Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
You're the same as one of those people that can never settle at a job, the issue isn't all of the companies in the world.
A referendum on masks would not follow the assumed patterns of a referendum on Brexit. In opinion polls on NPIs the main determinant is age. The younger the group, the less likely to support. But there is a secondary tendency for Labour supporters to be marginally more in favour of them than Tories.
At the risk of sounding like a High Court Judge...what is an NPI? Clearly summat mask related but I can't guess the acronym. I am familiar with a Narcissistic Personality Inventory.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
Starmer has no chance of winning back most of the RedWall anyway, only Burnham probably has a chance of that and even getting Labour to most seats, let alone a majority.
Starmer has instead likely concluded his best chance of becoming PM is winning most of the Tory Remain marginals in London and the suburbs and a handful of the most marginal RedWall seats, helped by LD tactical votes there now Corbyn has gone. Then hope the LDs pick up Tory Remain marginals in the South and so he can become PM with LD and SNP support even if the Conservatives still win most seats. Hence the appointment of Cooper and Reeves and Lammy to replace Nandy as Labour's top team is dominated by Remainers and People's Vote supporters so he can double down on uniting Remainers behind Labour and the LDs at the next general election having also largely extinguished Corbynites from the top ranks of Labour even though Leavers will largely stick with Boris
Depends which sort of seats you mean, I think Labour can win back some of the more urban seats in the North they lost in 2019 like say Burnley, Darlington, Blackpool S at the next election. I can't see any route for Starmer to become PM that does not involve winning those type of seats. Although I expect the Tories to further buttress their position in the Midlands in places like West Bromwich. I agree though that it would require Burnham to win back seats like Leigh and Bolsover.
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
You're the same as one of those people that can never settle at a job, the issue isn't all of the companies in the world.
Or I would be if I didn't settle into a job. Except that I've got 8 years service at one company, 6+ at another, even the jobs early on where other people would flit quickly were 3 years and 2.5 years.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
I quite like her, moreso than her dreadful Husband.
Labour has on its side a soon to be struggling economy and some bumps in the Covid road. JohnsonIan Conservatives can more than offset this by some mind-numbingly illiberal policies. Priti as HS was a stroke of populist genius by Johnson. Hanging, flogging and strafing economic migrants in Zodiacs will be meat and drink to the RedWall. Cooper has no answer to this.
I would rather we didn't go for full-on Trumpland, but if that is what is needed to secure the Conservatives in Government, that is what we will get.
I’d agree that is Johnson’s strategy. Nadine Dorries as Culture Sec was the biggest signal on that point, given she is loud and proud when it comes to these things.
However, it’s also a point that, when it comes to strategy, BJ is miles ahead of Labour. SKS thinks the RV voters are all still about Brexit and it will be forgotten by 2023/4. He’s wrong. BJ is right in realising that Brexit was the symptom of much wider dissatisfaction on the whole cultural front. He will therefore play up to all those issues.
What’s more he knows that Labour’s urban, socially superior intellectual base just won’t be able to help themselves when it comes to criticising people like Patel and particularly Dorries. Lots of sniggering at the latter’s background, her books etc. But what Labour’s core sees as being witty is interpreted in many areas as condescension and a “I’m so much better than you” worldview. And, if there is one thing that will motivate voters to give Labour another pasting is the view Labour looks down on them.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
Starmer has no chance of winning back most of the RedWall anyway, only Burnham probably has a chance of that and even getting Labour to most seats, let alone a majority.
Starmer has instead likely concluded his best chance of becoming PM is winning most of the Tory Remain marginals in London and the suburbs and a handful of the most marginal RedWall seats, helped by LD tactical votes there now Corbyn has gone. Then hope the LDs pick up Tory Remain marginals in the South and so he can become PM with LD and SNP support even if the Conservatives still win most seats. Hence the appointment of Cooper and Reeves and Lammy to replace Nandy as Labour's top team is dominated by Remainers and People's Vote supporters so he can double down on uniting Remainers behind Labour and the LDs at the next general election having also largely extinguished Corbynites from the top ranks of Labour even though Leavers will largely stick with Boris
Depends which sort of seats you mean, I think Labour can win back some of the more urban seats in the North they lost in 2019 like say Burnley, Darlington, Blackpool S at the next election. I can't see any route for Starmer to become PM that does not involve winning those type of seats. Although I expect the Tories to further buttress their position in the Midlands in places like West Bromwich. I agree though that it would require Burnham to win back seats like Leigh and Bolsover.
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
As I have posted repeatedly, red wall voters aren't stupid. Where parties take them for granted they call it out. And if that means flitting from one party to another and back again then to another (Redcar, Burnley) then thats what they do.
The red wall isn't uniform, and the Tories are likely to enhance their majorities in seats like Stockton South where the MP is a character and is throwing himself about a bit to be seen to be delivering. But there are loads of others where the new MP is a nobber who has already sunk themselves - Redcar being a prime example.
A referendum on masks would not follow the assumed patterns of a referendum on Brexit. In opinion polls on NPIs the main determinant is age. The younger the group, the less likely to support. But there is a secondary tendency for Labour supporters to be marginally more in favour of them than Tories.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
Starmer has no chance of winning back most of the RedWall anyway, only Burnham probably has a chance of that and even getting Labour to most seats, let alone a majority.
Starmer has instead likely concluded his best chance of becoming PM is winning most of the Tory Remain marginals in London and the suburbs and a handful of the most marginal RedWall seats, helped by LD tactical votes there now Corbyn has gone. Then hope the LDs pick up Tory Remain marginals in the South and so he can become PM with LD and SNP support even if the Conservatives still win most seats. Hence the appointment of Cooper and Reeves and Lammy to replace Nandy as Labour's top team is dominated by Remainers and People's Vote supporters so he can double down on uniting Remainers behind Labour and the LDs at the next general election having also largely extinguished Corbynites from the top ranks of Labour even though Leavers will largely stick with Boris
Depends which sort of seats you mean, I think Labour can win back some of the more urban seats in the North they lost in 2019 like say Burnley, Darlington, Blackpool S at the next election. I can't see any route for Starmer to become PM that does not involve winning those type of seats. Although I expect the Tories to further buttress their position in the Midlands in places like West Bromwich. I agree though that it would require Burnham to win back seats like Leigh and Bolsover.
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
Starmer I think can get Labour to about 250-255 seats, that plus 50 SNP MPs and 25 LD MPs would give him a majority in the Commons even despite the Conservatives winning most seats. Only Burnham however could get Labour to 300 seats+, agree on that. Cooper or Reeves might also get Labour a bit closer to 300 seats than Starmer can.
Hendon and Cities of London and Westminster are London Remain seats Starmer would hope to win along with the 3 you mentioned. Plus a few Remain or soft Leave seats in the South and East with a strong Labour vote like Stroud, Hastings and Watford and Peterborough and Wycombe. Add the more urban RedWall seats in the top 50 Labour target seats then he can get to 250-255.
F1: after much procrastinating, I've backed Tsunoda at 4.75 to win group (the Alpines and Ricciardo). He starts first of that set, and while Ocon's only one place behind he was two-tenths slower.
My sweeping generalisations on who wasn't wearing a mask yesterday...
On the trains, stag and hen groups.
In the shopping centre, groups of chavvy youths and those who had them.
I still haven't worked out why someone must wear a mask to pop into a half-deserted, airy supermarket for five minutes but it's OK to spend three hours un-masked in a crowded pub rubbing shoulders with a motley crew of drunken strangers.
F1: after much procrastinating, I've backed Tsunoda at 4.75 to win group (the Alpines and Ricciardo). He starts first of that set, and while Ocon's only one place behind he was two-tenths slower.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
Starmer has no chance of winning back most of the RedWall anyway, only Burnham probably has a chance of that and even getting Labour to most seats, let alone a majority.
Starmer has instead likely concluded his best chance of becoming PM is winning most of the Tory Remain marginals in London and the suburbs and a handful of the most marginal RedWall seats, helped by LD tactical votes there now Corbyn has gone. Then hope the LDs pick up Tory Remain marginals in the South and so he can become PM with LD and SNP support even if the Conservatives still win most seats. Hence the appointment of Cooper and Reeves and Lammy to replace Nandy as Labour's top team is dominated by Remainers and People's Vote supporters so he can double down on uniting Remainers behind Labour and the LDs at the next general election having also largely extinguished Corbynites from the top ranks of Labour even though Leavers will largely stick with Boris
Depends which sort of seats you mean, I think Labour can win back some of the more urban seats in the North they lost in 2019 like say Burnley, Darlington, Blackpool S at the next election. I can't see any route for Starmer to become PM that does not involve winning those type of seats. Although I expect the Tories to further buttress their position in the Midlands in places like West Bromwich. I agree though that it would require Burnham to win back seats like Leigh and Bolsover.
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
As I have posted repeatedly, red wall voters aren't stupid. Where parties take them for granted they call it out. And if that means flitting from one party to another and back again then to another (Redcar, Burnley) then thats what they do.
The red wall isn't uniform, and the Tories are likely to enhance their majorities in seats like Stockton South where the MP is a character and is throwing himself about a bit to be seen to be delivering. But there are loads of others where the new MP is a nobber who has already sunk themselves - Redcar being a prime example.
And of course Redcar, Blackpool S and Darlington aren't even technically red wall seats as the former went LD in 2010 and the latter two were both Tory under Thatcher.
Cricket update; India have declared, leaving New Zealand and improbable 539 to win. Currently, with about a session and a bit to go today, they're 43-1. It's only Day 3, so provided they can stay there, they've got time .......
That did look like a somewhat risky declaration, unless they were expecting a thunderstorm.
A couple of hours later, it looks like a very easy win for the home team.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
I quite like her, moreso than her dreadful Husband.
Labour has on its side a soon to be struggling economy and some bumps in the Covid road. JohnsonIan Conservatives can more than offset this by some mind-numbingly illiberal policies. Priti as HS was a stroke of populist genius by Johnson. Hanging, flogging and strafing economic migrants in Zodiacs will be meat and drink to the RedWall. Cooper has no answer to this.
I would rather we didn't go for full-on Trumpland, but if that is what is needed to secure the Conservatives in Government, that is what we will get.
I’d agree that is Johnson’s strategy. Nadine Dorries as Culture Sec was the biggest signal on that point, given she is loud and proud when it comes to these things.
However, it’s also a point that, when it comes to strategy, BJ is miles ahead of Labour. SKS thinks the RV voters are all still about Brexit and it will be forgotten by 2023/4. He’s wrong. BJ is right in realising that Brexit was the symptom of much wider dissatisfaction on the whole cultural front. He will therefore play up to all those issues.
What’s more he knows that Labour’s urban, socially superior intellectual base just won’t be able to help themselves when it comes to criticising people like Patel and particularly Dorries. Lots of sniggering at the latter’s background, her books etc. But what Labour’s core sees as being witty is interpreted in many areas as condescension and a “I’m so much better than you” worldview. And, if there is one thing that will motivate voters to give Labour another pasting is the view Labour looks down on them.
I would like to shoot your theory down in flames, but as you are right, I can't.
Dorries is indeed inspirational if populism is the strategy. And yes to people like myself she comes across as utterly moronic, but she too resonates with voters who matter.
When JohnsonIan Conservativism finally withers and dies our country will be in one hell of a sub-Corbyn mess.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
Starmer has no chance of winning back most of the RedWall anyway, only Burnham probably has a chance of that and even getting Labour to most seats, let alone a majority.
Starmer has instead likely concluded his best chance of becoming PM is winning most of the Tory Remain marginals in London and the suburbs and a handful of the most marginal RedWall seats, helped by LD tactical votes there now Corbyn has gone. Then hope the LDs pick up Tory Remain marginals in the South and so he can become PM with LD and SNP support even if the Conservatives still win most seats. Hence the appointment of Cooper and Reeves and Lammy to replace Nandy as Labour's top team is dominated by Remainers and People's Vote supporters so he can double down on uniting Remainers behind Labour and the LDs at the next general election having also largely extinguished Corbynites from the top ranks of Labour even though Leavers will largely stick with Boris
Depends which sort of seats you mean, I think Labour can win back some of the more urban seats in the North they lost in 2019 like say Burnley, Darlington, Blackpool S at the next election. I can't see any route for Starmer to become PM that does not involve winning those type of seats. Although I expect the Tories to further buttress their position in the Midlands in places like West Bromwich. I agree though that it would require Burnham to win back seats like Leigh and Bolsover.
