It seems to me that there could be good reasons to keep such a leak secret. It would be an opportunity to transfer false information, for example. There may be assets which the Russians know about but would sweep up when the leak was discovered who might be given some sort of a chance to run.
But it is also significant that this leak seems to have been on a private phone. If there was top secret material on a private phone Truss would have been guilty of what Braverman resigned for. The blazing row that allegedly took place between her and Truss comes back to mind: sacking her for something that Braverman knew Truss had been equally guilty of would cause rancor. And given leaky Sue's reputation is this why the story is public now?
Is this the same story that was going round in the Baltics in the spring? Not sure a UK specific press blackout really fools the Russians but the establishment has to establishment I guess......
the 250/1 missed bet angle is an aside and only worth a footnote ( you pay your money and take your chances especially in political betting ) but this is a really serious story especially given the danger the world faces with the Russia/Ukraine dispute. This is so serious there surely has to be a criminal investigation regarding the Official Secrets Act. I am sure recklessly handling top secret information is an offence even if not deliberately leaking it, as is covering up such leaks. Why are the current crop of top politicians so ignorant of these rules ? Is it that they were promoted too quickly and lost the sense of importance of these roles and that its not the individual in these roles that is important but the role itself?
Having done IT security stuff it's never easy to get higher-ups to follow the security rules. The problem is that they tend to be quite petty and bureaucratic-seeming, and they really get in the way of getting actual immediate work done.
The situation here is that it's not really possible to secure someone's Android phone or iPhone against an attacker with a sufficient budget, because with enough money you can buy exploits that nobody else yet even knows about. The normal solution is to compartmentalize, so they'd use one phone for stuff that doesn't need to be very secure and a different device for stuff that does. But compartmentalization is really hard to apply in practice, especially when the user is dealing with the same people for different purposes, and they have to remember to use this device to ask about the party and this other device to talk about the urgent issue they're going to have a meeting about before they go to the party.
I'm sure it doesn't help that Brexit and the general state of the Conservative Party has selected for con artists and dim-wits and they've literally kicked the other people out of the party, but the fundamental problem of securing communications without destroying productivity is genuinely hard.
so why allow them personal phones in these roles? Personal sacrifice is needed in these roles and this should be one of them- Obama never was allowed on when President (as he referenced on Bear Grylls show that he did with him)
If you don't allow them personal phones they'll do all their personal stuff on the work phone and you're back where you started.
Alternatively if you're going to lock down the work phone to the point where they can't use Whats App, and you can somehow force them to accept this despite the fact that they're nominally in charge of you not the other way around, they'll be instantly out-plotted and you'll have to start again with a new minister.
I am sure private matters can be conveyed through PA's, personal staff etc . i think denial of access to WhatsApp etc is a small price to pay to ensure national security and one that any serious high office holder would accept - Any high office holder must realise they are not important anymore, its the job .
If you ban the sale of contraception, the only legal route left to women is withholding sex. Not sure this is the vote winner he thinks it is.
That’s the next thing they’ll ban. Have you read the Handmaids Tale?
You know that’s fiction, right? I think too many seem to think it’s a bloody documentary.
It’s the ones who think it’s a manifesto that we need to worry about.
You mean the loons and fruitcakes? Every society has them. We do too. They are not in power.
Look up thread.
Do you really believe that a law to ban contraceptives will be enacted in the USA? Really? I think the U.K. rejoining the full fat EU more likely.
Do you really believe that the President of the US would encourage a violent mob to storm Congress? That once seemed utterly implausible, yet it then happened.
I’ll give you that one, but note that it failed and law and order won. To go back to my suggestion, I think the U.K. rejoining the full fat EU is more likely than a ban on contraception in the USA. I made no mention of marital rape.
I think a law to ban in at least one state is far from impossible within the next decade. And more likely than rejoining full membership of the EU in that timeframe. And we know there are at least three SC Justices who would vote to overturn Griswold - though for now I don’t think there would be more than four votes to do so. That could easily change under another Republican president.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Are you saying if you don't own your own business or work in "higher professional jobs" then that's failure?
Yes.
I see. Well, I'm sure "White British families" will be eager for more of your lessons. Any day now.
In New York they have a selective state school for the best and brightest. Despite considerable efforts, the number of Chinese students continues to rise. To the point that some quite liberal people want a cap on the number of Chinese students, to leave space for “other ethnic minorities”
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Are you saying if you don't own your own business or work in "higher professional jobs" then that's failure?
Yes.
I see. Well, I'm sure "White British families" will be eager for more of your lessons. Any day now.
They should be, not mine, the Hindu community that has gone from having nothing when arriving in the 60s and 70s to being the second highest earning religious group, the first non white PM and quite simply the backbone of the NHS. If people don't want to learn from that then more fool them.
Next time Andrew Sullivan is on the BBC telling us about left wing domination of US media, they might ask him about the Fox reaction to the Pelosi story. And the lack of interest of some of the 'liberal' media.
If you ban the sale of contraception, the only legal route left to women is withholding sex. Not sure this is the vote winner he thinks it is.
That’s the next thing they’ll ban. Have you read the Handmaids Tale?
You know that’s fiction, right? I think too many seem to think it’s a bloody documentary.
I don't think it's beyond the realms of possibility to see marital rape decriminalised. There doesn't seem to be any limit to their assault on women's rights.
I can understand male shitkickers wanting to take southern Murica back to the civilization stone age. What I don't understand is female shitkickers voting to enslave themselves to these neanderthals. What is in it for them?
Accounts from the US when I was there were of women registering for the midterms in record numbers
If you ban the sale of contraception, the only legal route left to women is withholding sex. Not sure this is the vote winner he thinks it is.
That’s the next thing they’ll ban. Have you read the Handmaids Tale?
You know that’s fiction, right? I think too many seem to think it’s a bloody documentary.
It’s the ones who think it’s a manifesto that we need to worry about.
You mean the loons and fruitcakes? Every society has them. We do too. They are not in power.
Look up thread.
Do you really believe that a law to ban contraceptives will be enacted in the USA? Really? I think the U.K. rejoining the full fat EU more likely.
Do you really believe that the President of the US would encourage a violent mob to storm Congress? That once seemed utterly implausible, yet it then happened.
I’ll give you that one, but note that it failed and law and order won. To go back to my suggestion, I think the U.K. rejoining the full fat EU is more likely than a ban on contraception in the USA. I made no mention of marital rape.
It’s good but irrelevant to the point that it failed. It was utterly implausible and then it happened.
I don’t think all contraception will be banned throughout the US either… but the morning after pill? Contraceptive methods that are partially abortifacient? In certain states?
Which is a long way from Gilead, which is my main point in all this. Maybe I’m wrong and in ten years most women in the US will be sterile and breeding women will be the privilidge of the elite. Or more realistically abortion will be banned, contraception banned and sex outside marriage illegal. I just don’t think it will happen. There are serious, religious, political nuts out there in the states, but the tide of human progress is against them. See also Iran right now.
The tide of human history depends a lot on the political hegemons of the day. If the US becomes a fundamentalist religious state it would be quite unsurprising to see that exported to much of the rest of the democratic world over a decade or two, leaving Northern Europe and the odd holdout elsewhere the exception rather the forerunners of history.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Are you saying if you don't own your own business or work in "higher professional jobs" then that's failure?
Yes.
I see. Well, I'm sure "White British families" will be eager for more of your lessons. Any day now.
They should be, not mine, the Hindu community that has gone from having nothing when arriving in the 60s and 70s to being the second highest earning religious group, the first non white PM and quite simply the backbone of the NHS. If people don't want to learn from that then more fool them.
Fuck knows how we managed as a country, 927-1960.
The cultural values that Hindus still live by that seemed to have been thrown away in the 50s and 60s to make way for welfarism.
the 250/1 missed bet angle is an aside and only worth a footnote ( you pay your money and take your chances especially in political betting ) but this is a really serious story especially given the danger the world faces with the Russia/Ukraine dispute. This is so serious there surely has to be a criminal investigation regarding the Official Secrets Act. I am sure recklessly handling top secret information is an offence even if not deliberately leaking it, as is covering up such leaks. Why are the current crop of top politicians so ignorant of these rules ? Is it that they were promoted too quickly and lost the sense of importance of these roles and that its not the individual in these roles that is important but the role itself?
