Skip to content

Things are going sub-optimally for Reform in Scotland – politicalbetting.com

124

Comments

  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 65,988

    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Same here.

    Wrapped in bay leaves and marinaded in Thyme, salt and pink peppercorns.

    Spent extra got it from a farm shop here.
    Yep - cost a bloody fortune with the "Easter lamb" tag!
    I have no idea why lamb is so expensive given this country is totally saturated with sheep,and massively more expensive than, say, pork which seems a somewhat more sophisticated and substantial animal, which there are far fewer of.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 24,880
    Hail stones bouncing down in otherwise sunny Airedale.

  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 23,077

    I hate lamb

    We used to have lamb very regularly in the 80s when I was a child. I loved having mint sauce with it. All came to an end when my three siblings progressively declared themselves to be vegetarian, but it's one of those vivid childhood taste memories that stays with me.

    My wife can't abide lamb.

    We're promised beef bourguignon at the in-laws today, which isn't exactly seasonal, but will be delicious.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,841

    Sandpit said:

    Is anyone watching the UK version of ”Saturday Night Live”?

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/2040568351190069423

    Surprisingly having a right go at the PM, portraying him as politically impotent.

    What do you mean surprisingly?
    I mean it’s surprising they have a real go at a Labour PM as much as they’d have a go at a Tory PM.

    Previous British attempts at political satire have have fallen way short of mocking Labour compared to the Tories, and the US version of SNL had suspiciously few sketches mocking Biden compared to Trump.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 59,162

    I hate lamb

    Well you're not invited then.

    They hate you too.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,042
    Sandpit said:

    malcolmg said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    dancing on the head of a pin there, utter bollox. It was never meant that you could pass through many many safe countries , pay criminals a large sum to pop up somewhere to spend your life on benefits.
    It was always intended that you could pass through many safe countries, as many Jewish refugees had before the war.

    Once someone is granted asylum, they have the same rights to benefits as other citizens. About half of those granted asylum are in employment two years after.
    How’s about people who claim asylum, and then travel back to their ‘home’ country for a holiday?

    The US has just started going through travel records and deporting such people. Starting with a couple of relatives of an Iranian general who celebrated the deaths of US soldiers.

    https://x.com/griftreport/status/2040723620398268848
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15706499/Hamideh-Soleimani-Afshar-qasem-niece-iran-green-card-ice.html
    I must say I read the bare bones of that story (I don't read the Mail) with quite a lot of surprise. After all, it's not as though Iran has had a significant change of government at any time time 1979.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941

    Sandpit said:

    Crossover in US Senate Polymarket, Dems now favourites to take it in the mid-terms.

    https://x.com/kobeissiletter/status/2040431890306318453

    Looking at the actual races I can’t see it, Dems take Texas has been “about to happen” for at least a couple of decades now, but it’s never close.

    Agreed.

    Hypothetically though, if Texas did start to lean-Dem (which I can't see happening, but hypothetically) such that on tied or a very small popular vote lead for the GOP the Democrats carry Texas . . . would that be enough to reverse the current distortion in the electoral college that led to Bush and Trump losing the PV but winning the Presidency?

    Would a blue Texas enable a Democrat candidate to lose the popular vote but win the Presidency?
    It won't start to "lean Dem" for the foreseeable future.
    What we're currently talking about is a large overperformance by the Democrats.

    A two or three point change in Texas voting habits would still leave it a fairly safe GOP state.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 24,880

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    Seeking asylum is the fall back option. If you get caught. Then you check your notes, and announce that you are a 15 year old gay Christian convert from Afghanistan.

    Vanishing without a trace, living in a "shed with a bed" and working for cash in hand is the preference of these lads.
    What’s your evidence for any of that? That seems like a bunch of silly stereotypes. The Refugee Council (I think quoting Govt figures) say 94% coming over on boats seeks asylum: https://www.refugeecouncil.org.uk/stay-informed/explainers/top-facts-from-the-latest-statistics-on-refugees-and-people-seeking-asylum/

    About 1% of asylum seekers claim to be gay: https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-statistics-year-ending-june-2022/asylum-claims-on-the-basis-of-sexual-orientation-2021--2 That’s below the population rate!

    Figures are not recorded on religion, but the Church of England have responded to claims that asylum seekers are abusing the process in this manner here: https://www.churchofengland.org/media/press-releases/bishop-churches-support-asylum-seekers-shouldnt-be-seen-magic-ticket
    I'm just employing the £350 million tactic.

    "But only some of them are taking the piss" isn't an effective counter argument, just like "It's only £260m a week net" played into the hands of the Leave campaign.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    Seeking asylum is the fall back option. If you get caught. Then you check your notes, and announce that you are a 15 year old gay Christian convert from Afghanistan.

    Vanishing without a trace, living in a "shed with a bed" and working for cash in hand is the preference of these lads.
    I dont think that is true. 96% of small boat arrivals apply for asylum.

    People working illegally are usually people who entered legally and either overstay their visas or work outside them.
    That's the small boat arrivals who get intercepted. The ones who arrive without being detected don't rock up at the police station to say hello.
    That’s your speculation. Do you have any actual evidence?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 59,162

    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Same here.

    Wrapped in bay leaves and marinaded in Thyme, salt and pink peppercorns.

    Spent extra got it from a farm shop here.
    Yep - cost a bloody fortune with the "Easter lamb" tag!
    I have no idea why lamb is so expensive given this country is totally saturated with sheep,and massively more expensive than, say, pork which seems a somewhat more sophisticated and substantial animal, which there are far fewer of.
    Where I live in south Devon, it was famous for the quality of its lamb during the times of the Domesday Book.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 19,339

    FF43 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Crossover in US Senate Polymarket, Dems now favourites to take it in the mid-terms.

    https://x.com/kobeissiletter/status/2040431890306318453

    Looking at the actual races I can’t see it, Dems take Texas has been “about to happen” for at least a couple of decades now, but it’s never close.

    Agreed.

    Hypothetically though, if Texas did start to lean-Dem (which I can't see happening, but hypothetically) such that on tied or a very small popular vote lead for the GOP the Democrats carry Texas . . . would that be enough to reverse the current distortion in the electoral college that led to Bush and Trump losing the PV but winning the Presidency?

    Would a blue Texas enable a Democrat candidate to lose the popular vote but win the Presidency?
    Maybe. It depends.

    If Texas leans very slightly Democrat then it means the Republicans pile up lots of wasted votes there, which is the sort of thing that has you lose the Electoral College while winning the popular vote.

    The uncertainty is that, for that to happen, the Democrats would have to lose voters in other states. If those voters are in California, where the Democrats pile up lots of votes they don't need to win the state, then that's good, but if they're voters in the mid-west, such as in PA, MI, WI or MN, then you could see the reverse in those states - the Democrats losing narrowly on a tied popular vote.
    I don't think votes piled up in California matters for the presidency. The number of college electors in each state is the most important thing. You want to win the big states, so you can offset votes from a larger number of smaller states. Of the big four, Democrats already hold California and New York. If they can put Texas and Florida into play, that's potentially a game changer for them.

    The opposite dynamic for the Senate where the senator from North Dakota is just as good as the one from Texas.
    Votes piled up pointlessly in California matters in terms of deciding who wins the electoral college on a tied popular vote.

    It's the same principle as with gerrymandering. Excess votes on California are "packing" and votes in a nearish miss like Texas are "cracking".
    It's very hypothetical given Trump won Texas with a double digit lead last time. My point is that if the Dems did win Texas and/or Florida it would be a marginal gain. Each state is its own election. What happens in California isn't relevant to Texas, except for general national trends that apply everywhere.

    A more sensible system would elect the president on a straight national vote, as happens everywhere else.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 24,880

    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Same here.

    Wrapped in bay leaves and marinaded in Thyme, salt and pink peppercorns.

    Spent extra got it from a farm shop here.
    Yep - cost a bloody fortune with the "Easter lamb" tag!
    I have no idea why lamb is so expensive given this country is totally saturated with sheep,and massively more expensive than, say, pork which seems a somewhat more sophisticated and substantial animal, which there are far fewer of.
    Apparently the number of sheep in the UK is falling significantly.

    Good news if the amount of over-grazing can be reduced, and wild flowers given a chance to grow on the hills.
  • TresTres Posts: 3,554
    Sandpit said:

    Is anyone watching the UK version of ”Saturday Night Live”?

