Regarding peacekeeping in Ukraine Macron has achieved nothing so far. The rising commodities prices hitting French consumers will take its tall on his re-election odds
What peace is there to keep in Ukraine, exactly?
Preventing war was a lost cause, but going to Moscow to have a go at that was a sensible thing to try.
so what exactly Macron has achieved there?
UPDATE 3-SocGen warns it could be stripped of Russian business
* French bank has $20 billion of Russia exposure. This is a clear political liability for him
Trying for peace at no cost to Ukraine, France, Europe, Humanity or himself. Just the price of plane tickets....
Every country in Europe has lost money as result of the sanctions. At the moment, such losses are seen as a sign of virtue.....
It’s terrible to reduce what they’re doing and the horrible reason why they’re doing it to admiring their hotness. But, y’know, phwoarrrr. I’m pretty liberal and, though I dislike the term, Woke, I guess. But my word they’re attractive young women.
Regarding peacekeeping in Ukraine Macron has achieved nothing so far. The rising commodities prices hitting French consumers will take its tall on his re-election odds
He has tried. Which is hugely important. He is displaying exactly the qualities we used to admire so much in British diplomacy - walk quietly and carry a big stick. If he fails it is through no fault of his own.
I reckon he deserves to win again if only as compensation for the hours he has had to spend on the phone being harangued by the lunatic in the Kremlin.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
And this is the real challenge for Russia. Can they garrison the cities of the East and still sufficient troops to advance towards Lviv. I'm sceptical.
I'm sure his generals have told Putin it is all perfectly possible.
The new series of "Wacky Races - Russia" looking interesting.
They will need to combine it with Stop the Pigeon. Even Professor Pat Pending's machines will get stuck in the mud or run out of fuel, and I fear the Ant Hill Mob will only churn the mud further with their little feet.
Regarding peacekeeping in Ukraine Macron has achieved nothing so far. The rising commodities prices hitting French consumers will take its tall on his re-election odds
He has tried. Which is hugely important. He is displaying exactly the qualities we used to admire so much in British diplomacy - walk quietly and carry a big stick. If he fails it is through no fault of his own.
I reckon he deserves to win again if only as compensation for the hours he has had to spend on the phone being harangued by the lunatic in the Kremlin.
Having the job of being last to try and talk the dictator down from The Really Big Mistake is always a sad business.
I remember when Gorbachev had a go with Saddam Hussein - who insulted him IIRC.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
Patel has just said in the HOC that people smugglers in Calais are involved in attempting to use this crisis for their own interests
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Regarding peacekeeping in Ukraine Macron has achieved nothing so far. The rising commodities prices hitting French consumers will take its tall on his re-election odds
He has tried. Which is hugely important. He is displaying exactly the qualities we used to admire so much in British diplomacy - walk quietly and carry a big stick. If he fails it is through no fault of his own.
I reckon he deserves to win again if only as compensation for the hours he has had to spend on the phone being harangued by the lunatic in the Kremlin.
wow. 'at least he has tried'. I appreciate his genuine efforts, I really do. but unfortunately it is a classic ''loser's defence''.
I agree with Leon. The German re-armament program represents a more significant challenge to the French world view than it does the British. To the French, a sense of equals is required, whereas the British merely want to prevent hegemony on the European continent, and we are a long way from that. You can call that simplistic, but sometimes, things are simple.
What do you mean with "the British merely want to prevent hegemony on the European continent"?
I'm British so I'm keen to see if I relate to it.
I don't think individual Britons really have this as an intended outcome. It's too abstract. But British foreign policy going back at least to Napoleon has been to try to prevent any one continental power in Europe becoming too powerful - typically by alliances with or support for the continent's second most powerful power. In the early twentieth century the entente cordiale was arguably more driven by the fact that Britain and France represented similar political cultures, in contrast to that of Germany and Austria-Hungary. Though we did end up with Russia on our side too.
Ok, well I second that then. I certainly wouldn't want to see any one nation dominating Europe. Gosh no. As I was saying to Leon on PT - just as everyone decamped to here - for me a core feature of the EU is to keep aggressive nationalism on the continent in its box. And with this Russian variety of it now unchained and likely to mean Europe (with Germany leading the way) ramping up its military capability we'd better hope it all holds together rather than fractures. No more 'exits' please. Let's have new entrants instead.
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin coming here and putting Gainsborough under "under extreme pressure in terms of housing and jobs", I will keep calling it for what it is.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
Regarding peacekeeping in Ukraine Macron has achieved nothing so far. The rising commodities prices hitting French consumers will take its tall on his re-election odds
He has tried. Which is hugely important. He is displaying exactly the qualities we used to admire so much in British diplomacy - walk quietly and carry a big stick. If he fails it is through no fault of his own.
I reckon he deserves to win again if only as compensation for the hours he has had to spend on the phone being harangued by the lunatic in the Kremlin.
wow. 'at least he has tried'. I appreciate his genuine efforts, I really do. but unfortunately it is a classic 'loser's defence'.
There was a 1/10,000 chance that a wiff of Creme Brûlée would have Putin on his knees begging to be considered cultured....
Worth a try.
It's like the bit in the bad movie where the negotiator tries to talk the obvious madman down. You know that it won't work but it has to happen.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
Patel has just said in the HOC that people smugglers in Calais are involved in attempting to use this crisis for their own interests
She has, and its pathetic. Every other country in Europe except us. Its indecent.
Regarding peacekeeping in Ukraine Macron has achieved nothing so far. The rising commodities prices hitting French consumers will take its tall on his re-election odds
He has tried. Which is hugely important. He is displaying exactly the qualities we used to admire so much in British diplomacy - walk quietly and carry a big stick. If he fails it is through no fault of his own.
I reckon he deserves to win again if only as compensation for the hours he has had to spend on the phone being harangued by the lunatic in the Kremlin.
wow. 'at least he has tried'. I appreciate his genuine efforts, I really do. but unfortunately it is a classic ''loser's defence''.
He might not have stopped the war, but he might have had other lesser achievements - we just don't know. Even if he hasn't achieved something, we need someone talking to him. Well done to Macron for at least trying.
