In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
The leaders of the three main UK parties were all privately educated… and two of the posh twats are knights of the realm!
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
You can tell you are state educated - it's learnt not learned.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Indeed, Kwasi Kwarteng gets more criticism for going to Eton than anything else.
Though of course given at least half the establishment and Cabinet, the PM, the Leader of the Opposition and the leader of the LDs and an above average number of British Olympic gold medallists and Oscar winners were privately educated it is not holding us private schoolboys back.
Indeed the next general election will be the first all private schoolboy general election since 1959
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Well, that's the first I knew of it. Probably due to your legendary modesty?
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
I had a similar but different experience at business school. It was only after graduating that I became aware of how many of my friends and colleagues came from super wealthy (i.e. $100 million and up) families - in the 10-15% range for the entire class of 210. I had no idea at the time. Once I knew, no-one was embarrassed about it, but it did seem a pattern of them wanting to establish friendships BEFORE the issue of wealth appeared.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Indeed, Kwasi Kwarteng gets more criticism for going to Eton than anything else.
Though of course given at least half the establishment and Cabinet, the PM, the Leader of the Opposition and the leader of the LDs were privately educated it is not holding us private schoolboys back
Really? I thought all the pelters were for him trudging into news studios to exculpate the bunch of crooks to whom he's sold his soul?
Tarmacking a lovely garden. Chopping down mature trees. Why? To build a much needed, beautiful building? No, to create a ‘22 space car park’
Jesus. We are mad and stupid
‘Police watching fences go up at Newark Library Garden while local residents gather to try to defend the garden and its mature trees. The trees are due to be felled for an unnecessary car park extension 💔 /1‘
Isn't that former Minister for Planning Jenrick's neck of the parking lot?
How can anyone look at this and think it’s a good idea? A fucking CAR PARK
People are irrational about car parking. Big story in Wigan is plans to knock down the little used market, with a car park (one third occupied) on the roof, to replace it with a smaller market, 400 new homes slap bang in the town centre and move parking slightly further away, Cue fury. People love an empty car park more than a full one. It's much more convenient. 400 new town centre homes will be "bad for the economy" somehow. No surprise the Red Wall remains deprived.
Yes.
It’s sad, but many of the people living in the Red Wall are basically living in the past.
I blame not the people themselves, but successive governments who deprive them of any real local agency.
I'm not sure the curse of NIMBYism is especially unique to the red wall.
Just down the road from Wigan in Warrington the old market etc also got bulldozed a few years ago along with about a quarter of the town centre. No new homes getting built though, a new cinema complex etc built instead so no NIMBY objections to that.
However 400 homes and less parking is an odd combination. 400 homes surely should come with 800 parking spaces for those homes.
Philip, I know this is an old trope of yours but town centre housing does not need two parking spaces per home. We could talk idealistically about this, but I know we differ: but pragmatically, people choosing to live close to the town centre tend to have fewer cars per family, and to use those cars less. Such spaces would be empty, or occupied by cars which would be unused most of the time. It is a very inefficient way of using town centre land. Plus Wigan town centre is massively over-provided for my car parking already. The resource-efficient solution here would be car clubs.
I'm sorry but no, absolutely not, Wigan is a town not Islington.
What percentage of households in Wigan own one or two cars? Do you have the actual facts?
400 homes without 800 parking spaces is a failure of planning. And for joined up thinking facing the green future they should be off-road parking with the ability to charge vehicles via plugging in.
300 homes with 600 spaces would be a better use of space than 400 homes with no parking.
I’m not saying no parking. I’m not being totally idealistic about this. But 800 spaces is far too much. Most of these houses will not be two car households. There is an average household size of 2.1, and these will be well under that. Houses with one person do not need two spaces. And this is central Wigan, not Standish or Aspull. Town centre locations have much lower rates of car ownership not because of lack of car parking spaces but because people who live without cars or with fewer cars place a higher value on accessible locations. Entirely left to the market, you’d expect no more than about 0.7 cars per household somewhere like this. We can give these spaces charging points, no problem there. But electric cars are still energy inefficient compared to living a lifestyle where more trips can be walked (because you are somewhere accessible like Central Wigan). Note to southerners (not you Philip, I know you’re local): central Wigan is actually quite nice, and getting nicer. And will be more attractive still if HS2 comes.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Perhaps because of your stunning lack of self awareness in attacking Grammar schools which help those who are bright but not rich enough to go to private school.
Personally I have nothing against Private schooling at all. Except when those who have benefitted from it like yourself think they have the right to deny some of those benefits to those whose parents are not wealthy enough to send their kids private.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
Perhaps just the Conservative ones are?
Have you guys returned the stolen money to the pensioners yet? Or are you waiting or them to die?
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Not quite, it is still acceptable to be prejudiced against the male WWC. This is being accentuated among the woker middle class as a disproportionate number of them have sympathy with Boris and Brexit.
I still can't get my head around the Public School right to rule ethos. Which meant officering the British Army and air forces almost completely from the Public Schools in the Great War.
Edit: it's all very well going on about their great sacrifice. Yes, in one sense. Officers had a short life. But they didn't let anyone but PS old boys be officers. So ... And the other classes/ranks* had to do what they said.
*yes, I know about the likes of R. H. Tawney serving in the ran ks.
If the British army hadn't let anyone but PS old boys be officers, they would have run out of officers some time around 1915. See Douglas Haig's final despatch:
Our universities and public schools throughout the Empire proved once more, as they have proved time and again in the past, that in the formation of character, which is the root of discipline, they have no rivals. Not that universities and public schools enjoy a monopoly of the qualities which make good officers. The life of the British Empire generally has proved sound under the severest tests, and while giving men whom it is an honour for any officer to command, has furnished officers of the highest standard from all ranks of society and all quarters of the world.
Promotion has been entirely by merit, and the highest appointments were open to the humblest, provided he had the necessary qualifications of character, skill and knowledge. Many instances could be quoted of men who from civil or comparatively humble occupations have risen to important commands. A schoolmaster, a lawyer, a taxicab driver, and an ex-Serjeant-Major have commanded brigades; one editor has commanded a division, and another held successfully the position of Senior Staff Officer to a Regular division; the under-cook of a Cambridge College, a clerk to the Metropolitan Water Board, an insurance clerk, an architect's assistant, and a police inspector became efficient General Staff Officers; a Mess Serjeant, a railway signalman, a coal miner, a market gardener, an assistant secretary to a haberdashers' company, a Quartermaster-Serjeant, and many private soldiers have risen to command battalions; clerks have commanded batteries; a schoolmaster, a collier, the son of a blacksmith, an iron moulder, an instructor in tailoring, an assistant gas engineer, a grocer's assistant, as well as policemen, clerks and privates, have commanded companies or acted as adjutants.
