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Did Trump fundraise from his election lies? – politicalbetting.com

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  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,039
    ydoethur said:

    I was trying to think who the last incumbent Democratic president to lose an actual presidential election (as opposed to embarrassing themselves in the primaries).

    There's Carter in 1980, obviously, but before that I keep coming up with Grover Cleveland in 1888 which seems an awfully long time ago.

    Though Cleveland like possibly Trump came back after defeat for re election to win the White House again 4 years after
  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,963

    Re the header, we get a lot around Trump but what about the possibility Biden doesn't stand because of a scandal risk and the betting implications there? There has been a number of headlines building up over the few days such as Hunter's business associates visiting the White House 80+ times when JB was VP, even though Biden has denied knowing anything of the visits.

    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/hunter-bidens-business-partners-assistants-visited-white-house-80-times-when-biden-vp

    And separately

    https://nypost.com/2023/04/11/ex-biden-stenographer-says-fbi-ignored-prezs-role-in-hunters-business-dealings/

    What is clear is that (a) the story won't go away and (b) the House will now launch its own investigations. There may be p1ss and wind here but given one of the people involved has said JB was taking bribes, the chances are probably not.

    Personally, I think this sort of stuff is more likely to make JB run again because he would have immunity but, if the stories and evidence keep ratcheting up, then there has to be a question whether some of the Democrat establishment at least think they need to look for an alternative.

    Then we have this, namely that Robert F Kennedy Jr is running at 10% support in the Democrat vote:

    https://unherd.com/thepost/one-in-10-democratic-voters-supports-robert-f-kennedy-jr/

    That is way behind Biden and I don't think where things stand now RFK has much of a chance but if Biden's scandals widen and he is seen as a liability, that percentage may rise and RFK becomes more of a potential threat.

    I'm not sure I would be backing Biden as the nominee yet.

    That Hunter Biden is an unpleasant parasite who has used his father's position to rake in money looks pretty certain.

    But such family enrichment is a common theme in American politics (not to mention in other countries).

    The Trump family certainly did similarly.
    No doubt but that is reflected in the betting etc.

    We don't have that for Biden. And it's not just HB made money off JB's position, it's the allegations JB was being funnelled cash. Nobody cares about Hunter. They do if JB was indeed taking cash from someone.
    If the alternative remains Trump, then I'm not at all sure that they do.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,039

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    Can we have an image of the King on some of our debit and credit cards as well then?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,660
    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:


    If the invasion is not defeated, it is very likely to be repeated - as we saw from 2014.

    Why won't it be repeated if it is defeated? For whatever value of 'defeated' you care to adopt.
    It makes it considerably less likely.
    If this one is seen to have achieved positive results, as with 2014, it makes another one easier.
    That's not a complicated point.
    There isn't some rational cost/benefit analysis to the SMO. See also Brexit.
    Perhaps not.
    It's a shit sandwich of Russia's making. There's no certainty of outcomes, but incentives still apply - and Ukraine isn't going to surrender.
    Nor is it in Europe's interest to encourage a repeat SMO in a few years' time.
    Perhaps the only long term solution is a reverse takeover of Russia by Kyiv.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,416
    HYUFD said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    Can we have an image of the King on some of our debit and credit cards as well then?
    £5 coronation coin is released on the 24th:

    (Trigger warning for TSE - contains images of King Charles)

    https://blog.westminstercollection.com/2023/04/13/official-uk-coronation-coins-revealed/

    Disappointed it's not called a crown but he is wearing one.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    It will become a legal requirement for all bank cards to prominently feature KCIII's face. And mobile payment apps will play a short video of KCIII for every transaction.

    (Off-topic, got £50 in cash yesterday for selling something on FB marketplace - commented to my wife that I had no real idea what to look for to check whether a bank note is real any more, handling them - particularly since the switch to plastic - so rarely.)
  • Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,978
    HYUFD said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    Can we have an image of the King on some of our debit and credit cards as well then?
    Couldn’t we get Kleenex By Royal Appointment? I can think of at least two strong markets for that.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,300

    Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
    I thought that a large chunk of drug money went through Bitcoin, these days?
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,300

    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:


    If the invasion is not defeated, it is very likely to be repeated - as we saw from 2014.

    Why won't it be repeated if it is defeated? For whatever value of 'defeated' you care to adopt.
    It makes it considerably less likely.
    If this one is seen to have achieved positive results, as with 2014, it makes another one easier.
    That's not a complicated point.
    There isn't some rational cost/benefit analysis to the SMO. See also Brexit.
    Perhaps not.
    It's a shit sandwich of Russia's making. There's no certainty of outcomes, but incentives still apply - and Ukraine isn't going to surrender.
    Nor is it in Europe's interest to encourage a repeat SMO in a few years' time.
    Perhaps the only long term solution is a reverse takeover of Russia by Kyiv.
    Hey, that's my peace plan! Make your own :-)
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    Cash is utterly pointless. Why would anyone bother with it? It's a complete anachronism. Wasteful, environmentally damaging, inconvenient, expensive.
  • Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:


    If the invasion is not defeated, it is very likely to be repeated - as we saw from 2014.

    Why won't it be repeated if it is defeated? For whatever value of 'defeated' you care to adopt.
    Because Russia won't be in a position to repeat it.

    Their army will have been destroyed, they'll be in no position to rebuild well, they've got little in the way of either economy or manufacturing capacity to replace that which has been lost any time soon. And Ukraine and her allies will be far better prepared than before too.

    Russia likes to think of herself as a Great Power but the truth is she's not even a major power anymore, with a GDP lower than that of Canada or Italy.
  • Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
    I thought that a large chunk of drug money went through Bitcoin, these days?
    Ban that too.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,708

    Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
    I thought that a large chunk of drug money went through Bitcoin, these days?
    IIUC Bitcoin has mostly lost that market to Monero. Bitcoin's main use now (apart from sitting on it hoping for a greater fool) is ransomware. It still has an advantage there because it's easier to explain to people with bad IT security than the other crypto things.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    A cashless society is a dystopian technologically controlled hell.

    Tinfoil hats at the ready from The Man Who Has Never Been to London.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,300

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    Cash is utterly pointless. Why would anyone bother with it? It's a complete anachronism. Wasteful, environmentally damaging, inconvenient, expensive.
    There's a non-trivial number of people who can't get any kind of bank account.

    This isn't due to not having money. The AltBanks will give pretty much anyone an account.

    I think it must be a KYC issue with documents/fixed address?
  • What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    Cash is utterly pointless. Why would anyone bother with it? It's a complete anachronism. Wasteful, environmentally damaging, inconvenient, expensive.
    And used by plebs. And old people. Who probably voted for Brexit. Abolish it.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    Re: cash, someone said to me the other day, have you seen the 'new' 50pm coin?

    I replied that I hadn't seen it, nor a 50p coin of any kind, old, middle-aged or new, for about a decade.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,372

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    Cash is utterly pointless. Why would anyone bother with it? It's a complete anachronism. Wasteful, environmentally damaging, inconvenient, expensive.
    Some people don't have bank accounts.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
    It's perfectly possible to have untraceable electronic payments in a cash-like card/account. So those industries will adapt.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,720

    Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
    The guy sat begging outside our local supermarket* has a notice saying he takes card payments.

