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Trump back as favourite to win WH2014 – politicalbetting.com

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  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 49,002

    I typed in "A tram at the newly opened Edgbaston Village tram stop on 16th August":




    Very good @Sunil_Prasannan
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 2,373
    Foxy said:

    CatMan said:

    Alistair said:

    rcs1000 said:
    There is an absolute humdinger of a fake twitter thread based on this policy floating around. I was initially taken in by it before I applied the necessary level of scepticism.

    Shows even the most incredibly savvy and sophisticated internet user such as my self is vulnerable to propaganda crafted to hit preconceived biases.
    Is this fake? Probably. Oh well.


    To some of us of a certain vintage, Starship Trooper means only one thing.

    Time and a word?
    The best Yes album ever.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 20,423

    I typed in "A tram at the newly opened Edgbaston Village tram stop on 16th August":




    I saw the tram going to Edgbaston Village when I was in Birmingham for the Commonwealth Games. Haven't been on it yet.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,637
    Dynamo said:

    Oh I see, DALLE-2 lets you give it a helping hand, as if you were a Richard Dawkins-style wholly objective and material reality-based evolution "guide"... This is what I got after a few rounds of assisted variation. Goodness knows why they are so symmetrical. They can perhaps be compared in artistic quality to paintings by bottom-of-the-market artists, but even a two-bit painter would surely do a better job at producing a pretend Carrington if they put their back into it?

    image

    Seriously - a forest glade, painted in the style of LC! It's not hard to imagine loads of things that could go into that glade... but this is what the great DALLE-2 can come up with after repeatedly being helped!

    Someone else had a go at Leonora:

    Dall-e 2
    The hands that control the nebula # 2
    Surreal style of Leonora Carrington
    Uncropped
    #openai #dalle2 #dalle #aiartist #aiart #surrealism




    https://twitter.com/triflingtree/status/1557657985358462978?s=20&t=7UtJcqte7H1p5sW7LPUMSg



    Not amazing, but a lot better than yours. Work on your prompts? We don't know the full prompt here, tho
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    rcs1000 said:

    My willingness to be impressed with technology is almost entirely dependent on how hard I think it would be for me to recreate it.

    Take Microsoft Word. If you gave me infinite time, I could recreate it.

    By contrast, I couldn't design even a simple microprocessor, despite having read reasonably extensively on the subject.

    Dalle-2 definitely comes in the first category.

    Yes, because it is software. By the same token do you not think you could recreate the human brain (as software, not the meat it runs on)?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,637
    Bwahaha


    “Jabba the Hutt as a gangsta rapper. 1996 photo” by KarlRunarsson

    #dalle #dalle2 #aiart #aiartwork



  • CookieCookie Posts: 8,142
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Leon said:

    Dalle2 is also getting better at faces (when allowed)

    At first glance it is hard to believe this isn't a real person, but it is not a real person. What's with the clingfilm on her neck

    Once it is truly allowed to let rip with genuine faces, holy shit

    "Experimenting with different lighting setups with #dalle2 and the results are consistently stunning. I am missing the ability to reuse seeds here. I would love the chance to tweak an output to improve the way I prompt. Without it, tweaking prompts involves a lot of guesswork."


    https://twitter.com/TomLikesRobots/status/1559846133064732672?s=20&t=yAAzIec8tv1mmZnNLdU44Q



    Too perfect to be a real person.
    Yes, perhaps

    Imagine what this tech will do when it is let off the leash. It can create gorgeous human faces and bodies. It can move them around - imaginatively

    It will create fake actors and actresses of flawless, hypnotic beauty, and we will love them; it will give them exactly the right voices and mannerisms to be charming and sexy - it will make the best Hollywood Stars in history. They will never age, or get drunk, they will never slap someone at the Oscars, they will work for nothing, in movies which are entirely generated - people, scenes, locations, words - by computer

    It will be dazzling. The best movies ever made. And it will be inhuman, in all senses of the word
    We're almost there already. Most Hollywood movies contain far, far more special effects than you think. Basically: it's pointless hiring extras or building sets. Increasingly, it is only the leading actors that are human.
    And then the leading actors too will go

    The potential is obvious and mind boggling. For a start Hollywood studios will be able to revive, with total accuracy, much loved stars from the past. A young De Niro. Cary Grant. Marilyn Monroe. Liz Taylor age 19. Or beloved comedians that everyone misses, Woody Allen before he got cranky, Gene Wilder, the Pythons at their peak

    They will star in new fake movies. and people will love them once more, just as they did. So there will be no need for actual annoying humans with their flaws and ageing faces and liking for underage boys, or bourbon and cocaine

    Or maybe the studios will inject the computer actors with flaws to make them even more believable? Fuck knows
    Mostly, get rid of the actors. Fine. Actors are overrated and if you spot the actor rather than the character then tha actor isn't doing his job.
    The exception - and the area AI will master last - is comedy: comedy is massively underrated as an art form, and good comic actors are for me the most talented of the bunch.
    Once AI can do something like Green Wing then humanity really can give up.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 19,093
    MrEd said:

    Off Topic

    Thoughts and prayers for GB News as Discovery sells its stake.

    Sorry Pete, not as big a deal as you think nor 'sends a signal'.

    Warner Bros Discovery CEO said last week that the company was changing strategy and not making so wild bets as in the past - and GB News is that.

    Still the fact that GB News is now being funded by wealthy individuals who believe in it and it's message is probably the best thing for continued funding for the channel. John Malone can be quite ruthless with things .

    Hmmm. £60m in new investment. Now with GB News production values that could take them well into the next century.

    "No spin, no bias".
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 15,486
    The AI pictures on this thread are mundane and mediocre. What exactly is the point of them?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 49,002
    IshmaelZ said:

    rcs1000 said:

    My willingness to be impressed with technology is almost entirely dependent on how hard I think it would be for me to recreate it.

    Take Microsoft Word. If you gave me infinite time, I could recreate it.

    By contrast, I couldn't design even a simple microprocessor, despite having read reasonably extensively on the subject.

    Dalle-2 definitely comes in the first category.

    Yes, because it is software. By the same token do you not think you could recreate the human brain (as software, not the meat it runs on)?
    Nope. Wouldn't have a clue.

    Dalle-2 is brilliant in its simplicity. I am itching to explain it, so just ask :smile:
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 15,486
    Leon said:

    Bwahaha


    “Jabba the Hutt as a gangsta rapper. 1996 photo” by KarlRunarsson

    #dalle #dalle2 #aiart #aiartwork



    What is this?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 49,002
    For the first time ever, the time that people in the US spend watching streaming services exceeded cable:


  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,637

    Leon said:

    Bwahaha


    “Jabba the Hutt as a gangsta rapper. 1996 photo” by KarlRunarsson

    #dalle #dalle2 #aiart #aiartwork



    What is this?
    The AI has taken the image of Jabba the Hutt, turned him into a gangsta rapper in a hoodie, and represented it in the style of a photograph from the 1990s. And it did it in ten seconds
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    This the output for Leonora Carrington glade with strange creatures

    https://huggingface.co/spaces/dalle-mini/dalle-mini
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,637
    Last one. Neat


    "35mm photo of a humanized rat chilling on a couch watching TV and smoking weed, digital art" Dalle Is crazy"




    https://twitter.com/sixffline/status/1558923715475152896?s=20&t=7UtJcqte7H1p5sW7LPUMSg
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 19,093
    Andy_JS said:

    CatMan said:

    .

