an election find out who the electorate is first.

    He has to win both among the MPs and the membership and whatever he (and indeed any of the other candidates) say between now and October is purely for their benefit, not mine or indeed not anyone who voted Conservative in July but who isn't a member.

    All this leaving the ECHR nonsense will be forgotten IF he wins and IF he achieves a modicum of success. The Conservatives have three targets which may be mutually exclusive - the Reform vote, the Labour/LD/Green vote and those who didn't vote three weeks ago.

    The messages to these three disparate groups will and indeed have to be very different.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,342
    moonshine said:

    DavidL said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
    I agree with you: I don't think Kelly would hold AZ for Harris, but I do think Shapiro wins Pennsylvania.

    And Pennsylvania is a big state; it means that Trump has to nearly sweep the board of the other in play states.
    Pennsylvania has basically taken over from Ohio and Florida as the swing state. It is very difficult to see a Harris win without it.
    What issue will most vex a swing voter in Pennsylvania two months from now? Or rather, make them turn out rather than sit at home.
    I don't know. It has done reasonably well, if not spectacularly, economically over the last few years. They currently have abortion to 24 weeks but do not allow state dollars to pay for it. Shapiro has been looking to change that by providing funding to the less well off. I suspect that will be a major dividing line, and not just in Penn.

    I have only been there once and it was quite a long time ago. It seemed a very prosperous place to me then. Some excellent micro breweries as I recall.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,235
    viewcode said:

    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    DJT needs to win any four out of NV, AZ, WI, MI, PA and GA.

    It's hard to see KH stopping that. On paper, she's got no fucking chance but she might able to save one of them with a shewd Veep pick.

    Trump 47 will be a mega LOL, so at least we can enjoy that once the Centrist Dads get over being dickhurt.

    Hence Harris should pick Shapiro the Pennsylvania governor and then Trump has to win Arizona, Nevada, Wisconsin and one of Michigan or Georgia if she holds Pennsylvania
    I agree with you: I don't think Kelly would hold AZ for Harris, but I do think Shapiro wins Pennsylvania.

    And Pennsylvania is a big state; it means that Trump has to nearly sweep the board of the other in play states.
    Do you think Shapiro will make all the difference between her taking, or not taking PA ?
    I'm still unconvinced by that kind of argument.
    I think the last VP that managed to deliver their state in a close election was LBJ in 1960. A lot of VPs have disappointed since then.
    Romney chose Paul Ryan as his running mate so he could deliver Wisconsin. He didn't.
    The Dem margin in WI fell from 14% in 2008 to 7% in 2012.

    So quite a swing.

    A good VP pick might have a home state factor of a few percent but likely less so as partisanship increases.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,659
    Driver said:

    franklyn said:

    I am not a Conservative voter under normal circumstances, although I have voted for them in the past, very much as a personal vote for our former, and much missed, MP, Alistair Burt.

    I am delighted by the chaos of the Conservative leadership battle; whoever is chosen seems destined to lead the Conservatives into oblivion, which is what they deserve, having trashed the country for 14 years. I am sure that the Lib Dems will provide a very adequate opposition.

    The Lib Dems, of course, were in government for five of the last 14 years.
    Nearly a decade ago as the junior partner, my friend.

    Don't forget they were also in Government in the 1970s as well so basically the natural party of Government.

    Seriously, so much has happened since Cameron made that foolish pledge to win himself a majority and yet you mention ancient history...
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,932

    HYUFD said:

    England would have qualified for the Olympics men’s football, except for the lack of agreement over how to represent the UK when there are English, Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish teams.

    There was a UK team in 2012
    There was a one-off fudge that was just about acceptable to the FA, which is terrified that the emergence of a UK national side would mean an end to the racket that enables us to send four separate teams to international competitions.

    Four teams means of course four sets of hangers-on, timeservers, unnecessary officials and gravy train deals, so you see the problem.
    Are not the Welsh FA, the Scottish FA and the NI FA independent bodies? Why should the FA care?
  • Sandpit said:

    Biased but amusing...


    Ian Dunt
    @IanDunt
    ·
    22m
    The Tory leadership contest this summer is going to be a delight. Just the dumbest most dreadful people saying the dumbest most dreadful things. But this time, none of it will matter. It'll be of no pertinence whatsoever. A shrivelled balloon, slowly deflating in an empty room.

    https://x.com/IanDunt

    Perhaps the famous BBC mispronunciation should apply to this guy’s surname as well?
    Scottandpaste constantly spamming with pictures of that c**ts tweets was a big reason I left back in 2016. The one a day piccy limit is a great improvement.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,077

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    England is around 130k square km; Metropolitan France around 550k.
    That's half of the answer, I think ?
    Yes. Plus the Industrial Revolution. Plus the Luftwaffe

    But we have done an awful lot of it to ourselves. Far too much immigration adding to the overcrowding. Hideous post war architecture now compounded by hideous new town red brick Barratt home horrors. An apparent inability to make town centres “nice”.

