What's also interesting about the EU denial of having escalation measures to threaten the UK is that the way it has been communicated is very similar to how the commission told the French to get fucked as well. Ireland have been told they are on their own, essentially. Ireland have been begging publicly and privately for the EU to take a tougher line on the UK pulling the A16 lever, we now know that this is not going to happen. There is no solidarity and ultimately Italian wineries want to sell us prosecco. It's funny to have to go back to that old canard but now that we have the TCA in place there is no appetite to pull it apart. The EU countries got what they wanted out of it, the ability to keep selling is wine, cars and meat without any threat of the UK putting up tariffs. That is never going to be jeopardised.
Once again, the twitter blue tick wankers and those who live and die by every word they write were wrong. They were wrong on the TCA, they were wrong on the French fishing issues and now they're wrong about the EU readying retaliatory measures out of the scope of the NI protocol. One day, maybe soon, everyone will simply ignore everything they say. In most cases they take a position more extreme and pro-EU than even the commission is willing to take.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Yes, I've also heard that theatres offer protection against the spread of COVID.
You had to have evidence of a recent negative test or being double vaccinated to attend.
Or being double vaccinated. So you don't have a problem with people not wearing a mask if they're double jabbed?
And they are surrounded by other people who are double vaccinated. Mask wearing is more about protecting other people in my view.
Oh, so you think people should wear masks to protect the unvaccinated?
Covid is still a risk to public health and I think we can all take small steps to limit its spread while still enjoying normal life as much as possible. Covering your mouth and nose on public transport and in other enclosed spaces seems a sensible precaution that protects those who are most vulnerable. Some of those may be people who can take the vaccine but choose not to. Personally I disapprove of their decision but that doesn't mean I want to risk killing them.
The unvaccinated will eventually encounter COVID. I don't see what difference it makes if they do so on a train today or in the pub tomorrow.
The "doesn't matter where you catch it" logic is mostly correct, but for both vaxxed and unvaxxed a hospital setting is the exception that proves the rule.
The Mail being as useful in the initimation of trends as ever :
"We live in Bury North, the most marginal seat with a 105 vote Tory Majority. We have just received the post, & in the post, is a letter addressed to my wife & myself from Keir Starmer. It makes very good reading when you look at the mess BOJO has gotten this country into. We have never voted Labour in our lives. However, if BOJO keeps spitting in the eyes of the majority & looking after the interests of billionaire Tory donor property developers, then we might just vote for Labour. As pensioners, BOJO's biggest mistake was to ditch the Triple Lock on State pensions. How can we trust anything he says in the future when he trashed a manifesto pledge not to ditch the triple lock? The fact that he ran away yesterday because he couldn't face being attacked in the Commons shows him to be a very weak person."
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Yes, I've also heard that theatres offer protection against the spread of COVID.
You had to have evidence of a recent negative test or being double vaccinated to attend.
Or being double vaccinated. So you don't have a problem with people not wearing a mask if they're double jabbed?
And they are surrounded by other people who are double vaccinated. Mask wearing is more about protecting other people in my view.
Oh, so you think people should wear masks to protect the unvaccinated?
Covid is still a risk to public health and I think we can all take small steps to limit its spread while still enjoying normal life as much as possible. Covering your mouth and nose on public transport and in other enclosed spaces seems a sensible precaution that protects those who are most vulnerable. Some of those may be people who can take the vaccine but choose not to. Personally I disapprove of their decision but that doesn't mean I want to risk killing them.
You're not risking killing them, their own choices and the virus are.
The virus is endemic, its going to spread. Whether they catch it today, tomorrow or next year doesn't really matter. What does matter is whether you're vaccinated or not.
NPIs made sense pre-PIs. Not now.
I don't know, that just seems a rather hard-hearted view to take about our fellow human beings. Like I say, I'd rather not be a fatal disease vector if I can avoid it at minimal inconvenience to myself.
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
In ‘oppressive’ Scotland I wear masks for probably around a total of an hour per week in 1-10 minute increments. If anyone thinks that’s anywhere in the top ten of the worst things that’s happened to them in the last 18 months they’ve had a pretty easy Covid.
If there comes a point when the PB Volkssturm had to be conscripted and deployed we’re all pretty much down the shitter anyway, but I fervently hope I don’t find myself in a foxhole alongside one of the giant man babies of PB.
You probably will - jumpy recruits will need to be placed alongside steely eyed veterans so we do not run away at the first sign of danger.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Oh I agree (my emphasis to the relevant point) – but there are many who advocated – and continue to advocate – masks in schools. Thank god that has receded, although some LEAs are continuing with it. My point is that mask wearing in early years care will indeed have had an impact on children's learning and socialisation – as we have evolved to be reassured by a smile.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Yes, I've also heard that theatres offer protection against the spread of COVID.
You had to have evidence of a recent negative test or being double vaccinated to attend.
Or being double vaccinated. So you don't have a problem with people not wearing a mask if they're double jabbed?
And they are surrounded by other people who are double vaccinated. Mask wearing is more about protecting other people in my view.
Oh, so you think people should wear masks to protect the unvaccinated?
Covid is still a risk to public health and I think we can all take small steps to limit its spread while still enjoying normal life as much as possible. Covering your mouth and nose on public transport and in other enclosed spaces seems a sensible precaution that protects those who are most vulnerable. Some of those may be people who can take the vaccine but choose not to. Personally I disapprove of their decision but that doesn't mean I want to risk killing them.
The unvaccinated will eventually encounter COVID. I don't see what difference it makes if they do so on a train today or in the pub tomorrow.
The "doesn't matter where you catch it" logic is mostly correct, but for both vaxxed and unvaxxed a hospital setting is the exception that proves the rule.
Serious question: has Boris ever had a job working on the floor with ordinary folk? A summer job say? Or?
I hope someone can tell me so I won't have to study up on him more closely.
I don't think so, from my memory of reading his biography. He should have done, my four years working in a restaurant when I was young have had a lasting positive effect in my life.
Thanks for that. If it's true that's a mega-flaw in his education. I had many jobs, usually in the summer but not always, from about age 13 through to my early 20s. Like you they taught me a lot.
Boris really seems to act like he's blind to ordinary vicissitude.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Yes, I've also heard that theatres offer protection against the spread of COVID.
You had to have evidence of a recent negative test or being double vaccinated to attend.
Or being double vaccinated. So you don't have a problem with people not wearing a mask if they're double jabbed?
And they are surrounded by other people who are double vaccinated. Mask wearing is more about protecting other people in my view.
Oh, so you think people should wear masks to protect the unvaccinated?
Covid is still a risk to public health and I think we can all take small steps to limit its spread while still enjoying normal life as much as possible. Covering your mouth and nose on public transport and in other enclosed spaces seems a sensible precaution that protects those who are most vulnerable. Some of those may be people who can take the vaccine but choose not to. Personally I disapprove of their decision but that doesn't mean I want to risk killing them.
You're not risking killing them, their own choices and the virus are.
The virus is endemic, its going to spread. Whether they catch it today, tomorrow or next year doesn't really matter. What does matter is whether you're vaccinated or not.
NPIs made sense pre-PIs. Not now.
I don't know, that just seems a rather hard-hearted view to take about our fellow human beings. Like I say, I'd rather not be a fatal disease vector if I can avoid it at minimal inconvenience to myself.
That's your choice.
I don't mind if I am an unwitting vector, it happens - and the mask is not minimal inconvenience as far as I'm concerned.
Chris Curtis @chriscurtis94 · 3h But it is also worth putting the latest drop in context. The Tory lead has been falling consistently since the "vaccine bounce" came to an end in May.
Looking at this chart, it seems more like the continuation of a trend rather than a shock in response to this week's news.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Yes, I've also heard that theatres offer protection against the spread of COVID.
You had to have evidence of a recent negative test or being double vaccinated to attend.
Or being double vaccinated. So you don't have a problem with people not wearing a mask if they're double jabbed?
And they are surrounded by other people who are double vaccinated. Mask wearing is more about protecting other people in my view.
Oh, so you think people should wear masks to protect the unvaccinated?
Covid is still a risk to public health and I think we can all take small steps to limit its spread while still enjoying normal life as much as possible. Covering your mouth and nose on public transport and in other enclosed spaces seems a sensible precaution that protects those who are most vulnerable. Some of those may be people who can take the vaccine but choose not to. Personally I disapprove of their decision but that doesn't mean I want to risk killing them.
You're not risking killing them, their own choices and the virus are.
The virus is endemic, its going to spread. Whether they catch it today, tomorrow or next year doesn't really matter. What does matter is whether you're vaccinated or not.
NPIs made sense pre-PIs. Not now.
I don't know, that just seems a rather hard-hearted view to take about our fellow human beings. Like I say, I'd rather not be a fatal disease vector if I can avoid it at minimal inconvenience to myself.
You didn't do it for the flu or any other potentially fatal disease until now. What makes COVID so special? As Philip points out, in a world without vaccines I'd agree, now that vaccines are freely available we really do need to learn to live with the virus. For 33 years I was ok with being a vector to any number of flu strains, I was ok with it then and now that COVID has vaccines available I'm ok with that too.
I can't imagine what a smart response from Raab (invited to defend Johnson's failure to wear a mask) might have been. Those who have to do Johnson's dirty work sometimes make things up. But I can't think of lies that Raab might have gone in for which would have served to excuse Johnson.
Another poll with reduced conservative lead but again labour not benefiting
NEW Westminster Voting Intention
Savanta ComRes
Our first post-Paterson polling
Con 38 (-2) Lab 35 (=) LDM 10 (+1) SNP 5 (=) Grn 4 (=) Other 9 (+1)
2,231 UK adults, 5-7 Nov
(Changes from 29-31 Oct)
Indeed. But the trend is clear. The Conservatives couldn't be beaten and could do what they liked polling 40% or above consistently. They can still do what they like of course. But have to be aware there are consequences. Not least several dozen Tory MP'S out of their seats on those figures.
ATM the clearest trend is that lack of support for the Tories is not leading to a Labour surge of the sort one would expect. The reasons for this are important for political and betting purposes.
The longer this goes on the smaller are the chances of a Labour victory (326+). The bookies put this at about 15%. They are wrong. It's closer to 5%.
The centre left voters (the majority) know well that by coalescing they can bring about a centre left government, but they aren't at this time. They are splitting the centre left vote just to please Boris etc and make sure the Tories are in with a real chance (nearly 50%) of winning.
IMHO the reason for not combining around Labour becomes clear the moment (as I did this morning) you listen for three minutes to David Miliband and reflect for 10 seconds on the fact that he lives in New York, while Hilary Benn is on the back benches and a load of faceless nonentities fill the opposition front bench, and someone like Richard Burgon or Angela Rayner will be a candidate for the leadership next time.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Hmm I doubt it. Japan's long hours work culture is the main cause I think. Not many lasting relationships start from conversations with strangers on public transport in my experience. Don't most young people meet partners via dating apps these days?
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
In ‘oppressive’ Scotland I wear masks for probably around a total of an hour per week in 1-10 minute increments. If anyone thinks that’s anywhere in the top ten of the worst things that’s happened to them in the last 18 months they’ve had a pretty easy Covid.
If there comes a point when the PB Volkssturm had to be conscripted and deployed we’re all pretty much down the shitter anyway, but I fervently hope I don’t find myself in a foxhole alongside one of the giant man babies of PB.