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
"Everybody wants to be humanitarian, and the Home Secretary is under pressure to have a visa-free scheme like the rest of Europe, but may I congratulate her on her proportionate response? We have to remember that, unlike the rest of Europe, we have uniquely liberal labour laws and we speak English, so we are the country of choice for mass immigration. I therefore urge her to listen to not only all the humanitarian voices but the voices of people in, for instance, Lincolnshire, where we feel we have really done our bit in terms of migration from eastern Europe. We are under extreme pressure in terms of housing and jobs. [Interruption.] I know that this is difficult to say, but we have to be honest about it. May I therefore be a correcting voice, and congratulate her on her humanitarian but proportionate response, and on not throwing away the immigration rulebook?"
Regarding peacekeeping in Ukraine Macron has achieved nothing so far. The rising commodities prices hitting French consumers will take its tall on his re-election odds
He has tried. Which is hugely important. He is displaying exactly the qualities we used to admire so much in British diplomacy - walk quietly and carry a big stick. If he fails it is through no fault of his own.
I reckon he deserves to win again if only as compensation for the hours he has had to spend on the phone being harangued by the lunatic in the Kremlin.
Walk quietly? Did that fail when Maggie became PM and high-heels* became footwear of choice?
(typo for 'talk', presumably?) *did she wear high heels? I was under 10 when she left office and don't remember from the clips I've seen
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
It’s terrible to reduce what they’re doing and the horrible reason why they’re doing it to admiring their hotness. But, y’know, phwoarrrr. I’m pretty liberal and, though I dislike the term, Woke, I guess. But my word they’re attractive young women.
I consider myself much the same as you, fairly liberal bloke. I went to Israel and, not to be coarse, I think the women in uniform genuinely awoke something in me...
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
I'm interested to know what is "embarrassing" about criticising Edward Leigh's crass intervention in the Commons. I provide a link for anyone who so wishes to recap his spectacularly selfish position. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lincolnshire-60586403.amp
Regarding peacekeeping in Ukraine Macron has achieved nothing so far. The rising commodities prices hitting French consumers will take its tall on his re-election odds
What peace is there to keep in Ukraine, exactly?
Preventing war was a lost cause, but going to Moscow to have a go at that was a sensible thing to try.
so what exactly Macron has achieved there?
UPDATE 3-SocGen warns it could be stripped of Russian business
* French bank has $20 billion of Russia exposure. This is a clear political liability for him
And yet Macron's polling has gone up since the start of the Ukraine crisis. In mid-February, he was on 24-25% in the polls, and now he's 29-30%.
So, when you say "political liability", do you mean "great thing for his polling"?
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
He's completely flipped his lid - his continual reference to immigrants as "forrin" is an obvious sign that he really doesn't have anything worth listening to on this subject.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Yes. It really is a heady brew of heartlessness and incompetence
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
Patel has just said in the HOC that people smugglers in Calais are involved in attempting to use this crisis for their own interests
She has, and its pathetic. Every other country in Europe except us. Its indecent.
You would do well to listen to the debate in the HOC
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
I'm interested to know what is "embarrassing" about criticising Edward Leigh's crass intervention in the Commons. I provide a link for anyone who so wishes to recap his spectacularly selfish position. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lincolnshire-60586403.amp
Referring to immigrants as "forrin" is embarrassing.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
I don't think that's right. Lincolnshire has already had a huge number of immigrants over the last 20 years.
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
"Everybody wants to be humanitarian, and the Home Secretary is under pressure to have a visa-free scheme like the rest of Europe, but may I congratulate her on her proportionate response? We have to remember that, unlike the rest of Europe, we have uniquely liberal labour laws and we speak English, so we are the country of choice for mass immigration. I therefore urge her to listen to not only all the humanitarian voices but the voices of people in, for instance, Lincolnshire, where we feel we have really done our bit in terms of migration from eastern Europe. We are under extreme pressure in terms of housing and jobs. [Interruption.] I know that this is difficult to say, but we have to be honest about it. May I therefore be a correcting voice, and congratulate her on her humanitarian but proportionate response, and on not throwing away the immigration rulebook?"
Boris signalling a review of UK energy supply and in particular the granting of licences for UK own oil and gas development
Cambo ?
In policy terms, the tories seem much keener to claw back Reform's 4% than they do Labour's 40%.
Economic reality
The hit that household finances are going to take from inflation, taxation and energy costs over the next year is being very underestimated as a political issue, in my view.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
A sane balance is needed. We are not Tommy Robinsons, nor are we prepared to have uncontrolled borders. In recent years over 29% of babies in the UK have been born to mothers born outside the UK. This would be impossible in a country which was so profoundly hostile and off putting to migration that it put people off migrating to the UK.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
Yes, almost everyone wants good and/or deserving immigrants and not bad and/or undeserving immigrants. We only differ where we draw the line. And I don't think, in reality, most of us differ all that much.
The problematic ones of course are the bad AND deserving immigrants.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
A sane balance is needed. We are not Tommy Robinsons, nor are we prepared to have uncontrolled borders. In recent years over 29% of babies in the UK have been born to mothers born outside the UK. This would be impossible in a country which was so profoundly hostile and off putting to migration that it put people off coming here.
Be careful with talk like that or people will call you racist.
It’s terrible to reduce what they’re doing and the horrible reason why they’re doing it to admiring their hotness. But, y’know, phwoarrrr. I’m pretty liberal and, though I dislike the term, Woke, I guess. But my word they’re attractive young women.
I consider myself much the same as you, fairly liberal bloke. I went to Israel and, not to be coarse, I think the women in uniform genuinely awoke something in me...
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
We're not - but the Tories think we are - a populist government remember. Its absolutely the case that a load of red wallers and eastern Englanders voted leave because they wanted less foreign workers. So we can't ignore it, even when they live in massively white areas where there are no foreign workers.
Pandering to that kind of dog whistle racism has worked before, so they're trying to keep it working. And it IS racism - Leigh even names the type of people he doesn't want letting in. That they have already had to soften their "come pick fruit" offer repeatedly does suggest that they can sense the mood has shifted.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
Patel has just said in the HOC that people smugglers in Calais are involved in attempting to use this crisis for their own interests
I'm sure they are - the question I would immediately be asking is How are they doing that - because it simply doesn't work.
You can go back to my original post to see the flaw in her / the home office "Argument"
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Well, that's the problem. The Home Office is so stuck in the mindset that vast numbers of people want to cheat to come here that they can't show any flexibility. Patel is clearly part of the problem not part of the solution, but she's only part of the problem.