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/2040568351190069423

    Surprisingly having a right go at the PM, portraying him as politically impotent.

    you been in dubai too long, comedians making jokes about political leaders is entirely routine
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 15,461
    Cookie said:



    I spent a very depressing morning a few months back volunteering at a centre to help the unemployed with putting together a CV. It was all Eritreans. And, to their credit, they wanted to work. They didn't want to come here and be on benefits. But these were not high skilled people. Farmers, mainly. Occasionally some might have experience of warehouse or retail or cleaning work. None spoke English well, few spoke it at all. I don't want to demonise these immigrants - they are responding rationally to the system. But it's hard to conclude that this is anything but a massive cost to Britain.

    I volunteer teaching English to refugees and find the Eritreans, Afghans and Sudanese to be the students with the most challenges. They are often not literate in their native languages. The Iranians are, by some distance, the most committed and ambitious students because their culture places a lot of value on education.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941

    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Same here.

    Wrapped in bay leaves and marinaded in Thyme, salt and pink peppercorns.

    Spent extra got it from a farm shop here.
    Yep - cost a bloody fortune with the "Easter lamb" tag!
    I have no idea why lamb is so expensive given this country is totally saturated with sheep,and massively more expensive than, say, pork which seems a somewhat more sophisticated and substantial animal, which there are far fewer of.
    Big export demand in recent years.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    Seeking asylum is the fall back option. If you get caught. Then you check your notes, and announce that you are a 15 year old gay Christian convert from Afghanistan.

    Vanishing without a trace, living in a "shed with a bed" and working for cash in hand is the preference of these lads.
    I dont think that is true. 96% of small boat arrivals apply for asylum.

    People working illegally are usually people who entered legally and either overstay their visas or work outside them.
    That's the small boat arrivals who get intercepted. The ones who arrive without being detected don't rock up at the police station to say hello.
    Somewhat of a question to which there is no answer, but has anyone any idea of how many people actually do make it across the Channel without being detected?
    Successive governments insist the number undetected is very low.

    If someone does get into the country undetected and doesn’t seek asylum, then they won’t be getting any financial support or be in a hotel, which I would think would please those who go on about scroungers.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 23,077

    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Same here.

    Wrapped in bay leaves and marinaded in Thyme, salt and pink peppercorns.

    Spent extra got it from a farm shop here.
    Yep - cost a bloody fortune with the "Easter lamb" tag!
    I have no idea why lamb is so expensive given this country is totally saturated with sheep,and massively more expensive than, say, pork which seems a somewhat more sophisticated and substantial animal, which there are far fewer of.
    I think sheep are a nearly useless animal when it comes to rearing them for meat. Historically they were kept mainly for the wool, for use in clothing, but the wool is almost worthless these days, and sheep numbers are maintained only by massive subsidy.

    Much more meat on a pig.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,841

    Sandpit said:

    malcolmg said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    dancing on the head of a pin there, utter bollox. It was never meant that you could pass through many many safe countries , pay criminals a large sum to pop up somewhere to spend your life on benefits.
    It was always intended that you could pass through many safe countries, as many Jewish refugees had before the war.

    Once someone is granted asylum, they have the same rights to benefits as other citizens. About half of those granted asylum are in employment two years after.
    How’s about people who claim asylum, and then travel back to their ‘home’ country for a holiday?

    The US has just started going through travel records and deporting such people. Starting with a couple of relatives of an Iranian general who celebrated the deaths of US soldiers.

    https://x.com/griftreport/status/2040723620398268848
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15706499/Hamideh-Soleimani-Afshar-qasem-niece-iran-green-card-ice.html
    I must say I read the bare bones of that story (I don't read the Mail) with quite a lot of surprise. After all, it's not as though Iran has had a significant change of government at any time time 1979.
    In this particular case it appears that the two women claimed asylum in the US some years ago, and to be fair the US has given asylum to a number of Iranian exiles since 1979. It’s just that these women are not exiles from the regime, they’re actually senior members of it, and appear to be living the high life in LA off the back of Iranian regime money.

    At least until last week.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,042

    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Same here.

    Wrapped in bay leaves and marinaded in Thyme, salt and pink peppercorns.

    Spent extra got it from a farm shop here.
    Yep - cost a bloody fortune with the "Easter lamb" tag!
    I have no idea why lamb is so expensive given this country is totally saturated with sheep,and massively more expensive than, say, pork which seems a somewhat more sophisticated and substantial animal, which there are far fewer of.
    Where I live in south Devon, it was famous for the quality of its lamb during the times of the Domesday Book.
    Round here, at about the same time, sheep were a source of wool. The people must have eaten the meat now and again, I suppose.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 23,077
    FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Crossover in US Senate Polymarket, Dems now favourites to take it in the mid-terms.

    https://x.com/kobeissiletter/status/2040431890306318453

    Looking at the actual races I can’t see it, Dems take Texas has been “about to happen” for at least a couple of decades now, but it’s never close.

    Agreed.

    Hypothetically though, if Texas did start to lean-Dem (which I can't see happening, but hypothetically) such that on tied or a very small popular vote lead for the GOP the Democrats carry Texas . . . would that be enough to reverse the current distortion in the electoral college that led to Bush and Trump losing the PV but winning the Presidency?

    Would a blue Texas enable a Democrat candidate to lose the popular vote but win the Presidency?
    Maybe. It depends.

    If Texas leans very slightly Democrat then it means the Republicans pile up lots of wasted votes there, which is the sort of thing that has you lose the Electoral College while winning the popular vote.

    The uncertainty is that, for that to happen, the Democrats would have to lose voters in other states. If those voters are in California, where the Democrats pile up lots of votes they don't need to win the state, then that's good, but if they're voters in the mid-west, such as in PA, MI, WI or MN, then you could see the reverse in those states - the Democrats losing narrowly on a tied popular vote.
    I don't think votes piled up in California matters for the presidency. The number of college electors in each state is the most important thing. You want to win the big states, so you can offset votes from a larger number of smaller states. Of the big four, Democrats already hold California and New York. If they can put Texas and Florida into play, that's potentially a game changer for them.

    The opposite dynamic for the Senate where the senator from North Dakota is just as good as the one from Texas.
    Votes piled up pointlessly in California matters in terms of deciding who wins the electoral college on a tied popular vote.

    It's the same principle as with gerrymandering. Excess votes on California are "packing" and votes in a nearish miss like Texas are "cracking".
    It's very hypothetical given Trump won Texas with a double digit lead last time. My point is that if the Dems did win Texas and/or Florida it would be a marginal gain. Each state is its own election. What happens in California isn't relevant to Texas, except for general national trends that apply everywhere.

    A more sensible system would elect the president on a straight national vote, as happens everywhere else.
    The context of the discussion was a hypothetical of how Texas changing to lean Dem on a tied popular vote would affect the bias in the electoral college.

    So your point was something of a tangent, to say the least, on the discussion at hand, and you seemed not to understand the context of the discussion you were wading into.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,841
    FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Crossover in US Senate Polymarket, Dems now favourites to take it in the mid-terms.

    https://x.com/kobeissiletter/status/2040431890306318453

    Looking at the actual races I can’t see it, Dems take Texas has been “about to happen” for at least a couple of decades now, but it’s never close.

    Agreed.

    Hypothetically though, if Texas did start to lean-Dem (which I can't see happening, but hypothetically) such that on tied or a very small popular vote lead for the GOP the Democrats carry Texas . . . would that be enough to reverse the current distortion in the electoral college that led to Bush and Trump losing the PV but winning the Presidency?

    Would a blue Texas enable a Democrat candidate to lose the popular vote but win the Presidency?
    Maybe. It depends.

    If Texas leans very slightly Democrat then it means the Republicans pile up lots of wasted votes there, which is the sort of thing that has you lose the Electoral College while winning the popular vote.

    The uncertainty is that, for that to happen, the Democrats would have to lose voters in other states. If those voters are in California, where the Democrats pile up lots of votes they don't need to win the state, then that's good, but if they're voters in the mid-west, such as in PA, MI, WI or MN, then you could see the reverse in those states - the Democrats losing narrowly on a tied popular vote.
    I don't think votes piled up in California matters for the presidency. The number of college electors in each state is the most important thing. You want to win the big states, so you can offset votes from a larger number of smaller states. Of the big four, Democrats already hold California and New York. If they can put Texas and Florida into play, that's potentially a game changer for them.

    The opposite dynamic for the Senate where the senator from North Dakota is just as good as the one from Texas.
    Votes piled up pointlessly in California matters in terms of deciding who wins the electoral college on a tied popular vote.

    It's the same principle as with gerrymandering. Excess votes on California are "packing" and votes in a nearish miss like Texas are "cracking".
    It's very hypothetical given Trump won Texas with a double digit lead last time. My point is that if the Dems did win Texas and/or Florida it would be a marginal gain. Each state is its own election. What happens in California isn't relevant to Texas, except for general national trends that apply everywhere.