Your fellow Scots don't all agree. On my plane back to London from Inverness in August there was a large group of young women (down south for fun, I suspect). They were dutifully wearing masks on the plane and then on the bus to the terminal, but then they looked around, saw the English not bothering, and one of them said, "Wait, girls, we don't have to wear fucking masks, we're in England!" - and they all whipped their masks off with much drunken cheering
Sadiq Khan is the politician for people who think Keir Starmer is too decisive and attention-grabby.
Without Trump to have a go at he is invisible. Not what a great city like London needs. He has been Mayor for 5 1/2 years, what has he achieved?
He has slowed down the creation of high-quality segregated cycling infrastructure.
Not an action that endears him to me, but I understand black cab drivers are vehemently opposed to any provision for cyclists, so it will have pleased some.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Hmm I doubt it. Japan's long hours work culture is the main cause I think. Not many lasting relationships start from conversations with strangers on public transport in my experience. Don't most young people meet partners via dating apps these days?
No one is sure why East Asian birth rates have collapsed so bad and so quick. Internet and social media are another factor. It's easier to be online. Also falling testosterone levels (also a problem in the West) = feminine men. Lower sperm counts too?
But masks might be involved. If you have a crisis of falling human interactions, adding another barrier to young people copping off is not good. Say a girl has a dazzling smile, which lights up her face, but the young man on the bus never sees it, that means they don't flirt = that's one love affair that never starts, and fewer babies down the line
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Hmm I doubt it. Japan's long hours work culture is the main cause I think. Not many lasting relationships start from conversations with strangers on public transport in my experience. Don't most young people meet partners via dating apps these days?
Clubs, pubs, friends of friends, workplaces & dating apps would likely cover most of the population I think. I guess the only masked place of those should/might be a workplace, but you'd know the person beyond the mask so to speak.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Yes, I've also heard that theatres offer protection against the spread of COVID.
You had to have evidence of a recent negative test or being double vaccinated to attend.
Or being double vaccinated. So you don't have a problem with people not wearing a mask if they're double jabbed?
And they are surrounded by other people who are double vaccinated. Mask wearing is more about protecting other people in my view.
Oh, so you think people should wear masks to protect the unvaccinated?
Covid is still a risk to public health and I think we can all take small steps to limit its spread while still enjoying normal life as much as possible. Covering your mouth and nose on public transport and in other enclosed spaces seems a sensible precaution that protects those who are most vulnerable. Some of those may be people who can take the vaccine but choose not to. Personally I disapprove of their decision but that doesn't mean I want to risk killing them.
The unvaccinated will eventually encounter COVID. I don't see what difference it makes if they do so on a train today or in the pub tomorrow.
The "doesn't matter where you catch it" logic is mostly correct, but for both vaxxed and unvaxxed a hospital setting is the exception that proves the rule.
And as this is true for flu, I'd suggest masks in hospital settings are here to stay.
Sadiq Khan is the politician for people who think Keir Starmer is too decisive and attention-grabby.
Without Trump to have a go at he is invisible. Not what a great city like London needs. He has been Mayor for 5 1/2 years, what has he achieved?
Nothing. Literally nothing. He’s a bed-blocker.
He is almost preternaturally ineffective and banal. What has he done? Cancelled things. Prohibited other things. That's it. He's a nullity. A big silly void. To think Labour once entertained the idea of him as a leader, FFS.
He hasn't got the charisma to be a mediocre junior minister. I wonder what he will do next, in that light
Chris Curtis @chriscurtis94 · 3h But it is also worth putting the latest drop in context. The Tory lead has been falling consistently since the "vaccine bounce" came to an end in May.
Looking at this chart, it seems more like the continuation of a trend rather than a shock in response to this week's news.
I think that's to misunderstand why a trend happens. If you think of a car and the trend of its speed increasing as it accelerates on a motorway slip road, the trend happens because of the extra force applied by the engine.
A trend doesn't simply happen as a thing in itself.
So either there is some underlying big picture reason for a steady erosion of government popularity - like a decline in living standards, or a struggling NHS - or else the trend is an artefact of a succession of individual events that have each applied a negative force to Tory support - Hancock, NI tax increase, Paterson, etc.
Edit: My guess is that it's more the latter, which is why I ultimately expect the Johnson Ministry to survive these crises and emerge victorious at the next general election.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Hmm I doubt it. Japan's long hours work culture is the main cause I think. Not many lasting relationships start from conversations with strangers on public transport in my experience. Don't most young people meet partners via dating apps these days?
Who knows though, just as you see masks as a barrier to getting or transmitting the virus, masks are also another barrier to socialising with strangers. That is absolutely undeniable. I don't think they are a good long term idea for this nation and I fully supported the government in getting rid of the legal mandates. I hope that people will slowly get rid of them as we develop better vaccines/therapeutics and the risk goes to zero. The UK is, IMO, at the forefront of "back to normal" and it's actually something I'm really happy about.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Yes, I've also heard that theatres offer protection against the spread of COVID.
You had to have evidence of a recent negative test or being double vaccinated to attend.
Or being double vaccinated. So you don't have a problem with people not wearing a mask if they're double jabbed?
And they are surrounded by other people who are double vaccinated. Mask wearing is more about protecting other people in my view.
Oh, so you think people should wear masks to protect the unvaccinated?
Covid is still a risk to public health and I think we can all take small steps to limit its spread while still enjoying normal life as much as possible. Covering your mouth and nose on public transport and in other enclosed spaces seems a sensible precaution that protects those who are most vulnerable. Some of those may be people who can take the vaccine but choose not to. Personally I disapprove of their decision but that doesn't mean I want to risk killing them.
The unvaccinated will eventually encounter COVID. I don't see what difference it makes if they do so on a train today or in the pub tomorrow.
The "doesn't matter where you catch it" logic is mostly correct, but for both vaxxed and unvaxxed a hospital setting is the exception that proves the rule.
And as this is true for flu, I'd suggest masks in hospital settings are here to stay.
Difficult to know what to think. One moment you see some poor Yazidi woman sleeping with her child on freezing mud and your heart cracks, the next you see a violent refugee attacking the border with an axe and you think “ok, fire some warning shots”
The truly murky shit is how they are getting there. It seems the Russians and Turks are flying them free from Damascus to Minsk then bussing them to the border.
Many want to go to Germany but others aspire to Britain. If they speak a foreign language it is English, of course
Supposedly 15 have died so far. Could be many more if this drags on
People are dying. They must be allowed safe passage. If they want to come here we should have them. We need workers.
That’s nice of you. Maybe you could house them in your garden
There are plenty of empty properties in the UK. God bless these vulnerable men, women and young children, seeking freedom from Persecution.
I don't think that is the case - though at present there are extras because of Covid restrictions, and the 12 month or more delay it takes to remove an unwilling tenant forced to stay because the Council have told them that leaving before the full legal process and the bailiff coming means they will be deemed "intentionally homeless", and not be eligible for housing. That prevents short term leases.
For the last few years long term "empties" (6 months or more) has been around 0.7%, recently increased to about 0.8-.9% during Covid. Can it realistically be less than that?
There's a reason Germany could take 1m refugees in 2015. There's also stuff about the UK not building very many.
Italy has a birth rate of 1.2/1.3 per woman, and the rate per thousand has more than halved since 1971; and they have millions of empty houses. The number of Italian nationals living in the UK has trebled since 2009, and AFAIC the more there are the happier I shall be - they are wonderful. But for Italy it is all a slow moving car crash. Perhaps they need to import a bit of new young life from, um....
PS 29% of all UK births are to mothers born abroad. I wonder what it is in Italy. Does anyone know?
Children in Italy are seen as a sacrifice and an investment, and having more than one is almost seen culturally as reckless. Then there’s youth unemployment since the pandemic, which remains high in Italy hence the child can be a financial burden for a long time. There was always a tendency in Italy for children to remain in their parents home until marriage, often into their 30s, so prospective parents know they are signing up for a long stretch. And Italians mostly live in flats so there’s a space issue.
Female participation in the labour market is high, and an alarming proportion of women lose their jobs in the year after childbirth, so there’s fear of unemployment. Then there’s childcare, which is scarce, due to the cultural reliance on grandparents. The boomer generation of grandparents isn’t always as keen on looking after the child as their own parents were, too. And there’s no child benefit, nor any real tax or other financial advantages from having a child. Italians spoil their children too, particularly boys, which adds to the cost.
From a historical perspective you can make a credible case that family size has tended to vary depending on the balance of economic advantage and disadvantage that children bring. Italy is the extreme example of where it is disadvantageous.
What's also interesting about the EU denial of having escalation measures to threaten the UK is that the way it has been communicated is very similar to how the commission told the French to get fucked as well. Ireland have been told they are on their own, essentially. Ireland have been begging publicly and privately for the EU to take a tougher line on the UK pulling the A16 lever, we now know that this is not going to happen. There is no solidarity and ultimately Italian wineries want to sell us prosecco. It's funny to have to go back to that old canard but now that we have the TCA in place there is no appetite to pull it apart. The EU countries got what they wanted out of it, the ability to keep selling is wine, cars and meat without any threat of the UK putting up tariffs. That is never going to be jeopardised.
Once again, the twitter blue tick wankers and those who live and die by every word they write were wrong. They were wrong on the TCA, they were wrong on the French fishing issues and now they're wrong about the EU readying retaliatory measures out of the scope of the NI protocol. One day, maybe soon, everyone will simply ignore everything they say. In most cases they take a position more extreme and pro-EU than even the commission is willing to take.
I am very sympathetic to this view. However the issue of where we shall end up over the island of Ireland hasn't gone away, and may not be deferable for ever. The reality is that either
an EU red line is broken and crossed
or a UK red line is ditto
or an RoI is ditto
or an NI is ditto.
Or a unicorn solution is found.
It remains fascinating to watch. The least interesting comments are from people who think there is a clear answer or that the present status quo is somehow written in stone. They are the wrongest of all.
Sadiq Khan is the politician for people who think Keir Starmer is too decisive and attention-grabby.
Without Trump to have a go at he is invisible. Not what a great city like London needs. He has been Mayor for 5 1/2 years, what has he achieved?
Nothing. Literally nothing. He’s a bed-blocker.
He is almost preternaturally ineffective and banal. What has he done? Cancelled things. Prohibited other things. That's it. He's a nullity. A big silly void. To think Labour once entertained the idea of him as a leader, FFS.
He hasn't got the charisma to be a mediocre junior minister. I wonder what he will do next, in that light
He is so bad that two highly obnoxious characters - the first an anti-semite, the second an oafish clown - made far better mayors than he.
Another poll with reduced conservative lead but again labour not benefiting
NEW Westminster Voting Intention
Savanta ComRes
Our first post-Paterson polling
Con 38 (-2) Lab 35 (=) LDM 10 (+1) SNP 5 (=) Grn 4 (=) Other 9 (+1)
2,231 UK adults, 5-7 Nov
(Changes from 29-31 Oct)
Indeed. But the trend is clear. The Conservatives couldn't be beaten and could do what they liked polling 40% or above consistently. They can still do what they like of course. But have to be aware there are consequences. Not least several dozen Tory MP'S out of their seats on those figures.
ATM the clearest trend is that lack of support for the Tories is not leading to a Labour surge of the sort one would expect. The reasons for this are important for political and betting purposes.
