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Worrying by-election pointers for Tories ahead of May 5th – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,161
edited April 2022 in General
Worrying by-election pointers for Tories ahead of May 5th – politicalbetting.com

Heybridge West (Maldon) council by-election result:LDEM: 44.8% (+44.8)CON: 18.4% (-21.2)IND (Burwood): 16.0% (+16.0)IND (Perry): 12.4% (+12.4)LAB: 8.4% (+8.4)No other Ind(s) (-60.4) as prev.Votes cast: 581Liberal Democrat GAIN from Independent.

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Comments

  • felixfelix Posts: 15,164
    A poor set of results for the Tories across the board might indeed be indicators for May. However, in previous weeks, even months the pattern has been very different. Not sure we have a trend yet but....
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,652
    In other news, down here in East Devon the rivers are already running very low and the ground is dry as a bone. It’s time to begin my first-ever south-west drought watch. How’s it looking elsewhere?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859

    In other news, down here in East Devon the rivers are already running very low and the ground is dry as a bone. It’s time to begin my first-ever south-west drought watch. How’s it looking elsewhere?

    The island gets its water pumped from Southampton, so we await the Hampshire rainfall reports with interest…

    Meanwhile here in the Alsace, it’s a beautiful morning.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,747
    The US must be tempted to ask Turkey to open the Bosphorous Straits to allow a few more Russian warships into the meat grinder.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070
    (FPT)The Russian reaction to the sinking is extraordinary - “the special military operation is over; this means war…”
    https://mobile.twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/status/1514766062771875851

    The logic there is almost too fncked up to comprehend, but it does strongly suggest that the Russian public have no idea of the scale of their losses to date if this incident is such a trigger. The desperate anger is palpable.
  • MalcolmDunnMalcolmDunn Posts: 139
    After this week who is surprised? But if Labour and the Lib Dems start to be taken seriously as an opposition then the media will start to ask them about their ideas and policies. That could be a big problem for both parties as they have been pretty much devoid of any over the past two years.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373

    In other news, down here in East Devon the rivers are already running very low and the ground is dry as a bone. It’s time to begin my first-ever south-west drought watch. How’s it looking elsewhere?

    Water levels are OK in the Midlands because the storms in February topped up all our reservoirs. Ground is a bit drier than normal though as there was so little rain in March.

    https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1067793/Midlands_water_situation_report_March_2022.pdf
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373
    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)The Russian reaction to the sinking is extraordinary - “the special military operation is over; this means war…”
    https://mobile.twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/status/1514766062771875851

    The logic there is almost too fncked up to comprehend, but it does strongly suggest that the Russian public have no idea of the scale of their losses to date if this incident is such a trigger. The desperate anger is palpable.

    Harder to hide the loss of a ship, especially such a famous one, than the loss of a unit. Unless you are running a Pals Battalion system you can tell each casualty!s family that they were one of the unlucky few.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,553

    In other news, down here in East Devon the rivers are already running very low and the ground is dry as a bone. It’s time to begin my first-ever south-west drought watch. How’s it looking elsewhere?

    No shortage of water in the central Midlands at the moment. Lots of rain yesterday.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373
    DavidL said:

    In other news, down here in East Devon the rivers are already running very low and the ground is dry as a bone. It’s time to begin my first-ever south-west drought watch. How’s it looking elsewhere?

    A fine PB tradition being upheld but is it just a legend that the last time you did this it rained for 40 days and nights? Could have waited until after the Easter weekend. We are supposed to be having a BBQ on Sunday.
    I don't Noah if that's true, but the forecast is dry here for the next two weeks.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070
    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)The Russian reaction to the sinking is extraordinary - “the special military operation is over; this means war…”
    https://mobile.twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/status/1514766062771875851

    The logic there is almost too fncked up to comprehend, but it does strongly suggest that the Russian public have no idea of the scale of their losses to date if this incident is such a trigger. The desperate anger is palpable.

    Harder to hide the loss of a ship, especially such a famous one, than the loss of a unit. Unless you are running a Pals Battalion system you can tell each casualty!s family that they were one of the unlucky few.
    Indeed.
    But it will become steadily harder to gloss over the reality of the land war.
    The next few weeks are going to be very dangerous ones, given Russia’s limited set of options for escalation.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,243
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    In other news, down here in East Devon the rivers are already running very low and the ground is dry as a bone. It’s time to begin my first-ever south-west drought watch. How’s it looking elsewhere?

    A fine PB tradition being upheld but is it just a legend that the last time you did this it rained for 40 days and nights? Could have waited until after the Easter weekend. We are supposed to be having a BBQ on Sunday.
    I don't Noah if that's true, but the forecast is dry here for the next two weeks.
    That’s a Shem. But I call a whole Lot of Baal.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    felix said:

    A poor set of results for the Tories across the board might indeed be indicators for May. However, in previous weeks, even months the pattern has been very different. Not sure we have a trend yet but....

    The Maldon result does suggest that the PM and party managers were wise to avoid a by-election in John Whittingdale's seat.

    And Good Morning all; bright and sunny here in Essex; significantly better than the BBC says it is!
  • Penddu2Penddu2 Posts: 689
    Now that FIFA has fixed the date of Wales remaining World Cup Qualifier against Scotland or Ukraine on June 5, I think that FAW should consider how to mark this match. Their people have suffered so much and are surviving in desparate conditions caused by the unwarranted aggression and imperial ambition on the part of their larger bullying neighbour.
    We could also consider something if Ukraine win.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,643
    Russians have been living on a diet of nationalist propaganda for years. The clash of their national myth with reality is full of risks. Whilst the aggression should be defeated, I am not sure that humiliation is going to help.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Cheers for the satellite state solidarity.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    In other news, down here in East Devon the rivers are already running very low and the ground is dry as a bone. It’s time to begin my first-ever south-west drought watch. How’s it looking elsewhere?