    * Waitrose, natch
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,813
    I still like using cash.

    So there.

    Very happy to be an anachronism!
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,372
    edited April 2023

    Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
    People would just use other means of untraceable payment, such as gems, cigarettes, gold sovereigns etc.
  • ydoethur said:

    I was trying to think who the last incumbent Democratic president to lose an actual presidential election (as opposed to embarrassing themselves in the primaries).

    There's Carter in 1980, obviously, but before that I keep coming up with Grover Cleveland in 1888 which seems an awfully long time ago.

    There have only been two since to compare - Clinton and Obama - so the subset is limited.

    As for Presidents who suffered a serious primary challenge, Ford was the last one with Reagan the challenger.
  • Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
    You are opposed to both?
  • Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:


    If the invasion is not defeated, it is very likely to be repeated - as we saw from 2014.

    Why won't it be repeated if it is defeated? For whatever value of 'defeated' you care to adopt.
    Because Russia won't be in a position to repeat it.

    Their army will have been destroyed, they'll be in no position to rebuild well, they've got little in the way of either economy or manufacturing capacity to replace that which has been lost any time soon. And Ukraine and her allies will be far better prepared than before too.

    Russia likes to think of herself as a Great Power but the truth is she's not even a major power anymore, with a GDP lower than that of Canada or Italy.
    Upper Volta (or Burkina Faso now) with nukes.

    Very good point about Russia not being able to replace its losses while Ukraine can and is being supplied. MOreover, this war is proving very damaging for the arms export industry.

    Putin needs some sort of get out quite soon.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    Cash is utterly pointless. Why would anyone bother with it? It's a complete anachronism. Wasteful, environmentally damaging, inconvenient, expensive.
    And used by plebs. And old people. Who probably voted for Brexit. Abolish it.
    Seatbelt paradox applies.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,794
    edited April 2023
    Miss Mc, I also collected coins. Been considering getting back into it.

    Edited extra bit: on that note: https://www.royalmint.com/shop/monarch/charles-iii/coronation/
  • Cash is obsolete, expensive and dangerous. Nobody who doesn't want to handle it should ever be obliged to do so.

    However if two parties both consensually want to use cash, that should be their prerogative.

    Quite rightly though an increasing number of stores will find that they do not find it convenient, which is their right to choose. Everyone has a freedom to choose.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405

    HYUFD said:

    'The UK economy saw no growth in February after being hit by the effects of strikes by public sector workers, official figures show.

    The Office for National Statistics (ONS) said that a rise in construction activity had been offset by walkouts by teachers and civil servants.

    It follows a surprise 0.4% jump in economic growth in January.

    Despite February's flat performance, the chancellor said the UK's economic outlook was "brighter than expected".

    Jeremy Hunt noted that GDP - the measure of economic growth - had grown by 0.1% in the three months to February and the UK was "set to avoid recession".'


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65250170

    Hmm. Not sure that Hunt is well advised to be publicly wetting himself over 0.1%. That sort of figure can be easily wiped out with a single revision later down the line.
    Not sure if any one has ever studied this, but the revisions almost always seem to be up to me. See also the triple dip that never happened.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,667
    edited April 2023

    Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
    You are opposed to both?
    Both at the same time?
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    Cash is utterly pointless. Why would anyone bother with it? It's a complete anachronism. Wasteful, environmentally damaging, inconvenient, expensive.
    Peer-to-peer, still works in power cuts, no personal data that can be leaked or misused, your ability to use it can't be arbitrarily restricted by some company with zero accountability.
    Is your mobile phone reliant on mains power?

    Odd.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,416

    A cashless society is a dystopian technologically controlled hell.

    Tinfoil hats at the ready from The Man Who Has Never Been to London.
    I thought you lived there?
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,720

    Miss Mc, I also collected coins. Been considering getting back into it.

    Edited extra bit: on that note: https://www.royalmint.com/shop/monarch/charles-iii/coronation/

    We used to collect all varieties of 'fag cards' too, in the 1940s.

  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405

    MaxPB said:

    DavidL said:

    Sean_F said:

    MaxPB said:

    Hmm, lots of upwards revisions in the GDP data this morning. Think that puts us above Feb 2020.

    For the month it looks like the public sector strikes dragged growth down by 0.1-0.2% but there will be an element of catch up in March so we're on course for about 0.6% growth in Q1. Far from the doom and gloom we've been listening to from pundits and international think tanks I'd rate 0.6% growth in Q1 as fairly solid.

    So, can it be, that the IMF were … wrong?

    In fact, we are now above Feb. 2020, indeed we went above Feb .2020 in May of last year.

    No one should take much notice of initial GDP estimates, for it is a law as immutable as that of the Medes and the Persians, that GDP gets revised upwards.
    Its remarkable how almost no one has picked up that story given that it has been a (non-existent) stick with which to beat ourselves for so long.
    It isn't amazing really. It's not a doom and gloom story so expect it to be ignored.
    Many years ago, I recall Norman Tebbit tormenting Brian Redhead about unemployment figures on Radio 4.

    “You always used to ask me about unemployment when I came on the program. But you’ve stopped. Why is that?”

    He basically refused to start the interview until Brian asked the question about unemployment. Which had been going down for 24 months straight, or something like that.
    Yet our current Conservatives seem uninterested that we now have full employment.

    Theory 1 - because we had high unemployment during most of the Thatcher era Conservatives now think that high unemployment is a good thing.

    Theory 2 - because Conservative voters tend to be oldies they're not interested in employment, even worse full employment leads to higher pay and so higher prices for oldies.
    An awful lot of people not working though - sickness, disability and retired.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,621

    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:


    If the invasion is not defeated, it is very likely to be repeated - as we saw from 2014.

    Why won't it be repeated if it is defeated? For whatever value of 'defeated' you care to adopt.
    Because Russia won't be in a position to repeat it.

    Their army will have been destroyed, they'll be in no position to rebuild well, they've got little in the way of either economy or manufacturing capacity to replace that which has been lost any time soon. And Ukraine and her allies will be far better prepared than before too.

    Russia likes to think of herself as a Great Power but the truth is she's not even a major power anymore, with a GDP lower than that of Canada or Italy.
    Upper Volta (or Burkina Faso now) with nukes.

    Very good point about Russia not being able to replace its losses while Ukraine can and is being supplied. MOreover, this war is proving very damaging for the arms export industry.

    Putin needs some sort of get out quite soon.
    Putin's had loads of opportunities to get out. He could have done it with his embarrassing withdrawal from Kyiv in March, or in autumn when they withdrew from Kherson. With the former, he might even have been able to keep hold of Crimea and the pre-2022 bits of the Donbass he had held.

    Now for the IMV part: he didn't do it, because his mindset appears to be that Russia must 'win' because there is no alternative to Russia winning. He remembered the withdrawal from Afghanistan, and the tragedy that happened to his country immediately afterwards. He also remembers Chechnya, and the fact a second attempt won it. I reckon he sees the current situation as the first Chechen war, and that a little push might turn it into the second.

