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Crisis, what crisis? – politicalbetting.com

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  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,205
    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    I've done *alot* of walking around this country. And whilst I know what you mean, scenery becomes a little boring after a while. The great thing about London is the sheer variety, both in views and the people. This can be seen in (say) a seven-mile walk along the Regents Canal from Mile End to Paddington, seven miles along the Thames Path, or seven miles south from Greenwich.

    If you want boring, try walking around Loch Long. Three days just to end up a couple of kilometres from where you began ...
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,456

    The Russians have lost an SU-35.

    Oh dear, how sad, what a shame...

    https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1510603614783426562

    Star Streak?
  • DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,190

    Scott_xP said:

    The Somerset and Frome MP David Warburton - suspended by the @Conservatives from the parliamentary party following allegations about his conduct in the #sundaytimes -has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital suffering from severe shock and stress, according to his wife Harriet
    https://twitter.com/iainjwatson/status/1510618374883225610

    Mental health is a serious issue and sadly is becoming very common

    Maybe give him some space
    What about his alleged victim?

    This smacks of the Prince Andrew defence. "The Falklands War changed me..."
    He has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital which requires serious mental health issues, sectioning, or suicide tendency

    He must face justice in due course but as with all mental health issues nobody benefits from lack of understanding
    I suspect the MP in question has checked himself in to some private facility. It strikes me as rather convenient on the day his alleged behaviour, or should I say, and let's not forget, his alleged criminality is busted by the Sunday Times.

    I take nothing away from anyone struggling with mental health issues, but in this instance, colour me skeptical. Didn't Keith Vaz take a similarly convenient route when he found himself in a spot of bother?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,280
    edited April 2022

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    I was afraid this would start to happen...

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    3h
    If the atrocities being reported are verified, and there's evidence they're still being perpetrated, then we need to intervene directly and militarily in Ukraine. Whether a country is part of NATO is irrelevant. We don't stand back and allow the perpetration of genocide.

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1510583932722548739

    ====

    How long before national newspapers and broadcasters are demanding something is done.

    He seems to have forgotten Rwanda, Syria, much of Bosnia, Cambodia etc where we did very little when genocide was committed.

    If a NATO nation is invaded then yes we have to take military action but in terms of Ukraine we just keep sending supplies, we don't go to WW3
    The problem with the argument about "not going to WW3" is that it sets an arbitrary threshold that hands escalation dominance to Putin. Are you going to let him decide what level of support is acceptable?
    No. The red line remains if he invades a NATO nation
    Only an invasion? And the red line for what specifically?
    NATO military response
    Then you're still in a discussion of what kind of response, by whom, what retaliation risks to avoid, etc.
    There are already NATO troops and jets based in Estonia and Latvia as NATO states bordering Russia.

    So if Putin invaded those states then at that point we would be at war
    What if Putin struck an airfield as a warning against NATO weapons shipments?
    If he struck an airfield and destroyed NATO planes then obviously NATO would respond in kind with airstrikes on a Russian base
  • PhilPhil Posts: 2,239
    Jesus Christ. These pictures out of Bucha.

    There’s no way back from this - the Russians went straight from invading Ukraine to committing war crimes without breaking sweat. Ukrainians will never forgive them inside living memory.

    When Ukraine takes back the cities in the south I fear they’re going to discover terrible things.

    As someone has pointed out on Twitter - Russia bought 45,000 body bags in preparation for the invasion. It doesn’t look like those were intended for Russian army boys does it? They were going to slaughter the Ukrainian political class - a second Katyn.

    Putin has to be stopped, but how?
  • Scott_xP said:

    The Somerset and Frome MP David Warburton - suspended by the @Conservatives from the parliamentary party following allegations about his conduct in the #sundaytimes -has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital suffering from severe shock and stress, according to his wife Harriet
    https://twitter.com/iainjwatson/status/1510618374883225610

    Mental health is a serious issue and sadly is becoming very common

    Maybe give him some space
    What about his alleged victim?

    This smacks of the Prince Andrew defence. "The Falklands War changed me..."
    He has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital which requires serious mental health issues, sectioning, or suicide tendency

    He must face justice in due course but as with all mental health issues nobody benefits from lack of understanding
    I suspect the MP in question has checked himself in to some private facility. It strikes me as rather convenient on the day his alleged behaviour, or should I say, and let's not forget, his alleged criminality is busted by the Sunday Times.

    I take nothing away from anyone struggling with mental health issues, but in this instance, colour me skeptical. Didn't Keith Vaz take a similarly convenient route when he found himself in a spot of bother?
    Even if he did I just do not understand how pilling onto him helps anyone
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,322
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    I was afraid this would start to happen...

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    3h
    If the atrocities being reported are verified, and there's evidence they're still being perpetrated, then we need to intervene directly and militarily in Ukraine. Whether a country is part of NATO is irrelevant. We don't stand back and allow the perpetration of genocide.

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1510583932722548739

    ====

    How long before national newspapers and broadcasters are demanding something is done.

    He seems to have forgotten Rwanda, Syria, much of Bosnia, Cambodia etc where we did very little when genocide was committed.

    If a NATO nation is invaded then yes we have to take military action but in terms of Ukraine we just keep sending supplies, we don't go to WW3
    The problem with the argument about "not going to WW3" is that it sets an arbitrary threshold that hands escalation dominance to Putin. Are you going to let him decide what level of support is acceptable?
    No. The red line remains if he invades a NATO nation
    Only an invasion? And the red line for what specifically?
    NATO military response
    Then you're still in a discussion of what kind of response, by whom, what retaliation risks to avoid, etc.
    There are already NATO troops and jets based in Estonia and Latvia as NATO states bordering Russia.

    So if Putin invaded those states then at that point we would be at war
    What if Putin struck an airfield as a warning against NATO weapons shipments?
    If he struck an airfield and destroyed NATO planes then obviously NATO would respond in kind with airstrikes on a Russian base
    So just tit for tat? Which NATO member would carry out the retaliation?
  • MalcolmDunnMalcolmDunn Posts: 139
    I wonder who TSE thinks has the taaalent to be Chancellor? Rachel Reeves?
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,576

    Scott_xP said:

    The Somerset and Frome MP David Warburton - suspended by the @Conservatives from the parliamentary party following allegations about his conduct in the #sundaytimes -has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital suffering from severe shock and stress, according to his wife Harriet
    https://twitter.com/iainjwatson/status/1510618374883225610

    Mental health is a serious issue and sadly is becoming very common

    Maybe give him some space
    What about his alleged victim?

    This smacks of the Prince Andrew defence. "The Falklands War changed me..."
    He has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital which requires serious mental health issues, sectioning, or suicide tendency

    He must face justice in due course but as with all mental health issues nobody benefits from lack of understanding
    I suspect the MP in question has checked himself in to some private facility. It strikes me as rather convenient on the day his alleged behaviour, or should I say, and let's not forget, his alleged criminality is busted by the Sunday Times.

    I take nothing away from anyone struggling with mental health issues, but in this instance, colour me skeptical. Didn't Keith Vaz take a similarly convenient route when he found himself in a spot of bother?
    Probably also helps mollify his missus, who was *not* the lady he was snorting coke with.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,280

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    I was afraid this would start to happen...

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    3h
    If the atrocities being reported are verified, and there's evidence they're still being perpetrated, then we need to intervene directly and militarily in Ukraine. Whether a country is part of NATO is irrelevant. We don't stand back and allow the perpetration of genocide.

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1510583932722548739

    ====

    How long before national newspapers and broadcasters are demanding something is done.

    He seems to have forgotten Rwanda, Syria, much of Bosnia, Cambodia etc where we did very little when genocide was committed.

    If a NATO nation is invaded then yes we have to take military action but in terms of Ukraine we just keep sending supplies, we don't go to WW3
    The problem with the argument about "not going to WW3" is that it sets an arbitrary threshold that hands escalation dominance to Putin. Are you going to let him decide what level of support is acceptable?
    No. The red line remains if he invades a NATO nation
    Only an invasion? And the red line for what specifically?
    NATO military response
    Then you're still in a discussion of what kind of response, by whom, what retaliation risks to avoid, etc.
    There are already NATO troops and jets based in Estonia and Latvia as NATO states bordering Russia.

    So if Putin invaded those states then at that point we would be at war
    What if Putin struck an airfield as a warning against NATO weapons shipments?
    If he struck an airfield and destroyed NATO planes then obviously NATO would respond in kind with airstrikes on a Russian base
    So just tit for tat? Which NATO member would carry out the retaliation?
    Planes from all of them, as NATO is based on collective defence
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,095
    ydoethur said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Farooq said:

    The idea that someone could look at Russia right now and say "hmm, maybe what's needed is a dictator" boggles me. It's the stupidest thing I've read on here (and I was here for when HYUFD claimed that you couldn't get from London to Cambridge without entering Essex).

