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And so the Queen’s coffin arrives in Westminster – politicalbetting.com

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  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 10,061
    edited September 2022
    Safe to say the EUs mandatory energy use at peak time cuts going down like a cup of cold sick with the peeps.
    Turns out they didnt join to have their living standards decimated. Riots by New Year
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,437
    edited September 2022

    ydoethur said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    Particularly the architect who infamously told teachers at a school of my acquaintance that they were stupid Philistines for not appreciating his classroom design.

    His L-shaped classroom design.
    In the last days of Gordon Brown, they proposed to merge two local schools. One failing utterly in every way. The other very successful. The management at the failing school would be in charge - seniority.

    The larger, failing school site would be sold off. And a new school built on the site of the other.

    The glass and concrete box presented, had no air conditioning, artifical or natural, despite glass walls everywhere. The price per square meter was such that a relative in the building industry pointed out that it was higher than the price he charged for constructing homes for the super rich. He commented, quite seriously, that he could have built the spec, and added in a basement 50m swimming pool and still had a nice profit.

    The cherry on top was the classroom design. The desks faced a glass wall. Sun in the eyes… the “board” was an unrolling projector screen that unrolled in front of the window - leaving lots of glass all around.

    When I pointed out at the planning meeting that seeing anything on the “board” would be impossible, the architect attending the meeting was quite rude.

    The plans fell through with the change of government…
    They changed the way they built schools during the Blair/Brown years away from compulsory competitive tendering to 'something else' (can't remember what the something else was, but effectively it meant a single developer or small group of developers getting all the work). My Dad worked for a developer in this area at the time. They were playing keyboard piano with what they charged education authorities (not him personally btw) 40% overcharging as standard.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    edited September 2022
    Cookie said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    London is sui generis.

    Edinburgh and Bath are already premier division.

    Liverpool, Glasgow, Bristol, Newcastle could all be made to “work” better with concerted effort.

    Manchester is “so-so”, Birmingham distressingly bad, Southampton and Portsmouth are downright disasters.

    I’m not familiar enough with Cardiff, Belfast, Sheffield, Leeds or Nottingham to offer an opinion.

    We can’t compete with Seville or Venice.
    But we can legitimately aspire to compete with Dutch, Scandinavian and German cities.

    Belfast could be grand. Amazing setting. Likewise Bristol

    Brum is helpless and yet it was once dense and beautiful. At its core. It cannot be saved, it is too
    Late. Scrap it

    I haven’t seen the new Manchester but I am suspicious tho it has a great inheritance of important Victorian buildings

    Sheffield is shite. Nottingham is unknown to
    Me

    Weirdly: Plymouth is brilliant. It is the one place modernism worked. Yet people despise it. Dunno why
    I have livedin both Sheffield and Nottingham.
    I love Sheffield utterly. In the 90s, it was horrible. But even when it was horrible it was wonderful, because the hills. You can see so much of the city from wherever you are. But nowadays it is much improved. I don't think there is any city which improved itself as much in the first decade of the century as Sheffield. (The prize for the second decade goes to Bradford, which is seriously worth a look now. It has determined it had too much office space and simply knocked all its ugliest buildings down, leaving pleasant squares from which to view the glories 9f the Victorian era. It is an astonishing turn around).
    Nottingham meanwhile was clearly wonderful in the fifties. The centre, inside the ring road and devoid of cars, is still a pleasant pre-Victorian city centre. The ring road is a regrettable scar. And then to the west and north west there is more pleasant pre-Victoriana. And comparatively unscarred by inadvisable brutalist council estates.
    Yeah Sheffield is lovely. Also very nice people. I generally am not a fan of Yorkshire but will make an exception for Sheffield.
    I have never fallen in love with a city at first sight like I did with Sheffield.
    It helped that I was approaching from the west. I challenge you to find a more agreeable highway into any British city than Sheffield from the A57 from Glossop or A623(? the Hope Valley Road into Ecclesall).
    Possibly those whose experience of Sheffield is seeing it from the M1 or approaching it from the east have a different impression.
    I also lived in Sheffield during the 1990s. I think its city centre is irredeemable (the Moor is just vile) despite the improvement efforts of recent years. Nevertheless, I love the place: its pubs, its people, mainly. I used to travel down the M1 from the North, and my heart would always stir coming down the slope towards the Parkway and seeing the city suddenly begin to appear in the valley below.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,329


    https://gizmodo.com/queen-elizabeth-ii-westminster-queue-line-what3words-uk-1849536290

    Some minor typos and homophones have led to mourners being directed to somewhere in the suburbs of London (it’s a long line, but not that long), or Yorkshire, or North Carolina, or California.

    ++++


    They could always hazard a guess that the queue “does not begin in Leeds or California”

  • Any requests for Sunday's threads, I'm writing them well in advance.
  • I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    Did you show her a turnip that was exactly the same shape as a thingy?
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,668
    edited September 2022
    ydoethur said:

    I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    That ruins Lady Whiteadder's give about 'where there are relatives, there is evidence of sex!'
    Calling friends of your parents Auntie or Uncle is a custom I also heard in Liverpool, possibly amongst the Irish / Catholic contingent.

    It definitely isn't unique to Pakistan.
  • Foxy said:

    This does not bode well.

    Asda has temporarily limited purchases of its new budget range Just Essentials, blaming soaring demand.

    The supermarket said customers would be limited to buying three items at most of each product until further notice.

    It launched Just Essentials in May, promising an expanded line of low-cost products to help shoppers with the cost of living.

    That came after food poverty campaigner Jack Monroe criticised Asda for cutting back its budget ranges in some stores.

    But on Wednesday, the supermarket said demand was outstripping availability, with sales growing almost 20% faster than the market average.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62905806

    Mrs Foxy won some Asda yellow products in raffle, and they were quite good. A good bit of marketing. People will buy other stuff while they are there.

    Worth noting that even if gas prices drop, there are a lot of other inflationary pressures on people.
    A pinch point our guys predicted was next March when a lot of people will see their mobile/landline/broadband costs go up around 20%.
    I've never signed up to be on one of those contracts where the price goes up by CPI + loads%

    I can't understand why anyone does.
    It's why I generally buy the device outright and recontract my sims in April.

    But not everybody can afford to buy outright so they get it monthly.

    Big shoutout to o2 though, they split the device cost and the airtime cost and only the CPI/RPI +3.9% rise to the airtime part.
    All those deals really involve buying the phone on HP and paying an outrageous interest rate. It is often higher than credit card rates….
    Nah, another reason why Apple are so awesome. 0% APR.


    iUP is a terrible deal. Skip and get on 0% finance.
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,028
    Watching the BBC live stream of the Queen lying in state. A really intimate and poignant look into peoples very private moments with our late monarch.

    Deeply moving.
  • I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    Nah, it's an Indian custom!

    Re. Urdu: although most Indians and Pakistanis would scoff at the idea, Urdu and Hindi are actually two variants of the same language:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindustani_language
  • Queue is only 5-6 hours.

    I'm tempted.
  • kamski said:

    ydoethur said:

    For a bit of fun I went on the YouGov approval ratings for public figures. HM Queen Elizabeth II is top though Volodymr Zelensky might threaten her position if he had the same recognition. Who have the lowest favourability ratings?

    There's no point including someone with a 2% favourability rating if only 3% know who they are. So in short order it appears to be Putin, Xi, Rupert Murdoch, MBS, Matt Hancock and a little surprisingly Keith Vaz.

    https://yougov.co.uk/ratings/politics/popularity/public-figures/all

    Eee, some real scumbags in that list.

