As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
Yes, I think so - but it's a very tiny minority.
Just as you get tiny minorities for all sorts of nutty opinions in any country.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
Yes, there are some unusual aspects though concerning the Hindu vote in Leicester. There was a major purge of sitting councillors who tried to vote to end the directly elected mayor role, and it is a bit opaque what all that was about. I think that the dislike of Mayor Soulsby is partly that he is fairly classically Old Labour, but also because of his reaction to the Hindutva street disturbances last September.
There was also the fracas when Corbyn parachuted Webbe into Keith Vaz's old seat. A lot of locals objected quite strongly and went over to the Conservatives.
There is a lot of support for Modi amongst Leicester Hindus, who quite like his Hindu nationalist policies, but to offset that there is a particular dislike of it from Leicester's secular Hindus, Sikhs and Muslims, who are also numerous.
Overall, I would expect the small number of racists in the country who moved to REFUK and similar when Sunak was coronation to offset the pro-Hindutva vote for Sunak, to net out nationally, though there may be some constituencies where one side is more prominent.
An interesting seat to me is Harrow East, which I suspect the Conservatives will hold, on the basis of what is now a huge Indian Conservative vote. Bob Blackman was ahead of the curve, by cultivating that community, over the course of thirty years. Brent North might also move back into play, at some point.
There always was an Indian Conservative vote in both seats, but in the 90's and 00's, demographic change outpaced the growth of that vote. Now, that vote seems to have grown sufficiently to outpace demographic change.
Professional Indians that I've worked with can be very right-wing.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
And that's it, that's the truth. It's not about whether Tories are racist and other voters aren't. You'll find racists in all walks of life. The only reason I mentioned Conservative voters is because I'm seeking the potential of negative effects that might balance the supposed positive effects HYUFD mentions. Racist Labour voters aren't the issue in this particular case because they are already not going to vote Tory, doubly so.
I've no idea whether your 1-2% is a fair estimate or not. But it's there, it exists, and it's fiercely naive for Casino to assert otherwise.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
There will always 1 to 2 % of population who will find a reason not to vote for a candidate.
Apparently you hear every so often in focus groups men saying we shouldn’t have women PMs simply because they might get emotional at that time of the month and make bad decisions.
Prime Ministerial Tension is a constant. The tension being what the rest of us feel about when the feckers are going to make their next bad decision.
@Cicero and others. I enjoyed this piece from Brett Devereaux, analysing why Russian military performance has been so poor (and the same may turn out to be true of other vaunted militaries). I also take his point that (counter-intuitively, WMD, especially nukes, save lives.)
As a counterbalance read this from foreignaffairs.com an unwinnable war.
That's a good article (if interminably long) - essentially TLDR: Ukraine and Russia will be mutually hostile indefinitely, and no military outcome will change that, Ukraine may well shift the current frontline but is unlikely to win decisively; Russia cannot win decisively at all without nukes and maybe not even with nukes; therefore a parallel diplomatic effort should be made to achieve an indefinite ceasefire coupled with an unambiguous US guarantee to Ukraine in the event of further fighting.
For those interested in the military detail, Tom Cooper (pro-Ukraine but tries to be factual) is interesting:
No one has a problem with a negotiated settlement Nick. As long as that means Ukraine (all of Ukraine including Crimea and Donbass) gets to decide for themselves as a country who they align with. Joining NATO and the EU as they see fit and Russia has no input at all. That should be the absolute minimum.
One of the problems is populations don’t stand still. If something has been seized and held for a while, or been a miserable war zone, can there be an approved UN backed negotiated settlement based on votes in the region that doesn’t rubber stamp original evil intent and let them get away with it?
For example, if you had a vote exactly here in land being fought over today at one point of history, the Cossacks would have won - I believe they were Cossacks, not Russian, Polish, Ukrainian or Lithuanian. But there is nothing in this world today, certainly not the United Nations, who at any point in history would have accepted a Cossack win.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
There will always 1 to 2 % of population who will find a reason not to vote for a candidate.
Apparently you hear every so often in focus groups men saying we shouldn’t have women PMs simply because they might get emotional at that time of the month and make bad decisions.
Prime Ministerial Tension is a constant. The tension being what the rest of us feel about when the feckers are going to make their next bad decision.
It would be terrible to have a PM whose behaviour was uncontrollably driven by their reproductive organs.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
And that's it, that's the truth. It's not about whether Tories are racist and other voters aren't. You'll find racists in all walks of life. The only reason I mentioned Conservative voters is because I'm seeking the potential of negative effects that might balance the supposed positive effects HYUFD mentions. Racist Labour voters aren't the issue in this particular case because they are already not going to vote Tory, doubly so.
I've no idea whether your 1-2% is a fair estimate or not. But it's there, it exists, and it's fiercely naive for Casino to assert otherwise.
The Labour candidate is v ginger. What about the anti-ginger vote?
I take it with all these threads by TSE that OGH is holiday?
We should have known the shit was going to his the fan big time... 😂
It’s going to be a nice quiet weekend topping up the tan. Everything will be nice and quiet. Cocktails in the sun. No need for PB. No need for Malmesbury to get his Davey Crocket out. Not that there is any kind of day that actually needs Malmesbury to get his Davey Crocket out.