    The M11, the main road route from London to Cambridge, goes through Essex. The Cambridge boat race crew may even use it tonight
    Is it flooded?
    You mean one can go there via the Persian Gulf?
    We'll all be in dire straits if that happens.
    So sue-us
  • Exclusively in @welt: Federal government refuses to supply Ukraine with armoured personnel carriers from Germany

    https://twitter.com/robinalexander_/status/1510629460508393487

    Germany is having a shocker
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,456

    TimT said:

    Onyx' Russian tank count now over 400. Closing in on 33% of the tanks that went in.

    So 500 doesn't seem an unreasonable tally. 2 in every 5 tanks in the special operation are goners. That is less operation, more special needs.

    And given the south has probably fared better than the operations in the north, that could realistically mean half of those that went into the north of Ukraine won't be going back.
    And that could become the fate of Russians around Kherson if the Ukrainians now have assets freed up from the north. Talk also of cutting off Russian supply routes by a push eastwards from Kharkhiv.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,317

    Scott_xP said:

    The Somerset and Frome MP David Warburton - suspended by the @Conservatives from the parliamentary party following allegations about his conduct in the #sundaytimes -has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital suffering from severe shock and stress, according to his wife Harriet
    https://twitter.com/iainjwatson/status/1510618374883225610

    Mental health is a serious issue and sadly is becoming very common

    Maybe give him some space
    What about his alleged victim?

    This smacks of the Prince Andrew defence. "The Falklands War changed me..."
    He has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital which requires serious mental health issues, sectioning, or suicide tendency

    He must face justice in due course but as with all mental health issues nobody benefits from lack of understanding
    The same courtesy should be extended to anyone 'accused' of some form of misconduct or criminality. It is not surprising that it would induce a breakdown. Better a psychiatric hospital than suicide.

    This is not a 'Wayne Couzens banging his head against a cell wall' episode.
  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,491
    TimT said:

    Onyx' Russian tank count now over 400. Closing in on 33% of the tanks that went in.

    Do we know exactly or even approximately how many Russian Tanks are involved in this war? open soirees intel indicates that the Russians have around 3,000 Tanks in operation units and 9,000 in reserve. A lot of these probably don't work, but how many is surely just guesswork.

  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,095
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Perhaps Rishi should book a summer holiday in a b and b in Skegness, Southend, Scarborough, Margate or Blackpool. Then he can try and restore his man of the people image as the cost of living rises after the damage of his Easter break in his multi million dollar California apartment

    But the real question that raises is why are Blackpool and Skegness the punchline of a joke on PB rather than thriving coastal resorts?
    To be fair they were until cheap flights to Spain arrived in the 1970s. They may be again if the cost of living crisis and high cost air fares make foreign travel again too expensive for many, even if there is less guarantee of sun there than the Costas in summer
    I don’t usually get involved in discussions with you. But a guarantee is binary. It is a guarantee or it is not.

    You can’t have a “less guarantee”
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,322
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    I was afraid this would start to happen...

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    3h
    If the atrocities being reported are verified, and there's evidence they're still being perpetrated, then we need to intervene directly and militarily in Ukraine. Whether a country is part of NATO is irrelevant. We don't stand back and allow the perpetration of genocide.

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1510583932722548739

    ====

    How long before national newspapers and broadcasters are demanding something is done.

    He seems to have forgotten Rwanda, Syria, much of Bosnia, Cambodia etc where we did very little when genocide was committed.

    If a NATO nation is invaded then yes we have to take military action but in terms of Ukraine we just keep sending supplies, we don't go to WW3
    The problem with the argument about "not going to WW3" is that it sets an arbitrary threshold that hands escalation dominance to Putin. Are you going to let him decide what level of support is acceptable?
    No. The red line remains if he invades a NATO nation
    Only an invasion? And the red line for what specifically?
    NATO military response
    Then you're still in a discussion of what kind of response, by whom, what retaliation risks to avoid, etc.
    There are already NATO troops and jets based in Estonia and Latvia as NATO states bordering Russia.

    So if Putin invaded those states then at that point we would be at war
    What if Putin struck an airfield as a warning against NATO weapons shipments?
    If he struck an airfield and destroyed NATO planes then obviously NATO would respond in kind with airstrikes on a Russian base
    So just tit for tat? Which NATO member would carry out the retaliation?
    Planes from all of them, as NATO is based on collective defence
    You'd send in bombers from every NATO member in response to a single missile strike? What if not every NATO member agrees with that plan? Which Russian targets would you need that many planes for and how would you defend them?
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,456
    Phil said:

    Jesus Christ. These pictures out of Bucha.

    There’s no way back from this - the Russians went straight from invading Ukraine to committing war crimes without breaking sweat. Ukrainians will never forgive them inside living memory.

    When Ukraine takes back the cities in the south I fear they’re going to discover terrible things.

    As someone has pointed out on Twitter - Russia bought 45,000 body bags in preparation for the invasion. It doesn’t look like those were intended for Russian army boys does it? They were going to slaughter the Ukrainian political class - a second Katyn.

    Putin has to be stopped, but how?

    Long-range heavy kit: artillery, AA, anti-ship. More drones.
  • darkage said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The Somerset and Frome MP David Warburton - suspended by the @Conservatives from the parliamentary party following allegations about his conduct in the #sundaytimes -has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital suffering from severe shock and stress, according to his wife Harriet
    https://twitter.com/iainjwatson/status/1510618374883225610

    Mental health is a serious issue and sadly is becoming very common

    Maybe give him some space
    What about his alleged victim?

    This smacks of the Prince Andrew defence. "The Falklands War changed me..."
    He has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital which requires serious mental health issues, sectioning, or suicide tendency

    He must face justice in due course but as with all mental health issues nobody benefits from lack of understanding
    The same courtesy should be extended to anyone 'accused' of some form of misconduct or criminality. It is not surprising that it would induce a breakdown. Better a psychiatric hospital than suicide.

    This is not a 'Wayne Couzens banging his head against a cell wall' episode.
    Indeed
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,456
    edited April 2022
    BigRich said:

    TimT said:

    Onyx' Russian tank count now over 400. Closing in on 33% of the tanks that went in.

    Do we know exactly or even approximately how many Russian Tanks are involved in this war? open soirees intel indicates that the Russians have around 3,000 Tanks in operation units and 9,000 in reserve. A lot of these probably don't work, but how many is surely just guesswork.

    The original estimate was 1250 tanks and that this constituted 75% of their total operational forces.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,205
    BigRich said:

    TimT said:

    Onyx' Russian tank count now over 400. Closing in on 33% of the tanks that went in.

    Do we know exactly or even approximately how many Russian Tanks are involved in this war? open soirees intel indicates that the Russians have around 3,000 Tanks in operation units and 9,000 in reserve. A lot of these probably don't work, but how many is surely just guesswork.
    A problem for the Russians is that it is probably guesswork for them as well...
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 41,947
    edited April 2022
    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    Bit different, we are. I really like the sea too, also open countryside, either rugged or manicured, but only to visit. I actually get to feeling a bit 'funny' if I spend a long time away from an urban setting with buildings and sundry strangers.

    My plan A idea for ending my life - which is actually plan Z since I bet I never would - is to go for a walk along a high Cornwall cliff and totter over onto the rocks below.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,456

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    I was afraid this would start to happen...

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    3h
    If the atrocities being reported are verified, and there's evidence they're still being perpetrated, then we need to intervene directly and militarily in Ukraine. Whether a country is part of NATO is irrelevant. We don't stand back and allow the perpetration of genocide.

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1510583932722548739

    ====

    How long before national newspapers and broadcasters are demanding something is done.

    He seems to have forgotten Rwanda, Syria, much of Bosnia, Cambodia etc where we did very little when genocide was committed.

    If a NATO nation is invaded then yes we have to take military action but in terms of Ukraine we just keep sending supplies, we don't go to WW3
    The problem with the argument about "not going to WW3" is that it sets an arbitrary threshold that hands escalation dominance to Putin. Are you going to let him decide what level of support is acceptable?
    No. The red line remains if he invades a NATO nation
    Only an invasion? And the red line for what specifically?
    NATO military response
    Then you're still in a discussion of what kind of response, by whom, what retaliation risks to avoid, etc.
    There are already NATO troops and jets based in Estonia and Latvia as NATO states bordering Russia.

    So if Putin invaded those states then at that point we would be at war
    What if Putin struck an airfield as a warning against NATO weapons shipments?
    If he struck an airfield and destroyed NATO planes then obviously NATO would respond in kind with airstrikes on a Russian base
    So just tit for tat? Which NATO member would carry out the retaliation?
    Unpredictable retaliation with an implicit escalation if iterations are needed, but with occasional 'forgiving' deescalation is what theory would recommend.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,280
    edited April 2022

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    I was afraid this would start to happen...

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    3h
    If the atrocities being reported are verified, and there's evidence they're still being perpetrated, then we need to intervene directly and militarily in Ukraine. Whether a country is part of NATO is irrelevant. We don't stand back and allow the perpetration of genocide.

