“Most of the people that died on October 7 were killed by Israeli soldiers”
Also the amount of flat out denial. “No that didn’t happen”. “You’re a pathetic Israeli shill and you’re lying”. “Total fabrication”
The irony is that the journalist, Matt Chorley, is a pretty feeble woke centre-lefty
I think there are quite a few left of centre types getting quite a shock just how anti-semitism isn't isolated to a few fringe people who Jezza calls friends, how overt it has become (its ok to chant a terrorist slogan in public, calling for the removal of all Jews from Middle East), after for long periods of time talking up the dangers of far right extremism.
One of the odder things is the double standards applied to thinking around 'river to the sea'. Jewish people, on the whole, find this a frightening phrase with implications of genocide. But the same people who police all manner of language, on the (often justified) basis that your intent isn't the point, it's how it lands with the people in question - don't seem to give a shit because, y'know, Jews.
I am certain that many (most?) people who chant it don't have genocidal intent. But that's not the point.
Do you thiink most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis?
Something like 40% of Jews live in Israel. Some of the Jews who live elsewhere will also think of themselves as Israeli (I live in Ireland and I think of myself as British).
So, yeah, seems likely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
Wikipedia has, with caveats, 30% of the Jewish population of the world living in Israel, with 51% living in the US. Although it depends on how you define who counts. On those numbers, it seems unlikely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
It only needs a minority of Jews living outside of Israel to think of themselves as Israeli to get to a majority overall. Are you really sure that it's less than a third?
Given the numbers who, for example, think of themselves as Irish-American in the US, I'd be really surprised if there weren't a majority of Jews who had an Israeli identity.
On these numbers, it would require 29% of Jews not living in Israel to consider themselves Israelis. I would guess the figure is less than that. I grew up and live in north London. Among Jewish people I know here, I can't think of any who consider themselves Israeli. The one person I know well with an Israeli passport does not even consider themself Israeli! But obviously who I know is a biased sample. It's the views of Jewish Americans that would answer your question.
Wikipedia gives a figure of 230,000 Jewish Israeli expats, so people with Israeli citizenship living in other countries are not large enough in number to satisfy your thesis, but of course some people without Israeli citizenship may still consider themselves Israeli in some sense.
“Most of the people that died on October 7 were killed by Israeli soldiers”
Also the amount of flat out denial. “No that didn’t happen”. “You’re a pathetic Israeli shill and you’re lying”. “Total fabrication”
The irony is that the journalist, Matt Chorley, is a pretty feeble woke centre-lefty
I think there are quite a few left of centre types getting quite a shock just how anti-semitism isn't isolated to a few fringe people who Jezza calls friends, how overt it has become (its ok to chant a terrorist slogan in public, calling for the removal of all Jews from Middle East), after for long periods of time talking up the dangers of far right extremism.
One of the odder things is the double standards applied to thinking around 'river to the sea'. Jewish people, on the whole, find this a frightening phrase with implications of genocide. But the same people who police all manner of language, on the (often justified) basis that your intent isn't the point, it's how it lands with the people in question - don't seem to give a shit because, y'know, Jews.
I am certain that many (most?) people who chant it don't have genocidal intent. But that's not the point.
Do you thiink most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis?
Something like 40% of Jews live in Israel. Some of the Jews who live elsewhere will also think of themselves as Israeli (I live in Ireland and I think of myself as British).
So, yeah, seems likely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
Wikipedia has, with caveats, 30% of the Jewish population of the world living in Israel, with 51% living in the US. Although it depends on how you define who counts. On those numbers, it seems unlikely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
It only needs a minority of Jews living outside of Israel to think of themselves as Israeli to get to a majority overall. Are you really sure that it's less than a third?
Given the numbers who, for example, think of themselves as Irish-American in the US, I'd be really surprised if there weren't a majority of Jews who had an Israeli identity.
I'd be wary of going too far down this rabbit hole as it can be antisemitic to describe non-Israeli Jews as owing their first loyalty to Israel.
Esther McVey has some work to do according to Ipsos.
People calling themselves 'woke' - 16% People calling themselves 'anti-woke' - 15% (1% less than the Suella Approvers!) People who don't care about such crap - 21% People who haven't a clue what any of it means - 44%
Just another sign why the culture wars thing is two groups only talking to themselves while the electorate scratch their heads at such lunacy
“Just another sign why the culture wars thing is two groups only talking to themselves while the electorate scratch their heads at such lunacy”
But this can be said of any political topic. Half the population has an IQ under 100 so they’re too stupid to even grasp the issues anyway
Another 35% are so busy getting by and feeding their families they don’t pay any attention to politics outside elections: especially abstract concepts like Wokeness
It is ALWAYS an elite 15% that has these debates. People with the leisure, brains, and motivation to get involved. Us guys
If only you could distract everyday people from their petty concerns of feeding their families, paying their electricity bills, and ensuring that their elderly relatives are looked after. Then they could join your debate on the important issues.
Everyone loves diversity and inclusion, until you stick up for the Palestinians. According to an Op-Ed in the Guardian. A paper which is overwhelmingly pro-Gazan.
How quickly the massacre of the 7th October is being forgotten.
"And that’s the point. If you are Palestinian, Arab or Muslim in the US today, or someone who is an ally of those groups, your speech is uniquely patrolled and your very right to speak is unfairly limited,"
I love it when someone writes an article in the mass media complaining that their voice is being silenced. Especially in the context of the mass pro-Palestinian marches there have been in the US.
Not sure if you've spent much time in the US but the debate there is skewed in an extremely pro-Israel direction compared to here. It is actually quite hard for any pro-Palestinian views to get a hearing in the mass media. Or at least that was my impression when I lived there. Maybe things have shifted since 2010, I don't know.
I think from looking at reports that things absolutely have shifted. Haven't there been (pro-Palestinian) protests at many of the ivy league universities, for example?
Yep. And this NYT report says young political aides in DC are rebelling against their pro Israeli bosses
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
This story gets worse every day, it really does.
Half of me wants to stop the whole thing now, and pass files to the CPS, while the other half of me wants to see the rest of the PO senior management forced to have their say under oath first.
Problem is by the time this is all over it will all just be swept under the carpet and the guilty will get away with destroying innocent peoples lives maliciously.
“Most of the people that died on October 7 were killed by Israeli soldiers”
Also the amount of flat out denial. “No that didn’t happen”. “You’re a pathetic Israeli shill and you’re lying”. “Total fabrication”
The irony is that the journalist, Matt Chorley, is a pretty feeble woke centre-lefty
I think there are quite a few left of centre types getting quite a shock just how anti-semitism isn't isolated to a few fringe people who Jezza calls friends, how overt it has become (its ok to chant a terrorist slogan in public, calling for the removal of all Jews from Middle East), after for long periods of time talking up the dangers of far right extremism.
One of the odder things is the double standards applied to thinking around 'river to the sea'. Jewish people, on the whole, find this a frightening phrase with implications of genocide. But the same people who police all manner of language, on the (often justified) basis that your intent isn't the point, it's how it lands with the people in question - don't seem to give a shit because, y'know, Jews.
I am certain that many (most?) people who chant it don't have genocidal intent. But that's not the point.
Do you thiink most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis?
Virtually every Jew I know is ardently pro Israel even if they despise the Israeli government of the day
They usually express it as: “after everything we’ve been through, we need one country we know is safe. Where we can always go if it comes to it”
In fact I’m not sure I’ve met a Jew that doesn’t feel this, tho they must exist. Perhaps you are one
They must be even more discombobulated recently on the one country we know is safe metric. Afaics Israel has held a view that they float in a sea of enemies who wish to destroy them and with whom they cannot negotiate for most of its (modern) history, which seems a weird kind of safety to my eyes.
You can't see very far then. Perhaps out to Auchtermuchty if you squint.
This whole episode came about on the eve of and arguably on account of an imminent agreement between Israel and Saudi.
Invoke the mighty Muchty as your derisory example of the archytpical Scottish one-horse town if you like, but how many places of equivalent size can claim not one but two celebrated contributions to the musical canon?