    But I am surprised Dominic Cummings didn't make the cut.

    Not only a loser, and a public leper, but less well-known than Keith Vaz? He'll never recover!

    Edit - fucking autocorrect is more away with the fairies today than a DfE official.
    There is indeed, something utterly detestable that oozes from Matt Hancock’s pores.

    Glad to see the general public also sense it, it’s not just me.
    David Cameron 99% have heard of, 17% have a positive opinion.

    Donald Trump 97% have heard of, 16% have a positive opinion.

    So Trump is slightly more popular among British people who have heard of him than Cameron. I suppose it makes sense.
    Obviously Johnson is the worst PM we’ve ever had. But Cameron, honestly, what a f***ing waste of space!
    Right now, I want a bright history class in about the year 2070, do I can set them an essay along the lines of

    "David Cameron was only a good Prime Minister when he didn't have the absolute power to do as he pleased."

    Discuss.

    I even want to make up a fake pundit I can attribute that quote to.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405

    Foxy said:

    This does not bode well.

    Asda has temporarily limited purchases of its new budget range Just Essentials, blaming soaring demand.

    The supermarket said customers would be limited to buying three items at most of each product until further notice.

    It launched Just Essentials in May, promising an expanded line of low-cost products to help shoppers with the cost of living.

    That came after food poverty campaigner Jack Monroe criticised Asda for cutting back its budget ranges in some stores.

    But on Wednesday, the supermarket said demand was outstripping availability, with sales growing almost 20% faster than the market average.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62905806

    Mrs Foxy won some Asda yellow products in raffle, and they were quite good. A good bit of marketing. People will buy other stuff while they are there.

    Worth noting that even if gas prices drop, there are a lot of other inflationary pressures on people.
    A pinch point our guys predicted was next March when a lot of people will see their mobile/landline/broadband costs go up around 20%.
    I've never signed up to be on one of those contracts where the price goes up by CPI + loads%

    I can't understand why anyone does.
    It's why I generally buy the device outright and recontract my sims in April.

    But not everybody can afford to buy outright so they get it monthly.

    Big shoutout to o2 though, they split the device cost and the airtime cost and only the CPI/RPI +3.9% rise to the airtime part.
    All those deals really involve buying the phone on HP and paying an outrageous interest rate. It is often higher than credit card rates….
    Nah, another reason why Apple are so awesome. 0% APR.


    Odd they don’t list the annual bill, or indeed the lifetime of the contract.
    If I’m ever in power monthly rates will be banned, only the yearly amount will be allowed.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,329
    edited September 2022

    I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    When I was 34 and living at my dad’s house due to being a smack addict, ex jailbird, ex BDSM rape accused trying not to die, my Puritan step grandmother found a mild porn magazine under my bed and, as a result, loudly accused me of being “a corrupt and evil man”

    No joke. I was tempted to point out all the weird shit I really HAD done, but I figured she’d die of a heart attack, being 89
  • Leon said:



    https://gizmodo.com/queen-elizabeth-ii-westminster-queue-line-what3words-uk-1849536290

    Some minor typos and homophones have led to mourners being directed to somewhere in the suburbs of London (it’s a long line, but not that long), or Yorkshire, or North Carolina, or California.

    ++++


    They could always hazard a guess that the queue “does not begin in Leeds or California”

    Are they Latvian homophones?
  • HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    RobD said:

    https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1570100104366891008?t=1x1PjcOTF544q35eUzxiTg&s=19

    NYT with the shocking expose that the state pay for a head of states funeral. Keep your beaks out twatsworths.
    No Exposé without Representaté!

    What a joke.
    How much it will cost may well be a news story, but 'taxpayers paying for it' is not.
    Oh it is, I remember John Major pointing out the Windsor castle fire took place during a recession and there was no way the country was going to pay for the restoration in those circumstances.

    That's why the Queen had to open up Buck House to the tourists.
    Paris city council contributed 50 million euros to the Notre Dame restoration fund
    See? Republics aren't all bad!
  • GIN1138 said:

    Leon said:

    GIN1138 said:

    jonny83 said:

    Just catching up with today's events. The choir singing Psalm 139 as the Coffin was brought in was absolutely beautiful.

    I would guess HMQ has chosen all the hymns/music we hear during her service and funeral?
    Yes. She took a keen and well informed interest

    She understood that half of royalty is this; the ceremonial. You have to nail these big events. That’s kinda the point. They capture the nation’s emotions

    So far I’d give her dramaturgy 9/10

    I’m knocking a point off for the flight from Edinburgh to Northolt. They should have found a way to do the train or a car. That would have been amazing. The whole nation throwing flowers

    Otherwise: perfect

    Yes I agree. It's a shame they didn't take her from Edinburgh to London on a train. Through the cities and the market towns. Through the villages and the shires. It would have been the ideal way to include all her subjects in her final goodbye.
    Agree. Especially by puggy train. Would have been enchanting.
  • I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    Did you show her a turnip that was exactly the same shape as a thingy?
    No, but I did have this Butternut Squash...


  • Foxy said:

    This does not bode well.

    Asda has temporarily limited purchases of its new budget range Just Essentials, blaming soaring demand.

    The supermarket said customers would be limited to buying three items at most of each product until further notice.

    It launched Just Essentials in May, promising an expanded line of low-cost products to help shoppers with the cost of living.

    That came after food poverty campaigner Jack Monroe criticised Asda for cutting back its budget ranges in some stores.

    But on Wednesday, the supermarket said demand was outstripping availability, with sales growing almost 20% faster than the market average.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62905806

    Mrs Foxy won some Asda yellow products in raffle, and they were quite good. A good bit of marketing. People will buy other stuff while they are there.

    Worth noting that even if gas prices drop, there are a lot of other inflationary pressures on people.
    A pinch point our guys predicted was next March when a lot of people will see their mobile/landline/broadband costs go up around 20%.
    I've never signed up to be on one of those contracts where the price goes up by CPI + loads%

    I can't understand why anyone does.
    It's why I generally buy the device outright and recontract my sims in April.

    But not everybody can afford to buy outright so they get it monthly.

    Big shoutout to o2 though, they split the device cost and the airtime cost and only the CPI/RPI +3.9% rise to the airtime part.
    All those deals really involve buying the phone on HP and paying an outrageous interest rate. It is often higher than credit card rates….
    Nah, another reason why Apple are so awesome. 0% APR.


    Odd they don’t list the annual bill, or indeed the lifetime of the contract.
    If I’m ever in power monthly rates will be banned, only the yearly amount will be allowed.
    iUP is 24 months at 0%. But it's more expensive than the 0% Apple do separately. iUP is a bad deal.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,397

    Any requests for Sunday's threads, I'm writing them well in advance.

    One on the importance of Newent in combating Woke attitudes would be great, if only to see @Leon actually explode!
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    I have huge conflicts in my head about old vs new in architecture. I abhor hanging on the old stuff just got the sake of it. I always ask, if the Romans had had double glazing, they would have used it.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,404

    ydoethur said:

    I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    That ruins Lady Whiteadder's give about 'where there are relatives, there is evidence of sex!'
    Calling friends of your parents Auntie or Uncle is a custom I also heard in Liverpool, possibly amongst the Irish / Catholic contingent.

