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It’s getting very messy – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,158
edited August 4 in General
imageIt’s getting very messy – politicalbetting.com

BREAKING: President Joe Biden's campaign chair acknowledges support "slippage" but says he's "absolutely" staying in the race and can beat Donald Trump. https://t.co/UL0OazQwWf

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,598
    Logan Roy is my spirit animal.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    Reportedly, every Democratic Senator but one wants Biden to step down. Similarly with the House leadership (and Pelosi).
    And polls show two thirds of Democratic voters think it time for him to call time.

    I suspect today's announcements are last gasp efforts from a Biden team reluctant to let go. Let's see what Biden decides over the weekend.

    Place your bets.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,157
    I know Tester has support but I think he's definitely testing it by suggesting Biden AND Harris need to go. I think he'll probably lose Montana now.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    Additionally, apparently Whitmer and Newson have 'let it be known' that they're not interested in the VP slot.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    Pulpstar said:

    I know Tester has support but I think he's definitely testing it by suggesting Biden AND Harris need to go. I think he'll probably lose Montana now.

    My money is on Harris getting the nod.
    The Tester idea seems very much a niche view.

    But hedging your bets is sensible in such a febrile market.
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,587
    Fortunately, Ladbrokes is down today so I'm not really tempted to do anything with respect to the Dem nominations.

    I do feel that a couple of quid on Buttigieg and Obama are not the hail Mary's they might have been a month ago.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    Leclerc has totalled his car for the day.
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 1,987
    I would put a bet on, but Ladbrokes is, well, broken. :)
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405
    Nigelb said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I know Tester has support but I think he's definitely testing it by suggesting Biden AND Harris need to go. I think he'll probably lose Montana now.

    My money is on Harris getting the nod.
    The Tester idea seems very much a niche view.

    But hedging your bets is sensible in such a febrile market.
    Strong nom determination energy from Tester
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    New favourites for the VP slot, with similar odds to Harris:
    Shapiro; Cooper: Beshear.

    Mark Kelly a little longer.
  • MisterBedfordshireMisterBedfordshire Posts: 2,252
    edited July 19
    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.


  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    Just put a quid on Beshear for president at 750, because why not ?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.

    Future increases are likely to be renewables with storage, though.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,808
    His position is increasingly untenable. Yes, there is no mechanism to force him to leave but the party is now spilling over to pretty much open revolt at this stage.

    To be honest this is now damaging the chances of the party whether he stays or goes.

    I think people like Pelosi, Schumer and Jeffries have tried to be discreet but if this goes on I actually think they will go over the top and openly tell him to go.
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405
    Crowdstrike down 9% now the market is open. Massive win for anyone who followed my tip that it was a screaming buy at -20% premarket
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,539

    His position is increasingly untenable. Yes, there is no mechanism to force him to leave but the party is now spilling over to pretty much open revolt at this stage.

    To be honest this is now damaging the chances of the party whether he stays or goes.

    I think people like Pelosi, Schumer and Jeffries have tried to be discreet but if this goes on I actually think they will go over the top and openly tell him to go.

    Oddly enough I think Biden would probably have got the message if he was 10 years younger, but sometimes people who didn't use to be particularly stubborn can become more so when they reach a certain age. Bit of a stereotype I know.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,110

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.


    That said, there are some pretty huge savings to come from the move to heat pumps and away from air conditioning/traditional central heating.
  • Nigelb said:

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.

    Future increases are likely to be renewables with storage, though.
    We just need that technology (scalabale to GW level economically to be invented and rolled out (a bit like Fusion).

    If either of those existed then the problem goes away and everyone goes for renewables because it is an economic no brainer.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,808
    edited July 19
    Nigelb said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I know Tester has support but I think he's definitely testing it by suggesting Biden AND Harris need to go. I think he'll probably lose Montana now.

    My money is on Harris getting the nod.
    The Tester idea seems very much a niche view.

    But hedging your bets is sensible in such a febrile market.
    There must be a slight possibility that Harris actually turns down the nomination or stays on the ticket as VP and there is a contested convention or more likely the establishment coalesces around an alternative candidate. But it does seem very unlikely that, being essentially gifted the nomination on a plate (something she’ll never get again), Harris would step aside.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,110
    Nigelb said:

    Additionally, apparently Whitmer and Newson have 'let it be known' that they're not interested in the VP slot.

    Liars.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,110
    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    rcs1000 said:

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.

    That said, there are some pretty huge savings to come from the move to heat pumps and away from air conditioning/traditional central heating.
    But that's still going to need an increase in electricity generated.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Additionally, apparently Whitmer and Newson have 'let it be known' that they're not interested in the VP slot.