They wouldn't have called them 'temporary gentlemen' if they'd been gentlemen already.
Quite. but that was very much forced on the Army. The old standards returned with a bang in peacetime
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Indeed, Kwasi Kwarteng gets more criticism for going to Eton than anything else.
Though of course given at least half the establishment and Cabinet, the PM, the Leader of the Opposition and the leader of the LDs and an above average number of British Olympic gold medallists and Oscar winners were privately educated it is not holding us private schoolboys back.
Indeed the next general election will be the first all private schoolboy general election since 1959
We used to call Public schoolboys ‘Wallies with confidence’ - if they were at our school they’d be the nerds you’d see going into the library who got picked last at football, but they were actually quite cocky. I suppose that’s worth the money by itself
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Perhaps because of your stunning lack of self awareness in attacking Grammar schools which help those who are bright but not rich enough to go to private school.
Personally I have nothing against Private schooling at all. Except when those who have benefitted from it like yourself think they have the right to deny some of those benefits to those whose parents are not wealthy enough to send their kids private.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
Believe it is Wykehamite 😈
I bow to your superior knowledge.
And would you like a drink, sir? I can recommend the Leflaive Premier Cru with the Dover Sole ...
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
It is hard to move in middle class London circles without realising, slowly, that you are surrounded by them.
It’s like that Harry Enfield sketch on “Birds”, except instead of working class folk, it’s privately educated chaps called Toby or Seb.
I don’t mind personally, but it’s sobering to think of what it implies in terms of wasted human capital.
It's not so prevalent in Scotland though Edinburgh tries its best. What's more disturbing is the poshos' infiltration of the arts. The Old Etonian of today is more likely to win a BAFTA than an MC in some dusty ditch in Helmand.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Not quite, it is still acceptable to be prejudiced against the male WWC. This is being accentuated among the woker middle class as a disproportionate number of them have sympathy with Boris and Brexit.
Hillary's 'deplorables' comment was a pretty accurate reflection of most upper middle class left liberals think of Trump or Leave and Boris voting white working class males
Why isn’t having private healthcare frowned upon the way private education is? Why should those with more money get better treatment?
I agree with you. I turned down the private health insurance offered by work and don't send my kids to private school. Healthcare and education are basic services that should be available to everyone at a high quality level.
Smarkets have paid out on restrictions being reintroduced
Jammy git. Their dodgy care worker rule clarification thing landed you that.
I had some good customer service from Smarkets, makes me feel reassured using them again in the future. 👍
Ended up £40 up on that market after a scare nearly left me £200 down.
They still screwed up on the 'clarifications' (or the initial market description) though. Even though I came out ahead and probably didn't lose any profit due to that in the end.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Perhaps because of your stunning lack of self awareness in attacking Grammar schools which help those who are bright but not rich enough to go to private school.
Personally I have nothing against Private schooling at all. Except when those who have benefitted from it like yourself think they have the right to deny some of those benefits to those whose parents are not wealthy enough to send their kids private.
There is a reason that our greatest ever PM, Lady Thatcher, closed so many grammar schools despite attending one herself.
That was Heath and Wilson mainly.
Dispproprtionally grammars still get a higher number into Oxbridge and law and medicine than comprehensives do and they are the only state schools which beat some private schools in league tables
Twitter has fucked up Twitter. Latest tweets have been Facebooked. Terrible idea
Not being on Twitter I genuinely have no idea what that means.
It's the one, indispensable feature that makes up for all of Twitter's manifold flaws.
If you are interested in a subject you type it in the search bar. Say, "Austria Covid". You tap Latest, and you will then get (or you used to get) all the most recent tweets on that subject. It is a fantastic resource. A personally curated real-time news feed of facts, opinions, videos, jokes, memes, relating to your chosen subject
Now Twitter seems to have done some weird Facebook Insta shit on Latest Tweets, so they aren't the most recent. They appear near-random (tho I would guess they are not). There is very little chronological order. Sometimes the tweets are from hours or days ago. Or they will be from just a few people.
Maddening. It destroys Twitter's USP.
People are speculating why it has happened. It is allegedly a glitch in an upgrade but others have doubts. I reckon Twitter is experimenting with new feeds, or they are trying to drive users to a paid-for premium service
Smarkets have paid out on restrictions being reintroduced
Jammy git. Their dodgy care worker rule clarification thing landed you that.
I had some good customer service from Smarkets, makes me feel reassured using them again in the future. 👍
Ended up £40 up on that market after a scare nearly left me £200 down.
That's good to hear! Did they accept your fat finger error?
I couldn't understand why my numbers were so bad, because even having clicked Lay instead of Back it shouldn't have matched - and even if it had, it should have just cancelled my back not been a huge deficit.
Turns out I'd also gotten Stake and Odds backwards. Instead of Backing at 1.2 with a stake of £200 I'd somehow Laid at 200 with a stake of £1.20 😨. Laying a market currently trading at 1.1 at 200 was certainly not my intention and no wonder it got matched instantly by their bots.
Not something I'd ever want to do again, but they have a "Clear and Obvious Error" policy and they accepted that laying at 200 was a clear and obvious error so that bet got voided.
Why isn’t having private healthcare frowned upon the way private education is? Why should those with more money get better treatment?
I agree with you. I turned down the private health insurance offered by work and don't send my kids to private school. Healthcare and education are basic services that should be available to everyone at a high quality level.
Shopping and food are basic services that should be available to everyone, so abolish M & S and Waitrose on the same logic and send everyone to Tesco, Asda or Lidl
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Perhaps because of your stunning lack of self awareness in attacking Grammar schools which help those who are bright but not rich enough to go to private school.
Personally I have nothing against Private schooling at all. Except when those who have benefitted from it like yourself think they have the right to deny some of those benefits to those whose parents are not wealthy enough to send their kids private.
Why isn’t having private healthcare frowned upon the way private education is? Why should those with more money get better treatment?
I agree with you. I turned down the private health insurance offered by work and don't send my kids to private school. Healthcare and education are basic services that should be available to everyone at a high quality level.