    It definitely isn't unique to Pakistan.
    I can confirm my parents' friends were my Aunts and Uncles.
    I went years not knowing I wasn't related to them.
    Irish/Catholic woollyback here.
  • Watching the BBC live stream of the Queen lying in state. A really intimate and poignant look into peoples very private moments with our late monarch.

    Deeply moving.

    But you can't actually see her!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,329

    Queue is only 5-6 hours.

    I'm tempted.

    I reckon if you joined the queue around 1-2am you’d be in and out before dawn easily

    That’s what I did with the Queen Mum, sort of. Joined around 11pm. Out by 1am. And well worth it

    The fact I’m still talking about it now, and can still vividly remember the deep emotions, tells you why
  • Looks like the Swedish Moderates are going to get the PM position.

    Funny, kept reading here about how awful the Moderates were going to do in the election.
  • I AM SHOCKED BY THESE SURVEY RESULTS! SHOCKED TO THE CORE!

    The Hundred is English cricket's least enjoyable competition, fans survey finds

    GEORGE DOBELL: The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to a Cricket Supporters' Association survey completed 3,704 times


    Almost two-thirds of cricket supporters do not enjoy The Hundred, according to the interim results of a survey conducted by the Cricket Supporters' Association.

    The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to the survey.

    Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they found it "not enjoyable", with 11 per cent more saying it was neither enjoyable nor not enjoyable. Only 27 per cent said they found it enjoyable.

    By comparison, 98 per cent of respondents said they found Test cricket enjoyable. Only 1 per cent said it was "not enjoyable".

    The survey, which was partly funded by the ECB, took around 25 minutes to complete and was done so 3,704 times.


    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/countycricket/the_hundred_english_cricket_least_enjoyable_competition_fans_survey.html
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,103

    Any requests for Sunday's threads, I'm writing them well in advance.

    "What's will happen with the Liberal Democrats? Revival or stasis?"
  • boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    I have huge conflicts in my head about old vs new in architecture. I abhor hanging on the old stuff just got the sake of it. I always ask, if the Romans had had double glazing, they would have used it.
    I believe that there are some things, just like our perception of beauty in humans, that we perceive to be beautiful in buildings. The really ugly buildings are those where the architects have ignored all that.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,158

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    What's wrong with Willing Buyer, Willing Seller?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,103

    Watching the BBC live stream of the Queen lying in state. A really intimate and poignant look into peoples very private moments with our late monarch.

    Deeply moving.

    But you can't actually see her!
    You see her in your heart, my good man.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405

    Watching the BBC live stream of the Queen lying in state. A really intimate and poignant look into peoples very private moments with our late monarch.

    Deeply moving.

    But you can't actually see her!
    Well you could try and prop open the lid but I wouldn’t recommend it…
  • kle4 said:

    Any requests for Sunday's threads, I'm writing them well in advance.

    "What's will happen with the Liberal Democrats? Revival or stasis?"
    Oooh.
  • dixiedean said:

    ydoethur said:

    I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    That ruins Lady Whiteadder's give about 'where there are relatives, there is evidence of sex!'
    Calling friends of your parents Auntie or Uncle is a custom I also heard in Liverpool, possibly amongst the Irish / Catholic contingent.

    It definitely isn't unique to Pakistan.
    I can confirm my parents' friends were my Aunts and Uncles.
    I went years not knowing I wasn't related to them.
    Irish/Catholic woollyback here.
    It's also a custom in USA, quite widespread and NOT limited to Catholics.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Russians habe blown a dam of a reservoir that feeds into the Inhulets. This os less than optimal as it has caused the river to flood wiping out the pontoon crossing the Ukrainians have been using. Troops are now cut off.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,360

    I've just realised that the way to liven up all this primogeniture nonsense is to take a leaf out of Stardust's book (and film...). The dying monarch sets all his or her children a dangerous quest to do. The first to complete the quest becomes the new monarch.

    In this case, Charles would waste time telling off his servant about the sort of tie he has to wear on the quest;
    Anne would zoom off on the nearest horse.
    Andrew would be too busy shagging Bernard (*)
    Whilst Edward would forget about the quest and direct a reality TV show about it.

    They probably don't have to go to the extent of the books, where all the male kids kill each other off...

    (*) You need to know the film.

    I could envisage a situation in which Meghan arranges for a plane carrying William and his children to be blown up. Charles dies of grief. However, Kate Middleton avoids the bombing at the last moment, and ferrets out the truth. King Harry is forced to allow his wife to be impeached by the Commons, and placed on trial for murder by the Lords. Parliament passes legislation to execute Meghan if she's found guilty. Kate seduces Harry, and urges that she becomes his Queen. But, Meghan plans the massacre of Parliament at her trial.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Foxy said:

    This does not bode well.

    Asda has temporarily limited purchases of its new budget range Just Essentials, blaming soaring demand.

    The supermarket said customers would be limited to buying three items at most of each product until further notice.

    It launched Just Essentials in May, promising an expanded line of low-cost products to help shoppers with the cost of living.

    That came after food poverty campaigner Jack Monroe criticised Asda for cutting back its budget ranges in some stores.

    But on Wednesday, the supermarket said demand was outstripping availability, with sales growing almost 20% faster than the market average.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62905806

    Mrs Foxy won some Asda yellow products in raffle, and they were quite good. A good bit of marketing. People will buy other stuff while they are there.

    Worth noting that even if gas prices drop, there are a lot of other inflationary pressures on people.
    A pinch point our guys predicted was next March when a lot of people will see their mobile/landline/broadband costs go up around 20%.
    I've never signed up to be on one of those contracts where the price goes up by CPI + loads%

    I can't understand why anyone does.
    It's why I generally buy the device outright and recontract my sims in April.

    But not everybody can afford to buy outright so they get it monthly.

    Big shoutout to o2 though, they split the device cost and the airtime cost and only the CPI/RPI +3.9% rise to the airtime part.
    Get it monthly. Fnaar.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,397

    I AM SHOCKED BY THESE SURVEY RESULTS! SHOCKED TO THE CORE!

    The Hundred is English cricket's least enjoyable competition, fans survey finds

    GEORGE DOBELL: The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to a Cricket Supporters' Association survey completed 3,704 times


    Almost two-thirds of cricket supporters do not enjoy The Hundred, according to the interim results of a survey conducted by the Cricket Supporters' Association.

    The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to the survey.

    Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they found it "not enjoyable", with 11 per cent more saying it was neither enjoyable nor not enjoyable. Only 27 per cent said they found it enjoyable.

    By comparison, 98 per cent of respondents said they found Test cricket enjoyable. Only 1 per cent said it was "not enjoyable".

    The survey, which was partly funded by the ECB, took around 25 minutes to complete and was done so 3,704 times.


    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/countycricket/the_hundred_english_cricket_least_enjoyable_competition_fans_survey.html

    If you will spend all your time telling your customers you're launching a new product because you hate their guts and think they're silly, and then tailor it to be everything they hate...what do you expect?

    The Strauss review should have started by asking if the ECB is past it and needs abolishing.
  • I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    Did you show her a turnip that was exactly the same shape as a thingy?
    No, but I did have this Butternut Squash...


    Five a day?
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405

    I AM SHOCKED BY THESE SURVEY RESULTS! SHOCKED TO THE CORE!

    The Hundred is English cricket's least enjoyable competition, fans survey finds

    GEORGE DOBELL: The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to a Cricket Supporters' Association survey completed 3,704 times


    Almost two-thirds of cricket supporters do not enjoy The Hundred, according to the interim results of a survey conducted by the Cricket Supporters' Association.

    The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to the survey.

    Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they found it "not enjoyable", with 11 per cent more saying it was neither enjoyable nor not enjoyable. Only 27 per cent said they found it enjoyable.

    By comparison, 98 per cent of respondents said they found Test cricket enjoyable. Only 1 per cent said it was "not enjoyable".

    The survey, which was partly funded by the ECB, took around 25 minutes to complete and was done so 3,704 times.


    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/countycricket/the_hundred_english_cricket_least_enjoyable_competition_fans_survey.html

    Genuinely they have asked the wrong people. It was never for existing cricket fans.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,103
    edited September 2022

    I AM SHOCKED BY THESE SURVEY RESULTS! SHOCKED TO THE CORE!

    The Hundred is English cricket's least enjoyable competition, fans survey finds

    GEORGE DOBELL: The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to a Cricket Supporters' Association survey completed 3,704 times


    Almost two-thirds of cricket supporters do not enjoy The Hundred, according to the interim results of a survey conducted by the Cricket Supporters' Association.

    The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to the survey.

    Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they found it "not enjoyable", with 11 per cent more saying it was neither enjoyable nor not enjoyable. Only 27 per cent said they found it enjoyable.

    By comparison, 98 per cent of respondents said they found Test cricket enjoyable. Only 1 per cent said it was "not enjoyable".

    The survey, which was partly funded by the ECB, took around 25 minutes to complete and was done so 3,704 times.


    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/countycricket/the_hundred_english_cricket_least_enjoyable_competition_fans_survey.html

    They thought Test Cricket was for old farts, and while that may be true, those old farts are used to the internet and following live-text updates all day, so know how to respond to online surveys? And the patience to complete one that lasts 25 minutes?
  • rcs1000 said:

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    What's wrong with Willing Buyer, Willing Seller?
    Nothing, but unless I'm missing your point, more people are willing to buy in Poundbury, for all that it's a pastiche, and looks daft from a fair few angles, than in most contemporaneous developments.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,964
    edited September 2022

    HYUFD said:

    kle4 said:

    RobD said:

    https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1570100104366891008?t=1x1PjcOTF544q35eUzxiTg&s=19

    NYT with the shocking expose that the state pay for a head of states funeral. Keep your beaks out twatsworths.
    No Exposé without Representaté!

    What a joke.
    How much it will cost may well be a news story, but 'taxpayers paying for it' is not.
    Oh it is, I remember John Major pointing out the Windsor castle fire took place during a recession and there was no way the country was going to pay for the restoration in those circumstances.

    That's why the Queen had to open up Buck House to the tourists.
    Paris city council contributed 50 million euros to the Notre Dame restoration fund
    Wasn't Notre Dame open to the public all year round though, rather than not at all or later on for just for one month a year?

    Abolish the monarchy and we could have Buck House attracting tourists 12 months a year.
    No we couldn't, it would likely be the President's residence as the Elysee Palace is Macron's residence and the Elysee is open less than Buckingham Palace. Notre Dame is also a cathedral not a palace
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,404
    Sean_F said:

    I've just realised that the way to liven up all this primogeniture nonsense is to take a leaf out of Stardust's book (and film...). The dying monarch sets all his or her children a dangerous quest to do. The first to complete the quest becomes the new monarch.

    In this case, Charles would waste time telling off his servant about the sort of tie he has to wear on the quest;
    Anne would zoom off on the nearest horse.
    Andrew would be too busy shagging Bernard (*)
    Whilst Edward would forget about the quest and direct a reality TV show about it.

    They probably don't have to go to the extent of the books, where all the male kids kill each other off...

    (*) You need to know the film.

    I could envisage a situation in which Meghan arranges for a plane carrying William and his children to be blown up. Charles dies of grief. However, Kate Middleton avoids the bombing at the last moment, and ferrets out the truth. King Harry is forced to allow his wife to be impeached by the Commons, and placed on trial for murder by the Lords. Parliament passes legislation to execute Meghan if she's found guilty. Kate seduces Harry, and urges that she becomes his Queen. But, Meghan plans the massacre of Parliament at her trial.
    Are you the Daily Mail Golden Scenario planner?
  • GIN1138 said:

    Leon said:

    GIN1138 said:

    jonny83 said:

    Just catching up with today's events. The choir singing Psalm 139 as the Coffin was brought in was absolutely beautiful.

    I would guess HMQ has chosen all the hymns/music we hear during her service and funeral?
    Yes. She took a keen and well informed interest

    She understood that half of royalty is this; the ceremonial. You have to nail these big events. That’s kinda the point. They capture the nation’s emotions

    So far I’d give her dramaturgy 9/10

    I’m knocking a point off for the flight from Edinburgh to Northolt. They should have found a way to do the train or a car. That would have been amazing. The whole nation throwing flowers

    Otherwise: perfect

    Yes I agree. It's a shame they didn't take her from Edinburgh to London on a train. Through the cities and the market towns. Through the villages and the shires. It would have been the ideal way to include all her subjects in her final goodbye.
    Agree. Especially by puggy train. Would have been enchanting.
    If they'd done it by train into St Pancras then they would have got a rare bit of track in the book between the ECML and HS1.


    Apparently.
  • ClippPClippP Posts: 1,904
    dixiedean said:

    ydoethur said:

    I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    That ruins Lady Whiteadder's give about 'where there are relatives, there is evidence of sex!'
    Calling friends of your parents Auntie or Uncle is a custom I also heard in Liverpool, possibly amongst the Irish / Catholic contingent.

    It definitely isn't unique to Pakistan.
    I can confirm my parents' friends were my Aunts and Uncles.
    I went years not knowing I wasn't related to them.
    Irish/Catholic woollyback here.
    Perfectly normal in the London suburbs in the 1940s...

    In fact, there was a Ralph Reeder gang show circa 1952, with one character called "Auntie", precisely for that reason.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,269

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    I have huge conflicts in my head about old vs new in architecture. I abhor hanging on the old stuff just got the sake of it. I always ask, if the Romans had had double glazing, they would have used it.
    And would have charged extra for it, in the vast slums they built that fell over all the time…

    Terror of the old is as stupid as terror of the new. Mix and match. Evolve what works.

    The things that people like about Edwardian terraces are a few features that make brick boxes less of a box, at the front and the garden.

    I know bay windows are ultra, neon fascism but maybe the architects should shut up for once.
  • ydoethur said:

    I AM SHOCKED BY THESE SURVEY RESULTS! SHOCKED TO THE CORE!

    The Hundred is English cricket's least enjoyable competition, fans survey finds

    GEORGE DOBELL: The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to a Cricket Supporters' Association survey completed 3,704 times


    Almost two-thirds of cricket supporters do not enjoy The Hundred, according to the interim results of a survey conducted by the Cricket Supporters' Association.

    The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to the survey.

    Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they found it "not enjoyable", with 11 per cent more saying it was neither enjoyable nor not enjoyable. Only 27 per cent said they found it enjoyable.

    By comparison, 98 per cent of respondents said they found Test cricket enjoyable. Only 1 per cent said it was "not enjoyable".

    The survey, which was partly funded by the ECB, took around 25 minutes to complete and was done so 3,704 times.


    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/countycricket/the_hundred_english_cricket_least_enjoyable_competition_fans_survey.html

    If you will spend all your time telling your customers you're launching a new product because you hate their guts and think they're silly, and then tailor it to be everything they hate...what do you expect?