    Liars.
    Are they ?
    In Newsom's case it's probably a recognition that he's not going to be anyone's pick for VP, and his best chance is to try for the presidency - either now, or in four years if the Democrats do lose in November.

    Might be something similar going on with Whitmer.

    Certainly they both want the top slot.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,361
    edited July 19
    Wonder what the pro Israel warmongers here will make of it.

    The ones who think IDF indiscriminate killing is okay, but Hamas not okay.

    Hardly a shock this https://x.com/frances_coppola/status/1814307732968690027?s=61
  • rcs1000 said:

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.


    That said, there are some pretty huge savings to come from the move to heat pumps and away from air conditioning/traditional central heating.
    Yes, if it ever happens. UK Roll out isn't going exactly to plan.

    if you have a nice big garden to install ground source (and the money to do that and rip up your floor to install underfloor heating) then happy days.

    If you live in a terrace in a small yard and want to install a reverse airconditioning unit on the wall next to your neighbours bedroom window that absolutely eats electricity in cold weather, not so much.
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405
    Andy_JS said:

    His position is increasingly untenable. Yes, there is no mechanism to force him to leave but the party is now spilling over to pretty much open revolt at this stage.

    To be honest this is now damaging the chances of the party whether he stays or goes.

    I think people like Pelosi, Schumer and Jeffries have tried to be discreet but if this goes on I actually think they will go over the top and openly tell him to go.

    Oddly enough I think Biden would probably have got the message if he was 10 years younger, but sometimes people who didn't use to be particularly stubborn can become more so when they reach a certain age. Bit of a stereotype I know.
    There's a parallel in drunk driving. You go from ok to drive, to not ok to drive and aware you are not, to very much not ok to drive and blind to the fact.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,747

    Nigelb said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I know Tester has support but I think he's definitely testing it by suggesting Biden AND Harris need to go. I think he'll probably lose Montana now.

    My money is on Harris getting the nod.
    The Tester idea seems very much a niche view.

    But hedging your bets is sensible in such a febrile market.
    There must be a slight possibility that Harris actually turns down the nomination or stays on the ticket as VP and there is a contested convention or more likely the establishment coalesces around an alternative candidate. But it does seem very unlikely that, being essentially gifted the nomination on a plate (something she’ll never get again), Harris would step aside.
    Well, much like Biden is doing so much damage to the Dems, a decline of the nomination by Harris would be equally as damaging. Who knows if she wants it, but if there's any sense in the world she's going to get it.

    As I've said previously I think she can win and win easily. I would love to read her thoughts on all this though, and her winning rather delays that.
  • Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.

    That said, there are some pretty huge savings to come from the move to heat pumps and away from air conditioning/traditional central heating.
    But that's still going to need an increase in electricity generated.
    The figures include gas. So even if elec goes up overall it goes down due to the greater efficiency of electric to heat versus gas to heat.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    And are only going to get cheaper.
    Either steadily, or very quickly*.

    *See, for example, the anode free sodium battery, which would be really cheap.
    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41560-024-01569-9
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Additionally, apparently Whitmer and Newson have 'let it be known' that they're not interested in the VP slot.

    Liars.
    I thought that, but the point is surely that VP to Harris is a bar (legal or de facto) to opposing her for nom for P.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.

    That said, there are some pretty huge savings to come from the move to heat pumps and away from air conditioning/traditional central heating.
    But that's still going to need an increase in electricity generated.
    The figures include gas. So even if elec goes up overall it goes down due to the greater efficiency of electric to heat versus gas to heat.
    Agreed.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,651

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.
    Higher insulation standards still feeding through though.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,651
    Andy_JS said:

    His position is increasingly untenable. Yes, there is no mechanism to force him to leave but the party is now spilling over to pretty much open revolt at this stage.

    To be honest this is now damaging the chances of the party whether he stays or goes.

    I think people like Pelosi, Schumer and Jeffries have tried to be discreet but if this goes on I actually think they will go over the top and openly tell him to go.

    Oddly enough I think Biden would probably have got the message if he was 10 years younger, but sometimes people who didn't use to be particularly stubborn can become more so when they reach a certain age. Bit of a stereotype I know.
    You met my late mum then?
  • MisterBedfordshireMisterBedfordshire Posts: 2,252
    edited July 19
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,651
    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.

    That said, there are some pretty huge savings to come from the move to heat pumps and away from air conditioning/traditional central heating.
    But that's still going to need an increase in electricity generated.
    We're now into one of those bizarre PB 'arguing about different things' loops. The original challenge was whether the total UK energy requirement was going to come down, regardless of the mix of provision.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,102
    edited July 19
    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405
    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I know Tester has support but I think he's definitely testing it by suggesting Biden AND Harris need to go. I think he'll probably lose Montana now.