    I reckon he's wrong, but he's made bad move after bad move in this mess so far.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405

    glw said:

    Driver said:

    HYUFD said:

    'The UK economy saw no growth in February after being hit by the effects of strikes by public sector workers, official figures show.

    The Office for National Statistics (ONS) said that a rise in construction activity had been offset by walkouts by teachers and civil servants.

    It follows a surprise 0.4% jump in economic growth in January.

    Despite February's flat performance, the chancellor said the UK's economic outlook was "brighter than expected".

    Jeremy Hunt noted that GDP - the measure of economic growth - had grown by 0.1% in the three months to February and the UK was "set to avoid recession".'


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65250170

    Hmm. Not sure that Hunt is well advised to be publicly wetting himself over 0.1%. That sort of figure can be easily wiped out with a single revision later down the line.
    This is true, but historically GDP has been revised up much more often than down, has it not?

    And politically, only the first estimate really counts because it's the one the news notices.
    It is a shame that few journalists feel any obligation to look back to a story about a forecast and report what actually happened.
    Including the nonsense headlines in the Express and the Star about the weather.
    Weather stories sell newspapers (apparently). We have a few on PB who follow the weather models and chat sights (like PB but much nastier and less polite - you should see Netweather if forcast snow doesn't arrive...) so are immune to some extent to Nathan Rao (for it is normally he) and the others. But little old dears getting their daily dose of hate believe the stories and gossip to everyone they meet.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,805
    AlistairM said:

    I thought this would appeal to some. An offshore windfarm is being built off the coast of Normandy, specifically Juno beach from D-Day. It is a place I know well as my father-in-law used to have a property right in Courseulles-sur-Mer for 30 years.

    It has been decided to name each of the turbines after a ship involved in the D-Day landings.

    Each of the 64 wind turbines being built off the coast of Courseulles-sur-mer will bear the name of a ship involved in the Normandy Landings

    https://twitter.com/Normandy_Post/status/1646219992805912576

    One of those ships was called HMS Black Prince. The Black Prince is famous for being heavily involved in the slaughter of the French at the Battle of Crecy in 1346.

    So, very shortly the French are going to have the Black Prince permanently sitting off the Normandy shore. This provided me with some mild amusement.

    I'm unexpectedly touched by that (not about the Black Prince bit, about the overall gesture). Nice one, France.
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860
    FPT on Eritrean food - it is a very similar cuisine to Ethiopian, and utterly delicious.

    Great for vegans too - there's a tradition of 'fasting food; which contains no animal products and is mainstream. Great balance of flavours and spices, and I love the injera (the giant sour pikelet you eat off and with). Nice clean lagers from both nations to wash it down.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405
    edited April 2023
    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,852
    edited April 2023
    AlistairM said:

    I thought this would appeal to some. An offshore windfarm is being built off the coast of Normandy, specifically Juno beach from D-Day. It is a place I know well as my father-in-law used to have a property right in Courseulles-sur-Mer for 30 years.

    It has been decided to name each of the turbines after a ship involved in the D-Day landings.

    Each of the 64 wind turbines being built off the coast of Courseulles-sur-mer will bear the name of a ship involved in the Normandy Landings

    https://twitter.com/Normandy_Post/status/1646219992805912576

    One of those ships was called HMS Black Prince. The Black Prince is famous for being heavily involved in the slaughter of the French at the Battle of Crecy in 1346.

    So, very shortly the French are going to have the Black Prince permanently sitting off the Normandy shore. This provided me with some mild amusement.

    Surprised you didn't note the Rodney, Nelson and Ramillies ... not to mention the original Arethusa having been captured from the French (In the C18). So jolly sporting of them.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486

    Cash is obsolete, expensive and dangerous. Nobody who doesn't want to handle it should ever be obliged to do so.

    However if two parties both consensually want to use cash, that should be their prerogative.

    Quite rightly though an increasing number of stores will find that they do not find it convenient, which is their right to choose. Everyone has a freedom to choose.

    Agreed. Lots of places around me are now cashless. They seem to cope fine!
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860

    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:


    If the invasion is not defeated, it is very likely to be repeated - as we saw from 2014.

    Why won't it be repeated if it is defeated? For whatever value of 'defeated' you care to adopt.
    It makes it considerably less likely.
    If this one is seen to have achieved positive results, as with 2014, it makes another one easier.
    That's not a complicated point.
    There isn't some rational cost/benefit analysis to the SMO. See also Brexit.
    Perhaps not.
    It's a shit sandwich of Russia's making. There's no certainty of outcomes, but incentives still apply - and Ukraine isn't going to surrender.
    Nor is it in Europe's interest to encourage a repeat SMO in a few years' time.
    Perhaps the only long term solution is a reverse takeover of Russia by Kyiv.
    In fairness there is precedent for this with the Kievan Rus'.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,039

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

  • SirNorfolkPassmoreSirNorfolkPassmore Posts: 7,152
    edited April 2023

    Re the header, we get a lot around Trump but what about the possibility Biden doesn't stand because of a scandal risk and the betting implications there? There has been a number of headlines building up over the few days such as Hunter's business associates visiting the White House 80+ times when JB was VP, even though Biden has denied knowing anything of the visits.

    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/hunter-bidens-business-partners-assistants-visited-white-house-80-times-when-biden-vp

    And separately

    https://nypost.com/2023/04/11/ex-biden-stenographer-says-fbi-ignored-prezs-role-in-hunters-business-dealings/

    What is clear is that (a) the story won't go away and (b) the House will now launch its own investigations. There may be p1ss and wind here but given one of the people involved has said JB was taking bribes, the chances are probably not.

    Personally, I think this sort of stuff is more likely to make JB run again because he would have immunity but, if the stories and evidence keep ratcheting up, then there has to be a question whether some of the Democrat establishment at least think they need to look for an alternative.

    Then we have this, namely that Robert F Kennedy Jr is running at 10% support in the Democrat vote:

    https://unherd.com/thepost/one-in-10-democratic-voters-supports-robert-f-kennedy-jr/

    That is way behind Biden and I don't think where things stand now RFK has much of a chance but if Biden's scandals widen and he is seen as a liability, that percentage may rise and RFK becomes more of a potential threat.

    I'm not sure I would be backing Biden as the nominee yet.

    I can still see there being a race for the Democratic nomination... but Kennedy is an irrelevance to that and the prospects of a contest are diminishing. Kennedy is simply a fruitcake with borrowed name recognition, and that's all. He (and Williamson) might get some protest votes but there is a hard and low cap on support as they are (to put it mildly) eccentrics who don't represent a sizeable part of the Democratic base.

    For things to unravel for Biden would require a reasonably serious candidate to enter the race - a credible progressive standard-bearer or Governor of an age where they are in a bit of a hurry. They might gather donations, gain momentum in early states, and frighten some of those with eyes on 2028 to come in too.

    The chances of it seem to be diminishing, though, helped by Harris's perceived weakness and the reasonably strong prospect of Trump being GOP candidate in 2024. Had Harris looked set fair for 2028, that would have effectively ruled out people like Gavin Newsom, who might then have gone for an outside shot at it in 2024. As it is, 2028 looks likely to be a fairly open contest on the Democratic side plus, whether Biden or Trump win in 2024, there would be no incumbent President standing in 2028. For that reason, it's hard to see who the serious candidates are who'd go for it in 2024 on the Democratic side.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,813

    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:


    If the invasion is not defeated, it is very likely to be repeated - as we saw from 2014.

