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Will Trump dump J.D. Vance? – politicalbetting.com

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  • eekeek Posts: 28,077

    Nigel Farage's maiden speech:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clbXZP7JM8g

    As Lola McEvoy said when she thanked him for his speech (it proceeded hers) it was quite a polished contribution that he has had 21 years to prepare—so thank you to him.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    How can you tell about the "quite literally"? Except about yourself, of course. Congrats! But personally I am not sexually aroused by KH, just delighted to have a normal human being in the frame.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231
    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,772

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    Oh don’t get me wrong, Harris is flawed as a candidate and it is still very much up in the air whether she can beat Trump. Her campaign record is not great.

    But I can’t help but say what I see, which is that she is much more fired up and comes across much better as a candidate than she has ever been able to demonstrate in her time as VP. I’m speaking as I find.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    How can you tell about the "quite literally"? Except about yourself, of course. Congrats! But personally I am not sexually aroused by KH, just delighted to have a normal human being in the frame.
    I won't highlight the posts - let's draw a polite veil.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,644
    Andy_JS said:

    "Owen Jones
    @OwenJones84

    Given Labour

    - only won a third of the vote
    - with the lowest turnout in democratic history
    - lost support to Greens and independents even before power

    I didn’t think they’d be stupid enough to purge MPs over child poverty.

    Well, good! Show everyone who you are. Suits me!"

    https://x.com/OwenJones84/status/1815852474047111350

    How many MPs does he have and why are most of them Islamic?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    Andy_JS said:

    "Owen Jones
    @OwenJones84

    Given Labour

    - only won a third of the vote
    - with the lowest turnout in democratic history
    - lost support to Greens and independents even before power

    I didn’t think they’d be stupid enough to purge MPs over child poverty.

    Well, good! Show everyone who you are. Suits me!"

    https://x.com/OwenJones84/status/1815852474047111350

    He still doesn't get it does he?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    It's notable how she seemed like such a boring person as VP, whereas now seems much more interesting.
    She may surprise on the upside, like Liz Truss
  • EScrymgeourEScrymgeour Posts: 141

    If anyone needs an insight into why many African Americans are oh so very angry, BBC4 are showing the Storyville on the Attica jail riot. Unusually hardly any nuance in the shittiness of the behaviour of the authorities. Bleak and depressing if you can cope with it.

    Pacinos character refers to it in Dog Day Afternoon, when surrounded by law enforcement outside the bank he is holding up.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703

    Nigel Farage's maiden speech:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clbXZP7JM8g

    It's actually quite a decent speech making his expected points, and he gets the tone about right for Westminster.

    Even though there seem to be some somewhat dodgy stats in it.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    Owen. This is why.


    Harry Cole
    @MrHarryCole
    ·
    2h
    Ruthless Starmer strikes again.

    And rightly so to secure his authority. Clown days are over.

    Apsana Begum, Richard Burgon, Ian Byrne, Imran Hussain, Rebecca Long-Bailey, John McDonnell and Zarah Sultana all suspended for six months.

    Fair play…
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774

    Latest Opinion Poll

    LAB 33.7%
    CON 23.7%
    LD 12.2%
    REF 14.3%
    GRN 6.4%

    Fieldwork 4/7/24

    Sample Size 28.88 million

    Lol @ the fieldwork date
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,707
    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    It's notable how she seemed like such a boring person as VP, whereas now seems much more interesting.
    She may surprise on the upside, like Liz Truss
    She may even be able to find her way out of a room unaided. The bar to leader of the free world is quite high these days.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,639
    edited July 23

    Owen. This is why.


    Harry Cole
    @MrHarryCole
    ·
    2h
    Ruthless Starmer strikes again.

    And rightly so to secure his authority. Clown days are over.

    Apsana Begum, Richard Burgon, Ian Byrne, Imran Hussain, Rebecca Long-Bailey, John McDonnell and Zarah Sultana all suspended for six months.

    Fair play…

    Scottish Labour and Mr Sarwar, however, are going to have to do some thinking. Given how their MPs have cravenly backed down *from Slab policy*.
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    I neither allowed nor ignored it, but taking it out on other children seems wrong to me,
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,707
    I can't make out if that's pro-Trump or anti. US politics-memes have got so confusing.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    It will be quite interesting to watch the inevitable framing of Harris vs Trump as "Prosecutor vs Felon", and how far it reaches into the perceptions of independents.
  • MuesliMuesli Posts: 202

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    It sure makes a real difference in comparison to watching every Biden appearance through one’s fingers, rooting for him to get through it without stumbling over either his words or his feet.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,792

    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:

    Nunu5 said:


    Kyle Griffin
    @kylegriffin1
    NEW Reuters/Ipsos poll:

    TWO-WAY
    Kamala Harris 44%
    Donald Trump 42%

    THREE-WAY
    Kamala Harris 42%
    Donald Trump 38%
    RFK Jr. 8%

    MoE +/-3%

    And we’re off. I do suspect in the end it’s not going to be close. As I’ve always said what does a convicted felon who’s had to pay millions to a woman he’s sexually assaulted and who was prepared to let a mob murder his own running mate have to offer swing voters?
    Morning Consult over almost the same timeframe

    Trump 47%
    Harris 45%

    https://pro.morningconsult.com/analysis/kamala-harris-biden-campaign-polling

    For the white working class Trump offers tariffs on imports while pushing US goods, cuts in immigration and anti wokeism.

    For the wealthy suburbanites he offers tax cuts, for Jews he offers to stand up for Israel, for evangelicals he enabled the end of Roe v Wade
    Tariffs on imports are taxes paid by consumers of those imports. You do get that don't you?

    Kamala's husband and step children are Jewish. It's not going to be easy to make out she is an anti-semite.

    Indeed there was another awesome Lawyer with a Jewish spouse that recently did very well in an election...
    Wait, Kamala Harris is a stepmom?
    (runs for the hills)
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 3,707
    Carnyx said:

    Owen. This is why.


    Harry Cole
    @MrHarryCole
    ·
    2h
    Ruthless Starmer strikes again.

    And rightly so to secure his authority. Clown days are over.

    Apsana Begum, Richard Burgon, Ian Byrne, Imran Hussain, Rebecca Long-Bailey, John McDonnell and Zarah Sultana all suspended for six months.

    Fair play…

    Scottish Labour and Mr Sarwar, however, are going to have to do some thinking. Given how their MPs have cravenly backed down *from Slab policy*.
    Slab had a policy? Was it 'say whatever, meh'?
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,548
    edited July 23

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    Vice Presidency of the United States is famously, traditionally, historically one of the inherently crap jobs of American politics. As in the old story, one brother was lost at sea and the other was elected Vice President; neither was ever heard from again. Lots of time just standing by, and if votes are tight in the Senate, waiting to break ties the way the President wants 'em breaking, At all times VP is constrained by POTUS in thought, word and deed. Lots of gory details but you get the picture.

    Of course always prospect of advancement thanks to some mad gunman, or even less violent ways. PLUS since 1952 when "I Like Ike" lead to Ike picks Dick, the Vice Presidency has been seen as a viable path to the White House, which it really wasn't before.

