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Will Keir Starmer face leadership challenge before the next general election? – politicalbetting.com

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  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 20,719

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    I wonder what Newcastle's position will be on the prohibition on serving alcohol during matches.
    Do you mean not allowing alcohol in the stands? There's talk about that being allowed again. Personally I'd rather we didn't because people spill drinks and it's not very nice.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 40,280
    Taz said:

    Newcastle having a shocker. 😂😂😂😂

    Kane scores against a low ranking team. Again.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 25,459
    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    I think you are absolutely correct about who is moving: the reality is that LA/SF/The Valley are all ridiculously expensive places to live. A software engineer earning $120k/year (which is hardly a pittance) with a wife earning $60k (also not a pittance) will struggle to earn enough to buy a three bedroom house in the Bay Area.

    If they move to Phoenix or Austin, and his salary drops to $100k, and hers to $50k - well, suddenly they can afford a nice house, in a nice area, with decent public schools.

    California is paying the price for imposing far too many restrictions on new building, which has sent property prices through the roof.

    (With a friend, I bought a plot of land in Los Angeles to build a spec house. We acquired it three years ago. We are still at least a year away from breaking ground.)
    Yes, well you and I both know people who have made the move. HYFUD has got the voices in his head.
    I know quite a few people who've left the Bay Area to move to places like South Carolina and Texas in the last couple of years.
    This is what we progressives need to counter the greater FPTP efficiency of the reactionary vote. Hopefully we'll see similar here in England. Migration in serious numbers from Highgate to Hartlepool, Battersea to Barnsley, Islington to any of the many rough & ready provincial places starting with an "I". Once Johnson has Levelled Up everywhere there's absolutely no reason why this shouldn't happen.
    Excuse me while I die laughing at the idea high earning upper middle class liberal 'progressives' would ever consider moving to Hartlepool, Barnsley and Stoke from Hampstead and Islington!

    The rural home counties is as conservative as they would go (and that at least has Country Life housing and views)
    Stoke? That doesn't begin with an "I". How can people move from Islington to Stoke?

    More seriously, though, it sounds like you, a Conservative member and activist, are writing off Levelling Up already. Cat says goodbye to bag.
    We can reduce the gap between North and South via HS2 and better infrastructure north of the Watford gap but we are never going to make Hull or Stoke global cities to rival London
    But HS2 is pre-Johnson. Sounds like you plan to just surf for free on prior decisions and seek to pluck low hanging fruit. Lack of ambition. Or rather the ambition falls way way short of the bouncy rhetoric.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 14,945
    edited October 17

    tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    Spurs deserve to be relegated for that kit alone.
    It's their third kit! Look at how terrible their away kit is...


    It scares me that Nike not only make the kits for Spurs but they also make them for Liverpool.
    The Newcastle chairman on his phone calling his bank to see if he can stop the cheque
  • tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    I wonder what Newcastle's position will be on the prohibition on serving alcohol during matches.
    Do you mean not allowing alcohol in the stands? There's talk about that being allowed again. Personally I'd rather we didn't because people spill drinks and it's not very nice.
    We'll get those ridiculous beer snakes.

    Am not mad keen on allowing alcohol in the stands.

    I wonder if it happens it could impact the choice of live TV matches as the police say no.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 4,447
    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    How do you know that? What evidence do you have? I at least know a few that have made the move, though I admit they won't be fully representative.
    There will be some liberals moving because of high house prices, there will be some conservatives moving too for cultural and high tax reasons.

    Conservative Louisiana and Oklahoma and Ohio also send large numbers of migrants to Texas too
    How do you know these things? You have yet to give any evidence. I at least have anecdotes.
    You have anecdote.

    The 2 top states with migrants moving to Texas are California and Trump voting Florida, followed by Trump voting Louisiana and Oklahoma

    https://apnews.com/article/texas-business-census-2020-science-0d436b250dc07111bff4b4f6cdd6682b#:~:text=Most of the Texas movers,Texas over the last decade.&text=Louisiana, Oklahoma, Illinois, Georgia,residents are moving to Texas.
    I assume by your emphasis on 'Trump voting' you are arguing their will be more Republicans moving from Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma to Texas because there are more of them. Yet you abandon that argument re California. Any reason?

    If there are specific reasons why Republicans may be moving from California over Democrats, don't you think the same might be true re Democrats in Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 20,719

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 40,280
    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    Spurs deserve to be relegated for that kit alone.
    It's their third kit! Look at how terrible their away kit is...


    It scares me that Nike not only make the kits for Spurs but they also make them for Liverpool.
    I always thought Nike made fairly decent kits/clothes for Arsenal. When we switched to PUMA it was so obvious that they were aiming for the bottom of the market. But I think they've all gone downmarket in recent seasons.
    I liked the New Balance Liverpool kits but that's all they did.

    The Nike ranges are really great, that said, having football obsessed kids is an expensive business.

    Do clubs need to release three kits every season with all the resultant three different training outfits as well?
    If I was Prime Minister, I'd pass a law banning the releasing of a new home kit every season. I think alternating new home/away kits each season is fair enough.
    I really cannot see any politician doing that. Exploiting supporters is something that comes naturally to football clubs and politicians alike.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 2,827
    As an Arsenal fan, the only correct attitude is Come On You Spurs.

    Newcastle have this week surely jumped to the top of everyone’s least favourite club list.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 849

    eek said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    Spurs deserve to be relegated for that kit alone.
    I'm not sure drinking, public vomiting and visiting Riyadh would be a good combination.

    On the other hand if a Geordie was arrested (or worse) there would be an awful lot of damage done to the sportwashing being attempted.
    I have a Scottish boss and both of us are convinced that Scotland are going to qualify for next year's world cup.

    The irony will be Scotland qualify for their first world cup in a quarter of a century and it will be in Qatar, somewhere the Tartan Army and their hard drinking fans will fit in royally.
    The Tartan Army are #45 ers these days - if they die of the DT's so be it.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 4,447
    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    I think you are absolutely correct about who is moving: the reality is that LA/SF/The Valley are all ridiculously expensive places to live. A software engineer earning $120k/year (which is hardly a pittance) with a wife earning $60k (also not a pittance) will struggle to earn enough to buy a three bedroom house in the Bay Area.

    If they move to Phoenix or Austin, and his salary drops to $100k, and hers to $50k - well, suddenly they can afford a nice house, in a nice area, with decent public schools.

    California is paying the price for imposing far too many restrictions on new building, which has sent property prices through the roof.

    (With a friend, I bought a plot of land in Los Angeles to build a spec house. We acquired it three years ago. We are still at least a year away from breaking ground.)
    Yes, well you and I both know people who have made the move. HYFUD has got the voices in his head.
    I know quite a few people who've left the Bay Area to move to places like South Carolina and Texas in the last couple of years.
    This is what we progressives need to counter the greater FPTP efficiency of the reactionary vote. Hopefully we'll see similar here in England. Migration in serious numbers from Highgate to Hartlepool, Battersea to Barnsley, Islington to any of the many rough & ready provincial places starting with an "I". Once Johnson has Levelled Up everywhere there's absolutely no reason why this shouldn't happen.
    Excuse me while I die laughing at the idea high earning upper middle class liberal 'progressives' would ever consider moving to Hartlepool, Barnsley and Stoke from Hampstead and Islington!

    The rural home counties is as conservative as they would go (and that at least has Country Life housing and views)
    Stoke? That doesn't begin with an "I". How can people move from Islington to Stoke?

    More seriously, though, it sounds like you, a Conservative member and activist, are writing off Levelling Up already. Cat says goodbye to bag.
    We can reduce the gap between North and South via HS2 and better infrastructure north of the Watford gap but we are never going to make Hull or Stoke global cities to rival London
    But HS2 is pre-Johnson. Sounds like you plan to just surf for free on prior decisions and seek to pluck low hanging fruit. Lack of ambition. Or rather the ambition falls way way short of the bouncy rhetoric.
    Kinabula could you maybe let HYUFD know in advance when you are going to pull his leg?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 97,887
    edited October 17
    moonshine said:

    As an Arsenal fan, the only correct attitude is Come On You Spurs.

    Newcastle have this week surely jumped to the top of everyone’s least favourite club list.

    Not whilst Chelsea exist.

    The only English club whose fans have racially abused me.

    I have a dislike of West Ham and not because of the dildo brothers.

    Saw some West Ham fans making hissing noises at fans of Spurs a few years ago.
  • tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    Will watch that later on.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 4,553
    moonshine said:

    As an Arsenal fan, the only correct attitude is Come On You Spurs.

    Newcastle have this week surely jumped to the top of everyone’s least favourite club list.

    Not for me. What does a Swindon fan care if a premiership club gets a huge, immoral, backer. Most of them seem to have big money behind them.
    I reserve my least favourite status for MK Dons, who stole a club entirely, rather than try to reach the leagues from scratch. At least a new Wimbledon arose.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 2,827

    moonshine said:

    As an Arsenal fan, the only correct attitude is Come On You Spurs.

    Newcastle have this week surely jumped to the top of everyone’s least favourite club list.

    Not whilst Chelsea exist.

    The only English club whose fans have racially abused me.

    I have a dislike of West Ham and not because of the dildo brothers.