Shopping and food are basic services that should be available to everyone, so abolish M & S and Waitrose on the same logic and send everyone to Tesco, Asda or Lidl
Smarkets have paid out on restrictions being reintroduced
Jammy git. Their dodgy care worker rule clarification thing landed you that.
I had some good customer service from Smarkets, makes me feel reassured using them again in the future. 👍
Ended up £40 up on that market after a scare nearly left me £200 down.
They still screwed up on the 'clarifications' (or the initial market description) though. Even though I came out ahead and probably didn't lose any profit due to that in the end.
I'm just glad this one's done now.
Oh agreed, that was badly handled.
But people tend to complain, rather than say when things go right, so personally speaking credit where credit's due I'm glad they voided my erroneous bet rather than just saying I had to live with it.
I still can't get my head around the Public School right to rule ethos. Which meant officering the British Army and air forces almost completely from the Public Schools in the Great War.
Edit: it's all very well going on about their great sacrifice. Yes, in one sense. Officers had a short life. But they didn't let anyone but PS old boys be officers. So ... And the other classes/ranks* had to do what they said.
*yes, I know about the likes of R. H. Tawney serving in the ran ks.
If the British army hadn't let anyone but PS old boys be officers, they would have run out of officers some time around 1915. See Douglas Haig's final despatch:
Our universities and public schools throughout the Empire proved once more, as they have proved time and again in the past, that in the formation of character, which is the root of discipline, they have no rivals. Not that universities and public schools enjoy a monopoly of the qualities which make good officers. The life of the British Empire generally has proved sound under the severest tests, and while giving men whom it is an honour for any officer to command, has furnished officers of the highest standard from all ranks of society and all quarters of the world.
Promotion has been entirely by merit, and the highest appointments were open to the humblest, provided he had the necessary qualifications of character, skill and knowledge. Many instances could be quoted of men who from civil or comparatively humble occupations have risen to important commands. A schoolmaster, a lawyer, a taxicab driver, and an ex-Serjeant-Major have commanded brigades; one editor has commanded a division, and another held successfully the position of Senior Staff Officer to a Regular division; the under-cook of a Cambridge College, a clerk to the Metropolitan Water Board, an insurance clerk, an architect's assistant, and a police inspector became efficient General Staff Officers; a Mess Serjeant, a railway signalman, a coal miner, a market gardener, an assistant secretary to a haberdashers' company, a Quartermaster-Serjeant, and many private soldiers have risen to command battalions; clerks have commanded batteries; a schoolmaster, a collier, the son of a blacksmith, an iron moulder, an instructor in tailoring, an assistant gas engineer, a grocer's assistant, as well as policemen, clerks and privates, have commanded companies or acted as adjutants.
They wouldn't have called them 'temporary gentlemen' if they'd been gentlemen already.
Going back a century further, you get the impression that the higher classes in the military really wanted to avoid mixing with the hoi polloi.
At Dover, there is a Grand Shaft (fnarr, fnarr) leading down to the base of the cliffs. It has three staircases winding down. The three stairs were designated for different groups: "gentlemen and their ladies", "officers and their wives" and "soldiers and their women"
Sounds terrible. Your schooling has given you such a disadvantage.
It is, held me back in life, helped contribute to my shy and modest persona.
(Actually I was a bit shy and modest at school, it was at university where I became cocky and self assured self.)
Cambridge does that to a lad.
It does.
My choice of university/degree was a fraught process.
I was expected to follow in the family profession and become a doctor but I realised around the age of 12/13 it really wasn't for me, my father was fine with it, my mother devastated, then it dawned on my mother I wouldn't be going to the University of Sheffield and coming back home every day but going far away and she was worried that girls would corrupt her innocent son.
I'm fairly certain my mother sent me to a private school was because it was an all boys school.
I loved every moment of university, met some great people and started some deep and long lasting friendships.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
Believe it is Wykehamite 😈
I bow to your superior knowledge.
And would you like a drink, sir? I can recommend the Leflaive Premier Cru with the Dover Sole ...
If 'Wykehamite' is an example of his superior knowledge, you should be offering him Penfolds Bin 389 Cabernet Shiraz with the fish.
Why isn’t having private healthcare frowned upon the way private education is? Why should those with more money get better treatment?
I agree with you. I turned down the private health insurance offered by work and don't send my kids to private school. Healthcare and education are basic services that should be available to everyone at a high quality level.
I don’t think we actually agree! I am happy for people with the money to send their kids to private school and have private health. I am considering the latter myself. Doesn’t bother me that some people can afford better. I think the basic services should be available to everyone at a basic level rather than high
That said, when we were moaning about how long we waited in uncomfortable seating before my girlfriends C Section last month, I did have to remind her this was for nothing, and going private was at least 6k
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
The version I always heard was:
An Etonian, a Wykehamist and a Harrovian are in a room when a lady walks in. The Etonian demands a chair for the lady, the Wykehamist arranges a chair is brought to her and the Harrovian sits on it.
Notice how none of them actually gets the chair. In fact, the oik getting the chair isn't even mentioned. The English class system in action.
In my career I have constantly found myself in meetings being one of the few non-privately educated attendees.
It’s kind of terrifying.
(My career was consulting, then advertising, then digital tech).
Ditto. I am often the only state schooled person in a meeting, or at a dinner
Erotic Flint Knapping is a surprisingly pukka world
Indeed I am still discovering quite how many of my friends are posh in this way. eg last week I learned that one of my oldest friends went to Fettes (Blair's old school, the Eton of Scotland). We were druggies together at UCL and I never thought to ask him about his schooling, ever. An odd omission, but heroin takes priority when you're 23
Intrigued by this... How do you know? As alluded to in your last paragraph, it's not something I know about several people I count as friends; I know the school sector of very few of my colleagues.
I would guess that most of them were state educated, but I do not know.
Having said that, most of my acquaintance whom I know to have been privately educated have tended to make that known (the most reticent of those was someone who was at Eton, on a scholarship, with Prince Harry - I didn't know he was an Etonian until Harry came up in conversation one day and he made clear his unfavourable view from personal experience!)
Really? The privately educated people I know tend to be very quiet about it. It’s not exactly a source of shame, but some minor embarrassment at least – ‘actually, I had quite a few advantages to get where I am’. I find where people are from, grew up, went to school fascinating. I’m probably nosier than most about this, certainly if they went to school in Greater Manchester and I can therefore unearth some link to someone else they might know (‘oh, you went to Cheadle Hulme High? Did you know x?’ etc.)
