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Have a good cry Argentina, you have earned it – politicalbetting.com

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  • Options
    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,144
    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    I’m wondering how Truss war-gamed all this in her comeback strategy?

    Truss is yesterday's news, Braverman is the candidate for ERG ideologues now, Cleverly and Barclay the established Cabinet candidates if and when Sunak goes
    You underestimate The Truss
    Cometh the hour, cometh the Fabricant.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,334
    Scott_xP said:

    @NicholasOwens

    @Jacob_Rees_Mogg delivers excoriating attack on PM on @GBNEWS saying: “Suella Braverman is right. The PM has repeatedly and manifestly not delivered on these promises.” He adds: “Sadly, this government no longer seems serious about solving illegal or even legal migration.”

    He's upsetting Mogg, Braverman, The Spectator and GB News,

    Calling it - he's on course to win the next election :smile:
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,386
    Leon said:

    Either some bot machine or some algorithm is hugely boosting Braverman’s social media exposure. The Chinese? The Russians? Elon?

    ChatGPT in a right wing mood?

    It could be that right-wing social media accounts with lots of followers are amplifying her to their followers.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    She’s now up to 18m views

    Ridiculous. Vanishingly few tweets even by global megastars get that kind of attention

    Someone quite clever and powerful is gaming TwiX to aid Braverman, in a significant way. Who why and how?

    Could be important if it continues. I wonder if it is AI
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,805
    edited November 2023
    Go Braverman. Next Empress of the UK.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,741

    Scott_xP said:

    @NicholasOwens

    @Jacob_Rees_Mogg delivers excoriating attack on PM on @GBNEWS saying: “Suella Braverman is right. The PM has repeatedly and manifestly not delivered on these promises.” He adds: “Sadly, this government no longer seems serious about solving illegal or even legal migration.”

    Solving 'legal migration'?
    A final solution?
  • Options
    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,184
    Leon said:

    She’s now up to 18m views

    Ridiculous. Vanishingly few tweets even by global megastars get that kind of attention

    Someone quite clever and powerful is gaming TwiX to aid Braverman, in a significant way. Who why and how?

    Could be important if it continues. I wonder if it is AI

    Al who? Pacino? Gore? Jazeera?
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,508
    algarkirk said:

    AlistairM said:

    Not sure if it's been mentioned, but Suella's diatribe contains explicit reference to a document on key priorities she agreed with Sunak in return for her backing:

    This was a document with clear terms to which you agreed in October 2022 during your second leadership campaign.

    I wonder why she hasn't included this document as an appendix to her letter?

    If she is smart, she has the document, Sunak's signature is on it and she is saving it for the next round- a Sunday paper, perhaps.

    If she is not smart, she doesn't have the document. Either she has lost it, or she never took a copy, or it was never written down on paper as such but she had an understanding...
    I saw a bit on the BBC news at 6 which said that such a document "was not for today" (or words to that effect). Implies that they have said document and are waiting for the right time to use it.
    When dealing with the top, obviously anything not in unambiguous writing will be dealt with as a misunderstanding, recollections many vary and all that.

    What Braverman may find out, is that at this level, if you have the top man bang to rights on unambiguous signed paper it does not mean you win and he loses, it means that great effort has to go into destroying your standing and credibility.

    So far I don't think there is evidence that Braverman is good at this politics malarkey. The letter is differently terrible from Dame Andrea's but still terrible. Perhaps she should study carefully the life of her college's founder, Margaret of Anjou.
    Hilarious mini melt-down. I'm imagining you as some spotty No. 10 staffer who idolises George Osborne and dreams of one day being asked to get a latte for Dr No.
  • Options
    Braverman’s letter reads like a rage against the dying of the light (right?).

    She has blown her leadership chances. And I suspect she knows it.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,334
    mwadams said:

    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    DougSeal said:

    I’m wondering how Truss war-gamed all this in her comeback strategy?

    Truss is yesterday's news, Braverman is the candidate for ERG ideologues now, Cleverly and Barclay the established Cabinet candidates if and when Sunak goes
    You underestimate The Truss
    Cometh the hour, cometh the Fabricant.
    The sexual routines of the potato wig are no concern of ours.
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,094
    @alexwickham

    NEW: Suella Braverman has in her possession physical documents that show Rishi Sunak reneged on a deal with her to make him leader, sources say

    — they may become public in the coming days along with further revelations about the PM’s record on migration
  • Options
    algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 10,593

    algarkirk said:

    AlistairM said:

    Not sure if it's been mentioned, but Suella's diatribe contains explicit reference to a document on key priorities she agreed with Sunak in return for her backing:

    This was a document with clear terms to which you agreed in October 2022 during your second leadership campaign.

    I wonder why she hasn't included this document as an appendix to her letter?

    If she is smart, she has the document, Sunak's signature is on it and she is saving it for the next round- a Sunday paper, perhaps.

    If she is not smart, she doesn't have the document. Either she has lost it, or she never took a copy, or it was never written down on paper as such but she had an understanding...
    I saw a bit on the BBC news at 6 which said that such a document "was not for today" (or words to that effect). Implies that they have said document and are waiting for the right time to use it.
    When dealing with the top, obviously anything not in unambiguous writing will be dealt with as a misunderstanding, recollections many vary and all that.

    What Braverman may find out, is that at this level, if you have the top man bang to rights on unambiguous signed paper it does not mean you win and he loses, it means that great effort has to go into destroying your standing and credibility.

    So far I don't think there is evidence that Braverman is good at this politics malarkey. The letter is differently terrible from Dame Andrea's but still terrible. Perhaps she should study carefully the life of her college's founder, Margaret of Anjou.
    Hilarious mini melt-down. I'm imagining you as some spotty No. 10 staffer who idolises George Osborne and dreams of one day being asked to get a latte for Dr No.
    Well spotted. How on earth did you know?
  • Options
    bigglesbiggles Posts: 4,349
    edited November 2023
    Leon said:

    The average tweet by Joe Biden gets about 300k - 1m views

    So Suella’s tweets are getting twenty times as many views as the President of the USA

    If we believe this is legit, she will soon be global fuhrer. I am a touch skeptical

    We’d have to look into how it is calculated but there are about 20m Twitter users in the U.K. and whilst the vast majority of them won’t follow politics as such, they will follow at least one news website. Said website will have linked to a lot of Braverman crap this week.

    However it does still seem a stretch for them all to be clicking through, so I do think bots are part of it.

