1. Why on earth do these people think the current Tory party is worth funding? 2. How do they afford such prices without the tax cuts we're told are essential for the economy?
A further question hit me. This is for the 80:20 campaign. To defend 80 seats and gain a further 20. My question was "What exactly are they on?"
80:20 - they must be looking for pareto improvement.
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
A photo for you both
If that's your real passport number you might want to edit it out?
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
Don't know much about Scottish politics, but the SNP seem to have had the great good fortune to have had two political giants in succession. These three seem to be a downgrade?
It's certainly not causing me to revise my 'Sturgeon was top drawer' assessment.
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
The Nissan Juke is surely the ugliest car ever made?
1. Why on earth do these people think the current Tory party is worth funding? 2. How do they afford such prices without the tax cuts we're told are essential for the economy?
A further question hit me. This is for the 80:20 campaign. To defend 80 seats and gain a further 20. My question was "What exactly are they on?"
Crystal meth to go with the crystal portraits?
But yes. 80 losses leaves the Conservatives on 300ish with the new boundaries. If the Conservatives do make that their battleground, the Otherlot parties will run round it much like the Germans did with the Maginot line.
1. Why on earth do these people think the current Tory party is worth funding? 2. How do they afford such prices without the tax cuts we're told are essential for the economy?
A further question hit me. This is for the 80:20 campaign. To defend 80 seats and gain a further 20. My question was "What exactly are they on?"
It's actually 1820 - as in let's party like it's 1820!
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
The Nissan Juke is surely the ugliest car ever made?
How Dare You!
Eye of the beholder. I am sure you won't let my aesthetic sensibilities put you off your long-sought goal.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
I rather think that some have jumped the gun already.
I look forward to the rest, meanwhile, being off PB playtime and the Sunday newspapers tomorrow, in the way of consistent policy. "Works of necessity or mercy", as the Shorter Catechism has it, don't include informing gamblers of the likely odds ...
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How’s the Montefiore? Does the schtick of following one “family” (I hear him talk about it on a podcast) work?
I’ve finished my laksa
I’ve now read 300 pages of the Montefiore book (out of 1300!) and I’m reaching a tentative conclusion. It’s a seriously flawed masterpiece
It has none of the vivacity of his brilliant Stalin books, but it avoids the effete meanderings of his Jerusalem book (very poor, I thought)
But it is unique and maybe it is unfair to compare to anything. It is an incredible act of scholarship and full of superb detail but it is also like reading The Old Testament, In toto. With something of the Silmarillion and a dash of Finnegan’s Wake. It is dense dense dense. I am managing 20 pages a day. A page turning thriller it is not
And yet I am very glad I am reading it, and I like knowing it is there to turn to. For another fascinating glimpse of mad history I never knew. It also succeeds in giving a new perspective on the vast sweep of human history
So, on the whole, I am definitely a fan. But prepare yourself for a long haul
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
A photo for you both
If that's your real passport number you might want to edit it out?
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Everyone making a song and dance about Forbes' version of Christianity. And yet the Catholic Church, to which Bozo has converted, has many similar views, but nobody highlights this as a reason why Bozo, Mogg or any other Papist is unsuitable for high office.
They would if Bozo said or wrote the same sorts of things as Forbes has.
If they were to forced to the think about it, the public would probably quite like Boris’s Augustinian philosophy.
I wonder if there is some issue about seeing a woman making her own choices the critics disagree with / don't understand?
I see the practice as an inability to distinguish issues of conscience from the general, and perhaps more worryingly an attempt to deny some people the ability to have a conscientious view where the answer is not liked. Is there perhaps a stereotype about anyone of a particular religion being unable to have any significant variance in their views (which is wrong).
Add in that it can be a potentially useful political baseball bat to bash other politicians with, and ... bingo !
It's recently been more visible for Jewish people (was something said about a UK Ambassador to Israel in the last several years "having two masters"?), but that trope has been played about RCs since forever, and at most UK elections iirc.
IMO Kate Forbes is getting the Free Presbyterian version of that attack line. As remarked, it's notable that no one has made the same comments about Humza's faith.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Everyone making a song and dance about Forbes' version of Christianity. And yet the Catholic Church, to which Bozo has converted, has many similar views, but nobody highlights this as a reason why Bozo, Mogg or any other Papist is unsuitable for high office.
They would if Bozo said or wrote the same sorts of things as Forbes has.
If they were to forced to the think about it, the public would probably quite like Boris’s Augustinian philosophy.
I wonder if there is some issue about seeing a woman making her own choices the critics disagree with / don't understand?
I see the practice as an inability to distinguish issues of conscience from the general, and perhaps more worryingly an attempt to deny some people the ability to have a conscientious view where the answer is not liked. Is there perhaps a stereotype about anyone of a particular religion being unable to have any significant variance in their views (which is wrong).
Add in that it can be a potentially useful political baseball bat to bash other politicians with, and ... bingo !
It's recently been more visible for Jewish people (was something said about a UK Ambassador to Israel in the last several years "having two masters"?), but that trope has been played about RCs since forever, and at most UK elections iirc.
IMO Kate Forbes is getting the Free Presbyterian version of that attack line. As remarked, it's notable that no one has made the same comments about Humza's faith.
Pedantry: KF isn't FPC(U) or FPC(S) [edit] but FCS.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
PS. Back her personally or for betting?
Personally. I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan. My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing from a betting POV if he doesn't screw up.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Everyone making a song and dance about Forbes' version of Christianity. And yet the Catholic Church, to which Bozo has converted, has many similar views, but nobody highlights this as a reason why Bozo, Mogg or any other Papist is unsuitable for high office.
They would if Bozo said or wrote the same sorts of things as Forbes has.
If they were to forced to the think about it, the public would probably quite like Boris’s Augustinian philosophy.
I wonder if there is some issue about seeing a woman making her own choices the critics disagree with / don't understand?
I see the practice as an inability to distinguish issues of conscience from the general, and perhaps more worryingly an attempt to deny some people the ability to have a conscientious view where the answer is not liked. Is there perhaps a stereotype about anyone of a particular religion being unable to have any significant variance in their views (which is wrong).
Add in that it can be a potentially useful political baseball bat to bash other politicians with, and ... bingo !
It's recently been more visible for Jewish people (was something said about a UK Ambassador to Israel in the last several years "having two masters"?), but that trope has been played about RCs since forever, and at most UK elections iirc.
IMO Kate Forbes is getting the Free Presbyterian version of that attack line. As remarked, it's notable that no one has made the same comments about Humza's faith.
Pedantry: KF isn't FPC(U) or FPC(S) [edit] but FCS.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
PS. Back her personally or for betting?
Personally. I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan. My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing if he doesn't screw up from a betting POV.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
PS. Back her personally or for betting?
Personally. I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan. My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing from a betting POV if he doesn't screw up.
I have a feeling that our upbringing in the days when a wet Sunday in [name burgh as appropriate] really was a haven of silence has made us more accustomed to that side of life than our younger or more distant colleagues on PB. Or indeed some in the SNP membership, as you imply.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
PS. Back her personally or for betting?
Personally. I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan. My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing if he doesn't screw up from a betting POV.