    My money is on Harris getting the nod.
    The Tester idea seems very much a niche view.

    But hedging your bets is sensible in such a febrile market.
    There must be a slight possibility that Harris actually turns down the nomination or stays on the ticket as VP and there is a contested convention or more likely the establishment coalesces around an alternative candidate. But it does seem very unlikely that, being essentially gifted the nomination on a plate (something she’ll never get again), Harris would step aside.
    Well, much like Biden is doing so much damage to the Dems, a decline of the nomination by Harris would be equally as damaging. Who knows if she wants it, but if there's any sense in the world she's going to get it.

    As I've said previously I think she can win and win easily. I would love to read her thoughts on all this though, and her winning rather delays that.
    It would be a calamity surely, an admission that for 4 years the USA was one elderly heartbeat away from a president who in her own view was not up to the job.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,772

    His position is increasingly untenable. Yes, there is no mechanism to force him to leave but the party is now spilling over to pretty much open revolt at this stage.

    To be honest this is now damaging the chances of the party whether he stays or goes.

    I think people like Pelosi, Schumer and Jeffries have tried to be discreet but if this goes on I actually think they will go over the top and openly tell him to go.

    If they do it, they need to do it next week. If it runs into August, then they'll simply run out of time for many logistical and legal reasons.
  • MattW said:

    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT

    Compared with the Glasgow Bin Lorry driver he was harshly treated.

    This sort of thing makes me wonder who is in what lodge.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,361
    MattW said:

    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT

    I’d be interested to know too, as a cyclist. That seems odd to say the least.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    Cobalt is becoming almost irrelevant to future bulk battery production.
    There's no shortage of lithium.

    And various solid state technologies are well beyond 'lab concept'.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,569
    Nigelb said:

    Leclerc has totalled his car for the day.

    He was blooming lucky there. That could have taken out all four corners of the car.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,093

    His position is increasingly untenable. Yes, there is no mechanism to force him to leave but the party is now spilling over to pretty much open revolt at this stage.

    To be honest this is now damaging the chances of the party whether he stays or goes.

    I think people like Pelosi, Schumer and Jeffries have tried to be discreet but if this goes on I actually think they will go over the top and openly tell him to go.

    He can't be the candidate when it's clear his party (inc their voters) don't want him. He has to cave.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,772

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I know Tester has support but I think he's definitely testing it by suggesting Biden AND Harris need to go. I think he'll probably lose Montana now.

    My money is on Harris getting the nod.
    The Tester idea seems very much a niche view.

    But hedging your bets is sensible in such a febrile market.
    There must be a slight possibility that Harris actually turns down the nomination or stays on the ticket as VP and there is a contested convention or more likely the establishment coalesces around an alternative candidate. But it does seem very unlikely that, being essentially gifted the nomination on a plate (something she’ll never get again), Harris would step aside.
    Well, much like Biden is doing so much damage to the Dems, a decline of the nomination by Harris would be equally as damaging. Who knows if she wants it, but if there's any sense in the world she's going to get it.

    As I've said previously I think she can win and win easily. I would love to read her thoughts on all this though, and her winning rather delays that.
    It would be a calamity surely, an admission that for 4 years the USA was one elderly heartbeat away from a president who in her own view was not up to the job.
    Yep, she has to at least fight for it.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,772
    Just wondering if it came to it, could a nuclear option be the 25th Amendment?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    Meanwhile, if you want to prepare psychologically for four years (and counting) of Trump again, I highly recommend season 4 of The Boys.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,808
    edited July 19
    Andy_JS said:

    His position is increasingly untenable. Yes, there is no mechanism to force him to leave but the party is now spilling over to pretty much open revolt at this stage.

    To be honest this is now damaging the chances of the party whether he stays or goes.

    I think people like Pelosi, Schumer and Jeffries have tried to be discreet but if this goes on I actually think they will go over the top and openly tell him to go.

    Oddly enough I think Biden would probably have got the message if he was 10 years younger, but sometimes people who didn't use to be particularly stubborn can become more so when they reach a certain age. Bit of a stereotype I know.
    I think he has always been a stubborn character and that will not have improved with age. Nor will the fact of him being counted out and coming back before have helped (though this time is clearly different to us as outside observers).

    There is also the fact that he is exceptionally close with his family, perhaps a bit uncomfortably so. I have not really engaged with the rumours about Jill Biden keeping him in the race because she hates Kamala Harris and wants to stay as First Lady, because to me when I first read it it smacked of the classic Lady MacBeth it’s-got-to-be-the-manipulative-woman lazy misogyny (even more so because it includes -gasp- salacious rumours about two women not getting on!). But it does seem there is an indication that he relies very strongly on his family circle, perhaps to a fault, and if they are telling him they’re backing him it might be making it harder for him to read the room.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,110

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,569
    Well done to Kavem Hodge.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,772

    Andy_JS said:

    His position is increasingly untenable. Yes, there is no mechanism to force him to leave but the party is now spilling over to pretty much open revolt at this stage.