    Why won't it be repeated if it is defeated? For whatever value of 'defeated' you care to adopt.
    Because Russia won't be in a position to repeat it.

    Their army will have been destroyed, they'll be in no position to rebuild well, they've got little in the way of either economy or manufacturing capacity to replace that which has been lost any time soon. And Ukraine and her allies will be far better prepared than before too.

    Russia likes to think of herself as a Great Power but the truth is she's not even a major power anymore, with a GDP lower than that of Canada or Italy.
    Upper Volta (or Burkina Faso now) with nukes.

    Very good point about Russia not being able to replace its losses while Ukraine can and is being supplied. MOreover, this war is proving very damaging for the arms export industry.

    Putin needs some sort of get out quite soon.
    Putin's had loads of opportunities to get out. He could have done it with his embarrassing withdrawal from Kyiv in March, or in autumn when they withdrew from Kherson. With the former, he might even have been able to keep hold of Crimea and the pre-2022 bits of the Donbass he had held.

    Now for the IMV part: he didn't do it, because his mindset appears to be that Russia must 'win' because there is no alternative to Russia winning. He remembered the withdrawal from Afghanistan, and the tragedy that happened to his country immediately afterwards. He also remembers Chechnya, and the fact a second attempt won it. I reckon he sees the current situation as the first Chechen war, and that a little push might turn it into the second.

    I reckon he's wrong, but he's made bad move after bad move in this mess so far.
    Yes, Putin will not voluntarily de-escalate.

    He is playing for time. If he can keep things at a rough stalemate without the front collapsing, he will hope Western resolve starts to falter and the other side will start talking about getting round the table.
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860
    geoffw said:

    Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
    The guy sat begging outside our local supermarket* has a notice saying he takes card payments.

    * Waitrose, natch
    This is the norm in Sweden.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,039

    ydoethur said:

    I was trying to think who the last incumbent Democratic president to lose an actual presidential election (as opposed to embarrassing themselves in the primaries).

    There's Carter in 1980, obviously, but before that I keep coming up with Grover Cleveland in 1888 which seems an awfully long time ago.

    There have only been two since to compare - Clinton and Obama - so the subset is limited.

    As for Presidents who suffered a serious primary challenge, Ford was the last one with Reagan the challenger.
    Carter also faced a strong primary challenge from Ted Kennedy in 1980 as did Bush Snr from Pat Buchanan in 1992
  • AlistairMAlistairM Posts: 2,005
    edited April 2023
    Carnyx said:

    AlistairM said:

    I thought this would appeal to some. An offshore windfarm is being built off the coast of Normandy, specifically Juno beach from D-Day. It is a place I know well as my father-in-law used to have a property right in Courseulles-sur-Mer for 30 years.

    It has been decided to name each of the turbines after a ship involved in the D-Day landings.

    Each of the 64 wind turbines being built off the coast of Courseulles-sur-mer will bear the name of a ship involved in the Normandy Landings

    https://twitter.com/Normandy_Post/status/1646219992805912576

    One of those ships was called HMS Black Prince. The Black Prince is famous for being heavily involved in the slaughter of the French at the Battle of Crecy in 1346.

    So, very shortly the French are going to have the Black Prince permanently sitting off the Normandy shore. This provided me with some mild amusement.

    Surprised you didn't note the Rodney, Nelson and Ramillies ... not to mention the original Arethusa having been captured from the French (In the C18). So jolly sporting of them.
    Good spot. For some reason I was drawn specifically to the Black Prince, possibly because he landed in Normandy before Crecy.

    Lots of memorials to famous victories over the French or people that were involved. All sitting off the coast of France. Hilarious.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,883

    HYUFD said:

    'The UK economy saw no growth in February after being hit by the effects of strikes by public sector workers, official figures show.

    The Office for National Statistics (ONS) said that a rise in construction activity had been offset by walkouts by teachers and civil servants.

    It follows a surprise 0.4% jump in economic growth in January.

    Despite February's flat performance, the chancellor said the UK's economic outlook was "brighter than expected".

    Jeremy Hunt noted that GDP - the measure of economic growth - had grown by 0.1% in the three months to February and the UK was "set to avoid recession".'


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65250170

    Hmm. Not sure that Hunt is well advised to be publicly wetting himself over 0.1%. That sort of figure can be easily wiped out with a single revision later down the line.
    Not sure if any one has ever studied this, but the revisions almost always seem to be up to me. See also the triple dip that never happened.
    Not sure I'm too bothered by the "nominal" decision about whether we have a recession or not. Surely the Elephant in the Room is we have barely any growth at all.......
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860

    I still like using cash.

    So there.

    Very happy to be an anachronism!

    Me and my daughter happily put five quids' worth of 2ps into the penny fall machines on Barry Island last weekend. I don't carry cash as much as I used to, but it still has its uses.
  • geoffw said:

    Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    I can think of plenty of places that will still *only* take cash, but they probably don't show up in the official numbers.
    Ban cash to win the war on drugs and prostitution.

    No brainer.
    The guy sat begging outside our local supermarket* has a notice saying he takes card payments.

    * Waitrose, natch
    The point isn't that drug dealers can't get hold of a card reader... it's that it creates a paper trail. Nobody cares about a beggar's paper trail, whereas if you're trying to prove the bloke you've caught with a quantity of drugs is a dealer rather than a user, it's very handy.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,300
    Cookie said:

    AlistairM said:

    I thought this would appeal to some. An offshore windfarm is being built off the coast of Normandy, specifically Juno beach from D-Day. It is a place I know well as my father-in-law used to have a property right in Courseulles-sur-Mer for 30 years.

    It has been decided to name each of the turbines after a ship involved in the D-Day landings.

    Each of the 64 wind turbines being built off the coast of Courseulles-sur-mer will bear the name of a ship involved in the Normandy Landings

    https://twitter.com/Normandy_Post/status/1646219992805912576

    One of those ships was called HMS Black Prince. The Black Prince is famous for being heavily involved in the slaughter of the French at the Battle of Crecy in 1346.

    So, very shortly the French are going to have the Black Prince permanently sitting off the Normandy shore. This provided me with some mild amusement.

    I'm unexpectedly touched by that (not about the Black Prince bit, about the overall gesture). Nice one, France.
    People in the area have strong memories of the history of D-Day. This will be popular with the locals.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405
    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,701
    Sean_F said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    Cash is utterly pointless. Why would anyone bother with it? It's a complete anachronism. Wasteful, environmentally damaging, inconvenient, expensive.
    Some people don't have bank accounts.
    digital exclusion exists. plus i don't want a finance or data company tracking my every move, unless they gonna pay me for the privilege
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,667
    Labour MPs have this week received yet another pay rise, of £2,440. Yet they won't support a single worker asking for the same, or even half that amount. What is the point of the Labour Party?

    SKS fans please explain
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,805
    edited April 2023

    Re: cash, someone said to me the other day, have you seen the 'new' 50pm coin?