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1510583932722548739

    ====

    How long before national newspapers and broadcasters are demanding something is done.

    He seems to have forgotten Rwanda, Syria, much of Bosnia, Cambodia etc where we did very little when genocide was committed.

    If a NATO nation is invaded then yes we have to take military action but in terms of Ukraine we just keep sending supplies, we don't go to WW3
    The problem with the argument about "not going to WW3" is that it sets an arbitrary threshold that hands escalation dominance to Putin. Are you going to let him decide what level of support is acceptable?
    No. The red line remains if he invades a NATO nation
    Only an invasion? And the red line for what specifically?
    NATO military response
    Then you're still in a discussion of what kind of response, by whom, what retaliation risks to avoid, etc.
    There are already NATO troops and jets based in Estonia and Latvia as NATO states bordering Russia.

    So if Putin invaded those states then at that point we would be at war
    What if Putin struck an airfield as a warning against NATO weapons shipments?
    If he struck an airfield and destroyed NATO planes then obviously NATO would respond in kind with airstrikes on a Russian base
    So just tit for tat? Which NATO member would carry out the retaliation?
    Planes from all of them, as NATO is based on collective defence
    You'd send in bombers from every NATO member in response to a single missile strike? What if not every NATO member agrees with that plan? Which Russian targets would you need that many planes for and how would you defend them?
    Unless every NATO state agrees and is ready to participate in NATO action then NATO is redundant to defend its member states and their armed forces. If Russia bombed NATO jets it should prepare for NATO jets to bomb an airfield with Russian jets.

    Otherwise NATO would then collapse and Russia could invade every individual NATO nation in turn. China would also take note of the inability and unwillingness of western nations to defend themselves when looking at Taiwan and the broader Far East
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,205
    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    Bit different, we are. I really like the sea too, also open countryside, either rugged or manicured, but only to visit. I actually get to feeling a bit 'funny' if I spend a long time away from an urban setting with buildings and sundry strangers.

    My plan A idea for ending my life - which is actually plan Z since I bet I never would - is to go for a walk along a high Cornwall cliff and totter over onto the rocks below.
    I once walked from Cape Cornwall towards Zennor in a storm, and came across a man (I think he was American) who had been coming the other way. A wave had swept him off the path, and he had a big gash on his head. He insisted on walking on. And I took to the road...
  • I wonder who TSE thinks has the taaalent to be Chancellor? Rachel Reeves?

    You really are dumb.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
    And in a time of truly extraordinary stress on our public finances, reeling from the worst pandemic in 100 years, an energy crisis seriously aggravated by necessary steps taken against those scumbags and criminals in Russia and our first serious bout of inflation in 20 years his priority is to budget for 1p off IT before the next election? I mean, FFS, get a grip.

    Disappointed? Yeah, doesn't quite cover it though.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,470
    Phil said:

    Jesus Christ. These pictures out of Bucha.

    There’s no way back from this - the Russians went straight from invading Ukraine to committing war crimes without breaking sweat. Ukrainians will never forgive them inside living memory.

    When Ukraine takes back the cities in the south I fear they’re going to discover terrible things.

    As someone has pointed out on Twitter - Russia bought 45,000 body bags in preparation for the invasion. It doesn’t look like those were intended for Russian army boys does it? They were going to slaughter the Ukrainian political class - a second Katyn.

    Putin has to be stopped, but how?

    I believe that Russia is again claiming that the Katyn massacres were carried out by 'Hitlerites'.
  • DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
    And in a time of truly extraordinary stress on our public finances, reeling from the worst pandemic in 100 years, an energy crisis seriously aggravated by necessary steps taken against those scumbags and criminals in Russia and our first serious bout of inflation in 20 years his priority is to budget for 1p off IT before the next election? I mean, FFS, get a grip.

    Disappointed? Yeah, doesn't quite cover it though.
    He's a bit rubbish.

    Do we think it is possible to be Chancellor of the Exchequer from the Lords?
  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,491

    Exclusively in @welt: Federal government refuses to supply Ukraine with armoured personnel carriers from Germany

    https://twitter.com/robinalexander_/status/1510629460508393487


    Errrrr Germany, what are you playing at.

    For the record theses are not 'German APC' that are APCs that where ones sold to GDR, who post unification sold them to Sweden who then decided that as there cold war was over they did not need them and therefor put them in storage for 25 years. then sold them to a company in the Czech republic. They are BMP1s which is an old design, but would be very good for Ukraine right now as Ukraine has Esperance operating the BMP1, and these particular BMP1s have not been used very much but were well loaded after in Swedish storage. so are in good working order.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,412

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    Bit different, we are. I really like the sea too, also open countryside, either rugged or manicured, but only to visit. I actually get to feeling a bit 'funny' if I spend a long time away from an urban setting with buildings and sundry strangers.

    My plan A idea for ending my life - which is actually plan Z since I bet I never would - is to go for a walk along a high Cornwall cliff and totter over onto the rocks below.
    I once walked from Cape Cornwall towards Zennor in a storm, and came across a man (I think he was American) who had been coming the other way. A wave had swept him off the path, and he had a big gash on his head. He insisted on walking on. And I took to the road...
    Sounds a lot more dramatic than my walk to St Ives where all that happened was meeting a man with seven wives.
  • DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
    And in a time of truly extraordinary stress on our public finances, reeling from the worst pandemic in 100 years, an energy crisis seriously aggravated by necessary steps taken against those scumbags and criminals in Russia and our first serious bout of inflation in 20 years his priority is to budget for 1p off IT before the next election? I mean, FFS, get a grip.

    Disappointed? Yeah, doesn't quite cover it though.
    I agree and I had high hopes for him
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,456
    boulay said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    Bit different, we are. I really like the sea too, also open countryside, either rugged or manicured, but only to visit. I actually get to feeling a bit 'funny' if I spend a long time away from an urban setting with buildings and sundry strangers.

    My plan A idea for ending my life - which is actually plan Z since I bet I never would - is to go for a walk along a high Cornwall cliff and totter over onto the rocks below.
    I once walked from Cape Cornwall towards Zennor in a storm, and came across a man (I think he was American) who had been coming the other way. A wave had swept him off the path, and he had a big gash on his head. He insisted on walking on. And I took to the road...
    Sounds a lot more dramatic than my walk to St Ives where all that happened was meeting a man with seven wives.
    I thought it was meant to be Seven Brides for Seven Brothers. ;)
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,362
    DavidL said:

    The Russian Army is now visually confirmed to have lost at least 400 tanks since it began its invasion of Ukraine on February 24, 2022.

    When including our backlog, the actual number of tanks visually confirmed to have been lost approaches 450.


    https://twitter.com/oryxspioenkop/status/1510632351050899456?cxt=HHwWgIDR6dOH7PYpAAAA

    Add in those those which Oryx doesn't know about it and it must be over 500, maybe over 600.

    I can't help feeling after the pictures today there is going to be a sharp reduction in the number of Russians taken alive as prisoners of war going forward.
    Downed Russian pilots who have bombed hospitals, schools and theatres - especially tough times ahead.
  • PaulDPaulD Posts: 51

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
    And in a time of truly extraordinary stress on our public finances, reeling from the worst pandemic in 100 years, an energy crisis seriously aggravated by necessary steps taken against those scumbags and criminals in Russia and our first serious bout of inflation in 20 years his priority is to budget for 1p off IT before the next election? I mean, FFS, get a grip.

    Disappointed? Yeah, doesn't quite cover it though.
    He's a bit rubbish.

    Do we think it is possible to be Chancellor of the Exchequer from the Lords?
    No. The Commons controls the finances and the Chancellor must be directly accountable to the Commons.

    I don't think he is rubbish. I think that he is clever and articulate. But his priorities? Jeez. As a centre right instinctively Tory supporter they just make me cringe and this was by far his worst effort to date.
  • PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Unfortunately Putin is the problem and as he has his back to the wall a ceasefire seems unlikely

    And welcome to PB
  • DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
    And in a time of truly extraordinary stress on our public finances, reeling from the worst pandemic in 100 years, an energy crisis seriously aggravated by necessary steps taken against those scumbags and criminals in Russia and our first serious bout of inflation in 20 years his priority is to budget for 1p off IT before the next election? I mean, FFS, get a grip.

    Disappointed? Yeah, doesn't quite cover it though.
    He's a bit rubbish.

    Do we think it is possible to be Chancellor of the Exchequer from the Lords?
    No. The Commons controls the finances and the Chancellor must be directly accountable to the Commons.

    I don't think he is rubbish. I think that he is clever and articulate. But his priorities? Jeez. As a centre right instinctively Tory supporter they just make me cringe and this was by far his worst effort to date.
    Damn, I was hoping for Lord Clarke of Nottingham as Chancellor.