    The Biden comparison isn’t quite right, since most of his tweets aren’t new making in themselves. Mostly.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,805

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    biggles said:

    Nigelb said:

    biggles said:

    Suella Braverman accuses Rishi Sunak of “manifestly and repeatedly” failing to deliver on key policies in scathing letter

    “It is generally agreed that my support was a pivotal factor in winning the leadership contest and thus enabling you to become Prime Minister”.

    Generally agreed by whom?
    Don't ask awkward questions.

    The replies to her Tweet are quite amusing.
    https://twitter.com/SuellaBraverman/status/1724465401982070914
    It reflects well on Rishi, since the sense of her letter is that’s she’s been left in the corner with the safety scissors, glue, and glitter, and kept away from doing any real damage.

    She clearly doesn’t have the self awareness to realise how idiotic she has made herself look.
    The problem is not that Suella Braverman is right wing. It is that she postures, but is useless.
    The letter - which of course is self serving - gives quite a convincing argument she isn’t useless - she has been thwarted

    I’ve no idea if this is true. I am fairly sure it is not good news for Sunak

    An almighty bust up is brewing in the Tories. Maybe they just need to split
    Nah. I think the new top team- Sunak, Dowden, Cameron, Cleverley - will be pretty united and will happily face down the mutineers. There will be a battle after the election and I rather suspect Cleverley is being lined up by the party establishment with Badenoch as as the approved alternative. Braverman, or whoever the rightwing factionalists line up, will likely get squeezed out.

    Braverman has rotten ratings with the public - she's no Boris - a paper tiger.
    All men, mostly from privileged backgrounds.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,719
    Leon said:

    She’s now up to 18m views

    Ridiculous. Vanishingly few tweets even by global megastars get that kind of attention

    Someone quite clever and powerful is gaming TwiX to aid Braverman, in a significant way. Who why and how?

    Could be important if it continues. I wonder if it is AI

    You’d instantly think the Russians, but then why? They either boost pro-Russians, or people who will divide society. One thing she’s not evinced, yet (but maybe Steve Bannon can work on this) is any particularly pro-Russian sentiments. And they are on the Palestinian / Iranian side in this battle.

    So it would have to be a division tactic. If so then you’d expect similar patterns of social media boosting for other characters on her side of the argument (JRM say) and their opposite numbers on the other side (Piers Corbyn? George Galloway?).

    Alternatively it’s just because everyone with an interest in UK politics is reading her tweets today, and reposting them like crazy. It could be that. Or a bit of both.
  • Options
    algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 10,593
    Leon said:

    She’s now up to 18m views

    Ridiculous. Vanishingly few tweets even by global megastars get that kind of attention

    Someone quite clever and powerful is gaming TwiX to aid Braverman, in a significant way. Who why and how?

    Could be important if it continues. I wonder if it is AI

    I have never seen Suella Braverman and Taylor Swift in the same room at the same time. Could her TwiX popularity be due to the fact that they are the same person? That girl next door charm is such a giveaway.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,741
    biggles said:

    Leon said:

    The average tweet by Joe Biden gets about 300k - 1m views

    So Suella’s tweets are getting twenty times as many views as the President of the USA

    If we believe this is legit, she will soon be global fuhrer. I am a touch skeptical

    We’d have to look into how it is calculated but there are about 20m Twitter users in the U.K. and whilst the vast majority of them won’t follow politics as such, they will follow at least one news website. Said website will have linked to a lot of Braverman crap this week.

    However it does still seem a stretch for them all to be clicking through, so I do think bots are part of it.

    The Biden comparison isn’t quite right, since most of his tweets aren’t new making in themselves. Mostly.
    Sunak gets a lot of Hindutva interest and amplification.
  • Options
    Tory surge Klaxon!

    Deltapoll (1,840 sample, 10 - 13 November)

    Lab 44 (-1)
    Con 28 (+4)!!
    LD 13 (+1)
    Green 6 (-1)
    Reform 4 (-2)
    SNP 3 (-)

    https://deltapoll.co.uk/polls/voteint231106-2
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,741
    On topic, looking how the polls shifted for the first round, at near evens Massa looks value.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,554
    edited November 2023
    Hmmm. People's Polling are Matt Goodwin's mob, and they don't always release their tables.

    Rishi Sunak’s premiership has been plunged into yet another crisis after new data showed Sir Keir Starmer’s Labour Party leading the Tories by 30 points.

    PeoplePolling surveyed 1,581 people exclusively for GB News immediately after the Prime Minister conducted his reshuffle yesterday....

    ....Rishi Sunak’s premiership has been plunged into yet another crisis after new data showed Sir Keir Starmer’s Labour Party leading the Tories by 30 points.

    PeoplePolling surveyed 1,581 people exclusively for GB News immediately after the Prime Minister conducted his reshuffle yesterday.

    Sunak sacked controversial Home Secretary Suella Braverman following her incendiary article about pro-Palestine protesters.

    He also appointed former Prime Minister David Cameron, who left Downing Street following the Brexit vote in 2016, to the Foreign Office.

    Only 19 per cent claimed they would vote for the Conservative Party if a general election were held tomorrow.

    Almost half of voters, 49 per cent, revealed they would vote for Labour.

    Richard Tice’s Reform UK also looks likely to benefit from Tory woes as 11 per cent of respondents threw their weight behind the populist party.

    Support for the Liberal Democrats stands at just nine per cent and the Green Party is registering around seven per cent.


    https://www.gbnews.com/politics/rishi-sunak-people-polling-rwanda-supreme-court
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    She’s now up to 18m views

    Ridiculous. Vanishingly few tweets even by global megastars get that kind of attention

    Someone quite clever and powerful is gaming TwiX to aid Braverman, in a significant way. Who why and how?

    Could be important if it continues. I wonder if it is AI

    You’d instantly think the Russians, but then why? They either boost pro-Russians, or people who will divide society. One thing she’s not evinced, yet (but maybe Steve Bannon can work on this) is any particularly pro-Russian sentiments. And they are on the Palestinian / Iranian side in this battle.

    So it would have to be a division tactic. If so then you’d expect similar patterns of social media boosting for other characters on her side of the argument (JRM say) and their opposite numbers on the other side (Piers Corbyn? George Galloway?).