    A fine PB tradition being upheld but is it just a legend that the last time you did this it rained for 40 days and nights? Could have waited until after the Easter weekend. We are supposed to be having a BBQ on Sunday.
    I don't Noah if that's true, but the forecast is dry here for the next two weeks.
    That’s a Shem. But I call a whole Lot of Baal.
    Oh lor, who sent for the Ham?
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,643

    Jonathan said:

    Russians have been living on a diet of nationalist propaganda for years. The clash of their national myth with reality is full of risks. Whilst the aggression should be defeated, I am not sure that humiliation is going to help.

    Then their government should stop saying really stupid shit.
    Well that’s that sorted then. Nice one. Will you have a word with Mr Putin or shall I?

    The point is that this is deeply ingrained. Imagine the worst Brexit style jingoism amplified times 100, dished out constantly for years. When reality dawns it will be painful.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,812
    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)The Russian reaction to the sinking is extraordinary - “the special military operation is over; this means war…”
    https://mobile.twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/status/1514766062771875851

    The logic there is almost too fncked up to comprehend, but it does strongly suggest that the Russian public have no idea of the scale of their losses to date if this incident is such a trigger. The desperate anger is palpable.

    Harder to hide the loss of a ship, especially such a famous one, than the loss of a unit. Unless you are running a Pals Battalion system you can tell each casualty!s family that they were one of the unlucky few.
    Indeed.
    But it will become steadily harder to gloss over the reality of the land war.
    The next few weeks are going to be very dangerous ones, given Russia’s limited set of options for escalation.
    It is indeed dangerous. There are 3 broad scenarios from here that I can see.

    The first is that with the aid of additional men and equipment the Russians continue slow progress across the south of the country at considerable cost.

    The second is that the Russians lose ground and personnel as the Ukrainians get ever more NATO kit and use this to destroy Russia's artillary. The radar systems designed to identify, track and then take out not particularly mobile Russian artillary could be a real gamechanger here.

    The third is that we end up with a bloody but exhausted stalemate, the sort of low level warfare we have seen in Donetsk for the last 8 years writ large.

    Of these the second is currently looking the most likely. If Russia is clearly defeated by vastly superior western kit how will they react? They will undoubtedly blame NATO for the defeat. The reaction to the loss of the Moscow gives us some idea. It will be a time of great risk for both the Putin regime and the world. We should perhaps be careful what we wish for.
  • CD13CD13 Posts: 6,366
    Where's the gratitude from the Ukranians? You go to help them clear out the rat's nest of Nazis for them, and your tanks and tanks spontaneously combust.

    Patriotism works well, but even the most patriotic will have doubts. They know politicians lie, but Russian politicians are bad liars.

    In times of war, patriotism peaks. I've no doubt Zelensky has told a fib or two, but Lavrov has admitted the Russians are not bothered about Western media attitudes, it's all for home consumption. It's blunt, almost childish, and often contradictory

    Politicians lie to the public and to each other, and they all know they're lying. On immigration, the right believe they're all economic migrants rather than asylum seekers. The left believe they're all fleeing (and the press always use that word) war and bigotry. The truth, as always, is somewhere in between, but no one publicly admits it.

    Putin's problem has always been there was no plan B. Ukraine has the upper hand in PR for obvious reasons and at least, the anti-Nato and anti-US brigade have been quietened for a time. It makes them silent but sullen. But I doubt if many minds are ever changed.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,859
    We just passed a woman taking her cat for a walk on a lead. Only in France…
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,572
    IanB2 said:

    We just passed a woman taking her cat for a walk on a lead. Only in France…

    We once met a man walking two ferrets in Bury St Edmunds.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,630
    edited April 2022
    IanB2 said:

    We just passed a woman taking her cat for a walk on a lead. Only in France…

    You've never been to Manchester?

    When I thought today couldn't get any stranger, man walking his ferret in Manchester station



    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/915632013637496832
  • Thoughts and prayers for the bloody infantry of the Conservative Party on the 5th of May.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,572
    CD13 said:

    Where's the gratitude from the Ukranians? You go to help them clear out the rat's nest of Nazis for them, and your tanks and tanks spontaneously combust.

    Patriotism works well, but even the most patriotic will have doubts. They know politicians lie, but Russian politicians are bad liars.

    In times of war, patriotism peaks. I've no doubt Zelensky has told a fib or two, but Lavrov has admitted the Russians are not bothered about Western media attitudes, it's all for home consumption. It's blunt, almost childish, and often contradictory

    Politicians lie to the public and to each other, and they all know they're lying. On immigration, the right believe they're all economic migrants rather than asylum seekers. The left believe they're all fleeing (and the press always use that word) war and bigotry. The truth, as always, is somewhere in between, but no one publicly admits it.

    Putin's problem has always been there was no plan B. Ukraine has the upper hand in PR for obvious reasons and at least, the anti-Nato and anti-US brigade have been quietened for a time. It makes them silent but sullen. But I doubt if many minds are ever changed.

    Russia's PR is not just internal; we do not see much of it as a apparently they're spending much of their effort spreading their lies in the east and Africa, especially with BRICS. They want to build a new world order against America. There is some anecdotal evidence that their efforts to spread their lies in other countries is working.