    A more sensible system would elect the president on a straight national vote, as happens everywhere else.
    The difference is that, in the US “Constitutional Republic”, the Federal government derives its power from the States, whereas in most of the rest of the world regions derive their power from the centre.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812

    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    This is bollocks. I am 99% certain that crossing the channel without papers or permission and avoiding all customs and borders - while often endangering children - breaks thousands of laws. It’s just that our enfeebled authorities are too pathetic to enforce them, and allow them to claim asylum

    The first job of a Reform government should be an end to the right of asylum. Just end it. Withdraw from all treaties that oblige it. Take only those who really need our help, and are not likely to rape and murder
    I think asylum is still valid, but the criteria are drawn far too broadly right now.

    We can't be obliged to take in anyone in the world who is facing any form of persecution anywhere, just because they make it to our shores, whereupon they instantly have the same rights as native Britons.
    They don’t instantly have the same rights. Asylum claims take over a year to be processed, on average. If a claimant is successful, they get to stay, but they still have to go through the usual process to become a citizen, which takes another 5 years (3 if you marry a British citizen). So, that’s 6+ years before you have the same rights.
  • BurgessianBurgessian Posts: 3,671

    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Same here.

    Wrapped in bay leaves and marinaded in Thyme, salt and pink peppercorns.

    Spent extra got it from a farm shop here.
    Yep - cost a bloody fortune with the "Easter lamb" tag!
    I have no idea why lamb is so expensive given this country is totally saturated with sheep,and massively more expensive than, say, pork which seems a somewhat more sophisticated and substantial animal, which there are far fewer of.
    Apparently the number of sheep in the UK is falling significantly.

    Good news if the amount of over-grazing can be reduced, and wild flowers given a chance to grow on the hills.
    It would be good if we could reduce the numbers of sheep grazing on marginal land in our National Parks. We are a nature-depleted country anyway and it very sad that so much of our uplands are so lacking in biodiversity because of over-grazing. The Lake District, which some time ago lost its last pair of breeding golden eagles, is a particularly egregious example.

    If we want to subsidise agriculture in these marginal areas let's at least try to maximise the public good we get for handing over the cash.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812
    Sandpit said:

    Is anyone watching the UK version of ”Saturday Night Live”?

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/2040568351190069423

    Surprisingly having a right go at the PM, portraying him as politically impotent.

    Comedians having a go at the government of the day: why are you surprised?
  • TazTaz Posts: 26,533

    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Same here.

    Wrapped in bay leaves and marinaded in Thyme, salt and pink peppercorns.

    Spent extra got it from a farm shop here.
    Yep - cost a bloody fortune with the "Easter lamb" tag!
    Especially when Costco and Sainsbury’s were less than half the price. But I’m a sucker for good quality stuff.

    Also got some mutton mince, pigs cheeks and lambs kidneys.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 59,162
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Crossover in US Senate Polymarket, Dems now favourites to take it in the mid-terms.

    https://x.com/kobeissiletter/status/2040431890306318453

    Looking at the actual races I can’t see it, Dems take Texas has been “about to happen” for at least a couple of decades now, but it’s never close.

    Agreed.

    Hypothetically though, if Texas did start to lean-Dem (which I can't see happening, but hypothetically) such that on tied or a very small popular vote lead for the GOP the Democrats carry Texas . . . would that be enough to reverse the current distortion in the electoral college that led to Bush and Trump losing the PV but winning the Presidency?

    Would a blue Texas enable a Democrat candidate to lose the popular vote but win the Presidency?
    It won't start to "lean Dem" for the foreseeable future.
    What we're currently talking about is a large overperformance by the Democrats.

    A two or three point change in Texas voting habits would still leave it a fairly safe GOP state.
    The issue will be Republicans sitting out 2026.

    And very pissed/scared Latinos thinking Trump and his Administration are *****. They have killed the American Dream.

    To keep Texas, the Republicans are going to have to spend a shedload of money. I'm doubtful it will work. The Dems have a very fine candidate.
  • BurgessianBurgessian Posts: 3,671

    So Britain isn’t broken says Badenoch. So she’s putting the tools down and joining the Labour Party?

    Presume she's seeking to underline the difference between Toryism, and Farage-style rightwing populism?

    Reform want to pull down the pillars and collapse the system, while Conservatives prefer a gradualist approach and are instinctively protective of the country's institutions. Big difference in philosophy.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812
    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    It may not be illegal, but that doesn't mean it's not a massive problem for the host country.

    Most of the world is a shithole. It's entirely understandable that people in, say, Eritrea want a better life here. It's entirely understandable that on arrival, they claim asylum, because that's what the system incentivises them to do. Whether 'asylum' is fleeing from torture amd respression or just fleeing from a really shit country is almoat beside the point.
    Yet we can't accommodate all of them. Indeed, even accommodating the million or so every two or three years who do come is massively challenging and expensive and - and this seems so obvious it shouldn't need saying, and yet some don't seem to get it - in no way a benefit to the UK.

    I spent a very depressing morning a few months back volunteering at a centre to help the unemployed with putting together a CV. It was all Eritreans. And, to their credit, they wanted to work. They didn't want to come here and be on benefits. But these were not high skilled people. Farmers, mainly. Occasionally some might have experience of warehouse or retail or cleaning work. None spoke English well, few spoke it at all. I don't want to demonise these immigrants - they are responding rationally to the system. But it's hard to conclude that this is anything but a massive cost to Britain.
    There aren’t a “million or so every two or three years”. There are currently about 100k asylum seekers per year, so it takes a decade to get to a million. Only about half are successful in their claims, so that’s 20 years to get to a million staying (although successive governments have been bad at ejecting unsuccessful claimants).
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,841

    Sandpit said:

    Is anyone watching the UK version of ”Saturday Night Live”?

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/2040568351190069423

    Surprisingly having a right go at the PM, portraying him as politically impotent.

    Comedians having a go at the government of the day: why are you surprised?
    Because they usually only do it when it’s a Tory government, and not when it’s a Labour government.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,904

    So Britain isn’t broken says Badenoch. So she’s putting the tools down and joining the Labour Party?

    Perhaps a compromise position could be thrashed out between her and Farage. Britain is broken on Tuesdays and Thursdays. For the rest of the week it just has some big challenges.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 60,841
    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    That does indeed appear to be the sentiment on US mil Twitter.

    Those venturing into enemy territory are reassured that half of America’s special forces will mobilise instantly to ensure they get out, were something to go wrong with the mission.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812
    Sandpit said:

    malcolmg said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    dancing on the head of a pin there, utter bollox. It was never meant that you could pass through many many safe countries , pay criminals a large sum to pop up somewhere to spend your life on benefits.
    It was always intended that you could pass through many safe countries, as many Jewish refugees had before the war.

    Once someone is granted asylum, they have the same rights to benefits as other citizens. About half of those granted asylum are in employment two years after.
    How’s about people who claim asylum, and then travel back to their ‘home’ country for a holiday?

    The US has just started going through travel records and deporting such people. Starting with a couple of relatives of an Iranian general who celebrated the deaths of US soldiers.

    https://x.com/griftreport/status/2040723620398268848
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15706499/Hamideh-Soleimani-Afshar-qasem-niece-iran-green-card-ice.html
    What happens in the US doesn’t tell us much about the UK experience.

    As for the US, Trump is still deporting fewer numbers than Obama, because the Obama administration focused on deporting those who should be deported, while the Trump administration focuses on generating social media content and racism.
  • TazTaz Posts: 26,533

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    It may not be illegal, but that doesn't mean it's not a massive problem for the host country.

    Most of the world is a shithole. It's entirely understandable that people in, say, Eritrea want a better life here. It's entirely understandable that on arrival, they claim asylum, because that's what the system incentivises them to do. Whether 'asylum' is fleeing from torture amd respression or just fleeing from a really shit country is almoat beside the point.
    Yet we can't accommodate all of them. Indeed, even accommodating the million or so every two or three years who do come is massively challenging and expensive and - and this seems so obvious it shouldn't need saying, and yet some don't seem to get it - in no way a benefit to the UK.

    I spent a very depressing morning a few months back volunteering at a centre to help the unemployed with putting together a CV. It was all Eritreans. And, to their credit, they wanted to work. They didn't want to come here and be on benefits. But these were not high skilled people. Farmers, mainly. Occasionally some might have experience of warehouse or retail or cleaning work. None spoke English well, few spoke it at all. I don't want to demonise these immigrants - they are responding rationally to the system. But it's hard to conclude that this is anything but a massive cost to Britain.
    There aren’t a “million or so every two or three years”. There are currently about 100k asylum seekers per year, so it takes a decade to get to a million. Only about half are successful in their claims, so that’s 20 years to get to a million staying (although successive governments have been bad at ejecting unsuccessful claimants).
    That’s an understatement.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Is anyone watching the UK version of ”Saturday Night Live”?

