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Is there a face-saving way Johnson can step aside? – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 8,489
edited June 13 in General
imageIs there a face-saving way Johnson can step aside? – politicalbetting.com

For someone who likes to be liked yesterday’s booing of Johnson, seen by tens of millions as he arrived at St Paul’s, must have been very difficult to stomach. I’m not a fan of the PM but it was hard not to feel for him as he walked up the Cathedral steps with the cameras on him yesterday,

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Comments

  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 45,381
    In the old days, you promoted failed politicians to "EU Commission President", but we can't do that any more...

    Or could we?

    Johnson is eligible for an EU passport. He's notoriously lazy. We could claim it as some kind of victory, as could the EU. It would probably help with Boris's child support issues.

    Could we, maybe, make it happen?
  • TomsToms Posts: 2,381
    edited June 4
    I didn't see it. Was he with his wife? Give 'em some platinum plated wall paper and a signed copy of "The Art of the Deal" as leaving gifts.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 45,381
    rcs1000 said:

    In the old days, you promoted failed politicians to "EU Commission President", but we can't do that any more...

    Or could we?

    Johnson is eligible for an EU passport. He's notoriously lazy. We could claim it as some kind of victory, as could the EU. It would probably help with Boris's child support issues.

    Could we, maybe, make it happen?

    Not only that, but it would potentially unite the nation:

    - Remainers could say "see, even Boris realises that we should be in the EU, and is just engaged in a 40 year plan"
    - Leavers could say "we finally have our man on the inside, which will result in the eventual destruction of the EUSSR"
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 40,044
    Like Johnson ever does face-saving?
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 13,821
    Trader working from home wiped out €300bn in stocks after adding extra zero
    Citigroup faces $50m hit after flash-crash caused by London-based trader

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/06/03/citigroup-faces-50m-hit-fat-fingered-trader-added-extra-zero/ (£££)
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    edited June 4
    A very good thread Mike.

    I was taken aback by the booing. It was a royalist crowd and seemed spontaneous. Coming on top of 'that' opening Mumsnet question, it has been a bruising week for him.

    Yesterday evening I was convinced it that it was over for him. We've all said that before about Boris though.

    p.s. RCS - had lunch guests. It was a lovely time sitting out in the sun.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    He wanted to be king of the world. Is there anything coming up in the UN?
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    Toms said:

    I didn't see it. Was he with his wife?

    Yes
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 13,821
    Heathener said:

    Toms said:

    I didn't see it. Was he with his wife?

    Yes
    The woman in red in the header picture is indeed Boris's wife. Some ungallant souls have suggested that Carrie's hats are chosen so she does not have to look at the old man. And that Boris's reading was maliciously chosen:-

    "Whatever is true, whatever is honourable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is pleasing, whatever is commendable … think about these things."
    Philippians 4:8.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    Also telling in a different way that Keir Starmer was greeted with complete silence.

  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156

    Heathener said:

    Toms said:

    I didn't see it. Was he with his wife?

    Yes
    The woman in red in the header picture is indeed Boris's wife. Some ungallant souls have suggested that Carrie's hats are chosen so she does not have to look at the old man. And that Boris's reading was maliciously chosen:-

    "Whatever is true, whatever is honourable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is pleasing, whatever is commendable … think about these things."
    Philippians 4:8.
    For sure DJL! I turned to my partner and said ... blimey, talk about irony!

    Also intriguing that both Andrew and Welby were absented by covid.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    "Earlier, the head of the Grassroots Conservatives organisation, which represents rank-and-file Tory members, called on Johnson to quit.

    Ed Costello told the Daily Telegraph: “I’ve come to the conclusion that he probably should resign, and if he had any sense he would resign before he was pushed.

    “He needs to go before the next election, because some of what he has done will put off voters. He just hasn’t been wholly honest about what went on, and it would have been better if he ’fessed up and it would all have been over.”

    Costello said recent tax rises were “silly” given the cost of living crisis and spiralling inflation, adding: “The tax rise is going to hit people at a time when they’re already being hit, and the cut in benefits was a foolish thing to do.”

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jun/03/boris-johnson-booed-st-pauls-platinum-jubilee-queen
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 101,701
    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    Anyway, am heading off to Lord's today so I hope the weather behaves.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 39,603

    Heathener said:

    Toms said:

    I didn't see it. Was he with his wife?

    Yes
    The woman in red in the header picture is indeed Boris's wife. Some ungallant souls have suggested that Carrie's hats are chosen so she does not have to look at the old man. And that Boris's reading was maliciously chosen:-

    "Whatever is true, whatever is honourable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is pleasing, whatever is commendable … think about these things."
    Philippians 4:8.
    Condign, not malicious.

    … I’m not a fan of the PM but it was hard not to feel for him as he walked up the Cathedral steps with the cameras on him yesterday...

    OGH is a generous soul.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311
    Heathener said:

    A very good thread Mike.

    I was taken aback by the booing. It was a royalist crowd and seemed spontaneous. Coming on top of 'that' opening Mumsnet question, it has been a bruising week for him.

    Yesterday evening I was convinced it that it was over for him. We've all said that before about Boris though.

    p.s. RCS - had lunch guests. It was a lovely time sitting out in the sun.

    The booing of Johnson was the unexpected highlight of the Jubilee. So British, like at a pantomime.

    Sorry to see HM isn't well enough for the Epsom Derby. To miss that, she really must be ill. Seems odd to have the Jubilee without her.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    Would he look good in anything?

    Other than perhaps an orange jumpsuit…
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722
    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 13,821
    edited June 4
    Heathener said:

    Also telling in a different way that Keir Starmer was greeted with complete silence.

    Almost all the guests were greeted in silence: Blair, Brown, Cameron, Sturgeon, Starmer, Truss. Even Sadiq Khan although I've seen it suggested elsewhere the Mayor was cheered; maybe that was on the way out.

    The Mail has a composite video if you scroll down a bit.
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10881619/Boris-Johnson-wife-Carrie-arrive-St-Pauls-Queens-Platinum-Jubilee-service.html

    Only a cynic would suggest the Mail played with the sound mixing.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    edited June 4
    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 39,603
    An utterly charming interview with the author of Wilhoit’s Law*.
    https://slate.com/business/2022/06/wilhoits-law-conservatives-frank-wilhoit.html

    * “ Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.”
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    On the subject of Bristol, I see that the second series of The Outlaws starts tomorrow.

