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This is why the Tories are set to get hammered – politicalbetting.com

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  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited June 2023

    Just catching up on this thread, I was intrigued to see how devout Tories would explain the graph in the header.

    I assume the WTF button had to be added to allow appropriate responses to HYUFD's assertion that the graph showed the Tories and and Labour managed waiting lists equally well. A WTAF?!? button would have been more appropriate imo.

    Has the WTF button added in order to react to the England lineup for the 2nd Ashes Test?

    England certainly don't bat deep, so have to scratch that one off the hopeium bingo card
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    edited June 2023

    ydoethur said:

    Please can I impose on the good nature of everyone here and ask if anyone has an answer to a technical Local Government Finance question?

    Does anyone know why local authorities want their Council Tax paid in 10 equal payments, rather than once a month for a year? I have been paying for my Council Tax by standing order (for 12 months) for the last 20 years or so, but my Council is now threatening me with a Magistrates Court summons if I don't pay up the full amount by tomorrow or set up a direct debit. What is their authority for doing this? Is it legislation, or their own local by-law?

    I have a perfectly good payments record (I have lived in the same house for over 30 years) and I cannot work out why they are having a hissy fit now.

    I know that back in the 1970s, in the days of local Rates, the authorities needed two months to prepare their annual accounts, but that was in an age before computers, on-line banking and Excel spreadsheets. Surely their systems can cope with me paying in 12 equal instalments rather than 10? FWIW, I want to pay in monthly instalments because that's how I get paid, and it makes my budgeting easier.

    Any help gratefully received.

    A few years ago, I didn't receive the council tax bill and made no payment at all for four months. When we worked out what had happened, they just told me they needed payment in full by the end of the year. So unless there has been a change in the law, which is of course possible, they are talking bollocks.

    I would demand they show their reasoning.

    Magistrates court is a pretty empty threat at the moment I would have thought. It would take months to get anywhere and by then you'll have paid most of it anyway.
    Pay in 10 instalments because fighting them to pay in 12 lots is not worth the candle (unless OP is skint). That 10 is standard across the country suggests there might be a reason for it, but that's not important.
    IIRC years back, it was changed so that you can pay 12 monthly instalments, rather than 10. Seem to recall it was 2014?

    Sounds like @AugustusCarp2 is having an encounter with a clipboardista. Who is making up rules - probably got a target they've invented to get everyone on a direct debit.
    I pay via direct debit in 12 installments. It's a slightly better time value of money in today's inflationary world compared to 10. Everyone should try and pay monthly I think !
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,263
    Leon said:

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    Leon said:

    FF43 said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Nigelb said:

    kjh said:

    Miklosvar said:

    malcolmg said:

    ydoethur said:

    WTF? I think ‘awesome’ is way worse than ‘like.’ So twee.

    Just need a LEON button now
    Has Leon apologised for being wrong on the lab leak?

    U.S. Intelligence Report Finds No Clear Evidence of Covid Origins in Wuhan Lab.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/23/us/politics/covid-lab-leak-wuhan-report.html
    It says no clear evidence. AOEINEOA. What clear evidence could there be anyway? CCTV of avirus sneaking out of the back door?
    In my lifetime there have been two lab leaks in the UK that I am aware of, Smallpox and Foot and Mouth. Both were provable lab leaks. So to say there can't be any clear evidence of a lab leak is obviously not correct.

    It may well be a lab leak and there may not be any evidence that can be found, but that doesn't mean it is a lab leak. It may be, it may not be.

    However unlike @leon I don't jump to conclusions. If leon didn't come out with so much tosh all the time (Do we all remember the mass alien ships over Ukraine?) we might take him more seriously. I can think of two pieces of evidence he provided for absolute proof it came from a lab that were completely dismantled here (one was from Fox news ffs).
    There's also the likely, but not proven Russian influenza leak, of course.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1977_Russian_flu
    Which is exactly the point: Likely but not proven is probably as good as we are going to get with an outbreak in China. They don't do openness there. So the claim of "no clear evidence" is still susceptible to the response: What clear evidence would you expect, given 1. China and 2. the catastrophic consequences of this leak?
    I would want to know why a lab leak is likely, beyond that someone had a notion. There is epidemiological evidence for the epidemic starting in a market, which is also how the previous SARS is known to have started.
    Aside from anything else “the nightmare of circumstantial evidence” - as was explicitly stated in the Fauci/Farrar emails at the beginning of the pandemic

    Problem is I then have to Google the claim to see if it really is evidence. This is the full quote from Ian Lipkin:

    It does not eliminate the possibility of inadvertent release following adaptation through selection in culture at the institute in Wuhan. Given the scale of the bat CoV research pursued there and the site of emergence of the first human cases we have a nightmare of circumstantial evidence to assess.

    So it seems not. The recent DNI report states

    Prior to the pandemic, we assess WIV scientists conducted extensive research on coronaviruses, which included animal sampling and genetic analysis. We continue to have no indication that the WIV’s pre-pandemic research holdings included SARSCoV-2 or a close progenitor, nor any direct evidence that a specific research-related incident occurred involving WIV personnel before the pandemic that could have caused the COVID pandemic.

    So Covid 19 doesn't match a virus the lab was known to be working on. We have to have some other reason to suspect a lab leak.
    "a virus the lab was known to be working on" is rather the point. Again, this is mere absence of evidence. Evidence of absence would require a complete, audited list from the lab of everything it was up to.
    Given that there is significant evidence China executed or otherwise silenced - forever - early covid whistleblowers, the idea they wouldn’t destroy evidence at the lab is fanciful. Indeed the opposite is true. They surely DID destroy evidence
    Indeed, and they also destroyed evidence at the market.
    I don't think we've ever argued that China behaved responsibly or openly with regard to what happened.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,263
    edited June 2023
    Bet DuraAce has never flown anything like this.
    https://twitter.com/Rainmaker1973/status/1673616040838717441

    (I've never seen anything like it.)

    (edit) Caproni's creations feature in the movies of Miyazaki, of course.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    Farooq said:

    Selebian said:

    Good morning one & all!
    Can I join the people who don’t like the WTF button, please!

    +1

    Is RCS ok?
    Good morning

    Maybe we only value some things when we have lost them !!!!
    Don't it always seem to go
    That you don't know what you've got
    Till it's gone
    They took all our likes
    And put up a 'what the fuck'
    :disappointed:
    like
    I can't quite tell if this a campaign to bring back the like button or the spam button?
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    FF43 said:

    ..

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Nigelb said:

    kjh said:

    Miklosvar said:

    malcolmg said:

    ydoethur said:

    WTF? I think ‘awesome’ is way worse than ‘like.’ So twee.

    Just need a LEON button now
    Has Leon apologised for being wrong on the lab leak?

    U.S. Intelligence Report Finds No Clear Evidence of Covid Origins in Wuhan Lab.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/23/us/politics/covid-lab-leak-wuhan-report.html
    It says no clear evidence. AOEINEOA. What clear evidence could there be anyway? CCTV of avirus sneaking out of the back door?
    In my lifetime there have been two lab leaks in the UK that I am aware of, Smallpox and Foot and Mouth. Both were provable lab leaks. So to say there can't be any clear evidence of a lab leak is obviously not correct.

    It may well be a lab leak and there may not be any evidence that can be found, but that doesn't mean it is a lab leak. It may be, it may not be.

    However unlike @leon I don't jump to conclusions. If leon didn't come out with so much tosh all the time (Do we all remember the mass alien ships over Ukraine?) we might take him more seriously. I can think of two pieces of evidence he provided for absolute proof it came from a lab that were completely dismantled here (one was from Fox news ffs).
    There's also the likely, but not proven Russian influenza leak, of course.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1977_Russian_flu
    Which is exactly the point: Likely but not proven is probably as good as we are going to get with an outbreak in China. They don't do openness there. So the claim of "no clear evidence" is still susceptible to the response: What clear evidence would you expect, given 1. China and 2. the catastrophic consequences of this leak?
    I would want to know why a lab leak is likely, beyond that someone had a notion. There is epidemiological evidence for the epidemic starting in a market, which is also how the previous SARS is known to have started.
    That evidence is basically "the first cases were near the wet market." Given the geography, that also implies "the first cases were near the lab."

    Let's also look at the terminology here. "Wet market" means no more than, a collection of butchers and fishmongers and whatever selling freshly slaughtered, unpackaged meet. Most English high streets would qualify. And anyway you can hardly base an argument on "wet markets are notorious breeding grounds for novel viruses" when the alternative is a lab expressly designed at enormous expense to be a breeding ground for novel viruses.
    A large proportion of the known first cases were actually in the wet market. The WIV isn't near the market. Wuhan is a tri-city metropolis. The lab and the market are in different historical cities.
    https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/Wuhan+Institute+of+Infectious+Diseases,+18+Jianghan+N+Rd,+Jianghan+District,+Wuhan,+Hubei,+China,+430000/Huanan+Seafood+Market,+207+Fa+Zhan+Da+Dao,+Jianghan+District,+Wuhan,+Hubei,+China,+430032/@30.6023109,114.2722462,13.75z/data=!4m14!4m13!1m5!1m1!1s0x342eaee6d8ca9703:0xbd90fcd3a9ec6b13!2m2!1d114.27983!2d30.589017!1m5!1m1!1s0x342eaeb553b58fd7:0x355ff7d1fe8e8fb7!2m2!1d114.2622935!2d30.6165888!3e2?entry=ttu

    3.8 km apart.
  • Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    Leon said:

    FF43 said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Nigelb said:

    kjh said:

    Miklosvar said:

    malcolmg said:

    ydoethur said:

    WTF? I think ‘awesome’ is way worse than ‘like.’ So twee.

    Just need a LEON button now
    Has Leon apologised for being wrong on the lab leak?

    U.S. Intelligence Report Finds No Clear Evidence of Covid Origins in Wuhan Lab.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/23/us/politics/covid-lab-leak-wuhan-report.html
    It says no clear evidence. AOEINEOA. What clear evidence could there be anyway? CCTV of avirus sneaking out of the back door?
    In my lifetime there have been two lab leaks in the UK that I am aware of, Smallpox and Foot and Mouth. Both were provable lab leaks. So to say there can't be any clear evidence of a lab leak is obviously not correct.

    It may well be a lab leak and there may not be any evidence that can be found, but that doesn't mean it is a lab leak. It may be, it may not be.