    What they appear to have missed is that they would be a minor player in such a new world order. *If* it happens, it would be dominated by China, India and Brazil (if they take part), with some African countries potentially giving Russia a run for their money in the long term.

    Russia is going to have to face the fact it has a diminished place in the world; a position that Putin's little Ukrainian adventure has worsened.
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,643

    Thoughts and prayers for the bloody infantry of the Conservative Party on the 5th of May.

    But no flowers, they chose this.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,243
    ydoethur said:

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    In other news, down here in East Devon the rivers are already running very low and the ground is dry as a bone. It’s time to begin my first-ever south-west drought watch. How’s it looking elsewhere?

    A fine PB tradition being upheld but is it just a legend that the last time you did this it rained for 40 days and nights? Could have waited until after the Easter weekend. We are supposed to be having a BBQ on Sunday.
    I don't Noah if that's true, but the forecast is dry here for the next two weeks.
    That’s a Shem. But I call a whole Lot of Baal.
    Oh lor, who sent for the Ham?
    I think you’re in a state of Daniel
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,652
    More detailed locals predictions …

    For the Tories:
    * Horrible in the south
    * Bad in the north
    * OK in the midlands
    * Bad in Wales
    * Very bad in Scotland

    For Labour:
    * OK in the south
    * Good in the north
    * Worrying in the midlands
    * Good in Wales
    * Promising in Scotland
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    May 6th is my birthday. As a LibLab I normally, my diary reminds me, wake up to less than happy electoral news.

    This year might, just might, be different!
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,561

    Jonathan said:

    Russians have been living on a diet of nationalist propaganda for years. The clash of their national myth with reality is full of risks. Whilst the aggression should be defeated, I am not sure that humiliation is going to help.

    Then their government should stop saying really stupid shit.
    Really stupid shit and the truth are their two options.

    The truth will see them shot.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424

    More detailed locals predictions …

    For the Tories:
    * Horrible in the south
    * Bad in the north
    * OK in the midlands
    * Bad in Wales
    * Very bad in Scotland

    For Labour:
    * OK in the south
    * Good in the north
    * Worrying in the midlands
    * Good in Wales
    * Promising in Scotland

    Add to that OK for the LibDems in the South, and, possibly, promising in Scotland
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373

    Jonathan said:

    Russians have been living on a diet of nationalist propaganda for years. The clash of their national myth with reality is full of risks. Whilst the aggression should be defeated, I am not sure that humiliation is going to help.

    Then their government should stop saying really stupid shit.
    Really stupid shit and the truth are their two options.

    The truth will see them shot.
    So win/win?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,561

    IanB2 said:

    We just passed a woman taking her cat for a walk on a lead. Only in France…

    We once met a man walking two ferrets in Bury St Edmunds.
    I'm bid two ferrets. Three anywhere?

    I'll take a tapir.....
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,779
    Jonathan said:

    Russians have been living on a diet of nationalist propaganda for years. The clash of their national myth with reality is full of risks. Whilst the aggression should be defeated, I am not sure that humiliation is going to help.

    I'm certainly glad I don't live in a country where the public are fed nationalist propaganda leading to disastrous decisions in the sphere of international relations.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,561

    May 6th is my birthday. As a LibLab I normally, my diary reminds me, wake up to less than happy electoral news.

    This year might, just might, be different!

    Or, the man down the pub thinks Rwanda is a cracking idea, and its as you were....
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,553
    "Tories set to lose 800 council seats – and Sir Keir Starmer on course to be PM in 2024
    Pollsters Electoral Calculus and Find Out Now forecast five per cent swing from Tories to Labour at local elections"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/04/14/exclusive-tories-set-lose-800-council-seats-sir-keir-starmer/
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405
    IanB2 said:

    We just passed a woman taking her cat for a walk on a lead. Only in France…

    I know at least two cats that get walked on leads in the U.K. One poor creature was a retired queen, some kind of posh cat I believe. It’s owners lived near a busy road, so the mog was a house prisoner aside of walks on a lead in the garden.
    It was neurotic.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,572
    A secret surveillance video has been released showing the Moskva's captain on his private patio:

    https://twitter.com/hike_charity/status/1514594342865936384
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677



    Russia needs humiliation: they need to lose in Ukraine, and be seen to lose

    This Manichean view of the conflict needs contextualisation. What would such a loss, that would be impossible to obfuscate, look like? Pushing the Russians back to the 2014 border?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    Andy_JS said:

    "Tories set to lose 800 council seats – and Sir Keir Starmer on course to be PM in 2024
    Pollsters Electoral Calculus and Find Out Now forecast five per cent swing from Tories to Labour at local elections"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/04/14/exclusive-tories-set-lose-800-council-seats-sir-keir-starmer/

    Isn't there a chance that the PM could lose his seat in an GE on figures like that? Have there been any whispers about him moving to a safer one?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070

    IanB2 said:

    We just passed a woman taking her cat for a walk on a lead. Only in France…

    We once met a man walking two ferrets in Bury St Edmunds.
    As I was going to St Ives….
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277
    Gorgeous here on the war torn borders of Primrose Hill
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    The European Union has closed a loophole that allowed EU governments to export weapons worth tens of millions of euros to Russia last year alone despite an embargo which took effect in 2014 after Russia annexed Ukraine's Crimea region.

    EU countries last year sold to Russia weapons and ammunition worth 39 million euros ($42.3 million), according to the latest data made available by the EU Commission — up more than 50% from 2020, when sales were worth 25 million euros, a volume in line with previous years.

