Pandemic etiquette question: You have a bad cough. You are confident that it is not covid (negative LFTs, seems to be the end of a normal cold). You can work from home, but normally go in a couple of times a week (this frequency normal practice in your workplace now). Do you stay working at home until the cough has cleared?
(This is me and I am staying at home - if nothing else I might spread the nasty cold - but pre-pandemic, even though I was able to work from home I probably would have gone in at some point while still having symptoms.)
It is Thursday; there are (probably) only two more days left in the working week. Maybe give today a miss with a view to possibly putting in an appearance on Friday. Or not, as it's Friday!
And I hope everything clears up PDQ, and the LFT's stay negative.
I'm allergic to Fridays! Well, I won't be in tomorrow as Fridays seem completely dead in the office - I've been in one Friday since we've been back in and saw one person I knew (not even in my team) all day. As the only point of going on is to actually see people and have some in person chat and meetings, I won't be in tomorrow (we're booking in - still occupancy limits in theory although I have my own office so not really for me) as no one else is.
I was keen to go, had cough been better as I've not been in for a couple of weeks - first stomach bug through the house that I didn't want to pass on and was off a coupe of days myself and now the cold.
No line management problems with WFH - even pre pandemic I was only in 2-3 days a week.
Just interested in the difference in attitudes now. Pre pandemic I'd have stayed home while the sickness bug was in our household, but would have gone in with a cough/cold.
I always find this strange; for the first half of my working life I was running pharmacies and if I wasn't there had to ensure a qualified replacement. Which meant that sometimes I crawled in only marginally fit, at best.
Ah, but you had a job that was actually important and people needed you
I mean, my research is world-changing, obviously, but the Lancet are content for me to submit my paper on Monday rather than today (and reject it on Tuesday rather than tomorrow!)
One thing about Covid that no one really seems to be stating:
The blunt reality is that vaccine effectiveness, upon which everything was and still is pinned, isnt quite as good as hoped, something illustrated by the fact you appartently need to be jabbed three times within 12 months and that the ability to prevent onward transmission isnt as good as what was hoped. Maybe version 2 of vaccines will improve this.
One thing does make me wonder, however about the way vaccine efficacy is being graded. How are they measuring this waning? Its not as if if I get a tetanus or a polio or whatever vaccine that my body maintains high levels of circulating antibodies for 10 or 15 years is it. What it should retain is memory in the locker about what to do when it comes across particular pathogen. How do you measure that memory? My understanding is that we have no idea whether that memory is anyway depleted, the entire science is based around the circulating antibodies which doesnt seem to actually be a good way of deciding vaccine effectiveness long term.
I am a fully signed up member of the vaccine club, doubled jabbed but its fair to say that I'm increasingly sceptical of the requirement for jab 3 on science grounds. I get it for the very old or the comprised who simply dont have the more finely tuned immunity system of most but are we really going end up with most of the population that have had two jabs then getting a third?
The standard efficacy measure is to compare the rates of infection in those vaccinated with those unvaccinated.
You do have to adjust for confounders (such as age differences, activity differences, and so forth) and increasing acquired immunity in the unjabbed provides an artificial apparent waning in any case to adjust for actual waning (if, say, half the unjabbed have acquired immunity, you’re not comparing vaxxed immune against unimmune but vaxxed immune against half-unimmune-and-half-infected-immune).
You also get difficulty if you don’t know the denominator (in the UK, we don’t actually know how many people are in the UK. The two main measures - ONS count and NIMS count - differ by several million, so whilst the number of jabbed per age range is well known, the number of unjabbed is very unclear (If you have jabbed 4.0 million in a certain age range and one measure things you have 4.2 million total people in that age range and the other reckons you have 4.8 million people, you have either 4.0 : 0.2 or 4.0 : 0.8, which changes the calculation significantly. And, of course, the antivaxxers grab the known-wrong numbers to “prove” it doesn’t work.
They’ve got around this to an extent by comparing triple-jabbed to double-jabbed and seen a huge and lasting benefit.
Some important points there on apparent waning.
The simplist figures to look at are the hospitalisations, ICU numbers and deaths as that measures the clinical impact. While the majority of our inpatients are double vaccinated and 15% triple, the severely sick are biased strongly to the unvaccinated.
It's been a long 2 years since this first appeared.
I get mine tomorrow. I am not sure that is even 6 months since my second. If it is it must be only just.
I had the text to book mine Monday and same-day appointments were available, at 5 and a half months. Of course, now I've got it, I have to wait another 28 days.
Yesterday I felt like I was improving - felt much brighter and did some stuff round the house - obvious I have been feeling lethargic and a bit brain-fogged but only because now it's no longer there. Aim to do some work from home today if only to counteract the boredom, but have woken up feeling very fatigued so I am going to try to get a bit more sleep.
Hope you feel better soon. Get lots of rest. I feel completely wiped out, spent the night shivering and having weird dreams. I'd been hoping to get some work done today too but not sure that's going to happen now.
I had similar thoughts, but apart from logging on for half an hour to check my diary, I haven't done so. It was obvious when I did so yesterday morning that I just didn't have the concentration. I had two such feverish nights and after the second I was completely wiped out.
If £96bn is available for infrastructure then I repeat that £96bn in road upgrades and new motorways etc would do far more for more people and for the economy than marginally faster commutes to London.
And if its all about "capacity" then lets apply that to roads too. How much would capacity be improved if a parallel M62 was built?
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
The reason they don't use the railway is because it is shit in their areas, not that they don't care about this.
When they see vastly better services promised then taken away meaning they are stuck on shitty buses and awfully congested roads as the railway is not an option, they will not be impressed.
Another example of broken promises, another example of not caring enough about the north which really does bite through in the Red Wall seats.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
So, If only that had been mentioned in the Tory manifesto. Point is it was not, but what was mentioned, and indeed was a clear centrepiece in the pitch to the Northern English voters is now in the process of being ditched. It is not the policy as such that is the Conservatives´ problem, it is the track back from a clear promise that is killing them.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
Fab. So we're scrapping Northern Powerhouse Rail to build a new all-weather motorway link over the Pennines...?
One thing about Covid that no one really seems to be stating:
The blunt reality is that vaccine effectiveness, upon which everything was and still is pinned, isnt quite as good as hoped, something illustrated by the fact you appartently need to be jabbed three times within 12 months and that the ability to prevent onward transmission isnt as good as what was hoped. Maybe version 2 of vaccines will improve this.
One thing does make me wonder, however about the way vaccine efficacy is being graded. How are they measuring this waning? Its not as if if I get a tetanus or a polio or whatever vaccine that my body maintains high levels of circulating antibodies for 10 or 15 years is it. What it should retain is memory in the locker about what to do when it comes across particular pathogen. How do you measure that memory? My understanding is that we have no idea whether that memory is anyway depleted, the entire science is based around the circulating antibodies which doesnt seem to actually be a good way of deciding vaccine effectiveness long term.
I am a fully signed up member of the vaccine club, doubled jabbed but its fair to say that I'm increasingly sceptical of the requirement for jab 3 on science grounds. I get it for the very old or the comprised who simply dont have the more finely tuned immunity system of most but are we really going end up with most of the population that have had two jabs then getting a third?
The standard efficacy measure is to compare the rates of infection in those vaccinated with those unvaccinated.
You do have to adjust for confounders (such as age differences, activity differences, and so forth) and increasing acquired immunity in the unjabbed provides an artificial apparent waning in any case to adjust for actual waning (if, say, half the unjabbed have acquired immunity, you’re not comparing vaxxed immune against unimmune but vaxxed immune against half-unimmune-and-half-infected-immune).
You also get difficulty if you don’t know the denominator (in the UK, we don’t actually know how many people are in the UK. The two main measures - ONS count and NIMS count - differ by several million, so whilst the number of jabbed per age range is well known, the number of unjabbed is very unclear (If you have jabbed 4.0 million in a certain age range and one measure things you have 4.2 million total people in that age range and the other reckons you have 4.8 million people, you have either 4.0 : 0.2 or 4.0 : 0.8, which changes the calculation significantly. And, of course, the antivaxxers grab the known-wrong numbers to “prove” it doesn’t work.
