OKC signing on, still from his hospital bed. Dictation is not easy on iPad! Delighted to see the poll; I don’t think it’ll be easy getting back, but I still hope we do so.
Yes, he wants to pay the Lithuanians and Romanians minimum wage, rather than pay Brits £2 or £3 more.
Nope
What’s more, with unemployment at a 40-year low of 3.4 per cent, it is ridiculous for ministers to insist that businesses can fill the 1.3 million vacancies by training domestic workers. All they can do is poach from other sectors, particularly the public sector, driving up wages and inflation and adding to the strain on public services.
LOL, if his solution is to throw modern slaves at the problem, rather than invest in automation and productivity improvements, then perhaps he’s in the wrong industry.
You're effectively arguing for a 20% rise across the entire economy for low paid individuals - which is at least an arguable point - but which, obviously, would do nothing to solve recruitment shortages.
But might incentivise capital investment to improve productivity. Employers should not be relying on the tax payer funded in-work benefits to run their businesses.
It might. Good luck with (for instance) keeping social care open in the meantime.
Long term solutions to immediate problems aren't effective policy. What Wolfson was suggesting (and you might decide that his 10% premium ought to be 20%, etc) is a short term solution to an immediate problem, and provides a similar incentive without the massive disruption.
He’s gone up from 7% then?
same pay as their UK colleagues and secondly, businesses must pay a percentage (say seven per cent) of overseas workers’ wages to the Government as a visa tax.
He has - that article is over a month old. But that's irrelevant, as it's government that would set any such rate, not Wolfson. The principle of the idea is sensible, and ought to be considered.
Again, the obsession with making rhetorical points about a given individual or company is a distraction.
The principle is not sensible, remotely. We don't need people coming over for minimum wage and getting welfare, so that firms can pay a small premium above minimum wage rather than a substantial wage people can live on...
Ministers are already approving work visas on an ad hoc basis for various sectors because of recruitment shortages. putting in place a system which doesn't rely on ministerial whom would be sensible.
What Wolfson does in his business is a matter for him, and of no interest to me.
Yes, he wants to pay the Lithuanians and Romanians minimum wage, rather than pay Brits £2 or £3 more.
Nope
What’s more, with unemployment at a 40-year low of 3.4 per cent, it is ridiculous for ministers to insist that businesses can fill the 1.3 million vacancies by training domestic workers. All they can do is poach from other sectors, particularly the public sector, driving up wages and inflation and adding to the strain on public services.
Why is driving up wages a bad thing?
Let uncompetitive businesses that can't survive by paying anything more than minimum wage go out of business.
Why should you be entitled to a minimum wage serf to serve you your grande, iced, sugar-free, vanilla latte with soy milk?
The point is that the EU is a superpower. Not militarily but in all other ways and we were at the very centre of this superpower. We walked away and replaced it with nothing because our position was irreplaceable. Like New York walking away from the United States.
If we do nothing we'll just go downhill watching the EU prosper. Whichever Party we have in power this is going to become apparent. The old people who voted Leave because they yearned for the Empire will be gone and they'll be replaced by those who remembered we were once at the very centre of this thriving economic and cutural Union. Far and away the best and most diverse in the world
In the words of Marlon Brando in On The Waterfront "You don’t understand! I coulda had class. I coulda been a contender, I could’ve been somebody, instead of a bum, which is what I am with a one way ticket to palookaville”
Yes. We lived under the pretence that we are Britain, a mega-power. We were, but haven't been for a while. And even the remaining genuine mega-powers know that today's world requires co-operation not a bulldog standing alone approach.
Spitting Image nailed it decades ago with their "Last Night of the Yobs" sketch, which included this:
Rule Britannia Britannia rules not much Less than the Spanish and the Belgians and the Dutch Rule Britannia Britannia's not so great Why can't we come out and admit it We're Tenth Rate
OK that is exaggerated satire. But there is a point there. We have worse infrastructure than most of our neighbours. Worst public services. Rampant inequality where so many of Europe's most deprived regions were in the UK. We can fix all that if we want to. But instead of people being horrified about a 2 year old boy dying from breathing in the mould in his Rochdale council house, the instinct of many is to question why his parents were here at all.
So much of the pro-European side of the debate seems to be based on what I think is a straw man - the belief from the pro-Europeans that anti-Europeans have this image of Britain as a superpower. We don't. We know exactly how big Britain is - about 20th biggest country in terms of population, about middle of the top ten in terms of economy, about 40th in terms of wealth per capita.* We know we're big enough to act as an independent country, but we're under no illusions that many in the west are rather more comfortably off. Indeed, it's that knowledge which drives the need for change and improvement: the awareness that where we were in the first 15 years of the century wasn't good enough and wasn't likely to get any better. And I'm under no illusion that Brexit is a magic bullet for this. There are dozens of things we need to do to become richer. Brexit simply strikes me as better than the alternative.
*We are not, though - and this is a bugbear of mine - 'a small island'. Great Britain is a huge island. One of the top ten biggest in the world, measured either by area or population.
The EU would have us back in a heartbeat. What better way of demonstrating the folly of trying to be outside than having an ex-member come crawling back begging for readmission?
But they would only have us back on their terms - Schengen and Euro being foremost among them - which would almost certainly be still totally unacceptable to the British electorate. Heck, those would be controversial enough in Scotland if it ever became independent, never mind England.
People should read this. The current polling may show people are unhappy with Brexit, but when people are asked what they do want it's not the EU. It's really worth having a look at, what people want is incompatible with EU and Single Market membership, and it's very unlikely to ever be offered. Cakeism is one way of describing it, we'd like all of the good bits and none of the bad. Hell if the EU offered that I'd bite their hand off, but that's not going to happen.