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
As I have posted repeatedly, red wall voters aren't stupid. Where parties take them for granted they call it out. And if that means flitting from one party to another and back again then to another (Redcar, Burnley) then thats what they do.
The red wall isn't uniform, and the Tories are likely to enhance their majorities in seats like Stockton South where the MP is a character and is throwing himself about a bit to be seen to be delivering. But there are loads of others where the new MP is a nobber who has already sunk themselves - Redcar being a prime example.
Yes. I'm not sure the term Red Wall has added anything to political analysis. The North is more politically diverse than any other region. Not all seats gained by the Tories are similar. Leigh, for example, is becoming younger and more middle class, and has a quick growing population. It is rapidly becoming a commuter suburb of Manchester rather than a depressed ex- mining town.
Most serious debating point though honest. If they hadn’t banned dwarf throwing competitions she wouldn’t be unemployed and would be able to feed her kids.
I mean I got it from a play I was in, where serfs (Greens) were fighting bolsheviks in the revolution because the reds were determined to free serfs from their serfdom, which would mean they wouldn’t get homed, looked after or paid anymore.
Respected Dutch journalist Erik Van Haren says Max Verstappen’s gearbox is fine and he won’t need a change and therefore avoids a grid penalty. Red Bull are not commenting at this stage
Except that the car has been locked up since the qualifying session yesterday, as is always the case, and they don’t get it back to prepare for the race for another 45 minutes.
They may have had a quick look at it on the back of the truck, but way too early for them to have made the decision.
Perhaps Red Bull might ask the medical centre, if they could use a CT scanner for a few minutes?
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
Don’t get the criticism of you over this. I think your position is honourable and you would only be stabbing g the Lib Dem party in the back had you remained a member and not voted for them.
Good morning everyone. 'Warmer' this morning, Though from the sound on the roof, it's raining again.
Quite what is the point of the new travel arrangements? I can, just about, see the point of my Thailand relatives not being allowed to board the plane without a negative test; they are after all going to be in the plane for around twelve hours, and neither I nor they have any issue with them having to have a PCR on arrival, but why does someone on a flight from, say Paris or the Canaries have to do two tests within a very few hours of each other. And what will be the arrangements at, again as example, for a lorry driver bringing over a load from Europe via Dover. Has the Sec of State for Health got relations running testing kit supply companies?
Presumably if someone has Omicrom (or whatever it is called) the idea is it would be picked up in the pre departure PCR test, rather than 2+ days after they have arrived in the UK, having spread it around in that time on the plane, at the airport, on the way home, and with whoever they are staying with whilst supposedly in quarantine.
The theory is fine. But it will kill international travel for most people other than the very rich.
And you think the very rich want to spend an extra two weeks wherever they are before they are allowed back into their own country?
It will affect everyone.
But at least @Philip_Thompson had a say in this democratic decision by the government.
“ And you think the very rich want to spend an extra two weeks wherever they are before they are allowed back into their own country?”
To be very honest Topping my first thought to that is it wouldn’t bother them. 🤔 The very rich could just carry on doing their work, and running all their business interests - including their MP or house of lords job - from the beach they are on?
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
Starmer has no chance of winning back most of the RedWall anyway, only Burnham probably has a chance of that and even getting Labour to most seats, let alone a majority.
Starmer has instead likely concluded his best chance of becoming PM is winning most of the Tory Remain marginals in London and the suburbs and a handful of the most marginal RedWall seats, helped by LD tactical votes there now Corbyn has gone. Then hope the LDs pick up Tory Remain marginals in the South and so he can become PM with LD and SNP support even if the Conservatives still win most seats. Hence the appointment of Cooper and Reeves and Lammy to replace Nandy as Labour's top team is dominated by Remainers and People's Vote supporters so he can double down on uniting Remainers behind Labour and the LDs at the next general election having also largely extinguished Corbynites from the top ranks of Labour even though Leavers will largely stick with Boris
Depends which sort of seats you mean, I think Labour can win back some of the more urban seats in the North they lost in 2019 like say Burnley, Darlington, Blackpool S at the next election. I can't see any route for Starmer to become PM that does not involve winning those type of seats. Although I expect the Tories to further buttress their position in the Midlands in places like West Bromwich. I agree though that it would require Burnham to win back seats like Leigh and Bolsover.
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
As I have posted repeatedly, red wall voters aren't stupid. Where parties take them for granted they call it out. And if that means flitting from one party to another and back again then to another (Redcar, Burnley) then thats what they do.
The red wall isn't uniform, and the Tories are likely to enhance their majorities in seats like Stockton South where the MP is a character and is throwing himself about a bit to be seen to be delivering. But there are loads of others where the new MP is a nobber who has already sunk themselves - Redcar being a prime example.
Yes. I'm not sure the term Red Wall has added anything to political analysis. The North is more politically diverse than any other region. Not all seats gained by the Tories are similar. Leigh, for example, is becoming younger and more middle class, and has a quick growing population. It is rapidly becoming a commuter suburb of Manchester rather than a depressed ex- mining town.
Edit. Not so much Leigh the town. But places like Astley, Lowton, Golborne and Atherleigh which are currently in the constituency. Leigh town centre is still on its knees. But why would you go when Bolton and Wigan, let alone Manchester are so close?
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
Starmer has no chance of winning back most of the RedWall anyway, only Burnham probably has a chance of that and even getting Labour to most seats, let alone a majority.
Starmer has instead likely concluded his best chance of becoming PM is winning most of the Tory Remain marginals in London and the suburbs and a handful of the most marginal RedWall seats, helped by LD tactical votes there now Corbyn has gone. Then hope the LDs pick up Tory Remain marginals in the South and so he can become PM with LD and SNP support even if the Conservatives still win most seats. Hence the appointment of Cooper and Reeves and Lammy to replace Nandy as Labour's top team is dominated by Remainers and People's Vote supporters so he can double down on uniting Remainers behind Labour and the LDs at the next general election having also largely extinguished Corbynites from the top ranks of Labour even though Leavers will largely stick with Boris
Depends which sort of seats you mean, I think Labour can win back some of the more urban seats in the North they lost in 2019 like say Burnley, Darlington, Blackpool S at the next election. I can't see any route for Starmer to become PM that does not involve winning those type of seats. Although I expect the Tories to further buttress their position in the Midlands in places like West Bromwich. I agree though that it would require Burnham to win back seats like Leigh and Bolsover.
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
As I have posted repeatedly, red wall voters aren't stupid. Where parties take them for granted they call it out. And if that means flitting from one party to another and back again then to another (Redcar, Burnley) then thats what they do.
The red wall isn't uniform, and the Tories are likely to enhance their majorities in seats like Stockton South where the MP is a character and is throwing himself about a bit to be seen to be delivering. But there are loads of others where the new MP is a nobber who has already sunk themselves - Redcar being a prime example.
Yes. I'm not sure the term Red Wall has added anything to political analysis. The North is more politically diverse than any other region. Not all seats gained by the Tories are similar. Leigh, for example, is becoming younger and more middle class, and has a quick growing population. It is rapidly becoming a commuter suburb of Manchester rather than a depressed ex- mining town.
Edit. Not so much Leigh the town. But places like Astley, Lowton and Atherleigh which are currently in the constituency. Leigh town centre is still on its knees. But why would you go when Bolton and Wigan, let alone Manchester are so close?
Which is interesting because, on that basis (ie becoming more middle class and young), Leigh should not have gone Tory under the traditional viewpoint
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
What worries me about his move to Zurich is that he is doing so fully in the knowledge that he can’t stand the local German-speaking culture. It is a recipe for disaster. An immigrant who not only plans to refuse to integrate, but doesn’t even respect the locals.
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
LOL I tipped you moving to the SNP a couple of months ago. Amused to see that you've realised that's where your heart lies now.
Another day, another example of David Cameron’s Twitter maxim.
Why are political parties still not properly vetting their candidates’ social media histories, when they know that not-so-friendly opponents and newspapers definitely will be?
Helen Morgan, Lib Dem candidate in North Shropshire with today’s Godwin award, for writing, in the context of her son reading a book about the Holocaust:
“He commented that the Nazis were only able to do such terrible things because they didn’t think their victims were people. He’s 11. On Twitter this morning, there are people talking about cancelling their RNLI donations because they have picked up “illegals”. The language used every day in this country – by the Government, press and people with thousands of followers on social media – it’s nothing short of chilling.”
Then she liked a post from someone who replied:
‘Having visited Auschwitz concentration camp in the recent past. It really brings home man’s inhumanity to man. Now on a daily basis the language and actions of the Conservative Party make me more and more concerned about the direction they are taking the UK and its people.’
Her own post is totally on the money. The post she liked is perhaps a bit over the top. But I'm sure that plenty of people share the sentiment that the othering and scapegoating of refugees that's going on in this country right now is chilling, and, for anyone with a knowledge of European history, has some alarming historical resonances.
The suggestion that the Tories are similar to the Nazis in outlook and policies is absurd and, frankly, as good an example of "othering" as you will find. The SNP do very similar things demonising something like 25% of Scots who vote Tory and who, as a result, are apparently not real Scots. It also encourages the arrogance and moral superiority complex that so many liberals, in the broadest sense, are prone to and is one of the reasons that they fail at the ballot box.
There was a chap about 2000 years ago who had some interesting observations about motes and beams. She should reflect on it.
Thank goodness Tories and Unionists never indulge in that kind of behaviour (I couldn’t find the photoshop of Sturgeon in an SS uniform so beloved by your fruitier fellow travellers, I suspect twitter may have banned it). Motes and beams indeed.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
I quite like her, moreso than her dreadful Husband.
Labour has on its side a soon to be struggling economy and some bumps in the Covid road. JohnsonIan Conservatives can more than offset this by some mind-numbingly illiberal policies. Priti as HS was a stroke of populist genius by Johnson. Hanging, flogging and strafing economic migrants in Zodiacs will be meat and drink to the RedWall. Cooper has no answer to this.
I would rather we didn't go for full-on Trumpland, but if that is what is needed to secure the Conservatives in Government, that is what we will get.
I’d agree that is Johnson’s strategy. Nadine Dorries as Culture Sec was the biggest signal on that point, given she is loud and proud when it comes to these things.
However, it’s also a point that, when it comes to strategy, BJ is miles ahead of Labour. SKS thinks the RV voters are all still about Brexit and it will be forgotten by 2023/4. He’s wrong. BJ is right in realising that Brexit was the symptom of much wider dissatisfaction on the whole cultural front. He will therefore play up to all those issues.
What’s more he knows that Labour’s urban, socially superior intellectual base just won’t be able to help themselves when it comes to criticising people like Patel and particularly Dorries. Lots of sniggering at the latter’s background, her books etc. But what Labour’s core sees as being witty is interpreted in many areas as condescension and a “I’m so much better than you” worldview. And, if there is one thing that will motivate voters to give Labour another pasting is the view Labour looks down on them.
I would like to shoot your theory down in flames, but as you are right, I can't.
Dorries is indeed inspirational if populism is the strategy. And yes to people like myself she comes across as utterly moronic, but she too resonates with voters who matter.
When JohnsonIan Conservativism finally withers and dies our country will be in one hell of a sub-Corbyn mess.
I think it will evolve but it will become the dominant Conservative strain. It’s why I don’t think people like Sunak or Truss will be the next Con leader. I think it will go to someone who is more in tune with these instincts and more appealing to the RV (and their MPS - who get to choose who goes through to the final two).
Respected Dutch journalist Erik Van Haren says Max Verstappen’s gearbox is fine and he won’t need a change and therefore avoids a grid penalty. Red Bull are not commenting at this stage
I guess they think the risk is worth it to give him a chance of the win. He made a similar calculation at the last corner of qualifying….