    Saw some West Ham fans making hissing noises at fans of Spurs a few years ago.
    That’s true, the fans of some clubs run the house of Saud close in dislikability.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 6,638
    edited October 17
    Scott_xP said:

    UK reports most COVID-19 cases in a day since mid-July http://reut.rs/3n87DFo https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1449763442093699073/photo/1

    I see lots of people talking about the Covid rate in the UK being high and how no one seems to concerned about it anymore. Have we now found the "acceptable level of death"?
    https://twitter.com/dizzy_thinks/status/1449265867901001728

    A significant amount of the current jump is the testing fiasco. People being retested etc. It’s going to take a while to figure out what is going on.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/StroudCorona


  • isamisam Posts: 38,522
    Scott_xP said:

    UK reports most COVID-19 cases in a day since mid-July http://reut.rs/3n87DFo https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1449763442093699073/photo/1

    I see lots of people talking about the Covid rate in the UK being high and how no one seems to concerned about it anymore. Have we now found the "acceptable level of death"?
    https://twitter.com/dizzy_thinks/status/1449265867901001728

    Deaths per week this year (Red) Last year (Amber) and the average of 5 previous years (Green)

    The totals so far are 436971 this year, 453803 last and 399883 average


  • isamisam Posts: 38,522
    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 20,187
    DougSeal said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK reports most COVID-19 cases in a day since mid-July http://reut.rs/3n87DFo https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1449763442093699073/photo/1

    I see lots of people talking about the Covid rate in the UK being high and how no one seems to concerned about it anymore. Have we now found the "acceptable level of death"?
    https://twitter.com/dizzy_thinks/status/1449265867901001728

    A significant amount of the current jump is the testing fiasco. People being retested etc. It’s going to take a while to figure out what is going on.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/StroudCorona


    Another reason not to use reporting day numbers...
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 64,406
    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Trump won 232 counties out of 254 in Texas in 2020, Biden just 22.

    Trump also won 22 out of 36 Texan congressional districts

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Texas
    You've proved my point. Look at the population growth of those 22 counties.

    https://www.kxan.com/news/national-news/us-census/data-heres-how-texas-population-increased-in-the-past-decade-according-to-the-2020-census/#:~:text=Hays County grew at the,top five fastest-growing counties.

    The fastest growing county in Texas - Hays - flipped from Trump to Biden.
    Interestingly if you determined the winner of Texas via FPTP of the Counties (like how the Electoral College is determined) then Biden won a landslide.

    The 22 counties that Biden won cast a total of 6,260,179 votes
    The 232 counties that Trump won cast a total of 5,054,877 votes
  • Really wish we never have to see another defibrillator used at a football match again.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 13,055
    moonshine said:

    As an Arsenal fan, the only correct attitude is Come On You Spurs.

    Newcastle have this week surely jumped to the top of everyone’s least favourite club list.

    A chant heard to memorable effect in one of the funniest TV parodies ever

    https://youtu.be/XGFknyGKtao
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 64,406

    Really wish we never have to see another defibrillator used at a football match again.

    Oh no what's happened this time? Hope whoever it is, is OK.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 849
    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    Sterling certainly seems to mince along a bit as his career progresess - but to be fair so do I.
  • isamisam Posts: 38,522
    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    Sterling certainly seems to mince along a bit as his career progresess - but to be fair so do I.
    He runs like Velma from Scooby Doo, but its not him! Married w kids isnt he?
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 21,319
    edited October 17

    DougSeal said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK reports most COVID-19 cases in a day since mid-July http://reut.rs/3n87DFo https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1449763442093699073/photo/1

    I see lots of people talking about the Covid rate in the UK being high and how no one seems to concerned about it anymore. Have we now found the "acceptable level of death"?
    https://twitter.com/dizzy_thinks/status/1449265867901001728

    A significant amount of the current jump is the testing fiasco. People being retested etc. It’s going to take a while to figure out what is going on.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/StroudCorona


    Another reason not to use reporting day numbers...
    The by sample of sample numbers are about to go mega for the South West regardless.

    If you've had a whole bunch of people with negatives not isolating then that increase the super spreader chances. And you can see the major pop centres in the west shooting up on incomplete days already.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 97,887
    edited October 17

    Really wish we never have to see another defibrillator used at a football match again.

    Oh no what's happened this time? Hope whoever it is, is OK.
    Someone in the stands at St James Park has had a medical episode, the players told the referee to stop the game and both medical teams have gone into the stands replete with a defibrillator. One of the players made a chest compressions gesture to the medical staff.

    About 10 mins after stopping the game the ref spoke to a policeman and has taken the players off.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 849
    isam said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    Sterling certainly seems to mince along a bit as his career progresess - but to be fair so do I.
    He runs like Velma from Scooby Doo, but its not him! Married w kids isnt he?
    It was just a guess as to who your mate's gaydar was picking up - Anyway you said you weren't going to speculate so I think we should probably stop now.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 64,406

    Really wish we never have to see another defibrillator used at a football match again.

    Oh no what's happened this time? Hope whoever it is, is OK.
    Someone in the stands at St James Park has had a medical episode, the players told the referee to stop the game and both medical teams have gone into the stands replete with a defibrillator. One of the players made a chest compressions gesture to the medical staff.

    About 10 mins after stopping the game the ref spoke to a policeman and has taken the players off.
    Oh dear that doesn't sound good. Hope whoever it is, is OK.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 4,447
    edited October 17

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Trump won 232 counties out of 254 in Texas in 2020, Biden just 22.

    Trump also won 22 out of 36 Texan congressional districts

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Texas
    You've proved my point. Look at the population growth of those 22 counties.

    https://www.kxan.com/news/national-news/us-census/data-heres-how-texas-population-increased-in-the-past-decade-according-to-the-2020-census/#:~:text=Hays County grew at the,top five fastest-growing counties.

    The fastest growing county in Texas - Hays - flipped from Trump to Biden.
    Interestingly if you determined the winner of Texas via FPTP of the Counties (like how the Electoral College is determined) then Biden won a landslide.

    The 22 counties that Biden won cast a total of 6,260,179 votes
    The 232 counties that Trump won cast a total of 5,054,877 votes
    Gosh that is remarkable. Is that due to gerrymandering or disproportionate turnout or what?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 20,719
    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    Sterling certainly seems to mince along a bit as his career progresess - but to be fair so do I.
    He runs like Velma from Scooby Doo, but its not him! Married w kids isnt he?
    It was just a guess as to who your mate's gaydar was picking up - Anyway you said you weren't going to speculate so I think we should probably stop now.
    If you watch the video, Matt says the worst thing is people ask him who he thinks is gay. He says something like “how the hell should I know?!”
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 9,766
    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    Sterling certainly seems to mince along a bit as his career progresess - but to be fair so do I.
    He runs like Velma from Scooby Doo, but its not him! Married w kids isnt he?
    It was just a guess as to who your mate's gaydar was picking up - Anyway you said you weren't going to speculate so I think we should probably stop now.
    The concept of "gaydar" is more than a little eeeuw, don't you think? And completely phony anyway, I know both straight people who are camp as fuck and gays with whom you would never know if you didn't know.
  • jonny83jonny83 Posts: 993
    Scott_xP said:

    UK reports most COVID-19 cases in a day since mid-July http://reut.rs/3n87DFo https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1449763442093699073/photo/1

    I see lots of people talking about the Covid rate in the UK being high and how no one seems to concerned about it anymore. Have we now found the "acceptable level of death"?
    https://twitter.com/dizzy_thinks/status/1449265867901001728

    It does seem quiet on the reporting front. I suspect that will change heading into the colder months with people's waning immunity levels and infections really starting to soar.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,694
    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Trump won 232 counties out of 254 in Texas in 2020, Biden just 22.

    Trump also won 22 out of 36 Texan congressional districts

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Texas
    You've proved my point. Look at the population growth of those 22 counties.

    https://www.kxan.com/news/national-news/us-census/data-heres-how-texas-population-increased-in-the-past-decade-according-to-the-2020-census/#:~:text=Hays County grew at the,top five fastest-growing counties.

    The fastest growing county in Texas - Hays - flipped from Trump to Biden.
    Interestingly if you determined the winner of Texas via FPTP of the Counties (like how the Electoral College is determined) then Biden won a landslide.

    The 22 counties that Biden won cast a total of 6,260,179 votes
    The 232 counties that Trump won cast a total of 5,054,877 votes
    Gosh that is remarkable. I'd that due to gerrymandering or disproportionate turnout or what?
    Err, no. It’s because those counties that the Democrat won had the biggest populations. And also substantial minorities of Republican voters.

    However, it’s moot because that is not how the system works.

    Anyway, on gerrymandering, here is a classic example of a partisan state heavily zigzagging it’s districts to rig the seats in one party’s favour. I’m sure those who criticise sharply states such as Texas for being a threat to democracy will do exactly the same here:

    https://chicago.suntimes.com/politics/2021/10/15/22729243/rep-marie-newman-democratic-illinois-congressional-map-redistricting-rep-adam-kinzinger
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 64,406
    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Trump won 232 counties out of 254 in Texas in 2020, Biden just 22.

    Trump also won 22 out of 36 Texan congressional districts

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Texas
    You've proved my point. Look at the population growth of those 22 counties.

    https://www.kxan.com/news/national-news/us-census/data-heres-how-texas-population-increased-in-the-past-decade-according-to-the-2020-census/#:~:text=Hays County grew at the,top five fastest-growing counties.

    The fastest growing county in Texas - Hays - flipped from Trump to Biden.
    Interestingly if you determined the winner of Texas via FPTP of the Counties (like how the Electoral College is determined) then Biden won a landslide.

    The 22 counties that Biden won cast a total of 6,260,179 votes
    The 232 counties that Trump won cast a total of 5,054,877 votes
    Gosh that is remarkable. I'd that due to gerrymandering or disproportionate turnout or what?
    A lot of the 'counties' in Texas are really tiny and unpopulated areas.

    Harris County, which contains the city of Houston, is both bigger geographically than most other counties and has a lot of people in it.

    Biden won almost all the populous counties, though given that Trump won more votes than Biden overall he must have won his counties proportionately by fewer votes than Trump won his by overall.
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 1,502
    jonny83 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK reports most COVID-19 cases in a day since mid-July http://reut.rs/3n87DFo https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1449763442093699073/photo/1

    I see lots of people talking about the Covid rate in the UK being high and how no one seems to concerned about it anymore. Have we now found the "acceptable level of death"?
    https://twitter.com/dizzy_thinks/status/1449265867901001728

    It does seem quiet on the reporting front. I suspect that will change heading into the colder months with people's waning immunity levels and infections really starting to soar.
    Seems to be literally 0 compliance with any public health measures at the moment.