If that's how people really think I genuinely see no medium term prospect of us even rejoining the Single Market nevermind the whole EU.
An interesting survey. It demonstrates that people support policies but not the names of the policies. As an example, a third support rejoining the single market, but 65% support the alignment of product standards. So we can forge single market and customs union alignment without specifically joining them - the Swiss or Turkish approaches.
Yes, this has downsides. I anticipate the post saying this is an awful deal as EU trade deals are then one-sided. But that is our place now - supplicants. And the one thing that Team Truss managed to deliver was signing bilateral agreements to extend EU trade deals to the UK. So it can be done, and a majority now accept it must be done.
OKC signing on, still from his hospital bed. Dictation is not easy on iPad! Delighted to see the poll; I don’t think it’ll be easy getting back, but I still hope we do so.
Delighted you are making the effort, good to hear from you!
Yes, he wants to pay the Lithuanians and Romanians minimum wage, rather than pay Brits £2 or £3 more.
Nope
What’s more, with unemployment at a 40-year low of 3.4 per cent, it is ridiculous for ministers to insist that businesses can fill the 1.3 million vacancies by training domestic workers. All they can do is poach from other sectors, particularly the public sector, driving up wages and inflation and adding to the strain on public services.
LOL, if his solution is to throw modern slaves at the problem, rather than invest in automation and productivity improvements, then perhaps he’s in the wrong industry.
You're effectively arguing for a 20% rise across the entire economy for low paid individuals - which is at least an arguable point - but which, obviously, would do nothing to solve recruitment shortages.
But might incentivise capital investment to improve productivity. Employers should not be relying on the tax payer funded in-work benefits to run their businesses.
It might. Good luck with (for instance) keeping social care open in the meantime.
Long term solutions to immediate problems aren't effective policy. What Wolfson was suggesting (and you might decide that his 10% premium ought to be 20%, etc) is a short term solution to an immediate problem, and provides a similar incentive without the massive disruption.
He’s gone up from 7% then?
same pay as their UK colleagues and secondly, businesses must pay a percentage (say seven per cent) of overseas workers’ wages to the Government as a visa tax.
He has - that article is over a month old. But that's irrelevant, as it's government that would set any such rate, not Wolfson. The principle of the idea is sensible, and ought to be considered.
Again, the obsession with making rhetorical points about a given individual or company is a distraction.
The principle is not sensible, remotely. We don't need people coming over for minimum wage and getting welfare, so that firms can pay a small premium above minimum wage rather than a substantial wage people can live on...
Ministers are already approving work visas on an ad hoc basis for various sectors because of recruitment shortages. putting in place a system which doesn't rely on ministerial whom would be sensible.
What Wolfson does in his business is a matter for him, and of no interest to me.
You're right ideally there shouldn't be any such system for shortages, my preferred proposal would be making visas very easy from anywhere in the world (not just Europe) for anyone with a clean criminal record who would be paying the higher rate of taxation.
Wouldn't help Wolfson though, unless he starts paying far, far more to his staff.
Movement should be for skilled labour, not unskilled. For unskilled, let the market drive rates up and drive forward automation and wages to a market level.
From last night, on my lay of Kier Starmer at 1.5, I have no special insights or information.
My assessment is that Rishi will sour rapidly following this budget, particularly his polling, and the Right of the Conservative Party will go into revolt. Because that's what they do.
There was clearly a stronger constituency of support for Boris (100MPs+) than I'd thought before and it might only take another 70 or so MPs to become really desperate that they'll switch, VONC Rishi, and roll the dice on him again in 2024. Try him out again just before an election campaign. He can deliver some goodies in a giveaway/pre-election budget.
That means Kier would not be the next PM. I don't think his chances of being the next PM are as high as 66%. And there's probably some value in Boris because once all real alternatives to him have been tried I think they'll come back to him.
It is undemocratic and outrageous that the Conservative Party could again replace its leader and our Prime Minister outside of a general election. And the people who say that also said it just before Rishi replaced Truss and before Truss replaced Boris. As you say, there is still time for another leader or even two before the next general election must be held, in January 2025.
Yes, he wants to pay the Lithuanians and Romanians minimum wage, rather than pay Brits £2 or £3 more.
Nope
What’s more, with unemployment at a 40-year low of 3.4 per cent, it is ridiculous for ministers to insist that businesses can fill the 1.3 million vacancies by training domestic workers. All they can do is poach from other sectors, particularly the public sector, driving up wages and inflation and adding to the strain on public services.
LOL, if his solution is to throw modern slaves at the problem, rather than invest in automation and productivity improvements, then perhaps he’s in the wrong industry.
You're effectively arguing for a 20% rise across the entire economy for low paid individuals - which is at least an arguable point - but which, obviously, would do nothing to solve recruitment shortages.
But might incentivise capital investment to improve productivity. Employers should not be relying on the tax payer funded in-work benefits to run their businesses.
It might. Good luck with (for instance) keeping social care open in the meantime.
Long term solutions to immediate problems aren't effective policy. What Wolfson was suggesting (and you might decide that his 10% premium ought to be 20%, etc) is a short term solution to an immediate problem, and provides a similar incentive without the massive disruption.
He’s gone up from 7% then?
same pay as their UK colleagues and secondly, businesses must pay a percentage (say seven per cent) of overseas workers’ wages to the Government as a visa tax.
He has - that article is over a month old. But that's irrelevant, as it's government that would set any such rate, not Wolfson. The principle of the idea is sensible, and ought to be considered.
Again, the obsession with making rhetorical points about a given individual or company is a distraction.
The principle is not sensible, remotely. We don't need people coming over for minimum wage and getting welfare, so that firms can pay a small premium above minimum wage rather than a substantial wage people can live on...
