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The markets edge back to Johnson but 2022 exit still odds on – politicalbetting.com

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  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,967
    Leon said:

    Favourite train journey?

    In the UK?

    Then abroad?
    Over the Brenner from Munich to Bolzano
  • Farooq said:

    Train porn. Since the Highlands is already taken, a shout out to these two sections:
    Between Ludlow and Church Stretton, and
    the Devon? Cornwall? section on the coast? Dawlish Warren perhaps.

    Abroad: Swiss/Austrian border. At dawn.

    Durham - Edinburgh I thoroughly recommend.
  • https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1488885734375403527

    A bit thick isn't he? "those in "charge of organisations should be held to account for their wider achievements and wider failings." says Simon Clarke...
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,411

    The Winston Smith blog http://winstonsmith33.blogspot.com/ is interesting reading in light of all this.

    What he makes clear is that the old, abusive, system of prison like control of children in care has been replaced with complete lack of control. One they are early teenagers, they use the care system as a dormitory.
    Hence Rochdale and Rotherham. In part, anyway.
  • https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1488885734375403527

    A bit thick isn't he? "those in "charge of organisations should be held to account for their wider achievements and wider failings." says Simon Clarke...

    Lol. Either that or he is trolling Big Clown
  • PolruanPolruan Posts: 2,083
    Farooq said:

    Train porn. Since the Highlands is already taken, a shout out to these two sections:
    Between Ludlow and Church Stretton, and
    the Devon? Cornwall? section on the coast? Dawlish Warren perhaps.

    Abroad: Swiss/Austrian border. At dawn.

    Yes, Dawlish - between Exeter and Newton Abbot, and almost exactly halfway between London and Penzance (in terms of time rather than distance). I'd add the Tamar crossing into Cornwall and the next couple of miles around the estuaries; and the last stretch past the Hayle estuary before crossing from north coast to south and coasting along Marazion marsh and round Mounts Bay into Penzance. Even after doing the journey weekly for a couple of years I still stop and watch those views each time.

    The St Ives branch line is pretty stunning too.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,306
    Foxy said:

    I was told that the line is freight only now, apart from occasional tourist specials. Part of the enjoyment of such public transport is the people watching.

    Not sure how safe the trip Mrs Foxy and I did would be now. We drove from Phoenix AZ to Puerto Vallata in an old pick up truck, with the canyon as a side trip. That West Coast of Mexico is a long way, and we have many great memories, as well as some of the worst food poisoning of my life!.



    Freight only? Ah, that is sad. So sad. It is an amazing train journey, and the canyon is phenomenal. We flew out

    Looking back I now realize it was an epicenter of the drug trade, hence the armed guards on the train, which at the time we thought were there for “colour”

    It was on that same journey that I got a BUS from the Canyon to Ciudad Juarez, then crossed into El Paso (where I had the worst Chinese meal of my life). Then I hired a car and drove around the wilder parts of Texas. Marfa! Brilliant place

    I remember thinking on my bus journey “Ooh Ciudad Juarez seems a bit depressing” - again this was early in the narcowars, but they were already happening, I took silly risks without realizing

    Mexico used to be one of my very favorite countries to visit. So much variety. And good food (unlike most of Latin America). Such a loss
  • rcs1000 said:

    Well, she annoys lefties because she's very authoritarian.
    And she annoys righties because she's done a very poor job with migrant border crossings.

    While in her previous role, she travelled to Israel, had a bunch of work meetings. Then lied about it to the Prime Minister. Was forgiven. More revelations came out. She then lied again. And after being lied to a second time, the Prime Minister was less forgiving.

    She has a great personal backstory, is attractive and articulate. She's clearly not stupid.

    But I'm not convinced she would be a great PM.
    Priti also annoys those who value height, received pronunciation and Oxbridge.
  • Polruan said:

    Yes, Dawlish - between Exeter and Newton Abbot, and almost exactly halfway between London and Penzance (in terms of time rather than distance). I'd add the Tamar crossing into Cornwall and the next couple of miles around the estuaries; and the last stretch past the Hayle estuary before crossing from north coast to south and coasting along Marazion marsh and round Mounts Bay into Penzance. Even after doing the journey weekly for a couple of years I still stop and watch those views each time.

    The St Ives branch line is pretty stunning too.
    Your name gives away a certain bias, but it is a bias that has much merit.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,407
    Farooq said:

    Honestly, if Patel became PM, I'd join the SNP the same day.
    Everybody agrees with you. It's just me that doesn't understand why.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,430
    edited February 2022

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1488885734375403527

    A bit thick isn't he? "those in "charge of organisations should be held to account for their wider achievements and wider failings." says Simon Clarke...

    Well he's a Smoggie isn't he? Those lot are thick as mince even before the smog addles their brains.

    Edit - Further proof he's thick as mince, he read history at University College, Oxford.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,637
    Did Rishi Sunak blow his chance at toppling Boris Johnson last week? That’s what some Tory MPs think. “We were waiting for the signal but it never came”.
    https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/levelling-up-white-paper-blackpool-michael-gove-rishi-sunak-b980179.html
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    edited February 2022
    Speaking of TVs, I'm pretty sure BBC3 isn't really aim't at the PB style audience - but it should be up and running again and they're showing a Africa Cup of Nations Semi-final tonight-

    https://www.betfair.com/exchange/plus/en/football/africa-cup-of-nations/burkina-faso-v-senegal-betting-31207991
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,220
    Foxy said:

    Err, accuracy?