    SO severe constraint and constant boredom combined with high stress and weird hours. Generally NOT much mitigated by efforts to make the job of VP be more consequential, or at least to appear that way.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,792
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    I just had the FOURTH GREATEST PICNIC OF MY LIFE

    Just walked out of this Aveyron village, loaded with saucisson, tomatoes, superb bread, a stupidly good wine from collioure (???), chocolate, raspberries, bayonne ham. Sat above an orchard overlooking the Tarn valley and the stone villages thereof. The light dimmed to faded sapphire then twinkling purple-black. We talked of life and death and whether it’s better to be a mule or a donkey, and we concocted a stupid poem about “jonquils”

    Walked home in the deepening darkness. Said Bon nuit to our landlord Pascal

    There are literally no foreign tourists here. It’s so amazingly quiet you can hear families laughing 2km across the valley. Nightingales

    Are you going to Albi? Lovely town further down the Tarn.
    I went last year. Indeed rather nice

    I’m moving on to another part of “lost France” once I have safely decanted my older daughter back to Blighty
    I know what you mean, but your use of the word "decanted" makes me think your daughter is an embryo carried in a glass amniotic sac in your pocket, possibly glowing slightly. It's an odd image.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    .
    Barnesian said:

    Barnesian said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Nunu5 said:


    Kyle Griffin
    @kylegriffin1
    NEW Reuters/Ipsos poll:

    TWO-WAY
    Kamala Harris 44%
    Donald Trump 42%

    THREE-WAY
    Kamala Harris 42%
    Donald Trump 38%
    RFK Jr. 8%

    MoE +/-3%

    And we’re off. I do suspect in the end it’s not going to be close. As I’ve always said what does a convicted felon who’s had to pay millions to a woman he’s sexually assaulted and who was prepared to let a mob murder his own running mate have to offer swing voters?
    Morning Consult over almost the same timeframe

    Trump 47%
    Harris 45%

    https://pro.morningconsult.com/analysis/kamala-harris-biden-campaign-polling

    For the white working class Trump offers tariffs on imports while pushing US goods, cuts in immigration and anti wokeism.

    For the wealthy suburbanites he offers tax cuts, for Jews he offers to stand up for Israel, for evangelicals he enabled the end of Roe v Wade
    For the white working class Trump offers tariffs on imports.
    Who pays the tariffs? The white working class.
    100% tariffs on Chinese imports are not paid by China. They are paid by Americans. Big uplift in cost of living as Kamala will eloquently explain.
    Whose jobs went to China, Mexico and Asia? The costs of globalisation have been borne by the west's WWC .
    True. But it will take time for businesses to invest in the US to substitute for Chinese goods behind the tariff barrier. In the meantime inflation will shoot up as US consumers pay the tariff. Possibly good long term intentions. Short and medium term a political disaster.
    Much better to slowly crank up tariffs rather than impose an immediate 100% tariff on Chinese goods.
    Trump wants the Chinese to build factories in the US.
    Fair enough. But that takes time. In the meantime inflation soars.
    Targeted sanctions can make sense. Though for now the Chinese car manufacturers have limited interest in the US market - whether building factories there, or exporting to it - because of the political uncertainty.

    And Trump’s across the board tariff proposals are nonsense.
  • MisterBedfordshireMisterBedfordshire Posts: 2,252
    edited July 23

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    I neither allowed nor ignored it, but taking it out on other children seems wrong to me,
    Taking what out, they are a Romanian Family, without British Citizenship or settled status and they want to go back to Romania. Who are we to have some neo colonial attitude implying Eastern Europeans and their governments are soft on child abuse and not to be trusted with the welfare of their own citizens?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    edited July 23
    viewcode said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    I just had the FOURTH GREATEST PICNIC OF MY LIFE

    Just walked out of this Aveyron village, loaded with saucisson, tomatoes, superb bread, a stupidly good wine from collioure (???), chocolate, raspberries, bayonne ham. Sat above an orchard overlooking the Tarn valley and the stone villages thereof. The light dimmed to faded sapphire then twinkling purple-black. We talked of life and death and whether it’s better to be a mule or a donkey, and we concocted a stupid poem about “jonquils”

    Walked home in the deepening darkness. Said Bon nuit to our landlord Pascal

    There are literally no foreign tourists here. It’s so amazingly quiet you can hear families laughing 2km across the valley. Nightingales

    Are you going to Albi? Lovely town further down the Tarn.
    I went last year. Indeed rather nice

    I’m moving on to another part of “lost France” once I have safely decanted my older daughter back to Blighty
    I know what you mean, but your use of the word "decanted" makes me think your daughter is an embryo carried in a glass amniotic sac in your pocket, possibly glowing slightly. It's an odd image.
    She’s precious! Like a fine wine. I transport her gently. She’s my beloved and very funny if eccentric offspring

    We share a vividly surreal sense of humour. Which is quite crucial. There aren’t many better things than riffing comedically and effectively with your own kids
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    I neither allowed nor ignored it, but taking it out on other children seems wrong to me,
    Taking what out, they are a Romanian Family, without British Citizenship or settled status and they want to go back to Romania. Who are we to have some neo colonial attitude implying Eastern Europeans and governments are soft on child abuse and not to be trusted with the welfare of their own citizens?
    You know much more about it than I do.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,870

    Andy_JS said:

    "Owen Jones
    @OwenJones84

    Given Labour

    - only won a third of the vote
    - with the lowest turnout in democratic history
    - lost support to Greens and independents even before power

    I didn’t think they’d be stupid enough to purge MPs over child poverty.

    Well, good! Show everyone who you are. Suits me!"

    https://x.com/OwenJones84/status/1815852474047111350

    He still doesn't get it does he?
    He doesn't want to get it.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 21,828
    Have we done these?

    Too soon to tell, but early polling for Harris not looking too shabby.


  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,317

    Owen. This is why.


    Harry Cole
    @MrHarryCole
    ·
    2h
    Ruthless Starmer strikes again.

    And rightly so to secure his authority. Clown days are over.

    Apsana Begum, Richard Burgon, Ian Byrne, Imran Hussain, Rebecca Long-Bailey, John McDonnell and Zarah Sultana all suspended for six months.

    Fair play…

    It seems highly probable that Corbyn's pro gaza group and Ref UK will start to pick up defections.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,548
    With respect to the strange nature of the Vice Presidency in US politics, the selection of Theodore Roosevelt as William McKinley's running mate on the 1900 Republican ticket, is one of the weirdest AND most significant examples.

    Because the "Easy Boss" of New York State GOP politics at the turn of 19th > 20th century was US Sen. Tom Platt, wanted to get newly-elected Gov. Theodore Roosevelt the hell out of Albany, where the Gov was opposing, hindering, exposing dirty deals by many of Platt's corporate donors & henchpeople.

    McKinley's first VP had died in office, so he needed another. Platt argued that TR would not only help carry NY State THE battleground state of the epoch. AND that the Hero of San Juan Hill would add luster and vigor to the ticket. Essentially a Mini-Me for McKinley.

    Political backer and campaign manager Mark Hanna famously warned WMcK that he should NOT pick Roosevelt, and put a "cowboy" within a heart beat of the Presidency. But he did . . . and the rest is history.

    But it did get TR out of Tom Platt's hair up in Albany.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,870
    darkage said:

    Owen. This is why.


    Harry Cole
    @MrHarryCole
    ·
    2h
    Ruthless Starmer strikes again.

    And rightly so to secure his authority. Clown days are over.

    Apsana Begum, Richard Burgon, Ian Byrne, Imran Hussain, Rebecca Long-Bailey, John McDonnell and Zarah Sultana all suspended for six months.