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
"Everybody wants to be humanitarian, and the Home Secretary is under pressure to have a visa-free scheme like the rest of Europe, but may I congratulate her on her proportionate response? We have to remember that, unlike the rest of Europe, we have uniquely liberal labour laws and we speak English, so we are the country of choice for mass immigration. I therefore urge her to listen to not only all the humanitarian voices but the voices of people in, for instance, Lincolnshire, where we feel we have really done our bit in terms of migration from eastern Europe. We are under extreme pressure in terms of housing and jobs. [Interruption.] I know that this is difficult to say, but we have to be honest about it. May I therefore be a correcting voice, and congratulate her on her humanitarian but proportionate response, and on not throwing away the immigration rulebook?"
When the local MP is explicit as to which types of migrant they don't want, its hard to then defend it and claim they really aren't being racist.
That seems to me to be about pressure on housing and jobs. Surely a reasonable concern for an mp to raise on behalf of constituents?
If it's open season for innuendo, what's the percentage of forrin types where you moved to vs where you moved from?
Leigh is talking garbage. Gainsborough is hardly a hotbed of immigration and overcrowding. Nor is there massive pressure on housing and services in the area. It is not even part of the main East of England farming region so he is not awash with seasonal labourers. This is just pure xenophobia.
The 100-billion-euro package for the Bundeswehr is intended to make the German armed forces the most powerful in Europe, says Minister Christian Lindner
It's not enough for that, even if they sort out their bureaucrats.
It is about 2.5% of GDP, which covers approx 4-5 years of shortfall - whilst the shortfall has been happening since the millenium at least.
All it will cover is pothole filling and sticky plasters, plus a little more. The big stuff will come from the 2% commitment, which is about an extra 40% on the previous Defence Budget,
It includes 20bn Euro to make sure they have enough ammunition stocks.
They still have minor problems to deal with such as any item over £25m requiring a Parliamentary vote.
Interesting, thanks.
...the German-French development of a new air-defense system, a new generation of battle tanks and the Eurodrone;
a new artillery and munitions system in cooperation with Britain;...
...top of the priority list is a successor to the ancient Tornado fighters. In his speech on Sunday, Scholz indicated that the current strategy calls for a hybrid solution, essentially taking elements of the modernized Eurofighter and from the new American super-fighter F-35 from Lockheed Martin. This project alone is estimated to cost around 15 billion euros....
What the heck is the last item - why don't they just buy the F35 ? Cobbling together a new aircraft will take years, might not produce anything useful, and is likely to cost as much if not more. A decent order ought to see them get a good slice of the production in Germany.
Boris signalling a review of UK energy supply and in particular the granting of licences for UK own oil and gas development
Cambo ?
In policy terms, the tories seem much keener to claw back Reform's 4% than they do Labour's 40%.
Economic reality
The hit that household finances are going to take from inflation, taxation and energy costs over the next year is being very underestimated as a political issue, in my view.
On this I think you are right. The conventional view is inflation is transient. It doesn’t seem to be. Energy costs are going to feed into it and there is little chance of energy costs falling anytime soon.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
It's got so much worse since he moved to Scotland. I left the UK in 2008 and my happiest years have beenm here in Spain but the one thing I'm clear about is that at all levels from the top of government down to 'el hombre en el autobus de Antas' we're all much of a muchness. Most locals here get on well with most immigrants but Utopia it is not... thank God!
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
The issue we have with most immigrants is that they intentionally destroy any paperwork they have.
Here it should be incredibly simple, show a Ukrainian Passport and all the confirmation needed is contained within it.
Patel and others really are showing exactly what they are made of - racist, xenophobic idiots...
The Home Office is stuck in a mould where lots of people want to cheat to get into the UK. They don't have the intellectual flexibility to change to a different mode of thinking. It's not exactly xenophobic and definitely not racist.
While that's true, Ms Patel could suspend the requirement for Ukrainians to have a visa to enter the UK with immediate effect.
She has chosen not to.
(FWIW, she will - I'm sure - change tack on this because it is politically unpopular. However we should have been on the front foot with this.)
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
"Everybody wants to be humanitarian, and the Home Secretary is under pressure to have a visa-free scheme like the rest of Europe, but may I congratulate her on her proportionate response? We have to remember that, unlike the rest of Europe, we have uniquely liberal labour laws and we speak English, so we are the country of choice for mass immigration. I therefore urge her to listen to not only all the humanitarian voices but the voices of people in, for instance, Lincolnshire, where we feel we have really done our bit in terms of migration from eastern Europe. We are under extreme pressure in terms of housing and jobs. [Interruption.] I know that this is difficult to say, but we have to be honest about it. May I therefore be a correcting voice, and congratulate her on her humanitarian but proportionate response, and on not throwing away the immigration rulebook?"
When the local MP is explicit as to which types of migrant they don't want, its hard to then defend it and claim they really aren't being racist.
That seems to me to be about pressure on housing and jobs. Surely a reasonable concern for an mp to raise on behalf of constituents?
If it's open season for innuendo, what's the percentage of forrin types where you moved to vs where you moved from?
Leigh is talking garbage. Gainsborough is hardly a hotbed of immigration and overcrowding. Nor is there massive pressure on housing and services in the area. It is not even part of the main East of England farming region so he is not awash with seasonal labourers. This is just pure xenophobia.
There are already 1.7m Ukrainian refugees - and that's likely to double if the war goes on. How many refugees have we actually admitted ?
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
I don't think that's right. Lincolnshire has already had a huge number of immigrants over the last 20 years.
Not where Leigh is representing. And Lincolnshire has no history of unrest or conflict with the migrants. There are no housing pressures here - houses are amongst the cheapest in the country and schools are certainly not overrun with foreign kids. Leigh is talking bullshit.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
I am really disappointed in @RochdalePioneers recent rants which do not relate to the discussions in the HOC and the contributions by conservative mps
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
"Everybody wants to be humanitarian, and the Home Secretary is under pressure to have a visa-free scheme like the rest of Europe, but may I congratulate her on her proportionate response? We have to remember that, unlike the rest of Europe, we have uniquely liberal labour laws and we speak English, so we are the country of choice for mass immigration. I therefore urge her to listen to not only all the humanitarian voices but the voices of people in, for instance, Lincolnshire, where we feel we have really done our bit in terms of migration from eastern Europe. We are under extreme pressure in terms of housing and jobs. [Interruption.] I know that this is difficult to say, but we have to be honest about it. May I therefore be a correcting voice, and congratulate her on her humanitarian but proportionate response, and on not throwing away the immigration rulebook?"
