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The June 23rd by-elections – what happened at GE2019 – politicalbetting.com

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  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,817
    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    Are the student loans running at 11%?.... thats horrendous.
    Most never pay a penny though
    You over-stated your case to create board strife. Unsurprisingly.

    The current pay back is 23% and expected to rise in 2023/4 to more than 50%.

    https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01079/
    Expected you dummy, bollox in other words. Bit like me expecting you to post sensible stuff in 2023, never going to happen.
    What on Earth is wrong with you today? Why are you always so unspeakably rude? At his most frosty, even Leon doesn’t post in such a disgraceful manner. You’re behaving like a drunken pub boor. It is eminently reasonable for working age people to contest that an inflation indexed pensions rise (which will add significantly to national expenditure) is acceptable while they themselves are not receiving anything like that, and may be paying significant student loan repayments (the terms of which can change at a whim). If you disagree, make your arguments rather than ranting away at those who disagree.

    Is there any wonder that the PB memetic pool is narrowing if this is the standard of ad-hominem argumentation which is tolerated? Do you want an echo chamber of elderly, overmonied men who just want to complain about whatever the yoof are up to now? Then there are alternatives. I started posting again because, occasionally, PB produces genuinely insightful debate in a way that only old fashioned forums do and I actually value that, even if you don’t.

    Or, to TLDR all of that, I got knocked off my bike on Tuesday and it was less painful than reading your pish. Bloody well behave.
    Sympathies. I'm not sure why Malcolm isn't banned, except that he's so consistently rude to almost everyone (to be fair I've not suffered myself) that people don't take it personally - it's like being abused by a drunken stranger, peculiar but not really worth worrying about.
    I am surprised you are not banned for being a nasty piece of work. As you say I have never said a bad thing about you yet you want me banned. Pompous hypocritical and plain nasty.
    nippy through the string vest this morning? 🙂


    Good morning , started well till I encountered the fools and comic singers on here, hopefully mor eof eth intelligent posters will be around later. Convinces me to look in later on in the day when the dross and flotsam have disappeared.
    There are a few exceptions of course.
    Irony alert. Almost certainly the least intelligent poster on PB complains about the intelligence of others. I completely agree with @NickPalmer, this bullying unpleasant and abusive little man should be hit with the ban hammer.
    Malcolm is indeed a deliberately nasty persona on here: out to antagonise everyone with a bullying and abusive demeanour which some mistake for humour.

    Of course he should put in the sin bin for a couple of weeks but I'm not holding my breath.
    Malc makes me laugh. I know he doesn't really mean half what he says but if you don't like his style just scroll on and don't engage with him.
  • Options
    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    GIN1138 said:

    Roger said:

    OT. I keep hearing that costs in the UK are only increasing at the same rate as all other countries in Europe. So for an experiment I compared my costs in the UK and in France over the last six months and the difference is significant. French costs have barely moved. In the UK in some instances (for example electricity) they've almost doubled.

    So anyone working from home who wants lower bills a better lifestyle a view of the Mediterranian and no Boris Johnson you know what to do.

    Are you offering to put us all up in your 157 bedroom mansion overlooking the Cote d'Azur Rog? :D
    I wish I could but I've rented it to Russians. They tell me the french have made them chateauless
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,067
    Scott_xP said:

    Lol:

    image

    Now sadly removed if it was ever indeed in wiki. Where's your sense of fun Wikipedia?

    Never fuck with a man named Mick Lynch. We know this in Ireland. The Mick Lynchs this world are born without fucks to give. They have no fuck glands. Do not approach a Mick Lynch without caution. Keep your head low and let the Mick Lynch know you mean no harm.
    https://twitter.com/NiecyOKeeffe/status/1539335139905486849
    Robert Peston: Did the RMT make a mistake backing Brexit?

    Mick Lynch: No, I don’t think we did make a mistake. We support Brexit.

    https://twitter.com/itvpeston/status/1539731821180731393
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,113
    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The upping of the state pension and the removal of limits on rich bankers' pay seems utterly tone deaf from the Government.

    Are they trying to lose?

    Pensioners and bankers are the Tory core vote. No real surprise
    Then the Tories deserve to lose.

    The more you speak for the Tories, the more I think maybe I should actually just vote Labour, if you represent the Tories. And I despise Labour, but not as much as what you want to stand for.
    Really? You even voted for Labour in 2001 when I voted Tory
    Yes, because I'm a sentient human who has principles and thinks about why I should vote. Those principles generally align with the Tories more, but if they don't, then the Tories don't deserve my vote.

    I don't just vote for a monkey with a blue rosette, and I don't put party before country.

    Oh, and don't forget, you lost in 2001. 😕
    Barty, I can’t stand your ideology, but I do admire your principles.
    He changes them more often than his panties.
    That's not true, unless he has very poor personal hygiene. He is a remarkably consistent Liberal Libertarian Free Marketeer. If anything I would fault him with being too consistent in his worldview, because reality is more complicated than that.
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,113

    Scott_xP said:

    Lol:

    image

    Now sadly removed if it was ever indeed in wiki. Where's your sense of fun Wikipedia?

    Never fuck with a man named Mick Lynch. We know this in Ireland. The Mick Lynchs this world are born without fucks to give. They have no fuck glands. Do not approach a Mick Lynch without caution. Keep your head low and let the Mick Lynch know you mean no harm.
    https://twitter.com/NiecyOKeeffe/status/1539335139905486849
    Robert Peston: Did the RMT make a mistake backing Brexit?

    Mick Lynch: No, I don’t think we did make a mistake. We support Brexit.

    https://twitter.com/itvpeston/status/1539731821180731393
    Well, nobody's perfect.
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415
    GIN1138 said:

    Taz said:
    The last Kantor was a bit of an outlier giving Labour a massive 6 lead. But on the other hand the other pollsters had bigger gaps too at that time, pre vonc.
    6-7% was about the average poll lead for Labour in May?

    https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/prediction_main.html

    This latest poll, giving Labour a 2% lead looks the outlier...
    That’s not how it works, No. Not from this pollster. They are the most friendly Tory pollster on methodology, kinder even than omimiom. Their 6 was the outlier.

    Three off green for lowest green score from them for a while, is on current trend of greens melting this summer
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,548
    edited June 2022
    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,609
    Catches on quick, does Frostie.

    https://twitter.com/lisaocarroll/status/1539898423071195136
    Lord Frost on Boris Johnson refusing to correct claims that there are more people in employment than pre pandemic.
    "I wish he wouldn't say things like that, they're obviously not true. I'm not gonna defend, making factually incorrect statements"
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,190

    Scott_xP said:

    Lol:

    image

    Now sadly removed if it was ever indeed in wiki. Where's your sense of fun Wikipedia?

    Never fuck with a man named Mick Lynch. We know this in Ireland. The Mick Lynchs this world are born without fucks to give. They have no fuck glands. Do not approach a Mick Lynch without caution. Keep your head low and let the Mick Lynch know you mean no harm.
    https://twitter.com/NiecyOKeeffe/status/1539335139905486849
    Robert Peston: Did the RMT make a mistake backing Brexit?

    Mick Lynch: No, I don’t think we did make a mistake. We support Brexit.

    https://twitter.com/itvpeston/status/1539731821180731393
    Awks!
  • Options
    JonWCJonWC Posts: 285
    GIN1138 said:

    Robert Peston
    @Peston
    ·
    2h
    Political expediency and economic reality are about to collide in the most painful way for Boris Johnson and his government. It is not hyperbole to say this feels like an emergency.

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1539879128937234433

    Well you can guarantee that if Peston predicts it the reverse will happen so hopefully we're almost over the worst of the "emergency"...
    Obviously the government's income is largely index-linked too.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,934

    Taz said:
    The last Kantor was a bit of an outlier giving Labour a massive 6 lead. But on the other hand the other pollsters had bigger gaps too at that time, pre vonc.

    They are certainly the pollster most favourable to Tories, yet still doesn’t help them get above 34 here.
    Thats not entirely accurate Rabbit.
    Last one was 6 lead, amongst the herd
    Before that lead of 3 when YouGov, Techne and Redfield were all giving 3 to 5 leads
    Before that we had 'tie', but Yougov had a lead of 1 same week, opinium a lead of 2 etc
    Before that amongst the herd
    They are on the better end Tory result wise but not as an outrageous outlier ever
  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 12,999

    Robert Peston
    @Peston
    ·
    2h
    Political expediency and economic reality are about to collide in the most painful way for Boris Johnson and his government. It is not hyperbole to say this feels like an emergency.

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1539879128937234433

    All these numbers, percentages, etc. are balls. Nobody has any fucking idea what's going to happen.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,631
    edited June 2022
    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects
    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 36% (-2)
    CON: 34% (+2)
    LDEM: 13% (-)
    GRN: 5% (-3)
    REF: 4% (+1)

    via
    @KantarPublic
    , 16 - 20 Jun
    Chgs. w/ May"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1539924893105537024
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,613
    Dura_Ace said:

    Robert Peston
    @Peston
    ·
    2h
    Political expediency and economic reality are about to collide in the most painful way for Boris Johnson and his government. It is not hyperbole to say this feels like an emergency.

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1539879128937234433

    All these numbers, percentages, etc. are balls. Nobody has any fucking idea what's going to happen.
    I see you have written an economics text book.
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,817

    GIN1138 said:

    Taz said:
    The last Kantor was a bit of an outlier giving Labour a massive 6 lead. But on the other hand the other pollsters had bigger gaps too at that time, pre vonc.
    6-7% was about the average poll lead for Labour in May?

    https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/prediction_main.html

    This latest poll, giving Labour a 2% lead looks the outlier...
    That’s not how it works, No. Not from this pollster. They are the most friendly Tory pollster on methodology, kinder even than omimiom. Their 6 was the outlier.

    Three off green for lowest green score from them for a while, is on current trend of greens melting this summer
    Oh you're comparing Kantor with Kantor? Well I've not been keeping a close eye on polls recently have had other things to think about lol!

    Am just starting to get back into it now! :D
  • Options
    Sandpit said:

    Pulpstar said:

    69-1 for the Tories in Wakefield isn't the worst long odds bet out there I think. In for £3 on that one.

    I think:
    a) Labour will win Wakefield,
    b) It will be a very disappointing result for them, with a small majority and a modest swing.
    c) Hope I'm wrong.
    My feeling is that Mr Herdson will keep his deposit, and take enough Tory votes to let Labour win, but that the Lab share itself won’t be much higher than the 40% they got in the GE.
    I hope you're right.