The longer this goes on the smaller are the chances of a Labour victory (326+). The bookies put this at about 15%. They are wrong. It's closer to 5%.
The centre left voters (the majority) know well that by coalescing they can bring about a centre left government, but they aren't at this time. They are splitting the centre left vote just to please Boris etc and make sure the Tories are in with a real chance (nearly 50%) of winning.
IMHO the reason for not combining around Labour becomes clear the moment (as I did this morning) you listen for three minutes to David Miliband and reflect for 10 seconds on the fact that he lives in New York, while Hilary Benn is on the back benches and a load of faceless nonentities fill the opposition front bench, and someone like Richard Burgon or Angela Rayner will be a candidate for the leadership next time.
Bet accordingly.
As usual, @algarkirk you nail it pretty much spot on. I would make another argument why Labour are unlikely to get in, namely that views on 'culture' are approaching as entrenched when it comes to voting as class was in the last century. There is nearly 50% of the country who would not dream of voting for any party on the centre-left for fear of what happens on the cultural front. Realistically, that means the Conservatives. The opposition side - progressives - is split between three parties. The only risk to the Conservatives is if there was a UKIP-style party that ate significantly into their culturally conservative base.
I've just been Googling "Sadiq Khan" to see what he is actually *doing*
Not much. But a few things. eg He is doing THIS
"Sadiq Khan has unveiled £25,000 grants to help people change street names as part of a diversity campaign launched following Black Lives Matter protests.
"The Mayor of London has announced a £1 million fund that will be shared out among community groups, including those wishing to campaign to alter potentially offensive road names.
"Grants of up to £25,000 will support groups through all aspects of the process of changing street names, which could include enlisting consultants and compensating residents.
"The Untold Stories fund is part of the Commission for Diversity in the Public Realm, which was established following Black Lives Matter protests to diversify artwork and statuary that came under scrutiny for commemorating figures linked to empire and slavery."
Utterly pointless Woke bullshit, which also wastes money. Brilliant
"London mayor Sadiq Khan has urged the government to make face coverings mandatory on public transport as the UK continues to average more than 40,000 confirmed coronavirus cases a day for over a week."
He wants us all to mask up again. That's an inspired and innovative policy. Who saw that coming?
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Yes, I've also heard that theatres offer protection against the spread of COVID.
You had to have evidence of a recent negative test or being double vaccinated to attend.
Or being double vaccinated. So you don't have a problem with people not wearing a mask if they're double jabbed?
And they are surrounded by other people who are double vaccinated. Mask wearing is more about protecting other people in my view.
Oh, so you think people should wear masks to protect the unvaccinated?
Covid is still a risk to public health and I think we can all take small steps to limit its spread while still enjoying normal life as much as possible. Covering your mouth and nose on public transport and in other enclosed spaces seems a sensible precaution that protects those who are most vulnerable. Some of those may be people who can take the vaccine but choose not to. Personally I disapprove of their decision but that doesn't mean I want to risk killing them.
You're not risking killing them, their own choices and the virus are.
The virus is endemic, its going to spread. Whether they catch it today, tomorrow or next year doesn't really matter. What does matter is whether you're vaccinated or not.
NPIs made sense pre-PIs. Not now.
I don't know, that just seems a rather hard-hearted view to take about our fellow human beings. Like I say, I'd rather not be a fatal disease vector if I can avoid it at minimal inconvenience to myself.
That's your choice.
I don't mind if I am an unwitting vector, it happens - and the mask is not minimal inconvenience as far as I'm concerned.
The things people come out with still amaze me sometimes. I suppose I should have learned by now.
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
In ‘oppressive’ Scotland I wear masks for probably around a total of an hour per week in 1-10 minute increments. If anyone thinks that’s anywhere in the top ten of the worst things that’s happened to them in the last 18 months they’ve had a pretty easy Covid.
If there comes a point when the PB Volkssturm had to be conscripted and deployed we’re all pretty much down the shitter anyway, but I fervently hope I don’t find myself in a foxhole alongside one of the giant man babies of PB.
You probably will - jumpy recruits will need to be placed alongside steely eyed veterans so we do not run away at the first sign of danger.
Elegy to a doomed man baby (with apols to Wilfred).
Gas! GAS! Quick, boys!—An ecstasy of fumbling Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time, But someone still was yelling out and stumbling And flound'ring like a man in fire or lime.— Dim through the misty panes and thick green light, As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.
What's also interesting about the EU denial of having escalation measures to threaten the UK is that the way it has been communicated is very similar to how the commission told the French to get fucked as well. Ireland have been told they are on their own, essentially. Ireland have been begging publicly and privately for the EU to take a tougher line on the UK pulling the A16 lever, we now know that this is not going to happen. There is no solidarity and ultimately Italian wineries want to sell us prosecco. It's funny to have to go back to that old canard but now that we have the TCA in place there is no appetite to pull it apart. The EU countries got what they wanted out of it, the ability to keep selling is wine, cars and meat without any threat of the UK putting up tariffs. That is never going to be jeopardised.
Once again, the twitter blue tick wankers and those who live and die by every word they write were wrong. They were wrong on the TCA, they were wrong on the French fishing issues and now they're wrong about the EU readying retaliatory measures out of the scope of the NI protocol. One day, maybe soon, everyone will simply ignore everything they say. In most cases they take a position more extreme and pro-EU than even the commission is willing to take.
I am very sympathetic to this view. However the issue of where we shall end up over the island of Ireland hasn't gone away, and may not be deferable for ever. The reality is that either
an EU red line is broken and crossed
or a UK red line is ditto
or an RoI is ditto
or an NI is ditto.
Or a unicorn solution is found.
It remains fascinating to watch. The least interesting comments are from people who think there is a clear answer or that the present status quo is somehow written in stone. They are the wrongest of all.
There will be a unicorn solution. I has always been the only possible solution.
That solution will breach an EU red line ("integrity" of the Single Market), but it will breach it in as limited a manner as possible and be less of a breach than if there were no solution.
Quite frankly we have a zero-tariff deal with the EU anyway. Given that, and given the security concerns, then what is a bit of "integrity" between neighbours?
The alternative - that there's still no deal, and worse there's tariffs - would mean that there'd need to be tariff checks at the border between NI and the Republic. Are the EU going to man those? Are Ireland? Of course not!
Sadiq Khan is the politician for people who think Keir Starmer is too decisive and attention-grabby.
Without Trump to have a go at he is invisible. Not what a great city like London needs. He has been Mayor for 5 1/2 years, what has he achieved?
Nothing. Literally nothing. He’s a bed-blocker.
He is almost preternaturally ineffective and banal. What has he done? Cancelled things. Prohibited other things. That's it. He's a nullity. A big silly void. To think Labour once entertained the idea of him as a leader, FFS.
He hasn't got the charisma to be a mediocre junior minister. I wonder what he will do next, in that light
It was Johnson who prohibited boozing on the tube. Who knows how many relationships haven't happened because two strangers didn't get pissed on the tube together? He's single handedly responsible for the death of the West. Or something.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Yes, I've also heard that theatres offer protection against the spread of COVID.
You had to have evidence of a recent negative test or being double vaccinated to attend.
Or being double vaccinated. So you don't have a problem with people not wearing a mask if they're double jabbed?
And they are surrounded by other people who are double vaccinated. Mask wearing is more about protecting other people in my view.
Oh, so you think people should wear masks to protect the unvaccinated?
Covid is still a risk to public health and I think we can all take small steps to limit its spread while still enjoying normal life as much as possible. Covering your mouth and nose on public transport and in other enclosed spaces seems a sensible precaution that protects those who are most vulnerable. Some of those may be people who can take the vaccine but choose not to. Personally I disapprove of their decision but that doesn't mean I want to risk killing them.
You're not risking killing them, their own choices and the virus are.
The virus is endemic, its going to spread. Whether they catch it today, tomorrow or next year doesn't really matter. What does matter is whether you're vaccinated or not.
NPIs made sense pre-PIs. Not now.
I don't know, that just seems a rather hard-hearted view to take about our fellow human beings. Like I say, I'd rather not be a fatal disease vector if I can avoid it at minimal inconvenience to myself.
That's your choice.
I don't mind if I am an unwitting vector, it happens - and the mask is not minimal inconvenience as far as I'm concerned.
The things people come out with still amaze me sometimes. I suppose I should have learned by now.
What's amazing about it?
Would you rather I lie?
Do you wear a mask 24/7 to prevent being an unwitting vector of cold, or flu or other potentially deadly diseases to others including those you live with? Or are you prepared to take the chance that you may from time to time be an unwitting vector because it happens and is a part of life.
A sign of the times: there are more players in the present England football squad who have played for Huddersfield Town (3) then for Manchester United (2). They are Coady, Chlwell, and Smith-Rowe.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
Absolutely. Those people who put photos of themselves on Twitter in masks are such idiots.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
Yes, we can be more relaxed with high rates of vaccination. However, but I find this use of language like "mentality of fear" preposterous. I am not fearful when I put on a mask to go round the local supermarket or on the Tube, just as I am not fearful when I wash my hands after handling raw chicken or when I put on a seat belt.
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
In ‘oppressive’ Scotland I wear masks for probably around a total of an hour per week in 1-10 minute increments. If anyone thinks that’s anywhere in the top ten of the worst things that’s happened to them in the last 18 months they’ve had a pretty easy Covid.
If there comes a point when the PB Volkssturm had to be conscripted and deployed we’re all pretty much down the shitter anyway, but I fervently hope I don’t find myself in a foxhole alongside one of the giant man babies of PB.
Your fellow Scots don't all agree. On my plane back to London from Inverness in August there was a large group of young women (down south for fun, I suspect). They were dutifully wearing masks on the plane and then on the bus to the terminal, but then they looked around, saw the English not bothering, and one of them said, "Wait, girls, we don't have to wear fucking masks, we're in England!" - and they all whipped their masks off with much drunken cheering
So there. True story
I love a tourist's anecdote, they're the best kind.
Sadiq Khan is the politician for people who think Keir Starmer is too decisive and attention-grabby.
Without Trump to have a go at he is invisible. Not what a great city like London needs. He has been Mayor for 5 1/2 years, what has he achieved?
Nothing. Literally nothing. He’s a bed-blocker.
He is almost preternaturally ineffective and banal. What has he done? Cancelled things. Prohibited other things. That's it. He's a nullity. A big silly void. To think Labour once entertained the idea of him as a leader, FFS.
He hasn't got the charisma to be a mediocre junior minister. I wonder what he will do next, in that light
He is so bad that two highly obnoxious characters - the first an anti-semite, the second an oafish clown - made far better mayors than he.
Yes, he's been exposed in office, and he's also shown that being a good London mayor is not as easy as it looks. You need to be loud and visible with a dash of *charm* and populism. The common touch helps as well. Ken and Boris both had these gifts, Khan has none of them
It looks like we will be spared Khan as Labour leader (let alone PM: imagine). He's down with Jess Philips and Rosena Allin-Khan in the next leader betting. Not going to happen
Anyone expecting the PM to set an example on anything is going to be sorely disappointed.
Striking juxta - vax made compulsory for NHS staff, PM refuses mask on NHS ward.
Interesting point made earlier, I see, that maybe he's virtue signalling to his base. Hadn't thought of that but, yes, could be. In which case, more than a touch of Britain Trump, and sad.