    Fair play…

    It seems highly probable that Corbyn's pro gaza group and Ref UK will start to pick up defections.
    Right away? Perhaps not. But given how many people get suspended per Parliament and that this time Reform and the Gaza Bros are ready to receive the suspended, the odds at some point are pretty good.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,585

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,870

    With respect to the strange nature of the Vice Presidency in US politics, the selection of Theodore Roosevelt as William McKinley's running mate on the 1900 Republican ticket, is one of the weirdest AND most significant examples.

    Because the "Easy Boss" of New York State GOP politics at the turn of 19th > 20th century was US Sen. Tom Platt, wanted to get newly-elected Gov. Theodore Roosevelt the hell out of Albany, where the Gov was opposing, hindering, exposing dirty deals by many of Platt's corporate donors & henchpeople.

    McKinley's first VP had died in office, so he needed another. Platt argued that TR would not only help carry NY State THE battleground state of the epoch. AND that the Hero of San Juan Hill would add luster and vigor to the ticket. Essentially a Mini-Me for McKinley.

    Political backer and campaign manager Mark Hanna famously warned WMcK that he should NOT pick Roosevelt, and put a "cowboy" within a heart beat of the Presidency. But he did . . . and the rest is history.

    But it did get TR out of Tom Platt's hair up in Albany.

    Still reckon they should have gone back to the runner up becoming VP. Trump being Biden's VP would have solved all issues.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,548

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    I neither allowed nor ignored it, but taking it out on other children seems wrong to me,
    Taking what out, they are a Romanian Family, without British Citizenship or settled status and they want to go back to Romania. Who are we to have some neo colonial attitude implying Eastern Europeans and their governments are soft on child abuse and not to be trusted with the welfare of their own citizens?
    Not sure how Romanian government is on child abuse, but do know they are damn hard on the Roma.
  • Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    I neither allowed nor ignored it, but taking it out on other children seems wrong to me,
    Taking what out, they are a Romanian Family, without British Citizenship or settled status and they want to go back to Romania. Who are we to have some neo colonial attitude implying Eastern Europeans and their governments are soft on child abuse and not to be trusted with the welfare of their own citizens?
    Not sure how Romanian government is on child abuse, but do know they are damn hard on the Roma.
    But they are esteemed Nato allies and a fellow member states of the European Court of Human Rights appointing judges to it that rule over the actions of the UK government, a place that our government was happy to have UK citizens extradited to without evidence under the European Arrest Warrant?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
    Fascinatingly, both her parents (mother India, father Jamaica) were subjects of the British Empire. She’s very British, in a peculiar way

    Our rainy archipelago continues to cast an outsize shadow on the world

    This does NOT mean she will be Brit-o-philic, of course. Quite possibly the opposite
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,585

    Latest Opinion Poll

    LAB 33.7%
    CON 23.7%
    LD 12.2%
    REF 14.3%
    GRN 6.4%

    Fieldwork 4/7/24

    Sample Size 28.88 million

    BJO fans please explain Green Tory polling so low.
    Go and cheer on Genocide along with your hero
    You claim that Ukraine "can't win their war". Can Hamas win THEIR war?
    The innocents slaughtered in Gaza can't thats for sure.
    But can Hamas win?
    Wouldnt have thought so but as SKS is not offering them £3Bn of taxpayers money a year like he is Zelensky you are as usual completely missing the point.

    Celebrate your Kid Starving victory
    Indeed, a double victory. 1) Government neithwr frittering money needlessly nor creating perverse incentives which will only increaae child poverty, and 2) SKS rids himself, albeit temporarily, of half a dozen or so of the party's more unappealing characters. Well done SKS.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,792
    Barnesian said:

    Barnesian said:

    Barnesian said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Nunu5 said:


    Kyle Griffin
    @kylegriffin1
    NEW Reuters/Ipsos poll:

    TWO-WAY
    Kamala Harris 44%
    Donald Trump 42%

    THREE-WAY
    Kamala Harris 42%
    Donald Trump 38%
    RFK Jr. 8%

    MoE +/-3%

    And we’re off. I do suspect in the end it’s not going to be close. As I’ve always said what does a convicted felon who’s had to pay millions to a woman he’s sexually assaulted and who was prepared to let a mob murder his own running mate have to offer swing voters?
    Morning Consult over almost the same timeframe

    Trump 47%
    Harris 45%

    https://pro.morningconsult.com/analysis/kamala-harris-biden-campaign-polling

    For the white working class Trump offers tariffs on imports while pushing US goods, cuts in immigration and anti wokeism.

    For the wealthy suburbanites he offers tax cuts, for Jews he offers to stand up for Israel, for evangelicals he enabled the end of Roe v Wade
    For the white working class Trump offers tariffs on imports.
    Who pays the tariffs? The white working class.
    100% tariffs on Chinese imports are not paid by China. They are paid by Americans. Big uplift in cost of living as Kamala will eloquently explain.
    Whose jobs went to China, Mexico and Asia? The costs of globalisation have been borne by the west's WWC .
    True. But it will take time for businesses to invest in the US to substitute for Chinese goods behind the tariff barrier. In the meantime inflation will shoot up as US consumers pay the tariff. Possibly good long term intentions. Short and medium term a political disaster.
    Much better to slowly crank up tariffs rather than impose an immediate 100% tariff on Chinese goods.
    Trump wants the Chinese to build factories in the US.
    Fair enough. But that takes time. In the meantime inflation soars.
    Of what? The US is not very reliant on imports.

    Barnesian said:

    Barnesian said:

    Barnesian said:

    HYUFD said:

    Nunu5 said:


    Kyle Griffin
    @kylegriffin1
    NEW Reuters/Ipsos poll:

    TWO-WAY
    Kamala Harris 44%
    Donald Trump 42%

    THREE-WAY
    Kamala Harris 42%
    Donald Trump 38%
    RFK Jr. 8%

    MoE +/-3%

    And we’re off. I do suspect in the end it’s not going to be close. As I’ve always said what does a convicted felon who’s had to pay millions to a woman he’s sexually assaulted and who was prepared to let a mob murder his own running mate have to offer swing voters?
    Morning Consult over almost the same timeframe

    Trump 47%
    Harris 45%

    https://pro.morningconsult.com/analysis/kamala-harris-biden-campaign-polling

    For the white working class Trump offers tariffs on imports while pushing US goods, cuts in immigration and anti wokeism.

    For the wealthy suburbanites he offers tax cuts, for Jews he offers to stand up for Israel, for evangelicals he enabled the end of Roe v Wade
    For the white working class Trump offers tariffs on imports.
    Who pays the tariffs? The white working class.
    100% tariffs on Chinese imports are not paid by China. They are paid by Americans. Big uplift in cost of living as Kamala will eloquently explain.
    Whose jobs went to China, Mexico and Asia? The costs of globalisation have been borne by the west's WWC .
    True. But it will take time for businesses to invest in the US to substitute for Chinese goods behind the tariff barrier. In the meantime inflation will shoot up as US consumers pay the tariff. Possibly good long term intentions. Short and medium term a political disaster.
    Much better to slowly crank up tariffs rather than impose an immediate 100% tariff on Chinese goods.
    Trump wants the Chinese to build factories in the US.
    Fair enough. But that takes time. In the meantime inflation soars.
    Of what? The US is not very reliant on imports.
    Imports are about 16% of US GDP.
    Zeihan (yes him again) notes not just the onshoring of US industry but that it's also moving from importing from Europe and Asia to importing from Mexico and Canada. When fracking took off it made the US energy independent, and the US now needs the world for very little.