    Also an absurd political aversion to rebuilding bombed towns because “that’s pastiche”. Yet the French did it in st Malo and the poles in Warsaw and now we marvel at how beautiful they are

    Britain has been governed by cretins (of all stripes) since about 1910
    It was the industrial revolution which created the wealth that led to Victorian town halls, market places, museums and banks being built.

    All those greco-roman style civic buildings which still look impressive in town centres.
    Very true. Look at pictures of industrial revolution cities like Manchester or Leeds from the Edwardian era. A beautiful, fine, coherent streetscape. No plate glass windows at street level, no roll shutters, almost no graffiti or litter.

    Mind you, some of the housing stock was hideous. We venerate Victorian terraces because it's the better ones which remain: many lived in truly awful conditions.

    Eeven there, though, a mixed picture: this photo from Halifax in 1965 is currently doing the rounds. Yes, the women look prematurely old and haggard (this goes back to a conversation we had on here the other day). But marvel at how clean everything is.

  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,932

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”

    Did you explain the French surrender in 1940 and the Vichy regime to your daughter?

    That's vile, actually, and anyone with such a misunderstanding of history should mark their own citizenship test a fail and voluntarily relocate to Rwanda. The surrender monkeys of 1940 were the Belgians (see a well known address to HoC by Churchill, W for details); the French hung in there while we did our run away monkey thing. And you think we wouldn't have had a Vichy? The English channel is a good thing but doesn't confer moral superiority.
    The French nation was let down by its leaders (government and military), not by the courage of its soldier and citizens. The channel plus the home fleet saved us from a similar fate. Although I think the case stated in 'The Model Occupation' is too strong (very high ratio of German soldier to Channel Island native, and all the men gone) there would have been a similar mix of behaviours in Britain to those seen in France.

    Pray you never have to face the moral challenges that that generation did.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,932
    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    England is around 130k square km; Metropolitan France around 550k.
    That's half of the answer, I think ?
    Yes. Plus the Industrial Revolution. Plus the Luftwaffe

    But we have done an awful lot of it to ourselves. Far too much immigration adding to the overcrowding. Hideous post war architecture now compounded by hideous new town red brick Barratt home horrors. An apparent inability to make town centres “nice”.

    Also an absurd political aversion to rebuilding bombed towns because “that’s pastiche”. Yet the French did it in st Malo and the poles in Warsaw and now we marvel at how beautiful they are

    Britain has been governed by cretins (of all stripes) since about 1910
    It was the industrial revolution which created the wealth that led to Victorian town halls, market places, museums and banks being built.

    All those greco-roman style civic buildings which still look impressive in town centres.
    Very true. Look at pictures of industrial revolution cities like Manchester or Leeds from the Edwardian era. A beautiful, fine, coherent streetscape. No plate glass windows at street level, no roll shutters, almost no graffiti or litter.

    Mind you, some of the housing stock was hideous. We venerate Victorian terraces because it's the better ones which remain: many lived in truly awful conditions.

    Eeven there, though, a mixed picture: this photo from Halifax in 1965 is currently doing the rounds. Yes, the women look prematurely old and haggard (this goes back to a conversation we had on here the other day). But marvel at how clean everything is.

    Amazing to think those two ladies were both in their mid-twenties.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,235
    edited July 25
    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    England is around 130k square km; Metropolitan France around 550k.
    That's half of the answer, I think ?
    Yes. Plus the Industrial Revolution. Plus the Luftwaffe

    But we have done an awful lot of it to ourselves. Far too much immigration adding to the overcrowding. Hideous post war architecture now compounded by hideous new town red brick Barratt home horrors. An apparent inability to make town centres “nice”.

    Also an absurd political aversion to rebuilding bombed towns because “that’s pastiche”. Yet the French did it in st Malo and the poles in Warsaw and now we marvel at how beautiful they are

    Britain has been governed by cretins (of all stripes) since about 1910
    It was the industrial revolution which created the wealth that led to Victorian town halls, market places, museums and banks being built.

    All those greco-roman style civic buildings which still look impressive in town centres.
    Very true. Look at pictures of industrial revolution cities like Manchester or Leeds from the Edwardian era. A beautiful, fine, coherent streetscape. No plate glass windows at street level, no roll shutters, almost no graffiti or litter.