I love driving but not expert on motor sport warning, but isn’t risk other way around I think as you are saying? Get the gearbox to de risk it, and then try to get as many points from the race. First example is Lewis doing similar a few races back? Second example is at Monaco where Ferrari tried to chance it didn’t get far and ended up with nothing. Second or third better for the Max Child than nothing?
Good morning everyone. 'Warmer' this morning, Though from the sound on the roof, it's raining again.
Quite what is the point of the new travel arrangements? I can, just about, see the point of my Thailand relatives not being allowed to board the plane without a negative test; they are after all going to be in the plane for around twelve hours, and neither I nor they have any issue with them having to have a PCR on arrival, but why does someone on a flight from, say Paris or the Canaries have to do two tests within a very few hours of each other. And what will be the arrangements at, again as example, for a lorry driver bringing over a load from Europe via Dover. Has the Sec of State for Health got relations running testing kit supply companies?
Presumably if someone has Omicrom (or whatever it is called) the idea is it would be picked up in the pre departure PCR test, rather than 2+ days after they have arrived in the UK, having spread it around in that time on the plane, at the airport, on the way home, and with whoever they are staying with whilst supposedly in quarantine.
The theory is fine. But it will kill international travel for most people other than the very rich.
And you think the very rich want to spend an extra two weeks wherever they are before they are allowed back into their own country?
It will affect everyone.
But at least @Philip_Thompson had a say in this democratic decision by the government.
“ And you think the very rich want to spend an extra two weeks wherever they are before they are allowed back into their own country?”
To be very honest Topping my first thought to that is it wouldn’t bother them. 🤔 The very rich could just carry on doing their work, and running all their business interests - including their MP or house of lords job - from the beach they are on?
Thats pretty much what I had in mind. I was on holiday a few weeks ago and was worried about the £2-3k hit that I would take if I tested positive for covid before leaving the country and had to quarantine. Small probability but a risk you can't really insure against. If we now have mandatory tests and isolation upon return then you are taking a double hit - the cost of the tests (about £150 per person) plus the risk of having to quarantine/isolate at expense to yourself. So the rich can just take is on the chin as a necessary annoyance but it puts foreign travel completely beyond the reach of ordinary working people. It is really quite an elitist policy, when you come to think about it.
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
LOL I tipped you moving to the SNP a couple of months ago. Amused to see that you've realised that's where your heart lies now.
Just don't start banging on about Yoons. 😉
I'm not joining the SNP. As a Federalist that would be some leap...
Good morning everyone. 'Warmer' this morning, Though from the sound on the roof, it's raining again.
Quite what is the point of the new travel arrangements? I can, just about, see the point of my Thailand relatives not being allowed to board the plane without a negative test; they are after all going to be in the plane for around twelve hours, and neither I nor they have any issue with them having to have a PCR on arrival, but why does someone on a flight from, say Paris or the Canaries have to do two tests within a very few hours of each other. And what will be the arrangements at, again as example, for a lorry driver bringing over a load from Europe via Dover. Has the Sec of State for Health got relations running testing kit supply companies?
Presumably if someone has Omicrom (or whatever it is called) the idea is it would be picked up in the pre departure PCR test, rather than 2+ days after they have arrived in the UK, having spread it around in that time on the plane, at the airport, on the way home, and with whoever they are staying with whilst supposedly in quarantine.
The theory is fine. But it will kill international travel for most people other than the very rich.
And you think the very rich want to spend an extra two weeks wherever they are before they are allowed back into their own country?
It will affect everyone.
But at least @Philip_Thompson had a say in this democratic decision by the government.
“ And you think the very rich want to spend an extra two weeks wherever they are before they are allowed back into their own country?”
To be very honest Topping my first thought to that is it wouldn’t bother them. 🤔 The very rich could just carry on doing their work, and running all their business interests - including their MP or house of lords job - from the beach they are on?
Thats pretty much what I had in mind. I was on holiday a few weeks ago and was worried about the £2-3k hit that I would take if I tested positive for covid before leaving the country and had to quarantine. Small probability but a risk you can't really insure against. If we now have mandatory tests and isolation upon return then you are taking a double hit - the cost of the tests (about £150 per person) plus the risk of having to quarantine/isolate at expense to yourself. So the rich can just take is on the chin as a necessary annoyance but it puts foreign travel completely beyond the reach of ordinary working people. It is really quite an elitist policy, when you come to think about it.
as is mask wearing - who uses public transport and tends to still shop in person? Its not the rich.Shame on Labour for being so positively fetish about masks
My sweeping generalisations on who wasn't wearing a mask yesterday...
On the trains, stag and hen groups.
In the shopping centre, groups of chavvy youths and those who had them.
I still haven't worked out why someone must wear a mask to pop into a half-deserted, airy supermarket for five minutes but it's OK to spend three hours un-masked in a crowded pub rubbing shoulders with a motley crew of drunken strangers.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
Starmer has no chance of winning back most of the RedWall anyway, only Burnham probably has a chance of that and even getting Labour to most seats, let alone a majority.
Starmer has instead likely concluded his best chance of becoming PM is winning most of the Tory Remain marginals in London and the suburbs and a handful of the most marginal RedWall seats, helped by LD tactical votes there now Corbyn has gone. Then hope the LDs pick up Tory Remain marginals in the South and so he can become PM with LD and SNP support even if the Conservatives still win most seats. Hence the appointment of Cooper and Reeves and Lammy to replace Nandy as Labour's top team is dominated by Remainers and People's Vote supporters so he can double down on uniting Remainers behind Labour and the LDs at the next general election having also largely extinguished Corbynites from the top ranks of Labour even though Leavers will largely stick with Boris
Depends which sort of seats you mean, I think Labour can win back some of the more urban seats in the North they lost in 2019 like say Burnley, Darlington, Blackpool S at the next election. I can't see any route for Starmer to become PM that does not involve winning those type of seats. Although I expect the Tories to further buttress their position in the Midlands in places like West Bromwich. I agree though that it would require Burnham to win back seats like Leigh and Bolsover.
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
As I have posted repeatedly, red wall voters aren't stupid. Where parties take them for granted they call it out. And if that means flitting from one party to another and back again then to another (Redcar, Burnley) then thats what they do.
The red wall isn't uniform, and the Tories are likely to enhance their majorities in seats like Stockton South where the MP is a character and is throwing himself about a bit to be seen to be delivering. But there are loads of others where the new MP is a nobber who has already sunk themselves - Redcar being a prime example.
Yes. I'm not sure the term Red Wall has added anything to political analysis. The North is more politically diverse than any other region. Not all seats gained by the Tories are similar. Leigh, for example, is becoming younger and more middle class, and has a quick growing population. It is rapidly becoming a commuter suburb of Manchester rather than a depressed ex- mining town.
Edit. Not so much Leigh the town. But places like Astley, Lowton and Atherleigh which are currently in the constituency. Leigh town centre is still on its knees. But why would you go when Bolton and Wigan, let alone Manchester are so close?
Which is interesting because, on that basis (ie becoming more middle class and young), Leigh should not have gone Tory under the traditional viewpoint
Indeed. But there were multiple factors. One of which being they lost Burnham as MP. And replaced with Joanne Platt. A total dud as well as fanatical Remainer. Also. It is getting more diverse. Rate of change rather than absolute numbers. Which folk didn't like in a town which was as close to 100% white British very recently. The younger end are homeowners too. Housing is cheap. But this is detached and semis land for families. Not single urban professionals. Plus. The miners are dying off. You really have to be 60+ to have been down t'pit. And very few of them. Most will be 80+ now. So, there are many different local factors at play, as in all.
Another day, another example of David Cameron’s Twitter maxim.
Why are political parties still not properly vetting their candidates’ social media histories, when they know that not-so-friendly opponents and newspapers definitely will be?
Helen Morgan, Lib Dem candidate in North Shropshire with today’s Godwin award, for writing, in the context of her son reading a book about the Holocaust:
“He commented that the Nazis were only able to do such terrible things because they didn’t think their victims were people. He’s 11. On Twitter this morning, there are people talking about cancelling their RNLI donations because they have picked up “illegals”. The language used every day in this country – by the Government, press and people with thousands of followers on social media – it’s nothing short of chilling.”
Then she liked a post from someone who replied:
‘Having visited Auschwitz concentration camp in the recent past. It really brings home man’s inhumanity to man. Now on a daily basis the language and actions of the Conservative Party make me more and more concerned about the direction they are taking the UK and its people.’
Her own post is totally on the money. The post she liked is perhaps a bit over the top. But I'm sure that plenty of people share the sentiment that the othering and scapegoating of refugees that's going on in this country right now is chilling, and, for anyone with a knowledge of European history, has some alarming historical resonances.
The suggestion that the Tories are similar to the Nazis in outlook and policies is absurd and, frankly, as good an example of "othering" as you will find. The SNP do very similar things demonising something like 25% of Scots who vote Tory and who, as a result, are apparently not real Scots. It also encourages the arrogance and moral superiority complex that so many liberals, in the broadest sense, are prone to and is one of the reasons that they fail at the ballot box.
There was a chap about 2000 years ago who had some interesting observations about motes and beams. She should reflect on it.
Thank goodness Tories and Unionists never indulge in that kind of behaviour (I couldn’t find the photoshop of Sturgeon in an SS uniform so beloved by your fruitier fellow travellers, I suspect twitter may have banned it). Motes and beams indeed.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
Starmer has no chance of winning back most of the RedWall anyway, only Burnham probably has a chance of that and even getting Labour to most seats, let alone a majority.
Starmer has instead likely concluded his best chance of becoming PM is winning most of the Tory Remain marginals in London and the suburbs and a handful of the most marginal RedWall seats, helped by LD tactical votes there now Corbyn has gone. Then hope the LDs pick up Tory Remain marginals in the South and so he can become PM with LD and SNP support even if the Conservatives still win most seats. Hence the appointment of Cooper and Reeves and Lammy to replace Nandy as Labour's top team is dominated by Remainers and People's Vote supporters so he can double down on uniting Remainers behind Labour and the LDs at the next general election having also largely extinguished Corbynites from the top ranks of Labour even though Leavers will largely stick with Boris
Depends which sort of seats you mean, I think Labour can win back some of the more urban seats in the North they lost in 2019 like say Burnley, Darlington, Blackpool S at the next election. I can't see any route for Starmer to become PM that does not involve winning those type of seats. Although I expect the Tories to further buttress their position in the Midlands in places like West Bromwich. I agree though that it would require Burnham to win back seats like Leigh and Bolsover.
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
As I have posted repeatedly, red wall voters aren't stupid. Where parties take them for granted they call it out. And if that means flitting from one party to another and back again then to another (Redcar, Burnley) then thats what they do.
The red wall isn't uniform, and the Tories are likely to enhance their majorities in seats like Stockton South where the MP is a character and is throwing himself about a bit to be seen to be delivering. But there are loads of others where the new MP is a nobber who has already sunk themselves - Redcar being a prime example.
Yes. I'm not sure the term Red Wall has added anything to political analysis. The North is more politically diverse than any other region. Not all seats gained by the Tories are similar. Leigh, for example, is becoming younger and more middle class, and has a quick growing population. It is rapidly becoming a commuter suburb of Manchester rather than a depressed ex- mining town.
The same is true of Cooper's seat. Loads of new housing around Pontecarlo bought by folk commuting in to Leeds.
It is, both literally and politically, a changing landscape.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
I don't think the idea that she is 'pro immigration' stands up to much scrutiny based on what she has said publicly for a while TBH (she wasn't even pro 2nd ref even if that was due to her constituency) and the 'pro imigration' left don't like her because of her record on work capability assessments among other reasons. I think the problem is she doesn't have any particular fan club outside the PLP and a narrow clique of weird FBPE posters on twitter even though I think she is still less deserving of criticism than certain recent and current 'moderate' Labour MPs.
Respected Dutch journalist Erik Van Haren says Max Verstappen’s gearbox is fine and he won’t need a change and therefore avoids a grid penalty. Red Bull are not commenting at this stage
I guess they think the risk is worth it to give him a chance of the win. He made a similar calculation at the last corner of qualifying….