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
Yes, there are some unusual aspects though concerning the Hindu vote in Leicester. There was a major purge of sitting councillors who tried to vote to end the directly elected mayor role, and it is a bit opaque what all that was about. I think that the dislike of Mayor Soulsby is partly that he is fairly classically Old Labour, but also because of his reaction to the Hindutva street disturbances last September.
There was also the fracas when Corbyn parachuted Webbe into Keith Vaz's old seat. A lot of locals objected quite strongly and went over to the Conservatives.
There is a lot of support for Modi amongst Leicester Hindus, who quite like his Hindu nationalist policies, but to offset that there is a particular dislike of it from Leicester's secular Hindus, Sikhs and Muslims, who are also numerous.
Overall, I would expect the small number of racists in the country who moved to REFUK and similar when Sunak was coronation to offset the pro-Hindutva vote for Sunak, to net out nationally, though there may be some constituencies where one side is more prominent.
An interesting seat to me is Harrow East, which I suspect the Conservatives will hold, on the basis of what is now a huge Indian Conservative vote. Bob Blackman was ahead of the curve, by cultivating that community, over the course of thirty years. Brent North might also move back into play, at some point.
There always was an Indian Conservative vote in both seats, but in the 90's and 00's, demographic change outpaced the growth of that vote. Now, that vote seems to have grown sufficiently to outpace demographic change.
Professional Indians that I've worked with can be very right-wing.
Thankfully their children less so. Takes a generation to assimilate properly.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
And that's it, that's the truth. It's not about whether Tories are racist and other voters aren't. You'll find racists in all walks of life. The only reason I mentioned Conservative voters is because I'm seeking the potential of negative effects that might balance the supposed positive effects HYUFD mentions. Racist Labour voters aren't the issue in this particular case because they are already not going to vote Tory, doubly so.
I've no idea whether your 1-2% is a fair estimate or not. But it's there, it exists, and it's fiercely naive for Casino to assert otherwise.
The Labour candidate is v ginger. What about the anti-ginger vote?
I wouldn't be in the least bit surprised. Of course, there are those who fetishise redheads... and let's just leave it at that.
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
Devoir is homework. There’s no code here, although I didn’t know who Le Clercq was.
Also, Uccle is a (prosperous) suburb of Brussels, not “a town”.
Fascinating isn't it how globalisation seems to require higher pay for the well connected and lower pay for everyone else.
The Conservatives have restructured the economy to continually import more and more cheap workers, disposing of the old ones like fuses. It's an assembly line designed to eat the poor for their labour and spit out the bits. Labour are applauding this.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
And that's it, that's the truth. It's not about whether Tories are racist and other voters aren't. You'll find racists in all walks of life. The only reason I mentioned Conservative voters is because I'm seeking the potential of negative effects that might balance the supposed positive effects HYUFD mentions. Racist Labour voters aren't the issue in this particular case because they are already not going to vote Tory, doubly so.
I've no idea whether your 1-2% is a fair estimate or not. But it's there, it exists, and it's fiercely naive for Casino to assert otherwise.
The Labour candidate is v ginger. What about the anti-ginger vote?
I totally agree. Labour have parachuted a Starmerite duffer in from Camben, Ginger, looks more like Prince Harry than the one Sky hired this week (though that’s not saying much) Labour have already blown this election.
However, they have been canny enough in their algorithm to put their “B Ark” campaigners onto the coach to Mid Beds, so they got that bit right.
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
fuck is a scullery though?
A quick look at the Wikipedia page for Uccle suggests it's easily posh enough to have houses with sculleries.
Also, under the "Notable Inhabitants" section, one B. Johnson and family.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
Still not convinced that some of it isn’t a home grown effort, a creative exercise as it were. Fair play to them for giving the auld lads a bit of excitement mind..
@Cicero and others. I enjoyed this piece from Brett Devereaux, analysing why Russian military performance has been so poor (and the same may turn out to be true of other vaunted militaries). I also take his point that (counter-intuitively, WMD, especially nukes, save lives.)
As a counterbalance read this from foreignaffairs.com an unwinnable war.
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
fuck is a scullery though?
A quick look at the Wikipedia page for Uccle suggests it's easily posh enough to have houses with sculleries.
Also, under the "Notable Inhabitants" section, one B. Johnson and family.
Space missing there. "Not able" should be two words.
Nick Palmer - we will have to see what happens on the battlefront and yes we need to be thinking about what comes next depending on where battlelines are. However we shouldn't ignore the economic aspect. The sanctions will in my view have a devastating effect on the Russian economy. The Saudis have tried to boost the oil price without any luck. It's not clear that Russia is making any profit on its current oil exports and it can't re-orient its gas supplies.
So the sanctions stay (possily tightened) so long as the current leader is in power and Russia maintains its claim on Ukrainian sovereign territory. Russians tolerated Putin because he brought economic prosperity. I expect the vast majority would quite happily give up Crimea to rescue them from penury. The other territories are ones they couldn't really care less about.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
Still not convinced that some of it isn’t a home grown effort, a creative exercise as it were. Fair play to them for giving the auld lads a bit of excitement mind..