    They've a lot to live up to. Series One was one of the funniest, most endearing, bitter-sweet, programmes I've watched in a long time.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722
    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
    Hmmm. They may find it a bit bigger than they expect, speaking as somebody who used to live there.

    But it is a lovely city.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    The other thing which has surprised and cheered me greatly are the number of Conservatives on here who have turned against Boris Johnson. There are very few left prepared to stand up for the reprobate.

    I recognise that this seems patronising but it fills me with great hope. That decency matters to good people on both left and right fills me with hope for the future of this country.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
    Hmmm. They may find it a bit bigger than they expect, speaking as somebody who used to live there.

    But it is a lovely city.
    Good on you, Bristolian.

    One of them grew up there and spent the first 20 years of their life in it so knows it very well. A return to their roots. I think it's fairly easy to get around in minutes on foot or bike as long as you don't mind the steep climb up to Clifton etc.

    The regeneration around the harbour is superb. Brilliant food to be had as well these days.

  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 3,156
    Right, got to go. Hope we get cricket!
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 23,036
    edited June 4
    Heathener said:

    Also telling in a different way that Keir Starmer was greeted with complete silence.

    Because no one knew who he was?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722
    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
    Hmmm. They may find it a bit bigger than they expect, speaking as somebody who used to live there.

    But it is a lovely city.
    Good on you, Bristolian.

    One of them grew up there and spent the first 20 years of their life in it so knows it very well. A return to their roots. I think it's fairly easy to get around in minutes on foot or bike as long as you don't mind the steep climb up to Clifton etc.

    The regeneration around the harbour is superb. Brilliant food to be had as well these days.

    Well, I was in Downend and Frenchay, so rather out on a limb and that may have coloured my views.

    But as you say there is a great deal to enjoy there.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 6,354

    Heathener said:

    Toms said:

    I didn't see it. Was he with his wife?

    Yes
    … snip …

    "Whatever is true, whatever is honourable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is pleasing, whatever is commendable … think about these things."
    Philippians 4:8.
    Did you (or anyone here) get the subtle message in the title of the chosen text? It was a message to the horse lovers (i.e. phillippians). More crudely hammered in by Stephen Cottrell the archbishop of York in his sermon references to the Derby and Aintree.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 39,603
    A militia member is suspected of having just shot and killed a former judge in Juneau County, WI. Sources say the suspect was carrying a hit list that includes other politically-motivated targets including Governor Evers.
    https://mobile.twitter.com/RVAwonk/status/1532861520425766915
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311
    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
    Hmmm. They may find it a bit bigger than they expect, speaking as somebody who used to live there.

    But it is a lovely city.
    Good on you, Bristolian.

    One of them grew up there and spent the first 20 years of their life in it so knows it very well. A return to their roots. I think it's fairly easy to get around in minutes on foot or bike as long as you don't mind the steep climb up to Clifton etc.

    The regeneration around the harbour is superb. Brilliant food to be had as well these days.

    I have been a few times for various events, but have never really taken to it. The contrast between the poshness of Clifton and the vaguely threatening city centre and Stokes Croft just doesn't work for me. Of Britain's major cities it is amongst my least favourite. Not cheap either.

    A lot of people seem to like it though.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 39,603
    ‘Everything is gone’: Russian business hit hard by tech sanctions

    Export controls placed on supply of chips and hardware over Ukraine war dent economy’s prospects
    https://www.ft.com/content/caf2cd3c-1f42-4e4a-b24b-c0ed803a6245
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311

    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    Good morning everybody.
    As someone who has a similar shape to our PM, but also as someone who has been married (to the same lady) for considerably longer than he has managed, or will manage, (59 years, 51 weeks AToW), I am certain that I would have had, in similar circumstances, a very critical review of my appearance both before leaving home and before getting out of the car!
    Hope you are feeling more lively for that celebration next week.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 39,603
    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 101,701
    edited June 4
    Nigelb said:

    ‘Everything is gone’: Russian business hit hard by tech sanctions

    Export controls placed on supply of chips and hardware over Ukraine war dent economy’s prospects
    https://www.ft.com/content/caf2cd3c-1f42-4e4a-b24b-c0ed803a6245

    In an AML briefing I had a few weeks ago it was flagged that these tech sanctions left Russian banks rather vulnerable to hacking.

    Their economy really could collapse if hackers emptied those banks.
  • TazTaz Posts: 5,041
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 2,236
    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
    Hmmm. They may find it a bit bigger than they expect, speaking as somebody who used to live there.

    But it is a lovely city.
    Good on you, Bristolian.

    One of them grew up there and spent the first 20 years of their life in it so knows it very well. A return to their roots. I think it's fairly easy to get around in minutes on foot or bike as long as you don't mind the steep climb up to Clifton etc.

    The regeneration around the harbour is superb. Brilliant food to be had as well these days.

    Well, I was in Downend and Frenchay, so rather out on a limb and that may have coloured my views.

    But as you say there is a great deal to enjoy there.
    If I was young I'd be off to Birmingham. What it lacks in beauty it makes up in energy.
    It is going to be 45 minutes to London in a couple of years on HS2.
    For salaried jobs in many industries, it is pretty much at London wages.
    And the property prices.... very affordable, as in you can actually buy a nice house/flat in a nice area for the money that you earn in a professional job. You can have the 15 minute lifestyle if that is what you want.
    Makes me wonder about all the criticism of house prices. There is no problem at all in large parts of the country. It really is concentrated in the south east, and for many people, the best answer is simply to move.
    My own assessment of London before quitting it 10 years ago was that it is fine if you either have serious wealth or are building up a career in your twenties. But there is no point sticking around beyond that.

  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311
    Nigelb said:

    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…

    My hospital has a couple of suspect cases, but no one seems very worried about it yet.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 39,603
    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…

    My hospital has a couple of suspect cases, but no one seems very worried about it yet.
    Well it’s certainly not even vaguely comparable to Covid as a threat, but I wonder if we shouldn’t be a little more proactive since it ought also to be a lot easier to limit its spread.