    It was plainly absurd to ignore 28 day deaths from reinfection, by counting 28 days from the original infection.

    I have no problem about people arguing against control measures for social, economic or ideological reasons, but denials that it is a serious health issue really gets my goat.
    What was international practice?

    And what was recommended by the WHO?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,064
    Leon said:

    I heard some truly disturbing gossip about “a very very well known 20th century rock star” which claimed that when his band entered town X, he and his one like-minded roadie would head for the nearest children’s home/orphanage, and select which pretty girl or boy they wanted, and pay handsomely for the privilege. They weren’t averse to retarded children, as they were even more malleable

    It came from a hugely well-informed music journalist, and I believe it to be probably true (but cannot know for sure, of course). It has made me quite conflicted, as I love the music of the band in question

    So, not Radiohead then...
  • Just noticed this thread seems to have turned into train spotters anonymous. Either that or Leon is not SeanT as we all thought, but is actually Michael Portillo. Might explain a few things.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,064
    Leon said:

    I know plenty of people that use old fash notepads. But what if you lose it?

    I use Evernote. It is all stored in the ethersphere so you can’t lose anything, It syncs across all devices. I can search all my notes from when I began using it (in about 2012). It’s brilliant

    I recently looked at my notes - more like diary entries - from Jan/Feb 2021. My God I was in the Pit of Winter Lockdown Despair. All I could see ahead of me was more darkness and cold. Awful

    It makes this sojourn in Sri Lanka even more delightful, and it is already quite high on the delightfulness scale
    I use the Remarkable tablet. It is genuinely just like taking notes on paper. But it all ends up in the cloud.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,064

    Priti also annoys those who value height, received pronunciation and Oxbridge.
    Didn't she go to Cambridge?
  • Way Off Topic - Portland Oregonian: Bud Clark, Portland’s former ‘citizen mayor,’ dies at 90

    https://www.oregonlive.com/politics/2022/02/portlands-former-citizen-mayor-bud-clark-dead-at-90.html

    I post this, in memory of a famous poster (the old-fashioned kind) that featured His Honor showing his personal appreciation for the arts in the Rose City:

    Bud Clark - "expose yourself to art"
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWxG0XRU_Io
  • Well he's a Smoggie isn't he? Those lot are thick as mince even before the smog addles their brains.

    Edit - Further proof he's thick as mince, he read history at University College, Oxford.
    Surely not as bad as reading Classics?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,637
    Two more Tory MPs are submitting letters of no confidence in the prime minister over his handling of partygate allegations https://trib.al/xvi6Koy
  • rcs1000 said:

    I use the Remarkable tablet. It is genuinely just like taking notes on paper. But it all ends up in the cloud.
    Has it solved the long problem of these kind of pads never feeling "natural" to use? I have a wacom drawing tablet and its a skill in itself to actually draw on it, you have to practice to get good, it really isn't like drawing on a piece of paper at all.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    Scott_xP said:

    Two more Tory MPs are submitting letters of no confidence in the prime minister over his handling of partygate allegations https://trib.al/xvi6Koy

    Same MPs as before, no?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,306
    Polruan said:

    Yes, Dawlish - between Exeter and Newton Abbot, and almost exactly halfway between London and Penzance (in terms of time rather than distance). I'd add the Tamar crossing into Cornwall and the next couple of miles around the estuaries; and the last stretch past the Hayle estuary before crossing from north coast to south and coasting along Marazion marsh and round Mounts Bay into Penzance. Even after doing the journey weekly for a couple of years I still stop and watch those views each time.

    The St Ives branch line is pretty stunning too.

    And nice and slow

    Everyone wants high-speed rail but there is a loss which comes with it, or so I have noted. Above a certain speed the countryside blurs - as you pass it too quickly - so you get no sense of the journey. It is just a whizzing mess of green or grey

    I did Paris to Nantes a few years ago, all along the Loire, and I am sure in olden days it would have been stunning, but on the TGV I might as well have been on a plane. There is no point in looking out of the window as everything just whooshes past


    Is there a single High-Speed Train on the great railway journeys list?I doubt it. Just as there isn’t a list of “great airline routes”
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 44,531
    edited February 2022

    'Those other people are doing it and recommending it' isn't actually an argument in its favour is it? It's the same argument lemmings use when charging over a cliff. If you agree with it, you can surely find a single convincing argument for it other than pointing at the German Government.
    When looking at a reform it's relevant where else it has been done and with what impact. People are saying self-Id is a perverts charter and an attack on women's rights, yet several countries have adopted self-Id and it hasn't been a perverts charter or caused a regression in women's rights. Germany is about to join these countries. When the UK government looked at this in 2018 they concluded that self-Id was a positive reform - because it would help this minority and harm nobody else. The Women & Equalities Committee of the HoC has recently re-endorsed this in their report of Dec 21. There are some solid arguments for this reform. People who are interested should take a look at them.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    rcs1000 said:

    I use the Remarkable tablet. It is genuinely just like taking notes on paper. But it all ends up in the cloud.
    I love the Remarkable target, a great device
  • Scott_xP said:

    Two more Tory MPs are submitting letters of no confidence in the prime minister over his handling of partygate allegations https://trib.al/xvi6Koy

    Oh, you had me excited there. We've already counted them!
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    Scott_xP said:

    Did Rishi Sunak blow his chance at toppling Boris Johnson last week? That’s what some Tory MPs think. “We were waiting for the signal but it never came”.
    https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/levelling-up-white-paper-blackpool-michael-gove-rishi-sunak-b980179.html

    There goes the 250-1 bet…
  • Scott_xP said:

    Two more Tory MPs are submitting letters of no confidence in the prime minister over his handling of partygate allegations https://trib.al/xvi6Koy

    Ellwood and Mangnall so not new
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,407
    Farooq said:

    I read your comment earlier and tried to see it from your point of view. I just can't manage it. I don't think she has anything redeeming about her. I wouldn't even say that about Corbyn or Boris. She might be the worst person in the world.
    I don't get the why of this.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,220
    edited February 2022
    Well, on the "what are you doing", I'm in the background making Pizza dough to partly use and partly freeze.

    I went out the other day and came back with the correct flour.

    And I ordered *my* pizza oven at slightly less expense than Max. This one, which is £169 but still reviews well and claims to make a pizza in 3 minutes at 450C.
    https://pizzaunited.co.uk/collections/frontpage/products/optima-pizza-express-napoli-pizza-oven

    The only fly in the ointment is that they very definitely do not deliver on Amazon Prime timescales.

    And I've had the first bike run of the year. Just a few miles, but a start.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,064
    MaxPB said:

    Right, now that I'm no longer tied into BA, wondering whether it's worth starting a new loyalty scheme. The new BA CEO seems better than Cruz but not by enough to get me to commit long term. What other choices have I got PB frequent fliers?

    Well, there are basically only two loyalty schemes of great size - Star Alliance and OneWorld. If you're not BA-ing, you probably want something in the Star Alliance programme. (Other smaller alternatives are Air France-KLM and Virgin Atlantic.)

    Personally, I am so near Gold For Life (33k/35k tier points), there's no point in me changing until I get there. But I'm also pretty fond of the Virgin transatlantic product.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 29,848
    edited February 2022
    rcs1000 said:

    Didn't she go to Cambridge?
    Wikipedia says Keele and Essex:-
    She [Priti Patel] attended a comprehensive girls school in Watford, Hertfordshire before going on to study economics at Keele University and then pursuing postgraduate studies in British government and politics at the University of Essex.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Priti_Patel#Early_life

    Not even Eton.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    Battlestations!

    That's the word I've been trying to remember for the last 10 mins.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/battlestations/
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,637
    Gary Streeter - first elected Tory MP in 1992 - submits letter of no confidence

    "I cannot reconcile the pain and sacrifice of the vast majority of the British Public during lockdown with the attitude and activities of those working in Downing Street"

    https://www.facebook.com/garystreeterSWD/posts/4827788877306053
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,306
    Farooq said:

    I find myself unable to explain, which is why I didn't reply to your original post. It's a visceral and wordless hate. I can normally articulate what I like or dislike about someone, but with Patel all I get is the words "SMIRKING GHOUL" and there it stops.
    My guess is: her alleged support of the Death Penalty

    It makes liberals get shingles in horror
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    Laura Kuenssberg
    @bbclaurak
    2m
    Gary Streeter becomes 3rd Tory MP today to say he's submitted letter to try to trigger a vote of no confidence in the PM
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,407

    Wikipedia says Keele and Essex:-
    She [Priti Patel] attended a comprehensive girls school in Watford, Hertfordshire before going on to study economics at Keele University and then pursuing postgraduate studies in British government and politics at the University of Essex.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Priti_Patel#Early_life

    Not even Eton.
    I vouch for her. A bit of a flyer, I admit.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,637
    The PM’s Savile remark, and his refusal to withdraw it, are going down awfully with the One Nation crowd of Tory MPs. It’s pushed some to tipping point and there’s talk of at least one more MP going public with a letter before the day’s over. https://twitter.com/politicshome/status/1488899605127479304
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,811
    Leon said:


    And nice and slow

    Everyone wants high-speed rail but there is a loss which comes with it, or so I have noted. Above a certain speed the countryside blurs - as you pass it too quickly - so you get no sense of the journey. It is just a whizzing mess of green or grey

    I did Paris to Nantes a few years ago, all along the Loire, and I am sure in olden days it would have been stunning, but on the TGV I might as well have been on a plane. There is no point in looking out of the window as everything just whooshes past


    Is there a single High-Speed Train on the great railway journeys list?I doubt it. Just as there isn’t a list of “great airline routes”
    I have had some great airline routes with window seats.

    From Schipol to Cape Town in daytime on a cloudless day was glorious. The coasts, the mountains, the deserts, the forests, the mouth of the Congo. Who needs an in-flight movie?

    Flying into Phoenix from the UK too. The snow, lakes, forests and mountains of Canada well worth a look.

  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,637
    Johnson faces a shire Tory rebellion, including MPs you may never have heard of...solid constituency MPs - not "the usual suspects". https://www.ft.com/content/3003a825-5985-4fbe-8949-0c7d717513b8
  • Leon said:

    My guess is: her alleged support of the Death Penalty

    It makes liberals get shingles in horror
    Nothing alleged about it.