Yep, well it's an observation among those that I know to have been privately educated. Almost by definition biased towards those who would make it known. I work far from where I grew up and know next to nothing of the local schools, so I don't tend to ask colleagues, even local ones, where they went to school. I might be surrounded by Old Etonians who don't care to make that known.
One of my closest university friends went to a private school. She was very coy about it. I knew her for quite some time before I learned that.
Bigotry towards the privately educated is the last acceptable bigotry in this country so we learn to keep it quiet.
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
Lol, I was doing an idle search for something on the internet and this page came up for the MOD. Finger on the pulse..
'The international military campaign has reduced the terrorist threat from this region and helped train a 350,000 strong Afghan National Security Force, which now has security responsibility for Afghanistan's 30 million citizens.'
'Since the drawdown of force elements, British troops are now stationed in Kabul where they take the lead within the Kabul Security Force, a 7 nation organisation which provides vital force protection for UK and coalition advisors who are working with our Afghan partners to increase the capabilities and capacity across the Afghan National Defence and Security Forces.'
Twitter has fucked up Twitter. Latest tweets have been Facebooked. Terrible idea
Not being on Twitter I genuinely have no idea what that means.
It's the one, indispensable feature that makes up for all of Twitter's manifold flaws.
If you are interested in a subject you type it in the search bar. Say, "Austria Covid". You tap Latest, and you will then get (or you used to get) all the most recent tweets on that subject. It is a fantastic resource. A personally curated real-time news feed of facts, opinions, videos, jokes, memes, relating to your chosen subject
Now Twitter seems to have done some weird Facebook Insta shit on Latest Tweets, so they aren't the most recent. They appear near-random (tho I would guess they are not). There is very little chronological order. Sometimes the tweets are from hours or days ago. Or they will be from just a few people.
Maddening. It destroys Twitter's USP.
People are speculating why it has happened. It is allegedly a glitch in an upgrade but others have doubts. I reckon Twitter is experimenting with new feeds, or they are trying to drive users to a paid-for premium service
If twitter blue ($2.99 a month I believe) gives me a chronological order feed I would given them the $2.99 a month.
The fact there isn't a filter on the feed beyond my selection of people I follow is why I like twitter.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
Believe it is Wykehamite 😈
I bow to your superior knowledge.
And would you like a drink, sir? I can recommend the Leflaive Premier Cru with the Dover Sole ...
If 'Wykehamite' is an example of his superior knowledge, you should be offering him Penfolds Bin 389 Cabernet Shiraz with the fish.
I know you're joking, but that is a good wine. 🍷 👍
Theory: all social media platforms will eventually mutilate their own interface until they become hated and unusable, and no one knows why this is a universal law, but it is
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
It seems a lot of essential equipment has still not arrived in Brazil.
Jennie Gow @JennieGow To clarify: the delayed kit is 2 plane loads of freight. All the last minute stuff, like power units, cars, pit wall kits - all the essential stuff that gets taken race to race.
I still can't get my head around the Public School right to rule ethos. Which meant officering the British Army and air forces almost completely from the Public Schools in the Great War.
Edit: it's all very well going on about their great sacrifice. Yes, in one sense. Officers had a short life. But they didn't let anyone but PS old boys be officers. So ... And the other classes/ranks* had to do what they said.
*yes, I know about the likes of R. H. Tawney serving in the ran ks.
If the British army hadn't let anyone but PS old boys be officers, they would have run out of officers some time around 1915. See Douglas Haig's final despatch:
Our universities and public schools throughout the Empire proved once more, as they have proved time and again in the past, that in the formation of character, which is the root of discipline, they have no rivals. Not that universities and public schools enjoy a monopoly of the qualities which make good officers. The life of the British Empire generally has proved sound under the severest tests, and while giving men whom it is an honour for any officer to command, has furnished officers of the highest standard from all ranks of society and all quarters of the world.
Promotion has been entirely by merit, and the highest appointments were open to the humblest, provided he had the necessary qualifications of character, skill and knowledge. Many instances could be quoted of men who from civil or comparatively humble occupations have risen to important commands. A schoolmaster, a lawyer, a taxicab driver, and an ex-Serjeant-Major have commanded brigades; one editor has commanded a division, and another held successfully the position of Senior Staff Officer to a Regular division; the under-cook of a Cambridge College, a clerk to the Metropolitan Water Board, an insurance clerk, an architect's assistant, and a police inspector became efficient General Staff Officers; a Mess Serjeant, a railway signalman, a coal miner, a market gardener, an assistant secretary to a haberdashers' company, a Quartermaster-Serjeant, and many private soldiers have risen to command battalions; clerks have commanded batteries; a schoolmaster, a collier, the son of a blacksmith, an iron moulder, an instructor in tailoring, an assistant gas engineer, a grocer's assistant, as well as policemen, clerks and privates, have commanded companies or acted as adjutants.
They wouldn't have called them 'temporary gentlemen' if they'd been gentlemen already.
Going back a century further, you get the impression that the higher classes in the military really wanted to avoid mixing with the hoi polloi.
At Dover, there is a Grand Shaft (fnarr, fnarr) leading down to the base of the cliffs. It has three staircases winding down. The three stairs were designated for different groups: "gentlemen and their ladies", "officers and their wives" and "soldiers and their women"
Only open on special days. I managed to get down to a Western Heights open day the summer before you know what, and got to go down the Shaft. Extraordinary triple helix with windows opening onto on a central empty well, to allow rapid deployment of Tommy Atkins from the barracks on the hilltop down to shore and invading Frenchman level.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
Believe it is Wykehamite 😈
I bow to your superior knowledge.
And would you like a drink, sir? I can recommend the Leflaive Premier Cru with the Dover Sole ...
I have 4 dinners in the next week, so I’m all sole-d out
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
Believe it is Wykehamite 😈
I bow to your superior knowledge.
And would you like a drink, sir? I can recommend the Leflaive Premier Cru with the Dover Sole ...
If 'Wykehamite' is an example of his superior knowledge, you should be offering him Penfolds Bin 389 Cabernet Shiraz with the fish.
I know you're joking, but that is a good wine. 🍷 👍
Oh, I'm not dissing Aussie reds - I love them. Memories of a Kangaroo Island wildlife safari with the barbecue going.