Anyone expecting the PM to set an example on anything is going to be sorely disappointed.
Striking juxta - vax made compulsory for NHS staff, PM refuses mask on NHS ward.
Interesting point made earlier, I see, that maybe he's virtue signalling to his base. Hadn't thought of that but, yes, could be. In which case, more than a touch of Britain Trump, and sad.
Raab is a consumate performer and has a mellifluous voice which I like. I also quite like/rate him.
This morning however he was guilty of an error and Mishal didn't pick him up on it.
When asked why the PM hadn't apologised he said that he doesn't speak for the PM. When asked about the change of mind he said that he speaks on behalf of the government in saying he regrets it.
Mishal wasn't bad but Humphries would have ripped him a new one over that.
Anyone expecting the PM to set an example on anything is going to be sorely disappointed.
Striking juxta - vax made compulsory for NHS staff, PM refuses mask on NHS ward.
Interesting point made earlier, I see, that maybe he's virtue signalling to his base. Hadn't thought of that but, yes, could be. In which case, more than a touch of Britain Trump, and sad.
What's also interesting about the EU denial of having escalation measures to threaten the UK is that the way it has been communicated is very similar to how the commission told the French to get fucked as well. Ireland have been told they are on their own, essentially. Ireland have been begging publicly and privately for the EU to take a tougher line on the UK pulling the A16 lever, we now know that this is not going to happen. There is no solidarity and ultimately Italian wineries want to sell us prosecco. It's funny to have to go back to that old canard but now that we have the TCA in place there is no appetite to pull it apart. The EU countries got what they wanted out of it, the ability to keep selling is wine, cars and meat without any threat of the UK putting up tariffs. That is never going to be jeopardised.
Once again, the twitter blue tick wankers and those who live and die by every word they write were wrong. They were wrong on the TCA, they were wrong on the French fishing issues and now they're wrong about the EU readying retaliatory measures out of the scope of the NI protocol. One day, maybe soon, everyone will simply ignore everything they say. In most cases they take a position more extreme and pro-EU than even the commission is willing to take.
Let's have a prediction then. Are we going to trigger Art 16? And if so what will it lead to?
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
In ‘oppressive’ Scotland I wear masks for probably around a total of an hour per week in 1-10 minute increments. If anyone thinks that’s anywhere in the top ten of the worst things that’s happened to them in the last 18 months they’ve had a pretty easy Covid.
If there comes a point when the PB Volkssturm had to be conscripted and deployed we’re all pretty much down the shitter anyway, but I fervently hope I don’t find myself in a foxhole alongside one of the giant man babies of PB.
Your fellow Scots don't all agree. On my plane back to London from Inverness in August there was a large group of young women (down south for fun, I suspect). They were dutifully wearing masks on the plane and then on the bus to the terminal, but then they looked around, saw the English not bothering, and one of them said, "Wait, girls, we don't have to wear fucking masks, we're in England!" - and they all whipped their masks off with much drunken cheering
So there. True story
I love a tourist's anecdote, they're the best kind.
Just a shame that the seat next to the Albanian was already taken.
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
In ‘oppressive’ Scotland I wear masks for probably around a total of an hour per week in 1-10 minute increments. If anyone thinks that’s anywhere in the top ten of the worst things that’s happened to them in the last 18 months they’ve had a pretty easy Covid.
If there comes a point when the PB Volkssturm had to be conscripted and deployed we’re all pretty much down the shitter anyway, but I fervently hope I don’t find myself in a foxhole alongside one of the giant man babies of PB.
Your fellow Scots don't all agree. On my plane back to London from Inverness in August there was a large group of young women (down south for fun, I suspect). They were dutifully wearing masks on the plane and then on the bus to the terminal, but then they looked around, saw the English not bothering, and one of them said, "Wait, girls, we don't have to wear fucking masks, we're in England!" - and they all whipped their masks off with much drunken cheering
So there. True story
I love a tourist's anecdote, they're the best kind.
I would have liked a bit more spice. As it stands it is a bit "meh".
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Mask wearing on public transport causes low birth rates? This is the best post I've read on PB for years. By "best", I mean, "raised the biggest laugh".
Anyone expecting the PM to set an example on anything is going to be sorely disappointed.
Striking juxta - vax made compulsory for NHS staff, PM refuses mask on NHS ward.
Interesting point made earlier, I see, that maybe he's virtue signalling to his base. Hadn't thought of that but, yes, could be. In which case, more than a touch of Britain Trump, and sad.
Good slogan to sell the compulsory vax though: You have to get the vaccination to protect yourself from maskless, fat, lying sacks of jizz.
I've been musing on Boris's showing in the polls. He's a poor PM, around whom swirls more than a whiff of corruption. Almost nobody likes him very much, despite which his polling is holding up extraordinary well.
I think it's three factors combining to achieve this.
1) He's performed an amazing piece of triangulation against his core voters. Want less tax and spend? No-one to vote for. Think net zero by 2050 is madness —no one to vote for. Think all the remaining Covid stuff (particularly Test and Trace) needs to go now - no one to vote for. Repeat ad nauseam for almost every issue conservative voters might care about.
Some of his lead is because there is a chunk of the electorate for whom there is no one else to vote. Some of them are still voting Boris on the basis that whilst bad, he's less bad than the (particularly on Brexit, the only area where he's been any good). Others (I'm currently in this position) are merely going to be Don't know/won't vote which halves their effects on the net figures.
2) The Labour Party isn't exactly in love with KS, and is riven with factional infighting. KS comes across as a dull dud on the odd occasion his voice can be heard above the fray, so even naturally lefties aren't rushing to vote for him.
3) A lot of people would take a corrupt buffoon over a meddling busybody. CS Lewis has a great line: "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be “cured” against one’s will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals."
I think this is actually the biggie. Starmer is a worthy type, who wants to tell us how to behave, what to do, what to think. It doesn't matter how corrupt and unpleasant the alternative - that sort of leader is always worse.
The man to watch here is Farage. He's started making noises off about a referendum on Net Zero by 2050 and all that this entails. He's entirely right of course - it's another cosy establishment stich up about which the voters never got asked. It's hard for him without the EU elections as a platform for a free hit at the government, but it's possible he'll succeed in doing exactly what he did over the EU, and threaten the Tory vote enough to force them to abandon their current triangulation. I can't see that happening with Carrie Antonette in No10, so it may be fun to see which way Boris jumps.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Hmm I doubt it. Japan's long hours work culture is the main cause I think. Not many lasting relationships start from conversations with strangers on public transport in my experience. Don't most young people meet partners via dating apps these days?
No one is sure why East Asian birth rates have collapsed so bad and so quick. Internet and social media are another factor. It's easier to be online. Also falling testosterone levels (also a problem in the West) = feminine men. Lower sperm counts too?
But masks might be involved. If you have a crisis of falling human interactions, adding another barrier to young people copping off is not good. Say a girl has a dazzling smile, which lights up her face, but the young man on the bus never sees it, that means they don't flirt = that's one love affair that never starts, and fewer babies down the line
Get rid of the masks. We want our smiles back
Maybe the the girl on the bus has poor teeth, but a lovely personality. Without masks, the young man dismisses her, but with masks, he gets to know her first, and a love affair is saved!
Or maybe the girl on the bus just wants to read her book and get to work, without being bothered by this young man. If she wants a date, she'll use Bumble.
Anyone expecting the PM to set an example on anything is going to be sorely disappointed.
Striking juxta - vax made compulsory for NHS staff, PM refuses mask on NHS ward.
Interesting point made earlier, I see, that maybe he's virtue signalling to his base. Hadn't thought of that but, yes, could be. In which case, more than a touch of Britain Trump, and sad.
Vaccines are massively more important than masks.
Vaccines are good. Masks are not.
Phil, he's in a hospital.
And I've already said since the government's guidance is to wear a mask in healthcare settings he's an arse for not doing so.
But just because of hypocrisy, not because masks are any good. Do you wear a mask in prior years so you don't pass on the flu, or a cold, or anything else unwittingly? If not, I see absolutely no reason to wear one this year either.
But since he's the PM and his government have put out guidance to say you should wear it, he should have worn it. Or dropped the guidance first.
Anyone expecting the PM to set an example on anything is going to be sorely disappointed.
Striking juxta - vax made compulsory for NHS staff, PM refuses mask on NHS ward.
Interesting point made earlier, I see, that maybe he's virtue signalling to his base. Hadn't thought of that but, yes, could be. In which case, more than a touch of Britain Trump, and sad.
Good slogan to sell the compulsory vax though: You have to get the vaccination to protect yourself from maskless, fat, lying sacks of jizz.
Those who know you will therefore be relieved when they get their jabs.
Given MoL is a big full-time job the MP side must have been skimped. Unless of course he worked his tail off dawn to dusk to make sure nothing got neglected. Maybe that's what happened. It's only an almost impossible notion.
As for Cox, people are missing the important point that with his megaphone of a voice - oh god can you remember it during the parliamentary Brexit debates? - he is perfectly capable of talking to his constituents from the Caribbean.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Mask wearing on public transport causes low birth rates? This is the best post I've read on PB for years. By "best", I mean, "raised the biggest laugh".
No, but when everyone around you is a potential disease carrier how much less likely are you to generally chat to a stranger? We know that East Asian countries suffer massively from a lack of socialising (and ultimately sex). Again, I'm not saying that masks are causing it at all, I'm just not ruling them out as a contributing factor. Masks inherently make everyone around you a potentially deadly hostile, that changes the nature of how we treat each other. Who's to say it isn't a factor in the low birth rate in East Asia?
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Mask wearing on public transport causes low birth rates? This is the best post I've read on PB for years. By "best", I mean, "raised the biggest laugh".
Yup, that poster when not proclaiming expertise on something he has a passing interest in is good for a chuckle.
Anyone expecting the PM to set an example on anything is going to be sorely disappointed.
Striking juxta - vax made compulsory for NHS staff, PM refuses mask on NHS ward.
Interesting point made earlier, I see, that maybe he's virtue signalling to his base. Hadn't thought of that but, yes, could be. In which case, more than a touch of Britain Trump, and sad.
Vaccines are massively more important than masks.
Vaccines are good. Masks are not.
Phil, he's in a hospital.
And I've already said since the government's guidance is to wear a mask in healthcare settings he's an arse for not doing so.
But just because of hypocrisy, not because masks are any good. Do you wear a mask in prior years so you don't pass on the flu, or a cold, or anything else unwittingly? If not, I see absolutely no reason to wear one this year either.
But since he's the PM and his government have put out guidance to say you should wear it, he should have worn it. Or dropped the guidance first.
Absolutely.
All those mask-fanatics are telling us that they have never at any point in the past XX years when they have felt a bit dodgy ever gone out in public. Because they sure as hell didn't ever wear a sodding mask.
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
In ‘oppressive’ Scotland I wear masks for probably around a total of an hour per week in 1-10 minute increments. If anyone thinks that’s anywhere in the top ten of the worst things that’s happened to them in the last 18 months they’ve had a pretty easy Covid.
If there comes a point when the PB Volkssturm had to be conscripted and deployed we’re all pretty much down the shitter anyway, but I fervently hope I don’t find myself in a foxhole alongside one of the giant man babies of PB.