    I disagree with Mr Herdson over Brexit, quite strongly, but if I were in the constituency I'd definitely vote for him over the official Tory.
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,442
    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    Offtopic, but the demand/renewables/carbon neutral graph is a terrible presentation choice. No way renewables looks like 24% or carbon neutral 36% on there, due to the reduced radius of those plots and so reduced area. What's wrong with simple bars? Or needles of the same length if they want to make it look like a dial?
  • Options
    theProletheProle Posts: 948
    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,934
    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    Are the student loans running at 11%?.... thats horrendous.
    Most never pay a penny though
    You over-stated your case to create board strife. Unsurprisingly.

    The current pay back is 23% and expected to rise in 2023/4 to more than 50%.

    https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01079/
    Expected you dummy, bollox in other words. Bit like me expecting you to post sensible stuff in 2023, never going to happen.
    What on Earth is wrong with you today? Why are you always so unspeakably rude? At his most frosty, even Leon doesn’t post in such a disgraceful manner. You’re behaving like a drunken pub boor. It is eminently reasonable for working age people to contest that an inflation indexed pensions rise (which will add significantly to national expenditure) is acceptable while they themselves are not receiving anything like that, and may be paying significant student loan repayments (the terms of which can change at a whim). If you disagree, make your arguments rather than ranting away at those who disagree.

    Is there any wonder that the PB memetic pool is narrowing if this is the standard of ad-hominem argumentation which is tolerated? Do you want an echo chamber of elderly, overmonied men who just want to complain about whatever the yoof are up to now? Then there are alternatives. I started posting again because, occasionally, PB produces genuinely insightful debate in a way that only old fashioned forums do and I actually value that, even if you don’t.

    Or, to TLDR all of that, I got knocked off my bike on Tuesday and it was less painful than reading your pish. Bloody well behave.
    Sympathies. I'm not sure why Malcolm isn't banned, except that he's so consistently rude to almost everyone (to be fair I've not suffered myself) that people don't take it personally - it's like being abused by a drunken stranger, peculiar but not really worth worrying about.
    I am surprised you are not banned for being a nasty piece of work. As you say I have never said a bad thing about you yet you want me banned. Pompous hypocritical and plain nasty.
    nippy through the string vest this morning? 🙂


    Good morning , started well till I encountered the fools and comic singers on here, hopefully mor eof eth intelligent posters will be around later. Convinces me to look in later on in the day when the dross and flotsam have disappeared.
    There are a few exceptions of course.
    Irony alert. Almost certainly the least intelligent poster on PB complains about the intelligence of others. I completely agree with @NickPalmer, this bullying unpleasant and abusive little man should be hit with the ban hammer.
    Malcolm is indeed a deliberately nasty persona on here: out to antagonise everyone with a bullying and abusive demeanour which some mistake for humour.

    Of course he should put in the sin bin for a couple of weeks but I'm not holding my breath.
    I always have a good chat with him and we are chalk and cheese on a lot of things politically, hes a solid bloke in my opinion.
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,817
    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    You should have had some fun with them for an hour and played along just to waste their time lol!
  • Options
    algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 10,541
    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects
    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 36% (-2)
    CON: 34% (+2)
    LDEM: 13% (-)
    GRN: 5% (-3)
    REF: 4% (+1)

    via
    @KantarPublic
    , 16 - 20 Jun
    Chgs. w/ May"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1539924893105537024

    The Tories are still as likely a Labour to form the next government. I don't think this prospect has ever changed during 2022. SFAICS there's about 45+% each chance of a Tory or a Lab government after the next election with a residual chance of a result in which no remotely stable government can be formed.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,974

    Malc has been very kind to me in the past, he has a way with words but I don't consider them abusive

    CHB, Thankyou , intelligent people realise that they are not abusive, just a particular choice of words very very often tongue in cheek and for a point but unfortunately they go over the donkeys heads.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,548
    edited June 2022
    theProle said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
    I'd say that particular chart shows the seasonal complementarity of wind and solar. And the utility of a grid of interconnectors.

    And, the increasing availability factor of offshore wind shows that it is an increasingly attractive option.
  • Options
    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects
    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 36% (-2)
    CON: 34% (+2)
    LDEM: 13% (-)
    GRN: 5% (-3)
    REF: 4% (+1)

    via
    @KantarPublic
    , 16 - 20 Jun
    Chgs. w/ May"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1539924893105537024

    Unless Starmer finds a voice this could be the shape of polls to come. Being 'NOT JOHNSON' will only take you so far and it always leaves you open to the Tories doing something unexpectedly interesting
  • Options
    Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 30,945
    theProle said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
    Well no not really. That is as unrealistic a position as claiming that wind can provide all the energy we need. Wind Generation is certainly not useless for the vast majority of the time when the wind is blowing. What we need is a robust and reliable mix of generation and wind is a huge part of that.
  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,631
    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    Are the student loans running at 11%?.... thats horrendous.
    Most never pay a penny though
    You over-stated your case to create board strife. Unsurprisingly.

    The current pay back is 23% and expected to rise in 2023/4 to more than 50%.

    https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01079/
    Expected you dummy, bollox in other words. Bit like me expecting you to post sensible stuff in 2023, never going to happen.
    What on Earth is wrong with you today? Why are you always so unspeakably rude? At his most frosty, even Leon doesn’t post in such a disgraceful manner. You’re behaving like a drunken pub boor. It is eminently reasonable for working age people to contest that an inflation indexed pensions rise (which will add significantly to national expenditure) is acceptable while they themselves are not receiving anything like that, and may be paying significant student loan repayments (the terms of which can change at a whim). If you disagree, make your arguments rather than ranting away at those who disagree.

    Is there any wonder that the PB memetic pool is narrowing if this is the standard of ad-hominem argumentation which is tolerated? Do you want an echo chamber of elderly, overmonied men who just want to complain about whatever the yoof are up to now? Then there are alternatives. I started posting again because, occasionally, PB produces genuinely insightful debate in a way that only old fashioned forums do and I actually value that, even if you don’t.

    Or, to TLDR all of that, I got knocked off my bike on Tuesday and it was less painful than reading your pish. Bloody well behave.
    Sympathies. I'm not sure why Malcolm isn't banned, except that he's so consistently rude to almost everyone (to be fair I've not suffered myself) that people don't take it personally - it's like being abused by a drunken stranger, peculiar but not really worth worrying about.
    I am surprised you are not banned for being a nasty piece of work. As you say I have never said a bad thing about you yet you want me banned. Pompous hypocritical and plain nasty.
    nippy through the string vest this morning? 🙂


    Good morning , started well till I encountered the fools and comic singers on here, hopefully mor eof eth intelligent posters will be around later. Convinces me to look in later on in the day when the dross and flotsam have disappeared.
    There are a few exceptions of course.
    Irony alert. Almost certainly the least intelligent poster on PB complains about the intelligence of others. I completely agree with @NickPalmer, this bullying unpleasant and abusive little man should be hit with the ban hammer.
    Malcolm is indeed a deliberately nasty persona on here: out to antagonise everyone with a bullying and abusive demeanour which some mistake for humour.

    Of course he should put in the sin bin for a couple of weeks but I'm not holding my breath.
    Malcolm makes me laugh and his insults are often quite poetic. I don't think he should be banned, just as I was against the efforts to have you banned.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,974
    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    Are the student loans running at 11%?.... thats horrendous.
    Most never pay a penny though
    You over-stated your case to create board strife. Unsurprisingly.

    The current pay back is 23% and expected to rise in 2023/4 to more than 50%.

    https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01079/
    Expected you dummy, bollox in other words. Bit like me expecting you to post sensible stuff in 2023, never going to happen.
    What on Earth is wrong with you today? Why are you always so unspeakably rude? At his most frosty, even Leon doesn’t post in such a disgraceful manner. You’re behaving like a drunken pub boor. It is eminently reasonable for working age people to contest that an inflation indexed pensions rise (which will add significantly to national expenditure) is acceptable while they themselves are not receiving anything like that, and may be paying significant student loan repayments (the terms of which can change at a whim). If you disagree, make your arguments rather than ranting away at those who disagree.

    Is there any wonder that the PB memetic pool is narrowing if this is the standard of ad-hominem argumentation which is tolerated? Do you want an echo chamber of elderly, overmonied men who just want to complain about whatever the yoof are up to now? Then there are alternatives. I started posting again because, occasionally, PB produces genuinely insightful debate in a way that only old fashioned forums do and I actually value that, even if you don’t.

    Or, to TLDR all of that, I got knocked off my bike on Tuesday and it was less painful than reading your pish. Bloody well behave.
    Sympathies. I'm not sure why Malcolm isn't banned, except that he's so consistently rude to almost everyone (to be fair I've not suffered myself) that people don't take it personally - it's like being abused by a drunken stranger, peculiar but not really worth worrying about.
    I am surprised you are not banned for being a nasty piece of work. As you say I have never said a bad thing about you yet you want me banned. Pompous hypocritical and plain nasty.
    nippy through the string vest this morning? 🙂


    Good morning , started well till I encountered the fools and comic singers on here, hopefully mor eof eth intelligent posters will be around later. Convinces me to look in later on in the day when the dross and flotsam have disappeared.
    There are a few exceptions of course.
    Irony alert. Almost certainly the least intelligent poster on PB complains about the intelligence of others. I completely agree with @NickPalmer, this bullying unpleasant and abusive little man should be hit with the ban hammer.
    He is the only Alba supporting poster we have though, so for representative purposes I would keep Malc
    First they came for Malc and I said nothing because I wasn't also radged.
    Well said Dura, these boys will need to toughen up plenty or they will get roasted.
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,817
    Roger said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects
    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 36% (-2)
    CON: 34% (+2)
    LDEM: 13% (-)
    GRN: 5% (-3)
    REF: 4% (+1)

    via
    @KantarPublic
    , 16 - 20 Jun
    Chgs. w/ May"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1539924893105537024

    Unless Starmer finds a voice this could be the shape of polls to come. Being 'NOT JOHNSON' will only take you so far and it always leaves you open to the Tories doing something unexpectedly interesting
    Starting to get a but jittery Rog? ;)
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,967
    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    What's the scam there if they were expecting you to say no?
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,934
    Roger said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects
    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 36% (-2)
    CON: 34% (+2)
    LDEM: 13% (-)
    GRN: 5% (-3)
    REF: 4% (+1)

    via
    @KantarPublic
    , 16 - 20 Jun
    Chgs. w/ May"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1539924893105537024

    Unless Starmer finds a voice this could be the shape of polls to come. Being 'NOT JOHNSON' will only take you so far and it always leaves you open to the Tories doing something unexpectedly interesting
    36 against dust. FPN to save Labour
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,974
    GIN1138 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    LOL! Morning Malc You tell the whippersnappers! :D
    Mornning GIN, hope you hospital visit went well and you are fighting fit.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,548
    Selebian said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:

    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?