I can see the fun in taking up a contrarian, pro-Russia position. But they never seem to do it very well.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
I read that it is so they can say in Russia that on Western message boards Western posters are hating aggression from Ukraine and the support for Ukraine is only from the leaders.
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
Devoir is homework...
I did not know that. Now I do. So today wasn't a total waste of time.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
And that's it, that's the truth. It's not about whether Tories are racist and other voters aren't. You'll find racists in all walks of life. The only reason I mentioned Conservative voters is because I'm seeking the potential of negative effects that might balance the supposed positive effects HYUFD mentions. Racist Labour voters aren't the issue in this particular case because they are already not going to vote Tory, doubly so.
I've no idea whether your 1-2% is a fair estimate or not. But it's there, it exists, and it's fiercely naive for Casino to assert otherwise.
The Labour candidate is v ginger. What about the anti-ginger vote?
I totally agree. Labour have parachuted a Starmerite duffer in from Camben, Ginger, looks more like Prince Harry than the one Sky hired this week (though that’s not saying much) Labour have already blown this election.
However, they have been canny enough in their algorithm to put their “B Ark” campaigners onto the coach to Mid Beds, so they got that bit right.
I'm sure your "Labour has blown it" prediction will be heartily cheering up Party headquarters.
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
Devoir is homework. There’s no code here, although I didn’t know who Le Clercq was.
Also, Uccle is a (prosperous) suburb of Brussels, not “a town”.
There was quite a procession of European politicians and technocrats through that house eating my mother's roast lamb over the years. I can't really remember any of them although I am eagerly anticipating the death of a famous British one so I can tell you what my mother said about him.
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
fuck is a scullery though?
A room where the servants used to wash dishes and clothes. Uccle does not house the poors...
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
There will always 1 to 2 % of population who will find a reason not to vote for a candidate.
Apparently you hear every so often in focus groups men saying we shouldn’t have women PMs simply because they might get emotional at that time of the month and make bad decisions.
Which shows how stupid that kind of man is. Of the three female prime ministers in the UK, two were past the age in which women have monthly hormonal swings. The one who was young enough was only there for one month anyway, and I'm sure you cant put her bad decisions down to the time of the month!
I take it with all these threads by TSE that OGH is holiday?
We should have known the shit was going to his the fan big time... 😂
It’s going to be a nice quiet weekend topping up the tan. Everything will be nice and quiet. Cocktails in the sun. No need for PB. No need for Malmesbury to get his Davey Crocket out. Not that there is any kind of day that actually needs Malmesbury to get his Davey Crocket out.
Reminds me of a joke I loved when I was little.
How many ears did Davey Crocket have?
3, his left ear, his right ear and his wild front ear.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
The visceral dislike of Rishi Sunak on the right of the Tory Party is quite something. Does his ethnicity play into this in some way? I'd hope not but I think it probably does.
I just went for a six-mile stroll around the village, and it was just about at the level where walking was still comfortable. A few degrees warmer and it would be in the uncomfortable realm.
Incidentally, one of the things they got right when building this village/town was creating a five-mile off-road boundary path, which crosses just two significant roads. All new developments should have similar.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
I read that it is so they can say in Russia that on Western message boards Western posters are hating aggression from Ukraine and the support for Ukraine is only from the leaders.
Throw in gay rights etc
There are rumours of Wagner mercenaries raping Russian troops. Have they been corrupted by western LGBTQI ideology?
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
The visceral dislike of Rishi Sunak on the right of the Tory Party is quite something. Does his ethnicity play into this in some way? I'd hope not but I think it probably does.
He is smarter than them, which doesn’t help as well.
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
Devoir is homework. There’s no code here, although I didn’t know who Le Clercq was.
Also, Uccle is a (prosperous) suburb of Brussels, not “a town”.
So @Dura_Ace is The Man From Uccle. No wonder he's given to feats of derring-do.
I take it with all these threads by TSE that OGH is holiday?
We should have known the shit was going to his the fan big time... 😂
It’s going to be a nice quiet weekend topping up the tan. Everything will be nice and quiet. Cocktails in the sun. No need for PB. No need for Malmesbury to get his Davey Crocket out. Not that there is any kind of day that actually needs Malmesbury to get his Davey Crocket out.
Reminds me of a joke I loved when I was little.
How many ears did Davey Crocket have?
3, his left ear, his right ear and his wild front ear.
I'm fairly certain that one made it into the Crack a Joke Book (or one of the other 2 in that series.) The bible of humour for 6yos in the late 70s.
Tim Bale on Twitter has noted that if Sunak had any sense, he would have waited until after the Privileges Committee report to agree Johnson’s honours list.
If there's one thing that could make me sympathetic to Boris Johnson it's Guy Vertwatstadt sounding his mouth off.
I have a soft spot for him. He's a complete basketcase but he sure doesn't hold back, including when he thinks his beloved EU is not living up to what he wants it to be.
He came to our house in Uccle for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq's passepartout though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir or playing with my Scalextric. According to my late mother, he disappeared into the scullery and spontaneously started washing the dishes at about 11pm.
For all those of you who don't speak @Dura_Ace, here is an annotation
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
fuck is a scullery though?
A quick look at the Wikipedia page for Uccle suggests it's easily posh enough to have houses with sculleries.