    However unlike @leon I don't jump to conclusions. If leon didn't come out with so much tosh all the time (Do we all remember the mass alien ships over Ukraine?) we might take him more seriously. I can think of two pieces of evidence he provided for absolute proof it came from a lab that were completely dismantled here (one was from Fox news ffs).
    There's also the likely, but not proven Russian influenza leak, of course.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1977_Russian_flu
    Which is exactly the point: Likely but not proven is probably as good as we are going to get with an outbreak in China. They don't do openness there. So the claim of "no clear evidence" is still susceptible to the response: What clear evidence would you expect, given 1. China and 2. the catastrophic consequences of this leak?
    I would want to know why a lab leak is likely, beyond that someone had a notion. There is epidemiological evidence for the epidemic starting in a market, which is also how the previous SARS is known to have started.
    Aside from anything else “the nightmare of circumstantial evidence” - as was explicitly stated in the Fauci/Farrar emails at the beginning of the pandemic

    Problem is I then have to Google the claim to see if it really is evidence. This is the full quote from Ian Lipkin:

    It does not eliminate the possibility of inadvertent release following adaptation through selection in culture at the institute in Wuhan. Given the scale of the bat CoV research pursued there and the site of emergence of the first human cases we have a nightmare of circumstantial evidence to assess.

    So it seems not. The recent DNI report states

    Prior to the pandemic, we assess WIV scientists conducted extensive research on coronaviruses, which included animal sampling and genetic analysis. We continue to have no indication that the WIV’s pre-pandemic research holdings included SARSCoV-2 or a close progenitor, nor any direct evidence that a specific research-related incident occurred involving WIV personnel before the pandemic that could have caused the COVID pandemic.

    So Covid 19 doesn't match a virus the lab was known to be working on. We have to have some other reason to suspect a lab leak.
    "a virus the lab was known to be working on" is rather the point. Again, this is mere absence of evidence. Evidence of absence would require a complete, audited list from the lab of everything it was up to.
    Given that there is significant evidence China executed or otherwise silenced - forever - early covid whistleblowers, the idea they wouldn’t destroy evidence at the lab is fanciful. Indeed the opposite is true. They surely DID destroy evidence
    Indeed, and they also destroyed evidence at the market.
    I don't think we've ever argued that China behaved responsibly or openly with regard to what happened.
    Indeed.

    From what we know, I think we can say for certain that China behaved irresponsibly.

    I think the balance of probabilities is that it probably came from the Lab.

    I think the less likely, but still possible option, is that it came naturally to and from the market without any involvement of the Lab.

    But I don't think we will ever know for certain.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    Leon said:

    FF43 said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Nigelb said:

    kjh said:

    Miklosvar said:

    malcolmg said:

    ydoethur said:

    WTF? I think ‘awesome’ is way worse than ‘like.’ So twee.

    Just need a LEON button now
    Has Leon apologised for being wrong on the lab leak?

    U.S. Intelligence Report Finds No Clear Evidence of Covid Origins in Wuhan Lab.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/23/us/politics/covid-lab-leak-wuhan-report.html
    It says no clear evidence. AOEINEOA. What clear evidence could there be anyway? CCTV of avirus sneaking out of the back door?
    In my lifetime there have been two lab leaks in the UK that I am aware of, Smallpox and Foot and Mouth. Both were provable lab leaks. So to say there can't be any clear evidence of a lab leak is obviously not correct.

    It may well be a lab leak and there may not be any evidence that can be found, but that doesn't mean it is a lab leak. It may be, it may not be.

    However unlike @leon I don't jump to conclusions. If leon didn't come out with so much tosh all the time (Do we all remember the mass alien ships over Ukraine?) we might take him more seriously. I can think of two pieces of evidence he provided for absolute proof it came from a lab that were completely dismantled here (one was from Fox news ffs).
    There's also the likely, but not proven Russian influenza leak, of course.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1977_Russian_flu
    Which is exactly the point: Likely but not proven is probably as good as we are going to get with an outbreak in China. They don't do openness there. So the claim of "no clear evidence" is still susceptible to the response: What clear evidence would you expect, given 1. China and 2. the catastrophic consequences of this leak?
    I would want to know why a lab leak is likely, beyond that someone had a notion. There is epidemiological evidence for the epidemic starting in a market, which is also how the previous SARS is known to have started.
    Aside from anything else “the nightmare of circumstantial evidence” - as was explicitly stated in the Fauci/Farrar emails at the beginning of the pandemic

    Problem is I then have to Google the claim to see if it really is evidence. This is the full quote from Ian Lipkin:

    It does not eliminate the possibility of inadvertent release following adaptation through selection in culture at the institute in Wuhan. Given the scale of the bat CoV research pursued there and the site of emergence of the first human cases we have a nightmare of circumstantial evidence to assess.

    So it seems not. The recent DNI report states

    Prior to the pandemic, we assess WIV scientists conducted extensive research on coronaviruses, which included animal sampling and genetic analysis. We continue to have no indication that the WIV’s pre-pandemic research holdings included SARSCoV-2 or a close progenitor, nor any direct evidence that a specific research-related incident occurred involving WIV personnel before the pandemic that could have caused the COVID pandemic.

    So Covid 19 doesn't match a virus the lab was known to be working on. We have to have some other reason to suspect a lab leak.
    "a virus the lab was known to be working on" is rather the point. Again, this is mere absence of evidence. Evidence of absence would require a complete, audited list from the lab of everything it was up to.
    Given that there is significant evidence China executed or otherwise silenced - forever - early covid whistleblowers, the idea they wouldn’t destroy evidence at the lab is fanciful. Indeed the opposite is true. They surely DID destroy evidence
    Indeed, and they also destroyed evidence at the market.
    I don't think we've ever argued that China behaved responsibly or openly with regard to what happened.
    That’s fair

    However a lab leak would be even more embarrassing for them than a market origin. Much more sinister. And problematic in multiple ways

    And of course a lab leak would be almost equally awkward for lots of people in America - given that the Yanks funded (as they now belatedly admit) GoF research at Wuhan

    This whole saga has stretched on for so long because both superpowers have reason to cover it up, and to get the truth we need science to admit Yeah, science fucked up

    REMEMBER LAB LEAK WAS CENSORED FOR A YEAR

    In a way it is remarkable we have come this far
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,302

    I assume the WTF button had to be added to allow appropriate responses to HYUFD's assertion that the graph showed the Tories and and Labour managed waiting lists equally well.

    It seems a bit biased to have a "Want Tory Future" button for HYUFD's posts.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    May I propose another set of response buttons to be used only on Saturday mornings "Bowled", "Six", "Silly Mid Wicket", "Cow Corner" - not just to confuse the Russian chat bots but also given todays reporting to reassure any classist, mysoginist, nationalists that the site will continue to cater for the right chaps.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    ..

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Nigelb said:

    kjh said:

    Miklosvar said:

    malcolmg said:

    ydoethur said:

    WTF? I think ‘awesome’ is way worse than ‘like.’ So twee.

    Just need a LEON button now
    Has Leon apologised for being wrong on the lab leak?

    U.S. Intelligence Report Finds No Clear Evidence of Covid Origins in Wuhan Lab.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/23/us/politics/covid-lab-leak-wuhan-report.html
    It says no clear evidence. AOEINEOA. What clear evidence could there be anyway? CCTV of avirus sneaking out of the back door?
    In my lifetime there have been two lab leaks in the UK that I am aware of, Smallpox and Foot and Mouth. Both were provable lab leaks. So to say there can't be any clear evidence of a lab leak is obviously not correct.

    It may well be a lab leak and there may not be any evidence that can be found, but that doesn't mean it is a lab leak. It may be, it may not be.

    However unlike @leon I don't jump to conclusions. If leon didn't come out with so much tosh all the time (Do we all remember the mass alien ships over Ukraine?) we might take him more seriously. I can think of two pieces of evidence he provided for absolute proof it came from a lab that were completely dismantled here (one was from Fox news ffs).
    There's also the likely, but not proven Russian influenza leak, of course.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1977_Russian_flu
    Which is exactly the point: Likely but not proven is probably as good as we are going to get with an outbreak in China. They don't do openness there. So the claim of "no clear evidence" is still susceptible to the response: What clear evidence would you expect, given 1. China and 2. the catastrophic consequences of this leak?
    I would want to know why a lab leak is likely, beyond that someone had a notion. There is epidemiological evidence for the epidemic starting in a market, which is also how the previous SARS is known to have started.
    That evidence is basically "the first cases were near the wet market." Given the geography, that also implies "the first cases were near the lab."

    Let's also look at the terminology here. "Wet market" means no more than, a collection of butchers and fishmongers and whatever selling freshly slaughtered, unpackaged meet. Most English high streets would qualify. And anyway you can hardly base an argument on "wet markets are notorious breeding grounds for novel viruses" when the alternative is a lab expressly designed at enormous expense to be a breeding ground for novel viruses.
    A large proportion of the known first cases were actually in the wet market. The WIV isn't near the market. Wuhan is a tri-city metropolis. The lab and the market are in different historical cities.
    https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/Wuhan+Institute+of+Infectious+Diseases,+18+Jianghan+N+Rd,+Jianghan+District,+Wuhan,+Hubei,+China,+430000/Huanan+Seafood+Market,+207+Fa+Zhan+Da+Dao,+Jianghan+District,+Wuhan,+Hubei,+China,+430032/@30.6023109,114.2722462,13.75z/data=!4m14!4m13!1m5!1m1!1s0x342eaee6d8ca9703:0xbd90fcd3a9ec6b13!2m2!1d114.27983!2d30.589017!1m5!1m1!1s0x342eaeb553b58fd7:0x355ff7d1fe8e8fb7!2m2!1d114.2622935!2d30.6165888!3e2?entry=ttu

    3.8 km apart.
    And the Wuhan CDC is literally 5 minutes walk from the market. And they originally claimed the CDC had no bats. Then they admitted it did
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,223
    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/jun/27/icec-report-key-findings-recommendations-cricket-ecb

    The report also indicated that female cricketers playing at domestic professional level are disproportionately white: in 2021, there were only two Black British, four mixed/multiple ethnicity and eight South Asian female players, out of a total of 161. Page 11

    As with the women footballers, the stats are being used as proof of racism in women's cricket.
  • A

    kyf_100 said:

    Meanwhile, a series of Russian military/diplomatic flights have just taken off for Washington (confirmed) and (allegedly) Beijing.

    People speculating on Twitter that Putin may no longer be in control (or worse, Russia may have lost a nuke).

    https://twitter.com/TimInHonolulu/status/1673587079295684611

    Can we get a "brace" button?

    It's all fine. I'm build a new table. Glass top, with RVs off a Russian missile as legs. As an amusing talking point, they are live.

    Was looking on eBay, and this chap who was using Grant Mitchell's photo as a logo offered me a low low price...
    I have never been a fan of Eastenders, so I'm not sure about this whole meme about how Prigozhin looks like Kemp.

    But he was pretty Gold in Spandau Ballet, even if Prigozhin never made it Through the Barricades.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,260
    edited June 2023
    Newsweek are picking up the Rubio story ; the post-Grusch allegations are now beginning to make it through to the main media.

    https://www.newsweek.com/marco-rubio-ufo-uap-top-us-officials-investigation-1809201
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,967
    Mr. 86, it's not quite as good as when it's claimed the countryside is racist because relatively fewer black people like hiking.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,395
    Leon said:

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    ..