    Novel viruses have the capacity to surprise.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722
    darkage said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
    Hmmm. They may find it a bit bigger than they expect, speaking as somebody who used to live there.

    But it is a lovely city.
    Good on you, Bristolian.

    One of them grew up there and spent the first 20 years of their life in it so knows it very well. A return to their roots. I think it's fairly easy to get around in minutes on foot or bike as long as you don't mind the steep climb up to Clifton etc.

    The regeneration around the harbour is superb. Brilliant food to be had as well these days.

    Well, I was in Downend and Frenchay, so rather out on a limb and that may have coloured my views.

    But as you say there is a great deal to enjoy there.
    If I was young I'd be off to Birmingham. What it lacks in beauty it makes up in energy.
    It is going to be 45 minutes to London in a couple of years on HS2.
    For salaried jobs in many industries, it is pretty much at London wages.
    And the property prices.... very affordable, as in you can actually buy a nice house/flat in a nice area for the money that you earn in a professional job. You can have the 15 minute lifestyle if that is what you want.
    Makes me wonder about all the criticism of house prices. There is no problem at all in large parts of the country. It really is concentrated in the south east, and for many people, the best answer is simply to move.
    My own assessment of London before quitting it 10 years ago was that it is fine if you either have serious wealth or are building up a career in your twenties. But there is no point sticking around beyond that.

    To be fair, I've spent a great deal of time in London and I never liked it at all. But again, my views may have been coloured by the fact I was a very impoverished student at the time. Even now, when I'm much better off, I wouldn't want to live there though.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722

    I don’t know what was more enjoyable: the lying grifter’s humiliation by conservative Middle England; or the desperate attempts of his dwindling band of supporters to argue that the boos were cheers.

    I can understand why Dorries, Rees Mogg and other fourth-raters stick by him - only he, for entirely venal, self-interested reasons, would put them in government - but how can anyone with an ounce of patriotism or any belief in democracy and the rule of law stand by when they could act to remove him from office?

    I guess I’ve answered my own question!

    I'm puzzled. Fourth raters? Why do you rate those two 96 levels above where they should be?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 22,073
    Interesting editorial in The Times about urgent need for welfare reform.

    It points out that the much-hyped figure of 3.7% unemployment (a 40-year low) is misleading. The “inactivity rate” is 21%, scandalously high for a country with a worker shortage.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-times-view-on-filling-britains-vacancies-welfare-into-work-mg67dlmmz
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 1,082
    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…

    My hospital has a couple of suspect cases, but no one seems very worried about it yet.
    Well it’s certainly not even vaguely comparable to Covid as a threat, but I wonder if we shouldn’t be a little more proactive since it ought also to be a lot easier to limit its spread.

    Novel viruses have the capacity to surprise.
    Fortunately, the Government invested in a world-leading health security agency… oh, until they slashed its budget recently.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 4,476
    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…

    My hospital has a couple of suspect cases, but no one seems very worried about it yet.
    Well it’s certainly not even vaguely comparable to Covid as a threat, but I wonder if we shouldn’t be a little more proactive since it ought also to be a lot easier to limit its spread.

    Novel viruses have the capacity to surprise.
    What does that mean though in this case - being proactive?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 22,463

    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…

    My hospital has a couple of suspect cases, but no one seems very worried about it yet.
    Well it’s certainly not even vaguely comparable to Covid as a threat, but I wonder if we shouldn’t be a little more proactive since it ought also to be a lot easier to limit its spread.

    Novel viruses have the capacity to surprise.
    Fortunately, the Government invested in a world-leading health security agency… oh, until they slashed its budget recently.
    Ditto vaccine research and production centre.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311
    darkage said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
    Hmmm. They may find it a bit bigger than they expect, speaking as somebody who used to live there.

    But it is a lovely city.
    Good on you, Bristolian.

    One of them grew up there and spent the first 20 years of their life in it so knows it very well. A return to their roots. I think it's fairly easy to get around in minutes on foot or bike as long as you don't mind the steep climb up to Clifton etc.

    The regeneration around the harbour is superb. Brilliant food to be had as well these days.

    Well, I was in Downend and Frenchay, so rather out on a limb and that may have coloured my views.

    But as you say there is a great deal to enjoy there.
    If I was young I'd be off to Birmingham. What it lacks in beauty it makes up in energy.
    It is going to be 45 minutes to London in a couple of years on HS2.
    For salaried jobs in many industries, it is pretty much at London wages.
    And the property prices.... very affordable, as in you can actually buy a nice house/flat in a nice area for the money that you earn in a professional job. You can have the 15 minute lifestyle if that is what you want.
    Makes me wonder about all the criticism of house prices. There is no problem at all in large parts of the country. It really is concentrated in the south east, and for many people, the best answer is simply to move.
    My own assessment of London before quitting it 10 years ago was that it is fine if you either have serious wealth or are building up a career in your twenties. But there is no point sticking around beyond that.

    I quite like Brum, though haven't been since the pandemic. The centre was awful 30 years ago, but the revamp really worked.

    I am not convinced that turning everywhere into a commuting town to London is the right regional policy for levelling up.

    Some strange things happening in the NHS there too, or so my grapevine tells me. Lots of contracting out to private consortia who are gutting core services for staff.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 13,821
    Scott_xP said:

    Interesting editorial in The Times about urgent need for welfare reform.

    It points out that the much-hyped figure of 3.7% unemployment (a 40-year low) is misleading. The “inactivity rate” is 21%, scandalously high for a country with a worker shortage.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-times-view-on-filling-britains-vacancies-welfare-into-work-mg67dlmmz

    Welfare reform, eh? Not better pay and conditions.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 4,476
    edited June 4
    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    being a natural scruff myself , I do have sympathy for him . It is not contempt for an occasion but a genuine inability to dress to the high standards of formal dress. Just like some people cannot drive or draw or do math , some people genuinely cannot dress or look smart
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311

    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…

    My hospital has a couple of suspect cases, but no one seems very worried about it yet.
    Well it’s certainly not even vaguely comparable to Covid as a threat, but I wonder if we shouldn’t be a little more proactive since it ought also to be a lot easier to limit its spread.