Your fellow Scots don't all agree. On my plane back to London from Inverness in August there was a large group of young women (down south for fun, I suspect). They were dutifully wearing masks on the plane and then on the bus to the terminal, but then they looked around, saw the English not bothering, and one of them said, "Wait, girls, we don't have to wear fucking masks, we're in England!" - and they all whipped their masks off with much drunken cheering
So there. True story
I love a tourist's anecdote, they're the best kind.
I would have liked a bit more spice. As it stands it is a bit "meh".
I would have expected the climax of the story to involve three of the women performing unmentionable acts on the author at the back of the plane. Heading south for fun, as it were. Without that is the story even believable?
Do you wear a mask in prior years so you don't pass on the flu, or a cold, or anything else unwittingly? If not, I see absolutely no reason to wear one this year either.
Absolutely no reason? So, you're saying that rates of infectious respiratory disease this year are absolutely the same as in 2019 and before?
Given MoL is a big full-time job the MP side must have been skimped. Unless of course he worked his tail off dawn to dusk to make sure nothing got neglected. Maybe that's what happened. It's only an almost impossible notion.
As for Cox, people are missing the important point that with his megaphone of a voice - oh god can you remember it during the parliamentary Brexit debates? - he is perfectly capable of talking to his constituents from the Caribbean.
Great point. There’s a guy in our office who’s Just the same.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Hmm I doubt it. Japan's long hours work culture is the main cause I think. Not many lasting relationships start from conversations with strangers on public transport in my experience. Don't most young people meet partners via dating apps these days?
No one is sure why East Asian birth rates have collapsed so bad and so quick. Internet and social media are another factor. It's easier to be online. Also falling testosterone levels (also a problem in the West) = feminine men. Lower sperm counts too?
But masks might be involved. If you have a crisis of falling human interactions, adding another barrier to young people copping off is not good. Say a girl has a dazzling smile, which lights up her face, but the young man on the bus never sees it, that means they don't flirt = that's one love affair that never starts, and fewer babies down the line
Get rid of the masks. We want our smiles back
Maybe the the girl on the bus has poor teeth, but a lovely personality. Without masks, the young man dismisses her, but with masks, he gets to know her first, and a love affair is saved!
Or maybe the girl on the bus just wants to read her book and get to work, without being bothered by this young man. If she wants a date, she'll use Bumble.
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
In ‘oppressive’ Scotland I wear masks for probably around a total of an hour per week in 1-10 minute increments. If anyone thinks that’s anywhere in the top ten of the worst things that’s happened to them in the last 18 months they’ve had a pretty easy Covid.
If there comes a point when the PB Volkssturm had to be conscripted and deployed we’re all pretty much down the shitter anyway, but I fervently hope I don’t find myself in a foxhole alongside one of the giant man babies of PB.
Your fellow Scots don't all agree. On my plane back to London from Inverness in August there was a large group of young women (down south for fun, I suspect). They were dutifully wearing masks on the plane and then on the bus to the terminal, but then they looked around, saw the English not bothering, and one of them said, "Wait, girls, we don't have to wear fucking masks, we're in England!" - and they all whipped their masks off with much drunken cheering
So there. True story
I love a tourist's anecdote, they're the best kind.
I would have liked a bit more spice. As it stands it is a bit "meh".
I would have expected the climax of the story to involve three of the women performing unmentionable acts on the author at the back of the plane. Heading south for fun, as it were. Without that is the story even believable?
Come fly with me, let's float down to Peru In llama-land there's a one-man band And he'll toot his flute for you
Do you wear a mask in prior years so you don't pass on the flu, or a cold, or anything else unwittingly? If not, I see absolutely no reason to wear one this year either.
Absolutely no reason? So, you're saying that rates of infectious respiratory disease this year are absolutely the same as in 2019 and before?
They're comparable, yes.
There's Covid this year, but we have vaccines for that, so forget about it.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Mask wearing on public transport causes low birth rates? This is the best post I've read on PB for years. By "best", I mean, "raised the biggest laugh".
No, but when everyone around you is a potential disease carrier how much less likely are you to generally chat to a stranger? We know that East Asian countries suffer massively from a lack of socialising (and ultimately sex). Again, I'm not saying that masks are causing it at all, I'm just not ruling them out as a contributing factor. Masks inherently make everyone around you a potentially deadly hostile, that changes the nature of how we treat each other. Who's to say it isn't a factor in the low birth rate in East Asia?
Given MoL is a big full-time job the MP side must have been skimped. Unless of course he worked his tail off dawn to dusk to make sure nothing got neglected. Maybe that's what happened. It's only an almost impossible notion.
As for Cox, people are missing the important point that with his megaphone of a voice - oh god can you remember it during the parliamentary Brexit debates? - he is perfectly capable of talking to his constituents from the Caribbean.
Great point. There’s a guy in our office who’s Just the same.
And I always seem to sit in the same carriage as him when I get the train anywhere.
NEW: Ireland making contingency plans for Article 16 and possible new trade barriers. Leo Varadkar, who negotiated the NI protocol with Johnson says if Britain were to resile from NIP, "the EU would have no option other than to introduce what we call rebalancing measures. 1/2
Varadkar has just told RTE that "Brexit is kind of done but this [art16] potentially undoes it"
Had a meeting yesterday on contingency preparations
What's also interesting about the EU denial of having escalation measures to threaten the UK is that the way it has been communicated is very similar to how the commission told the French to get fucked as well. Ireland have been told they are on their own, essentially. Ireland have been begging publicly and privately for the EU to take a tougher line on the UK pulling the A16 lever, we now know that this is not going to happen. There is no solidarity and ultimately Italian wineries want to sell us prosecco. It's funny to have to go back to that old canard but now that we have the TCA in place there is no appetite to pull it apart. The EU countries got what they wanted out of it, the ability to keep selling is wine, cars and meat without any threat of the UK putting up tariffs. That is never going to be jeopardised.
Once again, the twitter blue tick wankers and those who live and die by every word they write were wrong. They were wrong on the TCA, they were wrong on the French fishing issues and now they're wrong about the EU readying retaliatory measures out of the scope of the NI protocol. One day, maybe soon, everyone will simply ignore everything they say. In most cases they take a position more extreme and pro-EU than even the commission is willing to take.
Let's have a prediction then. Are we going to trigger Art 16? And if so what will it lead to?
If the EU are sensible they'll cave from the mere threat of Article 16, so thus avoiding the need to trigger it. If you can get what you want without triggering it but my merely threatening to do so, then job done.
If we do trigger it, then it will lead to the UK unilaterally rewriting the Protocol and setting "the facts on the ground" in a way that suits the UK best. Since the EU will have no realistic way of forcing the UK to back down, they'll have little choice but to accept those new facts on the ground as the new reality, which is why they may as well negotiate now rather than hand the UK complete unilateral control.
I've just been Googling "Sadiq Khan" to see what he is actually *doing*
Not much. But a few things. eg He is doing THIS
"Sadiq Khan has unveiled £25,000 grants to help people change street names as part of a diversity campaign launched following Black Lives Matter protests.
"The Mayor of London has announced a £1 million fund that will be shared out among community groups, including those wishing to campaign to alter potentially offensive road names.
"Grants of up to £25,000 will support groups through all aspects of the process of changing street names, which could include enlisting consultants and compensating residents.
"The Untold Stories fund is part of the Commission for Diversity in the Public Realm, which was established following Black Lives Matter protests to diversify artwork and statuary that came under scrutiny for commemorating figures linked to empire and slavery."
Utterly pointless Woke bullshit, which also wastes money. Brilliant
"London mayor Sadiq Khan has urged the government to make face coverings mandatory on public transport as the UK continues to average more than 40,000 confirmed coronavirus cases a day for over a week."
He wants us all to mask up again. That's an inspired and innovative policy. Who saw that coming?
He's just extended the ULEZ zone which at a stroke has stopped me gadding around in my big polluting Merc. Whilst I'm not his greatest fan, eg he comes over to me as a careerist, and as I say he's making me walk everywhere, it has to be noted that much of the more visceral dislike of him is driven by him being Muslim. Not you, of course, but it's undeniably in the mix. Which is disappointing to see.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Hmm I doubt it. Japan's long hours work culture is the main cause I think. Not many lasting relationships start from conversations with strangers on public transport in my experience. Don't most young people meet partners via dating apps these days?
No one is sure why East Asian birth rates have collapsed so bad and so quick. Internet and social media are another factor. It's easier to be online. Also falling testosterone levels (also a problem in the West) = feminine men. Lower sperm counts too?
But masks might be involved. If you have a crisis of falling human interactions, adding another barrier to young people copping off is not good. Say a girl has a dazzling smile, which lights up her face, but the young man on the bus never sees it, that means they don't flirt = that's one love affair that never starts, and fewer babies down the line
Get rid of the masks. We want our smiles back
Maybe the the girl on the bus has poor teeth, but a lovely personality. Without masks, the young man dismisses her, but with masks, he gets to know her first, and a love affair is saved!
Or maybe the girl on the bus just wants to read her book and get to work, without being bothered by this young man. If she wants a date, she'll use Bumble.
You have no romance in your soul. "Bumble". Pff!
Even more important than a lack of opportunities for impromptu sexual encounters, masks generally reduce levels of trust. And a society with a high level of trust (which by global standards, the UK still is) is the greatest asset we have.
Off topic, Daughter and I were out in London last night. Restaurant and theatre packed. A most enjoyable evening and a much-needed break for Daughter. I am worried about the immense strain she is under.
Anyway, on our way into town (separately from some other appointments) we both noticed one thing which annoyed us and will doubtless be dismissed by many on here as hyper-sensitivity. But here goes anyway.
There is a long corridor on the interchange between the Piccadilly and Jubilee lines. On it there are various Pride posters with stories and photos from individuals. All very lovely. No objection to this at all.
There were 29 posters. Only 7 of them were women and one of these was of a mother of a gay person. So only 6 gay women out of 29. 6 women. 22 men.
Why so few women? Why so few gay women? Are their stories not worth telling?
Daughter pointed out that whenever gay marriage is talked about or discussed it is very often accompanied by illustrations of gay men getting married. Not gay women. It annoyed her.
Then on the Central line at Bond Street a big poster saying how London stands together against hate. Well, yes, who wouldn't be?
The precise words used in the poster are these -
"London stands together against hate directed at someone on our transport network because of race, religion, sexual orientation, disability or gender identity."
All very lovely. But spot what's missing. "Sex" - a protected characteristic and probably one of the single biggest reasons for attacks on women and girls. The Mayor talks a good game about Violence against Women and Girls but he cannot bring himself to mention sex in this poster. He ignores the fact that it is a "protected characteristic" in law. He is happy to include characteristics which aren't. But something which is - and which is of great concern to women, especially in relation to the risks they face when travelling - is ignored.
Why? Deliberate? Or just forgotten?
These may seem like small matters. But this sort of unconscious overlooking of women, of the female experience is all too common, all too pervasive and, ironically, occurs at a time when diversity is trumpeted loudly by all sorts of people keen to promote their progressive credentials.
I rather feel that the more people talk about diversity the less likely they are to listen to actual women or do anything practical to help them.
One day we might have 29 posters with 22 of them of women, a few men and a token father. A 50/50 representation would be a start. And - imagine - those posters, those choices were all, I expect, signed off by lots of people in numerous meeting and none of those preparing and implementing this campaign noticed what two women at both ends of the age spectrum noticed in minutes while travelling through. Or cared about the message it sends.
