Undefined discussion subject.

Options
2456

Comments

  • MikeK
    MikeK Posts: 9,053
    Charles said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    antifrank said:

    NickPalmer said:

    edmundintokyo said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    I think Mr Herdson neglects the polling on the views of England on an SNP-propped up government...

    What does the polling say specifically that David Herdson is missing? Is there some polling the validates some argument like, "Don't vote Labour, because they'll have to rely on the SNP if not enough people vote for them"?
    Yes, David is making the point that Ashcroft found in polls - potential Labour supporters don't see that not voting Labour is going to reduce the risk, if it's a risk.

    The Sturgeon story with its heated denials is going to be obscure to most people, and I doubt if it will have much effect in England, but it feeds the sense of unease that Labour in Scotland is trying to encourage about the effect of replacing lots of Labour MPs with lots of Nationalists. Sturgeon will clearly see it as unhelpful, and tactically it's a mistake for the Tory press to go big on it if their primary motive is to prevent a Labour Government.

    It's not aimed at potential Labour voters. It's aimed at potential UKIP voters. And so far it's been far more effective than I expected.
    Don't understand that at all, and what on earth is your metric for effectiveness on potential kippers?
    The argument is that Kippers will be more concerned about a Lab-SNP pact than Labour voters and that it might be sufficient to tip them back into the Tory camp.

    I think I've seen some polling suggesting that Kippers were most worried about the SNP having significant influence over the next government than anyone else?
    Sorry Charles, no we're not!
  • MarkSenior
    MarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    nigel4england said:

    MarkSenior said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    MarkSenior said:

    Monksfield said:

    Roger said:

    Carlotta

    "Meanwhile the Mail explores Labour Hobbit Hypocrisy:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3025156/Red-Ed-s-hypocrite-Hobbit-tax-avoider-know-double-standards-champagne-socialists-investigation-shows-Labour-s-new-celebrity-poster-boy-really-takes-biscuit.html"

    Extraordinary story by the Mail. They have just repeated their story of last week but made the headlines more lurid adding that Freeman is a tax avoider which the article doesn't back up. I really can't imagine why he isn't suing them. There is something ugly about Tory cheerleaders.

    Dacre needs to take a long hard look at himself. The Mail is rapidly drowning in a torrent of its own bile.
    The paper that has supported fascism for over 80 years , Dacre is just following that tradition .
    I thought your beef about them was that they pointed out (correctly) that Cyril Smith was an active paedophile. Is that a fascist position?

    Clearly Cyril Smith is dead and cannot sue you otherwise a coward like you would not have dared to post that .
    David Icke posted things like that for years and he didn't get sued, he out Saville as a necrophiliac a long time before he died, and outed Smith on several occasions.

    To be honest I find your post absolutely disgusting.
    You are entitled to your opinion , just as I am . IMHO anyone who quotes David Icke in a positive way is in need of a brain transplant .
  • timmo
    timmo Posts: 1,469
    Dair said:

    MarkSenior said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    MarkSenior said:

    Monksfield said:

    Roger said:

    Carlotta

    "Meanwhile the Mail explores Labour Hobbit Hypocrisy:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3025156/Red-Ed-s-hypocrite-Hobbit-tax-avoider-know-double-standards-champagne-socialists-investigation-shows-Labour-s-new-celebrity-poster-boy-really-takes-biscuit.html"

    Extraordinary story by the Mail. They have just repeated their story of last week but made the headlines more lurid adding that Freeman is a tax avoider which the article doesn't back up. I really can't imagine why he isn't suing them. There is something ugly about Tory cheerleaders.

    Dacre needs to take a long hard look at himself. The Mail is rapidly drowning in a torrent of its own bile.
    The paper that has supported fascism for over 80 years , Dacre is just following that tradition .
    I thought your beef about them was that they pointed out (correctly) that Cyril Smith was an active paedophile. Is that a fascist position?

    Clearly Cyril Smith is dead and cannot sue you otherwise a coward like you would not have dared to post that .
    You're really a Cyril Smith defender?

    A Cyril Smith defender exists?

    Wonders never cease.
    No he's a LibDem defender at all costs....
  • Indigo
    Indigo Posts: 9,966
    Monksfield said:

    Roger said:

    Carlotta

    "Meanwhile the Mail explores Labour Hobbit Hypocrisy:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3025156/Red-Ed-s-hypocrite-Hobbit-tax-avoider-know-double-standards-champagne-socialists-investigation-shows-Labour-s-new-celebrity-poster-boy-really-takes-biscuit.html"

    Extraordinary story by the Mail. They have just repeated their story of last week but made the headlines more lurid adding that Freeman is a tax avoider which the article doesn't back up. I really can't imagine why he isn't suing them. There is something ugly about Tory cheerleaders.

    Dacre needs to take a long hard look at himself. The Mail is rapidly drowning in a torrent of its own bile.
    I think its more likely he will take a look at his 10m views and his share holders will tell him to carry on with what he is going. I guess he could trying sanctimony and self-righteousness, but then he might have 170k readers like The Guardian, who knows, he might even have to set up a trust in a tax haven to stay in business.
  • nigel4england
    nigel4england Posts: 4,800
    MarkSenior said:

    nigel4england said:

    MarkSenior said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    MarkSenior said:

    Monksfield said:

    Roger said:

    Carlotta

    "Meanwhile the Mail explores Labour Hobbit Hypocrisy:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3025156/Red-Ed-s-hypocrite-Hobbit-tax-avoider-know-double-standards-champagne-socialists-investigation-shows-Labour-s-new-celebrity-poster-boy-really-takes-biscuit.html"

    Extraordinary story by the Mail. They have just repeated their story of last week but made the headlines more lurid adding that Freeman is a tax avoider which the article doesn't back up. I really can't imagine why he isn't suing them. There is something ugly about Tory cheerleaders.

    Dacre needs to take a long hard look at himself. The Mail is rapidly drowning in a torrent of its own bile.
    The paper that has supported fascism for over 80 years , Dacre is just following that tradition .
    I thought your beef about them was that they pointed out (correctly) that Cyril Smith was an active paedophile. Is that a fascist position?

    Clearly Cyril Smith is dead and cannot sue you otherwise a coward like you would not have dared to post that .
    David Icke posted things like that for years and he didn't get sued, he out Saville as a necrophiliac a long time before he died, and outed Smith on several occasions.

    To be honest I find your post absolutely disgusting.
    You are entitled to your opinion , just as I am . IMHO anyone who quotes David Icke in a positive way is in need of a brain transplant .
    Even though he was proved right over Savile?

    The bloke is a complete loon I agree but you cannot deny he was right over Saville.
  • Roger
    Roger Posts: 20,744
    Izzy

    "I thought your beef about them was that they pointed out (correctly) that Cyril Smith was an active paedophile. Is that a fascist position?"

