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Nadine & Moggsy – the two Johnson uber-loyalists – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,161
edited February 2022 in General
imageNadine & Moggsy – the two Johnson uber-loyalists – politicalbetting.com

One feature that really has been interesting in the past few weeks has been which cabinet members have always been there to support the Prime Minister during his recent troubles. As Steerpike in the Speccie notes this really has been down to just two – Dorries and Rees-Mogg.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • At least Mike didn't use that photo of Nadine wearing that bloody stupid Indiana Jones hat.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    2nd like a PB pro
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,274
    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,454
    Two of the biggest whoppers known to humanity
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382

    At least Mike didn't use that photo of Nadine wearing that bloody stupid Indiana Jones hat.

    I am actually quite a fan of Nadine who is MP for the constituency next to mine.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,695
    turds of a feather circle together
  • JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,291
    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    Oh well, that was my planned viewing tonight. Still will be….though others here have also panned it.
  • FPT, too good not to repost.

    I love The Guardian, they've followed my lead and realised there is no distinction between people from Newcastle and Sunderland.

  • Don't forget the disgraced bully Conor Burns, his performances defending Boris Johnson have been performance art level.

    Ambushed by a cake!
  • Vaguely on topic, I started writing a thread entitled 'Are you mad for Nad?'

    It was about whether Nadine Dorries might be the Tory leader and/or PM.

    I couldn't finish it because I was that upset that this is what my party has come to.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
  • ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379

    FPT, too good not to repost.

    I love The Guardian, they've followed my lead and realised there is no distinction between people from Newcastle and Sunderland.

    With a team from that part of the country being thrashed, it's a reasonable first guess.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,454
    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MrEd said:

    HYUFD said:

    algarkirk said:

    Roger said:

    Anyone think this BJ thing is over listen to Any Answers. Listen particularly for ex John Major's Private Secretary (or similar). Hilarious. I'm not not talking studio audience I'm talking about the phone in afterwards. As a human being Johnson's finished

    Most of the habitual Tories I know would not vote Tory today, or so they say. (I generally vote Tory in GEs but certainly would not so right now). But there is no sense of having given up on the Tories as such, any more than centrists gave up on Labour in the dark days of Corbyn.
    I think that is correct

    Conservative mps depose Boris and a new leader from Rishi , Truss, Hunt or Tugendhat with a clearance of cabinet inadequates of JRM, Dorries and a few others, would see a change of narrative

    I will rejoin on Boris's exit which is more than likely some time this year
    Hunt or Tugendhat are Remainers, I expect they would see barely any Remainers switch from Labour or LD to a Tories led by them post Brexit. However some Leavers currently voting Tory under Boris would likely switch to RefUK or Labour under them.

    Truss was a Remainer even if now a committed Leaver and a libertarian, I expect she would also see leakage to RefUK and Labour, especially in the redwall. I also doubt any voters currently voting Labour or LD switch to a Truss led Tories.

    Sunak as a Leaver is likely to see less switching to RefUK however I doubt he would win many voters from Labour or the LDs either. At most he might win a few voters back who voted for Cameron in 2015 but have voted LD for example since. However I also think he would not have the appeal Boris does to the white working class in the redwall
    Total tosh. I know loads of people like myself that would happily return to the Conservative Party if The Clown is kicked out. You are obsessed with "Leavers and Remainers" even though you were a "remainer" yourself. It is yesterdays war, and very few people but the most swivel-eyed care. All I want is a competent, fiscally sensible, business friendly, socially liberal Conservative party back. Not this populist incompetent crap that we will continue top have under your idol "Boris". Wake up: he is a fuckwit.
    And there are plenty I know where @HYFUD’s analysis is right. It will be a trade off but, on balance, I think @HYFUD is right.
    The problem is that even if @HYUFD is right for 90% of 2019 Conservative voters, that's still a fairly meaningful drop in the Conservative vote.
    Yes, but you are assuming that everything else stays the same, which it probably will not. Labour is seeing shifts away from it from other ethnic groups (Indian Hindu / Sikhs etc) plus a further drop off in traditional “Labour until I die” voters. Labour has been seeing structural shifts in its vote since 2005 at least. 2019 just accelerated many of those trends.

    And yet Labour are still ahead in the polls. Curious.
    And three to four months ago, we were talking on here about whether to bet on Labour having an opinion poll lead in 2021.

    Things change very quickly.
    ...and?
    Should be obvious given your post but I’ll spell it out.

    If the polls show the Conservatives back in the lead with the leads they had, on your principle we should assume the Conservatives are well on track for 2024.

    Now, I don’t believe that but I am merely taking your view that opinion polls are a guide to the future.
    FPT

    Um, no. You argued that Labour is seeing structural shifts away from its vote since 2005 at least.

    Although Labour has lost some of its old support, it has gained some more in the middle classes, otherwise it wouldn't be polling in the high 30s.

    So what is your argument? That the polls are wrong? That the polls will change?

    They may very well change, but they also might not.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,454
    Applicant said:

    FPT, too good not to repost.

    I love The Guardian, they've followed my lead and realised there is no distinction between people from Newcastle and Sunderland.

    With a team from that part of the country being thrashed, it's a reasonable first guess.
    What does that say about Manchester United
  • JohnO said:

    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    Oh well, that was my planned viewing tonight. Still will be….though others here have also panned it.
    Have to admit, I'm looking forward to Operation Mincemeat even more now, that looks a cracker of a film, out in April I think.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Nadine s pork pie tweet must have been worth 4 letters to Graham, minimum

    I think Johnson is going down on a vonc and we'll all say we knew it all asking
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,274
    JohnO said:

    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    Oh well, that was my planned viewing tonight. Still will be….though others here have also panned it.
    It is honestly terrible. Nothing happens - at least, nothing stirring or unpredictable

    Fuck knows how that awful script got a green light. I suspect Covid desperation. They wanted material - anything to fill the slots and keep people subbing
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    edited January 2022

    Vaguely on topic, I started writing a thread entitled 'Are you mad for Nad?'

    It was about whether Nadine Dorries might be the Tory leader and/or PM.

    I couldn't finish it because I was that upset that this is what my party has come to.

    Do we have a name for your Type yet? The anti-Bozo rejoiners?

    EDIT: The "anti-Bozo rejoiners" isn't my suggestion of the name - it's just the best way to describe you lot at the moment. We need a catchy name.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,630
    edited January 2022
    JBriskin3 said:

    Vaguely on topic, I started writing a thread entitled 'Are you mad for Nad?'

    It was about whether Nadine Dorries might be the Tory leader and/or PM.

    I couldn't finish it because I was that upset that this is what my party has come to.

    Do we have a name for your Type yet? The anti-Bozo rejoiners?
    The Maquis or the Patriots.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    JBriskin3 said:

    Vaguely on topic, I started writing a thread entitled 'Are you mad for Nad?'

    It was about whether Nadine Dorries might be the Tory leader and/or PM.