Ministers are already approving work visas on an ad hoc basis for various sectors because of recruitment shortages. putting in place a system which doesn't rely on ministerial whom would be sensible.
What Wolfson does in his business is a matter for him, and of no interest to me.
You're right ideally there shouldn't be any such system for shortages, my preferred proposal would be making visas very easy from anywhere in the world (not just Europe) for anyone with a clean criminal record who would be paying the higher rate of taxation.
Wouldn't help Wolfson though, unless he starts paying far, far more to his staff.
Movement should be for skilled labour, not unskilled. For unskilled, let the market drive rates up and drive forward automation and wages to a market level.
Pretty soon everyone will be paying the top rate of tax!
An interesting survey. It demonstrates that people support policies but not the names of the policies. As an example, a third support rejoining the single market, but 65% support the alignment of product standards. So we can forge single market and customs union alignment without specifically joining them - the Swiss or Turkish approaches.
Yes, this has downsides. I anticipate the post saying this is an awful deal as EU trade deals are then one-sided. But that is our place now - supplicants. And the one thing that Team Truss managed to deliver was signing bilateral agreements to extend EU trade deals to the UK. So it can be done, and a majority now accept it must be done.
Alignment is probably the best we can hope for, but there is no way the British public would vote for being in the EU or Single Market today.
I've long thought the end point would be some sort of UK mirroring of most of what EFTA/EEA delivers. What will settle the issue is how flexible the EU and EFTA are willing to be. Would they accept an 80-90% of the EEA deal?
The EU would have us back in a heartbeat. What better way of demonstrating the folly of trying to be outside than having an ex-member come crawling back begging for readmission?
But they would only have us back on their terms - Schengen and Euro being foremost among them - which would almost certainly be still totally unacceptable to the British electorate. Heck, those would be controversial enough in Scotland if it ever became independent, never mind England.
People should read this. The current polling may show people are unhappy with Brexit, but when people are asked what they do want it's not the EU. It's really worth having a look at, what people want is incompatible with EU and Single Market membership, and it's very unlikely to ever be offered. Cakeism is one way of describing it, we'd like all of the good bits and none of the bad. Hell if the EU offered that I'd bite their hand off, but that's not going to happen.
If that's how people really think I genuinely see no medium term prospect of us even rejoining the Single Market nevermind the whole EU.
Top class cakeism indeed:
There is a growing political space to define a new type of relationship with the EU that works better and deepens bilateral relations – as long as it does not yet take the UK back into the European single market. Voters wish to see improvements on key aspects of economic, security and strategic cooperation with the EU, but most would support finding a closer yet unique association that caters to the UK’s interests.
The task of forging a better relationship with the EU will be left to a future Labour government. The data suggest that there is little political space for 2019 Conservatives to radically diverge from the type of Brexit policy they have pursued to date as the preferences of their voters appear to closely mirror those of 2016 Leave voters. However, a large majority of progressive voters and about a third of Leave voters would be in favour of improving the current relationship with the EU, offering an opportunity for Labour to call for a different approach to rebuilding a relationship with the EU.
Leaving the next Labour government holding the baby as the music stops. Time for 'thoroughgoing review of all options' to report after the following election.
The point is that the EU is a superpower. Not militarily but in all other ways and we were at the very centre of this superpower. We walked away and replaced it with nothing because our position was irreplaceable. Like New York walking away from the United States.
If we do nothing we'll just go downhill watching the EU prosper. Whichever Party we have in power this is going to become apparent. The old people who voted Leave because they yearned for the Empire will be gone and they'll be replaced by those who remembered we were once at the very centre of this thriving economic and cutural Union. Far and away the best and most diverse in the world
In the words of Marlon Brando in On The Waterfront "You don’t understand! I coulda had class. I coulda been a contender, I could’ve been somebody, instead of a bum, which is what I am with a one way ticket to palookaville”
Yes. We lived under the pretence that we are Britain, a mega-power. We were, but haven't been for a while. And even the remaining genuine mega-powers know that today's world requires co-operation not a bulldog standing alone approach.
Spitting Image nailed it decades ago with their "Last Night of the Yobs" sketch, which included this:
Rule Britannia Britannia rules not much Less than the Spanish and the Belgians and the Dutch Rule Britannia Britannia's not so great Why can't we come out and admit it We're Tenth Rate
OK that is exaggerated satire. But there is a point there. We have worse infrastructure than most of our neighbours. Worst public services. Rampant inequality where so many of Europe's most deprived regions were in the UK. We can fix all that if we want to. But instead of people being horrified about a 2 year old boy dying from breathing in the mould in his Rochdale council house, the instinct of many is to question why his parents were here at all.
So much of the pro-European side of the debate seems to be based on what I think is a straw man - the belief from the pro-Europeans that anti-Europeans have this image of Britain as a superpower. We don't. We know exactly how big Britain is - about 20th biggest country in terms of population, about middle of the top ten in terms of economy, about 40th in terms of wealth per capita.* We know we're big enough to act as an independent country, but we're under no illusions that many in the west are rather more comfortably off. Indeed, it's that knowledge which drives the need for change and improvement: the awareness that where we were in the first 15 years of the century wasn't good enough and wasn't likely to get any better. And I'm under no illusion that Brexit is a magic bullet for this. There are dozens of things we need to do to become richer. Brexit simply strikes me as better than the alternative.
*We are not, though - and this is a bugbear of mine - 'a small island'. Great Britain is a huge island. One of the top ten biggest in the world, measured either by area or population.
Question for you after that reasoned argument. If what you say is true, why did so many prominent leavers say the opposite? We held all the cards. Our market was so critical that the heads of BMW would force the EU to capitulate. We can just do what we want and other nations will obey. Lets go WTO where we just tell the world what they must do.