    Andy_JS said:

    Alistair said:

    TimS said:

    Alistair said:

    TimS said:

    I have been playing around with Dall:E this month. It’s variable - some remarkably good results, some a bit meh.

    Here’s three good examples:


    The last one (unlabelled) was “Liz Truss as princess Celestia from My Little Pony”.

    I think Dall-e has restrictions on famous people as this was its attempt at "portrait of tony blair in the style of chuck close"

    Which, as you can see, looks nothing like Tony Blair, nor the style of Chuck Close.


    It blocked any attempt at Boris, Trump, Macron etc. But somehow Truss got through. Not famous enough perhaps (yet).
    Weirdly for my Tony Blair prompt it also produced this which, to its credit is sort of in the style of Chuck Close post stroke but is clearly of Jack Straw

    Looks more like Donald Rumsfeld in the 1980s IMO.
    Not sure it does. For comparison here's an actual picture of him from the 80s:



    I think it's pretty close to him, maybe the 1990s rather than 1980s.
    Nah, it's Nick Hewer formerly of Countdown.
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651
    IshmaelZ said:


    This the output for Leonora Carrington glade with strange creatures

    https://huggingface.co/spaces/dalle-mini/dalle-mini

    I don't think that program likes me. This is what I got for "Two Bedlington terriers in different emotional states, three priestly enthusiasts of kabbalah, and a twenty-something female somnambulist, all painted in the style of Leonora Carrington":

    image
  • wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,650
    edited August 2022
    2 by elections tonight
    LD easy hold in Cambridge and Tories lose one to an independant in Wyre. They've proposed a new quarry in tbe ward, and perhaps unsurprisingly the ward has said fuck you, voting in an anti quarry indy.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,637
    Dynamo said:

    IshmaelZ said:


    This the output for Leonora Carrington glade with strange creatures

    https://huggingface.co/spaces/dalle-mini/dalle-mini

    I don't think that program likes me. This is what I got for "Two Bedlington terriers in different emotional states, three priestly enthusiasts of kabbalah, and a twenty-something female somnambulist, all painted in the style of Leonora Carrington":

    image
    Are you using Dalle? Dalle-2? Mini-dalle?
  • Jim_MillerJim_Miller Posts: 1,059
    rcs1000 said: "There's a lot of evidence that candidates without political experience do - on average - worse that seasoned politicians."

    Let me extend that: There's a lot of evidence that people without experience do their jobs - on average - worse that people with experience.

    Which is why I prefer candidates for high executive positions to have appropriate experiences. Through most of our history, most American voters agreed with me, most of the time. And so our successful presidents have often been governors or generals before becoming president. (Or in the early days, secretaries of state, when foreign policy problems were central.)
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,637
    Dynamo said:

    IshmaelZ said:


    This the output for Leonora Carrington glade with strange creatures

    https://huggingface.co/spaces/dalle-mini/dalle-mini

    I don't think that program likes me. This is what I got for "Two Bedlington terriers in different emotional states, three priestly enthusiasts of kabbalah, and a twenty-something female somnambulist, all painted in the style of Leonora Carrington":

    image
    Actually, some of those are pretty good. Amusing. It definitely helps to put MORE detail into your prompts, as to style, content, theme. The more explicit or imaginative your instructions, the more impressive the results
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Leon said:

    Dynamo said:

    IshmaelZ said:


    This the output for Leonora Carrington glade with strange creatures

    https://huggingface.co/spaces/dalle-mini/dalle-mini

    I don't think that program likes me. This is what I got for "Two Bedlington terriers in different emotional states, three priestly enthusiasts of kabbalah, and a twenty-something female somnambulist, all painted in the style of Leonora Carrington":

    image
    Are you using Dalle? Dalle-2? Mini-dalle?
    Now that is REALLY interesting because Bedlingtons notoriously look more like sheep than dogs, and it has filed them under sheep despite the terrier clue
  • DynamoDynamo Posts: 651
    Leon said:

    Dynamo said:

    IshmaelZ said:


    This the output for Leonora Carrington glade with strange creatures

    https://huggingface.co/spaces/dalle-mini/dalle-mini

    I don't think that program likes me. This is what I got for "Two Bedlington terriers in different emotional states, three priestly enthusiasts of kabbalah, and a twenty-something female somnambulist, all painted in the style of Leonora Carrington":

    image
    Actually, some of those are pretty good. Amusing. It definitely helps to put MORE detail into your prompts, as to style, content, theme. The more explicit or imaginative your instructions, the more impressive the results
    Leon said:

    Dynamo said:

    IshmaelZ said:


    This the output for Leonora Carrington glade with strange creatures

    https://huggingface.co/spaces/dalle-mini/dalle-mini

    I don't think that program likes me. This is what I got for "Two Bedlington terriers in different emotional states, three priestly enthusiasts of kabbalah, and a twenty-something female somnambulist, all painted in the style of Leonora Carrington":

    image
    Are you using Dalle? Dalle-2? Mini-dalle?
    DALLE-2 here: https://openai.com/dall-e-2/
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 49,002
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Bwahaha


    “Jabba the Hutt as a gangsta rapper. 1996 photo” by KarlRunarsson

    #dalle #dalle2 #aiart #aiartwork



    What is this?
    The AI has taken the image of Jabba the Hutt, turned him into a gangsta rapper in a hoodie, and represented it in the style of a photograph from the 1990s. And it did it in ten seconds
    That's not *quite* true.

    It has generated an image that scores well with image classifiers with the following keys:

    "gangsta rapper"
    "jabba the hutt"
    "1996 photo"
  • pingping Posts: 3,297
    https://www.ft.com/content/e6149799-f67b-4c73-b4c2-17d0142ea999

    “UK consumer confidence hits record low as household mood darkens”
  • LeonLeon Posts: 30,637
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Bwahaha


    “Jabba the Hutt as a gangsta rapper. 1996 photo” by KarlRunarsson

    #dalle #dalle2 #aiart #aiartwork



    What is this?
    The AI has taken the image of Jabba the Hutt, turned him into a gangsta rapper in a hoodie, and represented it in the style of a photograph from the 1990s. And it did it in ten seconds
    That's not *quite* true.

    It has generated an image that scores well with image classifiers with the following keys:

    "gangsta rapper"
    "jabba the hutt"
    "1996 photo"
    Well yes, but as is my wont I phrased it in a more mellifluous way, like a really good piece of neural writing software ;)

    And now I must go to bed. It has actually been quite refreshing to revisit Dalle-2. There are now so many people using it the trickle of impressive images has become a beauteous flood

    But also scary. These machines really will replace virtually all human artists, pretty much, within 10-20 years. Including writers and actors

    Brrr!

    Night night
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 20,423
    "Why Rishi Sunak failed
    The former chancellor, once Britain’s most popular politician, seems to have let No 10 slip from his grasp. Where did he go wrong?
    By Harry Lambert"

    https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/conservatives/2022/08/why-rishi-sunak-failed

    [You can read a few articles for free by registering which is how I read it].
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,825
    edited August 2022

    The AI pictures on this thread are mundane and mediocre. What exactly is the point of them?