    I couldn't finish it because I was that upset that this is what my party has come to.

    Do we have a name for your Type yet? The anti-Bozo rejoiners?
    The Maquis or the Patriots.
    de Sad.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,912
    edited January 2022
    Of course even if Boris goes, Boris loyalists like Dorries and Rees Mogg would not make life easier for his successor. When Thatcher was replaced by Major in 1990 Thatcherite rebels were a constant thorn in his side and after his narrow 1992 general election win it was all downhill from there with the Tories beset by disunity and division.

    After Major's landslide 1997 defeat the Tories returned to increasingly Thatcherite leaders anyway under Hague, IDS and Howard
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,368
    edited January 2022

    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MrEd said:

    HYUFD said:

    algarkirk said:

    Roger said:

    Anyone think this BJ thing is over listen to Any Answers. Listen particularly for ex John Major's Private Secretary (or similar). Hilarious. I'm not not talking studio audience I'm talking about the phone in afterwards. As a human being Johnson's finished

    Most of the habitual Tories I know would not vote Tory today, or so they say. (I generally vote Tory in GEs but certainly would not so right now). But there is no sense of having given up on the Tories as such, any more than centrists gave up on Labour in the dark days of Corbyn.
    I think that is correct

    Conservative mps depose Boris and a new leader from Rishi , Truss, Hunt or Tugendhat with a clearance of cabinet inadequates of JRM, Dorries and a few others, would see a change of narrative

    I will rejoin on Boris's exit which is more than likely some time this year
    Hunt or Tugendhat are Remainers, I expect they would see barely any Remainers switch from Labour or LD to a Tories led by them post Brexit. However some Leavers currently voting Tory under Boris would likely switch to RefUK or Labour under them.

    Truss was a Remainer even if now a committed Leaver and a libertarian, I expect she would also see leakage to RefUK and Labour, especially in the redwall. I also doubt any voters currently voting Labour or LD switch to a Truss led Tories.

    Sunak as a Leaver is likely to see less switching to RefUK however I doubt he would win many voters from Labour or the LDs either. At most he might win a few voters back who voted for Cameron in 2015 but have voted LD for example since. However I also think he would not have the appeal Boris does to the white working class in the redwall
    Total tosh. I know loads of people like myself that would happily return to the Conservative Party if The Clown is kicked out. You are obsessed with "Leavers and Remainers" even though you were a "remainer" yourself. It is yesterdays war, and very few people but the most swivel-eyed care. All I want is a competent, fiscally sensible, business friendly, socially liberal Conservative party back. Not this populist incompetent crap that we will continue top have under your idol "Boris". Wake up: he is a fuckwit.
    And there are plenty I know where @HYFUD’s analysis is right. It will be a trade off but, on balance, I think @HYFUD is right.
    The problem is that even if @HYUFD is right for 90% of 2019 Conservative voters, that's still a fairly meaningful drop in the Conservative vote.
    Yes, but you are assuming that everything else stays the same, which it probably will not. Labour is seeing shifts away from it from other ethnic groups (Indian Hindu / Sikhs etc) plus a further drop off in traditional “Labour until I die” voters. Labour has been seeing structural shifts in its vote since 2005 at least. 2019 just accelerated many of those trends.

    And yet Labour are still ahead in the polls. Curious.
    And three to four months ago, we were talking on here about whether to bet on Labour having an opinion poll lead in 2021.

    Things change very quickly.
    ...and?
    Should be obvious given your post but I’ll spell it out.

    If the polls show the Conservatives back in the lead with the leads they had, on your principle we should assume the Conservatives are well on track for 2024.

    Now, I don’t believe that but I am merely taking your view that opinion polls are a guide to the future.
    FPT

    Um, no. You argued that Labour is seeing structural shifts away from its vote since 2005 at least.

    Although Labour has lost some of its old support, it has gained some more in the middle classes, otherwise it wouldn't be polling in the high 30s.

    So what is your argument? That the polls are wrong? That the polls will change?

    They may very well change, but they also might not.
    I always had the polls tightening in Labour's favour post April 2022 (from its 12 monthly constant of low 30s) when the economy started to look uncomfortable for the Conservatives.

    The current state of affairs is an unexpected bonus. As the memory of Partygate fades I predict nip and tuck parity, but after April it could be less than optimal for the Conservatives, unless Putin can help them along.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,400
    Leon said:

    JohnO said:

    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    Oh well, that was my planned viewing tonight. Still will be….though others here have also panned it.
    It is honestly terrible. Nothing happens - at least, nothing stirring or unpredictable

    Fuck knows how that awful script got a green light. I suspect Covid desperation. They wanted material - anything to fill the slots and keep people subbing
    Yep.
    Thought Jeremy Irons was good, mind.
  • ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379
    HYUFD said:

    Of course even if Boris goes, Boris loyalists like Dorries and Rees Mogg would not make life easier for his successor. When Thatcher was replaced by Major in 1990 Thatcherite rebels were a constant thorn in his side and after his narrow 1992 general election win it was all downhill from there with the Tories beset by unity and division.

    After Major's landslide 1997 defeat the Tories returned to increasingly Thatcherite leaders anyway under Hague, IDS and Howard

    Yeah, that worked so well it should be repeated.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,912
    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    We quite enjoyed it. Jeremy Irons was excellent as Chamberlain.

    Certainly better than some of the other stuff on Netflix
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,274
    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    JohnO said:

    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    Oh well, that was my planned viewing tonight. Still will be….though others here have also panned it.
    It is honestly terrible. Nothing happens - at least, nothing stirring or unpredictable

    Fuck knows how that awful script got a green light. I suspect Covid desperation. They wanted material - anything to fill the slots and keep people subbing
    Yep.
    Thought Jeremy Irons was good, mind.
    Yes, he is the only good thing in it. But he is good, Otherwise, a waste of anyone’s time
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,912

    At least Mike didn't use that photo of Nadine wearing that bloody stupid Indiana Jones hat.

    I am actually quite a fan of Nadine who is MP for the constituency next to mine.
    Indeed, Nadine got 59.8% of the vote in 2019 in Mid Bedfordshire, she will be there for years to come
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,908
    They are the two least likely to ever get a job under any other leader?
  • JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,291

    JohnO said:

    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    Oh well, that was my planned viewing tonight. Still will be….though others here have also panned it.
    Have to admit, I'm looking forward to Operation Mincemeat even more now, that looks a cracker of a film, out in April I think.
    Thanks for the advance notice….will that also be on Netflix? I need to justify my subscription!
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,874
    Late afternoon all :)

    Out and about today - very pleasant pub lunch in the depths of Kent and given the spring-like weather, plenty of people out and about.

    The London Underground continues to confuse - trains are busy but there aren't many of them on some lines. My part of the District line was running an 8-minute service this morning which is curious as more people are travelling at weekends than on weekdays irrespective of the so-called "great return" to work.