    I replied that I hadn't seen it, nor a 50p coin of any kind, old, middle-aged or new, for about a decade.

    Really?

    Up until 2020, I had a coin jar, which accumulated change through the year and was periodically taken to the bank - it used to get about £400 a year in change. Since the pandemic, it no longer builds up ,and I have to go out of my way from time to time to get change to keep it stocked. But I do still need coins, for reasons including, er:
    - transactions with children (the tooth fairy doesn't bring plastic)
    - tips in restaurants (I want my money to go to the specific waiter/waitress who provided the service)
    - buskers
    - parking (most car parks accept payment by app but that is a massive pain in the arse, particularly if I don't have my glasses with me)
    - filling a pint glass with, then pissing in it and throwing it from on high at 15 year old girls who have a different favourite football team to me (joking - I'm not a Liverpool fan).

    It's not a massive list. But cash isn't dead yet.

    EDIT: All that said, upon meeting a colleague for the first time in 2 years recently, I was shocked to find he no longer even carries a wallet - just does everything on his phone. Does he not worry about running out of battery? Does he not worry about losing his phone? Does he not worry about having his phone but not his glasses? Apparently not. Not for me, Clive.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,039

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    About 25% of the population don't admittedly but even Corbyn won more than that in 2019.

    A ceremonial constitutional monarch and head of state world renowned is far better than a divisive elected party political head of state or a nonentity ceremonial President.

    Plenty of people still have jobs by birth, from farmers to family business owners anyway
  • Cookie said:

    AlistairM said:

    I thought this would appeal to some. An offshore windfarm is being built off the coast of Normandy, specifically Juno beach from D-Day. It is a place I know well as my father-in-law used to have a property right in Courseulles-sur-Mer for 30 years.

    It has been decided to name each of the turbines after a ship involved in the D-Day landings.

    Each of the 64 wind turbines being built off the coast of Courseulles-sur-mer will bear the name of a ship involved in the Normandy Landings

    https://twitter.com/Normandy_Post/status/1646219992805912576

    One of those ships was called HMS Black Prince. The Black Prince is famous for being heavily involved in the slaughter of the French at the Battle of Crecy in 1346.

    So, very shortly the French are going to have the Black Prince permanently sitting off the Normandy shore. This provided me with some mild amusement.

    I'm unexpectedly touched by that (not about the Black Prince bit, about the overall gesture). Nice one, France.
    People in the area have strong memories of the history of D-Day. This will be popular with the locals.
    HMS Quorn. Was that a substitute for HMS Chicken?
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,667
    Saw SKS arguing this morning we cant afford to restore Drs pay back to the levels of 2008 which Labour did afford.

    https://twitter.com/Agitate4Change/status/1646460992275062785
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,300
    AlistairM said:

    Carnyx said:

    AlistairM said:

    I thought this would appeal to some. An offshore windfarm is being built off the coast of Normandy, specifically Juno beach from D-Day. It is a place I know well as my father-in-law used to have a property right in Courseulles-sur-Mer for 30 years.

    It has been decided to name each of the turbines after a ship involved in the D-Day landings.

    Each of the 64 wind turbines being built off the coast of Courseulles-sur-mer will bear the name of a ship involved in the Normandy Landings

    https://twitter.com/Normandy_Post/status/1646219992805912576

    One of those ships was called HMS Black Prince. The Black Prince is famous for being heavily involved in the slaughter of the French at the Battle of Crecy in 1346.

    So, very shortly the French are going to have the Black Prince permanently sitting off the Normandy shore. This provided me with some mild amusement.

    Surprised you didn't note the Rodney, Nelson and Ramillies ... not to mention the original Arethusa having been captured from the French (In the C18). So jolly sporting of them.
    Good spot. For some reason I was drawn specifically to the Black Prince, possibly because he landed in Normandy before Crecy.

    Lots of memorials to famous victories over the French or people that were involved. All sitting off the coast of France. Hilarious.
    Which brings me back to - https://youtu.be/xTl7tphyvJY?t=41 - talk about vandalising history.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    About 25% of the population don't admittedly but even Corbyn won more than that in 2019.

    A ceremonial constitutional monarch and head of state world renowned is far better than a divisive elected party political head of state or a nonentity ceremonial President.

    Plenty of people still have jobs by birth, from farmers to family business owners anyway
    Can you explain why? Do we need a head of state that is not the PM?
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,669
    edited April 2023

    Cash is obsolete, expensive and dangerous. Nobody who doesn't want to handle it should ever be obliged to do so.

    However if two parties both consensually want to use cash, that should be their prerogative.

    Quite rightly though an increasing number of stores will find that they do not find it convenient, which is their right to choose. Everyone has a freedom to choose.

    Agreed. Lots of places around me are now cashless. They seem to cope fine!
    Just wait for the next Carrington Event...

    The lack of cash has surely changed how people think about money. Handing over a stack of twenties is very different to just waving a card or a phone around. I'm not sure this is a good thing.

    Having a physical token is also a good reminder that it is essentially worthless unless guaranteed by somebody.

    I'm not a techno-refusenik but I still use cash.
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860
    Cookie said:

    Re: cash, someone said to me the other day, have you seen the 'new' 50pm coin?

    I replied that I hadn't seen it, nor a 50p coin of any kind, old, middle-aged or new, for about a decade.

    Really?

    Up until 2020, I had a coin jar, which accumulated change through the year and was periodically taken to the bank - it used to get about £400 a year in change. Since the pandemic, it no longer builds up ,and I have to go out of my way from time to time to get change to keep it stocked. But I do still need coins, for reasons including, er:
    - transactions with children (the tooth fairy doesn't bring plastic)
    - tips in restaurants (I want my money to go to the specific waiter/waitress who provided the service)
    - buskers
    - parking (most car parks accept payment by app but that is a massive pain in the arse, particularly if I don't have my glasses with me)
    - filling a pint glass with, then pissing in it and throwing it from on high at 15 year old girls who have a different favourite football team to me (joking - I'm not a Liverpool fan).

    It's not a massive list. But cash isn't dead yet.
    Agree with this. Kids like coins and notes too, and the implicit value of a physical item is important in teaching the value of a thing, which is harder to do with digital money.

    Side note, but car park apps can get in the sea, in a bin, sealed in concrete and covered in warnings to prevent future generations from ever repeating our mistakes.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,039
    edited April 2023

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    About 25% of the population don't admittedly but even Corbyn won more than that in 2019.

    A ceremonial constitutional monarch and head of state world renowned is far better than a divisive elected party political head of state or a nonentity ceremonial President.

    Plenty of people still have jobs by birth, from farmers to family business owners anyway
    Can you explain why? Do we need a head of state that is not the PM?
    As the PM is head of government NOT head of state which should be above party politics.

    See the US, Brazil or effectively France for the problems that come when the head of government is also head of state and the divisions that produces
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,300
    edited April 2023
    Ghedebrav said:

    Cookie said:

    Re: cash, someone said to me the other day, have you seen the 'new' 50pm coin?

    I replied that I hadn't seen it, nor a 50p coin of any kind, old, middle-aged or new, for about a decade.

    Really?