    The problem it has is that the best art is not what you asked for, but rather the weirdly unexpected, like the film that I watched tonight on MUBI. "The woman with a knife" or the disturbingly unhinged "Wake in Fright" on BFI player. Films that are hard to like, yet leave you craving to repeat.

    https://mubi.com/films/the-woman-with-a-knife?utm_source=app_share&utm_medium=android

    https://player.bfi.org.uk/subscription/film/watch-wake-in-fright-1971-online

  • CookieCookie Posts: 8,142
    I have just got the following from 'Stockport Viaduct under a low full moon, watercolour'.

    Pretty good considering it's done by a computer which has never seen Stockport Viaduct.
    Oddly wobbly and vague. Like Stockport viaduct in a dream.
    The program I was using (craiyon) seems woeful at faces. Give it a landscape to do and it's a bit better.

  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 20,423
    edited August 2022
    When Trump won in 2016 everyone should have come together to work out why so many people voted for him and to try to ensure that it wouldn't happen again by dealing with the problems that must have resulted in him being elected. The fact that he's favourite again would suggest the problems haven't been properly addressed.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 49,002
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Bwahaha


    “Jabba the Hutt as a gangsta rapper. 1996 photo” by KarlRunarsson

    #dalle #dalle2 #aiart #aiartwork



    What is this?
    The AI has taken the image of Jabba the Hutt, turned him into a gangsta rapper in a hoodie, and represented it in the style of a photograph from the 1990s. And it did it in ten seconds
    That's not *quite* true.

    It has generated an image that scores well with image classifiers with the following keys:

    "gangsta rapper"
    "jabba the hutt"
    "1996 photo"
    Well yes, but as is my wont I phrased it in a more mellifluous way, like a really good piece of neural writing software ;)

    And now I must go to bed. It has actually been quite refreshing to revisit Dalle-2. There are now so many people using it the trickle of impressive images has become a beauteous flood

    But also scary. These machines really will replace virtually all human artists, pretty much, within 10-20 years. Including writers and actors

    Brrr!

    Night night
    I wasn't aware that "mellifluous" actually meant "inaccurate".
  • Jim_MillerJim_Miller Posts: 1,059
    Andy_JS - It is absolutely true that Trump owes some of his support to problems that weren't addressed. For example: During the Obama years, life expectancy fell:
    "The average life expectancy in the United States has been on a decline since 2014. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention cites three main reasons: a 72% increase in overdoses in the last decade (including a 30% increase in opioid overdoses from July 2016 to September 2017, but did not differentiate between accidental overdose with a legal prescription and overdose with opioids obtained illegally and/or combined with illegal drugs i.e., heroin, cocaine, methamphetamine, etc.), a ten-year increase in liver disease (the rate for men age 25 to 34 increased by 8% per year; for women, by 11% per year), and a 33% increase in suicide rates since 1999."
    source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_United_States

    As did the fertility rate. (The rate was, for two years during the George W. Bush presidency, 2006 and 2007, above replacement rate. I don't know of any other industrial nations for which that is true, since 2000.)

    Obama did almost nothing about China's predatory trade policies.

    If any of these problems even interested Obama, he hid his interest well.

    Moreover, Obama's allies worsened race relations, and his administration provoked abortion controversies. You don't make Al Sharpton an ally if you want to improve race relations, and you don't pick a fight with the Little Sisters of the Poor, if you are looking for some middle ground on abortion.

    Obligatory disclaimer: Trump has no solutions to any of these problems, and no interest in doing the hard work of finding solutions.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 49,002
    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    When Trump won in 2016 everyone should have come together to work out why so many people voted for him and to try to ensure that it wouldn't happen again by dealing with the problems that must have resulted in him being elected. The fact that he's favourite again would suggest the problems haven't been properly addressed.

    Many of the problems are incredibly difficult to solve.

    Take the forgotten towns, in Ohio or Pennsylvania or wherever.

    They are stuck in a cycle: businesses leave because of China or automation or private equity owners or just simple bad luck or bad management.

    This means there are no jobs, so people leave.

    Those that remain are the old and those who cannot afford to go elsewhere.

    And the tax base of the city has been screwed, because the major business left. But it still has to pay pensions to retired police, firefighters, etc.

    Taxes rise to meet obligations, which discourages people from moving in. While schools are starved of resources, because the tax base has shrunk, but the spending obligations to retirees remain.

    Ambitious parents leave, and those that stay see their children get terrible educations
    How do you solve this issue?

    These people feel the Federal government has abandoned them.

    And the people of Texas and Arizona and California don't want to send cash to Ohio. It's like the Eurozone crisis, but playing out in thousands of small municipalities across the US.

    And then there are the opiates. People without hope, looking for escape.

    There are no easy answers.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 49,002
    From the 2016 Democratic Primaries:


  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 17,949
    edited August 2022
    Foxy said:

    nico679 said:

    The government is planning a huge overseas recruitment drive to plug the gap in the NHS and social care . Barclays is targeting those from India and the Philippines .

    Of course Barclays daren’t try and recruit from the EU seeing as he was part of the Leave campaign who told EU workers to get lost .

    And those workers hardly feel welcome after being scapegoated by the hateful right wing press .

    Also more likely to be permanent immigrants, rather than temporary, and to set up chain migration.

    Mind you, I really rate our Keralan and Philippine nurses, a great bunch of colleagues
    Aiui (from Spectator TV I think but am too lazy to check) Britain already has a higher proportion of immigrants in the workforce than anywhere else, and also record levels of immigration since Brexit.

    ETA Too many graduates? Something odd is going on.
  • Betfair next prime minister
    1.04 Liz Truss 96%
    21 Rishi Sunak 5%

    Next Conservative leader
    1.04 Liz Truss 96%
    21 Rishi Sunak 5%

    Slight swing back to Rishi.

    Betfair next prime minister
    1.05 Liz Truss 95%
    16.5 Rishi Sunak 6%

    Next Conservative leader
    1.05 Liz Truss 95%
    17.5 Rishi Sunak 6%
  • OT Emma Raducanu has been beaten in the tennis.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 17,949
    edited August 2022
    Covid infections study increases calls for masks

    Two thirds of people with mild Covid-19 are still infectious five days after their symptoms begin, according to a study.

    The research revealed people spread the virus for longer than previously thought, contrary to NHS guidance which states “many will no longer be infectious to others after five days”.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/covid-infections-study-increases-calls-for-masks-vrbcjcr8t (£££)
  • Overseas hiring spree to bail out care homes
    Fears of winter crisis amid 160,000 vacancies in the sector

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/overseas-hiring-spree-to-bail-out-care-homes-rl2wbb2s9 (£££)
  • This England
    Sky TV drama about the government during the first Covid wave with Ken Branagh as Boris.

    Trailer @ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tl8PolKlg5U
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 17,949
    edited August 2022
    Team Truss is back in the clarification game after a 2009 leaflet emerged, co-written by Liz Truss, calling for, inter alia:-

    Doctors to have a 10 per cent pay cut — Liz hates @Foxy
    Patients to be charged to see doctors
    The Royal Navy to lose two aircraft carriers
    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/19553769/liz-truss-charge-patients-doctor-defence-cuts/
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 3,338
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    When Trump won in 2016 everyone should have come together to work out why so many people voted for him and to try to ensure that it wouldn't happen again by dealing with the problems that must have resulted in him being elected. The fact that he's favourite again would suggest the problems haven't been properly addressed.

    Many of the problems are incredibly difficult to solve.