    Alternatively it’s just because everyone with an interest in UK politics is reading her tweets today, and reposting them like crazy. It could be that. Or a bit of both.
    I’ve noticed that pro-Israeli tweets and politicians get really high numbers. Hmm. But I don’t want to sound like a crank

    Braverman is also getting a lot of replies and reposts and likes, so it’s a sophisticated operation if it is “an operation”

    And there has to be some gaming here. No UK politician gets 18m views for a tweet, not even the PM (I’ve looked). One earlier this week, by Braverman, got 22m

    Indians?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    19m now
  • Options
    bigglesbiggles Posts: 4,349
    edited November 2023
    Scott_xP said:

    @alexwickham

    NEW: Suella Braverman has in her possession physical documents that show Rishi Sunak reneged on a deal with her to make him leader, sources say

    — they may become public in the coming days along with further revelations about the PM’s record on migration

    Lol.

    She needs to think about how many embarrassing documents there are about her held by the Home Office, which will of course do it’s very best to stop any politicians from leaking them.

    I mean, what’s her narrative. “I’m a gullible idiot - look, here’s the final proof”.
  • Options
    Electoral Calculus' model gives the Tories only 24 seats, which amusingly includes one gain from the SNP. But models like that can't really handle swings this large.

    https://twitter.com/PipsFunFacts/status/1724540049880990111
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,805
    edited November 2023
    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,508
    algarkirk said:

    algarkirk said:

    AlistairM said:

    Not sure if it's been mentioned, but Suella's diatribe contains explicit reference to a document on key priorities she agreed with Sunak in return for her backing:

    This was a document with clear terms to which you agreed in October 2022 during your second leadership campaign.

    I wonder why she hasn't included this document as an appendix to her letter?

    If she is smart, she has the document, Sunak's signature is on it and she is saving it for the next round- a Sunday paper, perhaps.

    If she is not smart, she doesn't have the document. Either she has lost it, or she never took a copy, or it was never written down on paper as such but she had an understanding...
    I saw a bit on the BBC news at 6 which said that such a document "was not for today" (or words to that effect). Implies that they have said document and are waiting for the right time to use it.
    When dealing with the top, obviously anything not in unambiguous writing will be dealt with as a misunderstanding, recollections many vary and all that.

    What Braverman may find out, is that at this level, if you have the top man bang to rights on unambiguous signed paper it does not mean you win and he loses, it means that great effort has to go into destroying your standing and credibility.

    So far I don't think there is evidence that Braverman is good at this politics malarkey. The letter is differently terrible from Dame Andrea's but still terrible. Perhaps she should study carefully the life of her college's founder, Margaret of Anjou.
    Hilarious mini melt-down. I'm imagining you as some spotty No. 10 staffer who idolises George Osborne and dreams of one day being asked to get a latte for Dr No.
    Well spotted. How on earth did you know?
    Something to do with the nutso veiled threats to send the boys round combined with the fact that the post was clearly written by a nobody.
  • Options
    bigglesbiggles Posts: 4,349
    Foxy said:

    biggles said:

    Leon said:

    The average tweet by Joe Biden gets about 300k - 1m views

    So Suella’s tweets are getting twenty times as many views as the President of the USA

    If we believe this is legit, she will soon be global fuhrer. I am a touch skeptical

    We’d have to look into how it is calculated but there are about 20m Twitter users in the U.K. and whilst the vast majority of them won’t follow politics as such, they will follow at least one news website. Said website will have linked to a lot of Braverman crap this week.

    However it does still seem a stretch for them all to be clicking through, so I do think bots are part of it.

    The Biden comparison isn’t quite right, since most of his tweets aren’t new making in themselves. Mostly.
    Sunak gets a lot of Hindutva interest and amplification.
    Fair point. Hasn’t considered that.

    The other day, I was musing over whether there’s a seat or two in the country where a “Modi for Sunak” campaign might move the dial.
  • Options
    squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,365
    ydoethur said:

    sbjme19 said:

    Just watched a compendium of Holden's appearances this a.m. Oh dear. Rishi should have stuck with Hands.

    Appointing Cameron suggests a more general hands off approach.
    It frees Sunak's hands to deal with the Domestic agenda.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited November 2023
    I see the crazier Corbyn bro is claiming 7th Oct was Israeli false flag operation.

    Families dinners must be a blast.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,386
    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
  • Options
    squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,365
    Andy_JS said:

    Go Braverman. Next Empress of the UK.

    No.. Just Go.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    19m now
    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    The Cameron bounce! I said it was a genius move by Sunak - as @TheScreamingEagles and @TOPPING told us
  • Options
    Suella used to have a reputation as one of the nicest people in the Party. Perhaps she still is.

    Struggling to square with the latest view of "Cruella" and I suspect it's entirely performative.
  • Options
    Scott_xP said:

    Ok, this is definitely one for @Leon.

    “My fiancé left me because I’m having an emotional affair with ChatGPT”

    https://www.reddit.com/r/relationship_advice/comments/17tm450/fiancé_28m_found_my_26f_explicit_ai_chats_and/

    @TomChatfield

    A wonderful analogy from the conference I'm at. ChatGPT is like a humanities graduate. It has read a lot, can talk convincingly about anything, but has a hazy relationship with the truth and isn't very good at maths.
    Is Boris Johnson an AI?
  • Options
    Leon said:

    19m now

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    The Cameron bounce! I said it was a genius move by Sunak - as @TheScreamingEagles and @TOPPING told us
    Don't get overexcited.

    The Tory share has moved 2% since the last poll.

    Plus it is People's Polling, they always have the Tories much lower than the other pollsters.
  • Options
    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,176
    No betting on the SC's Ruanda decision tomorrow?
    I reckon it'll get the green light. Not going to bet on it though
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,993

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    30 points behind and the sitting government on 19%?
    And remarkably you're right.
    It isn't as bad as all that.
  • Options
    squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,365
    Leon said:

    19m now

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    The Cameron bounce! I said it was a genius move by Sunak - as @TheScreamingEagles and @TOPPING told us
    Phantom poll. It's bollocks imho..
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,508
    edited November 2023

    ydoethur said:

    sbjme19 said:

    Just watched a compendium of Holden's appearances this a.m. Oh dear. Rishi should have stuck with Hands.

    Appointing Cameron suggests a more general hands off approach.
    It frees Sunak's hands to deal with the Domestic agenda.
    Maths until 33?
  • Options
    BurgessianBurgessian Posts: 2,454
    Ah, women.

    I used to think that the feminisation of politics would lead to less ego, less posturing, and less, well, politicking.

    Liz, Nad, and Suella have certainly been a learning experience.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,993

    Scott_xP said:

    Ok, this is definitely one for @Leon.