    And the NHS is still fecked. Just not functioning at all to the point of impossibility in getting a face to face appointment or treatment
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 6,638
    edited October 17
    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Trump won 232 counties out of 254 in Texas in 2020, Biden just 22.

    Trump also won 22 out of 36 Texan congressional districts

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Texas
    You've proved my point. Look at the population growth of those 22 counties.

    https://www.kxan.com/news/national-news/us-census/data-heres-how-texas-population-increased-in-the-past-decade-according-to-the-2020-census/#:~:text=Hays County grew at the,top five fastest-growing counties.

    The fastest growing county in Texas - Hays - flipped from Trump to Biden.
    Interestingly if you determined the winner of Texas via FPTP of the Counties (like how the Electoral College is determined) then Biden won a landslide.

    The 22 counties that Biden won cast a total of 6,260,179 votes
    The 232 counties that Trump won cast a total of 5,054,877 votes
    Gosh that is remarkable. I'd that due to gerrymandering or disproportionate turnout or what?
    It’s simple - urban areas, with a greater concentration of voters, vote Democrat. Texas counties basically form a chessboard pattern over the state. Harris county, containing Houston, has a population of 4,731,145. Dallas county has 2,613,539 souks. Conversely Loving County, on the New Mexico border, has a population of 68 (sixty eight) - the smallest county in the USA.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 4,553

    jonny83 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK reports most COVID-19 cases in a day since mid-July http://reut.rs/3n87DFo https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1449763442093699073/photo/1

    I see lots of people talking about the Covid rate in the UK being high and how no one seems to concerned about it anymore. Have we now found the "acceptable level of death"?
    https://twitter.com/dizzy_thinks/status/1449265867901001728

    It does seem quiet on the reporting front. I suspect that will change heading into the colder months with people's waning immunity levels and infections really starting to soar.
    Seems to be literally 0 compliance with any public health measures at the moment.

    And the NHS is still fecked. Just not functioning at all to the point of impossibility in getting a face to face appointment or treatment
    It’s undoubtedly difficult right now, but what is the alternative. Back to lockdowns? Masks everywhere?
    Biggest thing we can do is crank up the vaccinations again. Boosters and kids. Something not going right there at the moment.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 25,459
    kjh said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    I think you are absolutely correct about who is moving: the reality is that LA/SF/The Valley are all ridiculously expensive places to live. A software engineer earning $120k/year (which is hardly a pittance) with a wife earning $60k (also not a pittance) will struggle to earn enough to buy a three bedroom house in the Bay Area.

    If they move to Phoenix or Austin, and his salary drops to $100k, and hers to $50k - well, suddenly they can afford a nice house, in a nice area, with decent public schools.

    California is paying the price for imposing far too many restrictions on new building, which has sent property prices through the roof.

    (With a friend, I bought a plot of land in Los Angeles to build a spec house. We acquired it three years ago. We are still at least a year away from breaking ground.)
    Yes, well you and I both know people who have made the move. HYFUD has got the voices in his head.
    I know quite a few people who've left the Bay Area to move to places like South Carolina and Texas in the last couple of years.
    This is what we progressives need to counter the greater FPTP efficiency of the reactionary vote. Hopefully we'll see similar here in England. Migration in serious numbers from Highgate to Hartlepool, Battersea to Barnsley, Islington to any of the many rough & ready provincial places starting with an "I". Once Johnson has Levelled Up everywhere there's absolutely no reason why this shouldn't happen.
    Excuse me while I die laughing at the idea high earning upper middle class liberal 'progressives' would ever consider moving to Hartlepool, Barnsley and Stoke from Hampstead and Islington!

    The rural home counties is as conservative as they would go (and that at least has Country Life housing and views)
    Stoke? That doesn't begin with an "I". How can people move from Islington to Stoke?

    More seriously, though, it sounds like you, a Conservative member and activist, are writing off Levelling Up already. Cat says goodbye to bag.
    We can reduce the gap between North and South via HS2 and better infrastructure north of the Watford gap but we are never going to make Hull or Stoke global cities to rival London
    But HS2 is pre-Johnson. Sounds like you plan to just surf for free on prior decisions and seek to pluck low hanging fruit. Lack of ambition. Or rather the ambition falls way way short of the bouncy rhetoric.
    Kinabula could you maybe let HYUFD know in advance when you are going to pull his leg?
    :smile: - Ok.

    But there's a piercing point to my playful probe of this staunchest of true blue loyalists. In this case it was to draw out how much genuine passion he has for his party's core policy of Levelling Up. The answer? Very little. The passion lies elsewhere. I bet the same applies at the higher echelons of the party. Sorry, the even higher echelons.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 13,826

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    I don't think there are any countries that implement Old Testament Christian punishments based on Christianity. There are countries that implement Islamic punishments such as Afghanistan, Iran and Saudi Arabia.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 4,447

    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Trump won 232 counties out of 254 in Texas in 2020, Biden just 22.

    Trump also won 22 out of 36 Texan congressional districts

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Texas
    You've proved my point. Look at the population growth of those 22 counties.

    https://www.kxan.com/news/national-news/us-census/data-heres-how-texas-population-increased-in-the-past-decade-according-to-the-2020-census/#:~:text=Hays County grew at the,top five fastest-growing counties.

    The fastest growing county in Texas - Hays - flipped from Trump to Biden.
    Interestingly if you determined the winner of Texas via FPTP of the Counties (like how the Electoral College is determined) then Biden won a landslide.

    The 22 counties that Biden won cast a total of 6,260,179 votes
    The 232 counties that Trump won cast a total of 5,054,877 votes
    Gosh that is remarkable. I'd that due to gerrymandering or disproportionate turnout or what?
    A lot of the 'counties' in Texas are really tiny and unpopulated areas.

    Harris County, which contains the city of Houston, is both bigger geographically than most other counties and has a lot of people in it.

    Biden won almost all the populous counties, though given that Trump won more votes than Biden overall he must have won his counties proportionately by fewer votes than Trump won his by overall.
    Cheers, appreciated.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 4,447
    DougSeal said:

    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Trump won 232 counties out of 254 in Texas in 2020, Biden just 22.

    Trump also won 22 out of 36 Texan congressional districts

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Texas
    You've proved my point. Look at the population growth of those 22 counties.

    https://www.kxan.com/news/national-news/us-census/data-heres-how-texas-population-increased-in-the-past-decade-according-to-the-2020-census/#:~:text=Hays County grew at the,top five fastest-growing counties.

    The fastest growing county in Texas - Hays - flipped from Trump to Biden.
    Interestingly if you determined the winner of Texas via FPTP of the Counties (like how the Electoral College is determined) then Biden won a landslide.

    The 22 counties that Biden won cast a total of 6,260,179 votes
    The 232 counties that Trump won cast a total of 5,054,877 votes
    Gosh that is remarkable. I'd that due to gerrymandering or disproportionate turnout or what?
    It’s simple - urban areas, with a greater concentration of voters, vote democrat. Texas counties basically form a chessboard pattern over the state. Harris county, containing Houston, has a population of 4,731,145. Dallas county has 2,613,539 souks. Conversely Loving County, on the New Mexico border, has a population of 68 (sixty eight) - the smallest county in the USA.
    Cheers appreciated.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 849
    IshmaelZ said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    Sterling certainly seems to mince along a bit as his career progresess - but to be fair so do I.
    He runs like Velma from Scooby Doo, but its not him! Married w kids isnt he?
    It was just a guess as to who your mate's gaydar was picking up - Anyway you said you weren't going to speculate so I think we should probably stop now.
    The concept of "gaydar" is more than a little eeeuw, don't you think? And completely phony anyway, I know both straight people who are camp as fuck and gays with whom you would never know if you didn't know.
    If that's binary options you can put me in the camp as fuck bracket.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 849
    tlg86 said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    Sterling certainly seems to mince along a bit as his career progresess - but to be fair so do I.
    He runs like Velma from Scooby Doo, but its not him! Married w kids isnt he?
    It was just a guess as to who your mate's gaydar was picking up - Anyway you said you weren't going to speculate so I think we should probably stop now.
    If you watch the video, Matt says the worst thing is people ask him who he thinks is gay. He says something like “how the hell should I know?!”
    As I stated earlier in the thread I'm on limited access to internet so can't afford to watch vids unfortumately.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 4,844
    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    There must be about 300 premier league players every week so it wouldn't surprise me if one of them was gay. Probably several.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 25,459
    edited October 17
    IshmaelZ said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    Sterling certainly seems to mince along a bit as his career progresess - but to be fair so do I.
    He runs like Velma from Scooby Doo, but its not him! Married w kids isnt he?
    It was just a guess as to who your mate's gaydar was picking up - Anyway you said you weren't going to speculate so I think we should probably stop now.
    The concept of "gaydar" is more than a little eeeuw, don't you think? And completely phony anyway, I know both straight people who are camp as fuck and gays with whom you would never know if you didn't know.
    Graham Le Saux read the Guardian in the dressing room. That raised some eyebrows.

    EDIT: And not only that the Graham was spelt Graeme. I mean c'mon ...
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 20,187
    Alistair said:

    DougSeal said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK reports most COVID-19 cases in a day since mid-July http://reut.rs/3n87DFo https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1449763442093699073/photo/1

    I see lots of people talking about the Covid rate in the UK being high and how no one seems to concerned about it anymore. Have we now found the "acceptable level of death"?
    https://twitter.com/dizzy_thinks/status/1449265867901001728

    A significant amount of the current jump is the testing fiasco. People being retested etc. It’s going to take a while to figure out what is going on.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/StroudCorona


    Another reason not to use reporting day numbers...
    The by sample of sample numbers are about to go mega for the South West regardless.