    It would be historically stupid for Trump to allow Chinese factories on American soil: it would just reduce American workers to the status of Chinese workers, with all the care that implies.
  • YokesYokes Posts: 1,327
    edited July 23
    Trump will not remove Vance but there is a question over whether Vance is a trojan horse for other interests.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 21,828

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    I neither allowed nor ignored it, but taking it out on other children seems wrong to me,
    Taking what out, they are a Romanian Family, without British Citizenship or settled status and they want to go back to Romania. Who are we to have some neo colonial attitude implying Eastern Europeans and their governments are soft on child abuse and not to be trusted with the welfare of their own citizens?
    Not sure how Romanian government is on child abuse, but do know they are damn hard on the Roma.
    No human rights violations though, they're in the EHCR.

    Or is the EHCR utterly meaningless?
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,792

    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:

    Nunu5 said:


    Kyle Griffin
    @kylegriffin1
    NEW Reuters/Ipsos poll:

    TWO-WAY
    Kamala Harris 44%
    Donald Trump 42%

    THREE-WAY
    Kamala Harris 42%
    Donald Trump 38%
    RFK Jr. 8%

    MoE +/-3%

    And we’re off. I do suspect in the end it’s not going to be close. As I’ve always said what does a convicted felon who’s had to pay millions to a woman he’s sexually assaulted and who was prepared to let a mob murder his own running mate have to offer swing voters?
    Morning Consult over almost the same timeframe

    Trump 47%
    Harris 45%

    https://pro.morningconsult.com/analysis/kamala-harris-biden-campaign-polling

    For the white working class Trump offers tariffs on imports while pushing US goods, cuts in immigration and anti wokeism.

    For the wealthy suburbanites he offers tax cuts, for Jews he offers to stand up for Israel, for evangelicals he enabled the end of Roe v Wade
    Tariffs on imports are taxes paid by consumers of those imports. You do get that don't you?

    Kamala's husband and step children are Jewish. It's not going to be easy to make out she is an anti-semite.

    Indeed there was another awesome Lawyer with a Jewish spouse that recently did very well in an election...
    Wait, Kamala Harris is a stepmom?
    Kamala when young: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GSyV1LRXQAA--F2?format=jpg
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,585
    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
    Fascinatingly, both her parents (mother India, father Jamaica) were subjects of the British Empire. She’s very British, in a peculiar way

    Our rainy archipelago continues to cast an outsize shadow on the world

    This does NOT mean she will be Brit-o-philic, of course. Quite possibly the opposite
    Yea, it can go either way. Obama had a Kenhan parent didn't he, and hated us. Trump had a Scottish parent, and didn't much like us. Neither of Biden's parents were British, and he loathed us.
    Maybe it can't go either way.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
    Fascinatingly, both her parents (mother India, father Jamaica) were subjects of the British Empire. She’s very British, in a peculiar way

    Our rainy archipelago continues to cast an outsize shadow on the world

    This does NOT mean she will be Brit-o-philic, of course. Quite possibly the opposite
    Yea, it can go either way. Obama had a Kenhan parent didn't he, and hated us. Trump had a Scottish parent, and didn't much like us. Neither of Biden's parents were British, and he loathed us.
    Maybe it can't go either way.
    I disagree. I think Trump is quite the Anglophile

    The others, yes
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,575
    Joe Biden is li

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    Another classic headline. Implies the kids are back with mum and dad. They are not. Extended family seems to have gone missing from the headline.
    Oddly though, the title does include the word extended:-
    Children returned to extended family after Leeds disorder - BBC News
    Possibly the headline was cut for length.
  • DumbosaurusDumbosaurus Posts: 777
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    I can just imagine @Heathener seeing this post and seething about underage Thai girls.

    (This is post is not to be interpreted as expressing any opinion upon anyone or anything other than things that amuse me)
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,548
    kle4 said:

    With respect to the strange nature of the Vice Presidency in US politics, the selection of Theodore Roosevelt as William McKinley's running mate on the 1900 Republican ticket, is one of the weirdest AND most significant examples.

    Because the "Easy Boss" of New York State GOP politics at the turn of 19th > 20th century was US Sen. Tom Platt, wanted to get newly-elected Gov. Theodore Roosevelt the hell out of Albany, where the Gov was opposing, hindering, exposing dirty deals by many of Platt's corporate donors & henchpeople.

    McKinley's first VP had died in office, so he needed another. Platt argued that TR would not only help carry NY State THE battleground state of the epoch. AND that the Hero of San Juan Hill would add luster and vigor to the ticket. Essentially a Mini-Me for McKinley.

    Political backer and campaign manager Mark Hanna famously warned WMcK that he should NOT pick Roosevelt, and put a "cowboy" within a heart beat of the Presidency. But he did . . . and the rest is history.

    But it did get TR out of Tom Platt's hair up in Albany.

    Still reckon they should have gone back to the runner up becoming VP. Trump being Biden's VP would have solved all issues.
    Was pretty bumpy with John Adams as POTUS with Thomas Jefferson as VP. Next time even worse with Jefferson as POTUS and Aaron Burr as VP.

    Those two outcomes in quick succession nixed the winner + runner up deal for good. Or ill.

    Sidebar - IF you ever find yourself in Parkersburg, West Virginia on the banks of the mighty Ohio River, take the paddle-wheeler over to Blennerhasset Island, which in first decade of 19th century was site of an impressive mansion in the howling wilderness. AND major staging area for Burr's Conspiracy. W

    Whatever it was Aaron Burr was actually conspiring to do? Thomas Jefferson thought it was treason against the United States, but Burr was acquitted of that crime in federal court trial, so who knows?
  • gettingbettergettingbetter Posts: 543

    Have we done these?

    Too soon to tell, but early polling for Harris not looking too shabby.


    Thanks for this. I suppose the electorall college gives about 3 points advantage to Trump, so if she's about 3 points ahead in the polls it's really about 50-50.

  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    I can just imagine @Heathener seeing this post and seething about underage Thai girls.

    (This is post is not to be interpreted as expressing any opinion upon anyone or anything other than things that amuse me)
    Well then shut the fuck up. Either make a comment of your own and attach your name to it, or don’t
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    edited July 23
    I don't think I've done my photo for the day.

    My new favourite genre:

    Americans trying Coleman's English Mustard


    https://x.com/Zaphod2042/status/1812541685840089419

    via Larry the Cat.

    Who has also commented on JD Vance's assaults on Cat Ladies.

    Larry the Cat @Number10cat
    Trump's pet pooch James Vance has attacked cat ladies, which in turn is an attack on cats. I've got bad news for you Jimmy: women vote, cat lovers vote. You need to find some charisma and substance real fast or it's obvious who'll be getting the blame from Daddy in November...

    https://x.com/Number10cat/status/1815757873818845455
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,792

    If anyone needs an insight into why many African Americans are oh so very angry, BBC4 are showing the Storyville on the Attica jail riot. Unusually hardly any nuance in the shittiness of the behaviour of the authorities. Bleak and depressing if you can cope with it.