    No this is.....


    http://www.undo.net/Pressrelease/foto/1279196011b.jpg
  • Dair
    Dair Posts: 6,108
    Sky News seems to have abandoned any attempt at impartiality in their reporting of #FrenchGate.
  • bigjohnowls
    bigjohnowls Posts: 22,951
    edited April 2015
    JackW said:

    BREAKING WIND NEWS **** BREAKING WIND NEWS **** BREAKING WIND NEWS ****

    The breaking news is that WIND is reporting to the JNN the contents of the latest ARSE with added APLOMB 2015 General Election and "JackW Dozen" Projections. (Changes From 31st March Projection) :

    Con 313 (-3) .. Lab 244 (+2) .. LibDem 30 (NC) .. SNP 36 (NC) .. PC 2 .. NI 18 .. UKIP 4 (+1) .. Respect 1 .. Green 1 .. Ind 0 .. Speaker 1

    Conservatives 13 seats short of a majority
    ......................................................................................

    >blockquote>

    TODAYS FIRST ADDED BJESUS

    4.4.15 LAB 292 (292) CON 271(272) LD 30(30) UKIP 2(2) Others 55(54) (Ed is crap is PM)
    ADDED BJESUS (Additional Debate Driven Election Drilldown Big John Electoral
    Services Uniform Swing)

  • chestnut
    chestnut Posts: 7,341
    edited April 2015
    On topic, The Tories have hit 36-37 with ICM, Comres (phone), Yougov and Opinium at some point in the last month or so, as well as Ashcroft who is supposed to be using Populus Phone Poll methodology.

    So job half done, according to most of those with a GE track record.

    The risk to Labour comes in the Opposition Debate. If, by some small miracle Caroline Lucas replaces Natalie Bennett, Labour could very quickly end up down at 30.

    Miliband v Farage, Lucas, Sturgeon.

    Bennett is Miliband's saviour.
  • RobD
    RobD Posts: 60,608
    Dair said:

    Sky News seems to have abandoned any attempt at impartiality in their reporting of #FrenchGate.

    Need to send the SNP in to sort them out.
  • Pulpstar
    Pulpstar Posts: 79,813
    edited April 2015
    noisywinter said:

    I'm looking for good constituency bets on the Tories to partially hedge my massive position on Labour most seats. I just keep laying and laying the Tories and its getting a bit big!

    Any ideas where Tories odds look good value?

    Also anyone checked the implied seats totals from bookies odds recently?

    I'm assuming backing the Tories in individual seats with Labour most seats is the best approach- hopefully this disparity still exists!

    Warwick and Leamington @ 8-15
    Nuneaton 11-8
  • FalseFlag
    FalseFlag Posts: 1,801
    MarkSenior said:

    Monksfield said:

    Roger said:

    Carlotta

    "Meanwhile the Mail explores Labour Hobbit Hypocrisy:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3025156/Red-Ed-s-hypocrite-Hobbit-tax-avoider-know-double-standards-champagne-socialists-investigation-shows-Labour-s-new-celebrity-poster-boy-really-takes-biscuit.html"

    Extraordinary story by the Mail. They have just repeated their story of last week but made the headlines more lurid adding that Freeman is a tax avoider which the article doesn't back up. I really can't imagine why he isn't suing them. There is something ugly about Tory cheerleaders.

    Dacre needs to take a long hard look at himself. The Mail is rapidly drowning in a torrent of its own bile.
    The paper that has supported fascism for over 80 years , Dacre is just following that tradition .
    Given that in the thirties the body count of facism was in thousands and the communists in the millions it would have been an entirely rational and morally defensible position to support the significantly lesser of two evils.
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,458
    chestnut said:

    On topic, The Tories have hit 36-37 with ICM, Comres (phone), Yougov and Opinium at some point in the last month or so, as well as Ashcroft who is supposed to be using Populus Phone Poll methodology.

    So job half done, according to most of those with a GE track record.

    The risk to Labour comes in the Opposition Debate. If, by some small miracle Caroline Lucas replaces Natalie Bennett, Labour could very quickly end up down at 30.

    Miliband v Farage, Lucas, Sturgeon.

    Bennett is Miliband's saviour.

    If Lucas gets subbed for Bennett, what chance Salmond gets subbed for Sturgeon? That would be a really painful night for Ed....

  • Roger
    Roger Posts: 20,744
    Dair

    "Sky News seems to have abandoned any attempt at impartiality in their reporting of ....gate"

    In favour of whom?
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    Mr. Dair, FrenchGate?
  • Pulpstar
    Pulpstar Posts: 79,813
    Indigo said:

    Monksfield said:

    Roger said:

    Carlotta

    "Meanwhile the Mail explores Labour Hobbit Hypocrisy:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3025156/Red-Ed-s-hypocrite-Hobbit-tax-avoider-know-double-standards-champagne-socialists-investigation-shows-Labour-s-new-celebrity-poster-boy-really-takes-biscuit.html"

    Extraordinary story by the Mail. They have just repeated their story of last week but made the headlines more lurid adding that Freeman is a tax avoider which the article doesn't back up. I really can't imagine why he isn't suing them. There is something ugly about Tory cheerleaders.

    Dacre needs to take a long hard look at himself. The Mail is rapidly drowning in a torrent of its own bile.
    I think its more likely he will take a look at his 10m views and his share holders will tell him to carry on with what he is going. I guess he could trying sanctimony and self-righteousness, but then he might have 170k readers like The Guardian, who knows, he might even have to set up a trust in a tax haven to stay in business.
    I enjoy the Mail online, though Adblock makes it even better.
  • Indigo
    Indigo Posts: 9,966
    I doubt this will be the first time a bit of political difficulty has been caused by a "French letter"...

    I'll get my coat!
  • Charles
    Charles Posts: 35,758
    CD13 said:


    Could someone explain Ed's new wheeze to use the first time buyers ISA money to increase house building, please?

    Loads of £40k houses from free money? A magic house tree?

    Is this a sort of nationalisation of the societies?

    This is from the Beeb

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-32176740

    Under its plan, any bank or building society that offered such an ISA would be required to invest the money in housing.

    This would unlock £5bn to invest in a Future Homes Investment Fund to build 125,000 new homes between 2015 and 2020, according to Mr Miliband, and a Labour government would underwrite the investment.

    Of course it all depends on the terms of the investment, but fundamentally banks should not be in the business of making principal investments with depositors' money.

    I suspect, though, that Miliband is just expecting them to stick a chunk of money into a fund to let him spend it.