    Vaguely on topic, we have of course a small but vocal number of Uber-loyalists to the Prime Minister on here. I can think of five or six who seem wiling to die in the ditch with the Prime Minister so we'll see if they stay uberly-loyal (probably not a word) once the various reports emerge (though I suspect dealing with the next Ice Age may be a more immediate concern).
  • JohnO said:

    JohnO said:

    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    Oh well, that was my planned viewing tonight. Still will be….though others here have also panned it.
    Have to admit, I'm looking forward to Operation Mincemeat even more now, that looks a cracker of a film, out in April I think.
    Thanks for the advance notice….will that also be on Netflix? I need to justify my subscription!
    Nope, cinema in the UK.
  • HYUFD said:

    Of course even if Boris goes, Boris loyalists like Dorries and Rees Mogg would not make life easier for his successor. When Thatcher was replaced by Major in 1990 Thatcherite rebels were a constant thorn in his side and after his narrow 1992 general election win it was all downhill from there with the Tories beset by unity and division.

    After Major's landslide 1997 defeat the Tories returned to increasingly Thatcherite leaders anyway under Hague, IDS and Howard

    And you think the conservatives aren't beset by division now, both in their mps and across the country

    Frankly, the party is a shambles much like Boris
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,410
    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    Jeremy Irons is good. He looks and sounds like Chamberlain. But, he's basically a walk-on part. The Hitler looks and sounds nothing like Hitler. And what I thought the film was trying to achieve wasn't really what it was about.

    It's basically about two university friends, one German and one English, and how they get caught up in 1930s politics - which is a slow and confused story that jumps around - with no real payoff. German guy: he's pro, and then he becomes anti, because he realises the Nazis really mean business with the Jews, and then we belatedly find out his girlfriend was one all along? Eh? The drama of the conference and the high politics of the situation is only flirted with, and you're left never really understanding why Hitler wanted to deal or why.

    That said it at least shows another side to Chamberlain towards the end, which is something.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578

    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    MrEd said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MrEd said:

    HYUFD said:

    algarkirk said:

    Roger said:

    Anyone think this BJ thing is over listen to Any Answers. Listen particularly for ex John Major's Private Secretary (or similar). Hilarious. I'm not not talking studio audience I'm talking about the phone in afterwards. As a human being Johnson's finished

    Most of the habitual Tories I know would not vote Tory today, or so they say. (I generally vote Tory in GEs but certainly would not so right now). But there is no sense of having given up on the Tories as such, any more than centrists gave up on Labour in the dark days of Corbyn.
    I think that is correct

    Conservative mps depose Boris and a new leader from Rishi , Truss, Hunt or Tugendhat with a clearance of cabinet inadequates of JRM, Dorries and a few others, would see a change of narrative

    I will rejoin on Boris's exit which is more than likely some time this year
    Hunt or Tugendhat are Remainers, I expect they would see barely any Remainers switch from Labour or LD to a Tories led by them post Brexit. However some Leavers currently voting Tory under Boris would likely switch to RefUK or Labour under them.

    Truss was a Remainer even if now a committed Leaver and a libertarian, I expect she would also see leakage to RefUK and Labour, especially in the redwall. I also doubt any voters currently voting Labour or LD switch to a Truss led Tories.

    Sunak as a Leaver is likely to see less switching to RefUK however I doubt he would win many voters from Labour or the LDs either. At most he might win a few voters back who voted for Cameron in 2015 but have voted LD for example since. However I also think he would not have the appeal Boris does to the white working class in the redwall
    Total tosh. I know loads of people like myself that would happily return to the Conservative Party if The Clown is kicked out. You are obsessed with "Leavers and Remainers" even though you were a "remainer" yourself. It is yesterdays war, and very few people but the most swivel-eyed care. All I want is a competent, fiscally sensible, business friendly, socially liberal Conservative party back. Not this populist incompetent crap that we will continue top have under your idol "Boris". Wake up: he is a fuckwit.
    And there are plenty I know where @HYFUD’s analysis is right. It will be a trade off but, on balance, I think @HYFUD is right.
    The problem is that even if @HYUFD is right for 90% of 2019 Conservative voters, that's still a fairly meaningful drop in the Conservative vote.
    Yes, but you are assuming that everything else stays the same, which it probably will not. Labour is seeing shifts away from it from other ethnic groups (Indian Hindu / Sikhs etc) plus a further drop off in traditional “Labour until I die” voters. Labour has been seeing structural shifts in its vote since 2005 at least. 2019 just accelerated many of those trends.

    And yet Labour are still ahead in the polls. Curious.
    And three to four months ago, we were talking on here about whether to bet on Labour having an opinion poll lead in 2021.

    Things change very quickly.
    ...and?
    Should be obvious given your post but I’ll spell it out.

    If the polls show the Conservatives back in the lead with the leads they had, on your principle we should assume the Conservatives are well on track for 2024.

    Now, I don’t believe that but I am merely taking your view that opinion polls are a guide to the future.
    FPT

    Um, no. You argued that Labour is seeing structural shifts away from its vote since 2005 at least.

    Although Labour has lost some of its old support, it has gained some more in the middle classes, otherwise it wouldn't be polling in the high 30s.

    So what is your argument? That the polls are wrong? That the polls will change?

    They may very well change, but they also might not.
    Let’s go back to the beginning.

    @rcs1000 stated even if the Tories lost only 10% of the 2019 vote, they would be in trouble. I pointed out Labour was seeing structural shifts away from it that could offset that impact.

    You then made the point that the opinion polls were showing Labour in a lead. I pointed out a few months back we were asking whether Labour would see a poll lead. Namely, polls change quickly.

    So, yes, the point is that polls can change. 6 months ago, we were writing off SKS. Now we are writing off BJ. A bit unwise.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    BTW, has anyone heard from @CorrectHorseBattery ? Haven’t heard from him in a while

  • The second problem is that Dominic Cummings, Johnson’s former senior aide, has signalled that further revelations about the prime minister’s chaotic administration are likely as long as he remains in post. This weekend two sources have revealed that in early 2020 Cummings ordered a crackdown on highly classified intelligence papers being put in Johnson’s ministerial red box.

    It is understood that he acted after visiting the family flat and finding highly classified “STRAP” material, easily identifiable because it is printed on pink paper, lying around where it could be read by any visitor. It was also found in the upstairs quarters at Chequers.

    One source compared the scene, where Carrie Johnson entertained friends, to “a frat house”.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/is-boris-johnson-wriggling-free-of-partygate-hn9rlbkrw
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,274
    MrEd said:

    BTW, has anyone heard from @CorrectHorseBattery ? Haven’t heard from him in a while

    He/she/they was on here a couple of days ago. All good
  • Despite his escapology last week, three strategic problems still loom for Johnson. The first is that he may have to anger his wife, Carrie, to please his MPs. Johnson told some last week that he is ready to remove some of her friends from their posts in No 10.

    One ally even speculated last week that the best plan for the prime minister would be for his wife and family to move out of Downing Street altogether. Another pronounced this a “total non-starter” for security reasons. “The protection squad would veto it.”