I love driving but not expert on motor sport warning, but isn’t risk other way around I think as you are saying? Get the gearbox to de risk it, and then try to get as many points from the race. First example is Lewis doing similar a few races back? Second example is at Monaco where Ferrari tried to chance it didn’t get far and ended up with nothing. Second or third better for the Max Child than nothing?
Yes, if you’re playing the long game you take the new gearbox and the penalty that comes with it. Yes, the precident is what happened with Lecerc’s Ferrari at Monaco, where they chose not to change the gearbox after a crash and it failed before the race even started.
It’s sadly already been suggested on other forums, that Max only needs that gearbox to last as long as it takes to run up the back of Lewis into the first corner, to move to the last race with the eight point lead intact.
A referendum on masks would not follow the assumed patterns of a referendum on Brexit. In opinion polls on NPIs the main determinant is age. The younger the group, the less likely to support. But there is a secondary tendency for Labour supporters to be marginally more in favour of them than Tories.
At the risk of sounding like a High Court Judge...what is an NPI? Clearly summat mask related but I can't guess the acronym. I am familiar with a Narcissistic Personality Inventory.
Respected Dutch journalist Erik Van Haren says Max Verstappen’s gearbox is fine and he won’t need a change and therefore avoids a grid penalty. Red Bull are not commenting at this stage
I guess they think the risk is worth it to give him a chance of the win. He made a similar calculation at the last corner of qualifying….
I love driving but not expert on motor sport warning, but isn’t risk other way around I think as you are saying? Get the gearbox to de risk it, and then try to get as many points from the race. First example is Lewis doing similar a few races back? Second example is at Monaco where Ferrari tried to chance it didn’t get far and ended up with nothing. Second or third better for the Max Child than nothing?
Yes, if you’re playing the long game you take the new gearbox and the penalty that comes with it. Yes, the precident is what happened with Lecerc’s Ferrari at Monaco, where they chose not to change the gearbox after a crash and it failed before the race even started.
It’s sadly already been suggested on other forums, that Max only needs that gearbox to last as long as it takes to run up the back of Lewis into the first corner, to move to the last race with the eight point lead intact.
LOL. It’s going to be exciting. Going out now to be back in time for it. 🍽
Another day, another example of David Cameron’s Twitter maxim.
Why are political parties still not properly vetting their candidates’ social media histories, when they know that not-so-friendly opponents and newspapers definitely will be?
Helen Morgan, Lib Dem candidate in North Shropshire with today’s Godwin award, for writing, in the context of her son reading a book about the Holocaust:
“He commented that the Nazis were only able to do such terrible things because they didn’t think their victims were people. He’s 11. On Twitter this morning, there are people talking about cancelling their RNLI donations because they have picked up “illegals”. The language used every day in this country – by the Government, press and people with thousands of followers on social media – it’s nothing short of chilling.”
Then she liked a post from someone who replied:
‘Having visited Auschwitz concentration camp in the recent past. It really brings home man’s inhumanity to man. Now on a daily basis the language and actions of the Conservative Party make me more and more concerned about the direction they are taking the UK and its people.’
Her own post is totally on the money. The post she liked is perhaps a bit over the top. But I'm sure that plenty of people share the sentiment that the othering and scapegoating of refugees that's going on in this country right now is chilling, and, for anyone with a knowledge of European history, has some alarming historical resonances.
The suggestion that the Tories are similar to the Nazis in outlook and policies is absurd and, frankly, as good an example of "othering" as you will find. The SNP do very similar things demonising something like 25% of Scots who vote Tory and who, as a result, are apparently not real Scots. It also encourages the arrogance and moral superiority complex that so many liberals, in the broadest sense, are prone to and is one of the reasons that they fail at the ballot box.
There was a chap about 2000 years ago who had some interesting observations about motes and beams. She should reflect on it.
Thank goodness Tories and Unionists never indulge in that kind of behaviour (I couldn’t find the photoshop of Sturgeon in an SS uniform so beloved by your fruitier fellow travellers, I suspect twitter may have banned it). Motes and beams indeed.
Another day, another example of David Cameron’s Twitter maxim.
Why are political parties still not properly vetting their candidates’ social media histories, when they know that not-so-friendly opponents and newspapers definitely will be?
Helen Morgan, Lib Dem candidate in North Shropshire with today’s Godwin award, for writing, in the context of her son reading a book about the Holocaust:
“He commented that the Nazis were only able to do such terrible things because they didn’t think their victims were people. He’s 11. On Twitter this morning, there are people talking about cancelling their RNLI donations because they have picked up “illegals”. The language used every day in this country – by the Government, press and people with thousands of followers on social media – it’s nothing short of chilling.”
Then she liked a post from someone who replied:
‘Having visited Auschwitz concentration camp in the recent past. It really brings home man’s inhumanity to man. Now on a daily basis the language and actions of the Conservative Party make me more and more concerned about the direction they are taking the UK and its people.’
Her own post is totally on the money. The post she liked is perhaps a bit over the top. But I'm sure that plenty of people share the sentiment that the othering and scapegoating of refugees that's going on in this country right now is chilling, and, for anyone with a knowledge of European history, has some alarming historical resonances.
The suggestion that the Tories are similar to the Nazis in outlook and policies is absurd and, frankly, as good an example of "othering" as you will find. The SNP do very similar things demonising something like 25% of Scots who vote Tory and who, as a result, are apparently not real Scots. It also encourages the arrogance and moral superiority complex that so many liberals, in the broadest sense, are prone to and is one of the reasons that they fail at the ballot box.
There was a chap about 2000 years ago who had some interesting observations about motes and beams. She should reflect on it.
Thank goodness Tories and Unionists never indulge in that kind of behaviour (I couldn’t find the photoshop of Sturgeon in an SS uniform so beloved by your fruitier fellow travellers, I suspect twitter may have banned it). Motes and beams indeed.
Most serious debating point though honest. If they hadn’t banned dwarf throwing competitions she wouldn’t be unemployed and would be able to feed her kids.
I mean I got it from a play I was in, where serfs (Greens) were fighting bolsheviks in the revolution because the reds were determined to free serfs from their serfdom, which would mean they wouldn’t get homed, looked after or paid anymore.
Yet another reason not to vote for socialists.
That's going to be expensive. Quite right, too.
IIRC there is no limit on compensation for secondary sex discrimination.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
Another day, another example of David Cameron’s Twitter maxim.
Why are political parties still not properly vetting their candidates’ social media histories, when they know that not-so-friendly opponents and newspapers definitely will be?
Helen Morgan, Lib Dem candidate in North Shropshire with today’s Godwin award, for writing, in the context of her son reading a book about the Holocaust:
“He commented that the Nazis were only able to do such terrible things because they didn’t think their victims were people. He’s 11. On Twitter this morning, there are people talking about cancelling their RNLI donations because they have picked up “illegals”. The language used every day in this country – by the Government, press and people with thousands of followers on social media – it’s nothing short of chilling.”
Then she liked a post from someone who replied:
‘Having visited Auschwitz concentration camp in the recent past. It really brings home man’s inhumanity to man. Now on a daily basis the language and actions of the Conservative Party make me more and more concerned about the direction they are taking the UK and its people.’
Her own post is totally on the money. The post she liked is perhaps a bit over the top. But I'm sure that plenty of people share the sentiment that the othering and scapegoating of refugees that's going on in this country right now is chilling, and, for anyone with a knowledge of European history, has some alarming historical resonances.
The suggestion that the Tories are similar to the Nazis in outlook and policies is absurd and, frankly, as good an example of "othering" as you will find. The SNP do very similar things demonising something like 25% of Scots who vote Tory and who, as a result, are apparently not real Scots. It also encourages the arrogance and moral superiority complex that so many liberals, in the broadest sense, are prone to and is one of the reasons that they fail at the ballot box.
There was a chap about 2000 years ago who had some interesting observations about motes and beams. She should reflect on it.
Thank goodness Tories and Unionists never indulge in that kind of behaviour (I couldn’t find the photoshop of Sturgeon in an SS uniform so beloved by your fruitier fellow travellers, I suspect twitter may have banned it). Motes and beams indeed.
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
What worries me about his move to Zurich is that he is doing so fully in the knowledge that he can’t stand the local German-speaking culture. It is a recipe for disaster. An immigrant who not only plans to refuse to integrate, but doesn’t even respect the locals.
There's also the matter that more than half of dwellings in Ch are rentals iirc, and foreigners can't buy one for quite a long time. Will Max out the blood pressure.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
Another day, another example of David Cameron’s Twitter maxim.
Why are political parties still not properly vetting their candidates’ social media histories, when they know that not-so-friendly opponents and newspapers definitely will be?
Helen Morgan, Lib Dem candidate in North Shropshire with today’s Godwin award, for writing, in the context of her son reading a book about the Holocaust:
“He commented that the Nazis were only able to do such terrible things because they didn’t think their victims were people. He’s 11. On Twitter this morning, there are people talking about cancelling their RNLI donations because they have picked up “illegals”. The language used every day in this country – by the Government, press and people with thousands of followers on social media – it’s nothing short of chilling.”
Then she liked a post from someone who replied:
‘Having visited Auschwitz concentration camp in the recent past. It really brings home man’s inhumanity to man. Now on a daily basis the language and actions of the Conservative Party make me more and more concerned about the direction they are taking the UK and its people.’
Her own post is totally on the money. The post she liked is perhaps a bit over the top. But I'm sure that plenty of people share the sentiment that the othering and scapegoating of refugees that's going on in this country right now is chilling, and, for anyone with a knowledge of European history, has some alarming historical resonances.
The suggestion that the Tories are similar to the Nazis in outlook and policies is absurd and, frankly, as good an example of "othering" as you will find. The SNP do very similar things demonising something like 25% of Scots who vote Tory and who, as a result, are apparently not real Scots. It also encourages the arrogance and moral superiority complex that so many liberals, in the broadest sense, are prone to and is one of the reasons that they fail at the ballot box.
There was a chap about 2000 years ago who had some interesting observations about motes and beams. She should reflect on it.
Thank goodness Tories and Unionists never indulge in that kind of behaviour (I couldn’t find the photoshop of Sturgeon in an SS uniform so beloved by your fruitier fellow travellers, I suspect twitter may have banned it). Motes and beams indeed.
That’s the one. Ironically what one might call the far right in Scotland tends to Unionism.
That’s a very seriously point actually as to why the SNP are wrong. Like Hitler they love the politics of nationalism. Take off those tinted glasses though and they see across the border in north of old Albion they feel 100% just the same as SNP about flipping London dominance.
Also SNP need to realise just how many Scots are in London flipping enjoying that flipping London south Albion thing!
SNP won’t last much longer. People of Scotland will tire of the Nationalism spectacles, gravitate to another approach and Scot nationalism will go back to be a fringe thing.
Telegraph doesn't think it looks too good for Kamala:
"some figures in Washington are reportedly considering the “nuclear option” of moving [Kamala Harris] to the Supreme Court and putting a more well-liked vice president in her place in time for the next presidential election. Staff are now leaving her office in their droves because they don’t want to be tarnished as a ‘Harris person’ ahead of 2024."
Is there a precedent for that? (Genuine question). I can’t think of a better way to undermine the perceived political independence of SCOTUS than by putting a senior politician on the bench
Well Harding nominated former President Taft.
Thanks. Google tells me there were 8 years between leaving the presidency and becoming Supreme Court justice so something of a firebreak at least.
Yes, there’s no direct precedent - but it’s not exactly unusual to appoint politicians to the SC. I suspect it would be less controversial than the recent-ish suggestion of Clinton (H).
A court that’s tolerated Alito and Thomas for as long as it has can’t be all that picky.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
Pretending to clean up the drugs problem. All this has been tried and failed. So double down. What's the betting seizing driving licences and passports of casual users won't be applied to any middle class dinner parties?
My sweeping generalisations on who wasn't wearing a mask yesterday...
On the trains, stag and hen groups.
In the shopping centre, groups of chavvy youths and those who had them.