    The net result - of course - is that no banks will offer this kind of ISA because the strings make it fundamentally unattractive business for them (cash ISAs simply aren't that profitable)

    Hence Miliband's expected source of funds disappears in a puff of smoke. Net result is either his pledge can't be met, or he has to meet it by additional borrowing over his baseline

    This neatly highlights my big concern about Miliband: it's all these nice sounding wheezes that don't event pass the first review without being found out. I can only see two options:

    1. He doesn't realise they won't work - i.e. he is incompetent
    2. He doesn't care they won't work provided they win him the election - i.e. he is disingenuous

    Is there a third option? Because I don't want a incompetent or a liar as a PM.
  • Dair
    Dair Posts: 6,108
    Morris_Dancer said:

    Mr. Dair, FrenchGate?

    I'd call it #TelegraphLiesGate but I suspect that's a hashtag that gets very regular use.
  • bigjohnowls
    bigjohnowls Posts: 22,951
    Morris_Dancer said:

    Mr. Dair, FrenchGate?

    Telegraph front page where Nicola secretly wants Dave to win
  • Scott_P
    Scott_P Posts: 51,453
    Dair said:

    I'd call it #TelegraphLiesGate but I suspect that's a hashtag that gets very regular use.

    The hashtag of choice is #nikileaks
  • Charles
    Charles Posts: 35,758
    Dair said:

    MarkSenior said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    MarkSenior said:

    Monksfield said:

    Roger said:

    Carlotta

    "Meanwhile the Mail explores Labour Hobbit Hypocrisy:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3025156/Red-Ed-s-hypocrite-Hobbit-tax-avoider-know-double-standards-champagne-socialists-investigation-shows-Labour-s-new-celebrity-poster-boy-really-takes-biscuit.html"

    Extraordinary story by the Mail. They have just repeated their story of last week but made the headlines more lurid adding that Freeman is a tax avoider which the article doesn't back up. I really can't imagine why he isn't suing them. There is something ugly about Tory cheerleaders.

    Dacre needs to take a long hard look at himself. The Mail is rapidly drowning in a torrent of its own bile.
    The paper that has supported fascism for over 80 years , Dacre is just following that tradition .
    I thought your beef about them was that they pointed out (correctly) that Cyril Smith was an active paedophile. Is that a fascist position?

    Clearly Cyril Smith is dead and cannot sue you otherwise a coward like you would not have dared to post that .
    You're really a Cyril Smith defender?

    A Cyril Smith defender exists?

    Wonders never cease.
    Mark will always defend against what he perceives as an attack on the LibDems and its predecessors.

    Whether it's defensible or not.

    He's a true tribalist
  • bigjohnowls
    bigjohnowls Posts: 22,951
    Sun Politics ‏@SunPolitics 10h10 hours ago
    Nicola Sturgeon ‘secretly backs Cameron in private phone conversation’ http://sunpl.us/6013N4IW

    With the French Ambassador Mr Dancer
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,458
    edited April 2015
    I see Jack's ARSE is impervious to any wonders being worked upon it by Nicola....

    A mere 36 seats would be a disaster from where the SNP currently look to be, which is wielding a Claymore above their heads atop Ben Nevis.
  • Roger
    Roger Posts: 20,744
    edited April 2015
    Chestnut

    "On topic, The Tories have hit 36-37 with ICM, Comres (phone), Yougov and Opinium at some point in the last month or so, as well as Ashcroft who is supposed to be using Populus Phone Poll methodology.

    So job half done, according to most of those with a GE track record.

    The risk to Labour comes in the Opposition Debate. If, by some small miracle Caroline Lucas replaces Natalie Bennett, Labour could very quickly end up down at 30."

    I remember when you first started posting and you appeared to be a new PB psephologist who are always the most worthwhile reads on here. But since then you've revealed yourself as just another Tory cheerleading fruitcake of which there are already far too many
  • Scott_P
    Scott_P Posts: 51,453
    Charles said:


    Under its plan, any bank or building society that offered such an ISA would be required to invest the money in housing.

    Apparently the shadow housing minister has just contradicted this on air

    @CCHQPress: Y'day @Ed_Miliband claimed he'd "force" banks to invest in Labour's housing scheme - @EmmaReynoldsMP today admits optional for banks #chaos

    @CCHQPress: Today will be @EmmaReynoldsMP's one and only TV appearance of the campaign
  • Sean_F
    Sean_F Posts: 39,132
    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    antifrank said:

    NickPalmer said:

    edmundintokyo said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    I think Mr Herdson neglects the polling on the views of England on an SNP-propped up government...

    What does the polling say specifically that David Herdson is missing? Is there some polling the validates some argument like, "Don't vote Labour, because they'll have to rely on the SNP if not enough people vote for them"?
    Yes, David is making the point that Ashcroft found in polls - potential Labour supporters don't see that not voting Labour is going to reduce the risk, if it's a risk.

    The Sturgeon story with its heated denials is going to be obscure to most people, and I doubt if it will have much effect in England, but it feeds the sense of unease that Labour in Scotland is trying to encourage about the effect of replacing lots of Labour MPs with lots of Nationalists. Sturgeon will clearly see it as unhelpful, and tactically it's a mistake for the Tory press to go big on it if their primary motive is to prevent a Labour Government.

    It's not aimed at potential Labour voters. It's aimed at potential UKIP voters. And so far it's been far more effective than I expected.
    Don't understand that at all, and what on earth is your metric for effectiveness on potential kippers?
    There is a cohort of voters who aren't warm on the current Conservative leadership who have been thinking about voting for UKIP. This group responds particularly virulently to the idea of Scotland being given more money. The idea of a Labour/SNP alliance fills them with loathing.

    Anecdotally I have had several such voters raise this spontaneously with me. And in the polls UKIP recently have been drifting down a bit while the Conservatives have been climbing a bit. Correlation does not equal causation, I accept.
    You're correct. Among my friends and acquaintances are plenty who dislike Cameron, would happily vote UKIP in secondary elections, but will vote Conservative to keep out Labour/SNP.
  • Millsy
    Millsy Posts: 900
    You gotta love Labour's method of campaigning, where the short hand they can give to journalists and voters is far removed from the actual policy.

    "We will spend £5bn on new houses" - translation: using money from the Tory Help to Buy ISA we will ask the banks very nicely if this could perhaps be spent on building houses

    "We will balance the books" - translation: the current account will be balanced, but this will happen anyway by the end of the parliament thanks to a growing economy, and billions will continue to be borrowed for "investment"

    "We will increase the minimum wage" - translation: it will go up slower than inflation and we don't have direct control over the NMW anyway so can't promise any more than this sorry

    "We will end zero hours contracts" - translation: sorry the government got there first on this and banned exclusive contracts so we are left with merely mentioning the evil zero hours contracts at every opportunity and will do other small things that people won't take up anyway
  • Charles
    Charles Posts: 35,758
    MikeK said:

    Charles said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    antifrank said:

    NickPalmer said:

    edmundintokyo said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    I think Mr Herdson neglects the polling on the views of England on an SNP-propped up government...