    The Strauss review should have started by asking if the ECB is past it and needs abolishing.
    With great respect to the responders, the title states that it has been designed to attract 'new supporters'; by definition, not the old ones. So it's not surprising or presumably particularly distressing that they don't like it.
  • dixiedean said:

    ydoethur said:

    I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    That ruins Lady Whiteadder's give about 'where there are relatives, there is evidence of sex!'
    Calling friends of your parents Auntie or Uncle is a custom I also heard in Liverpool, possibly amongst the Irish / Catholic contingent.

    It definitely isn't unique to Pakistan.
    I can confirm my parents' friends were my Aunts and Uncles.
    I went years not knowing I wasn't related to them.
    Irish/Catholic woollyback here.
    It's also a custom in USA, quite widespread and NOT limited to Catholics.
    Same here. Aunty Christine and Uncle Raymond etc.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,360
    ydoethur said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    Particularly the architect who infamously told teachers at a school of my acquaintance that they were stupid Philistines for not appreciating his classroom design.

    His L-shaped classroom design.
    One of the worst was Robin Hood Gardens.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,103

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    I have huge conflicts in my head about old vs new in architecture. I abhor hanging on the old stuff just got the sake of it. I always ask, if the Romans had had double glazing, they would have used it.
    Use modern materials, techniques and innovations, but if an older style (or pastiche of an older style) is still more attractive, don't junk it.
  • Any requests for Sunday's threads, I'm writing them well in advance.

    Why AV is the most appropriate method for electing our first President.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,397

    ydoethur said:

    I AM SHOCKED BY THESE SURVEY RESULTS! SHOCKED TO THE CORE!

    The Hundred is English cricket's least enjoyable competition, fans survey finds

    GEORGE DOBELL: The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to a Cricket Supporters' Association survey completed 3,704 times


    Almost two-thirds of cricket supporters do not enjoy The Hundred, according to the interim results of a survey conducted by the Cricket Supporters' Association.

    The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to the survey.

    Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they found it "not enjoyable", with 11 per cent more saying it was neither enjoyable nor not enjoyable. Only 27 per cent said they found it enjoyable.

    By comparison, 98 per cent of respondents said they found Test cricket enjoyable. Only 1 per cent said it was "not enjoyable".

    The survey, which was partly funded by the ECB, took around 25 minutes to complete and was done so 3,704 times.


    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/countycricket/the_hundred_english_cricket_least_enjoyable_competition_fans_survey.html

    If you will spend all your time telling your customers you're launching a new product because you hate their guts and think they're silly, and then tailor it to be everything they hate...what do you expect?

    The Strauss review should have started by asking if the ECB is past it and needs abolishing.
    With great respect to the responders, the title states that it has been designed to attract 'new supporters'; by definition, not the old ones. So it's not surprising or presumably particularly distressing that they don't like it.
    It's fair enough to try and attract new supporters.

    It's more than a bit dumb to tell your existing ones that they're useless old twats whose views don't matter and design the new format as far as possible to spit in their faces.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,103

    ydoethur said:

    I AM SHOCKED BY THESE SURVEY RESULTS! SHOCKED TO THE CORE!

    The Hundred is English cricket's least enjoyable competition, fans survey finds

    GEORGE DOBELL: The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to a Cricket Supporters' Association survey completed 3,704 times


    Almost two-thirds of cricket supporters do not enjoy The Hundred, according to the interim results of a survey conducted by the Cricket Supporters' Association.

    The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to the survey.

    Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they found it "not enjoyable", with 11 per cent more saying it was neither enjoyable nor not enjoyable. Only 27 per cent said they found it enjoyable.

    By comparison, 98 per cent of respondents said they found Test cricket enjoyable. Only 1 per cent said it was "not enjoyable".

    The survey, which was partly funded by the ECB, took around 25 minutes to complete and was done so 3,704 times.


    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/countycricket/the_hundred_english_cricket_least_enjoyable_competition_fans_survey.html

    If you will spend all your time telling your customers you're launching a new product because you hate their guts and think they're silly, and then tailor it to be everything they hate...what do you expect?

    The Strauss review should have started by asking if the ECB is past it and needs abolishing.
    With great respect to the responders, the title states that it has been designed to attract 'new supporters'; by definition, not the old ones. So it's not surprising or presumably particularly distressing that they don't like it.
    I get that, though I don't really know why confusing angles and order of replays on clips of the action is more appealing to non-fans. Otherwise I'm generally in favour as I can ignore the gimmicks.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,269

    rcs1000 said:

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    What's wrong with Willing Buyer, Willing Seller?
    Nothing, but unless I'm missing your point, more people are willing to buy in Poundbury, for all that it's a pastiche, and looks daft from a fair few angles, than in most contemporaneous developments.
    That’s because contemporaneous developments often look shit from *every* angle.
  • ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    I AM SHOCKED BY THESE SURVEY RESULTS! SHOCKED TO THE CORE!

    The Hundred is English cricket's least enjoyable competition, fans survey finds

    GEORGE DOBELL: The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to a Cricket Supporters' Association survey completed 3,704 times


    Almost two-thirds of cricket supporters do not enjoy The Hundred, according to the interim results of a survey conducted by the Cricket Supporters' Association.

    The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to the survey.

    Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they found it "not enjoyable", with 11 per cent more saying it was neither enjoyable nor not enjoyable. Only 27 per cent said they found it enjoyable.

    By comparison, 98 per cent of respondents said they found Test cricket enjoyable. Only 1 per cent said it was "not enjoyable".

    The survey, which was partly funded by the ECB, took around 25 minutes to complete and was done so 3,704 times.


    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/countycricket/the_hundred_english_cricket_least_enjoyable_competition_fans_survey.html

    If you will spend all your time telling your customers you're launching a new product because you hate their guts and think they're silly, and then tailor it to be everything they hate...what do you expect?

    The Strauss review should have started by asking if the ECB is past it and needs abolishing.
    With great respect to the responders, the title states that it has been designed to attract 'new supporters'; by definition, not the old ones. So it's not surprising or presumably particularly distressing that they don't like it.
    It's fair enough to try and attract new supporters.

    It's more than a bit dumb to tell your existing ones that they're useless old twats whose views don't matter and design the new format as far as possible to spit in their faces.
    I am a cricket sympathiser rather than an active fan. I know nothing about the format, so I can't comment. I thought most things in modern cricket were brought over from India.
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,288
    kle4 said:

    I AM SHOCKED BY THESE SURVEY RESULTS! SHOCKED TO THE CORE!

    The Hundred is English cricket's least enjoyable competition, fans survey finds

    GEORGE DOBELL: The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to a Cricket Supporters' Association survey completed 3,704 times


    Almost two-thirds of cricket supporters do not enjoy The Hundred, according to the interim results of a survey conducted by the Cricket Supporters' Association.

    The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to the survey.

    Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they found it "not enjoyable", with 11 per cent more saying it was neither enjoyable nor not enjoyable. Only 27 per cent said they found it enjoyable.

    By comparison, 98 per cent of respondents said they found Test cricket enjoyable. Only 1 per cent said it was "not enjoyable".

    The survey, which was partly funded by the ECB, took around 25 minutes to complete and was done so 3,704 times.


    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/countycricket/the_hundred_english_cricket_least_enjoyable_competition_fans_survey.html

    They thought Test Cricket was for old farts, and while that may be true, those old farts are used to the internet and following live-text updates all day, so know how to respond to online surveys? And the patience to complete one that lasts 25 minutes?
    You think a shorter form would have been more favourable to a shorter form?
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,486

    Any requests for Sunday's threads, I'm writing them well in advance.