Why isn’t having private healthcare frowned upon the way private education is? Why should those with more money get better treatment?
I agree with you. I turned down the private health insurance offered by work and don't send my kids to private school. Healthcare and education are basic services that should be available to everyone at a high quality level.
You are not Diane Abbott and you can save the £5 on school fees.
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
Believe it is Wykehamite 😈
Not Wykehamist?
Oops. Yep. I’ll go and hide now
OMG. This is like that moment in “Inglorious Basterds”.
Why isn’t having private healthcare frowned upon the way private education is? Why should those with more money get better treatment?
I agree with you. I turned down the private health insurance offered by work and don't send my kids to private school. Healthcare and education are basic services that should be available to everyone at a high quality level.
Shopping and food are basic services that should be available to everyone, so abolish M & S and Waitrose on the same logic and send everyone to Tesco, Asda or Lidl
Twitter has fucked up Twitter. Latest tweets have been Facebooked. Terrible idea
Not being on Twitter I genuinely have no idea what that means.
It's the one, indispensable feature that makes up for all of Twitter's manifold flaws.
If you are interested in a subject you type it in the search bar. Say, "Austria Covid". You tap Latest, and you will then get (or you used to get) all the most recent tweets on that subject. It is a fantastic resource. A personally curated real-time news feed of facts, opinions, videos, jokes, memes, relating to your chosen subject
Now Twitter seems to have done some weird Facebook Insta shit on Latest Tweets, so they aren't the most recent. They appear near-random (tho I would guess they are not). There is very little chronological order. Sometimes the tweets are from hours or days ago. Or they will be from just a few people.
Maddening. It destroys Twitter's USP.
People are speculating why it has happened. It is allegedly a glitch in an upgrade but others have doubts. I reckon Twitter is experimenting with new feeds, or they are trying to drive users to a paid-for premium service
If twitter blue ($2.99 a month I believe) gives me a chronological order feed I would given them the $2.99 a month.
The fact there isn't a filter on the feed beyond my selection of people I follow is why I like twitter.
Are you experiencing the same issue? There are loads of people on Twitter complaining about it but some say they have no problem
My guess is that it is an attempt to drive committed users to Blue
The damage Boris, JRM, Paterson and other Spartans have done in this idiotic act requires the red wall mps to take action and remove Boris and his cabinet as soon as possible, or the electorate will
It seems a lot of essential equipment has still not arrived in Brazil.
Jennie Gow @JennieGow To clarify: the delayed kit is 2 plane loads of freight. All the last minute stuff, like power units, cars, pit wall kits - all the essential stuff that gets taken race to race.
Didn’t happen when my son-in-law was at least partially responsible for despatch!
In summary Boris and his team were briefed about masks, decided to ignore the hospital management and put them in the impossible situation of how do you manage a PM in clear breach of his own guidance putting staff and patients in danger?
We have also forgotten already that just a few days earlier he was “at it” at COP, sitting next to Attenborough.
He’s got form in not giving a shit about anyone but himself.
As it was in the beginning, so shall it be in the end.
'I think he honestly believes that it is churlish of us not to regard him as an exception. one who should be free of the network of obligation which binds everyone else.'
Standing out as being arrogant, narcissistic and self-centred *at Eton* should have been a tell, for sure.
Most etonians are none of those
While outsiders sometimes get the wrong end of the stick, I'm not sure if Etonians are the best judge of how Etonians may come across.
Most won't be, but are they still a greater proportion than the average?
As a non-Etonian who has known many Etonians they are generally no different from the cohorts at my old school, other private schools and groups of friends from state schools.
There are arrogant entitled ones, intellectual ones, social animals, sports jocks, outsiders and geeks.
My impression has always been that there is just a larger ethos driven into Etonians that they can go on and do great things - they are surrounded by ghosts of famous alumni which no doubt is a driver to do exceptional things or believe they can do something special in some way.
Different schools, especially Public Schools, have a different ethos which has a major influence on the direction of travel after school and this combines with the fact that at the age of selecting the school the child has a certain personality or intellectual bent that directs them to a school where their individual character fits the school ethos/culture better.
So Etonians are like everyone else in terms of a spread of people and personality types in my experience.
I went to Denstone; a fairly little-known and low-influence private school. There were a wide range of characters there (especially as there were loads of local kids on cheap fees or bursaries), and I can say the same for every other school I've met multiple people from.
There was a joke: A Wykehamian, a Harrovian, and an Etonian are entertaining a lady. The Wykehamian pulls out the chair for the lady to sit, the Harrovian cleans the fabric for her, and the Etonian sits down, leaving the lady standing. Meanwhile, the Denstonian serves them all drinks.
I think it displays the status well.
Believe it is Wykehamite 😈
Not Wykehamist?
Oops. Yep. I’ll go and hide now
OMG. This is like that moment in “Inglorious Basterds”.
"Twitter Blue is a completely opt-in experience, and these initial features were designed for a specific segment of engaged users. Ultimately our goal is to provide enough value through premium features that people feel that it is worth paying for."
The damage Boris, JRM, Paterson and other Spartans have done in this idiotic act requires the red wall mps to take action and remove Boris and his cabinet as soon as possible, or the electorate will
A ridiculous over-reaction to a handful of polls. Boris has a majority of 80
Patergate is a stupid, unnecessary piece of self-harm, but the Tories have 2 or 3 years to recover and it would be surreal if they never recorded poll deficits over a parliament
Buy a block of basic student like flats. Offer that to MPs to use whilst they're in London. Stick a canteen at the bottom. Job done.
I know you’re being facetious, but I would actually do something like this
But make them big, luxury flats owned by the state in a nice part of Westminster. So the state ultimately gets the capital value of the investment - but the MPs get free accommodation in a very agreeable part of town
It would be a decent perk of the job. All MPs would be equal. No one would be forced to live there but if they decide not to, they won’t get any expenses for somewhere else
Simple.
There was a block of flats at the bottom of Waterloo bridge (Stamford street?) they looked at and passed on. Imperial turned it into student accommodation.
Your proposal seems reasonable. I’d make them 2 bedroom flats (no need to be mean). If MPs want to bring their families to London they can rent a hotel like everyone else.
Yes, no need to scrimp. The taxpayer will benefit as the state will get the capital gain from the property. Spacious 2 bed flats.