    To be honest this is now damaging the chances of the party whether he stays or goes.

    I think people like Pelosi, Schumer and Jeffries have tried to be discreet but if this goes on I actually think they will go over the top and openly tell him to go.

    Oddly enough I think Biden would probably have got the message if he was 10 years younger, but sometimes people who didn't use to be particularly stubborn can become more so when they reach a certain age. Bit of a stereotype I know.
    I think he has always been a stubborn character and that will not have improved with age. Nor will the fact of him being counted out and coming back before have helped (though this time is clearly different to us as outside observers).

    There is also the fact that he is exceptionally close with his family, perhaps a bit uncomfortably so. I have not really engaged with the rumours about Jill Biden keeping him in the race because she hates Kamala Harris and wants to stay as First Lady, because to me when I first read it it smacked of the classic Lady MacBeth it’s-got-to-be-the-manipulative-woman lazy misogyny (even more so because it includes -gasp- salacious rumours about two women not getting on!). But it does seem there is an indication that he relies very strongly on his family circle, perhaps to a fault, and if they are telling him they’re backing him it might be making it harder for him to read the room.
    I do also wonder about access to Biden, and who actually gets to speak with him. If the Biden family are gatekeeping and controlling him to a degree, maybe he's not fully aware of a lot of stuff (which is highly worrying in itself). How much of the media does he engage with?
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,539
    Travel expert Simon Calder — today was expected to be the busiest day in UK travel since 2019. The IT problem couldn't have happened at a worse time.
  • FeersumEnjineeyaFeersumEnjineeya Posts: 4,408
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    As does recycling.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    And there's a huge amount of known, unexploited lithium reserves.
    As an example, the US probably one of the world's largest known extractable deposit, and they haven't yet even started mining it.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thacker_Pass_Lithium_Mine

    Interestingly, ARPA-E, the US energy technology equivalent of DARPA is funding a few projects for innovative mining technology, in the hope of reviving US mining which has been undercut in recent years by low cost producers like China.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,102
    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT

    I’d be interested to know too, as a cyclist. That seems odd to say the least.
    Looking around, Scotland have only just started doing sentencing guidelines a la England, so I wonder if it is judicial discretion, or under a law which has not followed Westmnster yet.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.

    That said, there are some pretty huge savings to come from the move to heat pumps and away from air conditioning/traditional central heating.
    But that's still going to need an increase in electricity generated.
    We're now into one of those bizarre PB 'arguing about different things' loops. The original challenge was whether the total UK energy requirement was going to come down, regardless of the mix of provision.
    I wasn't arguing, FWIW.
    Just pointing out that we will need a significantly larger electric grid than we have now.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,874
    edited July 19
    Biden is playing this cleverly. Dems who want a more electable Democrat nominee than Biden are focusing on rustbelt governors like Shapiro, Whitmer and Evers.

    However if they replace Biden with one of those 3 governors that means shafting Harris and her black supporters who want her to be nominee instead. So basically Biden can play the 2 wings off against each other up to and through the convention. Say he keeps Harris as VP if his nomination confirmed at the convention while also retaining some of the rustbelt appeal he had in 2020 Harris lacks but rustbelt governors do have
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,940
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    Ah there you are. Some time ago you said that a particular earbud (Nothing?) was exceptional - do you happen to remember the model?

    tia
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,874
    Pulpstar said:

    I know Tester has support but I think he's definitely testing it by suggesting Biden AND Harris need to go. I think he'll probably lose Montana now.

    Unlikely as Montana didn't vote for Biden and Harris even in 2020
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,110
    TOPPING said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    Ah there you are. Some time ago you said that a particular earbud (Nothing?) was exceptional - do you happen to remember the model?

    tia
    Yes, the Nothing (a) earbuds

    They are superb
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,110

    Andy_JS said:

    His position is increasingly untenable. Yes, there is no mechanism to force him to leave but the party is now spilling over to pretty much open revolt at this stage.

    To be honest this is now damaging the chances of the party whether he stays or goes.

    I think people like Pelosi, Schumer and Jeffries have tried to be discreet but if this goes on I actually think they will go over the top and openly tell him to go.

    Oddly enough I think Biden would probably have got the message if he was 10 years younger, but sometimes people who didn't use to be particularly stubborn can become more so when they reach a certain age. Bit of a stereotype I know.
    I think he has always been a stubborn character and that will not have improved with age. Nor will the fact of him being counted out and coming back before have helped (though this time is clearly different to us as outside observers).