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/2040568351190069423

    Surprisingly having a right go at the PM, portraying him as politically impotent.

    What do you mean surprisingly?
    I mean it’s surprising they have a real go at a Labour PM as much as they’d have a go at a Tory PM.

    Previous British attempts at political satire have have fallen way short of mocking Labour compared to the Tories, and the US version of SNL had suspiciously few sketches mocking Biden compared to Trump.
    The US is not the UK.

    Maybe if you were in the UK, you’d have a more accurate sense of who British comics were critiquing.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812

    I hate lamb

    Well you're not invited then.

    They hate you too.
    Lambs would probably love someone who doesn’t want to eat them!
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941

    I hate lamb

    Well you're not invited then.

    They hate you too.
    Lambs would probably love someone who doesn’t want to eat them!
    We need our resident expert @MoonRabbit to weigh in.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,821
    Happy Easter, everyone,. Hope you're not feasting on too many eggs!
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    Seeking asylum is the fall back option. If you get caught. Then you check your notes, and announce that you are a 15 year old gay Christian convert from Afghanistan.

    Vanishing without a trace, living in a "shed with a bed" and working for cash in hand is the preference of these lads.
    What’s your evidence for any of that? That seems like a bunch of silly stereotypes. The Refugee Council (I think quoting Govt figures) say 94% coming over on boats seeks asylum: https://www.refugeecouncil.org.uk/stay-informed/explainers/top-facts-from-the-latest-statistics-on-refugees-and-people-seeking-asylum/

    About 1% of asylum seekers claim to be gay: https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/immigration-statistics-year-ending-june-2022/asylum-claims-on-the-basis-of-sexual-orientation-2021--2 That’s below the population rate!

    Figures are not recorded on religion, but the Church of England have responded to claims that asylum seekers are abusing the process in this manner here: https://www.churchofengland.org/media/press-releases/bishop-churches-support-asylum-seekers-shouldnt-be-seen-magic-ticket
    I'm just employing the £350 million tactic.

    "But only some of them are taking the piss" isn't an effective counter argument, just like "It's only £260m a week net" played into the hands of the Leave campaign.
    That’s a long attempt at a justification for being wrong.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941
    edited 10:52AM
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 59,162
    FF43 said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Mrs C cooked a very nice Steak Diane last night, with which we enjoyed a Primitivo, a Christmas present from elder son.
    We have a rather nice Madiran for our guests...
    But you'll be drinking the 2016 Chateau Margaux yourselves?
    The Madiran is better...
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812
    Taz said:

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    It may not be illegal, but that doesn't mean it's not a massive problem for the host country.

    Most of the world is a shithole. It's entirely understandable that people in, say, Eritrea want a better life here. It's entirely understandable that on arrival, they claim asylum, because that's what the system incentivises them to do. Whether 'asylum' is fleeing from torture amd respression or just fleeing from a really shit country is almoat beside the point.
    Yet we can't accommodate all of them. Indeed, even accommodating the million or so every two or three years who do come is massively challenging and expensive and - and this seems so obvious it shouldn't need saying, and yet some don't seem to get it - in no way a benefit to the UK.

    I spent a very depressing morning a few months back volunteering at a centre to help the unemployed with putting together a CV. It was all Eritreans. And, to their credit, they wanted to work. They didn't want to come here and be on benefits. But these were not high skilled people. Farmers, mainly. Occasionally some might have experience of warehouse or retail or cleaning work. None spoke English well, few spoke it at all. I don't want to demonise these immigrants - they are responding rationally to the system. But it's hard to conclude that this is anything but a massive cost to Britain.
    There aren’t a “million or so every two or three years”. There are currently about 100k asylum seekers per year, so it takes a decade to get to a million. Only about half are successful in their claims, so that’s 20 years to get to a million staying (although successive governments have been bad at ejecting unsuccessful claimants).
    That’s an understatement.
    But it is changing, with deportations markedly up under Labour.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,821

    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Same here.

    Wrapped in bay leaves and marinaded in Thyme, salt and pink peppercorns.

    Spent extra got it from a farm shop here.
    Yep - cost a bloody fortune with the "Easter lamb" tag!
    I have no idea why lamb is so expensive given this country is totally saturated with sheep,and massively more expensive than, say, pork which seems a somewhat more sophisticated and substantial animal, which there are far fewer of.
    Meat is over-rated.

    [runs and hides]
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,821
    Dura_Ace said:

    Breaking news... A old shipmate on FB has reminded me that I was on the F-14 RAG at Oceana with Capt. Wiseman of Artemis II fame. Disappointingly, I can remember precisely zero about him. There's probably a life lesson in our respective career trajectories subsequent to our time together in the 'Grim Reapers' but I'm fucked if I know what it is.

    An Artemis II model kit is available!

    https://revell.com/en-uk/products/037609090-nasa-artemis-space-launch-system-sls?srsltid=AfmBOopm3rftu_qY2x8khno5DRzba66vlZjoe0igDvo0Ts8KPrrRnaIh

    Also available in Lego.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 29,208
    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941
    This thread describes how close we are to global shutdown for quite a few industries.
    It will start in Asia.

    1/ Goldman Sachs analysts report that the biggest oil crisis in history is about to hit globally, with profound and highly destructive consequences. A new report asks ""Are We Running Out of Oil?", and concludes that the answer is yes. ⬇️
    https://x.com/ChrisO_wiki/status/2040708045487985104

    For example, the last jet fuel tankers out of the Gulf to Asia arrived a while ago; the last one for the UK arrives on April 9th.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,128
    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Slow-cooking leg of lamb in the oven. Smells great.

    We're eating at 3, if anybody wants to invite themselves...
    Same here.

    Wrapped in bay leaves and marinaded in Thyme, salt and pink peppercorns.

    Spent extra got it from a farm shop here.
    roast chicken for us
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 28,169
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Is anyone watching the UK version of ”Saturday Night Live”?

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/2040568351190069423

    Surprisingly having a right go at the PM, portraying him as politically impotent.

    Comedians having a go at the government of the day: why are you surprised?
    Because they usually only do it when it’s a Tory government, and not when it’s a Labour government.
    Mock the Week: BBC Two 5 June 2005 to 4 November 2022.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,128

    malcolmg said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    dancing on the head of a pin there, utter bollox. It was never meant that you could pass through many many safe countries , pay criminals a large sum to pop up somewhere to spend your life on benefits.
    It was always intended that you could pass through many safe countries, as many Jewish refugees had before the war.

    Once someone is granted asylum, they have the same rights to benefits as other citizens. About half of those granted asylum are in employment two years after.
    And the band played believe it if you like
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 15,461

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    The effort to get Col. Gene Hambleton back after the EB-66 shootdown in the 'Nam went way beyond anything they did in Khuzestan yesterday. 100 sorties/day for 12 days with 5 additional shootdowns and 12 KIAs but they just kept going until they got him.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941
    Dura_Ace said:

    Breaking news... A old shipmate on FB has reminded me that I was on the F-14 RAG at Oceana with Capt. Wiseman of Artemis II fame. Disappointingly, I can remember precisely zero about him. There's probably a life lesson in our respective career trajectories subsequent to our time together in the 'Grim Reapers' but I'm fucked if I know what it is.

    Keep your copybook unblotted, and they'll send you to space; the alternative is ending up on PB ?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 59,162

    Dura_Ace said:

    Breaking news... A old shipmate on FB has reminded me that I was on the F-14 RAG at Oceana with Capt. Wiseman of Artemis II fame. Disappointingly, I can remember precisely zero about him. There's probably a life lesson in our respective career trajectories subsequent to our time together in the 'Grim Reapers' but I'm fucked if I know what it is.

    An Artemis II model kit is available!

    https://revell.com/en-uk/products/037609090-nasa-artemis-space-launch-system-sls?srsltid=AfmBOopm3rftu_qY2x8khno5DRzba66vlZjoe0igDvo0Ts8KPrrRnaIh

    Also available in Lego.
    1:144.

    Bit titchy.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812
    Nigelb said:

    This thread describes how close we are to global shutdown for quite a few industries.
    It will start in Asia.

    1/ Goldman Sachs analysts report that the biggest oil crisis in history is about to hit globally, with profound and highly destructive consequences. A new report asks ""Are We Running Out of Oil?", and concludes that the answer is yes. ⬇️
    https://x.com/ChrisO_wiki/status/2040708045487985104

    For example, the last jet fuel tankers out of the Gulf to Asia arrived a while ago; the last one for the UK arrives on April 9th.