Also, under the "Notable Inhabitants" section, one B. Johnson and family.
Depends how old you are. My grandma lived above the shop (admittedly a fairly solid sort of shop) and had a scullery for the washing up and mucky kitchen work such as potato peeling, but then much of the kitchen proper was taken up by a coal-fired cast iron range anyway for the cooking and hot water.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
I read that it is so they can say in Russia that on Western message boards Western posters are hating aggression from Ukraine and the support for Ukraine is only from the leaders.
Throw in gay rights etc
There are rumours of Wagner mercenaries raping Russian troops. Have they been corrupted by western LGBTQI ideology?
The use of male-on-male rape to establish a hierarchy in Russian or Russian-aligned armies is unfortunately very well established. You don't want the details.
On topic I think Chris Bryant is indulging in wishful thinking. As I posted last night, the HoC library is explict that an MP, even one who is expelled from Parliament, can immediately stand again. One MP was expelled 3 times (for different offences) and stood and won again on each occasion.
I would like to see Johnson simply disappear but that isn't going to happen and I can easily see him making a comeback some time in the future as the supposed 'saviour' of the Tory party.
Isn't the point that is being made that if he stood again and was elected as an MP he'd immediately be suspended for 10 days and liable to a local petition for a recall which would immediately lead to another election.
I suspect he would be able to claim that, having been outside of Parliament for much longer than the 10 day suspension he had already effectively been through the recall process. The electors would have chosen him in full knowledge of his verdict. I don't want to see him back but I think he would win any argument on that basis. All the more so if it is a couple of years down the line.
Remember he sees himself as Churchill so I do think he is playing the long game here. He will disassociate himself from the forthcoming Tory GE defeat and then watch Starmer struggle to make any real impact on the problems the country is facing. Then a nice safe seat for the King over the Water to slip into.
Except Boris will be 64 by the election after next, and probably not a fit sprightly 64 at that. He'll also be bald as a coot, which matters for Boris. The hair is his brand.
I'm sure returning from the wilderness is the story he will tell himself. I'm sure he will collect some deluded followers that way. But it is a delusion, and one that will harm the Conservatives until it finally dies.
Parliament and the public had better blooming well see that report, though.
When you get older losing your hair Many years from now Will you still impregnate other people's wives? Spreading Covid ruining lives?
If your barbecue got out of hand Sick upon the floor Will we still need you, will we still feed you When you're sixty-four
I read the news today, oh boy About a thicko man who quit his job And though the news was rather fab Well, I just had to laugh I saw the photograph He blew his beans in Princess Nut He didn't notice she's a lunatic A crowd of people stood and stared They'd seen his face before Nobody was really sure if he was selling Channel Four
I saw a film today, oh boy The English voters chose the Brexit path A crowd of people believed me But I just had to cough I lied my head off
Woke up, fell out of bed Dragged a broom across my head Found my way downstairs and drank a rum And looking dumb, I noticed I was late Found my coat and grabbed my hat Made cabinet in seconds flat Found my way upstairs and had a wank And somebody spoke and I went into a dream
I read the news today, oh boy Four thousand dead in some old people's home And though the dead were rather old They had to count them all Now they know how many dead it takes to fill the Albert Hall
I'm not sure I'd be rolling around laughing even if I were familiar with the source material.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
Yes, there are some unusual aspects though concerning the Hindu vote in Leicester. There was a major purge of sitting councillors who tried to vote to end the directly elected mayor role, and it is a bit opaque what all that was about. I think that the dislike of Mayor Soulsby is partly that he is fairly classically Old Labour, but also because of his reaction to the Hindutva street disturbances last September.
There was also the fracas when Corbyn parachuted Webbe into Keith Vaz's old seat. A lot of locals objected quite strongly and went over to the Conservatives.
There is a lot of support for Modi amongst Leicester Hindus, who quite like his Hindu nationalist policies, but to offset that there is a particular dislike of it from Leicester's secular Hindus, Sikhs and Muslims, who are also numerous.
Overall, I would expect the small number of racists in the country who moved to REFUK and similar when Sunak was coronation to offset the pro-Hindutva vote for Sunak, to net out nationally, though there may be some constituencies where one side is more prominent.
An interesting seat to me is Harrow East, which I suspect the Conservatives will hold, on the basis of what is now a huge Indian Conservative vote. Bob Blackman was ahead of the curve, by cultivating that community, over the course of thirty years. Brent North might also move back into play, at some point.
There always was an Indian Conservative vote in both seats, but in the 90's and 00's, demographic change outpaced the growth of that vote. Now, that vote seems to have grown sufficiently to outpace demographic change.
Professional Indians that I've worked with can be very right-wing.
Thankfully their children less so. Takes a generation to assimilate properly.
Yes, I think that fair comment too. The fanatical Hindutvas tend to be first and to a lesser degree second generation migrants.
A psephological interjection. June polling so far mixed for the Tories, several polls showing them down on previous. The Deltapoll with Tories slashing the Labour lead by three (I can explain BJO) is pure Dutch Salute, as Tory share went backward.
Based on this trend I only have the Tories improving by 1 in next Opinium, to 29% and deficit of 13.