    Mind you, some of the housing stock was hideous. We venerate Victorian terraces because it's the better ones which remain: many lived in truly awful conditions.

    Eeven there, though, a mixed picture: this photo from Halifax in 1965 is currently doing the rounds. Yes, the women look prematurely old and haggard (this goes back to a conversation we had on here the other day). But marvel at how clean everything is.

    People had to clean because of all the coal dust.

    And as everyone was doing so it quickly became a source of pride.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,077

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    .

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”
    England is around 130k square km; Metropolitan France around 550k.
    That's half of the answer, I think ?
    Yes. Plus the Industrial Revolution. Plus the Luftwaffe

    But we have done an awful lot of it to ourselves. Far too much immigration adding to the overcrowding. Hideous post war architecture now compounded by hideous new town red brick Barratt home horrors. An apparent inability to make town centres “nice”.

    Also an absurd political aversion to rebuilding bombed towns because “that’s pastiche”. Yet the French did it in st Malo and the poles in Warsaw and now we marvel at how beautiful they are

    Britain has been governed by cretins (of all stripes) since about 1910
    It was the industrial revolution which created the wealth that led to Victorian town halls, market places, museums and banks being built.

    All those greco-roman style civic buildings which still look impressive in town centres.
    Very true. Look at pictures of industrial revolution cities like Manchester or Leeds from the Edwardian era. A beautiful, fine, coherent streetscape. No plate glass windows at street level, no roll shutters, almost no graffiti or litter.

    Mind you, some of the housing stock was hideous. We venerate Victorian terraces because it's the better ones which remain: many lived in truly awful conditions.

    Eeven there, though, a mixed picture: this photo from Halifax in 1965 is currently doing the rounds. Yes, the women look prematurely old and haggard (this goes back to a conversation we had on here the other day). But marvel at how clean everything is.

    People had to clean because of all the coal dust.

    And as everyone was doing so it quickly became as source of pride.
    True. Streets may have been full of litter, but were, incredibly, even dirtier in those days. That's one of the reasons the shoe polish business is falling through the floor - people simply don't need to polish their shoes so often any more.
    And the air quality was awful.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 48,464

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”

    Did you explain the French surrender in 1940 and the Vichy regime to your daughter?

    That's vile, actually, and anyone with such a misunderstanding of history should mark their own citizenship test a fail and voluntarily relocate to Rwanda. The surrender monkeys of 1940 were the Belgians (see a well known address to HoC by Churchill, W for details); the French hung in there while we did our run away monkey thing. And you think we wouldn't have had a Vichy? The English channel is a good thing but doesn't confer moral superiority.
    There is a certain truth that there was less of a determination to fight.

    My grandfather on my father's side was assigned (due to age) to the fortress troops. When the Germans approached, he was prepared to fight, as were some of the others. The majority of the unit literally held them up at gunpoint, while they sent out representatives with a white flag. This was fairly late in the Battle of France.

    Essentially, after the initial German success, the mood became (for many) "Get the surrender done and the war over. We lost."
  • eekeek Posts: 27,536

    Muesli said:

    FF43 said:

    None of the candidates for leadership of the Conservative Party are being sensible. I hope whoever gets selected is a little bit serious once in post. I don't think the Party realises just what a bad place it's in. It can definitely can go backwards in 2029, compared with the 2024 disaster.

    Tugendhat’s leadership pitch in the Telegraph is a real disappointment for those of us who believe our democracy works best with sensible, credible leadership of the main opposition party.

    One could hope that he’s just doing a Starmer by showing a bit of leg to his party’s wingnuts to get their support before kicking them to the kerb when becoming leader but it’s just so transparently desperate… and I find it difficult to believe that those looking for an authentic anti-ECHR, climate change denying transphobe won’t go for one of the other options on offer instead.
    Not just that.

    Starmer was able to pull the switcheroo on his party because it's not easy to depose a Labour leader. A Conservative leader trying the same scam would be much more vulnerable when things went wrong. Bob Blackman's letterbox does not need to be big.

    A Conservative leader is only going to be able to change the party if it wants to change. That might take a defeat or two more.
    True but there would still be a no confidence vote (see Teresa May) where I can't see the bit another candidate winning at the moment because if things are going badly none of the other choices will be much better.
  • Nunu5Nunu5 Posts: 954
    https://x.com/patrynard/status/1816183353772761538

    JD Vance says people with children should have more votes. The more children you have the more votes you should have.

    Insane.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,710
    stodge said:

    Driver said:

    franklyn said:

    I am not a Conservative voter under normal circumstances, although I have voted for them in the past, very much as a personal vote for our former, and much missed, MP, Alistair Burt.