Anyone expecting the PM to set an example on anything is going to be sorely disappointed.
Striking juxta - vax made compulsory for NHS staff, PM refuses mask on NHS ward.
Interesting point made earlier, I see, that maybe he's virtue signalling to his base. Hadn't thought of that but, yes, could be. In which case, more than a touch of Britain Trump, and sad.
Vaccines are massively more important than masks.
Vaccines are good. Masks are not.
Phil, he's in a hospital.
And I've already said since the government's guidance is to wear a mask in healthcare settings he's an arse for not doing so.
But just because of hypocrisy, not because masks are any good. Do you wear a mask in prior years so you don't pass on the flu, or a cold, or anything else unwittingly? If not, I see absolutely no reason to wear one this year either.
But since he's the PM and his government have put out guidance to say you should wear it, he should have worn it. Or dropped the guidance first.
Absolutely.
All those mask-fanatics are telling us that they have never at any point in the past XX years when they have felt a bit dodgy ever gone out in public. Because they sure as hell didn't ever wear a sodding mask.
True, and many went into the office or factory with colds and spread them to their colleagues.
I hope the culture of going to work when poorly and workers being viewed as slacking if they have time off is well and truly at an end.
Off topic, Daughter and I were out in London last night. Restaurant and theatre packed. A most enjoyable evening and a much-needed break for Daughter. I am worried about the immense strain she is under.
Anyway, on our way into town (separately from some other appointments) we both noticed one thing which annoyed us and will doubtless be dismissed by many on here as hyper-sensitivity. But here goes anyway.
There is a long corridor on the interchange between the Piccadilly and Jubilee lines. On it there are various Pride posters with stories and photos from individuals. All very lovely. No objection to this at all.
There were 29 posters. Only 7 of them were women and one of these was of a mother of a gay person. So only 6 gay women out of 29. 6 women. 22 men.
Why so few women? Why so few gay women? Are their stories not worth telling?
Daughter pointed out that whenever gay marriage is talked about or discussed it is very often accompanied by illustrations of gay men getting married. Not gay women. It annoyed her.
Then on the Central line at Bond Street a big poster saying how London stands together against hate. Well, yes, who wouldn't be?
The precise words used in the poster are these -
"London stands together against hate directed at someone on our transport network because of race, religion, sexual orientation, disability or gender identity."
All very lovely. But spot what's missing. "Sex" - a protected characteristic and probably one of the single biggest reasons for attacks on women and girls. The Mayor talks a good game about Violence against Women and Girls but he cannot bring himself to mention sex in this poster. He ignores the fact that it is a "protected characteristic" in law. He is happy to include characteristics which aren't. But something which is - and which is of great concern to women, especially in relation to the risks they face when travelling - is ignored.
Why? Deliberate? Or just forgotten?
These may seem like small matters. But this sort of unconscious overlooking of women, of the female experience is all too common, all too pervasive and, ironically, occurs at a time when diversity is trumpeted loudly by all sorts of people keen to promote their progressive credentials.
I rather feel that the more people talk about diversity the less likely they are to listen to actual women or do anything practical to help them.
One day we might have 29 posters with 22 of them of women, a few men and a token father. A 50/50 representation would be a start. And - imagine - those posters, those choices were all, I expect, signed off by lots of people in numerous meeting and none of those preparing and implementing this campaign noticed what two women at both ends of the age spectrum noticed in minutes while travelling through. Or cared about the message it sends.
Grrr.....
Of course it’s deliberate. It’s very much ‘women know your place’
I've just been Googling "Sadiq Khan" to see what he is actually *doing*
Not much. But a few things. eg He is doing THIS
"Sadiq Khan has unveiled £25,000 grants to help people change street names as part of a diversity campaign launched following Black Lives Matter protests.
"The Mayor of London has announced a £1 million fund that will be shared out among community groups, including those wishing to campaign to alter potentially offensive road names.
"Grants of up to £25,000 will support groups through all aspects of the process of changing street names, which could include enlisting consultants and compensating residents.
"The Untold Stories fund is part of the Commission for Diversity in the Public Realm, which was established following Black Lives Matter protests to diversify artwork and statuary that came under scrutiny for commemorating figures linked to empire and slavery."
Utterly pointless Woke bullshit, which also wastes money. Brilliant
"London mayor Sadiq Khan has urged the government to make face coverings mandatory on public transport as the UK continues to average more than 40,000 confirmed coronavirus cases a day for over a week."
He wants us all to mask up again. That's an inspired and innovative policy. Who saw that coming?
He's just extended the ULEZ zone which at a stroke has stopped me gadding around in my big polluting Merc. Whilst I'm not his greatest fan, eg he comes over to me as a careerist, and as I say he's making me walk everywhere, it has to be noted that much of the more visceral dislike of him is driven by him being Muslim. Not you, of course, but it's undeniably in the mix. Which is disappointing to see.
The fact he’s a bellend is nothing to do with his religion. It’s like people criticising him for some of the people he acted for in his legal role. He did nothing wrong at all. It’s just cheap dog whistle. It also gets him off the hook for his ineptitude.
Off topic, Daughter and I were out in London last night. Restaurant and theatre packed. A most enjoyable evening and a much-needed break for Daughter. I am worried about the immense strain she is under.
Anyway, on our way into town (separately from some other appointments) we both noticed one thing which annoyed us and will doubtless be dismissed by many on here as hyper-sensitivity. But here goes anyway.
There is a long corridor on the interchange between the Piccadilly and Jubilee lines. On it there are various Pride posters with stories and photos from individuals. All very lovely. No objection to this at all.
There were 29 posters. Only 7 of them were women and one of these was of a mother of a gay person. So only 6 gay women out of 29. 6 women. 22 men.
Why so few women? Why so few gay women? Are their stories not worth telling?
Daughter pointed out that whenever gay marriage is talked about or discussed it is very often accompanied by illustrations of gay men getting married. Not gay women. It annoyed her.
Then on the Central line at Bond Street a big poster saying how London stands together against hate. Well, yes, who wouldn't be?
The precise words used in the poster are these -
"London stands together against hate directed at someone on our transport network because of race, religion, sexual orientation, disability or gender identity."
All very lovely. But spot what's missing. "Sex" - a protected characteristic and probably one of the single biggest reasons for attacks on women and girls. The Mayor talks a good game about Violence against Women and Girls but he cannot bring himself to mention sex in this poster. He ignores the fact that it is a "protected characteristic" in law. He is happy to include characteristics which aren't. But something which is - and which is of great concern to women, especially in relation to the risks they face when travelling - is ignored.
Why? Deliberate? Or just forgotten?
These may seem like small matters. But this sort of unconscious overlooking of women, of the female experience is all too common, all too pervasive and, ironically, occurs at a time when diversity is trumpeted loudly by all sorts of people keen to promote their progressive credentials.
I rather feel that the more people talk about diversity the less likely they are to listen to actual women or do anything practical to help them.
One day we might have 29 posters with 22 of them of women, a few men and a token father. A 50/50 representation would be a start. And - imagine - those posters, those choices were all, I expect, signed off by lots of people in numerous meeting and none of those preparing and implementing this campaign noticed what two women at both ends of the age spectrum noticed in minutes while travelling through. Or cared about the message it sends.
Grrr.....
Its deliberate because they're trying to write off sex as something that even exists.
"Gender identity" covers "sex" in his eyes so that's the end of the story.
Do you wear a mask in prior years so you don't pass on the flu, or a cold, or anything else unwittingly? If not, I see absolutely no reason to wear one this year either.
Absolutely no reason? So, you're saying that rates of infectious respiratory disease this year are absolutely the same as in 2019 and before?
They're comparable, yes.
There's Covid this year, but we have vaccines for that, so forget about it.
Yes, they are comparable, in the sense that I can compare the figures now and the figures in 2019 and see the huge friggin' difference. For example:
2019: flu deaths 1213. Last seven days: COVID-19 deaths 1191.
So, in the last week, COVID-19 has killed about the same number as all the deaths from flu in 2019. (And we still have flu this year too.) Looks to me like maybe there is some reason to wear a mask this year compared to in the past.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Yes, I've also heard that theatres offer protection against the spread of COVID.
You had to have evidence of a recent negative test or being double vaccinated to attend.
Or being double vaccinated. So you don't have a problem with people not wearing a mask if they're double jabbed?
And they are surrounded by other people who are double vaccinated. Mask wearing is more about protecting other people in my view.
Oh, so you think people should wear masks to protect the unvaccinated?
Covid is still a risk to public health and I think we can all take small steps to limit its spread while still enjoying normal life as much as possible. Covering your mouth and nose on public transport and in other enclosed spaces seems a sensible precaution that protects those who are most vulnerable. Some of those may be people who can take the vaccine but choose not to. Personally I disapprove of their decision but that doesn't mean I want to risk killing them.
You're not risking killing them, their own choices and the virus are.
The virus is endemic, its going to spread. Whether they catch it today, tomorrow or next year doesn't really matter. What does matter is whether you're vaccinated or not.
NPIs made sense pre-PIs. Not now.
I don't know, that just seems a rather hard-hearted view to take about our fellow human beings. Like I say, I'd rather not be a fatal disease vector if I can avoid it at minimal inconvenience to myself.
You didn't do it for the flu or any other potentially fatal disease until now. What makes COVID so special? As Philip points out, in a world without vaccines I'd agree, now that vaccines are freely available we really do need to learn to live with the virus. For 33 years I was ok with being a vector to any number of flu strains, I was ok with it then and now that COVID has vaccines available I'm ok with that too.
I think Boris has pissed off a lot of his natural supporters with this nonsense about ditching gas boilers. It's madness while China is building more coal fired power stations. Have you noticed how non of the MSM mention the beloved Germany's extensive use of coal?
A sign of the times: there are more players in the present England football squad who have played for Huddersfield Town (3) then for Manchester United (2). They are Coady, Chlwell, and Smith-Rowe.
That should be Chilwell. It is also possible that a former player and a current player could feature soon - Trevor Chalobah and Levi Colwill.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
I agree. I also test twice a week for work. So it's highly unlikely I would infect anyone. But my aversion to inadvertently infecting someone vulnerable is extremely high and I also feel like seeing people wearing masks in those confined spaces may reassure the vulnerable that others are looking out for them and allow them to participate more in society. It doesn't feel like a massive sacrifice either. Also I don't really want to catch Covid myself even though in all likelihood it would be a mild infection. It could disrupt my kids' schooling. And I could get Long Covid. So it makes sense to take small steps to avoid getting it if possible. I don't really know why masks are so totemic for some people.
Masks are fucking horrible. A blight on human life. It's an ominous sign that someone relatively sensible like you just shrugs and accepts them. They must absolutely NOT be normalised, and we have to bin them ASAP if not yesterday
For a start they are really really bad for deaf people, and for autistic people. They are just BAD. Human smiles given and received make daily life sweeter, a billion times a day. Give us back our smiles
I guess I just don't really find them such an imposition. You must have a lot more random people smiling at you than I do if that's the deal breaker for you. PS "relatively sensible"? Thanks, I'll take that. 😉
Leon is right on this, though. Given that smiling and nonverbal feedback is the very heart of human conversation, masks are a huge imposition. And he is also right, of course, that they seriously afflict the lives of the deaf, partially deaf and autistic. I suspect evidence will soon emerge that they affect young children's socialisation too: there is a reason why we have evolved to have faces – and face each other.