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Nigelb said:

    kjh said:

    Miklosvar said:

    malcolmg said:

    ydoethur said:

    WTF? I think ‘awesome’ is way worse than ‘like.’ So twee.

    Just need a LEON button now
    Has Leon apologised for being wrong on the lab leak?

    U.S. Intelligence Report Finds No Clear Evidence of Covid Origins in Wuhan Lab.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/23/us/politics/covid-lab-leak-wuhan-report.html
    It says no clear evidence. AOEINEOA. What clear evidence could there be anyway? CCTV of avirus sneaking out of the back door?
    In my lifetime there have been two lab leaks in the UK that I am aware of, Smallpox and Foot and Mouth. Both were provable lab leaks. So to say there can't be any clear evidence of a lab leak is obviously not correct.

    It may well be a lab leak and there may not be any evidence that can be found, but that doesn't mean it is a lab leak. It may be, it may not be.

    However unlike @leon I don't jump to conclusions. If leon didn't come out with so much tosh all the time (Do we all remember the mass alien ships over Ukraine?) we might take him more seriously. I can think of two pieces of evidence he provided for absolute proof it came from a lab that were completely dismantled here (one was from Fox news ffs).
    There's also the likely, but not proven Russian influenza leak, of course.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1977_Russian_flu
    Which is exactly the point: Likely but not proven is probably as good as we are going to get with an outbreak in China. They don't do openness there. So the claim of "no clear evidence" is still susceptible to the response: What clear evidence would you expect, given 1. China and 2. the catastrophic consequences of this leak?
    I would want to know why a lab leak is likely, beyond that someone had a notion. There is epidemiological evidence for the epidemic starting in a market, which is also how the previous SARS is known to have started.
    That evidence is basically "the first cases were near the wet market." Given the geography, that also implies "the first cases were near the lab."

    Let's also look at the terminology here. "Wet market" means no more than, a collection of butchers and fishmongers and whatever selling freshly slaughtered, unpackaged meet. Most English high streets would qualify. And anyway you can hardly base an argument on "wet markets are notorious breeding grounds for novel viruses" when the alternative is a lab expressly designed at enormous expense to be a breeding ground for novel viruses.
    A large proportion of the known first cases were actually in the wet market. The WIV isn't near the market. Wuhan is a tri-city metropolis. The lab and the market are in different historical cities.
    https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/Wuhan+Institute+of+Infectious+Diseases,+18+Jianghan+N+Rd,+Jianghan+District,+Wuhan,+Hubei,+China,+430000/Huanan+Seafood+Market,+207+Fa+Zhan+Da+Dao,+Jianghan+District,+Wuhan,+Hubei,+China,+430032/@30.6023109,114.2722462,13.75z/data=!4m14!4m13!1m5!1m1!1s0x342eaee6d8ca9703:0xbd90fcd3a9ec6b13!2m2!1d114.27983!2d30.589017!1m5!1m1!1s0x342eaeb553b58fd7:0x355ff7d1fe8e8fb7!2m2!1d114.2622935!2d30.6165888!3e2?entry=ttu

    3.8 km apart.
    And the Wuhan CDC is literally 5 minutes walk from the market. And they originally claimed the CDC had no bats. Then they admitted it did
    This is about equal opportunities access to cricket?
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,832
    Nigelb said:

    Bet DuraAce has never flown anything like this.
    https://twitter.com/Rainmaker1973/status/1673616040838717441

    (I've never seen anything like it.)

    (edit) Caproni's creations feature in the movies of Miyazaki, of course.

    That certainly requires a 'WTF'
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    Leon said:

    FF43 said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Nigelb said:

    kjh said:

    Miklosvar said:

    malcolmg said:

    ydoethur said:

    WTF? I think ‘awesome’ is way worse than ‘like.’ So twee.

    Just need a LEON button now
    Has Leon apologised for being wrong on the lab leak?

    U.S. Intelligence Report Finds No Clear Evidence of Covid Origins in Wuhan Lab.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/23/us/politics/covid-lab-leak-wuhan-report.html
    It says no clear evidence. AOEINEOA. What clear evidence could there be anyway? CCTV of avirus sneaking out of the back door?
    In my lifetime there have been two lab leaks in the UK that I am aware of, Smallpox and Foot and Mouth. Both were provable lab leaks. So to say there can't be any clear evidence of a lab leak is obviously not correct.

    It may well be a lab leak and there may not be any evidence that can be found, but that doesn't mean it is a lab leak. It may be, it may not be.

    However unlike @leon I don't jump to conclusions. If leon didn't come out with so much tosh all the time (Do we all remember the mass alien ships over Ukraine?) we might take him more seriously. I can think of two pieces of evidence he provided for absolute proof it came from a lab that were completely dismantled here (one was from Fox news ffs).
    There's also the likely, but not proven Russian influenza leak, of course.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1977_Russian_flu
    Which is exactly the point: Likely but not proven is probably as good as we are going to get with an outbreak in China. They don't do openness there. So the claim of "no clear evidence" is still susceptible to the response: What clear evidence would you expect, given 1. China and 2. the catastrophic consequences of this leak?
    I would want to know why a lab leak is likely, beyond that someone had a notion. There is epidemiological evidence for the epidemic starting in a market, which is also how the previous SARS is known to have started.
    Aside from anything else “the nightmare of circumstantial evidence” - as was explicitly stated in the Fauci/Farrar emails at the beginning of the pandemic

    Problem is I then have to Google the claim to see if it really is evidence. This is the full quote from Ian Lipkin:

    It does not eliminate the possibility of inadvertent release following adaptation through selection in culture at the institute in Wuhan. Given the scale of the bat CoV research pursued there and the site of emergence of the first human cases we have a nightmare of circumstantial evidence to assess.

    So it seems not. The recent DNI report states

    Prior to the pandemic, we assess WIV scientists conducted extensive research on coronaviruses, which included animal sampling and genetic analysis. We continue to have no indication that the WIV’s pre-pandemic research holdings included SARSCoV-2 or a close progenitor, nor any direct evidence that a specific research-related incident occurred involving WIV personnel before the pandemic that could have caused the COVID pandemic.

    So Covid 19 doesn't match a virus the lab was known to be working on. We have to have some other reason to suspect a lab leak.
    "a virus the lab was known to be working on" is rather the point. Again, this is mere absence of evidence. Evidence of absence would require a complete, audited list from the lab of everything it was up to.
    Given that there is significant evidence China executed or otherwise silenced - forever - early covid whistleblowers, the idea they wouldn’t destroy evidence at the lab is fanciful. Indeed the opposite is true. They surely DID destroy evidence
    Indeed, and they also destroyed evidence at the market.
    I don't think we've ever argued that China behaved responsibly or openly with regard to what happened.
    Indeed.

    From what we know, I think we can say for certain that China behaved irresponsibly.

    I think the balance of probabilities is that it probably came from the Lab.

    I think the less likely, but still possible option, is that it came naturally to and from the market without any involvement of the Lab.

    But I don't think we will ever know for certain.
    There is also the modest possibility - discussed right at the outset - that a worker at the WIV/CDC tried to sell lab bats at the market. I think it’s quite unlikely, but it has the advantage of pleasing both sides
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,947
    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    No I haven't Leon, but I have had to lose quite a bit of weight recently for initially my pit special flight and then more recently my cycle trip. I eat and drink a lot. The only way I can manage it is to crash diet. Probably not advisable but I can lose several kg per week. I just stuff myself with fruit, tasty salad and good quality bread and don't touch alcohol. Probably not good for me but I lost 8kg in a few weeks prior to my cycle trip which is more than you are after.
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,680
    algarkirk said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fishing said:

    Can we have the like button back please and ideally a dislike button as well?

    And an ambivalent button for us centrists too!
    Three buttons: Up, Down and Grand Old Duke of York.
    Six buttons: Up, down, charm, strange, top, bottom.
    Quirky
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,721
    IMHO the decline in ‘ordinary’ boys (and girls) playing cricket is down to the massive increase in traffic. In my youth the street where I lived, and played cricket in the summer saw about two cars per day. Now it’s much busier, even though it’s purely residential.
    In the small town where I live now the Cricket Club is flourishing, with three men’s teams, a boys and a girls team and a women’s team.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,437
    tlg86 said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/jun/27/icec-report-key-findings-recommendations-cricket-ecb

    The report also indicated that female cricketers playing at domestic professional level are disproportionately white: in 2021, there were only two Black British, four mixed/multiple ethnicity and eight South Asian female players, out of a total of 161. Page 11

    As with the women footballers, the stats are being used as proof of racism in women's cricket.

    The cricket diversity police should have a look at the people in the Covid Inquiry being livestreamed at
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9bjywfpgrA
  • eekeek Posts: 28,592

    ydoethur said:

    Please can I impose on the good nature of everyone here and ask if anyone has an answer to a technical Local Government Finance question?

    Does anyone know why local authorities want their Council Tax paid in 10 equal payments, rather than once a month for a year? I have been paying for my Council Tax by standing order (for 12 months) for the last 20 years or so, but my Council is now threatening me with a Magistrates Court summons if I don't pay up the full amount by tomorrow or set up a direct debit. What is their authority for doing this? Is it legislation, or their own local by-law?

    I have a perfectly good payments record (I have lived in the same house for over 30 years) and I cannot work out why they are having a hissy fit now.

    I know that back in the 1970s, in the days of local Rates, the authorities needed two months to prepare their annual accounts, but that was in an age before computers, on-line banking and Excel spreadsheets. Surely their systems can cope with me paying in 12 equal instalments rather than 10? FWIW, I want to pay in monthly instalments because that's how I get paid, and it makes my budgeting easier.

    Any help gratefully received.

    A few years ago, I didn't receive the council tax bill and made no payment at all for four months. When we worked out what had happened, they just told me they needed payment in full by the end of the year. So unless there has been a change in the law, which is of course possible, they are talking bollocks.

    I would demand they show their reasoning.

    Magistrates court is a pretty empty threat at the moment I would have thought. It would take months to get anywhere and by then you'll have paid most of it anyway.
    Pay in 10 instalments because fighting them to pay in 12 lots is not worth the candle (unless OP is skint). That 10 is standard across the country suggests there might be a reason for it, but that's not important.
    IIRC years back, it was changed so that you can pay 12 monthly instalments, rather than 10. Seem to recall it was 2014?

    Sounds like @AugustusCarp2 is having an encounter with a clipboardista. Who is making up rules - probably got a target they've invented to get everyone on a direct debit.
    Logic for 10 payments was that it means payments are taken from May to February and March / April can be spent sorting out getting next years bills out.

    How relevant that is in the 21st century when bill generation and similar should be automatic is a thought experiment for others.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    algarkirk said:

    ydoethur said:

    Fishing said:

    Can we have the like button back please and ideally a dislike button as well?