    Novel viruses have the capacity to surprise.
    Fortunately, the Government invested in a world-leading health security agency… oh, until they slashed its budget recently.
    UK Smallpox vaccination ended in 1971, though I think poor uptake by the final years.. It might mean some immunity for the older generation.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 13,821
    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
    Hmmm. They may find it a bit bigger than they expect, speaking as somebody who used to live there.

    But it is a lovely city.
    Good on you, Bristolian.

    One of them grew up there and spent the first 20 years of their life in it so knows it very well. A return to their roots. I think it's fairly easy to get around in minutes on foot or bike as long as you don't mind the steep climb up to Clifton etc.

    The regeneration around the harbour is superb. Brilliant food to be had as well these days.

    Well, I was in Downend and Frenchay, so rather out on a limb and that may have coloured my views.

    But as you say there is a great deal to enjoy there.
    If I was young I'd be off to Birmingham. What it lacks in beauty it makes up in energy.
    It is going to be 45 minutes to London in a couple of years on HS2.
    For salaried jobs in many industries, it is pretty much at London wages.
    And the property prices.... very affordable, as in you can actually buy a nice house/flat in a nice area for the money that you earn in a professional job. You can have the 15 minute lifestyle if that is what you want.
    Makes me wonder about all the criticism of house prices. There is no problem at all in large parts of the country. It really is concentrated in the south east, and for many people, the best answer is simply to move.
    My own assessment of London before quitting it 10 years ago was that it is fine if you either have serious wealth or are building up a career in your twenties. But there is no point sticking around beyond that.

    I quite like Brum, though haven't been since the pandemic. The centre was awful 30 years ago, but the revamp really worked.

    I am not convinced that turning everywhere into a commuting town to London is the right regional policy for levelling up.

    Some strange things happening in the NHS there too, or so my grapevine tells me. Lots of contracting out to private consortia who are gutting core services for staff.
    It is interesting that Jeremy Hunt seems sceptical of private sector outsourcing as a panacea for the NHS. As he points out, it is not just the same pool of staff they are fishing in, usually it is exactly the same doctors working for both sides.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 36,679
    ydoethur said:

    I don’t know what was more enjoyable: the lying grifter’s humiliation by conservative Middle England; or the desperate attempts of his dwindling band of supporters to argue that the boos were cheers.

    I can understand why Dorries, Rees Mogg and other fourth-raters stick by him - only he, for entirely venal, self-interested reasons, would put them in government - but how can anyone with an ounce of patriotism or any belief in democracy and the rule of law stand by when they could act to remove him from office?

    I guess I’ve answered my own question!

    I'm puzzled. Fourth raters? Why do you rate those two 96 levels above where they should be?

    Fair point. But it’s a holiday weekend and I’m feeling generous!

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 22,463
    edited June 4

    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    being a natural scruff myself , I do have sympathy for him . It is not contempt for an occasion but a genuine inability to dress to the high standards of formal dress. Just like some people cannot drive or draw or do math , some people genuinely cannot dress or look smart
    Point takjen (I am rather like that myself) but not even being arsed to check one's tie is a bit much. I found myself reminded of the cover drawing on the Just William books by Richmal Crompton (no idea if they are still a thing).
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 13,821

    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    being a natural scruff myself , I do have sympathy for him . It is not contempt for an occasion but a genuine inability to dress to the high standards of formal dress. Just like some people cannot drive or draw or do math , some people genuinely cannot dress or look smart
    Yes, except Boris is rich and powerful and could access the best stylists and tailors. He could also look in the mirror and straighten his tie. Look at the transformation of Jeremy Corbyn. But this is not being naturally scruffy; he works at it. Boris's ill-fitting, stained clothes are a deliberate choice, as is messing up his hair.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 22,073
    “The PM would have to have a skin as thick as a rhino — and his advisers must be as thick as porridge — not to realise what’s going on.” PM's allies turn on Tory Euro-plotters. Sections of jubilee crowd turn on the PM
    https://www.ft.com/content/3e59b029-8790-4f67-8aca-2977b309464f
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 1,082
    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…

    My hospital has a couple of suspect cases, but no one seems very worried about it yet.
    Well it’s certainly not even vaguely comparable to Covid as a threat, but I wonder if we shouldn’t be a little more proactive since it ought also to be a lot easier to limit its spread.

    Novel viruses have the capacity to surprise.
    Fortunately, the Government invested in a world-leading health security agency… oh, until they slashed its budget recently.
    UK Smallpox vaccination ended in 1971, though I think poor uptake by the final years.. It might mean some immunity for the older generation.
    As my parents were going to places were smallpox was still an issue, I got vaccinated a bit later in the ‘70s thankfully!
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 28,169

    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    being a natural scruff myself , I do have sympathy for him . It is not contempt for an occasion but a genuine inability to dress to the high standards of formal dress. Just like some people cannot drive or draw or do math , some people genuinely cannot dress or look smart
    I have some sympathy, too, but he could at least look like he's made an effort. And I know his 'toddlers hairstyle' is by way of a trademark, but it just looks untidy.

    Incidentally, recalling the criticism of Michael Foot in his smart 'British warm', categorised in the right-wing Press as a donkey jacket, I assume we'll see editorials in the Mail etc calling attention to the PM's sartorial failings.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 36,679
    darkage said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
    Hmmm. They may find it a bit bigger than they expect, speaking as somebody who used to live there.

    But it is a lovely city.
    Good on you, Bristolian.

    One of them grew up there and spent the first 20 years of their life in it so knows it very well. A return to their roots. I think it's fairly easy to get around in minutes on foot or bike as long as you don't mind the steep climb up to Clifton etc.

    The regeneration around the harbour is superb. Brilliant food to be had as well these days.

    Well, I was in Downend and Frenchay, so rather out on a limb and that may have coloured my views.