They’ve got around this to an extent by comparing triple-jabbed to double-jabbed and seen a huge and lasting benefit.
Some important points there on apparent waning.
The simplist figures to look at are the hospitalisations, ICU numbers and deaths as that measures the clinical impact. While the majority of our inpatients are double vaccinated and 15% triple, the severely sick are biased strongly to the unvaccinated.
It's been a long 2 years since this first appeared.
Indeed.
The cases figures are even harder to de-confound, because the outright covid denialists and antivaxxers are, unsurprisingly almost all in the unvaxxed and take up a fairly significant proportion of them. And those ones are far less likely to get a covid test when pinged or even when symptomatic.
If and when they end up in ICU, that reluctance has ceased to be a factor, though.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
Car commuters - so let's talk about the Darlington Northern Relief road ( designed to get 1000 lorries a day off the streets of Darlington as they head to Teesside / Amazon) which was scrapped earlier this year.
I suspect a lot (most) other constituencies will have similar attack points. For Bishop Auckland it's a bypass that was going to bypass 2 villages / pain points but now will only bypass one in a way that the other village can no longer be bypassed.
Now give us those rather than the railway infrastructure by all means but Boris can't because these were scrapped earlier this year and other work prioritised. And there are only so many contractors to go round all of whom are busy.
The Lib Dem leaflet once again demonstrates that party's utter paucity of ideas.
They won in Chesham & Amersham. Against all the odds and against what virtually everyone on here predicted, except Mike Smithson.
Chesham and Amersham was in Chiltern which was 55% Remain and the LDs got 56% in the by election ie virtually identical.
North Shropshire however was 59% Leave and only 41% Remain
So viewed like that, they need to flip 1 Leave voter in 6 over sleaze, or have 2 Leave voters in 6 stay home over it. On balance that feels like too heavy a lift, but definitely not unthinkable.
There simply isn't any way that what Liar is suggesting in the Northern Echo can be delivered. Ending HS2E at the power station means a slow trundle to Nottingham or Derby along already congested 2 track lines. North to Chesterfield there is 4 tracks, but then a crawl along already congested 2 track lines to Sheffield and then onwards towards Leeds.
"I will build all of HS2" is a lie. "I can delikver almost all the benefits quicker for less money" is a laughable lie. Red wall voters are not stupid. They are not going to believe anything this lot promise them, especially if the more dense of their new MPs try and claim that not building the promised stuff delivers better results than the promised stuff.
Laughable. Northerners simply aren't worth investing in - thats the message.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
Fab. So we're scrapping Northern Powerhouse Rail to build a new all-weather motorway link over the Pennines...?
I think in Boris's world that's covered by the dualling of the single lane bits of the A66 (which was just about the only local project that wasn't scrapped in the spending review as it should have been done 20 years ago).
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
Car commuters - so let's talk about the Darlington Northern Relief road ( designed to get 1000 lorries a day off the streets of Darlington as they head to Teesside / Amazon) which was scrapped earlier this year.
I suspect a lot (most) other constituencies will have similar attack points. For Bishop Auckland it's a bypass that was going to bypass 2 villages / pain points but now will only bypass one in a way that the other village can no longer be bypassed.
Now give us those rather than the railway infrastructure by all means but Boris can't because these were scrapped earlier this year and other work prioritised. And there are only so many contractors to go round all of whom are busy.
This is a much bigger failing in my eyes than any London obsessions over a rail route taht wouldn't even be built for decades.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
This leads to an interesting (to me, at least...) question; are successful metropolitan areas successful because of access to good mass transit? How much does mass transit act as a catalyst for the economic success of an area?
IMV: without mass transit, there is zero way London could be an economic success. It would just drown in cars. So how much are areas like Manchester, Leeds, Edinburgh etc held back by *not* having brilliant mass transit?
(And London's mass transit is brilliant, however much regular uses may wish to complain about it.)
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
Fab. So we're scrapping Northern Powerhouse Rail to build a new all-weather motorway link over the Pennines...?
I think in Boris's world that's covered by the dualling of the single lane bits of the A66 (which was just about the only local project that wasn't scrapped in the spending review as it should have been done 20 years ago).
Infrastructure in this country has been a joke for decades. We decided that we didn't need a chunk of the rail network because we were building roads - and then stopped building roads as well. The A66 would be a motorway in any other country.
There simply isn't any way that what Liar is suggesting in the Northern Echo can be delivered. Ending HS2E at the power station means a slow trundle to Nottingham or Derby along already congested 2 track lines. North to Chesterfield there is 4 tracks, but then a crawl along already congested 2 track lines to Sheffield and then onwards towards Leeds.
"I will build all of HS2" is a lie. "I can delikver almost all the benefits quicker for less money" is a laughable lie. Red wall voters are not stupid. They are not going to believe anything this lot promise them, especially if the more dense of their new MPs try and claim that not building the promised stuff delivers better results than the promised stuff.
Laughable. Northerners simply aren't worth investing in - thats the message.
Boris is talking about speed so everyone really should be focussed on capacity.
And that is a very simple question will the number and frequency of train slots that would have been available across HS2 / Midland mainline and ECML be the same with Boris's new plans.
The irony is that long distance rail travel is already close to pre covid rates and was always profitable.
Morning all. Anasthesia is very weird. You might feel a little sleepy, says the nurse, and the next thing you know it’s a couple of hours later and you feel like a bottle of whisky disappeared last night!
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
Fab. So we're scrapping Northern Powerhouse Rail to build a new all-weather motorway link over the Pennines...?
I think in Boris's world that's covered by the dualling of the single lane bits of the A66 (which was just about the only local project that wasn't scrapped in the spending review as it should have been done 20 years ago).
Infrastructure in this country has been a joke for decades. We decided that we didn't need a chunk of the rail network because we were building roads - and then stopped building roads as well. The A66 would be a motorway in any other country.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
Car commuters - so let's talk about the Darlington Northern Relief road ( designed to get 1000 lorries a day off the streets of Darlington as they head to Teesside / Amazon) which was scrapped earlier this year.
I suspect a lot (most) other constituencies will have similar attack points. For Bishop Auckland it's a bypass that was going to bypass 2 villages / pain points but now will only bypass one in a way that the other village can no longer be bypassed.
Now give us those rather than the railway infrastructure by all means but Boris can't because these were scrapped earlier this year and other work prioritised. And there are only so many contractors to go round all of whom are busy.
This is a much bigger failing in my eyes than any London obsessions over a rail route taht wouldn't even be built for decades.
Yep by my point is - we aren't getting the trains and we aren't getting the promised road links (for they have already been deprioritised, with the contractors reassigned).
The other sad death this morning is the brief renaissance of multi-generational projects. HS2 was something started 20 years ago to deliver in 20 more years. A recognition that some things we need are on a longer timescale than the next election and of more import to the country than one party or the other winning the next election.
We know that the country needs this rail network, the case was made and construction was started, despite stupidity over contracts driving the cost up of some parts to £crazy. Expansion of the scheme continued - like the motorway network we knew that it needed to go to multiple places.
Until now. Where we've just announced the scrapping of the M1 north of J24 and the cancellation of the M62 scheme across the Pennines. "I know you know you need them and I know I promised them. But you aren't worth it, and besides if I invest a few pennies in removing that kerb on the A62 at Gildersome instead transport will be hugely sped up between everywhere and everywhere else. And you're stupid enough to believe me, what larks"
Leeds is the tenth largest city in the UK. Lille is the tenth largest city in France. Even from London, I can take a train to Lille that travels at an average speed of 127mph. I can take a train to Leeds that averages 85mph. Transport connections in this country are a joke, and the Tories have just gutted the only serious attempt in my lifetime to improve them. Levelling Up? A joke.
I generally steer clear of being judgmental about parenting, but this takes the piss.
We had an experience with this recently. The Little 'un has a schoolfriend whose mum is (in our view) struggling. He apparently only eats potato waffles and chicken dippers. Every day. No food intolerances, just fussy. So when he's been around to ours, that's what we cook.
I'm not particularly happy with the little 'un eating just that, so I always cook more: fish fingers, peas, green beans etc, and let the boys tuck in. I scoff whatever they don't eat.