    If you've had a whole bunch of people with negatives not isolating then that increase the super spreader chances. And you can see the major pop centres in the west shooting up on incomplete days already.
    What I see in the data is longer running trends - people are always trying to say that X causes the current wave.
  • AslanAslan Posts: 732

    moonshine said:

    As an Arsenal fan, the only correct attitude is Come On You Spurs.

    Newcastle have this week surely jumped to the top of everyone’s least favourite club list.

    Not for me. What does a Swindon fan care if a premiership club gets a huge, immoral, backer. Most of them seem to have big money behind them.
    I reserve my least favourite status for MK Dons, who stole a club entirely, rather than try to reach the leagues from scratch. At least a new Wimbledon arose.
    There are levels of immorality.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,694
    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    How do you know that? What evidence do you have? I at least know a few that have made the move, though I admit they won't be fully representative.
    There will be some liberals moving because of high house prices, there will be some conservatives moving too for cultural and high tax reasons.

    Conservative Louisiana and Oklahoma and Ohio also send large numbers of migrants to Texas too
    How do you know these things? You have yet to give any evidence. I at least have anecdotes.
    You have anecdote.

    The 2 top states with migrants moving to Texas are California and Trump voting Florida, followed by Trump voting Louisiana and Oklahoma

    https://apnews.com/article/texas-business-census-2020-science-0d436b250dc07111bff4b4f6cdd6682b#:~:text=Most of the Texas movers,Texas over the last decade.&text=Louisiana, Oklahoma, Illinois, Georgia,residents are moving to Texas.
    I assume by your emphasis on 'Trump voting' you are arguing their will be more Republicans moving from Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma to Texas because there are more of them. Yet you abandon that argument re California. Any reason?

    If there are specific reasons why Republicans may be moving from California over Democrats, don't you think the same might be true re Democrats in Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma?
    Texas is pretty big (29 million) so sweeping generalisations should be treated with caution but I’ll throw in a few myself as to what is happening there which are shifting the voting patterns:

    - College-educated professionals moving to places such as Dallas and Houston, as they move away from being oil towns, plus liberal cities such as Austin and San Antonio. Help to Democrats
    - Students coming to Texas to study and who stay - ditto
    - People fleeing California because of what is happening there. There will be exceptions but expect this more positive for the Republicans, as they don’t want CA replicated in Texas.
    - People coming from Florida and Louisiana. Probably coming for jobs than politicised reasons but I would think those fleeing “illiberal” Florida / Louisiana are not going to choose Texas. So probably helps Republicans in the state;
    - Hispanic vote moving more GOP

    The latter I think is the crucial point. If the Hispanic vote wasn’t shifting, I would say TX would become more like North Carolina where an influx of professionals into Raleigh has helped the Democrats. But the Hispanic vote is trending more GOP and so, I’m inclined to think that 2020 was the peak of Democrat chances in TX - from now on, a combination of the Hispanic vote shift plus some migration from CA and other Republican areas bolsters their position. I also suspect some of what Abbott is doing will also make TX less attractive a place to live for liberals.
  • AslanAslan Posts: 732
    MrEd said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    How do you know that? What evidence do you have? I at least know a few that have made the move, though I admit they won't be fully representative.
    There will be some liberals moving because of high house prices, there will be some conservatives moving too for cultural and high tax reasons.

    Conservative Louisiana and Oklahoma and Ohio also send large numbers of migrants to Texas too
    How do you know these things? You have yet to give any evidence. I at least have anecdotes.
    You have anecdote.

    The 2 top states with migrants moving to Texas are California and Trump voting Florida, followed by Trump voting Louisiana and Oklahoma

    https://apnews.com/article/texas-business-census-2020-science-0d436b250dc07111bff4b4f6cdd6682b#:~:text=Most of the Texas movers,Texas over the last decade.&text=Louisiana, Oklahoma, Illinois, Georgia,residents are moving to Texas.
    I assume by your emphasis on 'Trump voting' you are arguing their will be more Republicans moving from Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma to Texas because there are more of them. Yet you abandon that argument re California. Any reason?

    If there are specific reasons why Republicans may be moving from California over Democrats, don't you think the same might be true re Democrats in Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma?
    Texas is pretty big (29 million) so sweeping generalisations should be treated with caution but I’ll throw in a few myself as to what is happening there which are shifting the voting patterns:

    - College-educated professionals moving to places such as Dallas and Houston, as they move away from being oil towns, plus liberal cities such as Austin and San Antonio. Help to Democrats
    - Students coming to Texas to study and who stay - ditto
    - People fleeing California because of what is happening there. There will be exceptions but expect this more positive for the Republicans, as they don’t want CA replicated in Texas.
    - People coming from Florida and Louisiana. Probably coming for jobs than politicised reasons but I would think those fleeing “illiberal” Florida / Louisiana are not going to choose Texas. So probably helps Republicans in the state;
    - Hispanic vote moving more GOP

    The latter I think is the crucial point. If the Hispanic vote wasn’t shifting, I would say TX would become more like North Carolina where an influx of professionals into Raleigh has helped the Democrats. But the Hispanic vote is trending more GOP and so, I’m inclined to think that 2020 was the peak of Democrat chances in TX - from now on, a combination of the Hispanic vote shift plus some migration from CA and other Republican areas bolsters their position. I also suspect some of what Abbott is doing will also make TX less attractive a place to live for liberals.
    The "Hispanic trending to GOP" has a trend of exactly one election, held during a pandemic.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 26,208
    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    I think you are absolutely correct about who is moving: the reality is that LA/SF/The Valley are all ridiculously expensive places to live. A software engineer earning $120k/year (which is hardly a pittance) with a wife earning $60k (also not a pittance) will struggle to earn enough to buy a three bedroom house in the Bay Area.

    If they move to Phoenix or Austin, and his salary drops to $100k, and hers to $50k - well, suddenly they can afford a nice house, in a nice area, with decent public schools.

    California is paying the price for imposing far too many restrictions on new building, which has sent property prices through the roof.

    (With a friend, I bought a plot of land in Los Angeles to build a spec house. We acquired it three years ago. We are still at least a year away from breaking ground.)
    Yes, well you and I both know people who have made the move. HYFUD has got the voices in his head.
    I know quite a few people who've left the Bay Area to move to places like South Carolina and Texas in the last couple of years.
    This is what we progressives need to counter the greater FPTP efficiency of the reactionary vote. Hopefully we'll see similar here in England. Migration in serious numbers from Highgate to Hartlepool, Battersea to Barnsley, Islington to any of the many rough & ready provincial places starting with an "I". Once Johnson has Levelled Up everywhere there's absolutely no reason why this shouldn't happen.
    Excuse me while I die laughing at the idea high earning upper middle class liberal 'progressives' would ever consider moving to Hartlepool, Barnsley and Stoke from Hampstead and Islington!

    The rural home counties is as conservative as they would go (and that at least has Country Life housing and views)
    Stoke? That doesn't begin with an "I". How can people move from Islington to Stoke?

    More seriously, though, it sounds like you, a Conservative member and activist, are writing off Levelling Up already. Cat says goodbye to bag.
    We can reduce the gap between North and South via HS2 and better infrastructure north of the Watford gap but we are never going to make Hull or Stoke global cities to rival London
    But HS2 is pre-Johnson. Sounds like you plan to just surf for free on prior decisions and seek to pluck low hanging fruit. Lack of ambition. Or rather the ambition falls way way short of the bouncy rhetoric.
    That's a rather strange argument, especially as infrastructure takes decades+ to plan and implement.

    One common argument about the problems facing politics is short-termism: politicians only being concerned with policies that will show positive fruit before the next electoral cycle. Politicians who cancel long-standing projects just to replace them with 'their' projects, which themselves get cancelled within 4-5 years, should be condemned.

    Just look at the US and space: a new administration comes in, looks at a multi-year project, then cancels it. It's massively wasteful, and the 'new' projects are often worse than what preceded them. (Biden's been a rare example who hasn't).

    I'm pleasantly surprised Johnson hasn't done much cancelling.

    The real question is what long-term projects a politician *starts* whilst in power: I'm glad that Biden's infrastructure bill had received cross-party support - albeit it is being held up by his own party!
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 20,187
    UK caess by specimen date

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    UK cases by specimen date and scaled to 100K

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  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 6,460
    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    I think you are absolutely correct about who is moving: the reality is that LA/SF/The Valley are all ridiculously expensive places to live. A software engineer earning $120k/year (which is hardly a pittance) with a wife earning $60k (also not a pittance) will struggle to earn enough to buy a three bedroom house in the Bay Area.

    If they move to Phoenix or Austin, and his salary drops to $100k, and hers to $50k - well, suddenly they can afford a nice house, in a nice area, with decent public schools.

    California is paying the price for imposing far too many restrictions on new building, which has sent property prices through the roof.

    (With a friend, I bought a plot of land in Los Angeles to build a spec house. We acquired it three years ago. We are still at least a year away from breaking ground.)
    Yes, well you and I both know people who have made the move. HYFUD has got the voices in his head.
    I know quite a few people who've left the Bay Area to move to places like South Carolina and Texas in the last couple of years.
    This is what we progressives need to counter the greater FPTP efficiency of the reactionary vote. Hopefully we'll see similar here in England. Migration in serious numbers from Highgate to Hartlepool, Battersea to Barnsley, Islington to any of the many rough & ready provincial places starting with an "I". Once Johnson has Levelled Up everywhere there's absolutely no reason why this shouldn't happen.
    Excuse me while I die laughing at the idea high earning upper middle class liberal 'progressives' would ever consider moving to Hartlepool, Barnsley and Stoke from Hampstead and Islington!

    The rural home counties is as conservative as they would go (and that at least has Country Life housing and views)
    Plenty of people have moved from Islington to Stoke. Stoke Newington, that is.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 20,187
    UK Local R

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    UK case summary

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    UK hospitals

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    UK deaths

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    Case trends

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  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 6,460

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    Most interesting findings from that poll...