    And pretty much all because of the actions of one man.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 67,559
    edited 11:06AM
    Beautiful spring day here in Falmouth. The bluebells are out and the sun is sparkling on Carrick Roads

    “Th’uncertain glory of an April sky”

    🍾🍸

    If I had to live in the UK outside London it would be here. Somewhere around Falmouth


  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 62,163

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    In Vietnam, quite a few US aircraft were lost and number of crew died to rescue downed American aircrew.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,821

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    In Vietnam, quite a few US aircraft were lost and number of crew died to rescue downed American aircrew.
    FUBAR.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 71,078
    Nigelb said:

    This thread describes how close we are to global shutdown for quite a few industries.
    It will start in Asia.

    1/ Goldman Sachs analysts report that the biggest oil crisis in history is about to hit globally, with profound and highly destructive consequences. A new report asks ""Are We Running Out of Oil?", and concludes that the answer is yes. ⬇️
    https://x.com/ChrisO_wiki/status/2040708045487985104

    For example, the last jet fuel tankers out of the Gulf to Asia arrived a while ago; the last one for the UK arrives on April 9th.

    Might as well enjoy Easter before we have to

    #brace
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941
    Dura_Ace said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    The effort to get Col. Gene Hambleton back after the EB-66 shootdown in the 'Nam went way beyond anything they did in Khuzestan yesterday. 100 sorties/day for 12 days with 5 additional shootdowns and 12 KIAs but they just kept going until they got him.
    Serious efforts to recover aircrew (air sea rescue) started in WWII, didn't they ?
    Limited by helicopters not being a thing, obviously.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 34,323
    Leon said:

    Beautiful spring day here in Falmouth. The bluebells are out and the sun is sparkling on Carrick Roads

    “Th’uncertain glory of an April sky”

    🍾🍸

    If I had to live in the UK outside London it would be here. Somewhere around Falmouth


    Definitely an April day in Lincolnshoire. Quite cool with blue skies, scudding clouds and occasional, sharp hail and rain showers.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 34,323
    Nigelb said:

    This thread describes how close we are to global shutdown for quite a few industries.
    It will start in Asia.

    1/ Goldman Sachs analysts report that the biggest oil crisis in history is about to hit globally, with profound and highly destructive consequences. A new report asks ""Are We Running Out of Oil?", and concludes that the answer is yes. ⬇️
    https://x.com/ChrisO_wiki/status/2040708045487985104

    For example, the last jet fuel tankers out of the Gulf to Asia arrived a while ago; the last one for the UK arrives on April 9th.

    Cheers Nigel. My wife just showed me this very thread (I am not on X myself) and I was just trying to work out how to link to it on here. .
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,821

    Dura_Ace said:

    Breaking news... A old shipmate on FB has reminded me that I was on the F-14 RAG at Oceana with Capt. Wiseman of Artemis II fame. Disappointingly, I can remember precisely zero about him. There's probably a life lesson in our respective career trajectories subsequent to our time together in the 'Grim Reapers' but I'm fucked if I know what it is.

    An Artemis II model kit is available!

    https://revell.com/en-uk/products/037609090-nasa-artemis-space-launch-system-sls?srsltid=AfmBOopm3rftu_qY2x8khno5DRzba66vlZjoe0igDvo0Ts8KPrrRnaIh

    Also available in Lego.
    1:144.

    Bit titchy.
    AMT's version is only 1:200...
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 58,821
    Dura_Ace said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    The effort to get Col. Gene Hambleton back after the EB-66 shootdown in the 'Nam went way beyond anything they did in Khuzestan yesterday. 100 sorties/day for 12 days with 5 additional shootdowns and 12 KIAs but they just kept going until they got him.
    Lieutenant Dewindt: Yeah, Brigadier General Amend, deputy commander, 101st. Some fucking genius had the great idea of welding a couple of steel plates onto our deck to keep the general safe from ground fire. Unfortunately, they forgot to tell me about it until we were just getting airborne. Well, that's like trying to fly a freight train. OK? Gross overload. Trim characteristics all shot to hell. I nearly broke both my arms trying to keep her level. And when- and when we released, you know I cut as hard as I could, tried to gain some altitude and still keep her from stalling. We came down like a fucking meteor. And that is how we ended up. And the others, they stopped easy enough OK, though, you know? We were just-we were just too damn heavy, you know? The grass was wet, downward slope and all. 22 guys dead.

    Captain Miller: All that for a general?

    Lieutenant Dewindt: One man.

    Private Reiben: Lot of that going around.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941

    Foxy said:

    malcolmg said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    dancing on the head of a pin there, utter bollox. It was never meant that you could pass through many many safe countries , pay criminals a large sum to pop up somewhere to spend your life on benefits.
    If you have ever watched the film Casablanca then you would know that wasn't true. Made in 1942 and the people smugglers are the heroes.
    In my top three of the best films of all time.

    I am sure most people already know this so apologies for a bit of Rick-splaining.

    Many of the actors in Casablanca were themselves refugees from the Nazis.

    Peter Lorre who left Germany after the Nazis came to power as his most notable film at that time had been condemned as subversive.
    Paul Henreid who plays Victor Lazlo was half Jewish and had been declared an enemy of the state by the Nazis.
    Conrad Veidt who played the main villain Major Strasser who fled Germany with his Jewish wife
    Marcel Dalio who plays the croupier
    Madeleine Lebeau, Dalio's real life wife who is the lady crying as she sings La Marseillaise. She was crying for real in that scene.
    Helmut Dantine who plays one half of the young refugee couple and who had himself been arrested by the Nazis in Austria
    S.Z. Sakall who plays the waiter and who lost much of his family in the concentratiuon camps
    Curt Bois who played the pickpocket. He was a German Jew who was forced out of the country in 1934 after the Nazis came to power

    Many of the extras were also refugees, some of them family of the named actors.

    Knowing the background of these actors make some of the scenes - particularly the singing of La Marseillaise at Rick's - incredibly powerful.
    Great movie, made on a relative shoestring.
    (The Lockheed plane at the end is a half scale prop on the sound stage.)
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 19,339

    FF43 said:

    FF43 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Crossover in US Senate Polymarket, Dems now favourites to take it in the mid-terms.

    https://x.com/kobeissiletter/status/2040431890306318453

    Looking at the actual races I can’t see it, Dems take Texas has been “about to happen” for at least a couple of decades now, but it’s never close.

    Agreed.

    Hypothetically though, if Texas did start to lean-Dem (which I can't see happening, but hypothetically) such that on tied or a very small popular vote lead for the GOP the Democrats carry Texas . . . would that be enough to reverse the current distortion in the electoral college that led to Bush and Trump losing the PV but winning the Presidency?

    Would a blue Texas enable a Democrat candidate to lose the popular vote but win the Presidency?
    Maybe. It depends.

    If Texas leans very slightly Democrat then it means the Republicans pile up lots of wasted votes there, which is the sort of thing that has you lose the Electoral College while winning the popular vote.

    The uncertainty is that, for that to happen, the Democrats would have to lose voters in other states. If those voters are in California, where the Democrats pile up lots of votes they don't need to win the state, then that's good, but if they're voters in the mid-west, such as in PA, MI, WI or MN, then you could see the reverse in those states - the Democrats losing narrowly on a tied popular vote.
    I don't think votes piled up in California matters for the presidency. The number of college electors in each state is the most important thing. You want to win the big states, so you can offset votes from a larger number of smaller states. Of the big four, Democrats already hold California and New York. If they can put Texas and Florida into play, that's potentially a game changer for them.

    The opposite dynamic for the Senate where the senator from North Dakota is just as good as the one from Texas.
    Votes piled up pointlessly in California matters in terms of deciding who wins the electoral college on a tied popular vote.

    It's the same principle as with gerrymandering. Excess votes on California are "packing" and votes in a nearish miss like Texas are "cracking".
    It's very hypothetical given Trump won Texas with a double digit lead last time. My point is that if the Dems did win Texas and/or Florida it would be a marginal gain. Each state is its own election. What happens in California isn't relevant to Texas, except for general national trends that apply everywhere.

    A more sensible system would elect the president on a straight national vote, as happens everywhere else.
    The context of the discussion was a hypothetical of how Texas changing to lean Dem on a tied popular vote would affect the bias in the electoral college.