The last couple of visits, the friend has eaten more of the stuff, including, to his mum's amazement, melon.
It's so easy to get stuck in a rut with kids. We were with the little 'un for a while; but from what we've seen, other parents have it *much* worse.
Just a gentle aside over the latest Tory sleaze. In a way it is quite surprising that JR-M has not been dragged further into the circle of blame, since it now appears that he, and not the chief whip, was the prime mover in the attempt to subvert the existing disciplinary process.
The obviously planted recent stories concerning R-Ms business dealings are perhaps something of a warning to him from someone, and it has been City gossip for years that he not only makes investments in Russia, but that large numbers of the ultimate beneficiaries in his funds are also people that mainstream investment firms would not be minded to accept as clients.
The Sir Geoffrey Cox stories were about a lawyer who could look after himself and maybe took the heat off, but in fact JR-M trousered eight million from outside activities, not the paltry three million alleged about the litigious Sir Geoffrey, and still less the few tens of thousands that Patterson managed.
JR-Ms lack of candour concerning his business dealings has been noted before.
Leeds is the tenth largest city in the UK. Lille is the tenth largest city in France. Even from London, I can take a train to Lille that travels at an average speed of 127mph. I can take a train to Leeds that averages 85mph. Transport connections in this country are a joke, and the Tories have just gutted the only serious attempt in my lifetime to improve them. Levelling Up? A joke.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
Fab. So we're scrapping Northern Powerhouse Rail to build a new all-weather motorway link over the Pennines...?
I think in Boris's world that's covered by the dualling of the single lane bits of the A66 (which was just about the only local project that wasn't scrapped in the spending review as it should have been done 20 years ago).
Infrastructure in this country has been a joke for decades. We decided that we didn't need a chunk of the rail network because we were building roads - and then stopped building roads as well. The A66 would be a motorway in any other country.
Leeds is the tenth largest city in the UK. Lille is the tenth largest city in France. Even from London, I can take a train to Lille that travels at an average speed of 127mph. I can take a train to Leeds that averages 85mph. Transport connections in this country are a joke, and the Tories have just gutted the only serious attempt in my lifetime to improve them. Levelling Up? A joke.
What get's me is the bit that is being scrapped on HS2 is the cheapest bit with the greatest benefit. It would make way more sense to build HS2 to Sheffield and then add a link to the ECML near Doncaster rather than a pointless fast link from Leeds to Sheffield (a railway that I don't think anyone can find any reason for existing now).
I really don't know who was designing these ideas unless it was with the intention of making Boris look like a complete fool.
Lord Jim O’Neill, former treasury minister and Vice Chair of the Northern Powerhouse Partnership, told BBC Radio 4’s Today programme that the move to scrap the Eastern leg of HS2 seemed "a very strange risk-return calculation both economically and politically".
He added: "Given the amount of uproar it will cause in Red Wall seats and Tory northern MPs, especially in the current time, I’m not quite sure why they’ve done it."
Interesting that Dominic Raab is saying that the amount MP's earn from outside interests could be a measure of whether its appropriate or not. Yesterday it was all about hours.... https://twitter.com/adamfleming/status/1461253665176571905
@rottenborough I presume the calculation is quite clear and simple - that the uproar will not be enough to upset too many northern tories whilst pleasing enough southern tories.
The other sad death this morning is the brief renaissance of multi-generational projects. HS2 was something started 20 years ago to deliver in 20 more years. A recognition that some things we need are on a longer timescale than the next election and of more import to the country than one party or the other winning the next election.
We know that the country needs this rail network, the case was made and construction was started, despite stupidity over contracts driving the cost up of some parts to £crazy. Expansion of the scheme continued - like the motorway network we knew that it needed to go to multiple places.
Until now. Where we've just announced the scrapping of the M1 north of J24 and the cancellation of the M62 scheme across the Pennines. "I know you know you need them and I know I promised them. But you aren't worth it, and besides if I invest a few pennies in removing that kerb on the A62 at Gildersome instead transport will be hugely sped up between everywhere and everywhere else. And you're stupid enough to believe me, what larks"
The great thing is this is Boris's legacy - one that can and will be drummed home daily between now and the next election.
If you are a Red Wall MP I would advise you to look at the Redcar 2010 and 2015 election results - fail to deliver and the Red Wall seats will switch to the other option.
As the PBer who uses the Northern railway services the most I am outraged at Boris Johnson's 'levelling up' of the North.
I'm likely to move house in the next year or so to the North West and if I end up living in a Con/Lab marginal then I'm contemplating voting Labour for the first time in my life.
@rottenborough I presume the calculation is quite clear and simple - that the uproar will not be enough to upset too many northern tories whilst pleasing enough southern tories.
Does anyone really give a fuck what trains to Leeds will be like 20 years hence?
@rottenborough I presume the calculation is quite clear and simple - that the uproar will not be enough to upset too many northern tories whilst pleasing enough southern tories.
Not Amersham and the other Buckinghamshire seats - who now have to suffer 10 years of building work for a complete white elephant (HS2) of a project because it doesn't make economic sense anymore.
Interesting that Dominic Raab is saying that the amount MP's earn from outside interests could be a measure of whether its appropriate or not. Yesterday it was all about hours.... https://twitter.com/adamfleming/status/1461253665176571905
Surely it is hours that matter. Judging by money is just the politics of envy. I want to know my MP is doing his job not how much money he has.
Leeds is the tenth largest city in the UK. Lille is the tenth largest city in France. Even from London, I can take a train to Lille that travels at an average speed of 127mph. I can take a train to Leeds that averages 85mph. Transport connections in this country are a joke, and the Tories have just gutted the only serious attempt in my lifetime to improve them. Levelling Up? A joke.
What get's me is the bit that is being scrapped on HS2 is the cheapest bit with the greatest benefit. It would make way more sense to build HS2 to Sheffield and then add a link to the ECML near Doncaster rather than a pointless fast link from Leeds to Sheffield (a railway that I don't think anyone can find any reason for existing now).
I really don't know who was designing these ideas unless it was with the intention of making Boris look like a complete fool.
There is Good News for you - the Leeds - Thurscoe high speed fragment is also cancelled.
Apols for my ignorance, is the use of "Kevin" as a derogatory term something unique to YCC or a wider issue?
I wondered that too. I've never heard of it and lived relatively locally (although thankfully across the border in the good, non-racist* bit of Yorkshire) for almost a decade.
*to be fair, N Yorks is so white that there probably isn't much chance for racists to practice their craft, so they head west to where there are more opportunities
I have to say I think that's wrong. When we lived near Selby, N. Yorks, we encountered more racism* than anywhere else we have lived.
I put this down to the fear of the unknown. Selby was overwhelmingly white and all those I met who passed casually racist comments seemed to have no actual experience of knowing anyone from different cultures. In contrast, in Halifax for example, most people seemed to rub along pretty well regardless of culture or ethnicity.
Sorry @Selebian to appear to be dissing Selby, which otherwise has much to commend it, but that's how I found it.
(*The racism wasn't directed at us, being white, rather we were incorrectly assumed to be co-conspirators.)
Edit to also note: my original comment was not really serious, I don't think North Yorkshire is likely to be any different to West on racism or - if it is - likely to be worse at least in attitude for the reasons you state.
As comments on Selby go, that's probably one of the more positive I've heard ("much to commend it"). I'd describe it as more of a missed opportunity - it has the history and, in the Abbey and canal etc, the present potential to be far better than it is.
Having lived in a few places around the area, I've not found it worse than other places. I only remember one overtly racist comment, from an elderly neighbour. Beyond family though, most of the people we mix with (friends from work) are either living around York or Leeds. The latter is obviously more diverse and the former is too, in some ways, although still very white.
I thought Selby was fine, if a little down at heel in parts. I doubt it is any worse than any of many similar towns in most respects. I think it suffers most from being surrounded by agri-desert and not really having a lot of good open space. There's Skipwith I suppose but the river corridor is rather confined (by necessity).
The Abbey is well worth a visit though. They even let me park my bike inside...
I've been to Selby once, on a walk down from York on the old railway line. There is (was?) a series of model planets strung along the path south from York, showing the relative distance of the planets.