    And an ambivalent button for us centrists too!
    Three buttons: Up, Down and Grand Old Duke of York.
    Six buttons: Up, down, charm, strange, top, bottom.
    And on Sundays in honour of a special branch of the Irish church - Feck, Arse, Drink
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,437
    edited June 2023

    IMHO the decline in ‘ordinary’ boys (and girls) playing cricket is down to the massive increase in traffic. In my youth the street where I lived, and played cricket in the summer saw about two cars per day. Now it’s much busier, even though it’s purely residential.
    In the small town where I live now the Cricket Club is flourishing, with three men’s teams, a boys and a girls team and a women’s team.

    Michael Grade said he brought Neighbours to BBC1 because its characters were playing street cricket in the opening titles.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    kjh said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    No I haven't Leon, but I have had to lose quite a bit of weight recently for initially my pit special flight and then more recently my cycle trip. I eat and drink a lot. The only way I can manage it is to crash diet. Probably not advisable but I can lose several kg per week. I just stuff myself with fruit, tasty salad and good quality bread and don't touch alcohol. Probably not good for me but I lost 8kg in a few weeks prior to my cycle trip which is more than you are after.
    I’ve always been able to do that - previously. Crash dieting and fasting. For some reason I’m finding that impossible, atm

    Just wondering if we have any Ozempians on PB

    I get very varied accounts from friends and fam. From “brilliant” to “ugh, made me sick, did nothing”
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    tlg86 said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/jun/27/icec-report-key-findings-recommendations-cricket-ecb

    The report also indicated that female cricketers playing at domestic professional level are disproportionately white: in 2021, there were only two Black British, four mixed/multiple ethnicity and eight South Asian female players, out of a total of 161. Page 11

    As with the women footballers, the stats are being used as proof of racism in women's cricket.

    When's the investigation into sprinting ?

    As for the point about independent schools - I'm not sure if this has changed but the first XI teams at mine were always cricket and rugby. Given the huge draw of football generally in the population I always felt like this was why cricketers were more likely to emerge from private schools.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,504
    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    Just go out there and get some exercise... ;)
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156

    IMHO the decline in ‘ordinary’ boys (and girls) playing cricket is down to the massive increase in traffic. In my youth the street where I lived, and played cricket in the summer saw about two cars per day. Now it’s much busier, even though it’s purely residential.
    In the small town where I live now the Cricket Club is flourishing, with three men’s teams, a boys and a girls team and a women’s team.

    Sport organised by kids themselves must be 90% or more down from the last millenium, whilst time spent on coached sport will be up fivefold or more. Kids nowadays get far far better coaching, and facilities (when they exist), but lose out on the creativity and play side of sport.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    Just go out there and get some exercise... ;)
    I do! Gym five times a week and a decent walk every day
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited June 2023
    Pulpstar said:

    tlg86 said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/jun/27/icec-report-key-findings-recommendations-cricket-ecb

    The report also indicated that female cricketers playing at domestic professional level are disproportionately white: in 2021, there were only two Black British, four mixed/multiple ethnicity and eight South Asian female players, out of a total of 161. Page 11

    As with the women footballers, the stats are being used as proof of racism in women's cricket.

    When's the investigation into sprinting ?

    As for the point about independent schools - I'm not sure if this has changed but the first XI teams at mine were always cricket and rugby. Given the huge draw of football generally in the population I always felt like this was why cricketers were more likely to emerge from private schools.
    With the foundation of football academy programmes, they are hoovering up talent from very young age in bigger numbers than ever and actively discourage / forbid participation in other sports (if you had time anyway, as many run training 2-3 times a week + matches & then summer tours etc).

    My friends child is in one, not allowed to play any school sports even if they had any time, which they don't (they train 3 times a week plus have gym training programme) & only a small break from grind of training, matches, tours in the summer.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    I wouldn't. The blurb: "The most common side effects of Ozempic® may include nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, stomach (abdominal) pain, and constipation."

    The reality: google ozempic defecation.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,778
    edited June 2023
    Nigelb said:

    Bet DuraAce has never flown anything like this.
    https://twitter.com/Rainmaker1973/status/1673616040838717441

    (I've never seen anything like it.)

    (edit) Caproni's creations feature in the movies of Miyazaki, of course.

    Considering I spent 20 years prolonging my adolescence in military aviation I actually have a pretty thin CV and haven't flown a great variety of aircraft - Bulldog, Chipmunk, Tucano (worst), Hawk, Harrier, Tomcat (best).

    Hubschraubers: Squirrel, Griffin (best), Lynx (worst)

    Been a sand bag in just about everything though. F-15, F-16, F/A-18, T-45, Tornado, EA-6, C-2, E-2, T-37, MH-60, CH-53 plus loads of trash haulers (C-130, VC-10, etc.)
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    eek said:

    ydoethur said:

    Please can I impose on the good nature of everyone here and ask if anyone has an answer to a technical Local Government Finance question?

    Does anyone know why local authorities want their Council Tax paid in 10 equal payments, rather than once a month for a year? I have been paying for my Council Tax by standing order (for 12 months) for the last 20 years or so, but my Council is now threatening me with a Magistrates Court summons if I don't pay up the full amount by tomorrow or set up a direct debit. What is their authority for doing this? Is it legislation, or their own local by-law?

    I have a perfectly good payments record (I have lived in the same house for over 30 years) and I cannot work out why they are having a hissy fit now.

    I know that back in the 1970s, in the days of local Rates, the authorities needed two months to prepare their annual accounts, but that was in an age before computers, on-line banking and Excel spreadsheets. Surely their systems can cope with me paying in 12 equal instalments rather than 10? FWIW, I want to pay in monthly instalments because that's how I get paid, and it makes my budgeting easier.

    Any help gratefully received.

    A few years ago, I didn't receive the council tax bill and made no payment at all for four months. When we worked out what had happened, they just told me they needed payment in full by the end of the year. So unless there has been a change in the law, which is of course possible, they are talking bollocks.

    I would demand they show their reasoning.

    Magistrates court is a pretty empty threat at the moment I would have thought. It would take months to get anywhere and by then you'll have paid most of it anyway.
    Pay in 10 instalments because fighting them to pay in 12 lots is not worth the candle (unless OP is skint). That 10 is standard across the country suggests there might be a reason for it, but that's not important.
    IIRC years back, it was changed so that you can pay 12 monthly instalments, rather than 10. Seem to recall it was 2014?

    Sounds like @AugustusCarp2 is having an encounter with a clipboardista. Who is making up rules - probably got a target they've invented to get everyone on a direct debit.
    Logic for 10 payments was that it means payments are taken from May to February and March / April can be spent sorting out getting next years bills out.

    How relevant that is in the 21st century when bill generation and similar should be automatic is a thought experiment for others.
    With savings rate approaching 4% must be worth about 0.5-1% or so in extra revenue to the council to get the money in slightly early.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,947
    Leon said:

    kjh said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    No I haven't Leon, but I have had to lose quite a bit of weight recently for initially my pit special flight and then more recently my cycle trip. I eat and drink a lot. The only way I can manage it is to crash diet. Probably not advisable but I can lose several kg per week. I just stuff myself with fruit, tasty salad and good quality bread and don't touch alcohol. Probably not good for me but I lost 8kg in a few weeks prior to my cycle trip which is more than you are after.
    I’ve always been able to do that - previously. Crash dieting and fasting. For some reason I’m finding that impossible, atm

    Just wondering if we have any Ozempians on PB

    I get very varied accounts from friends and fam. From “brilliant” to “ugh, made me sick, did nothing”
    Ok. Sorry to hear that. I did wonder about posting it as it was a bit like posting the bleeding obvious, but I did because I can't do the normal diets as I like my food too much and this works for me.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    Just go out there and get some exercise... ;)
    Weight loss 70% diet 15% exercise 15% genetics/age.
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 5,065

    Can we have the old buttons back please? We have grown up with them and I am missing them.

    Grown up with them??? You must be quite young.
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    I miss the like button. What I would like more than a like is an "Appreciate" button. Sometimes I don't like the content but I appreciate being made aware of something that I did not know and learning something.
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    I think the Russians give us far more credit than we are due.

    Normal service has resumed on Russian state TV

    The UK continues to live rent free in their heads 🇬🇧

    https://twitter.com/francis_scarr/status/1673630113131380737
  • UnpopularUnpopular Posts: 888
    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    I've not tried it, though is that the one Boris had a bad time on?

    I struggled to shift the COVID weight for ages, still am actually, though I had a fair bit more than 12 lbs to move. It might be that I'm older (my other experience with being overweight happened during my placement abroad at Uni) and it doesn't melt off the way it did when I was 21, but it feels like it's taken ages to shift this weight. Only in the last three or four months have I started to feel that my eating and exercise habits have fully recovered. Exercise 3 times a week and caloric moderation is slowly chipping away at it.

    It doesn't answer your specific question, and giving unwarranted health/diet advice is very impolite, but have you tried counting weekly calories? I found thinking about weekly intake helped me moderate a lot better than on a day-to-day basis, at least at first.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533

    IMHO the decline in ‘ordinary’ boys (and girls) playing cricket is down to the massive increase in traffic. In my youth the street where I lived, and played cricket in the summer saw about two cars per day. Now it’s much busier, even though it’s purely residential.
    In the small town where I live now the Cricket Club is flourishing, with three men’s teams, a boys and a girls team and a women’s team.

    Sport organised by kids themselves must be 90% or more down from the last millenium, whilst time spent on coached sport will be up fivefold or more. Kids nowadays get far far better coaching, and facilities (when they exist), but lose out on the creativity and play side of sport.
    Parents demand organised activites and kids when not doing so have the draw of video games (that are now social in the way they weren't 20 years ago) plus mindless tik tok scrolling etc.

    When i was a kid, the only way you got to interact with your mates was going outside, which then turned into informal kick about, etc etc etc. Now you can just talk to them from your cellphone, shout at them in a video game etc
  • Leon said:

    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Miklosvar said:

    FF43 said:

    Leon said:

    FF43 said:

    Miklosvar said:

    Nigelb said:

    kjh said:

    Miklosvar said:

    malcolmg said:

    ydoethur said:

    WTF? I think ‘awesome’ is way worse than ‘like.’ So twee.

    Just need a LEON button now
    Has Leon apologised for being wrong on the lab leak?

    U.S. Intelligence Report Finds No Clear Evidence of Covid Origins in Wuhan Lab.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/23/us/politics/covid-lab-leak-wuhan-report.html
    It says no clear evidence. AOEINEOA. What clear evidence could there be anyway? CCTV of avirus sneaking out of the back door?
    In my lifetime there have been two lab leaks in the UK that I am aware of, Smallpox and Foot and Mouth. Both were provable lab leaks. So to say there can't be any clear evidence of a lab leak is obviously not correct.

    It may well be a lab leak and there may not be any evidence that can be found, but that doesn't mean it is a lab leak. It may be, it may not be.