    Offtopic, but the demand/renewables/carbon neutral graph is a terrible presentation choice. No way renewables looks like 24% or carbon neutral 36% on there, due to the reduced radius of those plots and so reduced area. What's wrong with simple bars? Or needles of the same length if they want to make it look like a dial?
    Fair points, though there are plenty of options on the UK graphs, and I chose the one showing interconnectors, as I am mainly interested in imports / exports.

    The French one is more limited.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,974
    Leon said:

    Good morning PB

    Travel question, maybe for @Sandpit

    How horrible is the UAE at this time of year? Can you even go out during the day? Is it possible to swim or simply too hot?

    TA!

    It is a dump all of the year , avoid like the plague.
  • Options
    theProle said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
    Affordable storage is being worked on and is coming along. But in the meantime, we're able to use all of the wind that is generated, so its absolutely not a waste of time. Wind is frequently generating 5-10GW or more of power, that's not something to be sniffed at.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929
    MattW said:

    theProle said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
    I'd say that particular chart shows the seasonal complementarity of wind and solar. And the utility of a grid of interconnectors.

    And, the increasing availability factor of offshore wind shows that it is an increasingly attractive option.
    In terms of pure bang for buck, onshore wind is the generation type in the UK that produces the cheapest electricity per kilowatt currently.

    Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)
  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,631
    GIN1138 said:

    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    You should have had some fun with them for an hour and played along just to waste their time lol!
    I often do. I have put them on hold before, had them call back, etc, etc. This was a new effort. I wondered what would happen. I have kept Microsoft support going for ages before.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,609
    edited June 2022
    EU parliament votes for Ukraine candidate status.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jun/23/eu-leaders-ukraine-candidate-status-russian-attack

    529 for; 45 against; 14 abstentions.
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,817
    malcolmg said:

    GIN1138 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    LOL! Morning Malc You tell the whippersnappers! :D
    Mornning GIN, hope you hospital visit went well and you are fighting fit.
    I'm doing OK thanks Malc. Hope you and Mrs G are well too?
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415

    Taz said:
    The last Kantor was a bit of an outlier giving Labour a massive 6 lead. But on the other hand the other pollsters had bigger gaps too at that time, pre vonc.

    They are certainly the pollster most favourable to Tories, yet still doesn’t help them get above 34 here.
    Thats not entirely accurate Rabbit.
    Last one was 6 lead, amongst the herd
    Before that lead of 3 when YouGov, Techne and Redfield were all giving 3 to 5 leads
    Before that we had 'tie', but Yougov had a lead of 1 same week, opinium a lead of 2 etc
    Before that amongst the herd
    They are on the better end Tory result wise but not as an outrageous outlier ever
    I agree not an outrageous outlier. You added outrageous and ever I simply said “bit of” outlier. Before this one it’s a 3 before that a tie before that 5.
    But on the other hand, as Gin pointed out, the 6 fitted in with the other pollsters from that time, they were not particularly reporting higher, so the Kantor methodology shouldn’t have fitted in so neatly with the other pollsters, 🙂 it does point to a bit of a labourish sample in that one from them, you see whst I mean?

    Yougov random number generator, 🤣 what’s that got to do with proper poll comparing

    For a better understanding of Kantor being favourable to Tories as you put it, is before the big autumn crash, they came up with juicy Tory leads.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,974

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The upping of the state pension and the removal of limits on rich bankers' pay seems utterly tone deaf from the Government.

    Are they trying to lose?

    Pensioners and bankers are the Tory core vote. No real surprise
    Then the Tories deserve to lose.

    The more you speak for the Tories, the more I think maybe I should actually just vote Labour, if you represent the Tories. And I despise Labour, but not as much as what you want to stand for.
    Really? You even voted for Labour in 2001 when I voted Tory
    Yes, because I'm a sentient human who has principles and thinks about why I should vote. Those principles generally align with the Tories more, but if they don't, then the Tories don't deserve my vote.

    I don't just vote for a monkey with a blue rosette, and I don't put party before country.

    Oh, and don't forget, you lost in 2001. 😕
    Barty, I can’t stand your ideology, but I do admire your principles.
    He changes them more often than his panties.
    That's not true, unless he has very poor personal hygiene. He is a remarkably consistent Liberal Libertarian Free Marketeer. If anything I would fault him with being too consistent in his worldview, because reality is more complicated than that.
    He is full of mince
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,611

    Taz said:
    The last Kantor was a bit of an outlier giving Labour a massive 6 lead. But on the other hand the other pollsters had bigger gaps too at that time, pre vonc.

    They are certainly the pollster most favourable to Tories, yet still doesn’t help them get above 34 here.
    LLG at 54% is on the low side of recent polls but still in the range.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,548
    edited June 2022
    Pulpstar said:

    MattW said:

    theProle said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
    I'd say that particular chart shows the seasonal complementarity of wind and solar. And the utility of a grid of interconnectors.

    And, the increasing availability factor of offshore wind shows that it is an increasingly attractive option.
    In terms of pure bang for buck, onshore wind is the generation type in the UK that produces the cheapest electricity per kilowatt currently.

    Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)
    Serious Q: do you know whether that comparison takes into account the substantially lower availability of onshore wind vs offshore wind?

    (My general view is keep farmland as farmland for food security - and not wind or solar without a really strong business case - and go overwhelmingly for offshore wind, and solar on industrial and domestic roofs, airfields etc.)

    >Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)

    Indeedy-doody. My electricity bills are roughly halved by the solar. Buggers still haven't taken it out of their estimates 7 years later, though.
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,817
    kjh said:

    GIN1138 said:

    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    You should have had some fun with them for an hour and played along just to waste their time lol!
    I often do. I have put them on hold before, had them call back, etc, etc. This was a new effort. I wondered what would happen. I have kept Microsoft support going for ages before.

    Good man! Keep changing your strategy to waste these scammers time...
  • Options
    algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 10,541
    This piece of rubbish is a melancholy reminder of:
    What constitutes news
    What we have become
    What the BBC is in danger of becoming.


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-61895950
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,974
    kjh said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    Are the student loans running at 11%?.... thats horrendous.
    Most never pay a penny though
    You over-stated your case to create board strife. Unsurprisingly.

    The current pay back is 23% and expected to rise in 2023/4 to more than 50%.

    https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01079/
    Expected you dummy, bollox in other words. Bit like me expecting you to post sensible stuff in 2023, never going to happen.
    What on Earth is wrong with you today? Why are you always so unspeakably rude? At his most frosty, even Leon doesn’t post in such a disgraceful manner. You’re behaving like a drunken pub boor. It is eminently reasonable for working age people to contest that an inflation indexed pensions rise (which will add significantly to national expenditure) is acceptable while they themselves are not receiving anything like that, and may be paying significant student loan repayments (the terms of which can change at a whim). If you disagree, make your arguments rather than ranting away at those who disagree.

    Is there any wonder that the PB memetic pool is narrowing if this is the standard of ad-hominem argumentation which is tolerated? Do you want an echo chamber of elderly, overmonied men who just want to complain about whatever the yoof are up to now? Then there are alternatives. I started posting again because, occasionally, PB produces genuinely insightful debate in a way that only old fashioned forums do and I actually value that, even if you don’t.

    Or, to TLDR all of that, I got knocked off my bike on Tuesday and it was less painful than reading your pish. Bloody well behave.
    Sympathies. I'm not sure why Malcolm isn't banned, except that he's so consistently rude to almost everyone (to be fair I've not suffered myself) that people don't take it personally - it's like being abused by a drunken stranger, peculiar but not really worth worrying about.
    I am surprised you are not banned for being a nasty piece of work. As you say I have never said a bad thing about you yet you want me banned. Pompous hypocritical and plain nasty.
    nippy through the string vest this morning? 🙂


    Good morning , started well till I encountered the fools and comic singers on here, hopefully mor eof eth intelligent posters will be around later. Convinces me to look in later on in the day when the dross and flotsam have disappeared.
    There are a few exceptions of course.
    Irony alert. Almost certainly the least intelligent poster on PB complains about the intelligence of others. I completely agree with @NickPalmer, this bullying unpleasant and abusive little man should be hit with the ban hammer.
    Malcolm is indeed a deliberately nasty persona on here: out to antagonise everyone with a bullying and abusive demeanour which some mistake for humour.

    Of course he should put in the sin bin for a couple of weeks but I'm not holding my breath.
    Malcolm makes me laugh and his insults are often quite poetic. I don't think he should be banned, just as I was against the efforts to have you banned.
    KJH, these losers have no sense of humour. I can just imagine meeting them in a pub, would be a nightmare.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,548
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The upping of the state pension and the removal of limits on rich bankers' pay seems utterly tone deaf from the Government.

    Are they trying to lose?

    Pensioners and bankers are the Tory core vote. No real surprise
    Then the Tories deserve to lose.

    The more you speak for the Tories, the more I think maybe I should actually just vote Labour, if you represent the Tories. And I despise Labour, but not as much as what you want to stand for.
    Really? You even voted for Labour in 2001 when I voted Tory
    Yes, because I'm a sentient human who has principles and thinks about why I should vote. Those principles generally align with the Tories more, but if they don't, then the Tories don't deserve my vote.

    I don't just vote for a monkey with a blue rosette, and I don't put party before country.

    Oh, and don't forget, you lost in 2001. 😕
    Barty, I can’t stand your ideology, but I do admire your principles.
    He changes them more often than his panties.
    That's not true, unless he has very poor personal hygiene. He is a remarkably consistent Liberal Libertarian Free Marketeer. If anything I would fault him with being too consistent in his worldview, because reality is more complicated than that.
    He is full of mince
    Reminds me that today is make some beef-burgers day.
  • Options
    Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 30,945
    malcolmg said:

    Leon said:

    Good morning PB

    Travel question, maybe for @Sandpit

    How horrible is the UAE at this time of year? Can you even go out during the day? Is it possible to swim or simply too hot?

    TA!

    It is a dump all of the year , avoid like the plague.
    To be honest I quite liked the UAE when I worked there - but that was more than 30 years ago and I spent most of my time in camps in the desert on the southern fringes. I have never been anywhere on earth like the Arabian desert. Brutal but fantastic.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,974

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    Are the student loans running at 11%?.... thats horrendous.
    Most never pay a penny though
    You over-stated your case to create board strife. Unsurprisingly.