    Up until 2020, I had a coin jar, which accumulated change through the year and was periodically taken to the bank - it used to get about £400 a year in change. Since the pandemic, it no longer builds up ,and I have to go out of my way from time to time to get change to keep it stocked. But I do still need coins, for reasons including, er:
    - transactions with children (the tooth fairy doesn't bring plastic)
    - tips in restaurants (I want my money to go to the specific waiter/waitress who provided the service)
    - buskers
    - parking (most car parks accept payment by app but that is a massive pain in the arse, particularly if I don't have my glasses with me)
    - filling a pint glass with, then pissing in it and throwing it from on high at 15 year old girls who have a different favourite football team to me (joking - I'm not a Liverpool fan).

    It's not a massive list. But cash isn't dead yet.
    Agree with this. Kids like coins and notes too, and the implicit value of a physical item is important in teaching the value of a thing, which is harder to do with digital money.

    Side note, but car park apps can get in the sea, in a bin, sealed in concrete and covered in warnings to prevent future generations from ever repeating our mistakes.
    As far as I can tell, the design methodology for car parking apps appears to be

    1) Give the designers and engineers a two week experience of using the Tesla charging network.
    2) Tell them "Not like that"
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,805

    Saw SKS arguing this morning we cant afford to restore Drs pay back to the levels of 2008 which Labour did afford.

    https://twitter.com/Agitate4Change/status/1646460992275062785

    There was a lot that Labour 'afforded' in 2008 because it was spending about 25% more than it raised and borrowing the rest. That's not really 'affording' it.
    (I'm not saying, of course, that the Tories got us out of that habit.)
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,805

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    About 25% of the population don't admittedly but even Corbyn won more than that in 2019.

    A ceremonial constitutional monarch and head of state world renowned is far better than a divisive elected party political head of state or a nonentity ceremonial President.

    Plenty of people still have jobs by birth, from farmers to family business owners anyway
    Can you explain why? Do we need a head of state that is not the PM?
    We don't need one. But it is quite useful to have a head of state who is not political, who can say things without 60% of the population taking an instinctive dislike to them, and who can outlast the political fray.
    The downside of this is you have to take the head of state you are given. Sometimes you get one who is not political and who we can largely agree on. And sometimes you get King Charles III.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677
    There's a reason they aren't called "Hitiles"...
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    About 25% of the population don't admittedly but even Corbyn won more than that in 2019.

    A ceremonial constitutional monarch and head of state world renowned is far better than a divisive elected party political head of state or a nonentity ceremonial President.

    Plenty of people still have jobs by birth, from farmers to family business owners anyway
    Can you explain why? Do we need a head of state that is not the PM?
    As the PM is head of government NOT head of state which should be above party politics.

    See the US, Brazil or effectively France for the problems that come when the head of government is also head of state and the divisions that produces
    Absent a monarch, what is the best approach here? The Irish model?
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,805

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    He seems fairly keen to make that happen.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,963

    Ghedebrav said:

    Cookie said:

    Re: cash, someone said to me the other day, have you seen the 'new' 50pm coin?

    I replied that I hadn't seen it, nor a 50p coin of any kind, old, middle-aged or new, for about a decade.

    Really?

    Up until 2020, I had a coin jar, which accumulated change through the year and was periodically taken to the bank - it used to get about £400 a year in change. Since the pandemic, it no longer builds up ,and I have to go out of my way from time to time to get change to keep it stocked. But I do still need coins, for reasons including, er:
    - transactions with children (the tooth fairy doesn't bring plastic)
    - tips in restaurants (I want my money to go to the specific waiter/waitress who provided the service)
    - buskers
    - parking (most car parks accept payment by app but that is a massive pain in the arse, particularly if I don't have my glasses with me)
    - filling a pint glass with, then pissing in it and throwing it from on high at 15 year old girls who have a different favourite football team to me (joking - I'm not a Liverpool fan).

    It's not a massive list. But cash isn't dead yet.
    Agree with this. Kids like coins and notes too, and the implicit value of a physical item is important in teaching the value of a thing, which is harder to do with digital money.

    Side note, but car park apps can get in the sea, in a bin, sealed in concrete and covered in warnings to prevent future generations from ever repeating our mistakes.
    As far as I can tell, the design methodology for car parking apps appears to be

    1) Give the designers and engineers a two week experience of using the Tesla charging network.
    2) Tell them "Not like that"
    The main three are OK, my problem is with car parks that use an obscure little one.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,667
    Cookie said:

    Saw SKS arguing this morning we cant afford to restore Drs pay back to the levels of 2008 which Labour did afford.

    https://twitter.com/Agitate4Change/status/1646460992275062785

    There was a lot that Labour 'afforded' in 2008 because it was spending about 25% more than it raised and borrowing the rest. That's not really 'affording' it.
    (I'm not saying, of course, that the Tories got us out of that habit.)
    Yes I think Rachel Reeves would agree Labour crashed the economy

    SKS is more right wing than Margaret Thatcher, so SKS fans don't pat yourself on the back if you intend to vote Labour.

    Obviously for voters that want insomniacs put into a Coma SKS is your man for PM
  • TresTres Posts: 2,701
    Council round here has moved to phone apps entirely for parking, even though they had machines available which could take contactless payments. Bonkers.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,099

    HYUFD said:

    'The UK economy saw no growth in February after being hit by the effects of strikes by public sector workers, official figures show.

    The Office for National Statistics (ONS) said that a rise in construction activity had been offset by walkouts by teachers and civil servants.

    It follows a surprise 0.4% jump in economic growth in January.

    Despite February's flat performance, the chancellor said the UK's economic outlook was "brighter than expected".

    Jeremy Hunt noted that GDP - the measure of economic growth - had grown by 0.1% in the three months to February and the UK was "set to avoid recession".'


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65250170

    The UK avoiding a recession will shoot Labour's foxes.

    And "unemployment" isn't a stick to beat the Tories with either these days.

    Rishi getting the UK through current difficulties will play well for him at the general.
    Very low growth that narrowly avoids a recession and a continuing cost of living crisis means Labour’s foxes are doing fine, and raising a healthy litter of cubs too.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,195
    Tres said:

    Council round here has moved to phone apps entirely for parking, even though they had machines available which could take contactless payments. Bonkers.

    Contactless is great. Phone apps for carparking just shouldn't be allowed. For one thing your debit card won't go out of battery for that 1% of time your phone is out of juice and you can't phone tap the contactless.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727
    Ghedebrav said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    About 25% of the population don't admittedly but even Corbyn won more than that in 2019.

    A ceremonial constitutional monarch and head of state world renowned is far better than a divisive elected party political head of state or a nonentity ceremonial President.

    Plenty of people still have jobs by birth, from farmers to family business owners anyway
    Can you explain why? Do we need a head of state that is not the PM?
    As the PM is head of government NOT head of state which should be above party politics.

    See the US, Brazil or effectively France for the problems that come when the head of government is also head of state and the divisions that produces
    Absent a monarch, what is the best approach here? The Irish model?
    Rozanna Purcell?

    (Google tells me she is the most famous Irish model; other Irish models are no doubt available)
  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860

    HYUFD said:

    'The UK economy saw no growth in February after being hit by the effects of strikes by public sector workers, official figures show.