Having done IT security stuff it's never easy to get higher-ups to follow the security rules. The problem is that they tend to be quite petty and bureaucratic-seeming, and they really get in the way of getting actual immediate work done.
The situation here is that it's not really possible to secure someone's Android phone or iPhone against an attacker with a sufficient budget, because with enough money you can buy exploits that nobody else yet even knows about. The normal solution is to compartmentalize, so they'd use one phone for stuff that doesn't need to be very secure and a different device for stuff that does. But compartmentalization is really hard to apply in practice, especially when the user is dealing with the same people for different purposes, and they have to remember to use this device to ask about the party and this other device to talk about the urgent issue they're going to have a meeting about before they go to the party.
I'm sure it doesn't help that Brexit and the general state of the Conservative Party has selected for con artists and dim-wits and they've literally kicked the other people out of the party, but the fundamental problem of securing communications without destroying productivity is genuinely hard.
so why allow them personal phones in these roles? Personal sacrifice is needed in these roles and this should be one of them- Obama never was allowed on when President (as he referenced on Bear Grylls show that he did with him)
If you don't allow them personal phones they'll do all their personal stuff on the work phone and you're back where you started.
Alternatively if you're going to lock down the work phone to the point where they can't use Whats App, and you can somehow force them to accept this despite the fact that they're nominally in charge of you not the other way around, they'll be instantly out-plotted and you'll have to start again with a new minister.
Give them burner phones like they do in The Wire.
I can picture Matt Hancock on the corner of the projects “Pandemic, got that pandemic right here”
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Are you saying if you don't own your own business or work in "higher professional jobs" then that's failure?
Yes.
I see. Well, I'm sure "White British families" will be eager for more of your lessons. Any day now.
They should be, not mine, the Hindu community that has gone from having nothing when arriving in the 60s and 70s to being the second highest earning religious group, the first non white PM and quite simply the backbone of the NHS. If people don't want to learn from that then more fool them.
Fuck knows how we managed as a country, 927-1960.
Well, for large periods of that time people were farmers or industrial labourers. You know, "failures".
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Are you saying if you don't own your own business or work in "higher professional jobs" then that's failure?
Yes.
I see. Well, I'm sure "White British families" will be eager for more of your lessons. Any day now.
While it’s always dangerous to generalise, especially when race is involved, providing children with the right environment to thrive, and expecting success are reasonable aspirations for any parents. Not everyone is up to university, and for some it would just pile on debt. But there are other great routes to success. My nephews were not academic, but are now extremely happy. One works in the family firm fabricating steel for construction, the other is a tree surgeon.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Are you saying if you don't own your own business or work in "higher professional jobs" then that's failure?
Yes.
LOL, if only everyone had Daddy to get them a plum job
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Welfarism, the state replacing the role of families in being a safety net. The drive to not fail in life diminishes when the state says it's no problem to fail. And our safety net is laughably generous. It's become a way of life for people who stack excuse upon excuse for why they can't work when the reality is that they don't want to.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
Oxford University's vice-chancellor has used the famous matriculation ceremonies to tell every new student that they must “hear the other side” of arguments and prepare to be offended https://twitter.com/ewansomerville/status/1586357756604317701
Dr James Orr, a Cambridge lecturer who helped organise the Scruton lecture series, said: “It is disheartening to discover that there are students at Oxford who believe that the physical presence of those who do not share their views affects their safety.”’
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Max is a dab hand at envy and bitterness, you should hear him on fatcat pensioners living the life of Riley on £10,000 a year.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Absolutely true of my Scots ancestors too, and also true of many other sub-sections of society that highly value education, entrepreneurs and family. That culture of self-improvement by work and study used to be quite a feature of working class British life, though never the only one.
It can be a rather suffocating and oppressive family environment, which is part of why it has declined. This decline is seen too in migrant communities as the generations descend.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
If you listened to some elderly Scottish folk the rot set in with Labour domination in the [edit] mid-1950s on. Not many Hindus about then.
Oxford University's vice-chancellor has used the famous matriculation ceremonies to tell every new student that they must “hear the other side” of arguments and prepare to be offended https://twitter.com/ewansomerville/status/1586357756604317701
Dr James Orr, a Cambridge lecturer who helped organise the Scruton lecture series, said: “It is disheartening to discover that there are students at Oxford who believe that the physical presence of those who do not share their views affects their safety.”’
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Welfarism, the state replacing the role of families in being a safety net. The drive to not fail in life diminishes when the state says it's no problem to fail. And our safety net is laughably generous. It's become a way of life for people who stack excuse upon excuse for why they can't work when the reality is that they don't want to.
Did you learn all that while you were getting these "generous" benefits then or are you just another pampered middle class twat that has been funded through Daddy's hard work and now thinks he knows it all and rubbishes people who have not had it handed to them on a plate.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
If you listened to some elderly Scottish folk the rot set in with Labour domination in the [edit] mid-1950s on. Not many Hindus about then.
Pretty sure we were included in the same category as blacks, dogs and Irish back then. Some parts of the UK probably still do.
Amanda Akass @amandaakass · 11m Labour says the alleged hack raises “serious security questions” which need urgent investigation. Lib Dems questioning why the details were not made public earlier. Tobias Elwood, Tory Chair of Defence Committee, tells Sky News Intelligence & Security Committee should investigate
Why were they not made public? Seriously do people expect the security services to give a running commentary on Russian espionage operations? There might even be a live investigation going on that some leaker has now compromised. Hell we might even inadvertantly be tipping off other would be adversaries about a new method of attack. People may not like it but there are many good reasons to keep such things quiet.
I'm mean, yes it's very serious, but the oppostion parties are saying some bloody stupid things in response.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
That is nonsense. Hindus are very much on the up because their cultural values give them an edge over the indigenous population but one is not incompatible with the other. In the 20 years we had kids at DHS we saw Hindus go from a tiny minority to a significant presence in the school. Their parents were completely up for sacrifices to ensure that their kids got a proper education. They are the doctors, lawyers and accountants of the next generation. Already they are disproportionately more professional and earn significantly more than the average.
The problem Scotland has is that there are not enough Hindus, or people who share those values, to carry the rest. And we have a government whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the Union and how unfair everything is.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
From 0.01% to 0.02%, growth.
Doubling. Beware exponentials. Within months all Scots will be Hindu.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Welfarism, the state replacing the role of families in being a safety net. The drive to not fail in life diminishes when the state says it's no problem to fail. And our safety net is laughably generous. It's become a way of life for people who stack excuse upon excuse for why they can't work when the reality is that they don't want to.
All those people in lower professional jobs and manual, shop, sales, customer service, and transport work are "failures" in your words. I guess why break your back just to be lumped into a one category of "failure" when you can have an easy life being a different category of "failure"?
If Hindus, generally speaking, perform well then instead of just going down the sociology route of blaming a vague and amorphous 'society' for the lack of prosperity of certain groups then, shockingly, questions might be asked about why Hindus can do well. Could... people and families be responsible for their own success and failures rather than victims of circumstance or inheriting privilege?
[For the avoidance of doubt, lots of people do get dealt shitty or fantastic hands and obviously it's easier to do well when you get the latter. But the idea personal agency or a broader culture are minor things is deeply unhealthy. Seeing people as flotsam buffeted by the waves of fate is not good.]
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Absolutely true of my Scots ancestors too, and also true of many other sub-sections of society that highly value education, entrepreneurs and family. That culture of self-improvement by work and study used to be quite a feature of working class British life, though never the only one.
It can be a rather suffocating and oppressive family environment, which is part of why it has declined. This decline is seen too in migrant communities as the generations descend.
Not a coincidence that Samuel Smiles, the auithor of Self-Help, came from a small Lothian burgh.
Calvinist Protestantism in its Scottish Presbyterian form, however, seems to have put particular emphasis on hard work and not wasting one's time on earth with idle dissipation.
But it's not as simple as that. There is an interesting interaction with poverty, too: Belfast RCs placed a high emphasis on education, partly to escape to decent lives elsewhere, and still seem to do so.
I suspect the same was true of RCs in the West Central belt of Scotland (where [edit] many were kept very much in inferior jobs by the Protestant-Unionist ascendancy).
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Hang on, I thought you were fundamentally disadvantaged due to structural and endemic racism in British society?