Who do you actually want to win?
Genuine question. Am intrigued.
As with most things it's gonnae be the least worst at the time of voting; I know it's the ultimate cop out but I'd still like to see how they perform over the next few weeks. Regan very much third on the list atm.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Everyone making a song and dance about Forbes' version of Christianity. And yet the Catholic Church, to which Bozo has converted, has many similar views, but nobody highlights this as a reason why Bozo, Mogg or any other Papist is unsuitable for high office.
They would if Bozo said or wrote the same sorts of things as Forbes has.
If they were to forced to the think about it, the public would probably quite like Boris’s Augustinian philosophy.
I wonder if there is some issue about seeing a woman making her own choices the critics disagree with / don't understand?
I see the practice as an inability to distinguish issues of conscience from the general, and perhaps more worryingly an attempt to deny some people the ability to have a conscientious view where the answer is not liked. Is there perhaps a stereotype about anyone of a particular religion being unable to have any significant variance in their views (which is wrong).
Add in that it can be a potentially useful political baseball bat to bash other politicians with, and ... bingo !
It's recently been more visible for Jewish people (was something said about a UK Ambassador to Israel in the last several years "having two masters"?), but that trope has been played about RCs since forever, and at most UK elections iirc.
IMO Kate Forbes is getting the Free Presbyterian version of that attack line. As remarked, it's notable that no one has made the same comments about Humza's faith.
Pedantry: KF isn't FPC(U) or FPC(S) [edit] but FCS.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Everyone making a song and dance about Forbes' version of Christianity. And yet the Catholic Church, to which Bozo has converted, has many similar views, but nobody highlights this as a reason why Bozo, Mogg or any other Papist is unsuitable for high office.
They would if Bozo said or wrote the same sorts of things as Forbes has.
If they were to forced to the think about it, the public would probably quite like Boris’s Augustinian philosophy.
I wonder if there is some issue about seeing a woman making her own choices the critics disagree with / don't understand?
I see the practice as an inability to distinguish issues of conscience from the general, and perhaps more worryingly an attempt to deny some people the ability to have a conscientious view where the answer is not liked. Is there perhaps a stereotype about anyone of a particular religion being unable to have any significant variance in their views (which is wrong).
Add in that it can be a potentially useful political baseball bat to bash other politicians with, and ... bingo !
It's recently been more visible for Jewish people (was something said about a UK Ambassador to Israel in the last several years "having two masters"?), but that trope has been played about RCs since forever, and at most UK elections iirc.
IMO Kate Forbes is getting the Free Presbyterian version of that attack line. As remarked, it's notable that no one has made the same comments about Humza's faith.
Pedantry: KF isn't FPC(U) or FPC(S) [edit] but FCS.
Fair enough comment.
FPC(U) being Ian Paisley's Church, FPC(S) sounding similar but being older, and FCS being Wee Frees who are both Presbyterian and Calvinist, and may be growing in strength but it is not clear whether this is a short-term or long-term trend - depending a bit on what happens to unity in the Church of Scotland over gay marriage and what happens to any splinters.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
My antenna go straight up with this sort of Wokescreening.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
PS. Back her personally or for betting?
Personally. I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan. My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing if he doesn't screw up from a betting POV.
Who do you actually want to win?
Genuine question. Am intrigued.
As with most things it's gonnae be the least worst at the time of voting; I know it's the ultimate cop out but I'd still like to see how they perform over the next few weeks. Regan very much third on the list atm.
That doesn't strike me as a cop-out. What's the point of having a campaign if it isn't to help the membership decide who would do best?
Worst thing is I can think of many many people like this. It's one of those counterpoints to 'armchair everything experts', the ones who argue nothing can be truly known.
3h So the theory is: thousands of journalists, millions of refugees, tens of millions of citizens, the UN, Presidents Putin and Zelenskyy, and the OSINT community came together to fake a war to steal 5% of the US defence budget worth of last generation military equipment.
Not even Russian media is pretending this war isn't happening.
You absolute puddings have memed yourself into a stance that is so ridiculous even Russian propogandists looked at it and went, "no, that would just be nuts."
It’s weird how the internet has brought people to the point where they think believing nothing makes them seem smart Dmitry Grozoubinski @DmitryOpines
"I'm too savvy to get my news from the MSM, which is why I get all my information about the world from a basement dwelling edgelord in Ohio or worse, Jordon Peterson."
So as well as her anti homosexual marriage and anti abortion views she might be favoured very strongly by the Vatican now and the most hardline Evangelicals but hard to see the average Scot not expressing reservations about her views
Worst thing is I can think of many many people like this. It's one of those counterpoints to 'armchair everything experts', the ones who argue nothing can be truly known.
3h So the theory is: thousands of journalists, millions of refugees, tens of millions of citizens, the UN, Presidents Putin and Zelenskyy, and the OSINT community came together to fake a war to steal 5% of the US defence budget worth of last generation military equipment.
Not even Russian media is pretending this war isn't happening.
You absolute puddings have memed yourself into a stance that is so ridiculous even Russian propogandists looked at it and went, "no, that would just be nuts."
It’s weird how the internet has brought people to the point where they think believing nothing makes them seem smart Dmitry Grozoubinski @DmitryOpines
"I'm too savvy to get my news from the MSM, which is why I get all my information about the world from a basement dwelling edgelord in Ohio or worse, Jordon Peterson."
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Everyone making a song and dance about Forbes' version of Christianity. And yet the Catholic Church, to which Bozo has converted, has many similar views, but nobody highlights this as a reason why Bozo, Mogg … is unsuitable for high office.
Tbf, in their particular cases we’re spoiled for choice.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Everyone making a song and dance about Forbes' version of Christianity. And yet the Catholic Church, to which Bozo has converted, has many similar views, but nobody highlights this as a reason why Bozo, Mogg or any other Papist is unsuitable for high office.
They would if Bozo said or wrote the same sorts of things as Forbes has.
If they were to forced to the think about it, the public would probably quite like Boris’s Augustinian philosophy.
I wonder if there is some issue about seeing a woman making her own choices the critics disagree with / don't understand?
I see the practice as an inability to distinguish issues of conscience from the general, and perhaps more worryingly an attempt to deny some people the ability to have a conscientious view where the answer is not liked. Is there perhaps a stereotype about anyone of a particular religion being unable to have any significant variance in their views (which is wrong).
Add in that it can be a potentially useful political baseball bat to bash other politicians with, and ... bingo !
It's recently been more visible for Jewish people (was something said about a UK Ambassador to Israel in the last several years "having two masters"?), but that trope has been played about RCs since forever, and at most UK elections iirc.
IMO Kate Forbes is getting the Free Presbyterian version of that attack line. As remarked, it's notable that no one has made the same comments about Humza's faith.
Pedantry: KF isn't FPC(U) or FPC(S) [edit] but FCS.
Fair enough comment.
FPC(U) being Ian Paisley's Church, FPC(S) sounding similar but being older, and FCS being Wee Frees who are both Presbyterian and Calvinist, and may be growing in strength but it is not clear whether this is a short-term or long-term trend.
They're all Calvinist!