    Take the forgotten towns, in Ohio or Pennsylvania or wherever.

    They are stuck in a cycle: businesses leave because of China or automation or private equity owners or just simple bad luck or bad management.

    This means there are no jobs, so people leave.

    Those that remain are the old and those who cannot afford to go elsewhere.

    And the tax base of the city has been screwed, because the major business left. But it still has to pay pensions to retired police, firefighters, etc.

    Taxes rise to meet obligations, which discourages people from moving in. While schools are starved of resources, because the tax base has shrunk, but the spending obligations to retirees remain.

    Ambitious parents leave, and those that stay see their children get terrible educations
    How do you solve this issue?

    These people feel the Federal government has abandoned them.

    And the people of Texas and Arizona and California don't want to send cash to Ohio. It's like the Eurozone crisis, but playing out in thousands of small municipalities across the US.

    And then there are the opiates. People without hope, looking for escape.

    There are no easy answers.
    This is actually quite a good argument for the more centralised funding model of English Local Government, which dates back to Thatcherite reforms of the 1980s. Similar towns in the UK aren't saddled with having to pay pensions to firefighters. They can't just raise tax either, not so much. So the towns/cities can't really go bankrupt. The problem ends up returning to Central Government, who have to send in commissioners to run failing authorities, an increasingly common phenomenon.
  • 'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 3,338

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
  • darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    Not really like a grammar school. I think a lot of sixth form colleges (and even sixth forms in schools) are selective; perhaps this one more than most.

    But yes, if you filter out pupils who do not want to be in school at all, and then pick the most academic of those, the sausage is halfway made but it is still doing something right if it scores more Oxbridge places than Eton.

    Aggressive targeting, perhaps. One chap once told me he got people through DofE awards by carefully tailoring programmes to people rather than sending massive cohorts through one-size-fits-all expeditions.

    And the power of example. The kids can see what is possible if it has been done before. No longer is there a sense that university is "not for the likes of us".
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 20,423
    "Apple warns of serious security flaw for iPhones, iPads and Macs that could let attackers take complete control of devices - and it may have already been 'exploited'"

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11125441/Apple-warns-security-flaw-iPhones-iPads-Macs.html
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 42,503
    Another morning, another Russian weapons dump on fire.

    The difference today, is that this one is actually in Russia, 30km from the Ukranian border near Kharkiv.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1560384840066895874

    Explosions reported at another Crimean airbase too, this one near Sevastopol.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,316
    edited August 2022
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Disturbingly when I wargame this in my head, as Vlad Putin, I keep reaching the conclusion: Do Something Bad

    ie Leak at least a bit of radiation, blame it on the Ukrainians, say it was shelled. What's not to like? Don't destroy the plant and the world, but do enough - poison a town or two - to put terror into your enemies, and make Europe sue for peace

    Putin and Russia rely on the impression of power and aggression. If they back down now, and nothing happens, then it will look weak. So it was all a bluff. The West will gain resolve

    For this gambit to work best for him, he needs to do something bad at the power plant, just not something apocalyptic, yet

    If I was Putin I woudl want the west to forget about ukraine - hence do very little of interest - a bit of war in the East of Ukraine etc - After all the west (after great consternation at the time) forgot about the Taleban takeover in a matter of weeks , so much so that people were surprised it was only a year ago the other day on the anniversary.
    No, he wants the sanctions lifted. The status quo is not good for him, medium term
    sanctions will get lifted he is does very little either out of boredom, money incentive to break them or the (real) need of the west for Russia's gas especially
    But this is a way to get them lifted very quickly

    Create a Fukushima style calamity. Kill a few hundred people and contaminate 100 sq km of Ukraine

    That would be enough, I reckon, to horrify the world, terrify europe and create pressure on Ukraine to accept a bad peace, as the west agrees to lift sanctions

    It’s not pleasant but I could easily see that “working” for Putin
    And equally, not.
    It's just as likely that the west decides someone so dangerous has to be resisted.

    And just as pertinently, China does not appreciate reckless gambles from its allies, either.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 42,503
    Andy_JS said:

    "Apple warns of serious security flaw for iPhones, iPads and Macs that could let attackers take complete control of devices - and it may have already been 'exploited'"

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11125441/Apple-warns-security-flaw-iPhones-iPads-Macs.html

    Yep, this is a serious one. Update your devices today, guys and gals.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,316
    Is it correct that Weisselberg has said he won't testify against Trump as part of his plea deal ?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 42,503
    edited August 2022

    Foxy said:

    nico679 said:

    The government is planning a huge overseas recruitment drive to plug the gap in the NHS and social care . Barclays is targeting those from India and the Philippines .

    Of course Barclays daren’t try and recruit from the EU seeing as he was part of the Leave campaign who told EU workers to get lost .

    And those workers hardly feel welcome after being scapegoated by the hateful right wing press .

    Also more likely to be permanent immigrants, rather than temporary, and to set up chain migration.

    Mind you, I really rate our Keralan and Philippine nurses, a great bunch of colleagues
    Aiui (from Spectator TV I think but am too lazy to check) Britain already has a higher proportion of immigrants in the workforce than anywhere else, and also record levels of immigration since Brexit.

    ETA Too many graduates? Something odd is going on.
    Waves from UAE, where the locals are only 15% of the population, and about 5% of the workforce. 👋🏼

    But yes, outside a few small petro-states, UK (and USA) is pretty high up the list of countries by number of immigrants - as witnessed by the 6m permanent visas given to EU citizens a couple of years ago.

    Most of the nurses out here are Filipinas by the way, lovely people. Philippines is top of the inverse of the list above, they have more of their citizens working overseas than anywhere else. Their largest source of foreign currency is ‘remittances’ from overseas workers to their families.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 3,338

    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    Not really like a grammar school. I think a lot of sixth form colleges (and even sixth forms in schools) are selective; perhaps this one more than most.

    But yes, if you filter out pupils who do not want to be in school at all, and then pick the most academic of those, the sausage is halfway made but it is still doing something right if it scores more Oxbridge places than Eton.

    Aggressive targeting, perhaps. One chap once told me he got people through DofE awards by carefully tailoring programmes to people rather than sending massive cohorts through one-size-fits-all expeditions.

    And the power of example. The kids can see what is possible if it has been done before. No longer is there a sense that university is "not for the likes of us".
    I am not sure I agree - it seems like the success of this arrangement is very closely connected to the principle of selective education, which is the same principle that drives grammar schools; and it is what left leaning middle class people often object to. Brampton College provides a dilemma for them, because the beneficiaries of the system are overwhelmingly poor people, many of whom appear to be non white and from an immigrant background.

    Somewhere like Peter Symonds College in Winchester typically applies a 5 C's at GCSE admission policy, and gets very good Oxbridge offers, something like 60 in an average year. But it is in an affluent area with very high house prices (Winchester).



  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 16,322
    Nigelb said:

    Is it correct that Weisselberg has said he won't testify against Trump as part of his plea deal ?