    The thing that scares me was the fact she believed nobody innocent is ever convicted.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,637
    Bang on 5.00 pm. As predicted by @AVMikhailova. Clear coordination now. Clear it’s not going to stop.
    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1488921672866574340
    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1488920741718409216
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,811

    Wikipedia says Keele and Essex:-
    She [Priti Patel] attended a comprehensive girls school in Watford, Hertfordshire before going on to study economics at Keele University and then pursuing postgraduate studies in British government and politics at the University of Essex.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Priti_Patel#Early_life

    Not even Eton.
    A contemporary of Liz Kendall at her Watford school.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 45,119
    Leon said:


    And nice and slow

    Everyone wants high-speed rail but there is a loss which comes with it, or so I have noted. Above a certain speed the countryside blurs - as you pass it too quickly - so you get no sense of the journey. It is just a whizzing mess of green or grey

    I did Paris to Nantes a few years ago, all along the Loire, and I am sure in olden days it would have been stunning, but on the TGV I might as well have been on a plane. There is no point in looking out of the window as everything just whooshes past


    Is there a single High-Speed Train on the great railway journeys list?I doubt it. Just as there isn’t a list of “great airline routes”
    I totally agree with that, but there's another question: how many high-speed routes go through massively scenic areas? For instance, the first phase of HS2 goes between London and Birmingham. I've walked the Grand Union Canal between the two places, and been on the train many times, and there's nothing too spectacular - even in the Tring area.

    Also, much of HS2 is going to be in tunnels. There's little point in looking out of the windows in that case.

    So perhaps high-speed rail should be seen as a way of getting to the scenic journeys faster. ;)
  • EndillionEndillion Posts: 4,976
    kinabalu said:

    When looking at a reform it's relevant where else it has been done and with what impact. People are saying self-Id is a perverts charter and an attack on women's rights, yet several countries have adopted self-Id and it hasn't been a perverts charter or caused a regression in women's rights. Germany is about to join these countries. When the UK government looked at this in 2018 they concluded that self-Id was a positive reform - because it would help this minority and harm nobody else. The Women & Equalities Committee of the HoC has recently re-endorsed this in their report of Dec 21. There are some solid arguments for this reform. People who are interested should take a look at them.
    Do you have any links to studies from these countries evidencing that "it hasn't been a perverts charter or caused a regression in women's rights"? For example, that attacks on female prisoners have not increased since the change was made?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,411

    Wikipedia says Keele and Essex:-
    She [Priti Patel] attended a comprehensive girls school in Watford, Hertfordshire before going on to study economics at Keele University and then pursuing postgraduate studies in British government and politics at the University of Essex.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Priti_Patel#Early_life

    Not even Eton.
    I’m always surprised she got through a year or two at Essex U alive with her right-wing views!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,306
    edited February 2022
    Foxy said:

    I have had some great airline routes with window seats.

    From Schipol to Cape Town in daytime on a cloudless day was glorious. The coasts, the mountains, the deserts, the forests, the mouth of the Congo. Who needs an in-flight movie?

    Flying into Phoenix from the UK too. The snow, lakes, forests and mountains of Canada well worth a look.

    A fair point. A great airline route is actually better than high speed rail. I was wrong


    flying across the Alps in clear weather is always fun. I also remember a flight across the Greenland Ice Cap from Iceland to ilullisat. OMG!


    And seaplanes, I do love a seaplane. Sydney to Pittwater. Colombo to the Sri Lankan highlands. Anywhere in the Maldives to anywhere else. Seaplanes are brilliant
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,794
    rcs1000 said:

    Well, there are basically only two loyalty schemes of great size - Star Alliance and OneWorld. If you're not BA-ing, you probably want something in the Star Alliance programme. (Other smaller alternatives are Air France-KLM and Virgin Atlantic.)

    Personally, I am so near Gold For Life (33k/35k tier points), there's no point in me changing until I get there. But I'm also pretty fond of the Virgin transatlantic product.
    Yeah I'm only at around a third of that so I'm not fussed to try and get lifetime status and I've been less and less impressed by BA since I started seriously flying for business in 2014 and the Japanese execs seem unimpressed by JAL. Yet I'm booking the US in for a personal holiday and Star Alliance options seem crap as well.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 9,225
    Farooq said:

    I find myself unable to explain, which is why I didn't reply to your original post. It's a visceral and wordless hate. I can normally articulate what I like or dislike about someone, but with Patel all I get is the words "SMIRKING GHOUL" and there it stops.
    On the smirking bit, she has a habit of only smiling with mouth closed, which makes her look like she's smirking. In the clip of Johnson failing to open an umbrella, she actually does a proper smile and suddenly looks much more sympathetic. I have a friend who also only does closed mouth smiles for photos etc and looks a numpty/smirker, in her case because she believes she has bad teeth.

    For me, as a liberal, the big problem is her authoritarian instincts. The lying etc doesn't help either, but I'm horrified by a Patel administration far more than a Johnson administration and I'm not exactly delighted about that, either.
  • MaxPB said:

    New York, San Francisco and Tokyo for business in club class. With points I'd probably go to Asia. The company doesn't have a preferred airline for 2022 at least but will probably partner with ANA or JAL, last time out we had JAL but the Japanese execs weren't happy with them. Bonus points if they serve Haneda.
    Worth looking at American's and Alaska's loyalty programmes I think. There are a few articles on the web comparing them for accrual, you'd probably also get a helpful response on headforpoints or flyertalk if you pose the question.