    The Office for National Statistics (ONS) said that a rise in construction activity had been offset by walkouts by teachers and civil servants.

    It follows a surprise 0.4% jump in economic growth in January.

    Despite February's flat performance, the chancellor said the UK's economic outlook was "brighter than expected".

    Jeremy Hunt noted that GDP - the measure of economic growth - had grown by 0.1% in the three months to February and the UK was "set to avoid recession".'


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65250170

    The UK avoiding a recession will shoot Labour's foxes.

    And "unemployment" isn't a stick to beat the Tories with either these days.

    Rishi getting the UK through current difficulties will play well for him at the general.
    Very low growth that narrowly avoids a recession and a continuing cost of living crisis means Labour’s foxes are doing fine, and raising a healthy litter of cubs too.
    Yep. Only-just-not-a-recession is cold comfort for folk whose are spending £200 a month more on their mortgage, never mind food, energy etc.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,723
    Selebian said:

    What joyous news.

    King Charles could be the last monarch on a banknote as cash loses its crown

    Digital payments dominate amid increasing obsolescence of cash


    Halfway through 2024, King Charles III will become only the second monarch to see his portrait launched into circulation on British banknotes. It is feasible that his likeness will be the last one on a banknote that is ever actually used.

    The use of cash is collapsing around the world. De La Rue, a firm which designs a third of the world’s banknotes, says global demand for physical currency has hit a 20-year low. Card, mobile and digital wallet payments are replacing traditional payment methods at a swift rate.

    Globally, between 2018 and 2022, the value of global cash transactions fell from $11.6 trillion (£9.3 trillion) to $7.7 trillion, a drop of a third, according to financial services firm FIS.

    Last year, cash accounted for just 16pc of transactions worldwide. By 2026, global cash transactions will be worth only $6 trillion, making up just one in 10 payments, FIS has forecast.

    By this measure, the UK is ahead of the curve: last year, cash already accounted for only a tenth of point of sale transactions.

    In the 10 years to 2031, cash payments will slump by another 52pc, according to UK Finance, the lender trade body. Debit card payments, already the dominant method for settling up, will have surged by nearly a quarter in that time.

    “We are going to have to start preparing for a very, very low cash society,” says John Howells, chief executive of Link, the UK’s cash machine network.

    “Cash will be a store for safety, but as a means of payment it is already dropping fast, and that is going to continue. I think in 15 or 20 years’ time that could have virtually disappeared.”


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/13/king-charles-iii-cash-banknote-money-payments/

    It will become a legal requirement for all bank cards to prominently feature KCIII's face. And mobile payment apps will play a short video of KCIII for every transaction.

    (Off-topic, got £50 in cash yesterday for selling something on FB marketplace - commented to my wife that I had no real idea what to look for to check whether a bank note is real any more, handling them - particularly since the switch to plastic - so rarely.)
    I'd like to see that on all Dura Ace's cards.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,852
    edited April 2023

    Cookie said:

    AlistairM said:

    I thought this would appeal to some. An offshore windfarm is being built off the coast of Normandy, specifically Juno beach from D-Day. It is a place I know well as my father-in-law used to have a property right in Courseulles-sur-Mer for 30 years.

    It has been decided to name each of the turbines after a ship involved in the D-Day landings.

    Each of the 64 wind turbines being built off the coast of Courseulles-sur-mer will bear the name of a ship involved in the Normandy Landings

    https://twitter.com/Normandy_Post/status/1646219992805912576

    One of those ships was called HMS Black Prince. The Black Prince is famous for being heavily involved in the slaughter of the French at the Battle of Crecy in 1346.

    So, very shortly the French are going to have the Black Prince permanently sitting off the Normandy shore. This provided me with some mild amusement.

    I'm unexpectedly touched by that (not about the Black Prince bit, about the overall gesture). Nice one, France.
    People in the area have strong memories of the history of D-Day. This will be popular with the locals.
    HMS Quorn. Was that a substitute for HMS Chicken?
    The complete opposite*. One of a class of ships named after fox and stag hunts. WW1 minesweepers, WW2 destroyers, postwar minehunters/sweepers.

    Edit: wokewise (to be anachronistic), except obviously for the venison bit.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,963
    Pulpstar said:

    Tres said:

    Council round here has moved to phone apps entirely for parking, even though they had machines available which could take contactless payments. Bonkers.

    Contactless is great. Phone apps for carparking just shouldn't be allowed. For one thing your debit card won't go out of battery for that 1% of time your phone is out of juice and you can't phone tap the contactless.
    People don't charge their phones in their cars?
  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,963
    Carnyx said:

    Cookie said:

    AlistairM said:

    I thought this would appeal to some. An offshore windfarm is being built off the coast of Normandy, specifically Juno beach from D-Day. It is a place I know well as my father-in-law used to have a property right in Courseulles-sur-Mer for 30 years.

    It has been decided to name each of the turbines after a ship involved in the D-Day landings.

    Each of the 64 wind turbines being built off the coast of Courseulles-sur-mer will bear the name of a ship involved in the Normandy Landings

    https://twitter.com/Normandy_Post/status/1646219992805912576

    One of those ships was called HMS Black Prince. The Black Prince is famous for being heavily involved in the slaughter of the French at the Battle of Crecy in 1346.

    So, very shortly the French are going to have the Black Prince permanently sitting off the Normandy shore. This provided me with some mild amusement.

    I'm unexpectedly touched by that (not about the Black Prince bit, about the overall gesture). Nice one, France.
    People in the area have strong memories of the history of D-Day. This will be popular with the locals.
    HMS Quorn. Was that a substitute for HMS Chicken?
    The complete opposite. One of a class of ships named after fox and stag hunts. WW1 minesweepers, WW2 destroyers, postwar minehunters/sweepers.
    I know some hearty folk whose party joke's
    Pretending to hunt with the Quorn
    Gone away! Gone away! Was it one of them took it away?
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,372

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    Lots of people would rather not, and lots more people rather would.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,813
    Ghedebrav said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    About 25% of the population don't admittedly but even Corbyn won more than that in 2019.

    A ceremonial constitutional monarch and head of state world renowned is far better than a divisive elected party political head of state or a nonentity ceremonial President.

    Plenty of people still have jobs by birth, from farmers to family business owners anyway
    Can you explain why? Do we need a head of state that is not the PM?
    As the PM is head of government NOT head of state which should be above party politics.

    See the US, Brazil or effectively France for the problems that come when the head of government is also head of state and the divisions that produces
    Absent a monarch, what is the best approach here? The Irish model?
    Elect a figurehead President for life (subject to recall). Maintains the continuity but gives an element of popular choice/control.

    Honestly I’ve got no real beef with the monarchy though. I do think the most compelling argument against it is the impact it has on the people in the institution itself - growing up knowing you’re different to others and will be subject to public scrutiny whatever your life choices must be horrendous.

    As for Charles - I don’t think he’s doing a bad job at all, so far.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,020
    On cash v card, I now find myself feeling slightly annoyed when I am in a cafe or pub behind someone who is paying by cash, with the extra time taken by the person serving them to rummage in the till and count out change.