My theory of Opinium is that they are unfavourable to Tories. If they didn’t have swingback built in they would probably average about 26 same as yougov and Omnisis give Tories. Then again unfavourable might be the wrong word, and accurate the right one, in what Mike Smithson calls battle between proven pollsters and newbies, perhaps the Tories would poll mid twenties if there was an election today - perhaps that’s the level they are currently stuck on with Sunak.
Finding this bizarre in view of TUD;s earlier, and presumably unconnected, comments on what Brexiters do with their vacuum-cleaners.
...
BTW were you after one of the little ones, or the kind which looks like a warlock's broomstick? Which has just done a piece on vacs, the latter I think.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
The visceral dislike of Rishi Sunak on the right of the Tory Party is quite something. Does his ethnicity play into this in some way? I'd hope not but I think it probably does.
Clearly it plays into it with you, or you wouldn't have mentioned it.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
The visceral dislike of Rishi Sunak on the right of the Tory Party is quite something. Does his ethnicity play into this in some way? I'd hope not but I think it probably does.
My parents voted for Truss in the leadership contest because they felt Sunak uncommitted to this country. I don't think this so much racism as his Green card and Non-Dom wife, properties in California, and his comment that if it hadn't been for his political career he would have stayed in California.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
I read that it is so they can say in Russia that on Western message boards Western posters are hating aggression from Ukraine and the support for Ukraine is only from the leaders.
Throw in gay rights etc
There are rumours of Wagner mercenaries raping Russian troops. Have they been corrupted by western LGBTQI ideology?
The use of male-on-male rape to establish a hierarchy in Russian or Russian-aligned armies is unfortunately very well established. You don't want the details.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
The visceral dislike of Rishi Sunak on the right of the Tory Party is quite something. Does his ethnicity play into this in some way? I'd hope not but I think it probably does.
My parents voted for Truss in the leadership contest because they felt Sunak uncommitted to this country. I don't think this so much racism as his Green card and Non-Dom wife, properties in California, and his comment that if it hadn't been for his political career he would have stayed in California.
Subsequent events have proved them extremely wise.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
I read that it is so they can say in Russia that on Western message boards Western posters are hating aggression from Ukraine and the support for Ukraine is only from the leaders.
Throw in gay rights etc
There are rumours of Wagner mercenaries raping Russian troops. Have they been corrupted by western LGBTQI ideology?
The use of male-on-male rape to establish a hierarchy in Russian or Russian-aligned armies is unfortunately very well established. You don't want the details.
Tim Bale on Twitter has noted that if Sunak had any sense, he would have waited until after the Privileges Committee report to agree Johnson’s honours list.
As the smoke clears, Sunak and his team will look like a lemon for the mess they have made of this. They have put themselves too much on the side of the Nad Blocking Johnson Ousting for many Tories.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
And that's it, that's the truth. It's not about whether Tories are racist and other voters aren't. You'll find racists in all walks of life. The only reason I mentioned Conservative voters is because I'm seeking the potential of negative effects that might balance the supposed positive effects HYUFD mentions. Racist Labour voters aren't the issue in this particular case because they are already not going to vote Tory, doubly so.
I've no idea whether your 1-2% is a fair estimate or not. But it's there, it exists, and it's fiercely naive for Casino to assert otherwise.
Your contention was that this would be material in Uxbridge because Christians, atheists and Muslim Conservatives would change their vote because the PM was a brown-skinned Hindu.
This was shown up to be the utter nonsense it is.
Now, you're changing the goalposts with a bit of deflection tactics in a desperate attempt not to lose face.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
The visceral dislike of Rishi Sunak on the right of the Tory Party is quite something. Does his ethnicity play into this in some way? I'd hope not but I think it probably does.
My parents voted for Truss in the leadership contest because they felt Sunak uncommitted to this country. I don't think this so much racism as his Green card and Non-Dom wife, properties in California, and his comment that if it hadn't been for his political career he would have stayed in California.
Perhaps we should double-down on not being committed to this country and draft in a political equivalent of Sven-Göran Eriksson to run the government?
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
I read that it is so they can say in Russia that on Western message boards Western posters are hating aggression from Ukraine and the support for Ukraine is only from the leaders.
Throw in gay rights etc
There are rumours of Wagner mercenaries raping Russian troops. Have they been corrupted by western LGBTQI ideology?
The use of male-on-male rape to establish a hierarchy in Russian or Russian-aligned armies is unfortunately very well established. You don't want the details.
Sounds like Eton.
Water Eaton or Woodeaton? Dangerous folk, those Oxford rustics.
Shhhh - you’re drawing attention to my earlier typo. I don’t want anyone to know I initially wrote “Eaton” because it will make me look common.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
I read that it is so they can say in Russia that on Western message boards Western posters are hating aggression from Ukraine and the support for Ukraine is only from the leaders.
Throw in gay rights etc
There are rumours of Wagner mercenaries raping Russian troops. Have they been corrupted by western LGBTQI ideology?
The use of male-on-male rape to establish a hierarchy in Russian or Russian-aligned armies is unfortunately very well established. You don't want the details.
Sounds like Eton.
Water Eaton or Woodeaton? Dangerous folk, those Oxford rustics.