    I am with American's AAdvantage program. Originally because I inherited half a million points (!) but have been happy to stick with them. Have never been tempted by Avios, mainly because I'm not tempted to ever actually fly with BA so don't care about the 2-4-1 voucher. They are also rubbish for redemptions, even through oneworld partners: crappy seats (though that is improving with the new club suite), disinterested cabin crew, hefty fuel charges, charging for seat reservations even in business class. Donnez-moi un break !
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,375
    rcs1000 said:

    The problem we have is that we don't know how much evidence there was, whether the girls themselves (or their parents) wanted to testify, etc. The CPS has a limited budget, and their goal - always - is going to be to maximise the number of successful prosecutions. If something is seen as difficult - perhaps because the primary witnesses would struggle on the stand - then one can see why it might get dropped.

    It's easy with the benefit of hindsight to say 'Savile was a wrong-un'. But did the CPS/DPP know that? Or did they just think that the chances of a conviction were not great, that the witnesses parents did not want them grilled on the stand, and see a better use of scarce resources elsewhere?
    I agree although I do think that when a incredibly well known person is accused of something this heinous and the police have forwarded 4 seperate potential prosecutions, then someone senior would have made the decision to not prosecute.

    I do follow potential miscarriages of justice as a bit of a hobby and some cases where people are in prison for murder, its hard to see how the case ever got to court as the evidence was so weak, yet the CPS authorised a prosecution, a great example being Roger Kearney who was convicted of the murder of his lover Paula Poolton whose body was found at a train station very close to where I live. In his case there was no direct evidence and no circumstantial evidence. DNA that was found in the boot next to her body which was not his. His wife also gave him an alibi for the night the murder happened. Despite this a case was bought and the jury found him guilty. He can't appeal becuase he cannot contradict the evidence he was convicted on as there was not any. The fact that he was her lover was enough for a conviction.

    My point is that the CPS regulalry pursue prosecutions where there is limited evidence, sometimes succesfully sometimes not. The Saville case must have been one of the most important decisions of that year and the decision to not prosecute would not have been taken lightly and I would have thought that very senior people within the CPS were aware of the case at the time.
  • Leon said:

    My guess is: her alleged support of the Death Penalty

    It makes liberals get shingles in horror
    I don't like her opinions at all but I don't really get why she is disliked more than other Tories. She doesn't trigger me like she triggers some people. I think she's an effective political operator.
  • Andy_CookeAndy_Cooke Posts: 5,045

    Great Barrington Declaration supporter publishes paper in favour of Great Barrington Declaration.....

    Surprise!

    Shock!

    Horror!

    No RoB
    No I^2 value given.
    Not a meta-analysis by the methodology of meta-analyses (either Cochrane or PRISMA - and they state they used PRISMA for selection of studies, but didn't bother with the Risk of Bias study or the heterogeneity value.
    Not peer-reviewed.
    Written by authors affilliated with the AEIR (behind both the GBD and the antivaxxer Brownstone Institute).

    Hmm.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,407

    I’m always surprised she got through a year or two at Essex U alive with her right-wing views!
    A wonderful endorsement of Essex U.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,436
    Scott_xP said:

    Bang on 5.00 pm. As predicted by @AVMikhailova. Clear coordination now. Clear it’s not going to stop.
    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1488921672866574340
    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1488920741718409216

    Excellent stuff - when is the next one coming?
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,795
    Leon said:

    My guess is: her alleged support of the Death Penalty

    It makes liberals get shingles in horror
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DrsVhzbLzU
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,811
    Farooq said:

    I can assure you of one thing: you won't find a singular cause. Yes, you can name aspects like that, yes, death penalty, fair point, but the whole will be greater than the sum of the parts. It's at least partly irrational, possibly mostly.
    She was speaking at a Leave meeting in the run up to the referendum in 2016, so I went along to see her. I reported on it here at the time.

    She was far from the most capable speaker on the bill. Indeed the Business for Leave speaker was considerably more articulate. Her answers were evasive in the typical politicians media style, even though it couldn't have been an easier audience. I came away under whelmed by her.

    I am green on her for next leader though.



  • I don't like her opinions at all but I don't really get why she is disliked more than other Tories. She doesn't trigger me like she triggers some people. I think she's an effective political operator.
    For me, putting aside the fact she's a disgraced national security risk, is here hypocrisy, she's enacting policies and rhetoric which if it had applied to her parents, then they would have never been allowed to settle in the UK.
  • PolruanPolruan Posts: 2,083
    Foxy said:

    I have had some great airline routes with window seats.

    From Schipol to Cape Town in daytime on a cloudless day was glorious. The coasts, the mountains, the deserts, the forests, the mouth of the Congo. Who needs an in-flight movie?

    Flying into Phoenix from the UK too. The snow, lakes, forests and mountains of Canada well worth a look.

    +1 for the Phoenix route (my second longhaul flight and my first in business, I think).