    “My fiancé left me because I’m having an emotional affair with ChatGPT”

    https://www.reddit.com/r/relationship_advice/comments/17tm450/fiancé_28m_found_my_26f_explicit_ai_chats_and/

    @TomChatfield

    A wonderful analogy from the conference I'm at. ChatGPT is like a humanities graduate. It has read a lot, can talk convincingly about anything, but has a hazy relationship with the truth and isn't very good at maths.
    Is Boris Johnson an AI?
    He's willing to call anyone Betty.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    edited November 2023
    “Poll conducted after the reshuffle”

    I was right. I said the reshuffle was a “catastrophe”. It is a catastrophe
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749
    Leon said:

    19m now

    44k of whom liked it. Which sounds like a very low proportion to me but happy to be corrected.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,919

    Scott_xP said:

    @NicholasOwens

    @Jacob_Rees_Mogg delivers excoriating attack on PM on @GBNEWS saying: “Suella Braverman is right. The PM has repeatedly and manifestly not delivered on these promises.” He adds: “Sadly, this government no longer seems serious about solving illegal or even legal migration.”

    Solving 'legal migration'?
    If only her party had been in power for the last 13 years. Imagine what she could have done.

  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425

    Leon said:

    19m now

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    The Cameron bounce! I said it was a genius move by Sunak - as @TheScreamingEagles and @TOPPING told us
    Phantom poll. It's bollocks imho..
    Remember OGH’s golden rule: a rogue poll is a poll with a result you don’t like
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,094

    Scott_xP said:

    Ok, this is definitely one for @Leon.

    “My fiancé left me because I’m having an emotional affair with ChatGPT”

    https://www.reddit.com/r/relationship_advice/comments/17tm450/fiancé_28m_found_my_26f_explicit_ai_chats_and/

    @TomChatfield

    A wonderful analogy from the conference I'm at. ChatGPT is like a humanities graduate. It has read a lot, can talk convincingly about anything, but has a hazy relationship with the truth and isn't very good at maths.
    Is Boris Johnson an AI?
    A-hole...
  • Options
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    She’s now up to 18m views

    Ridiculous. Vanishingly few tweets even by global megastars get that kind of attention

    Someone quite clever and powerful is gaming TwiX to aid Braverman, in a significant way. Who why and how?

    Could be important if it continues. I wonder if it is AI

    You’d instantly think the Russians, but then why? They either boost pro-Russians, or people who will divide society. One thing she’s not evinced, yet (but maybe Steve Bannon can work on this) is any particularly pro-Russian sentiments. And they are on the Palestinian / Iranian side in this battle.

    So it would have to be a division tactic. If so then you’d expect similar patterns of social media boosting for other characters on her side of the argument (JRM say) and their opposite numbers on the other side (Piers Corbyn? George Galloway?).

    Alternatively it’s just because everyone with an interest in UK politics is reading her tweets today, and reposting them like crazy. It could be that. Or a bit of both.
    I’ve noticed that pro-Israeli tweets and politicians get really high numbers. Hmm. But I don’t want to sound like a crank

    Braverman is also getting a lot of replies and reposts and likes, so it’s a sophisticated operation if it is “an operation”

    And there has to be some gaming here. No UK politician gets 18m views for a tweet, not even the PM (I’ve looked). One earlier this week, by Braverman, got 22m

    Indians?
    https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/16/analysis-why-is-so-much-anti-palestinian-disinformation-coming-from-india
  • Options
    After next GE...Taxi for the Tory MPs....Taxis for Tory MPs....we have a small sprinter van ready to take all Tory MPs home.
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,072

    Hmmm. People's Polling are Matt Goodwin's mob, and they don't always release their tables.

    Rishi Sunak’s premiership has been plunged into yet another crisis after new data showed Sir Keir Starmer’s Labour Party leading the Tories by 30 points.

    PeoplePolling surveyed 1,581 people exclusively for GB News immediately after the Prime Minister conducted his reshuffle yesterday....

    ....Rishi Sunak’s premiership has been plunged into yet another crisis after new data showed Sir Keir Starmer’s Labour Party leading the Tories by 30 points.

    PeoplePolling surveyed 1,581 people exclusively for GB News immediately after the Prime Minister conducted his reshuffle yesterday.

    Sunak sacked controversial Home Secretary Suella Braverman following her incendiary article about pro-Palestine protesters.

    He also appointed former Prime Minister David Cameron, who left Downing Street following the Brexit vote in 2016, to the Foreign Office.

    Only 19 per cent claimed they would vote for the Conservative Party if a general election were held tomorrow.

    Almost half of voters, 49 per cent, revealed they would vote for Labour.

    Richard Tice’s Reform UK also looks likely to benefit from Tory woes as 11 per cent of respondents threw their weight behind the populist party.

    Support for the Liberal Democrats stands at just nine per cent and the Green Party is registering around seven per cent.


    https://www.gbnews.com/politics/rishi-sunak-people-polling-rwanda-supreme-court

    Matt Goodwin.

    I can only assume this poll is dodgy in a whole world of ways.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,508

    Ah, women.

    I used to think that the feminisation of politics would lead to less ego, less posturing, and less, well, politicking.

    Liz, Nad, and Suella have certainly been a learning experience.

    :D

    Brilliant, now it's women's fault.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,919
    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    She’s now up to 18m views

    Ridiculous. Vanishingly few tweets even by global megastars get that kind of attention

    Someone quite clever and powerful is gaming TwiX to aid Braverman, in a significant way. Who why and how?

    Could be important if it continues. I wonder if it is AI

    Al who? Pacino? Gore? Jazeera?
    "I will call you Betty. And baby when you call me you will call me Al"
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    Look at all those Remainers rushing back to the Tories now David Duke of Brexit has got a lordship and a free country house

    Millions of them! And thank god, because otherwise the Tories would be polling lower than Mebyon Kernow
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,072
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    19m now

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    The Cameron bounce! I said it was a genius move by Sunak - as @TheScreamingEagles and @TOPPING told us
    Phantom poll. It's bollocks imho..
    Remember OGH’s golden rule: a rogue poll is a poll with a result you don’t like
    In fairness, this one is run by Matt “Godwin” Goodwin, so probably worthy of a degree of scepticism
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,966
    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    To my mind, the problem with much of the political right, in this country and in much of the rest of the world, is that they shout a lot, but are quite ineffectual in practice.

    That’s Suella Braverman. Over-promise, under-deliver.

    A much better strategy would be to talk moderate, and act right.

    “Walk softly, and carry a big stick.”