    Pacinos character refers to it in Dog Day Afternoon, when surrounded by law enforcement outside the bank he is holding up.
    Why Al Pacino's character is shouting "Attica" in Dog Day Afternoon?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nzQsSbq-pk
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    Southern Baptist agency tangles itself in knots over Biden’s ‘selfless act’

    https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/23/southern-baptist-biden-00170764
    In under 48 hours, the head of the staunchly conservative public-policy arm of the Southern Baptist Convention rankled fellow Baptists by applauding President Joe Biden’s “selfless act” of withdrawing his candidacy for reelection. Then, his agency reported he was fired — and now they have reaffirmed his leadership.

    The head-spinning series of events started Sunday, but by Tuesday morning, the SBC’s Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission announced that no, leader Brent Leatherwood wasn’t fired. Rather, he has the full support of his top board members — though its chair resigned and apologized for the erroneous announcement...

  • DumbosaurusDumbosaurus Posts: 777
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    I can just imagine @Heathener seeing this post and seething about underage Thai girls.

    (This is post is not to be interpreted as expressing any opinion upon anyone or anything other than things that amuse me)
    Well then shut the fuck up. Either make a comment of your own and attach your name to it, or don’t
    I haven't read your book. How am I supposed to make a comment in good faith :D
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,792

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
    Fascinatingly, both her parents (mother India, father Jamaica) were subjects of the British Empire. She’s very British, in a peculiar way

    Our rainy archipelago continues to cast an outsize shadow on the world

    This does NOT mean she will be Brit-o-philic, of course. Quite possibly the opposite
    Yea, it can go either way. Obama had a Kenhan parent didn't he, and hated us. Trump had a Scottish parent, and didn't much like us. Neither of Biden's parents were British, and he loathed us.
    Maybe it can't go either way.
    I think it's more that Britain just isn't considered that important in the U.S., outside very particular areas of intelligencce-sharing and co-operation, and which is a fact that is very difficult for the British Right to accept or integrate with a particular worldview.
    Almost none of the Presidents listed below have actusally hated Britain, but they just weren't particularly interested.

    Ironically it's actually the countries like France, Germany and Italy that always consider Britain important, and we all know where the UK Right has gone
    with that.
    Indeed
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,153
    edited July 23
    Trump will do whatever he can to WIN so if he calculates dumping LOSER JD Vance would help his chances of re-election he will of course go down that route...
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 21,828

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
    Fascinatingly, both her parents (mother India, father Jamaica) were subjects of the British Empire. She’s very British, in a peculiar way

    Our rainy archipelago continues to cast an outsize shadow on the world

    This does NOT mean she will be Brit-o-philic, of course. Quite possibly the opposite
    Yea, it can go either way. Obama had a Kenhan parent didn't he, and hated us. Trump had a Scottish parent, and didn't much like us. Neither of Biden's parents were British, and he loathed us.
    Maybe it can't go either way.
    I think it's more that Britain just isn't considered that important in the U.S., outside very particular areas of intelligencce-sharing and co-operation, and which is a fact that is very difficult for the British Right to accept or integrate with a particular worldview.
    Almost none of the Presidents listed below have actusally hated Britain, but they just weren't particularly interested.

    Ironically it's actually the countries like France, Germany and Italy that always consider Britain important, and we all know where the UK Right has gone
    with that.
    Outside of intelligence-sharing and co-operation?

    So outside of the things that matter?

    Outside of warm weather and sunshine, people don't really think about summer.

    Outside of spending time with family and giving presents, people don't really think about Christmas.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,165
    edited July 23
    viewcode said:

    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:

    Nunu5 said:


    Kyle Griffin
    @kylegriffin1
    NEW Reuters/Ipsos poll:

    TWO-WAY
    Kamala Harris 44%
    Donald Trump 42%

    THREE-WAY
    Kamala Harris 42%
    Donald Trump 38%
    RFK Jr. 8%

    MoE +/-3%

    And we’re off. I do suspect in the end it’s not going to be close. As I’ve always said what does a convicted felon who’s had to pay millions to a woman he’s sexually assaulted and who was prepared to let a mob murder his own running mate have to offer swing voters?
    Morning Consult over almost the same timeframe

    Trump 47%
    Harris 45%

    https://pro.morningconsult.com/analysis/kamala-harris-biden-campaign-polling

    For the white working class Trump offers tariffs on imports while pushing US goods, cuts in immigration and anti wokeism.

    For the wealthy suburbanites he offers tax cuts, for Jews he offers to stand up for Israel, for evangelicals he enabled the end of Roe v Wade
    Tariffs on imports are taxes paid by consumers of those imports. You do get that don't you?

    Kamala's husband and step children are Jewish. It's not going to be easy to make out she is an anti-semite.

    Indeed there was another awesome Lawyer with a Jewish spouse that recently did very well in an election...
    Wait, Kamala Harris is a stepmom?
    Kamala when young: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GSyV1LRXQAA--F2?format=jpg
    On this video she explains the photo was taken in front of Rankin Chapel at Howard University in Washington DC. At around 1 mins 15 secs.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KP_Ibr-g5U
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,548
    Nigelb said:

    Southern Baptist agency tangles itself in knots over Biden’s ‘selfless act’

    https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/23/southern-baptist-biden-00170764
    In under 48 hours, the head of the staunchly conservative public-policy arm of the Southern Baptist Convention rankled fellow Baptists by applauding President Joe Biden’s “selfless act” of withdrawing his candidacy for reelection. Then, his agency reported he was fired — and now they have reaffirmed his leadership.

    The head-spinning series of events started Sunday, but by Tuesday morning, the SBC’s Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission announced that no, leader Brent Leatherwood wasn’t fired. Rather, he has the full support of his top board members — though its chair resigned and apologized for the erroneous announcement...

    Wow.

    Southern Baptist Convention is America's largest Protestant religious denomination, with chuchs and church members everywhere, most especially across the Southern States. Increasingly conservative in theology AND politics.

    This is sign that there are still strong voices within even very conservative, Trump-friendly circles, that believe in at least two things

    > Resisting turning God's church into political cells for political parties even (or maybe especially) when you agree with them.

    > Praying for government leaders even (or perhaps especially) when you do NOT agree with them.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,548
    MattW said:

    I don't think I've done my photo for the day.

    My new favourite genre:

    Americans trying Coleman's English Mustard


    https://x.com/Zaphod2042/status/1812541685840089419

    via Larry the Cat.

    Who has also commented on JD Vance's assaults on Cat Ladies.

    Larry the Cat @Number10cat
    Trump's pet pooch James Vance has attacked cat ladies, which in turn is an attack on cats. I've got bad news for you Jimmy: women vote, cat lovers vote. You need to find some charisma and substance real fast or it's obvious who'll be getting the blame from Daddy in November...

    https://x.com/Number10cat/status/1815757873818845455

    Suspect that Larry the Cat's account has been hacked. Hardly seemingly for a member of HMG to be engaging in a political cat fight beyond the realm.

    Trust Larry to maintain a dignified silence, However, IF J,D. Vance ever comes calling in Downing Street, expect the claws to be out. OR at very least a warning hiss.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,548

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Romania arrested Andrew Tate. Which gives their justice system a gold star from me.
    At least one, for sure. Without justifying the warts on their government, courts, politicos, etc.

    Same as in USA or UK or where ever.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,165
    edited July 23

    MattW said:

    I don't think I've done my photo for the day.