Buyt interesting remarks. The two masters stuff is presumably having a foreign (if still spiritually related) rather than spiritual overlord? Like the mid Victorian panic over the RCs trying to set up a new hierarchy in UK? If so it is certainly not a slur that can be applied to the Free Church, however, or even to the Church of Scotland after de facto disestablishment.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
PS. Back her personally or for betting?
Personally. I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan. My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing if he doesn't screw up from a betting POV.
Who do you actually want to win?
Genuine question. Am intrigued.
As with most things it's gonnae be the least worst at the time of voting; I know it's the ultimate cop out but I'd still like to see how they perform over the next few weeks. Regan very much third on the list atm.
Me too; I'd swap Mr Y for Ms R at the moment, but all very contingent for the same reasons.
Had to share this doozy, because there are a surprising number of people who get really triggered by Zelensky maintaining an image such as not wearing a regular business suit to meet the king, which is in a similar vein.
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
The Nissan Juke is surely the ugliest car ever made?
Every politician, every person, is entitled to hold views guided by faith, but the people of Scotland must have confidence that the man or woman who leads their country will vehemently defend the battles on human rights that have already been won and passionately fight the battles on human rights that are yet to come. And Kate Forbes, although a confident, able minister, fails that test.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
PS. Back her personally or for betting?
Personally. I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan. My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing if he doesn't screw up from a betting POV.
Who do you actually want to win?
Genuine question. Am intrigued.
As with most things it's gonnae be the least worst at the time of voting; I know it's the ultimate cop out but I'd still like to see how they perform over the next few weeks. Regan very much third on the list atm.
That’s not a cop out. That’s a fair answer. So thanks
As a unionist none of them worries me particularly. Forbes did - I readily confess - but she now seems semi-permanently damaged and will divide the party. Also she’s been inept in a basic way
If I was an SNP member I’d be genuinely bewildered how to vote. And rather disappointed by the choice
Sturgeon and Salmond were always going to be hard to follow
Luckily for the Nats they are not exactly faced by opposition titans at Holyrood
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
The Nissan Juke is surely the ugliest car ever made?
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Everyone making a song and dance about Forbes' version of Christianity. And yet the Catholic Church, to which Bozo has converted, has many similar views, but nobody highlights this as a reason why Bozo, Mogg or any other Papist is unsuitable for high office.
They would if Bozo said or wrote the same sorts of things as Forbes has.
If they were to forced to the think about it, the public would probably quite like Boris’s Augustinian philosophy.
I wonder if there is some issue about seeing a woman making her own choices the critics disagree with / don't understand?
I see the practice as an inability to distinguish issues of conscience from the general, and perhaps more worryingly an attempt to deny some people the ability to have a conscientious view where the answer is not liked. Is there perhaps a stereotype about anyone of a particular religion being unable to have any significant variance in their views (which is wrong).
Add in that it can be a potentially useful political baseball bat to bash other politicians with, and ... bingo !
It's recently been more visible for Jewish people (was something said about a UK Ambassador to Israel in the last several years "having two masters"?), but that trope has been played about RCs since forever, and at most UK elections iirc.
IMO Kate Forbes is getting the Free Presbyterian version of that attack line. As remarked, it's notable that no one has made the same comments about Humza's faith.
Pedantry: KF isn't FPC(U) or FPC(S) [edit] but FCS.
Fair enough comment.
FPC(U) being Ian Paisley's Church, FPC(S) sounding similar but being older, and FCS being Wee Frees who are both Presbyterian and Calvinist, and may be growing in strength but it is not clear whether this is a short-term or long-term trend.
They're all Calvinist!
Buyt interesting remarks. The two masters stuff is presumably having a foreign (if still spiritually related) rather than spiritual overlord? Like the mid Victorian panic over the RCs trying to set up a new hierarchy in UK? If so it is certainly not a slur that can be applied to the Free Church, however, or even to the Church of Scotland after de facto disestablishment.
Though Kate Forbes' views are certainly closer to those of Pope Francis or even more so the late Pope Benedict than to those of King Charles III
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
The Nissan Juke is surely the ugliest car ever made?
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
The Nissan Juke is surely the ugliest car ever made?
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Everyone making a song and dance about Forbes' version of Christianity. And yet the Catholic Church, to which Bozo has converted, has many similar views, but nobody highlights this as a reason why Bozo, Mogg or any other Papist is unsuitable for high office.
They would if Bozo said or wrote the same sorts of things as Forbes has.
If they were to forced to the think about it, the public would probably quite like Boris’s Augustinian philosophy.
I wonder if there is some issue about seeing a woman making her own choices the critics disagree with / don't understand?
I see the practice as an inability to distinguish issues of conscience from the general, and perhaps more worryingly an attempt to deny some people the ability to have a conscientious view where the answer is not liked. Is there perhaps a stereotype about anyone of a particular religion being unable to have any significant variance in their views (which is wrong).
Add in that it can be a potentially useful political baseball bat to bash other politicians with, and ... bingo !
It's recently been more visible for Jewish people (was something said about a UK Ambassador to Israel in the last several years "having two masters"?), but that trope has been played about RCs since forever, and at most UK elections iirc.
IMO Kate Forbes is getting the Free Presbyterian version of that attack line. As remarked, it's notable that no one has made the same comments about Humza's faith.
Pedantry: KF isn't FPC(U) or FPC(S) [edit] but FCS.
Fair enough comment.
FPC(U) being Ian Paisley's Church, FPC(S) sounding similar but being older, and FCS being Wee Frees who are both Presbyterian and Calvinist, and may be growing in strength but it is not clear whether this is a short-term or long-term trend.
They're all Calvinist!
Buyt interesting remarks. The two masters stuff is presumably having a foreign (if still spiritually related) rather than spiritual overlord? Like the mid Victorian panic over the RCs trying to set up a new hierarchy in UK? If so it is certainly not a slur that can be applied to the Free Church, however, or even to the Church of Scotland after de facto disestablishment.
Though Kate Forbes' views are certainly closer to those of Pope Francis or even more so the late Pope Benedict than to those of King Charles III
Picking and choosing to suit your preconceptions as usual. If you look hard enough she might have had a red toy ball when she was wee, like the Pope.
Was just out rowing on the Tideway (lower, tidal but if the Thames)
They’re strict rules about how you navigate. I was steering, coming up the river in the inshore zone. Staying moderately wide of the bank, since the tide was very low. Inches of water below the boat.
A certain club were on the river. They are from the non-tidal bit. They regard us as rank amateurs - which we are. They may well get some pots in Head of the River. We wouldn’t in a million years.
Having been a bit rude all morning (and their coaching launch), I saw they coming up behind us in a sprint. They were trying to overtake on the inside - which is shocking manners.
So I let them. I also gave the steering a kick - made it look like my steering was more rough and ready than it was. So they moved even more to the bank as they passed us on the inside.
Looked over my shoulder and yesssss - crunch. They were solidly on a mud bank, fin and rudder broken off, probably. At the least, they would need to get out of the boat to lighten it.
Sadly, we couldn’t wave as we passed them in turn, since we were sculling. I did smile though, broadly.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
My antenna go straight up with this sort of Wokescreening.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
Golly, I can hear your bellowing all the way from that forest clearing in Sweden, the wind must be in the right direction.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
PS. Back her personally or for betting?