You are slightly proving the point because you probably need to walk 500 miles if you start out from Auchtermuchty to get anywhere of note.
Tsk you obviously don't know the song very well. Total distance walked is 1000 miles.
Do they actually do the walking though ?
Aren't they just saying they would walk 500 more and then another 500, to meet some chick they fancy.
It is a while since I heard the song.
Yes it is merely an intent but it is expressed quite strongly. The other actions in the song (waking up, havering etc) are reported as things that are "gonna" happen but the walking is more conditional ("would"). I've seen the Proclaimers live though and I'd bet that they generally follow through on their promises.
I guess it is also understandable that they would fall down at her door if they had walked 1000 miles to get there,
Everyone loves diversity and inclusion, until you stick up for the Palestinians. According to an Op-Ed in the Guardian. A paper which is overwhelmingly pro-Gazan.
How quickly the massacre of the 7th October is being forgotten.
"And that’s the point. If you are Palestinian, Arab or Muslim in the US today, or someone who is an ally of those groups, your speech is uniquely patrolled and your very right to speak is unfairly limited,"
I love it when someone writes an article in the mass media complaining that their voice is being silenced. Especially in the context of the mass pro-Palestinian marches there have been in the US.
Not sure if you've spent much time in the US but the debate there is skewed in an extremely pro-Israel direction compared to here. It is actually quite hard for any pro-Palestinian views to get a hearing in the mass media. Or at least that was my impression when I lived there. Maybe things have shifted since 2010, I don't know.
I think from looking at reports that things absolutely have shifted. Haven't there been (pro-Palestinian) protests at many of the ivy league universities, for example?
Yep. And this NYT report says young political aides in DC are rebelling against their pro Israeli bosses
Definitely a change in US attitudes; perilous for Israel
Jerusalem needs to pursue a two state solution NOW before it is too late - once they have eliminated Hamas. That’s the hard truth for Israel
Otherwise they will end up with a one state solution
Its not good for US either.
I remember warning my Israeli friends of this 15 years ago. “One day America will not be so powerful”. “One day America might change its attitude to Israel”. “China is rising and will not be so friendly”
They dismissed it all, rather arrogantly. Arrogance is a problem in Israeli politics and I think it comes from so many years of occupying palestine and beating up the Arabs - you start to think you are innately superior, rather than temporarily stronger
Everyone loves diversity and inclusion, until you stick up for the Palestinians. According to an Op-Ed in the Guardian. A paper which is overwhelmingly pro-Gazan.
How quickly the massacre of the 7th October is being forgotten.
"And that’s the point. If you are Palestinian, Arab or Muslim in the US today, or someone who is an ally of those groups, your speech is uniquely patrolled and your very right to speak is unfairly limited,"
I love it when someone writes an article in the mass media complaining that their voice is being silenced. Especially in the context of the mass pro-Palestinian marches there have been in the US.
Not sure if you've spent much time in the US but the debate there is skewed in an extremely pro-Israel direction compared to here. It is actually quite hard for any pro-Palestinian views to get a hearing in the mass media. Or at least that was my impression when I lived there. Maybe things have shifted since 2010, I don't know.
I think from looking at reports that things absolutely have shifted. Haven't there been (pro-Palestinian) protests at many of the ivy league universities, for example?
Yep. And this NYT report says young political aides in DC are rebelling against their pro Israeli bosses
Definitely a change in US attitudes; perilous for Israel
Jerusalem needs to pursue a two state solution NOW before it is too late - once they have eliminated Hamas. That’s the hard truth for Israel
Otherwise they will end up with a one state solution
"Jerusalem" as in the city the Palestinians want half of to be the capital of their state?
Yes, Jerusalem will be a sticking point. Perhaps the city can be an interzone, like old Tangiers. Run by uninterested outsiders and agreeably libertine
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
There have been suicides in the PO case.
Yes but that is not enough for say corporate manslaughter, as in a train crash where the train company was directly responsible for passengers deaths by gross negligence or a construction company which built a building so poorly it collapsed and killed the residents of it
Everyone loves diversity and inclusion, until you stick up for the Palestinians. According to an Op-Ed in the Guardian. A paper which is overwhelmingly pro-Gazan.
How quickly the massacre of the 7th October is being forgotten.
"And that’s the point. If you are Palestinian, Arab or Muslim in the US today, or someone who is an ally of those groups, your speech is uniquely patrolled and your very right to speak is unfairly limited,"
I love it when someone writes an article in the mass media complaining that their voice is being silenced. Especially in the context of the mass pro-Palestinian marches there have been in the US.
Not sure if you've spent much time in the US but the debate there is skewed in an extremely pro-Israel direction compared to here. It is actually quite hard for any pro-Palestinian views to get a hearing in the mass media. Or at least that was my impression when I lived there. Maybe things have shifted since 2010, I don't know.
I think from looking at reports that things absolutely have shifted. Haven't there been (pro-Palestinian) protests at many of the ivy league universities, for example?
Yep. And this NYT report says young political aides in DC are rebelling against their pro Israeli bosses
Definitely a change in US attitudes; perilous for Israel
Jerusalem needs to pursue a two state solution NOW before it is too late - once they have eliminated Hamas. That’s the hard truth for Israel
Otherwise they will end up with a one state solution
Its not good for US either.
I remember warning my Israeli friends of this 15 years ago. “One day America will not be so powerful”. “One day America might change its attitude to Israel”. “China is rising and will not be so friendly”
They dismissed it all, rather arrogantly. Arrogance is a problem in Israeli politics and I think it comes from so many years of occupying palestine and beating up the Arabs - you start to think you are innately superior, rather than temporarily stronger
Case in point, just look at Russia. From second best army in the world to second best in Ukraine.
"A teacher is being sought by police after carrying a placard comparing Rishi Sunak and Suella Braverman to coconuts at Saturday's pro-Palestinian protest in central London...Marieha Mohsin Hussain, 36, took part in the Armistice Day protest while carrying the sign, the Times newspaper reported...The sign was the subject of a police appeal. The term can be seen as an offensive racial slur because it suggests a person has betrayed their race."
Everyone loves diversity and inclusion, until you stick up for the Palestinians. According to an Op-Ed in the Guardian. A paper which is overwhelmingly pro-Gazan.
How quickly the massacre of the 7th October is being forgotten.
"And that’s the point. If you are Palestinian, Arab or Muslim in the US today, or someone who is an ally of those groups, your speech is uniquely patrolled and your very right to speak is unfairly limited,"
I love it when someone writes an article in the mass media complaining that their voice is being silenced. Especially in the context of the mass pro-Palestinian marches there have been in the US.
Not sure if you've spent much time in the US but the debate there is skewed in an extremely pro-Israel direction compared to here. It is actually quite hard for any pro-Palestinian views to get a hearing in the mass media. Or at least that was my impression when I lived there. Maybe things have shifted since 2010, I don't know.
I think from looking at reports that things absolutely have shifted. Haven't there been (pro-Palestinian) protests at many of the ivy league universities, for example?
Yep. And this NYT report says young political aides in DC are rebelling against their pro Israeli bosses
Definitely a change in US attitudes; perilous for Israel
Jerusalem needs to pursue a two state solution NOW before it is too late - once they have eliminated Hamas. That’s the hard truth for Israel
Otherwise they will end up with a one state solution
Mostly young Democrat aides, Republicans are generally much more pro Israel, even including Trump.
It is probably better for Israel therefore if Trump or another Republican wins the Presidential election next year but for Ukraine it is probably better if Biden and the Democrats win again
“Most of the people that died on October 7 were killed by Israeli soldiers”
Also the amount of flat out denial. “No that didn’t happen”. “You’re a pathetic Israeli shill and you’re lying”. “Total fabrication”
The irony is that the journalist, Matt Chorley, is a pretty feeble woke centre-lefty
I think there are quite a few left of centre types getting quite a shock just how anti-semitism isn't isolated to a few fringe people who Jezza calls friends, how overt it has become (its ok to chant a terrorist slogan in public, calling for the removal of all Jews from Middle East), after for long periods of time talking up the dangers of far right extremism.