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Welfarism, the state replacing the role of families in being a safety net. The drive to not fail in life diminishes when the state says it's no problem to fail. And our safety net is laughably generous. It's become a way of life for people who stack excuse upon excuse for why they can't work when the reality is that they don't want to.
I can see why those tory party members thought you were "one of the good ones."
I don't wanna sound unduly combative, but you have lucked in to a ludicrously overpaid job which adds zero to society and takes relatively little in the way of skill and aptitude, it's the kind of thing all the least interesting people I knew at Oxford do. The lucking in - I wouldn't normally make this point but it is thoroughly relevant to your claims - is thanks to this country, bond trading being less of a thing on the subcontinent - and your signature posting style is to shit on the old and poor for not being old and poor enough. If that's Hindu values, I have a suggestion as to where you can put them.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
Perhaps the extreme nationalism of Hinduism as expressed in Modi’s India is reflected in the rise of the SNP? It’s all beginning to make sense!
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Welfarism, the state replacing the role of families in being a safety net. The drive to not fail in life diminishes when the state says it's no problem to fail. And our safety net is laughably generous. It's become a way of life for people who stack excuse upon excuse for why they can't work when the reality is that they don't want to.
That may be a factor but it seems to me just too glib. I think as a society we have switched our focus from opportunities to entitlements. Opportunities are just too hard work to take advantage for many. Welfare is still pretty awful to live on, it is existing rather than living. But the focus on rights given than things earned is seriously out of whack.
There's a total stigma in the MSM and amongst establishment politicians about the importance of the nuclear family in maximising the success of children, IMHO.
I think it's recognised things don't always work out that way (divorce, tragedy, sexuality and infertility) but children being raised by both biological parents in wedlock wherever possible?
There's oodles of evidence for the benefits of that.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
I certainly recognise that. My grandmothers were the eldest and youngest of large families. In both cases the eldest were sent out to work so the family could afford to educate the youngest. One was sent into service in WWI (to London, because the original plan of Glasgow was scotched when her grandmother read of a murder there, so that was ruled unsafe) and the youngest to Teacher Training College. She then became one of the first female car owners in the county to drive to her village school. Because of the significant camber on the roads her engineer brother told her to drive in the middle of the road - since there was little other motorised traffic in the day - a habit she found difficult to shake in succeeding decades. When I was growing up Scots liked to boast of having “the best education in the U.K.” - that’s long gone, and the rot set in well before the current administration.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Are you saying if you don't own your own business or work in "higher professional jobs" then that's failure?
Yes.
I see. Well, I'm sure "White British families" will be eager for more of your lessons. Any day now.
In New York they have a selective state school for the best and brightest. Despite considerable efforts, the number of Chinese students continues to rise. To the point that some quite liberal people want a cap on the number of Chinese students, to leave space for “other ethnic minorities”
My daughter recently passed her 11+ to attend a grammar school. It is over 30% English-as-a-second language and around 50% non-white. Trafford has its minorities, but the non-whites are massively overrepresented at grammar schools.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
That is nonsense. Hindus are very much on the up because their cultural values give them an edge over the indigenous population but one is not incompatible with the other. In the 20 years we had kids at DHS we saw Hindus go from a tiny minority to a significant presence in the school. Their parents were completely up for sacrifices to ensure that their kids got a proper education. They are the doctors, lawyers and accountants of the next generation. Already they are disproportionately more professional and earn significantly more than the average.
The problem Scotland has is that there are not enough Hindus, or people who share those values, to carry the rest. And we have a government whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the Union and how unfair everything is.
And we have Unionism whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the SNP and how unfair everything is.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
That is nonsense. Hindus are very much on the up because their cultural values give them an edge over the indigenous population but one is not incompatible with the other. In the 20 years we had kids at DHS we saw Hindus go from a tiny minority to a significant presence in the school. Their parents were completely up for sacrifices to ensure that their kids got a proper education. They are the doctors, lawyers and accountants of the next generation. Already they are disproportionately more professional and earn significantly more than the average.
The problem Scotland has is that there are not enough Hindus, or people who share those values, to carry the rest. And we have a government whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the Union and how unfair everything is.
You are doing the same thing that you condemn - blame the government for everything. A government that tries to support students more than the norm of the UKG settlement, within the limits of the devolution settlement.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
That is nonsense. Hindus are very much on the up because their cultural values give them an edge over the indigenous population but one is not incompatible with the other. In the 20 years we had kids at DHS we saw Hindus go from a tiny minority to a significant presence in the school. Their parents were completely up for sacrifices to ensure that their kids got a proper education. They are the doctors, lawyers and accountants of the next generation. Already they are disproportionately more professional and earn significantly more than the average.
The problem Scotland has is that there are not enough Hindus, or people who share those values, to carry the rest. And we have a government whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the Union and how unfair everything is.
Sorry, my bad. I need these things explaining to me over and over again because I'm just not Hindu enough. You have to understand that I have spent a significant portion of my working life living as a failure by having lowly administrative jobs, hauling palettes off lorries, serving coffees to successful people, and pints to other failures. Obviously if I'd had more Hinduism in my life things would have been different.
I was disturbed to read a comment from The Screaming Eagles on the last thread about a possible change of PM next May. Is The Oaf still planning a comeback? It is like one of those horror films when you think the Creature from the Black Lagoon is dead and then its blubbery form rises up again. Is this likely?
I was disturbed to read a comment from The Screaming Eagles on the last thread about a possible change of PM next May. Is The Oaf still planning a comeback? It is like one of those horror films when you think the Creature from the Black Lagoon is dead and then its blubbery form rises up again. Is this likely?
No, he’s done now.
The Tories got a sniff of what things might be like if he returned, and they won’t be going back there.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
That is nonsense. Hindus are very much on the up because their cultural values give them an edge over the indigenous population but one is not incompatible with the other. In the 20 years we had kids at DHS we saw Hindus go from a tiny minority to a significant presence in the school. Their parents were completely up for sacrifices to ensure that their kids got a proper education. They are the doctors, lawyers and accountants of the next generation. Already they are disproportionately more professional and earn significantly more than the average.
The problem Scotland has is that there are not enough Hindus, or people who share those values, to carry the rest. And we have a government whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the Union and how unfair everything is.
A government that tries to support students more than the norm of the UKG settlement, within the limits of the devolution settlement.
By giving middle class University students free tuition so fewer poor ones get in?
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
If you listened to some elderly Scottish folk the rot set in with Labour domination in the [edit] mid-1950s on. Not many Hindus about then.
Pretty sure we were included in the same category as blacks, dogs and Irish back then. Some parts of the UK probably still do.
Not enough for the question to arise that often one way or another, I suspect. (Unlike the Irish.) There were travelling clothes salesmen (retail) in the countryside and the Islands in the mid-C20 who came from the subcontinent but I have a feeling they might have been from Pakistan so probably not Hindu! There woulkd be specific links between Dundee in particular and India (in the old sense) because of the jute trade, but I don't know enough about that area.
I was disturbed to read a comment from The Screaming Eagles on the last thread about a possible change of PM next May. Is The Oaf still planning a comeback? It is like one of those horror films when you think the Creature from the Black Lagoon is dead and then its blubbery form rises up again. Is this likely?
No, he’s done now.
The Tories got a sniff of what things might be like if he returned, and they won’t be going back there.
Plus since last weekend it seems we already have yet another major scandal with his name attached looking at Mail front page.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Are you saying if you don't own your own business or work in "higher professional jobs" then that's failure?
Yes.
I see. Well, I'm sure "White British families" will be eager for more of your lessons. Any day now.
In New York they have a selective state school for the best and brightest. Despite considerable efforts, the number of Chinese students continues to rise. To the point that some quite liberal people want a cap on the number of Chinese students, to leave space for “other ethnic minorities”
My daughter recently passed her 11+ to attend a grammar school. It is over 30% English-as-a-second language and around 50% non-white. Trafford has its minorities, but the non-whites are massively overrepresented at grammar schools.
@MaxPB is right though. I'm from a WWC background (actually unemployed) but I went to Oxford and would say I have been successful in my professional life. Yes, I did all the studying etc but the biggest factor was the support - and proactiveness - of my parents to make sure I had a very decent education and to back me on what I did. But I can tell you from my experience that I was very much the exception.