    “Poundbury, a retirement village for stepmoms or the future of NIMBY friendly housing development?”
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,990
    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,103
    edited September 2022
    Pro_Rata said:

    kle4 said:

    I AM SHOCKED BY THESE SURVEY RESULTS! SHOCKED TO THE CORE!

    The Hundred is English cricket's least enjoyable competition, fans survey finds

    GEORGE DOBELL: The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to a Cricket Supporters' Association survey completed 3,704 times


    Almost two-thirds of cricket supporters do not enjoy The Hundred, according to the interim results of a survey conducted by the Cricket Supporters' Association.

    The tournament, introduced by the ECB to attract new supporters to the sport, was rated the least popular of all formats of the game by respondents to the survey.

    Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they found it "not enjoyable", with 11 per cent more saying it was neither enjoyable nor not enjoyable. Only 27 per cent said they found it enjoyable.

    By comparison, 98 per cent of respondents said they found Test cricket enjoyable. Only 1 per cent said it was "not enjoyable".

    The survey, which was partly funded by the ECB, took around 25 minutes to complete and was done so 3,704 times.


    https://www.thecricketer.com/Topics/countycricket/the_hundred_english_cricket_least_enjoyable_competition_fans_survey.html

    They thought Test Cricket was for old farts, and while that may be true, those old farts are used to the internet and following live-text updates all day, so know how to respond to online surveys? And the patience to complete one that lasts 25 minutes?
    You think a shorter form would have been more favourable to a shorter form?
    Sorry, misread and missed the joke.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,103
    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,659

    rcs1000 said:

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    What's wrong with Willing Buyer, Willing Seller?
    Nothing, but unless I'm missing your point, more people are willing to buy in Poundbury, for all that it's a pastiche, and looks daft from a fair few angles, than in most contemporaneous developments.
    Edwardian Mock Tudor and Victorian Gothic Revival were both heavily criticised in their day.

    Poundbury does look like an English version of Disney World's Celebration township, but each to their own.

    https://www.florida-backroads-travel.com/celebration-florida.html
  • kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    Remember during the Brexit Parliamentary Battle of The Somme we spent hours looking at the front door of 10 Downing Street?
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,668

    dixiedean said:

    ydoethur said:

    I have an auntie* who is so much like Lady Whiteadder.

    She actually smacked me around the face and called me a wicked child** when I was 25.

    *Pakistani custom, all friends of your parents you call them auntie or uncle.

    **A lot more strong in Urdu.

    That ruins Lady Whiteadder's give about 'where there are relatives, there is evidence of sex!'
    Calling friends of your parents Auntie or Uncle is a custom I also heard in Liverpool, possibly amongst the Irish / Catholic contingent.

    It definitely isn't unique to Pakistan.
    I can confirm my parents' friends were my Aunts and Uncles.
    I went years not knowing I wasn't related to them.
    Irish/Catholic woollyback here.
    It's also a custom in USA, quite widespread and NOT limited to Catholics.
    Same here. Aunty Christine and Uncle Raymond etc.
    Interesting. Maybe it is just traditionalist. [This was Liverpool in the 70s/80s, BTW]

    Wasn't something my family ever did. I wonder where it originated (or why it died out, if it did).
  • Leon said:

    Queue is only 5-6 hours.

    I'm tempted.

    I reckon if you joined the queue around 1-2am you’d be in and out before dawn easily

    That’s what I did with the Queen Mum, sort of. Joined around 11pm. Out by 1am. And well worth it

    The fact I’m still talking about it now, and can still vividly remember the deep emotions, tells you why
    I've watched the live feed on BBC Parliament for 20 minutes.

    I've been struck by how emotional everyone looks, particularly the women.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,718

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    Remember during the Brexit Parliamentary Battle of The Somme we spent hours looking at the front door of 10 Downing Street?
    And the paint was already dry.

  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405
    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    Yes, and a sleigh ride and a sheep to jumper event (shear the sheep, spin the wool, knit the jumper).
  • Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    What's wrong with Willing Buyer, Willing Seller?
    Nothing, but unless I'm missing your point, more people are willing to buy in Poundbury, for all that it's a pastiche, and looks daft from a fair few angles, than in most contemporaneous developments.
    Edwardian Mock Tudor and Victorian Gothic Revival were both heavily criticised in their day.

    Poundbury does look like an English version of Disney World's Celebration township, but each to their own.

    https://www.florida-backroads-travel.com/celebration-florida.html
    Has a Truman Show vibe, I think.
  • Leon said:

    Queue is only 5-6 hours.

    I'm tempted.

    I reckon if you joined the queue around 1-2am you’d be in and out before dawn easily

    That’s what I did with the Queen Mum, sort of. Joined around 11pm. Out by 1am. And well worth it

    The fact I’m still talking about it now, and can still vividly remember the deep emotions, tells you why
    I've watched the live feed on BBC Parliament for 20 minutes.

    I've been struck by how emotional everyone looks, particularly the women.
    This is interesting as a cultural thing.

    How many hours of queuing would you endure to pay your last respects?

    3, 4, 5, a dozen, thirty six?

    Could be a new SI unit: queutics.

  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405

    Leon said:

    Queue is only 5-6 hours.

    I'm tempted.

    I reckon if you joined the queue around 1-2am you’d be in and out before dawn easily

    That’s what I did with the Queen Mum, sort of. Joined around 11pm. Out by 1am. And well worth it

    The fact I’m still talking about it now, and can still vividly remember the deep emotions, tells you why
    I've watched the live feed on BBC Parliament for 20 minutes.

    I've been struck by how emotional everyone looks, particularly the women.
    It’s somewhat self selected mind. Composed of people moved enough to queue for hours for 10 s with a sealed coffin that might not even contain the queens mortal remains.*

    *Just trying to get in ahead of @leon on the conspiracy theory.
  • kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    This is slow television i believe. It's a thing.

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840
    Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    What's wrong with Willing Buyer, Willing Seller?
    Nothing, but unless I'm missing your point, more people are willing to buy in Poundbury, for all that it's a pastiche, and looks daft from a fair few angles, than in most contemporaneous developments.
    Edwardian Mock Tudor and Victorian Gothic Revival were both heavily criticised in their day.

    Poundbury does look like an English version of Disney World's Celebration township, but each to their own.

    https://www.florida-backroads-travel.com/celebration-florida.html
    Did you form any view of the quality of the workmanship? I was looking around the first bit when it was a few years old, with a friend who is into DIY home building, and some of the rendering/harling/stucco/whatever was alreadfy being replaced. The cemetery gates to the north didn't look too great either.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    Remember during the Brexit Parliamentary Battle of The Somme we spent hours looking at the front door of 10 Downing Street?
    I found the BBC Parliament division chatter surprisingly compelling during the endless HoC votes.
  • kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    Yes, and a sleigh ride and a sheep to jumper event (shear the sheep, spin the wool, knit the jumper).
    And the ferry journey.

    The BBC did one on a bus in the Yorkshire Dales.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,659

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    I have huge conflicts in my head about old vs new in architecture. I abhor hanging on the old stuff just got the sake of it. I always ask, if the Romans had had double glazing, they would have used it.
    And would have charged extra for it, in the vast slums they built that fell over all the time…

    Terror of the old is as stupid as terror of the new. Mix and match. Evolve what works.

    The things that people like about Edwardian terraces are a few features that make brick boxes less of a box, at the front and the garden.