When the local MP is explicit as to which types of migrant they don't want, its hard to then defend it and claim they really aren't being racist.
That seems to me to be about pressure on housing and jobs. Surely a reasonable concern for an mp to raise on behalf of constituents?
If it's open season for innuendo, what's the percentage of forrin types where you moved to vs where you moved from?
Leigh is talking garbage. Gainsborough is hardly a hotbed of immigration and overcrowding. Nor is there massive pressure on housing and services in the area. It is not even part of the main East of England farming region so he is not awash with seasonal labourers. This is just pure xenophobia.
There are already 1.7m Ukrainian refugees - and that's likely to double if the war goes on. How many refugees have we actually admitted ?
Bugger all. We could take tens or hundreds of thousands. And we should.
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
"Everybody wants to be humanitarian, and the Home Secretary is under pressure to have a visa-free scheme like the rest of Europe, but may I congratulate her on her proportionate response? We have to remember that, unlike the rest of Europe, we have uniquely liberal labour laws and we speak English, so we are the country of choice for mass immigration. I therefore urge her to listen to not only all the humanitarian voices but the voices of people in, for instance, Lincolnshire, where we feel we have really done our bit in terms of migration from eastern Europe. We are under extreme pressure in terms of housing and jobs. [Interruption.] I know that this is difficult to say, but we have to be honest about it. May I therefore be a correcting voice, and congratulate her on her humanitarian but proportionate response, and on not throwing away the immigration rulebook?"
When the local MP is explicit as to which types of migrant they don't want, its hard to then defend it and claim they really aren't being racist.
That seems to me to be about pressure on housing and jobs. Surely a reasonable concern for an mp to raise on behalf of constituents?
If it's open season for innuendo, what's the percentage of forrin types where you moved to vs where you moved from?
Is it pressure on housing and jobs? Or just "no Eastern Europeans". He even names them.
I moved from NE England to NE Scotland. Thornaby was a Catholic town with a small asian minority which infamously had anti-muslim abuse sprayed onto the Gurdwara. To its SE is Ingleby Barwick, historically part of the town when it was fields, now dubbed Europe's largest village. Very very white, but so many doorstep conversations complaining about too many immigrants.
Up here north of the wall? We have quite a lot of eastern Europeans - there are Russian and Latvian and Hungarian kids in local schools and you hear Russian spoken a lot in Fraserburgh and they sell a lot of polish food from polish stores there too.
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
"Everybody wants to be humanitarian, and the Home Secretary is under pressure to have a visa-free scheme like the rest of Europe, but may I congratulate her on her proportionate response? We have to remember that, unlike the rest of Europe, we have uniquely liberal labour laws and we speak English, so we are the country of choice for mass immigration. I therefore urge her to listen to not only all the humanitarian voices but the voices of people in, for instance, Lincolnshire, where we feel we have really done our bit in terms of migration from eastern Europe. We are under extreme pressure in terms of housing and jobs. [Interruption.] I know that this is difficult to say, but we have to be honest about it. May I therefore be a correcting voice, and congratulate her on her humanitarian but proportionate response, and on not throwing away the immigration rulebook?"
When the local MP is explicit as to which types of migrant they don't want, its hard to then defend it and claim they really aren't being racist.
That seems to me to be about pressure on housing and jobs. Surely a reasonable concern for an mp to raise on behalf of constituents?
If it's open season for innuendo, what's the percentage of forrin types where you moved to vs where you moved from?
Leigh is talking garbage. Gainsborough is hardly a hotbed of immigration and overcrowding. Nor is there massive pressure on housing and services in the area. It is not even part of the main East of England farming region so he is not awash with seasonal labourers. This is just pure xenophobia.
There are already 1.7m Ukrainian refugees - and that's likely to double if the war goes on. How many refugees have we actually admitted ?
50 - although Pritti is currently trying to find reasons to justify blocking people with Ukrainian passports catching a ferry from Calais.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
The issue we have with most immigrants is that they intentionally destroy any paperwork they have.
Here it should be incredibly simple, show a Ukrainian Passport and all the confirmation needed is contained within it.
Patel and others really are showing exactly what they are made of - racist, xenophobic idiots...
The Home Office is stuck in a mould where lots of people want to cheat to get into the UK. They don't have the intellectual flexibility to change to a different mode of thinking. It's not exactly xenophobic and definitely not racist.
While that's true, Ms Patel could suspend the requirement for Ukrainians to have a visa to enter the UK with immediate effect.
She has chosen not to.
(FWIW, she will - I'm sure - change tack on this because it is politically unpopular. However we should have been on the front foot with this.)
At which point the media and Eurozealots will start whinging about the edge cases...
It's pretty obvious to me that those getting to the border are overwhelmingly women/children/the injured, and we should be doing everything possible to take the pressure off our allies in eastern Europe.
The demographic is in total contrast to those that normally linger in Calais and are highly likely to return to reunite with, or mourn, the men who have stayed to fight.
Pledge to rebuild Ukraine. Pick up refugees as close to the border as possible. Don't play the game of the human traffickers who must be absolutely delighted at this state of affairs, particularly as Poland etc get overwhelmed.
Boris signalling a review of UK energy supply and in particular the granting of licences for UK own oil and gas development
Cambo ?
In policy terms, the tories seem much keener to claw back Reform's 4% than they do Labour's 40%.
Economic reality
The hit that household finances are going to take from inflation, taxation and energy costs over the next year is being very underestimated as a political issue, in my view.
On this I think you are right. The conventional view is inflation is transient. It doesn’t seem to be. Energy costs are going to feed into it and there is little chance of energy costs falling anytime soon.
If the conventional view, formed before this invasion, and based on shaky assumptions in the first place imho, hasn't been radically re-assessed, then I'd be very surprised indeed.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Well, that's the problem. The Home Office is so stuck in the mindset that vast numbers of people want to cheat to come here that they can't show any flexibility. Patel is clearly part of the problem not part of the solution, but she's only part of the problem.
I remember John Reid when he was home secretary (?) arguing (?) that the home office was not fit for purpose (which, I think, was the first time I came across the phrase, which has become widespread since). It does seem to be a uniquely difficult department.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
I don't think that's right. Lincolnshire has already had a huge number of immigrants over the last 20 years.