    But she quite persuasively explains in THE LETTER that she wanted to get things done but was constantly thwarted by number 10 and the civil service

    I can well believe that on Rwanda. Most of them will find Rwanda distasteful and cruel blah blah. Which is fine - that’s a moral choice - but if that is your opinion don’t simultaneously make “Rwanda” a policy

    My suspicion is that they wanted the credit for trying Rwanda, but they wanted to get knocked back, so they wouldn’t have to do it. Then they could go to the voters and say ooh look we tried vote for us to really do it next time!

    Then they would have done nothing. Again

    By contrast Braverman ACTUALLY wanted to do it
    This has been going on forever though

    My Enoch memory vault is a bit rusty, but there’s an interview with him in the early 70s where he says the exact same thing about Edward Heath’s government; that they wanted the credit for cutting immigration but weren’t prepared to actually do anything about it
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425

    Leon said:

    19m now

    44k of whom liked it. Which sounds like a very low proportion to me but happy to be corrected.
    I agree. Something dodgy. But that’s interesting in itself - if some powerful manipulators are getting behind Suella….
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 27,993
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    19m now

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    The Cameron bounce! I said it was a genius move by Sunak - as @TheScreamingEagles and @TOPPING told us
    Phantom poll. It's bollocks imho..
    Remember OGH’s golden rule: a rogue poll is a poll with a result you don’t like
    Not a rogue. But an outlier. The Tory share has been drifting downwards all November.
    We aren't in mid-term anymore.
    But swingback. Shy Tories. Reform.
    There was a "decent" other poll today for the Tories showing them only 16 % behind.
    Which is precisely the MAXIMUM lead Ed Miliband ever had in any poll.
    A vast number of variables are going to have to come together perfectly for the Tories to be forcing a Hung Parliament.
    Unfortunately for them. A competent plan is one.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749
    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
  • Options
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    She’s now up to 18m views

    Ridiculous. Vanishingly few tweets even by global megastars get that kind of attention

    Someone quite clever and powerful is gaming TwiX to aid Braverman, in a significant way. Who why and how?

    Could be important if it continues. I wonder if it is AI

    You’d instantly think the Russians, but then why? They either boost pro-Russians, or people who will divide society. One thing she’s not evinced, yet (but maybe Steve Bannon can work on this) is any particularly pro-Russian sentiments. And they are on the Palestinian / Iranian side in this battle.

    So it would have to be a division tactic. If so then you’d expect similar patterns of social media boosting for other characters on her side of the argument (JRM say) and their opposite numbers on the other side (Piers Corbyn? George Galloway?).

    Alternatively it’s just because everyone with an interest in UK politics is reading her tweets today, and reposting them like crazy. It could be that. Or a bit of both.
    I’ve noticed that pro-Israeli tweets and politicians get really high numbers. Hmm. But I don’t want to sound like a crank

    Braverman is also getting a lot of replies and reposts and likes, so it’s a sophisticated operation if it is “an operation”

    And there has to be some gaming here. No UK politician gets 18m views for a tweet, not even the PM (I’ve looked). One earlier this week, by Braverman, got 22m

    Indians?
    I noticed that if I watch a video on Facebook and let it play some more the third or fourth, after a couple of train videos, is generally a piece of pro-Israel material. Is that because I've contributed to discussions on the topic on here? It's odd. Presumably someone is paying for it.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    I can believe People Polling are skewed against the Tories (tho they might still be right). But more important is the movement. Tories down (and reform up?) which is what you’d expect if the reshuffle has bombed
  • Options
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    19m now

    44k of whom liked it. Which sounds like a very low proportion to me but happy to be corrected.
    I agree. Something dodgy. But that’s interesting in itself - if some powerful manipulators are getting behind Suella….
    Presumably either Russia, China, the transatlantic billionaire donor class or anyone else who wishes Britain harm.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749
    viewcode said:

    DougSeal said:

    Leon said:

    She’s now up to 18m views

    Ridiculous. Vanishingly few tweets even by global megastars get that kind of attention

    Someone quite clever and powerful is gaming TwiX to aid Braverman, in a significant way. Who why and how?

    Could be important if it continues. I wonder if it is AI

    Al who? Pacino? Gore? Jazeera?
    "I will call you Betty. And baby when you call me you will call me Al"
    Now it's clear - Betty Truss is behind it all!
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,785
    edited November 2023
    Scott_xP said:

    @alexwickham

    NEW: Suella Braverman has in her possession physical documents that show Rishi Sunak reneged on a deal with her to make him leader, sources say

    — they may become public in the coming days along with further revelations about the PM’s record on migration

    I have in my hand a piece of paper…

    Suella who?
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,097
    edited November 2023
    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    ReformUK now just 1% behind the UKIP total Farage got in 2015 if that poll is correct and closer to the Tories than the Tories are to Labour, even if the LDs are down 2% on 2019 (which Cameron did help with). If replicated at a general election the Tories would get just 20 seats with Sunak and Hunt and Cleverly and Braverman all losing their seats.

    https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/fcgi-bin/usercode.py?scotcontrol=Y&CON=19&LAB=49&LIB=9&Reform=11&Green=7&UKIP=&TVCON=&TVLAB=&TVLIB=&TVReform=&TVGreen=&TVUKIP=&SCOTCON=19.5&SCOTLAB=33.5&SCOTLIB=5.5&SCOTReform=1&SCOTGreen=2.5&SCOTUKIP=&SCOTNAT=34&display=AllChanged&regorseat=(none)&boundary=2019base

    Sunak needs to shore up his right flank fast if that poll is correct (though it is Goodwin and the 19% PP has the Tories on now is still higher than the 14% PP had the Truss led Tories on on 20th October last year)
    https://peoplepolling.org/tables/202210_GBN_W42_full.pdf#subsection*.12
  • Options
    Leon said:

    I can believe People Polling are skewed against the Tories (tho they might still be right). But more important is the movement. Tories down (and reform up?) which is what you’d expect if the reshuffle has bombed

    Did you Deltapoll I posted upthread? (Con +4).
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    She’s now up to 18m views

    Ridiculous. Vanishingly few tweets even by global megastars get that kind of attention

    Someone quite clever and powerful is gaming TwiX to aid Braverman, in a significant way. Who why and how?

    Could be important if it continues. I wonder if it is AI

    You’d instantly think the Russians, but then why? They either boost pro-Russians, or people who will divide society. One thing she’s not evinced, yet (but maybe Steve Bannon can work on this) is any particularly pro-Russian sentiments. And they are on the Palestinian / Iranian side in this battle.