    Should the government bail out companies hit by high energy prices?

    Yes - 45%
    No - 35%

    I wonder what the percentages would be if you replaced government with tax payer.

    Do you support vaccine passports?

    Yes - 61%
    No - 28%

    And yet...

    Should dancers on Strictly be dropped if they don't have the jab

    Yes - 51%
    No - 30%

    So when it affects something specific, people aren't so keen.

    Are you worried about...

    Interest rates rising?

    Yes - 66%
    No - 29%

    Inflation rising?

    Yes - 80%
    No - 17%

    I wonder what the cross-tab is like on interest rates and inflation. How many people understand that rates are a tool for controlling inflation?

    Losing your job?

    Yes - 42%
    No - 55%

    I reckon this is a bit different to 30 years ago.

    Will you buy an electric vehicle before 2030?

    Yes - 71%
    No - 14%

    As pointed out by @Casino_Royale, this is very revealing.

    Who should succeed the Queen?

    Charles - 30%
    William - 41%

    Plenty will be disappointed (unless HMQ outlives Charles, of course).

    Should the next James Bond be a Woman?
    Sir Keir says yes
    Public say 56/34 No

    Is it right to say only Women have a Cervix?
    Sir Keir says No
    Public say 50/23 Yes
    What would Boris think?
    He is an expert in the field, I believe.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 20,187
    Age related data

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  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 20,187
    Age related data scaled to 100K

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  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 849
    What happens if it's a draw? #bbcnfl ?
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 849
    JBriskin3 said:

    What happens if it's a draw? #bbcnfl ?

    Jaguers win
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 34,927
    isam said:

    kinabalu said:

    Taz said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    I think you are absolutely correct about who is moving: the reality is that LA/SF/The Valley are all ridiculously expensive places to live. A software engineer earning $120k/year (which is hardly a pittance) with a wife earning $60k (also not a pittance) will struggle to earn enough to buy a three bedroom house in the Bay Area.

    If they move to Phoenix or Austin, and his salary drops to $100k, and hers to $50k - well, suddenly they can afford a nice house, in a nice area, with decent public schools.

    California is paying the price for imposing far too many restrictions on new building, which has sent property prices through the roof.

    (With a friend, I bought a plot of land in Los Angeles to build a spec house. We acquired it three years ago. We are still at least a year away from breaking ground.)
    Yes, well you and I both know people who have made the move. HYFUD has got the voices in his head.
    I know quite a few people who've left the Bay Area to move to places like South Carolina and Texas in the last couple of years.
    This is what we progressives need to counter the greater FPTP efficiency of the reactionary vote. Hopefully we'll see similar here in England. Migration in serious numbers from Highgate to Hartlepool, Battersea to Barnsley, Islington to any of the many rough & ready provincial places starting with an "I". Once Johnson has Levelled Up everywhere there's absolutely no reason why this shouldn't happen.
    Islywn ?
    That sounds like Wales so still not quite fitting the bill. Ixworth is the place I naturally think of as where somebody from Islington might like to move once the Magnificent Muscly Man has Got Levelling Up Done - as I think he likes to put it, in case our attention strays after 4 words.
    Ipswich?
    Italy more likely
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 849
    edited October 17
    Well that was an enjoyable enough afternoon. So kind of the BBC to put something I might actually be interested in on twice a year. And I only have to pay 20 quid a month for it!
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 34,927
    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Tbf. You can be a "California Conservative". My Godfather was one. I doubt he'd have felt comfortable as a Texas Conservative.
    The scary thing is that Socal Republicans (aka “Nixon Conservatives”) are now so moderate they barely fit in the modern GOP
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 26,208

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    There must be about 300 premier league players every week so it wouldn't surprise me if one of them was gay. Probably several.
    If 1-2% of people are gay, then 3-6 Premier League players should be gay. if they are not out, then either:
    *) gay people are, for some reason, not good enough to be top-league players
    *) football discourages / prevents gay players from reaching the top flight, or
    *) players in the top flight don't feel free to come out, for whatever reason.

    The first option is ridiculous, especially as several gay figures have come out in other sports, such as rugby. IMV it is therefore an issue within football, and one football should tackle.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 11,979
    DougSeal said:

    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Trump won 232 counties out of 254 in Texas in 2020, Biden just 22.

    Trump also won 22 out of 36 Texan congressional districts

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Texas
    You've proved my point. Look at the population growth of those 22 counties.

    https://www.kxan.com/news/national-news/us-census/data-heres-how-texas-population-increased-in-the-past-decade-according-to-the-2020-census/#:~:text=Hays County grew at the,top five fastest-growing counties.

    The fastest growing county in Texas - Hays - flipped from Trump to Biden.
    Interestingly if you determined the winner of Texas via FPTP of the Counties (like how the Electoral College is determined) then Biden won a landslide.

    The 22 counties that Biden won cast a total of 6,260,179 votes
    The 232 counties that Trump won cast a total of 5,054,877 votes
    Gosh that is remarkable. I'd that due to gerrymandering or disproportionate turnout or what?
    It’s simple - urban areas, with a greater concentration of voters, vote Democrat. Texas counties basically form a chessboard pattern over the state. Harris county, containing Houston, has a population of 4,731,145. Dallas county has 2,613,539 souks. Conversely Loving County, on the New Mexico border, has a population of 68 (sixty eight) - the smallest county in the USA.
    Not enough loving in Loving County?
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 64,406

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    There must be about 300 premier league players every week so it wouldn't surprise me if one of them was gay. Probably several.
    If 1-2% of people are gay, then 3-6 Premier League players should be gay. if they are not out, then either:
    *) gay people are, for some reason, not good enough to be top-league players
    *) football discourages / prevents gay players from reaching the top flight, or
    *) players in the top flight don't feel free to come out, for whatever reason.

    The first option is ridiculous, especially as several gay figures have come out in other sports, such as rugby. IMV it is therefore an issue within football, and one football should tackle.
    It could be

    d) players in the top flight do feel free to come out, but don't want to.

    If there's ~3 top flight gay players then its entirely possible those three would rather keep their private life private and have their football rather than their sexuality be what is spoken about.

    A bit like how a Tory MP 'came out' earlier this week but simply didn't speak about it before because she didn't think it important to speak about and its not what she wanted to be known for.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 849

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    There must be about 300 premier league players every week so it wouldn't surprise me if one of them was gay. Probably several.
    If 1-2% of people are gay, then 3-6 Premier League players should be gay. if they are not out, then either:
    *) gay people are, for some reason, not good enough to be top-league players
    *) football discourages / prevents gay players from reaching the top flight, or
    *) players in the top flight don't feel free to come out, for whatever reason.

    The first option is ridiculous, especially as several gay figures have come out in other sports, such as rugby. IMV it is therefore an issue within football, and one football should tackle.
    It could be

    d) players in the top flight do feel free to come out, but don't want to.

    If there's ~3 top flight gay players then its entirely possible those three would rather keep their private life private and have their football rather than their sexuality be what is spoken about.

    A bit like how a Tory MP 'came out' earlier this week but simply didn't speak about it before because she didn't think it important to speak about and its not what she wanted to be known for.
    A good comment. The media set a very bad precedent with Simon Hughes if you ask me.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 25,459
    edited October 17

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    I think you are absolutely correct about who is moving: the reality is that LA/SF/The Valley are all ridiculously expensive places to live. A software engineer earning $120k/year (which is hardly a pittance) with a wife earning $60k (also not a pittance) will struggle to earn enough to buy a three bedroom house in the Bay Area.

    If they move to Phoenix or Austin, and his salary drops to $100k, and hers to $50k - well, suddenly they can afford a nice house, in a nice area, with decent public schools.

    California is paying the price for imposing far too many restrictions on new building, which has sent property prices through the roof.

    (With a friend, I bought a plot of land in Los Angeles to build a spec house. We acquired it three years ago. We are still at least a year away from breaking ground.)
    Yes, well you and I both know people who have made the move. HYFUD has got the voices in his head.
    I know quite a few people who've left the Bay Area to move to places like South Carolina and Texas in the last couple of years.
    This is what we progressives need to counter the greater FPTP efficiency of the reactionary vote. Hopefully we'll see similar here in England. Migration in serious numbers from Highgate to Hartlepool, Battersea to Barnsley, Islington to any of the many rough & ready provincial places starting with an "I". Once Johnson has Levelled Up everywhere there's absolutely no reason why this shouldn't happen.
    Excuse me while I die laughing at the idea high earning upper middle class liberal 'progressives' would ever consider moving to Hartlepool, Barnsley and Stoke from Hampstead and Islington!

    The rural home counties is as conservative as they would go (and that at least has Country Life housing and views)
    Stoke? That doesn't begin with an "I". How can people move from Islington to Stoke?

    More seriously, though, it sounds like you, a Conservative member and activist, are writing off Levelling Up already. Cat says goodbye to bag.
    We can reduce the gap between North and South via HS2 and better infrastructure north of the Watford gap but we are never going to make Hull or Stoke global cities to rival London
    But HS2 is pre-Johnson. Sounds like you plan to just surf for free on prior decisions and seek to pluck low hanging fruit. Lack of ambition. Or rather the ambition falls way way short of the bouncy rhetoric.
    That's a rather strange argument, especially as infrastructure takes decades+ to plan and implement.

    One common argument about the problems facing politics is short-termism: politicians only being concerned with policies that will show positive fruit before the next electoral cycle. Politicians who cancel long-standing projects just to replace them with 'their' projects, which themselves get cancelled within 4-5 years, should be condemned.

    Just look at the US and space: a new administration comes in, looks at a multi-year project, then cancels it. It's massively wasteful, and the 'new' projects are often worse than what preceded them. (Biden's been a rare example who hasn't).

    I'm pleasantly surprised Johnson hasn't done much cancelling.