    The current pay back is 23% and expected to rise in 2023/4 to more than 50%.

    https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01079/
    Expected you dummy, bollox in other words. Bit like me expecting you to post sensible stuff in 2023, never going to happen.
    What on Earth is wrong with you today? Why are you always so unspeakably rude? At his most frosty, even Leon doesn’t post in such a disgraceful manner. You’re behaving like a drunken pub boor. It is eminently reasonable for working age people to contest that an inflation indexed pensions rise (which will add significantly to national expenditure) is acceptable while they themselves are not receiving anything like that, and may be paying significant student loan repayments (the terms of which can change at a whim). If you disagree, make your arguments rather than ranting away at those who disagree.

    Is there any wonder that the PB memetic pool is narrowing if this is the standard of ad-hominem argumentation which is tolerated? Do you want an echo chamber of elderly, overmonied men who just want to complain about whatever the yoof are up to now? Then there are alternatives. I started posting again because, occasionally, PB produces genuinely insightful debate in a way that only old fashioned forums do and I actually value that, even if you don’t.

    Or, to TLDR all of that, I got knocked off my bike on Tuesday and it was less painful than reading your pish. Bloody well behave.
    Sympathies. I'm not sure why Malcolm isn't banned, except that he's so consistently rude to almost everyone (to be fair I've not suffered myself) that people don't take it personally - it's like being abused by a drunken stranger, peculiar but not really worth worrying about.
    I am surprised you are not banned for being a nasty piece of work. As you say I have never said a bad thing about you yet you want me banned. Pompous hypocritical and plain nasty.
    nippy through the string vest this morning? 🙂


    Good morning , started well till I encountered the fools and comic singers on here, hopefully mor eof eth intelligent posters will be around later. Convinces me to look in later on in the day when the dross and flotsam have disappeared.
    There are a few exceptions of course.
    Irony alert. Almost certainly the least intelligent poster on PB complains about the intelligence of others. I completely agree with @NickPalmer, this bullying unpleasant and abusive little man should be hit with the ban hammer.
    Malcolm is indeed a deliberately nasty persona on here: out to antagonise everyone with a bullying and abusive demeanour which some mistake for humour.

    Of course he should put in the sin bin for a couple of weeks but I'm not holding my breath.
    I always have a good chat with him and we are chalk and cheese on a lot of things politically, hes a solid bloke in my opinion.
    Thank you Woolie feelings are reciprocated
  • Options
    Pulpstar said:

    MattW said:

    theProle said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
    I'd say that particular chart shows the seasonal complementarity of wind and solar. And the utility of a grid of interconnectors.

    And, the increasing availability factor of offshore wind shows that it is an increasingly attractive option.
    In terms of pure bang for buck, onshore wind is the generation type in the UK that produces the cheapest electricity per kilowatt currently.

    Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)
    Well said, onshore wind is by far the cheapest form of electricity we have, its a shame that some have tried to block its rollout. Its also relatively one of the quickest forms of energy to construct.

    One thing I don't respect Boris for is constantly banging on about nuclear as the solution to high energy prices - no, nuclear is exorbitantly, eye-wateringly expensive and it will take many years if not decades to actually construct.

    Liberate planning constraints on onshore wind, get as much of it built, as fast as we can. We can use everything it generates, its far cheaper than gas when we can, and in the event we have a surplus we can export some to France etc

    JFDI and get it built.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,934
    edited June 2022

    Taz said:
    The last Kantor was a bit of an outlier giving Labour a massive 6 lead. But on the other hand the other pollsters had bigger gaps too at that time, pre vonc.

    They are certainly the pollster most favourable to Tories, yet still doesn’t help them get above 34 here.
    Thats not entirely accurate Rabbit.
    Last one was 6 lead, amongst the herd
    Before that lead of 3 when YouGov, Techne and Redfield were all giving 3 to 5 leads
    Before that we had 'tie', but Yougov had a lead of 1 same week, opinium a lead of 2 etc
    Before that amongst the herd
    They are on the better end Tory result wise but not as an outrageous outlier ever
    I agree not an outrageous outlier. You added outrageous and ever I simply said “bit of” outlier. Before this one it’s a 3 before that a tie before that 5.
    But on the other hand, as Gin pointed out, the 6 fitted in with the other pollsters from that time, they were not particularly reporting higher, so the Kantor methodology shouldn’t have fitted in so neatly with the other pollsters, 🙂 it does point to a bit of a labourish sample in that one from them, you see whst I mean?

    Yougov random number generator, 🤣 what’s that got to do with proper poll comparing

    For a better understanding of Kantor being favourable to Tories as you put it, is before the big autumn crash, they came up with juicy Tory leads.
    I do see yes, although i think the next few others reporting might help us see if Kantar are on to a trend here or just doing Kantar things. Techne is one to watch tomorrow
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,422
    GIN1138 said:

    kjh said:

    GIN1138 said:

    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    You should have had some fun with them for an hour and played along just to waste their time lol!
    I often do. I have put them on hold before, had them call back, etc, etc. This was a new effort. I wondered what would happen. I have kept Microsoft support going for ages before.

    Good man! Keep changing your strategy to waste these scammers time...
    You could ask them to spell the names of the recipients for you. And then say 'sorry, I didn't hear, can you start again'. And then repeat it back to them getting it wrong deliberately.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,259
    kinabalu said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    maxh said:

    malcolmg said:

    Jonathan said:

    Foxy said:

    Heathener said:

    Foxy said:

    malcolmg said:

    darkage said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    Are the student loans running at 11%?.... thats horrendous.
    What is quite amazing how completely and utterly useless young people are at asserting themselves politically. They don't seem to even realise that they are being screwed over. The NI increase went through without a murmur of dissent. Whack up taxes, change the terms of student loans, keep giving bungs to pensioners so they vote tory.... Zero opposition (or even interest) from young people. It is astonishing.
    That is because most are useless. They spend a few years at uni and think they are big shots when in fact they mainly struggle to wipe their own arses. They then whine incessantly about only earning 50k while complaining that all all those nasty pensioners who worked and paid taxes for 50 years are living high on the hog on their 9k pensions.
    Yep, they shouldn't go to uni. Better off with a secure job and good income, such as working on the railways.
    I think I shall bid you all good day.

    The forum is more than normally populated by grumpy old, white, men this morning. I shall leave you all to dribble with anger into your cornflakes.

    xx
    I was being tongue in cheek, echoing the PB perennial of too many of other people's children going to university, with the notion that they would be better getting proper jobs.
    Do you not think there's a point to be made there? Why is 50% of people going to university the magic number? Why not 90%? 20%?

    My nephew got the grades to go to uni, but chose instead to go into the Wonderful World of Work. He's now on a significantly higher salary than his friends who went to uni, and has a house (with mortgage).

    One of the great education sins of the last 30 yeas has been this idea that kids must go to uni, and that kids who do not are somehow inferior.
    Surely the point is that people have the choice. Get the grades, go if you want. Personally I would encourage people to get an education and see the world before locking themselves into he tedious world of work, nappies and mortgages. You’ll spend decades doing that.
    We have enough freeloaders thank you.
    Aye. The boomers that went to university all expenses paid and chose to break the earnings link for pensioners when they were working, so they didn't have to pay much to pensioners when they were working . . . then whinge about how poor pensions are when they're the ones claiming it and shaft the young.

    Truly the most selfish generation that shafted their own parents and their own grandchildren, but keep repeating the bollocks about how much tax you paid.
    @BartholomewRoberts I don't often agree with your posts (though often find them informative), but this is enjoyably succint and accurate (as far as I'm aware - I didn't know that it was the baby boomer generation that broke the earnings link). Thank you.
    He had to guess as he had run out of fingers and toes. He would not know a boomer if he fell over one. A whining whinging Tory snake.
    You really are the most miserable poster on this site Malc. I can only assume your life is so shite you have to lash out at everyone else who might actually be enjoying theirs.

    On which basis, I hope things improve for you and you learn to hate your fellow human beings a little less.
    F Off Loser,I have a great life.Listening to pish from the likes of you would make anyone disappear. Stick to something you know anything about , like being a loser, rather than trying to guess.
    You could bore for UK at the Olympics and likely get gold.
    Nobody else will bore for the UK while Andy Murray lives.
    He hasn't won a tournament for a while so I think you'll find he currently bores for Scotland.

    Disclaimer: I usually find what he says QI, maybe Anglos are addicted to 'entertainers' like BJ.
    It's more his oratorical style - or lack of it - than the content.

    I once had a really interesting chat with Steve Davis at a funk gig in Camden.
    Do you mean the tone of his voice? Agree it has a touch of the Starmers, but unlike poor old Keir, Andy is usually good value for content.
    Touch of Clint Eastwood there imo but with more fragrant politics. I've never had much difficulty imagining Andy with a poncho and a week of stubble, walking slowly out of town, passing the undertaker and going, "my mistake - FOUR coffins."

    Whereas Tim was just the perfect embodiment of Middle England. A comforting figure.

    Big fan of both.
    That comparison is more than a bit off given Andy's experience at school.
  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,631
    RobD said:

    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    What's the scam there if they were expecting you to say no?
    This is one of the most common scams. To stop the non existent payments they want to get into your bank accounts. Another alternative is they make a so called mistake in refunding you so you make another payment to correct it. It is the bog standard scam we all get everyday. Made myself and wife laugh at his reaction when confirming the fictional payments were valid.
  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,631
    RobD said:

    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    What's the scam there if they were expecting you to say no?
    This is one of the most common scams. To stop the non existent payments they want to get into your bank accounts. Another alternative is they make a so called mistake in refunding you so you make another payment to correct it. It is the bog standard scam we all get everyday. Made myself and wife laugh at his reaction when confirming the fictional payments were valid.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,897
    kjh said:

    GIN1138 said:

    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    You should have had some fun with them for an hour and played along just to waste their time lol!
    I often do. I have put them on hold before, had them call back, etc, etc. This was a new effort. I wondered what would happen. I have kept Microsoft support going for ages before.
    “Microsoft Support” became a sport in an old office a decade or so back - where we were doing actual support of WIndows environments and business applications. Half an hour was normal, we got them close to an hour on occasion. We were obviously on their hit list of people who engaged positively with them, so kept getting calls.

    At least it stopped them calling my Mum and her friends.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,974
    MattW said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The upping of the state pension and the removal of limits on rich bankers' pay seems utterly tone deaf from the Government.