The railway itself was quite interesting: the line closed in 1983, when a new high-speed line (the first in 80 years) was opened to the west. The NCB wanted to mine coal under the route, and they were afraid of subsidence affecting the line. A lot of money spent; I wonder if they ever actually mined under the route?
Planets still there; it's a great use of the old line although it could do with a bit of maintenance. Doesn't actually run to Selby - stops at Riccall, to the north of Selby.
Not sure if the coalfield actually extended under the line (not sure where there are maps of extent) but in the 80s coal round there was still going strong so likely it did. There was a pithead at Riccall. Last of the Selby coalfield pits closed early 2000s, I think.
As the PBer who uses the Northern railway services the most I am outraged at Boris Johnson's 'levelling up' of the North.
I'm likely to move house in the next year or so to the North West and if I end up living in a Con/Lab marginal then I'm contemplating voting Labour for the first time in my life.
I thought the Sheffield Leeds line was being built for you (I can't imagine why anyone else would use it).
Morning all. Anasthesia is very weird. You might feel a little sleepy, says the nurse, and the next thing you know it’s a couple of hours later and you feel like a bottle of whisky disappeared last night!
Welcome back, Sandpit - sounds promising despite the surreal aspect!
As the PBer who uses the Northern railway services the most I am outraged at Boris Johnson's 'levelling up' of the North.
I'm likely to move house in the next year or so to the North West and if I end up living in a Con/Lab marginal then I'm contemplating voting Labour for the first time in my life.
I thought the Sheffield Leeds line was being built for you (I can't imagine why anyone else would use it).
I'm the Sheffield to Manchester line user.
The problem is Manchester Piccadilly just cannot cope at the moment.
There's been a few scary moments at platform 13/14 when it cannot cope when the passengers outnumbers the space on those two platforms.
Lord Jim O’Neill, former treasury minister and Vice Chair of the Northern Powerhouse Partnership, told BBC Radio 4’s Today programme that the move to scrap the Eastern leg of HS2 seemed "a very strange risk-return calculation both economically and politically".
He added: "Given the amount of uproar it will cause in Red Wall seats and Tory northern MPs, especially in the current time, I’m not quite sure why they’ve done it."
Telegraph blog
Whatever the possible merits of the modified plan the politics are completely toxic. Maybe he'll be panicked into a u-turn?
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
Andrew Adonis @Andrew_Adonis · 1h Boris Johnson pledged that the whole of HS2 would be built. Now he cancelling half of it, cutting the East Midlands, Yorkshire, the north-east and Scotland adrift
Surely it is hours that matter. Judging by money is just the politics of envy. I want to know my MP is doing his job not how much money he has.
...but if my MP is earning a boatload of cash from their second job I would suspect they might be more concerned with acting in a way that didn't piss off their paymaster, rather than the voters, even if the number of hours is small...
My guess - and the poll evidence - is that the whole Paterson affair and its fallout has upset Tories who are disproportionately in the South. So today's announcement designed to upset the North will be a levelling of sorts, if in the opposite direction to that promised?
As the PBer who uses the Northern railway services the most I am outraged at Boris Johnson's 'levelling up' of the North.
I'm likely to move house in the next year or so to the North West and if I end up living in a Con/Lab marginal then I'm contemplating voting Labour for the first time in my life.
I thought the Sheffield Leeds line was being built for you (I can't imagine why anyone else would use it).
I'm the Sheffield to Manchester line user.
The problem is Manchester Piccadilly just cannot cope at the moment.
There's been a few scary moments at platform 13/14 when it cannot cope when the passengers outnumbers the space on those two platforms.
A few? - those platforms are completely unfit for purpose as you end up with passengers waiting for multiple trains on the platform because you can't wait anywhere else. Nowadays I need to get on / off at Victoria and that is little better as they use 1 platform for trains running in both directions.
What's the odds that the planned platforms 15/16 are also delayed / scrapped in this announcement?
Anna Soubry @Anna_Soubry · 1h V much hope @bbcemt@ITVCentral reminds viewers that #HS2 w the E Mids Hub at #Toton won cross party support in #Nottingham #Notts & #Derby bc it delivered * extra rail capacity * high speed links to #Birmingham #Leeds #Sheffield * better links between Derby&Nottm AND
My guess - and the poll evidence - is that the whole Paterson affair and its fallout has upset Tories who are disproportionately in the South. So today's announcement designed to upset the North will be a levelling of sorts, if in the opposite direction to that promised?
I doubt we will hear much about the "levelling up" agenda again.
It is about to be buried.
Gove's department will be quietly renamed when there is a big distracting news story to hide the change.
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
Upgrading existing lines is far more disruptive than building new ones.
See how disruptive and how little the WCML upgrade delivered.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
Car commuters - so let's talk about the Darlington Northern Relief road ( designed to get 1000 lorries a day off the streets of Darlington as they head to Teesside / Amazon) which was scrapped earlier this year.
I suspect a lot (most) other constituencies will have similar attack points. For Bishop Auckland it's a bypass that was going to bypass 2 villages / pain points but now will only bypass one in a way that the other village can no longer be bypassed.
Now give us those rather than the railway infrastructure by all means but Boris can't because these were scrapped earlier this year and other work prioritised. And there are only so many contractors to go round all of whom are busy.
This is a much bigger failing in my eyes than any London obsessions over a rail route taht wouldn't even be built for decades.
The other issue is: why are we beholden to central government? Of course a London to Leeds High speed rail line would be a major national infrastructure project, but NPR? Why can't Andy Burnham and other local interested parties just get together and fund it? England is far too centralised and suffering from being a directly-run territory of the British state. We need federalism. Now.
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
HS3 - I can see the argument.
HS2 - sorry but the economics of the entire project has been destroyed by the removal of the eastern leg. It is now a complete white elephant that will cost the Tories every seat in Bucks at the next election (a set of easy Lib Dem wins that will give them a long term foundation to build from).
I generally steer clear of being judgmental about parenting, but this takes the piss.
We had an experience with this recently. The Little 'un has a schoolfriend whose mum is (in our view) struggling. He apparently only eats potato waffles and chicken dippers. Every day. No food intolerances, just fussy. So when he's been around to ours, that's what we cook.
I'm not particularly happy with the little 'un eating just that, so I always cook more: fish fingers, peas, green beans etc, and let the boys tuck in. I scoff whatever they don't eat.
The last couple of visits, the friend has eaten more of the stuff, including, to his mum's amazement, melon.
It's so easy to get stuck in a rut with kids. We were with the little 'un for a while; but from what we've seen, other parents have it *much* worse.
Good on you!
I’d have thought food refusal was fairly basic child psych. Surely there’s some basic techniques that are effective? Sound like you’ve cracked it with your little one, anyway. Well done!
Morning all. Anasthesia is very weird. You might feel a little sleepy, says the nurse, and the next thing you know it’s a couple of hours later and you feel like a bottle of whisky disappeared last night!
Are you sure it was anaesthesia, not whisky?
Assuming this is a current/recent experience then I wish you a speedy recovery, from the anaesthetic and whatever was th reason for it.
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
There are several aspects to the 'quicker, more local transport improvements':
1) It assumes the money will be made available for these. Smaller projects are easier to forget. 2) You might get less bang for your buck. The 199x-200x WCML Upgrade is a classic example. 3) Improvements are best looked at at a global level, not just a local one. Like shiny bypasses that lead out onto windy single-lane roads. 4) Local improvements are reactive; looking at what we needed yesterday. Sometimes we need to consider what will be needed in several decades.
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
Absolutely correct Big G!
These massive schemes are a complete waste of money, they always end up years late and massively over budget. Look at Crossrail in London!
Much better to spend it on local targeted improvements, rail and road.
Have a good day all, and remember if you are on the train or bus, wear a mask. COVID hasn't gone away!
Anna Soubry @Anna_Soubry · 1h V much hope @bbcemt@ITVCentral reminds viewers that #HS2 w the E Mids Hub at #Toton won cross party support in #Nottingham #Notts & #Derby bc it delivered * extra rail capacity * high speed links to #Birmingham #Leeds #Sheffield * better links between Derby&Nottm AND
If it's the UK's fourth largest city then so much the worse. You can bet that the fourth largest city in any other major European country would have fantastic transport links stretching across the continent.