    With a name like that you would have thought he would.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 42,503
    Nigelb said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Disturbingly when I wargame this in my head, as Vlad Putin, I keep reaching the conclusion: Do Something Bad

    ie Leak at least a bit of radiation, blame it on the Ukrainians, say it was shelled. What's not to like? Don't destroy the plant and the world, but do enough - poison a town or two - to put terror into your enemies, and make Europe sue for peace

    Putin and Russia rely on the impression of power and aggression. If they back down now, and nothing happens, then it will look weak. So it was all a bluff. The West will gain resolve

    For this gambit to work best for him, he needs to do something bad at the power plant, just not something apocalyptic, yet

    If I was Putin I woudl want the west to forget about ukraine - hence do very little of interest - a bit of war in the East of Ukraine etc - After all the west (after great consternation at the time) forgot about the Taleban takeover in a matter of weeks , so much so that people were surprised it was only a year ago the other day on the anniversary.
    No, he wants the sanctions lifted. The status quo is not good for him, medium term
    sanctions will get lifted he is does very little either out of boredom, money incentive to break them or the (real) need of the west for Russia's gas especially
    But this is a way to get them lifted very quickly

    Create a Fukushima style calamity. Kill a few hundred people and contaminate 100 sq km of Ukraine

    That would be enough, I reckon, to horrify the world, terrify europe and create pressure on Ukraine to accept a bad peace, as the west agrees to lift sanctions

    It’s not pleasant but I could easily see that “working” for Putin
    And equally, not.
    It's just as likely that the west decides someone so dangerous has to be resisted.

    And just as pertinently, China does not appreciate reckless gambles from its allies, either.
    If there’s one thing pretty much guaranteed to get NATO countries actively involved in this war, it’s Russia playing silly games with a nuclear power station and causing an ‘accident’.

    And no, Mr Putin, absolutely no-one believes you when you say that the Ukranians are going to cause an ‘accident’ at their own power station. Any ‘problems’ at Zaporizhzhya are entirely on Russia.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 16,322
    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    Selection and separation at 11 or 16 are completely different.
  • darkage said:

    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    Not really like a grammar school. I think a lot of sixth form colleges (and even sixth forms in schools) are selective; perhaps this one more than most.

    But yes, if you filter out pupils who do not want to be in school at all, and then pick the most academic of those, the sausage is halfway made but it is still doing something right if it scores more Oxbridge places than Eton.

    Aggressive targeting, perhaps. One chap once told me he got people through DofE awards by carefully tailoring programmes to people rather than sending massive cohorts through one-size-fits-all expeditions.

    And the power of example. The kids can see what is possible if it has been done before. No longer is there a sense that university is "not for the likes of us".
    I am not sure I agree - it seems like the success of this arrangement is very closely connected to the principle of selective education, which is the same principle that drives grammar schools; and it is what left leaning middle class people often object to. Brampton College provides a dilemma for them, because the beneficiaries of the system are overwhelmingly poor people, many of whom appear to be non white and from an immigrant background.

    Somewhere like Peter Symonds College in Winchester typically applies a 5 C's at GCSE admission policy, and gets very good Oxbridge offers, something like 60 in an average year. But it is in an affluent area with very high house prices (Winchester).
    We agree it is selective but not whether it is like a grammar school. Both this and the other one you mention probably do well at least in part because their kids apply to Oxbridge in the first place, whereas many don't.
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 11,036
    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    To my mind there is a huge difference between selection at 11 and selection at 16. I don't have a problem with selective sixth forms (my daughter will probably be going to one, pending results next week), and in reality all A level courses have entry requirements. But selection of younger children is unnecessarily divisive, creates two classes of education, writes kids off before some have the chance to show their potential, and is unfair because in reality it disadvantages poorer kids. My objection to selection in education is more practical than ideological - looking at the evidence I don't think it works at 11, but I can see the case for it at 16, and even more so at 18. My objection to private education is both ideological and practical, on the other hand.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,825
    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    For any A level a "B" or better in the relevant GCSE is a requirement, even within schools. It is not like selection for grammar schools at age 11.

    No one objects to selection focused on particular subjects at age 18 to go to University, it is selection at age 11 to cover all subjects that is the problem.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 1,909
    Sandpit said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Apple warns of serious security flaw for iPhones, iPads and Macs that could let attackers take complete control of devices - and it may have already been 'exploited'"

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11125441/Apple-warns-security-flaw-iPhones-iPads-Macs.html

    Yep, this is a serious one. Update your devices today, guys and gals.
    Funnily enough this was being pushed in The Sun earlier yesterday so I took their advice - usually the only advice I take from them is from Dear Deirdre.

    To be fair to them they are quite hot on their tech updates with regular updates re changes to WhatsApp etc.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 72,863
    Nigelb said:

    Is it correct that Weisselberg has said he won't testify against Trump as part of his plea deal ?

    What a name lol
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,348
    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    MrEd said:


    How much do you want to bet Fetternan wins by 17% in November?

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Sort of on-topic... A- Rated pollster Public Opinion Strategies has a new Pennsylvania Senate poll out, and it gives Fetterman a staggering 17 point lead: https://www.politicspa.com/poll-fetterman-shapiro-extend-leads/111049/

    And... the Cook Report has moved Pennsylvania into the Democrat column: https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3606366-cook-report-shifts-pennsylvania-senate-race-to-lean-democrat/
    Slip sliding away ...
    Trump picked the TV doctor guy who doesn't live in the state.

    What could possibly go wrong?

    There's a lot of evidence that candidates without political experience do - on average - worse that seasoned politicians.

    See 538: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/its-hard-to-win-a-senate-race-when-youve-never-won-an-election-before/

    And the Republicans have managed to put up an awful lot of inexperienced candidates in key Senatorial contests:

    Oz in Pennsylvania - was a pro-Choice doctor, and has little connection with the State
    Masters in Arizona - worked for Peter Thiel's hedge fund; thinks that the dollar should be replaced by Bitcoin; speaks in a monotone with weird pauses
    Walker in Georgia - was an American football player
    Vance in Ohio - wrote a book, and worked as a venture capitalist

    Only in Nevada have the Republicans picked an experienced politico - and Laxalit is looking odds on to win that race, even though it should be a much harder State for the Republicans than (say) Georgia or Pennsylvania.
    The US Primary system means that activists get to choose the candidate, so the more extreme ones get chosen. These are then less likely to appeal to voters in the actual election. Currently this is a much bigger problem for the Republicans because of Trump.
    It is also a problem for our very own Tory party where the activist are choosing the person least likely to appeal to the wider electorate.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 1,909
    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    Not really like a grammar school. I think a lot of sixth form colleges (and even sixth forms in schools) are selective; perhaps this one more than most.

    But yes, if you filter out pupils who do not want to be in school at all, and then pick the most academic of those, the sausage is halfway made but it is still doing something right if it scores more Oxbridge places than Eton.

    Aggressive targeting, perhaps. One chap once told me he got people through DofE awards by carefully tailoring programmes to people rather than sending massive cohorts through one-size-fits-all expeditions.

    And the power of example. The kids can see what is possible if it has been done before. No longer is there a sense that university is "not for the likes of us".
    I am not sure I agree - it seems like the success of this arrangement is very closely connected to the principle of selective education, which is the same principle that drives grammar schools; and it is what left leaning middle class people often object to. Brampton College provides a dilemma for them, because the beneficiaries of the system are overwhelmingly poor people, many of whom appear to be non white and from an immigrant background.

    Somewhere like Peter Symonds College in Winchester typically applies a 5 C's at GCSE admission policy, and gets very good Oxbridge offers, something like 60 in an average year. But it is in an affluent area with very high house prices (Winchester).



    I don’t know whether Peter Symonds still offers boarding but they used to have boarding as well as a lot of locals who put up students as lodgers which increased the catchment.