Shhhh - you’re drawing attention to my earlier typo. I don’t want anyone to know I initially wrote “Eaton” because it will make me look common.
I had a geography teacher called Mrs Eaton. I doubt she was into male-on-male rape, but you never know.
I think qualifying PB contributors should be tagged with “I supported Boris”.
Only BartyBobbins is open about it, so far as I can tell.
Oh I’m very happy to tell you I was then, and remain now, incredibly grateful for him forcing Brexit through. I take the long view on anything else he did or didn’t do, as anything can be tweaked by future Governments now. I also think he was useful when Ukraine happened in stopping us hesitating.
Is the lesson from Ukraine that an air force is largely redundant unless you're bombing insurgents like the Taliban?
It does look that airpower is used sparingly in this war, with neither side doing much in the way of sorties over enemy held territory.
Notable too that the larger drones like the Bayrakhtar are also not being used much now either. It seems land based air defences have become quite dominant.
What do those trolls think they are achieving? I thought the GRU was better than this. You have to play the long game chaps. Infiltrate this site with quality material on eating out, cricket, steam trains, and obscure political trivia from the 50s; and then spend 30% of your time arguing over trans issues. Get those things right and you can then say any old #### and be listened to. You might even get a thread header.
I read that it is so they can say in Russia that on Western message boards Western posters are hating aggression from Ukraine and the support for Ukraine is only from the leaders.
Throw in gay rights etc
There are rumours of Wagner mercenaries raping Russian troops. Have they been corrupted by western LGBTQI ideology?
The use of male-on-male rape to establish a hierarchy in Russian or Russian-aligned armies is unfortunately very well established. You don't want the details.
Sounds like Eton.
Water Eaton or Woodeaton? Dangerous folk, those Oxford rustics.
Shhhh - you’re drawing attention to my earlier typo. I don’t want anyone to know I initially wrote “Eaton” because it will make me look common.
I had a geography teacher called Mrs Eaton. I doubt she was into male-on-male rape, but you never know.
Is the lesson from Ukraine that an air force is largely redundant unless you're bombing insurgents like the Taliban?
I think it’s a mystery to some commentators Russia not using AirPower more. Maybe just internal politics where airforce leader is just very forceful around the decision table?
So we could use it as sign Russia struggling and in trouble if suddenly start to use AirPower more?
I think qualifying PB contributors should be tagged with “I supported Boris”.
Only BartyBobbins is open about it, so far as I can tell.
Oh I’m very happy to tell you I was then, and remain now, incredibly grateful for him forcing Brexit through. I take the long view on anything else he did or didn’t do, as anything can be tweaked by future Governments now. I also think he was useful when Ukraine happened in stopping us hesitating.
I guess “Biggles” (like “CasinoRoyale”) was a tell.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
And that's it, that's the truth. It's not about whether Tories are racist and other voters aren't. You'll find racists in all walks of life. The only reason I mentioned Conservative voters is because I'm seeking the potential of negative effects that might balance the supposed positive effects HYUFD mentions. Racist Labour voters aren't the issue in this particular case because they are already not going to vote Tory, doubly so.
I've no idea whether your 1-2% is a fair estimate or not. But it's there, it exists, and it's fiercely naive for Casino to assert otherwise.
Your contention was that this would be material in Uxbridge because Christians, atheists and Muslim Conservatives would change their vote because the PM was a brown-skinned Hindu.
This was shown up to be the utter nonsense it is.
Now, you're changing the goalposts with a bit of deflection tactics in a desperate attempt not to lose face.
Correction, I asked questions about whether it was a factor.
If I'm sure of something, I say it. If I want to know more about what others think or I'm not sure, I ask questions. You, know like a normal person. I bet you don't know any of those either.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
The visceral dislike of Rishi Sunak on the right of the Tory Party is quite something. Does his ethnicity play into this in some way? I'd hope not but I think it probably does.
My parents voted for Truss in the leadership contest because they felt him uncommitted to this country. I don't think this so much racism as his Green card and Non
Is the lesson from Ukraine that an air force is largely redundant unless you're bombing insurgents like the Taliban?
It does look that airpower is used sparingly in this war, with neither side doing much in the way of sorties over enemy held territory.
Notable too that the larger drones like the Bayrakhtar are also not being used much now either. It seems land based air defences have become quite dominant.
Neither side has air supremacy though, or even evident air superiority. Which goes back to poor Russian training and maintenance it would seem, given the numbers.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If I were Davey, I’d be wary of what happened in 1997.
1997? When the GE more than doubled the Lib Dems’ seat total?
Thinking more of the alliance idea when Blair wasnt sure of winning.
I think qualifying PB contributors should be tagged with “I supported Boris”.
Only BartyBobbins is open about it, so far as I can tell.
Oh I’m very happy to tell you I was then, and remain now, incredibly grateful for him forcing Brexit through. I take the long view on anything else he did or didn’t do, as anything can be tweaked by future Governments now. I also think he was useful when Ukraine happened in stopping us hesitating.
I guess “Biggles” (like “CasinoRoyale”) was a tell.
Worth noting I am not, have never been, and never would be a Tory Party member or member of any other party, so my “support” is pretty irrelevant.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
The visceral dislike of Rishi Sunak on the right of the Tory Party is quite something. Does his ethnicity play into this in some way? I'd hope not but I think it probably does.