The only point I would make is that this is something that has to come from the individuals themselves
Next time Andrew Sullivan is on the BBC telling us about left wing domination of US media, they might ask him about the Fox reaction to the Pelosi story. And the lack of interest of some of the 'liberal' media.
If you ban the sale of contraception, the only legal route left to women is withholding sex. Not sure this is the vote winner he thinks it is.
That’s the next thing they’ll ban. Have you read the Handmaids Tale?
You know that’s fiction, right? I think too many seem to think it’s a bloody documentary.
It’s the ones who think it’s a manifesto that we need to worry about.
You mean the loons and fruitcakes? Every society has them. We do too. They are not in power.
Look up thread.
Do you really believe that a law to ban contraceptives will be enacted in the USA? Really? I think the U.K. rejoining the full fat EU more likely.
Do you really believe that the President of the US would encourage a violent mob to storm Congress? That once seemed utterly implausible, yet it then happened.
I’ll give you that one, but note that it failed and law and order won. To go back to my suggestion, I think the U.K. rejoining the full fat EU is more likely than a ban on contraception in the USA. I made no mention of marital rape.
It’s good but irrelevant to the point that it failed. It was utterly implausible and then it happened.
I don’t think all contraception will be banned throughout the US either… but the morning after pill? Contraceptive methods that are partially abortifacient? In certain states?
Which is a long way from Gilead, which is my main point in all this. Maybe I’m wrong and in ten years most women in the US will be sterile and breeding women will be the privilidge of the elite. Or more realistically abortion will be banned, contraception banned and sex outside marriage illegal. I just don’t think it will happen. There are serious, religious, political nuts out there in the states, but the tide of human progress is against them. See also Iran right now.
The tide of human history depends a lot on the political hegemons of the day. If the US becomes a fundamentalist religious state it would be quite unsurprising to see that exported to much of the rest of the democratic world over a decade or two, leaving Northern Europe and the odd holdout elsewhere the exception rather the forerunners of history.
IF doing a lot of heavy lifting there.
Complacency usually involves ignoring unlikely but plausible negative outcomes. You are being complacent and assuming the status quo and recent history are more stable than they really are.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Are you saying if you don't own your own business or work in "higher professional jobs" then that's failure?
Yes.
I see. Well, I'm sure "White British families" will be eager for more of your lessons. Any day now.
In New York they have a selective state school for the best and brightest. Despite considerable efforts, the number of Chinese students continues to rise. To the point that some quite liberal people want a cap on the number of Chinese students, to leave space for “other ethnic minorities”
My daughter recently passed her 11+ to attend a grammar school. It is over 30% English-as-a-second language and around 50% non-white. Trafford has its minorities, but the non-whites are massively overrepresented at grammar schools.
Not just Hindus either.
There are a number of Hindus in my department, but also Muslims of African and Asian descent, Greeks, Poles, Italians, Sikhs, Chinese, Jews and even two WASPs.
Only one has truly working class background though, the rest all have middle class or professional parents. I think class advantage trumps ethnic background massively in England now.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Welfarism, the state replacing the role of families in being a safety net. The drive to not fail in life diminishes when the state says it's no problem to fail. And our safety net is laughably generous. It's become a way of life for people who stack excuse upon excuse for why they can't work when the reality is that they don't want to.
That may be a factor but it seems to me just too glib. I think as a society we have switched our focus from opportunities to entitlements. Opportunities are just too hard work to take advantage for many. Welfare is still pretty awful to live on, it is existing rather than living. But the focus on rights given than things earned is seriously out of whack.
Whilst I agree with the sentiment, there is a problem. We have millions of people who work very hard all the hours there are and yet don't have enough money to pay the bills.
What opportunity is there for people who are perpetually broke despite grafting harder than you or I?
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
It has long been a complaint of some SNP MSPs that Nicola Sturgeon does not turn up for internal group meetings as regularly as her predecessor, leading to accusations that she has become remote.
It’s a complaint that may be heard less in future after the party leader and some of her advisers seemed to be taken aback by Thursday’s rebellion over proposed gender reforms that culminated in a ministerial resignation and the SNP’s biggest internal revolt in 15 years.
Had Sturgeon attended Tuesday afternoon’s group meeting, she could have heard at first hand of the concerns of Ash Regan, among others, rather than profess surprise when her community safety minister later stood down, voicing fears for the safety of women and girl
I was disturbed to read a comment from The Screaming Eagles on the last thread about a possible change of PM next May. Is The Oaf still planning a comeback? It is like one of those horror films when you think the Creature from the Black Lagoon is dead and then its blubbery form rises up again. Is this likely?
If Sunak goes before the next election, which is unlikely, then Boris remains the likely replacement as PM. So TSE trying to push Sunak out needs to be aware of that.
If Sunak loses the next election and Johnson holds his seat he would also again be a contender
I was disturbed to read a comment from The Screaming Eagles on the last thread about a possible change of PM next May. Is The Oaf still planning a comeback? It is like one of those horror films when you think the Creature from the Black Lagoon is dead and then its blubbery form rises up again. Is this likely?
No, he’s done now.
The Tories got a sniff of what things might be like if he returned, and they won’t be going back there.
Plus since last weekend it seems we already have yet another major scandal with his name attached looking at Mail front page.
Pippa Crerar said on the politics show a couple of weeks back that if the clown ever got back to senior office there were further stories known to journalists that they’d get straight back onto.
Next time Andrew Sullivan is on the BBC telling us about left wing domination of US media, they might ask him about the Fox reaction to the Pelosi story. And the lack of interest of some of the 'liberal' media.
You may well discover there are *reasons* this story is being underplayed
What you mean is that the MAGA/right wing echo chamber has gone into overdrive to try to deflect blame from themselves, seizing on a couple of misreported and/or misrepresented “facts” in the initial aftermath (since debunked/withdrawn as inaccurate) to create a vast fantastical conspiracy which is a million miles from the highly likely and most obvious version of events.
Because when the obvious version of events doesn’t paint MAGA and its followers in a good light they have to create an alternative version (or several for when each one falls by the wayside).
I was disturbed to read a comment from The Screaming Eagles on the last thread about a possible change of PM next May. Is The Oaf still planning a comeback? It is like one of those horror films when you think the Creature from the Black Lagoon is dead and then its blubbery form rises up again. Is this likely?
No, he’s done now.
The Tories got a sniff of what things might be like if he returned, and they won’t be going back there.
Plus since last weekend it seems we already have yet another major scandal with his name attached looking at Mail front page.
Pippa Crerar said on the politics show a couple of weeks back that if the clown ever got back to senior office there were further stories known to journalists that they’d get straight back onto.
Possibly levers that were used last weekend.
Which shows exactly why Pippa Crerar is as unfit for her job as Johnson was. Journalists are there to discover things and report them, not to discover things and save them up for when they might tip politics in a particular direction.
Mental health providers are seeing an uptick in teens diagnosing themselves with mental illnesses — including rare disorders — after learning about the conditions online, particularly on TikTok. Some are embracing ineffective or inappropriate treatments.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
That is nonsense. Hindus are very much on the up because their cultural values give them an edge over the indigenous population but one is not incompatible with the other. In the 20 years we had kids at DHS we saw Hindus go from a tiny minority to a significant presence in the school. Their parents were completely up for sacrifices to ensure that their kids got a proper education. They are the doctors, lawyers and accountants of the next generation. Already they are disproportionately more professional and earn significantly more than the average.
The problem Scotland has is that there are not enough Hindus, or people who share those values, to carry the rest. And we have a government whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the Union and how unfair everything is.
You are doing the same thing that you condemn - blame the government for everything. A government that tries to support students more than the norm of the UKG settlement, within the limits of the devolution settlement.
No I absolutely am not. The government is not helping but this is a much wider problem that existed long before an SNP administration was ever contemplated. In my lifetime Scots have switched from admiring those that get on and make something of themselves to resenting them and wanting to tax them out of existence. That is not an SNP thing although they seem to have those values too.
And as for helping students more, well the SG funding is so poor that our Universities have become dependent upon foreign students and indeed English students to subsidise their education. Even then, the number of places are limited and becoming more so, closing the door to opportunity. We have utterly destroyed our college system replacing it with certificates for all, regardless of effort or attendance, the exact opposite of training people for the world of work. Our school standards have fallen so far against international standards the SG doesn't want to play anymore.