I still haven't worked out why someone must wear a mask to pop into a half-deserted, airy supermarket for five minutes but it's OK to spend three hours un-masked in a crowded pub rubbing shoulders with a motley crew of drunken strangers.
The point of the rules are not to prevent everybody from catching C-19 but to slightly reduce the number that do each week to try to prevent it getting out of control. People can shop with masks on without too much trouble so it is not going to cost supermarkets much to implement. Masking up in pubs would have a much bigger financial effect on the landlords but as far fewer people go to pubs it would probably have a minor effect on R.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Quite. And what's all this about tightening up on drugs in prisons? Did we have a soft touch policy before? Why?
This is a response to some sort of focus group.
Nixon's war on drugs was code for war on black people. This is code for something or other.
Coincidentally, I've just discovered my fave new band The War On Drugs is playing London in April. Hurrah, if it happens.
Telegraph doesn't think it looks too good for Kamala:
"some figures in Washington are reportedly considering the “nuclear option” of moving [Kamala Harris] to the Supreme Court and putting a more well-liked vice president in her place in time for the next presidential election. Staff are now leaving her office in their droves because they don’t want to be tarnished as a ‘Harris person’ ahead of 2024."
Is there a precedent for that? (Genuine question). I can’t think of a better way to undermine the perceived political independence of SCOTUS than by putting a senior politician on the bench
How about the appointment of Amy Coney Barrett and Kavanaugh etc?
Your extreme partisanship blinds you.
The notion that SCOTUS is politically independent hasn't been true for decades, if ever.
Extreme partisanship?
I am biased towards preserving existing structures which more or less work and have been proven through time. Coupled with necessary, consensus based, reform when appropriate*
Both of the Justices that you suggest had a specific legal perspective that was shared by many in the majority party. But AFAIK they weren’t party political.
To appoint a sitting VP to the Supreme Court would create a precedent that would be ruthlessly exploited in future. It would completely undermine any chance of SCOTUS being seen as not party political.
But I know you are happy to expand the benches for political advantage so there isn’t much point in debating as you’ve already shown you don’t value the independence of the court…
Frankly that’s humbug. Kavanaugh is nothing if not a political hack. Barrett, I’ll grant you is a genuine ideologue. As for ‘ruthlessly exploited’, given the behaviour of Mitch McConnell over the last couple of administrations, you are joking. And very few think the Supreme Court in its current incarnation isn’t party political.
Whomever Biden nominates, should he get the chance, will be greeted with howls of outrage from Republicans - as the example of Merrick Garland makes very clear. To pretend otherwise is disingenuous in the extreme.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Quite. And what's all this about tightening up on drugs in prisons? Did we have a soft touch policy before? Why?
This is a response to some sort of focus group.
Nixon's war on drugs was code for war on black people. This is code for something or other.
Coincidentally, I've just discovered my fave new band The War On Drugs is playing London in April. Hurrah, if it happens.
Plays well with the old. Round up the feckless youngsters who can't afford a house cos they spend it on drugs. *
*Actually they don't. It's Generation X who really caned it. And still do. But this is the political subtext. Shores up the retired vote and their refusal to compromise with a changing reality.
My sweeping generalisations on who wasn't wearing a mask yesterday...
On the trains, stag and hen groups.
In the shopping centre, groups of chavvy youths and those who had them.
I still haven't worked out why someone must wear a mask to pop into a half-deserted, airy supermarket for five minutes but it's OK to spend three hours un-masked in a crowded pub rubbing shoulders with a motley crew of drunken strangers.
Perhaps because there’s still a large cohort of people avoiding pubs, an inessential, who find shopping essential ?
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Now, if the Lib Dems want to make a striking policy splash in North Shropshire, suggesting that pharmacists rather than criminals supply drugs might be an interesting one.
Decades of failed policy on drugs, and the problem appears to be worse than ever.
Respected Dutch journalist Erik Van Haren says Max Verstappen’s gearbox is fine and he won’t need a change and therefore avoids a grid penalty. Red Bull are not commenting at this stage
I guess they think the risk is worth it to give him a chance of the win. He made a similar calculation at the last corner of qualifying….
I love driving but not expert on motor sport warning, but isn’t risk other way around I think as you are saying? Get the gearbox to de risk it, and then try to get as many points from the race. First example is Lewis doing similar a few races back? Second example is at Monaco where Ferrari tried to chance it didn’t get far and ended up with nothing. Second or third better for the Max Child than nothing?
Yes, if you’re playing the long game you take the new gearbox and the penalty that comes with it. Yes, the precident is what happened with Lecerc’s Ferrari at Monaco, where they chose not to change the gearbox after a crash and it failed before the race even started.
It’s sadly already been suggested on other forums, that Max only needs that gearbox to last as long as it takes to run up the back of Lewis into the first corner, to move to the last race with the eight point lead intact.
Of course - but as he proved in qualifying, Max is a gambler who doesn’t pay much attention to the odds.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Now, if the Lib Dems want to make a striking policy splash in North Shropshire, suggesting that pharmacists rather than criminals supply drugs might be an interesting one.
Decades of failed policy on drugs, and the problem appears to be worse than ever.
Tisnt easy though. The most recent drug story has been all the yobs out of their heads on coke at the footie. The fact of it being legal coke isn't going to help.
Telegraph doesn't think it looks too good for Kamala:
"some figures in Washington are reportedly considering the “nuclear option” of moving [Kamala Harris] to the Supreme Court and putting a more well-liked vice president in her place in time for the next presidential election. Staff are now leaving her office in their droves because they don’t want to be tarnished as a ‘Harris person’ ahead of 2024."
Is there a precedent for that? (Genuine question). I can’t think of a better way to undermine the perceived political independence of SCOTUS than by putting a senior politician on the bench
How about the appointment of Amy Coney Barrett and Kavanaugh etc?
Your extreme partisanship blinds you.
The notion that SCOTUS is politically independent hasn't been true for decades, if ever.
Extreme partisanship?
I am biased towards preserving existing structures which more or less work and have been proven through time. Coupled with necessary, consensus based, reform when appropriate*
Both of the Justices that you suggest had a specific legal perspective that was shared by many in the majority party. But AFAIK they weren’t party political.
To appoint a sitting VP to the Supreme Court would create a precedent that would be ruthlessly exploited in future. It would completely undermine any chance of SCOTUS being seen as not party political.
But I know you are happy to expand the benches for political advantage so there isn’t much point in debating as you’ve already shown you don’t value the independence of the court…
Frankly that’s humbug. Kavanaugh is nothing if not a political hack. Barrett, I’ll grant you is a genuine ideologue. As for ‘ruthlessly exploited’, given the behaviour of Mitch McConnell over the last couple of administrations, you are joking. And very few think the Supreme Court in its current incarnation isn’t party political.
Whomever Biden nominates, should he get the chance, will be greeted with howls of outrage from Republicans - as the example of Merrick Garland makes very clear. To pretend otherwise is disingenuous in the extreme.
The President really needs to be leaning hard on Stephen Breyer (aged 83!) to let there be a vacancy before the mid-terms, while there’s just about a Democrat vote in the Senate.
Maybe even add Sonia Sotomayor, who’s 67, past what most people might consider to be retirement age.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
I don't think the idea that she is 'pro immigration' stands up to much scrutiny based on what she has said publicly for a while TBH (she wasn't even pro 2nd ref even if that was due to her constituency) and the 'pro imigration' left don't like her because of her record on work capability assessments among other reasons. I think the problem is she doesn't have any particular fan club outside the PLP and a narrow clique of weird FBPE posters on twitter even though I think she is still less deserving of criticism than certain recent and current 'moderate' Labour MPs.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Though with lower consumption overall. During the prohibition era fewer Americans drank alcohol for instance than did so once it was legalised again.
That is a balance you draw, the benefits of reduction of consumption of harmful substances and products from criminalisation with the likelihood those substances and products will be sold by criminals to those who still want to consume them. Plus the extra funds needed by the police and judicial system to arrest and jail those supplying and consuming those products.
For alcohol and soft drugs though moderate consumption is not very harmful and indeed in the case of red wine can have health benefits. Consumption of hard drugs though is harmful to health however much consumed
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
LOL I tipped you moving to the SNP a couple of months ago. Amused to see that you've realised that's where your heart lies now.
Just don't start banging on about Yoons. 😉
I'm not joining the SNP. As a Federalist that would be some leap...
You're not joining the SNP yet ...
You will and you'll campaign for Yes if there is another referendum, mark my words ...
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
LOL I tipped you moving to the SNP a couple of months ago. Amused to see that you've realised that's where your heart lies now.
Just don't start banging on about Yoons. 😉
I'm not joining the SNP. As a Federalist that would be some leap...
You're not joining the SNP yet ...
You will and you'll campaign for Yes if there is another referendum, mark my words ...
Why would a good federalist do that? You either buy into what works best or you don’t.
Scottish nationalism It’s just that same anti London bias 100%. Only with added Hitler spectacles on. And the popularity of SNP is on a cycle, ten years old now, clocks ticking. Won’t even be part of the political debate soon.
I say that, but still am I the only one on here who likes Nicola sturgeon, and thinks she she would be brill in the House of Commons Where she should be. With a stint as UK PM? And Farage should be in there too to add to debate. And lots more greens.
Sleepy UK has an out of date electoral system, a seventieth century restoration parliamentary system with billion sticky plasters and amendments on it. a silly mish mash devolvement of powers, a pickle of nationalist identity (where not all history has been good or fair) I mean, a devolvement of powers reliant on hand outs of money from… that flipping Dominant London thing again! LOL. Scottish Indy ref would have been 70%+ for if SNP had been able to explain how much of the vital money coming up from London is actually Scottish! 😀
The President really needs to be leaning hard on Stephen Breyer (aged 83!) to let there be a vacancy before the mid-terms, while there’s just about a Democrat vote in the Senate.
I have no idea if the 'nominate Harris' idea is serious or just a bonkers bit of clickbait, but if it was tried I could see Manchin effectively blocking it and making them pick somebody less obviously partisan instead...
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Though with lower consumption overall. During the prohibition era fewer Americans drank alcohol for instance than did so once it was legalised again.
That is a balance you draw, the benefits of reduction of consumption of harmful substances and products from criminalisation with the likelihood those substances and products will be sold by criminals to those who still want to consume them. Plus the extra funds needed by the police and judicial system to arrest and jail those supplying and consuming those products.
For alcohol and soft drugs though moderate consumption is not very harmful and indeed in the case of red wine can have health benefits. Consumption of hard drugs though is harmful to health however much consumed
No it isn't. Opiates in moderation are absolutely fine; heroin is the single drug the NHS gets through most of. Conversely cannabis psychosis is probably the most serious drug related health problem we have so the soft/hard distinction is meaningless.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Though with lower consumption overall. During the prohibition era fewer Americans drank alcohol for instance than did so once it was legalised again.
That is a balance you draw, the benefits of reduction of consumption of harmful substances and products from criminalisation with the likelihood those substances and products will be sold by criminals to those who still want to consume them. Plus the extra funds needed by the police and judicial system to arrest and jail those supplying and consuming those products.
For alcohol and soft drugs though moderate consumption is not very harmful and indeed in the case of red wine can have health benefits. Consumption of hard drugs though is harmful to health however much consumed
No it isn't. Opiates in moderation are absolutely fine; heroin is the single drug the NHS gets through most of. Conversely cannabis psychosis is probably the most serious drug related health problem we have so the soft/hard distinction is meaningless.
In which case keep all drugs still illegal, soft or hard, as that will reduce consumption
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
LOL I tipped you moving to the SNP a couple of months ago. Amused to see that you've realised that's where your heart lies now.
Just don't start banging on about Yoons. 😉
I'm not joining the SNP. As a Federalist that would be some leap...
You're not joining the SNP yet ...
You will and you'll campaign for Yes if there is another referendum, mark my words ...
Why would a good federalist do that? You either buy into what works best or you don’t.
Scottish nationalism It’s just that same anti London bias 100%. Only with added Hitler spectacles on. And the popularity of SNP is on a cycle, ten years old now, clocks ticking. Won’t even be part of the political debate soon.