Correct. And they voted leave so that they would go home again. "No Eastern Europeans" says one MP. Boston the town was endlessly finding voters for voxpops wanting the poles and romanians to leave.
Leigh says "no Eastern Europeans". Racism. He doesn't say "no migration, no more people moving here from London". Its only the poles and romanians and now Ukrainians he doesn't want.
So obviously me satirising open racism is the problem.
The tragedy of Russian history has always been the same. We are some of the kindest, smartest, most creative, most principled and most honourable people who have been ruled for centuries by the most evil, sadistic, corrupt, megalomaniacal dregs of our own society."
It's pretty obvious to me that those getting to the border are overwhelmingly women/children/the injured, and we should be doing everything possible to take the pressure off our allies in eastern Europe.
The demographic is in total contrast to those that normally linger in Calais and are highly likely to return to reunite with, or mourn, the men who have stayed to fight.
Pledge to rebuild Ukraine. Pick up refugees as close to the border as possible. Don't play the game of the human traffickers who must be absolutely delighted at this state of affairs, particularly as Poland etc get overwhelmed.
They are putting on free trains from the border to many places across Europe. We should just say that they are welcome to send some of those trains straight through to Calais and on to London.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
He's completely flipped his lid - his continual reference to immigrants as "forrin" is an obvious sign that he really doesn't have anything worth listening to on this subject.
That isn't the reference at all. "Forrin" is me satirising the shrieking of racists like Sir Edward Leigh, not me referring to foreigners or immigrants. I'm the one saying let the refugees in, not the one saying shut them out.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
Patel has just said in the HOC that people smugglers in Calais are involved in attempting to use this crisis for their own interests
How about by-passing Calais by laying on direct flights to the UK from Poland, Ms Patel?
I agree with Leon. The German re-armament program represents a more significant challenge to the French world view than it does the British. To the French, a sense of equals is required, whereas the British merely want to prevent hegemony on the European continent, and we are a long way from that. You can call that simplistic, but sometimes, things are simple.
What do you mean with "the British merely want to prevent hegemony on the European continent"?
I'm British so I'm keen to see if I relate to it.
I don't think individual Britons really have this as an intended outcome. It's too abstract. But British foreign policy going back at least to Napoleon has been to try to prevent any one continental power in Europe becoming too powerful - typically by alliances with or support for the continent's second most powerful power. In the early twentieth century the entente cordiale was arguably more driven by the fact that Britain and France represented similar political cultures, in contrast to that of Germany and Austria-Hungary. Though we did end up with Russia on our side too.
It's quite startling that @kinabalu is apparently unaware of this extremely well-known history
As I've said before, he's a bright guy with a notably narrow mind, settled contentedly in his views
Unfair. Not so much the "bright" bit but that I have a narrow mind. It's the opposite. Ok, so I'm no history buff, I'm about numbers and probabilities and the meaning of life, but what I'm doing here is questioning the extent to which these old chestnuts (about what drives different nations) really inform what is happening today. Because there's *so* much tosh talked about what various nations are all about, isn't there? I mean, have you heard that Russian bloke, Vladimir Putin? Jeez what a load of tripe.
Regarding peacekeeping in Ukraine Macron has achieved nothing so far. The rising commodities prices hitting French consumers will take its tall on his re-election odds
What peace is there to keep in Ukraine, exactly?
Preventing war was a lost cause, but going to Moscow to have a go at that was a sensible thing to try.
so what exactly Macron has achieved there?
UPDATE 3-SocGen warns it could be stripped of Russian business
* French bank has $20 billion of Russia exposure. This is a clear political liability for him
And yet Macron's polling has gone up since the start of the Ukraine crisis. In mid-February, he was on 24-25% in the polls, and now he's 29-30%.
So, when you say "political liability", do you mean "great thing for his polling"?
The polling is absurd. I expect the polling figures to change dramatically in early April. What exactly has Macron won for France? Ukrainian refuges ? sky-high gas prices? the possibility of a nuclear conflict/incident in Europe?
Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean it's not true.
Also - don't you perhaps think that Vladimir Putin is responsible for the Ukrainian refugees, rather than Emmanuel Macron?
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
I don't think that's right. Lincolnshire has already had a huge number of immigrants over the last 20 years.
Correct. And they voted leave so that they would go home again. "No Eastern Europeans" says one MP. Boston the town was endlessly finding voters for voxpops wanting the poles and romanians to leave.
Leigh says "no Eastern Europeans". Racism. He doesn't say "no migration, no more people moving here from London". Its only the poles and romanians and now Ukrainians he doesn't want.
So obviously me satirising open racism is the problem.
There are 6000 Portuguese settled in and around Boston. Are you sure it wasn't them saying Poles and Romanians go home?
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
I am really disappointed in @RochdalePioneers recent rants which do not relate to the discussions in the HOC and the contributions by conservative mps
I was directly quoting from a contribution by a Conservative MP. Then posted verbatim his entire contribution and a link.
How is posting Sir Edward Leigh's entire diatribe me "ranting" in a way which does not relate to contributions by Conservative MPs like Sir Edward Leigh?
Its very very simple. Every country in Europe has opened its doors to Ukrainian refugees. All of them. Except one. Personally I am disgusted by this. Others are not. Me posting verbatim comments by Tory MPs demonstrating why we stand alone in closing our door to refugees is not me performing "recent rants".
The 100-billion-euro package for the Bundeswehr is intended to make the German armed forces the most powerful in Europe, says Minister Christian Lindner
It's not enough for that, even if they sort out their bureaucrats.
It is about 2.5% of GDP, which covers approx 4-5 years of shortfall - whilst the shortfall has been happening since the millenium at least.
All it will cover is pothole filling and sticky plasters, plus a little more. The big stuff will come from the 2% commitment, which is about an extra 40% on the previous Defence Budget,
It includes 20bn Euro to make sure they have enough ammunition stocks.
They still have minor problems to deal with such as any item over £25m requiring a Parliamentary vote.
Interesting, thanks.
...the German-French development of a new air-defense system, a new generation of battle tanks and the Eurodrone;
a new artillery and munitions system in cooperation with Britain;...
...top of the priority list is a successor to the ancient Tornado fighters. In his speech on Sunday, Scholz indicated that the current strategy calls for a hybrid solution, essentially taking elements of the modernized Eurofighter and from the new American super-fighter F-35 from Lockheed Martin. This project alone is estimated to cost around 15 billion euros....