One of the odder things is the double standards applied to thinking around 'river to the sea'. Jewish people, on the whole, find this a frightening phrase with implications of genocide. But the same people who police all manner of language, on the (often justified) basis that your intent isn't the point, it's how it lands with the people in question - don't seem to give a shit because, y'know, Jews.
I am certain that many (most?) people who chant it don't have genocidal intent. But that's not the point.
Do you thiink most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis?
Something like 40% of Jews live in Israel. Some of the Jews who live elsewhere will also think of themselves as Israeli (I live in Ireland and I think of myself as British).
So, yeah, seems likely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
Wikipedia has, with caveats, 30% of the Jewish population of the world living in Israel, with 51% living in the US. Although it depends on how you define who counts. On those numbers, it seems unlikely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
It only needs a minority of Jews living outside of Israel to think of themselves as Israeli to get to a majority overall. Are you really sure that it's less than a third?
Given the numbers who, for example, think of themselves as Irish-American in the US, I'd be really surprised if there weren't a majority of Jews who had an Israeli identity.
I'll check with my kids when they get back from school but pretty sure that don't have an Israeli identity.
Off topic: Last night I finished Bill Gates's "How to Prevent the Next Pandemic", and can recommend it to anyone interested in a thoughtful discussion of what the world got right -- and wrong -- in our reaction to COVID. (I should warn some of you that he is not interested in many of the topics that inspired so many comments here, for example, the lab leak theory.)
He has some positive remarks about advances in the UK, as well as many other nations.
He is right to remind us of the incredible overall improvements in health since WW II. For example, in 1960, 20 percent of the children born in the world did not reach their 5th birthday; today 5 percent do not.
And that progress is continuing, which gives us reason to believe we can do even better against diseases, including another pandemic
He is more optimistic about nations cooperating against a future pandemic than I am -- but he does also warn about the threat of bioterrorism. But many of the steps he advocates can be taken by nations, and some can be taken by families and individuals.
They’ve just told us the turbulence is back and it’s going to get WORSE
It's a shame there are no aviation experts on PB but as far as I'm aware turbulence is very very unlikely to be dangerous beyond little bottles of gin flying down the aisle like someone's firing a .50 cal.
Not sure this article gets it entirely right, because owning a car in the middle of big cities has never been particularly popular with young professionals. A few yuppies in the late 1980s in London probably weren't significant in the scheme of things.
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
The Met don't prosecute, the CPS does. Is there no mechanism to report a crime to the CPS and for them to direct that a police investigation take place. Maybe they should have their own police force.
They’ve just told us the turbulence is back and it’s going to get WORSE
It's a shame there are no aviation experts on PB but as far as I'm aware turbulence is very very unlikely to be dangerous beyond little bottles of gin flying down the aisle like someone's firing a .50 cal.
I know that - logically. The biggest risk is not being strapped in and you get hurled from your seat breaking your neck - so just fasten your belt
But there’s a point when logic gives way to primal fear - you’re 30,000 feet up in the air in a little metal tube which js being tossed around like a chihuahua in the jaws of an XL Bully
“Most of the people that died on October 7 were killed by Israeli soldiers”
Also the amount of flat out denial. “No that didn’t happen”. “You’re a pathetic Israeli shill and you’re lying”. “Total fabrication”
The irony is that the journalist, Matt Chorley, is a pretty feeble woke centre-lefty
I think there are quite a few left of centre types getting quite a shock just how anti-semitism isn't isolated to a few fringe people who Jezza calls friends, how overt it has become (its ok to chant a terrorist slogan in public, calling for the removal of all Jews from Middle East), after for long periods of time talking up the dangers of far right extremism.
One of the odder things is the double standards applied to thinking around 'river to the sea'. Jewish people, on the whole, find this a frightening phrase with implications of genocide. But the same people who police all manner of language, on the (often justified) basis that your intent isn't the point, it's how it lands with the people in question - don't seem to give a shit because, y'know, Jews.
I am certain that many (most?) people who chant it don't have genocidal intent. But that's not the point.
Do you thiink most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis?
Something like 40% of Jews live in Israel. Some of the Jews who live elsewhere will also think of themselves as Israeli (I live in Ireland and I think of myself as British).
So, yeah, seems likely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
Wikipedia has, with caveats, 30% of the Jewish population of the world living in Israel, with 51% living in the US. Although it depends on how you define who counts. On those numbers, it seems unlikely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
It only needs a minority of Jews living outside of Israel to think of themselves as Israeli to get to a majority overall. Are you really sure that it's less than a third?
Given the numbers who, for example, think of themselves as Irish-American in the US, I'd be really surprised if there weren't a majority of Jews who had an Israeli identity.
I'll check with my kids when they get back from school but pretty sure that don't have an Israeli identity.
I think some seriously crossed purposes have entered this debate: one does not need to actually consider oneself "Israeli" (I certainly don't) in order for me to care deeply about what happens there (which I certainly do).
Many of the minority of Jews worldwide who don't consider Israel at all part of their religious or cultural identity, will still have some sort of vested interest in its affairs due to family members living there.
“Most of the people that died on October 7 were killed by Israeli soldiers”
Also the amount of flat out denial. “No that didn’t happen”. “You’re a pathetic Israeli shill and you’re lying”. “Total fabrication”
The irony is that the journalist, Matt Chorley, is a pretty feeble woke centre-lefty
I think there are quite a few left of centre types getting quite a shock just how anti-semitism isn't isolated to a few fringe people who Jezza calls friends, how overt it has become (its ok to chant a terrorist slogan in public, calling for the removal of all Jews from Middle East), after for long periods of time talking up the dangers of far right extremism.
One of the odder things is the double standards applied to thinking around 'river to the sea'. Jewish people, on the whole, find this a frightening phrase with implications of genocide. But the same people who police all manner of language, on the (often justified) basis that your intent isn't the point, it's how it lands with the people in question - don't seem to give a shit because, y'know, Jews.
I am certain that many (most?) people who chant it don't have genocidal intent. But that's not the point.
Do you thiink most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis?
Something like 40% of Jews live in Israel. Some of the Jews who live elsewhere will also think of themselves as Israeli (I live in Ireland and I think of myself as British).
So, yeah, seems likely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
Wikipedia has, with caveats, 30% of the Jewish population of the world living in Israel, with 51% living in the US. Although it depends on how you define who counts. On those numbers, it seems unlikely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
It only needs a minority of Jews living outside of Israel to think of themselves as Israeli to get to a majority overall. Are you really sure that it's less than a third?
Given the numbers who, for example, think of themselves as Irish-American in the US, I'd be really surprised if there weren't a majority of Jews who had an Israeli identity.
I'll check with my kids when they get back from school but pretty sure that don't have an Israeli identity.
I think some seriously crossed purposes have entered this debate: one does not need to actually consider oneself "Israeli" (I certainly don't) in order for me to care deeply about what happens there (which I certainly do).
Many of the minority of Jews worldwide who don't consider Israel at all part of their religious or cultural identity, will still have some sort of vested interest in its affairs due to family members living there.
Yes that’s my experience of my Jewish friends
Call themselves Israeli? Definitely not
Invested in the survival of Israel? Absolutely yes
“Most of the people that died on October 7 were killed by Israeli soldiers”
Also the amount of flat out denial. “No that didn’t happen”. “You’re a pathetic Israeli shill and you’re lying”. “Total fabrication”
The irony is that the journalist, Matt Chorley, is a pretty feeble woke centre-lefty
I think there are quite a few left of centre types getting quite a shock just how anti-semitism isn't isolated to a few fringe people who Jezza calls friends, how overt it has become (its ok to chant a terrorist slogan in public, calling for the removal of all Jews from Middle East), after for long periods of time talking up the dangers of far right extremism.
One of the odder things is the double standards applied to thinking around 'river to the sea'. Jewish people, on the whole, find this a frightening phrase with implications of genocide. But the same people who police all manner of language, on the (often justified) basis that your intent isn't the point, it's how it lands with the people in question - don't seem to give a shit because, y'know, Jews.
I am certain that many (most?) people who chant it don't have genocidal intent. But that's not the point.