    I know bay windows are ultra, neon fascism but maybe the architects should shut up for once.
    I like Edwardian houses. Older houses either seem to be knocked together cottages with small rooms and low ceilings, or great soulless sepulchres. The rooms are human sized, well proportioned, and suited to modern living. They have manageable gardens.

    Most importantly they have proper construction such as damp courses, and I high standard of workmanship because before WW1 good craftsmen were employed on low wages. Post WW2 any fool could get a job on a building site, and the quality of workmanship has been pisspoor since.

  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,526

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    I have huge conflicts in my head about old vs new in architecture. I abhor hanging on the old stuff just got the sake of it. I always ask, if the Romans had had double glazing, they would have used it.
    I believe that there are some things, just like our perception of beauty in humans, that we perceive to be beautiful in buildings. The really ugly buildings are those where the architects have ignored all that.
    With humans, it's surely a good thing that we don't all agree - those of us not blessed with classical beauty nonetheless come across eccentrics who think we're good-looking. If we all had to look like Robert Redford it'd be a bit sad.

    And surely the same applies to buildings? The willing buyer/willing seller principle seems hard to argue with. Why should third parties intervene and tel lthem they're wrong?
  • boulay said:

    Any requests for Sunday's threads, I'm writing them well in advance.

    “Poundbury, a retirement village for stepmoms or the future of NIMBY friendly housing development?”
    "Why not use AV to elect the next sovereign?"
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,840

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    Yes, and a sleigh ride and a sheep to jumper event (shear the sheep, spin the wool, knit the jumper).
    A forest with the occasional moose.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705

    Leon said:

    Queue is only 5-6 hours.

    I'm tempted.

    I reckon if you joined the queue around 1-2am you’d be in and out before dawn easily

    That’s what I did with the Queen Mum, sort of. Joined around 11pm. Out by 1am. And well worth it

    The fact I’m still talking about it now, and can still vividly remember the deep emotions, tells you why
    I've watched the live feed on BBC Parliament for 20 minutes.

    I've been struck by how emotional everyone looks, particularly the women.
    It’s somewhat self selected mind. Composed of people moved enough to queue for hours for 10 s with a sealed coffin that might not even contain the queens mortal remains.*

    *Just trying to get in ahead of @leon on the conspiracy theory.
    Randomly at some point over the next 72 hours the coffin will burst open and there'll be a Beadle's About moment.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,659

    Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    What's wrong with Willing Buyer, Willing Seller?
    Nothing, but unless I'm missing your point, more people are willing to buy in Poundbury, for all that it's a pastiche, and looks daft from a fair few angles, than in most contemporaneous developments.
    Edwardian Mock Tudor and Victorian Gothic Revival were both heavily criticised in their day.

    Poundbury does look like an English version of Disney World's Celebration township, but each to their own.

    https://www.florida-backroads-travel.com/celebration-florida.html
    Has a Truman Show vibe, I think.
    Yes, I think so too. It isn't just Britain that is turning into a theme park of its own history.
  • FossFoss Posts: 1,019

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    Yes, and a sleigh ride and a sheep to jumper event (shear the sheep, spin the wool, knit the jumper).
    And the ferry journey.

    The BBC did one on a bus in the Yorkshire Dales.
    The Norwegians have something similar from the front of a train. It's actually quite pretty.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,659
    edited September 2022

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    I have huge conflicts in my head about old vs new in architecture. I abhor hanging on the old stuff just got the sake of it. I always ask, if the Romans had had double glazing, they would have used it.
    I believe that there are some things, just like our perception of beauty in humans, that we perceive to be beautiful in buildings. The really ugly buildings are those where the architects have ignored all that.
    With humans, it's surely a good thing that we don't all agree - those of us not blessed with classical beauty nonetheless come across eccentrics who think we're good-looking. If we all had to look like Robert Redford it'd be a bit sad.

    And surely the same applies to buildings? The willing buyer/willing seller principle seems hard to argue with. Why should third parties intervene and tel lthem they're wrong?
    My advice is to buy the house opposite the thatched cottage. You get the olde worlde view, and don't have to pay to maintain it.
  • kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    It has now become a Christmas tradition, for some US TV stations, to broadast a live stream (or possible film loop) of roaring (or blazing) fire. Often with holiday muzak as accompaniment.

    Think it was a thing in NYC for decades, then started catching on in rest of the country, esp. with growth of cable TV and the expansion of broadcast band channels.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,668
    edited September 2022

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    Yes, and a sleigh ride and a sheep to jumper event (shear the sheep, spin the wool, knit the jumper).
    And the ferry journey.

    The BBC did one on a bus in the Yorkshire Dales.
    A flat day in a cycle race is much the same.

    Sometimes it gets livened up for 30 seconds by a farmer's protest or a mass pile up, but 99% of the time it ends in a bunch sprint.

    Just a bit of scenery rolling past most of the time.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,718

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    Yes, and a sleigh ride and a sheep to jumper event (shear the sheep, spin the wool, knit the jumper).
    Just yesterday my better half told me that the linen towel I was using had been made by her mother in toto. She'd grown the flax, spun the thread and woven the cloth.

  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,404
    Messi,.Neymar and Mbappe score for PSG.
    It's a wonder they don't win every game.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405
    geoffw said:

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Didn't one of the Scandanavian nations broadcast a live stream of a log fire for hours, with big views? Odd things can compel.
    Yes, and a sleigh ride and a sheep to jumper event (shear the sheep, spin the wool, knit the jumper).
    Just yesterday my better half told me that the linen towel I was using had been made by her mother in toto. She'd grown the flax, spun the thread and woven the cloth.

    Having seen flax being turned up into fibre at a historic recreation day, respect to the effort involved in making that towel!
  • That live stream is something else. Weirdly powerful. Moving.

    If I was editor of a Sunday newspaper I would be commissioning articles on what that queue and the live stream tells us about modern Britain and the deep ancestral roots that still stir.

  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,659
    The Wagner group recruiting in a Penal Settlement. Serve six months in Ukraine and then can be free.

    https://twitter.com/wartranslated/status/1570123353331011586?t=KObw59JiJ9c3SNoZ2XBVGg&s=19
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,329
    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    I did point this out yesterday. Re the live feed from Scotland

    It’s an endless series of intense renaissance paintings
  • Leon said:

    Queue is only 5-6 hours.

    I'm tempted.

    I reckon if you joined the queue around 1-2am you’d be in and out before dawn easily

    That’s what I did with the Queen Mum, sort of. Joined around 11pm. Out by 1am. And well worth it

    The fact I’m still talking about it now, and can still vividly remember the deep emotions, tells you why
    I've watched the live feed on BBC Parliament for 20 minutes.

    I've been struck by how emotional everyone looks, particularly the women.
    This is interesting as a cultural thing.

    How many hours of queuing would you endure to pay your last respects?

    3, 4, 5, a dozen, thirty six?

    Could be a new SI unit: queutics.

    Answer is simple: enough for me to get through in one night (so I can work the next day) and squeeze in 3-4 hours sleep.

    So, I reckon queuing from 6pm that about 8 hours would be my limit. Ideally, I'd combine with a Premier Inn nearby.
  • That live stream is something else. Weirdly powerful. Moving.

    If I was editor of a Sunday newspaper I would be commissioning articles on what that queue and the live stream tells us about modern Britain and the deep ancestral roots that still stir.