A Scottish education was something to be proud of in my youth, If you did well in it you had worked hard and applied yourself. Sadly, that is no longer the case and it is not equipping our next generation to create and develop the economy we need.
I was disturbed to read a comment from The Screaming Eagles on the last thread about a possible change of PM next May. Is The Oaf still planning a comeback? It is like one of those horror films when you think the Creature from the Black Lagoon is dead and then its blubbery form rises up again. Is this likely?
No, he’s done now.
The Tories got a sniff of what things might be like if he returned, and they won’t be going back there.
Plus since last weekend it seems we already have yet another major scandal with his name attached looking at Mail front page.
Pippa Crerar said on the politics show a couple of weeks back that if the clown ever got back to senior office there were further stories known to journalists that they’d get straight back onto.
Possibly levers that were used last weekend.
Which shows exactly why Pippa Crerar is as unfit for her job as Johnson was. Journalists are there to discover things and report them, not to discover things and save them up for when they might tip politics in a particular direction.
Some of the possibilities are only really stories if he is prominent.
Time and resources are limited in all lines of work.
Next time Andrew Sullivan is on the BBC telling us about left wing domination of US media, they might ask him about the Fox reaction to the Pelosi story. And the lack of interest of some of the 'liberal' media.
You may well discover there are *reasons* this story is being underplayed
What you mean is that the MAGA/right wing echo chamber has gone into overdrive to try to deflect blame from themselves, seizing on a couple of misreported and/or misrepresented “facts” in the initial aftermath (since debunked/withdrawn as inaccurate) to create a vast fantastical conspiracy which is a million miles from the highly likely and most obvious version of events.
Because when the obvious version of events doesn’t paint MAGA and its followers in a good light they have to create an alternative version (or several for when each one falls by the wayside).
There is a more simple reason why this is maybe not getting a lot more focus is that it's probably on both sides' interest to play it down - the GOP because of the potential nut job faction and the Democrats because it highlights the issue of crime which is a major factor why the races in NY / OR (Governorships) and even WA (Senate) are not the runaway victories they should be
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
That is nonsense. Hindus are very much on the up because their cultural values give them an edge over the indigenous population but one is not incompatible with the other. In the 20 years we had kids at DHS we saw Hindus go from a tiny minority to a significant presence in the school. Their parents were completely up for sacrifices to ensure that their kids got a proper education. They are the doctors, lawyers and accountants of the next generation. Already they are disproportionately more professional and earn significantly more than the average.
The problem Scotland has is that there are not enough Hindus, or people who share those values, to carry the rest. And we have a government whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the Union and how unfair everything is.
And we have Unionism whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the SNP and how unfair everything is.
Also true. We have indeed become a nation of whinners. It is not a good look or a good prospect.
Next time Andrew Sullivan is on the BBC telling us about left wing domination of US media, they might ask him about the Fox reaction to the Pelosi story. And the lack of interest of some of the 'liberal' media.
Next time Andrew Sullivan is on the BBC telling us about left wing domination of US media, they might ask him about the Fox reaction to the Pelosi story. And the lack of interest of some of the 'liberal' media.
You may well discover there are *reasons* this story is being underplayed
What you mean is that the MAGA/right wing echo chamber has gone into overdrive to try to deflect blame from themselves, seizing on a couple of misreported and/or misrepresented “facts” in the initial aftermath (since debunked/withdrawn as inaccurate) to create a vast fantastical conspiracy which is a million miles from the highly likely and most obvious version of events.
Because when the obvious version of events doesn’t paint MAGA and its followers in a good light they have to create an alternative version (or several for when each one falls by the wayside).
There is a more simple reason why this is maybe not getting a lot more focus is that it's probably on both sides' interest to play it down - the GOP because of the potential nut job faction and the Democrats because it highlights the issue of crime which is a major factor why the races in NY / OR (Governorships) and even WA (Senate) are not the runaway victories they should be
Whether that is or is not true, we all know that that is not what Leon is getting at, who has swallowed the salacious version whole.
A FAILURE to apologise to one of the men wrongly arrested as part of the “malicious” Rangers fraud prosecutions scandal is to cost the taxpayer up to £72 million, The Herald on Sunday can reveal.
Former Ibrox finance chief Imran Ahmad requested a simple apology three years ago from the Lord Advocate, the chief legal officer of the Scottish Government and the Crown in Scotland over his wrongful arrest in place of a damages claim, but was "unbelievably" turned down.
Former Ibrox finance chief Imran Ahmad is pursuing a £75m claim against the Lord Advocate over the loss of his livelihood and "irreparable reputational harm" over what his legal team argue was a "malicious" prosecution in the failed Rangers club fraud case.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Welfarism, the state replacing the role of families in being a safety net. The drive to not fail in life diminishes when the state says it's no problem to fail. And our safety net is laughably generous. It's become a way of life for people who stack excuse upon excuse for why they can't work when the reality is that they don't want to.
That may be a factor but it seems to me just too glib. I think as a society we have switched our focus from opportunities to entitlements. Opportunities are just too hard work to take advantage for many. Welfare is still pretty awful to live on, it is existing rather than living. But the focus on rights given than things earned is seriously out of whack.
Whilst I agree with the sentiment, there is a problem. We have millions of people who work very hard all the hours there are and yet don't have enough money to pay the bills.
What opportunity is there for people who are perpetually broke despite grafting harder than you or I?
We need a more dynamic, entrepreneurial economy where employers are incentivised to invest in training and capital equipment to make their staff produce more. Only then can they be paid more and, perhaps, take that training as a step to even better things. I absolutely agree with you that our current minimum wage, low skill society is trapping millions in misery.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
Welfarism, the state replacing the role of families in being a safety net. The drive to not fail in life diminishes when the state says it's no problem to fail. And our safety net is laughably generous. It's become a way of life for people who stack excuse upon excuse for why they can't work when the reality is that they don't want to.
That may be a factor but it seems to me just too glib. I think as a society we have switched our focus from opportunities to entitlements. Opportunities are just too hard work to take advantage for many. Welfare is still pretty awful to live on, it is existing rather than living. But the focus on rights given than things earned is seriously out of whack.
Whilst I agree with the sentiment, there is a problem. We have millions of people who work very hard all the hours there are and yet don't have enough money to pay the bills.
What opportunity is there for people who are perpetually broke despite grafting harder than you or I?
I think this is a very important point. It's pretty important to acknowledge that the whole discussion is pretty reductionist, since (to my mind) we're discussing Hindu-owned SMEs and Jakeys from the estate, their family dependent on welfarism. Someone talked about Hindu parents making huge sacrifices for their children's education (indeed this is something I have both seen personally and Sunak himself provides a good example of). That might include private school, or tutors. However, economically, we're comparing apples and deep-fried oranges. Hindu children of SME owners are going to outcompete white kids from a shit hole any day of the week because at the end of the day, despite the media going on about Sunak's humble origins, his family had assets leverage and money available.
The comparator is middle class white kids, imo, who are not likely to be recipients of welfare. And here I think cultural values might show more. I was failing physics (as were the rest of the class). Being of the aspirant middle class my parents offered to get me a tutor. I was mortified at the thought being both ashamed that such a thing was required and that it was unfair to my fellow students. I was haunted by visions of people whispering that my improved grades would be because my parents had paid for them. I refused the help and went on to scrape a pass by the fine hairs of my arse. Based on what has been written in this discussion, it seems the typical Hindu family, were they in a position to offer such help, their child would not have been allowed to refuse it in the (stupid) manner that I did.
Essentially, my point of view is that, in like-for-like cases things like cultural background with emphases on education and hard work can be determinants of success, but that there are also other factors (class, economic situation) that are bigger determinates. We are neither free agents in the world, nor are we boats buffeted by the tides of circumstances but some mixture of the two.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
Scottish Hindus must be the wrong caste.
Caste is an unspoken issue, because most Britons are oblivious.
I wonder how well Dalit migrants do in British society?
the 250/1 missed bet angle is an aside and only worth a footnote ( you pay your money and take your chances especially in political betting ) but this is a really serious story especially given the danger the world faces with the Russia/Ukraine dispute. This is so serious there surely has to be a criminal investigation regarding the Official Secrets Act. I am sure recklessly handling top secret information is an offence even if not deliberately leaking it, as is covering up such leaks. Why are the current crop of top politicians so ignorant of these rules ? Is it that they were promoted too quickly and lost the sense of importance of these roles and that its not the individual in these roles that is important but the role itself?