Do you thiink most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis?
Virtually every Jew I know is ardently pro Israel even if they despise the Israeli government of the day
They usually express it as: “after everything we’ve been through, we need one country we know is safe. Where we can always go if it comes to it”
In fact I’m not sure I’ve met a Jew that doesn’t feel this, tho they must exist. Perhaps you are one
They must be even more discombobulated recently on the one country we know is safe metric. Afaics Israel has held a view that they float in a sea of enemies who wish to destroy them and with whom they cannot negotiate for most of its (modern) history, which seems a weird kind of safety to my eyes.
You can't see very far then. Perhaps out to Auchtermuchty if you squint.
This whole episode came about on the eve of and arguably on account of an imminent agreement between Israel and Saudi.
Invoke the mighty Muchty as your derisory example of the archytpical Scottish one-horse town if you like, but how many places of equivalent size can claim not one but two celebrated contributions to the musical canon?
You are slightly proving the point because you probably need to walk 500 miles if you start out from Auchtermuchty to get anywhere of note.
Tsk you obviously don't know the song very well. Total distance walked is 1000 miles.
Do they actually do the walking though ?
Aren't they just saying they would walk 500 more and then another 500, to meet some chick they fancy.
It is a while since I heard the song.
Yes it is merely an intent but it is expressed quite strongly. The other actions in the song (waking up, havering etc) are reported as things that are "gonna" happen but the walking is more conditional ("would"). I've seen the Proclaimers live though and I'd bet that they generally follow through on their promises.
I guess it is also understandable that they would fall down at her door if they had walked 1000 miles to get there,
Nah. 1,000 miles is lightweight. I walked 6,266.5 miles and ended up exactly where I started.
In fact, I started off drinking from a bottle of champagne, and ended up surrounded by horses and with a glass of whisky in my hand.
They’ve just told us the turbulence is back and it’s going to get WORSE
It's a shame there are no aviation experts on PB but as far as I'm aware turbulence is very very unlikely to be dangerous beyond little bottles of gin flying down the aisle like someone's firing a .50 cal.
I know that - logically. The biggest risk is not being strapped in and you get hurled from your seat breaking your neck - so just fasten your belt
But there’s a point when logic gives way to primal fear - you’re 30,000 feet up in the air in a little metal tube which js being tossed around like a chihuahua in the jaws of an XL Bully
I’m not at that primal fear stage YET
Belt done up tight, and everything stowed away - including your ipad, unless you want to get smacked in the face by it. Phone and passport in your trousers front pocket, to make sure you still know exactly where they are after everything stops flying around.
Keep a good look out for flying G&Ts and cabin crew.
Big day tommorow with Rwanda and the inflation numbers. I suppose with both if one goes the Gov'ts way and the other doesn't, they can pump one up on the morning rounds to try and suffocate the other.
Also the first semi-final of the cricket. Thank God for a reshuffle to keep us all occupied for the last two cricket-free days.
They’ve just told us the turbulence is back and it’s going to get WORSE
It's a shame there are no aviation experts on PB but as far as I'm aware turbulence is very very unlikely to be dangerous beyond little bottles of gin flying down the aisle like someone's firing a .50 cal.
I know that - logically. The biggest risk is not being strapped in and you get hurled from your seat breaking your neck - so just fasten your belt
But there’s a point when logic gives way to primal fear - you’re 30,000 feet up in the air in a little metal tube which js being tossed around like a chihuahua in the jaws of an XL Bully
I’m not at that primal fear stage YET
Belt done up tight, and everything stowed away - including your ipad, unless you want to get smacked in the face by it. Phone and passport in your trousers front pocket, to make sure you still know exactly where they are after everything stops flying around.
If you hear someone shouting BRACE then you have a split second to work out whether it’s about to crash or there’s some news story breaking about AI or aliens.
It’s 3 hours old so I realise it’s probably already been commented on. But my hunch is that a. she won’t release it in the end, and b. If she does it’ll be somewhat less exciting than trailed.
Everyone loves diversity and inclusion, until you stick up for the Palestinians. According to an Op-Ed in the Guardian. A paper which is overwhelmingly pro-Gazan.
How quickly the massacre of the 7th October is being forgotten.
"And that’s the point. If you are Palestinian, Arab or Muslim in the US today, or someone who is an ally of those groups, your speech is uniquely patrolled and your very right to speak is unfairly limited,"
I love it when someone writes an article in the mass media complaining that their voice is being silenced. Especially in the context of the mass pro-Palestinian marches there have been in the US.
Not sure if you've spent much time in the US but the debate there is skewed in an extremely pro-Israel direction compared to here. It is actually quite hard for any pro-Palestinian views to get a hearing in the mass media. Or at least that was my impression when I lived there. Maybe things have shifted since 2010, I don't know.
I think from looking at reports that things absolutely have shifted. Haven't there been (pro-Palestinian) protests at many of the ivy league universities, for example?
Yep. And this NYT report says young political aides in DC are rebelling against their pro Israeli bosses
Definitely a change in US attitudes; perilous for Israel
Jerusalem needs to pursue a two state solution NOW before it is too late - once they have eliminated Hamas. That’s the hard truth for Israel
Otherwise they will end up with a one state solution
"Jerusalem" as in the city the Palestinians want half of to be the capital of their state?
Yes, Jerusalem will be a sticking point. Perhaps the city can be an interzone, like old Tangiers. Run by uninterested outsiders and agreeably libertine
I WAS glad when they said unto me : We will go into the house of the Lord.
Our feet shall stand in thy gates : O Jerusalem.
Jerusalem is built as a city : that is at unity in itself.
For thither the tribes go up, even the tribes of the Lord : to testify unto Israel, to give thanks unto the Name of the Lord.
For there is the seat of judgement : even the seat of the house of David.
O pray for the peace of Jerusalem : they shall prosper that love thee.
Peace be within thy walls : and plenteousness within thy palaces.
For my brethren and companions' sakes : I will wish thee prosperity.
Yea, because of the house of the Lord our God : I will seek to do thee good.
HMG & opposition acknowledging large numbers of dead Palestinian women and children. Let's hope they're not using the Hamas Health Ministry numbers or else they're just doing their work for them.
It’s 3 hours old so I realise it’s probably already been commented on. But my hunch is that a. she won’t release it in the end, and b. If she does it’ll be somewhat less exciting than trailed.
Is this like Trump saying he's got evidence of election fraud he's going to release... any day now...
Everyone loves diversity and inclusion, until you stick up for the Palestinians. According to an Op-Ed in the Guardian. A paper which is overwhelmingly pro-Gazan.
How quickly the massacre of the 7th October is being forgotten.
"And that’s the point. If you are Palestinian, Arab or Muslim in the US today, or someone who is an ally of those groups, your speech is uniquely patrolled and your very right to speak is unfairly limited,"
I love it when someone writes an article in the mass media complaining that their voice is being silenced. Especially in the context of the mass pro-Palestinian marches there have been in the US.
Not sure if you've spent much time in the US but the debate there is skewed in an extremely pro-Israel direction compared to here. It is actually quite hard for any pro-Palestinian views to get a hearing in the mass media. Or at least that was my impression when I lived there. Maybe things have shifted since 2010, I don't know.
I think from looking at reports that things absolutely have shifted. Haven't there been (pro-Palestinian) protests at many of the ivy league universities, for example?
Yep. And this NYT report says young political aides in DC are rebelling against their pro Israeli bosses
Definitely a change in US attitudes; perilous for Israel
Jerusalem needs to pursue a two state solution NOW before it is too late - once they have eliminated Hamas. That’s the hard truth for Israel
Otherwise they will end up with a one state solution
"Jerusalem" as in the city the Palestinians want half of to be the capital of their state?
Yes, Jerusalem will be a sticking point. Perhaps the city can be an interzone, like old Tangiers. Run by uninterested outsiders and agreeably libertine
I WAS glad when they said unto me : We will go into the house of the Lord.
Our feet shall stand in thy gates : O Jerusalem.
Jerusalem is built as a city : that is at unity in itself.
For thither the tribes go up, even the tribes of the Lord : to testify unto Israel, to give thanks unto the Name of the Lord.