I do worry about the deaf. I doubt children will be affected much by not seeing the mouth of random adults on the bus, if primary caregivers at school and home aren't wearing them. Mask wearing on public transport is normal in places like Japan and I am not aware of any long term negative impact on child development.
Japan is hardly a model society. Who knows whether mask wearing has contributed to their current lack of kids. I like to see a girl's face before I start chatting to her, difficult to do if everyone's wearing a bloody mask. I think subconsciously a mask also sends the "this person is closed for business" message, loads of East Asian countries are struggling with low birth rates and record low marriages. Who knows how much not seeing each other's faces has contributed to it?
Mask wearing on public transport causes low birth rates? This is the best post I've read on PB for years. By "best", I mean, "raised the biggest laugh".
No, but when everyone around you is a potential disease carrier how much less likely are you to generally chat to a stranger? We know that East Asian countries suffer massively from a lack of socialising (and ultimately sex). Again, I'm not saying that masks are causing it at all, I'm just not ruling them out as a contributing factor. Masks inherently make everyone around you a potentially deadly hostile, that changes the nature of how we treat each other. Who's to say it isn't a factor in the low birth rate in East Asia?
But I wonder if mask-wearing is actually another symptom of a greater crisis in human interaction, in these countries, rather than a partial cause of it
The most masked-up nations in western Europe are Spain and Italy
Off topic, Daughter and I were out in London last night. Restaurant and theatre packed. A most enjoyable evening and a much-needed break for Daughter. I am worried about the immense strain she is under.
Anyway, on our way into town (separately from some other appointments) we both noticed one thing which annoyed us and will doubtless be dismissed by many on here as hyper-sensitivity. But here goes anyway.
There is a long corridor on the interchange between the Piccadilly and Jubilee lines. On it there are various Pride posters with stories and photos from individuals. All very lovely. No objection to this at all.
There were 29 posters. Only 7 of them were women and one of these was of a mother of a gay person. So only 6 gay women out of 29. 6 women. 22 men.
Why so few women? Why so few gay women? Are their stories not worth telling?
Daughter pointed out that whenever gay marriage is talked about or discussed it is very often accompanied by illustrations of gay men getting married. Not gay women. It annoyed her.
Then on the Central line at Bond Street a big poster saying how London stands together against hate. Well, yes, who wouldn't be?
The precise words used in the poster are these -
"London stands together against hate directed at someone on our transport network because of race, religion, sexual orientation, disability or gender identity."
All very lovely. But spot what's missing. "Sex" - a protected characteristic and probably one of the single biggest reasons for attacks on women and girls. The Mayor talks a good game about Violence against Women and Girls but he cannot bring himself to mention sex in this poster. He ignores the fact that it is a "protected characteristic" in law. He is happy to include characteristics which aren't. But something which is - and which is of great concern to women, especially in relation to the risks they face when travelling - is ignored.
Why? Deliberate? Or just forgotten?
These may seem like small matters. But this sort of unconscious overlooking of women, of the female experience is all too common, all too pervasive and, ironically, occurs at a time when diversity is trumpeted loudly by all sorts of people keen to promote their progressive credentials.
I rather feel that the more people talk about diversity the less likely they are to listen to actual women or do anything practical to help them.
One day we might have 29 posters with 22 of them of women, a few men and a token father. A 50/50 representation would be a start. And - imagine - those posters, those choices were all, I expect, signed off by lots of people in numerous meeting and none of those preparing and implementing this campaign noticed what two women at both ends of the age spectrum noticed in minutes while travelling through. Or cared about the message it sends.
Grrr.....
Its deliberate because they're trying to write off sex as something that even exists.
"Gender identity" covers "sex" in his eyes so that's the end of the story.
Yup, stonewall have redefined homosexuality as same gender attraction as opposed to same sex. Lesbians need to embrace ‘girldick’ or be labelled ‘TERFS’ if they don’t with all that entails.
He knows his base hate masks. I took a train in today, it's notable that people coming in from Bexley, Dartford etc are much less likely to be wearing masks, especially the older white man-spreading type that I would peg as likely Johnson supporters (based on polling cross-tabs). The inner London commuters from solid Labour seats are mostly masked.
Interesting - was around Piccadilly last Saturday. The only people wearing masks indoors (like me), were the older groups (40s and above), and those who were Korean, Chinese & Japanese.
The level of non-compliance on the Tube was extremely high.
I think rush hour compliance is better than weekend which is better than late night, probably reflecting both demographics and degree of overcrowding. Personally I wear a mask indoors most of the time, except where I know there is regular testing in place like at work or eg when I went to the theatre recently, and not at home obvs.
Why do you wear a mask indoors most of the time? Are you not double vaxxed? Or do you have waning immunity?
To protect other people.
Fair enough, but it is highly unlikely you are infectious if you are double jabbed and have no symptoms
I have stopped wearing a mask (tho I might do it again, for personal protection, as I wait for my Booster). We have to get beyond the mentality of fear
I have a silk neck gaiter, which I wear mainly because it looks cool, like I am a war correspondent just back from Kabul, but I slip it over my nose if I am surrounded by the paranoid
Yes, we can be more relaxed with high rates of vaccination. However, but I find this use of language like "mentality of fear" preposterous. I am not fearful when I put on a mask to go round the local supermarket or on the Tube, just as I am not fearful when I wash my hands after handling raw chicken or when I put on a seat belt.
Fear is definitely an accurate description to use for my response to masks. Sometimes it's necessary to live with some fear. And sometimes it isn't.
I've just been Googling "Sadiq Khan" to see what he is actually *doing*
Not much. But a few things. eg He is doing THIS
"Sadiq Khan has unveiled £25,000 grants to help people change street names as part of a diversity campaign launched following Black Lives Matter protests.
"The Mayor of London has announced a £1 million fund that will be shared out among community groups, including those wishing to campaign to alter potentially offensive road names.
"Grants of up to £25,000 will support groups through all aspects of the process of changing street names, which could include enlisting consultants and compensating residents.
"The Untold Stories fund is part of the Commission for Diversity in the Public Realm, which was established following Black Lives Matter protests to diversify artwork and statuary that came under scrutiny for commemorating figures linked to empire and slavery."
Utterly pointless Woke bullshit, which also wastes money. Brilliant
"London mayor Sadiq Khan has urged the government to make face coverings mandatory on public transport as the UK continues to average more than 40,000 confirmed coronavirus cases a day for over a week."
He wants us all to mask up again. That's an inspired and innovative policy. Who saw that coming?
He's just extended the ULEZ zone which at a stroke has stopped me gadding around in my big polluting Merc. Whilst I'm not his greatest fan, eg he comes over to me as a careerist, and as I say he's making me walk everywhere, it has to be noted that much of the more visceral dislike of him is driven by him being Muslim. Not you, of course, but it's undeniably in the mix. Which is disappointing to see.
It is deniably in the mix. He’s just crap.
The only person to bring up his Muslim-ness was the equally crap Zac Goldsmith.
Anyone expecting the PM to set an example on anything is going to be sorely disappointed.
Striking juxta - vax made compulsory for NHS staff, PM refuses mask on NHS ward.
Interesting point made earlier, I see, that maybe he's virtue signalling to his base. Hadn't thought of that but, yes, could be. In which case, more than a touch of Britain Trump, and sad.
Vaccines are massively more important than masks.
Vaccines are good. Masks are not.
Phil, he's in a hospital.
And I've already said since the government's guidance is to wear a mask in healthcare settings he's an arse for not doing so.
But just because of hypocrisy, not because masks are any good. Do you wear a mask in prior years so you don't pass on the flu, or a cold, or anything else unwittingly? If not, I see absolutely no reason to wear one this year either.
But since he's the PM and his government have put out guidance to say you should wear it, he should have worn it. Or dropped the guidance first.
Absolutely.
All those mask-fanatics are telling us that they have never at any point in the past XX years when they have felt a bit dodgy ever gone out in public. Because they sure as hell didn't ever wear a sodding mask.
True, and many went into the office or factory with colds and spread them to their colleagues.
I hope the culture of going to work when poorly and workers being viewed as slacking if they have time off is well and truly at an end.
Forlorn hope. And not just work of course. Anywhere outside. Never happened, no need for it to happen now.
Given MoL is a big full-time job the MP side must have been skimped. Unless of course he worked his tail off dawn to dusk to make sure nothing got neglected. Maybe that's what happened. It's only an almost impossible notion.
As for Cox, people are missing the important point that with his megaphone of a voice - oh god can you remember it during the parliamentary Brexit debates? - he is perfectly capable of talking to his constituents from the Caribbean.
Great point. There’s a guy in our office who’s Just the same.
And I always seem to sit in the same carriage as him when I get the train anywhere.
For me it’s always someone eating crisps or an apple loudly.
Comments
He often makes an exemplary bad example.
Once again, the twitter blue tick wankers and those who live and die by every word they write were wrong. They were wrong on the TCA, they were wrong on the French fishing issues and now they're wrong about the EU readying retaliatory measures out of the scope of the NI protocol. One day, maybe soon, everyone will simply ignore everything they say. In most cases they take a position more extreme and pro-EU than even the commission is willing to take.
"We live in Bury North, the most marginal seat with a 105 vote Tory Majority. We have just received the post, & in the post, is a letter addressed to my wife & myself from Keir Starmer. It makes very good reading when you look at the mess BOJO has gotten this country into. We have never voted Labour in our lives. However, if BOJO keeps spitting in the eyes of the majority & looking after the interests of billionaire Tory donor property developers, then we might just vote for Labour. As pensioners, BOJO's biggest mistake was to ditch the Triple Lock on State pensions. How can we trust anything he says in the future when he trashed a manifesto pledge not to ditch the triple lock? The fact that he ran away yesterday because he couldn't face being attacked in the Commons shows him to be a very weak person."
He’s a bed-blocker.
Yes, that's a fair and crucial point.
Boris really seems to act like he's blind to ordinary vicissitude.
I don't mind if I am an unwitting vector, it happens - and the mask is not minimal inconvenience as far as I'm concerned.
@chriscurtis94
·
3h
But it is also worth putting the latest drop in context. The Tory lead has been falling consistently since the "vaccine bounce" came to an end in May.
Looking at this chart, it seems more like the continuation of a trend rather than a shock in response to this week's news.
https://twitter.com/chriscurtis94/status/1458004661760319489
The longer this goes on the smaller are the chances of a Labour victory (326+). The bookies put this at about 15%. They are wrong. It's closer to 5%.
The centre left voters (the majority) know well that by coalescing they can bring about a centre left government, but they aren't at this time. They are splitting the centre left vote just to please Boris etc and make sure the Tories are in with a real chance (nearly 50%) of winning.
IMHO the reason for not combining around Labour becomes clear the moment (as I did this morning) you listen for three minutes to David Miliband and reflect for 10 seconds on the fact that he lives in New York, while Hilary Benn is on the back benches and a load of faceless nonentities fill the opposition front bench, and someone like Richard Burgon or Angela Rayner will be a candidate for the leadership next time.
Bet accordingly.
So there. True story
Not an action that endears him to me, but I understand black cab drivers are vehemently opposed to any provision for cyclists, so it will have pleased some.