    A purge could be made easier by claims in Whitehall that Gray has discovered that several of Carrie Johnson’s friends had the access Pin code to the private flat above 11 Downing Street so they could come and go at will.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    Leon said:

    MrEd said:

    BTW, has anyone heard from @CorrectHorseBattery ? Haven’t heard from him in a while

    He/she/they was on here a couple of days ago. All good
    Ah very good to hear.
  • However, it has now emerged that, as part of Sue Gray’s investigation into lockdown socialising in the flat, “several” of Carrie Johnson’s friends were given the access code Pin to go in and out of the Downing Street flat at will.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,826
    I see Tom Tugendhat has raised his standard as a leadership candidate. Frankly I'd be happy to see a contest soon not just to get rid of Johnson but also to have the current shower of a cabinet turfed out, Sunak and Wallace excepted.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,695

    However, it has now emerged that, as part of Sue Gray’s investigation into lockdown socialising in the flat, “several” of Carrie Johnson’s friends were given the access code Pin to go in and out of the Downing Street flat at will.

    Hope none of these friends are rushing to leave the country.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631

    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    Jeremy Irons is good. He looks and sounds like Chamberlain. But, he's basically a walk-on part. The Hitler looks and sounds nothing like Hitler. And what I thought the film was trying to achieve wasn't really what it was about.

    It's basically about two university friends, one German and one English, and how they get caught up in 1930s politics - which is a slow and confused story that jumps around - with no real payoff. German guy: he's pro, and then he becomes anti, because he realises the Nazis really mean business with the Jews, and then we belatedly find out his girlfriend was one all along? Eh? The drama of the conference and the high politics of the situation is only flirted with, and you're left never really understanding why Hitler wanted to deal or why.

    That said it at least shows another side to Chamberlain towards the end, which is something.
    Yes, I thought the same. The plot of the university friends was both plodding and implausible. Irons was very good indeed. Hitler was not. None of the evil charisma of the man in his prime.

    There is a good film to be made one day over the drift to war, and the futile efforts to stop it, but this isn't it.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    The second problem is that Dominic Cummings, Johnson’s former senior aide, has signalled that further revelations about the prime minister’s chaotic administration are likely as long as he remains in post. This weekend two sources have revealed that in early 2020 Cummings ordered a crackdown on highly classified intelligence papers being put in Johnson’s ministerial red box.

    It is understood that he acted after visiting the family flat and finding highly classified “STRAP” material, easily identifiable because it is printed on pink paper, lying around where it could be read by any visitor. It was also found in the upstairs quarters at Chequers.

    One source compared the scene, where Carrie Johnson entertained friends, to “a frat house”.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/is-boris-johnson-wriggling-free-of-partygate-hn9rlbkrw

    Fucking hell

    Army needs to step in
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    edited January 2022
    I remember when copyright law stopped us quoting more than a paragraph from the dailies-

    Has the law changed Mr Lawyer @TheScreamingEagles ?
  • Despite his escapology last week, three strategic problems still loom for Johnson. The first is that he may have to anger his wife, Carrie, to please his MPs. Johnson told some last week that he is ready to remove some of her friends from their posts in No 10.

    One ally even speculated last week that the best plan for the prime minister would be for his wife and family to move out of Downing Street altogether. Another pronounced this a “total non-starter” for security reasons. “The protection squad would veto it.”

    A purge could be made easier by claims in Whitehall that Gray has discovered that several of Carrie Johnson’s friends had the access Pin code to the private flat above 11 Downing Street so they could come and go at will.

    If it meant he could stay in No 10 a bit longer, he'd dump Carrie, wouldn't he?
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    So what were you expecting. I thought it was OK. Must remember to ignore your film reviews
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,028
    If Boris is in his flat with secret papers overflowing from briefing boxes, it shouldn’t even be a question about him keeping his job.

    He doesn’t give a shit
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Despite his escapology last week, three strategic problems still loom for Johnson. The first is that he may have to anger his wife, Carrie, to please his MPs. Johnson told some last week that he is ready to remove some of her friends from their posts in No 10.

    One ally even speculated last week that the best plan for the prime minister would be for his wife and family to move out of Downing Street altogether. Another pronounced this a “total non-starter” for security reasons. “The protection squad would veto it.”

    A purge could be made easier by claims in Whitehall that Gray has discovered that several of Carrie Johnson’s friends had the access Pin code to the private flat above 11 Downing Street so they could come and go at will.

    If it meant he could stay in No 10 a bit longer, he'd dump Carrie, wouldn't he?
    She would sell her story to the press
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,410

    Political anecdata from bluest Surrey - I'm noticing a moderate increase in Labour membership, activity and interest on the doorstep, after a year when people were preoccupied with the pandemic and barely active on the political side. Some of that is very explicitly about Boris Johnson, but there's a more general "time for a change from the Tories" starting to build among floating voters which I've not really seen for a while - "Honestly, I'm bored of their squabbles, maybe you can do better", as one said. At a national level, Ann Black (on the NEC) reports something similar.

    It's not dramatic and it's more anti-Tory than pro-Labour, but I've been around enough to recognise a shift in mood.

    I'd agree with that. I have no interest in voting Tory at the moment: they offer nothing for me. It all feels a bit 1995 to me.

    The difference is that Labour are nowhere near where they were under Blair. Also, they haven't fully modernised and addressed their weaknesses: immigration and identity politics is Labour's Achilles heel amongst many floating voters - and it's clear to me that turning it up to 11 is one of the first things they'll do - but if the economy goes down the tubes or people are taxed/priced into oblivion they might still get in regardless.
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    JBriskin3 said:

    I remember when copyright law stopped us quoting more than a paragraph from the dailies-

    Has the law changed Mr Lawyer @TheScreamingEagles ?

    We have to be careful and I have received solicitor letters on behalf of media owners a couple of times. Short clips are OK
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,630
    edited January 2022
    IshmaelZ said:

    The second problem is that Dominic Cummings, Johnson’s former senior aide, has signalled that further revelations about the prime minister’s chaotic administration are likely as long as he remains in post. This weekend two sources have revealed that in early 2020 Cummings ordered a crackdown on highly classified intelligence papers being put in Johnson’s ministerial red box.

    It is understood that he acted after visiting the family flat and finding highly classified “STRAP” material, easily identifiable because it is printed on pink paper, lying around where it could be read by any visitor. It was also found in the upstairs quarters at Chequers.

    One source compared the scene, where Carrie Johnson entertained friends, to “a frat house”.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/is-boris-johnson-wriggling-free-of-partygate-hn9rlbkrw

    Fucking hell

    Army needs to step in
    Gets worse.

    Cummings and Martin Reynolds, Johnson’s principal private secretary, agreed the prime minister should only be given sensitive papers for signature in his office. “Cummings spoke to the PPS and they agreed on new protocols to stop sensitive STRAP material going to the flat or upstairs at Chequers,” one former No 10 source said. “Instead material was to be shown to the PM downstairs in No 10 or Chequers then immediately returned to safekeeping.”