    What does the polling say specifically that David Herdson is missing? Is there some polling the validates some argument like, "Don't vote Labour, because they'll have to rely on the SNP if not enough people vote for them"?
    Yes, David is making the point that Ashcroft found in polls - potential Labour supporters don't see that not voting Labour is going to reduce the risk, if it's a risk.

    The Sturgeon story with its heated denials is going to be obscure to most people, and I doubt if it will have much effect in England, but it feeds the sense of unease that Labour in Scotland is trying to encourage about the effect of replacing lots of Labour MPs with lots of Nationalists. Sturgeon will clearly see it as unhelpful, and tactically it's a mistake for the Tory press to go big on it if their primary motive is to prevent a Labour Government.

    It's not aimed at potential Labour voters. It's aimed at potential UKIP voters. And so far it's been far more effective than I expected.
    Don't understand that at all, and what on earth is your metric for effectiveness on potential kippers?
    The argument is that Kippers will be more concerned about a Lab-SNP pact than Labour voters and that it might be sufficient to tip them back into the Tory camp.

    I think I've seen some polling suggesting that Kippers were most worried about the SNP having significant influence over the next government than anyone else?
    Sorry Charles, no we're not!
    You may not be, but then you are one of the 21% of UKIP voters who are okay with it. 75% are opposed. (The Tories are 12% ok, 86% opposed, Labour 44% ok, 51% opposed)

    Q4

    lordashcroftpolls.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/ANP-summary-150309X1.pdf

  • Artist
    Artist Posts: 1,893
    edited April 2015
    noisywinter said:

    Mike (or anyone)- what do you think of the Tory prospects of holding Bedford if you dont mind me asking?

    2/1 with Lad's

    I wouldn't touch that with a ten foot barge pole.

    Pudsey, Worcester, Gloucester and Kingswood are seats where the Tories could just hang on.
  • SquareRoot
    SquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    What did we actually learn from the debate that we did not know already? Frankly I think the answer is a sweet fat zero. Anoraks might pick over this or that, but I doubt it has made much difference. I should think a lot of the audience switched off long before the second half. It was a as dull as ditch water.
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,458
    Indigo said:

    I doubt this will be the first time a bit of political difficulty has been caused by a "French letter"...

    I'll get my coat!

    Or in this case, the lack of a French letter.
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    Mr. Owls, that seems quite an odd thing for her to say. Over the telephone. To a Frenchman.

    I'm sure she might prefer a Conservative Government, but I'd be surprised if she said as such, in that way, to that diplomat.
  • SquareRoot
    SquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    Roger said:

    Chestnut

    "On topic, The Tories have hit 36-37 with ICM, Comres (phone), Yougov and Opinium at some point in the last month or so, as well as Ashcroft who is supposed to be using Populus Phone Poll methodology.

    So job half done, according to most of those with a GE track record.

    The risk to Labour comes in the Opposition Debate. If, by some small miracle Caroline Lucas replaces Natalie Bennett, Labour could very quickly end up down at 30."

    I remember when you first started posting and you appeared to be a new PB psephologist who are always the most worthwhile reads on here. But since then you've revealed yourself as just another Tory cheerleading fruitcake of which there are already far too many

    Look in your own eye first .
  • Dair
    Dair Posts: 6,108
    edited April 2015
    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.
  • Charles
    Charles Posts: 35,758
    Scott_P said:

    Charles said:


    Under its plan, any bank or building society that offered such an ISA would be required to invest the money in housing.

    Apparently the shadow housing minister has just contradicted this on air

    @CCHQPress: Y'day @Ed_Miliband claimed he'd "force" banks to invest in Labour's housing scheme - @EmmaReynoldsMP today admits optional for banks #chaos

    @CCHQPress: Today will be @EmmaReynoldsMP's one and only TV appearance of the campaign
    May be she didn't know about the policy before yesterday?
  • dr_spyn
    dr_spyn Posts: 11,312
    Cameron announces boost to skills in IT industry....controls on access to porn or naked photos of young women.

  • Scott_P
    Scott_P Posts: 51,453
    Charles said:

    May be she didn't know about the policy before yesterday?

    I think that is indeed likely to be the case...
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    edited April 2015
    Mr. Dair, wouldn't that imply the story's true?

    That said, civil servants not being neutral is not news. Wasn't Damian McBride technically a civil servant?

    Mr. P, sounds like Miliband thinks he's sufficiently buggered up energy, and is now looking for a new sector to damage.

    Edited extra bit: Dr. Spyn, I can see why that will make the Mail cheer, but how is it to work?

    I do think Cameron needs to be slapped around the head and neck with a large haddock until the vaguest notion of how the bloody internet works is beaten into him.
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,458
    Morris_Dancer said:

    Mr. Owls, that seems quite an odd thing for her to say. Over the telephone. To a Frenchman.

    I'm sure she might prefer a Conservative Government, but I'd be surprised if she said as such, in that way, to that diplomat.

    On the other hand, it is a bit of a perfect storm of prejudice - to have no legs this story assumes both a Scot and French diplomat are not lying.... What are the odds of that?

  • Scott_P
    Scott_P Posts: 51,453
    @SkyNewsBreak: Labour leader Ed #Miliband says the claims that Nicola #Sturgeon secretly backs David Cameron as Prime Minister are "damning revelations"
  • Charles
    Charles Posts: 35,758
    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
  • TGOHF
    TGOHF Posts: 21,633
    edited April 2015
    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    Story still the leading the Telegraph website - I guess Nicolas writs are en route ? Or it's true.
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    I see a guy on death row for 30 years was freed recently, and it wasn't even something like new DNA testing techniques which was behind it. Poor bugger.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-32178121
  • TGOHF
    TGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
    He hasn't denied that she said Ed wasn't up to being PM. A non denial.
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,458
    Scott_P said:

    @SkyNewsBreak: Labour leader Ed #Miliband says the claims that Nicola #Sturgeon secretly backs David Cameron as Prime Minister are "damning revelations"

    Scott_P said:

    @SkyNewsBreak: Labour leader Ed #Miliband says the claims that Nicola #Sturgeon secretly backs David Cameron as Prime Minister are "damning revelations"

    Well that's just ensured Ed a nice easy ride from Nicola in the next debate....

    Hur hur hur.... Has anybody actually briefed Ed about this story?
  • Charles
    Charles Posts: 35,758
    TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
    He hasn't denied that she said Ed wasn't up to being PM. A non denial.
    No: it's perfectly possible in the world of Scottish politics to think that Ed isn't up to the job but still prefer him to Cameron
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    Mr. kle4, saw that on the news last night. It was a disgraceful travesty of justice.