I say that, but still am I the only one on here who likes Nicola sturgeon, and thinks she she would be brill in the House of Commons Where she should be. With a stint as UK PM? And Farage should be in there too to add to debate. And lots more greens.
Sleepy UK has an out of date electoral system, a seventieth century restoration parliamentary system with billion sticky plasters and amendments on it. a silly mish mash devolvement of powers, a pickle of nationalist identity (where not all history has been good or fair) I mean, a devolvement of powers reliant on hand outs of money from… that flipping Dominant London thing again! LOL. Scottish Indy ref would have been 70%+ for if SNP had been able to explain how much of the vital money coming up from London is actually Scottish! 😀
Not much of it actually unless you count North Sea oil tax revenues which are decliining
Cannabis use leads to a higher incidence of psychosis. Whether this is causal hasn't been proved AFAIAA. It may be that the folk who are susceptible to psychosis are more likely to self-medicate.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Quite. And what's all this about tightening up on drugs in prisons? Did we have a soft touch policy before? Why?
This is a response to some sort of focus group.
Nixon's war on drugs was code for war on black people. This is code for something or other.
Coincidentally, I've just discovered my fave new band The War On Drugs is playing London in April. Hurrah, if it happens.
No, it is more cynical than that. A lot of the red wall or "left behind" seaside towns have long been used as dumping grounds for indigent druggies. Now Boris has given up on new trains for northerners, he at least wants to get the drug-dependent beggars off the station forecourts. Red wall voters get a slightly enhanced quality of life and the blue team gets another term.
The President really needs to be leaning hard on Stephen Breyer (aged 83!) to let there be a vacancy before the mid-terms, while there’s just about a Democrat vote in the Senate.
I have no idea if the 'nominate Harris' idea is serious or just a bonkers bit of clickbait, but if it was tried I could see Manchin effectively blocking it and making them pick somebody less obviously partisan instead...
I think it's a bonkers theory as she'd not want to do it, but don't believe Manchin would block it were it credible.
He backed the nominations both Neil Gorsuch and Brett Kavanaugh, and said the only reason he didn't back Amy Coney Barrett was that it was too near to a Presidential election (and the precedent had been set on that in 2016).
So he's been pretty consistent that the President has a lot of leeway to nominate a qualified person to the job, which Kamala Harris is.
Telegraph doesn't think it looks too good for Kamala:
"some figures in Washington are reportedly considering the “nuclear option” of moving [Kamala Harris] to the Supreme Court and putting a more well-liked vice president in her place in time for the next presidential election. Staff are now leaving her office in their droves because they don’t want to be tarnished as a ‘Harris person’ ahead of 2024."
Is there a precedent for that? (Genuine question). I can’t think of a better way to undermine the perceived political independence of SCOTUS than by putting a senior politician on the bench
How about the appointment of Amy Coney Barrett and Kavanaugh etc?
Your extreme partisanship blinds you.
The notion that SCOTUS is politically independent hasn't been true for decades, if ever.
Extreme partisanship?
I am biased towards preserving existing structures which more or less work and have been proven through time. Coupled with necessary, consensus based, reform when appropriate*
Both of the Justices that you suggest had a specific legal perspective that was shared by many in the majority party. But AFAIK they weren’t party political.
To appoint a sitting VP to the Supreme Court would create a precedent that would be ruthlessly exploited in future. It would completely undermine any chance of SCOTUS being seen as not party political.
But I know you are happy to expand the benches for political advantage so there isn’t much point in debating as you’ve already shown you don’t value the independence of the court. That’s one of those things, like Brexit, where we won’t agree because we value different things. I’m in favour of fairness, integrity and the courts acting as a brake on the executive. I don’t know what you want.
* @HYUFD that’s the definition of a “true” conservative
All suggestions that Democrats would pack the court or so blatently undermine it are just laughable.
The Democrats are the ones who benefit from the Supreme Court continuing to pretend it isn't political. They're the ones using the court to try and claim some issues are beyond politics, so they're the ones who need to keep the line going. As soon as that line is clearly undermined, it'll be open season for Republicans to pack it right back and go back to letting states make democratic choices.
Telegraph doesn't think it looks too good for Kamala:
"some figures in Washington are reportedly considering the “nuclear option” of moving [Kamala Harris] to the Supreme Court and putting a more well-liked vice president in her place in time for the next presidential election. Staff are now leaving her office in their droves because they don’t want to be tarnished as a ‘Harris person’ ahead of 2024."
Is there a precedent for that? (Genuine question). I can’t think of a better way to undermine the perceived political independence of SCOTUS than by putting a senior politician on the bench
How about the appointment of Amy Coney Barrett and Kavanaugh etc?
Your extreme partisanship blinds you.
The notion that SCOTUS is politically independent hasn't been true for decades, if ever.
Extreme partisanship?
I am biased towards preserving existing structures which more or less work and have been proven through time. Coupled with necessary, consensus based, reform when appropriate*
Both of the Justices that you suggest had a specific legal perspective that was shared by many in the majority party. But AFAIK they weren’t party political.
To appoint a sitting VP to the Supreme Court would create a precedent that would be ruthlessly exploited in future. It would completely undermine any chance of SCOTUS being seen as not party political.
But I know you are happy to expand the benches for political advantage so there isn’t much point in debating as you’ve already shown you don’t value the independence of the court…
Frankly that’s humbug. Kavanaugh is nothing if not a political hack. Barrett, I’ll grant you is a genuine ideologue. As for ‘ruthlessly exploited’, given the behaviour of Mitch McConnell over the last couple of administrations, you are joking. And very few think the Supreme Court in its current incarnation isn’t party political.
Whomever Biden nominates, should he get the chance, will be greeted with howls of outrage from Republicans - as the example of Merrick Garland makes very clear. To pretend otherwise is disingenuous in the extreme.
The President really needs to be leaning hard on Stephen Breyer (aged 83!) to let there be a vacancy before the mid-terms, while there’s just about a Democrat vote in the Senate.
Maybe even add Sonia Sotomayor, who’s 67, past what most people might consider to be retirement age.
Breyer is clearly past it, as was abundantly clear from recent oral arguments. Sotomayor, though, is at the top of her game, and might be so for another decade. Retirement is entirely their choice, of course - but Breyer really should see sense if he values his legacy.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
How's that going to work with the requirement for ID to vote? Does it mean drug users lose their vote too?
As I have posted repeatedly, red wall voters aren't stupid. Where parties take them for granted they call it out. And if that means flitting from one party to another and back again then to another (Redcar, Burnley) then thats what they do.
The red wall isn't uniform, and the Tories are likely to enhance their majorities in seats like Stockton South where the MP is a character and is throwing himself about a bit to be seen to be delivering. But there are loads of others where the new MP is a nobber who has already sunk themselves - Redcar being a prime example.
Yes. I'm not sure the term Red Wall has added anything to political analysis. The North is more politically diverse than any other region. Not all seats gained by the Tories are similar. Leigh, for example, is becoming younger and more middle class, and has a quick growing population. It is rapidly becoming a commuter suburb of Manchester rather than a depressed ex- mining town.
Yes, if Red Wall was a race lots of people would be arrested for generalising critically about all Red Wallers. Part of the Red Wall shift is quite simply internal migration - people from other areas keen to get bargain-priced homes. But also, not everyone in the Red Wall is hostile to migration, and those who are hostile to migration are not all only motivated by that when they come to vote. People who I've met who are migration-critical, including UKIP and BNP voters, primarily want to stop what they perceive as uncontrolled migration. If they feel it's more or less being managed, they are prepared to consider other issues too.
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
LOL I tipped you moving to the SNP a couple of months ago. Amused to see that you've realised that's where your heart lies now.
Just don't start banging on about Yoons. 😉
I'm not joining the SNP. As a Federalist that would be some leap...
You're not joining the SNP yet ...
You will and you'll campaign for Yes if there is another referendum, mark my words ...
Why would a good federalist do that? You either buy into what works best or you don’t.
Scottish nationalism It’s just that same anti London bias 100%. Only with added Hitler spectacles on. And the popularity of SNP is on a cycle, ten years old now, clocks ticking. Won’t even be part of the political debate soon.
I say that, but still am I the only one on here who likes Nicola sturgeon, and thinks she she would be brill in the House of Commons Where she should be. With a stint as UK PM? And Farage should be in there too to add to debate. And lots more greens.
Sleepy UK has an out of date electoral system, a seventieth century restoration parliamentary system with billion sticky plasters and amendments on it. a silly mish mash devolvement of powers, a pickle of nationalist identity (where not all history has been good or fair) I mean, a devolvement of powers reliant on hand outs of money from… that flipping Dominant London thing again! LOL. Scottish Indy ref would have been 70%+ for if SNP had been able to explain how much of the vital money coming up from London is actually Scottish! 😀
Not much of it actually unless you count North Sea oil tax revenues which are decliining
That’s a good point isn’t it not
If there is to be another Scottish Indy ref, a simply yes or no, will the yes be for Scotland to have its own currency? Or be in the Euro? Or Stay with the London £ London hand outs?
Have they learnt this lesson from the last failed one? Well, if they have where is all the groundwork being put in to show they have? So you presume they hsvn’t, because it won’t go over the line without that groundwork.
The clocks ticking on the SNP to deliver. You know, I don’t even think they realise this.
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
Don’t get the criticism of you over this. I think your position is honourable and you would only be stabbing g the Lib Dem party in the back had you remained a member and not voted for them.
We often get posters here who claim to be floating voters, but end up being the opposite - solid partisans for one side or another. Mr Pioneers is close to being the opposite. He presents as a person of firm principles, but his declared voting record is akin to a random walk.
This opinion may be coloured by my opinion of tactical voting. I can see the appeal, but I tend to think that if you don't vote positively for what you want then you won't get it. A temporary expedient becomes a lifetime of voting against your wishes - or else you are using tactical voting as an excuse so that you can avoid the reality of having changed your mind.
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
Don’t get the criticism of you over this. I think your position is honourable and you would only be stabbing g the Lib Dem party in the back had you remained a member and not voted for them.
We often get posters here who claim to be floating voters, but end up being the opposite - solid partisans for one side or another. Mr Pioneers is close to being the opposite. He presents as a person of firm principles, but his declared voting record is akin to a random walk.
This opinion may be coloured by my opinion of tactical voting. I can see the appeal, but I tend to think that if you don't vote positively for what you want then you won't get it. A temporary expedient becomes a lifetime of voting against your wishes - or else you are using tactical voting as an excuse so that you can avoid the reality of having changed your mind.
I tend to agree, but then I am approaching retirement, in the knowledge that every single General Election vote I have ever cast has always been wasted. Despite the incessant trolling of our Philip, that isn’t a healthy state of affairs for any supposed democracy.
In my personal case, I had the luxury of having been able to vote for myself in five successive local election wins, which does deaden the pain somewhat. But there are nevertheless millions of citizens in our country whose votes have never counted for anything.
Another day, another example of David Cameron’s Twitter maxim.
Why are political parties still not properly vetting their candidates’ social media histories, when they know that not-so-friendly opponents and newspapers definitely will be?
Helen Morgan, Lib Dem candidate in North Shropshire with today’s Godwin award, for writing, in the context of her son reading a book about the Holocaust:
“He commented that the Nazis were only able to do such terrible things because they didn’t think their victims were people. He’s 11. On Twitter this morning, there are people talking about cancelling their RNLI donations because they have picked up “illegals”. The language used every day in this country – by the Government, press and people with thousands of followers on social media – it’s nothing short of chilling.”
Then she liked a post from someone who replied:
‘Having visited Auschwitz concentration camp in the recent past. It really brings home man’s inhumanity to man. Now on a daily basis the language and actions of the Conservative Party make me more and more concerned about the direction they are taking the UK and its people.’
Her own post is totally on the money. The post she liked is perhaps a bit over the top. But I'm sure that plenty of people share the sentiment that the othering and scapegoating of refugees that's going on in this country right now is chilling, and, for anyone with a knowledge of European history, has some alarming historical resonances.