    Athens to Rome late on a winter afternoon: harsh golden horizontal sun on the gulfs of Corinth and Patras and the Antirrio bridge, then over the Ionian islands and up the instep of Italy with the Puglian coast to the right before crossing Basilicata and rounding Vesuvius at dusk. Spectacular enough to watch the whole flight without opening a book once.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,794
    Leon said:

    My guess is: her alleged support of the Death Penalty

    It makes liberals get shingles in horror
    They think she's a race traitor. There's really not more to it than that.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,407
    MaxPB said:

    They think she's a race traitor. There's really not more to it than that.
    I'll stand for her. Pistols?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,316
    edited February 2022

    For me, putting aside the fact she's a disgraced national security risk, is here hypocrisy, she's enacting policies and rhetoric which if it had applied to her parents, then they would have never been allowed to settle in the UK.
    I think that's the least of reasons to criticise her, personally. I don't see that someone should feel bound to a political policy decision based on who their parents were and what policies applied to those parents. I think there are good enough reasons to criticise her positions without adding on 'Her own policies would not have worked out well for her parents'. Maybe so, maybe not, but either a policy is good or it isn't, and how it might have applied to a parent seems irrelevant.

    It might make a political position more surprising, but we've probably all met longer standing immigrants who are opposed to more immigration as an example.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 9,225
    Foxy said:

    I have had some great airline routes with window seats.

    From Schipol to Cape Town in daytime on a cloudless day was glorious. The coasts, the mountains, the deserts, the forests, the mouth of the Congo. Who needs an in-flight movie?

    Flying into Phoenix from the UK too. The snow, lakes, forests and mountains of Canada well worth a look.

    Santiago to Teniente Vidal (Chile) for me. Right down the Andes/west coast with spectacular views of both before descending to a near invisible airport that pops into sight at the last moment.
  • That Levelling Up White paper is great, isn't it? Yet another regurgitated promise of rolling out 5G, some vacuous stuff about improving local transport, and more devolution if the locals want it. I'm sure voters in the Red Wall will come flooding back to Johnson now.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,306

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DrsVhzbLzU
    What a load of old pants. We’ve been extra-judicially executing people for decades, via drone. Obama loved doing it. Suddenly if we do it at home its omg no ewwwwww

    Spare me this liberal cant
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,794

    For me, putting aside the fact she's a disgraced national security risk, is here hypocrisy, she's enacting policies and rhetoric which if it had applied to her parents, then they would have never been allowed to settle in the UK.
    That't unlikely to be true, her parents were very likely in the same proverbial boat as my grandparents and parents, British citizens in the Empire which made resettlement pretty straightforwards. Additionally, she's extended a similar programme that her parents would have had to Hong Kongers, another group of people who have claim to some kind of British citizenship and she's made it easier for them to resettle in the UK.

    This is a meme that is repeated across lefty types, it's untrue and I'm surprised you've fallen for it.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,436
    MaxPB said:

    They think she's a race traitor. There's really not more to it than that.
    Well a woman of colour in the conservative party? How dare she! Bit alarming to hear @TSE say that she believes no innocent people have ever been convicted when that's so easy to prove wrong. I don't think she'd be a good prime minister and with her past record I cant see her honesty and behaviour as a minister suggesting she'd be much of an improvement on the current oaf.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 13,837
    Scott_xP said:

    Did Rishi Sunak blow his chance at toppling Boris Johnson last week? That’s what some Tory MPs think. “We were waiting for the signal but it never came”.
    https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/levelling-up-white-paper-blackpool-michael-gove-rishi-sunak-b980179.html

    Sunak has three big obstacles:

    Maxed out on tax, spend, debt and deficit

    Stayed in cabinet when everyone else knew the government and leader was in the wrong and that the only moral course was to say so and resign (was the Savile slur the last new excuse giving clear grounds to do this?)

    The billions of payments to fraudulent bogus companies which a nine year old would have spotted coming down the tracks



  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,637
    Exclusive: Ex-civil service chief attended Downing Street party being investigated by police By @HarryYorke1
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/02/02/exclusive-ex-civil-service-chief-attended-downing-street-party/
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,316
    Scott_xP said:

    Johnson faces a shire Tory rebellion, including MPs you may never have heard of...solid constituency MPs - not "the usual suspects". https://www.ft.com/content/3003a825-5985-4fbe-8949-0c7d717513b8

    Never rouse the Shires, basic rule for a Tory PM I'd think. It's why the planning rule changes were junked.
  • MaxPB said:

    They think she's a race traitor. There's really not more to it than that.
    Not sure that is true. They don't seem to have the same hatred for Sunak. She comes across to me as really very smug. I find that irritating, plus the fact that her views are strongly populist.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,316
    Farooq said:

    Wait what?
    Not everyone will think that, obviously, but I doubt it will take long to find examples of that sentiment.

    Personally part of why I'm more suspicious of Patel compared to others is based on who seems to like her most or who she is trying to please with 'tough on the boats' stuff and the like.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,790
    Scott_xP said:

    Did Rishi Sunak blow his chance at toppling Boris Johnson last week? That’s what some Tory MPs think. “We were waiting for the signal but it never came”.
    https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/levelling-up-white-paper-blackpool-michael-gove-rishi-sunak-b980179.html

    In Liz we Trusst ? ;)
  • Farooq said:

    I've been thinking more about the politicians who wind me up to an inexplicable level:
    Patel
    Blackford
    Hoyle
    Nandy

    I dislike each of them far more than I should. What do they have in common? I can't think of anything.