Having done IT security stuff it's never easy to get higher-ups to follow the security rules. The problem is that they tend to be quite petty and bureaucratic-seeming, and they really get in the way of getting actual immediate work done.
The situation here is that it's not really possible to secure someone's Android phone or iPhone against an attacker with a sufficient budget, because with enough money you can buy exploits that nobody else yet even knows about. The normal solution is to compartmentalize, so they'd use one phone for stuff that doesn't need to be very secure and a different device for stuff that does. But compartmentalization is really hard to apply in practice, especially when the user is dealing with the same people for different purposes, and they have to remember to use this device to ask about the party and this other device to talk about the urgent issue they're going to have a meeting about before they go to the party.
I'm sure it doesn't help that Brexit and the general state of the Conservative Party has selected for con artists and dim-wits and they've literally kicked the other people out of the party, but the fundamental problem of securing communications without destroying productivity is genuinely hard.
so why allow them personal phones in these roles? Personal sacrifice is needed in these roles and this should be one of them- Obama never was allowed on when President (as he referenced on Bear Grylls show that he did with him)
If you don't allow them personal phones they'll do all their personal stuff on the work phone and you're back where you started.
Alternatively if you're going to lock down the work phone to the point where they can't use Whats App, and you can somehow force them to accept this despite the fact that they're nominally in charge of you not the other way around, they'll be instantly out-plotted and you'll have to start again with a new minister.
I am sure private matters can be conveyed through PA's, personal staff etc . i think denial of access to WhatsApp etc is a small price to pay to ensure national security and one that any serious high office holder would accept - Any high office holder must realise they are not important anymore, its the job .
It's complicated. Half of government, or at least politics, seems to run on Whatsapp these days, and the other half on Zoom. You might remember some comment when the pictures of the first Cabinet Zoom meeting were shown, to the effect they did not seem to be very security conscious. And then there is the complication, to which edmundintokyo has alluded, of needing to distinguish government Whatsapp groups from party Whatsapp groups and special interest Whatsapp groups, with huge overlaps in membership, right down to social and family Whatsapp groups.
And that is without the inertia that many will be familiar with from normal employment. When people are promoted, or transferred to a different team, they should lose all their previous access rights, keys and passwords. Nine times out of ten people keep them, despite role-based access being specified in the outer appendices of the company rule book.
Am I alone in considering it an irony that a certain grade of PB Tory has determined we need to dispense with the "something for nothing" culture of welfare benefits, at the same time they are drawing their £500,000 p a salaries whilst posting on PB all day? I can vouch that when I am sat in my office writing bollocks on PB, I am not productive.
Perhaps I am wrong and the PB Tory faithful can walk and chew gum at the same time.
The simple truth is the massive gap in educational aspiration between white and non white working class communities. Not sure what the policy makers can do about it - it’s deeply embedded culturally.
Visit any grammar school in London to see this fact in play.
One thing to pay attention to is that Germany is doing a lot of "Indirect" aid which graphs like these may or may not capture. They are providing replacement kit to Eastern European nations who transfer stuff to Ukraine.
So Slovenia transfer a bunch of M-55S (shite tank but Ukraine will take it) and Germany then supply Slovenia with equipment as replacement.
Carlotta is not interested in a fair and balanced representation of the facts. The account is used purely for propaganda purposes.
Is it really up to Simon Case to impose a news blackout? He would do that without asking the Prime minister??????????
I find this implausible.
The key questions would be whether Truss ignored security advice on the use of her phone. And if she wasn't given advice why the hell not?
One of the last people to get a mobile phone in the UK was Tony Blair who only got one in 2007 after he ceased being Prime minister. Have we become more lax since?
Mental health providers are seeing an uptick in teens diagnosing themselves with mental illnesses — including rare disorders — after learning about the conditions online, particularly on TikTok. Some are embracing ineffective or inappropriate treatments.
the 250/1 missed bet angle is an aside and only worth a footnote ( you pay your money and take your chances especially in political betting ) but this is a really serious story especially given the danger the world faces with the Russia/Ukraine dispute. This is so serious there surely has to be a criminal investigation regarding the Official Secrets Act. I am sure recklessly handling top secret information is an offence even if not deliberately leaking it, as is covering up such leaks. Why are the current crop of top politicians so ignorant of these rules ? Is it that they were promoted too quickly and lost the sense of importance of these roles and that its not the individual in these roles that is important but the role itself?
Having done IT security stuff it's never easy to get higher-ups to follow the security rules. The problem is that they tend to be quite petty and bureaucratic-seeming, and they really get in the way of getting actual immediate work done.
The situation here is that it's not really possible to secure someone's Android phone or iPhone against an attacker with a sufficient budget, because with enough money you can buy exploits that nobody else yet even knows about. The normal solution is to compartmentalize, so they'd use one phone for stuff that doesn't need to be very secure and a different device for stuff that does. But compartmentalization is really hard to apply in practice, especially when the user is dealing with the same people for different purposes, and they have to remember to use this device to ask about the party and this other device to talk about the urgent issue they're going to have a meeting about before they go to the party.
I'm sure it doesn't help that Brexit and the general state of the Conservative Party has selected for con artists and dim-wits and they've literally kicked the other people out of the party, but the fundamental problem of securing communications without destroying productivity is genuinely hard.
so why allow them personal phones in these roles? Personal sacrifice is needed in these roles and this should be one of them- Obama never was allowed on when President (as he referenced on Bear Grylls show that he did with him)
If you don't allow them personal phones they'll do all their personal stuff on the work phone and you're back where you started.
Alternatively if you're going to lock down the work phone to the point where they can't use Whats App, and you can somehow force them to accept this despite the fact that they're nominally in charge of you not the other way around, they'll be instantly out-plotted and you'll have to start again with a new minister.
I am sure private matters can be conveyed through PA's, personal staff etc . i think denial of access to WhatsApp etc is a small price to pay to ensure national security and one that any serious high office holder would accept - Any high office holder must realise they are not important anymore, its the job .
It's complicated. Half of government, or at least politics, seems to run on Whatsapp these days, and the other half on Zoom. You might remember some comment when the pictures of the first Cabinet Zoom meeting were shown, to the effect they did not seem to be very security conscious. And then there is the complication, to which edmundintokyo has alluded, of needing to distinguish government Whatsapp groups from party Whatsapp groups and special interest Whatsapp groups, with huge overlaps in membership, right down to social and family Whatsapp groups.
And that is without the inertia that many will be familiar with from normal employment. When people are promoted, or transferred to a different team, they should lose all their previous access rights, keys and passwords. Nine times out of ten people keep them, despite role-based access being specified in the outer appendices of the company rule book.
This is not the minutes of a parish church council meeting but national security including nuclear security - anyone with high office needs to be serious about it and accept sacrifice and if they cannto see that themselves (or as you put it not bother to change previosu passwords) they are not fit for the job
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
In five years' time, and probably a lot less, it will be seen as a racist trope that Indians give high value to education and family life. This is not intended as criticism of any poster, more musing on the zeitgeist that has already changed how we view similar generalisations of other racial groups, from Blacks to Jews. What starts as positive becomes negative.
The simple truth is the massive gap in educational aspiration between white and non white working class communities. Not sure what the policy makers can do about it - it’s deeply embedded culturally.
Visit any grammar school in London to see this fact in play.
Very true in theory, but please don't go there with grammar schools. HY will be along in a moment demanding a grammar school on every Street corner.
The simple truth is the massive gap in educational aspiration between white and non white working class communities. Not sure what the policy makers can do about it - it’s deeply embedded culturally.
Visit any grammar school in London to see this fact in play.
And between Indian and Chinese working class communities and the other non white communities too as well as the white working class.
Although part of it is due to the fact immigrants tend to be more motivated
One thing to pay attention to is that Germany is doing a lot of "Indirect" aid which graphs like these may or may not capture. They are providing replacement kit to Eastern European nations who transfer stuff to Ukraine.
So Slovenia transfer a bunch of M-55S (shite tank but Ukraine will take it) and Germany then supply Slovenia with equipment as replacement.
Carlotta is not interested in a fair and balanced representation of the facts. The account is used purely for propaganda purposes.