For there is the seat of judgement : even the seat of the house of David.
O pray for the peace of Jerusalem : they shall prosper that love thee.
Peace be within thy walls : and plenteousness within thy palaces.
For my brethren and companions' sakes : I will wish thee prosperity.
Yea, because of the house of the Lord our God : I will seek to do thee good.
HMG & opposition acknowledging large numbers of dead Palestinian women and children. Let's hope they're not using the Hamas Health Ministry numbers or else they're just doing their work for them.
If you have other numbers from a better source, feel free to share them.
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
There have been suicides in the PO case.
Yes but that is not enough for say corporate manslaughter, as in a train crash where the train company was directly responsible for passengers deaths by gross negligence or a construction company which built a building so poorly it collapsed and killed the residents of it
The copious evidence that management, and lawyers knowingly brought prosecutions on evidence they knew not to be true - and continued to do so over an extended period of time - provides a very strong prima facie case for bringing conspiracy charges.
The individual victims have a similarly strong case to sue the PO in a civil court for malicious prosecution. There's normally a pretty high bar for that, but it seems already to have been cleared.
Lammy needs to be careful trying to get an easy hit over Cameron not in Commons to face qs because he is a peer.
Is Starmer sure he wont need to do the same kind of thing at some point when he is PM?
On which, there was a notable change in tone in parliament this morning. Both Mitchell (Cameron's representative in the Commons) and Lammy beginning to be more critical of the huge loss of civilian lives in Gaza. Mitchell calling for significantly extended humanitarian pauses, and expressing concern about fighting in and around hospitals. Tories and Labour pretty much on the same page. Very similar to what Biden and Blinken have been saying in the USA over the last couple of days.
No calls for a ceasefire yet, but it's edging there.
HMG & opposition acknowledging large numbers of dead Palestinian women and children. Let's hope they're not using the Hamas Health Ministry numbers or else they're just doing their work for them.
If you have other numbers from a better source, feel free to share them.
Sorry, probably too deadpan there. Just channelling a certain strain of PB commentary.
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
There have been suicides in the PO case.
Yes but that is not enough for say corporate manslaughter, as in a train crash where the train company was directly responsible for passengers deaths by gross negligence or a construction company which built a building so poorly it collapsed and killed the residents of it
It would indeed be difficult, but not impossible.
The facts of the PO case are so egregious, I wouldn't rule it out.
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
There have been suicides in the PO case.
Yes but that is not enough for say corporate manslaughter, as in a train crash where the train company was directly responsible for passengers deaths by gross negligence or a construction company which built a building so poorly it collapsed and killed the residents of it
It would indeed be difficult, but not impossible.
The facts of the PO case are so egregious, I wouldn't rule it out.
I've sent Lord Cameron a message telling him to tell Sunak to appoint Cyclefree to run the inquiry.
With their history, it would frankly be incredible if most Jews DIDN’T care about Israel
Of course, Israel is the only nation in the world with a Jewish majority, therefore the only nation in the world Jews can truly be safe
Is the only place that members of a particular religious, ethnic or ethno-religious group can truly be safe in a nation where they are a majority? That view is both depressingly pessimistic and harks back to a some 19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos that I thought we had long since abandoned.
We should make the world safe for all minorities and majorities.
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
There have been suicides in the PO case.
Yes but that is not enough for say corporate manslaughter, as in a train crash where the train company was directly responsible for passengers deaths by gross negligence or a construction company which built a building so poorly it collapsed and killed the residents of it
The copious evidence that management, and lawyers knowingly brought prosecutions on evidence they knew not to be true - and continued to do so over an extended period of time - provides a very strong prima facie case for bringing conspiracy charges.
The individual victims have a similarly strong case to sue the PO in a civil court for malicious prosecution. There's normally a pretty high bar for that, but it seems already to have been cleared.
Could they sue the people responsible for the case individually - I’m not usually a vindictive person but in the case of the PO prosecutors i believe an example should be made
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
There have been suicides in the PO case.
Yes but that is not enough for say corporate manslaughter, as in a train crash where the train company was directly responsible for passengers deaths by gross negligence or a construction company which built a building so poorly it collapsed and killed the residents of it
The copious evidence that management, and lawyers knowingly brought prosecutions on evidence they knew not to be true - and continued to do so over an extended period of time - provides a very strong prima facie case for bringing conspiracy charges.
The individual victims have a similarly strong case to sue the PO in a civil court for malicious prosecution. There's normally a pretty high bar for that, but it seems already to have been cleared.
Maybe malicious prosecution yes if they knew the IT financial system was faulty, no evidence for manslaughter though
Seeking reax from Western diplomats about David Cameron's appointment, the recurring theme is he's a 'known quantity'... & perhaps unsurprisingly, that's seen as a firm positive after all the chopping and changing at the top of the UK govt in the past couple of years
Poll taken Friday to yesterday so a bit early yet to see any change but some early encouragement for Sunak there
If Sunak DOES get a sustained 4 point bounce from the reshuffle then I shall eat the humblest of pies. I still don’t expect it, tho
I think I said "a few points" yesterday, because it would pull some moderate Tories back from the Liberals. I reckon it's fairly easy picking. You lose a hard rightwing moronic fruitcake and replace her with someone who can rub two braincells together, you are likely to gain something from it. But, I might just be talking my book.
A terrifying short thread on Ageing Britain (and the ageing world, for that matter)
“Britain is ageing, rapidly. By 2026, there will be more people aged over 65 than under 18 for the first time in our history. By 2072, the UK is set to have 1.9 people of working age per pensioner, down from 3.3 today. In fact, the workforce is set to start shrinking as of 2040s.”
We worry about AI, but in fact AI is the cavalry in a western - the only force that can save us
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
There have been suicides in the PO case.
Yes but that is not enough for say corporate manslaughter, as in a train crash where the train company was directly responsible for passengers deaths by gross negligence or a construction company which built a building so poorly it collapsed and killed the residents of it
The copious evidence that management, and lawyers knowingly brought prosecutions on evidence they knew not to be true - and continued to do so over an extended period of time - provides a very strong prima facie case for bringing conspiracy charges.
The individual victims have a similarly strong case to sue the PO in a civil court for malicious prosecution. There's normally a pretty high bar for that, but it seems already to have been cleared.
Could they sue the people responsible for the case individually - I’m not usually a vindictive person but in the case of the PO prosecutors i believe an example should be made
It’s a serious and egregious abuse of a very specific power to initiate prosecutions. There must have been a number of senior individuals who were both aware that the Horizon system couldn’t add up, and that the prosecutions were continuing nonetheless.
These individuals need to explain to twelve ordinary men and women, why they shoudn’t be going to prison.
With their history, it would frankly be incredible if most Jews DIDN’T care about Israel
Of course, Israel is the only nation in the world with a Jewish majority, therefore the only nation in the world Jews can truly be safe
Is the only place that members of a particular religious, ethnic or ethno-religious group can truly be safe in a nation where they are a majority? That view is both depressingly pessimistic and harks back to a some 19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos that I thought we had long since abandoned.
We should make the world safe for all minorities and majorities.
The "19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos" is a fairly recent invention: 19th or even 20th century IIRC. Prior to that we had Westphalian states (legal countries with peoples and borders), and prior to that we had realms (kings with peoples but not necessarily borders - see empires) and tribes (groups of people with no defined borders)
Happy to be contradicted on this, but I'm pretty sure the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a multiethnic people is pretty recent (within the last 300? years), and the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a monoethnic people is also recent, particularly in WW1/aftermath/WW2/aftermath.
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
There have been suicides in the PO case.
Yes but that is not enough for say corporate manslaughter, as in a train crash where the train company was directly responsible for passengers deaths by gross negligence or a construction company which built a building so poorly it collapsed and killed the residents of it
The copious evidence that management, and lawyers knowingly brought prosecutions on evidence they knew not to be true - and continued to do so over an extended period of time - provides a very strong prima facie case for bringing conspiracy charges.
The individual victims have a similarly strong case to sue the PO in a civil court for malicious prosecution. There's normally a pretty high bar for that, but it seems already to have been cleared.