    A lot of students went there from public schools for sixth form for a variety of reasons - it was better, and rightfully had the reputation, than their private schools at getting students into top universities, the students wanted a transition between boarding school life and university life, they had been asked to leave their private schools once GCSEs were done…

    Most of the people I knew there were from wealthy families and it was a back door to top universities. Very good school and if you think that Oxbridge etc are actively reducing places offered to public schools then a very good switcheroo to send your kids there for sixth form after three years elsewhere.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 49,002
    Nigelb said:

    Is it correct that Weisselberg has said he won't testify against Trump as part of his plea deal ?

    I think he's said he'll cooperate with the probe into the Trump Organization, but went testify against Trump in a criminal case.

    Not, of course, that he can resist a lawful subpoena.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,825

    Team Truss is back in the clarification game after a 2009 leaflet emerged, co-written by Liz Truss, calling for, inter alia:-

    Doctors to have a 10 per cent pay cut — Liz hates @Foxy
    Patients to be charged to see doctors
    The Royal Navy to lose two aircraft carriers
    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/19553769/liz-truss-charge-patients-doctor-defence-cuts/

    Since 2009 doctors have had real terms pay cuts most years, including 6% this year*, with a cumulative cut of 20-30% according to grade,

    * though this may be changed, there is a ballot on industrial action shortly, almost certain to endorse rejecting the government's offer, and hence a strike.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 29,264
    rcs1000 said:

    By contrast, I couldn't design even a simple microprocessor, despite having read reasonably extensively on the subject.

    Sure you could

    https://turingcomplete.game
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 24,023
    https://mobile.twitter.com/ONS/status/1560507188459741185

    Retail sales volumes rose slightly by 0.3% in July 2022 following a fall of 0.2% in June 2022.

    Retail remains 2.3% above its pre-pandemic level http://ow.ly/aAlL50KnA8c


    People not feeling the need to tighten their belts.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756
    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    For any A level a "B" or better in the relevant GCSE is a requirement, even within schools. It is not like selection for grammar schools at age 11.

    No one objects to selection focused on particular subjects at age 18 to go to University, it is selection at age 11 to cover all subjects that is the problem.
    Not for any, only for some. Politics and Sociology don't usually have thresholds, for example.

    And it's now 6 or above, not B or above.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,825
    boulay said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    Not really like a grammar school. I think a lot of sixth form colleges (and even sixth forms in schools) are selective; perhaps this one more than most.

    But yes, if you filter out pupils who do not want to be in school at all, and then pick the most academic of those, the sausage is halfway made but it is still doing something right if it scores more Oxbridge places than Eton.

    Aggressive targeting, perhaps. One chap once told me he got people through DofE awards by carefully tailoring programmes to people rather than sending massive cohorts through one-size-fits-all expeditions.

    And the power of example. The kids can see what is possible if it has been done before. No longer is there a sense that university is "not for the likes of us".
    I am not sure I agree - it seems like the success of this arrangement is very closely connected to the principle of selective education, which is the same principle that drives grammar schools; and it is what left leaning middle class people often object to. Brampton College provides a dilemma for them, because the beneficiaries of the system are overwhelmingly poor people, many of whom appear to be non white and from an immigrant background.

    Somewhere like Peter Symonds College in Winchester typically applies a 5 C's at GCSE admission policy, and gets very good Oxbridge offers, something like 60 in an average year. But it is in an affluent area with very high house prices (Winchester).



    I don’t know whether Peter Symonds still offers boarding but they used to have boarding as well as a lot of locals who put up students as lodgers which increased the catchment.

    A lot of students went there from public schools for sixth form for a variety of reasons - it was better, and rightfully had the reputation, than their private schools at getting students into top universities, the students wanted a transition between boarding school life and university life, they had been asked to leave their private schools once GCSEs were done…

    Most of the people I knew there were from wealthy families and it was a back door to top universities. Very good school and if you think that Oxbridge etc are actively reducing places offered to public schools then a very good switcheroo to send your kids there for sixth form after three years elsewhere.
    I went to Peter Symonds. The boarders were almost entirely children of the military, rather than other parts of the country. Some were children from local authority care. The vast majority of the intake was from the feeder Comprehensives, of which there were 5.

    I don't think the intake has changed much since my day.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,825
    tlg86 said:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/ONS/status/1560507188459741185

    Retail sales volumes rose slightly by 0.3% in July 2022 following a fall of 0.2% in June 2022.

    Retail remains 2.3% above its pre-pandemic level http://ow.ly/aAlL50KnA8c


    People not feeling the need to tighten their belts.

    Or simply having to pay higher prices for things...
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 49,002
    Scott_xP said:

    rcs1000 said:

    By contrast, I couldn't design even a simple microprocessor, despite having read reasonably extensively on the subject.

    Sure you could

    https://turingcomplete.game
    I have it.

    And yes, I can create basic binary arithmetic circuits.

    But now think about the complexities involved in creating storage. Or doing timings. How do you ensure that your cascade of transistors have finished before the next clock cycle starts?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756
    Foxy said:

    tlg86 said:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/ONS/status/1560507188459741185

    Retail sales volumes rose slightly by 0.3% in July 2022 following a fall of 0.2% in June 2022.

    Retail remains 2.3% above its pre-pandemic level http://ow.ly/aAlL50KnA8c


    People not feeling the need to tighten their belts.

    Or simply having to pay higher prices for things...
    Or stocking up.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,825
    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    tlg86 said:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/ONS/status/1560507188459741185

    Retail sales volumes rose slightly by 0.3% in July 2022 following a fall of 0.2% in June 2022.

    Retail remains 2.3% above its pre-pandemic level http://ow.ly/aAlL50KnA8c


    People not feeling the need to tighten their belts.

    Or simply having to pay higher prices for things...
    Or stocking up.
    Indeed, expecting things to go further up in price.

    The ONS did mention that alcohol, tobacco, clothes and household goods all fell. This would suggest to me that discretionary spending is down.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,316
    rcs1000 said:

    Nigelb said:

    Is it correct that Weisselberg has said he won't testify against Trump as part of his plea deal ?

    I think he's said he'll cooperate with the probe into the Trump Organization, but went testify against Trump in a criminal case.

    Not, of course, that he can resist a lawful subpoena.
    No, but he can decline to answer questions.

    The (to my thinking rather lenient) jail term of 5 months reportedly results from the refusal to cooperate with the investigation into Trump himself. He's saved himself a decades long (in his case effectively life) jail term by testifying against the company.
    ...Weisselberg, who is seen as one of Mr Trump's most loyal business associates, worked for the former president for almost 50 years. He left his job as chief financial officer which he had held since 2005 when he was arrested last year.
    The Trump Organization is also a defendant in this case and its lawyers have entered a not guilty plea.
    Weisselberg must now testify against the company at a criminal trial later this year, after agreeing to a plea deal that was first reported by The New York Times.
    But he refused to co-operate with prosecutors in their wider investigation into Donald Trump and his business practices, reports say....

  • boulayboulay Posts: 1,909
    Foxy said:

    boulay said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    Not really like a grammar school. I think a lot of sixth form colleges (and even sixth forms in schools) are selective; perhaps this one more than most.

    But yes, if you filter out pupils who do not want to be in school at all, and then pick the most academic of those, the sausage is halfway made but it is still doing something right if it scores more Oxbridge places than Eton.