    A third source said Johnson’s ministerial box was left outside the door of the flat on Saturdays. “It would be there in the morning and often still there in the evening,” the official said. “He wouldn’t have touched it.”
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Exclusive: Downing Street will next unveil a prime ministerial business council which includes bosses from companies such as Microsoft, Graphcore, Burberry and Virgin Atlantic; for the first time, exactly half the members of such a forum will be women.

    https://twitter.com/MarkKleinmanSky/status/1487484232066912257

    Shagger on the pull, amazing what a captainess of industry will do for a peerage
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254

    JBriskin3 said:

    I remember when copyright law stopped us quoting more than a paragraph from the dailies-

    Has the law changed Mr Lawyer @TheScreamingEagles ?

    We have to be careful and I have received solicitor letters on behalf of media owners a couple of times. Short clips are OK
    Thanks for clarifying Mr Smithson. I can't afford a newspaper subscription so I should be ok.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,822
    IshmaelZ said:

    Despite his escapology last week, three strategic problems still loom for Johnson. The first is that he may have to anger his wife, Carrie, to please his MPs. Johnson told some last week that he is ready to remove some of her friends from their posts in No 10.

    One ally even speculated last week that the best plan for the prime minister would be for his wife and family to move out of Downing Street altogether. Another pronounced this a “total non-starter” for security reasons. “The protection squad would veto it.”

    A purge could be made easier by claims in Whitehall that Gray has discovered that several of Carrie Johnson’s friends had the access Pin code to the private flat above 11 Downing Street so they could come and go at will.

    If it meant he could stay in No 10 a bit longer, he'd dump Carrie, wouldn't he?
    She would sell her story to the press
    I do wonder if she has signed the Official Secrets Act? An interesting point.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631

    IshmaelZ said:

    The second problem is that Dominic Cummings, Johnson’s former senior aide, has signalled that further revelations about the prime minister’s chaotic administration are likely as long as he remains in post. This weekend two sources have revealed that in early 2020 Cummings ordered a crackdown on highly classified intelligence papers being put in Johnson’s ministerial red box.

    It is understood that he acted after visiting the family flat and finding highly classified “STRAP” material, easily identifiable because it is printed on pink paper, lying around where it could be read by any visitor. It was also found in the upstairs quarters at Chequers.

    One source compared the scene, where Carrie Johnson entertained friends, to “a frat house”.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/is-boris-johnson-wriggling-free-of-partygate-hn9rlbkrw

    Fucking hell

    Army needs to step in
    Gets worse.

    Cummings and Martin Reynolds, Johnson’s principal private secretary, agreed the prime minister should only be given sensitive papers for signature in his office. “Cummings spoke to the PPS and they agreed on new protocols to stop sensitive STRAP material going to the flat or upstairs at Chequers,” one former No 10 source said. “Instead material was to be shown to the PM downstairs in No 10 or Chequers then immediately returned to safekeeping.”

    A third source said Johnson’s ministerial box was left outside the door of the flat on Saturdays. “It would be there in the morning and often still there in the evening,” the official said. “He wouldn’t have touched it.”
    I expect that he was on the job indoors.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    HYUFD said:

    At least Mike didn't use that photo of Nadine wearing that bloody stupid Indiana Jones hat.

    I am actually quite a fan of Nadine who is MP for the constituency next to mine.
    Indeed, Nadine got 59.8% of the vote in 2019 in Mid Bedfordshire, she will be there for years to come
    Have a look at how well Tony Newton did in ‘defending’ Braintree in 1997.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/01/29/tory-voters-really-think-boris-partygate/

    Wall to wall Boris hatred

    I'm already balls deep in gone by end Q1, but 5 looks tremendous value (smarkets, no liquidity, mind)
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,984
    Lord help us.

    Always worth imagining what prominent present-day politicians would do if transplanted back to some shocking autocracy of the past or present.

    I have no difficulty imagining JRM being in charge of packing them off to the camps/gulags/re-education facilities.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,375

    IshmaelZ said:

    The second problem is that Dominic Cummings, Johnson’s former senior aide, has signalled that further revelations about the prime minister’s chaotic administration are likely as long as he remains in post. This weekend two sources have revealed that in early 2020 Cummings ordered a crackdown on highly classified intelligence papers being put in Johnson’s ministerial red box.

    It is understood that he acted after visiting the family flat and finding highly classified “STRAP” material, easily identifiable because it is printed on pink paper, lying around where it could be read by any visitor. It was also found in the upstairs quarters at Chequers.

    One source compared the scene, where Carrie Johnson entertained friends, to “a frat house”.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/is-boris-johnson-wriggling-free-of-partygate-hn9rlbkrw

    Fucking hell

    Army needs to step in
    Gets worse.

    Cummings and Martin Reynolds, Johnson’s principal private secretary, agreed the prime minister should only be given sensitive papers for signature in his office. “Cummings spoke to the PPS and they agreed on new protocols to stop sensitive STRAP material going to the flat or upstairs at Chequers,” one former No 10 source said. “Instead material was to be shown to the PM downstairs in No 10 or Chequers then immediately returned to safekeeping.”

    A third source said Johnson’s ministerial box was left outside the door of the flat on Saturdays. “It would be there in the morning and often still there in the evening,” the official said. “He wouldn’t have touched it.”
    Lots of different sources here - 'one former No 10 source'; a 'third source'. Sounds to me like Cummings is adopting multiple identities to drip feed dirt to his contacts. He probably learned this technique from PB.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,190

    Leon said:

    My God, Munich the Netflix movie is bad. Like, monumentally bad

    Inert acting, laborious screenplay, terrible “plot”, no drama, insane non-existent twists, nice costumes, no wit, no fun, fucking hell

    I get that the original material is possibly a bit shit. But jeez. The theme is so fertile?

    This is what happens when a company like Netflix has all the money and zero ideas

    So what were you expecting. I thought it was OK. Must remember to ignore your film reviews
    They can be misleading. I watched "Don't look up" last week. It was totally feeble, boring and predictable. I stuck with it, partly because Leon had been raving about how the film insulted Trump supporters and for the first hour and a half there was no sign of this at all - and almost no sign of it in the last hour either. Instead, the targets of the "humour" were corrupt coastal elites, celebrity culture, and the media. The usual suspects. Definitely a complete waste of time (but apparently evidence that the Democratic Party are "completely insane", though I don't think they were involved in making this rubbish).
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,912
    edited January 2022

    HYUFD said:

    At least Mike didn't use that photo of Nadine wearing that bloody stupid Indiana Jones hat.