    So it would have to be a division tactic. If so then you’d expect similar patterns of social media boosting for other characters on her side of the argument (JRM say) and their opposite numbers on the other side (Piers Corbyn? George Galloway?).

    Alternatively it’s just because everyone with an interest in UK politics is reading her tweets today, and reposting them like crazy. It could be that. Or a bit of both.
    I’ve noticed that pro-Israeli tweets and politicians get really high numbers. Hmm. But I don’t want to sound like a crank

    Braverman is also getting a lot of replies and reposts and likes, so it’s a sophisticated operation if it is “an operation”

    And there has to be some gaming here. No UK politician gets 18m views for a tweet, not even the PM (I’ve looked). One earlier this week, by Braverman, got 22m

    Indians?
    I noticed that if I watch a video on Facebook and let it play some more the third or fourth, after a couple of train videos, is generally a piece of pro-Israel material. Is that because I've contributed to discussions on the topic on here? It's odd. Presumably someone is paying for it.
    Well we know the Russians and Chinese are pumping out pro-pal material on TikTok. Maybe this is a counter operation by the pro-Israeli side
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749
    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    ReformUK now just 1% behind the UKIP total Farage got in 2015 if that poll is correct and closer to the Tories than the Tories are to Labour.

    Sunak needs to shore up his right flank fast if that poll is correct (though it is Goodwin and the 19% PP has the Tories on now is still higher than the 14% PP had the Truss led Tories on on 20th October last year
    https://peoplepolling.org/tables/202210_GBN_W42_full.pdf#subsection*.12
    Are People Polling members of the British Polling Council?
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,930

    I see the crazier Corbyn bro is claiming 7th Oct was Israeli false flag operation.

    Families dinners must be a blast.

    Surprised it took this long for that idea to get a bit of attention.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    That poll would not have caught any of the reaction to the reshuffle. And tbf maybe this one hasn’t either

    Doesn’t it take a few days for political events to percolate down to polls?
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,719

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a lot of volatility in the Tory score in the next 2 weeks. Don’t forget we also have the Autumn statement next week which will be yet another day of conservatives in the news.

    I doubt the great British public have a settled view of this yet. What’s sure though is that if they go into yet another bout of open warfare they’re going to plummet.
  • Options
    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,805

    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    ReformUK now just 1% behind the UKIP total Farage got in 2015 if that poll is correct and closer to the Tories than the Tories are to Labour.

    Sunak needs to shore up his right flank fast if that poll is correct (though it is Goodwin and the 19% PP has the Tories on now is still higher than the 14% PP had the Truss led Tories on on 20th October last year
    https://peoplepolling.org/tables/202210_GBN_W42_full.pdf#subsection*.12
    Are People Polling members of the British Polling Council?
    Yes they are.

    https://www.britishpollingcouncil.org/officers-members/
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a lot of volatility in the Tory score in the next 2 weeks. Don’t forget we also have the Autumn statement next week which will be yet another day of conservatives in the news.

    I doubt the great British public have a settled view of this yet. What’s sure though is that if they go into yet another bout of open warfare they’re going to plummet.
    Well the Tories are deffo going into open infighting. Sunak brought that on with his “brilliant” reshuffle
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,930



    Scott_xP said:

    @alexwickham

    NEW: Suella Braverman has in her possession physical documents that show Rishi Sunak reneged on a deal with her to make him leader, sources say

    — they may become public in the coming days along with further revelations about the PM’s record on migration

    I have in my hand a piece of paper…

    Suella who?
    Has Sunak's camp actually denied they had a deal yet? I'd have thought the potential hit to his internal authority would be whether his word can be trusted, not whether they put his word down on paper.

    Obviously if they are denying there was a deal then written proof is more impactful.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    That poll would not have caught any of the reaction to the reshuffle. And tbf maybe this one hasn’t either

    Doesn’t it take a few days for political events to percolate down to polls?
    True dat.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,966
    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    ReformUK now just 1% behind the UKIP total Farage got in 2015 if that poll is correct and closer to the Tories than the Tories are to Labour, even if the LDs are down 2% on 2019 (which Cameron did help with). If replicated at a general election the Tories would get just 20 seats with Sunak and Hunt and Cleverly and Braverman all losing their seats.

    https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/fcgi-bin/usercode.py?scotcontrol=Y&CON=19&LAB=49&LIB=9&Reform=11&Green=7&UKIP=&TVCON=&TVLAB=&TVLIB=&TVReform=&TVGreen=&TVUKIP=&SCOTCON=19.5&SCOTLAB=33.5&SCOTLIB=5.5&SCOTReform=1&SCOTGreen=2.5&SCOTUKIP=&SCOTNAT=34&display=AllChanged&regorseat=(none)&boundary=2019base

    Sunak needs to shore up his right flank fast if that poll is correct (though it is Goodwin and the 19% PP has the Tories on now is still higher than the 14% PP had the Truss led Tories on on 20th October last year)
    https://peoplepolling.org/tables/202210_GBN_W42_full.pdf#subsection*.12
    Compared to their last poll, the only change is Tories losing 2 pts to Reform
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited November 2023
    kle4 said:

    I see the crazier Corbyn bro is claiming 7th Oct was Israeli false flag operation.

    Families dinners must be a blast.

    Surprised it took this long for that idea to get a bit of attention.
    The apologists were too busy arguing if it was 1 baby beheaded by an overexcited Hamas Freedom Fighter or more than that.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    I accept this poll may well be an outlier, but nonetheless it is objectively funny. Especially after the “greatest reshuffle in world history”


    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%

    Chortle
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,930
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a lot of volatility in the Tory score in the next 2 weeks. Don’t forget we also have the Autumn statement next week which will be yet another day of conservatives in the news.

    I doubt the great British public have a settled view of this yet. What’s sure though is that if they go into yet another bout of open warfare they’re going to plummet.
    Well the Tories are deffo going into open infighting. Sunak brought that on with his “brilliant” reshuffle
    The infighting was there whether open or not, and a reshuffle had been trailed for a long time. Bottom line is they needed to pick a direction for the last year in office, and they won't get all on board with that direction so best to have the argument now?

    Not entirely convinced they've picked the most effective direction, but like Labour a few years ago the factions are pretty irreconcilable at the moment.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    kle4 said:



    Scott_xP said:

    @alexwickham

    NEW: Suella Braverman has in her possession physical documents that show Rishi Sunak reneged on a deal with her to make him leader, sources say

    — they may become public in the coming days along with further revelations about the PM’s record on migration

    I have in my hand a piece of paper…

    Suella who?
    Has Sunak's camp actually denied they had a deal yet? I'd have thought the potential hit to his internal authority would be whether his word can be trusted, not whether they put his word down on paper.