    As well as his unjust imprisonment for 30 years, the families of the victims now have far less chance of the killer(s) being captured because so much time has elapsed.
  • bigjohnowls
    bigjohnowls Posts: 22,951
    Nicola has to be interviewed between now and 7/5/15.

    She needs to tell what she actually said or it will haunt the SNP campaign.
  • dr_spyn
    dr_spyn Posts: 11,312
    @TGOHF

    French Ambassadress:: Her Excellency Sylvie BERMANN

    Looks very much a woman.

    http://www.ambafrance-uk.org/Biography-23568

  • Sandpit
    Sandpit Posts: 56,045
    DecrepitJohnL said:

    Sandpit said:

    DecrepitJohnL said:

    Sandpit said:

    DecrepitJohnL said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    This is all tremendous fun but how many votes will it shift? The paradox is the right is attacking Hobbit for doing things they approve of anyway.
    Nope - he is being attacked for being another luvvie hypocrite, trying to tell us how to behave yet doing things very differently for himself.
    And how many votes will it shift? How many voters will switch from Labour because Hobbit does these things, and vote instead for a party which approves of those things being done? It's the politics of the playground. What next? Vote Plaid because William Hague learnt Welsh?
    It's the same as Miliband saying that he knows how the ordinary man is feeling, from his two-kitchened house in North London. Look at Scotland to see the damage that is doing to Labour.

    The party of the working class have stopped looking and sounding like the voice of the working man, instead being the same PPE clones as the Tories they claim to despise, caring themselves more about attracting the support of tax-avoiding luvvies that the white van man - who is fed up with being sneered at and moving his support to Con or more likely UKIP.

    It also plays into the more general narrative that Labour have gone into the campaign with no planning at all, their election strategy seems to be shouting over and over again that Tories eat babies and hoping that this is enough to see them just over the line.

    Their researchers seemed to have switched off their internet connections while assembling their letter the other day. Any researcher not star-struck would have spotted that Freeman was perhaps not the best guy to lead their opening day campaign. Who next, Jimmy Carr?
    And are you sure Jimmy Carr supports Labour? I'm not. But leave that to one side.

    All those criticisms of Labour, and its campaign may well be true, and have been made here previously. The question remains, how do the Conservatives gain from this, given they support it?
    I think this election is almost unique in living memory as being about much more than just the top two parties. Anecdotal evidence suggests that there's little direct exchange of votes between the top two.

    Any shift toward the Tories will be either a vote for NOTA (UKIP?) or not bothering to vote at all - in the marginals (esp. Midlands and North) this may be enough to swing the election one way or the other, it may even come down to the weather on the day.
  • MonikerDiCanio
    MonikerDiCanio Posts: 5,792
    edited April 2015
    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    Rue du Jour.
  • Scott_P
    Scott_P Posts: 51,453
    @faisalislam: .during indyref Salmond repeatedly cited 1 totally denied single anonymous sourced Guardian report on currency union in his arguments favour
  • Dair
    Dair Posts: 6,108
    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
    Nicola says it's false.
    French Ambassador says it's false.
    French Consul General says it's false.
    Scottish Government Minutes say it's false.
    Telegraph Source - Third Hand UK Government Minutes say it's probably false.

    Even the Huff Post comments section which usually tears strips out the SNP is full of castigation of The Telegraph. It seems clear that this isn't going to hurt Sturgeon now but it could have very bad consequences for The Telegraph, The Civil Service and whichever political party this ends up being linked to.
  • saddened
    saddened Posts: 2,245
    Scott_P said:

    @SkyNewsBreak: Labour leader Ed #Miliband says the claims that Nicola #Sturgeon secretly backs David Cameron as Prime Minister are "damning revelations"

    The confirmation that sturgeon thinks Ed is incompetent, rather than the suspicion she thinks he's incompetent, is a damming revelation? Not so sure it is.
  • bigjohnowls
    bigjohnowls Posts: 22,951
    The narrative that SNP want Tories in power growing on Sky News

    Sell SNP seats Pulpstar!
  • Yorkcity
    Yorkcity Posts: 4,382
    The SNP obviously want a Conservative government, hardly a shock in that.

    As it opens a quick route to another referendum on Scottish Independence, through the constitutional arguments of the next two years over an in out referendum on the EU
  • TGOHF
    TGOHF Posts: 21,633
    edited April 2015
    bigjohnowls said:

    Nicola has to be interviewed between now and 7/5/15.

    She needs to tell what she actually said or it will haunt the SNP campaign.

    She said Ed wasnt up to being PM - for once she's in the majority.
  • CD13
    CD13 Posts: 6,386
    Charles,

    "1. He doesn't realise they won't work - i.e. he is incompetent
    2. He doesn't care they won't work provided they win him the election - i.e. he is disingenuous"

    I suspect it's 2. But that's OK because the ends justifies the means. An Ed-led Labour government is essential to right all wrongs.
  • Dair
    Dair Posts: 6,108
    TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
    He hasn't denied that she said Ed wasn't up to being PM. A non denial.
    He doesn't have to be up to the job as long as the person whose pocket he resides in is.
  • Steven_Whaley
    Steven_Whaley Posts: 313
    Charles said:



    Why don't you stand? Even just as a paper candidate.

    I don't want to be a candidate and I certainly don't want to be an MP.

  • Alistair
    Alistair Posts: 23,670
    So now the French have denied that Sturgeon said that she wanted Cameron as PM as have 'sources' who have seen the memo.

    Telegraph is right out on a limb now.

    Is this one of their classic not actually a quite quotes that they love to do with SNP pols?
  • Peter_the_Punter
    Peter_the_Punter Posts: 14,779
    Artist said:

    noisywinter said:

    Mike (or anyone)- what do you think of the Tory prospects of holding Bedford if you dont mind me asking?

    2/1 with Lad's

    I wouldn't touch that with a ten foot barge pole.

    Pudsey, Worcester, Gloucester and Kingswood are seats where the Tories could just hang on.
    Kind of agree with that, Artist, though I'd want a longer barge pole.

    Tories should hold Worcester but I've backed Labour in Gloucester. The incumbent MP has done no wrong but the Labour candidate is good and there's a big LD vote to squeeze.

    No opinion on the other two.
  • JackW
    JackW Posts: 14,787
    Dair said:

    TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
    He hasn't denied that she said Ed wasn't up to being PM. A non denial.
    He doesn't have to be up to the job as long as the person whose pocket he resides in is.
    Does Len McCluskey wear tailored suits ?

  • TheWatcher
    TheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    'What the Ambassador said' is just as likely to have been cobbled together by Labour to discredit Sturgeon.
  • TGOHF
    TGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Dair said:

    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
    Nicola says it's false.
    French Ambassador says it's false.
    French Consul General says it's false.
    Scottish Government Minutes say it's false.
    Telegraph Source - Third Hand UK Government Minutes say it's probably false.