    The real question is what long-term projects a politician *starts* whilst in power: I'm glad that Biden's infrastructure bill had received cross-party support - albeit it is being held up by his own party!
    That WAS my argument. HS2 isn't a Johnson levelling up initiative. I agree with your general point and going ahead with HS2 is a decision of this government I support. It's easy to nitpick your way out of making these big investments, it's never the right time, there's always influential people and voters who are het up and against, energetic autodidacts saying they know better, let's just delay and delay, or cancel, leave it to somebody else in a few years, bla bla, but then what happens is nothing happens, and time passes, and an extremely unsatisfactory state of affairs creeps up on you. It eventually becomes intolerable and now you HAVE to act, by which time it's got harder and more expensive and you've bent things even more out of shape with all the tactical "fixes" you've done and the compromises you've made in order to keep the previous show on the road. To me it's very like when you put off embracing new tech in your personal life, something I'm habitually guilty of. It's always the wrong decision to "hold out" and I never learn.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,562
    tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    I wonder what Newcastle's position will be on the prohibition on serving alcohol during matches.
    Do you mean not allowing alcohol in the stands? There's talk about that being allowed again. Personally I'd rather we didn't because people spill drinks and it's not very nice.
    In the US, alcohol is allowed in the stands. It's quite nice to sip a pint of beer while cheering your team on.
  • Not wishing to put the mockers on it but Scotland might just be able to beat a test nation in the World T20.

    On Sky Sports Cricket now.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 64,406
    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    I wonder what Newcastle's position will be on the prohibition on serving alcohol during matches.
    Do you mean not allowing alcohol in the stands? There's talk about that being allowed again. Personally I'd rather we didn't because people spill drinks and it's not very nice.
    In the US, alcohol is allowed in the stands. It's quite nice to sip a pint of beer while cheering your team on.
    Yes because who could sit through American sport while sober?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlORWhsJjNM
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 4,553
    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    I wonder what Newcastle's position will be on the prohibition on serving alcohol during matches.
    Do you mean not allowing alcohol in the stands? There's talk about that being allowed again. Personally I'd rather we didn't because people spill drinks and it's not very nice.
    In the US, alcohol is allowed in the stands. It's quite nice to sip a pint of beer while cheering your team on.
    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    I wonder what Newcastle's position will be on the prohibition on serving alcohol during matches.
    Do you mean not allowing alcohol in the stands? There's talk about that being allowed again. Personally I'd rather we didn't because people spill drinks and it's not very nice.
    In the US, alcohol is allowed in the stands. It's quite nice to sip a pint of beer while cheering your team on.
    Problem around football culture, as seen at the euros final. Cricket fans, rugby fans etc can be trusted to sit with no segregation and to have beer at the seat. Until football changes it’s culture, there will always be issues with alcohol. I find it astonishing that normal people have to be separated out into respective fans for football, but for no other sport.
  • JBriskin3JBriskin3 Posts: 849

    Not wishing to put the mockers on it but Scotland might just be able to beat a test nation in the World T20.

    On Sky Sports Cricket now.

    My Saturday paper tells me it's Bangladesh.

    C'mon Scotland!
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 20,719

    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    I wonder what Newcastle's position will be on the prohibition on serving alcohol during matches.
    Do you mean not allowing alcohol in the stands? There's talk about that being allowed again. Personally I'd rather we didn't because people spill drinks and it's not very nice.
    In the US, alcohol is allowed in the stands. It's quite nice to sip a pint of beer while cheering your team on.
    Problem around football culture, as seen at the euros final. Cricket fans, rugby fans etc can be trusted to sit with no segregation and to have beer at the seat. Until football changes it’s culture, there will always be issues with alcohol. I find it astonishing that normal people have to be separated out into respective fans for football, but for no other sport.
    I'd say the segregation makes for a better atmosphere. When Cologne bought 20,000 fans to Emirates in 2017, they bought up tickets in the Arsenal parts of the ground. But they didn't just sit in the seats they had bought, they all wanted to run round to where the actual away section was. And that's what cause the hour delay to the kick off. I went home as I had to be up early and wasn't prepared to wait until 21:00 for the game to start.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 31,982
    edited October 17

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    There must be about 300 premier league players every week so it wouldn't surprise me if one of them was gay. Probably several.
    If 1-2% of people are gay, then 3-6 Premier League players should be gay. if they are not out, then either:
    *) gay people are, for some reason, not good enough to be top-league players
    *) football discourages / prevents gay players from reaching the top flight, or
    *) players in the top flight don't feel free to come out, for whatever reason.

    The first option is ridiculous, especially as several gay figures have come out in other sports, such as rugby. IMV it is therefore an issue within football, and one football should tackle.
    It could be

    d) players in the top flight do feel free to come out, but don't want to.

    If there's ~3 top flight gay players then its entirely possible those three would rather keep their private life private and have their football rather than their sexuality be what is spoken about.

    A bit like how a Tory MP 'came out' earlier this week but simply didn't speak about it before because she didn't think it important to speak about and its not what she wanted to be known for.
    True. It's no one's business but their own.

    That said if one of the reasons they don't want to come out is because of the perceived anti gay environment within football then that brings us back to it being football's problem.
  • Just switched on the football

    Who on earth designed Spurs strip

    It is dreadful and also makes it difficult to follow play
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 21,319

    Alistair said:

    DougSeal said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK reports most COVID-19 cases in a day since mid-July http://reut.rs/3n87DFo https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1449763442093699073/photo/1

    I see lots of people talking about the Covid rate in the UK being high and how no one seems to concerned about it anymore. Have we now found the "acceptable level of death"?
    https://twitter.com/dizzy_thinks/status/1449265867901001728

    A significant amount of the current jump is the testing fiasco. People being retested etc. It’s going to take a while to figure out what is going on.

    https://mobile.twitter.com/StroudCorona


    Another reason not to use reporting day numbers...
    The by sample of sample numbers are about to go mega for the South West regardless.

    If you've had a whole bunch of people with negatives not isolating then that increase the super spreader chances. And you can see the major pop centres in the west shooting up on incomplete days already.
    What I see in the data is longer running trends - people are always trying to say that X causes the current wave.
    Whilst i generally subscribe to that view of long running trends over events I feel places like Bristol more that trippling their daily case counts over night suggests "an event" rather than a trend in this case.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 2,827

    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    I wonder what Newcastle's position will be on the prohibition on serving alcohol during matches.
    Do you mean not allowing alcohol in the stands? There's talk about that being allowed again. Personally I'd rather we didn't because people spill drinks and it's not very nice.
    In the US, alcohol is allowed in the stands. It's quite nice to sip a pint of beer while cheering your team on.
    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    I wonder what Newcastle's position will be on the prohibition on serving alcohol during matches.
    Do you mean not allowing alcohol in the stands? There's talk about that being allowed again. Personally I'd rather we didn't because people spill drinks and it's not very nice.
    In the US, alcohol is allowed in the stands. It's quite nice to sip a pint of beer while cheering your team on.
    Problem around football culture, as seen at the euros final. Cricket fans, rugby fans etc can be trusted to sit with no segregation and to have beer at the seat. Until football changes it’s culture, there will always be issues with alcohol. I find it astonishing that normal people have to be separated out into respective fans for football, but for no other sport.
    Cricket and rugby are entertaining ways to spend a day, a nice diversion over which to catch up with mates. But for too many, football is the most consequential aspect of life. It also seems to be a weird kind of therapy for some people. Somewhere inside they think they’ve paid their money and that gives them the right to vent their spleen for an hour and half at the on pitch performers. You know the type. Spends the entire match screaming in expletives but when it’s all done queues serenely for the tube home.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 20,719
    TOPPING said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    There must be about 300 premier league players every week so it wouldn't surprise me if one of them was gay. Probably several.
    If 1-2% of people are gay, then 3-6 Premier League players should be gay. if they are not out, then either:
    *) gay people are, for some reason, not good enough to be top-league players
    *) football discourages / prevents gay players from reaching the top flight, or
    *) players in the top flight don't feel free to come out, for whatever reason.

    The first option is ridiculous, especially as several gay figures have come out in other sports, such as rugby. IMV it is therefore an issue within football, and one football should tackle.
    It could be

    d) players in the top flight do feel free to come out, but don't want to.

    If there's ~3 top flight gay players then its entirely possible those three would rather keep their private life private and have their football rather than their sexuality be what is spoken about.

    A bit like how a Tory MP 'came out' earlier this week but simply didn't speak about it before because she didn't think it important to speak about and its not what she wanted to be known for.
    True. It's no one's business but their own.

    That said if one of the reasons they don't want to come out is because of the perceived anti gay environment within football then that brings us back to it being football's problem.
    I'd recommend watching the video. This issue is discussed.
  • rpjsrpjs Posts: 3,585
    rcs1000 said:

    MrEd said:

    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Trump won 232 counties out of 254 in Texas in 2020, Biden just 22.

    Trump also won 22 out of 36 Texan congressional districts

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_presidential_election_in_Texas
    You've proved my point. Look at the population growth of those 22 counties.

    https://www.kxan.com/news/national-news/us-census/data-heres-how-texas-population-increased-in-the-past-decade-according-to-the-2020-census/#:~:text=Hays County grew at the,top five fastest-growing counties.

    The fastest growing county in Texas - Hays - flipped from Trump to Biden.
    Interestingly if you determined the winner of Texas via FPTP of the Counties (like how the Electoral College is determined) then Biden won a landslide.

    The 22 counties that Biden won cast a total of 6,260,179 votes
    The 232 counties that Trump won cast a total of 5,054,877 votes
    Gosh that is remarkable. I'd that due to gerrymandering or disproportionate turnout or what?
    Err, no. It’s because those counties that the Democrat won had the biggest populations. And also substantial minorities of Republican voters.

    However, it’s moot because that is not how the system works.