    So your point was something of a tangent, to say the least, on the discussion at hand, and you seemed not to understand the context of the discussion you were wading into.
    You certainly know how to patronise. I'll give you that.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 29,208
    Dura_Ace said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    The effort to get Col. Gene Hambleton back after the EB-66 shootdown in the 'Nam went way beyond anything they did in Khuzestan yesterday. 100 sorties/day for 12 days with 5 additional shootdowns and 12 KIAs but they just kept going until they got him.
    How many other occasions did they just keep going until they didn't get him ?

    If morale is at risk without any rescue missions then when is the tipping point reached of morale begin even more at risk as casualties pile up because of the rescue missions and when the rescue missions themselves require rescue missions ?

    And with increasing resources being committed to the tactics of the rescue missions and away from the strategy of the air campaign.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 15,461
    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    The effort to get Col. Gene Hambleton back after the EB-66 shootdown in the 'Nam went way beyond anything they did in Khuzestan yesterday. 100 sorties/day for 12 days with 5 additional shootdowns and 12 KIAs but they just kept going until they got him.
    Serious efforts to recover aircrew (air sea rescue) started in WWII, didn't they ?
    Limited by helicopters not being a thing, obviously.
    WW2 was a different game where exfil relied on courageous efforts by friendlies on the ground like la Ligne Comète with Andrée De Jongh (accurately and memorably described by a senior RAF officer as 'a pure heroine of legend').
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,128

    Cookie said:

    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegral immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    It may not be illegal, but that doesn't mean it's not a massive problem for the host country.

    Most of the world is a shithole. It's entirely understandable that people in, say, Eritrea want a better life here. It's entirely understandable that on arrival, they claim asylum, because that's what the system incentivises them to do. Whether 'asylum' is fleeing from torture amd respression or just fleeing from a really shit country is almoat beside the point.
    Yet we can't accommodate all of them. Indeed, even accommodating the million or so every two or three years who do come is massively challenging and expensive and - and this seems so obvious it shouldn't need saying, and yet some don't seem to get it - in no way a benefit to the UK.

    I spent a very depressing morning a few months back volunteering at a centre to help the unemployed with putting together a CV. It was all Eritreans. And, to their credit, they wanted to work. They didn't want to come here and be on benefits. But these were not high skilled people. Farmers, mainly. Occasionally some might have experience of warehouse or retail or cleaning work. None spoke English well, few spoke it at all. I don't want to demonise these immigrants - they are responding rationally to the system. But it's hard to conclude that this is anything but a massive cost to Britain.
    There aren’t a “million or so every two or three years”. There are currently about 100k asylum seekers per year, so it takes a decade to get to a million. Only about half are successful in their claims, so that’s 20 years to get to a million staying (although successive governments have been bad at ejecting unsuccessful claimants).
    selective quoting od statistics , who would have thought
  • ohnotnowohnotnow Posts: 5,963

    Leon said:

    Beautiful spring day here in Falmouth. The bluebells are out and the sun is sparkling on Carrick Roads

    “Th’uncertain glory of an April sky”

    🍾🍸

    If I had to live in the UK outside London it would be here. Somewhere around Falmouth


    Definitely an April day in Lincolnshoire. Quite cool with blue skies, scudding clouds and occasional, sharp hail and rain showers.
    We've had quite heavy snow here in Glasgow. Which was a bit of a surprise.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941
    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    The effort to get Col. Gene Hambleton back after the EB-66 shootdown in the 'Nam went way beyond anything they did in Khuzestan yesterday. 100 sorties/day for 12 days with 5 additional shootdowns and 12 KIAs but they just kept going until they got him.
    Serious efforts to recover aircrew (air sea rescue) started in WWII, didn't they ?
    Limited by helicopters not being a thing, obviously.
    WW2 was a different game where exfil relied on courageous efforts by friendlies on the ground like la Ligne Comète with Andrée De Jongh (accurately and memorably described by a senior RAF officer as 'a pure heroine of legend').
    I was thinking more of the development (from pretty well zero in England) of systems to rescue pilots downed in the Channel, and stuff like the US Catalinas in the Pacific.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 10,506
    Nigelb said:
    Amazing that the BBC were happy to let him go whilst the increasingly embarrassing John Simpson is treated like the grand old man of broadcasting.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941

    Dura_Ace said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    The effort to get Col. Gene Hambleton back after the EB-66 shootdown in the 'Nam went way beyond anything they did in Khuzestan yesterday. 100 sorties/day for 12 days with 5 additional shootdowns and 12 KIAs but they just kept going until they got him.
    How many other occasions did they just keep going until they didn't get him ?

    If morale is at risk without any rescue missions then when is the tipping point reached of morale begin even more at risk as casualties pile up because of the rescue missions and when the rescue missions themselves require rescue missions ?

    And with increasing resources being committed to the tactics of the rescue missions and away from the strategy of the air campaign.
    It was an unusual case, and there were some limits.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iceal_Hambleton
    ...During the rescue operation, five aircraft were shot down, eleven airmen were killed in action, and two were captured. Nine additional aircraft and helicopters were badly damaged during the ongoing rescue attempts.[8]: 53 

    General Creighton Abrams ordered that no further air rescue operations should be attempted, but ordered a ground rescue operation.[9] Hambleton was a USAF ballistic missile expert with a Top Secret/SCI clearance and his capture by the North Vietnamese Army would have been of tremendous benefit to them and the Soviet Union...
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 23,077
    Nigelb said:

    This thread describes how close we are to global shutdown for quite a few industries.
    It will start in Asia.

    1/ Goldman Sachs analysts report that the biggest oil crisis in history is about to hit globally, with profound and highly destructive consequences. A new report asks ""Are We Running Out of Oil?", and concludes that the answer is yes. ⬇️
    https://x.com/ChrisO_wiki/status/2040708045487985104

    For example, the last jet fuel tankers out of the Gulf to Asia arrived a while ago; the last one for the UK arrives on April 9th.

    Is there any information on whether the UK is sourcing jet fuel supplies from elsewhere?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 67,559
    Hmm

    Central Falmouth looking pleasingly prosperous. A notable absence of vape shops and Turkish barbers. Only a few empty premises. Lots of thriving little cafes and pubs with tables out in the sun

    One could almost be optimistic if it wasn’t for that fucker Trump
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 34,621

    Nigelb said:

    This thread describes how close we are to global shutdown for quite a few industries.
    It will start in Asia.

    1/ Goldman Sachs analysts report that the biggest oil crisis in history is about to hit globally, with profound and highly destructive consequences. A new report asks ""Are We Running Out of Oil?", and concludes that the answer is yes. ⬇️
    https://x.com/ChrisO_wiki/status/2040708045487985104

    For example, the last jet fuel tankers out of the Gulf to Asia arrived a while ago; the last one for the UK arrives on April 9th.

    Might as well enjoy Easter before we have to

    #brace
    If only we had our own source of oil.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 13,028

    HYUFD said:

    viewcode said:
    On Ashcroft's poll according to Nowcast Kemi would likely be PM with most seats in a hung parliament, though she might have to make Nigel her Deputy PM.

    Conservatives 172
    Reform 151
    Greens 116
    LDs 61
    Labour 58
    SNP 45
    PC 18

    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom
    Nah. Even if you had a reliable Reform partner you’d be barely a majority government and would be hostage to the nutters.

    Let the left try to stitch together 5 parties… or have another election when they will be in complete disarray as they would with those numbers
    The conventional wisdom is you can't win most seats at a General Election then say, "nah, not my job" when it comes to trying to form a government, or you'll be punished hard at the further election. It's effectively saying you don't want to govern when given the chance, which begs the question as to what the point is voting for you.

    I think the conventional wisdom is probably broadly right on that. In particular, Farage would be saying "let's tango" in these circumstances, and Badenoch would be punished very hard, losing votes both to him and the Lib Dems, if she said, "we're largest party, but I think I'll just sit this one out for tactical reasons" - it's not very credible out in the country.
    Sure, you negotiate but it’s not an equal partnership.
  • BurgessianBurgessian Posts: 3,671

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    In Vietnam, quite a few US aircraft were lost and number of crew died to rescue downed American aircrew.
    Apparently, in total, the United States military lost in Vietnam almost 10,000 aircraft and helicopters.

    Jeezo. Puts things in perspective.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 34,621

    HYUFD said:

    viewcode said:
    On Ashcroft's poll according to Nowcast Kemi would likely be PM with most seats in a hung parliament, though she might have to make Nigel her Deputy PM.

    Conservatives 172
    Reform 151
    Greens 116
    LDs 61
    Labour 58
    SNP 45
    PC 18

    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom
    Nah. Even if you had a reliable Reform partner you’d be barely a majority government and would be hostage to the nutters.