Takes away all the hassle of renting in London. You can move in immediately. Day one of Parliament. Don’t like it, fine, don’t live there but you won’t get money for anywhere else
A nice little perk of the job, but impossible to abuse the system. Sorted
Don’t MEPs have something like this? Official apartments owned by the EU? Or maybe they just sleep in their offices. They are known for their selflessness
No.
They just get ~10k Euro per month in their Daily Allowance, which covers accommodation and related costs.
Paid tax-free into their personal bank account, and from which they pay their staff and expenses.
None of this having to actually account for the spending stuff.
When the UK MPs expense scandal happened, the European Parliament reacted quickly, decisively and nearly unanimously.
They made their expenses a specially protected secret, with severe penalties for leaking them.
Yes. There was an investigation for German TV which showed dozens of MEPs turning up on Friday morning at the singing-in office (to qualify for teh daily 300 Euro or whatever allowance) with their suitcases ready to go straight to their travel arrangements.
I booked a Covid test for foreign travel with a major provider of Covid tests, which was very competitively priced. After doing so I read their terms and conditions and privacy policy and 'fair processing notice'. It transpired from this that they appear to be collecting DNA samples from the swabs for the purposes of 'research', for which they declare an intention to share with companies and government agencies. They also set out in the privacy policy that there is no unconditional opt out of this research programme. It appears that the intention is to use the data from Covid testing to create a private DNA database. Looking further in the legality of this, they appear to be relying on 'legitimate interests' under the GDPR to avoid having to explicitly seek their customers consent for doing so - it was not mentioned at any point on the website, nor in the standard terms and conditions: only in the privacy policy which of course people are very unlikely to ever read.
I have complained to them asking for comments on the above, and they immediately refunded my test fee. Some people may not be concerned about this type of activity, but if you are, then I suggest you are extremely careful about non NHS covid testing. Unless the company in question come up with a very convincing explanation, I will be pursuing this privately with a complaint to the ICO.
@RedfieldWilton First Labour Lead in Voting Intention in a Year.
Full Results (10 Nov):
Lab 38% (+2) Con 36% (-1) Lib Dem 10% (–) Green 6% (–) SNP 4% (-1) Reform UK 3% (-2) Other 1% (–)
Changes +/- 8 Nov
I'd want to see Labour at least 5 points clear and see that sustained well beyond the current media shit-storm before I get too excited. It would be shocking if you weren't getting polls with Labour leads right now since the Tories seem to be doing everything in their power to alienate the electorate.
The damage Boris, JRM, Paterson and other Spartans have done in this idiotic act requires the red wall mps to take action and remove Boris and his cabinet as soon as possible, or the electorate will
A ridiculous over-reaction to a handful of polls. Boris has a majority of 80
Patergate is a stupid, unnecessary piece of self-harm, but the Tories have 2 or 3 years to recover and it would be surreal if they never recorded poll deficits over a parliament
That is as maybe, but my reaction is not to the polls but the impression this idiotic manoeuvre has left with ordinary decent people and it is very clearly Boris's 'Ratner' moment
“ Corbyn stopped Starmer taking a second job doing high-paid consultancy work for law firm Mishcon de Reya in 2017, several key figures from the Corbyn leadership have confirmed to me.
Starmer argued he should be free to take up the role, but Corbyn decided "absolutely no.
Starmer has tried to capitalise on Tory sleaze despite ditching Labour's 2019 pledge to ban MPs' second jobs.
Yet sources say Starmer wanted to take a lucrative second job while in the shadow cabinet, was blocked by Corbyn, and then pretended otherwise.
The matter was raised at a meeting of the shadow cabinet, where "Jeremy very politely reminded Keir what Labour Party policy was," according to a senior member of Corbyn's shadow ministerial team.
Starmer's office had argued there was nothing to worry about in him taking the job, because the Mishcon training academy, which he would be advising, was "really cool."
When the issue blew up & the Tories attacked (Mishcon represented Gina Miller, Starmer's brief was Brexit), Starmer wanted to stick with Mishcon's words that "We are in discussions with Keir Starmer about reappointing him as an adviser" & say it was a limited role—ie ride it out.
However, the job was vetoed, whereupon Starmer switched to claim it was his decision, saying "I am grateful for Mischon de Reya for discussing a possible role advising the Mishcon Academy with me but given my other commitments, I have decided not to further the discussions."
@RedfieldWilton First Labour Lead in Voting Intention in a Year.
Full Results (10 Nov):
Lab 38% (+2) Con 36% (-1) Lib Dem 10% (–) Green 6% (–) SNP 4% (-1) Reform UK 3% (-2) Other 1% (–)
Changes +/- 8 Nov
I'd want to see Labour at least 5 points clear and see that sustained well beyond the current media shit-storm before I get too excited. It would be shocking if you weren't getting polls with Labour leads right now since the Tories seem to be doing everything in their power to alienate the electorate.
Yes, anyone who places any faith in these pointless midterm polls is a fool. Yet no doubt we’ll be subject to lots of over analysis on PB.
I booked a Covid test for foreign travel with a major provider of Covid tests, which was very competitively priced. After doing so I read their terms and conditions and privacy policy and 'fair processing notice'. It transpired from this that they appear to be collecting DNA samples from the swabs for the purposes of 'research', for which they declare an intention to share with companies and government agencies. They also set out in the privacy policy that there is no unconditional opt out of this research programme. It appears that the intention is to use the data from Covid testing to create a private DNA database. Looking further in the legality of this, they appear to be relying on 'legitimate interests' under the GDPR to avoid having to explicitly seek their customers consent for doing so - it was not mentioned at any point on the website, nor in the standard terms and conditions: only in the privacy policy which of course people are very unlikely to ever read.
I have complained to them asking for comments on the above, and they immediately refunded my test fee. Some people may not be concerned about this type of activity, but if you are, then I suggest you are extremely careful about non NHS covid testing. Unless the company in question come up with a very convincing explanation, I will be pursuing this privately with a complaint to the ICO.
This is outrageous & I suggest you also forward your concerns to your MP & maybe to any interested journalists you can track down?
There is no way that this is an appropriate use of the material provided to this company & they cannot possibly have acquired the appropriate permissions. If anyone within the NHS or UK research community tried to do this, the ethics ctte would string them up.