Personally. I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan. My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing if he doesn't screw up from a betting POV.
Who do you actually want to win?
Genuine question. Am intrigued.
As with most things it's gonnae be the least worst at the time of voting; I know it's the ultimate cop out but I'd still like to see how they perform over the next few weeks. Regan very much third on the list atm.
As at this moment Forbes started as odds on favourite, went out to 4/1, and is now at 5/4 with Hills.
The punters are all over the place.
As to the result: Despite the torrent of attacks on Forbes, the issue, it seems to me, is who looks most like a winner. Ash and Humza don't appear like winners, but Forbes outstandingly does, but only if you overlook the elephant in the room.
I think she will be favourite by Monday. All the rubbish (and rubbish it is) about her is already out. Once people realise there has been an outrageous over reaction sentiment will shift.
Was just out rowing on the Tideway (lower, tidal but if the Thames)
They’re strict rules about how you navigate. I was steering, coming up the river in the inshore zone. Staying moderately wide of the bank, since the tide was very low. Inches of water below the boat.
A certain club were on the river. They are from the non-tidal bit. They regard us as rank amateurs - which we are. They may well get some pots in Head of the River. We wouldn’t in a million years.
Having been a bit rude all morning (and their coaching launch), I saw they coming up behind us in a sprint. They were trying to overtake on the inside - which is shocking manners.
So I let them. I also gave the steering a kick - made it look like my steering was more rough and ready than it was. So they moved even more to the bank as they passed us on the inside.
Looked over my shoulder and yesssss - crunch. They were solidly on a mud bank, fin and rudder broken off, probably. At the least, they would need to get out of the boat to lighten it.
Sadly, we couldn’t wave as we passed them in turn, since we were sculling. I did smile though, broadly.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
My antenna go straight up with this sort of Wokescreening.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
Golly, I can hear your bellowing all the way from that forest clearing in Sweden, the wind must be in the right direction.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
PS. Back her personally or for betting?
Personally. I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan. My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing if he doesn't screw up from a betting POV.
Who do you actually want to win?
Genuine question. Am intrigued.
As with most things it's gonnae be the least worst at the time of voting; I know it's the ultimate cop out but I'd still like to see how they perform over the next few weeks. Regan very much third on the list atm.
As at this moment Forbes started as odds on favourite, went out to 4/1, and is now at 5/4 with Hills.
The punters are all over the place.
As to the result: Despite the torrent of attacks on Forbes, the issue, it seems to me, is who looks most like a winner. Ash and Humza don't appear like winners, but Forbes outstandingly does, but only if you overlook the elephant in the room.
I think she will be favourite by Monday. All the rubbish (and rubbish it is) about her is already out. Once people realise there has been an outrageous over reaction sentiment will shift.
And then what about the inevitable ensuing divisions in the party? A lot of SNP MPs, MSPs and activists find her views absolutely intolerable
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
PS. Back her personally or for betting?
Personally. I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan. My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing if he doesn't screw up from a betting POV.
Who do you actually want to win?
Genuine question. Am intrigued.
As with most things it's gonnae be the least worst at the time of voting; I know it's the ultimate cop out but I'd still like to see how they perform over the next few weeks. Regan very much third on the list atm.
As at this moment Forbes started as odds on favourite, went out to 4/1, and is now at 5/4 with Hills.
The punters are all over the place.
As to the result: Despite the torrent of attacks on Forbes, the issue, it seems to me, is who looks most like a winner. Ash and Humza don't appear like winners, but Forbes outstandingly does, but only if you overlook the elephant in the room.
I think she will be favourite by Monday. All the rubbish (and rubbish it is) about her is already out. Once people realise there has been an outrageous over reaction sentiment will shift.
And then what about the inevitable ensuing divisions in the party? A lot of SNP MPs, MSPs and activists find her views absolutely intolerable
It’s a recipe for years of bitter infighting
Well, that'll keep the PB comments section busy - so that's one positive.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
My antenna go straight up with this sort of Wokescreening.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
Golly, I can hear your bellowing all the way from that forest clearing in Sweden, the wind must be in the right direction.
Had to share this doozy, because there are a surprising number of people who get really triggered by Zelensky maintaining an image such as not wearing a regular business suit to meet the king, which is in a similar vein.
Literally suggesting that so long as you’re well groomed, mass murder is no biggie.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
My antenna go straight up with this sort of Wokescreening.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
Golly, I can hear your bellowing all the way from that forest clearing in Sweden, the wind must be in the right direction.
Stop the clock!
Took you 22 minutes to come up with a 2/10 comeback.
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
The Nissan Juke is surely the ugliest car ever made?
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
My antenna go straight up with this sort of Wokescreening.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
Golly, I can hear your bellowing all the way from that forest clearing in Sweden, the wind must be in the right direction.
Didn't know you were Orange, either.
I have a distant relative..
Ah, I see now, ta. Still trying to work out what a secretarianist is ...
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
My antenna go straight up with this sort of Wokescreening.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
Golly, I can hear your bellowing all the way from that forest clearing in Sweden, the wind must be in the right direction.
Stop the clock!
Took you 22 minutes to come up with a 2/10 comeback.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
If she seriously believes that, why on earth is she standing?
Surely being First Minister of Scotland is far more important in its impacton people's lives than being a minister in a fringe evangelical church sect?
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
My antenna go straight up with this sort of Wokescreening.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
Golly, I can hear your bellowing all the way from that forest clearing in Sweden, the wind must be in the right direction.
Didn't know you were Orange, either.
I have a distant relative..
Ah, I see now, ta. Still trying to work out what a secretarianist is ...
Reverting to my 12 year old self (never difficult), someone who uses their dictaphone?
"The problem is that growing salad vegetables in the UK has been made economically unviable, both by those shortsighted supermarkets and in large part by Brexit. Growers in the Lea Valley around London, regarded as Britain’s salad bowl, have started applying to knock down dozens of acres of greenhouses so the land can be used more profitably for houses. As the Lea Valley Growers Association has explained, the post-Brexit seasonal workers’ scheme only granted six-month visas when they were needed for nine months. It meant bringing in two cohorts and double the training. That means extra costs which are not being met by supermarkets."
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
My antenna go straight up with this sort of Wokescreening.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
Golly, I can hear your bellowing all the way from that forest clearing in Sweden, the wind must be in the right direction.
Didn't know you were Orange, either.
I have a distant relative..
Well, that's a distant relative of all of us.
About two million years ago and 25,000 generations, maybe?
"The problem is that growing salad vegetables in the UK has been made economically unviable, both by those shortsighted supermarkets and in large part by Brexit. Growers in the Lea Valley around London, regarded as Britain’s salad bowl, have started applying to knock down dozens of acres of greenhouses so the land can be used more profitably for houses. As the Lea Valley Growers Association has explained, the post-Brexit seasonal workers’ scheme only granted six-month visas when they were needed for nine months. It meant bringing in two cohorts and double the training. That means extra costs which are not being met by supermarkets."
Clarkson complained it was actually very difficult to sell his vegetables when he'd grown them.