    Are they trying to lose?

    Pensioners and bankers are the Tory core vote. No real surprise
    Then the Tories deserve to lose.

    The more you speak for the Tories, the more I think maybe I should actually just vote Labour, if you represent the Tories. And I despise Labour, but not as much as what you want to stand for.
    Really? You even voted for Labour in 2001 when I voted Tory
    Yes, because I'm a sentient human who has principles and thinks about why I should vote. Those principles generally align with the Tories more, but if they don't, then the Tories don't deserve my vote.

    I don't just vote for a monkey with a blue rosette, and I don't put party before country.

    Oh, and don't forget, you lost in 2001. 😕
    Barty, I can’t stand your ideology, but I do admire your principles.
    He changes them more often than his panties.
    That's not true, unless he has very poor personal hygiene. He is a remarkably consistent Liberal Libertarian Free Marketeer. If anything I would fault him with being too consistent in his worldview, because reality is more complicated than that.
    He is full of mince
    Reminds me that today is make some beef-burgers day.
    Enjoy them Matt, hard to beat a nice homemade cheeseburger with some fries on the side.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,631
    "While this is certainly a significant part of the picture, what is rarely accounted for is the wholesale fiscal and monetary contempt the modern Tory Party has for anyone who isn’t a home-owning pensioner. Faced with the highest tax burden since the war, the highest inflation in decades, and ever-shifting student loan repayment terms — faced with plummeting rates of homeownership and sky-high house prices that have more than sextupled the time it takes for someone in their late-twenties to save a deposit — why should anyone under-40 vote for the Conservative Party?

    And for retirees? As much jam as they want. Pensioner incomes now even exceed working incomes, after tax and housing costs, for the first time in history. The United Kingdom is choosing not to reward those who are building for the future. Instead, the spoils of the Treasury are being diverted to the mediocrity of the already satisfied, whose biggest ambition is driving their Honda Jazz to the local garden centre to buy a plastic lawn they won’t have to bother mowing."

    https://unherd.com/2022/06/the-boomers-have-destroyed-the-tories/
  • Options
    algarkirk said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects
    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 36% (-2)
    CON: 34% (+2)
    LDEM: 13% (-)
    GRN: 5% (-3)
    REF: 4% (+1)

    via
    @KantarPublic
    , 16 - 20 Jun
    Chgs. w/ May"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1539924893105537024

    The Tories are still as likely a Labour to form the next government. I don't think this prospect has ever changed during 2022. SFAICS there's about 45+% each chance of a Tory or a Lab government after the next election with a residual chance of a result in which no remotely stable government can be formed.
    Worth bearing in mind Mike's key point about un-coalition-ability... to form a Government, Tories essentially need a majority (or very close to it), whereas Labour do not.

    This is the issue with Tories polling low to mid 30s. It makes it hard to see the route for them whether Labour are within MoE in an individual poll or outside it. I've said it before and I will again - a lot of those lost 2019 voters aren't coming back with Johnson in post.
  • Options
    Given how quickly John Smith was banned the other day, I doubt the mods need (nor particularly appreciate) the copious amount of unsolicited advice they get on who to ban and when. I’d imagine that it’s particularly irritating when they get tagged in posts with such spurious recommendations.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,934
    malcolmg said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    Are the student loans running at 11%?.... thats horrendous.
    Most never pay a penny though
    You over-stated your case to create board strife. Unsurprisingly.

    The current pay back is 23% and expected to rise in 2023/4 to more than 50%.

    https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01079/
    Expected you dummy, bollox in other words. Bit like me expecting you to post sensible stuff in 2023, never going to happen.
    What on Earth is wrong with you today? Why are you always so unspeakably rude? At his most frosty, even Leon doesn’t post in such a disgraceful manner. You’re behaving like a drunken pub boor. It is eminently reasonable for working age people to contest that an inflation indexed pensions rise (which will add significantly to national expenditure) is acceptable while they themselves are not receiving anything like that, and may be paying significant student loan repayments (the terms of which can change at a whim). If you disagree, make your arguments rather than ranting away at those who disagree.

    Is there any wonder that the PB memetic pool is narrowing if this is the standard of ad-hominem argumentation which is tolerated? Do you want an echo chamber of elderly, overmonied men who just want to complain about whatever the yoof are up to now? Then there are alternatives. I started posting again because, occasionally, PB produces genuinely insightful debate in a way that only old fashioned forums do and I actually value that, even if you don’t.

    Or, to TLDR all of that, I got knocked off my bike on Tuesday and it was less painful than reading your pish. Bloody well behave.
    Sympathies. I'm not sure why Malcolm isn't banned, except that he's so consistently rude to almost everyone (to be fair I've not suffered myself) that people don't take it personally - it's like being abused by a drunken stranger, peculiar but not really worth worrying about.
    I am surprised you are not banned for being a nasty piece of work. As you say I have never said a bad thing about you yet you want me banned. Pompous hypocritical and plain nasty.
    nippy through the string vest this morning? 🙂


    Good morning , started well till I encountered the fools and comic singers on here, hopefully mor eof eth intelligent posters will be around later. Convinces me to look in later on in the day when the dross and flotsam have disappeared.
    There are a few exceptions of course.
    Irony alert. Almost certainly the least intelligent poster on PB complains about the intelligence of others. I completely agree with @NickPalmer, this bullying unpleasant and abusive little man should be hit with the ban hammer.
    Malcolm is indeed a deliberately nasty persona on here: out to antagonise everyone with a bullying and abusive demeanour which some mistake for humour.

    Of course he should put in the sin bin for a couple of weeks but I'm not holding my breath.
    I always have a good chat with him and we are chalk and cheese on a lot of things politically, hes a solid bloke in my opinion.
    Thank you Woolie feelings are reciprocated
    Solid. PB geezers versus the wilted lettuces.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,548
    edited June 2022
    malcolmg said:

    MattW said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The upping of the state pension and the removal of limits on rich bankers' pay seems utterly tone deaf from the Government.

    Are they trying to lose?

    Pensioners and bankers are the Tory core vote. No real surprise
    Then the Tories deserve to lose.

    The more you speak for the Tories, the more I think maybe I should actually just vote Labour, if you represent the Tories. And I despise Labour, but not as much as what you want to stand for.
    Really? You even voted for Labour in 2001 when I voted Tory
    Yes, because I'm a sentient human who has principles and thinks about why I should vote. Those principles generally align with the Tories more, but if they don't, then the Tories don't deserve my vote.

    I don't just vote for a monkey with a blue rosette, and I don't put party before country.

    Oh, and don't forget, you lost in 2001. 😕
    Barty, I can’t stand your ideology, but I do admire your principles.
    He changes them more often than his panties.
    That's not true, unless he has very poor personal hygiene. He is a remarkably consistent Liberal Libertarian Free Marketeer. If anything I would fault him with being too consistent in his worldview, because reality is more complicated than that.
    He is full of mince
    Reminds me that today is make some beef-burgers day.
    Enjoy them Matt, hard to beat a nice homemade cheeseburger with some fries on the side.
    Thanks, Malc.

    Have the mince. Have the onions and the heggs. And have some left over hot peppers.

    Should be good.
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,415
    edited June 2022
    TimS said:

    Taz said:
    The last Kantor was a bit of an outlier giving Labour a massive 6 lead. But on the other hand the other pollsters had bigger gaps too at that time, pre vonc.

    They are certainly the pollster most favourable to Tories, yet still doesn’t help them get above 34 here.
    LLG at 54% is on the low side of recent polls but still in the range.
    It was 59 from Kantor last time.

    The previous 3 lead 55

    The tied poll, LLG 54

    Points to the 59 and 6% Lab lead a “bit of an” outlier. 🙂

    Kantor have certainly picked up on trend for greens going downward, but in their methodology it has not helped Labour, some of the recent Lab in 40’s seem to have come from green expense with some pollsters

    There’s a blend of different methodologies out there!
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,222
    Dura_Ace said:

    Robert Peston
    @Peston
    ·
    2h
    Political expediency and economic reality are about to collide in the most painful way for Boris Johnson and his government. It is not hyperbole to say this feels like an emergency.

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1539879128937234433

    All these numbers, percentages, etc. are balls. Nobody has any fucking idea what's going to happen.
    Went to see Top Gun 2 yesterday. I'd assumed Cruise at 59 would be over the hill but he absolutely isn't. At one juncture he got into an old rustbucket of an F14 and took out 3 Russian state of the art hypersonic fighter planes in a dogfight. He also flew 50 miles at altitude 100 feet at Mach 10. My palms were sweating just sitting there!
  • Options
    BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 18,725
    edited June 2022
    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there are a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,113
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The upping of the state pension and the removal of limits on rich bankers' pay seems utterly tone deaf from the Government.

    Are they trying to lose?

    Pensioners and bankers are the Tory core vote. No real surprise
    Then the Tories deserve to lose.

    The more you speak for the Tories, the more I think maybe I should actually just vote Labour, if you represent the Tories. And I despise Labour, but not as much as what you want to stand for.
    Really? You even voted for Labour in 2001 when I voted Tory
    Yes, because I'm a sentient human who has principles and thinks about why I should vote. Those principles generally align with the Tories more, but if they don't, then the Tories don't deserve my vote.

    I don't just vote for a monkey with a blue rosette, and I don't put party before country.

    Oh, and don't forget, you lost in 2001. 😕
    Barty, I can’t stand your ideology, but I do admire your principles.
    He changes them more often than his panties.
    That's not true, unless he has very poor personal hygiene. He is a remarkably consistent Liberal Libertarian Free Marketeer. If anything I would fault him with being too consistent in his worldview, because reality is more complicated than that.
    He is full of mince
    Ha ha, that's another take.

    I guess he's probably on the opposite side of things on most issues for you, whereas as a libertarian socialist* I do agree with him on some social issues.

    * bit of a poncy label but according to that website where you answer questions and it ascribes a political ideology to you this is what I am.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,974
    MattW said:

    malcolmg said:

    MattW said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The upping of the state pension and the removal of limits on rich bankers' pay seems utterly tone deaf from the Government.

    Are they trying to lose?

    Pensioners and bankers are the Tory core vote. No real surprise
    Then the Tories deserve to lose.

    The more you speak for the Tories, the more I think maybe I should actually just vote Labour, if you represent the Tories. And I despise Labour, but not as much as what you want to stand for.
    Really? You even voted for Labour in 2001 when I voted Tory
    Yes, because I'm a sentient human who has principles and thinks about why I should vote. Those principles generally align with the Tories more, but if they don't, then the Tories don't deserve my vote.