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
Self inflicted own goals are definitely the worst kind.
The Lib Dem leaflet once again demonstrates that party's utter paucity of ideas.
They won in Chesham & Amersham. Against all the odds and against what virtually everyone on here predicted, except Mike Smithson.
Chesham and Amersham was in Chiltern which was 55% Remain and the LDs got 56% in the by election ie virtually identical.
North Shropshire however was 59% Leave and only 41% Remain
I must admit 4-11 odds on William Hill for the Tories to hold the seat is pretty tempting.
The LDs were also a clear second in Chesham and Amersham in 2019 on 26% to just 12% for Labour with the Greens on 5%.
In North Shropshire however Labour were a clear second in 2019 on 22% to 10% for the LDs so the LDs have a way to go to even ensure second place let alone beat the Tories and win the seat
The Libs/LD's had reasonable vote-shares, and second places in the 80's & early 90's, but since then, with the exception of 2010, it's always been Labour in second place.Indeed, in 1997 the Labour candidate came with 1600 votes. Don't know what the Councillor situation is, though.
As the PBer who uses the Northern railway services the most I am outraged at Boris Johnson's 'levelling up' of the North.
I'm likely to move house in the next year or so to the North West and if I end up living in a Con/Lab marginal then I'm contemplating voting Labour for the first time in my life.
I thought the Sheffield Leeds line was being built for you (I can't imagine why anyone else would use it).
I'm the Sheffield to Manchester line user.
The problem is Manchester Piccadilly just cannot cope at the moment.
There's been a few scary moments at platform 13/14 when it cannot cope when the passengers outnumbers the space on those two platforms.
A few? - those platforms are completely unfit for purpose as you end up with passengers waiting for multiple trains on the platform because you can't wait anywhere else. Nowadays I need to get on / off at Victoria and that is little better as they use 1 platform for trains running in both directions.
What's the odds that the planned platforms 15/16 are also delayed / scrapped in this announcement?
Inevitable that 15/16 get cancelled.
As for 13/14 it was a nightmare a couple of years ago when delays meant the Glasgow train, the Newcastle train, and Holyhead train were all delayed and arriving in the same 5 minute window. How nobody fell off the platform and died was a miracle.
Like you I end going to another station if I have to catch a train from those platforms.
Last time I did Manchester to Glasgow I went to Manchester Airport to catch the train from there.
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
There are several aspects to the 'quicker, more local transport improvements':
1) It assumes the money will be made available for these. Smaller projects are easier to forget. 2) You might get less bang for your buck. The 199x-200x WCML Upgrade is a classic example. 3) Improvements are best looked at at a global level, not just a local one. Like shiny bypasses that lead out onto windy single-lane roads. 4) Local improvements are reactive; looking at what we needed yesterday. Sometimes we need to consider what will be needed in several decades.
Leeds has been contemplating trams* for probably a decade or more. My wife's consultancy firm has made a good living from the planning, economic evaluation, public enquiry etc etc for years, all without any actual tangible progress being made.
*or buses, or trolleybuses or something, had the woolly name new generation transport, I think. The new generation being probably our grandchildren's grandchildren
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
There are several aspects to the 'quicker, more local transport improvements':
1) It assumes the money will be made available for these. Smaller projects are easier to forget. 2) You might get less bang for your buck. The 199x-200x WCML Upgrade is a classic example. 3) Improvements are best looked at at a global level, not just a local one. Like shiny bypasses that lead out onto windy single-lane roads. 4) Local improvements are reactive; looking at what we needed yesterday. Sometimes we need to consider what will be needed in several decades.
Actually planned local improvements take decades to get right - J45 of the M1 was built to allow Leeds to expand in a particular direction, it's only now 15 years later that it's occurring.
Locally as I mentioned earlier the planned Darlington Northern Relief road has been scrapped. So that's 1000 lorries a day driving into and out of Darlington with all the additional pollution and cars.
Worse it means Darlington doesn't now have the road that would allow the next x,000 homes to be built to the North of the town.
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
So what if it takes years to build? Most of our rail network was built in the 1840s and we're still benefiting from it almost 200 years later. Where is the ambition or the foresightedness? Is this what happens when a party gets most of its votes from the elderly?
I generally steer clear of being judgmental about parenting, but this takes the piss.
We had an experience with this recently. The Little 'un has a schoolfriend whose mum is (in our view) struggling. He apparently only eats potato waffles and chicken dippers. Every day. No food intolerances, just fussy. So when he's been around to ours, that's what we cook.
I'm not particularly happy with the little 'un eating just that, so I always cook more: fish fingers, peas, green beans etc, and let the boys tuck in. I scoff whatever they don't eat.
The last couple of visits, the friend has eaten more of the stuff, including, to his mum's amazement, melon.
It's so easy to get stuck in a rut with kids. We were with the little 'un for a while; but from what we've seen, other parents have it *much* worse.
Good on you!
I’d have thought food refusal was fairly basic child psych. Surely there’s some basic techniques that are effective? Sound like you’ve cracked it with your little one, anyway. Well done!
Thanks, but we're not there yet. For instance: if we go anywhere, I make sandwiches. He loves ham sandwiches. But if I buy any from a cafe, he hates butter on the bread. The margarine I put on at home is fine, and he loves butter on other things, but he refuses to eat cafe ham sandwiches ...
But he's getting a wider palate. When he started school, we were worried about him not eating school meals. But we decided not to send him in with sandwiches each day: instead, he'd have to eat the school lunches (*). More than anything else, I credit this to widening the foods he likes. He either eats the food at school or goes hungry, they're not going to cook especially for him.
(His friend apparently does not have a packed lunch, but does not eat the school lunch either...)
(*) Incidentally, when he started at school we parents were invited in to sample a school meal. It was a good idea, and the food was okay.
On Topic - Is there any polling of the constituency? Is any planned?
HS2 - Where can I get stats on what happened with existing rail usage in the areas effected by the announcement. We all have heard lots about the changes to commenting in London from WFH. What has happened around Leeds, for example?
All people aged 40 to 49 years old who have not previously been eligible will soon be able to book an appointment for a booster dose using this service.
We will update this site with more information when these appointments are available to book. We expect this to be from Monday 22 November 2021.
I generally steer clear of being judgmental about parenting, but this takes the piss.
We had an experience with this recently. The Little 'un has a schoolfriend whose mum is (in our view) struggling. He apparently only eats potato waffles and chicken dippers. Every day. No food intolerances, just fussy. So when he's been around to ours, that's what we cook.
I'm not particularly happy with the little 'un eating just that, so I always cook more: fish fingers, peas, green beans etc, and let the boys tuck in. I scoff whatever they don't eat.
The last couple of visits, the friend has eaten more of the stuff, including, to his mum's amazement, melon.
It's so easy to get stuck in a rut with kids. We were with the little 'un for a while; but from what we've seen, other parents have it *much* worse.
Good on you!
I’d have thought food refusal was fairly basic child psych. Surely there’s some basic techniques that are effective? Sound like you’ve cracked it with your little one, anyway. Well done!
Our daughter had a similar experience with her second child. He would only eat what he would eat, and it took years for him to eat what everyone else did; didn't really start too change until he went to Uni and cooked for himself. Now he's married and he and his wife cook, and eat, all sorts of things. We always 'blamed' his maternal gt.grandfather who was an incredibly fussy eater virtually all his life. Then he developed Alzheimers and ate, to our amazement, whatever was put in front of him, including things he'd always refused.
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
Morning Big_G hope you are bright and breezy!
I am definitely a political opponent of the liar, though as I have said consistently I expect the Tories to win the next election led by Sunak or similar. I'm not doing partisan ramping as the other lot won't win. For me it has been increasingly about Right and Wrong and thats been the theme for weeks as lies and corruption are piled high.
Lets look at your points here. You mention "20 years of disruption". Lets compare and contrast HS3/NPR with what they are about to announce.