Of course, how truthful he was being is another question. But AIUI they are a sod of a crop. A bugger to grow and selling them fresh is a pain, while selling them in any way other than fresh is an even bigger pain.
"The problem is that growing salad vegetables in the UK has been made economically unviable, both by those shortsighted supermarkets and in large part by Brexit. Growers in the Lea Valley around London, regarded as Britain’s salad bowl, have started applying to knock down dozens of acres of greenhouses so the land can be used more profitably for houses. As the Lea Valley Growers Association has explained, the post-Brexit seasonal workers’ scheme only granted six-month visas when they were needed for nine months. It meant bringing in two cohorts and double the training. That means extra costs which are not being met by supermarkets."
Clarkson complained it was actually very difficult to sell his vegetables when he'd grown them.
Of course, how truthful he was being is another question. But AIUI they are a sod of a crop. A bugger to grow and selling them fresh is a pain, while selling them in any way other than fresh is an even bigger pain.
We get ours from (mostly) local growers through the community hamster food store, so we do what we can. But having to deal with the supermarkets would make me lose the will to live. Much easier to build battery commuter hutches.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Everyone making a song and dance about Forbes' version of Christianity. And yet the Catholic Church, to which Bozo has converted, has many similar views, but nobody highlights this as a reason why Bozo, Mogg or any other Papist is unsuitable for high office.
They would if Bozo said or wrote the same sorts of things as Forbes has.
If they were to forced to the think about it, the public would probably quite like Boris’s Augustinian philosophy.
I wonder if there is some issue about seeing a woman making her own choices the critics disagree with / don't understand?
I see the practice as an inability to distinguish issues of conscience from the general, and perhaps more worryingly an attempt to deny some people the ability to have a conscientious view where the answer is not liked. Is there perhaps a stereotype about anyone of a particular religion being unable to have any significant variance in their views (which is wrong).
Add in that it can be a potentially useful political baseball bat to bash other politicians with, and ... bingo !
It's recently been more visible for Jewish people (was something said about a UK Ambassador to Israel in the last several years "having two masters"?), but that trope has been played about RCs since forever, and at most UK elections iirc.
IMO Kate Forbes is getting the Free Presbyterian version of that attack line. As remarked, it's notable that no one has made the same comments about Humza's faith.
Pedantry: KF isn't FPC(U) or FPC(S) [edit] but FCS.
Fair enough comment.
FPC(U) being Ian Paisley's Church, FPC(S) sounding similar but being older, and FCS being Wee Frees who are both Presbyterian and Calvinist, and may be growing in strength but it is not clear whether this is a short-term or long-term trend.
They're all Calvinist!
Buyt interesting remarks. The two masters stuff is presumably having a foreign (if still spiritually related) rather than spiritual overlord? Like the mid Victorian panic over the RCs trying to set up a new hierarchy in UK? If so it is certainly not a slur that can be applied to the Free Church, however, or even to the Church of Scotland after de facto disestablishment.
IMO the two-masters (or divided loyalties may be a better term) is a bit of an historical echo, perhaps in style only, of the politics around the Reformation, when the RC Church *was* an existential threat to the English Crown. And the Govt hunted out its agents.
For KF, I'd say it's not "two masters", but a commitment to a belief-system perceived (or portrayed) as incompatible with modern Scotland (in this case).
For me I don't see a huge issue - as in my experience Evangelicals are likely to be punctilious about keeping their personal views of conscience separate from a State Role, and the more traditionalist the more they may do it, and there is a lot of Non-conformist history of persecution that has on the whole enforced that firewall - even going back to eg the Pilgrim Fathers having to depart, but also much more recently in the UK, much at the hands of the 16C-19C Church of England.
One example being admission to Oxbridge not being regularised for non-conformists, like RCs, until 1871.
I've known Evangelicals who have viewed themselves as distanced from daily politics to the extent of choosing not to vote.
IMO the two-masters trope has play whenever there are two views or communities where a wedge can be driven. Seen in Islamic Countries alongside a drive-to-purity, but also rightly or wrongly in Western Countries in WW2 (USA - Japanese, UK interning enemy aliens), and contemporaneously around religious minorities.
Then there's the separate question of whether opinions in such groups will be uniform and socially conservative. The Methodists are 'Evangelical', yet they now do same sex marriages, with a dissenting sub-community. I have no idea when the Wee Frees will get there.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
Surely the Nits can’t be mad enough to elect the South Uist Salafist?
She will never escape this. It will be hurled at her continuously and do endless damage
It’s even more over for her than it was before.
Not per the betting it isn't. Forbes and Yousaf are either side of evens and close. Regan - who does come over as the most lightweight to me - is the one out with the washing.
I’m with Leon on this. It’s the reason I want her to win.
Kates views on no sex before marriage is laugh out loud funny. But the thought of her being a parent to someone who is gay isn’t funny at all. So I think this makes her my preference for winning this, because her prejudice will be very much in the spotlight throughout her time as leader, this will get people talking and arguing and thinking about prejudice based positions like opposing all sex marriage, and that would be really good, exactly what the world actually needs to focus on outdated outgoing philosophies built on prejudice, and expunge them as soon as possible now. So I can see how a lot of good can come from such a senior UK political leader holding such views as hers, helping to maintain the spotlight on such things.
In terms of the independence politics of it, none of them seem to have come up with very good responses in interviews about how to achieve it from here. I don’t understand why there is so much hostility to using all Westminster elections and Scottish government elections as pleblicites on support for independence - it’s a fantastic idea for maximising SNP vote every time.
The best result for unionists, would be Ash, as her interviews are car crashes, she’s out of her depth. The worst result for Conservatives would be Kate, as she seeks independence but has social and economic values closer to conservatives. Best result for Labour, Kate, for same reasons in reverse to why she is worst for Conservative vote.
Who do I think wins? Kate. Even if Humza has the SNP establishment support, for, as someone wittily put it, applauding everything Sturgeon said and done like a demented seal, I still don’t think that’s enough to stop Kate now.
Bit all over the place here, confused London by looks of it.
You are not even in the SNP party. Do you vote Alba - So why are you so interested?
“In terms of the independence politics of it, none of them seem to have come up with very good responses in interviews about how to achieve it from here.” That’s true isn’t? So how would you do it?
You don’t have an answer do you.
Becuase you know I am right. I’m the only one with the answer.
The truth here Malc, since accepting London’s devolved parliament, that’s not remotely independence, the push for independence has become confused and all over the place. If anyone in Scotland was a wee bit interested in independence now, they would have identical attitude to working so hard in a devolved parliament they don’t want to exist they would have to their MPs going to Westminster and working so hard there without remotely wanting to be part of it.
If any nationalist in Scotland wants independence they need to shun Londons devolved assembly trap, let the labour tory unionists run that in coalition, and go on civil disobedience against anything to do with union.
Today, Scottish Nationalism has become weak. Limp. Half hearted and confused. In comparison to how history of the world people have worked harder than this for their freedom.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
My antenna go straight up with this sort of Wokescreening.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
Golly, I can hear your bellowing all the way from that forest clearing in Sweden, the wind must be in the right direction.
Didn't know you were Orange, either.