    That's a man with impeccable Thatcherite credentials and knows how to run an economy.
  • PaulDPaulD Posts: 51
    Phil said:

    Jesus Christ. These pictures out of Bucha.

    There’s no way back from this - the Russians went straight from invading Ukraine to committing war crimes without breaking sweat. Ukrainians will never forgive them inside living memory.

    When Ukraine takes back the cities in the south I fear they’re going to discover terrible things.

    As someone has pointed out on Twitter - Russia bought 45,000 body bags in preparation for the invasion. It doesn’t look like those were intended for Russian army boys does it? They were going to slaughter the Ukrainian political class - a second Katyn.

    Putin has to be stopped, but how?

    i think they will discover more than terrible things. I dont doubt many ukrainians in the southern cities have been tortured to death
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,470
    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    The pretending to be 'normal' rarely works.

    Being 'normal' sometimes does.

    But to be 'normal' its better to try it out before the media follow you around everywhere.

    Because there's multiple types of 'normal' and different people will like or dislike different varieties.

    So a politician (or family) attempting 'normal' will likely look pretty bloody miserable if they choose the wrong type of 'normal' to play at.
  • PaulDPaulD Posts: 51

    PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Unfortunately Putin is the problem and as he has his back to the wall a ceasefire seems unlikely

    And welcome to PB
    thankyou my good friend
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,412
    TimT said:

    boulay said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    Bit different, we are. I really like the sea too, also open countryside, either rugged or manicured, but only to visit. I actually get to feeling a bit 'funny' if I spend a long time away from an urban setting with buildings and sundry strangers.

    My plan A idea for ending my life - which is actually plan Z since I bet I never would - is to go for a walk along a high Cornwall cliff and totter over onto the rocks below.
    I once walked from Cape Cornwall towards Zennor in a storm, and came across a man (I think he was American) who had been coming the other way. A wave had swept him off the path, and he had a big gash on his head. He insisted on walking on. And I took to the road...
    Sounds a lot more dramatic than my walk to St Ives where all that happened was meeting a man with seven wives.
    I thought it was meant to be Seven Brides for Seven Brothers. ;)
    That was my walk in Norfolk - one delightful set of 14 siblings.
  • DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
    And in a time of truly extraordinary stress on our public finances, reeling from the worst pandemic in 100 years, an energy crisis seriously aggravated by necessary steps taken against those scumbags and criminals in Russia and our first serious bout of inflation in 20 years his priority is to budget for 1p off IT before the next election? I mean, FFS, get a grip.

    Disappointed? Yeah, doesn't quite cover it though.
    He's a bit rubbish.

    Do we think it is possible to be Chancellor of the Exchequer from the Lords?
    No. The Commons controls the finances and the Chancellor must be directly accountable to the Commons.

    I don't think he is rubbish. I think that he is clever and articulate. But his priorities? Jeez. As a centre right instinctively Tory supporter they just make me cringe and this was by far his worst effort to date.
    Damn, I was hoping for Lord Clarke of Nottingham as Chancellor.

    That's a man with impeccable Thatcherite credentials and knows how to run an economy.
    I would be very happy to see Ken back in that role
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,177
    Farooq said:

    Farooq said:

    It's not possible to get from Scotland to Ireland without going through Northern Ireland

    Via Holyhead ?
    I was wrong.
    Careful, PB is not the place for admitting mistakes... :D
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706
    edited April 2022
    PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Hmm, not completely sure about that. I want a lot more of these murderers going home in wooden boxes and as much equipment stripped off the Russian army as possible so they can't come back. Allowing the Russians to regroup and rearm might be a major mistake.

    Edit, but welcome by the way. New voices always welcome.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,322
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    I was afraid this would start to happen...

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    3h
    If the atrocities being reported are verified, and there's evidence they're still being perpetrated, then we need to intervene directly and militarily in Ukraine. Whether a country is part of NATO is irrelevant. We don't stand back and allow the perpetration of genocide.

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1510583932722548739

    ====

    How long before national newspapers and broadcasters are demanding something is done.

    He seems to have forgotten Rwanda, Syria, much of Bosnia, Cambodia etc where we did very little when genocide was committed.

    If a NATO nation is invaded then yes we have to take military action but in terms of Ukraine we just keep sending supplies, we don't go to WW3
    The problem with the argument about "not going to WW3" is that it sets an arbitrary threshold that hands escalation dominance to Putin. Are you going to let him decide what level of support is acceptable?
    No. The red line remains if he invades a NATO nation
    Only an invasion? And the red line for what specifically?
    NATO military response
    Then you're still in a discussion of what kind of response, by whom, what retaliation risks to avoid, etc.
    There are already NATO troops and jets based in Estonia and Latvia as NATO states bordering Russia.

    So if Putin invaded those states then at that point we would be at war
    What if Putin struck an airfield as a warning against NATO weapons shipments?
    If he struck an airfield and destroyed NATO planes then obviously NATO would respond in kind with airstrikes on a Russian base
    So just tit for tat? Which NATO member would carry out the retaliation?
    Planes from all of them, as NATO is based on collective defence
    You'd send in bombers from every NATO member in response to a single missile strike? What if not every NATO member agrees with that plan? Which Russian targets would you need that many planes for and how would you defend them?
    Unless every NATO state agrees and is ready to participate in NATO action then NATO is redundant to defend its member states and their armed forces. If Russia bombed NATO jets it should prepare for NATO jets to bomb an airfield with Russian jets.

    Otherwise NATO would then collapse and Russia could invade every individual NATO nation in turn. China would also take note of the inability and unwillingness of western nations to defend themselves when looking at Taiwan and the broader Far East
    If you read NATO Article 5, that's not what collective defence is based on.
  • PaulDPaulD Posts: 51

    Scott_xP said:

    The Somerset and Frome MP David Warburton - suspended by the @Conservatives from the parliamentary party following allegations about his conduct in the #sundaytimes -has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital suffering from severe shock and stress, according to his wife Harriet
    https://twitter.com/iainjwatson/status/1510618374883225610

    Mental health is a serious issue and sadly is becoming very common

    Maybe give him some space
    What about his alleged victim?

    This smacks of the Prince Andrew defence. "The Falklands War changed me..."
    He has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital which requires serious mental health issues, sectioning, or suicide tendency

    He must face justice in due course but as with all mental health issues nobody benefits from lack of understanding
    I suspect the MP in question has checked himself in to some private facility. It strikes me as rather convenient on the day his alleged behaviour, or should I say, and let's not forget, his alleged criminality is busted by the Sunday Times.

    I take nothing away from anyone struggling with mental health issues, but in this instance, colour me skeptical. Didn't Keith Vaz take a similarly convenient route when he found himself in a spot of bother?
    Even if he did I just do not understand how pilling onto him helps anyone
    starting to feel a bit sorry for him tbf
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,470
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
    And in a time of truly extraordinary stress on our public finances, reeling from the worst pandemic in 100 years, an energy crisis seriously aggravated by necessary steps taken against those scumbags and criminals in Russia and our first serious bout of inflation in 20 years his priority is to budget for 1p off IT before the next election? I mean, FFS, get a grip.

    Disappointed? Yeah, doesn't quite cover it though.
    The contrast between increasing NI while promising an income tax cut was not good for Sunak's credibility.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,314
    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Perhaps, though, Sunak's great wealth and privileged lifestyle has a bearing, in that he doesn't really understand what it is like to scrape through life under a constant financial struggle? Same with Osborne and his 'austerity' (for the poor) programme. Certainly Sunak seems to lack genuine empathy with, for example, those who have no choice but to subsist on benefits.
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,638

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
    And in a time of truly extraordinary stress on our public finances, reeling from the worst pandemic in 100 years, an energy crisis seriously aggravated by necessary steps taken against those scumbags and criminals in Russia and our first serious bout of inflation in 20 years his priority is to budget for 1p off IT before the next election? I mean, FFS, get a grip.

    Disappointed? Yeah, doesn't quite cover it though.
    He's a bit rubbish.

    Do we think it is possible to be Chancellor of the Exchequer from the Lords?
    No. The Commons controls the finances and the Chancellor must be directly accountable to the Commons.

    I don't think he is rubbish. I think that he is clever and articulate. But his priorities? Jeez. As a centre right instinctively Tory supporter they just make me cringe and this was by far his worst effort to date.
    Damn, I was hoping for Lord Clarke of Nottingham as Chancellor.

    That's a man with impeccable Thatcherite credentials and knows how to run an economy.
    I would be very happy to see Ken back in that role
    TSE + Big G = CORRECT 👍
  • Trying to be an optimist am I being silly in hoping that China has seen how bad invading Ukraine is that they think invading Taiwan will be a hundred times harder and abandon all plans to do so?