NPR would have run from Liverpool Lime Street quickly onto a new line past Warrington to have a triangular junction with HS2 giving southern access towards Brum and London before running onto HS2 through Manchester Airport to an expanded Piccadilly. From there another new line with a lot of tunnels and a station in Bradford before running into the new Leeds HS station. A final reversal and out to rejoin HS2 to York.
The line would have been disruptive to build but not be disruptive to existing rail services. What we know of what is being unveiled at 10:30 is an expanded Transpennine upgrade. Which according to Network Rail will effectively close the line most weekends for years and have extended journey times during the week crawling over speed restrictions. Plus somehow a warp speed journey time Leeds to Bradford which much be along the New Pudsey route which again will need to be heavily and disruptively upgraded.
So no, this doesn't deliver faster and without disruption. We get more disruption for slower and fewer journeys. Without the extra capacity added throughout the finished product will have LESS capacity than now because the faster the express services run the fewer the slower services you can run on the same route.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
This leads to an interesting (to me, at least...) question; are successful metropolitan areas successful because of access to good mass transit? How much does mass transit act as a catalyst for the economic success of an area?
IMV: without mass transit, there is zero way London could be an economic success. It would just drown in cars. So how much are areas like Manchester, Leeds, Edinburgh etc held back by *not* having brilliant mass transit?
(And London's mass transit is brilliant, however much regular uses may wish to complain about it.)
I think that's quite close to a post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy.
Many successful metropolitan areas like for example Austin, Texas rely predominantly upon cars for transportation. According to Wikipedia's statistics there cars (inc. carpools) form 83.1% of transportation with transit being only 5%.
Whether you wish to rely upon mass transit or roads, either way you need the investment. Our lack of investment in roads to keep up with increasing populations is a terrible failing in this nation. We've had new rail links be opened or planned repeatedly in the past couple of decades but what new motorways have opened in the last couple of decades? What new motorways are planned?
@HYUFD Off topic - Thank you for your reply yesterday to my questions. I liked your reply, not because I agree, obviously being an atheist, but because of your clear honest reply.
Your reply made me want to ask a few additional questions mainly because I don't get a chance to ask these questions of people of these beliefs normally and I am interested:
a) I assume from your reply you would consider yourself an evangelical Christian? Is my assumption correct?
b) If you believe in Adam and Eve does that mean you don't believe in evolution? I believe there are some Christians who believe in Evolution for all living things except humans. Are you in that category? If you are in that category what are your views on the other human species and that science has determined that Neanderthal DNA exists in most Homo Sapiens?
c) Do you believe the Old Testament in its entirety?
d) What are your views on where science contradicts traditional teachings eg age of the earth. The only justification I have heard is that God created the earth like this. Eg Argon Potassium dating which shows rocks to be million of years old is also a creation of God.
A subvariant of Delta that is growing in Britain is less likely to lead to symptomatic COVID-19 infection, a coronavirus prevalence survey found, adding that overall cases had dropped from a peak in October.
The Imperial College London REACT-1 study, released on Thursday, found that the subvariant, known as AY.4.2, had grown to be nearly 12% of samples sequenced, but only a third had "classic" COVID symptoms, compared with nearly a half of those with the currently dominant Delta lineage AY.4.
Two-thirds of people with AY.4.2 had "any" symptom, compared with more than three-quarters with AY.4.
AY.4.2 is thought to be slightly more transmissible, but it has not been shown to cause more severe disease or evade vaccines more easily than Delta.
The researchers said that asymptomatic people might self-isolate less, but also that people with fewer symptoms might spread it less easily through coughing and also may be unlikely to get severely ill.
"It is preferentially appearing to be more transmissible," Imperial epidemiologist Paul Elliott told reporters. "It does seem to be less symptomatic, which is a good thing."
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
So what if it takes years to build? Most of our rail network was built in the 1840s and we're still benefiting from it almost 200 years later. Where is the ambition or the foresightedness? Is this what happens when a party gets most of its votes from the elderly?
The money (£96 billion) is still being invested in rail and transport in the north
Investing in the North was - and is - a worthwhile project. It was about the only good thing the government had going for it.
It is the Treasury's stupid short-term penny wise pound foolish approach to investment which is behind this and I hope it scuppers Sunak's chances.
Will Labour promise to build what the Tories are not? Because if not, what is the point of them either?
It's going to be interesting to see if half the Treasury moving to Darlington impacts their thinking longer term (and whether the move still goes ahead).
I noticed that the Office for Tax Simplification have 2 roles open and both are based in London - were Darlington an option I would probably be incredibly qualified for one of them but I won't be applying for a part-time London based role.
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
Absolutely correct Big G!
These massive schemes are a complete waste of money, they always end up years late and massively over budget. Look at Crossrail in London!
Much better to spend it on local targeted improvements, rail and road.
Have a good day all, and remember if you are on the train or bus, wear a mask. COVID hasn't gone away!
Wheres the extra capacity for local services going to come from?
Leeds is the tenth largest city in the UK. Lille is the tenth largest city in France. Even from London, I can take a train to Lille that travels at an average speed of 127mph. I can take a train to Leeds that averages 85mph. Transport connections in this country are a joke, and the Tories have just gutted the only serious attempt in my lifetime to improve them. Levelling Up? A joke.
Ummm...
From a geographical point of view, Lille is not exactly a typical French city - it lies at the nexus of London - Paris - Brussels.
If it wasn't on the route between three of Europe's capitals, it's train service would be a lot less impressive.
It doesn’t, everyone has known for the past 10 years what the route would be and bought accordingly with warnings.
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The decisions are stupid. Utterly utterly stupid. The attempt to spin it as delivery of the promise is frankly life-threatening to Boris's career.
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
Red wall voters aren't stupid. The other thing red wall voters aren't mostly is rail commuters - they're car commuters.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
Car commuters - so let's talk about the Darlington Northern Relief road ( designed to get 1000 lorries a day off the streets of Darlington as they head to Teesside / Amazon) which was scrapped earlier this year.
I suspect a lot (most) other constituencies will have similar attack points. For Bishop Auckland it's a bypass that was going to bypass 2 villages / pain points but now will only bypass one in a way that the other village can no longer be bypassed.
Now give us those rather than the railway infrastructure by all means but Boris can't because these were scrapped earlier this year and other work prioritised. And there are only so many contractors to go round all of whom are busy.
This is a much bigger failing in my eyes than any London obsessions over a rail route taht wouldn't even be built for decades.
Yep by my point is - we aren't getting the trains and we aren't getting the promised road links (for they have already been deprioritised, with the contractors reassigned).
And that isn't acceptable. I'm not making excuses for the government - if the promised road links etc don't arrive then to quote the Foreign Secretary "That. Is. A. Disgrace."
But why aren't the road links getting a fraction of the media's attention that rail not planned to be built for decades anyway is getting?
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
So what if it takes years to build? Most of our rail network was built in the 1840s and we're still benefiting from it almost 200 years later. Where is the ambition or the foresightedness? Is this what happens when a party gets most of its votes from the elderly?
The money (£96 billion) is still being invested in rail and transport in the north
It's not - there are a set of savings from the cancelled schemes but the new schemes have probably never been costed (and because of where they are will inevitably overrun by £bns and years as shown by the WCML electrification disaster).
Heck the biggest reason for HS2 was to avoid similar disasters in the future - initially by being a completely new line, and longer term because the extra capacity meant that future work would have diversions and capacity available to allow trains to continue running)
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
So what if it takes years to build? Most of our rail network was built in the 1840s and we're still benefiting from it almost 200 years later. Where is the ambition or the foresightedness? Is this what happens when a party gets most of its votes from the elderly?
The money (£96 billion) is still being invested in rail and transport in the north
No it isn't.
They are going to look at feasibility studies, I'm fairly certain that £96 billion will not be spent.
If £96bn is available for infrastructure then I repeat that £96bn in road upgrades and new motorways etc would do far more for more people and for the economy than marginally faster commutes to London.
And if its all about "capacity" then lets apply that to roads too. How much would capacity be improved if a parallel M62 was built?
You can't increase road capacity inside towns and cities because there's no room to widen urban roads, so all your parallel M62 would achieve would be to usher people more quickly to longer tailbacks on the edges of urban areas.