    I am actually quite a fan of Nadine who is MP for the constituency next to mine.
    Indeed, Nadine got 59.8% of the vote in 2019 in Mid Bedfordshire, she will be there for years to come
    Have a look at how well Tony Newton did in ‘defending’ Braintree in 1997.
    Newton only got 52% in 1992, even on the same swing in Braintree in 1997 in Mid Bedfordshire in 2024 Dorries would hold the seat comfortably with a 10% majority over Labour
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,405
    MrEd said:

    BTW, has anyone heard from @CorrectHorseBattery ? Haven’t heard from him in a while

    He did pop in a day or two ago, but no meaningful contribution. Shame. He will be loving the way the polls have turned. Maybe still licking his wounds after his hysteria about Covid was shown to be just that?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,706
    JBriskin3 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    I remember when copyright law stopped us quoting more than a paragraph from the dailies-

    Has the law changed Mr Lawyer @TheScreamingEagles ?

    We have to be careful and I have received solicitor letters on behalf of media owners a couple of times. Short clips are OK
    Thanks for clarifying Mr Smithson. I can't afford a newspaper subscription so I should be ok.
    Comes under Fair Dealing in copyright legal terms I think.

    CH 4 have a handy, if long guide on all this, but obviously it is aimed at film clips rather than newspapers:

    https://www.channel4.com/producers-handbook/c4-guidelines/fair-dealing-guidelines
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    MrEd said:

    BTW, has anyone heard from @CorrectHorseBattery ? Haven’t heard from him in a while

    He did pop in a day or two ago, but no meaningful contribution. Shame. He will be loving the way the polls have turned. Maybe still licking his wounds after his hysteria about Covid was shown to be just that?
    time running out on OGH bet on con lead by end jan...
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,400
    MrEd said:

    BTW, has anyone heard from @CorrectHorseBattery ? Haven’t heard from him in a while

    He's taking a break from posting.
    Still lurking and well, thanks.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398

    Political anecdata from bluest Surrey - I'm noticing a moderate increase in Labour membership, activity and interest on the doorstep, after a year when people were preoccupied with the pandemic and barely active on the political side. Some of that is very explicitly about Boris Johnson, but there's a more general "time for a change from the Tories" starting to build among floating voters which I've not really seen for a while - "Honestly, I'm bored of their squabbles, maybe you can do better", as one said. At a national level, Ann Black (on the NEC) reports something similar.

    It's not dramatic and it's more anti-Tory than pro-Labour, but I've been around enough to recognise a shift in mood.

    I'd agree with that. I have no interest in voting Tory at the moment: they offer nothing for me. It all feels a bit 1995 to me.

    The difference is that Labour are nowhere near where they were under Blair. Also, they haven't fully modernised and addressed their weaknesses: immigration and identity politics is Labour's Achilles heel amongst many floating voters - and it's clear to me that turning it up to 11 is one of the first things they'll do - but if the economy goes down the tubes or people are taxed/priced into oblivion they might still get in regardless.
    I could probably vote for either conservative or labour at the moment. I am now a floating voter. The main positive about Labour is Starmer, the main positive about the tories being their backbenchers. And I am actually in a labour/conservative marginal seat, my vote could make all the difference.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,032
    edited January 2022
    Senior conservation mps want full report

    And quite right - we all must demand the full report now and sack Dick if necessary

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60183030
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,748

    The second problem is that Dominic Cummings, Johnson’s former senior aide, has signalled that further revelations about the prime minister’s chaotic administration are likely as long as he remains in post. This weekend two sources have revealed that in early 2020 Cummings ordered a crackdown on highly classified intelligence papers being put in Johnson’s ministerial red box.

    It is understood that he acted after visiting the family flat and finding highly classified “STRAP” material, easily identifiable because it is printed on pink paper, lying around where it could be read by any visitor. It was also found in the upstairs quarters at Chequers.

    One source compared the scene, where Carrie Johnson entertained friends, to “a frat house”.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/is-boris-johnson-wriggling-free-of-partygate-hn9rlbkrw

    Whatever next? They found the baby playing with the nuclear button?
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    IshmaelZ said:

    The second problem is that Dominic Cummings, Johnson’s former senior aide, has signalled that further revelations about the prime minister’s chaotic administration are likely as long as he remains in post. This weekend two sources have revealed that in early 2020 Cummings ordered a crackdown on highly classified intelligence papers being put in Johnson’s ministerial red box.

    It is understood that he acted after visiting the family flat and finding highly classified “STRAP” material, easily identifiable because it is printed on pink paper, lying around where it could be read by any visitor. It was also found in the upstairs quarters at Chequers.

    One source compared the scene, where Carrie Johnson entertained friends, to “a frat house”.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/is-boris-johnson-wriggling-free-of-partygate-hn9rlbkrw

    Fucking hell

    Army needs to step in
    Gets worse.

    Cummings and Martin Reynolds, Johnson’s principal private secretary, agreed the prime minister should only be given sensitive papers for signature in his office. “Cummings spoke to the PPS and they agreed on new protocols to stop sensitive STRAP material going to the flat or upstairs at Chequers,” one former No 10 source said. “Instead material was to be shown to the PM downstairs in No 10 or Chequers then immediately returned to safekeeping.”

    A third source said Johnson’s ministerial box was left outside the door of the flat on Saturdays. “It would be there in the morning and often still there in the evening,” the official said. “He wouldn’t have touched it.”
    Lots of different sources here - 'one former No 10 source'; a 'third source'. Sounds to me like Cummings is adopting multiple identities to drip feed dirt to his contacts. He probably learned this technique from PB.
    Proper journalists are probably quite good at verifying their sources

    If there's a Cummings/PPS conv reported by a former DS source, and the PPS is a current DS source, that does narrow it down though
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,424
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    At least Mike didn't use that photo of Nadine wearing that bloody stupid Indiana Jones hat.

    I am actually quite a fan of Nadine who is MP for the constituency next to mine.
    Indeed, Nadine got 59.8% of the vote in 2019 in Mid Bedfordshire, she will be there for years to come
    Have a look at how well Tony Newton did in ‘defending’ Braintree in 1997.
    Newton only got 52% in 1992, even on the same swing in Braintree in 1997 in Mid Bedfordshire in 2024 Dorries would hold the seat comfortably with a 10% majority over Labour
    Too simplistic, I think. What happened in 1997 was that the non Tory vote coalesced around Alan Hurst.
    I met both of them; Hurst was a really nice guy and a good constituency MP.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    edited January 2022
    In fact, building on my last comment, my optimum scenario would perhaps be Keir Starmer leading the tories. I am a total centrist dad.
  • darkage said:

    In fact, building on my last comment, my optimum scenario would perhaps be Keir Starmer leading the tories. I am a total centrist dad.

    You will have @BJO agreeing with you
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373
    edited January 2022

    IshmaelZ said:

    The second problem is that Dominic Cummings, Johnson’s former senior aide, has signalled that further revelations about the prime minister’s chaotic administration are likely as long as he remains in post. This weekend two sources have revealed that in early 2020 Cummings ordered a crackdown on highly classified intelligence papers being put in Johnson’s ministerial red box.

    It is understood that he acted after visiting the family flat and finding highly classified “STRAP” material, easily identifiable because it is printed on pink paper, lying around where it could be read by any visitor. It was also found in the upstairs quarters at Chequers.