    Even the Huff Post comments section which usually tears strips out the SNP is full of castigation of The Telegraph. It seems clear that this isn't going to hurt Sturgeon now but it could have very bad consequences for The Telegraph, The Civil Service and whichever political party this ends up being linked to.
    It appears to be too subtle for you Dair. Nicola has denied something, the French have denied something else and neither is exactly what is in the Telegraph - which stands behind its story.

    Only Nicola is rueing the day.
  • Roger
    Roger Posts: 20,744
    edited April 2015
    Charles

    "The press's primary objective is to sell papers. Any editorial slant is entirely driven by that (appealing to core readership, etc)."

    One would like to think so. With the Mail the evidence is that Dacre has a list of prejudices which his newspaper allows him to give vent to. I doubt his poison sells a single extra copy. I know many readers who are embarrassed by it. His paper does well in spite of it.


  • TGOHF
    TGOHF Posts: 21,633
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/SNP/11515276/Revealed-Full-text-of-Nicola-Sturgeon-memo.html
  • dr_spyn
    dr_spyn Posts: 11,312
    @Morris_Dancer Perhaps Mr Brooks Newmark could help advise Cameron how to stop that sort of thing.
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,458
    On topic, I don't think David gives enough weight to the considerable anger at the notion of the SNP being able to lean on a weak and desperate Ed to get whatever they want. People in the South-West worry that next time the Dawlish line goes down, the funds to bring it back in service will have been purloined by Scotland.

    For some Kippers, the notion of money going to the Central Belt causes them to fulminate more than the idea of it going to Brussels. There are votes in this for the Tories. I suspect it will play badly for Labour in the Midlands too, although I'm not door-knocking there, so will wait for others to tell us what they are finding.
  • Dair
    Dair Posts: 6,108
    Woah - Ed Miliband now calling the French Ambassador a liar on TV.
  • Carnyx
    Carnyx Posts: 44,654
    TGOHF said:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/SNP/11515276/Revealed-Full-text-of-Nicola-Sturgeon-memo.html

    Hmmm ... look at he bit where it says the unknown writer doesn't believe his 3rd hand story himself.

  • MonikerDiCanio
    MonikerDiCanio Posts: 5,792
    edited April 2015
    Dair said:

    Woah - Ed Miliband now calling the French Ambassador a liar on TV.

    As Nicola rightly said he isn't PM material.
  • Dair
    Dair Posts: 6,108
    TGOHF said:

    Dair said:

    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
    Nicola says it's false.
    French Ambassador says it's false.
    French Consul General says it's false.
    Scottish Government Minutes say it's false.
    Telegraph Source - Third Hand UK Government Minutes say it's probably false.

    Even the Huff Post comments section which usually tears strips out the SNP is full of castigation of The Telegraph. It seems clear that this isn't going to hurt Sturgeon now but it could have very bad consequences for The Telegraph, The Civil Service and whichever political party this ends up being linked to.
    It appears to be too subtle for you Dair. Nicola has denied something, the French have denied something else and neither is exactly what is in the Telegraph - which stands behind its story.

    Only Nicola is rueing the day.
    Seems to be only in that head of yours that this opinion is being held.

    Must be one hell of a strange country.
  • CD13
    CD13 Posts: 6,386
    Here's a guess about Frenchgate.

    Nicola, like many even in the Labour party, thinks Ed isn't up to it and says so. The assumption is made that she'd prefer Cameron.

    All have deny-ability on parts of the story.

    And I have no idea of the truth either.
  • Sandpit
    Sandpit Posts: 56,045
    Monksfield said:

    Sandpit said:



    Swap Labour and tories around in that sentence and you get a good indication of why an increasing number of people hate them both.
    Sean_F said:

    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    antifrank said:

    NickPalmer said:

    edmundintokyo said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    I think Mr Herdson neglects the polling on the views of England on an SNP-propped up government...

    What does the polling say specifically that David Herdson is missing? Is there some polling the validates some argument like, "Don't vote Labour, because they'll have to rely on the SNP if not enough people vote for them"?
    Yes, David is making the point that Ashcroft found in polls - potential Labour supporters don't see that not voting Labour is going to reduce the risk, if it's a risk.

    The Sturgeon story with its heated denials is going to be obscure to most people, and I doubt if it will have much effect in England, but it feeds the sense of unease that Labour in Scotland is trying to encourage about the effect of replacing lots of Labour MPs with lots of Nationalists. Sturgeon will clearly see it as unhelpful, and tactically it's a mistake for the Tory press to go big on it if their primary motive is to prevent a Labour Government.

    It's not aimed at potential Labour voters. It's aimed at potential UKIP voters. And so far it's been far more effective than I expected.
    Don't understand that at all, and what on earth is your metric for effectiveness on potential kippers?
    There is a cohort of voters who aren't warm on the current Conservative leadership who have been thinking about voting for UKIP. This group responds particularly virulently to the idea of Scotland being given more money. The idea of a Labour/SNP alliance fills them with loathing.

    Anecdotally I have had several such voters raise this spontaneously with me. And in the polls UKIP recently have been drifting down a bit while the Conservatives have been climbing a bit. Correlation does not equal causation, I accept.
    You're correct. Among my friends and acquaintances are plenty who dislike Cameron, would happily vote UKIP in secondary elections, but will vote Conservative to keep out Labour/SNP.
    Yep! Agree with the anecdotal data that while Cameron is maybe not brilliant, the alternative is a throwback to the 1970's and could well end up with us heading to the IMF again. Given that choice, a lot of Blue Kippers in the marginals may well, through gritted teeth, vote blue on the day.

    If Greece defaults next week then I expect to wake up to a repeat of the 1992 result on May 8th.
  • chestnut
    chestnut Posts: 7,341
    Roger,

    The only things that have changed since I've posted on here are the polls.

    If we examine them, we are confronted with several core questions.

    1) Which methodology do we trust? Phones or internet?

    2) Which pollsters do we trust? Ones with recent proven accuracy or ones who have been seen to be amiss by miles recently?

    3) Which pollsters do we place most faith in? Ones who have years of success on their CVs, or the new kids on the block?

    From what I see the most favourable Labour polls are those of Survation online, Comres online and Populus online. The most obvious variation with their data and that of the longer running phone operations is the Con-UKIP switchers.

    They're basically 50% higher than the phone pollsters find

    The variety in the polls is either methodology around this group, or we have some shy Kippers who claim to be Tories when telephoned.
  • Roger
    Roger Posts: 20,744
    edited April 2015
    HGOHF

    "http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/SNP/11515276/Revealed-Full-text-of-Nicola-Sturgeon-memo.html"

    Jesus!! From hero to zero in a day!!

    Must be the luckyest £350 I've ever made. I guess it shows her inexperience (or duplicity).