I have a distant relative..
Well, that's a distant relative of all of us.
About two million years ago and 25,000 generations, maybe?
Magnificent creatures, though. A real privilege to see one in the wild - you get a real sense of the nobility and wisdom of such an ancient beast.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
If she seriously believes that, why on earth is she standing?
Surely being First Minister of Scotland is far more important in its impacton people's lives than being a minister in a fringe evangelical church sect?
Perhaps as God has called her to ban the teaching of evolution in Scottish schools?
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
If she seriously believes that, why on earth is she standing?
Surely being First Minister of Scotland is far more important in its impacton people's lives than being a minister in a fringe evangelical church sect?
Perhaps as God has called her to ban the teaching of evolution in Scottish schools?
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
If she seriously believes that, why on earth is she standing?
Surely being First Minister of Scotland is far more important in its impacton people's lives than being a minister in a fringe evangelical church sect?
I think the key to understanding that is the phrase "in the church", and life in the public realm not being subject to a practice that only applies in the 'private' realm. Ironically many of those stating that she is not suited to be FM because of her church membership would affirm the split as reflecting laicite a la France.
It would be interesting to see if her views have changed between 23 and 32 years old.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
If she seriously believes that, why on earth is she standing?
Surely being First Minister of Scotland is far more important in its impacton people's lives than being a minister in a fringe evangelical church sect?
I think the key to understanding that is the phrase "in the church", and life in the public realm not being subject to a practice that only applies in the 'private' realm. Ironically many of those stating that she is not suited to be FM because of her church membership would affirm the split as reflecting laicite a la France.
It would be interesting to see if her views have changed between 23 and 32 years old.
Indeed, she's Finance Minister already. Which bears out the distinction you make.
Was just out rowing on the Tideway (lower, tidal but if the Thames)
They’re strict rules about how you navigate. I was steering, coming up the river in the inshore zone. Staying moderately wide of the bank, since the tide was very low. Inches of water below the boat.
A certain club were on the river. They are from the non-tidal bit. They regard us as rank amateurs - which we are. They may well get some pots in Head of the River. We wouldn’t in a million years.
Having been a bit rude all morning (and their coaching launch), I saw they coming up behind us in a sprint. They were trying to overtake on the inside - which is shocking manners.
So I let them. I also gave the steering a kick - made it look like my steering was more rough and ready than it was. So they moved even more to the bank as they passed us on the inside.
Looked over my shoulder and yesssss - crunch. They were solidly on a mud bank, fin and rudder broken off, probably. At the least, they would need to get out of the boat to lighten it.
Sadly, we couldn’t wave as we passed them in turn, since we were sculling. I did smile though, broadly.
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
The Nissan Juke is surely the ugliest car ever made?
Hmmm.
Multipla?
That's I think, a Chrysler PT Cruiser. Horrible.
Quite like Multiplas - had two in the family. I managed to drive one into the o/s rear corner of a Saab when I forgot how wide it was pulling out of a parking space, and the amount of damage was .. horrific.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
If she seriously believes that, why on earth is she standing?
Surely being First Minister of Scotland is far more important in its impacton people's lives than being a minister in a fringe evangelical church sect?
I think the key to understanding that is the phrase "in the church", and life in the public realm not being subject to a practice that only applies in the 'private' realm. Ironically many of those stating that she is not suited to be FM because of her church membership would affirm the split as reflecting laicite a la France.
It would be interesting to see if her views have changed between 23 and 32 years old.
You have the wrong end of the stick here.
The issue is that she has - albeit marginally - overstepped the line into looking like she wanted to impose her private religious beliefs on the public.
Now people are digging up more detail on those private beliefs which increasingly look, in the secular light of 2023, to be quite odd.
This is not about Forbes’s Wee Free Christianity getting a hard ride compared to Humza’s Islamic faith.
Humza has fronted the issue and provided sufficient reassurance that whatever the teachings of Islam, he himself is happy to lead and represent a modern and progressive Scottish community.
I was so bored this morning I tried to fly IMMEDIATELY to Rangoon
I spent 3 hours getting all the paperwork in order, insurance, mad covid shit, endless red tape, got it all done, was congratulating myself, Evisa sorted, then I got an email telling me my instant e-visa would actually take 3 working days minimum
That’s when I popped a trammy, and drank half a bottle of 19 crimes shiraz, at 10 am
Turns out that’s quite superb for curing monotony. Add a couple of salty margaritas. Some modestly kinky porn. A chapter of Simon Sebag Montefiore’s WORLD HISTORY. An hour in the sun, half an our in the gym. The day passes
How can you live like that FFS? I’ve been working diligently for 22 years as a solicitor and I’ve nearly earned enough to buy a 2014 Nissan Juke. If you’d applied yourself you could have had the same.
Do you honestly think any of this is real? It's fiction.
I can assure you that my imminent purchase of a 64 Reg Automatic Nissan Juke is very real!
The Nissan Juke is surely the ugliest car ever made?
Hmmm.
Multipla?
That's I think, a Chrysler PT Cruiser. Horrible.
Quite like Multiplas - had two in the family. I managed to drive one into the o/s rear corner of a Saab when I forgot how wide it was pulling out of a parking space, and the amount of damage was .. horrific.
Not a car for a 30mph accident.
For some reason, every time I see that car, I start imagine it being torn apart and rebuilt by those American hotrod types.
'Kate Forbes said in 2014 letter that women should not be church ministers as God does "not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man" within the church.'
If she seriously believes that, why on earth is she standing?
Surely being First Minister of Scotland is far more important in its impacton people's lives than being a minister in a fringe evangelical church sect?
I think the key to understanding that is the phrase "in the church", and life in the public realm not being subject to a practice that only applies in the 'private' realm. Ironically many of those stating that she is not suited to be FM because of her church membership would affirm the split as reflecting laicite a la France.
It would be interesting to see if her views have changed between 23 and 32 years old.
You have the wrong end of the stick here.
The issue is that she has - albeit marginally - overstepped the line into looking like she wanted to impose her private religious beliefs on the public.
Now people are digging up more detail on those private beliefs which increasingly look, in the secular light of 2023, to be quite odd.
This is not about Forbes’s Wee Free Christianity getting a hard ride compared to Humza’s Islamic faith.
Humza has fronted the issue and provided sufficient reassurance that whatever the teachings of Islam, he himself is happy to lead and represent a modern and progressive Scottish community.
Forbes just failed to do that.
Humza is, I think, threading a careful line of being progressive, without actually speaking out against the teachings of much of the Islamic movement.
To put it bluntly, I think he is the position of those Catholics who ditch the Churches teaching on these areas.
Forbes has said that she would use her private beliefs to guide her votes. At which point her private beliefs become public beliefs.
"The problem is that growing salad vegetables in the UK has been made economically unviable, both by those shortsighted supermarkets and in large part by Brexit. Growers in the Lea Valley around London, regarded as Britain’s salad bowl, have started applying to knock down dozens of acres of greenhouses so the land can be used more profitably for houses. As the Lea Valley Growers Association has explained, the post-Brexit seasonal workers’ scheme only granted six-month visas when they were needed for nine months. It meant bringing in two cohorts and double the training. That means extra costs which are not being met by supermarkets."