    I am with you on most, except Hoyle. Think he is doing a good job. I think smugness is the commonality with the other three. Smug with little to be smug about.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,866
    Leon said:

    What a load of old pants. We’ve been extra-judicially executing people for decades, via drone. Obama loved doing it. Suddenly if we do it at home its omg no ewwwwww

    Spare me this liberal cant
    Clinton began it with cruise missiles. Given the way that cruise missiles got modified for insight video transmission, and control, they have sort of become one-way-drones, now.....
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 18,436
    algarkirk said:

    Sunak has three big obstacles:

    Maxed out on tax, spend, debt and deficit

    Stayed in cabinet when everyone else knew the government and leader was in the wrong and that the only moral course was to say so and resign (was the Savile slur the last new excuse giving clear grounds to do this?)

    The billions of payments to fraudulent bogus companies which a nine year old would have spotted coming down the tracks



    On staying in cabinet, you can throw that argument at Starmer, who seemed quite at home in Corbyn's shadow cabinet.
    I suspect that quite a few conservative MP's were hoping to keep Johnson until the catastrophic local elections in May as the right time to knife him. New leader installed in time for the conference. Reset the direction, 18 months to bed in, with some judicious tax cuts bribes to electorate and bingo...
    Sadly the oaf is not even capable of lasting this long.
  • Endillion said:

    Do you have any links to studies from these countries evidencing that "it hasn't been a perverts charter or caused a regression in women's rights"? For example, that attacks on female prisoners have not increased since the change was made?
    Seems there is lot of silliness on trans rights on these boards just as there is from self indulgent commentators in the Times and the Observer. Tom Harwood on GB news has far more sensible views on trans rights and has pointed out that prisoners are already assessed on an individual basis.

    Germany seems a lot better on trans rights and there is no controversy in their gvt about it.

    I don't think people like Rosie Duffield and cyclefree understand the equality act and if they do they want to repeal parts of it.
  • eekeek Posts: 29,553
    edited February 2022
    algarkirk said:

    Sunak has three big obstacles:

    Maxed out on tax, spend, debt and deficit

    Stayed in cabinet when everyone else knew the government and leader was in the wrong and that the only moral course was to say so and resign (was the Savile slur the last new excuse giving clear grounds to do this?)

    The billions of payments to fraudulent bogus companies which a nine year old would have spotted coming down the tracks



    A lot of that is the fault of the banks who processed the loans and did no work at all to check who got what. 1 obvious starting point that could be done is refusing to refund loans made to companies that were created after Covid appeared

    This is another example of where the blame lies 100% with the bank giving the same director multiple loans

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59761294
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,637
    ** Brexit flashback **

    NEW Labour is backing a plan to use a 'humble address' to force the publication of the full Sue Gray report.
    Sir Lyndsay Hoyle is likely to look favourably on it.
    One Commons source asks "Would Theresa May table it?" More in Chopper's Politics Newsletter.

    https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1488926863582023682
  • TimTTimT Posts: 6,468
    edited February 2022

    Here's mine

    image
    Here's mine, or at least the view (taken sitting at my desk through the screen):
  • kle4 said:

    Never rouse the Shires, basic rule for a Tory PM I'd think. It's why the planning rule changes were junked.
    I think that has been bubbling for a while. Most Tory MPs are decent people. Johnson's behaviour is an anathema to them and their constituents.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,411
    MaxPB said:

    That't unlikely to be true, her parents were very likely in the same proverbial boat as my grandparents and parents, British citizens in the Empire which made resettlement pretty straightforwards. Additionally, she's extended a similar programme that her parents would have had to Hong Kongers, another group of people who have claim to some kind of British citizenship and she's made it easier for them to resettle in the UK.

    This is a meme that is repeated across lefty types, it's untrue and I'm surprised you've fallen for it.
    Her parents got out of Uganda not too long before Amin started getting antsy. If they hadn’t I certainly have campaigned for them to be allowed here. As I did for hundreds of others.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,637
    NEW Michael Ashcroft's biography of Carrie Johnson is published on Mar 22
    It will "offer the electorate the chance to assess exactly what role she plays in Boris Johnson’s unpredictable administration and why that matters", the publisher says
    More in Chopper's Politics Newsletter
    https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1488927363752677385
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,637
    Remember. We haven’t had all the parties yet. We haven’t had the photos yet. We haven’t had the fixed penalty notices yet. We haven’t had Sue Gray 2 yet.
    https://twitter.com/DPJHodges/status/1488927211948285971
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,790
    Scott_xP said:

    NEW Michael Ashcroft's biography of Carrie Johnson is published on Mar 22
    It will "offer the electorate the chance to assess exactly what role she plays in Boris Johnson’s unpredictable administration and why that matters", the publisher says
    More in Chopper's Politics Newsletter
    https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1488927363752677385

    The Good Lord cashing in before (or just after) the Johnson's are history? ;)
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,811
    Leon said:

    A fair point. A great airline route is actually better than high speed rail. I was wrong


    flying across the Alps in clear weather is always fun. I also remember a flight across the Greenland Ice Cap from Iceland to ilullisat. OMG!