    The EU had banned the export of arms to Moscow in July 2014 in reaction to Russia's annexation of Crimea, but a clause in the sanctions permitted sales under contracts signed before August 2014.

    Countries with large defense industries, such as France and Germany, were among the largest exporters.


    https://www.voanews.com/a/eu-closes-loophole-allowing-multimillion-euro-arms-sales-to-russia/6529031.html
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070
    30 km from the front line. Sowing season starts in Zaporizhia Oblast
    “The land can't wait; we need to sow, fertilize&plant. Our Armed Forces&people must be fed. We have a second front here, which we, agricultural workers of #Ukraine️ must defend&protect!” say farmers

    https://mobile.twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1514830674875887619

    Not without risks.
    https://mobile.twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1514765772035440640
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,663

    May 6th is my birthday. As a LibLab I normally, my diary reminds me, wake up to less than happy electoral news.

    This year might, just might, be different!

    Or, the man down the pub thinks Rwanda is a cracking idea, and its as you were....
    Man is no longer down the pub, due to worries about about his energy, transport and food costs.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,572
    Dura_Ace said:



    Russia needs humiliation: they need to lose in Ukraine, and be seen to lose

    This Manichean view of the conflict needs contextualisation. What would such a loss, that would be impossible to obfuscate, look like? Pushing the Russians back to the 2014 border?
    You call it a 'Manichean' view. I am usually a shades-of-grey person, but I find it really, really difficult to do anything other than put the Russian regime fully in the 'evil' camp and Ukraine in the 'good' camp.

    Do you differ? Do you think the Russian regime are the good guys? Do you think the Ukrainians have brought the death and destruction on themselves? How do you get shades-of-grey out of what Russia has done?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,663

    IanB2 said:

    We just passed a woman taking her cat for a walk on a lead. Only in France…

    We once met a man walking two ferrets in Bury St Edmunds.
    I'm bid two ferrets. Three anywhere?

    I'll take a tapir.....
    Mrs P. once met a man with a lobster on a string in Hamburg.

    Well that's what she says anyway.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,561

    The European Union has closed a loophole that allowed EU governments to export weapons worth tens of millions of euros to Russia last year alone despite an embargo which took effect in 2014 after Russia annexed Ukraine's Crimea region.

    EU countries last year sold to Russia weapons and ammunition worth 39 million euros ($42.3 million), according to the latest data made available by the EU Commission — up more than 50% from 2020, when sales were worth 25 million euros, a volume in line with previous years.

    The EU had banned the export of arms to Moscow in July 2014 in reaction to Russia's annexation of Crimea, but a clause in the sanctions permitted sales under contracts signed before August 2014.

    Countries with large defense industries, such as France and Germany, were among the largest exporters.


    https://www.voanews.com/a/eu-closes-loophole-allowing-multimillion-euro-arms-sales-to-russia/6529031.html

    France? Germany? Supplying arms to Russia? Paint me ever so surprised.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    You know whose probably most affected by the sinking of the Moskva? I would say China. Another example of how this war is shaking up the strategic calculus and will, hopefully, make countries think twice about starting wars in the future.

    https://twitter.com/phillipspobrien/status/1514502020258050051
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,747
    DavidL said:

    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    (FPT)The Russian reaction to the sinking is extraordinary - “the special military operation is over; this means war…”
    https://mobile.twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/status/1514766062771875851

    The logic there is almost too fncked up to comprehend, but it does strongly suggest that the Russian public have no idea of the scale of their losses to date if this incident is such a trigger. The desperate anger is palpable.

    Harder to hide the loss of a ship, especially such a famous one, than the loss of a unit. Unless you are running a Pals Battalion system you can tell each casualty!s family that they were one of the unlucky few.
    Indeed.
    But it will become steadily harder to gloss over the reality of the land war.
    The next few weeks are going to be very dangerous ones, given Russia’s limited set of options for escalation.
    It is indeed dangerous. There are 3 broad scenarios from here that I can see.

    The first is that with the aid of additional men and equipment the Russians continue slow progress across the south of the country at considerable cost.

    The second is that the Russians lose ground and personnel as the Ukrainians get ever more NATO kit and use this to destroy Russia's artillary. The radar systems designed to identify, track and then take out not particularly mobile Russian artillary could be a real gamechanger here.

    The third is that we end up with a bloody but exhausted stalemate, the sort of low level warfare we have seen in Donetsk for the last 8 years writ large.

    Of these the second is currently looking the most likely. If Russia is clearly defeated by vastly superior western kit how will they react? They will undoubtedly blame NATO for the defeat. The reaction to the loss of the Moscow gives us some idea. It will be a time of great risk for both the Putin regime and the world. We should perhaps be careful what we wish for.
    The risk to the world I think comes not from Putin but from what potentially follows. Others might know better but if the Russian state starts to politically fragment in the regions, how sure are we that nuclear materials will remain securely held?

    There’s a chance of course he uses nerve gas in Ukraine. But he must know that would likely be met with a barrage of cruise missiles at all Russian military assets in Ukraine. Painted yellow & blue or red, white and blue I couldn’t say.

    I also still wonder if he might look east for a victory rather than West. Kazakhstan perhaps. There’s a definite spillover risk to the ‘Stans, which have been very reliant on remittances from their citizens working in Russia. So I gather those remittances are drying up due to the banking sanctions, could be a lot of young unemployed heading home. Add to that, Kazakh crude flowing through the CPC pipeline is fast becoming persona non grata, because it’s comingled with Russian molecules (10% of the total).
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,070

    May 6th is my birthday. As a LibLab I normally, my diary reminds me, wake up to less than happy electoral news.