Could they sue the people responsible for the case individually - I’m not usually a vindictive person but in the case of the PO prosecutors i believe an example should be made
It’s a serious and egregious abuse of a very specific power to initiate prosecutions. There must have been a number of senior individuals who were both aware that the Horizon system couldn’t add up, and that the prosecutions were continuing nonetheless.
These individuals need to explain to twelve ordinary men and women, why they shoudn’t be going to prison.
From what I’ve heard there were a lot of people willing to hide evidence that would have helped the defence lawyers actually defend the case.
I’m more inclined to the viewpoint that jail isn’t good enough for them - they should be made to compensate the people involved until they are penniless and bankrupt (as they left the victims to be) and only after that should the persecutions kick off.
Sacking Suella Braverman means "suicide" for Tory party and Rishi Sunak has just "thrown the election away" according to leaked WhatsApp messages between members of grassroot Tory organisation
"I've not been this angry since Boris was forced out"
A terrifying short thread on Ageing Britain (and the ageing world, for that matter)
“Britain is ageing, rapidly. By 2026, there will be more people aged over 65 than under 18 for the first time in our history. By 2072, the UK is set to have 1.9 people of working age per pensioner, down from 3.3 today. In fact, the workforce is set to start shrinking as of 2040s.”
We worry about AI, but in fact AI is the cavalry in a western - the only force that can save us
Apologies for continually talking to you today, but you keep bringing up salient points and (as you are soon to die in a plane crash) I don't have a lot of time. This is the reason why the Government is importing people like mad, and @rcs1000 did a whole video on aging population, which annoyingly I cannot find.
With their history, it would frankly be incredible if most Jews DIDN’T care about Israel
Of course, Israel is the only nation in the world with a Jewish majority, therefore the only nation in the world Jews can truly be safe
Is the only place that members of a particular religious, ethnic or ethno-religious group can truly be safe in a nation where they are a majority? That view is both depressingly pessimistic and harks back to a some 19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos that I thought we had long since abandoned.
We should make the world safe for all minorities and majorities.
The "19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos" is a fairly recent invention: 19th or even 20th century IIRC. Prior to that we had Westphalian states (legal countries with peoples and borders), and prior to that we had realms (kings with peoples but not necessarily borders - see empires) and tribes (groups of people with no defined borders)
Happy to be contradicted on this, but I'm pretty sure the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a multiethnic people is pretty recent (within the last 300? years), and the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a monoethnic people is also recent, particularly in WW1/aftermath/WW2/aftermath.
Everyone loves diversity and inclusion, until you stick up for the Palestinians. According to an Op-Ed in the Guardian. A paper which is overwhelmingly pro-Gazan.
How quickly the massacre of the 7th October is being forgotten.
"And that’s the point. If you are Palestinian, Arab or Muslim in the US today, or someone who is an ally of those groups, your speech is uniquely patrolled and your very right to speak is unfairly limited,"
I love it when someone writes an article in the mass media complaining that their voice is being silenced. Especially in the context of the mass pro-Palestinian marches there have been in the US.
Not sure if you've spent much time in the US but the debate there is skewed in an extremely pro-Israel direction compared to here. It is actually quite hard for any pro-Palestinian views to get a hearing in the mass media. Or at least that was my impression when I lived there. Maybe things have shifted since 2010, I don't know.
I think from looking at reports that things absolutely have shifted. Haven't there been (pro-Palestinian) protests at many of the ivy league universities, for example?
Yep. And this NYT report says young political aides in DC are rebelling against their pro Israeli bosses
Definitely a change in US attitudes; perilous for Israel
Jerusalem needs to pursue a two state solution NOW before it is too late - once they have eliminated Hamas. That’s the hard truth for Israel
Otherwise they will end up with a one state solution
"Jerusalem" as in the city the Palestinians want half of to be the capital of their state?
Yes, Jerusalem will be a sticking point. Perhaps the city can be an interzone, like old Tangiers. Run by uninterested outsiders and agreeably libertine
I WAS glad when they said unto me : We will go into the house of the Lord.
Our feet shall stand in thy gates : O Jerusalem.
Jerusalem is built as a city : that is at unity in itself.
For thither the tribes go up, even the tribes of the Lord : to testify unto Israel, to give thanks unto the Name of the Lord.
For there is the seat of judgement : even the seat of the house of David.
O pray for the peace of Jerusalem : they shall prosper that love thee.
Peace be within thy walls : and plenteousness within thy palaces.
For my brethren and companions' sakes : I will wish thee prosperity.
Yea, because of the house of the Lord our God : I will seek to do thee good.
With their history, it would frankly be incredible if most Jews DIDN’T care about Israel
Of course, Israel is the only nation in the world with a Jewish majority, therefore the only nation in the world Jews can truly be safe
Is the only place that members of a particular religious, ethnic or ethno-religious group can truly be safe in a nation where they are a majority? That view is both depressingly pessimistic and harks back to a some 19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos that I thought we had long since abandoned.
We should make the world safe for all minorities and majorities.
Yeah that’s great - in Kumbaya-LaLaLand
But we don’t live there. And until we do, history has proven that Jews get persecuted more than any other minority, and this has been happening for twenty centuries - and it peaked in living memory, in our own continent - so a safe nation for Jews to live seems a reasonable ask, until we reach your utopia
Of course it would have been better in retrospect if this had been done without the nakba, but we are where we are
A two state solution guaranteed by all major powers and all major Islamic nations is the only sensible answer. It will be hard to achieve but every other answer is even worse, and more dangerous
Good grief. Debbie Stapel, PO Investigator, has just stated openly that the PO and Fujitsu should have acknowledged the Horizon system was faulty, and that it was possible to manually alter branch accounts remotely with Subpostmasters knowing.
They knew this, but they proceeded with prosecutions anyway, and didn't advise the defence lawyers of these obvious and catastrophic flaws.
Surely on that evidence alone, they have to be jailed? The only questions remaining is who exactly, how many and for how long?
They've certainly opened themselves to being sued for malicious prosecution, without any credible defence.
Criminal prosecutions for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice are up the the DPP.
Wow. I don’t think “misconduct in a public office” has a max sentence….
It doesn't. I took advice from a prosecuting lawyer on raising this for the campaign I am involved in and was told the police are not very keen unless someone has died (eg Hillsborough), although the PO case does have a very high level of suffering.
I was told if I was interested in pursuing it (I didn't) to contact the local plod. They wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about but would point me in the right direction.
I am aware of an old campaign of individuals who have brought serious complaints to the PHSO where NHS treatment has gone wrong and have felt the PHSO have been guilty of this in their work on their complaints and have tried to get the Met to prosecute and the Met have refused. I have no idea of the merit of the complaints.
There have been suicides in the PO case.
Yes but that is not enough for say corporate manslaughter, as in a train crash where the train company was directly responsible for passengers deaths by gross negligence or a construction company which built a building so poorly it collapsed and killed the residents of it
The copious evidence that management, and lawyers knowingly brought prosecutions on evidence they knew not to be true - and continued to do so over an extended period of time - provides a very strong prima facie case for bringing conspiracy charges.
The individual victims have a similarly strong case to sue the PO in a civil court for malicious prosecution. There's normally a pretty high bar for that, but it seems already to have been cleared.
Maybe malicious prosecution yes if they knew the IT financial system was faulty, no evidence for manslaughter though
Pursuing further knowingly bogus prosecutions after people had committed suicide in other cases?
I would say that they are morally responsible. Obviously, needs a lawyer to say what the legal responsibility is.
With their history, it would frankly be incredible if most Jews DIDN’T care about Israel
Of course, Israel is the only nation in the world with a Jewish majority, therefore the only nation in the world Jews can truly be safe
Is the only place that members of a particular religious, ethnic or ethno-religious group can truly be safe in a nation where they are a majority? That view is both depressingly pessimistic and harks back to a some 19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos that I thought we had long since abandoned.
We should make the world safe for all minorities and majorities.