    Aggressive targeting, perhaps. One chap once told me he got people through DofE awards by carefully tailoring programmes to people rather than sending massive cohorts through one-size-fits-all expeditions.

    And the power of example. The kids can see what is possible if it has been done before. No longer is there a sense that university is "not for the likes of us".
    I am not sure I agree - it seems like the success of this arrangement is very closely connected to the principle of selective education, which is the same principle that drives grammar schools; and it is what left leaning middle class people often object to. Brampton College provides a dilemma for them, because the beneficiaries of the system are overwhelmingly poor people, many of whom appear to be non white and from an immigrant background.

    Somewhere like Peter Symonds College in Winchester typically applies a 5 C's at GCSE admission policy, and gets very good Oxbridge offers, something like 60 in an average year. But it is in an affluent area with very high house prices (Winchester).



    I don’t know whether Peter Symonds still offers boarding but they used to have boarding as well as a lot of locals who put up students as lodgers which increased the catchment.

    A lot of students went there from public schools for sixth form for a variety of reasons - it was better, and rightfully had the reputation, than their private schools at getting students into top universities, the students wanted a transition between boarding school life and university life, they had been asked to leave their private schools once GCSEs were done…

    Most of the people I knew there were from wealthy families and it was a back door to top universities. Very good school and if you think that Oxbridge etc are actively reducing places offered to public schools then a very good switcheroo to send your kids there for sixth form after three years elsewhere.
    I went to Peter Symonds. The boarders
    were almost entirely children of the military, rather than other parts of the country. Some
    were children from local authority care. The vast majority of the intake was from the
    feeder Comprehensives, of which there were 5.

    I don't think the intake has changed much
    since my day.
    Maybe I knew the Symmonds people in a freak period but had friends there from the comprehensive feeders but also a good number of “The Hon xxxx xxxxxx” and A lot of ex Radley, charterhouse, and similar. Not a massive proportion but not negligible.

  • darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    To my mind there is a huge difference between selection at 11 and selection at 16. I don't have a problem with selective sixth forms (my daughter will probably be going to one, pending results next week), and in reality all A level courses have entry requirements. But selection of younger children is unnecessarily divisive, creates two classes of education, writes kids off before some have the chance to show their potential, and is unfair because in reality it disadvantages poorer kids. My objection to selection in education is more practical than ideological - looking at the evidence I don't think it works at 11, but I can see the case for it at 16, and even more so at 18. My objection to private education is both ideological and practical, on the other hand.
    My guess is that the vast majority of the kids attending Brampton previously attended non-selective comprehensives and got their GCSE grades at those. As you say, there is a huge difference between selection at 16 and at 11.

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,316
    The frauds reportedly were motivated by Trump being too cheap to pay his executives market rates. They therefore paid themselves benefits by way of fraud.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,825
    🍗 Chicken thighs in Sainsbury’s now cost 58% more than they did a year ago

    🥛 Two-pint carton of milk in Morrisons 📈 56%
    🫘 Own-label baked beans 📈 50%
    🍞 White Hovis loaf in Tesco 📈 21%
    ☕️ Nescafe instant coffee in Asda 📈 50%

    See the full list here ⤵️ https://t.co/Zji2P7cxUb
  • High quality AI-generated art will make high-quality human generated art even more valuable. There will always be a premium on something created by a person.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 24,023
    Foxy said:

    tlg86 said:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/ONS/status/1560507188459741185

    Retail sales volumes rose slightly by 0.3% in July 2022 following a fall of 0.2% in June 2022.

    Retail remains 2.3% above its pre-pandemic level http://ow.ly/aAlL50KnA8c


    People not feeling the need to tighten their belts.

    Or simply having to pay higher prices for things...
    Well, that makes my point even more strongly. Discretionary spending up in July, rather than falling off a cliff as one might expect. And that’s despite things being more expensive.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 47,316
    rcs1000 said:

    From the 2016 Democratic Primaries:


    Campaign to RE-Elect the President ?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 24,023
    Foxy said:

    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    tlg86 said:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/ONS/status/1560507188459741185

    Retail sales volumes rose slightly by 0.3% in July 2022 following a fall of 0.2% in June 2022.

    Retail remains 2.3% above its pre-pandemic level http://ow.ly/aAlL50KnA8c


    People not feeling the need to tighten their belts.

    Or simply having to pay higher prices for things...
    Or stocking up.
    Indeed, expecting things to go further up in price.

    The ONS did mention that alcohol, tobacco, clothes and household goods all fell. This would suggest to me that discretionary spending is down.
    Lol, you’ve realised the logical error in your first argument.

    To be honest, that discretionary spending isn’t falling off a cliff should be a big concern.

    Of course, the media don’t see it like that. They want the story to be “people are feeling the squeeze and spending less.” They don’t like asking “well why aren’t people saving ahead of the huge energy price rises?”
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 2,644

    Foxy said:

    CatMan said:

    Alistair said:

    rcs1000 said:
    There is an absolute humdinger of a fake twitter thread based on this policy floating around. I was initially taken in by it before I applied the necessary level of scepticism.

    Shows even the most incredibly savvy and sophisticated internet user such as my self is vulnerable to propaganda crafted to hit preconceived biases.
    Is this fake? Probably. Oh well.


    To some of us of a certain vintage, Starship Trooper means only one thing.

    Time and a word?
    The best Yes album ever.
    Brad Mehldau’s latest album Jacob’s Ladder covers parts of “Starship Trooper”. It’s excellent. See http://www.bondegezou.co.uk/wnyesm.htm#covers for details.

  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 2,644
    Andy_JS said:

    When Trump won in 2016 everyone should have come together to work out why so many people voted for him and to try to ensure that it wouldn't happen again by dealing with the problems that must have resulted in him being elected. The fact that he's favourite again would suggest the problems haven't been properly addressed.

    It was difficult for people to come together to solve these problems because Trump was in power for 4 years. And then when Biden won, he’s been somewhat limited by a narrow hold on the Senate and Republican filibustering, plus a pair of global crises in COVID and the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
  • theakestheakes Posts: 679
    BUT latest polling in the States says that most voters approve of the FBI raid on his Florida abode.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 29,264
    If the new prime minister cannot make proper use of the powers of the state to help people through the coming emergency, it is going to be a long, miserable winter for both the British public and the Conservatives.
    @NewStatesman. https://www.newstatesman.com/comment/2022/08/liz-truss-power-state-relieve-living-standards-emergency
  • TazTaz Posts: 6,594
    rcs1000 said:

    From the 2016 Democratic Primaries:


    I'm with Hillary.

    Creep was fifth on my Spotify Top Songs of 2021.

    Only behind "The Seeker", "Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep", "All the Young Dudes" and "Layla"

    Creep is THAT good.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 37,054
    edited August 2022

    High quality AI-generated art will make high-quality human generated art even more valuable. There will always be a premium on something created by a person.

    It will be but one genre amongst many.

    Saying it will crowd out everything else is as ridiculous as saying American action painting will mark the end of the portrait.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Andy_JS said:

    When Trump won in 2016 everyone should have come together to work out why so many people voted for him

    Because the majority of people who voted for Romney voted for him.

    So to work out how to stop people voting for Trump means to work out how to stop people voting Republican.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 49,002
    Taz said:

    rcs1000 said:

    From the 2016 Democratic Primaries:


    I'm with Hillary.