The damage Boris, JRM, Paterson and other Spartans have done in this idiotic act requires the red wall mps to take action and remove Boris and his cabinet as soon as possible, or the electorate will
A ridiculous over-reaction to a handful of polls. Boris has a majority of 80
Patergate is a stupid, unnecessary piece of self-harm, but the Tories have 2 or 3 years to recover and it would be surreal if they never recorded poll deficits over a parliament
That is as maybe, but my reaction is not to the polls but the impression this idiotic manoeuvre has left with ordinary decent people and it is very clearly Boris's 'Ratner' moment
He needs to be replaced
It was an astonishingly tin-eared and inept mistake. Entirely unforced. But it far too early to say Boris is screwed, electorally. He's good at comebacks
@RedfieldWilton First Labour Lead in Voting Intention in a Year.
Full Results (10 Nov):
Lab 38% (+2) Con 36% (-1) Lib Dem 10% (–) Green 6% (–) SNP 4% (-1) Reform UK 3% (-2) Other 1% (–)
Changes +/- 8 Nov
I'd want to see Labour at least 5 points clear and see that sustained well beyond the current media shit-storm before I get too excited. It would be shocking if you weren't getting polls with Labour leads right now since the Tories seem to be doing everything in their power to alienate the electorate.
Yes, anyone who places any faith in these pointless midterm polls is a fool. Yet no doubt we’ll be subject to lots of over analysis on PB.
Any individual poll? Absolutely. A trend showing the Tories sliding? Then we can do analysis. At the moment its merely interesting and slightly funny - as frankly are the polls that show a strengthening of a Tory lead when they're caught being naughty.
Comments
Edit: No, I was obviously just States educated
I have experienced more bigotry in this country on the grounds of my private education than I have ever for my skin colour or the religion of my parents.
It must have been hard for you, attending private school yet somehow managing to avoid any classical history.
Though of course given at least half the establishment and Cabinet, the PM, the Leader of the Opposition and the leader of the LDs and an above average number of British Olympic gold medallists and Oscar winners were privately educated it is not holding us private schoolboys back.
Indeed the next general election will be the first all private schoolboy general election since 1959
(Actually I was a bit shy and modest at school, it was at university where I became cocky and self assured self.)
Most of these houses will not be two car households. There is an average household size of 2.1, and these will be well under that. Houses with one person do not need two spaces.
And this is central Wigan, not Standish or Aspull. Town centre locations have much lower rates of car ownership not because of lack of car parking spaces but because people who live without cars or with fewer cars place a higher value on accessible locations.
Entirely left to the market, you’d expect no more than about 0.7 cars per household somewhere like this.
We can give these spaces charging points, no problem there. But electric cars are still energy inefficient compared to living a lifestyle where more trips can be walked (because you are somewhere accessible like Central Wigan).
Note to southerners (not you Philip, I know you’re local): central Wigan is actually quite nice, and getting nicer. And will be more attractive still if HS2 comes.
Personally I have nothing against Private schooling at all. Except when those who have benefitted from it like yourself think they have the right to deny some of those benefits to those whose parents are not wealthy enough to send their kids private.
Ended up £40 up on that market after a scare nearly left me £200 down.
There is a very real sense that the PS ethos absolutely dominated.
https://theconversation.com/grammar-schools-damage-social-cohesion-and-make-no-difference-to-exam-grades-new-research-93957
There is a reason that our greatest ever PM, Lady Thatcher, closed so many grammar schools despite attending one herself.
And would you like a drink, sir? I can recommend the Leflaive Premier Cru with the Dover Sole ...
Their later incarnation, of course, brings to mind the idea of men in black who can do terrible things with a palette knife.
I'm just glad this one's done now.
Dispproprtionally grammars still get a higher number into Oxbridge and law and medicine than comprehensives do and they are the only state schools which beat some private schools in league tables
It was brutal.
Edit: Damn, she's 'Kendall' with two 'l's, isn't she
If you are interested in a subject you type it in the search bar. Say, "Austria Covid". You tap Latest, and you will then get (or you used to get) all the most recent tweets on that subject. It is a fantastic resource. A personally curated real-time news feed of facts, opinions, videos, jokes, memes, relating to your chosen subject
Now Twitter seems to have done some weird Facebook Insta shit on Latest Tweets, so they aren't the most recent. They appear near-random (tho I would guess they are not). There is very little chronological order. Sometimes the tweets are from hours or days ago. Or they will be from just a few people.
Maddening. It destroys Twitter's USP.
People are speculating why it has happened. It is allegedly a glitch in an upgrade but others have doubts. I reckon Twitter is experimenting with new feeds, or they are trying to drive users to a paid-for premium service
Turns out I'd also gotten Stake and Odds backwards. Instead of Backing at 1.2 with a stake of £200 I'd somehow Laid at 200 with a stake of £1.20 😨. Laying a market currently trading at 1.1 at 200 was certainly not my intention and no wonder it got matched instantly by their bots.
Not something I'd ever want to do again, but they have a "Clear and Obvious Error" policy and they accepted that laying at 200 was a clear and obvious error so that bet got voided.
Redfield & Wilton Strategies
Does the British public think Scotland should be an independent country?
Yes: 26%
No: 47%
Don't know: 27%
Respondents aged 25-34 are the most likely to say yes (32%), while those aged 65+ are the most likely to say no (65%).
But people tend to complain, rather than say when things go right, so personally speaking credit where credit's due I'm glad they voided my erroneous bet rather than just saying I had to live with it.
At Dover, there is a Grand Shaft (fnarr, fnarr) leading down to the base of the cliffs. It has three staircases winding down. The three stairs were designated for different groups: "gentlemen and their ladies", "officers and their wives" and "soldiers and their women"
https://www.heritagegateway.org.uk/Gateway/Results_Single.aspx?uid=d8b03f18-1452-4300-9601-d91ec65ba499&resourceID=19191
My choice of university/degree was a fraught process.
I was expected to follow in the family profession and become a doctor but I realised around the age of 12/13 it really wasn't for me, my father was fine with it, my mother devastated, then it dawned on my mother I wouldn't be going to the University of Sheffield and coming back home every day but going far away and she was worried that girls would corrupt her innocent son.
I'm fairly certain my mother sent me to a private school was because it was an all boys school.
I loved every moment of university, met some great people and started some deep and long lasting friendships.
LAB: 38% (+2)
CON: 36% (-1)
LDEM: 10% (-)
GRN: 6% (-)
via @RedfieldWilton, 10 Nov
Chgs. w/ 08 Nov
Redfield & Wilton Strategies
First Labour Lead in Voting Intention in a Year.