I am certain that many of the people making these absurd arguments really do feel as you said. But they did have illusions - and delusions. Confusions. Every kind of usion. Utterly deluded about reality. And the "bulldog spirit" with "Britain standing alone" like we did in 1940. We stood on the brink of annihilation in 1940. Volunteering to go back to standing alone was deeply irrational.
Yes, he wants to pay the Lithuanians and Romanians minimum wage, rather than pay Brits £2 or £3 more.
Nope
What’s more, with unemployment at a 40-year low of 3.4 per cent, it is ridiculous for ministers to insist that businesses can fill the 1.3 million vacancies by training domestic workers. All they can do is poach from other sectors, particularly the public sector, driving up wages and inflation and adding to the strain on public services.
LOL, if his solution is to throw modern slaves at the problem, rather than invest in automation and productivity improvements, then perhaps he’s in the wrong industry.
You're effectively arguing for a 20% rise across the entire economy for low paid individuals - which is at least an arguable point - but which, obviously, would do nothing to solve recruitment shortages.
But might incentivise capital investment to improve productivity. Employers should not be relying on the tax payer funded in-work benefits to run their businesses.
It might. Good luck with (for instance) keeping social care open in the meantime.
Long term solutions to immediate problems aren't effective policy. What Wolfson was suggesting (and you might decide that his 10% premium ought to be 20%, etc) is a short term solution to an immediate problem, and provides a similar incentive without the massive disruption.
He’s gone up from 7% then?
same pay as their UK colleagues and secondly, businesses must pay a percentage (say seven per cent) of overseas workers’ wages to the Government as a visa tax.
He has - that article is over a month old. But that's irrelevant, as it's government that would set any such rate, not Wolfson. The principle of the idea is sensible, and ought to be considered.
Again, the obsession with making rhetorical points about a given individual or company is a distraction.
The principle is not sensible, remotely. We don't need people coming over for minimum wage and getting welfare, so that firms can pay a small premium above minimum wage rather than a substantial wage people can live on...
Ministers are already approving work visas on an ad hoc basis for various sectors because of recruitment shortages. putting in place a system which doesn't rely on ministerial whom would be sensible.
What Wolfson does in his business is a matter for him, and of no interest to me.
You're right ideally there shouldn't be any such system for shortages, my preferred proposal would be making visas very easy from anywhere in the world (not just Europe) for anyone with a clean criminal record who would be paying the higher rate of taxation.
Wouldn't help Wolfson though, unless he starts paying far, far more to his staff.
Movement should be for skilled labour, not unskilled. For unskilled, let the market drive rates up and drive forward automation and wages to a market level.
Pretty soon everyone will be paying the top rate of tax!
From last night, on my lay of Kier Starmer at 1.5, I have no special insights or information.
My assessment is that Rishi will sour rapidly following this budget, particularly his polling, and the Right of the Conservative Party will go into revolt. Because that's what they do.
There was clearly a stronger constituency of support for Boris (100MPs+) than I'd thought before and it might only take another 70 or so MPs to become really desperate that they'll switch, VONC Rishi, and roll the dice on him again in 2024. Try him out again just before an election campaign. He can deliver some goodies in a giveaway/pre-election budget.
That means Kier would not be the next PM. I don't think his chances of being the next PM are as high as 66%. And there's probably some value in Boris because once all real alternatives to him have been tried I think they'll come back to him.
It is undemocratic and outrageous that the Conservative Party could again replace its leader and our Prime Minister outside of a general election. And the people who say that also said it just before Rishi replaced Truss and before Truss replaced Boris. As you say, there is still time for another leader or even two before the next general election must be held, in January 2025.
Frankly I just do not see Rishi being removed before the next GE
Indeed both Rishi and Hunt are their best hope of mitigating the 2024 GE result
There's no chance of rejoining. The only faint chance would be if the current split between France and Germany widened and they needed a referee. Not going to happen. The EU is a conglomeration of vastly different countries trying to unite under a single voice. Look at Italy and Hungary as an example.
If only they'd stayed as an economic forum and not ventured into politics.
The point is that the EU is a superpower. Not militarily but in all other ways and we were at the very centre of this superpower. We walked away and replaced it with nothing because our position was irreplaceable. Like New York walking away from the United States.
If we do nothing we'll just go downhill watching the EU prosper. Whichever Party we have in power this is going to become apparent. The old people who voted Leave because they yearned for the Empire will be gone and they'll be replaced by those who remembered we were once at the very centre of this thriving economic and cutural Union. Far and away the best and most diverse in the world
In the words of Marlon Brando in On The Waterfront "You don’t understand! I coulda had class. I coulda been a contender, I could’ve been somebody, instead of a bum, which is what I am with a one way ticket to palookaville”
Trouble is Roger those looking for Empire were boomers of my age and a little older who never knew Empire anyway.
The Road to Damascus's very own @williamglenn asserted on here yesterday that Rejoiners should be selling the benefits of the EU rather than carping on at the woes of Brexit. Not even "enthusiastic" Remainers like me were particularly enamoured with the EU, we just knew the alternative would be far worse. And Leave didn't propose a truthful positive view of Brexit in 2016, they just said the EU was corrupt and we (Brexiteers like Farage and Johnson) are a Sovereign British anti- corruption alliance, "it'll be great, we are just not sure what "it" is yet".
I don't believe the EU should entertain having us back under any circumstances that are not an arm's length arrangement. We don't deserve to be back in the tent, so I for one will be voting to remain out.
The point is that the EU is a superpower. Not militarily but in all other ways and we were at the very centre of this superpower. We walked away and replaced it with nothing because our position was irreplaceable. Like New York walking away from the United States.