    There is also the fact that he is exceptionally close with his family, perhaps a bit uncomfortably so. I have not really engaged with the rumours about Jill Biden keeping him in the race because she hates Kamala Harris and wants to stay as First Lady, because to me when I first read it it smacked of the classic Lady MacBeth it’s-got-to-be-the-manipulative-woman lazy misogyny (even more so because it includes -gasp- salacious rumours about two women not getting on!). But it does seem there is an indication that he relies very strongly on his family circle, perhaps to a fault, and if they are telling him they’re backing him it might be making it harder for him to read the room.
    I do also wonder about access to Biden, and who actually gets to speak with him. If the Biden family are gatekeeping and controlling him to a degree, maybe he's not fully aware of a lot of stuff (which is highly worrying in itself). How much of the media does he engage with?
    He loves Nickelodeon
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,110

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    As does recycling.
    True, that.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,940
    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    Ah there you are. Some time ago you said that a particular earbud (Nothing?) was exceptional - do you happen to remember the model?

    tia
    Yes, the Nothing (a) earbuds

    They are superb
    tyvm
  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,963

    Just wondering if it came to it, could a nuclear option be the 25th Amendment?

    Biden can contest it. If he does, and Harris and the cabinet insist, it gets decided by Congress. Which would give the Republicans an interesting choice.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,806
    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    And there's a huge amount of known, unexploited lithium reserves.
    As an example, the US probably one of the world's largest known extractable deposit, and they haven't yet even started mining it.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thacker_Pass_Lithium_Mine

    Interestingly, ARPA-E, the US energy technology equivalent of DARPA is funding a few projects for innovative mining technology, in the hope of reviving US mining which has been undercut in recent years by low cost producers like China.
    What happens when the lithium runs out?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,809
    MattW said:

    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT

    I’d be interested to know too, as a cyclist. That seems odd to say the least.
    Looking around, Scotland have only just started doing sentencing guidelines a la England, so I wonder if it is judicial discretion, or under a law which has not followed Westmnster yet.
    Eh? Been doing it for years as far as I know (as much whined about on PB by those who can't bear to see different parts of the UK doing things differently). The SSC was founded in 2015. Are you thinking of offence-specific guidelines?

    https://www.scottishsentencingcouncil.org.uk/media/ytuhsy0m/statutory-offences-of-causing-death-by-driving-sentencing-guideline.pdf

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-46032207
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,707
    Here in Finland they're saying that the US president is going to be horrible*
    :smile:
    * they could well be right. Kamala really is horrible in Finnish
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,543
    edited July 19
    rcs1000 said:

    TOPPING said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    Ah there you are. Some time ago you said that a particular earbud (Nothing?) was exceptional - do you happen to remember the model?

    tia
    Yes, the Nothing (a) earbuds

    They are superb
    I don't know if you saw the post, but the other day I raved about Shokz Openswim Pro bone-conduction headphones. They're blooming brilliant for swimming and running.

    https://uk.shokz.com/products/openswim-pro

    (edit: got the incorrect product page...)
  • Jim_MillerJim_Miller Posts: 2,998
    Related to the topic: People have begun to call J. D. Vance a "shapeshifter". It's not a compliment: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shapeshifting

    (Those looking for a modern fictional description of a "shapeshifter" can find one here: https://www.amazon.com/Shape-Shifter-Tony-Hillerman/dp/0060563478

    I enjoyed reading the book, and would put it in the top half of Hillerman detective stories.)
  • TweedledeeTweedledee Posts: 1,405

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    And there's a huge amount of known, unexploited lithium reserves.
    As an example, the US probably one of the world's largest known extractable deposit, and they haven't yet even started mining it.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thacker_Pass_Lithium_Mine

    Interestingly, ARPA-E, the US energy technology equivalent of DARPA is funding a few projects for innovative mining technology, in the hope of reviving US mining which has been undercut in recent years by low cost producers like China.
    What happens when the lithium runs out?
    Bad news for bipolars
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,484
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    I’ve been working for a few months on a project for a government who have huge stockpiles of a commodity that’s very useful, actually quite essential. All the parties have been working on the basis of the gov putting x amount of the commodity aside as we are leveraging it and using the value in a different way for them.

    They have informed us last week that they are now happy to triple the allocation for what we are doing as it’s worked its way through to their minds that they have lots of it, they have lots still to just sell even after tripling our allocation, and by diverting a bigger slice to us it reduces the amount on the market so effectively maintains or increases the value of the commodity.

    Trebles all round.
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,934

    Related to the topic: People have begun to call J. D. Vance a "shapeshifter". It's not a compliment: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shapeshifting

    (Those looking for a modern fictional description of a "shapeshifter" can find one here: https://www.amazon.com/Shape-Shifter-Tony-Hillerman/dp/0060563478

    I enjoyed reading the book, and would put it in the top half of Hillerman detective stories.)