My parents voted for Truss in the leadership contest because they felt Sunak uncommitted to this country. I don't think this so much racism as his Green card and Non-Dom wife, properties in California, and his comment that if it hadn't been for his political career he would have stayed in California.
Is the lesson from Ukraine that an air force is largely redundant unless you're bombing insurgents like the Taliban?
What makes you say it worked against the Taliban outside of immediate close air support….?
Heh. But at least you could fly a plane over Afghanistan - Ukraine is basically a NFZ for everyone now. Would that be the same for a 2nd Falklands conflict? Iran, North Korea? What has changed since the Gulf War?
It's okay to admit you made a mistake in backing Johnson, we did with Corbyn.
Both were obviously dangerous frauds, though.
Dangerous could be applied to both (from a certain perspective) and Johnson certainly has an element of fraud to his public persona, but I wouldn't apply the charge of being a fraud to Corbyn.
Is the lesson from Ukraine that an air force is largely redundant unless you're bombing insurgents like the Taliban?
What makes you say it worked against the Taliban outside of immediate close air support….?
Heh. But at least you could fly a plane over Afghanistan - Ukraine is basically a NFZ for everyone now. Would that be the same for a 2nd Falklands conflict? Iran, North Korea? What has changed since the Gulf War?
In this case, Ukrainian access to Patriot (backed with western intelligence and possibly radar data?) is a game changer that few countries could rely on. I doubt any airforce could fly over it reliably at high altitude in the way we often do elsewhere.
Trump still going strong despite endless criminality and attempting to overthrown democracy.
One of the reasons I dislike the Britain Trump or "he's just like Trump" rubbish is not because Boris deserves any credit, but because Trump is far worse than Boris and we shouldn't ever downplay it by comparing Trump with a more run-of-the-mill fool. If only Trump was merely a philandering, dishonest, lazy idiot, unfortunately he is far worse than that with a very dark authoritarian streak that is nothing like Boris.
Trump still going strong despite endless criminality and attempting to overthrown democracy.
One of the reasons I dislike the Britain Trump or "he's just like Trump" rubbish is not because Boris deserves any credit, but because Trump is far worse than Boris and we shouldn't ever downplay it by comparing Trump with a more run-of-the-mill fool. If only Trump was merely a philandering, dishonest, lazy idiot, unfortunately he is far worse than that with a very dark authoritarian streak that is nothing like Boris.
Yup. Like him or loath him, Boris is (well) within the bounds of normal democratic politics. Trump is not.
As I said: Its been reported quite widely that Starmer and Davey get on very well and have conversations. So I assume that they have already Tehran Conferenced the coming byelections: Rutherglen: Labour Mid Beds: LibDems Uxbridge: Labour
If the Tories pick a local councillor in nearly 10% Hindu Uxbridge they could even win it under Rishi.
Would be amusing if Labour lost Uxbridge but the LDs won Mid Beds which I think is possible.
Leaving Labour's only gain from the SNP not the Tories in Rutherglen
I don’t know what is more sad.
Your assumption that Hindus will vote, as a block, for a Hindu, or the fact that your assumption is probably correct.
Our politics shouldn’t work like this.
Leicester has the highest Hindu percentage of voters in the UK and the Tories had their best result in the local elections in the UK by far in Leicester in May gaining 17 seats from Labour. Hindus may only be less than 2% of the UK population but for them having one of their own as UK PM is as big as Obama being US President was for African Americans. Where the Hindu population is well above average there may even be a swing to the Conservatives while Rishi is PM
And do you think the opposite could be true? Voters who see brown-skinned Hindu and change their vote from Conservative to something else? Given that Hindus are outnumbered in Uxbridge by Christians, atheists, and Muslims, do you think the PM's ethnicity and religion could count more against than for him?
No.
You've never met a racist? Lucky you.
You desperately want all Conservatives or Conservative-inclined voters to be racist because this would conveniently fit your world view.
Unfortunately for you, it's not true; your prejudices are just that.
Not all, but do you think there might be a minority, perhaps 1-2% of the country, who won't vote for a non-white PM?
The visceral dislike of Rishi Sunak on the right of the Tory Party is quite something. Does his ethnicity play into this in some way? I'd hope not but I think it probably does.
My parents voted for Truss in the leadership contest because they felt Sunak uncommitted to this country. I don't think this so much racism as his Green card and Non-Dom wife, properties in California, and his comment that if it hadn't been for his political career he would have stayed in California.
Perhaps we should double-down on not being committed to this country and draft in a political equivalent of Sven-Göran Eriksson to run the government?
There's a challenge. Here y'go, PB: which politician from another country would you draft in to be PM? Double points if not American. Stephen Harper? Sanna Marin? Leo Varadkar?
Trump still going strong despite endless criminality and attempting to overthrown democracy.
One of the reasons I dislike the Britain Trump or "he's just like Trump" rubbish is not because Boris deserves any credit, but because Trump is far worse than Boris and we shouldn't ever downplay it by comparing Trump with a more run-of-the-mill fool. If only Trump was merely a philandering, dishonest, lazy idiot, unfortunately he is far worse than that with a very dark authoritarian streak that is nothing like Boris.