    Let the left try to stitch together 5 parties… or have another election when they will be in complete disarray as they would with those numbers
    The conventional wisdom is you can't win most seats at a General Election then say, "nah, not my job" when it comes to trying to form a government, or you'll be punished hard at the further election. It's effectively saying you don't want to govern when given the chance, which begs the question as to what the point is voting for you.

    I think the conventional wisdom is probably broadly right on that. In particular, Farage would be saying "let's tango" in these circumstances, and Badenoch would be punished very hard, losing votes both to him and the Lib Dems, if she said, "we're largest party, but I think I'll just sit this one out for tactical reasons" - it's not very credible out in the country.
    Sure, you negotiate but it’s not an equal partnership.
    Your idea that Kemi should remain aloof of 'the nutters' and let the left Govern instead is utterly absurd.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812
    It’s pretty depressing that, at Easter, when Christians celebrate the sacrifice Jesus made, there’s a bunch of people here saying we shouldn’t help refugees because it doesn’t benefit us.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 65,988

    HYUFD said:

    viewcode said:
    On Ashcroft's poll according to Nowcast Kemi would likely be PM with most seats in a hung parliament, though she might have to make Nigel her Deputy PM.

    Conservatives 172
    Reform 151
    Greens 116
    LDs 61
    Labour 58
    SNP 45
    PC 18

    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom
    Nah. Even if you had a reliable Reform partner you’d be barely a majority government and would be hostage to the nutters.

    Let the left try to stitch together 5 parties… or have another election when they will be in complete disarray as they would with those numbers
    The conventional wisdom is you can't win most seats at a General Election then say, "nah, not my job" when it comes to trying to form a government, or you'll be punished hard at the further election. It's effectively saying you don't want to govern when given the chance, which begs the question as to what the point is voting for you.

    I think the conventional wisdom is probably broadly right on that. In particular, Farage would be saying "let's tango" in these circumstances, and Badenoch would be punished very hard, losing votes both to him and the Lib Dems, if she said, "we're largest party, but I think I'll just sit this one out for tactical reasons" - it's not very credible out in the country.
    Sure, you negotiate but it’s not an equal partnership.
    Your idea that Kemi should remain aloof of 'the nutters' and let the left Govern instead is utterly absurd.
    Immigration reform and the tangled web of vested interests that preserve de facto open borders are today's Unions of the 1970s.

    Is Kemi today's Thatcher?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,904
    Leon said:

    Hmm

    Central Falmouth looking pleasingly prosperous. A notable absence of vape shops and Turkish barbers. Only a few empty premises. Lots of thriving little cafes and pubs with tables out in the sun

    One could almost be optimistic if it wasn’t for that fucker Trump

    Evergreen observation.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 87,941

    Nigelb said:

    This thread describes how close we are to global shutdown for quite a few industries.
    It will start in Asia.

    1/ Goldman Sachs analysts report that the biggest oil crisis in history is about to hit globally, with profound and highly destructive consequences. A new report asks ""Are We Running Out of Oil?", and concludes that the answer is yes. ⬇️
    https://x.com/ChrisO_wiki/status/2040708045487985104

    For example, the last jet fuel tankers out of the Gulf to Asia arrived a while ago; the last one for the UK arrives on April 9th.

    Might as well enjoy Easter before we have to

    #brace
    If only we had our own source of oil.
    It is refined products that are the upcoming problem.
    You're essentially arguing in favour of autarky, which is absurd.
    Even the US, for example, imports 60% of its heating oil.
  • CarrCarr Posts: 52
    edited 11:55AM
    Foxy said:

    Carr said:

    Carr said:

    On topic, let it never be forgotten that Scotland’s hacks were giving Lord Offord collective standing ovations a few months ago. His latest masterstroke is to frighten Scots with the boat peopl.




    https://x.com/rebecca_brady_/status/2039295498100559954?s=61&t=LYVEHh2mqFy1oUJAdCfe-Q

    Most illegal immigrants haven't arrived on small boats, and London is a bigger magnet than Scotland for recent arrivals, but I don't think making either of those points will hit Reform particularly hard in Glasgow, which is where this propaganda is aimed at. "Glasgow is the illegal immigrant capital of the UK" is quite a clever slogan.
    Might be proven wrong but don’t think Glasgow will be particularly fertile territory for Reform outside the Rangers supporting folk, Ayrshire, Forth Valley and bits of the NE more likely.

    Given that it’s Scotland & Glasgow’s generous policy towards supporting refuweegees and HMG sotto voce encouraging them to take the high road to Scotland, it’s a good argument for us having independent control over immigration. Don’t suppose Reform is suggesting that.
    If the SNP adopt the position that illegal immigration is a big issue and they're the party best placed to deal with it, because after independence they'll be able to, they may find it hard to convince people.
    For the billionth time: it isn't illegal to enter the country with the purpose of seeking asylum.
    You need to pay more attention rather than repeatedly having the same thought. Here is the issue that Reform are raising again, in the exact words that they use: "Glasgow is the illegal immigrant capital of the UK". I said what I thought will happen if the SNP say yeah, sure, and we're your best option for fixing the problem that Reform have raised. To wit, they'll find it hard to convince people. If instead they focus on saying what you say, perhaps in the form of "Reform are raising a non-issue, acktchooarly, because entering Britain in order to claim asylum is thoroughly allowed according to the law", they'll find it even harder to get people to vote SNP rather than Reform. I wouldn't vote Reform if somebody paid me to. Just observing that their spiel is likely to have some traction in Glasgow and is quite cleverly put, even if it wouldn't win a debate among politicos. What the SNP need to do IMHO is downplay immigration (immigration for whatever purpose) as an issue. For Reform of course it will remain front and centre.

  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 23,077

    HYUFD said:

    viewcode said:
    On Ashcroft's poll according to Nowcast Kemi would likely be PM with most seats in a hung parliament, though she might have to make Nigel her Deputy PM.

    Conservatives 172
    Reform 151
    Greens 116
    LDs 61
    Labour 58
    SNP 45
    PC 18

    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom
    Nah. Even if you had a reliable Reform partner you’d be barely a majority government and would be hostage to the nutters.

    Let the left try to stitch together 5 parties… or have another election when they will be in complete disarray as they would with those numbers
    The conventional wisdom is you can't win most seats at a General Election then say, "nah, not my job" when it comes to trying to form a government, or you'll be punished hard at the further election. It's effectively saying you don't want to govern when given the chance, which begs the question as to what the point is voting for you.

    I think the conventional wisdom is probably broadly right on that. In particular, Farage would be saying "let's tango" in these circumstances, and Badenoch would be punished very hard, losing votes both to him and the Lib Dems, if she said, "we're largest party, but I think I'll just sit this one out for tactical reasons" - it's not very credible out in the country.
    Sure, you negotiate but it’s not an equal partnership.
    Your idea that Kemi should remain aloof of 'the nutters' and let the left Govern instead is utterly absurd.
    Immigration reform and the tangled web of vested interests that preserve de facto open borders are today's Unions of the 1970s.

    Is Kemi today's Thatcher?
    The borders are not de facto open. Border control is also a detail when it comes to determining the country's fate.

    Britain has much bigger issues in terms of low investment and extraction of monopoly rents. Those are the vested interests that need to be taken on.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 13,028
    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Not much nutritional value to grass and hay. You should watch that
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 10,506

    It’s pretty depressing that, at Easter, when Christians celebrate the sacrifice Jesus made, there’s a bunch of people here saying we shouldn’t help refugees because it doesn’t benefit us.

    a) We're not that Christian anymore.
    b) If I was to offer advice to the left on this, it would be that they have to acknowledge we only have finite resources. The idea we can be a receptacle for anyone around the world in need is fanciful.
  • BurgessianBurgessian Posts: 3,671

    Nigelb said:
    Amazing that the BBC were happy to let him go whilst the increasingly embarrassing John Simpson is treated like the grand old man of broadcasting.
    Pretty grim reading. To make RN capable of fighting war by 2029:

    "Jenkins’s blueprint for getting there quickly includes adopting more uncrewed ships, aircraft and submersibles. Even so, the MoD calculated in 2021 that it would need to build 25 new warships to fulfil its tasks. There is unease that the Treasury has not yet committed to making that possible as part of the long-delayed defence investment plan.

    "The forces have many times been confronted by unexpected emergencies — not least the invasion of the Falklands in 1982. But the means available now are so much smaller that even if the government wanted to, the Royal Navy cannot make a significant contribution to reopening the Strait of Hormuz by force."
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 49,904

    It’s pretty depressing that, at Easter, when Christians celebrate the sacrifice Jesus made, there’s a bunch of people here saying we shouldn’t help refugees because it doesn’t benefit us.