What the heck is the last item - why don't they just buy the F35 ? Cobbling together a new aircraft will take years, might not produce anything useful, and is likely to cost as much if not more. A decent order ought to see them get a good slice of the production in Germany.
Look up the history of multi-national aircraft projects, in Europe.
- Germany announces they will have the biggest buy. - Germany get the biggest work share. - Germany cuts the buy and announces that if they lose work share, they will collapse the project.
This is quite Funny, but do we know they where heading to Ukraine to 'help' the Russian army's logistical position?
is it not possible and more likely that this was just a train with vehicles to be scraped, or sold in Belorussia or something?
somebody have videoed a train and we are putting 2 and 2 together and coming up with 17 because its more funny?
There's Z on the vehicles which in theory means military use in Ukr, but could be a joke.
O yes I hadn't spotted the Zs perhaps as you say its somebodies idea of a joke, but also possible its not, and its the whole of the Russian Army that's a joke!
Regarding peacekeeping in Ukraine Macron has achieved nothing so far. The rising commodities prices hitting French consumers will take its tall on his re-election odds
He has tried. Which is hugely important. He is displaying exactly the qualities we used to admire so much in British diplomacy - walk quietly and carry a big stick. If he fails it is through no fault of his own.
I reckon he deserves to win again if only as compensation for the hours he has had to spend on the phone being harangued by the lunatic in the Kremlin.
wow. 'at least he has tried'. I appreciate his genuine efforts, I really do. but unfortunately it is a classic ''loser's defence''.
If you don't try you can never succeed. And we are no worse off at all because he has been trying than if he had not tried at all. I hope he keeps on trying. It hasn't stopped the French committing forces and doing just as much as the rest of the countries to try and help Ukraine militarily so I say good luck to him and thanks.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
The issue we have with most immigrants is that they intentionally destroy any paperwork they have.
Here it should be incredibly simple, show a Ukrainian Passport and all the confirmation needed is contained within it.
Patel and others really are showing exactly what they are made of - racist, xenophobic idiots...
The Home Office is stuck in a mould where lots of people want to cheat to get into the UK. They don't have the intellectual flexibility to change to a different mode of thinking. It's not exactly xenophobic and definitely not racist.
While that's true, Ms Patel could suspend the requirement for Ukrainians to have a visa to enter the UK with immediate effect.
She has chosen not to.
(FWIW, she will - I'm sure - change tack on this because it is politically unpopular. However we should have been on the front foot with this.)
At which point the media and Eurozealots will start whinging about the edge cases...
My point is that there is something that she is empowered to do, that she has chosen not to do.
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
"Everybody wants to be humanitarian, and the Home Secretary is under pressure to have a visa-free scheme like the rest of Europe, but may I congratulate her on her proportionate response? We have to remember that, unlike the rest of Europe, we have uniquely liberal labour laws and we speak English, so we are the country of choice for mass immigration. I therefore urge her to listen to not only all the humanitarian voices but the voices of people in, for instance, Lincolnshire, where we feel we have really done our bit in terms of migration from eastern Europe. We are under extreme pressure in terms of housing and jobs. [Interruption.] I know that this is difficult to say, but we have to be honest about it. May I therefore be a correcting voice, and congratulate her on her humanitarian but proportionate response, and on not throwing away the immigration rulebook?"
When the local MP is explicit as to which types of migrant they don't want, its hard to then defend it and claim they really aren't being racist.
That seems to me to be about pressure on housing and jobs. Surely a reasonable concern for an mp to raise on behalf of constituents?
If it's open season for innuendo, what's the percentage of forrin types where you moved to vs where you moved from?
Leigh is talking garbage. Gainsborough is hardly a hotbed of immigration and overcrowding. Nor is there massive pressure on housing and services in the area. It is not even part of the main East of England farming region so he is not awash with seasonal labourers. This is just pure xenophobia.
There are already 1.7m Ukrainian refugees - and that's likely to double if the war goes on. How many refugees have we actually admitted ?
Bugger all. We could take tens or hundreds of thousands. And we should.
Absolutely. The UK population is around 13% of the combined UK/EU total, I think ? Even if we were to take a mere quarter of our pro rata 'share', that would be 55k out of the current 1.7m refugees.
The UK response on this, unlike its military support, appears pitiful.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
Patel has just said in the HOC that people smugglers in Calais are involved in attempting to use this crisis for their own interests
How about by-passing Calais by laying on direct flights to the UK from Poland, Ms Patel?
I thought the agreed idea was to send such flights to Rwanda.
Now 153 rubles to the dollar, half its value from before this war.
Technically good news for the Moscow Exchange (if taken in isolation), but an awful harbinger of doom in other respects.
So we know why such a big move today? I would have thought a big more on the first day and then gradual slide from there is a more logical reaction?
Perhaps the news of all the helicopters destroyed is more significant in the minds of curacy traders than here?
I think the 153 figure comes from non-Russian markets, Therefore there is some speculation involved in terms of actually getting your rubles, which makes the ruble less attractive to buy. I think this is the predominant factor, although there may be an element of some of the measures announced last week wearing off (inc. the requirement for Russian business to sell foreign currency).
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
The issue we have with most immigrants is that they intentionally destroy any paperwork they have.
Here it should be incredibly simple, show a Ukrainian Passport and all the confirmation needed is contained within it.
Patel and others really are showing exactly what they are made of - racist, xenophobic idiots...
The Home Office is stuck in a mould where lots of people want to cheat to get into the UK. They don't have the intellectual flexibility to change to a different mode of thinking. It's not exactly xenophobic and definitely not racist.
While that's true, Ms Patel could suspend the requirement for Ukrainians to have a visa to enter the UK with immediate effect.
She has chosen not to.
(FWIW, she will - I'm sure - change tack on this because it is politically unpopular. However we should have been on the front foot with this.)
At which point the media and Eurozealots will start whinging about the edge cases...
My point is that there is something that she is empowered to do, that she has chosen not to do.
Indeed. But my point is that she has no incentive to do it.
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
I'm interested to know what is "embarrassing" about criticising Edward Leigh's crass intervention in the Commons. I provide a link for anyone who so wishes to recap his spectacularly selfish position. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lincolnshire-60586403.amp
Referring to immigrants as "forrin" is embarrassing.