    I mean Taiwan is much better defended and harder to invade given they have to cross the sea, rather than a border?
  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,491
    PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Hello PaulD, and welcome to PB

    A ceasefire would be the best ting imaginable, but a ceasefire by any means possible means giving in to Putin. Whiles I would understand if the Ukrainians wanted to give in, and would not blamed them, the lack of support from much in the west (looking at you germane) is shameful. however for as long as they what to fight we sould support and help them do that.
  • DoubleCarpetDoubleCarpet Posts: 865
    edited April 2022
    Hungary

    Polls close 6pm UK time, TV links below:

    https://hirado.hu/elo/m1/

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lK49GwyksTk

    Will add any decent result sites with maps if I find them.

    Well done if you got Orban at 1.25 on Betfair for next PM - will be very surprised if Fidesz don't win, still think the current 1.14 is value, anywhere from a comfortable win in seats to outside chance of 2/3 majority maybe, gut feel is 4-5% vote lead for Fidesz although one recent poll was a tie.

    Hope you are all keeping well.

    Many thanks,

    DC
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,965
    boulay said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    Bit different, we are. I really like the sea too, also open countryside, either rugged or manicured, but only to visit. I actually get to feeling a bit 'funny' if I spend a long time away from an urban setting with buildings and sundry strangers.

    My plan A idea for ending my life - which is actually plan Z since I bet I never would - is to go for a walk along a high Cornwall cliff and totter over onto the rocks below.
    I once walked from Cape Cornwall towards Zennor in a storm, and came across a man (I think he was American) who had been coming the other way. A wave had swept him off the path, and he had a big gash on his head. He insisted on walking on. And I took to the road...
    Sounds a lot more dramatic than my walk to St Ives where all that happened was meeting a man with seven wives.
    St Ives, Utah?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    As TSE would say;

    The 167th Boat Race took place today on the Thames.

    Many congratulations to Cambridge for a strong second place. Well done!

    (Commiserations to Oxford for coming last but one.)


    https://twitter.com/DXWQC/status/1510635220759945227
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,706

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Perhaps, though, Sunak's great wealth and privileged lifestyle has a bearing, in that he doesn't really understand what it is like to scrape through life under a constant financial struggle? Same with Osborne and his 'austerity' (for the poor) programme. Certainly Sunak seems to lack genuine empathy with, for example, those who have no choice but to subsist on benefits.
    I can see the argument. But someone that clever really should have a bit more imagination.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,412
    DavidL said:

    PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Hmm, not completely sure about that. I want a lot more of these murderers going home in wooden boxes and as much equipment stripped off the Russian army as possible so they can't come back. Allowing the Russians to regroup and rearm might be a major mistake.

    Edit, but welcome by the way. New voices always welcome.
    You don’t want them going back in wooden boxes - you want them going back missing limbs as they will be a clear and indisputable “truth” to the Russian people of the cost of the war they support.

    If there are 20,000 young men who are visibly ruined by the war it cannot be hidden and also they will be able to tell their families and friends about what they saw and how bad the Russian military really is.

    Also injured soldiers use up more resources than dead soldiers along the line….
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401

    darkage said:

    Scott_xP said:

    The Somerset and Frome MP David Warburton - suspended by the @Conservatives from the parliamentary party following allegations about his conduct in the #sundaytimes -has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital suffering from severe shock and stress, according to his wife Harriet
    https://twitter.com/iainjwatson/status/1510618374883225610

    Mental health is a serious issue and sadly is becoming very common

    Maybe give him some space
    What about his alleged victim?

    This smacks of the Prince Andrew defence. "The Falklands War changed me..."
    He has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital which requires serious mental health issues, sectioning, or suicide tendency

    He must face justice in due course but as with all mental health issues nobody benefits from lack of understanding
    The same courtesy should be extended to anyone 'accused' of some form of misconduct or criminality. It is not surprising that it would induce a breakdown. Better a psychiatric hospital than suicide.

    This is not a 'Wayne Couzens banging his head against a cell wall' episode.
    Indeed
    If he has been admitted to a psychiatric hospital with the current state of NHS mental health provision then it must have been extremely serious. Beds are like absolute gold dust.


  • PaulDPaulD Posts: 51

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Perhaps, though, Sunak's great wealth and privileged lifestyle has a bearing, in that he doesn't really understand what it is like to scrape through life under a constant financial struggle? Same with Osborne and his 'austerity' (for the poor) programme. Certainly Sunak seems to lack genuine empathy with, for example, those who have no choice but to subsist on benefits.
    put it in perspective sunaks worth around £500 million. For him an extra £100 is equivalent to an extra 10p for someone with £500000 net worth (ie not remotely poor themselves)
  • As TSE would say;

    The 167th Boat Race took place today on the Thames.

    Many congratulations to Cambridge for a strong second place. Well done!

    (Commiserations to Oxford for coming last but one.)


    https://twitter.com/DXWQC/status/1510635220759945227

    Only the women's race matters.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 27,576

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
    And in a time of truly extraordinary stress on our public finances, reeling from the worst pandemic in 100 years, an energy crisis seriously aggravated by necessary steps taken against those scumbags and criminals in Russia and our first serious bout of inflation in 20 years his priority is to budget for 1p off IT before the next election? I mean, FFS, get a grip.

    Disappointed? Yeah, doesn't quite cover it though.
    He's a bit rubbish.

    Do we think it is possible to be Chancellor of the Exchequer from the Lords?
    No. The Commons controls the finances and the Chancellor must be directly accountable to the Commons.

    I don't think he is rubbish. I think that he is clever and articulate. But his priorities? Jeez. As a centre right instinctively Tory supporter they just make me cringe and this was by far his worst effort to date.
    Damn, I was hoping for Lord Clarke of Nottingham as Chancellor.

    That's a man with impeccable Thatcherite credentials and knows how to run an economy.
    That might have come as a surprise to Mrs Thatcher.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,316

    Trying to be an optimist am I being silly in hoping that China has seen how bad invading Ukraine is that they think invading Taiwan will be a hundred times harder and abandon all plans to do so?

    I mean Taiwan is much better defended and harder to invade given they have to cross the sea, rather than a border?

    Easier to reclaim Haishenwai ( Vladivostok ) its closer to home and the other sides army has no tanks left
  • PaulDPaulD Posts: 51
    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    I've done *alot* of walking around this country. And whilst I know what you mean, scenery becomes a little boring after a while. The great thing about London is the sheer variety, both in views and the people. This can be seen in (say) a seven-mile walk along the Regents Canal from Mile End to Paddington, seven miles along the Thames Path, or seven miles south from Greenwich.

    If you want boring, try walking around Loch Long. Three days just to end up a couple of kilometres from where you began ...
    I agree re London walks. They are interesting. But I never find scenery boring because there is so much to notice - the plants, the trees, the light, the shadows on rocks, the animals etc.

    One of the things I was told by an old gardening hand was to walk round your garden every single day and simply look closely. You'd think that there would be no change from day to day but you'd be wrong. And learning how to really see has been a blessing. And once you start doing it there is so much to observe. Partly because of my asthma I rarely walks for long periods without stopping. But also because I am always seeing all sorts of things up close - even the beauty of a gorse bush - or moss or lichen on a stone- or the pattern of a dry stone wall or ferns growing out the ground or a wall.

    Honestly I could bore you all for hours about it. Don't worry. I won't.



    london walks are great but the air pollution means you benefit a lot more from country walks
  • MalcolmDunnMalcolmDunn Posts: 139
    That's not a very nice thing to say TSE. From what I read of your comments on this article and many others it seems I am being insulted by someone with a less than stellar intellect.
  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,491

    Trying to be an optimist am I being silly in hoping that China has seen how bad invading Ukraine is that they think invading Taiwan will be a hundred times harder and abandon all plans to do so?

    I mean Taiwan is much better defended and harder to invade given they have to cross the sea, rather than a border?

    Maybe, but Taiwan is much smaller in both space and population and much harder for outside would to help, at least with equipment. amongst other things China will be looking at the cost to Russia in the form of western sanctions. sadly they may be concluding that if Europe will not even stop importing gas from Russia when war Crimes are committed in Europe, then there is no Chace of meaningful sanctions if Taiwan is invaded :(
  • DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Rishi simply was wrong in ignoring those in real fuel poverty and showed an uncaring side which disappointed me

    I expect he will be in the frame as Boris successor but he has not helped his chances in this budget
    And in a time of truly extraordinary stress on our public finances, reeling from the worst pandemic in 100 years, an energy crisis seriously aggravated by necessary steps taken against those scumbags and criminals in Russia and our first serious bout of inflation in 20 years his priority is to budget for 1p off IT before the next election? I mean, FFS, get a grip.

    Disappointed? Yeah, doesn't quite cover it though.
    He's a bit rubbish.

    Do we think it is possible to be Chancellor of the Exchequer from the Lords?
    No. The Commons controls the finances and the Chancellor must be directly accountable to the Commons.

    I don't think he is rubbish. I think that he is clever and articulate. But his priorities? Jeez. As a centre right instinctively Tory supporter they just make me cringe and this was by far his worst effort to date.
    Damn, I was hoping for Lord Clarke of Nottingham as Chancellor.