    My new favourite genre:

    Americans trying Coleman's English Mustard


    https://x.com/Zaphod2042/status/1812541685840089419

    via Larry the Cat.

    Who has also commented on JD Vance's assaults on Cat Ladies.

    Larry the Cat @Number10cat
    Trump's pet pooch James Vance has attacked cat ladies, which in turn is an attack on cats. I've got bad news for you Jimmy: women vote, cat lovers vote. You need to find some charisma and substance real fast or it's obvious who'll be getting the blame from Daddy in November...

    https://x.com/Number10cat/status/1815757873818845455

    Suspect that Larry the Cat's account has been hacked. Hardly seemingly for a member of HMG to be engaging in a political cat fight beyond the realm.

    Trust Larry to maintain a dignified silence, However, IF J,D. Vance ever comes calling in Downing Street, expect the claws to be out. OR at very least a warning hiss.
    Larry the Cat has been getting involved in quasi-political arguments for quite a while now. I agree that he ought to stick to more usual feline concerns, like catching mice. 😊
  • No_Offence_AlanNo_Offence_Alan Posts: 4,465

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    With a "hung" Senate, including a couple of unreliable "Independents", she had to hang around there in case her casting vote was needed.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,889
    Oh dear oh dear - the media doing such a horrendous job on reporting the child benefit situation has had people apparently not claiming child benefit for their third child. All over the comments of Martin Lewis Facebook.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,451
    A British soldier has been rushed to hospital by air ambulance after a 'serious stabbing' close to an army barracks.

    The man, who is in his 40s, was found seriously injured less than 200 metres from Brompton Barracks in Chatham, Kent, at around 6pm on Tuesday evening.

    A horrified witness said the attacker, hidden by a ski mask and in a NASA bomber jacket, leapt off a moped and ran towards the uniformed soldier.

    The serviceman managed to get away but was chased down and attacked once more by the assailant who was brandishing two kitchen knifes, the onlooker claimed.

    It is claimed moments later the knifeman held up one of the bloodied weapons and licked it in front of terrified locals who had rushed out of their homes to help the serviceman.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13664985/Soldier-Army-barracks-stabbing-Gillingham-man-arrested.html
  • MJWMJW Posts: 1,723
    Nigelb said:

    Southern Baptist agency tangles itself in knots over Biden’s ‘selfless act’

    https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/23/southern-baptist-biden-00170764
    In under 48 hours, the head of the staunchly conservative public-policy arm of the Southern Baptist Convention rankled fellow Baptists by applauding President Joe Biden’s “selfless act” of withdrawing his candidacy for reelection. Then, his agency reported he was fired — and now they have reaffirmed his leadership.

    The head-spinning series of events started Sunday, but by Tuesday morning, the SBC’s Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission announced that no, leader Brent Leatherwood wasn’t fired. Rather, he has the full support of his top board members — though its chair resigned and apologized for the erroneous announcement...

    Sounds exactly like the Green Party and its giving in to its influx of cranks.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,792

    MattW said:

    I don't think I've done my photo for the day.

    My new favourite genre:

    Americans trying Coleman's English Mustard


    https://x.com/Zaphod2042/status/1812541685840089419

    via Larry the Cat.

    Who has also commented on JD Vance's assaults on Cat Ladies.

    Larry the Cat @Number10cat
    Trump's pet pooch James Vance has attacked cat ladies, which in turn is an attack on cats. I've got bad news for you Jimmy: women vote, cat lovers vote. You need to find some charisma and substance real fast or it's obvious who'll be getting the blame from Daddy in November...

    https://x.com/Number10cat/status/1815757873818845455

    Suspect that Larry the Cat's account has been hacked. Hardly seemingly for a member of HMG to be engaging in a political cat fight beyond the realm.

    Trust Larry to maintain a dignified silence, However, IF J,D. Vance ever comes calling in Downing Street, expect the claws to be out. OR at very least a warning hiss.
    Yes I was concerned about that. @Number10cat is a light comedy twitter that humanises the institution and the PM. That's incompatible with partisanship, and even worse when referring to foreign dignitaries, especially allies. This is just stupid.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,792
    MJW said:

    Nigelb said:

    Southern Baptist agency tangles itself in knots over Biden’s ‘selfless act’

    https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/23/southern-baptist-biden-00170764
    In under 48 hours, the head of the staunchly conservative public-policy arm of the Southern Baptist Convention rankled fellow Baptists by applauding President Joe Biden’s “selfless act” of withdrawing his candidacy for reelection. Then, his agency reported he was fired — and now they have reaffirmed his leadership.

    The head-spinning series of events started Sunday, but by Tuesday morning, the SBC’s Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission announced that no, leader Brent Leatherwood wasn’t fired. Rather, he has the full support of his top board members — though its chair resigned and apologized for the erroneous announcement...

    Sounds exactly like the Green Party and its giving in to its influx of cranks.
    Thay won two or more seats in 2024. Apparently. :)
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,451
    edited July 23
    Andy_JS said:

    Useless fact: 1% of Labour's 5 year mandate in office has been used up. 18.5 days out of around 1826.25 days.

    It amazing how fast time flies...

    It is why parties need to hit the ground running. If you don't start pushing through your big policy ideas straight away, they won't get actually to the coalface until end of year 1 and little chance you can claim any benefits from them by year 5.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,178
    edited July 23
    darkage said:

    Owen. This is why.


    Harry Cole
    @MrHarryCole
    ·
    2h
    Ruthless Starmer strikes again.

    And rightly so to secure his authority. Clown days are over.

    Apsana Begum, Richard Burgon, Ian Byrne, Imran Hussain, Rebecca Long-Bailey, John McDonnell and Zarah Sultana all suspended for six months.

    Fair play…

    It seems highly probable that Corbyn's pro gaza group and Ref UK will start to pick up defections.
    I can't see any of that rabble having common cause with Ref UK... On the other hand, it looks like a nearly clean sweep of all Corbin's idiot mates (although thin ice skating specialist, Ms D Abbot seems to have had a particularly convenient immovable prior engagement).
  • MJWMJW Posts: 1,723
    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    It's notable how she seemed like such a boring person as VP, whereas now seems much more interesting.
    Simple, no? The VP serves the president and has to follow his lead - with the exception of Cheney. Unless they are already a nationally established figure, like Biden was under Obama, they're always going to seem entirely on the undercard. As are following the principal's strategy not their own.

    That goes doubly for Biden/Harris as due to age and strategy Biden's team's plan was to offer him as a softly spoken father of the nation figure, which necessitated Harris not really doing or saying much. As you couldn't have Harris going round attracting attention and speculation she was the real one in charge or that she was being silly.

    Now she can play to what her perceived strengths are - some of which is having something more of a cultural and personal hinterland than many politicians - which might not win her the thing but make her much more interesting to watch.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,792
    Maya Rudolph as Kamala in the SNL skit VP debate in 2020 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xI_lxFv203I
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,165
    edited July 24
    New article from one of the best essayists out there imo, Theodore Dalrymple.

    "The proportion of the total electorate that abstained, 40 percent, was the second highest since the 1880s. This didn’t really surprise me. No doubt there were many among the 40 percent who simply, or habitually, could not be bothered to cast their vote; but before the election, I heard many people who usually voted say that they would not vote this time because of their disenchantment with the political class as a whole (not that they have been exactly enchanted with it for a long time). In vain did I argue that, bad as politicians might be as a class of human beings, there were always better and worse among them, even if marginally so: it is not possible for everyone at the same time to be the worst. I found, however, that the disgust ran so deep that there was no convincing them that they ought to vote."

    https://lawliberty.org/a-crisis-of-democratic-legitimacy/
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 4,488
    edited July 24
    viewcode said:

    MattW said:

    I don't think I've done my photo for the day.