    I don't just vote for a monkey with a blue rosette, and I don't put party before country.

    Oh, and don't forget, you lost in 2001. 😕
    Barty, I can’t stand your ideology, but I do admire your principles.
    He changes them more often than his panties.
    That's not true, unless he has very poor personal hygiene. He is a remarkably consistent Liberal Libertarian Free Marketeer. If anything I would fault him with being too consistent in his worldview, because reality is more complicated than that.
    He is full of mince
    Reminds me that today is make some beef-burgers day.
    Enjoy them Matt, hard to beat a nice homemade cheeseburger with some fries on the side.
    Thanks, Malc.

    Have the mince. Have the onions and the heggs. And have some left over hot peppers.

    Should be good.
    pickles, mustard , ketchup , etc as well hopefully
  • Options
    FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 3,886
    edited June 2022

    GIN1138 said:

    kjh said:

    GIN1138 said:

    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    You should have had some fun with them for an hour and played along just to waste their time lol!
    I often do. I have put them on hold before, had them call back, etc, etc. This was a new effort. I wondered what would happen. I have kept Microsoft support going for ages before.

    Good man! Keep changing your strategy to waste these scammers time...
    You could ask them to spell the names of the recipients for you. And then say 'sorry, I didn't hear, can you start again'. And then repeat it back to them getting it wrong deliberately.
    The last scam call I received went something like this:

    "We understand you had a car accident recently."
    "Ah. Do you mean the Bentley or the Ferrari?"
    "Who do you think you are, Tom Cruise?"
    "Who do you think you are, an actual insurer?"
    -Click-


    The number of calls has reduced significantly now though - I think BT is getting on top of the problem.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929
    edited June 2022
    MattW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MattW said:

    theProle said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
    I'd say that particular chart shows the seasonal complementarity of wind and solar. And the utility of a grid of interconnectors.

    And, the increasing availability factor of offshore wind shows that it is an increasingly attractive option.
    In terms of pure bang for buck, onshore wind is the generation type in the UK that produces the cheapest electricity per kilowatt currently.

    Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)
    Serious Q: do you know whether that comparison takes into account the substantially lower availability of onshore wind vs offshore wind?

    (My general view is keep farmland as farmland for food security - and not wind or solar without a really strong business case - and go overwhelmingly for offshore wind, and solar on industrial and domestic roofs, airfields etc.)

    >Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)

    Indeedy-doody. My electricity bills are roughly halved by the solar. Buggers still haven't taken it out of their estimates 7 years later, though.
    It takes into account the diesel backup and lower average generation per turbine (I'd imagine) that onshore wind gives. Not everywhere is farmland - the main objection seems to be people having the view spoilt.
    When you strip out both the green case (Obviously in favour) and the view case (Against) and only consider economics it's the best. As Barty points out it has a quick enough turn around time to be relevant in the current squeeze too. (Offshore takes longer, and as for nuclear...)
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,259
    kinabalu said:

    23rd June anyway. That date. The exact same one on which this great country of ours took a wrong turn that will probably see us lost in the weeds for the best part of 50 years. There's nothing you can do to stop it coming around every year - thankfully just the once - so you just have to crack on. Bad memories though.

    Had you noticed that the EU Council will be making its decision today on whether to grant candidate status to Ukraine and Moldova?

    I'm sure that isn't a mere coincidence. The symbolism of announcing another stage of EU expansion on the sixth anniversary of the lost Brexit referendum is very powerful, particularly when Ukraine is fighting a war in part for the purpose of being able to join the EU.

    I don't think the EU have fully grasped the opportunity that Russia's invasion of Ukraine provided for creating a sense of purpose and unity. This is a chance to take that a step forward.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,548

    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there is a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍

    Isn't that essentially polluting (visually or emission-wise) installations being stuffed away from the rich, powerful people?

    Would County Durham get tunnels for HS2 like Buckinghamshire?
  • Options
    algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 10,541

    algarkirk said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Britain Elects
    @BritainElects
    Westminster voting intention:

    LAB: 36% (-2)
    CON: 34% (+2)
    LDEM: 13% (-)
    GRN: 5% (-3)
    REF: 4% (+1)

    via
    @KantarPublic
    , 16 - 20 Jun
    Chgs. w/ May"

    https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1539924893105537024

    The Tories are still as likely a Labour to form the next government. I don't think this prospect has ever changed during 2022. SFAICS there's about 45+% each chance of a Tory or a Lab government after the next election with a residual chance of a result in which no remotely stable government can be formed.
    Worth bearing in mind Mike's key point about un-coalition-ability... to form a Government, Tories essentially need a majority (or very close to it), whereas Labour do not.

    This is the issue with Tories polling low to mid 30s. It makes it hard to see the route for them whether Labour are within MoE in an individual poll or outside it. I've said it before and I will again - a lot of those lost 2019 voters aren't coming back with Johnson in post.
    Mostly agree. The variables, to my mind, balance out in such a way that you can't rationally distinguish %wise between the two big outcomes: a Lab or Tory led government. The Tories are indeed, at the moment uncoalitionable, but have an 80 seat lead. Labour are coalitionable but are a billion seats behind, and face a real uphill challenge with voters over the SNP problem, + the Tories have the power to change the leader, + Labour have the ability to morph into Leninist zealots in seconds.

  • Options
    MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594
    edited June 2022

    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there are a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍

    Solve the intermittency problem, and you can build all the wind turbines you want.

    Right now you can't solve it, though.
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,113

    Given how quickly John Smith was banned the other day, I doubt the mods need (nor particularly appreciate) the copious amount of unsolicited advice they get on who to ban and when. I’d imagine that it’s particularly irritating when they get tagged in posts with such spurious recommendations.

    Cancel culture innit.
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,405
    Pulpstar said:

    MattW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MattW said:

    theProle said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
    I'd say that particular chart shows the seasonal complementarity of wind and solar. And the utility of a grid of interconnectors.

    And, the increasing availability factor of offshore wind shows that it is an increasingly attractive option.
    In terms of pure bang for buck, onshore wind is the generation type in the UK that produces the cheapest electricity per kilowatt currently.

    Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)
    Serious Q: do you know whether that comparison takes into account the substantially lower availability of onshore wind vs offshore wind?

    (My general view is keep farmland as farmland for food security - and not wind or solar without a really strong business case - and go overwhelmingly for offshore wind, and solar on industrial and domestic roofs, airfields etc.)

    >Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)

    Indeedy-doody. My electricity bills are roughly halved by the solar. Buggers still haven't taken it out of their estimates 7 years later, though.
    It takes into account the diesel backup and lower average generation per turbine (I'd imagine) that onshore wind gives. Not everywhere is farmland - the main objection seems to be people having the view spoilt.
    When you strip out both the green case (Obviously in favour) and the view case (Against) and only consider economics it's the best. As Barty points out it has a quick enough turn around time to be relevant in the current squeeze too. (Offshore takes longer, and as for nuclear...)
    I’d be interested to see the latest costs for onshore vs offshore installation - with 100m+ blades in the next generation of wind turbines the transport issues on land would be… fun.
  • Options
    MISTY said:

    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there are a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍

    Solve the intermittency problem, and you can build all the wind turbines you want.

    Right now you can't.
    What intermittency problem?

    As it stands 100% of the energy produced is able to be either consumed, stored or exported - and its economically far, far cheaper than either gas or coal. Even before the recent commodity spike in costs it already was, now its even cheaper.

    So how is that a problem? If we were generating energy we couldn't use, that'd be a problem, but we're not.
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,817

    GIN1138 said:

    kjh said:

    GIN1138 said:

    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    You should have had some fun with them for an hour and played along just to waste their time lol!
    I often do. I have put them on hold before, had them call back, etc, etc. This was a new effort. I wondered what would happen. I have kept Microsoft support going for ages before.

    Good man! Keep changing your strategy to waste these scammers time...
    You could ask them to spell the names of the recipients for you. And then say 'sorry, I didn't hear, can you start again'. And then repeat it back to them getting it wrong deliberately.
    This became one of my favourite YouTube channels when I was recovering from my recent treatment - Scammer Payback: https://www.youtube.com/c/ScammerPayback
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,442
    edited June 2022
    kjh said:

    RobD said:

    kjh said:

    Just had a scam call (identical one yesterday) re two unusual payments on my card to Amazon and an international money transfer. I was asked if I wanted to confirm these payments. When I said yes they got very flustered. Asked me to confirm in a disbelieving voice several times before hanging up.

    What's the scam there if they were expecting you to say no?
    This is one of the most common scams. To stop the non existent payments they want to get into your bank accounts. Another alternative is they make a so called mistake in refunding you so you make another payment to correct it. It is the bog standard scam we all get everyday. Made myself and wife laugh at his reaction when confirming the fictional payments were valid.
    With the ambulance chasers (which seem to have disappeared, for me at least) I'd say yes, I did have an accident, yes, I think I had whiplash and everything else. Would my claim be affected by me having had ten pints at the time of the fictional crash and it all being my fault?
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,897
    Brilliant headline in the Telegraph”

    “Train strikes latest: 'Public is behind us' claims RMT as millions forced to work from home”

    There’s at least two, if not three different ways you can read that.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/06/23/train-rail-strikes-latest-news-uk-london-updates/
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,259
    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    This is apparently more to do with gas supply than the French nuclear reactors, or any preference for using British supply over German.

    Ever since the start of the war there's been more LNG import into the UK, but we only have limited gas pipeline capacity to send that to Europe. So we're converting it to electricity and sending the electricity to the continent instead, thus displacing continental gas use.

    This then means we're more likely to need our leftover coal plants to make up the deficit when the wind isn't blowing.

    Variations in French-German supply are mostly driven by variations in German wind generation.
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,442
    edited June 2022
    kinabalu said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Robert Peston
    @Peston
    ·
    2h
    Political expediency and economic reality are about to collide in the most painful way for Boris Johnson and his government. It is not hyperbole to say this feels like an emergency.

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1539879128937234433

    All these numbers, percentages, etc. are balls. Nobody has any fucking idea what's going to happen.
    Went to see Top Gun 2 yesterday. I'd assumed Cruise at 59 would be over the hill but he absolutely isn't. At one juncture he got into an old rustbucket of an F14 and took out 3 Russian state of the art hypersonic fighter planes in a dogfight. He also flew 50 miles at altitude 100 feet at Mach 10. My palms were sweating just sitting there!
    Russian? I thought they were extremely careful not to disclose the nationality of the bad guys. I did like the dark helmets the bad guys were using. Looked pretty cool (and hid their ethnicity). Maybe a bit too dark though, as they didn't seem to be able to see very well to fire at Cruise.