Without wishing to put words in his mouth, I think he is mocking Edward Leigh. Which seems reasonable.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
I don't think that's right. Lincolnshire has already had a huge number of immigrants over the last 20 years.
Correct. And they voted leave so that they would go home again. "No Eastern Europeans" says one MP. Boston the town was endlessly finding voters for voxpops wanting the poles and romanians to leave.
Leigh says "no Eastern Europeans". Racism. He doesn't say "no migration, no more people moving here from London". Its only the poles and romanians and now Ukrainians he doesn't want.
So obviously me satirising open racism is the problem.
There are 6000 Portuguese settled in and around Boston. Are you sure it wasn't them saying Poles and Romanians go home?
Perhaps! Its a known reality that many previous generation migrants then don't want future generations to crowd the place!
Now 153 rubles to the dollar, half its value from before this war.
Technically good news for the Moscow Exchange (if taken in isolation), but an awful harbinger of doom in other respects.
So we know why such a big move today? I would have thought a big more on the first day and then gradual slide from there is a more logical reaction?
Perhaps the news of all the helicopters destroyed is more significant in the minds of curacy traders than here?
I think that the Russian Central Bank were active in the market trying to reduce losses the first few days, but it looks like they are running out of either ability or desire to continue to intervene.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
The issue we have with most immigrants is that they intentionally destroy any paperwork they have.
Here it should be incredibly simple, show a Ukrainian Passport and all the confirmation needed is contained within it.
Patel and others really are showing exactly what they are made of - racist, xenophobic idiots...
The Home Office is stuck in a mould where lots of people want to cheat to get into the UK. They don't have the intellectual flexibility to change to a different mode of thinking. It's not exactly xenophobic and definitely not racist.
While that's true, Ms Patel could suspend the requirement for Ukrainians to have a visa to enter the UK with immediate effect.
She has chosen not to.
(FWIW, she will - I'm sure - change tack on this because it is politically unpopular. However we should have been on the front foot with this.)
At which point the media and Eurozealots will start whinging about the edge cases...
My point is that there is something that she is empowered to do, that she has chosen not to do.
Indeed. But my point is that she has no incentive to do it.
The point is that the Tory party wouldn't look like the bunch of racist xenophobic bureaucratic utterly incompetent hypocrites.
As can be amply demonstrated by this poster at Calais
Andy Lines @andylines The shocking poster that greets Ukraine refugees arriving here in Calais. Appears to be absolutely no official British help on the ground for these traumatised people. The wonderful volunteers of @Care4Calais are doing their best to help.
When we still have cretins like Sir Edward Leigh in the commons saying that his constituents are sick of the forrin
I stopped reading there. Grow up and stop embarrassing yourself.
I'm interested to know what is "embarrassing" about criticising Edward Leigh's crass intervention in the Commons. I provide a link for anyone who so wishes to recap his spectacularly selfish position. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lincolnshire-60586403.amp
Referring to immigrants as "forrin" is embarrassing.
Without wishing to put words in his mouth, I think he is mocking Edward Leigh. Which seems reasonable.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
I am really disappointed in @RochdalePioneers recent rants which do not relate to the discussions in the HOC and the contributions by conservative mps
I was directly quoting from a contribution by a Conservative MP. Then posted verbatim his entire contribution and a link.
How is posting Sir Edward Leigh's entire diatribe me "ranting" in a way which does not relate to contributions by Conservative MPs like Sir Edward Leigh?
Its very very simple. Every country in Europe has opened its doors to Ukrainian refugees. All of them. Except one. Personally I am disgusted by this. Others are not. Me posting verbatim comments by Tory MPs demonstrating why we stand alone in closing our door to refugees is not me performing "recent rants".
You are demonising conservatives by highlighting one disgusting mp who does nor represent HMG
You may as well attack labour who have pro Putin mps on their benches
The polling is absurd. I expect the polling figures to change dramatically in early April. What exactly has Macron won for France? Ukrainian refuges ? sky-high gas prices? the possibility of a nuclear conflict/incident in Europe?
Standing up for French values and the defence of Ukraine. You may not understand but most French people will.
The Ukrainian family was so happy to have visas and an exchanged ferry ticket and be on way to UK this afternoon. But they're now being held by immigration officials at Calais and they don't know why. They are distraught. I don't know what to say to them. @ukhomeoffice?
They're being "detained" by border force for "further inquiries". They've been given an IS.81 form and told they're "liable to be detained under Paragraph 16(1) of Schedule 2 of the Immigration Act 1971". Passports and travel documents have been taken. This is just inhumane.
I, like many others, have been dismayed at some of the reports about how the UK is managing Ukrainian refugees. If Priti Patel really has screwed this up in the way it has been reported then she needs to be removed ASAP. Emergencies like this soon sort the wheat from the chaff.
Fortunately, it doesn't seem to be affecting the positive way UK is seen in Ukraine itself, where the early efforts to support, supply and train seem to be appreciated. Looks like that investment was well worth it, to say the least.
It isn't if. Its a fact. We are not letting refugees in without an approved visa which they have to complete somewhere else. This is a unique way to handle refugees where HM Border Force turn away people fleeing the war and stop them coming to stay with friends / relatives.
Ah, there you go again, pretending that the situation of people in Ukraine trying to get into Poland is identical to people in France trying to get into the UK.
Every country in Europe, not just Poland.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
No she isn't. She has completely failed to stop immigration. We haven't even got to the point of being able to distinguish between the immigrants we want and the immigrants we don't.
Listen to Sir Edward Leigh. A stack of people don't want *any* immigrants. At all.
That’s true, but they are a tiny minority.
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
I am really disappointed in @RochdalePioneers recent rants which do not relate to the discussions in the HOC and the contributions by conservative mps
I was directly quoting from a contribution by a Conservative MP. Then posted verbatim his entire contribution and a link.
How is posting Sir Edward Leigh's entire diatribe me "ranting" in a way which does not relate to contributions by Conservative MPs like Sir Edward Leigh?
Its very very simple. Every country in Europe has opened its doors to Ukrainian refugees. All of them. Except one. Personally I am disgusted by this. Others are not. Me posting verbatim comments by Tory MPs demonstrating why we stand alone in closing our door to refugees is not me performing "recent rants".
You are demonising conservatives by highlighting one disgusting mp who does nor represent HMG
You may as well attack labour who have pro Putin mps on their benches
Comments
Every country in Europe has lost money as result of the sanctions. At the moment, such losses are seen as a sign of virtue.....