    However unlike @leon I don't jump to conclusions. If leon didn't come out with so much tosh all the time (Do we all remember the mass alien ships over Ukraine?) we might take him more seriously. I can think of two pieces of evidence he provided for absolute proof it came from a lab that were completely dismantled here (one was from Fox news ffs).
    There's also the likely, but not proven Russian influenza leak, of course.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1977_Russian_flu
    Which is exactly the point: Likely but not proven is probably as good as we are going to get with an outbreak in China. They don't do openness there. So the claim of "no clear evidence" is still susceptible to the response: What clear evidence would you expect, given 1. China and 2. the catastrophic consequences of this leak?
    I would want to know why a lab leak is likely, beyond that someone had a notion. There is epidemiological evidence for the epidemic starting in a market, which is also how the previous SARS is known to have started.
    Aside from anything else “the nightmare of circumstantial evidence” - as was explicitly stated in the Fauci/Farrar emails at the beginning of the pandemic

    Problem is I then have to Google the claim to see if it really is evidence. This is the full quote from Ian Lipkin:

    It does not eliminate the possibility of inadvertent release following adaptation through selection in culture at the institute in Wuhan. Given the scale of the bat CoV research pursued there and the site of emergence of the first human cases we have a nightmare of circumstantial evidence to assess.

    So it seems not. The recent DNI report states

    Prior to the pandemic, we assess WIV scientists conducted extensive research on coronaviruses, which included animal sampling and genetic analysis. We continue to have no indication that the WIV’s pre-pandemic research holdings included SARSCoV-2 or a close progenitor, nor any direct evidence that a specific research-related incident occurred involving WIV personnel before the pandemic that could have caused the COVID pandemic.

    So Covid 19 doesn't match a virus the lab was known to be working on. We have to have some other reason to suspect a lab leak.
    "a virus the lab was known to be working on" is rather the point. Again, this is mere absence of evidence. Evidence of absence would require a complete, audited list from the lab of everything it was up to.
    Given that there is significant evidence China executed or otherwise silenced - forever - early covid whistleblowers, the idea they wouldn’t destroy evidence at the lab is fanciful. Indeed the opposite is true. They surely DID destroy evidence
    Indeed, and they also destroyed evidence at the market.
    I don't think we've ever argued that China behaved responsibly or openly with regard to what happened.
    Indeed.

    From what we know, I think we can say for certain that China behaved irresponsibly.

    I think the balance of probabilities is that it probably came from the Lab.

    I think the less likely, but still possible option, is that it came naturally to and from the market without any involvement of the Lab.

    But I don't think we will ever know for certain.
    There is also the modest possibility - discussed right at the outset - that a worker at the WIV/CDC tried to sell lab bats at the market. I think it’s quite unlikely, but it has the advantage of pleasing both sides
    If that happened, then it's from the lab.

    How it leaked from the lab, if it did, is a different question to did it?

    If I was to break it down I'd guess the odds as

    80% accidental leak from lab.
    15% natural to the market, no lab involvement.
    5% deliberate leak from lab.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,302
    @Liveuamap
    Kremlin's spokesperson Peskov denies that Putin lost his grip on power as result of Wagner's mutiny


    https://twitter.com/Liveuamap/status/1673630802125504513
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    Unpopular said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    I've not tried it, though is that the one Boris had a bad time on?

    I struggled to shift the COVID weight for ages, still am actually, though I had a fair bit more than 12 lbs to move. It might be that I'm older (my other experience with being overweight happened during my placement abroad at Uni) and it doesn't melt off the way it did when I was 21, but it feels like it's taken ages to shift this weight. Only in the last three or four months have I started to feel that my eating and exercise habits have fully recovered. Exercise 3 times a week and caloric moderation is slowly chipping away at it.

    It doesn't answer your specific question, and giving unwarranted health/diet advice is very impolite, but have you tried counting weekly calories? I found thinking about weekly intake helped me moderate a lot better than on a day-to-day basis, at least at first.
    If Boris was on it, at least that does explain why he thought shits and giggles was an appropriate philosophy for number 10.
  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 5,037
    Lab leak stuff:

    - The purported evidence that the Times, Vanity Fair, Fox News, Wall Street Journal etc claimed they had was not real and was unfounded. It is highly likely they all got their stories from the same source - David Asher (as per Christopher Ford's Open Letter here: https://christopherashleyford.medium.com/the-lab-leak-inquiry-at-the-state-department-96973cff3a65 ).

    - The virus shows no signs of having been tampered with. This doesn't preclude lab leak; it merely points to IF that happened, it was from a naturally collected sample, which is certainly possible. It does, though, mean that the coincidence is considerably less so - as most large Chinese cities have at least one lab working on understanding bat coronaviruses, we'd have a co-located potential lab source in most large Chinese cities (ie WCDC (holds samples and investigates them) rather than WIV (which does more detailed stuff).

    - There is no "smoking gun" - no sign of tampering, no patient zero(s), no literature that would point towards it prior to an accident, and so forth.

    - China has had history with live animal markets - bringing in multiple species (including suitable intermediary species for bat coronaviruses) from far and wide, crowding them in unsanitary conditions, and pouring people through them in the prefect environment for both zoonotic transfer and super-spreading conditions. This is precisely why they were supposed to have banned these following SARS. And we have evidence that they did NOT do so, and allowed this to continue, but hurriedly tried to cover up this and claim "no, wasn't that, wasn't us, must have come from elsewhere."

    - The superspreading source was the live animal market, and multiple events sparked from there (most "attempted" hops fizzle out, but enough events occurred to support two separate lineages both sourced from the live animal market). This is perfectly compatible with zoonotic transfer from repeatedly selling similar animals from the same source; it's harder to support multiple lab leaks where no superspreading events happened anywhere else than the live animal market (no train stations, no airports, no other markets or supermarkets, no sports facilities, no nothing).

    - No repercussions have happened to any staff members of WIV or WCDC, which would be strange if China believed they were the source of this massive embarrassment to China.

    A lab leak source could still have happened. I'd like some evidence as to how the multiple lineages were introduced (there and not elsewhere), though. I'm definitely leaning quite strongly towards zoonosis, though, but am amenable to evidence the other way.

    Regardless, work to both eliminate live animal markets and to tighten up biosafety in all labs should go forwards.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,416

    IMHO the decline in ‘ordinary’ boys (and girls) playing cricket is down to the massive increase in traffic. In my youth the street where I lived, and played cricket in the summer saw about two cars per day. Now it’s much busier, even though it’s purely residential.
    In the small town where I live now the Cricket Club is flourishing, with three men’s teams, a boys and a girls team and a women’s team.

    Michael Grade said he brought Neighbours to BBC1 because its characters were playing street cricket in the opening titles.
    Which explains his hatred of Doctor Who. Not enough cricket. 😀
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,778

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    Just go out there and get some exercise... ;)
    Weight loss 70% diet 15% exercise 15% genetics/age.
    I eat 1700 kCal/day at age 55 to maintain the same weight (69kg) as when I ate 2800kCal/day at age 35. I have to drop to 1200 kCal/day if I'm injured and can't do my normal 200km/week on the bike.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,416
    eristdoof said:

    Can we have the old buttons back please? We have grown up with them and I am missing them.

    Grown up with them??? You must be quite young.
    The site has been going for nearly(?) 20 years.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 22,416
    Please put the like button back
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited June 2023
    Following on from comment on football academies.

    Another point....they are extremely proactive at going out into the community & observing kids in unorganised settings like football cages and then getting them into the formalised programmes. They aren't just waiting to see a kid at 13-14-15 playing for a local team.

    I think most other sports like cricket rely on selecting from those already established within club cricket. Its something that Ebony-Rainford Brent has tried to address with a scheme, but it drop in the ocean compared to the way football is able to hoover up a wide net of atheletical gifted kids where spending a few £100k a year on people scouting / training kids is nothing if you get one player makes it to the first team.

    Outside T20 & Test cricket, there is no money in cricket. County cricketers are on buttons. It a crap occupation if you are an average county player. Where as even lower league football pros are way above average wages these days.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,778

    @Liveuamap
    Kremlin's spokesperson Peskov denies that Putin lost his grip on power as result of Wagner's mutiny


    https://twitter.com/Liveuamap/status/1673630802125504513

    Peskov = Billy. Zakharova = Sam.
  • A

    kyf_100 said:

    Meanwhile, a series of Russian military/diplomatic flights have just taken off for Washington (confirmed) and (allegedly) Beijing.

    People speculating on Twitter that Putin may no longer be in control (or worse, Russia may have lost a nuke).

    https://twitter.com/TimInHonolulu/status/1673587079295684611

    Can we get a "brace" button?

    It's all fine. I'm build a new table. Glass top, with RVs off a Russian missile as legs. As an amusing talking point, they are live.

    Was looking on eBay, and this chap who was using Grant Mitchell's photo as a logo offered me a low low price...
    I have never been a fan of Eastenders, so I'm not sure about this whole meme about how Prigozhin looks like Kemp.

    But he was pretty Gold in Spandau Ballet, even if Prigozhin never made it Through the Barricades.
    Although the link was strained, I'm disappointed that nobody responded to my deliberate Kemp/Eastenders/Spandau Ballet mixup with other puns.

    If we can't get lazy, pop-culture puns going on this site then what is the world coming to?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    Unpopular said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    I've not tried it, though is that the one Boris had a bad time on?

    I struggled to shift the COVID weight for ages, still am actually, though I had a fair bit more than 12 lbs to move. It might be that I'm older (my other experience with being overweight happened during my placement abroad at Uni) and it doesn't melt off the way it did when I was 21, but it feels like it's taken ages to shift this weight. Only in the last three or four months have I started to feel that my eating and exercise habits have fully recovered. Exercise 3 times a week and caloric moderation is slowly chipping away at it.

    It doesn't answer your specific question, and giving unwarranted health/diet advice is very impolite, but have you tried counting weekly calories? I found thinking about weekly intake helped me moderate a lot better than on a day-to-day basis, at least at first.
    My technique - which worked for fifteen years - was blissfully simply (probably why it worked)

    I shifted from 14 stone 6 (fat) to about 12 stone 12 (just about right) over several months. As you are meant to do

    After that whenever I went over 13 stone I simply fasted - ate nothing - til I was back to 12 stone 12. Worked like a dream. For 15 years!

    The pandemic screwed it all up and I’ve never - psychologically - been able to get back down to the magic 12 stone 12. I get too bored

    So my hope is I can use ozempic to give me that crucial weight loss to 12 12, then I can revert to my old technique

    Tho on the advice of @Miklosvar I have just googled ozempic and apparently it makes thousands of people shit themselves

    Oh
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,778
    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    Just go out there and get some exercise... ;)
    I do! Gym five times a week and a decent walk every day
    I have the impression you drink a lot of alcohol. Have you tried cutting back on that?
    Haha. Good one.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    Just go out there and get some exercise... ;)
    I do! Gym five times a week and a decent walk every day
    I have the impression you drink a lot of alcohol. Have you tried cutting back on that?
    Yes. A bit - tho not entirely
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    Ok another close relative has messaged


    “Ozempic is amazing. It really works”

    So, why not
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,263
    Leon said:

    kjh said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    No I haven't Leon, but I have had to lose quite a bit of weight recently for initially my pit special flight and then more recently my cycle trip. I eat and drink a lot. The only way I can manage it is to crash diet. Probably not advisable but I can lose several kg per week. I just stuff myself with fruit, tasty salad and good quality bread and don't touch alcohol. Probably not good for me but I lost 8kg in a few weeks prior to my cycle trip which is more than you are after.
    I’ve always been able to do that - previously. Crash dieting and fasting. For some reason I’m finding that impossible, atm

    Just wondering if we have any Ozempians on PB

    I get very varied accounts from friends and fam. From “brilliant” to “ugh, made me sick, did nothing”
    I'd wait a few years to see what side effects emerge.
    Interfering with chemical signalling in the brain is not usually without long term consequences.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Leon said:

    Unpopular said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    I've not tried it, though is that the one Boris had a bad time on?