Full Results (10 Nov):
Lab 38% (+2)
Con 36% (-1)
Lib Dem 10% (–)
Green 6% (–)
SNP 4% (-1)
Reform UK 3% (-2)
Other 1% (–)
Changes +/- 8 Nov
That said, when we were moaning about how long we waited in uncomfortable seating before my girlfriends C Section last month, I did have to remind her this was for nothing, and going private was at least 6k
https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1458811770957615104
'The international military campaign has reduced the terrorist threat from this region and helped train a 350,000 strong Afghan National Security Force, which now has security responsibility for Afghanistan's 30 million citizens.'
'Since the drawdown of force elements, British troops are now stationed in Kabul where they take the lead within the Kabul Security Force, a 7 nation organisation which provides vital force protection for UK and coalition advisors who are working with our Afghan partners to increase the capabilities and capacity across the Afghan National Defence and Security Forces.'
https://www.army.mod.uk/deployments/afghanistan/
The fact there isn't a filter on the feed beyond my selection of people I follow is why I like twitter.
Probably one of the most intelligent people I know.
It seems a lot of essential equipment has still not arrived in Brazil.
Jennie Gow
@JennieGow
To clarify: the delayed kit is 2 plane loads of freight. All the last minute stuff, like power units, cars, pit wall kits - all the essential stuff that gets taken race to race.
https://doverwesternheights.org/grand-shaft/
First Labour Lead in Voting Intention in a Year.
Full Results (10 Nov):
Lab 38% (+2)
Con 36% (-1)
Lib Dem 10% (–)
Green 6% (–)
SNP 4% (-1)
Reform UK 3% (-2)
Other 1% (–)
Changes +/- 8 Nov
https://twitter.com/RedfieldWilton/status/1458811770957615104
The Tories would still have most seats in a hung parliament though, EC on the new boundaries gives the Tories 288 seats and Labour 275 on the new Redfield poll
https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/fcgi-bin/usercode.py?scotcontrol=Y&CON=36&LAB=38&LIB=10&Reform=3&Green=6&UKIP=&TVCON=&TVLAB=&TVLIB=&TVReform=&TVGreen=&TVUKIP=&SCOTCON=22.3&SCOTLAB=18.3&SCOTLIB=6.3&SCOTReform=0.7&SCOTGreen=0.7&SCOTUKIP=&SCOTNAT=48.3&display=AllChanged&regorseat=(none)&boundary=2019nbbase
notDiane Abbott and you can save the £5 on school fees.This is like that moment in “Inglorious Basterds”.
Turns out Charles runs a chippy in Chorley.
My guess is that it is an attempt to drive committed users to Blue
I think Labour might be very slightly disappointed by this.
If Labour hit 40% we’d start to see a narrative change reflected in the media.
First Labour Lead in Voting Intention in a Year.
Full Results (10 Nov):
Lab 38% (+2)
Con 36% (-1)
Lib Dem 10% (–)
Green 6% (–)
SNP 4% (-1)
Reform UK 3% (-2)
Other 1% (–)
Changes +/- 8 Nov
Hmm
"Twitter Blue is a completely opt-in experience, and these initial features were designed for a specific segment of engaged users. Ultimately our goal is to provide enough value through premium features that people feel that it is worth paying for."
https://help.twitter.com/en/using-twitter/twitter-blue#tbfeatures
They are going to make Free Twitter progressively less appealing, in slow increments, until the "most engaged users" think Fuck it, OK, I will pay
And fair enough. Just be honest about it
Axis of evil: 39%
Don’t know: 1%
Missing in action: 2%
Patergate is a stupid, unnecessary piece of self-harm, but the Tories have 2 or 3 years to recover and it would be surreal if they never recorded poll deficits over a parliament
And Strasbourg.
Except on Fridays.
I booked a Covid test for foreign travel with a major provider of Covid tests, which was very competitively priced. After doing so I read their terms and conditions and privacy policy and 'fair processing notice'. It transpired from this that they appear to be collecting DNA samples from the swabs for the purposes of 'research', for which they declare an intention to share with companies and government agencies. They also set out in the privacy policy that there is no unconditional opt out of this research programme. It appears that the intention is to use the data from Covid testing to create a private DNA database. Looking further in the legality of this, they appear to be relying on 'legitimate interests' under the GDPR to avoid having to explicitly seek their customers consent for doing so - it was not mentioned at any point on the website, nor in the standard terms and conditions: only in the privacy policy which of course people are very unlikely to ever read.
I have complained to them asking for comments on the above, and they immediately refunded my test fee. Some people may not be concerned about this type of activity, but if you are, then I suggest you are extremely careful about non NHS covid testing. Unless the company in question come up with a very convincing explanation, I will be pursuing this privately with a complaint to the ICO.
He needs to be replaced
Ooh, they just did
“ Corbyn stopped Starmer taking a second job doing high-paid consultancy work for law firm Mishcon de Reya in 2017, several key figures from the Corbyn leadership have confirmed to me.
Starmer argued he should be free to take up the role, but Corbyn decided "absolutely no.
Starmer has tried to capitalise on Tory sleaze despite ditching Labour's 2019 pledge to ban MPs' second jobs.
Yet sources say Starmer wanted to take a lucrative second job while in the shadow cabinet, was blocked by Corbyn, and then pretended otherwise.
The matter was raised at a meeting of the shadow cabinet, where "Jeremy very politely reminded Keir what Labour Party policy was," according to a senior member of Corbyn's shadow ministerial team.
Starmer's office had argued there was nothing to worry about in him taking the job, because the Mishcon training academy, which he would be advising, was "really cool."
When the issue blew up & the Tories attacked (Mishcon represented Gina Miller, Starmer's brief was Brexit), Starmer wanted to stick with Mishcon's words that "We are in discussions with Keir Starmer about reappointing him as an adviser" & say it was a limited role—ie ride it out.
However, the job was vetoed, whereupon Starmer switched to claim it was his decision, saying "I am grateful for Mischon de Reya for discussing a possible role advising the Mishcon Academy with me but given my other commitments, I have decided not to further the discussions."
https://twitter.com/alexnunns/status/1458456622276255750?s=21
There is no way that this is an appropriate use of the material provided to this company & they cannot possibly have acquired the appropriate permissions. If anyone within the NHS or UK research community tried to do this, the ethics ctte would string them up.
This is what happened between 1992 and 1997.