The suggestion that the Tories are similar to the Nazis in outlook and policies is absurd and, frankly, as good an example of "othering" as you will find. The SNP do very similar things demonising something like 25% of Scots who vote Tory and who, as a result, are apparently not real Scots. It also encourages the arrogance and moral superiority complex that so many liberals, in the broadest sense, are prone to and is one of the reasons that they fail at the ballot box.
There was a chap about 2000 years ago who had some interesting observations about motes and beams. She should reflect on it.
Thank goodness Tories and Unionists never indulge in that kind of behaviour (I couldn’t find the photoshop of Sturgeon in an SS uniform so beloved by your fruitier fellow travellers, I suspect twitter may have banned it). Motes and beams indeed.
That’s the one. Ironically what one might call the far right in Scotland tends to Unionism.
That’s a very seriously point actually as to why the SNP are wrong. Like Hitler they love the politics of nationalism. Take off those tinted glasses though and they see across the border in north of old Albion they feel 100% just the same as SNP about flipping London dominance.
Also SNP need to realise just how many Scots are in London flipping enjoying that flipping London south Albion thing!
SNP won’t last much longer. People of Scotland will tire of the Nationalism spectacles, gravitate to another approach and Scot nationalism will go back to be a fringe thing.
I see you’re as insightful and original on this topic as on others.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
On topic this seat is safe for Labour. The blue surge topped out in the red wall in 2019, cannot see how they hope to win them in 2024 after what they've done.
I am not so sure.
The collapse of the Brexit vote is a big bonus for the Tories. Brexit voters dovetail nicely into the JohnsonIan Conservative Party.
Neither am I sure an intellectual Liberal like Cooper is that well equipped to deal with a super-populist like Priti. Cooper will look weak and on the side of vile villainy against Priti's near-future demands to execute Wayne Couzens, Emma Tustin, Gary Glitter and their ilk.
Ed should consider buying Yvette some dancing shoes.
I’m with you on both those points. I can’t see Brexit voters returning to Labour, they will switch to the Tories (and it’s not just Brexit - it’s the wider cultural issues). It’s also worth noting this will be. a seat where there will a drag effect from the “Labour till I die” voters dying off.
I said on here a few days back that SKS’s decision to put Cooper as SHS was an absolute stinker when it came to attracting back Red Wall voters - Cooper is pro-immigration and, in such a high profile role, will be in the public eye talking about the need to protect migrants etc.
However, there might be another angle to SKS’ move which is he is scared of a threat to Labour on the left flank, particularly from the Greens. In that case, his move does make some sense - it reminds these voters that Labour still cares about social justice issues etc. But what it means is that Labour is effectively giving up on an electoral winning strategy and now is retreating to its base.
Starmer has no chance of winning back most of the RedWall anyway, only Burnham probably has a chance of that and even getting Labour to most seats, let alone a majority.
Starmer has instead likely concluded his best chance of becoming PM is winning most of the Tory Remain marginals in London and the suburbs and a handful of the most marginal RedWall seats, helped by LD tactical votes there now Corbyn has gone. Then hope the LDs pick up Tory Remain marginals in the South and so he can become PM with LD and SNP support even if the Conservatives still win most seats. Hence the appointment of Cooper and Reeves and Lammy to replace Nandy as Labour's top team is dominated by Remainers and People's Vote supporters so he can double down on uniting Remainers behind Labour and the LDs at the next general election having also largely extinguished Corbynites from the top ranks of Labour even though Leavers will largely stick with Boris
Depends which sort of seats you mean, I think Labour can win back some of the more urban seats in the North they lost in 2019 like say Burnley, Darlington, Blackpool S at the next election. I can't see any route for Starmer to become PM that does not involve winning those type of seats. Although I expect the Tories to further buttress their position in the Midlands in places like West Bromwich. I agree though that it would require Burnham to win back seats like Leigh and Bolsover.
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
As I have posted repeatedly, red wall voters aren't stupid. Where parties take them for granted they call it out. And if that means flitting from one party to another and back again then to another (Redcar, Burnley) then thats what they do.
The red wall isn't uniform, and the Tories are likely to enhance their majorities in seats like Stockton South where the MP is a character and is throwing himself about a bit to be seen to be delivering. But there are loads of others where the new MP is a nobber who has already sunk themselves - Redcar being a prime example.
Yes. I'm not sure the term Red Wall has added anything to political analysis. The North is more politically diverse than any other region. Not all seats gained by the Tories are similar. Leigh, for example, is becoming younger and more middle class, and has a quick growing population. It is rapidly becoming a commuter suburb of Manchester rather than a depressed ex- mining town.
Edit. Not so much Leigh the town. But places like Astley, Lowton and Atherleigh which are currently in the constituency. Leigh town centre is still on its knees. But why would you go when Bolton and Wigan, let alone Manchester are so close?
Which is interesting because, on that basis (ie becoming more middle class and young), Leigh should not have gone Tory under the traditional viewpoint
Home ownership is still a reliable indicator of Conservative voting.
A young middle class home owner in a new estate in a mining area is very different from a young middle class flat sharer in an urban area.
Tackling drug abuse will be at the heart of a law and order initiative to be announced this week. It will include:
HARSH punishments to deter lifestyle drug use, including removal of passports and driving licences, night-time curfews and football-style travel bans; TOUGHER sentences for dealers, action to break up County Lines gangs who exploit children and a crackdown on drugs in prisons; RECORD spending on treatment and recovery services to get people out of addictions which drive offending; EXTRA cash for 50 local authorities with the worst drug problems, including Middlesbrough, Blackpool, Liverpool, Hull and coastal towns in the North East and Yorkshire. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/16941848/boris-johnson-drugs-crackdown-war/
Hold on. Is this political genius? Boris has given up on levelling up but hopes to keep those red wall voters by cleaning up their drugs problems. (And as @IshmaelZ notes, it puts the kybosh on Gove as a leadership rival.)
6 September
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Thank God they're responding with more criminalisation, an approach that has worked so well in the past. You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
Quite. And what's all this about tightening up on drugs in prisons? Did we have a soft touch policy before? Why?
This is a response to some sort of focus group.
Nixon's war on drugs was code for war on black people. This is code for something or other.
Coincidentally, I've just discovered my fave new band The War On Drugs is playing London in April. Hurrah, if it happens.
No, it is more cynical than that. A lot of the red wall or "left behind" seaside towns have long been used as dumping grounds for indigent druggies. Now Boris has given up on new trains for northerners, he at least wants to get the drug-dependent beggars off the station forecourts. Red wall voters get a slightly enhanced quality of life and the blue team gets another term.
Yes but. It is exactly the same policy. I don't see how it works.
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
Don’t get the criticism of you over this. I think your position is honourable and you would only be stabbing g the Lib Dem party in the back had you remained a member and not voted for them.
We often get posters here who claim to be floating voters, but end up being the opposite - solid partisans for one side or another. Mr Pioneers is close to being the opposite. He presents as a person of firm principles, but his declared voting record is akin to a random walk.
This opinion may be coloured by my opinion of tactical voting. I can see the appeal, but I tend to think that if you don't vote positively for what you want then you won't get it. A temporary expedient becomes a lifetime of voting against your wishes - or else you are using tactical voting as an excuse so that you can avoid the reality of having changed your mind.
I’m sorry but Mr P’s voting record is similar to mine, vote for the least worst person who may win the election.
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
Don’t get the criticism of you over this. I think your position is honourable and you would only be stabbing g the Lib Dem party in the back had you remained a member and not voted for them.
We often get posters here who claim to be floating voters, but end up being the opposite - solid partisans for one side or another. Mr Pioneers is close to being the opposite. He presents as a person of firm principles, but his declared voting record is akin to a random walk.
This opinion may be coloured by my opinion of tactical voting. I can see the appeal, but I tend to think that if you don't vote positively for what you want then you won't get it. A temporary expedient becomes a lifetime of voting against your wishes - or else you are using tactical voting as an excuse so that you can avoid the reality of having changed your mind.
I’m sorry but Mr P’s voting record is similar to mine, vote for the least worst person who may win the election.
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
Don’t get the criticism of you over this. I think your position is honourable and you would only be stabbing g the Lib Dem party in the back had you remained a member and not voted for them.
We often get posters here who claim to be floating voters, but end up being the opposite - solid partisans for one side or another. Mr Pioneers is close to being the opposite. He presents as a person of firm principles, but his declared voting record is akin to a random walk.
This opinion may be coloured by my opinion of tactical voting. I can see the appeal, but I tend to think that if you don't vote positively for what you want then you won't get it. A temporary expedient becomes a lifetime of voting against your wishes - or else you are using tactical voting as an excuse so that you can avoid the reality of having changed your mind.
I tend to agree, but then I am approaching retirement, in the knowledge that every single General Election vote I have ever cast has always been wasted. Despite the incessant trolling of our Philip, that isn’t a healthy state of affairs for any supposed democracy.
In my personal case, I had the luxury of having been able to vote for myself in five successive local election wins, which does deaden the pain somewhat. But there are nevertheless millions of citizens in our country whose votes have never counted for anything.
What nonsense. There's no right in a democracy to vote for a winner.
Having resolved that I have to vote SNP to remove the lickspittle Duguid, I have resigned my membership of the LibDems. I can't in good conscience remain as a member having decided to vote against whomever their candidate is.
Stabbed the Lib Dems in the back too now mate. Maybe the issue isn't with them?
Comedy gold. Having embarrassed yourself claiming things about an exit wave that was entirely your invention, you're still going on about traitors and backstabbers.
When do you stab the UK in the back and move to Switzerland? I don't deny the mote in my eye...
Don’t get the criticism of you over this. I think your position is honourable and you would only be stabbing g the Lib Dem party in the back had you remained a member and not voted for them.
We often get posters here who claim to be floating voters, but end up being the opposite - solid partisans for one side or another. Mr Pioneers is close to being the opposite. He presents as a person of firm principles, but his declared voting record is akin to a random walk.
This opinion may be coloured by my opinion of tactical voting. I can see the appeal, but I tend to think that if you don't vote positively for what you want then you won't get it. A temporary expedient becomes a lifetime of voting against your wishes - or else you are using tactical voting as an excuse so that you can avoid the reality of having changed your mind.
I tend to agree, but then I am approaching retirement, in the knowledge that every single General Election vote I have ever cast has always been wasted. Despite the incessant trolling of our Philip, that isn’t a healthy state of affairs for any supposed democracy.
In my personal case, I had the luxury of having been able to vote for myself in five successive local election wins, which does deaden the pain somewhat. But there are nevertheless millions of citizens in our country whose votes have never counted for anything.
What nonsense. There's no right in a democracy to vote for a winner.
Not what he said though is it? There should be an expectation that your vote counts for something and not be completely wasted.
Another day, another example of David Cameron’s Twitter maxim.
Why are political parties still not properly vetting their candidates’ social media histories, when they know that not-so-friendly opponents and newspapers definitely will be?
Helen Morgan, Lib Dem candidate in North Shropshire with today’s Godwin award, for writing, in the context of her son reading a book about the Holocaust:
“He commented that the Nazis were only able to do such terrible things because they didn’t think their victims were people. He’s 11. On Twitter this morning, there are people talking about cancelling their RNLI donations because they have picked up “illegals”. The language used every day in this country – by the Government, press and people with thousands of followers on social media – it’s nothing short of chilling.”
Then she liked a post from someone who replied:
‘Having visited Auschwitz concentration camp in the recent past. It really brings home man’s inhumanity to man. Now on a daily basis the language and actions of the Conservative Party make me more and more concerned about the direction they are taking the UK and its people.’
Her own post is totally on the money. The post she liked is perhaps a bit over the top. But I'm sure that plenty of people share the sentiment that the othering and scapegoating of refugees that's going on in this country right now is chilling, and, for anyone with a knowledge of European history, has some alarming historical resonances.
The suggestion that the Tories are similar to the Nazis in outlook and policies is absurd and, frankly, as good an example of "othering" as you will find. The SNP do very similar things demonising something like 25% of Scots who vote Tory and who, as a result, are apparently not real Scots. It also encourages the arrogance and moral superiority complex that so many liberals, in the broadest sense, are prone to and is one of the reasons that they fail at the ballot box.