Yup. Like him or loath him, Boris is (well) within the bounds of normal democratic politics. Trump is not.
Can the truth be in between? Johnson isn't as bad as Trump, but he is beyond democratic norms. His resignation statement goes beyond familiar democratic politics in its degree of mendacity and conspiratorial thinking.
Is the lesson from Ukraine that an air force is largely redundant unless you're bombing insurgents like the Taliban?
I wouldn’t say redundant but the ability to exploit air power (particularly tactical and CAS) in the SMO is limited by the sheer panoply of AD systems now in theatre and the fact that the AFU and RF (And UK. LOL. Thanks, tories) have very little capacity to supress or destroy enemy AD systems. There is also the ever present danger of being shot down by your own side (which the AFU and RF have done multiple times) because both sides are operating the same types.
Do people on this site really want all the fighting age men of ukraine to be slaughtered.
No of course not. We want all the fighting age men of Russia to be slaughtered.
Except for the ones fighting for the independent Russian republics emerging on the border, which have nothing whatever to do with Ukraine.
Good point, spare them. But otherwise we want the Russian ability to wage war reduced as much as possible, and that does mean killing a hell of a lot of Russians.
Comments
Just as you get tiny minorities for all sorts of nutty opinions in any country.
It's not about whether Tories are racist and other voters aren't. You'll find racists in all walks of life. The only reason I mentioned Conservative voters is because I'm seeking the potential of negative effects that might balance the supposed positive effects HYUFD mentions. Racist Labour voters aren't the issue in this particular case because they are already not going to vote Tory, doubly so.
I've no idea whether your 1-2% is a fair estimate or not. But it's there, it exists, and it's fiercely naive for Casino to assert otherwise.
The tension being what the rest of us feel about when the feckers are going to make their next bad decision.
We should have known the shit was going to his the fan big time... 😂
For example, if you had a vote exactly here in land being fought over today at one point of history, the Cossacks would have won - I believe they were Cossacks, not Russian, Polish, Ukrainian or Lithuanian. But there is nothing in this world today, certainly not the United Nations, who at any point in history would have accepted a Cossack win.
There are other ways to underpin Ukrainian security.
What about the anti-ginger vote?
He (Guy Verhofstadt, a Belgian liberal politician) came to our house in Uccle (a town in Belgium) for a dinner party when he was Willy De Clercq (another Belgian liberal politician)'s passepartout (bagman, general assistant) though I have no recollection of it as I was 10 and was probably doing my devoir (stuck on this one: could be anything from homework to wanking) or playing with my Scalextric (a popular toy for boys in the pre-computer days, involving toy cars and an electrified track)
Takes a generation to assimilate properly.
There’s no code here, although I didn’t know who Le Clercq was.
Also, Uccle is a (prosperous) suburb of Brussels, not “a town”.
I wanted to ask if he was a Doug Stander, Pop Side, Kop or HenPenner?
How about this:
Russia stop invading other nations, and agree to a 10m demilitarisation zone across all their borders.
Sounds fair to me given they are the constant aggressor in this region.
https://www.dyson.co.uk/outlet
However, they have been canny enough in their algorithm to put their “B Ark” campaigners onto the coach to Mid Beds, so they got that bit right.
Also, under the "Notable Inhabitants" section, one B. Johnson and family.
So the sanctions stay (possily tightened) so long as the current leader is in power and Russia maintains its claim on Ukrainian sovereign territory. Russians tolerated Putin because he brought economic prosperity. I expect the vast majority would quite happily give up Crimea to rescue them from penury. The other territories are ones they couldn't really care less about.
Throw in gay rights etc
How many ears did Davey Crocket have?
3, his left ear, his right ear and his wild front ear.
Incidentally, one of the things they got right when building this village/town was creating a five-mile off-road boundary path, which crosses just two significant roads. All new developments should have similar.
Tim Bale on Twitter has noted that if Sunak had any sense, he would have waited until after the Privileges Committee report to agree Johnson’s honours list.
Based on this trend I only have the Tories improving by 1 in next Opinium, to 29% and deficit of 13.
My theory of Opinium is that they are unfavourable to Tories. If they didn’t have swingback built in they would probably average about 26 same as yougov and Omnisis give Tories. Then again unfavourable might be the wrong word, and accurate the right one, in what Mike Smithson calls battle between proven pollsters and newbies, perhaps the Tories would poll mid twenties if there was an election today - perhaps that’s the level they are currently stuck on with Sunak.
Only BartyBobbins is open about it, so far as I can tell.
This was shown up to be the utter nonsense it is.
Now, you're changing the goalposts with a bit of deflection tactics in a desperate attempt not to lose face.
Is the lesson from Ukraine that an air force is largely redundant unless you're bombing insurgents like the Taliban?
I doubt she was into male-on-male rape, but you never know.
Notable too that the larger drones like the Bayrakhtar are also not being used much now either. It seems land based air defences have become quite dominant.
So we could use it as sign Russia struggling and in trouble if suddenly start to use AirPower more?
If I'm sure of something, I say it. If I want to know more about what others think or I'm not sure, I ask questions. You, know like a normal person. I bet you don't know any of those either.
EDIT: you got it before me