I reckon he deserves to win again if only as compensation for the hours he has had to spend on the phone being harangued by the lunatic in the Kremlin.
If you think the forrin should be kept away that's fine - Patel is doing this for you. Some of us have humanity still.
The Ukrs are fecking heroes. No doubt about it.
I remember when Gorbachev had a go with Saddam Hussein - who insulted him IIRC.
In war, both sides will commit war crimes. But the Russians will come off the worst, simply because they took all the phones off their troops...
Ignorant. Stupid. Heartless. Indecent.
Worth a try.
It's like the bit in the bad movie where the negotiator tries to talk the obvious madman down. You know that it won't work but it has to happen.
https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/2022-03-01/debates/2BD3EE0E-5EF0-42E0-B9BE-3AA0D03BEF86/details#contribution-6EE01800-AD23-447E-B110-57502C5FA725
When the local MP is explicit as to which types of migrant they don't want, its hard to then defend it and claim they really aren't being racist.
https://twitter.com/patrickkmaguire/status/1500860351767851016
(typo for 'talk', presumably?)
*did she wear high heels? I was under 10 when she left office and don't remember from the clips I've seen
They way you go on about this, and normally you’re pretty level headed, is as if we’re an island of Tommy Robinson’s which we clearly are not.
So, when you say "political liability", do you mean "great thing for his polling"?
Sadly not for much longer...
It really is a heady brew of heartlessness and incompetence
If it's open season for innuendo, what's the percentage of forrin types where you moved to vs where you moved from?
The problematic ones of course are the bad AND deserving immigrants.
Pandering to that kind of dog whistle racism has worked before, so they're trying to keep it working. And it IS racism - Leigh even names the type of people he doesn't want letting in. That they have already had to soften their "come pick fruit" offer repeatedly does suggest that they can sense the mood has shifted.
You can go back to my original post to see the flaw in her / the home office "Argument"
Indeed considerable attacks coming from the conservative benches against the House of Lords
...the German-French development of a new air-defense system, a new generation of battle tanks and the Eurodrone;
a new artillery and munitions system in cooperation with Britain;...
...top of the priority list is a successor to the ancient Tornado fighters. In his speech on Sunday, Scholz indicated that the current strategy calls for a hybrid solution, essentially taking elements of the modernized Eurofighter and from the new American super-fighter F-35 from Lockheed Martin. This project alone is estimated to cost around 15 billion euros....
What the heck is the last item - why don't they just buy the F35 ?
Cobbling together a new aircraft will take years, might not produce anything useful, and is likely to cost as much if not more.
A decent order ought to see them get a good slice of the production in Germany.
She has chosen not to.
(FWIW, she will - I'm sure - change tack on this because it is politically unpopular. However we should have been on the front foot with this.)
How many refugees have we actually admitted ?
is it not possible and more likely that this was just a train with vehicles to be scraped, or sold in Belorussia or something?
somebody have videoed a train and we are putting 2 and 2 together and coming up with 17 because its more funny?
I moved from NE England to NE Scotland. Thornaby was a Catholic town with a small asian minority which infamously had anti-muslim abuse sprayed onto the Gurdwara. To its SE is Ingleby Barwick, historically part of the town when it was fields, now dubbed Europe's largest village. Very very white, but so many doorstep conversations complaining about too many immigrants.
Up here north of the wall? We have quite a lot of eastern Europeans - there are Russian and Latvian and Hungarian kids in local schools and you hear Russian spoken a lot in Fraserburgh and they sell a lot of polish food from polish stores there too.
Whats your point again?
Technically good news for the Moscow Exchange (if taken in isolation), but an awful harbinger of doom in other respects.
The demographic is in total contrast to those that normally linger in Calais and are highly likely to return to reunite with, or mourn, the men who have stayed to fight.
Pledge to rebuild Ukraine. Pick up refugees as close to the border as possible. Don't play the game of the human traffickers who must be absolutely delighted at this state of affairs, particularly as Poland etc get overwhelmed.
Leigh says "no Eastern Europeans". Racism. He doesn't say "no migration, no more people moving here from London". Its only the poles and romanians and now Ukrainians he doesn't want.
So obviously me satirising open racism is the problem.
The tragedy of Russian history has always been the same. We are some of the kindest, smartest, most creative, most principled and most honourable people who have been ruled for centuries by the most evil, sadistic, corrupt, megalomaniacal dregs of our own society."
https://twitter.com/KonstantinKisin/status/1500091796394762243
Also - don't you perhaps think that Vladimir Putin is responsible for the Ukrainian refugees, rather than Emmanuel Macron?
Perhaps the news of all the helicopters destroyed is more significant in the minds of curacy traders than here?
How is posting Sir Edward Leigh's entire diatribe me "ranting" in a way which does not relate to contributions by Conservative MPs like Sir Edward Leigh?
Its very very simple. Every country in Europe has opened its doors to Ukrainian refugees. All of them. Except one. Personally I am disgusted by this. Others are not. Me posting verbatim comments by Tory MPs demonstrating why we stand alone in closing our door to refugees is not me performing "recent rants".
- Germany announces they will have the biggest buy.
- Germany get the biggest work share.
- Germany cuts the buy and announces that if they lose work share, they will collapse the project.
That won't work with an F-35 buy
The UK population is around 13% of the combined UK/EU total, I think ?
Even if we were to take a mere quarter of our pro rata 'share', that would be 55k out of the current 1.7m refugees.
The UK response on this, unlike its military support, appears pitiful.
If you wanted a sabotage team to drive around incognito, I suppose the Lada might be appropriate. If it starts.
As can be amply demonstrated by this poster at Calais
https://twitter.com/andylines/status/1500837210895130629
Andy Lines
@andylines
The shocking poster that greets Ukraine refugees arriving here in Calais. Appears to be absolutely no official British help on the ground for these traumatised people. The wonderful volunteers of
@Care4Calais
are doing their best to help.
.
You may as well attack labour who have pro Putin mps on their benches
You are better than this
https://twitter.com/kimwillsher1/status/1500804536558051337
They're being "detained" by border force for "further inquiries". They've been given an IS.81 form and told they're "liable to be detained under Paragraph 16(1) of Schedule 2 of the Immigration Act 1971". Passports and travel documents have been taken. This is just inhumane.
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/priti-patel-refugees-ukraine_uk_622627f2e4b012a2628e68af