    This year might, just might, be different!

    Or, the man down the pub thinks Rwanda is a cracking idea, and its as you were....
    Man is no longer down the pub, due to worries about about his energy, transport and food costs.
    I was this week.
    I don’t think many there were considering an X alongside the Tory candidate, FWIW.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,561
    Leon said:

    Gorgeous here on the war torn borders of Primrose Hill

    Now musing on whether all your various personas are just those of "Gorgeous" George Galloway....?
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,663

    Thoughts and prayers for the bloody infantry of the Conservative Party on the 5th of May.

    They don't have to promote their lying, thieving, nasty party. Just saying.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,572
    Dura_Ace said:

    Jonathan said:

    Russians have been living on a diet of nationalist propaganda for years. The clash of their national myth with reality is full of risks. Whilst the aggression should be defeated, I am not sure that humiliation is going to help.

    I'm certainly glad I don't live in a country where the public are fed nationalist propaganda leading to disastrous decisions in the sphere of international relations.
    Anybody wondering how the Russians could be so easily gulled should spend some time looking at British Facebook accounts of boomer morons. There is plenty of widely shared and sincerely believed nonsense about asylum seekers getting PS5s because the EU told us to do it, etc.
    I know a couple of people whose FB accounts are (ahem) rather the other way. Including one fool who insisted that the Moskva had safely docked back at port...
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,663

    IanB2 said:

    We just passed a woman taking her cat for a walk on a lead. Only in France…

    I know at least two cats that get walked on leads in the U.K. One poor creature was a retired queen, some kind of posh cat I believe. It’s owners lived near a busy road, so the mog was a house prisoner aside of walks on a lead in the garden.
    It was neurotic.
    It's bad enough seeing owners who never let their dog off the lead for some free running; a cat that can't roam a bit is even worse. Someone should call the RSPCA tbh.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,561

    Andy_JS said:

    "Tories set to lose 800 council seats – and Sir Keir Starmer on course to be PM in 2024
    Pollsters Electoral Calculus and Find Out Now forecast five per cent swing from Tories to Labour at local elections"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/04/14/exclusive-tories-set-lose-800-council-seats-sir-keir-starmer/

    Isn't there a chance that the PM could lose his seat in an GE on figures like that? Have there been any whispers about him moving to a safer one?
    It's another reason for Boris to depart next year. Losing an 80 seat majority to dreadfully dreary Starmer would be bad enough. Losing his seat too, in a Portillo moment of national rejoicing, would haunt him for decades....
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424

    Thoughts and prayers for the bloody infantry of the Conservative Party on the 5th of May.

    They don't have to promote their lying, thieving, nasty party. Just saying.
    HYUFD will be along shortly to tell us he was part of a large and enthusiastic party of canvassers last night.
    Who were impressed with the positive effect of the 'export of refugees' policy.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,561

    Thoughts and prayers for the bloody infantry of the Conservative Party on the 5th of May.

    They don't have to promote their lying, thieving, nasty party. Just saying.
    But most of them are well known and respected in their local communities. Done good works for years. Their footsoldiers are happy to go out and leaflet and door-knock for them.

    Then - vaporised in a pre-emptive strike by the voters.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,188
    People's Republic of China to conduct exercises near the Republic of China today apparently.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,652
    Time to watch this again …
    https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xxxmjr
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277

    Dura_Ace said:



    Russia needs humiliation: they need to lose in Ukraine, and be seen to lose

    This Manichean view of the conflict needs contextualisation. What would such a loss, that would be impossible to obfuscate, look like? Pushing the Russians back to the 2014 border?
    You call it a 'Manichean' view. I am usually a shades-of-grey person, but I find it really, really difficult to do anything other than put the Russian regime fully in the 'evil' camp and Ukraine in the 'good' camp.

    Do you differ? Do you think the Russian regime are the good guys? Do you think the Ukrainians have brought the death and destruction on themselves? How do you get shades-of-grey out of what Russia has done?
    I have here a little list. Of PB-ers who ever-so-slightly want Russia to win, but are just too embarrassed to admit it out loud. You can spot them as they always over-estimate Russia’s military prowess, or they want a “peace now on present borders”, and they are super keen to NOT humiliate Putin. On PB it’s

    @Dura_Ace

    @NickPalmer

    @Luckyguy1983

    Any others?

    I have a couple, similarly minded, in my friend/family network

    I don’t necessarily condemn them. I quite strongly disagree - but it’s a free country. I just wish they’d be less mealy mouthed sometimes
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,215

    Andy_JS said:

    "Tories set to lose 800 council seats – and Sir Keir Starmer on course to be PM in 2024
    Pollsters Electoral Calculus and Find Out Now forecast five per cent swing from Tories to Labour at local elections"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/04/14/exclusive-tories-set-lose-800-council-seats-sir-keir-starmer/

    Isn't there a chance that the PM could lose his seat in an GE on figures like that? Have there been any whispers about him moving to a safer one?
    It's another reason for Boris to depart next year. Losing an 80 seat majority to dreadfully dreary Starmer would be bad enough. Losing his seat too, in a Portillo moment of national rejoicing, would haunt him for decades....
    Part of me thinks "good". He wants to go down in history, let him go down in history in shame. Like Pontius Pilate.