    That's a man with impeccable Thatcherite credentials and knows how to run an economy.
    That might have come as a surprise to Mrs Thatcher.
    Policy wise he was a staunch Thatcherite during her premiership.

    Whenever she had a problem she sent Ken Clarke to fix it.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,679
    boulay said:

    DavidL said:

    PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Hmm, not completely sure about that. I want a lot more of these murderers going home in wooden boxes and as much equipment stripped off the Russian army as possible so they can't come back. Allowing the Russians to regroup and rearm might be a major mistake.

    Edit, but welcome by the way. New voices always welcome.
    You don’t want them going back in wooden boxes - you want them going back missing limbs as they will be a clear and indisputable “truth” to the Russian people of the cost of the war they support.

    If there are 20,000 young men who are visibly ruined by the war it cannot be hidden and also they will be able to tell their families and friends about what they saw and how bad the Russian military really is.

    Also injured soldiers use up more resources than dead soldiers along the line….
    That’s why the Azov battalion shot those Russian POWs in the legs. Much more militarily effective than murder
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Perhaps, though, Sunak's great wealth and privileged lifestyle has a bearing, in that he doesn't really understand what it is like to scrape through life under a constant financial struggle? Same with Osborne and his 'austerity' (for the poor) programme. Certainly Sunak seems to lack genuine empathy with, for example, those who have no choice but to subsist on benefits.
    I can see the argument. But someone that clever really should have a bit more imagination.
    It isn't a lack of imagination.
    It's his ideology.
  • PaulDPaulD Posts: 51
    boulay said:

    DavidL said:

    PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Hmm, not completely sure about that. I want a lot more of these murderers going home in wooden boxes and as much equipment stripped off the Russian army as possible so they can't come back. Allowing the Russians to regroup and rearm might be a major mistake.

    Edit, but welcome by the way. New voices always welcome.
    You don’t want them going back in wooden boxes - you want them going back missing limbs as they will be a clear and indisputable “truth” to the Russian people of the cost of the war they support.

    If there are 20,000 young men who are visibly ruined by the war it cannot be hidden and also they will be able to tell their families and friends about what they saw and how bad the Russian military really is.

    Also injured soldiers use up more resources than dead soldiers along the line….
    yes but these may be ordinary russian conscipts....we have to maintain our sense of morality here
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,314
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    I remember SamCam looking pretty bloody miserable when DC dragged her away for some holiday bash on Easyjet pretending to be "normal" whilst Osborne had no problem at all going to an exclusive skiing resort with his then missus.

    Personally, I have no problem with politicians being who they are and not apologising for it. Rishi is a very rich man married to an extremely rich woman and can go wherever the hell he likes on holiday so far as I am concerned.

    I am more concerned about a budget that did not do anything to help those facing serious real terms cuts in their already poor living standards as the increase in benefits is dwarfed by the current rise in inflation, who reduced VAT on home improvements for privately owned properties but didn't on heating costs. Who still thinks, despite the increase in the reliefs on NI, that earned income should still bear a higher tax rate than unearned income. Whose idea of help for those unable to heat their homes was a ridiculous loan available in several months time.

    And no Labour, the answer to all of this is not some ridiculous windfall tax.

    Perhaps, though, Sunak's great wealth and privileged lifestyle has a bearing, in that he doesn't really understand what it is like to scrape through life under a constant financial struggle? Same with Osborne and his 'austerity' (for the poor) programme. Certainly Sunak seems to lack genuine empathy with, for example, those who have no choice but to subsist on benefits.
    I can see the argument. But someone that clever really should have a bit more imagination.
    Well, you're assuming he's "that clever". I'm not so sure. And I see little sign of Sunak having imaginative solutions to the current mess.
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 4,874
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Perhaps Rishi should book a summer holiday in a b and b in Skegness, Southend, Scarborough, Margate or Blackpool. Then he can try and restore his man of the people image as the cost of living rises after the damage of his Easter break in his multi million dollar California apartment

    But the real question that raises is why are Blackpool and Skegness the punchline of a joke on PB rather than thriving coastal resorts?
    To be fair they were until cheap flights to Spain arrived in the 1970s. They may be again if the cost of living crisis and high cost air fares make foreign travel again too expensive for many, even if there is less guarantee of sun there than the Costas in summer
    When I was in Felixstowe in the 1950s/1960s for family holidays, there was a big notice board on the prom, listing sunshine hours by resort. Felixstowe was always first, except when pipped to the post by Southend, or occasionally Margate. They never seemed to show Palma, Magaluf or Las Palmas!
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,412
    Leon said:

    boulay said:

    DavidL said:

    PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Hmm, not completely sure about that. I want a lot more of these murderers going home in wooden boxes and as much equipment stripped off the Russian army as possible so they can't come back. Allowing the Russians to regroup and rearm might be a major mistake.

    Edit, but welcome by the way. New voices always welcome.
    You don’t want them going back in wooden boxes - you want them going back missing limbs as they will be a clear and indisputable “truth” to the Russian people of the cost of the war they support.

    If there are 20,000 young men who are visibly ruined by the war it cannot be hidden and also they will be able to tell their families and friends about what they saw and how bad the Russian military really is.

    Also injured soldiers use up more resources than dead soldiers along the line….
    That’s why the Azov battalion shot those Russian POWs in the legs. Much more militarily effective than murder
    I seem to remember from the Ken Burns Vietnam doc that whilst the American public were shocked by deaths the effect of seeing the wounded and traumatised soldiers around them every day brought the war home much more viscerally than stats of dead soldiers.

    If you are a Russian mother and you see young men come home missing limbs and traumatised in your town and then you look at your son who might get called up then you might start questioning the propaganda.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342
    BigRich said:

    Trying to be an optimist am I being silly in hoping that China has seen how bad invading Ukraine is that they think invading Taiwan will be a hundred times harder and abandon all plans to do so?

    I mean Taiwan is much better defended and harder to invade given they have to cross the sea, rather than a border?

    Maybe, but Taiwan is much smaller in both space and population and much harder for outside would to help, at least with equipment. amongst other things China will be looking at the cost to Russia in the form of western sanctions. sadly they may be concluding that if Europe will not even stop importing gas from Russia when war Crimes are committed in Europe, then there is no Chace of meaningful sanctions if Taiwan is invaded :(
    On the other hand it isn't flat, open farmland either. It is hugely mountainous with rainforest.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,695

    That's not a very nice thing to say TSE. From what I read of your comments on this article and many others it seems I am being insulted by someone with a less than stellar intellect.

    Um I think you might be wrong.
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 4,874

    I genuinely don't understand why Labour are seen as more trusted on the economy. Since Starmer became leader two years ago they have had nothing to say on the subject and have not announced a single policy designed to control inflation or foster growth.

    Because when your rivals are talking sh1te, it’s often best to say nothing.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,679
    edited April 2022
    PaulD said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    I've done *alot* of walking around this country. And whilst I know what you mean, scenery becomes a little boring after a while. The great thing about London is the sheer variety, both in views and the people. This can be seen in (say) a seven-mile walk along the Regents Canal from Mile End to Paddington, seven miles along the Thames Path, or seven miles south from Greenwich.

    If you want boring, try walking around Loch Long. Three days just to end up a couple of kilometres from where you began ...
    I agree re London walks. They are interesting. But I never find scenery boring because there is so much to notice - the plants, the trees, the light, the shadows on rocks, the animals etc.

    One of the things I was told by an old gardening hand was to walk round your garden every single day and simply look closely. You'd think that there would be no change from day to day but you'd be wrong. And learning how to really see has been a blessing. And once you start doing it there is so much to observe. Partly because of my asthma I rarely walks for long periods without stopping. But also because I am always seeing all sorts of things up close - even the beauty of a gorse bush - or moss or lichen on a stone- or the pattern of a dry stone wall or ferns growing out the ground or a wall.

    Honestly I could bore you all for hours about it. Don't worry. I won't.



    london walks are great but the air pollution means you benefit a lot more from country walks
    Today I saw this

    The oldest life size statue in the world. His obsidian eyes are truly haunting. 12,000 years old. Those eyes looked at me as if to say, You again







  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,491

    Hungary

    Polls close 6pm UK time, TV links below:

    https://hirado.hu/elo/m1/

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lK49GwyksTk

    Will add any decent result sites with maps if I find them.

    Well done if you got Orban at 1.25 on Betfair for next PM - will be very surprised if Fidesz don't win, still think the current 1.14 is value, anywhere from a comfortable win in seats to outside chance of 2/3 majority maybe, gut feel is 4-5% vote lead for Fidesz although one recent poll was a tie.

    Hope you are all keeping well.

    Many thanks,

    DC

    Thanks for the updates @DoubleCarpet, do you know if we are expecting exit polls?
  • Leon said:

    PaulD said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    I've done *alot* of walking around this country. And whilst I know what you mean, scenery becomes a little boring after a while. The great thing about London is the sheer variety, both in views and the people. This can be seen in (say) a seven-mile walk along the Regents Canal from Mile End to Paddington, seven miles along the Thames Path, or seven miles south from Greenwich.