    But as you say there is a great deal to enjoy there.
    If I was young I'd be off to Birmingham. What it lacks in beauty it makes up in energy.
    It is going to be 45 minutes to London in a couple of years on HS2.
    For salaried jobs in many industries, it is pretty much at London wages.
    And the property prices.... very affordable, as in you can actually buy a nice house/flat in a nice area for the money that you earn in a professional job. You can have the 15 minute lifestyle if that is what you want.
    Makes me wonder about all the criticism of house prices. There is no problem at all in large parts of the country. It really is concentrated in the south east, and for many people, the best answer is simply to move.
    My own assessment of London before quitting it 10 years ago was that it is fine if you either have serious wealth or are building up a career in your twenties. But there is no point sticking around beyond that.

    I lived in Birmingham in the 1980s. Let’s just say it’s improved somewhat since then. Not sure if it’s still the same now, but back then it felt like a collection of smaller towns that had come together - Selly Oak, Mosley, Harborne, Handsworth, Aston, Bournville, Balsall Heath, etc - rather than a single entity that had grown outwards. All those places and many others had very different personalities. And that’s before you moved into the Black Country, which will never, ever, be Brum.

  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 1,082

    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…

    My hospital has a couple of suspect cases, but no one seems very worried about it yet.
    Well it’s certainly not even vaguely comparable to Covid as a threat, but I wonder if we shouldn’t be a little more proactive since it ought also to be a lot easier to limit its spread.

    Novel viruses have the capacity to surprise.
    What does that mean though in this case - being proactive?
    Identify cases as quickly as possible. Get them to take actions to limit spread. Give post-exposure prophylactic (smallpox) vaccination to their close contacts. Get the close contacts to also take actions to limit spread (as there’s a long incubation period). Basic public health stuff, for which you need a good, trained workforce.

  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 22,463
    edited June 4

    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    being a natural scruff myself , I do have sympathy for him . It is not contempt for an occasion but a genuine inability to dress to the high standards of formal dress. Just like some people cannot drive or draw or do math , some people genuinely cannot dress or look smart
    I have some sympathy, too, but he could at least look like he's made an effort. And I know his 'toddlers hairstyle' is by way of a trademark, but it just looks untidy.

    Incidentally, recalling the criticism of Michael Foot in his smart 'British warm', categorised in the right-wing Press as a donkey jacket, I assume we'll see editorials in the Mail etc calling attention to the PM's sartorial failings.
    I somehow don't think we had any Royals complimenting Mr Johnson on his appearance yesterday, in contrast to the Queen Mother and Mr Foot's jacket.

    Edit: for the young Carnyx, that was a very early lesson in the vicious hatred by the right-wing media and their utterly subjective approach to things.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 22,463

    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    being a natural scruff myself , I do have sympathy for him . It is not contempt for an occasion but a genuine inability to dress to the high standards of formal dress. Just like some people cannot drive or draw or do math , some people genuinely cannot dress or look smart
    Yes, except Boris is rich and powerful and could access the best stylists and tailors. He could also look in the mirror and straighten his tie. Look at the transformation of Jeremy Corbyn. But this is not being naturally scruffy; he works at it. Boris's ill-fitting, stained clothes are a deliberate choice, as is messing up his hair.
    Stained? Eew.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722
    Scott_xP said:

    “The PM would have to have a skin as thick as a rhino — and his advisers must be as thick as porridge — not to realise what’s going on.” PM's allies turn on Tory Euro-plotters. Sections of jubilee crowd turn on the PM
    https://www.ft.com/content/3e59b029-8790-4f67-8aca-2977b309464f

    So they won't realise?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 48,722

    If any Labour leader had dressed as shabbily as Johnson did yesterday it would have been all over every front page this morning, with right-wing columnists lining up to let rip on the lack of respect to the Queen and hatred of Britain it demonstrated.

    In this case, not so much a donkey jacket as a jacket on a donkey.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 6,613
    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…

    My hospital has a couple of suspect cases, but no one seems very worried about it yet.
    Well it’s certainly not even vaguely comparable to Covid as a threat, but I wonder if we shouldn’t be a little more proactive since it ought also to be a lot easier to limit its spread.

    Novel viruses have the capacity to surprise.
    Fortunately, the Government invested in a world-leading health security agency… oh, until they slashed its budget recently.
    UK Smallpox vaccination ended in 1971, though I think poor uptake by the final years.. It might mean some immunity for the older generation.
    One of my earliest memories is queueing for a smallpox vaccine at Wandsworth Town Hall during an outbreak in London. We moved from London in 1963 so it would have been before that.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 22,463
    ydoethur said:

    If any Labour leader had dressed as shabbily as Johnson did yesterday it would have been all over every front page this morning, with right-wing columnists lining up to let rip on the lack of respect to the Queen and hatred of Britain it demonstrated.

    In this case, not so much a donkey jacket as a jacket on a donkey.
    Though I somehow don't think that he would like to have his retirement years provided by Mr Starmer!
  • LDLFLDLF Posts: 62
    edited June 4
    If I were attempting a character analysis of Johnson I would guess that he responds to public booing (which he has been treated to before, but never at so high-profile an event) with a desire not to shrink away from the light but to try to become popular again. That is how he has functioned thus far in his career, which seems to consist purely of crests and troughs.

    Tory MPs who want to see the back of him should therefore take the initiative themselves rather than wait for him to do so.

    If they want him to go, they ought to encourage obvious contenders to emerge, probably sneakily from within cabinet. Hunt as current lead contender doesn't really inspire; why replace a Prime Minister who hides in fridges with one who hides behind trees?

    Tugendhat is impressive but I think the prospective replacement is likely to be someone who is currently a member of the cabinet.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311

    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    ydoethur said:

    Heathener said:

    I expect Leon has seen this but Camden market is up for sale. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61680387

    I used to love it back in the day when it was a real place with a properly edgy vibe. Then gentrification took over. The lambretta seats went, and in came all sorts of trendy eateries and shops selling fancy things at exorbitant prices.

    Two of my young guests yesterday announced that they're leaving London next month for a provincial city. Now that they can predominantly work from home they no longer find London an attractive proposition. They'd rather be in a city where you can easily walk or cycle from one part to the other in a matter of minutes.