    I am delighted by the chaos of the Conservative leadership battle; whoever is chosen seems destined to lead the Conservatives into oblivion, which is what they deserve, having trashed the country for 14 years. I am sure that the Lib Dems will provide a very adequate opposition.

    The Lib Dems, of course, were in government for five of the last 14 years.
    Nearly a decade ago as the junior partner, my friend.

    Don't forget they were also in Government in the 1970s as well so basically the natural party of Government.

    Seriously, so much has happened since Cameron made that foolish pledge to win himself a majority and yet you mention ancient history...
    Whilst that's true, it's still the natural response to "the last 14 years were awful - vote Lib Dem".
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,932

    Leon said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Taz said:

    Has the bubble finally burst?

    If so the ramifications for the US election will be huge

    Nasdaq 100 is down 1650 points from its peak of 20,690 on July 10th. And last night

    "Tokyo’s benchmark Nikkei 225 lost more than 1,000 points at one stage as pessimism set in around the so-called “Magnificent Seven” group of megacap companies on Wall Street.

    The world’s only $3 trillion companies all dragged down markets, with Nvidia dropping 6.8pc, Apple down 2.9pc and Microsoft down 3.6pc. Tesla fell 12pc."

    [The cause was Tesla and Alphabet (google) profits matching reality not insanity]

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/ftse-100-latest-news-uk-asia-europe-stocks-fall-us-tech/

    We will have to see. The US bond markets made some interesting moves yesterday, there was a massive move in the yield curve. 2Y is now above 10Y. But we have been here before many times.

    Lots of chatter now that the Fed will cut this month.

    I cannot see how Trumps isolationism and plans to weaponise the dollar through devalution could do anything positive.

    Also whoever wins need to do something about the debt instead of just adding to it.
    The political and economic volatility elsewhere is starting to make Britain look like a bit of a safe haven for investment, now the moron premium has gone and the dullness dividend kicks in. So says the Telegraph:

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/07/25/britain-shaking-off-moron-premium-safe-haven-global-cash/
    Yes, this was happening prior to the election as people and markets were factoring in a change of government,

    Let's hope that Rachel Reeves is smart enough not to scare the horses. I think she is.

    We have been undervalued for a while and if we don't value our businesses others will. Hence the bids for some from overseas.

    One way that Labour are lucky is that if you are part of a group being chased by a crocodile, you don't need to be faster than the crocodile, just faster than the slowest person in the group.

    Compared with the likes of France, our problems are minor and politics stable.
    Sitting in the blissful sunshine of peaceful, almost Edenic Aveyron, the UK looks like a basket case of bad weather and brutal knife crime

    It’s an unfair POV but it is hard to avoid

    My daughter’s only experience of France til this summer was a depressing school trip to wintry Paris. She thought all of France was like that

    Yesterday, after ten days touring Provence and Occitanie she spontaneously said “why is Britain so hideous. All our towns are ugly”

    Did you explain the French surrender in 1940 and the Vichy regime to your daughter?

    That's vile, actually, and anyone with such a misunderstanding of history should mark their own citizenship test a fail and voluntarily relocate to Rwanda. The surrender monkeys of 1940 were the Belgians (see a well known address to HoC by Churchill, W for details); the French hung in there while we did our run away monkey thing. And you think we wouldn't have had a Vichy? The English channel is a good thing but doesn't confer moral superiority.
    There is a certain truth that there was less of a determination to fight.

    My grandfather on my father's side was assigned (due to age) to the fortress troops. When the Germans approached, he was prepared to fight, as were some of the others. The majority of the unit literally held them up at gunpoint, while they sent out representatives with a white flag. This was fairly late in the Battle of France.

    Essentially, after the initial German success, the mood became (for many) "Get the surrender done and the war over. We lost."
    The British and French high command expected Western Front mark II, but instead their static defences, with little in the way of mobile reserves, were blown off balance by the inferior German assault (the allies had more guns, more tanks etc). Once unhinged the defeatism spread at the highest level. No one was more surprised than the Germans, including the heads of the Wehrmacht, who had been against attacking.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,276
    WH24: It's interesting to think about specific combos of Rust/Sun swing states to get over the line but I'm viewing things slightly differently. Everyone says this election is going to be very close. I'm not so sure. For me it's about whether Harris 'catches' as a candidate - which means achieving two things: energising her own side and forcing non-partisan voters to recognize the threat that Trump poses. If she does this successfully she can (and probably will) win all of the swing states. If she fails they'll probably all go to Trump. So a comfortable win either way is quite likely imo.
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