Clarkson complained it was actually very difficult to sell his vegetables when he'd grown them.
Of course, how truthful he was being is another question. But AIUI they are a sod of a crop. A bugger to grow and selling them fresh is a pain, while selling them in any way other than fresh is an even bigger pain.
I watched Clarkson's Farm 2 as wallpaper this week. Obviously come of it (discussions about killing badgers) is normal Clarkson-chic to stir up the outrage bus. I found the planning stuff interesting, and some of that was obviously exaggerated too (eg Appeal Costs).
I'd say that that is another one where the Govt need to decide how they are going to adjust their policies to account for the UK's changed situation, in terms of resilience etc. The opportunity and the need is there if they are serious about creating a future outside the EU single market.
"The problem is that growing salad vegetables in the UK has been made economically unviable, both by those shortsighted supermarkets and in large part by Brexit. Growers in the Lea Valley around London, regarded as Britain’s salad bowl, have started applying to knock down dozens of acres of greenhouses so the land can be used more profitably for houses. As the Lea Valley Growers Association has explained, the post-Brexit seasonal workers’ scheme only granted six-month visas when they were needed for nine months. It meant bringing in two cohorts and double the training. That means extra costs which are not being met by supermarkets."
Clarkson complained it was actually very difficult to sell his vegetables when he'd grown them.
Of course, how truthful he was being is another question. But AIUI they are a sod of a crop. A bugger to grow and selling them fresh is a pain, while selling them in any way other than fresh is an even bigger pain.
He was probably demanding the cost of growing them plus a profit. That kind of fascist thinking would never pass the muster at Tesco.
I had a look round today - the supermarkets have a fair amount of fresh veg. The specialty shops around here - higher quality, more expensive produce - are stacked to the ceiling with veg.
"The problem is that growing salad vegetables in the UK has been made economically unviable, both by those shortsighted supermarkets and in large part by Brexit. Growers in the Lea Valley around London, regarded as Britain’s salad bowl, have started applying to knock down dozens of acres of greenhouses so the land can be used more profitably for houses. As the Lea Valley Growers Association has explained, the post-Brexit seasonal workers’ scheme only granted six-month visas when they were needed for nine months. It meant bringing in two cohorts and double the training. That means extra costs which are not being met by supermarkets."
Clarkson complained it was actually very difficult to sell his vegetables when he'd grown them.
Of course, how truthful he was being is another question. But AIUI they are a sod of a crop. A bugger to grow and selling them fresh is a pain, while selling them in any way other than fresh is an even bigger pain.
I watched Clarkson's Farm 2 as wallpaper this week. Obviously come of it (discussions about killing badgers) is normal Clarkson-chic to stir up the outrage bus. I found the planning stuff interesting, and some of that was obviously exaggerated too (eg Appeal Costs).
I'd say that that is another one where the Govt need to decide how they are going to adjust their policies to account for the UK's changed situation, in terms of resilience etc. The opportunity and the need is there if they are serious about creating a future outside the EU single market.
Be fair. They've only had seven years to think about it. Apart from stuff like importing kumquats to/from Australia and [edit] trying to bankrupt UK sheep farmers with the same agreement.
Comments
1.5 seconds.
That's how long it would take for all the current non Scotland based gammony defenders of Kate's faith (eg the Speccie) to start bellowing about Scotland being a reactionary unprogressive hellhole if she became FM.
I'd still back her over 'I am a mother first' Ash mind.
But yes. 80 losses leaves the Conservatives on 300ish with the new boundaries. If the Conservatives do make that their battleground, the Otherlot parties will run round it much like the Germans did with the Maginot line.
I look forward to the rest, meanwhile, being off PB playtime and the Sunday newspapers tomorrow, in the way of consistent policy. "Works of necessity or mercy", as the Shorter Catechism has it, don't include informing gamblers of the likely odds ...
I’ve now read 300 pages of the Montefiore book (out of 1300!) and I’m reaching a tentative conclusion. It’s a seriously flawed masterpiece
It has none of the vivacity of his brilliant Stalin books, but it avoids the effete meanderings of his Jerusalem book (very poor, I thought)
But it is unique and maybe it is unfair to compare to anything. It is an incredible act of scholarship and full of superb detail but it is also like reading The Old Testament, In toto. With something of the Silmarillion and a dash of Finnegan’s Wake. It is dense dense dense. I am managing 20 pages a day. A page turning thriller it is not
And yet I am very glad I am reading it, and I like knowing it is there to turn to. For another fascinating glimpse of mad history I never knew. It also succeeds in giving a new perspective on the vast sweep of human history
So, on the whole, I am definitely a fan. But prepare yourself for a long haul
Edit: curse of Divvieamus
I see the practice as an inability to distinguish issues of conscience from the general, and perhaps more worryingly an attempt to deny some people the ability to have a conscientious view where the answer is not liked. Is there perhaps a stereotype about anyone of a particular religion being unable to have any significant variance in their views (which is wrong).
Add in that it can be a potentially useful political baseball bat to bash other politicians with, and ... bingo !
It's recently been more visible for Jewish people (was something said about a UK Ambassador to Israel in the last several years "having two masters"?), but that trope has been played about RCs since forever, and at most UK elections iirc.
Here's an example from 2007 when RC Labour MPs had met with Cardinal Cormac Murphy O Connor. Apparently it was "sinister":
https://www.secularism.org.uk/churchpressureoncatholicmpssinis2.html
IMO Kate Forbes is getting the Free Presbyterian version of that attack line. As remarked, it's notable that no one has made the same comments about Humza's faith.
I'm disappointed that Forbes hasn't been capable of framing her faith as a prospective leader of a progressive party, she still might I guess but there's an awful lot of existing baggage there. I still think she's got intellectual heft and principles (too many?) compared to Regan.
My limted knowledge of the SNP membership makes Yousaf last man standing from a betting POV if he doesn't screw up.
Genuine question. Am intrigued.
FPC(U) being Ian Paisley's Church, FPC(S) sounding similar but being older, and FCS being Wee Frees who are both Presbyterian and Calvinist, and may be growing in strength but it is not clear whether this is a short-term or long-term trend - depending a bit on what happens to unity in the Church of Scotland over gay marriage and what happens to any splinters.
Like most people who do this, they secretly hold bigoted views - as your constant pushing of loyalism and secretarianism shows - and this is designed to make you feel better about yourself for it, and throw others off the scent.
@DmitryOpines
3h
So the theory is: thousands of journalists, millions of refugees, tens of millions of citizens, the UN, Presidents Putin and Zelenskyy, and the OSINT community came together to fake a war to steal 5% of the US defence budget worth of last generation military equipment.
Not even Russian media is pretending this war isn't happening.
You absolute puddings have memed yourself into a stance that is so ridiculous even Russian propogandists looked at it and went, "no, that would just be nuts."