    The catch with the "he'll walk when he fears defeat" idea (which is what I kinda suspect too) is BoJo's Boosterism. Will he be able to read the writing on the wall? Will there be anyone left in the bunker who will read it to him? Will the message get through?
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,677
    edited April 2022

    Dura_Ace said:



    Russia needs humiliation: they need to lose in Ukraine, and be seen to lose

    This Manichean view of the conflict needs contextualisation. What would such a loss, that would be impossible to obfuscate, look like? Pushing the Russians back to the 2014 border?
    You call it a 'Manichean' view. I am usually a shades-of-grey person, but I find it really, really difficult to do anything other than put the Russian regime fully in the 'evil' camp and Ukraine in the 'good' camp.

    Do you differ? Do you think the Russian regime are the good guys? Do you think the Ukrainians have brought the death and destruction on themselves? How do you get shades-of-grey out of what Russia has done?
    To the extent that my moral judgement matters, that is not at all, I think Ukraine is more sinned against than sinner but they have some minor culpability. They pulled a 'Johnson' by signing up to the Minsk agreement without have any intention to honour it.

    Ukraine and Russia were and are both dysfunctional shitholes largely populated by people with the Slavic love of secrets and lies. It's impossible to tell what's really going on because of that and our media cleaves to the Ukrainian line on events. I don't give a fuck about the fate of either nation.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277

    Thoughts and prayers for the bloody infantry of the Conservative Party on the 5th of May.

    They don't have to promote their lying, thieving, nasty party. Just saying.
    HYUFD will be along shortly to tell us he was part of a large and enthusiastic party of canvassers last night.
    Who were impressed with the positive effect of the 'export of refugees' policy.
    All these people criticising the Rwanda policy REALLY need to come up with an alternative which is simultaneously humane, practical and affordable, and which prevents 50-100,000 people - or more, and more - crossing the channel in tiny boats to come to the UK and never be sent back. With hundreds drowning. Even thousands

    Because that’s what we’re looking at. This year so far is doubling the number last year; which doubled the number the year before. Etc
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,986
    Dura_Ace said:



    Russia needs humiliation: they need to lose in Ukraine, and be seen to lose

    This Manichean view of the conflict needs contextualisation. What would such a loss, that would be impossible to obfuscate, look like? Pushing the Russians back to the 2014 border?
    Back to the 2014 borders, with a negotiated peace that allows for a future referendum in Donbas, would be a good humiliation.

    It would mean the war, the sanctions, losses, global pariah status would have all been a pointless waste of time. Wars that get you back to where you started (like Korea) are the most pointless and seem like the most likely to undermine Putin at home without him being able to rally people against a threat to the motherland.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373
    edited April 2022
    Dura_Ace said:

    Dura_Ace said:



    Russia needs humiliation: they need to lose in Ukraine, and be seen to lose

    This Manichean view of the conflict needs contextualisation. What would such a loss, that would be impossible to obfuscate, look like? Pushing the Russians back to the 2014 border?
    You call it a 'Manichean' view. I am usually a shades-of-grey person, but I find it really, really difficult to do anything other than put the Russian regime fully in the 'evil' camp and Ukraine in the 'good' camp.

    Do you differ? Do you think the Russian regime are the good guys? Do you think the Ukrainians have brought the death and destruction on themselves? How do you get shades-of-grey out of what Russia has done?
    To the extent that my moral judgement matters, that is not at all, I think Ukraine is more sinned against than sinner but they have some minor culpability. They pulled a 'Johnson' by signing up to the Minsk agreement without have any intention to honour it.

    Ukraine and Russia were and are both dysfunctional shitholes largely populated by people with the Slavic love of secrets and lies. It's impossible to tell what's really going on because of that and our media cleaves to the Ukrainian line on events. I don't give a fuck about the fate of either nation.
    On the subject of Ukraine, did you manage to get the paperwork sorted for those two orphaned girls Mrs DA was looking after? I have been wondering.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,553
    edited April 2022
    Interesting statistic wrt the French election:

    The only age group to prefer Macron over Le Pen were the over 60s.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373
    edited April 2022

    Andy_JS said:

    "Tories set to lose 800 council seats – and Sir Keir Starmer on course to be PM in 2024
    Pollsters Electoral Calculus and Find Out Now forecast five per cent swing from Tories to Labour at local elections"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/04/14/exclusive-tories-set-lose-800-council-seats-sir-keir-starmer/

    Isn't there a chance that the PM could lose his seat in an GE on figures like that? Have there been any whispers about him moving to a safer one?
    It's another reason for Boris to depart next year. Losing an 80 seat majority to dreadfully dreary Starmer would be bad enough. Losing his seat too, in a Portillo moment of national rejoicing, would haunt him for decades....
    No British Prime Minister has ever lost his seat at a General Election. Not one. The closest anyone has come are Balfour in 1906 and Macdonald in 1935, who had both been PM a few months before (one for Balfour, six for MacDonald).

    For Johnson to lose his seat a la John Howard would be an epochal humiliation that would far dwarf any Portillo moment.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277
    Dura_Ace said:

    Dura_Ace said:



    Russia needs humiliation: they need to lose in Ukraine, and be seen to lose

    This Manichean view of the conflict needs contextualisation. What would such a loss, that would be impossible to obfuscate, look like? Pushing the Russians back to the 2014 border?
    You call it a 'Manichean' view. I am usually a shades-of-grey person, but I find it really, really difficult to do anything other than put the Russian regime fully in the 'evil' camp and Ukraine in the 'good' camp.