    Creep was fifth on my Spotify Top Songs of 2021.

    Only behind "The Seeker", "Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep", "All the Young Dudes" and "Layla"

    Creep is THAT good.
    Reading that also makes me think that Bernie isn't a true Radiohead fan: Kid A was released three years after OK Computer.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 56,756
    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    Not really like a grammar school. I think a lot of sixth form colleges (and even sixth forms in schools) are selective; perhaps this one more than most.

    But yes, if you filter out pupils who do not want to be in school at all, and then pick the most academic of those, the sausage is halfway made but it is still doing something right if it scores more Oxbridge places than Eton.

    Aggressive targeting, perhaps. One chap once told me he got people through DofE awards by carefully tailoring programmes to people rather than sending massive cohorts through one-size-fits-all expeditions.

    And the power of example. The kids can see what is possible if it has been done before. No longer is there a sense that university is "not for the likes of us".
    I am not sure I agree - it seems like the success of this arrangement is very closely connected to the principle of selective education, which is the same principle that drives grammar schools; and it is what left leaning middle class people often object to. Brampton College provides a dilemma for them, because the beneficiaries of the system are overwhelmingly poor people, many of whom appear to be non white and from an immigrant background.

    Somewhere like Peter Symonds College in Winchester typically applies a 5 C's at GCSE admission policy, and gets very good Oxbridge offers, something like 60 in an average year. But it is in an affluent area with very high house prices (Winchester).

    Sure.
    But somewhere like Greenhead College in Kirklees, which is neither in an affluent area nor selective, also gets very good results.

    Well run large sixth form colleges work.

    Shame that the government's administration methods, funding structure and tax policies are making them pretty well unviable then.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 32,813
    rcs1000 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    rcs1000 said:

    By contrast, I couldn't design even a simple microprocessor, despite having read reasonably extensively on the subject.

    Sure you could

    https://turingcomplete.game
    I have it.

    And yes, I can create basic binary arithmetic circuits.

    But now think about the complexities involved in creating storage. Or doing timings. How do you ensure that your cascade of transistors have finished before the next clock cycle starts?
    That question is interesting; especially as the clock signals take time to go through the chips.

    A few years ago Steve Furber (co-designer of the ARM chip) and his group at Manchester University created Amulet, an asynchronous chip with no main clock signal.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMULET_microprocessor
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 36,825
    boulay said:

    Foxy said:

    boulay said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    'East End Eton' celebrates record year with nearly 90% of A-level students getting A* or A grades: State school in one of London's poorest boroughs will send 85 pupils to Oxbridge this year
    Brampton Manor Academy in one of London's poorest boroughs sees 430 students achieve straight A* or As
    85 pupils secured places at Oxford or Cambridge universities - with 470 going to a Russell Group institution
    School in Newham has now sent nearly 300 students to Oxbridge in just a decade since it opened sixth form
    This year's figure for Oxbridge of 85 was a significant rise on the 55 offers received in 2021 and 51 in 2020

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11124035/East-End-Eton-Brampton-Manor-Academy-sees-nearly-90-level-students-getting-A.html

    Looking at their admissions page, they are a state school, but seem to be an independent selective sixth form college; so you need A's or B's at GCSE and to pass an interview to get in.
    A bit like a 'grammar school'.

    https://www.bramptoncollege.com/admissions/
    Not really like a grammar school. I think a lot of sixth form colleges (and even sixth forms in schools) are selective; perhaps this one more than most.

    But yes, if you filter out pupils who do not want to be in school at all, and then pick the most academic of those, the sausage is halfway made but it is still doing something right if it scores more Oxbridge places than Eton.

    Aggressive targeting, perhaps. One chap once told me he got people through DofE awards by carefully tailoring programmes to people rather than sending massive cohorts through one-size-fits-all expeditions.

    And the power of example. The kids can see what is possible if it has been done before. No longer is there a sense that university is "not for the likes of us".
    I am not sure I agree - it seems like the success of this arrangement is very closely connected to the principle of selective education, which is the same principle that drives grammar schools; and it is what left leaning middle class people often object to. Brampton College provides a dilemma for them, because the beneficiaries of the system are overwhelmingly poor people, many of whom appear to be non white and from an immigrant background.

    Somewhere like Peter Symonds College in Winchester typically applies a 5 C's at GCSE admission policy, and gets very good Oxbridge offers, something like 60 in an average year. But it is in an affluent area with very high house prices (Winchester).



    I don’t know whether Peter Symonds still offers boarding but they used to have boarding as well as a lot of locals who put up students as lodgers which increased the catchment.

    A lot of students went there from public schools for sixth form for a variety of reasons - it was better, and rightfully had the reputation, than their private schools at getting students into top universities, the students wanted a transition between boarding school life and university life, they had been asked to leave their private schools once GCSEs were done…

    Most of the people I knew there were from wealthy families and it was a back door to top universities. Very good school and if you think that Oxbridge etc are actively reducing places offered to public schools then a very good switcheroo to send your kids there for sixth form after three years elsewhere.
    I went to Peter Symonds. The boarders
    were almost entirely children of the military, rather than other parts of the country. Some
    were children from local authority care. The vast majority of the intake was from the
    feeder Comprehensives, of which there were 5.

    I don't think the intake has changed much
    since my day.
    Maybe I knew the Symmonds people in a freak period but had friends there from the comprehensive feeders but also a good number of “The Hon xxxx xxxxxx” and A lot of ex Radley, charterhouse, and similar. Not a massive proportion but not negligible.

    Winchester is certainly a posh area, but when my sibs and I were there, I don't recall there being many from private schools. Most were fairly ordinary middle class folk. It is much more of a London commuter town now, but when I have been back to visit, not greatly different demographics

    Almost everyone (including us) came from the feeder Comprehensives locally. There were a couple from private schools, but no one that I knew had a title etc.
  • TazTaz Posts: 6,594
    rcs1000 said:

    Taz said:

    rcs1000 said:

    From the 2016 Democratic Primaries:


    I'm with Hillary.

    Creep was fifth on my Spotify Top Songs of 2021.

    Only behind "The Seeker", "Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep", "All the Young Dudes" and "Layla"

    Creep is THAT good.
    Reading that also makes me think that Bernie isn't a true Radiohead fan: Kid A was released three years after OK Computer.
    He deserved to lose the nomination for that alone,
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 3,415
    Taz said:

    rcs1000 said:

    From the 2016 Democratic Primaries:


    I'm with Hillary.

    Creep was fifth on my Spotify Top Songs of 2021.

    Only behind "The Seeker", "Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep", "All the Young Dudes" and "Layla"

    Creep is THAT good.
    Creep is just "The air that I breathe" with different lyrics.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaXFc4Zb78s

  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 4,993
    kyf_100 said:

    Taz said:

    rcs1000 said:

    From the 2016 Democratic Primaries:


    I'm with Hillary.

    Creep was fifth on my Spotify Top Songs of 2021.

    Only behind "The Seeker", "Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep", "All the Young Dudes" and "Layla"

    Creep is THAT good.
    Creep is just "The air that I breathe" with different lyrics.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaXFc4Zb78s

    Lana del Rey was lucky to get away with that. But Creep vs Hollies is no more or less a copy than any other rock song in the last 30 years. Similar chord progression but different tempo and mood.
This discussion has been closed.