    Yes, but does he have a love-hate relationship with a vaguely Jewish-coded bartender and an unrequited crush on a vaguely lesbian-coded freedom fighter he met during the Cardassian occupation?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,874
    edited July 19
    MattW said:

    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT

    Of course in England and Wales we also need those causing death or serious injury by careless cycling or indeed dangerous cycling laws the UK government has promised to bring in so cyclists can be prosecuted on the same terms as drivers can if they injure or kill a pedestrian. I believe Scotland's government has now done so
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,809
    HYUFD said:

    MattW said:

    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT

    Of course in England and Scotland we also need those causing death or serious injury by careless cycling or indeed dangerous cycling laws the government has promised to bring in so cyclists can be prosecuted on the same terms as drivers can if they injure or kill a pedestrian
    Helpful hint: consider suggesting that the Conservative Party demands laws to see hedgehogs taken to court for obstructing respectable Tory-voting drivers.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,809
    O/T but of interest to some of us:

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/article/2024/jul/19/midges-thriving-wet-scottish-summer-worse-to-come

    'This week the Scottish Midge Forecast predicted high numbers of the biting insects, reaching peaks of four and five on a scale of one to five.

    Tourist hotspots such as Ullapool, Fort William and Lochcarron have been some of the worst-affected areas, with an early surge in May due to Scotland’s wetter than average spring.

    Jay Hutchison, an entomology project director at Dundee-based APS Biocontrol, which researches midges in Scotland and produces an insect repellant, said: “They came about two weeks early this year in May. They usually appear in May but there were much larger numbers than expected. Scotland had a particularly wet spring and they thrive in damp conditions.”'
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,839
    UK government debt highest since 1962
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgxqzp2zdw4o

    Two weeks and Labour's already bankrupted the country.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,569
    Okay, my one photo today goes to this.

  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,484
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    MattW said:

    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT

    Of course in England and Scotland we also need those causing death or serious injury by careless cycling or indeed dangerous cycling laws the government has promised to bring in so cyclists can be prosecuted on the same terms as drivers can if they injure or kill a pedestrian
    Helpful hint: consider suggesting that the Conservative Party demands laws to see hedgehogs taken to court for obstructing respectable Tory-voting drivers.
    Sod hedgehogs, it’s the bastards who drive Honda Jazz who need locking up for the disruption to the roads. I think the moment someone buys one a signal should go at the DVLA and the driver is ordered in to retake their test.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,651
    Nigelb said:

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    FPT



    Well, since 2000:

    Year || Total energy supply (TWh)
    2000 || 2579
    2001 || 2592
    2002 || 2558
    2003 || 2609
    2004 || 2572
    2005 || 2583
    2006 || 2541
    2007 || 2451
    2008 || 2412
    2009 || 2274
    2010 || 2359
    2011 || 2182
    2012 || 2233
    2013 || 2196
    2014 || 2060
    2015 || 2080
    2016 || 2053
    2017 || 2027
    2018 || 2000
    2019 || 1923
    2020 || 1765
    2021 || 1821
    2022 || 1793

    We've had the easy gains (greater efficiency on boilers, LED lighhting, closing down our heavy industry and letting china make the money instead).

    The latter isn't actually a gain, just a sleight of hand that will cost us dearly in years to come.

    The recent drops are covid/lockdown distorted too.

    That said, there are some pretty huge savings to come from the move to heat pumps and away from air conditioning/traditional central heating.
    But that's still going to need an increase in electricity generated.
    We're now into one of those bizarre PB 'arguing about different things' loops. The original challenge was whether the total UK energy requirement was going to come down, regardless of the mix of provision.
    I wasn't arguing, FWIW.
    Just pointing out that we will need a significantly larger electric grid than we have now.
    That's a good point (if not actually what you said ;))
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,839
    Carnyx said:

    O/T but of interest to some of us:

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/article/2024/jul/19/midges-thriving-wet-scottish-summer-worse-to-come

    'This week the Scottish Midge Forecast predicted high numbers of the biting insects, reaching peaks of four and five on a scale of one to five.

    Tourist hotspots such as Ullapool, Fort William and Lochcarron have been some of the worst-affected areas, with an early surge in May due to Scotland’s wetter than average spring.

    Jay Hutchison, an entomology project director at Dundee-based APS Biocontrol, which researches midges in Scotland and produces an insect repellant, said: “They came about two weeks early this year in May. They usually appear in May but there were much larger numbers than expected. Scotland had a particularly wet spring and they thrive in damp conditions.”'