    Applying 'benefit to the nation' as the key criteria for granting asylum is tantamount to opting out of the whole concept. Which I think is the underlying sentiment.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 67,559

    It’s pretty depressing that, at Easter, when Christians celebrate the sacrifice Jesus made, there’s a bunch of people here saying we shouldn’t help refugees because it doesn’t benefit us.

    a) We're not that Christian anymore.
    b) If I was to offer advice to the left on this, it would be that they have to acknowledge we only have finite resources. The idea we can be a receptacle for anyone around the world in need is fanciful.
    It’s not just fanciful it’s asinine, juvenile virtue-signalling, and it will bankrupt the entire country unless people like @bondegezou are silenced
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 13,028
    MattW said:

    In March, the Ukrainians claimed to have killed or wounded 35,300 Russian troops. Of those, 34,000 were by drones - 96%. That beats the stated replenishment rate - if that rate can even be achieved by Putin.

    Just 1,363 killed/injured by artillery, mines, aircraft munitions. The changing shape of war.

    Which has not been factored in to US planning for Iran.

    The rather good Emergency Podcast, of which I believe @RochdalePioneers is one of the hosts, was highlighting this very point a couple of days ago. If you want to see the likely fate of a US attempt to force open the Straits of Hormuz, look no further than the Russian Black Sea Fleet. Drones are rapidly changing the whole nature of warfare.
    I currently have a small beef with Rochdale.

    He has clearly received a Google Ads promotion of some sort, because Google continually drops "sponsored" segments of him declaring today's exciting activity of substantially enhancing the interior of his passion wagon by fitting new bionic six million dollar floor mats, with great detail as to the patterns of the tesselated Ts orientated to minimise moisture and dampness.

    I keep having to swat it to get my fix of Ukraine news. I don't want to keep clicking on it, because if I do that then click away it will start to undermine his algorithm treatment.
    You don’t have to listen for long. Something like 30 secs retention is huge for him
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 58,619

    It’s pretty depressing that, at Easter, when Christians celebrate the sacrifice Jesus made, there’s a bunch of people here saying we shouldn’t help refugees because it doesn’t benefit us.

    The way that the only form of help that we can now envisage is to invite people to move here must say something about our catastrophic loss of confidence in our ability to shape the world.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 58,101
    edited 11:59AM

    DavidL said:

    Happy Easter everyone!

    We have a tradition in my house that this is Sushi Sunday. When my then-girlfriend and I first lived together we decided on our day off today to make sushi, rather than a traditional roast. The next year we decided that was fun so lets do it again, and it became our annual tradition. Fast forward about 16 years and now its a tradition our kids love too, they help up us to both make and then demolish the sushi.

    Whatever you do today, hope you enjoy it.

    I have to assist in creating a chocolate egg hunt for 3 extremely rowdy small children.
    Ive already earned my Monday of extreme inactivity
    We had our Easter yesterday with the family around at the house and my first BBQ of the year. I was pleased to get the food into the Conservatory before the sleet started. A great time was had by all, especially my 1 year grandson who eats like a horse.
    Not much nutritional value to grass and hay. You should watch that
    He had salmon, lemon sole and peas. My daughter is quite strict with his diet. No sugar, no processed foods and no cake (although he did get a sugar free cake for his birthday which went down enormously well).
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,294
    Dura_Ace said:

    Nigelb said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Fox News can confirm that the 2nd crew member of the downed F15E fighter jet has been rescued and he and the members of the rescue team that extracted him from behind enemy lines in Iran are all safely out of Iran. That according to two senior US officials and multiple well placed sources in the region. The Weapons Systems Officer ejected along with the pilot when their F15E Strike Eagle they were flying was struck Thursday night (early Friday local time) in southwest Iran.

    The WSO used the SERE (Survival, Evasion, Resistance, and Escape) training to evade capture, hiding on an elevated ridge after hiking away from the wreckage and putting out an emergency beacon.) US Special Operations rescue forces to include PJs (United States Air Force Pararescuemen (PJs) and many layers of elite rescue forces took part in the complex, layered mission to both find the crew member and also keep the Iranian forces who were hunting the American weapons system operator at bay. There are videos that have appeared from local eyewitnesses that show what appear to have been injured and dead Iranian members of the IRGC and Basij who were looking for the downed American crew member. Fox has learned there was fighting on the ground but no Americans killed during the operation. “It was a very complex operation to retrieve the downed service member,” a well placed source briefed on the operation told me. Many different branches of the US military were involved in the rescue.

    https://x.com/JenGriffinFNC/status/2040637421373505989?s=20

    Coming to cinemas in 2028....

    Western militaries do go to quite extraordinary lengths to rescue their own in an emergency. Multiple elite units across services, dozens of personnel and vehicles, literally no stone unturned in the effort to recover the downed airman.

    A brief description, from someone who’s been there.
    https://x.com/mcccanm/status/2040124352478543897

    There are even some reports of fighting between IRGC troops (in plain clothes) and local Iranians, the locals trying to keep the soldiers off the trail to find the American.
    Because they will be horribly tortured and face a very unpleasant death otherwise.
    Yes an airman captured becomes a bargaining chip to those who don’t play by the usual rules. This guy was a colonel apparently, much more senior than your average WSO in the back of an F-15. He’d have been paraded on Iranian TV and subjected to all sorts of ‘interrogation’, then either killed or exchanged for a terrorist from US prison.

    But it’s still a massive effort put into the recovery mission.
    They didn't do it for that guy because, whoever he was, he wasn't worth what that recovery risked and cost.

    They did to prevent a morale collapse among aircrew. You've got to believe they're going to pop a bollock to get you back if you have to go over the taffrail.
    Yet they managed to fly far more dangerous operations in the world war and against Vietnam without that assurance.
    The effort to get Col. Gene Hambleton back after the EB-66 shootdown in the 'Nam went way beyond anything they did in Khuzestan yesterday. 100 sorties/day for 12 days with 5 additional shootdowns and 12 KIAs but they just kept going until they got him.
    Serious efforts to recover aircrew (air sea rescue) started in WWII, didn't they ?
    Limited by helicopters not being a thing, obviously.
    WW2 was a different game where exfil relied on courageous efforts by friendlies on the ground like la Ligne Comète with Andrée De Jongh (accurately and memorably described by a senior RAF officer as 'a pure heroine of legend').
    I think I mentioned before that Chuck Yeager was shot down early 1944, helped the Maquis with various activities, escaped over the Pyrenees and then demanded to be put back into action & shooting down another 10+ enemy aircraft. The right stuff.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 23,077

    It’s pretty depressing that, at Easter, when Christians celebrate the sacrifice Jesus made, there’s a bunch of people here saying we shouldn’t help refugees because it doesn’t benefit us.

    a) We're not that Christian anymore.
    b) If I was to offer advice to the left on this, it would be that they have to acknowledge we only have finite resources. The idea we can be a receptacle for anyone around the world in need is fanciful.
    As a leftie I'm willing to accept some amendment of the criteria on which asylum is granted, on the quid pro quo that we stop demonising those who are granted asylum on that basis.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 19,812

    It’s pretty depressing that, at Easter, when Christians celebrate the sacrifice Jesus made, there’s a bunch of people here saying we shouldn’t help refugees because it doesn’t benefit us.

    a) We're not that Christian anymore.
    b) If I was to offer advice to the left on this, it would be that they have to acknowledge we only have finite resources. The idea we can be a receptacle for anyone around the world in need is fanciful.
    We are not a receptacle for anyone around the world. We take in fewer refugees for a country of our size than many in Europe and far fewer than, say, Turkey, Jordan, Iran etc.

    The amount we spend on refugees is not large. Its not bankrupting our nation. Government spending remains dominated by things like pensions, the NHS, education etc.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,294
    ohnotnow said:

    Leon said:

    Beautiful spring day here in Falmouth. The bluebells are out and the sun is sparkling on Carrick Roads

    “Th’uncertain glory of an April sky”

    🍾🍸

    If I had to live in the UK outside London it would be here. Somewhere around Falmouth


    Definitely an April day in Lincolnshoire. Quite cool with blue skies, scudding clouds and occasional, sharp hail and rain showers.
    We've had quite heavy snow here in Glasgow. Which was a bit of a surprise.
    Now blinding sunshine..
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 47,294

    It’s pretty depressing that, at Easter, when Christians celebrate the sacrifice Jesus made, there’s a bunch of people here saying we shouldn’t help refugees because it doesn’t benefit us.

    Aboo Hafsah
    @AbuHafsah1
    ·
    3 Apr
    London has fallen.

    Sadiq Khan arranges yet another Middle Eastern event in the heart of London.

    https://x.com/AbuHafsah1/status/2040118973748941180?s=20
Sign In or Register to comment.