There was a chap about 2000 years ago who had some interesting observations about motes and beams. She should reflect on it.
Thank goodness Tories and Unionists never indulge in that kind of behaviour (I couldn’t find the photoshop of Sturgeon in an SS uniform so beloved by your fruitier fellow travellers, I suspect twitter may have banned it). Motes and beams indeed.
That’s the one. Ironically what one might call the far right in Scotland tends to Unionism.
That’s a very seriously point actually as to why the SNP are wrong. Like Hitler they love the politics of nationalism. Take off those tinted glasses though and they see across the border in north of old Albion they feel 100% just the same as SNP about flipping London dominance.
Also SNP need to realise just how many Scots are in London flipping enjoying that flipping London south Albion thing!
SNP won’t last much longer. People of Scotland will tire of the Nationalism spectacles, gravitate to another approach and Scot nationalism will go back to be a fringe thing.
I see you’re as insightful and original on this topic as on others.
Does Britain have a significant drug overdose problem?
The United States lost over 100,000 to drug overdoses last year. The main problem now, as I understand it, is fentanyl, most of it coming from China, directly or indirectly.
(Cannabis psychosis gets almost no discussion here, perhaps because so many of our journalists use the stuff, regularly.)
Does Britain have a significant drug overdose problem?
The United States lost over 100,000 to drug overdoses last year. The main problem now, as I understand it, is fentanyl, most of it coming from China, directly or indirectly.
(Cannabis psychosis gets almost no discussion here, perhaps because so many of our journalists use the stuff, regularly.)
Comments
There are hardly any remain marginals in London apart from Kensington, Chingford and Chipping Barnet that Labour can hope to win at the next election so Starmer would be on a hiding to nothing with that strategy (although I'm not sure that is the strategy if there is any 'strategy' whatsoever).
So you're talking nonsense again.
However, it’s also a point that, when it comes to strategy, BJ is miles ahead of Labour. SKS thinks the RV voters are all still about Brexit and it will be forgotten by 2023/4. He’s wrong. BJ is right in realising that Brexit was the symptom of much wider dissatisfaction on the whole cultural front. He will therefore play up to all those issues.
What’s more he knows that Labour’s urban, socially superior intellectual base just won’t be able to help themselves when it comes to criticising people like Patel and particularly Dorries. Lots of sniggering at the latter’s background, her books etc. But what Labour’s core sees as being witty is interpreted in many areas as condescension and a “I’m so much better than you” worldview. And, if there is one thing that will motivate voters to give Labour another pasting is the view Labour looks down on them.
The red wall isn't uniform, and the Tories are likely to enhance their majorities in seats like Stockton South where the MP is a character and is throwing himself about a bit to be seen to be delivering. But there are loads of others where the new MP is a nobber who has already sunk themselves - Redcar being a prime example.
ON TOPIC Great to have you back Eagles as I said the same as your header last week and got just as much stick!
I’m sticking by it. Obviously outside Yorkshire posters can’t spot limp and has been politicians!
Hendon and Cities of London and Westminster are London Remain seats Starmer would hope to win along with the 3 you mentioned. Plus a few Remain or soft Leave seats in the South and East with a strong Labour vote like Stroud, Hastings and Watford and Peterborough and Wycombe. Add the more urban RedWall seats in the top 50 Labour target seats then he can get to 250-255.
Betting PostF1: after much procrastinating, I've backed Tsunoda at 4.75 to win group (the Alpines and Ricciardo). He starts first of that set, and while Ocon's only one place behind he was two-tenths slower.
https://enormo-haddock.blogspot.com/2021/12/saudi-arabia-pre-race-2021.html
A couple of hours later, it looks like a very easy win for the home team.
Dorries is indeed inspirational if populism is the strategy. And yes to people like myself she comes across as utterly moronic, but she too resonates with voters who matter.
When JohnsonIan Conservativism finally withers and dies our country will be in one hell of a sub-Corbyn mess.
The North is more politically diverse than any other region.
Not all seats gained by the Tories are similar. Leigh, for example, is becoming younger and more middle class, and has a quick growing population. It is rapidly becoming a commuter suburb of Manchester rather than a depressed ex- mining town.
I mean I got it from a play I was in, where serfs (Greens) were fighting bolsheviks in the revolution because the reds were determined to free serfs from their serfdom, which would mean they wouldn’t get homed, looked after or paid anymore.
Yet another reason not to vote for socialists.
They may have had a quick look at it on the back of the truck, but way too early for them to have made the decision.
Perhaps Red Bull might ask the medical centre, if they could use a CT scanner for a few minutes?
To be very honest Topping my first thought to that is it wouldn’t bother them. 🤔 The very rich could just carry on doing their work, and running all their business interests - including their MP or house of lords job - from the beach they are on?
Leigh town centre is still on its knees. But why would you go when Bolton and Wigan, let alone Manchester are so close?
Just don't start banging on about Yoons. 😉
The younger end are homeowners too. Housing is cheap. But this is detached and semis land for families. Not single urban professionals.
Plus. The miners are dying off. You really have to be 60+ to have been down t'pit. And very few of them. Most will be 80+ now.
So, there are many different local factors at play, as in all.
I actually Like Nicola Sturgeon.
ON TOPIC you see she would be more effective than Mrs Balls.
It is, both literally and politically, a changing landscape.
I think the problem is she doesn't have any particular fan club outside the PLP and a narrow clique of weird FBPE posters on twitter even though I think she is still less deserving of criticism than certain recent and current 'moderate' Labour MPs.
It’s sadly already been suggested on other forums, that Max only needs that gearbox to last as long as it takes to run up the back of Lewis into the first corner, to move to the last race with the eight point lead intact.
Ironically what one might call the far right in Scotland tends to Unionism.
IIRC there is no limit on compensation for secondary sex discrimination.
Spouse purchase, maybe.
"Cash, drugs and weapons were seized during a county lines operation in Shropshire.
Officers from West Mercia and Merseyside Police targeted supplies and associated crime in Oswestry, Whitchurch, Market Drayton, Harlescott, Castlefields and Shrewsbury town centre.
Seven people have been arrested, £9,000 in cash was seized and four weapons including three knives were found by police.
Shropshire Proactive CID's Detective Constable Ben Docherty said: “We know individuals involved in county lines drug dealing are travelling from Merseyside into Shropshire. Those involved in this criminality are either looking to exploit vulnerable people in our communities or are being exploited themselves.
“We are working in partnership with Merseyside Police to strengthen our response to disrupt their drugs supply and protect those at risk of exploitation.”
https://www.bordercountiesadvertizer.co.uk/news/19562530.cash-drugs-weapons-seized-county-lines-operation/
I think this is narrowly focussed on NS. County lines presumably cropping up on the doorstep.
Also SNP need to realise just how many Scots are in London flipping enjoying that flipping London south Albion thing!
SNP won’t last much longer. People of Scotland will tire of the Nationalism spectacles, gravitate to another approach and Scot nationalism will go back to be a fringe thing.
A court that’s tolerated Alito and Thomas for as long as it has can’t be all that picky.
You make stuff criminal, it gets sold by criminals. It's not rocket science.
All this has been tried and failed. So double down.
What's the betting seizing driving licences and passports of casual users won't be applied to any middle class dinner parties?
Again.
FFS.
This is a response to some sort of focus group.
Nixon's war on drugs was code for war on black people. This is code for something or other.
Coincidentally, I've just discovered my fave new band The War On Drugs is playing London in April. Hurrah, if it happens.
Kavanaugh is nothing if not a political hack. Barrett, I’ll grant you is a genuine ideologue.
As for ‘ruthlessly exploited’, given the behaviour of Mitch McConnell over the last couple of administrations, you are joking. And very few think the Supreme Court in its current incarnation isn’t party political.
Whomever Biden nominates, should he get the chance, will be greeted with howls of outrage from Republicans - as the example of Merrick Garland makes very clear. To pretend otherwise is disingenuous in the extreme.
*Actually they don't. It's Generation X who really caned it. And still do.
But this is the political subtext. Shores up the retired vote and their refusal to compromise with a changing reality.
Decades of failed policy on drugs, and the problem appears to be worse than ever.
Maybe even add Sonia Sotomayor, who’s 67, past what most people might consider to be retirement age.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/06/nicola-sturgeon-and-yvette-cooper-offer-to-house-syrian-refugees
But you are right in the fact she doesn’t have much of a fan base.
She is a clear lay (betting wise).
That is a balance you draw, the benefits of reduction of consumption of harmful substances and products from criminalisation with the likelihood those substances and products will be sold by criminals to those who still want to consume them. Plus the extra funds needed by the police and judicial system to arrest and jail those supplying and consuming those products.
For alcohol and soft drugs though moderate consumption is not very harmful and indeed in the case of red wine can have health benefits. Consumption of hard drugs though is harmful to health however much consumed
You will and you'll campaign for Yes if there is another referendum, mark my words ...
Scottish nationalism It’s just that same anti London bias 100%. Only with added Hitler spectacles on.
And the popularity of SNP is on a cycle, ten years old now, clocks ticking. Won’t even be part of the political debate soon.
I say that, but still am I the only one on here who likes Nicola sturgeon, and thinks she she would be brill in the House of Commons Where she should be. With a stint as UK PM? And Farage should be in there too to add to debate. And lots more greens.
Sleepy UK has an out of date electoral system, a seventieth century restoration parliamentary system with billion sticky plasters and amendments on it. a silly mish mash devolvement of powers, a pickle of nationalist identity (where not all history has been good or fair) I mean, a devolvement of powers reliant on hand outs of money from… that flipping Dominant London thing again! LOL. Scottish Indy ref would have been 70%+ for if SNP had been able to explain how much of the vital money coming up from London is actually Scottish! 😀
Whether this is causal hasn't been proved AFAIAA. It may be that the folk who are susceptible to psychosis are more likely to self-medicate.
He backed the nominations both Neil Gorsuch and Brett Kavanaugh, and said the only reason he didn't back Amy Coney Barrett was that it was too near to a Presidential election (and the precedent had been set on that in 2016).
So he's been pretty consistent that the President has a lot of leeway to nominate a qualified person to the job, which Kamala Harris is.
The Democrats are the ones who benefit from the Supreme Court continuing to pretend it isn't political. They're the ones using the court to try and claim some issues are beyond politics, so they're the ones who need to keep the line going. As soon as that line is clearly undermined, it'll be open season for Republicans to pack it right back and go back to letting states make democratic choices.
Sotomayor, though, is at the top of her game, and might be so for another decade. Retirement is entirely their choice, of course - but Breyer really should see sense if he values his legacy.
If there is to be another Scottish Indy ref, a simply yes or no, will the yes be for Scotland to have its own currency? Or be in the Euro? Or Stay with the London £ London hand outs?
Have they learnt this lesson from the last failed one? Well, if they have where is all the groundwork being put in to show they have? So you presume they hsvn’t, because it won’t go over the line without that groundwork.
The clocks ticking on the SNP to deliver. You know, I don’t even think they realise this.
This opinion may be coloured by my opinion of tactical voting. I can see the appeal, but I tend to think that if you don't vote positively for what you want then you won't get it. A temporary expedient becomes a lifetime of voting against your wishes - or else you are using tactical voting as an excuse so that you can avoid the reality of having changed your mind.
In my personal case, I had the luxury of having been able to vote for myself in five successive local election wins, which does deaden the pain somewhat. But there are nevertheless millions of citizens in our country whose votes have never counted for anything.
Boris Johnson orders de-escalation of tensions with France https://on.ft.com/3xWjQBJ
A young middle class home owner in a new estate in a mining area is very different from a young middle class flat sharer in an urban area.
It is exactly the same policy. I don't see how it works.
NEW THREAD
The United States lost over 100,000 to drug overdoses last year. The main problem now, as I understand it, is fentanyl, most of it coming from China, directly or indirectly.
(Cannabis psychosis gets almost no discussion here, perhaps because so many of our journalists use the stuff, regularly.)