If we do nothing we'll just go downhill watching the EU prosper. Whichever Party we have in power this is going to become apparent. The old people who voted Leave because they yearned for the Empire will be gone and they'll be replaced by those who remembered we were once at the very centre of this thriving economic and cutural Union. Far and away the best and most diverse in the world
In the words of Marlon Brando in On The Waterfront "You don’t understand! I coulda had class. I coulda been a contender, I could’ve been somebody, instead of a bum, which is what I am with a one way ticket to palookaville”
Yes. We lived under the pretence that we are Britain, a mega-power. We were, but haven't been for a while. And even the remaining genuine mega-powers know that today's world requires co-operation not a bulldog standing alone approach.
Spitting Image nailed it decades ago with their "Last Night of the Yobs" sketch, which included this:
Rule Britannia Britannia rules not much Less than the Spanish and the Belgians and the Dutch Rule Britannia Britannia's not so great Why can't we come out and admit it We're Tenth Rate
OK that is exaggerated satire. But there is a point there. We have worse infrastructure than most of our neighbours. Worst public services. Rampant inequality where so many of Europe's most deprived regions were in the UK. We can fix all that if we want to. But instead of people being horrified about a 2 year old boy dying from breathing in the mould in his Rochdale council house, the instinct of many is to question why his parents were here at all.
So much of the pro-European side of the debate seems to be based on what I think is a straw man - the belief from the pro-Europeans that anti-Europeans have this image of Britain as a superpower. We don't. We know exactly how big Britain is - about 20th biggest country in terms of population, about middle of the top ten in terms of economy, about 40th in terms of wealth per capita.* We know we're big enough to act as an independent country, but we're under no illusions that many in the west are rather more comfortably off. Indeed, it's that knowledge which drives the need for change and improvement: the awareness that where we were in the first 15 years of the century wasn't good enough and wasn't likely to get any better. And I'm under no illusion that Brexit is a magic bullet for this. There are dozens of things we need to do to become richer. Brexit simply strikes me as better than the alternative.
*We are not, though - and this is a bugbear of mine - 'a small island'. Great Britain is a huge island. One of the top ten biggest in the world, measured either by area or population.
Question for you after that reasoned argument. If what you say is true, why did so many prominent leavers say the opposite? We held all the cards. Our market was so critical that the heads of BMW would force the EU to capitulate. We can just do what we want and other nations will obey. Lets go WTO where we just tell the world what they must do.
I am certain that many of the people making these absurd arguments really do feel as you said. But they did have illusions - and delusions. Confusions. Every kind of usion. Utterly deluded about reality. And the "bulldog spirit" with "Britain standing alone" like we did in 1940. We stood on the brink of annihilation in 1940. Volunteering to go back to standing alone was deeply irrational.
We do/did hold all the cards which is why when we were prepared to use them, Lord Frost was able to get us such a great deal. It didn't help that before then, Theresa May wasn't prepared to use them. It doesn't matter how many Aces you're dealt if you fold at the first bet.
German car manufacturers have been telling Germany to capitulate to Russia. The idea they'd have wanted a trade war with Britain, when they can't even cope with sanctions with Russia during a real war, was always preposterous bullshit.
A few weeks ago we were promised tax cuts as a reward for seeing our taxes going up for a decade to protect the vulnerable now our taxes are going up for the rest of decade to protect a parasitical pensioner class.
This is so unfair that workers are screwed to protect the Tory client vote.
When we are once again the sick man of Europe we will be begging to join.
Whether they will have us is another question, since we pissed away all the advantages we had that made us attractive in the first place.
If sickness is such a real prospect, why is unemployment lower in Britain than Europe, and why is wage growth in Britain much higher than in the Eurozone? 🤔
The only sickness is in your mind, where you've been driven completely mad by Brexit.
The point is that the EU is a superpower. Not militarily but in all other ways and we were at the very centre of this superpower. We walked away and replaced it with nothing because our position was irreplaceable. Like New York walking away from the United States.
If we do nothing we'll just go downhill watching the EU prosper. Whichever Party we have in power this is going to become apparent. The old people who voted Leave because they yearned for the Empire will be gone and they'll be replaced by those who remembered we were once at the very centre of this thriving economic and cutural Union. Far and away the best and most diverse in the world
In the words of Marlon Brando in On The Waterfront "You don’t understand! I coulda had class. I coulda been a contender, I could’ve been somebody, instead of a bum, which is what I am with a one way ticket to palookaville”
Yes. We lived under the pretence that we are Britain, a mega-power. We were, but haven't been for a while. And even the remaining genuine mega-powers know that today's world requires co-operation not a bulldog standing alone approach.
Spitting Image nailed it decades ago with their "Last Night of the Yobs" sketch, which included this:
Rule Britannia Britannia rules not much Less than the Spanish and the Belgians and the Dutch Rule Britannia Britannia's not so great Why can't we come out and admit it We're Tenth Rate
OK that is exaggerated satire. But there is a point there. We have worse infrastructure than most of our neighbours. Worst public services. Rampant inequality where so many of Europe's most deprived regions were in the UK. We can fix all that if we want to. But instead of people being horrified about a 2 year old boy dying from breathing in the mould in his Rochdale council house, the instinct of many is to question why his parents were here at all.
So much of the pro-European side of the debate seems to be based on what I think is a straw man - the belief from the pro-Europeans that anti-Europeans have this image of Britain as a superpower. We don't. We know exactly how big Britain is - about 20th biggest country in terms of population, about middle of the top ten in terms of economy, about 40th in terms of wealth per capita.* We know we're big enough to act as an independent country, but we're under no illusions that many in the west are rather more comfortably off. Indeed, it's that knowledge which drives the need for change and improvement: the awareness that where we were in the first 15 years of the century wasn't good enough and wasn't likely to get any better. And I'm under no illusion that Brexit is a magic bullet for this. There are dozens of things we need to do to become richer. Brexit simply strikes me as better than the alternative.