    Do you differ? Do you think the Russian regime are the good guys? Do you think the Ukrainians have brought the death and destruction on themselves? How do you get shades-of-grey out of what Russia has done?
    To the extent that my moral judgement matters, that is not at all, I think Ukraine is more sinned against than sinner but they have some minor culpability. They pulled a 'Johnson' by signing up to the Minsk agreement without have any intention to honour it.

    Ukraine and Russia were and are both dysfunctional shitholes largely populated by people with the Slavic love of secrets and lies. It's impossible to tell what's really going on because of that and our media cleaves to the Ukrainian line on events. I don't give a fuck about the fate of either nation.
    It’s really not “impossible to tell”. Yes, the fog of war. Yes, our media is biased to Ukraine. Yes, whatever

    The fact is there are zero reports of Ukrainian soldiers in Russian cities raping 12 year olds or shooting bicyclists. Even in Russian media.

    That’s all you need to know
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373
    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting statistic wrt the French election:

    The only age group to prefer Macron over Le Pen were the over 60s.

    Really? That's actually quite alarming.

    Are we talking small margins of a lead, or big pluralities?
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,215

    Thoughts and prayers for the bloody infantry of the Conservative Party on the 5th of May.

    They don't have to promote their lying, thieving, nasty party. Just saying.
    But most of them are well known and respected in their local communities. Done good works for years. Their footsoldiers are happy to go out and leaflet and door-knock for them.

    Then - vaporised in a pre-emptive strike by the voters.
    Been involved in campaigns that have been won and lost on that basis, and yes- it sucks.

    I don't know what the answer is; if moderates leave the party when it goes mad (see Corbyn Labour, or Johnson Conservatives), it just concentrates the insanity. There comes a point where one has no choice, natch, but it's incredibly hard for an elected representative to do that.

    Besides, why should we hold a candidate for Yourtown Borough Council accountable for Johnson being a nasty piece of work who surrounds himself with nasty pieces of work? (Soon to be ex-)Councillor Blank may have voted for Hunt, anyway.

    Won't stop me doing that, though.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,553
    edited April 2022
    ydoethur said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting statistic wrt the French election:

    The only age group to prefer Macron over Le Pen were the over 60s.

    Really? That's actually quite alarming.

    Are we talking small margins of a lead, or big pluralities?
    60-69 was 30% to 22%. 70+ was 41% to 13%.

    The French version of boomers and gammons is obviously different to over here.

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1513556894811664395
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,572
    BTW, I still think it's easily possible that Russia gets a tactical victory and takes over the eastern half of Ukraine, or even the entirety. It is getting less likely as time goes on, but is possible.

    But IMO that would only be a tactical, not a strategic victory, as it will do immense damage to the Russia militarily, politically and economically.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,553
    IanB2 said:

    We just passed a woman taking her cat for a walk on a lead. Only in France…

    Was it a Siamese?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373
    Andy_JS said:

    ydoethur said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting statistic wrt the French election:

    The only age group to prefer Macron over Le Pen were the over 60s.

    Really? That's actually quite alarming.

    Are we talking small margins of a lead, or big pluralities?
    60-69 was 30% to 22%. 70+ was 41% to 13%.

    The French version of boomers and gammons is obviously different compared to over here.

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1513556894811664395
    I meant for Le Pen! However, the fact she outscored Macron by such substantial margins in three of the four other age groups bodes ill for future political developments in France.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,164

    Andy_JS said:

    "Tories set to lose 800 council seats – and Sir Keir Starmer on course to be PM in 2024
    Pollsters Electoral Calculus and Find Out Now forecast five per cent swing from Tories to Labour at local elections"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/04/14/exclusive-tories-set-lose-800-council-seats-sir-keir-starmer/

    Isn't there a chance that the PM could lose his seat in an GE on figures like that? Have there been any whispers about him moving to a safer one?
    I would be surprised if Boris fights the next GE. If the May locals are bad then the party will act.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,714
    Joe Biden's popularity plummeted to the joint lowest level of his presidency as a poll showed only 33 per cent of Americans approve of his job performance.

    telegraph
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331

    Thoughts and prayers for the bloody infantry of the Conservative Party on the 5th of May.

    They don't have to promote their lying, thieving, nasty party. Just saying.
    HYUFD will be along shortly to tell us he was part of a large and enthusiastic party of canvassers last night.
    Who were impressed with the positive effect of the 'export of refugees' policy.
    Tbf to him, he normally tells it as it is. It’s why his posts are worth reading.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277

    BTW, I still think it's easily possible that Russia gets a tactical victory and takes over the eastern half of Ukraine, or even the entirety. It is getting less likely as time goes on, but is possible.

    But IMO that would only be a tactical, not a strategic victory, as it will do immense damage to the Russia militarily, politically and economically.

    I fear it is increasingly likely that Russia, in its expanding humiliation, will resort to tactical nukes

    I’m not sure what other options are left

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,918
    The last time we had local elections at the equivalent stage of this year's local elections before the next general election led to a change in government was in 1994 and 2006.

    In those elections Blair and Cameron both saw their parties have a 13% lead over the respective Conservative and Labour governments. In 1994 Major's Tories lost over 500 council seats and in 2006 Blair's Labour lost over 300 council seats.

    So Starmer needs to have a big NEV lead of close to 10% and see Labour make big gains in councillors from the Tories to show he has a good chance of becoming PM
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373

    Thoughts and prayers for the bloody infantry of the Conservative Party on the 5th of May.