On a per capita basis, some of the small Eastern European countries are indeed doing the most.
The next fun one that will pop up is the provenance of some of the LNG arriving in Europe…. There a contract from Germany, in particular, that is errrrr.. a resale.
The simple truth is the massive gap in educational aspiration between white and non white working class communities. Not sure what the policy makers can do about it - it’s deeply embedded culturally.
Visit any grammar school in London to see this fact in play.
And between Indian and Chinese working class communities and the other non white communities too as well as the white working class.
Although part of it is due to the fact immigrants tend to be more motivated
Obviously the UK needs more of these motivated people.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
Scottish Hindus must be the wrong caste.
Caste is an unspoken issue, because most Britons are oblivious.
I wonder how well Dalit migrants do in British society?
From my own experience of Indians (I had Indian neighbours for 8 years) I suspect that they prefer dealing with non Indians purely because of the caste issue. My neighbours never had anything good to say about and rarely mixed with other Indians. In 8 years I never thought to ask what caste they were!
My Indian software teams discussed caste with me on social nights. They had some eye-opening stories to tell.
The simple truth is the massive gap in educational aspiration between white and non white working class communities. Not sure what the policy makers can do about it - it’s deeply embedded culturally.
Visit any grammar school in London to see this fact in play.
And between Indian and Chinese working class communities and the other non white communities too as well as the white working class.
Although part of it is due to the fact immigrants tend to be more motivated
Indeed. A large part of why people migrate is for better economic opportunities. By their very nature immigrants have a great deal of "get up and go".
Is it really up to Simon Case to impose a news blackout? He would do that without asking the Prime minister??????????
I find this implausible.
The key questions would be whether Truss ignored security advice on the use of her phone. And if she wasn't given advice why the hell not?
One of the last people to get a mobile phone in the UK was Tony Blair who only got one in 2007 after he ceased being Prime minister. Have we become more lax since?
Given we, both as the electorate and the selectorate of Tory MPs that knew him well, chose to elect as PM a known compulsive liar who visits the villas of ex KGB agents on holiday and cant recall what was discussed, perhaps yes, just a tad more lax. We as the public are complicit though, in accepting such shocking standards for potential partisan gain.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
Are you saying if you don't own your own business or work in "higher professional jobs" then that's failure?
Has anyone considered that allowing Liz Truss to own a compromised phone would be an excellent way to feed misinformation to the Russians? Think of all the whack-job ideas and Maggie-like photos they would have to sift through to get to the buried treasure of a misunderstood secret.
It must have been like Chinese whispers on steriods....
Has anyone considered that allowing Liz Truss to own a compromised phone would be an excellent way to feed misinformation to the Russians? Think of all the whack-job ideas and Maggie-like photos they would have to sift through to get to the buried treasure of a misunderstood secret.
It must have been like Chinese whispers on steriods....
No, I think it is just the arrogance of power. Rules are for the little people.
Has anyone considered that allowing Liz Truss to own a compromised phone would be an excellent way to feed misinformation to the Russians?
Of course that is an option, or rather it was until some idiot leaker thought they knew best. Russia now knows that we know, and I haven't read the story but they might also be able to pin down the rough date of when it was discovered, which would be used to assess the veracity of any intelligence. The leaker(s) have put politics ahead of security.
Great article from The Times. Gives people a good background into the driving force of success for British Indians and Hindus. The UK could learn a lot from our cultural values, hopefully Rishi is able to impart some on the wider nation.
In case anyone doesn't want to read it, the three keys are education, family and education. In that order. Every single one of my cousins is degree educated and all of them work in higher professional jobs or own and run businesses. There's simply no option of failure given to us as kids, parental support in education, high expectations and ongoing support after university are key to all of us being successful. White British families could learn a lot.
There was a time when Scotland was like that, with a massive emphasis on education and a huge desire to "get on". It's tragic how far we have fallen away from those cultural values to those of envy and bitterness. I really don't know how it happened but it is in my lifetime. My parents and my wife's parents would recognise and endorse the values you espouse in a heartbeat.
But Hinduism is growing in Scotland. I don't get it. How can Max's heralds of right living be on the up at the same time it's all going to rack and ruin? At least one of you must be wrong.
That is nonsense. Hindus are very much on the up because their cultural values give them an edge over the indigenous population but one is not incompatible with the other. In the 20 years we had kids at DHS we saw Hindus go from a tiny minority to a significant presence in the school. Their parents were completely up for sacrifices to ensure that their kids got a proper education. They are the doctors, lawyers and accountants of the next generation. Already they are disproportionately more professional and earn significantly more than the average.
The problem Scotland has is that there are not enough Hindus, or people who share those values, to carry the rest. And we have a government whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the Union and how unfair everything is.
You are doing the same thing that you condemn - blame the government for everything. A government that tries to support students more than the norm of the UKG settlement, within the limits of the devolution settlement.
No I absolutely am not. The government is not helping but this is a much wider problem that existed long before an SNP administration was ever contemplated. In my lifetime Scots have switched from admiring those that get on and make something of themselves to resenting them and wanting to tax them out of existence. That is not an SNP thing although they seem to have those values too.
And as for helping students more, well the SG funding is so poor that our Universities have become dependent upon foreign students and indeed English students to subsidise their education. Even then, the number of places are limited and becoming more so, closing the door to opportunity. We have utterly destroyed our college system replacing it with certificates for all, regardless of effort or attendance, the exact opposite of training people for the world of work. Our school standards have fallen so far against international standards the SG doesn't want to play anymore.
A Scottish education was something to be proud of in my youth, If you did well in it you had worked hard and applied yourself. Sadly, that is no longer the case and it is not equipping our next generation to create and develop the economy we need.
The devastation wreaked on Scottish, and the wider UK, society, by Thatcher destroyed hope and ambition in many places. Why try to improve when there are no jobs and no hope?
The simple truth is the massive gap in educational aspiration between white and non white working class communities. Not sure what the policy makers can do about it - it’s deeply embedded culturally.
Visit any grammar school in London to see this fact in play.
And between Indian and Chinese working class communities and the other non white communities too as well as the white working class.
Although part of it is due to the fact immigrants tend to be more motivated
Probably quite a bit of it. People prepared to move across the world, including (say) WWC Brits who went to Australia have a lot of the secret sauce in common with each other.
However.
Globetrotting elite professionals and stay-at-home mediocrities need each other. Society can't function without the care worker, the school teaching assistant, the street cleaner... The sort of jobs where there just aren't efficiency gains to be wrangled. And it's right that people doing those jobs have good lives as well. Balancing rewards for success with good society isn't easy, but some don't even try.
And all of us here have had faiy hefty dollops of luck. Self-made men worshipping their creators is always a bit distasteful.
Am I alone in considering it an irony that a certain grade of PB Tory has determined we need to dispense with the "something for nothing" culture of welfare benefits, at the same time they are drawing their £500,000 p a salaries whilst posting on PB all day? I can vouch that when I am sat in my office writing bollocks on PB, I am not productive.
Perhaps I am wrong and the PB Tory faithful can walk and chew gum at the same time.
As a civil servant I can't access pb at work. On my work computer that is. I'm fairly careful about logins on my phone.
Has anyone considered that allowing Liz Truss to own a compromised phone would be an excellent way to feed misinformation to the Russians?
Of course that is an option, or rather it was until some idiot leaker thought they knew best. Russia now knows that we know, and I haven't read the story but they might also be able to pin down the rough date of when it was discovered, which would be used to assess the veracity of any intelligence. The leaker(s) have put politics ahead of security.
Give it up. That might fly if (a) that was what happened, and (b) the spooks had not relieved LizT of the compromised phone, and (c) the KGB was too thick to realise no-one was using said phone any more.
Next time Andrew Sullivan is on the BBC telling us about left wing domination of US media, they might ask him about the Fox reaction to the Pelosi story. And the lack of interest of some of the 'liberal' media.
Comments
And we know there are at least three SC Justices who would vote to overturn Griswold - though for now I don’t think there would be more than four votes to do so. That could easily change under another Republican president.
Not enough to make up for the interest rate hit...
You may well discover there are *reasons* this story is being underplayed
“Pandemic, got that pandemic right here”
She didn't just read right wing twitter and then then cryptically post stuff to mysteriously appear "in the know".