    I struggled to shift the COVID weight for ages, still am actually, though I had a fair bit more than 12 lbs to move. It might be that I'm older (my other experience with being overweight happened during my placement abroad at Uni) and it doesn't melt off the way it did when I was 21, but it feels like it's taken ages to shift this weight. Only in the last three or four months have I started to feel that my eating and exercise habits have fully recovered. Exercise 3 times a week and caloric moderation is slowly chipping away at it.

    It doesn't answer your specific question, and giving unwarranted health/diet advice is very impolite, but have you tried counting weekly calories? I found thinking about weekly intake helped me moderate a lot better than on a day-to-day basis, at least at first.
    My technique - which worked for fifteen years - was blissfully simply (probably why it worked)

    I shifted from 14 stone 6 (fat) to about 12 stone 12 (just about right) over several months. As you are meant to do

    After that whenever I went over 13 stone I simply fasted - ate nothing - til I was back to 12 stone 12. Worked like a dream. For 15 years!

    The pandemic screwed it all up and I’ve never - psychologically - been able to get back down to the magic 12 stone 12. I get too bored

    So my hope is I can use ozempic to give me that crucial weight loss to 12 12, then I can revert to my old technique

    Tho on the advice of @Miklosvar I have just googled ozempic and apparently it makes thousands of people shit themselves

    Oh
    Diarrhoea is effective for weight loss.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,976
    Leon said:

    Unpopular said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    I've not tried it, though is that the one Boris had a bad time on?

    I struggled to shift the COVID weight for ages, still am actually, though I had a fair bit more than 12 lbs to move. It might be that I'm older (my other experience with being overweight happened during my placement abroad at Uni) and it doesn't melt off the way it did when I was 21, but it feels like it's taken ages to shift this weight. Only in the last three or four months have I started to feel that my eating and exercise habits have fully recovered. Exercise 3 times a week and caloric moderation is slowly chipping away at it.

    It doesn't answer your specific question, and giving unwarranted health/diet advice is very impolite, but have you tried counting weekly calories? I found thinking about weekly intake helped me moderate a lot better than on a day-to-day basis, at least at first.
    My technique - which worked for fifteen years - was blissfully simply (probably why it worked)

    I shifted from 14 stone 6 (fat) to about 12 stone 12 (just about right) over several months. As you are meant to do

    After that whenever I went over 13 stone I simply fasted - ate nothing - til I was back to 12 stone 12. Worked like a dream. For 15 years!

    The pandemic screwed it all up and I’ve never - psychologically - been able to get back down to the magic 12 stone 12. I get too bored

    So my hope is I can use ozempic to give me that crucial weight loss to 12 12, then I can revert to my old technique

    Tho on the advice of @Miklosvar I have just googled ozempic and apparently it makes thousands of people shit themselves

    Oh
    Just imagine if you had taken Ozempic just before you watched Threads.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,167
    Leon said:

    Ok another close relative has messaged


    “Ozempic is amazing. It really works”

    So, why not

    I hope your long standing reluctance to pop pills doesn’t stand in the way of a beach bod.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,843
    Leon said:

    Ok another close relative has messaged


    “Ozempic is amazing. It really works”

    So, why not

    You don't need it.walk briskly for an hour a day and the weight will fall off. I've lost a stone at least already. Try the NHS Active 10 app.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,302
    I thought @TheScreamingEagles said this wouldn't happen?

    @faisalislam
    NEW

    Chancellor Jeremy Hunt in Brussels to sign financial services cooperation Memorandum of Understanding with EU, one of the fruits of the Windsor Agreement over NI Brexit rules…


    https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1673621357345611779
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,976
    edited June 2023

    I thought @TheScreamingEagles said this wouldn't happen?

    @faisalislam
    NEW

    Chancellor Jeremy Hunt in Brussels to sign financial services cooperation Memorandum of Understanding with EU, one of the fruits of the Windsor Agreement over NI Brexit rules…


    https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1673621357345611779

    I said it could happen but it wasn't the awesome deal we had pre-Brextit that the Sunak cheerleaders were trying to spin it a

    But I welcome this alignment with the EU, it is better than nothing.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,263
    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:

    Bet DuraAce has never flown anything like this.
    https://twitter.com/Rainmaker1973/status/1673616040838717441

    (I've never seen anything like it.)

    (edit) Caproni's creations feature in the movies of Miyazaki, of course.

    Considering I spent 20 years prolonging my adolescence in military aviation I actually have a pretty thin CV and haven't flown a great variety of aircraft - Bulldog, Chipmunk, Tucano (worst), Hawk, Harrier, Tomcat (best).

    Hubschraubers: Squirrel, Griffin (best), Lynx (worst)

    Been a sand bag in just about everything though. F-15, F-16, F/A-18, T-45, Tornado, EA-6, C-2, E-2, T-37, MH-60, CH-53 plus loads of trash haulers (C-130, VC-10, etc.)
    FWIW, I've flown a Chipmunk, and a Slingsby T.31 (worst).

    The early developments in Italian aviation were pretty mad.
    Apparently the test pilot looped Caproni's WWI heavy bomber prototype.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,153
    A
    AlistairM said:

    I think the Russians give us far more credit than we are due.

    Normal service has resumed on Russian state TV

    The UK continues to live rent free in their heads 🇬🇧

    https://twitter.com/francis_scarr/status/1673630113131380737

    It's nice to see our soft power in action.
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,260
    edited June 2023
    Re; a post much earler in the day indicating conspiracy thinking, I don't see what reason Rubio and others would have to lie. If he's vice-chair of the Intelligence Committee, and he says that multiple, current and high-level insiders, have come forward to all the people at his Committee with these claims, that's not really the kind of thing he'd find it very easy to lie about.

    That would seem to leave two options ; either there's a large-scale misinformation campaign by senior people in the U.S. to cover up some sort of very powerful earth technology, or something else..
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,437
    The Rest is Politics.

    John Major outlines what he believes to be the reason for Margaret Thatcher's downfall.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWilajNRotU
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,167
    Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?



  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,606
    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    Just go out there and get some exercise... ;)
    I do! Gym five times a week and a decent walk every day
    I have the impression you drink a lot of alcohol. Have you tried cutting back on that?
    Yes. A bit - tho not entirely
    You don't need to cut it out completely, but set a limit and stick to it. And make that limit low. Try no more than 1 bottle of wine or equivalent per fortnight. Force yourself to really pick and choose when to use your "budget". Stick with it for a while, say three months. Write it down to keep yourself honest, and don't commit yourself to going back or carrying on until the end of that fixed period. Treat it as an experiment rather than a regime, and that way you can make a sensible choice afterwards to decide whether it suits you. Maybe you value the fun over the the weight loss and decide to carry on boozing, or maybe you like it better feeling trimmer and soberer. Just give yourself a proper run at it so you can decide based on what it's actually like, rather than on your hopes and fears of what it might be like.
    Apparently ozempic also reduces - significantly - your desire for booze. So that’s a positive side effect if it is the case. I’ll keep PB posted
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,721
    Totally off-topic but is anyone else having trouble with the Dartford Crossing site? I’m trying to check my statement but it’s decided not to recognise my email, let along my password, for log-in.
  • UnpopularUnpopular Posts: 888
    Leon said:

    Unpopular said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    I've not tried it, though is that the one Boris had a bad time on?

    I struggled to shift the COVID weight for ages, still am actually, though I had a fair bit more than 12 lbs to move. It might be that I'm older (my other experience with being overweight happened during my placement abroad at Uni) and it doesn't melt off the way it did when I was 21, but it feels like it's taken ages to shift this weight. Only in the last three or four months have I started to feel that my eating and exercise habits have fully recovered. Exercise 3 times a week and caloric moderation is slowly chipping away at it.

    It doesn't answer your specific question, and giving unwarranted health/diet advice is very impolite, but have you tried counting weekly calories? I found thinking about weekly intake helped me moderate a lot better than on a day-to-day basis, at least at first.
    My technique - which worked for fifteen years - was blissfully simply (probably why it worked)

    I shifted from 14 stone 6 (fat) to about 12 stone 12 (just about right) over several months. As you are meant to do

    After that whenever I went over 13 stone I simply fasted - ate nothing - til I was back to 12 stone 12. Worked like a dream. For 15 years!

    The pandemic screwed it all up and I’ve never - psychologically - been able to get back down to the magic 12 stone 12. I get too bored

    So my hope is I can use ozempic to give me that crucial weight loss to 12 12, then I can revert to my old technique

    Tho on the advice of @Miklosvar I have just googled ozempic and apparently it makes thousands of people shit themselves

    Oh
    I think for me part of the delay in losing the weight was psychological as you say. My old strategies pre-COVID weren't working for me post-COVID. It felt like I had to learn them all over again and in the same way as before.

    When I got back from my year abroad and realised I was fat, I started calorie restriction with absolute shit, frozen processed rubbish, which I love, to get me to the end of the day. I didn't care if I was hungry when I could look forward to a spam sarnie (four slices, mind) with a cheese single. Then I got sick of that, learned to cook and slowly started on meal prepping more healthy stuff and portioning it out etc (it's a ball ache). I kept that up for years, it was still all calorie counted, and it worked.

    Then COVID came and fucked any motivation and the weight piled back on. I think what helped get me back into those habits, psychologically, is that I ended up rebuilding them, more or less, the exact same way and in the same order as I'd built them in the first place. I'll let you know after the next pandemic if my cod psychology works out!
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156

    Re; a post much earler in the day indicating conspiracy thinking, I don't see what reason Rubio and others would have to lie. If he's vice-chair of the Intelligence Committee, and he says that multiple, current and high-level insiders, have come forward to all the people at his Committee with these claims, that's not really the kind of thing he'd find it very easy to lie about.

    That would seem to leave two options ; either there's a large-scale misinformation campaign by very senior people in the U.S. to cover up some sort of very powerful earth technology, or something else..

    That a lot of Americans, including those senior in government, have gone slightly doolally and love a conspiracy theory? They are quite likely to re-elect a narcissist toddler who would otherwise be going to jail as President. They want to ban the teaching of evolution because the world was created in seven days. The best reaction to such statements are a very lazy wtf until ET decides to address us on live tv.
  • Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?