*We are not, though - and this is a bugbear of mine - 'a small island'. Great Britain is a huge island. One of the top ten biggest in the world, measured either by area or population.
Question for you after that reasoned argument. If what you say is true, why did so many prominent leavers say the opposite? We held all the cards. Our market was so critical that the heads of BMW would force the EU to capitulate. We can just do what we want and other nations will obey. Lets go WTO where we just tell the world what they must do.
I am certain that many of the people making these absurd arguments really do feel as you said. But they did have illusions - and delusions. Confusions. Every kind of usion. Utterly deluded about reality. And the "bulldog spirit" with "Britain standing alone" like we did in 1940. We stood on the brink of annihilation in 1940. Volunteering to go back to standing alone was deeply irrational.
We do/did hold all the cards which is why when we were prepared to use them, Lord Frost was able to get us such a great deal. It didn't help that before then, Theresa May wasn't prepared to use them. It doesn't matter how many Aces you're dealt if you fold at the first bet.
German car manufacturers have been telling Germany to capitulate to Russia. The idea they'd have wanted a trade war with Britain, when they can't even cope with sanctions with Russia during a real war, was always preposterous bullshit.
Interest in the WC will rapidly increase if and when England start winning games.
Good morning
I have to say playing Iran next week in Qatar is just wrong and is a terrible first game for Engand and the optics of the competition
Just because Iran have announced they plan to murder 18,000 people for the crime of rebelling against religious zealotry doesn't mean we shouldn't play football with them. As those wise folk at FIFA have angrily said, football has nothing to do with politics. And money presumably. Hence the perfectly rational decision to host the World Cup in a tiny rich dictatorship with no history of playing football at any serious level.
The point is that the EU is a superpower. Not militarily but in all other ways and we were at the very centre of this superpower. We walked away and replaced it with nothing because our position was irreplaceable. Like New York walking away from the United States.
If we do nothing we'll just go downhill watching the EU prosper. Whichever Party we have in power this is going to become apparent. The old people who voted Leave because they yearned for the Empire will be gone and they'll be replaced by those who remembered we were once at the very centre of this thriving economic and cutural Union. Far and away the best and most diverse in the world
In the words of Marlon Brando in On The Waterfront "You don’t understand! I coulda had class. I coulda been a contender, I could’ve been somebody, instead of a bum, which is what I am with a one way ticket to palookaville”
Yes. We lived under the pretence that we are Britain, a mega-power. We were, but haven't been for a while. And even the remaining genuine mega-powers know that today's world requires co-operation not a bulldog standing alone approach.
Spitting Image nailed it decades ago with their "Last Night of the Yobs" sketch, which included this:
Rule Britannia Britannia rules not much Less than the Spanish and the Belgians and the Dutch Rule Britannia Britannia's not so great Why can't we come out and admit it We're Tenth Rate
OK that is exaggerated satire. But there is a point there. We have worse infrastructure than most of our neighbours. Worst public services. Rampant inequality where so many of Europe's most deprived regions were in the UK. We can fix all that if we want to. But instead of people being horrified about a 2 year old boy dying from breathing in the mould in his Rochdale council house, the instinct of many is to question why his parents were here at all.
So much of the pro-European side of the debate seems to be based on what I think is a straw man - the belief from the pro-Europeans that anti-Europeans have this image of Britain as a superpower. We don't. We know exactly how big Britain is - about 20th biggest country in terms of population, about middle of the top ten in terms of economy, about 40th in terms of wealth per capita.* We know we're big enough to act as an independent country, but we're under no illusions that many in the west are rather more comfortably off. Indeed, it's that knowledge which drives the need for change and improvement: the awareness that where we were in the first 15 years of the century wasn't good enough and wasn't likely to get any better. And I'm under no illusion that Brexit is a magic bullet for this. There are dozens of things we need to do to become richer. Brexit simply strikes me as better than the alternative.
*We are not, though - and this is a bugbear of mine - 'a small island'. Great Britain is a huge island. One of the top ten biggest in the world, measured either by area or population.
Question for you after that reasoned argument. If what you say is true, why did so many prominent leavers say the opposite? We held all the cards. Our market was so critical that the heads of BMW would force the EU to capitulate. We can just do what we want and other nations will obey. Lets go WTO where we just tell the world what they must do.
I am certain that many of the people making these absurd arguments really do feel as you said. But they did have illusions - and delusions. Confusions. Every kind of usion. Utterly deluded about reality. And the "bulldog spirit" with "Britain standing alone" like we did in 1940. We stood on the brink of annihilation in 1940. Volunteering to go back to standing alone was deeply irrational.
We do/did hold all the cards which is why when we were prepared to use them, Lord Frost was able to get us such a great deal. It didn't help that before then, Theresa May wasn't prepared to use them. It doesn't matter how many Aces you're dealt if you fold at the first bet.
German car manufacturers have been telling Germany to capitulate to Russia. The idea they'd have wanted a trade war with Britain, when they can't even cope with sanctions with Russia during a real war, was always preposterous bullshit.
A few weeks ago we were promised tax cuts as a reward for seeing our taxes going up for a decade to protect the vulnerable now our taxes are going up for the rest of decade to protect a parasitical pensioner class.
This is so unfair that workers are screwed to protect the Tory client vote.
Didn’t you vote for Sunak, and describe Truss’s plans as reckless?
The point is that the EU is a superpower. Not militarily but in all other ways and we were at the very centre of this superpower. We walked away and replaced it with nothing because our position was irreplaceable. Like New York walking away from the United States.