    My new favourite genre:

    Americans trying Coleman's English Mustard


    https://x.com/Zaphod2042/status/1812541685840089419

    via Larry the Cat.

    Who has also commented on JD Vance's assaults on Cat Ladies.

    Larry the Cat @Number10cat
    Trump's pet pooch James Vance has attacked cat ladies, which in turn is an attack on cats. I've got bad news for you Jimmy: women vote, cat lovers vote. You need to find some charisma and substance real fast or it's obvious who'll be getting the blame from Daddy in November...

    https://x.com/Number10cat/status/1815757873818845455

    Suspect that Larry the Cat's account has been hacked. Hardly seemingly for a member of HMG to be engaging in a political cat fight beyond the realm.

    Trust Larry to maintain a dignified silence, However, IF J,D. Vance ever comes calling in Downing Street, expect the claws to be out. OR at very least a warning hiss.
    Yes I was concerned about that. @Number10cat is a light comedy twitter that humanises the institution and the PM. That's incompatible with partisanship, and even worse when referring to foreign dignitaries, especially allies. This is just stupid.
    Someone, I forget who, once remarked: "Every popular twitter account, if it is not explicitly rightwing, will eventually become explicitly leftwing."
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 21,792
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,165
    On Dave Leip's famous prediction page, Michigan has just flipped from GOP to Dem.

    https://uselectionatlas.org/PRED/PRESIDENT/2024/pred.php
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,424
    Andy_JS said:

    Useless fact: 1% of Labour's 5 year mandate in office has been used up. 18.5 days out of around 1826.25 days.

    And not a single new cycle lane. Hmph.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,320
    This kind of attack ad against Harris could be effective:

    https://x.com/davemccormickpa/status/1815894904650047929
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
    Fascinatingly, both her parents (mother India, father Jamaica) were subjects of the British Empire. She’s very British, in a peculiar way

    Our rainy archipelago continues to cast an outsize shadow on the world

    This does NOT mean she will be Brit-o-philic, of course. Quite possibly the opposite
    Yea, it can go either way. Obama had a Kenhan parent didn't he, and hated us. Trump had a Scottish parent, and didn't much like us. Neither of Biden's parents were British, and he loathed us.
    Maybe it can't go either way.
    I think it's more that Britain just isn't considered that important in the U.S., outside very particular areas of intelligencce-sharing and co-operation, and which is a fact that is very difficult for the British Right to accept or integrate with a particular worldview.
    Almost none of the Presidents listed below have actusally hated Britain, but they just weren't particularly interested.

    Ironically it's actually the countries like France, Germany and Italy that always consider Britain important, and we all know where the UK Right has gone
    with that.
    Yes, there's a desperate neediness to our end of "the Special Relationship".

    They're just not that into us.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,190

    This kind of attack ad against Harris could be effective:

    https://x.com/davemccormickpa/status/1815894904650047929

    Maybe, maybe not.

    The quality of the attack ads is top drawer. You like yours, I particularly like Lincoln Project ads. Do they change the narrative? I suspect the Border might be the most effective.

    On the other hand Kamala's USP is she's not 80 and she's Trump or Biden.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231
    Foxy said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
    Fascinatingly, both her parents (mother India, father Jamaica) were subjects of the British Empire. She’s very British, in a peculiar way

    Our rainy archipelago continues to cast an outsize shadow on the world

    This does NOT mean she will be Brit-o-philic, of course. Quite possibly the opposite
    Yea, it can go either way. Obama had a Kenhan parent didn't he, and hated us. Trump had a Scottish parent, and didn't much like us. Neither of Biden's parents were British, and he loathed us.
    Maybe it can't go either way.
    I think it's more that Britain just isn't considered that important in the U.S., outside very particular areas of intelligencce-sharing and co-operation, and which is a fact that is very difficult for the British Right to accept or integrate with a particular worldview.
    Almost none of the Presidents listed below have actusally hated Britain, but they just weren't particularly interested.

    Ironically it's actually the countries like France, Germany and Italy that always consider Britain important, and we all know where the UK Right has gone
    with that.
    Yes, there's a desperate neediness to our end of "the Special Relationship".

    They're just not that into us.
    It would be lovely if that were in any way true, but it isn't. From John Kerry coming here to 'warn' us not to open a new coking coal mine (when the USA has hundreds of coal mines), to Joe Biden making astonishing snarling public interventions about Liz Truss's changes to the top rate of tax (when it would still have been more than America's top rate of tax), US politicians seem to take a close and incredibly overbearing interest in British domestic policy.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,316
    Foxy said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
    Fascinatingly, both her parents (mother India, father Jamaica) were subjects of the British Empire. She’s very British, in a peculiar way

    Our rainy archipelago continues to cast an outsize shadow on the world

    This does NOT mean she will be Brit-o-philic, of course. Quite possibly the opposite
    Yea, it can go either way. Obama had a Kenhan parent didn't he, and hated us. Trump had a Scottish parent, and didn't much like us. Neither of Biden's parents were British, and he loathed us.
    Maybe it can't go either way.
    I think it's more that Britain just isn't considered that important in the U.S., outside very particular areas of intelligencce-sharing and co-operation, and which is a fact that is very difficult for the British Right to accept or integrate with a particular worldview.
    Almost none of the Presidents listed below have actusally hated Britain, but they just weren't particularly interested.

    Ironically it's actually the countries like France, Germany and Italy that always consider Britain important, and we all know where the UK Right has gone
    with that.
    Yes, there's a desperate neediness to our end of "the Special Relationship".

    They're just not that into us.
    We suffer from not telling them to piss off more frequently.

    Door mats dont get respect.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,316
    Cicero said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
    Fascinatingly, both her parents (mother India, father Jamaica) were subjects of the British Empire. She’s very British, in a peculiar way

    Our rainy archipelago continues to cast an outsize shadow on the world

    This does NOT mean she will be Brit-o-philic, of course. Quite possibly the opposite
    Yea, it can go either way. Obama had a Kenhan parent didn't he, and hated us. Trump had a Scottish parent, and didn't much like us. Neither of Biden's parents were British, and he loathed us.
    Maybe it can't go either way.
    I disagree. I think Trump is quite the Anglophile

    The others, yes
    Well, it's certainly not nutual, is it?

    Trump represents most of the human failings particularly loathed in Btitain. Charmless, graceless, humourless, a bully and a coward. A crook, a coarse and vulgar braggart who would never stand his round...the list is long.
    So America's Gordon Brown then.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774

    This kind of attack ad against Harris could be effective:

    https://x.com/davemccormickpa/status/1815894904650047929

    Maybe, maybe not.

    The quality of the attack ads is top drawer. You like yours, I particularly like Lincoln Project ads. Do they change the narrative? I suspect the Border might be the most effective.

    On the other hand Kamala's USP is she's not 80 and she's Trump or Biden.
    The biggest opportunity is to project a message of hope (cf. Obama). Trump won’t be able to cope with that; his message is essentially negative and destructive.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774

    Foxy said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Well, one thing is for sure now. Kamala will bring far more energy and vibrancy to the Dem campaign than Biden had any hope of mustering even on one of his good days.