@MattBrookes3
It’s weird how the internet has brought people to the point where they think believing nothing makes them seem smart
Dmitry Grozoubinski
@DmitryOpines
"I'm too savvy to get my news from the MSM, which is why I get all my information about the world from a basement dwelling edgelord in Ohio or worse, Jordon Peterson."
https://twitter.com/DmitryOpines/status/1629437806480175104
https://twitter.com/electpoliticsuk/status/1629412868884971522?s=20
So as well as her anti homosexual marriage and anti abortion views she might be favoured very strongly by the Vatican now and the most hardline Evangelicals but hard to see the average Scot not expressing reservations about her views
Buyt interesting remarks. The two masters stuff is presumably having a foreign (if still spiritually related) rather than spiritual overlord? Like the mid Victorian panic over the RCs trying to set up a new hierarchy in UK? If so it is
certainly not a slur that can be applied to the Free Church, however, or even to the Church of Scotland after de facto disestablishment.
As a unionist none of them worries me particularly. Forbes did - I readily confess - but she now seems semi-permanently damaged and will divide the party. Also she’s been inept in a basic way
If I was an SNP member I’d be genuinely bewildered how to vote. And rather disappointed by the choice
Sturgeon and Salmond were always going to be hard to follow
Luckily for the Nats they are not exactly faced by opposition titans at Holyrood
Was just out rowing on the Tideway (lower, tidal but if the Thames)
They’re strict rules about how you navigate. I was steering, coming up the river in the inshore zone. Staying moderately wide of the bank, since the tide was very low. Inches of water below the boat.
A certain club were on the river. They are from the non-tidal bit. They regard us as rank amateurs - which we are. They may well get some pots in Head of the River. We wouldn’t in a million years.
Having been a bit rude all morning (and their coaching launch), I saw they coming up behind us in a sprint. They were trying to overtake on the inside - which is shocking manners.
So I let them. I also gave the steering a kick - made it look like my steering was more rough and ready than it was. So they moved even more to the bank as they passed us on the inside.
Looked over my shoulder and yesssss - crunch. They were solidly on a mud bank, fin and rudder broken off, probably. At the least, they would need to get out of the boat to lighten it.
Sadly, we couldn’t wave as we passed them in turn, since we were sculling. I did smile though, broadly.
The punters are all over the place.
As to the result: Despite the torrent of attacks on Forbes, the issue, it seems to me, is who looks most like a winner. Ash and Humza don't appear like winners, but Forbes outstandingly does, but only if you overlook the elephant in the room.
I think she will be favourite by Monday. All the rubbish (and rubbish it is) about her is already out. Once people realise there has been an outrageous over reaction sentiment will shift.
It’s a recipe for years of bitter infighting
Jeremy Corbyn’s post-Labour career continues to plumb new depths as he met with the racist conspiracy theorist Roger Waters last night.
Took you 22 minutes to come up with a 2/10 comeback.
Conclusion: got you bang to rights.
Surely being First Minister of Scotland is far more important in its impacton people's lives than being a minister in a fringe evangelical church sect?
"The problem is that growing salad vegetables in the UK has been made economically unviable, both by those shortsighted supermarkets and in large part by Brexit. Growers in the Lea Valley around London, regarded as Britain’s salad bowl, have started applying to knock down dozens of acres of greenhouses so the land can be used more profitably for houses. As the Lea Valley Growers Association has explained, the post-Brexit seasonal workers’ scheme only granted six-month visas when they were needed for nine months. It meant bringing in two cohorts and double the training. That means extra costs which are not being met by supermarkets."
About two million years ago and 25,000 generations, maybe?
Of course, how truthful he was being is another question. But AIUI they are a sod of a crop. A bugger to grow and selling them fresh is a pain, while selling them in any way other than fresh is an even bigger pain.
For KF, I'd say it's not "two masters", but a commitment to a belief-system perceived (or portrayed) as incompatible with modern Scotland (in this case).
For me I don't see a huge issue - as in my experience Evangelicals are likely to be punctilious about keeping their personal views of conscience separate from a State Role, and the more traditionalist the more they may do it, and there is a lot of Non-conformist history of persecution that has on the whole enforced that firewall - even going back to eg the Pilgrim Fathers having to depart, but also much more recently in the UK, much at the hands of the 16C-19C Church of England.
One example being admission to Oxbridge not being regularised for non-conformists, like RCs, until 1871.
I've known Evangelicals who have viewed themselves as distanced from daily politics to the extent of choosing not to vote.
IMO the two-masters trope has play whenever there are two views or communities where a wedge can be driven. Seen in Islamic Countries alongside a drive-to-purity, but also rightly or wrongly in Western Countries in WW2 (USA - Japanese, UK interning enemy aliens), and contemporaneously around religious minorities.
Then there's the separate question of whether opinions in such groups will be uniform and socially conservative. The Methodists are 'Evangelical', yet they now do same sex marriages, with a dissenting sub-community. I have no idea when the Wee Frees will get there.
Harry's book title "Waaagh".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsJRU3F4yfA
“In terms of the independence politics of it, none of them seem to have come up with very good responses in interviews about how to achieve it from here.” That’s true isn’t? So how would you do it?
You don’t have an answer do you.
Becuase you know I am right. I’m the only one with the answer.
The truth here Malc, since accepting London’s devolved parliament, that’s not remotely independence, the push for independence has become confused and all over the place. If anyone in Scotland was a wee bit interested in independence now, they would have identical attitude to working so hard in a devolved parliament they don’t want to exist they would have to their MPs going to Westminster and working so hard there without remotely wanting to be part of it.
If any nationalist in Scotland wants independence they need to shun Londons devolved assembly trap, let the labour tory unionists run that in coalition, and go on civil disobedience against anything to do with union.
Today, Scottish Nationalism has become weak. Limp. Half hearted and confused. In comparison to how history of the world people have worked harder than this for their freedom.
What are your thoughts CR?
It would be interesting to see if her views have changed between 23 and 32 years old.
Quite like Multiplas - had two in the family. I managed to drive one into the o/s rear corner of a Saab when I forgot how wide it was pulling out of a parking space, and the amount of damage was .. horrific.
Not a car for a 30mph accident.
The issue is that she has - albeit marginally - overstepped the line into looking like she wanted to impose her private religious beliefs on the public.
Now people are digging up more detail on those private beliefs which increasingly look, in the secular light of 2023, to be quite odd.
This is not about Forbes’s Wee Free Christianity getting a hard ride compared to Humza’s Islamic faith.
Humza has fronted the issue and provided sufficient reassurance that whatever the teachings of Islam, he himself is happy to lead and represent a modern and progressive Scottish community.
Forbes just failed to do that.
Everyone deserves to find happiness.
To put it bluntly, I think he is the position of those Catholics who ditch the Churches teaching on these areas.
Forbes has said that she would use her private beliefs to guide her votes. At which point her private beliefs become public beliefs.
But it’s a shame nonetheless.
It's kids I most feel sorry for if this is true.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Park,_Ilford
I'd say that that is another one where the Govt need to decide how they are going to adjust their policies to account for the UK's changed situation, in terms of resilience etc. The opportunity and the need is there if they are serious about creating a future outside the EU single market.
I had a look round today - the supermarkets have a fair amount of fresh veg. The specialty shops around here - higher quality, more expensive produce - are stacked to the ceiling with veg.
Get a grip, man.
Jamie Vardy, your wife’s a grass.