If we do nothing we'll just go downhill watching the EU prosper. Whichever Party we have in power this is going to become apparent. The old people who voted Leave because they yearned for the Empire will be gone and they'll be replaced by those who remembered we were once at the very centre of this thriving economic and cutural Union. Far and away the best and most diverse in the world
In the words of Marlon Brando in On The Waterfront "You don’t understand! I coulda had class. I coulda been a contender, I could’ve been somebody, instead of a bum, which is what I am with a one way ticket to palookaville”
Yes. We lived under the pretence that we are Britain, a mega-power. We were, but haven't been for a while. And even the remaining genuine mega-powers know that today's world requires co-operation not a bulldog standing alone approach.
Spitting Image nailed it decades ago with their "Last Night of the Yobs" sketch, which included this:
Rule Britannia Britannia rules not much Less than the Spanish and the Belgians and the Dutch Rule Britannia Britannia's not so great Why can't we come out and admit it We're Tenth Rate
OK that is exaggerated satire. But there is a point there. We have worse infrastructure than most of our neighbours. Worst public services. Rampant inequality where so many of Europe's most deprived regions were in the UK. We can fix all that if we want to. But instead of people being horrified about a 2 year old boy dying from breathing in the mould in his Rochdale council house, the instinct of many is to question why his parents were here at all.
So much of the pro-European side of the debate seems to be based on what I think is a straw man - the belief from the pro-Europeans that anti-Europeans have this image of Britain as a superpower. We don't. We know exactly how big Britain is - about 20th biggest country in terms of population, about middle of the top ten in terms of economy, about 40th in terms of wealth per capita.* We know we're big enough to act as an independent country, but we're under no illusions that many in the west are rather more comfortably off. Indeed, it's that knowledge which drives the need for change and improvement: the awareness that where we were in the first 15 years of the century wasn't good enough and wasn't likely to get any better. And I'm under no illusion that Brexit is a magic bullet for this. There are dozens of things we need to do to become richer. Brexit simply strikes me as better than the alternative.
*We are not, though - and this is a bugbear of mine - 'a small island'. Great Britain is a huge island. One of the top ten biggest in the world, measured either by area or population.
Question for you after that reasoned argument. If what you say is true, why did so many prominent leavers say the opposite? We held all the cards. Our market was so critical that the heads of BMW would force the EU to capitulate. We can just do what we want and other nations will obey. Lets go WTO where we just tell the world what they must do.
I am certain that many of the people making these absurd arguments really do feel as you said. But they did have illusions - and delusions. Confusions. Every kind of usion. Utterly deluded about reality. And the "bulldog spirit" with "Britain standing alone" like we did in 1940. We stood on the brink of annihilation in 1940. Volunteering to go back to standing alone was deeply irrational.
We do/did hold all the cards which is why when we were prepared to use them, Lord Frost was able to get us such a great deal. It didn't help that before then, Theresa May wasn't prepared to use them. It doesn't matter how many Aces you're dealt if you fold at the first bet.
German car manufacturers have been telling Germany to capitulate to Russia. The idea they'd have wanted a trade war with Britain, when they can't even cope with sanctions with Russia during a real war, was always preposterous bullshit.
The more you repeat this, the funnier it is.
It's just a Russian troll, always pushing the line that Britain's true enemy is Germany.
Numbers given to 1 decimal place for subsamples that could be as many as 10-20 respondents because New Hampshire is helluva White.
2019 figures have 1.8% of New Hampshire population as Black. What's the claimed sample size on Trafalgar polls?
My own personal view is that I suspect (but of course I concede I may be completely wrong, and unreservedly apologise should that be so, if Mr Cahaley's lawyers are reading PB) the Trafalgar sample size may well be just one rather smug man in a bow tie.
Interest in the WC will rapidly increase if and when England start winning games.
Good morning
I have to say playing Iran next week in Qatar is just wrong and is a terrible first game for Engand and the optics of the competition
I'm hoping to resist the temptation to watch, but I do hope that we stuff the Iranians by a wide margin.
Iran aren't even that crap any more. FIFA rank 20.
I saw them get fucked by Mexico in the 2006 WC and they were utterly shit then but the Persian Premier League has really improved the domestic Iranian football scene.
Brexit is dying on its arse. Imagine the swing against it by next GE.
I don't expect a major party in England to campaign on Rejoin at GE 2024, but I can see a strong backlash against the party that gave us the shit sandwich in the first place.
Revenge will be a dish served cold when umpteen Brexity Tories get their P45.
The shit sandwich of full employment and the highest pay rises for decades ?
Now perhaps the libertarian, globalist variety of Leaver is disappointed but then its up to them to make those aspects work. And that involves hard work not babbling about 'lucrative trade deals'.
But from Boston to Barnsley the working class Leavers got what they were promised, even the extra spending on the NHS.
Not sure if this horseshit is serious?!
Perhaps you don't like the reality but the UK currently does have full employment and the highest pay rises for decades.
Yes, he wants to pay the Lithuanians and Romanians minimum wage, rather than pay Brits £2 or £3 more.
Nope
What’s more, with unemployment at a 40-year low of 3.4 per cent, it is ridiculous for ministers to insist that businesses can fill the 1.3 million vacancies by training domestic workers. All they can do is poach from other sectors, particularly the public sector, driving up wages and inflation and adding to the strain on public services.
Why is driving up wages a bad thing?
Let uncompetitive businesses that can't survive by paying anything more than minimum wage go out of business.
Why should you be entitled to a minimum wage serf to serve you your grande, iced, sugar-free, vanilla latte with soy milk?
The people who bewail pay rises for the low paid do not have the same concern for rising house prices.