    Any excuse for Kenneth McKellar
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMLona9oelM
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,651

    UK government debt highest since 1962
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgxqzp2zdw4o

    Two weeks and Labour's already bankrupted the country.

    Plays into Labour's "much worse than we were told" hand.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    boulay said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    MattW said:

    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT

    Of course in England and Scotland we also need those causing death or serious injury by careless cycling or indeed dangerous cycling laws the government has promised to bring in so cyclists can be prosecuted on the same terms as drivers can if they injure or kill a pedestrian
    Helpful hint: consider suggesting that the Conservative Party demands laws to see hedgehogs taken to court for obstructing respectable Tory-voting drivers.
    Sod hedgehogs, it’s the bastards who drive Honda Jazz who need locking up for the disruption to the roads. I think the moment someone buys one a signal should go at the DVLA and the driver is ordered in to retake their test.
    Black Range Rovers. I volunteered at the Stour Music Festival last month and got put on car park duty. Two of the fuckers drove at me without stopping, hi viz and everything. Maybe they were really really keen not to miss any Early Music but even so…

    (My mother drives a Honda Jazz. Can’t say I disagree with the above post)
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,409

    UK government debt highest since 1962
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgxqzp2zdw4o

    Two weeks and Labour's already bankrupted the country.

    Plays into Labour's "much worse than we were told" hand.
    But decisions already made on oil and gas will worsen it, at the same time as worsening worldwide CO2 emissions.
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 3,242
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    As does recycling.
    True, that.
    In the 1970s the impetus for renewable energy was the fear that oil would run out. Now it's the fear that oil won't run out. Same solution, diametrically opposite problem.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,484
    DougSeal said:

    boulay said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    MattW said:

    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT

    Of course in England and Scotland we also need those causing death or serious injury by careless cycling or indeed dangerous cycling laws the government has promised to bring in so cyclists can be prosecuted on the same terms as drivers can if they injure or kill a pedestrian
    Helpful hint: consider suggesting that the Conservative Party demands laws to see hedgehogs taken to court for obstructing respectable Tory-voting drivers.
    Sod hedgehogs, it’s the bastards who drive Honda Jazz who need locking up for the disruption to the roads. I think the moment someone buys one a signal should go at the DVLA and the driver is ordered in to retake their test.
    Black Range Rovers. I volunteered at the Stour Music Festival last month and got put on car park duty. Two of the fuckers drove at me without stopping, hi viz and everything. Maybe they were really really keen not to miss any Early Music but even so…

    (My mother drives a Honda Jazz. Can’t say I disagree with the above post)
    I would rather live in a world with Range Rover drivers than Honda Jazz drivers. I keep making the fatal error of being nice and letting them out at junctions then cursing them as they proceed to drive massively under the limit until they get to a really low speed limit zone and they drive at the same speed as before which is now over the limit so they can’t even use the caution and safety excuse.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454

    UK government debt highest since 1962
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgxqzp2zdw4o

    Two weeks and Labour's already bankrupted the country.

    Plays into Labour's "much worse than we were told" hand.
    The truth is that it's hit that record level a few times, before being revised down.

    For example in the previous release it hit a high of 99.8% but this month has hit a new high of... 99.5%
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,015

    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Also FPT

    Cannot speak for the accuracy of the figures, but this is a worrying thread about Labour's green plans:

    https://x.com/aDissentient/status/1814239901094654095

    It doesn't really make sense. For example:

    "Supply exceeds demand 64% of the time, so, lacking any suitable storage technology, we'd be throwing out 120 TWh of power, worth well over £10 billion, every year. That's perhaps £500 per household chucked down the drain."

    How can power produced in excess of what can be used have a value? It is, by definition, worth nothing. Also the assumption that we'd have no suitable storage technology is a bit of a biggie, especially given the possibility of using car batteries for storage.

    Edit: The obvious way to go is to improve connectivity with other countries. After all, the wind is always blowing somewhere.
    Unless I've got the wrong end of the stick, through payments to windfarms when the power is not required:

    "This means that the government is having to pay huge sums in curtailment fees to wind farm owners to switch off turbines when they are generating more power than is needed.
    Some £210m ($267m) of curtailment payments were made to renewable energy generators to curtail output in 2022, said the report
    With the UK planning to grow its offshore wind capacity from 14GW today to 50GW by 2030, the report says that curtailment costs are expected to rise to £3.5bn annually by the end of the decade."

    https://www.rechargenews.com/wind/turn-wasted-wind-power-into-green-hydrogen-and-save-uk-billions-study/2-1-1583623

    or:

    "Wasted wind power adds £40 to household energy costs, says think tank"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67494082
    It's not quite as simple as that.

    The wind farms have guaranteed prices for the power they produce from contracts signed with the government, but they still participate in the spot market.