    Which ‘provincial city?’
    Brizzle

    I was being coy in case they read this!!!! :blush:
    Hmmm. They may find it a bit bigger than they expect, speaking as somebody who used to live there.

    But it is a lovely city.
    Good on you, Bristolian.

    One of them grew up there and spent the first 20 years of their life in it so knows it very well. A return to their roots. I think it's fairly easy to get around in minutes on foot or bike as long as you don't mind the steep climb up to Clifton etc.

    The regeneration around the harbour is superb. Brilliant food to be had as well these days.

    Well, I was in Downend and Frenchay, so rather out on a limb and that may have coloured my views.

    But as you say there is a great deal to enjoy there.
    If I was young I'd be off to Birmingham. What it lacks in beauty it makes up in energy.
    It is going to be 45 minutes to London in a couple of years on HS2.
    For salaried jobs in many industries, it is pretty much at London wages.
    And the property prices.... very affordable, as in you can actually buy a nice house/flat in a nice area for the money that you earn in a professional job. You can have the 15 minute lifestyle if that is what you want.
    Makes me wonder about all the criticism of house prices. There is no problem at all in large parts of the country. It really is concentrated in the south east, and for many people, the best answer is simply to move.
    My own assessment of London before quitting it 10 years ago was that it is fine if you either have serious wealth or are building up a career in your twenties. But there is no point sticking around beyond that.

    I quite like Brum, though haven't been since the pandemic. The centre was awful 30 years ago, but the revamp really worked.

    I am not convinced that turning everywhere into a commuting town to London is the right regional policy for levelling up.

    Some strange things happening in the NHS there too, or so my grapevine tells me. Lots of contracting out to private consortia who are gutting core services for staff.
    It is interesting that Jeremy Hunt seems sceptical of private sector outsourcing as a panacea for the NHS. As he points out, it is not just the same pool of staff they are fishing in, usually it is exactly the same doctors working for both sides.
    Indeed it is.

    I have done some work for a few of these consortia over the years. In part because the money is good, £4000 for a weekend somewhere is pretty handy, on top of base salary, but also to see if some of the practices could be adapted to my day job.

    On the whole not though. It was mostly just churning patients without any real effort to remodel care, and no continuity or long term plan. It reminded me of the good old days with the "Hello Nurse"*, a way of ticking the box to meet a management target for outpatient times, but without really addressing the underlying capacity problem. Such gaming of targets is everywhere now, with the connivance and complicity of the government. I am glad that my own Trust SMT has a more in depth and long term plan.

    *https://www.bmj.com/content/315/7101/143.6
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 6,028
    I know Alistair Campbell thought it should have been on the news yesterday but I suspect the booing will be once politics resumes on Monday.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 22,073

    I know Alistair Campbell thought it should have been on the news yesterday but I suspect the booing will be once politics resumes on Monday.

    Apparently the BBC missed them...

    Royal fans jeer and boo at British Prime Minister Boris Johnson as he arrived along with his wife Carrie at London's St Paul's Cathedral for a Service of Thanksgiving for Queen Elizabeth’s #PlatinumJubilee https://reut.rs/3GJH8iS https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1532814376901545984/video/1

    Thank you so much @maxfostercnn @cnn for having me at St Paul’s this morning.
    Huge cheers for Sussexes.
    The opposite for Boris Johnson. Loud boos. https://twitter.com/KateWilliamsme/status/1532715119230259206/photo/1

    @NadineDorries The facts are, and I was there, the boos were very loud indeed. No escaping that. Reporters are there to report. Not make stuff up.

    https://twitter.com/chrisshipitv/status/1532860646328520704
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 22,073
    "Boris Johnson and his party have weaponised their own definition of impartiality, to the detriment of democracy."

    In the @NewStatesman by a German reporter covering the UK. https://www.newstatesman.com/comment/2022/05/criticising-government-isnt-journalistic-bias-goes-job Bears on whether journalists in the US should be "pro-democracy." Via @froomkin.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311

    I know Alistair Campbell thought it should have been on the news yesterday but I suspect the booing will be once politics resumes on Monday.

    Oh, it certainly got around about the booing, even if not in the headlines. No doubt to be spun by the Daily Mail as "Lovable impish Boris greeted noisily, while Starmer gets the silent treatment..."
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 6,008

    Scott_xP said:

    Interesting editorial in The Times about urgent need for welfare reform.

    It points out that the much-hyped figure of 3.7% unemployment (a 40-year low) is misleading. The “inactivity rate” is 21%, scandalously high for a country with a worker shortage.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-times-view-on-filling-britains-vacancies-welfare-into-work-mg67dlmmz

    Welfare reform, eh? Not better pay and conditions.
    Besides, what carrot or stick works with people who've decided to retire a bit earlier than expected?
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 6,008

    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    being a natural scruff myself , I do have sympathy for him . It is not contempt for an occasion but a genuine inability to dress to the high standards of formal dress. Just like some people cannot drive or draw or do math , some people genuinely cannot dress or look smart
    Yes, except Boris is rich and powerful and could access the best stylists and tailors. He could also look in the mirror and straighten his tie. Look at the transformation of Jeremy Corbyn. But this is not being naturally scruffy; he works at it. Boris's ill-fitting, stained clothes are a deliberate choice, as is messing up his hair.
    The trouble with an affectation like that (and scruffy Boris is an affectation) is that, after a while, the affectation becomes the person.

    On topic, the dignified way of walking would be for a tame doctor to tell him he had to retire for the sake of his health. Utterly dishonest, of course, but that's totes on-brand.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 22,463

    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    being a natural scruff myself , I do have sympathy for him . It is not contempt for an occasion but a genuine inability to dress to the high standards of formal dress. Just like some people cannot drive or draw or do math , some people genuinely cannot dress or look smart
    Having defended Corbyn's preference for concentrating on the job rather than his appearance, I'm inclined to be relaxed about Johnson's look too. Let's say that if that was the worst thing about them, we should get over ourselves. That goes for Truss's remarks on the monarchy in the last thread too - we shouldn't be judged by what we thought decades ago (eyes mirror uneasily :)). I don't know if it's a sign of age, but I can't help feeling that British politics is getting more trivial every year.
    Good points - but there is a difference between (1) not being an instinctive clothes horse but still trying to meet the legitimate demands of the job, and (2) concocting a sham persona to the degree that it interferes with the actual job and begins to erode it. We're all familiar enough with the scruffy male trying to look his best on a formal occasion and being given some leeway insofar as he falls short; the other is downright manipulative. Like Harold Wilson's pipe, only worse.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 22,073
    BoZo is performatively scruffy.