    Also. Rooster - WTF? Gosling was right there (and no more lame than Rooster or Goose)

    Edit: Or were they Russian-made planes? With undisclosed nationality of owner.
  • Options
    GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 20,817

    malcolmg said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    malcolmg said:

    Heathener said:

    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Thursday's Express: "It's only fair! Rishi defends £1,000 boost to pensions"

    Aha, we locked down to save them and our student loans get jacked up 11%, fuck off you twat

    Pay the money you borrowed and stop whining. You either benefitted with a good job of you leave the poor to pick up your tab for years pissing it up at uni wasting pensioners hard earned pittance. Stop blaming other people for your uselessness
    Are the student loans running at 11%?.... thats horrendous.
    Most never pay a penny though
    You over-stated your case to create board strife. Unsurprisingly.

    The current pay back is 23% and expected to rise in 2023/4 to more than 50%.

    https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01079/
    Expected you dummy, bollox in other words. Bit like me expecting you to post sensible stuff in 2023, never going to happen.
    What on Earth is wrong with you today? Why are you always so unspeakably rude? At his most frosty, even Leon doesn’t post in such a disgraceful manner. You’re behaving like a drunken pub boor. It is eminently reasonable for working age people to contest that an inflation indexed pensions rise (which will add significantly to national expenditure) is acceptable while they themselves are not receiving anything like that, and may be paying significant student loan repayments (the terms of which can change at a whim). If you disagree, make your arguments rather than ranting away at those who disagree.

    Is there any wonder that the PB memetic pool is narrowing if this is the standard of ad-hominem argumentation which is tolerated? Do you want an echo chamber of elderly, overmonied men who just want to complain about whatever the yoof are up to now? Then there are alternatives. I started posting again because, occasionally, PB produces genuinely insightful debate in a way that only old fashioned forums do and I actually value that, even if you don’t.

    Or, to TLDR all of that, I got knocked off my bike on Tuesday and it was less painful than reading your pish. Bloody well behave.
    Sympathies. I'm not sure why Malcolm isn't banned, except that he's so consistently rude to almost everyone (to be fair I've not suffered myself) that people don't take it personally - it's like being abused by a drunken stranger, peculiar but not really worth worrying about.
    I am surprised you are not banned for being a nasty piece of work. As you say I have never said a bad thing about you yet you want me banned. Pompous hypocritical and plain nasty.
    nippy through the string vest this morning? 🙂


    Good morning , started well till I encountered the fools and comic singers on here, hopefully mor eof eth intelligent posters will be around later. Convinces me to look in later on in the day when the dross and flotsam have disappeared.
    There are a few exceptions of course.
    Irony alert. Almost certainly the least intelligent poster on PB complains about the intelligence of others. I completely agree with @NickPalmer, this bullying unpleasant and abusive little man should be hit with the ban hammer.
    Malcolm is indeed a deliberately nasty persona on here: out to antagonise everyone with a bullying and abusive demeanour which some mistake for humour.

    Of course he should put in the sin bin for a couple of weeks but I'm not holding my breath.
    I always have a good chat with him and we are chalk and cheese on a lot of things politically, hes a solid bloke in my opinion.
    Thank you Woolie feelings are reciprocated
    Solid. PB geezers versus the wilted lettuces.
    LOL! :D
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,548
    Pulpstar said:

    MattW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MattW said:

    theProle said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
    I'd say that particular chart shows the seasonal complementarity of wind and solar. And the utility of a grid of interconnectors.

    And, the increasing availability factor of offshore wind shows that it is an increasingly attractive option.
    In terms of pure bang for buck, onshore wind is the generation type in the UK that produces the cheapest electricity per kilowatt currently.

    Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)
    Serious Q: do you know whether that comparison takes into account the substantially lower availability of onshore wind vs offshore wind?

    (My general view is keep farmland as farmland for food security - and not wind or solar without a really strong business case - and go overwhelmingly for offshore wind, and solar on industrial and domestic roofs, airfields etc.)

    >Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)

    Indeedy-doody. My electricity bills are roughly halved by the solar. Buggers still haven't taken it out of their estimates 7 years later, though.
    It takes into account the diesel backup and lower average generation per turbine (I'd imagine) that onshore wind gives. Not everywhere is farmland - the main objection seems to be people having the view spoilt.
    When you strip out both the green case (Obviously in favour) and the view case (Against) and only consider economics it's the best. As Barty points out it has a quick enough turn around time to be relevant in the current squeeze too. (Offshore takes longer, and as for nuclear...)
    Offshore takes basically 10-15 years, and our current huge raft of offshore wind coming on stream (7GW capacity this year iirc) is I think from the 2010 or earlier licensing rounds. (Open to correction)

    Serious Tory cockup not to have maintained the momentum, and they did no more licensing until 2021.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,966
    62-3.
    Williamson out.
  • Options
    MISTYMISTY Posts: 1,594

    MISTY said:

    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there are a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍

    Solve the intermittency problem, and you can build all the wind turbines you want.

    Right now you can't.
    What intermittency problem?

    As it stands 100% of the energy produced is able to be either consumed, stored or exported - and its economically far, far cheaper than either gas or coal. Even before the recent commodity spike in costs it already was, now its even cheaper.

    So how is that a problem? If we were generating energy we couldn't use, that'd be a problem, but we're not.
    Er....sometimes the wind doesn't blow, and the turbines don't go around. But we still need the electricity.....??

    The Telegraph reckons if we get a wind drought of the order of some of the recent ones, then we are looking at blackouts this winter. That's why Kwarteng is leaning on some existing power sources not to shut down.

    When the turbines can store some of the energy during windy times, via green ammonia or new battery technology that does not exist yet, then you will have a strong case.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,259

    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there are a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍

    Once you continue on to the M74/A74(M) in Dumfries and Galloway there are lots of wind turbines again.

    Apparently there are parts of the country where you can blight the hills with sheep, but it's completely forbidden to add a few graceful wind turbines.
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,860
    Today's Kantar.

    2 pt lead

    SKS fans please explain
  • Options
    TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 1,708
    Nigelb said:

    CatMan said:

    kle4 said:

    This seems like a really really dumb attempt to argue justification to carry your deadly toy around with you whenever you want.

    A medieval English law dating back nearly seven centuries is now at the heart of the most important US Supreme Court gun case in a decade.

    The case - which stems from a New York legal battle - challenges a state law that requires that gun users who want a concealed carry permit first prove they have a valid reason.

    To help them determine how broad the rights of America's many gun owners go, the country's nine supreme court judges are also looking back to the 1328 Statute of Northampton, which dates back to the reign of Edward III...

    In a separate 2008 Supreme Court case that struck down strict Washington DC handgun laws, the late Justice Antonin Scalia argued that the Second Amendment to the US constitution codified "a pre-existing right" from England.

    He added that by the time the United States was founded in 1776, the "right to have arms had become fundamental for English subjects."

    Some historians, however, have disagreed with that assessment, noting that by the late 1200s, English authorities had passed laws restricting the right to carry weapons while traveling in public or in London.

    The later 1328 Statute of Northampton - which predates the first recorded use of a firearm in Europe by several decades - declared that nobody "except the King's servants in his presence" will "go nor ride armed by night nor by day" in fairs, markets "nor in no part elsewhere"...

    In a brief for the Supreme Court, attorney Paul Clement - who represents Mr Nash, Mr Koch and the New York Rifle and Pistol Association - wrote that the statute was only meant to control "unusual weapons" that would frighten the public


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-59158248

    I don't understand why if the 2nd Amendment allows 18 year olds to own semi-automatic weapons, why doesn't it also allow them to own fully automatic weapons, or grenades, or rocket launchers, or Napalm, or Tactical Nuclear Weapons
    It probably should. The whole point of the 2nd Amendment was to allow the people to overthrow the government if the government descended into tyranny.
    A US government of the late 18th century would only have muskets in its army, so allowing private citizens the same put them on an equal footing.
    Now the US army has nuclear weapons, the only real way for the citizens to effectively fight the US army (should it be needed) is to allow them the same weapons.

    So really, yes, private US citizens should be allowed to buy tactical and strategic nuclear weapons, along with the delivery system.
    They could put them in their back yards.
    Except was that actually the point of the 2nd Amendment?

    That is the line beloved of NRA types, but the less mentioned "well regulated militia" part of the Amendment rather suggests otherwise.
    @TheValiant is perhaps being ironic there ?
    I was!
    The 2nd Amendment is redundant. Given how many countries have gun controls, and they haven't descended into violence and anarchy I don't see any point for it anymore.

    Countries have problems. Gun ownership or not doesn't seem to make a difference to those problems. But gun ownership along with some belief that it is a fundamental right that can never be infringed is leading to significant problems.
  • Options
    wooliedyedwooliedyed Posts: 6,934

    Today's Kantar.

    2 pt lead

    SKS fans please explain

    Thats before he abandoned the unions and made sinners of his MPs
    'Forensic'
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,548
    MISTY said:

    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there are a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍

    Solve the intermittency problem, and you can build all the wind turbines you want.

    Right now you can't solve it, though.
    That's a MUCH smaller issue for offshore over onshore, and I think is now fading away with larger turbines.
  • Options
    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    edited June 2022

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The upping of the state pension and the removal of limits on rich bankers' pay seems utterly tone deaf from the Government.

    Are they trying to lose?

    Pensioners and bankers are the Tory core vote. No real surprise
    Then the Tories deserve to lose.

    The more you speak for the Tories, the more I think maybe I should actually just vote Labour, if you represent the Tories. And I despise Labour, but not as much as what you want to stand for.
    Really? You even voted for Labour in 2001 when I voted Tory
    Yes, because I'm a sentient human who has principles and thinks about why I should vote. Those principles generally align with the Tories more, but if they don't, then the Tories don't deserve my vote.

    I don't just vote for a monkey with a blue rosette, and I don't put party before country.

    Oh, and don't forget, you lost in 2001. 😕
    Barty, I can’t stand your ideology, but I do admire your principles.
    He changes them more often than his panties.
    That's not true, unless he has very poor personal hygiene. He is a remarkably consistent Liberal Libertarian Free Marketeer. If anything I would fault him with being too consistent in his worldview, because reality is more complicated than that.

    malcolmg said:

    OnboardG1 said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    The upping of the state pension and the removal of limits on rich bankers' pay seems utterly tone deaf from the Government.

    Are they trying to lose?

    Pensioners and bankers are the Tory core vote. No real surprise
    Then the Tories deserve to lose.