    They don't have to promote their lying, thieving, nasty party. Just saying.
    HYUFD will be along shortly to tell us he was part of a large and enthusiastic party of canvassers last night.
    Who were impressed with the positive effect of the 'export of refugees' policy.
    Tbf to him, he normally tells it as it is. It’s why his posts are worth reading.
    Although TBF as well the entertainment value when he refuses to admit basic errors can be quite high too...
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,277
    ydoethur said:

    Andy_JS said:

    ydoethur said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting statistic wrt the French election:

    The only age group to prefer Macron over Le Pen were the over 60s.

    Really? That's actually quite alarming.

    Are we talking small margins of a lead, or big pluralities?
    60-69 was 30% to 22%. 70+ was 41% to 13%.

    The French version of boomers and gammons is obviously different compared to over here.

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1513556894811664395
    I meant for Le Pen! However, the fact she outscored Macron by such substantial margins in three of the four other age groups bodes ill for future political developments in France.
    They’ve been saying the same in Scotland since 2014. The young are Yes!

    Stubbornly, the young Yes seem to turn into older Nos as they age, hence the total inability of Yes to gain a sustained poll lead in that time

    And it’s been eight years now. So the experiment has been done. Thank God for the moderation and wisdom of Age
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,918
    Andy_JS said:

    ydoethur said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting statistic wrt the French election:

    The only age group to prefer Macron over Le Pen were the over 60s.

    Really? That's actually quite alarming.

    Are we talking small margins of a lead, or big pluralities?
    60-69 was 30% to 22%. 70+ was 41% to 13%.

    The French version of boomers and gammons is obviously different to over here.

    https://twitter.com/GoodwinMJ/status/1513556894811664395
    However Pecresse still did best with pensioners too as the main centre right candidate, just as the Tories do.

    However more Fillon voting pensioners from 2017 voted for Macron this time than Pecresse.

    The youngest voters in France voted for Melenchon, as they voted for Corbyn here in 2017 and 2019. Middle aged voters voted for Le Pen
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,331
    ydoethur said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Tories set to lose 800 council seats – and Sir Keir Starmer on course to be PM in 2024
    Pollsters Electoral Calculus and Find Out Now forecast five per cent swing from Tories to Labour at local elections"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/04/14/exclusive-tories-set-lose-800-council-seats-sir-keir-starmer/

    Isn't there a chance that the PM could lose his seat in an GE on figures like that? Have there been any whispers about him moving to a safer one?
    It's another reason for Boris to depart next year. Losing an 80 seat majority to dreadfully dreary Starmer would be bad enough. Losing his seat too, in a Portillo moment of national rejoicing, would haunt him for decades....
    No British Prime Minister has ever lost his seat at a General Election. Not one. The closest anyone has come are Balfour in 1906 and Macdonald in 1935, who had both been PM a few months before (one for Balfour, six for MacDonald).

    For Johnson to lose his seat a la John Howard would be an epochal humiliation that would far dwarf any Portillo moment.
    Agreed, but it’s actually quite likely if he stays until 2024.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,553
    HYUFD said:

    The last time we had local elections at the equivalent stage of this year's local elections before the next general election led to a change in government was in 1994 and 2006.

    In those elections Blair and Cameron both saw their parties have a 13% lead over the respective Conservative and Labour governments. In 1994 Major's Tories lost over 500 council seats and in 2006 Blair's Labour lost over 300 council seats.

    So Starmer needs to have a big NEV lead of close to 10% and see Labour make big gains in councillors from the Tories to show he has a good chance of becoming PM

    A council like Nuneaton & Bedworth will be interesting to watch. Labour almost got wiped out there last time.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,890

    A secret surveillance video has been released showing the Moskva's captain on his private patio:

    https://twitter.com/hike_charity/status/1514594342865936384

    "Never return to a firework once it has been lit."
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,918
    ydoethur said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Tories set to lose 800 council seats – and Sir Keir Starmer on course to be PM in 2024
    Pollsters Electoral Calculus and Find Out Now forecast five per cent swing from Tories to Labour at local elections"

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/04/14/exclusive-tories-set-lose-800-council-seats-sir-keir-starmer/

    Isn't there a chance that the PM could lose his seat in an GE on figures like that? Have there been any whispers about him moving to a safer one?
    It's another reason for Boris to depart next year. Losing an 80 seat majority to dreadfully dreary Starmer would be bad enough. Losing his seat too, in a Portillo moment of national rejoicing, would haunt him for decades....
    No British Prime Minister has ever lost his seat at a General Election. Not one. The closest anyone has come are Balfour in 1906 and Macdonald in 1935, who had both been PM a few months before (one for Balfour, six for MacDonald).

    For Johnson to lose his seat a la John Howard would be an epochal humiliation that would far dwarf any Portillo moment.
    That is more a factor of how safe their seat is. Major's Huntingdon had a massive majority in 1992 for example but he won a smaller majority than Boris did in 2019 but with Boris' Uxbridge seat having a smaller majority.

    As for John Howard he also won 4 general elections before he lost his seat and the election in 2007 and is still the second longest serving Australian PM since WW2
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,188

    Joe Biden's popularity plummeted to the joint lowest level of his presidency as a poll showed only 33 per cent of Americans approve of his job performance.

    telegraph

    Good lord, that's sub Trump nadir I think
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,663

    Joe Biden's popularity plummeted to the joint lowest level of his presidency as a poll showed only 33 per cent of Americans approve of his job performance.

    telegraph

    Biden's popularity has not really moved much at all since mid-January according to 538. No sign of a recent dip (or uplift).

    https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/biden-approval-rating
This discussion has been closed.