    It doesn't speak well of the man.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 1,143
    LDLF said:

    If I were attempting a character analysis of Johnson I would guess that he responds to public booing (which he has been treated to before, but never at so high-profile an event) with a desire not to shrink away from the light but to try to become popular again. That is how he has functioned thus far in his career, which seems to consist purely of crests and troughs.

    Tory MPs who want to see the back of him should therefore take the initiative themselves rather than wait for him to do so.

    If they want him to go, they ought to encourage obvious contenders to emerge, probably sneakily from within cabinet. Hunt as current lead contender doesn't really inspire; why replace a Prime Minister who hides in fridges with one who hides behind trees?

    Tugendhat is impressive but I think the prospective replacement is likely to be someone who is currently a member of the cabinet.

    I don’t think Tugendhat will get it as I think he’s “too confident and able”. This might seems silly but I have a theory, which is probably bollocks, that all Tory leaders are chosen because there is a large rump of MPs who choose someone they think they can “control”.

    I think a lot would have looked at Boris and thought “well he’s a lightweight showman but he’ll get us elected and we can do all the work and make the decisions by the scenes and he will just be a figurehead”.

    With May they might have thought “she’s a dull administrator so whilst she’s doing the paperwork we can show our individuality and brio and get things done because she will be happy shuffling paper and being a good technocrat.”

    Cameron “he’s young and posh, we can guide him and get him to do what we want from behind the scenes”.

    IDS “he’s an idiot, we can do what we want”.

    Howard “placeholder, young cardinals vote for old popes”.

    Hague - similar to Cameron.

    So I think a lot would look at Truss and think too headstrong, Hunt not able to be manipulated. Will probably go for a blank canvas they think they can put their own design on and as usual be unpleasantly surprised when that person doesn’t do things the way they thought.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 50,617
    Is there something wrong with the quote function this morning?

    I can't see to be able to reply to a comment - get the one character short in body complaint.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 40,044
    Scott_xP said:

    BoZo is performatively scruffy.

    It doesn't speak well of the man.

    It doesn't - but Nick is right that in itself it's not a big deal. As part of the package of being lazy, complacent, reluctant to make much effort and trying to wing everything at the last minute, it is.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 20,921

    Is there something wrong with the quote function this morning?

    I can't see to be able to reply to a comment - get the one character short in body complaint.

    Seems to work for me ok
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 17,006
    Scott_xP said:

    I know Alistair Campbell thought it should have been on the news yesterday but I suspect the booing will be once politics resumes on Monday.

    Apparently the BBC missed them...

    Royal fans jeer and boo at British Prime Minister Boris Johnson as he arrived along with his wife Carrie at London's St Paul's Cathedral for a Service of Thanksgiving for Queen Elizabeth’s #PlatinumJubilee https://reut.rs/3GJH8iS https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1532814376901545984/video/1

    Thank you so much @maxfostercnn @cnn for having me at St Paul’s this morning.
    Huge cheers for Sussexes.
    The opposite for Boris Johnson. Loud boos. https://twitter.com/KateWilliamsme/status/1532715119230259206/photo/1

    @NadineDorries The facts are, and I was there, the boos were very loud indeed. No escaping that. Reporters are there to report. Not make stuff up.

    https://twitter.com/chrisshipitv/status/1532860646328520704
    Editorial note: that is a reply to Nadine
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 17,006

    Is there something wrong with the quote function this morning?

    I can't see to be able to reply to a comment - get the one character short in body complaint.

    Is there a stray angle bracket in the thread?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 17,006
    IshmaelZ said:

    Is there something wrong with the quote function this morning?

    I can't see to be able to reply to a comment - get the one character short in body complaint.

    Is there a stray angle bracket in the thread?
    @OnlyLivingBoy s less than 65 possibly
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311
    The ONS does cover why the economic inactivity rate has gone up: Over fifties with degrees (?early retirement), over fifties self employed (?closed by covid and too much effort to restart) and women on long term sick (?Long covid).

    https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/employmentandemployeetypes/bulletins/employmentintheuk/april2022#:~:text=The UK employment rate was,December 2019 to February 2020).
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,084
    kjh said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    The current outbreak of monkeypox is unusual in its symptoms, which seems to aid its spread.
    While it’s relatively mild compared to some other strains, it’s also mutating substantially faster than is usual in monkeypox viruses.

    https://text.npr.org/1102945017
    … This gap in detection may be because the symptoms of monkeypox in this outbreak can be much more subtle than in past cases.

    As a result, health officials are asking health-care workers – and individuals who may have been exposed – to be on the lookout for signs of monkeypox, especially signs of a rash.

    But what does that rash often look like? Turns out, it's not what medical textbooks show, says infectious disease doctor Donald Vinh at McGill University. Those images depict people with their trunk or hands covered with pus-filled blisters. What's happening in this outbreak can be much more subtle, Vinh and other doctors involved with the outbreak say.

    In fact, some patients have only one or two small lesions that can easily be confused with lesions caused by several sexually transmitted diseases, such as herpes and syphilis.

    "I think that's actually supercritical," Vinh says, "Because you can see how these patients can be missed. But they are still contagious and may propagate the disease."

    Vinh has been helping to treat 5 people with monkeypox at McGill University Health Centre in Montreal. The outbreak in that city includes at least 50 cases, he says.

    Just Thursday morning, a colleague called to discuss a patient, newly diagnosed with monkeypox, who had only one lesion…

    My hospital has a couple of suspect cases, but no one seems very worried about it yet.
    Well it’s certainly not even vaguely comparable to Covid as a threat, but I wonder if we shouldn’t be a little more proactive since it ought also to be a lot easier to limit its spread.