    One source compared the scene, where Carrie Johnson entertained friends, to “a frat house”.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/is-boris-johnson-wriggling-free-of-partygate-hn9rlbkrw

    Fucking hell

    Army needs to step in
    Gets worse.

    Cummings and Martin Reynolds, Johnson’s principal private secretary, agreed the prime minister should only be given sensitive papers for signature in his office. “Cummings spoke to the PPS and they agreed on new protocols to stop sensitive STRAP material going to the flat or upstairs at Chequers,” one former No 10 source said. “Instead material was to be shown to the PM downstairs in No 10 or Chequers then immediately returned to safekeeping.”

    A third source said Johnson’s ministerial box was left outside the door of the flat on Saturdays. “It would be there in the morning and often still there in the evening,” the official said. “He wouldn’t have touched it.”
    Lots of different sources here - 'one former No 10 source'; a 'third source'. Sounds to me like Cummings is adopting multiple identities to drip feed dirt to his contacts. He probably learned this technique from PB.
    Or from Harold Wilson, who did exactly the same thing.

    Caused a few difficulties late in his premiership when he had the early stages of dementia and couldn't always remember who he was posing as when he leaked things. Or indeed that he had leaked things.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373

    Senior conservation mps want full report

    And quite right - we all must demand the full report now and sack Dick if necessary

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60183030

    This is getting more and more outrageous.

    I'm now finding myself in agreement with Richard Burgon *And* Sir Christopher Chope.

    This is just awful.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,400
    Course, if you fancy reading Top Secret papers, having the pin code is a no brainer.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,373
    dixiedean said:

    Course, if you fancy reading Top Secret papers, having the pin code is a no brainer.

    They'll be flogging the pin code for pin money next though and that's when shit will hit the fan...
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,706
    Tres said:

    However, it has now emerged that, as part of Sue Gray’s investigation into lockdown socialising in the flat, “several” of Carrie Johnson’s friends were given the access code Pin to go in and out of the Downing Street flat at will.

    Hope none of these friends are rushing to leave the country.
    Has PC Dick blocked Gray's report because they are now looking at breaks in the Official Secrets Act? Far more serious than on the piss in lockdown perhaps??
  • ydoethur said:

    Senior conservation mps want full report

    And quite right - we all must demand the full report now and sack Dick if necessary

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60183030

    This is getting more and more outrageous.

    I'm now finding myself in agreement with Richard Burgon *And* Sir Christopher Chope.

    This is just awful.
    It's worse than that, I'm also agreeing with Andrew Bridgen that Boris needs to go.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,839

    Senior conservation mps want full report

    And quite right - we all must demand the full report now and sack Dick if necessary

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-60183030

    A hollow performance. If they don't get what they pretend to want (which they won't) then they'll continue to blame the Met not the PM, and persist in supporting him. They want to do nothing. It's another excuse for doing nothing.
  • I expect when Boris appears with Sue Gray's redacted report. the fury across all sides will be palpable and may well see the letters going in

    This is wrong and an abuse of the electorate
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,706
    James Johnson
    @jamesjohnson252
    ·
    21m
    Our focus groups are not mellowing on Boris - if anything they’re getting worse

    https://twitter.com/jamesjohnson252/status/1487492357977260040

    ===

    Time and tide, Sunak. Time and tide...
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,912
    edited January 2022

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    At least Mike didn't use that photo of Nadine wearing that bloody stupid Indiana Jones hat.

    I am actually quite a fan of Nadine who is MP for the constituency next to mine.
    Indeed, Nadine got 59.8% of the vote in 2019 in Mid Bedfordshire, she will be there for years to come
    Have a look at how well Tony Newton did in ‘defending’ Braintree in 1997.
    Newton only got 52% in 1992, even on the same swing in Braintree in 1997 in Mid Bedfordshire in 2024 Dorries would hold the seat comfortably with a 10% majority over Labour
    Too simplistic, I think. What happened in 1997 was that the non Tory vote coalesced around Alan Hurst.
    I met both of them; Hurst was a really nice guy and a good constituency MP.
    So, I included exactly the same swing and tactical voting for Hurst and Labour in Mid Bedfordshire as occurred in Braintree in 1997 and Dorries still won comfortably.

    Mid Bedfordshire is comfortably in the top 150 safest Tory seats now and remember even in 1997 165 Tory MPs held on
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,288
    It is beyond laziness, it is beyond recklessness, it is beyond entitled not giving a damn, though they are all part of it.

    Can anyone seriously tell me any more that Boris doesn't have acute, uncontrolled, DSM-V adult ADD, and not content with embracing the worst angels of it as his identity, has entirely surrounded himself with people who feed those worst angels.

    There were ways of operating that could have seen him succeed much better than this in number 10, but he was either oblivious to the possibility or chose not to.

    Of course, some of his political talent comes from the same place, and letting Boris be Boris played its part in getting him here in the first place, so perhaps he feared being constrained by a more structured set up.

    But, good grief, the extent of the lack of constraint is more extraordinary by the day.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    darkage said:

    In fact, building on my last comment, my optimum scenario would perhaps be Keir Starmer leading the tories. I am a total centrist dad.

    That's more like the Saturday PB spirit!

    Living in Nippy's semi-autonomous paradise I'm not sure I will be able to consider Sir Keir's party for much longer-

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/keir-starmer-says-more-powers-26079744
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 1,254
    Pro_Rata said:

    It is beyond laziness, it is beyond recklessness, it is beyond entitled not giving a damn, though they are all part of it.

    Can anyone seriously tell me any more that Boris doesn't have acute, uncontrolled, DSM-V adult ADD, and not content with embracing the worst angels of it as his identity, has entirely surrounded himself with people who feed those worst angels.

    There were ways of operating that could have seen him succeed much better than this in number 10, but he was either oblivious to the possibility or chose not to.

    Of course, some of his political talent comes from the same place, and letting Boris be Boris played its part in getting him here in the first place, so perhaps he feared being constrained by a more structured set up.

    But, good grief, the extent of the lack of constraint is more extraordinary by the day.

    DSM lol

    Le'ts just hope you're not Borderline.
  • IshmaelZ said:

    The second problem is that Dominic Cummings, Johnson’s former senior aide, has signalled that further revelations about the prime minister’s chaotic administration are likely as long as he remains in post. This weekend two sources have revealed that in early 2020 Cummings ordered a crackdown on highly classified intelligence papers being put in Johnson’s ministerial red box.

    It is understood that he acted after visiting the family flat and finding highly classified “STRAP” material, easily identifiable because it is printed on pink paper, lying around where it could be read by any visitor. It was also found in the upstairs quarters at Chequers.

    One source compared the scene, where Carrie Johnson entertained friends, to “a frat house”.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/is-boris-johnson-wriggling-free-of-partygate-hn9rlbkrw

    Fucking hell

    Army needs to step in
    Gets worse.