    During periods of overproduction, instantaneous prices go negative (ie the grid offers to pay producers to reduce production and/or customers to use power). If their guaranteed strike price is higher than the negative market price, it still pays the wind farm to carry on producing; a negative price which exceeds what they earn pays them to stun off production.

    Similarly with solar (though not all solar connections are 'throttleable' in the same manner.)

    With the rapid increase in renewables production, total hours with negative pricing will also grown over then next few years.
    But the very strong market incentive is going to see the storage market grow in response.

    The game changer is the drop in battery prices over the last year. They're now just about at the point it pays to deploy grid scale storage - it just needs the factories to build them.
    Battery prices have dropped 55% since the beginning of last year.

    Lots of things that weren't economic are now economic.
    They won't stay low in the long term unless someone finds an awful lot more copper etc that can be mined cheaply. Raw materials of copper cobalt, lithium etc are a big elephant in the room

    New "battery" techology is needed. Keep seeing breakthrough announcements but few make it to production as the announcements are normally about a lab concept to try and attract (high risk) investment money to turn that into something sellable.
    More fortunes have been lost betting on commodities not being found than any other way.

    As prices rise, more deposits become economic.
    And there's a huge amount of known, unexploited lithium reserves.
    As an example, the US probably one of the world's largest known extractable deposit, and they haven't yet even started mining it.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thacker_Pass_Lithium_Mine

    Interestingly, ARPA-E, the US energy technology equivalent of DARPA is funding a few projects for innovative mining technology, in the hope of reviving US mining which has been undercut in recent years by low cost producers like China.
    What happens when the lithium runs out?
    Ask @rcs1000 .
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,839
    Biden, Harris and the rest: I've lost my nerve since this morning and cashed out completely.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454
    Sandpit said:

    Okay, my one photo today goes to this.

    Are you sure that isn't the Ferrari strategy department every race weekend?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,102
    edited July 19

    MattW said:

    Detheaded so FPT:

    Brains Trust

    Do any of us know about Scottish Sentencing Guidelines for Causing Serious Injury by Careless Driving?

    I've just read an account of an "Expert Driver" (stunts for C4) who drove straight across a mini roundabout and mowed a cyclist down breaking his shoulder blade (Hi Viz, LED beacon on the cycle), with a witness, and then did the traditional "the cyclist raced out and fell over in front of me" lie to Court, despite different behaviour at the scene. And a "moment of distraction" mitigation.

    He was also warned that he could be in contempt of court, when he interrupted the judge.

    He was given a £300 fine and a 12 month ban.

    I'm interested that that does not even reach the bottom of the scale in England, which for that offence starts at a Community Order and a 12 month ban.

    How does this work in Scotland? @Eabhal ?

    Report here, Aberdeen Courier:
    https://archive.ph/8MoPT

    Compared with the Glasgow Bin Lorry driver he was harshly treated.

    This sort of thing makes me wonder who is in what lodge.
    I think there's fairly well attested evidence around "let a colleague or former colleague off", and there are certain forces which are regarded as lackadaisical (Police Scotland often being thought of as one, plus several down in England).
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,102
    edited July 19
    My picture of the day.

    Matt Gaetz is a Star Trek alien, but I'm not sure which one. Any ideas?

    I reckon those eyebrows are late 1970s Vulcan.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,839
    MattW said:

    My picture of the day.

    Matt Gaetz is a Star Trek alien, but I'm not sure which one. Any ideas?

    You're thinking of The Invisible Man.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,228
    My daily photo is of Aries, last night

    Eat crow, Vincent


  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,569
    Finally got him. Hodge lbw b.Woakes 120
  • FossFoss Posts: 1,019
    MattW said:

    My picture of the day.

    Matt Gaetz is a Star Trek alien, but I'm not sure which one. Any ideas?

    I reckon those eyebrows are late 1970s Vulcan.

    A Talaxian? Or one of the fake ones from Galaxy Quest?
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,541
    Leon said:

    My daily photo is of Aries, last night

    Eat crow, Vincent


    Lovely part of the world. Before we married and Mrs Seal went to Arles when we got back together in 2005. Very happy memories.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,157

    Biden, Harris and the rest: I've lost my nerve since this morning and cashed out completely.

    It's a hell of a market
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,102

    MattW said:

    My picture of the day.

    Matt Gaetz is a Star Trek alien, but I'm not sure which one. Any ideas?

    You're thinking of The Invisible Man.
    LOL. I wish, given his record.

    I dad to add the piccie through the other interface !
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,484
    Leon said:

    My daily photo is of Aries, last night

    Eat crow, Vincent


    Is that looking towards the bank of the Rhône?
This discussion has been closed.