Yes, he wants to pay the Lithuanians and Romanians minimum wage, rather than pay Brits £2 or £3 more.
Nope
What’s more, with unemployment at a 40-year low of 3.4 per cent, it is ridiculous for ministers to insist that businesses can fill the 1.3 million vacancies by training domestic workers. All they can do is poach from other sectors, particularly the public sector, driving up wages and inflation and adding to the strain on public services.
Why is driving up wages a bad thing?
Let uncompetitive businesses that can't survive by paying anything more than minimum wage go out of business.
Why should you be entitled to a minimum wage serf to serve you your grande, iced, sugar-free, vanilla latte with soy milk?
The people who bewail pay rises for the low paid do not have the same concern for rising house prices.
And an increasing cost of labour is an incentive for organisations to increase their productivity by investing in equipment, new technology and training.
The process which has always been behind the growth in the economy and prosperity for centuries.
What we are seeing is the fundamental difference between those who want a rentier country of low wages and higher property values where income comes from ownership compared with those who want a productive country of high wages and lower property values where income comes from work.
Comments
What Wolfson does in his business is a matter for him, and of no interest to me.
Let uncompetitive businesses that can't survive by paying anything more than minimum wage go out of business.
Why should you be entitled to a minimum wage serf to serve you your grande, iced, sugar-free, vanilla latte with soy milk?
And I'm under no illusion that Brexit is a magic bullet for this. There are dozens of things we need to do to become richer. Brexit simply strikes me as better than the alternative.
*We are not, though - and this is a bugbear of mine - 'a small island'. Great Britain is a huge island. One of the top ten biggest in the world, measured either by area or population.
Yes, this has downsides. I anticipate the post saying this is an awful deal as EU trade deals are then one-sided. But that is our place now - supplicants. And the one thing that Team Truss managed to deliver was signing bilateral agreements to extend EU trade deals to the UK. So it can be done, and a majority now accept it must be done.
Wouldn't help Wolfson though, unless he starts paying far, far more to his staff.
Movement should be for skilled labour, not unskilled. For unskilled, let the market drive rates up and drive forward automation and wages to a market level.
I have to say playing Iran next week in Qatar is just wrong and is a terrible first game for Engand and the optics of the competition
Actually, no wait, this is my favourite crosstab
Numbers given to 1 decimal place for subsamples that could be as many as 10-20 respondents because New Hampshire is helluva White.
I've long thought the end point would be some sort of UK mirroring of most of what EFTA/EEA delivers. What will settle the issue is how flexible the EU and EFTA are willing to be. Would they accept an 80-90% of the EEA deal?
There is a growing political space to define a new type of relationship with the EU that works better and deepens bilateral relations – as long as it does not yet take the UK back into the European single market. Voters wish to see improvements on key aspects of economic, security and strategic cooperation with the EU, but most would support finding a closer yet unique association that caters to the UK’s interests.
The task of forging a better relationship with the EU will be left to a future Labour government. The data suggest that there is little political space for 2019 Conservatives to radically diverge from the type of Brexit policy they have pursued to date as the preferences of their voters appear to closely mirror those of 2016 Leave voters. However, a large majority of progressive voters and about a third of Leave voters would be in favour of improving the current relationship with the EU, offering an opportunity for Labour to call for a different approach to rebuilding a relationship with the EU.
Leaving the next Labour government holding the baby as the music stops. Time for 'thoroughgoing review of all options' to report after the following election.
I am certain that many of the people making these absurd arguments really do feel as you said. But they did have illusions - and delusions. Confusions. Every kind of usion. Utterly deluded about reality. And the "bulldog spirit" with "Britain standing alone" like we did in 1940. We stood on the brink of annihilation in 1940. Volunteering to go back to standing alone was deeply irrational.
Whether they will have us is another question, since we pissed away all the advantages we had that made us attractive in the first place.
Indeed both Rishi and Hunt are their best hope of mitigating the 2024 GE result
If only they'd stayed as an economic forum and not ventured into politics.
The Road to Damascus's very own @williamglenn asserted on here yesterday that Rejoiners should be selling the benefits of the EU rather than carping on at the woes of Brexit. Not even "enthusiastic" Remainers like me were particularly enamoured with the EU, we just knew the alternative would be far worse. And Leave didn't propose a truthful positive view of Brexit in 2016, they just said the EU was corrupt and we (Brexiteers like Farage and Johnson) are a Sovereign British anti- corruption alliance, "it'll be great, we are just not sure what "it" is yet".
I don't believe the EU should entertain having us back under any circumstances that are not an arm's length arrangement. We don't deserve to be back in the tent, so I for one will be voting to remain out.
German car manufacturers have been telling Germany to capitulate to Russia. The idea they'd have wanted a trade war with Britain, when they can't even cope with sanctions with Russia during a real war, was always preposterous bullshit.
A few weeks ago we were promised tax cuts as a reward for seeing our taxes going up for a decade to protect the vulnerable now our taxes are going up for the rest of decade to protect a parasitical pensioner class.
This is so unfair that workers are screwed to protect the Tory client vote.
The only sickness is in your mind, where you've been driven completely mad by Brexit.
NEW THREAD
Fuckers.
Very likely those odds will move in a profitable direction over the next few months.
If not, I expect to be able to trade out for a small loss.
Value bet, imo.
The Tory party ain’t a happy party and the autumn statement could well be the trigger.
I saw them get fucked by Mexico in the 2006 WC and they were utterly shit then but the Persian Premier League has really improved the domestic Iranian football scene.
The process which has always been behind the growth in the economy and prosperity for centuries.
What we are seeing is the fundamental difference between those who want a rentier country of low wages and higher property values where income comes from ownership compared with those who want a productive country of high wages and lower property values where income comes from work.