    I think it shows sod all personally
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,329
    edited September 2022
    This is what I said two days ago, on PB, about the live feed of the Scottish lying in state:

    “This is brilliant. A Sky News feed of the lying-in-state from Edinburgh (looking nobly beautiful in the autumn sun)


    It’s FIVE HOURS of ordinary people filing past the Queen’s coffin. That’s it. And yet it is utterly compelling. The different reactions. Why has the guy with his lunchbox showed up with a scowl? What’s the point? Why is that very young woman crying? Who is the dude in the green tee who apparently doesn’t care, but then suddenly bows, deeply?


    My favourite is the middle aged daughter wheeling in her very elderly mother in a chair. They stop in front of the dead queen. The mother shuts her eyes. The daughter brushes away a single tear. Then the daughter quietly kisses her mother. And off they go


    It is inexplicably moving. Something of the intense human power of monarchy is detailed here. I just can’t quite work out what”

  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,404
    edited September 2022
    Leon said:

    This is what I said two days ago, on PB, about the live feed of the Scottish lying in state:

    “This is brilliant. A Sky News feed of the lying-in-state from Edinburgh (looking nobly beautiful in the autumn sun)


    It’s FIVE HOURS of ordinary people filing past the Queen’s coffin. That’s it. And yet it is utterly compelling. The different reactions. Why has the guy with his lunchbox showed up with a scowl? What’s the point? Why is that very young woman crying? Who is the dude in the green tee who apparently doesn’t care, but then suddenly bows, deeply?


    My favourite is the middle aged daughter wheeling in her very elderly mother in a chair. They stop in front of the dead queen. The mother shuts her eyes. The daughter brushes away a single tear. Then the daughter quietly kisses her mother. And off they go


    It is inexplicably moving. Something of the intense human power of monarchy is detailed here. I just can’t quite work out what”

    We're not the Protestant country some people like to think we are.
  • Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Yes. It is.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,329
    Foxy said:

    rcs1000 said:

    boulay said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The trouble is there is no great British city waiting to be opened up and pedestrianised and revealed in its spleandour like Seville

    The Luftwaffe and the Marxist town planners destroyed most of our great cities and many of our small cities - london Glasgow and Edinburgh apart.

    Newcastle is probably the only big UK city that has some truly magnificent surviving architecture and a noble setting and therefore hope. It appears Liverpool has recently destroyed itself if UNESCO are right

    Why are we so shamefully bad at urbanisation? How come the Spanish can do it and we can’t?

    Perhaps you should write a letter to his majesty the King. He is known for being interested in such matters.
    He’s bang on, in this case

    There was some sneering about Poundbury on this site a couple of days ago. Yet Poundbury is massively popular, is oversubscribed, people want to live there A LOT, and does well on all metrics - crime etc

    Is it toytown? What does that even mean? Venice is Toytown. It is designed to be pretty in a slightly frivolous way. What the fuck is wrong with that? Do we actually want our towns to be ugly? Sometimes it feels that way. Soulless dreary cheapo redbrick suburbs with no sense of urbanity

    Build a thousand Poundburys. Our descendants will thank us
    The problem with Poundbry is that, as with the late Queen’s taste in art, it disappoints he experts.

    The proles should love Brutalist tower blocks. Poundbry is a public slap in the face to Those Who Know Better.

    A friend who teaches the history of art at a university told me that the problem the Queen had with some in the art works was that they thought her taste in pictures somehow belonged to art appreciation world. That she should like what they liked as a sort of public duty.

    Artistic taste is individual. It can be guided and informed. But dictated, no.

    Anyone who says that “You must love X” is wrong at an utterly fundamental level.
    There's nothing wrong with Poundbry. Indeed, it looks (for a new development) rather an attractive place to be. I also love the system they have for first time buyers, where you get to buy at a discount... but then you have to sell to another first time buyer with the same embedded discount.

    On the other hand, I'm a big fan of 'willing buyer, willing seller': if people want to live in Poundbry's, then fantastic! Let the developers build them. If they want to live in high rise buildings, also fantastic! Let the developers build them.

    Willing buyer. Willing seller.

    And different people want different things.
    I wonder if that writer Sean Knox is thinking it might be a good idea to, instead of jumping on the next flight to Seville now he’s seen that Leon is there, go down to Poundbury and write an in depth opinion piece for the Spectator?

    Personally I think Poundbry is a C- in the old style. Nice idea but needs better execution.
    A recreation of the past is never perfect - it is of its time. But it shouldn't be compared to real old buildings - that's daft. Compare it to a similar development of buildings done between the early 90's and now.
    What's wrong with Willing Buyer, Willing Seller?
    Nothing, but unless I'm missing your point, more people are willing to buy in Poundbury, for all that it's a pastiche, and looks daft from a fair few angles, than in most contemporaneous developments.
    Edwardian Mock Tudor and Victorian Gothic Revival were both heavily criticised in their day.

    Poundbury does look like an English version of Disney World's Celebration township, but each to their own.

    https://www.florida-backroads-travel.com/celebration-florida.html
    Show us where you live @Foxy

    Not exactly: but the style

    I guarantee it will be derivative and laughable in some way
  • Feck, 2 penalties and a red card against Rangers at Ibrox, easy seen it wasn’t a Scottish ref.

    Are they the King’s 11 now?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,329
    edited September 2022
    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    This is what I said two days ago, on PB, about the live feed of the Scottish lying in state:

    “This is brilliant. A Sky News feed of the lying-in-state from Edinburgh (looking nobly beautiful in the autumn sun)


    It’s FIVE HOURS of ordinary people filing past the Queen’s coffin. That’s it. And yet it is utterly compelling. The different reactions. Why has the guy with his lunchbox showed up with a scowl? What’s the point? Why is that very young woman crying? Who is the dude in the green tee who apparently doesn’t care, but then suddenly bows, deeply?


    My favourite is the middle aged daughter wheeling in her very elderly mother in a chair. They stop in front of the dead queen. The mother shuts her eyes. The daughter brushes away a single tear. Then the daughter quietly kisses her mother. And off they go


    It is inexplicably moving. Something of the intense human power of monarchy is detailed here. I just can’t quite work out what”

    We're not the Protestant country some people like to think we are.
    Nah bollocks. Protestantism is full of reverence and worship

    This is religious but it’s fuck all to do with Christian denominations. That’s laughably wrong
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 8,671

    Scott_xP said:

    The live stream of people passing the coffin is utterly compelling, for no obvious reasons

    Yes. It is.
    Inspired by the BBC to put it up. I was getting a little irritated by the coverage but it's actually the constant filler from the newsreaders that is annoying.

    I just want to watch London do it's thing. The last great fanfare from the former Imperial Capital.
  • Leon said:

    This is what I said two days ago, on PB, about the live feed of the Scottish lying in state:

    “This is brilliant. A Sky News feed of the lying-in-state from Edinburgh (looking nobly beautiful in the autumn sun)


    It’s FIVE HOURS of ordinary people filing past the Queen’s coffin. That’s it. And yet it is utterly compelling. The different reactions. Why has the guy with his lunchbox showed up with a scowl? What’s the point? Why is that very young woman crying? Who is the dude in the green tee who apparently doesn’t care, but then suddenly bows, deeply?


    My favourite is the middle aged daughter wheeling in her very elderly mother in a chair. They stop in front of the dead queen. The mother shuts her eyes. The daughter brushes away a single tear. Then the daughter quietly kisses her mother. And off they go


    It is inexplicably moving. Something of the intense human power of monarchy is detailed here. I just can’t quite work out what”

    It's almost like you were there.
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