The "19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos" is a fairly recent invention: 19th or even 20th century IIRC. Prior to that we had Westphalian states (legal countries with peoples and borders), and prior to that we had realms (kings with peoples but not necessarily borders - see empires) and tribes (groups of people with no defined borders)
Happy to be contradicted on this, but I'm pretty sure the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a multiethnic people is pretty recent (within the last 300? years), and the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a monoethnic people is also recent, particularly in WW1/aftermath/WW2/aftermath.
Philip Bobbitt is your friend here.
Noted. Thank you. I shall read/watch.
Philip Bobbitt "The End of the Era of Industrial Nation-States”, Carnegie Council for Ethics in International Affairs, Oct 26, 2018, see also https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8A-Sb9uRfs
"A teacher is being sought by police after carrying a placard comparing Rishi Sunak and Suella Braverman to coconuts at Saturday's pro-Palestinian protest in central London...Marieha Mohsin Hussain, 36, took part in the Armistice Day protest while carrying the sign, the Times newspaper reported...The sign was the subject of a police appeal. The term can be seen as an offensive racial slur because it suggests a person has betrayed their race."
“Most of the people that died on October 7 were killed by Israeli soldiers”
Also the amount of flat out denial. “No that didn’t happen”. “You’re a pathetic Israeli shill and you’re lying”. “Total fabrication”
The irony is that the journalist, Matt Chorley, is a pretty feeble woke centre-lefty
I think there are quite a few left of centre types getting quite a shock just how anti-semitism isn't isolated to a few fringe people who Jezza calls friends, how overt it has become (its ok to chant a terrorist slogan in public, calling for the removal of all Jews from Middle East), after for long periods of time talking up the dangers of far right extremism.
One of the odder things is the double standards applied to thinking around 'river to the sea'. Jewish people, on the whole, find this a frightening phrase with implications of genocide. But the same people who police all manner of language, on the (often justified) basis that your intent isn't the point, it's how it lands with the people in question - don't seem to give a shit because, y'know, Jews.
I am certain that many (most?) people who chant it don't have genocidal intent. But that's not the point.
Do you thiink most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis?
Something like 40% of Jews live in Israel. Some of the Jews who live elsewhere will also think of themselves as Israeli (I live in Ireland and I think of myself as British).
So, yeah, seems likely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
Wikipedia has, with caveats, 30% of the Jewish population of the world living in Israel, with 51% living in the US. Although it depends on how you define who counts. On those numbers, it seems unlikely that most Jews believe themselves to be Israelis.
It only needs a minority of Jews living outside of Israel to think of themselves as Israeli to get to a majority overall. Are you really sure that it's less than a third?
Given the numbers who, for example, think of themselves as Irish-American in the US, I'd be really surprised if there weren't a majority of Jews who had an Israeli identity.
I'd be wary of going too far down this rabbit hole as it can be antisemitic to describe non-Israeli Jews as owing their first loyalty to Israel.
Eye-roll
I didn't say anything about loyalty. It wouldn't occur to me to think that any Irish-Americans owed their first loyalty to Ireland, for example.
A terrifying short thread on Ageing Britain (and the ageing world, for that matter)
“Britain is ageing, rapidly. By 2026, there will be more people aged over 65 than under 18 for the first time in our history. By 2072, the UK is set to have 1.9 people of working age per pensioner, down from 3.3 today. In fact, the workforce is set to start shrinking as of 2040s.”
We worry about AI, but in fact AI is the cavalry in a western - the only force that can save us
Apologies for continually talking to you today, but you keep bringing up salient points and (as you are soon to die in a plane crash) I don't have a lot of time. This is the reason why the Government is importing people like mad, and @rcs1000 did a whole video on aging population, which annoyingly I cannot find.
If you are importing people you need to ensure everyone has somewhere to live.
You can’t continue to cram more and more people into the same number of houses
A terrifying short thread on Ageing Britain (and the ageing world, for that matter)
“Britain is ageing, rapidly. By 2026, there will be more people aged over 65 than under 18 for the first time in our history. By 2072, the UK is set to have 1.9 people of working age per pensioner, down from 3.3 today. In fact, the workforce is set to start shrinking as of 2040s.”
We worry about AI, but in fact AI is the cavalry in a western - the only force that can save us
Apologies for continually talking to you today, but you keep bringing up salient points and (as you are soon to die in a plane crash) I don't have a lot of time. This is the reason why the Government is importing people like mad, and @rcs1000 did a whole video on aging population, which annoyingly I cannot find.
If you are importing people you need to ensure everyone has somewhere to live.
You can’t continue to cram more and more people into the same number of houses
I still find it utterly fascinating, that the same young liberals complaining about being unable to buy a house anywhere near London, are also some of the most in favour of more immigration.
As ever, the answer is build more houses. Then build a few more after that, then find new ways of building houses, then find new places in which to build houses.
I am tempted to say "good" because it would crash and burn, and drag the Conservatives down with in under FPTP. However, the US and elsewhere have taught us to be wary of democratic backsliding and how easy it is for fascism to become mainstream.
With their history, it would frankly be incredible if most Jews DIDN’T care about Israel
Of course, Israel is the only nation in the world with a Jewish majority, therefore the only nation in the world Jews can truly be safe
Is the only place that members of a particular religious, ethnic or ethno-religious group can truly be safe in a nation where they are a majority? That view is both depressingly pessimistic and harks back to a some 19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos that I thought we had long since abandoned.
We should make the world safe for all minorities and majorities.
The "19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos" is a fairly recent invention: 19th or even 20th century IIRC. Prior to that we had Westphalian states (legal countries with peoples and borders), and prior to that we had realms (kings with peoples but not necessarily borders - see empires) and tribes (groups of people with no defined borders)
Happy to be contradicted on this, but I'm pretty sure the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a multiethnic people is pretty recent (within the last 300? years), and the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a monoethnic people is also recent, particularly in WW1/aftermath/WW2/aftermath.
Anyone know what the latest is with the boundary changes?
My understanding is that the report has been laid before the Privy Council, but there hasn't since been a meeting of the Privy Council at which KCIII can say "approved", so that they will come into effect.
Though it's possible the November Privy Council meeting recently happened and the website hasn't been updated yet.
With their history, it would frankly be incredible if most Jews DIDN’T care about Israel
Of course, Israel is the only nation in the world with a Jewish majority, therefore the only nation in the world Jews can truly be safe
Is the only place that members of a particular religious, ethnic or ethno-religious group can truly be safe in a nation where they are a majority? That view is both depressingly pessimistic and harks back to a some 19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos that I thought we had long since abandoned.
We should make the world safe for all minorities and majorities.
The "19th-century notion of the nation state built around an ethnos" is a fairly recent invention: 19th or even 20th century IIRC. Prior to that we had Westphalian states (legal countries with peoples and borders), and prior to that we had realms (kings with peoples but not necessarily borders - see empires) and tribes (groups of people with no defined borders)
Happy to be contradicted on this, but I'm pretty sure the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a multiethnic people is pretty recent (within the last 300? years), and the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a monoethnic people is also recent, particularly in WW1/aftermath/WW2/aftermath.
Mildly controversial opinion but I've often thought that the collapse of the Austro-Hungarian and Ottoman entities was a slow burn catastrophe for the world. I say "entities" because they did not have to, necessarily, continue as autocratic Empires. Also leaving the Saudis in charge of most of Arabia hasn't really helped.
At university, there was apparently a doppelganger of me at another college, who I got plenty of second hand reports was quite a naughty chap. I never actually met them, but the number of times I had to explain no it wasn't be in such and such a bar on top of the bar, shirt off, singing then fighting with the staff when they tried to get them down....
Comments
Wikipedia gives a figure of 230,000 Jewish Israeli expats, so people with Israeli citizenship living in other countries are not large enough in number to satisfy your thesis, but of course some people without Israeli citizenship may still consider themselves Israeli in some sense.
They dismissed it all, rather arrogantly. Arrogance is a problem in Israeli politics and I think it comes from so many years of occupying palestine and beating up the Arabs - you start to think you are innately superior, rather than temporarily stronger
Is Starmer sure he wont need to do the same kind of thing at some point when he is PM?