We need a sensible mix of transport modes. Cars have had too much emphasis for too long.
Comments
I mean, my research is world-changing, obviously, but the Lancet are content for me to submit my paper on Monday rather than today (and reject it on Tuesday rather than tomorrow!)
https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2021/nov/06/how-nfts-non-fungible-tokens-are-shaking-up-the-art-world?utm_source=pocket-newtab-global-en-GB
My friend in Leeds knew before they bought their house in 2016 that HS2 would be running about 50m from their back garden..
This really is a complete own goal by Boris…
The simplist figures to look at are the hospitalisations, ICU numbers and deaths as that measures the clinical impact. While the majority of our inpatients are double vaccinated and 15% triple, the severely sick are biased strongly to the unvaccinated.
It's been a long 2 years since this first appeared.
I once lived 3 doors from a dye works, and when the works was knocked down and built on made a significant jump in the house value.
And if its all about "capacity" then lets apply that to roads too. How much would capacity be improved if a parallel M62 was built?
Red wall voters are not stupid. They are now to be told that although the thing they were personally promised by the PM himself is not happening, enough bits are happening for you to have all the same benefits! Sheffield is still connected! There's still a time saving to Newcastle!
This has already gone down like the proverbial bucket of sick and it hasn't even yet been thrown. If Red Wall Tories turn out to try and spin this is a win they are finished. David Duguid tried yesterday to claim Tory credit for the cancellation of CCS in his constituency and was howled at by the SNP. Will the same but louder by Labour over this.
It'd be great if we dropped London-obsessions about mass transit and invested better in roads instead or as well.
When they see vastly better services promised then taken away meaning they are stuck on shitty buses and awfully congested roads as the railway is not an option, they will not be impressed.
Another example of broken promises, another example of not caring enough about the north which really does bite through in the Red Wall seats.
The cases figures are even harder to de-confound, because the outright covid denialists and antivaxxers are, unsurprisingly almost all in the unvaxxed and take up a fairly significant proportion of them.
And those ones are far less likely to get a covid test when pinged or even when symptomatic.
If and when they end up in ICU, that reluctance has ceased to be a factor, though.
I suspect a lot (most) other constituencies will have similar attack points. For Bishop Auckland it's a bypass that was going to bypass 2 villages / pain points but now will only bypass one in a way that the other village can no longer be bypassed.
Now give us those rather than the railway infrastructure by all means but Boris can't because these were scrapped earlier this year and other work prioritised. And there are only so many contractors to go round all of whom are busy.
I generally steer clear of being judgmental about parenting, but this takes the piss.
"I will build all of HS2" is a lie. "I can delikver almost all the benefits quicker for less money" is a laughable lie. Red wall voters are not stupid. They are not going to believe anything this lot promise them, especially if the more dense of their new MPs try and claim that not building the promised stuff delivers better results than the promised stuff.
Laughable. Northerners simply aren't worth investing in - thats the message.
IMV: without mass transit, there is zero way London could be an economic success. It would just drown in cars. So how much are areas like Manchester, Leeds, Edinburgh etc held back by *not* having brilliant mass transit?
(And London's mass transit is brilliant, however much regular uses may wish to complain about it.)
And that is a very simple question will the number and frequency of train slots that would have been available across HS2 / Midland mainline and ECML be the same with Boris's new plans.
The irony is that long distance rail travel is already close to pre covid rates and was always profitable.
We know that the country needs this rail network, the case was made and construction was started, despite stupidity over contracts driving the cost up of some parts to £crazy. Expansion of the scheme continued - like the motorway network we knew that it needed to go to multiple places.
Until now. Where we've just announced the scrapping of the M1 north of J24 and the cancellation of the M62 scheme across the Pennines. "I know you know you need them and I know I promised them. But you aren't worth it, and besides if I invest a few pennies in removing that kerb on the A62 at Gildersome instead transport will be hugely sped up between everywhere and everywhere else. And you're stupid enough to believe me, what larks"
Levelling Up? A joke.
I'm not particularly happy with the little 'un eating just that, so I always cook more: fish fingers, peas, green beans etc, and let the boys tuck in. I scoff whatever they don't eat.
The last couple of visits, the friend has eaten more of the stuff, including, to his mum's amazement, melon.
It's so easy to get stuck in a rut with kids. We were with the little 'un for a while; but from what we've seen, other parents have it *much* worse.
The obviously planted recent stories concerning R-Ms business dealings are perhaps something of a warning to him from someone, and it has been City gossip for years that he not only makes investments in Russia, but that large numbers of the ultimate beneficiaries in his funds are also people that mainstream investment firms would not be minded to accept as clients.
The Sir Geoffrey Cox stories were about a lawyer who could look after himself and maybe took the heat off, but in fact JR-M trousered eight million from outside activities, not the paltry three million alleged about the litigious Sir Geoffrey, and still less the few tens of thousands that Patterson managed.
JR-Ms lack of candour concerning his business dealings has been noted before.
I really don't know who was designing these ideas unless it was with the intention of making Boris look like a complete fool.
He added: "Given the amount of uproar it will cause in Red Wall seats and Tory northern MPs, especially in the current time, I’m not quite sure why they’ve done it."
Telegraph blog
https://twitter.com/adamfleming/status/1461253665176571905
If you are a Red Wall MP I would advise you to look at the Redcar 2010 and 2015 election results - fail to deliver and the Red Wall seats will switch to the other option.
Mr. Boy, sure about that?
I remember reading that Leeds was the fourth biggest city in England (behind London, Birmingham, and Manchester). I can't see it being down in tenth.
I'm likely to move house in the next year or so to the North West and if I end up living in a Con/Lab marginal then I'm contemplating voting Labour for the first time in my life.
Not sure if the coalfield actually extended under the line (not sure where there are maps of extent) but in the 80s coal round there was still going strong so likely it did. There was a pithead at Riccall. Last of the Selby coalfield pits closed early 2000s, I think.
The North and Midlands once again betrayed by London-centric government.
The problem is Manchester Piccadilly just cannot cope at the moment.
There's been a few scary moments at platform 13/14 when it cannot cope when the passengers outnumbers the space on those two platforms.
This last two weeks has been a self inflicted own goal by Boris which has damaged him and his government
This forum has been an open season on everything about Boris and it does seem dominated by his political opponents and at times it is difficult to consider anything on its merit with so much antagonism
However, I am going to say that on the cancellation of HS2E and HS3 I think it is very much the correct decision despite the fury coming from labour mayor's, politicians and others
These projects would involve upto 20 years of disruption before one train had passed over them, and cost billions including apparently 40 billion alone to tunnel under the Pennines, whereas the monies saved can be directed to quicker more local transport improvements
I did read that a conservative mp in the area has welcomed the change of direction as he said his constituents would have had years of construction work only to see HST spending through
It is unquestionably a controversial decision, and of course Boris's self inflicted reputation of being untrustworthy does not help, but he does seem willing to take the hit and to me it is the right decision
@Andrew_Adonis
·
1h
Boris Johnson pledged that the whole of HS2 would be built. Now he cancelling half of it, cutting the East Midlands, Yorkshire, the north-east and Scotland adrift
He is totally unfit for office
What's the odds that the planned platforms 15/16 are also delayed / scrapped in this announcement?
Anna Soubry
@Anna_Soubry
·
1h
V much hope @bbcemt @ITVCentral
reminds viewers that #HS2 w the E Mids Hub at #Toton won cross party support in #Nottingham #Notts & #Derby bc it delivered
* extra rail capacity
* high speed links to #Birmingham #Leeds #Sheffield
* better links between Derby&Nottm AND
It is about to be buried.
Gove's department will be quietly renamed when there is a big distracting news story to hide the change.
See how disruptive and how little the WCML upgrade delivered.
HS2 - sorry but the economics of the entire project has been destroyed by the removal of the eastern leg. It is now a complete white elephant that will cost the Tories every seat in Bucks at the next election (a set of easy Lib Dem wins that will give them a long term foundation to build from).
I’d have thought food refusal was fairly basic child psych. Surely there’s some basic techniques that are effective? Sound like you’ve cracked it with your little one, anyway. Well done!