    Obviously if they are denying there was a deal then written proof is more impactful.
    No, they explicitly did not deny it. So it sounds like there may be some extant proof

    Which js really dangerous for Sunak
  • Options
    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a lot of volatility in the Tory score in the next 2 weeks. Don’t forget we also have the Autumn statement next week which will be yet another day of conservatives in the news.

    I doubt the great British public have a settled view of this yet. What’s sure though is that if they go into yet another bout of open warfare they’re going to plummet.
    Well the Tories are deffo going into open infighting. Sunak brought that on with his “brilliant” reshuffle
    Another year of this.

    Jeez.

    Britain totally adrift while we wait for this circus to end.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425
    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a lot of volatility in the Tory score in the next 2 weeks. Don’t forget we also have the Autumn statement next week which will be yet another day of conservatives in the news.

    I doubt the great British public have a settled view of this yet. What’s sure though is that if they go into yet another bout of open warfare they’re going to plummet.
    Well the Tories are deffo going into open infighting. Sunak brought that on with his “brilliant” reshuffle
    The infighting was there whether open or not, and a reshuffle had been trailed for a long time. Bottom line is they needed to pick a direction for the last year in office, and they won't get all on board with that direction so best to have the argument now?

    Not entirely convinced they've picked the most effective direction, but like Labour a few years ago the factions are pretty irreconcilable at the moment.
    Sacking Braverman was a mistake; appointing Cameron was a mistake
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,930
    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    To my mind, the problem with much of the political right, in this country and in much of the rest of the world, is that they shout a lot, but are quite ineffectual in practice.

    That’s Suella Braverman. Over-promise, under-deliver.

    A much better strategy would be to talk moderate, and act right.

    “Walk softly, and carry a big stick.”

    But she quite persuasively explains in THE LETTER that she wanted to get things done but was constantly thwarted by number 10 and the civil service

    I can well believe that on Rwanda. Most of them will find Rwanda distasteful and cruel blah blah. Which is fine - that’s a moral choice - but if that is your opinion don’t simultaneously make “Rwanda” a policy

    My suspicion is that they wanted the credit for trying Rwanda, but they wanted to get knocked back, so they wouldn’t have to do it. Then they could go to the voters and say ooh look we tried vote for us to really do it next time!

    Then they would have done nothing. Again

    By contrast Braverman ACTUALLY wanted to do it
    This has been going on forever though

    My Enoch memory vault is a bit rusty, but there’s an interview with him in the early 70s where he says the exact same thing about Edward Heath’s government; that they wanted the credit for cutting immigration but weren’t prepared to actually do anything about it
    The public don't help, since they claim to want it and probably mean it, but it's not like they consistently punish those who do not deliver it, so I can see why politicians think noises would be enough most of the time.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,097
    edited November 2023
    Leon said:

    I accept this poll may well be an outlier, but nonetheless it is objectively funny. Especially after the “greatest reshuffle in world history”


    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%

    Chortle

    Say what you like about John Major but at least in 1997 he largely kept the right behind him to get to 30% (with only small leakage to the Referendum party who got 3%).

    Now Sunak on that poll has almost split the right in half, 30% still voting for rightwing parties but 11% going Reform and only 19% Tory.

    However it is Goodwin and I expect other pollsters will have less dramatic a shift
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,520
    A
    Leon said:

    kle4 said:



    Scott_xP said:

    @alexwickham

    NEW: Suella Braverman has in her possession physical documents that show Rishi Sunak reneged on a deal with her to make him leader, sources say

    — they may become public in the coming days along with further revelations about the PM’s record on migration

    I have in my hand a piece of paper…

    Suella who?
    Has Sunak's camp actually denied they had a deal yet? I'd have thought the potential hit to his internal authority would be whether his word can be trusted, not whether they put his word down on paper.

    Obviously if they are denying there was a deal then written proof is more impactful.
    No, they explicitly did not deny it. So it sounds like there may be some extant proof

    Which js really dangerous for Sunak
    So two politicians came to an agreement between themselves. One has ditched it - and the other politician. Because he can.

    Isn't that politics 101?
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,749
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a lot of volatility in the Tory score in the next 2 weeks. Don’t forget we also have the Autumn statement next week which will be yet another day of conservatives in the news.

    I doubt the great British public have a settled view of this yet. What’s sure though is that if they go into yet another bout of open warfare they’re going to plummet.
    I am struggling to work out how the Autumn statement can bring any boost to Tory poll numbers.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,930
    Leon said:

    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a lot of volatility in the Tory score in the next 2 weeks. Don’t forget we also have the Autumn statement next week which will be yet another day of conservatives in the news.

    I doubt the great British public have a settled view of this yet. What’s sure though is that if they go into yet another bout of open warfare they’re going to plummet.
    Well the Tories are deffo going into open infighting. Sunak brought that on with his “brilliant” reshuffle
    The infighting was there whether open or not, and a reshuffle had been trailed for a long time. Bottom line is they needed to pick a direction for the last year in office, and they won't get all on board with that direction so best to have the argument now?

    Not entirely convinced they've picked the most effective direction, but like Labour a few years ago the factions are pretty irreconcilable at the moment.
    Sacking Braverman was a mistake; appointing Cameron was a mistake
    Braverman did seem to want to be sacked in fairness, people have been speculating on that for months, at some point he had to accept she was the real boss or try to reassert authority.

    The Cameron appointment was more just bizarre and unexpected.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,386
    Leon said:

    I accept this poll may well be an outlier, but nonetheless it is objectively funny. Especially after the “greatest reshuffle in world history”


    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%

    Chortle

    It's certainly eye-catching.

    What will be interesting to see is whether it shapes the narrative, and the reshuffle is talked about in the context of a 30 point polling deficit and Reform in double figures. Because that sort of narrative can be self-fulfilling.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,719

    A

    Leon said:

    kle4 said:



    Scott_xP said:

    @alexwickham

    NEW: Suella Braverman has in her possession physical documents that show Rishi Sunak reneged on a deal with her to make him leader, sources say

    — they may become public in the coming days along with further revelations about the PM’s record on migration

    I have in my hand a piece of paper…

    Suella who?
    Has Sunak's camp actually denied they had a deal yet? I'd have thought the potential hit to his internal authority would be whether his word can be trusted, not whether they put his word down on paper.