    Either way not good for her or the Nats
  • anotherDave
    anotherDave Posts: 6,746
    MarqueeMark said:


    For some Kippers, the notion of money going to the Central Belt causes them to fulminate more than the idea of it going to Brussels. There are votes in this for the Tories.

    The Tories spoke about english votes for english laws before the last election. They've had five years in government to do something about it.

    They've had five years in government to reform the Barnett formula.

    What have they actually done?
  • Dair
    Dair Posts: 6,108
    CD13 said:

    Here's a guess about Frenchgate.

    Nicola, like many even in the Labour party, thinks Ed isn't up to it and says so. The assumption is made that she'd prefer Cameron.

    All have deny-ability on parts of the story.

    And I have no idea of the truth either.

    Not sure how much deniability The Telegraph has.

    They've published their source document and it doesn't back up their story and clearly states that it's "probably wrong".
  • DecrepitJohnL
    DecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Sandpit said:


    If Greece defaults next week then I expect to wake up to a repeat of the 1992 result on May 8th.

    If Greece defaults and Nigel Farrage can't blame it all on the Europe and the Eurozone, the man has no business running a whelk stall, let alone UKIP.
  • Indigo
    Indigo Posts: 9,966
    TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
    He hasn't denied that she said Ed wasn't up to being PM. A non denial.
    As usual the question is cui bono, to whom is the benefit.

    SNP ? Nothing there except hassle for them

    Tories ? Nope, the very last thing they needs is SNP votes moving back to Labour

    LDs ? Possibly, takes a bit of pressure off their Scottish seats

    The French ? Possibly they might want a Lab government and no referendum, but they wouldn't do it in a way that obviously points the finger at themselves. In anycase they know Cameron is going to get nothing from the EU (because they will make sure of it) and the referendum will be a fiasco.

    Labour ? Hell yes, try and move votes back from SNP to themselves, and tempt red kippers who don't like the idea of a Lab/SNP government back. Plus they have form for this sort of stunt, and it looks at least semi-deniable.

    Did I miss anyone ?
  • Carnyx
    Carnyx Posts: 44,654
    Roger said:

    HGOHF

    "http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/SNP/11515276/Revealed-Full-text-of-Nicola-Sturgeon-memo.html"

    Jesus!! From hero to zero in a day!!

    Must be the luckyest £350 I've ever made. I guess it shows her inexperience (or duplicity).

    Either way not good for her or the Nats

    What strikes me about this story, as well as the atual wording of the memo ("appears ... not sure ... something lost") is the way in which certain major SLAB activists latched onto it very quickly to tweet very loudly about it, and then almost as quickly deleted their tweets, as if they realise it's a sharny midden of a story.

  • Sandpit
    Sandpit Posts: 56,045
    Morris_Dancer said:

    Mr. Owls, that seems quite an odd thing for her to say. Over the telephone. To a Frenchman.

    I'm sure she might prefer a Conservative Government, but I'd be surprised if she said as such, in that way, to that diplomat.

    There still seems something not quite right about this one. I guess that the Civil Service are bound to say absolutely nothing during purdah, but if it is clearly a hoax or fabrication would someone from the relevant department be allowed to comment to the media..?
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,458
    anotherDave said:

    MarqueeMark said:


    For some Kippers, the notion of money going to the Central Belt causes them to fulminate more than the idea of it going to Brussels. There are votes in this for the Tories.

    The Tories spoke about english votes for english laws before the last election. They've had five years in government to do something about it.

    They've had five years in government to reform the Barnett formula.

    What have they actually done?
    Been blocked by the LibDems?
  • DeanJB
    DeanJB Posts: 1
    There's enough semantic wiggle-room here.

    Sturgeon probably said something like "We'd work with Labour, but to be honest EdM isn't Prime Ministerial - at least Dave is up to the job"

    That's not "backing Dave" it's "not backing Ed", but in headline-speak....
  • Peter_the_Punter
    Peter_the_Punter Posts: 14,779
    Carnyx said:

    TGOHF said:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/SNP/11515276/Revealed-Full-text-of-Nicola-Sturgeon-memo.html

    Hmmm ... look at he bit where it says the unknown writer doesn't believe his 3rd hand story himself.

    Fascinating document, Carnyx.

    Not the least fascinating aspect is how it came into the hands of the DT, why, and who is up to what?!

    All good fun....but no game-changer.
  • Dair
    Dair Posts: 6,108
    Indigo said:

    TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
    He hasn't denied that she said Ed wasn't up to being PM. A non denial.
    As usual the question is cui bono, to whom is the benefit.

    SNP ? Nothing there except hassle for them

    Tories ? Nope, the very last thing they needs is SNP votes moving back to Labour

    LDs ? Possibly, takes a bit of pressure off their Scottish seats

    The French ? Possibly they might want a Lab government and no referendum, but they wouldn't do it in a way that obviously points the finger at themselves. In anycase they know Cameron is going to get nothing from the EU (because they will make sure of it) and the referendum will be a fiasco.

    Labour ? Hell yes, try and move votes back from SNP to themselves, and tempt red kippers who don't like the idea of a Lab/SNP government back. Plus they have form for this sort of stunt, and it looks at least semi-deniable.

    Did I miss anyone ?
    Civil Service. Lots of criticism over how they handled the First Indyref and I think there's a few enquiries/committee sessions due for them.

    Miliband is being ripped apart on twitter.

    Calling senior diplomats from a close ally liars is not a good move. The man doesn't seem to be Prime Ministerial material.
  • foxinsoxuk
    foxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    JackW said:

    BREAKING WIND NEWS **** BREAKING WIND NEWS **** BREAKING WIND NEWS ****

    The breaking news is that WIND is reporting to the JNN the contents of the latest ARSE with added APLOMB 2015 General Election and "JackW Dozen" Projections. (Changes From 31st March Projection) :

    Con 313 (-3) .. Lab 244 (+2) .. LibDem 30 (NC) .. SNP 36 (NC) .. PC 2 .. NI 18 .. UKIP 4 (+1) .. Respect 1 .. Green 1 .. Ind 0 .. Speaker 1

    Conservatives 13 seats short of a majority
    ......................................................................................

    "JackW Dozen" - 13 seats that will shape the General Election result :

    Bury North - Con Hold
    Pudsey - Likely Con Hold
    Broxtowe - TCTC from Likely Con Hold
    Warwickshire North - Likely Con Hold
    Cambridge - LibDem Hold
    Ipswich - Con Hold
    Watford - TCTC
    Croydon Central - Con Hold
    Enfield North - TCTC
    Cornwall North - TCTC
    Great Yarmouth - Con Hold
    Vale of Glamorgan - Con Hold
    Ochil and South Perthshire - SNP Gain

    Changes From 31 Mar - Broxtowe moves from Likely Con Hold to TCTC

    TCTC - Too Close To Call - Less than 500 votes
    Likely Hold/Gain - 500 - 2500 votes
    Gain/Hold - Over 2500
    .......................................................................................