    Novel viruses have the capacity to surprise.
    Fortunately, the Government invested in a world-leading health security agency… oh, until they slashed its budget recently.
    UK Smallpox vaccination ended in 1971, though I think poor uptake by the final years.. It might mean some immunity for the older generation.
    One of my earliest memories is queueing for a smallpox vaccine at Wandsworth Town Hall during an outbreak in London. We moved from London in 1963 so it would have been before that.
    A friend of mine needed smallpox, amongst other jabs, before a US holiday in 1970, so presumably one of the last.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 32,311

    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    being a natural scruff myself , I do have sympathy for him . It is not contempt for an occasion but a genuine inability to dress to the high standards of formal dress. Just like some people cannot drive or draw or do math , some people genuinely cannot dress or look smart
    Yes, except Boris is rich and powerful and could access the best stylists and tailors. He could also look in the mirror and straighten his tie. Look at the transformation of Jeremy Corbyn. But this is not being naturally scruffy; he works at it. Boris's ill-fitting, stained clothes are a deliberate choice, as is messing up his hair.
    The trouble with an affectation like that (and scruffy Boris is an affectation) is that, after a while, the affectation becomes the person.

    On topic, the dignified way of walking would be for a tame doctor to tell him he had to retire for the sake of his health. Utterly dishonest, of course, but that's totes on-brand.
    He won't walk. He will be dragged out, fighting to hold the doorframe as he goes with no dignity at all.

    I think he survives the VONC for the reason that each faction is uncertain of their chances and suspicious of their rivals. Johnson has nibbled them all, so that he can hold on.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 4,537
    IanB2 said:

    Dunt in the i:

    And then, finally, there is the apparent attempt to capture “Waitrose woman” – another of those imagined market-research categories, like Mondeo Man, which can unlock a supposed electoral demographic. This group, real or not, apparently shops at expensive supermarkets, voted Remain, is small-c conservative, and doesn’t like Johnson. How does the Rwanda policy or the Protocol decision attract them? No-one has explained this discrepancy.

    It’s not just Johnson. The confusion goes all the way down. Leading Tory MP Tobias Ellwood deserves considerable respect for breaking the omerta on Brexit this week. In an article for the House magazine, he dared to say the thing that no-one will mention: Britain is suffering for having left the European single market. Regulatory checks are holding up trade and driving up prices. They’re part of the reason why the Northern Ireland issue has become so acute.

    His reward, it goes without saying, was instant dismissal and sneering condescension. Reporters and Tory MPs rejected it out of hand.

    That was always going to be the way it played out once someone opened the window to let the air in. Everyone else would stand up and scream for him to shut it again. But Ellwood was doing something striking. He was daring to speak in terms of economic and political rationality in a party which has forsaken them.

    A closer relationship with Europe is inevitable. It might be a new trade deal, or customs union membership, or single market membership, or even full EU membership. It might be a few years or a decade. But it is coming.

    It is coming by virtue of trading gravity. They are big, they are right next to us, and eventually people will start asking what we can do to trade more easily with them. And once you start asking that question, you are entering the debate upon which the EU is founded.

    Ellwood wasn’t just daring to suggest it. He was providing the first instance of a process which will one day need to take place: the Tory rapprochement with reality. There will be kickbacks and much gnashing and wailing. But reality will demand to be let in. It must, in the end, be faced up to, no matter how intense your dream-state.

    Johnson’s splatter-against-the-walls personal defence strategy is just the start. As the party declines, it is going to keep exploring all sorts of contradictory and desperate gambits to reverse its misfortune.

    It is about to experience an almighty hangover. For years now, Conservatives have given up on reality-based politics and committed exclusively to character-based politics. Now they are waking up after a hell of a bender. The pain hasn’t hit yet, but they just got that first stabbing jolt in their temple, and, with it, the knowledge that it’s going to be a horrible day.

    LOL. It is highly amusing to see Dunt talk about "rapprochement with reality" as he rehashes for the umpteenth time why Britain must be in the EU's market, using perverted logic that would mean Canada has to be in the USA or Japan has to be in China.

    The only "reality" is that Dunt can't accept he lost and is still living in a parallel universe where everything is going to be reversed and all will be right with the world again.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 20,921
    Everybody seems to have got it wrong, it wasn't Johnson who was booed after all:

    "Harry and Meghan get booed as they arrive at St Paul's Cathedral..."

    https://twitter.com/Daily_Express/status/1532667058034552835?s=20&t=m3ojrBZ5HrLZdYRYlWdYkA
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 7,804
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    What an utter scruff our Prime Minister, he's worse than Steptoe Corbyn.

    That tie isn't aligned properly with the shirt.

    He'd also be better off with a double breasted waistcoat.

    Morning suits are meant to make the man look so elegant and classy (which is why I regularly wear them) but he doesn't look at all good in one.

    He doesn't have a good body for clothes, with his short neck, and hunched obesity, but even so! His lack of sartorial effort on such a day shows real contempt for others and the occasion. Carrie looked presentable though, and clearly looks after herself well.
    being a natural scruff myself , I do have sympathy for him . It is not contempt for an occasion but a genuine inability to dress to the high standards of formal dress. Just like some people cannot drive or draw or do math , some people genuinely cannot dress or look smart
    Yes, except Boris is rich and powerful and could access the best stylists and tailors. He could also look in the mirror and straighten his tie. Look at the transformation of Jeremy Corbyn. But this is not being naturally scruffy; he works at it. Boris's ill-fitting, stained clothes are a deliberate choice, as is messing up his hair.
    The trouble with an affectation like that (and scruffy Boris is an affectation) is that, after a while, the affectation becomes the person.

    On topic, the dignified way of walking would be for a tame doctor to tell him he had to retire for the sake of his health. Utterly dishonest, of course, but that's totes on-brand.
    He won't walk. He will be dragged out, fighting to hold the doorframe as he goes with no dignity at all.

    I think he survives the VONC for the reason that each faction is uncertain of their chances and suspicious of their rivals. Johnson has nibbled them all, so that he can hold on.
    I think he would walk if the cabinet all ganged up on him. I don't think that's at all likely though.

    Him being booed yesterday was an irrelevance. After all what sort of half-wit goes to a Jubilee event and boos anyone.
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