    Morally I think its reasonable to ask the buyer to cover any legal fees and costs, since their due diligence failed and you shouldn't be out of pocket for that.

    Morally I think its unreasonable to get extra money for the land itself, considering you agree that you had sold it.

    What the buyer wants to do with their own land, whether it be commercial or orphanage, doesn't morally enter into it in my eyes.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,592

    Totally off-topic but is anyone else having trouble with the Dartford Crossing site? I’m trying to check my statement but it’s decided not to recognise my email, let along my password, for log-in.

    There currently appears to be 2 Dartford tunnel sites so make sure you are using the correct one...
  • WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 9,260
    edited June 2023

    Re; a post much earler in the day indicating conspiracy thinking, I don't see what reason Rubio and others would have to lie. If he's vice-chair of the Intelligence Committee, and he says that multiple, current and high-level insiders, have come forward to all the people at his Committee with these claims, that's not really the kind of thing he'd find it very easy to lie about.

    That would seem to leave two options ; either there's a large-scale misinformation campaign by very senior people in the U.S. to cover up some sort of very powerful earth technology, or something else..

    That a lot of Americans, including those senior in government, have gone slightly doolally and love a conspiracy theory? They are quite likely to re-elect a narcissist toddler who would otherwise be going to jail as President. They want to ban the teaching of evolution because the world was created in seven days. The best reaction to such statements are a very lazy wtf until ET decides to address us on live tv.
    But he says that these are very senior military and/or currently serving intelligence figures ( and apparently senior politicians ) , who've come forward with direct, first hand evidence to his intelligence committee.

    It does have to be said that there is a cultural danger of thinking that because the populist right are nowadays often the most open to these kind of claims, in the twenty-first century and among the broader public, they must be wrong.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    edited June 2023

    Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?

    It sounds like his solicitors were at fault tbh. For a proper opinion you'd have to ask a conveyancing solicitor - not that that would be free of course. But it sounds to me like you retain the rights so I'd sell at the current commercial value if I were you. Does he have the pp for the site ?
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,951
    Leon said:

    Ok another close relative has messaged


    “Ozempic is amazing. It really works”

    So, why not

    Where are you getting it from? I understand there is a chronic shortage in the UK at the moment. And even if you're able to get it one month, it may not be in stock the next, and it takes several months of consistent treatment to get the desired effects?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,263

    Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?

    Yes, IMO, if only for the inconvenience.
    But be generous in how much you ask. And have a chat with your solicitor first.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,976
    🚨 EXCLUSIVE: Bayern Munich have today submitted an official proposal to sign Harry Kane from Tottenham Hotspur. #FCBayern written offer to #THFC for 29yo striker worth €70m + add-ons. England captain has 1yr left of existing Spurs contract @TheAthleticFC

    https://twitter.com/David_Ornstein/status/1673636610942943232
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    edited June 2023

    Lab leak stuff:

    - The purported evidence that the Times, Vanity Fair, Fox News, Wall Street Journal etc claimed they had was not real and was unfounded. It is highly likely they all got their stories from the same source - David Asher (as per Christopher Ford's Open Letter here: https://christopherashleyford.medium.com/the-lab-leak-inquiry-at-the-state-department-96973cff3a65 ).

    - The virus shows no signs of having been tampered with. This doesn't preclude lab leak; it merely points to IF that happened, it was from a naturally collected sample, which is certainly possible. It does, though, mean that the coincidence is considerably less so - as most large Chinese cities have at least one lab working on understanding bat coronaviruses, we'd have a co-located potential lab source in most large Chinese cities (ie WCDC (holds samples and investigates them) rather than WIV (which does more detailed stuff).

    - There is no "smoking gun" - no sign of tampering, no patient zero(s), no literature that would point towards it prior to an accident, and so forth.

    - China has had history with live animal markets - bringing in multiple species (including suitable intermediary species for bat coronaviruses) from far and wide, crowding them in unsanitary conditions, and pouring people through them in the prefect environment for both zoonotic transfer and super-spreading conditions. This is precisely why they were supposed to have banned these following SARS. And we have evidence that they did NOT do so, and allowed this to continue, but hurriedly tried to cover up this and claim "no, wasn't that, wasn't us, must have come from elsewhere."

    - The superspreading source was the live animal market, and multiple events sparked from there (most "attempted" hops fizzle out, but enough events occurred to support two separate lineages both sourced from the live animal market). This is perfectly compatible with zoonotic transfer from repeatedly selling similar animals from the same source; it's harder to support multiple lab leaks where no superspreading events happened anywhere else than the live animal market (no train stations, no airports, no other markets or supermarkets, no sports facilities, no nothing).

    - No repercussions have happened to any staff members of WIV or WCDC, which would be strange if China believed they were the source of this massive embarrassment to China.

    A lab leak source could still have happened. I'd like some evidence as to how the multiple lineages were introduced (there and not elsewhere), though. I'm definitely leaning quite strongly towards zoonosis, though, but am amenable to evidence the other way.

    Regardless, work to both eliminate live animal markets and to tighten up biosafety in all labs should go forwards.

    Para 1 - too meta to bother with

    para 2 - I don't claim to understand the science, but there's lots of scientists who say the furin cleavage site is actually rather fishy. And is anyone denying that whatever emerged from the lab had its ultimate origins in the wild?

    "as most large Chinese cities have at least one lab working on understanding bat coronaviruses, we'd have a co-located potential lab source in most large Chinese cities" - GLARING fallacy, and the sort of thing which discredits lab leak debunkers generally. Say I hear that someone has died violently in Los Angeles, and I sagely say: prolly shot, there's lots of guns in LA, how does it weaken my argument to say that there's lots of guns in all other US cities?

    para 3 - AOEINEOA

    3 and 4 are your best points, but nobody (sane) is saying the lab leak theory is for certain.

    para 5 is batshit. If you are trying to cover up an error by an employee, disciplining him for the error is not the brightest idea in the world. It is an affirmation that the error happened.

    This is getting boring. Either theory is distinctly possible and we will never know the answer for certain. But what's striking is that it is the *attacks* on the lab leak theory which almost invariably contain logical howlers as in paras 2, 3 and 5 above.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156

    Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?



    If he has been shafted it is his solicitor who represents him, so feels like the legal target, not you or your solicitor.

    Morally, if all parties agreed and were clear at the time and paperwork wrong, then yes he has a moral claim, but should still cover your admin and legal costs to resolve.

    To be brutally honest, not sure what I would do though, the world economy is not the most moral of places so would depend on circumstances and could be from free of charge to nominal contribution to a charity to building the holiday homes myself....
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,976

    Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?



    I'd recommend getting legal advice. The fault would be on his sols side.

    Perhaps @DavidL can recommend somebody.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,395

    Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?



    The father of a friend of mine (in England) sold house 1 and the family bought and lived in a new house 2 thereafter for a decade or two. Family grew up, etc., and Pa decided to move. When he tried to sell House 2 to the new buyer, he discovered he didn't own it. Bad screwup at the purchase. Basically, he was completely out of luck if the previous owner wanted to be difficult. For instance, p. o. could have had a huge capital gain at the cost of refunding the purchase price plus standard interest.

    Very fortunately, p.o. was jolly decent about it and signed it over - but what I do remember is that Pa's solicitor got the blame. He was paid to do the checks, and had screwed up. Pa got a new solicitor instantly. No idea if former solicitor had to pay the bill, though.

    Your buyer's solicitor is the one responsible to him. Your solicitor is the oine responsible to you. Your buyer's solicitor has\ screwed up. Your buyer has no lien on your solicitor or you as I see it.

    But irrespective of all that you might want to get a specialist solicitor to look the matter over, and tell you what your options are. It's always possible there is some huge misundersyanding or some hidden motive to do with restrictions etc in the sasines. And if it is crofting land ...
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,558

    Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?



    As we are in a post moral age you should sort it out in return for a month a year for life for you and your brother in one of the holiday let’s outside peak.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,167

    Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?

    Thanks for replies thus far. I'm reactionary enough to not indulge in this new fangled wtf business.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Ok you bastards.

    I've removed "like".

    A sad day in the annals of taking Leon seriously.
    +1
    This is LEONWORLD
    And some people deny we live in a dystopia.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,223
    Weekly deaths update:

    https://tinyurl.com/yjtdr9ax

    Not done this recently, but of interest is the COVID deaths figure of 156. That's the lowest it's been since July 2021 when the effects of lockdown were probably still a factor.

    I wonder if the virus has nearly picked off everyone it's going to or if hospitals aren't testing quite so much? (i.e. many of the COVID deaths are people dying with rather than from COVID).

    Non-COVID deaths still several hundred a week above the five-year average. That said, we're still a net c.10,000 non-COVID deaths below the five-year average since May 2020 (i.e. once most COVID deaths were being detected as such).

    Week-ending | 5-year average | COVID deaths | non-COVID deaths | non-COVID deaths in excess of the 5-year average

    09-Dec-22 | 11,007 | 326 | 11,368 | 361
    16-Dec-22 | 11,203 | 390 | 11,999 | 796
    23-Dec-22 | 12,037 | 429 | 14,101 | 2,064
    30-Dec-22 | 7,925 | 393 | 9,124 | 1,199
    06-Jan-23 | 12,037 | 739 | 14,244 | 2,207
    13-Jan-23 | 13,749 | 922 | 16,459 | 2,710
    20-Jan-23 | 13,098 | 781 | 15,023 | 1,925
    27-Jan-23 | 12,562 | 579 | 13,588 | 1,026
    03-Feb-23 | 12,108 | 499 | 12,913 | 805
    10-Feb-23 | 11,794 | 446 | 12,226 | 432
    17-Feb-23 | 11,586 | 416 | 11,766 | 180
    24-Feb-23 | 11,444 | 420 | 11,532 | 88
    03-Mar-23 | 11,037 | 513 | 11,536 | 499
    10-Mar-23 | 11,419 | 533 | 10,877 | -542
    17-Mar-23 | 11,200 | 559 | 11,574 | 374
    24-Mar-23 | 10,806 | 624 | 11,428 | 622
    31-Mar-23 | 10,163 | 634 | 10,950 | 787
    07-Apr-23 | 10,130 | 513 | 9,576 | -554
    14-Apr-23 | 10,290 | 465 | 9,513 | -777
    21-Apr-23 | 10,108 | 538 | 11,882 | 1,774
    28-Apr-23 | 10,683 | 459 | 11,693 | 1,010
    05-May-23 | 9,674 | 310 | 9,833 | 159
    12-May-23 | 10,119 | 309 | 10,058 | -61
    19-May-23 | 10,414 | 322 | 11,332 | 918
    26-May-23 | 10,090 | 262 | 10,849 | 759
    02-Jun-23 | 7,869 | 189 | 8,650 | 781
    09-Jun-23 | 10,362 | 211 | 10,729 | 367
    16-Jun-23 | 9,692 | 156 | 10,544 | 852
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,263
    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    Just go out there and get some exercise... ;)
    I do! Gym five times a week and a decent walk every day
    I have the impression you drink a lot of alcohol. Have you tried cutting back on that?
    Yes. A bit - tho not entirely
    You don't need to cut it out completely, but set a limit and stick to it. And make that limit low. Try no more than 1 bottle of wine or equivalent per fortnight. Force yourself to really pick and choose when to use your "budget". Stick with it for a while, say three months. Write it down to keep yourself honest, and don't commit yourself to going back or carrying on until the end of that fixed period. Treat it as an experiment rather than a regime, and that way you can make a sensible choice afterwards to decide whether it suits you. Maybe you value the fun over the the weight loss and decide to carry on boozing, or maybe you like it better feeling trimmer and soberer. Just give yourself a proper run at it so you can decide based on what it's actually like, rather than on your hopes and fears of what it might be like.
    Apparently ozempic also reduces - significantly - your desire for booze. So that’s a positive side effect if it is the case. I’ll keep PB posted
    Any likely effects on (eg) your desire to write ?