    And seaplanes, I do love a seaplane. Sydney to Pittwater. Colombo to the Sri Lankan highlands. Anywhere in the Maldives to anywhere else. Seaplanes are brilliant
    I flew from St Thomas to Puerto Rico in the late Seventies with this eccentric airline:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antilles_Air_Boats

    The pilot was the only crew, and the co-pilot seat had the instruments removed to turn it into another passenger seat. Alas, my brother got that one. After taxiing down the ramp into the water the pilot had to handcraft up the wheels before taking off from the harbour.

    The whole airline was a bit heath Robinson, and unfortunately the founder died in one of the planes shortly after, but a great experience while it lasted.
  • EndillionEndillion Posts: 4,976

    Seems there is lot of silliness on trans rights on these boards just as there is from self indulgent commentators in the Times and the Observer. Tom Harwood on GB news has far more sensible views on trans rights and has pointed out that prisoners are already assessed on an individual basis.

    Germany seems a lot better on trans rights and there is no controversy in their gvt about it.

    I don't think people like Rosie Duffield and cyclefree understand the equality act and if they do they want to repeal parts of it.
    Prisoners are currently assessed on an individual basis, because when we let then "self-ID" themselves, there was a spate of rapes in women's prisons. If we change the law, we lose the ability to perform those individual assessments.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 53,866

    Seems there is lot of silliness on trans rights on these boards just as there is from self indulgent commentators in the Times and the Observer. Tom Harwood on GB news has far more sensible views on trans rights and has pointed out that prisoners are already assessed on an individual basis.

    Germany seems a lot better on trans rights and there is no controversy in their gvt about it.

    I don't think people like Rosie Duffield and cyclefree understand the equality act and if they do they want to repeal parts of it.
    So in the case of @Cyclefree you are mansplaining a lawyer? Interesting.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,407
    It's truly ridiculous how the critics of Patel vanish when tested. I really like the idea of an annoyoing, short, Indian, and whirlwind like young lady being in power.
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 3,332
    Polruan said:

    +1 for the Phoenix route (my second longhaul flight and my first in business, I think).

    Athens to Rome late on a winter afternoon: harsh golden horizontal sun on the gulfs of Corinth and Patras and the Antirrio bridge, then over the Ionian islands and up the instep of Italy with the Puglian coast to the right before crossing Basilicata and rounding Vesuvius at dusk. Spectacular enough to watch the whole flight without opening a book once.
    Yes, or Milan-Athens as well, the views over the Croatian Adriatic are stunning, Equally the landing into Ljubljana on a clear day is abasolutely spectacular (but pretty scary in bad weather)
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 22,124
    edited February 2022
    Farooq said:

    Yes, that's an astute point, I hadn't noticed that but it's true.
    I'm now thinking that the same applies to three of my list of four. They are liked by the "wrong" people.
    I don't really know who is a fan of Nandy though... perhaps nobody?
    I’m a fan of Nandy.
    I wish she were LOTO not Keir.
    She’s smart and passionate but also articulate and measured.

    Watching Keir today, he did OK at PMQs, but there’s something robotic about him.

    As for the rest of your list, I don’t mind Hoyle but the reason Patel is loathed is just that’s she’s a thick authoritarian, not “a race traitor” as MaxPB suggests.

    PBers seem to have suddenly forgotten the disgraceful policing bills…
  • Omnium said:

    It's truly ridiculous how the critics of Patel vanish when tested. I really like the idea of an annoyoing, short, Indian, and whirlwind like young lady being in power.

    She's a disgraced national security risk.
  • GIN1138 said:

    In Liz we Trusst ? ;)
    I learned today that Brexiteers are concerned he is not strong enough on the NI protocol , even though he is a leaver
  • kjhkjh Posts: 12,393
    MaxPB said:

    They think she's a race traitor. There's really not more to it than that.
    Not sure what you mean by that? Who does?

    I don't like her because of her politics and she has been caught out telling whoppers a couple of times in the same way our glorious leader has. I don't care two hoots if she is black, white or blue (well I might be a little intrigued if she were blue)
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 34,411
    edited February 2022
    Foxy said:

    I flew from St Thomas to Puerto Rico in the late Seventies with this eccentric airline:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antilles_Air_Boats

    The pilot was the only crew, and the co-pilot seat had the instruments removed to turn it into another passenger seat. Alas, my brother got that one. After taxiing down the ramp into the water the pilot had to handcraft up the wheels before taking off from the harbour.

    The whole airline was a bit heath Robinson, and unfortunately the founder died in one of the planes shortly after, but a great experience while it lasted.
    Not so exotic, but flying into Alderney on a stormy day can be ‘fun’!
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,316
    Others have talked about the smirking thing from Patel, and that it comes up so often I think shows it isn't entirely about her policy positions because it is such a petty thing which people raise.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 13,837
    eek said:

    A lot of that is the fault of the banks who processed the loans and did no work at all to check who got what. 1 obvious starting point that could be done is refusing to refund loans made to companies that were created after Covid appeared

    This is another example of where the blame lies 100% with the bank giving the same director multiple loans

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59761294
    The banks aren't candidates for PM. Sunak is.

    Government sets the rules for spending government money and is always accountable.

    Two wrongs don't make a right.



This discussion has been closed.