    Anyway, on gerrymandering, here is a classic example of a partisan state heavily zigzagging it’s districts to rig the seats in one party’s favour. I’m sure those who criticise sharply states such as Texas for being a threat to democracy will do exactly the same here:

    https://chicago.suntimes.com/politics/2021/10/15/22729243/rep-marie-newman-democratic-illinois-congressional-map-redistricting-rep-adam-kinzinger
    @MrEd

    All gerrymandering is outrageous. It is a direct affront to democracy, and - yes - the Democrats started it, and are still at it today.

    But the answer is not to say "everyone does it. so it's OK", it's to say "how can we come to a solution so gerrymandering doesn't exist in future?"

    If we get rid of gerrymandering, we make individual votes more meaningful. That means people have more stake in the political process.

    It is notable that wherever there have been ballot initiatives against gerrymandering, they have passed (often by wide margins).
    Here in New York in November we will have a proposition on the ballot to make gerrymandering easier. I have no idea whether it will pass or not, but it will be an interesting one to watch.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,562
    MrEd said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    How do you know that? What evidence do you have? I at least know a few that have made the move, though I admit they won't be fully representative.
    There will be some liberals moving because of high house prices, there will be some conservatives moving too for cultural and high tax reasons.

    Conservative Louisiana and Oklahoma and Ohio also send large numbers of migrants to Texas too
    How do you know these things? You have yet to give any evidence. I at least have anecdotes.
    You have anecdote.

    The 2 top states with migrants moving to Texas are California and Trump voting Florida, followed by Trump voting Louisiana and Oklahoma

    https://apnews.com/article/texas-business-census-2020-science-0d436b250dc07111bff4b4f6cdd6682b#:~:text=Most of the Texas movers,Texas over the last decade.&text=Louisiana, Oklahoma, Illinois, Georgia,residents are moving to Texas.
    I assume by your emphasis on 'Trump voting' you are arguing their will be more Republicans moving from Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma to Texas because there are more of them. Yet you abandon that argument re California. Any reason?

    If there are specific reasons why Republicans may be moving from California over Democrats, don't you think the same might be true re Democrats in Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma?
    Texas is pretty big (29 million) so sweeping generalisations should be treated with caution but I’ll throw in a few myself as to what is happening there which are shifting the voting patterns:

    - College-educated professionals moving to places such as Dallas and Houston, as they move away from being oil towns, plus liberal cities such as Austin and San Antonio. Help to Democrats
    - Students coming to Texas to study and who stay - ditto
    - People fleeing California because of what is happening there. There will be exceptions but expect this more positive for the Republicans, as they don’t want CA replicated in Texas.
    - People coming from Florida and Louisiana. Probably coming for jobs than politicised reasons but I would think those fleeing “illiberal” Florida / Louisiana are not going to choose Texas. So probably helps Republicans in the state;
    - Hispanic vote moving more GOP

    The latter I think is the crucial point. If the Hispanic vote wasn’t shifting, I would say TX would become more like North Carolina where an influx of professionals into Raleigh has helped the Democrats. But the Hispanic vote is trending more GOP and so, I’m inclined to think that 2020 was the peak of Democrat chances in TX - from now on, a combination of the Hispanic vote shift plus some migration from CA and other Republican areas bolsters their position. I also suspect some of what Abbott is doing will also make TX less attractive a place to live for liberals.
    Interesting, but I disagree.

    I think that the trends in Texas are really very similar to the ones in Arizona. Almost all the growth in Texas's population is in urban and suburban areas, as the State become the US's second tech hub behind California.

    It's also worth noting that Trump's outperformance among Hispanics was more than all from Hispanics without college degrees. Among those with degrees, he went backwards from 2016.

    Texas was a resource State, but it is becoming a high tech, high education state, and I think that works against the Republicans in the long run.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 31,982
    tlg86 said:

    TOPPING said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    There must be about 300 premier league players every week so it wouldn't surprise me if one of them was gay. Probably several.
    If 1-2% of people are gay, then 3-6 Premier League players should be gay. if they are not out, then either:
    *) gay people are, for some reason, not good enough to be top-league players
    *) football discourages / prevents gay players from reaching the top flight, or
    *) players in the top flight don't feel free to come out, for whatever reason.

    The first option is ridiculous, especially as several gay figures have come out in other sports, such as rugby. IMV it is therefore an issue within football, and one football should tackle.
    It could be

    d) players in the top flight do feel free to come out, but don't want to.

    If there's ~3 top flight gay players then its entirely possible those three would rather keep their private life private and have their football rather than their sexuality be what is spoken about.

    A bit like how a Tory MP 'came out' earlier this week but simply didn't speak about it before because she didn't think it important to speak about and its not what she wanted to be known for.
    True. It's no one's business but their own.

    That said if one of the reasons they don't want to come out is because of the perceived anti gay environment within football then that brings us back to it being football's problem.
    I'd recommend watching the video. This issue is discussed.
    Thanks will do.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,562
    Aslan said:

    MrEd said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    How do you know that? What evidence do you have? I at least know a few that have made the move, though I admit they won't be fully representative.
    There will be some liberals moving because of high house prices, there will be some conservatives moving too for cultural and high tax reasons.

    Conservative Louisiana and Oklahoma and Ohio also send large numbers of migrants to Texas too
    How do you know these things? You have yet to give any evidence. I at least have anecdotes.
    You have anecdote.

    The 2 top states with migrants moving to Texas are California and Trump voting Florida, followed by Trump voting Louisiana and Oklahoma

    https://apnews.com/article/texas-business-census-2020-science-0d436b250dc07111bff4b4f6cdd6682b#:~:text=Most of the Texas movers,Texas over the last decade.&text=Louisiana, Oklahoma, Illinois, Georgia,residents are moving to Texas.
    I assume by your emphasis on 'Trump voting' you are arguing their will be more Republicans moving from Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma to Texas because there are more of them. Yet you abandon that argument re California. Any reason?

    If there are specific reasons why Republicans may be moving from California over Democrats, don't you think the same might be true re Democrats in Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma?
    Texas is pretty big (29 million) so sweeping generalisations should be treated with caution but I’ll throw in a few myself as to what is happening there which are shifting the voting patterns:

    - College-educated professionals moving to places such as Dallas and Houston, as they move away from being oil towns, plus liberal cities such as Austin and San Antonio. Help to Democrats
    - Students coming to Texas to study and who stay - ditto
    - People fleeing California because of what is happening there. There will be exceptions but expect this more positive for the Republicans, as they don’t want CA replicated in Texas.
    - People coming from Florida and Louisiana. Probably coming for jobs than politicised reasons but I would think those fleeing “illiberal” Florida / Louisiana are not going to choose Texas. So probably helps Republicans in the state;
    - Hispanic vote moving more GOP

    The latter I think is the crucial point. If the Hispanic vote wasn’t shifting, I would say TX would become more like North Carolina where an influx of professionals into Raleigh has helped the Democrats. But the Hispanic vote is trending more GOP and so, I’m inclined to think that 2020 was the peak of Democrat chances in TX - from now on, a combination of the Hispanic vote shift plus some migration from CA and other Republican areas bolsters their position. I also suspect some of what Abbott is doing will also make TX less attractive a place to live for liberals.
    The "Hispanic trending to GOP" has a trend of exactly one election, held during a pandemic.
    I think, if voting in the US becomes even more polarized around religion, then that probably benefits the GOP among Hispanics.

    But there is a problem for the GOP. While Hispanics are disproportionately Catholic, and Catholics disproportionately support more abortion controls, US born Hispanics are *more* liberal on abortion than Anglos. 65% of them support legal abortion.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 64,406
    rcs1000 said:

    MrEd said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    How do you know that? What evidence do you have? I at least know a few that have made the move, though I admit they won't be fully representative.
    There will be some liberals moving because of high house prices, there will be some conservatives moving too for cultural and high tax reasons.

    Conservative Louisiana and Oklahoma and Ohio also send large numbers of migrants to Texas too
    How do you know these things? You have yet to give any evidence. I at least have anecdotes.
    You have anecdote.

    The 2 top states with migrants moving to Texas are California and Trump voting Florida, followed by Trump voting Louisiana and Oklahoma

    https://apnews.com/article/texas-business-census-2020-science-0d436b250dc07111bff4b4f6cdd6682b#:~:text=Most of the Texas movers,Texas over the last decade.&text=Louisiana, Oklahoma, Illinois, Georgia,residents are moving to Texas.
    I assume by your emphasis on 'Trump voting' you are arguing their will be more Republicans moving from Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma to Texas because there are more of them. Yet you abandon that argument re California. Any reason?

    If there are specific reasons why Republicans may be moving from California over Democrats, don't you think the same might be true re Democrats in Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma?
    Texas is pretty big (29 million) so sweeping generalisations should be treated with caution but I’ll throw in a few myself as to what is happening there which are shifting the voting patterns:

    - College-educated professionals moving to places such as Dallas and Houston, as they move away from being oil towns, plus liberal cities such as Austin and San Antonio. Help to Democrats
    - Students coming to Texas to study and who stay - ditto
    - People fleeing California because of what is happening there. There will be exceptions but expect this more positive for the Republicans, as they don’t want CA replicated in Texas.
    - People coming from Florida and Louisiana. Probably coming for jobs than politicised reasons but I would think those fleeing “illiberal” Florida / Louisiana are not going to choose Texas. So probably helps Republicans in the state;
    - Hispanic vote moving more GOP

    The latter I think is the crucial point. If the Hispanic vote wasn’t shifting, I would say TX would become more like North Carolina where an influx of professionals into Raleigh has helped the Democrats. But the Hispanic vote is trending more GOP and so, I’m inclined to think that 2020 was the peak of Democrat chances in TX - from now on, a combination of the Hispanic vote shift plus some migration from CA and other Republican areas bolsters their position. I also suspect some of what Abbott is doing will also make TX less attractive a place to live for liberals.
    Interesting, but I disagree.