    The list of side effects looks pretty off putting to me. If you're not morbidly obese, why not just eat tofu for a fortnight ?
    The would require a certain degree of willpower, but at least you won't be hungry.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    🚨 EXCLUSIVE: Bayern Munich have today submitted an official proposal to sign Harry Kane from Tottenham Hotspur. #FCBayern written offer to #THFC for 29yo striker worth €70m + add-ons. England captain has 1yr left of existing Spurs contract @TheAthleticFC

    https://twitter.com/David_Ornstein/status/1673636610942943232

    Very steep for 1 year left. I'd take the money if I was Spuds or extend his contract.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,167
    Pulpstar said:

    Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?

    It sounds like his solicitors were at fault tbh. For a proper opinion you'd have to ask a conveyancing solicitor - not that that would be free of course. But it sounds to me like you retain the rights so I'd sell at the current commercial value if I were you. Does he have the pp for the site ?
    PP = planning permission? No, putting in the PP was how he discovered he didn't actually own the land.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,395
    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Farooq said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    On topic. Have any pb-ers tried Ozempic or the like?

    I’m not obese but I just can’t shift the ten-twelve pounds I put on during the pandemic - even now. If I could magic it away with a needle or a pill, I would

    Just go out there and get some exercise... ;)
    I do! Gym five times a week and a decent walk every day
    I have the impression you drink a lot of alcohol. Have you tried cutting back on that?
    Yes. A bit - tho not entirely
    You don't need to cut it out completely, but set a limit and stick to it. And make that limit low. Try no more than 1 bottle of wine or equivalent per fortnight. Force yourself to really pick and choose when to use your "budget". Stick with it for a while, say three months. Write it down to keep yourself honest, and don't commit yourself to going back or carrying on until the end of that fixed period. Treat it as an experiment rather than a regime, and that way you can make a sensible choice afterwards to decide whether it suits you. Maybe you value the fun over the the weight loss and decide to carry on boozing, or maybe you like it better feeling trimmer and soberer. Just give yourself a proper run at it so you can decide based on what it's actually like, rather than on your hopes and fears of what it might be like.
    Apparently ozempic also reduces - significantly - your desire for booze. So that’s a positive side effect if it is the case. I’ll keep PB posted
    Any likely effects on (eg) your desire to write ?

    The list of side effects looks pretty off putting to me. If you're not morbidly obese, why not just eat tofu for a fortnight ?
    The would require a certain degree of willpower, but at least you won't be hungry.
    It'd save on bed linen laundering costs. And shiteing the bed is a bit embarrassing for a travel writer.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    tlg86 said:

    Weekly deaths update:

    https://tinyurl.com/yjtdr9ax

    Not done this recently, but of interest is the COVID deaths figure of 156. That's the lowest it's been since July 2021 when the effects of lockdown were probably still a factor.

    I wonder if the virus has nearly picked off everyone it's going to or if hospitals aren't testing quite so much? (i.e. many of the COVID deaths are people dying with rather than from COVID).

    Non-COVID deaths still several hundred a week above the five-year average. That said, we're still a net c.10,000 non-COVID deaths below the five-year average since May 2020 (i.e. once most COVID deaths were being detected as such).

    Week-ending | 5-year average | COVID deaths | non-COVID deaths | non-COVID deaths in excess of the 5-year average

    09-Dec-22 | 11,007 | 326 | 11,368 | 361
    16-Dec-22 | 11,203 | 390 | 11,999 | 796
    23-Dec-22 | 12,037 | 429 | 14,101 | 2,064
    30-Dec-22 | 7,925 | 393 | 9,124 | 1,199
    06-Jan-23 | 12,037 | 739 | 14,244 | 2,207
    13-Jan-23 | 13,749 | 922 | 16,459 | 2,710
    20-Jan-23 | 13,098 | 781 | 15,023 | 1,925
    27-Jan-23 | 12,562 | 579 | 13,588 | 1,026
    03-Feb-23 | 12,108 | 499 | 12,913 | 805
    10-Feb-23 | 11,794 | 446 | 12,226 | 432
    17-Feb-23 | 11,586 | 416 | 11,766 | 180
    24-Feb-23 | 11,444 | 420 | 11,532 | 88
    03-Mar-23 | 11,037 | 513 | 11,536 | 499
    10-Mar-23 | 11,419 | 533 | 10,877 | -542
    17-Mar-23 | 11,200 | 559 | 11,574 | 374
    24-Mar-23 | 10,806 | 624 | 11,428 | 622
    31-Mar-23 | 10,163 | 634 | 10,950 | 787
    07-Apr-23 | 10,130 | 513 | 9,576 | -554
    14-Apr-23 | 10,290 | 465 | 9,513 | -777
    21-Apr-23 | 10,108 | 538 | 11,882 | 1,774
    28-Apr-23 | 10,683 | 459 | 11,693 | 1,010
    05-May-23 | 9,674 | 310 | 9,833 | 159
    12-May-23 | 10,119 | 309 | 10,058 | -61
    19-May-23 | 10,414 | 322 | 11,332 | 918
    26-May-23 | 10,090 | 262 | 10,849 | 759
    02-Jun-23 | 7,869 | 189 | 8,650 | 781
    09-Jun-23 | 10,362 | 211 | 10,729 | 367
    16-Jun-23 | 9,692 | 156 | 10,544 | 852

    Is the 5 yr average adjusted for population rise?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,976
    Pulpstar said:

    🚨 EXCLUSIVE: Bayern Munich have today submitted an official proposal to sign Harry Kane from Tottenham Hotspur. #FCBayern written offer to #THFC for 29yo striker worth €70m + add-ons. England captain has 1yr left of existing Spurs contract @TheAthleticFC

    https://twitter.com/David_Ornstein/status/1673636610942943232

    Very steep for 1 year left. I'd take the money if I was Spuds or extend his contract.
    He's not extending his contract at Spurs.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,395

    Pulpstar said:

    Help requested in an ethical dilemma.

    My father died 25 years ago leaving my brother and me his house and a patch of land (several acres afaIcr including a small loch). We sold the house and the land a couple of years later. The buyer now wants to build holiday homes on that land and has discovered that it was not included in the sale, and my father's estate still holds title to the land. He appears to think that our solicitors were at fault so should sort this out foc, though it seems to me his solicitor should also have done due diligence at that point.

    Since we had thought that the land was disposed of at the time, morally I guess we should do what we can to resolve the current situation on that assumption, otoh my brother and I are currently the legal landowners. The buyer originally paid a fraction of the current value of house and land (10% I'd very roughly guess) and now wants to develop it commercially, so it's not as if we're standing in the way of an orphanage or donkey sanctuary. Should I be asking for a payment to transfer ownership of the land to the buyer?

    It sounds like his solicitors were at fault tbh. For a proper opinion you'd have to ask a conveyancing solicitor - not that that would be free of course. But it sounds to me like you retain the rights so I'd sell at the current commercial value if I were you. Does he have the pp for the site ?
    PP = planning permission? No, putting in the PP was how he discovered he didn't actually own the land.
    Possible that there is a mistake with the Land Registry mapping, which is what the PP would be looking at?There is a case known to me where I am 99% sure this happened (from old OS maps and title deeds and sasines) but fortunately didn't need to spend on the solicitors to sort out.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Pulpstar said:

    🚨 EXCLUSIVE: Bayern Munich have today submitted an official proposal to sign Harry Kane from Tottenham Hotspur. #FCBayern written offer to #THFC for 29yo striker worth €70m + add-ons. England captain has 1yr left of existing Spurs contract @TheAthleticFC

    https://twitter.com/David_Ornstein/status/1673636610942943232

    Very steep for 1 year left. I'd take the money if I was Spuds or extend his contract.
    He's not extending his contract at Spurs.
    They need to take the money then or he's off for free in a year's time.
  • TazTaz Posts: 15,049

    Pulpstar said:

    🚨 EXCLUSIVE: Bayern Munich have today submitted an official proposal to sign Harry Kane from Tottenham Hotspur. #FCBayern written offer to #THFC for 29yo striker worth €70m + add-ons. England captain has 1yr left of existing Spurs contract @TheAthleticFC

    https://twitter.com/David_Ornstein/status/1673636610942943232

    Very steep for 1 year left. I'd take the money if I was Spuds or extend his contract.
    He's not extending his contract at Spurs.
    Don't blame him. He wants to win things not play in a team of gallant losers. A gallant loser is.......a loser.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    Pulpstar said:

    🚨 EXCLUSIVE: Bayern Munich have today submitted an official proposal to sign Harry Kane from Tottenham Hotspur. #FCBayern written offer to #THFC for 29yo striker worth €70m + add-ons. England captain has 1yr left of existing Spurs contract @TheAthleticFC

    https://twitter.com/David_Ornstein/status/1673636610942943232

    Very steep for 1 year left. I'd take the money if I was Spuds or extend his contract.
    Less than Arsenal paying for Kai Havertz. And close to zero chance Kane extends his contract this close to the end of his contract. Doubt he would be willing to go to Bayern either - if he wants to drop down in standard could get a billion dollar deal in Saudi.
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    Pulpstar said:

    🚨 EXCLUSIVE: Bayern Munich have today submitted an official proposal to sign Harry Kane from Tottenham Hotspur. #FCBayern written offer to #THFC for 29yo striker worth €70m + add-ons. England captain has 1yr left of existing Spurs contract @TheAthleticFC

    https://twitter.com/David_Ornstein/status/1673636610942943232

    Very steep for 1 year left. I'd take the money if I was Spuds or extend his contract.
    Real will probably come in now. Perfect replacement for Benzema.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591
    AlistairM said:

    I think the Russians give us far more credit than we are due.

    Normal service has resumed on Russian state TV

    The UK continues to live rent free in their heads 🇬🇧

    https://twitter.com/francis_scarr/status/1673630113131380737

    Its nice of them to think of us
This discussion has been closed.