    The one time I do tend to pay cash is when a bunch of us are having a meal and we want to split the bill. Easier to drop my share on the table than ask the member of staff to faff about with the card machine half a dozen times.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,195
    Driver said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Tres said:

    Council round here has moved to phone apps entirely for parking, even though they had machines available which could take contactless payments. Bonkers.

    Contactless is great. Phone apps for carparking just shouldn't be allowed. For one thing your debit card won't go out of battery for that 1% of time your phone is out of juice and you can't phone tap the contactless.
    People don't charge their phones in their cars?
    Could never get that to work with my old phone, mind you I drive Peugeots - not renowned for their auxillary electric. I've got a new Pixel 6a today so perhaps that will play ball.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727
    Pulpstar said:

    Tres said:

    Council round here has moved to phone apps entirely for parking, even though they had machines available which could take contactless payments. Bonkers.

    Contactless is great. Phone apps for carparking just shouldn't be allowed. For one thing your debit card won't go out of battery for that 1% of time your phone is out of juice and you can't phone tap the contactless.
    If there's contactless (hell, even chip and pin) then I'm not too bothered about what else is available. Cash for those who prefer/need that should also be provided, I think.

    The frustrating thing is that any halfway decent parking app standard would be more convenient for most. Car reg(s) stored in app. Location services pinpoint the car park (or some NFC thing to swipe at worst). Choose your time and go, automatic payment. Extendable without returning to the car park. No queues. Many benefits. The current shit-show is not necessary.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,039
    Ghedebrav said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    About 25% of the population don't admittedly but even Corbyn won more than that in 2019.

    A ceremonial constitutional monarch and head of state world renowned is far better than a divisive elected party political head of state or a nonentity ceremonial President.

    Plenty of people still have jobs by birth, from farmers to family business owners anyway
    Can you explain why? Do we need a head of state that is not the PM?
    As the PM is head of government NOT head of state which should be above party politics.

    See the US, Brazil or effectively France for the problems that come when the head of government is also head of state and the divisions that produces
    Absent a monarch, what is the best approach here? The Irish model?
    No, Higgins is an ex Irish Labour politician himself and little known outside Ireland.

    His wife also has not been very supportive of Zelensky
    https://www.politico.eu/article/irish-president-wife-sabina-higgins-russia-ukraine-peace-letter/
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,372
    HYUFD said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    About 25% of the population don't admittedly but even Corbyn won more than that in 2019.

    A ceremonial constitutional monarch and head of state world renowned is far better than a divisive elected party political head of state or a nonentity ceremonial President.

    Plenty of people still have jobs by birth, from farmers to family business owners anyway
    Can you explain why? Do we need a head of state that is not the PM?
    As the PM is head of government NOT head of state which should be above party politics.

    See the US, Brazil or effectively France for the problems that come when the head of government is also head of state and the divisions that produces
    Absent a monarch, what is the best approach here? The Irish model?
    No, Higgins is an ex Irish Labour politician himself and little known outside Ireland.

    His wife also has not been very supportive of Zelensky
    https://www.politico.eu/article/irish-president-wife-sabina-higgins-russia-ukraine-peace-letter/
    And, he's a bit of a wanker, too.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,669
    Driver said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Tres said:

    Council round here has moved to phone apps entirely for parking, even though they had machines available which could take contactless payments. Bonkers.

    Contactless is great. Phone apps for carparking just shouldn't be allowed. For one thing your debit card won't go out of battery for that 1% of time your phone is out of juice and you can't phone tap the contactless.
    People don't charge their phones in their cars?
    Not everyone carries a phone everywhere or wants stupid apps installed even if they do.

    Everyone with a bank account (very unlikely not to if you are in possession of a car) has a contactless card.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,039
    Sean_F said:

    HYUFD said:

    Ghedebrav said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    King Charles could be the last monarch

    would be better...

    Absolutely not, King William will follow and then King George will outlive us all.

    We certainly don't want President Johnson or President Blair

    You may not, but lots of people would rather not have someone in a position simply by act of birth.

    Its the 21st century.
    About 25% of the population don't admittedly but even Corbyn won more than that in 2019.

    A ceremonial constitutional monarch and head of state world renowned is far better than a divisive elected party political head of state or a nonentity ceremonial President.

    Plenty of people still have jobs by birth, from farmers to family business owners anyway
    Can you explain why? Do we need a head of state that is not the PM?
    As the PM is head of government NOT head of state which should be above party politics.

    See the US, Brazil or effectively France for the problems that come when the head of government is also head of state and the divisions that produces
    Absent a monarch, what is the best approach here? The Irish model?
    No, Higgins is an ex Irish Labour politician himself and little known outside Ireland.

    His wife also has not been very supportive of Zelensky
    https://www.politico.eu/article/irish-president-wife-sabina-higgins-russia-ukraine-peace-letter/
    And, he's a bit of a wanker, too.
    I wouldn't go that far but https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/who-michael-d-higgins-irish-21602588
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,723
    Driver said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Tres said:

    Council round here has moved to phone apps entirely for parking, even though they had machines available which could take contactless payments. Bonkers.

    Contactless is great. Phone apps for carparking just shouldn't be allowed. For one thing your debit card won't go out of battery for that 1% of time your phone is out of juice and you can't phone tap the contactless.
    People don't charge their phones in their cars?
    The charging speed on all car ports is very poor. No idea why its so slow.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,963
    Pulpstar said:

    Driver said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Tres said:

    Council round here has moved to phone apps entirely for parking, even though they had machines available which could take contactless payments. Bonkers.

    Contactless is great. Phone apps for carparking just shouldn't be allowed. For one thing your debit card won't go out of battery for that 1% of time your phone is out of juice and you can't phone tap the contactless.
    People don't charge their phones in their cars?
    Could never get that to work with my old phone, mind you I drive Peugeots - not renowned for their auxillary electric. I've got a new Pixel 6a today so perhaps that will play ball.
    My Corsa has a built-in USB, which gives just enough charge to keep the phone at the same battery level, and a 12v "cigarette lighter" socket that I have an adapter for that charges about as quickly as the mains.
  • DriverDriver Posts: 4,963
    Selebian said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Tres said:

    Council round here has moved to phone apps entirely for parking, even though they had machines available which could take contactless payments. Bonkers.

    Contactless is great. Phone apps for carparking just shouldn't be allowed. For one thing your debit card won't go out of battery for that 1% of time your phone is out of juice and you can't phone tap the contactless.
    If there's contactless (hell, even chip and pin) then I'm not too bothered about what else is available. Cash for those who prefer/need that should also be provided, I think.

    The frustrating thing is that any halfway decent parking app standard would be more convenient for most. Car reg(s) stored in app. Location services pinpoint the car park (or some NFC thing to swipe at worst). Choose your time and go, automatic payment. Extendable without returning to the car park. No queues. Many benefits. The current shit-show is not necessary.
    The trouble with car parks is that accepting cash does add significant extra costs to the operator - and even card payments has some extra costs over a phone app.

    But for most businesses, the idea that handling cash is more expensive than card payments is absurd to me and suggests that something dodgy is going on with the banking system.
This discussion has been closed.