Oxford University's vice-chancellor has used the famous matriculation ceremonies to tell every new student that they must “hear the other side” of arguments and prepare to be offended
https://twitter.com/ewansomerville/status/1586357756604317701
Dr James Orr, a Cambridge lecturer who helped organise the Scruton lecture series, said: “It is disheartening to discover that there are students at Oxford who believe that the physical presence of those who do not share their views affects their safety.”’
https://twitter.com/nettleshippy/status/1586470193202573314
It can be a rather suffocating and oppressive family environment, which is part of why it has declined. This decline is seen too in migrant communities as the generations descend.
I'm mean, yes it's very serious, but the oppostion parties are saying some bloody stupid things in response.
The problem Scotland has is that there are not enough Hindus, or people who share those values, to carry the rest. And we have a government whose main focus is finding reasons to whine about the Union and how unfair everything is.
If Hindus, generally speaking, perform well then instead of just going down the sociology route of blaming a vague and amorphous 'society' for the lack of prosperity of certain groups then, shockingly, questions might be asked about why Hindus can do well. Could... people and families be responsible for their own success and failures rather than victims of circumstance or inheriting privilege?
[For the avoidance of doubt, lots of people do get dealt shitty or fantastic hands and obviously it's easier to do well when you get the latter. But the idea personal agency or a broader culture are minor things is deeply unhealthy. Seeing people as flotsam buffeted by the waves of fate is not good.]
Calvinist Protestantism in its Scottish Presbyterian form, however, seems to have put particular emphasis on hard work and not wasting one's time on earth with idle dissipation.
But it's not as simple as that. There is an interesting interaction with poverty, too: Belfast RCs placed a high emphasis on education, partly to escape to decent lives elsewhere, and still seem to do so.
I suspect the same was true of RCs in the West Central belt of Scotland (where [edit] many were kept very much in inferior jobs by the Protestant-Unionist ascendancy).
I don't wanna sound unduly combative, but you have lucked in to a ludicrously overpaid job which adds zero to society and takes relatively little in the way of skill and aptitude, it's the kind of thing all the least interesting people I knew at Oxford do. The lucking in - I wouldn't normally make this point but it is thoroughly relevant to your claims - is thanks to this country, bond trading being less of a thing on the subcontinent - and your signature posting style is to shit on the old and poor for not being old and poor enough. If that's Hindu values, I have a suggestion as to where you can put them.
I think it's recognised things don't always work out that way (divorce, tragedy, sexuality and infertility) but children being raised by both biological parents in wedlock wherever possible?
There's oodles of evidence for the benefits of that.
You have to understand that I have spent a significant portion of my working life living as a failure by having lowly administrative jobs, hauling palettes off lorries, serving coffees to successful people, and pints to other failures. Obviously if I'd had more Hinduism in my life things would have been different.
The Tories got a sniff of what things might be like if he returned, and they won’t be going back there.
The only point I would make is that this is something that has to come from the individuals themselves
There are a number of Hindus in my department, but also Muslims of African and Asian descent, Greeks, Poles, Italians, Sikhs, Chinese, Jews and even two WASPs.
Only one has truly working class background though, the rest all have middle class or professional parents. I think class advantage trumps ethnic background massively in England now.
What opportunity is there for people who are perpetually broke despite grafting harder than you or I?
It’s a complaint that may be heard less in future after the party leader and some of her advisers seemed to be taken aback by Thursday’s rebellion over proposed gender reforms that culminated in a ministerial resignation and the SNP’s biggest internal revolt in 15 years.
Had Sturgeon attended Tuesday afternoon’s group meeting, she could have heard at first hand of the concerns of Ash Regan, among others, rather than profess surprise when her community safety minister later stood down, voicing fears for the safety of women and girl
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/473bec5a-57d1-11ed-a3b8-342870f8e8b9?shareToken=d8b542dc6e629fe27660bf1918dc4dbd
If Sunak loses the next election and Johnson holds his seat he would also again be a contender
Possibly levers that were used last weekend.
Because when the obvious version of events doesn’t paint MAGA and its followers in a good light they have to create an alternative version (or several for when each one falls by the wayside).
Mental health providers are seeing an uptick in teens diagnosing themselves with mental illnesses — including rare disorders — after learning about the conditions online, particularly on TikTok. Some are embracing ineffective or inappropriate treatments.
https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1586393677454270465
And as for helping students more, well the SG funding is so poor that our Universities have become dependent upon foreign students and indeed English students to subsidise their education. Even then, the number of places are limited and becoming more so, closing the door to opportunity. We have utterly destroyed our college system replacing it with certificates for all, regardless of effort or attendance, the exact opposite of training people for the world of work. Our school standards have fallen so far against international standards the SG doesn't want to play anymore.
A Scottish education was something to be proud of in my youth, If you did well in it you had worked hard and applied yourself. Sadly, that is no longer the case and it is not equipping our next generation to create and develop the economy we need.
Time and resources are limited in all lines of work.
Is that it?
Former Ibrox finance chief Imran Ahmad requested a simple apology three years ago from the Lord Advocate, the chief legal officer of the Scottish Government and the Crown in Scotland over his wrongful arrest in place of a damages claim, but was "unbelievably" turned down.
Former Ibrox finance chief Imran Ahmad is pursuing a £75m claim against the Lord Advocate over the loss of his livelihood and "irreparable reputational harm" over what his legal team argue was a "malicious" prosecution in the failed Rangers club fraud case.
https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/homenews/23088005.failure-apologise-wrongful-arrest-ex-rangers-finance-chief-set-cost-taxpayer-72m/
https://twitter.com/culturaltutor/status/1586428728179146754?s=61&t=MvhlD_Kj7Xaq81caIYObGg
Also more grist to the AI art is a pedestrian parlour trick for philistines mill.
The comparator is middle class white kids, imo, who are not likely to be recipients of welfare. And here I think cultural values might show more. I was failing physics (as were the rest of the class). Being of the aspirant middle class my parents offered to get me a tutor. I was mortified at the thought being both ashamed that such a thing was required and that it was unfair to my fellow students. I was haunted by visions of people whispering that my improved grades would be because my parents had paid for them. I refused the help and went on to scrape a pass by the fine hairs of my arse. Based on what has been written in this discussion, it seems the typical Hindu family, were they in a position to offer such help, their child would not have been allowed to refuse it in the (stupid) manner that I did.
Essentially, my point of view is that, in like-for-like cases things like cultural background with emphases on education and hard work can be determinants of success, but that there are also other factors (class, economic situation) that are bigger determinates. We are neither free agents in the world, nor are we boats buffeted by the tides of circumstances but some mixture of the two.
I wonder how well Dalit migrants do in British society?
And that is without the inertia that many will be familiar with from normal employment. When people are promoted, or transferred to a different team, they should lose all their previous access rights, keys and passwords. Nine times out of ten people keep them, despite role-based access being specified in the outer appendices of the company rule book.
Perhaps I am wrong and the PB Tory faithful can walk and chew gum at the same time.
Visit any grammar school in London to see this fact in play.
I find this implausible.
The key questions would be whether Truss ignored security advice on the use of her phone. And if she wasn't given advice why the hell not?
One of the last people to get a mobile phone in the UK was Tony Blair who only got one in 2007 after he ceased being Prime minister. Have we become more lax since?
There are large numbers now of self diagnosed people "on the ASD spectrum" many of whom are probably validly doing so.
I cannot read the article through the paywall. Are these teens correctly diagnosing themselves?
He is wrong and they are wrong..
Although part of it is due to the fact immigrants tend to be more motivated
The next fun one that will pop up is the provenance of some of the LNG arriving in Europe…. There a contract from Germany, in particular, that is errrrr.. a resale.
My Indian software teams discussed caste with me on social nights. They had some eye-opening stories to tell.
It must have been like Chinese whispers on steriods....
However.
Globetrotting elite professionals and stay-at-home mediocrities need each other. Society can't function without the care worker, the school teaching assistant, the street cleaner... The sort of jobs where there just aren't efficiency gains to be wrangled. And it's right that people doing those jobs have good lives as well. Balancing rewards for success with good society isn't easy, but some don't even try.
And all of us here have had faiy hefty dollops of luck. Self-made men worshipping their creators is always a bit distasteful.
Impressive place. Two mighty tectonic plates ripping apart - creating these deep dark lava rock ravines, where they used to hurl witches. Perfect