    ARSE is sponsored by Auchentennach Fine Pies (Est 1745)

    WIND - Whimsical Independent News Division
    JNN - Jacobite News Network
    ARSE - Anonymous Random Selection of Electors
    APLOMB - Auchentennach Pies Leading Outsales Mainland Britain

    A fine view of your ARSE.

    I am sure Nick P will be pleased!
  • TheWatcher
    TheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    MarkSenior said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    MarkSenior said:

    Monksfield said:

    Roger said:

    Carlotta

    "Meanwhile the Mail explores Labour Hobbit Hypocrisy:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3025156/Red-Ed-s-hypocrite-Hobbit-tax-avoider-know-double-standards-champagne-socialists-investigation-shows-Labour-s-new-celebrity-poster-boy-really-takes-biscuit.html"

    Extraordinary story by the Mail. They have just repeated their story of last week but made the headlines more lurid adding that Freeman is a tax avoider which the article doesn't back up. I really can't imagine why he isn't suing them. There is something ugly about Tory cheerleaders.

    Dacre needs to take a long hard look at himself. The Mail is rapidly drowning in a torrent of its own bile.
    The paper that has supported fascism for over 80 years , Dacre is just following that tradition .
    I thought your beef about them was that they pointed out (correctly) that Cyril Smith was an active paedophile. Is that a fascist position?

    Clearly Cyril Smith is dead and cannot sue you otherwise a coward like you would not have dared to post that .
    You're really a Cyril Smith defender?

    A Cyril Smith defender exists?

    Wonders never cease.
    Mark will always defend against what he perceives as an attack on the LibDems and its predecessors.

    Whether it's defensible or not.

    He's a true tribalist
    Cyril Smith's child abuse is indefensible. Why does Senior bother?
  • Sandpit
    Sandpit Posts: 56,045
    Morris_Dancer said:

    I do think Cameron needs to be slapped around the head and neck with a large haddock until the vaguest notion of how the bloody internet works is beaten into him.

    This. A thousand times this.

    As someone who works in IT, may I plead with CCHQ that whoever the F is advising Cameron about the internet needs to be fired yesterday, he is a complete idiot.
  • Charles
    Charles Posts: 35,758
    anotherDave said:

    MarqueeMark said:


    For some Kippers, the notion of money going to the Central Belt causes them to fulminate more than the idea of it going to Brussels. There are votes in this for the Tories.

    The Tories spoke about english votes for english laws before the last election. They've had five years in government to do something about it.

    They've had five years in government to reform the Barnett formula.

    What have they actually done?
    They had a report commissioned to consider constitutional change properly.

    Perhaps they didn't do anything because they couldn't build a consensus with other parties and are loath to make radical changes to the constitution for partisan advantage?
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    Mr. Dair, is that literally what Miliband's said?
  • CD13
    CD13 Posts: 6,386
    Dair,

    I feel sorry for Nicola now. Clearly someone or some party is out to get her and I'm fed up with honest comments being used as dirt. She's entitled to her opinion.

    Perfidious Frogs.
  • dr_spyn
    dr_spyn Posts: 11,312
    The pound in your pocket will not be devalued.

    https://twitter.com/LouiseMensch/status/584188434434158593
  • Carnyx
    Carnyx Posts: 44,654
    Indigo said:

    TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    While Sky NEws and to a lesser extent the BBC continue to embarrass themselves, New Media gives the best account of #FrenchGate

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewgraemesmith/frenchgate-two-hours-in-the-life-of-a-strange-sc-1gjrg

    Quote : it means there is political leaking coming from the upper echelons of the civil service. Not only are they leaking, they aren’t even doing it well.

    I hadn't realised that the French Ambassador had denied it as well.

    I know he's French, and a diplomat, but it would be unusual for someone in his position to lie openly
    He hasn't denied that she said Ed wasn't up to being PM. A non denial.
    As usual the question is cui bono, to whom is the benefit.

    SNP ? Nothing there except hassle for them

    Tories ? Nope, the very last thing they needs is SNP votes moving back to Labour

    LDs ? Possibly, takes a bit of pressure off their Scottish seats

    The French ? Possibly they might want a Lab government and no referendum, but they wouldn't do it in a way that obviously points the finger at themselves. In anycase they know Cameron is going to get nothing from the EU (because they will make sure of it) and the referendum will be a fiasco.

    Labour ? Hell yes, try and move votes back from SNP to themselves, and tempt red kippers who don't like the idea of a Lab/SNP government back. Plus they have form for this sort of stunt, and it looks at least semi-deniable.

    Did I miss anyone ?
    What puzzles me is why certain SLAB activists etc tweeted very loudly to disseminiate the story but very quickly deleted and in at least one case apologised to Ms Sturgeon.

    Yes, a SLAB activist saying sorry to a SNP leader. SORRY. I APOLOGISE TO YOU.

    http://wingsoverscotland.com/leesten-varry-caurfelly/#more-69168
    https://storify.com/theSNP/telegraph-and-the-scottish-labour
  • Pong
    Pong Posts: 4,693
    edited April 2015
    Peter_the_Punter said:

    Carnyx said:

    TGOHF said:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/SNP/11515276/Revealed-Full-text-of-Nicola-Sturgeon-memo.html

    Hmmm ... look at he bit where it says the unknown writer doesn't believe his 3rd hand story himself.

    Fascinating document, Carnyx.

    Not the least fascinating aspect is how it came into the hands of the DT, why, and who is up to what?!

    All good fun....but no game-changer.
    I struggle to see a compelling reason for Slab'ers to turn out to vote.

    Murphy needs to find one. Quickly.
  • chestnut
    chestnut Posts: 7,341
    Sturgeon's rebuttal is bound to be "we don't want either, we want Scotland run by Scotland".

    Tories go on child protection issues today

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32180744

  • Peter_the_Punter
    Peter_the_Punter Posts: 14,779
    @Indigo

    "Did I miss anyone ?"

    Yes, The Daily Telegraph.

    But since their post-debate headline announced the smaller Parties as the winners and Labour as the losers, I think we can take it that it's a bit detached from reality at the moment and likely to remain so until May 8th.
  • MaxPB
    MaxPB Posts: 40,327
    anotherDave said:

    MarqueeMark said:


    For some Kippers, the notion of money going to the Central Belt causes them to fulminate more than the idea of it going to Brussels. There are votes in this for the Tories.

    The Tories spoke about english votes for english laws before the last election. They've had five years in government to do something about it.

    They've had five years in government to reform the Barnett formula.

    What have they actually done?
    I'm not sure you understand the concept of coalition very well.
This discussion has been closed.

Categories