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/met-police-coconuts-poster-rishi-sunak-suella-braverman-pro-palestine-march-b1120176.html
It is probably better for Israel therefore if Trump or another Republican wins the Presidential election next year but for Ukraine it is probably better if Biden and the Democrats win again
He has some positive remarks about advances in the UK, as well as many other nations.
He is right to remind us of the incredible overall improvements in health since WW II. For example, in 1960, 20 percent of the children born in the world did not reach their 5th birthday; today 5 percent do not.
And that progress is continuing, which gives us reason to believe we can do even better against diseases, including another pandemic
He is more optimistic about nations cooperating against a future pandemic than I am -- but he does also warn about the threat of bioterrorism. But many of the steps he advocates can be taken by nations, and some can be taken by families and individuals.
https://www.amazon.com/Prevent-Next-Pandemic-Bill-Gates/dp/0593534484
(Fun fact I learned from the book: The Chilean soapbark tree might be worth cultivating.)
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/11/14/why-owning-car-millions-drivers-young-professionals
But there’s a point when logic gives way to primal fear - you’re 30,000 feet up in the air in a little metal tube which js being tossed around like a chihuahua in the jaws of an XL Bully
I’m not at that primal fear stage YET
Many of the minority of Jews worldwide who don't consider Israel at all part of their religious or cultural identity, will still have some sort of vested interest in its affairs due to family members living there.
Call themselves Israeli? Definitely not
Invested in the survival of Israel? Absolutely yes
In fact, I started off drinking from a bottle of champagne, and ended up surrounded by horses and with a glass of whisky in my hand.
It's amazing what I'll for for a drink....
Keep a good look out for flying G&Ts and cabin crew.
Not quite cricket free. Beats news of war.
https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1724372155779989996?s=46
It’s 3 hours old so I realise it’s probably already been commented on. But my hunch is that a. she won’t release it in the end, and b. If she does it’ll be somewhat less exciting than trailed.
Our feet shall stand in thy gates : O Jerusalem.
Jerusalem is built as a city : that is at unity in itself.
For thither the tribes go up, even the tribes of the Lord : to testify unto Israel, to give thanks unto the Name of the Lord.
For there is the seat of judgement : even the seat of the house of David.
O pray for the peace of Jerusalem : they shall prosper that love thee.
Peace be within thy walls : and plenteousness within thy palaces.
For my brethren and companions' sakes : I will wish thee prosperity.
Yea, because of the house of the Lord our God : I will seek to do thee good.
https://news.sky.com/story/seven-members-of-paedophile-gang-guilty-of-running-monstrous-child-sex-abuse-ring-13008082
Words fail me. Those poor children.
LAB: 44% (-1)
CON: 28% (+4)
LDM: 13% (+1)
GRN: 6% (-1)
RFM: 4% (-2)
SNP: 3% (=)
https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/1724411566081077550?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw
The individual victims have a similarly strong case to sue the PO in a civil court for malicious prosecution. There's normally a pretty high bar for that, but it seems already to have been cleared.
No calls for a ceasefire yet, but it's edging there.
Just channelling a certain strain of PB commentary.
The facts of the PO case are so egregious, I wouldn't rule it out.
We should make the world safe for all minorities and majorities.
CPI 0.2 above consensus target, Gov't loses Rwanda case, India beat the Kiwis...
Changes w/ 3-6 Nov.
https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/1724411566081077550
Seeking reax from Western diplomats about David Cameron's appointment, the recurring theme is he's a 'known quantity'... & perhaps unsurprisingly, that's seen as a firm positive after all the chopping and changing at the top of the UK govt in the past couple of years
https://twitter.com/LOS_Fisher/status/1724378981976191168
lose a hard rightwing moronic fruitcake and replace her with someone who can rub two braincells together, you are likely to gain something from it. But, I might just be talking my book.
“Britain is ageing, rapidly. By 2026, there will be more people aged over 65 than under 18 for the first time in our history. By 2072, the UK is set to have 1.9 people of working age per pensioner, down from 3.3 today. In fact, the workforce is set to start shrinking as of 2040s.”
We worry about AI, but in fact AI is the cavalry in a western - the only force that can save us
https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1724421879945994436?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw
These individuals need to explain to twelve ordinary men and women, why they shoudn’t be going to prison.
Happy to be contradicted on this, but I'm pretty sure the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a multiethnic people is pretty recent (within the last 300? years), and the concept of a state with legal personality, borders and a monoethnic people is also recent, particularly in WW1/aftermath/WW2/aftermath.
I’m more inclined to the viewpoint that jail isn’t good enough for them - they should be made to compensate the people involved until they are penniless and bankrupt (as they left the victims to be) and only after that should the persecutions kick off.
https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1724199460215865617
I mean, looking at her, she was obviously a member of the IDF, wasn't she?
Other "peace activists" might want to consider that Hamas don't care if you're a peace activist. They'll kill you anyway.
EXC
Sacking Suella Braverman means "suicide" for Tory party and Rishi Sunak has just "thrown the election away" according to leaked WhatsApp messages between members of grassroot Tory organisation
"I've not been this angry since Boris was forced out"
But we don’t live there. And until we do, history has proven that Jews get persecuted more than any other minority, and this has been happening for twenty centuries - and it peaked in living memory, in our own continent - so a safe nation for Jews to live seems a reasonable ask, until we reach your utopia
Of course it would have been better in retrospect if this had been done without the nakba, but we are where we are
A two state solution guaranteed by all major powers and all major Islamic nations is the only sensible answer. It will be hard to achieve but every other answer is even worse, and more dangerous
New Cons deny claim there were only 12 at their meeting last night, say it was 20
But understand some "elders of the right" also met last night to lament return of Cameron
Mood is fairly sulphurous
"I'm not sure I'm even voting for myself at this point", laments one Tory MP
I would say that they are morally responsible. Obviously, needs a lawyer to say what the legal responsibility is.
Philip Bobbitt "The End of the Era of Industrial Nation-States”, Carnegie Council for Ethics in International Affairs, Oct 26, 2018, see also https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8A-Sb9uRfs
Answering a question from Council on Foreign Relations' Max Boot, Yale Law School's Philip Bobbitt says that we could be entering a new era in the international order. For full transcript and audio, please go to: https://www.carnegiecouncil.org/media/series/39/20181016-fight-for-liberty-max-boot-philip-bobbitt-garry-kasparov-bret-stephens
NEW: Leaders of right-wing Tory caucus announce plans to organise within party, amid reshuffle outrage
New Conservatives will build powerbase by fundraising & recruiting supporters to help their MP members, plus develop their own policy proposals…
Big headache looms for Sunak
If they can organise their way out of a wet paper bag I will be surprised...
The New Conservatives have built a six-figure war chest to date, acc to insider
"This reshuffle is the San Andreas Fault of British politics. There's money in the kitty & it'll start to flow v soon," says source
Here's statement from NC co-chairs Danny Kruger & Miriam Cates 👇
https://x.com/LOS_Fisher/status/1724431654620459272?s=20
I didn't say anything about loyalty. It wouldn't occur to me to think that any Irish-Americans owed their first loyalty to Ireland, for example.
You can’t continue to cram more and more people into the same number of houses
As ever, the answer is build more houses. Then build a few more after that, then find new ways of building houses, then find new places in which to build houses.
A man mistakenly accused on social media of a racially aggravated incident after footage was posted online says he has received "incessant" abuse.
Jamie Turner, 34, of Northampton, was wrongly identified as one of a group of men shouting at pro-Palestinian protesters at Waterloo Station, London.
He said his phone "lit up like a Christmas tree" with "incessant calls, voicemails and death threats".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-northamptonshire-67408915
Though it's possible the November Privy Council meeting recently happened and the website hasn't been updated yet.
https://privycouncil.independent.gov.uk/meetings-and-orders/orders-in-council/
@PaulBrandITV
70% of the public say Rishi Sunak was right to sack Suella Braverman. Just 17% think he was wrong.
https://x.com/PaulBrandITV/status/1724435421390610478?s=20
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-67372493
Quelle surprise.
ETA: careful now. He is still alive and able to sue.