    If you want boring, try walking around Loch Long. Three days just to end up a couple of kilometres from where you began ...
    I agree re London walks. They are interesting. But I never find scenery boring because there is so much to notice - the plants, the trees, the light, the shadows on rocks, the animals etc.

    One of the things I was told by an old gardening hand was to walk round your garden every single day and simply look closely. You'd think that there would be no change from day to day but you'd be wrong. And learning how to really see has been a blessing. And once you start doing it there is so much to observe. Partly because of my asthma I rarely walks for long periods without stopping. But also because I am always seeing all sorts of things up close - even the beauty of a gorse bush - or moss or lichen on a stone- or the pattern of a dry stone wall or ferns growing out the ground or a wall.

    Honestly I could bore you all for hours about it. Don't worry. I won't.



    london walks are great but the air pollution means you benefit a lot more from country walks
    Today I saw this

    The oldest life size statue in the world. His obsidian eyes are truly haunting. 12,000 years old. Those eyes looked at me as if to say, You again







    That looks like some children's art project I saw back in 2019.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,280

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    I was afraid this would start to happen...

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    3h
    If the atrocities being reported are verified, and there's evidence they're still being perpetrated, then we need to intervene directly and militarily in Ukraine. Whether a country is part of NATO is irrelevant. We don't stand back and allow the perpetration of genocide.

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1510583932722548739

    ====

    How long before national newspapers and broadcasters are demanding something is done.

    He seems to have forgotten Rwanda, Syria, much of Bosnia, Cambodia etc where we did very little when genocide was committed.

    If a NATO nation is invaded then yes we have to take military action but in terms of Ukraine we just keep sending supplies, we don't go to WW3
    The problem with the argument about "not going to WW3" is that it sets an arbitrary threshold that hands escalation dominance to Putin. Are you going to let him decide what level of support is acceptable?
    No. The red line remains if he invades a NATO nation
    Only an invasion? And the red line for what specifically?
    NATO military response
    Then you're still in a discussion of what kind of response, by whom, what retaliation risks to avoid, etc.
    There are already NATO troops and jets based in Estonia and Latvia as NATO states bordering Russia.

    So if Putin invaded those states then at that point we would be at war
    What if Putin struck an airfield as a warning against NATO weapons shipments?
    If he struck an airfield and destroyed NATO planes then obviously NATO would respond in kind with airstrikes on a Russian base
    So just tit for tat? Which NATO member would carry out the retaliation?
    Planes from all of them, as NATO is based on collective defence
    You'd send in bombers from every NATO member in response to a single missile strike? What if not every NATO member agrees with that plan? Which Russian targets would you need that many planes for and how would you defend them?
    Unless every NATO state agrees and is ready to participate in NATO action then NATO is redundant to defend its member states and their armed forces. If Russia bombed NATO jets it should prepare for NATO jets to bomb an airfield with Russian jets.

    Otherwise NATO would then collapse and Russia could invade every individual NATO nation in turn. China would also take note of the inability and unwillingness of western nations to defend themselves when looking at Taiwan and the broader Far East
    If you read NATO Article 5, that's not what collective defence is based on.
    It is based on an attack on one NATO ally being an attack on all of them.

    So if Russia can bomb NATO jets without response from the collective NATO nations then Putin could invade Estonia and Latvia etc without fear of collective NATO response either. The Baltic states on their own are far easier pickings than Ukraine, much smaller with far less strong militaries
  • pm215pm215 Posts: 1,118

    Trying to be an optimist am I being silly in hoping that China has seen how bad invading Ukraine is that they think invading Taiwan will be a hundred times harder and abandon all plans to do so?

    I think if you're the Chinese military establishment you can probably find plenty of supporting material for an argument that this was largely down to Russian military incompetence and lousy equipment and therefore not applicable for any military adventures you'd like to embark on yourself...

  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 4,874
    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    Are we allowed to attend if we only dutifully applaud?
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,695
    edited April 2022
    boulay said:

    Leon said:

    boulay said:

    DavidL said:

    PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Hmm, not completely sure about that. I want a lot more of these murderers going home in wooden boxes and as much equipment stripped off the Russian army as possible so they can't come back. Allowing the Russians to regroup and rearm might be a major mistake.

    Edit, but welcome by the way. New voices always welcome.
    You don’t want them going back in wooden boxes - you want them going back missing limbs as they will be a clear and indisputable “truth” to the Russian people of the cost of the war they support.

    If there are 20,000 young men who are visibly ruined by the war it cannot be hidden and also they will be able to tell their families and friends about what they saw and how bad the Russian military really is.

    Also injured soldiers use up more resources than dead soldiers along the line….
    That’s why the Azov battalion shot those Russian POWs in the legs. Much more militarily effective than murder
    I seem to remember from the Ken Burns Vietnam doc that whilst the American public were shocked by deaths the effect of seeing the wounded and traumatised soldiers around them every day brought the war home much more viscerally than stats of dead soldiers.

    If you are a Russian mother and you see young men come home missing limbs and traumatised in your town and then you look at your son who might get called up then you might start questioning the propaganda.
    Ken Burns documentaries on Vietnam and the American Civil War are excellent.
  • pm215 said:

    Trying to be an optimist am I being silly in hoping that China has seen how bad invading Ukraine is that they think invading Taiwan will be a hundred times harder and abandon all plans to do so?

    I think if you're the Chinese military establishment you can probably find plenty of supporting material for an argument that this was largely down to Russian military incompetence and lousy equipment and therefore not applicable for any military adventures you'd like to embark on yourself...

    Bugger.
  • BigRich said:

    Hungary

    Polls close 6pm UK time, TV links below:

    https://hirado.hu/elo/m1/

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lK49GwyksTk

    Will add any decent result sites with maps if I find them.

    Well done if you got Orban at 1.25 on Betfair for next PM - will be very surprised if Fidesz don't win, still think the current 1.14 is value, anywhere from a comfortable win in seats to outside chance of 2/3 majority maybe, gut feel is 4-5% vote lead for Fidesz although one recent poll was a tie.

    Hope you are all keeping well.

    Many thanks,

    DC

    Thanks for the updates @DoubleCarpet, do you know if we are expecting exit polls?
    Hi so not sure tbh - but watching both channels so will try and post exits if there are any.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,456
    Leon said:

    boulay said:

    DavidL said:

    PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Hmm, not completely sure about that. I want a lot more of these murderers going home in wooden boxes and as much equipment stripped off the Russian army as possible so they can't come back. Allowing the Russians to regroup and rearm might be a major mistake.

    Edit, but welcome by the way. New voices always welcome.
    You don’t want them going back in wooden boxes - you want them going back missing limbs as they will be a clear and indisputable “truth” to the Russian people of the cost of the war they support.

    If there are 20,000 young men who are visibly ruined by the war it cannot be hidden and also they will be able to tell their families and friends about what they saw and how bad the Russian military really is.

    Also injured soldiers use up more resources than dead soldiers along the line….
    That’s why the Azov battalion shot those Russian POWs in the legs. Much more militarily effective than murder
    Apparently many of the Russian funerals are closed, sealed casket because of the horrific state of the bodies.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,412
    PaulD said:

    boulay said:

    DavidL said:

    PaulD said:

    Reuters - Ukrainian prosecutors investigating possible war crimes by Russia have found 410 bodies in towns near Kyiv and 140 of them had been examined. Russia denied allegations that its forces killed civilians in the town of Bucha near Kyiv.

    https://twitter.com/alextomo/status/1510652531290128387

    Disgusting behaviour from Putin. There really needs to be a way to find a ceasefire now by any means possible and end this war
    Hmm, not completely sure about that. I want a lot more of these murderers going home in wooden boxes and as much equipment stripped off the Russian army as possible so they can't come back. Allowing the Russians to regroup and rearm might be a major mistake.

    Edit, but welcome by the way. New voices always welcome.
    You don’t want them going back in wooden boxes - you want them going back missing limbs as they will be a clear and indisputable “truth” to the Russian people of the cost of the war they support.

    If there are 20,000 young men who are visibly ruined by the war it cannot be hidden and also they will be able to tell their families and friends about what they saw and how bad the Russian military really is.

    Also injured soldiers use up more resources than dead soldiers along the line….
    yes but these may be ordinary russian conscipts....we have to maintain our sense of morality here
    Absolutely fair point and I feel for the conscripts however from a cold practical perspective it is more likely to help Ukraine if these conscripts are injured and home than dead.

    Also probably better for the conscripts.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,205
    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    I've done *alot* of walking around this country. And whilst I know what you mean, scenery becomes a little boring after a while. The great thing about London is the sheer variety, both in views and the people. This can be seen in (say) a seven-mile walk along the Regents Canal from Mile End to Paddington, seven miles along the Thames Path, or seven miles south from Greenwich.