Assuming this is a current/recent experience then I wish you a speedy recovery, from the anaesthetic and whatever was th reason for it.
1) It assumes the money will be made available for these. Smaller projects are easier to forget.
2) You might get less bang for your buck. The 199x-200x WCML Upgrade is a classic example.
3) Improvements are best looked at at a global level, not just a local one. Like shiny bypasses that lead out onto windy single-lane roads.
4) Local improvements are reactive; looking at what we needed yesterday. Sometimes we need to consider what will be needed in several decades.
These massive schemes are a complete waste of money, they always end up years late and massively over budget. Look at Crossrail in London!
Much better to spend it on local targeted improvements, rail and road.
Have a good day all, and remember if you are on the train or bus, wear a mask. COVID hasn't gone away!
https://worldpopulationreview.com/countries/cities/united-kingdom
If it's the UK's fourth largest city then so much the worse. You can bet that the fourth largest city in any other major European country would have fantastic transport links stretching across the continent.
Don't know what the Councillor situation is, though.
As for 13/14 it was a nightmare a couple of years ago when delays meant the Glasgow train, the Newcastle train, and Holyhead train were all delayed and arriving in the same 5 minute window. How nobody fell off the platform and died was a miracle.
Like you I end going to another station if I have to catch a train from those platforms.
Last time I did Manchester to Glasgow I went to Manchester Airport to catch the train from there.
Those local benefits will no longer happen away from the missing line....
https://youtu.be/Nf5avCUNP0M
*or buses, or trolleybuses or something, had the woolly name new generation transport, I think. The new generation being probably our grandchildren's grandchildren
Edit: proposals in some form have been running since before 2005 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolleybuses_in_Leeds
Locally as I mentioned earlier the planned Darlington Northern Relief road has been scrapped. So that's 1000 lorries a day driving into and out of Darlington with all the additional pollution and cars.
Worse it means Darlington doesn't now have the road that would allow the next x,000 homes to be built to the North of the town.
But he's getting a wider palate. When he started school, we were worried about him not eating school meals. But we decided not to send him in with sandwiches each day: instead, he'd have to eat the school lunches (*). More than anything else, I credit this to widening the foods he likes. He either eats the food at school or goes hungry, they're not going to cook especially for him.
(His friend apparently does not have a packed lunch, but does not eat the school lunch either...)
(*) Incidentally, when he started at school we parents were invited in to sample a school meal. It was a good idea, and the food was okay.
HS2 - Where can I get stats on what happened with existing rail usage in the areas effected by the announcement. We all have heard lots about the changes to commenting in London from WFH. What has happened around Leeds, for example?
Lastly - From https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/coronavirus-vaccination/book-coronavirus-vaccination/book-or-manage-a-booster-dose-of-the-coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine/
All people aged 40 to 49 years old who have not previously been eligible will soon be able to book an appointment for a booster dose using this service.
We will update this site with more information when these appointments are available to book. We expect this to be from Monday 22 November 2021.
We always 'blamed' his maternal gt.grandfather who was an incredibly fussy eater virtually all his life. Then he developed Alzheimers and ate, to our amazement, whatever was put in front of him, including things he'd always refused.
What is the point of this government anymore?
Investing in the North was - and is - a worthwhile project. It was about the only good thing the government had going for it.
It is the Treasury's stupid short-term penny wise pound foolish approach to investment which is behind this and I hope it scuppers Sunak's chances.
Will Labour promise to build what the Tories are not? Because if not, what is the point of them either?
Edited: and it also looks as if the government has shafted the poorest on social care as well.
I am definitely a political opponent of the liar, though as I have said consistently I expect the Tories to win the next election led by Sunak or similar. I'm not doing partisan ramping as the other lot won't win. For me it has been increasingly about Right and Wrong and thats been the theme for weeks as lies and corruption are piled high.
Lets look at your points here. You mention "20 years of disruption". Lets compare and contrast HS3/NPR with what they are about to announce.
NPR would have run from Liverpool Lime Street quickly onto a new line past Warrington to have a triangular junction with HS2 giving southern access towards Brum and London before running onto HS2 through Manchester Airport to an expanded Piccadilly. From there another new line with a lot of tunnels and a station in Bradford before running into the new Leeds HS station. A final reversal and out to rejoin HS2 to York.
The line would have been disruptive to build but not be disruptive to existing rail services. What we know of what is being unveiled at 10:30 is an expanded Transpennine upgrade. Which according to Network Rail will effectively close the line most weekends for years and have extended journey times during the week crawling over speed restrictions. Plus somehow a warp speed journey time Leeds to Bradford which much be along the New Pudsey route which again will need to be heavily and disruptively upgraded.
So no, this doesn't deliver faster and without disruption. We get more disruption for slower and fewer journeys. Without the extra capacity added throughout the finished product will have LESS capacity than now because the faster the express services run the fewer the slower services you can run on the same route.
Many successful metropolitan areas like for example Austin, Texas rely predominantly upon cars for transportation. According to Wikipedia's statistics there cars (inc. carpools) form 83.1% of transportation with transit being only 5%.
Whether you wish to rely upon mass transit or roads, either way you need the investment. Our lack of investment in roads to keep up with increasing populations is a terrible failing in this nation. We've had new rail links be opened or planned repeatedly in the past couple of decades but what new motorways have opened in the last couple of decades? What new motorways are planned?
Your reply made me want to ask a few additional questions mainly because I don't get a chance to ask these questions of people of these beliefs normally and I am interested:
a) I assume from your reply you would consider yourself an evangelical Christian? Is my assumption correct?
b) If you believe in Adam and Eve does that mean you don't believe in evolution? I believe there are some Christians who believe in Evolution for all living things except humans. Are you in that category? If you are in that category what are your views on the other human species and that science has determined that Neanderthal DNA exists in most Homo Sapiens?
c) Do you believe the Old Testament in its entirety?
d) What are your views on where science contradicts traditional teachings eg age of the earth. The only justification I have heard is that God created the earth like this. Eg Argon Potassium dating which shows rocks to be million of years old is also a creation of God.
A subvariant of Delta that is growing in Britain is less likely to lead to symptomatic COVID-19 infection, a coronavirus prevalence survey found, adding that overall cases had dropped from a peak in October.
The Imperial College London REACT-1 study, released on Thursday, found that the subvariant, known as AY.4.2, had grown to be nearly 12% of samples sequenced, but only a third had "classic" COVID symptoms, compared with nearly a half of those with the currently dominant Delta lineage AY.4.
Two-thirds of people with AY.4.2 had "any" symptom, compared with more than three-quarters with AY.4.
AY.4.2 is thought to be slightly more transmissible, but it has not been shown to cause more severe disease or evade vaccines more easily than Delta.
The researchers said that asymptomatic people might self-isolate less, but also that people with fewer symptoms might spread it less easily through coughing and also may be unlikely to get severely ill.
"It is preferentially appearing to be more transmissible," Imperial epidemiologist Paul Elliott told reporters. "It does seem to be less symptomatic, which is a good thing."
https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/uk-study-suggests-delta-subvariant-less-likely-cause-symptoms-2021-11-18/
When can we expect Starmer and iSage to start the apologies and admit the right strategy was chosen during the summer.
I noticed that the Office for Tax Simplification have 2 roles open and both are based in London - were Darlington an option I would probably be incredibly qualified for one of them but I won't be applying for a part-time London based role.
From a geographical point of view, Lille is not exactly a typical French city - it lies at the nexus of London - Paris - Brussels.
If it wasn't on the route between three of Europe's capitals, it's train service would be a lot less impressive.
But why aren't the road links getting a fraction of the media's attention that rail not planned to be built for decades anyway is getting?
To Raab: Boris previously said he can definitely confirm the Eastern rail link. Now he says there will be a feasibility study. Which is it?
Heck the biggest reason for HS2 was to avoid similar disasters in the future - initially by being a completely new line, and longer term because the extra capacity meant that future work would have diversions and capacity available to allow trains to continue running)
They are going to look at feasibility studies, I'm fairly certain that £96 billion will not be spent.
We need a sensible mix of transport modes. Cars have had too much emphasis for too long.
Tory MPs will not forget, nor will Northern voters.