    Obviously if they are denying there was a deal then written proof is more impactful.
    No, they explicitly did not deny it. So it sounds like there may be some extant proof

    Which js really dangerous for Sunak
    So two politicians came to an agreement between themselves. One has ditched it - and the other politician. Because he can.

    Isn't that politics 101?
    Granita politics
  • Options
    Leon said:

    I accept this poll may well be an outlier, but nonetheless it is objectively funny. Especially after the “greatest reshuffle in world history”


    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%

    Chortle

    Apparently it was a GB poll by Goodwin of 2019 conservative voters
  • Options

    George Mann
    @sgfmann
    ·
    3m
    Daily Express: War is declared #TomorrowsPapersToday
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,520
    TimS said:

    A

    Leon said:

    kle4 said:



    Scott_xP said:

    @alexwickham

    NEW: Suella Braverman has in her possession physical documents that show Rishi Sunak reneged on a deal with her to make him leader, sources say

    — they may become public in the coming days along with further revelations about the PM’s record on migration

    I have in my hand a piece of paper…

    Suella who?
    Has Sunak's camp actually denied they had a deal yet? I'd have thought the potential hit to his internal authority would be whether his word can be trusted, not whether they put his word down on paper.

    Obviously if they are denying there was a deal then written proof is more impactful.
    No, they explicitly did not deny it. So it sounds like there may be some extant proof

    Which js really dangerous for Sunak
    So two politicians came to an agreement between themselves. One has ditched it - and the other politician. Because he can.

    Isn't that politics 101?
    Granita politics
    That's a bingo
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,097
    Leon said:

    I accept this poll may well be an outlier, but nonetheless it is objectively funny. Especially after the “greatest reshuffle in world history”


    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%

    Chortle

    That is also not a million miles from the Canadian 1993 result of Liberals 41%, Reform 18%, Canadian Tories 16%, NDP 6%
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_Canadian_federal_election
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,425

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a lot of volatility in the Tory score in the next 2 weeks. Don’t forget we also have the Autumn statement next week which will be yet another day of conservatives in the news.

    I doubt the great British public have a settled view of this yet. What’s sure though is that if they go into yet another bout of open warfare they’re going to plummet.
    Well the Tories are deffo going into open infighting. Sunak brought that on with his “brilliant” reshuffle
    Another year of this.

    Jeez.

    Britain totally adrift while we wait for this circus to end.
    Yes, my laughter is tinged with despair

    It’s time for the Tories to go. Just eff off. Bereft of ideas, led by a silly man, spineless on policy, full of corruption, so lacking in talent they have to appoint a non-MP loser wanker as foreign secretary - enough!

    For God’s sake: GO
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,930
    edited November 2023

    Leon said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a lot of volatility in the Tory score in the next 2 weeks. Don’t forget we also have the Autumn statement next week which will be yet another day of conservatives in the news.

    I doubt the great British public have a settled view of this yet. What’s sure though is that if they go into yet another bout of open warfare they’re going to plummet.
    Well the Tories are deffo going into open infighting. Sunak brought that on with his “brilliant” reshuffle
    Another year of this.

    Jeez.

    Britain totally adrift while we wait for this circus to end.
    I predict only 11 months 1 week until it ends, so well below a year, no problem.

    General Election 24th October 2024, change in government 25th October, the 2 year anniversary for Rishi.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,919

    Leon said:

    I accept this poll may well be an outlier, but nonetheless it is objectively funny. Especially after the “greatest reshuffle in world history”


    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%

    Chortle

    Apparently it was a GB poll by Goodwin of 2019 conservative voters
    Forgive me but I doubt that. if 49% of 2019 Con voters have gone to Lab then Con are not just dead but annihilated.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,719

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "PeoplePolling for GB News

    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%"

    https://vote-2012.proboards.com/post/1433390/thread

    It's only -2pp on the Tory score since the previous poll by that company, so not as bad as it looks at first glance.
    Ahahahahahaha

    A comment for the ages. Can the moderators preserve it in amber?
    Much as I'd love the Tory poll number to go through the floor, the latest Deltapoll conducted 10th-13th November shows a 4 point increase in Tory support. Admittedly, only 1 of the 3 days of polling will reflect Braverman's sacking & Cameron's appointment.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a lot of volatility in the Tory score in the next 2 weeks. Don’t forget we also have the Autumn statement next week which will be yet another day of conservatives in the news.

    I doubt the great British public have a settled view of this yet. What’s sure though is that if they go into yet another bout of open warfare they’re going to plummet.
    I am struggling to work out how the Autumn statement can bring any boost to Tory poll numbers.
    I don’t think it’ll shift their polling. I do think it’ll probably help along the longer term drift upwards in the blue wall and downwards in the red. It’s going to be very business focused statement.

    That’s if the party isn’t already in open warfare by then. But do they have the numbers for a VONC? Not sure.
  • Options
    Leon said:

    kle4 said:



    Scott_xP said:

    @alexwickham

    NEW: Suella Braverman has in her possession physical documents that show Rishi Sunak reneged on a deal with her to make him leader, sources say

    — they may become public in the coming days along with further revelations about the PM’s record on migration

    I have in my hand a piece of paper…

    Suella who?
    Has Sunak's camp actually denied they had a deal yet? I'd have thought the potential hit to his internal authority would be whether his word can be trusted, not whether they put his word down on paper.

    Obviously if they are denying there was a deal then written proof is more impactful.
    No, they explicitly did not deny it. So it sounds like there may be some extant proof

    Which js really dangerous for Sunak
    is it?

    How many swing voters could give a f whether Braverman has a gravy stained bit of paper saying the boss promised she could be even more horrible than she was?

    They just see division and chaos.

  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,719
    All things being equal if this week’s reshuffle does have a net impact on the polls we might expect to see Ref up and Lib Dems down, with Labour and green stable and conservatives either slightly up or slightly down or flat, depending on whether they’ve managed to gain more from LDs than lose to Refuk.

    Interesting we’re not seeing any sign of Labour left drift to Green despite the Palestine marches.
  • Options
    viewcode said:

    Leon said:

    I accept this poll may well be an outlier, but nonetheless it is objectively funny. Especially after the “greatest reshuffle in world history”


    Lab 49%
    Con 19%
    Reform 11%
    LD 9%
    Green 7%

    Chortle

    Apparently it was a GB poll by Goodwin of 2019 conservative voters
    Forgive me but I doubt that. if 49% of 2019 Con voters have gone to Lab then Con are not just dead but annihilated.
    I have no idea how valid it is as a poll and await polls from recognised pollsters
This discussion has been closed.