    Just watched the Harris speech.

    It’s doing nothing to contradict my view that I’ve had for some time that Vice President was not the right role for her.

    She is a world away from that awkward figure who sorta hid away and popped up at the odd event to spout stream of consciousness gobbledygook. She looks like she’s found her stride.

    She is never going to be the greatest orator, and don’t get me wrong there’s a lot of road ahead, but the contrast is really stark. Makes you wonder where this Kamala Harris has been hiding for 4 years.


    I'm getting a real "Everyone suddenly burst out singing" vibe which I have never had from politics before. Sort of thing the dimmer lefties apparently got from the smarmy murderous Blairfest of 1997.
    Some of the tumescent (quite literally in some cases) posts about Kamala Harris on PB today are best read on an empty stomach.

    I have nothing against the lady, she seems quite nice. But let's rein it in just a tad.
    It is the Kamalagasm. And it’s as awks as anyone climaxing in public

    However, in this case it can be forgiven. Whatever your opinions, the prospect of Trump v Biden 2.0 was fucking dismal as shit. So I share some of the ebullient relief

    I still deeply dislike both parties. The Dems for their Wokeness, Trump because he’s Trump. But I sense Woke is in retreat and Trump is still an evil old fuck? Who knows…

    I’d like a sane hard right but NATO-friendly GOP candidate. That’s not on offer. The offer is Trump

    Eesh. I’d reluctantly vote for Kamala
    Either way, the incoming President won't dislike the UK as much as the outgoing one, so that's nice.
    Is Kamala not a Britophobe then? That'll be a nice change.
    Fascinatingly, both her parents (mother India, father Jamaica) were subjects of the British Empire. She’s very British, in a peculiar way

    Our rainy archipelago continues to cast an outsize shadow on the world

    This does NOT mean she will be Brit-o-philic, of course. Quite possibly the opposite
    Yea, it can go either way. Obama had a Kenhan parent didn't he, and hated us. Trump had a Scottish parent, and didn't much like us. Neither of Biden's parents were British, and he loathed us.
    Maybe it can't go either way.
    I think it's more that Britain just isn't considered that important in the U.S., outside very particular areas of intelligencce-sharing and co-operation, and which is a fact that is very difficult for the British Right to accept or integrate with a particular worldview.
    Almost none of the Presidents listed below have actusally hated Britain, but they just weren't particularly interested.

    Ironically it's actually the countries like France, Germany and Italy that always consider Britain important, and we all know where the UK Right has gone
    with that.
    Yes, there's a desperate neediness to our end of "the Special Relationship".

    They're just not that into us.
    We suffer from not telling them to piss off more frequently.

    Door mats dont get respect.
    The unbalanced extradition issue that David Davis does so much to challenge is a most egregious example.
  • Interesting article in The Times by Danny Finkelstein and worthy of a thread header. Why were the polls so wrong on July 4th?
    https://www.thetimes.com/comment/columnists/article/pollsters-were-so-wrong-they-need-a-rethink-l9f0w3zlk
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,736
    Surely Vance's former anti-Trump views were already well known when Trump picked him?

  • MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,797
    Really not a fan of the new intolerance in British politics. Dissent has always been a legitimate element of parliamentary politics and in the past was indulged. The ongoing war on the left will ultimately hurt Labour, just as the Tory war on the wets hurt them. A high proportion of core Labour supporters will have a degree of sympathy with the rebels.
  • MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,797
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    100,000+ is quite the claim. And a fairly unsubstantiated one I suspect.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,062

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    100,000+ is quite the claim. And a fairly unsubstantiated one I suspect.
    Quite, but never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,700
    Good morning, everyone.

    Mr. Monksfield, was it a three line whip? I would've thought backing a finance measure in the Labour manifesto would be.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162

    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:

    Nunu5 said:


    Kyle Griffin
    @kylegriffin1
    NEW Reuters/Ipsos poll:

    TWO-WAY
    Kamala Harris 44%
    Donald Trump 42%

    THREE-WAY
    Kamala Harris 42%
    Donald Trump 38%
    RFK Jr. 8%

    MoE +/-3%

    And we’re off. I do suspect in the end it’s not going to be close. As I’ve always said what does a convicted felon who’s had to pay millions to a woman he’s sexually assaulted and who was prepared to let a mob murder his own running mate have to offer swing voters?
    Morning Consult over almost the same timeframe

    Trump 47%
    Harris 45%

    https://pro.morningconsult.com/analysis/kamala-harris-biden-campaign-polling

    For the white working class Trump offers tariffs on imports while pushing US goods, cuts in immigration and anti wokeism.

    For the wealthy suburbanites he offers tax cuts, for Jews he offers to stand up for Israel, for evangelicals he enabled the end of Roe v Wade
    Tariffs on imports are taxes paid by consumers of those imports. You do get that don't you?

    Kamala's husband and step children are Jewish. It's not going to be easy to make out she is an anti-semite.

    Indeed there was another awesome Lawyer with a Jewish spouse that recently did very well in an election...
    Wait, Kamala Harris is a stepmom?
    O M G
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    BBC News - Children returned to family after Leeds disorder
    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyj41w72vn8o

    What a messy situation.

    So those 4 children were all under court orders since April to stay with extended family, and last Thursday was because there was a fear of them being removed from the country.

    "The court heard the children were all foreign nationals without settled status in the UK, and it could be difficult for them to return to Britain."

    Why are we trying to keep them in the country?, no doubt at taxpayers expense for welfare payments as well as all the agencies time.

    Not like they are going to North Korea. I thought Romania are esteemed allies who subscribe to all human rights nostrums as EU members, so let them go, send Romanian Embassy a report that they are going and tell them the Romanian Social Services might want to read it then close the case.

    Of course a lot of work and money for various professionals and lawyers at
    taxpayers expense if they are prevented from leaving.
    Because - and I don’t know the facts of this case - they are vulnerable children at risk.

    There is a moral duty to intervene to protect them
    The UK government also has a moral duty to not impoverish the citizens of the UK by pointlessly and expensively trying to better the lives of everyone in the world; and also to not destroy the urban culture and trust of UK society by importing seven billion people a year, many of them openly contemptuous of our values

    I fear these other duties have been forgotten to such an extent the UK is now beyond saving - for its own citizens
    Don't be silly. You really, really can judge a society by how it treats its prisoners and a fortiori by what lengths it goes to to prevent the abuse, torture, murder etc of its children (and these children are as much citizens as anyone else is)
    Yes indeed. We allowed 100,000+ underage white girls to be raped by racist Muslim grooming gangs, because we were afraid of “inflaming community tensions”. THAT is how Britain tries to “prevent the abuse of its children”. By literally ignoring the greatest crime in a century
    There are 220,000 people in Rochdale, more or less. Are you suggesting nearly half its population are survivors of this sexual abuse case or are you pulling figures out of your arse for effect, to inflame tensions yourself? I’m going to assume the latter.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,069

    Good morning, everyone.

    Mr. Monksfield, was it a three line whip? I would've thought backing a finance measure in the Labour manifesto would be.

    King's Speech vote is understood to be a vote of confidence. Slightly weird because of the amendment thing, but it's an reasonable point.

    Still, the Witless Whipless Wonders have got the publicity and irrelevance they crave, and now they can say whatever they like.
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