But masks might be involved. If you have a crisis of falling human interactions, adding another barrier to young people copping off is not good. Say a girl has a dazzling smile, which lights up her face, but the young man on the bus never sees it, that means they don't flirt = that's one love affair that never starts, and fewer babies down the line
Get rid of the masks. We want our smiles back
I guess the only masked place of those should/might be a workplace, but you'd know the person beyond the mask so to speak.
He hasn't got the charisma to be a mediocre junior minister. I wonder what he will do next, in that light
A trend doesn't simply happen as a thing in itself.
So either there is some underlying big picture reason for a steady erosion of government popularity - like a decline in living standards, or a struggling NHS - or else the trend is an artefact of a succession of individual events that have each applied a negative force to Tory support - Hancock, NI tax increase, Paterson, etc.
Edit: My guess is that it's more the latter, which is why I ultimately expect the Johnson Ministry to survive these crises and emerge victorious at the next general election.
Female participation in the labour market is high, and an alarming proportion of women lose their jobs in the year after childbirth, so there’s fear of unemployment. Then there’s childcare, which is scarce, due to the cultural reliance on grandparents. The boomer generation of grandparents isn’t always as keen on looking after the child as their own parents were, too. And there’s no child benefit, nor any real tax or other financial advantages from having a child. Italians spoil their children too, particularly boys, which adds to the cost.
From a historical perspective you can make a credible case that family size has tended to vary depending on the balance of economic advantage and disadvantage that children bring. Italy is the extreme example of where it is disadvantageous.
an EU red line is broken and crossed
or a UK red line is ditto
or an RoI is ditto
or an NI is ditto.
Or a unicorn solution is found.
It remains fascinating to watch. The least interesting comments are from people who think there is a clear answer or that the present status quo is somehow written in stone. They are the wrongest of all.
https://twitter.com/joeyfjones/status/1458058365591068672
https://twitter.com/trussliz/status/1458034109201145862
PM’s spokesman at this morning’s press briefing says “MPs’ primary job is and must be to serve their constituents” - a clear rebuke. https://twitter.com/benrileysmith/status/1457994768592613379
Not much. But a few things. eg He is doing THIS
"Sadiq Khan has unveiled £25,000 grants to help people change street names as part of a diversity campaign launched following Black Lives Matter protests.
"The Mayor of London has announced a £1 million fund that will be shared out among community groups, including those wishing to campaign to alter potentially offensive road names.
"Grants of up to £25,000 will support groups through all aspects of the process of changing street names, which could include enlisting consultants and compensating residents.
"The Untold Stories fund is part of the Commission for Diversity in the Public Realm, which was established following Black Lives Matter protests to diversify artwork and statuary that came under scrutiny for commemorating figures linked to empire and slavery."
Utterly pointless Woke bullshit, which also wastes money. Brilliant
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/10/21/black-boy-lane-diversity-drive-sadiq-khan-plans-25000-grants/
And THIS:
"London mayor Sadiq Khan has urged the government to make face coverings mandatory on public transport as the UK continues to average more than 40,000 confirmed coronavirus cases a day for over a week."
He wants us all to mask up again. That's an inspired and innovative policy. Who saw that coming?
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/sadiq-khan-mandatory-face-masks-public-transport-b1947540.html
Gas! GAS! Quick, boys!—An ecstasy of fumbling
Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time,
But someone still was yelling out and stumbling
And flound'ring like a man in fire or lime.—
Dim through the misty panes and thick green light,
As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.
That solution will breach an EU red line ("integrity" of the Single Market), but it will breach it in as limited a manner as possible and be less of a breach than if there were no solution.
Quite frankly we have a zero-tariff deal with the EU anyway. Given that, and given the security concerns, then what is a bit of "integrity" between neighbours?
The alternative - that there's still no deal, and worse there's tariffs - would mean that there'd need to be tariff checks at the border between NI and the Republic. Are the EU going to man those? Are Ireland? Of course not!
Would you rather I lie?
Do you wear a mask 24/7 to prevent being an unwitting vector of cold, or flu or other potentially deadly diseases to others including those you live with? Or are you prepared to take the chance that you may from time to time be an unwitting vector because it happens and is a part of life.
It looks like we will be spared Khan as Labour leader (let alone PM: imagine). He's down with Jess Philips and Rosena Allin-Khan in the next leader betting. Not going to happen
https://www.oddschecker.com/politics/british-politics/next-labour-leader
Yes he was for over a year.
How did that work?
Interesting point made earlier, I see, that maybe he's virtue signalling to his base. Hadn't thought of that but, yes, could be. In which case, more than a touch of Britain Trump, and sad.
Vaccines are good. Masks are not.
This morning however he was guilty of an error and Mishal didn't pick him up on it.
When asked why the PM hadn't apologised he said that he doesn't speak for the PM. When asked about the change of mind he said that he speaks on behalf of the government in saying he regrets it.
Mishal wasn't bad but Humphries would have ripped him a new one over that.
I think it's three factors combining to achieve this.
1) He's performed an amazing piece of triangulation against his core voters. Want less tax and spend? No-one to vote for. Think net zero by 2050 is madness —no one to vote for. Think all the remaining Covid stuff (particularly Test and Trace) needs to go now - no one to vote for. Repeat ad nauseam for almost every issue conservative voters might care about.
Some of his lead is because there is a chunk of the electorate for whom there is no one else to vote. Some of them are still voting Boris on the basis that whilst bad, he's less bad than the (particularly on Brexit, the only area where he's been any good). Others (I'm currently in this position) are merely going to be Don't know/won't vote which halves their effects on the net figures.
2) The Labour Party isn't exactly in love with KS, and is riven with factional infighting. KS comes across as a dull dud on the odd occasion his voice can be heard above the fray, so even naturally lefties aren't rushing to vote for him.
3) A lot of people would take a corrupt buffoon over a meddling busybody. CS Lewis has a great line: "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be “cured” against one’s will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals."
I think this is actually the biggie. Starmer is a worthy type, who wants to tell us how to behave, what to do, what to think. It doesn't matter how corrupt and unpleasant the alternative - that sort of leader is always worse.
The man to watch here is Farage. He's started making noises off about a referendum on Net Zero by 2050 and all that this entails. He's entirely right of course - it's another cosy establishment stich up about which the voters never got asked. It's hard for him without the EU elections as a platform for a free hit at the government, but it's possible he'll succeed in doing exactly what he did over the EU, and threaten the Tory vote enough to force them to abandon their current triangulation. I can't see that happening with Carrie Antonette in No10, so it may be fun to see which way Boris jumps.
Or maybe the girl on the bus just wants to read her book and get to work, without being bothered by this young man. If she wants a date, she'll use Bumble.
But just because of hypocrisy, not because masks are any good. Do you wear a mask in prior years so you don't pass on the flu, or a cold, or anything else unwittingly? If not, I see absolutely no reason to wear one this year either.
But since he's the PM and his government have put out guidance to say you should wear it, he should have worn it. Or dropped the guidance first.
As for Cox, people are missing the important point that with his megaphone of a voice - oh god can you remember it during the parliamentary Brexit debates? - he is perfectly capable of talking to his constituents from the Caribbean.
All those mask-fanatics are telling us that they have never at any point in the past XX years when they have felt a bit dodgy ever gone out in public. Because they sure as hell didn't ever wear a sodding mask.
In llama-land there's a one-man band
And he'll toot his flute for you
There's Covid this year, but we have vaccines for that, so forget about it.
...
They took their masks off!!
Yeah. Needs work.
"Mes chers compatriotes,
Je vous donne rendez-vous ici à 20h."
https://twitter.com/EmmanuelMacron/status/1458065667022901249?s=20
-He campaigned for free meals extension
-Cabinet ministers Gavin Williamson and Matt Hancock opposed him
-Funny how things work out https://twitter.com/paul__johnson/status/1458067062266507271/photo/1
Varadkar has just told RTE that "Brexit is kind of done but this [art16] potentially undoes it"
Had a meeting yesterday on contingency preparations
https://twitter.com/lisaocarroll/status/1458067282920361987
If we do trigger it, then it will lead to the UK unilaterally rewriting the Protocol and setting "the facts on the ground" in a way that suits the UK best. Since the EU will have no realistic way of forcing the UK to back down, they'll have little choice but to accept those new facts on the ground as the new reality, which is why they may as well negotiate now rather than hand the UK complete unilateral control.
Anyway, on our way into town (separately from some other appointments) we both noticed one thing which annoyed us and will doubtless be dismissed by many on here as hyper-sensitivity. But here goes anyway.
There is a long corridor on the interchange between the Piccadilly and Jubilee lines. On it there are various Pride posters with stories and photos from individuals. All very lovely. No objection to this at all.
There were 29 posters. Only 7 of them were women and one of these was of a mother of a gay person. So only 6 gay women out of 29. 6 women. 22 men.
Why so few women? Why so few gay women? Are their stories not worth telling?
Daughter pointed out that whenever gay marriage is talked about or discussed it is very often accompanied by illustrations of gay men getting married. Not gay women. It annoyed her.
Then on the Central line at Bond Street a big poster saying how London stands together against hate. Well, yes, who wouldn't be?
The precise words used in the poster are these -
"London stands together against hate directed at someone on our transport network because of race, religion, sexual orientation, disability or gender identity."
All very lovely. But spot what's missing. "Sex" - a protected characteristic and probably one of the single biggest reasons for attacks on women and girls. The Mayor talks a good game about Violence against Women and Girls but he cannot bring himself to mention sex in this poster. He ignores the fact that it is a "protected characteristic" in law. He is happy to include characteristics which aren't. But something which is - and which is of great concern to women, especially in relation to the risks they face when travelling - is ignored.
Why? Deliberate? Or just forgotten?
These may seem like small matters. But this sort of unconscious overlooking of women, of the female experience is all too common, all too pervasive and, ironically, occurs at a time when diversity is trumpeted loudly by all sorts of people keen to promote their progressive credentials.
I rather feel that the more people talk about diversity the less likely they are to listen to actual women or do anything practical to help them.
One day we might have 29 posters with 22 of them of women, a few men and a token father. A 50/50 representation would be a start. And - imagine - those posters, those choices were all, I expect, signed off by lots of people in numerous meeting and none of those preparing and implementing this campaign noticed what two women at both ends of the age spectrum noticed in minutes while travelling through. Or cared about the message it sends.
Grrr.....
I hope the culture of going to work when poorly and workers being viewed as slacking if they have time off is well and truly at an end.
"Gender identity" covers "sex" in his eyes so that's the end of the story.
2019: flu deaths 1213.
Last seven days: COVID-19 deaths 1191.
So, in the last week, COVID-19 has killed about the same number as all the deaths from flu in 2019. (And we still have flu this year too.) Looks to me like maybe there is some reason to wear a mask this year compared to in the past.
Singapore, Hong Kong, China, Japan, Taiwan, South Korea
Now look at the ten countries with the lowest birth rates (ignoring micronations)
Japan, South Korea, Singapore, Taiwan are all in the bottom 10
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/birth-rate-by-country
But I wonder if mask-wearing is actually another symptom of a greater crisis in human interaction, in these countries, rather than a partial cause of it
The most masked-up nations in western Europe are Spain and Italy
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1114375/wearing-a-face-mask-outside-in-european-countries/
They too have terrible birth rates...
He’s just crap.
The only person to bring up his Muslim-ness was the equally crap Zac Goldsmith.