    Cummings and Martin Reynolds, Johnson’s principal private secretary, agreed the prime minister should only be given sensitive papers for signature in his office. “Cummings spoke to the PPS and they agreed on new protocols to stop sensitive STRAP material going to the flat or upstairs at Chequers,” one former No 10 source said. “Instead material was to be shown to the PM downstairs in No 10 or Chequers then immediately returned to safekeeping.”

    A third source said Johnson’s ministerial box was left outside the door of the flat on Saturdays. “It would be there in the morning and often still there in the evening,” the official said. “He wouldn’t have touched it.”
    Lots of different sources here - 'one former No 10 source'; a 'third source'. Sounds to me like Cummings is adopting multiple identities to drip feed dirt to his contacts. He probably learned this technique from PB.
    Looks like Dom's moving on to Plan B here (or alternative Plan A): now that destroying Boris and replacing him with his protégé Rishi has been scuppered, he'll make Boris look so toxically arrogant, slapdash and downright dangerous that Boris will bring the entire Tory Party crashing down with him at the next election. This could get bloody.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,485

    FPT, too good not to repost.

    I love The Guardian, they've followed my lead and realised there is no distinction between people from Newcastle and Sunderland.

    LOL. I mean, there’s no doubt that geographically Sunderland is just a large suburb of Newcastle (same phone code, same Tube system FFS!) but confusing the two clubs… wow.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,874
    HYUFD said:

    Of course even if Boris goes, Boris loyalists like Dorries and Rees Mogg would not make life easier for his successor. When Thatcher was replaced by Major in 1990 Thatcherite rebels were a constant thorn in his side and after his narrow 1992 general election win it was all downhill from there with the Tories beset by unity and division.

    After Major's landslide 1997 defeat the Tories returned to increasingly Thatcherite leaders anyway under Hague, IDS and Howard

    It's fair to say parties suffering a severe defeat (whether after a period in office or not) do tend to go a bit "strange". I do think after a long period in office a party needs time to re-organise, reflect and rebuild.

    One of the most remarkable aspects of 1997 was not the fact or the size of the Conservative defeat which were both well sign posted but the way in which the Conservative political campaigning machine had atrophied after years in Government. Accounts from David Cameron, George Osborne and William Hague all speak of a desperately outdated and antiquated organisational structure at CCHQ certainly in contrast to the operation Peter Mandelson was running out of Millbank at the time.

    The other side of it is parties who have been in power for a long time have often forgotten the art of Opposition - they literally don't know how to oppose effectively (and it's even harder to be effective when you're facing a 179-seat majority).

    That said, the start of the fight back (which for the Conservatives was on May 2nd 1997 locally) would be the re-election of a new generation of Conservative councillors who might then be prospective Parliamentary candidates down the line.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,485
    Just got back from a rubbish day out and been cheered by the Covid numbers. I’d expected a rise this week, but there’s another fall on all metrics. That said, life is seemingly rapidly back to normal down here. Pubs lovely and busy and masks become rarer in shops.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    Was getting a bit bored being on day 6 of self isolation, having largely recovered but still testing positive so unable to lawfully leave the house. I bought in an order of wine and beer and a ready meal from Morrisons via deliveroo. Not cheap. And obviously not an option to those struggling to make ends meet.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,485
    edited January 2022

    I expect when Boris appears with Sue Gray's redacted report. the fury across all sides will be palpable and may well see the letters going in

    This is wrong and an abuse of the electorate

    Hopefully someone in Gray’s office has taken one for the team and leaked the full report to the Sunday Sport.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,912
    stodge said:

    HYUFD said:

    Of course even if Boris goes, Boris loyalists like Dorries and Rees Mogg would not make life easier for his successor. When Thatcher was replaced by Major in 1990 Thatcherite rebels were a constant thorn in his side and after his narrow 1992 general election win it was all downhill from there with the Tories beset by unity and division.

    After Major's landslide 1997 defeat the Tories returned to increasingly Thatcherite leaders anyway under Hague, IDS and Howard

    It's fair to say parties suffering a severe defeat (whether after a period in office or not) do tend to go a bit "strange". I do think after a long period in office a party needs time to re-organise, reflect and rebuild.

    One of the most remarkable aspects of 1997 was not the fact or the size of the Conservative defeat which were both well sign posted but the way in which the Conservative political campaigning machine had atrophied after years in Government. Accounts from David Cameron, George Osborne and William Hague all speak of a desperately outdated and antiquated organisational structure at CCHQ certainly in contrast to the operation Peter Mandelson was running out of Millbank at the time.

    The other side of it is parties who have been in power for a long time have often forgotten the art of Opposition - they literally don't know how to oppose effectively (and it's even harder to be effective when you're facing a 179-seat majority).

    That said, the start of the fight back (which for the Conservatives was on May 2nd 1997 locally) would be the re-election of a new generation of Conservative councillors who might then be prospective Parliamentary candidates down the line.
    Indeed, for Tory councillors and council candidates it might be better to lose next time and benefit from the inevitable protest vote against a Labour government as even Hague's Tories got in local elections from 1998 to 2000 than face the heavy losses in local elections Tory councillors faced under the Major government from 1993 to 1996
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,028

    James Johnson
    @jamesjohnson252
    ·
    21m
    Our focus groups are not mellowing on Boris - if anything they’re getting worse

    https://twitter.com/jamesjohnson252/status/1487492357977260040

    ===

    Time and tide, Sunak. Time and tide...

    But are they proper tories?
  • I expect when Boris appears with Sue Gray's redacted report. the fury across all sides will be palpable and may well see the letters going in

    This is wrong and an abuse of the electorate

    Hopefully someone in Gray’s office has taken one for the team and leaked the full report to the Sunday Sport.
    I am sure that will not happen and actually that would be a disaster for everyone

    We must demand Dick backs off and the full report is published by Sue Gray
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,485
    JBriskin3 said:

    darkage said:

    In fact, building on my last comment, my optimum scenario would perhaps be Keir Starmer leading the tories. I am a total centrist dad.

    That's more like the Saturday PB spirit!

    Living in Nippy's semi-autonomous paradise I'm not sure I will be able to consider Sir Keir's party for much longer-

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/keir-starmer-says-more-powers-26079744
    I think Slab being nakedly pro-Union is strategically flawed. They should be neutral and allow individual Labour candidates to express their own views. I think Labour would do better north of the Tweed if they weren’t seen as the natural home of Rangers supporters.
  • darkage said:

    Was getting a bit bored being on day 6 of self isolation, having largely recovered but still testing positive so unable to lawfully leave the house. I bought in an order of wine and beer and a ready meal from Morrisons via deliveroo. Not cheap. And obviously not an option to those struggling to make ends meet.

    Hope you are free soon
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,908
    edited January 2022
    excellent piece on Ch 4 News. John Major's Private Secretary particularly impressive as is the ex Attorney General and the High Court judge who declares the police investigation bullshit (my words not his)

    https://www.channel4.com/now/C4
This discussion has been closed.