    The more you speak for the Tories, the more I think maybe I should actually just vote Labour, if you represent the Tories. And I despise Labour, but not as much as what you want to stand for.
    Really? You even voted for Labour in 2001 when I voted Tory
    Yes, because I'm a sentient human who has principles and thinks about why I should vote. Those principles generally align with the Tories more, but if they don't, then the Tories don't deserve my vote.

    I don't just vote for a monkey with a blue rosette, and I don't put party before country.

    Oh, and don't forget, you lost in 2001. 😕
    Barty, I can’t stand your ideology, but I do admire your principles.
    He changes them more often than his panties.
    That's not true, unless he has very poor personal hygiene. He is a remarkably consistent Liberal Libertarian Free Marketeer. If anything I would fault him with being too consistent in his worldview, because reality is more complicated than that.
    I'm with Malcolm on this one. 'The futures bright the futures orange isn't an ideology' it's a slogan. He has announced himself "a libertarian" since before his Lazarus act but he's also said 'Boris Johnson is the best Prime Minister since at least Thatcher and possibly since the war'. That suggests that Malcolm's 'mince' isn't too far off the mark.

  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,897
    edited June 2022
    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Robert Peston
    @Peston
    ·
    2h
    Political expediency and economic reality are about to collide in the most painful way for Boris Johnson and his government. It is not hyperbole to say this feels like an emergency.

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1539879128937234433

    All these numbers, percentages, etc. are balls. Nobody has any fucking idea what's going to happen.
    Went to see Top Gun 2 yesterday. I'd assumed Cruise at 59 would be over the hill but he absolutely isn't. At one juncture he got into an old rustbucket of an F14 and took out 3 Russian state of the art hypersonic fighter planes in a dogfight. He also flew 50 miles at altitude 100 feet at Mach 10. My palms were sweating just sitting there!
    Russian? I thought they were extremely careful not to disclose the nationality of the bad guys. I did like the dark helmets the bad guys were using. Looked pretty cool (and hid their ethnicity). Maybe a bit too dark though, as they didn't seem to be able to see very well to fire at Cruise.

    Also. Rooster - WTF? Gosling was right there (and no more lame than Rooster or Goose)

    Edit: Or were they Russian-made planes? With undisclosed nationality of owner.
    The target was clearly in Iran, but they were careful not to describe the planes of the enemy, except as “5th Generation Fighters”. They looked a little like the new Russian Su-57.

    Good movie though, much better than the usual Hollywood bollocks of recent years.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,929
    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there are a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍

    Solve the intermittency problem, and you can build all the wind turbines you want.

    Right now you can't.
    What intermittency problem?

    As it stands 100% of the energy produced is able to be either consumed, stored or exported - and its economically far, far cheaper than either gas or coal. Even before the recent commodity spike in costs it already was, now its even cheaper.

    So how is that a problem? If we were generating energy we couldn't use, that'd be a problem, but we're not.
    Er....sometimes the wind doesn't blow, and the turbines don't go around. But we still need the electricity.....??

    The Telegraph reckons if we get a wind drought of the order of some of the recent ones, then we are looking at blackouts this winter. That's why Kwarteng is leaning on some existing power sources not to shut down.

    When the turbines can store some of the energy during windy times, via green ammonia or new battery technology that does not exist yet, then you will have a strong case.
    Intermittancy is only a true issue if there's a day when ~100% of generation is being produced by turbines as excess on that day will be 'wasted'. We haven't built enough to run into that issue yet.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,631

    Today's Kantar.

    2 pt lead

    SKS fans please explain

    Tories down 11% on the last election, Labour up 3%.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,304
    kinabalu said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Robert Peston
    @Peston
    ·
    2h
    Political expediency and economic reality are about to collide in the most painful way for Boris Johnson and his government. It is not hyperbole to say this feels like an emergency.

    https://twitter.com/Peston/status/1539879128937234433

    All these numbers, percentages, etc. are balls. Nobody has any fucking idea what's going to happen.
    Went to see Top Gun 2 yesterday. I'd assumed Cruise at 59 would be over the hill but he absolutely isn't. At one juncture he got into an old rustbucket of an F14 and took out 3 Russian state of the art hypersonic fighter planes in a dogfight. He also flew 50 miles at altitude 100 feet at Mach 10. My palms were sweating just sitting there!
    Plenty of reviews on the web by Top Guns. All (that I've seen) very positive.
  • Options
    BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 18,725
    edited June 2022
    MISTY said:

    MISTY said:

    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there are a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍

    Solve the intermittency problem, and you can build all the wind turbines you want.

    Right now you can't.
    What intermittency problem?

    As it stands 100% of the energy produced is able to be either consumed, stored or exported - and its economically far, far cheaper than either gas or coal. Even before the recent commodity spike in costs it already was, now its even cheaper.

    So how is that a problem? If we were generating energy we couldn't use, that'd be a problem, but we're not.
    Er....sometimes the wind doesn't blow, and the turbines don't go around. But we still need the electricity.....??

    The Telegraph reckons if we get a wind drought of the order of some of the recent ones, then we are looking at blackouts this winter. That's why Kwarteng is leaning on some existing power sources not to shut down.

    When the turbines can store some of the energy during windy times, via green ammonia or new battery technology that does not exist yet, then you will have a strong case.
    But how is that a problem?

    We already have a strong case, because wind is so cheap. When wind is blowing, you can use wind, when wind isn't blowing, you can use gas, but wind is far cheaper than gas.

    Having gas etc available as a backup when wind isn't blowing is only logical, but that's not a reason to use the far more expensive gas all the time, rather than using the far cheaper wind when it is blowing now, is it?

    In the longer term if you wish to eliminate CCGT's then you'll need a viable alternative, but in the shorter term there is literally no reason not to be using the much cheaper onshore wind.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,548
    edited June 2022

    Pulpstar said:

    MattW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    MattW said:

    theProle said:

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    It's charts like this (both French and UK) which show why wind generation is a complete waste of time unless someone comes along with some affordable storage...
    I'd say that particular chart shows the seasonal complementarity of wind and solar. And the utility of a grid of interconnectors.

    And, the increasing availability factor of offshore wind shows that it is an increasingly attractive option.
    In terms of pure bang for buck, onshore wind is the generation type in the UK that produces the cheapest electricity per kilowatt currently.

    Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)
    Serious Q: do you know whether that comparison takes into account the substantially lower availability of onshore wind vs offshore wind?

    (My general view is keep farmland as farmland for food security - and not wind or solar without a really strong business case - and go overwhelmingly for offshore wind, and solar on industrial and domestic roofs, airfields etc.)

    >Solar will actually be producing more than the shown 5.54 GW, as some will be being used directly (Reduction in demand)

    Indeedy-doody. My electricity bills are roughly halved by the solar. Buggers still haven't taken it out of their estimates 7 years later, though.
    It takes into account the diesel backup and lower average generation per turbine (I'd imagine) that onshore wind gives. Not everywhere is farmland - the main objection seems to be people having the view spoilt.
    When you strip out both the green case (Obviously in favour) and the view case (Against) and only consider economics it's the best. As Barty points out it has a quick enough turn around time to be relevant in the current squeeze too. (Offshore takes longer, and as for nuclear...)
    I’d be interested to see the latest costs for onshore vs offshore installation - with 100m+ blades in the next generation of wind turbines the transport issues on land would be… fun.
    Much of that is in the lists of offshore / onshore wind on wiki, or in occasional summary articles.

    eg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_offshore_wind_farms_in_the_United_Kingdom

    MattW said:

    Interesting situation in Power Supply this morning. In the UK:


    Fr has once again maxed out electricity imports from UK at 2GW. Has been the case throughout this year so far. To do with very old nuclear reactors in Fr; half turned off for maintenance.

    Also interesting to note that the UK is generating 3% from coal - that is afaik all the coal generation we have left. In addition to 5.5% of supply from UK, Fr also importing 5.2% from De.

    Suggests UK currently preferred to De in prevailing conditions, has De has more links available. Impacted by EDF owning UK-Fr links (if they do?)?


    This is apparently more to do with gas supply than the French nuclear reactors, or any preference for using British supply over German.

    Ever since the start of the war there's been more LNG import into the UK, but we only have limited gas pipeline capacity to send that to Europe. So we're converting it to electricity and sending the electricity to the continent instead, thus displacing continental gas use.

    This then means we're more likely to need our leftover coal plants to make up the deficit when the wind isn't blowing.

    Variations in French-German supply are mostly driven by variations in German wind generation.
    Interesting alternative perspective, thanks.
  • Options
    eekeek Posts: 24,981
    edited June 2022

    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there are a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍

    Once you continue on to the M74/A74(M) in Dumfries and Galloway there are lots of wind turbines again.

    Apparently there are parts of the country where you can blight the hills with sheep, but it's completely forbidden to add a few graceful wind turbines.
    It's not the turbines that are the issue usually it's the wire wiring them up to the grid...

    https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/scottish-windfarms-penalised-by-energy-grid-charges-claims-mp-3302561 covered the issue last year but it's the same once you go outside the old industrial areas.

    Round Runcorn where the electricity network was historically designed to carry large amounts of electricity connecting wind turbines to the network is easy and relatively cheap.

    Further north there isn't much historic connectivity capacity / spare capacity and once it's been grabbed it's expensive to add more items.

    It's a while since I've been to the West of the Lake District but I do seem to remember a number of wind turbines there.
  • Options
    eek said:

    What's interesting with onshore wind is the very differing regional variations for it.

    Drive along the M56 and there are a lot of wind turbines available, especially around Runcorn. Along the M58 there is a fair amount too.

    Drive along the M6, especially north of Preston, and its much, much rarer in comparison.

    Areas that were used to lots of industry seem to have absolutely no qualms with turbines.

    For me, I love onshore wind turbines. They're just a part of the background, like power pylons, but they look nice too. Especially compared to the alternative, I used to have to drive past Fiddlers Ferry power station on a daily basis and my car would turn from red to grey due to the amount of emissions from the power station that would land on my car. That can't be good for your breath either, I'd assume. So that area being covered in turbines rather than Fiddlers Ferry operating is a mammoth improvement. 👍

    Once you continue on to the M74/A74(M) in Dumfries and Galloway there are lots of wind turbines again.

    Apparently there are parts of the country where you can blight the hills with sheep, but it's completely forbidden to add a few graceful wind turbines.
    It's not the turbines that are the issue usually it's the wire wiring them up to the grid...
    Interesting. What's the problem? Do pylons not work on hills?
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