    If you want boring, try walking around Loch Long. Three days just to end up a couple of kilometres from where you began ...
    I agree re London walks. They are interesting. But I never find scenery boring because there is so much to notice - the plants, the trees, the light, the shadows on rocks, the animals etc.

    One of the things I was told by an old gardening hand was to walk round your garden every single day and simply look closely. You'd think that there would be no change from day to day but you'd be wrong. And learning how to really see has been a blessing. And once you start doing it there is so much to observe. Partly because of my asthma I rarely walks for long periods without stopping. But also because I am always seeing all sorts of things up close - even the beauty of a gorse bush - or moss or lichen on a stone- or the pattern of a dry stone wall or ferns growing out the ground or a wall.

    Honestly I could bore you all for hours about it. Don't worry. I won't.



    That looks beautiful. However my garden is one of a new-build. A walk around it takes a minute, tops, if I don't get strangled by the washing line in the process. I can see well over twenty other rooftops from an upper window.

    As it happens, I converse with lots of coastal walkers. I tell the ones who do it sectionally over a number of years that they get more out of it than those of us who do it in one go. They get to choose the season and the weather. And they get to see scenery with fresh eyes. On my walk, after six months it became: "Oh, another nice view. Oh well." I had scenery fatigue. And I was always rushing, rarely stopping.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,679

    Leon said:

    PaulD said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Anyway, I am back up North tomorrow am. I have been a city girl most of my life - Naples, London, Bristol, Paris - with childhood holidays in very rural Ireland. I love cities.

    And, yet, I feel trapped in London in a way I have never done before. I look out of the window and see buildings. Even though on the top floor I can see across London to the Surrey hills the view is still of buildings. And my soul dies a little. Everywhere I look out of my home up North I see sea and sky and mountains and valleys so sumptuous in their colours it makes my heart fit to burst. And the bird song. Plus the moon at night and stars, lots of them. I really miss it. I cannot wait to get back.

    I never thought I would feel this way. Can people change quite so much? Or maybe I have secretly always been a solitary misanthrope?

    There is something about the natural world which my mind, my soul needs, I think, to feel whole. No other way to explain it.

    Plus - mad as it is - I love driving by myself. Nothing better than to have the music on very loud - and have some really strong music on to get the blood racing. Just f***ing awesome.

    Still in May I shall be speaking at a big conference in London. If you're very good I may tell you about it and you can come and enthusiastically applaud. 😀

    What about the Heath and Regents Park? Doesn't that work for you when you're here in NL?
    The Heath does - for a walk. But it's the sense of enclosure which is what is different. I have horizons there. I have always loved being near the sea. In Naples - which is urban to the nth degree - it was a 5 minute walk down to the sea. If I had to end my life I would go into the sea, not bloody Dignitas.

    And you can stare at the sea for hours. It is never ever boring.
    I've done *alot* of walking around this country. And whilst I know what you mean, scenery becomes a little boring after a while. The great thing about London is the sheer variety, both in views and the people. This can be seen in (say) a seven-mile walk along the Regents Canal from Mile End to Paddington, seven miles along the Thames Path, or seven miles south from Greenwich.

    If you want boring, try walking around Loch Long. Three days just to end up a couple of kilometres from where you began ...
    I agree re London walks. They are interesting. But I never find scenery boring because there is so much to notice - the plants, the trees, the light, the shadows on rocks, the animals etc.

    One of the things I was told by an old gardening hand was to walk round your garden every single day and simply look closely. You'd think that there would be no change from day to day but you'd be wrong. And learning how to really see has been a blessing. And once you start doing it there is so much to observe. Partly because of my asthma I rarely walks for long periods without stopping. But also because I am always seeing all sorts of things up close - even the beauty of a gorse bush - or moss or lichen on a stone- or the pattern of a dry stone wall or ferns growing out the ground or a wall.

    Honestly I could bore you all for hours about it. Don't worry. I won't.



    london walks are great but the air pollution means you benefit a lot more from country walks
    Today I saw this

    The oldest life size statue in the world. His obsidian eyes are truly haunting. 12,000 years old. Those eyes looked at me as if to say, You again







    That looks like some children's art project I saw back in 2019.

    He looks like a terrified footballer protecting his nads before a scary free kick.

    Or a kind of vacantly menacing snow-god
  • HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    I was afraid this would start to happen...

    (((Dan Hodges)))
    @DPJHodges
    ·
    3h
    If the atrocities being reported are verified, and there's evidence they're still being perpetrated, then we need to intervene directly and militarily in Ukraine. Whether a country is part of NATO is irrelevant. We don't stand back and allow the perpetration of genocide.

    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1510583932722548739

    ====

    How long before national newspapers and broadcasters are demanding something is done.

    He seems to have forgotten Rwanda, Syria, much of Bosnia, Cambodia etc where we did very little when genocide was committed.

    If a NATO nation is invaded then yes we have to take military action but in terms of Ukraine we just keep sending supplies, we don't go to WW3
    The problem with the argument about "not going to WW3" is that it sets an arbitrary threshold that hands escalation dominance to Putin. Are you going to let him decide what level of support is acceptable?
    No. The red line remains if he invades a NATO nation
    Only an invasion? And the red line for what specifically?
    NATO military response
    Then you're still in a discussion of what kind of response, by whom, what retaliation risks to avoid, etc.
    There are already NATO troops and jets based in Estonia and Latvia as NATO states bordering Russia.

    So if Putin invaded those states then at that point we would be at war
    What if Putin struck an airfield as a warning against NATO weapons shipments?
    If he struck an airfield and destroyed NATO planes then obviously NATO would respond in kind with airstrikes on a Russian base
    So just tit for tat? Which NATO member would carry out the retaliation?
    Planes from all of them, as NATO is based on collective defence
    You'd send in bombers from every NATO member in response to a single missile strike? What if not every NATO member agrees with that plan? Which Russian targets would you need that many planes for and how would you defend them?
    Unless every NATO state agrees and is ready to participate in NATO action then NATO is redundant to defend its member states and their armed forces. If Russia bombed NATO jets it should prepare for NATO jets to bomb an airfield with Russian jets.

    Otherwise NATO would then collapse and Russia could invade every individual NATO nation in turn. China would also take note of the inability and unwillingness of western nations to defend themselves when looking at Taiwan and the broader Far East
    If you read NATO Article 5, that's not what collective defence is based on.
    It is based on an attack on one NATO ally being an attack on all of them.

    So if Russia can bomb NATO jets without response from the collective NATO nations then Putin could invade Estonia and Latvia etc without fear of collective NATO response either. The Baltic states on their own are far easier pickings than Ukraine, much smaller with far less strong militaries
    Invasion of Estonia and Latvia is WW111
  • FYI - It dawned on me last night that we're coming up to exactly a decade since I did my first ever PB thread.

    I might review my greatest hits next month.
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,456

    Looking at the latest appalling images from Ukraine and the verified equipment losses if arms shipments from the West are upped so that Russian air cover is reduced further and the Ukrainians can move men and equipment around reasonably freely then Russia could be heading for cataclysmic battlefield defeat.

    Not if Germany has its way.....
    This from Illia Ponomarenko, The Kyiv Independent:

    "I am now facing an interview no sane human being would easily wish to have.
    And I am horrified by the fact I will have to write it down. Word by word."


    Can't imagine who he is interviewing, but I can imagine about what. Some of these journalists are going to need serious counseling once this is over.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,205

    FYI - It dawned on me last night that we're coming up to exactly a decade since I did my first ever PB thread.

    I might review my greatest hits next month.

    You do know that Vanilla has a minimum post size limit? ;)
  • I tempted to apply...

    BBC bosses have readvertised the job of political editor after being unhappy with the choice of candidates to replace Laura Kuenssberg in one of the most influential roles in British journalism.

    Following weeks of interviews and an extensive recruitment process, the corporation had produced an all-female shortlist for the role, with ITV News’s Anushka Asthana and Sky News’s Sophy Ridge believed to be the final two candidates. An announcement on which of them would get the job had been expected to coincide with Kuenssberg stepping down last week.

    Instead, the BBC political correspondent Chris Mason is now the favourite to land the role after bosses quietly began inviting fresh applications for the job. The recruitment page for the role of political editor has been reopened until Tuesday, although there has been no acknowledgement of this from senior staff or formal announcement from the BBC encouraging fresh applications.

    Mason is widely liked across the BBC but one media industry executive pointed out the BBC could be about to reject “an all-female shortlist of brilliant women” in favour of a man.

    Reopening applications will allow Mason to send in his CV – but will also make it possible for anyone else to apply and is a public sign that executives are not content with the existing range of candidates. In recent days, there had been speculation that BBC executives were unhappy with the process and were seeking other candidates for the role.


    https://www.theguardian.com/media/2022/apr/03/chris-mason-favourite-to-be-bbc-political-editor-as-job-readvertised
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