    I think that the trends in Texas are really very similar to the ones in Arizona. Almost all the growth in Texas's population is in urban and suburban areas, as the State become the US's second tech hub behind California.

    It's also worth noting that Trump's outperformance among Hispanics was more than all from Hispanics without college degrees. Among those with degrees, he went backwards from 2016.

    Texas was a resource State, but it is becoming a high tech, high education state, and I think that works against the Republicans in the long run.
    If Texas switches to a blue state when nationally both candidates have the same number of votes, then which way will the electoral college lean when there's a tie on votes?

    Would that be enough to switch the EC from leaning red to leaning blue on a par score?
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 2,827
    tlg86 said:

    TOPPING said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    There must be about 300 premier league players every week so it wouldn't surprise me if one of them was gay. Probably several.
    If 1-2% of people are gay, then 3-6 Premier League players should be gay. if they are not out, then either:
    *) gay people are, for some reason, not good enough to be top-league players
    *) football discourages / prevents gay players from reaching the top flight, or
    *) players in the top flight don't feel free to come out, for whatever reason.

    The first option is ridiculous, especially as several gay figures have come out in other sports, such as rugby. IMV it is therefore an issue within football, and one football should tackle.
    It could be

    d) players in the top flight do feel free to come out, but don't want to.

    If there's ~3 top flight gay players then its entirely possible those three would rather keep their private life private and have their football rather than their sexuality be what is spoken about.

    A bit like how a Tory MP 'came out' earlier this week but simply didn't speak about it before because she didn't think it important to speak about and its not what she wanted to be known for.
    True. It's no one's business but their own.

    That said if one of the reasons they don't want to come out is because of the perceived anti gay environment within football then that brings us back to it being football's problem.
    I'd recommend watching the video. This issue is discussed.
    In the 16-34 group, c. 3.5% of males identify as gay or bisexual. That comes out at 17 in the premier league or roughly 1 per dressing room in a given season. Seems pretty clear to me there’s a cultural problem.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 41,562
    Charles said:

    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    @HYUFD - it is the urban and suburban areas of Texas which have been growing, and which have also been becoming more Democrat.

    That does not suggest that it is California conservatives which are moving.
    Tbf. You can be a "California Conservative". My Godfather was one. I doubt he'd have felt comfortable as a Texas Conservative.
    The scary thing is that Socal Republicans (aka “Nixon Conservatives”) are now so moderate they barely fit in the modern GOP
    There are a lot of politically homeless people in the US, who would prefer Republican policies on tax and regulation, but who think Trump is a dangerous demagogue.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 9,766
    kinabalu said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    JBriskin3 said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    Sterling certainly seems to mince along a bit as his career progresess - but to be fair so do I.
    He runs like Velma from Scooby Doo, but its not him! Married w kids isnt he?
    It was just a guess as to who your mate's gaydar was picking up - Anyway you said you weren't going to speculate so I think we should probably stop now.
    The concept of "gaydar" is more than a little eeeuw, don't you think? And completely phony anyway, I know both straight people who are camp as fuck and gays with whom you would never know if you didn't know.
    Graham Le Saux read the Guardian in the dressing room. That raised some eyebrows.

    EDIT: And not only that the Graham was spelt Graeme. I mean c'mon ...
    Nod's as good as a wink... Bet he has immaculate taste in soft furnishings, too.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 26,208
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    I think you are absolutely correct about who is moving: the reality is that LA/SF/The Valley are all ridiculously expensive places to live. A software engineer earning $120k/year (which is hardly a pittance) with a wife earning $60k (also not a pittance) will struggle to earn enough to buy a three bedroom house in the Bay Area.

    If they move to Phoenix or Austin, and his salary drops to $100k, and hers to $50k - well, suddenly they can afford a nice house, in a nice area, with decent public schools.

    California is paying the price for imposing far too many restrictions on new building, which has sent property prices through the roof.

    (With a friend, I bought a plot of land in Los Angeles to build a spec house. We acquired it three years ago. We are still at least a year away from breaking ground.)
    Yes, well you and I both know people who have made the move. HYFUD has got the voices in his head.
    I know quite a few people who've left the Bay Area to move to places like South Carolina and Texas in the last couple of years.
    This is what we progressives need to counter the greater FPTP efficiency of the reactionary vote. Hopefully we'll see similar here in England. Migration in serious numbers from Highgate to Hartlepool, Battersea to Barnsley, Islington to any of the many rough & ready provincial places starting with an "I". Once Johnson has Levelled Up everywhere there's absolutely no reason why this shouldn't happen.
    Excuse me while I die laughing at the idea high earning upper middle class liberal 'progressives' would ever consider moving to Hartlepool, Barnsley and Stoke from Hampstead and Islington!

    The rural home counties is as conservative as they would go (and that at least has Country Life housing and views)
    Stoke? That doesn't begin with an "I". How can people move from Islington to Stoke?

    More seriously, though, it sounds like you, a Conservative member and activist, are writing off Levelling Up already. Cat says goodbye to bag.
    We can reduce the gap between North and South via HS2 and better infrastructure north of the Watford gap but we are never going to make Hull or Stoke global cities to rival London
    But HS2 is pre-Johnson. Sounds like you plan to just surf for free on prior decisions and seek to pluck low hanging fruit. Lack of ambition. Or rather the ambition falls way way short of the bouncy rhetoric.
    That's a rather strange argument, especially as infrastructure takes decades+ to plan and implement.

    One common argument about the problems facing politics is short-termism: politicians only being concerned with policies that will show positive fruit before the next electoral cycle. Politicians who cancel long-standing projects just to replace them with 'their' projects, which themselves get cancelled within 4-5 years, should be condemned.

    Just look at the US and space: a new administration comes in, looks at a multi-year project, then cancels it. It's massively wasteful, and the 'new' projects are often worse than what preceded them. (Biden's been a rare example who hasn't).

    I'm pleasantly surprised Johnson hasn't done much cancelling.

    The real question is what long-term projects a politician *starts* whilst in power: I'm glad that Biden's infrastructure bill had received cross-party support - albeit it is being held up by his own party!
    That WAS my argument. HS2 isn't a Johnson levelling up initiative. I agree with your general point and going ahead with HS2 is a decision of this government I support. It's easy to nitpick your way out of making these big investments, it's never the right time, there's always influential people and voters who are het up and against, energetic autodidacts saying they know better, let's just delay and delay, or cancel, leave it to somebody else in a few years, bla bla, but then what happens is nothing happens, and time passes, and an extremely unsatisfactory state of affairs creeps up on you. It eventually becomes intolerable and now you HAVE to act, by which time it's got harder and more expensive and you've bent things even more out of shape with all the tactical "fixes" you've done and the compromises you've made in order to keep the previous show on the road. To me it's very like when you put off embracing new tech in your personal life, something I'm habitually guilty of. It's always the wrong decision to "hold out" and I never learn.
    Actually, in tech at a personal level, it's often the 'right' decision to hold out, at least for a year. Things get cheaper, and unless you're really a power user (hint: few of us are, although we kid ourselves we are), the provision of (say) a 12MP camera over an 8 or 10MP is pretty much meaningless. Skill in composure and usage overwhelms the pixel count. You pay a hefty premium to be on the bleeding edge.

    I still haven't seen a reasonable use-case for home assistants such as Echo/Home that overwhelms the loss of privacy. Others may differ. ;)
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 64,406
    moonshine said:

    tlg86 said:

    TOPPING said:

    isam said:

    tlg86 said:

    tlg86 said:

    Anyone know if Newcastle will continue to participate in the Rainbow Laces campaign?

    Will Liverpool?
    Yes, always do.

    Was a seminal moment last season.

    https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11669/12153881/rainbow-laces-liverpool-captain-jordan-henderson-shows-how-lgbt-campaign-makes-a-difference

    I think they'll ramp it up even more to as the opposition to the rent boys chant.
    On the subject of homosexuality and football, I'd recommend watching this discussion about it:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX8n2XY016Q

    I went to school with Luke Tuffs. He was always mad about football, so it's great to see him doing so well.
    One of my mates is convinced a current Prem footballer is gay. I have to say there seems to be a lot in favour of his argument from what I have noticed, but I wont speculate with a name
    There must be about 300 premier league players every week so it wouldn't surprise me if one of them was gay. Probably several.
    If 1-2% of people are gay, then 3-6 Premier League players should be gay. if they are not out, then either:
    *) gay people are, for some reason, not good enough to be top-league players
    *) football discourages / prevents gay players from reaching the top flight, or
    *) players in the top flight don't feel free to come out, for whatever reason.

    The first option is ridiculous, especially as several gay figures have come out in other sports, such as rugby. IMV it is therefore an issue within football, and one football should tackle.
    It could be

    d) players in the top flight do feel free to come out, but don't want to.

    If there's ~3 top flight gay players then its entirely possible those three would rather keep their private life private and have their football rather than their sexuality be what is spoken about.

    A bit like how a Tory MP 'came out' earlier this week but simply didn't speak about it before because she didn't think it important to speak about and its not what she wanted to be known for.
    True. It's no one's business but their own.

    That said if one of the reasons they don't want to come out is because of the perceived anti gay environment within football then that brings us back to it being football's problem.
    I'd recommend watching the video. This issue is discussed.
    In the 16-34 group, c. 3.5% of males identify as gay or bisexual. That comes out at 17 in the premier league or roughly 1 per dressing room in a given season. Seems pretty clear to me there’s a cultural problem.
    I wouldn't assign every difference to a cultural problem.

    There will be some sectors where its naturally higher than 3.5% and some where its naturally lower.

    If its higher than 3.5% in fashion for instance then is that a "problem"?

    It could be that gay people are naturally less interested in going into professional football in the first place so its naturally below 3.5% there, even without any "problems".
  • stodgestodge Posts: 9,364
    rcs1000 said:

    tlg86 said:

    dixiedean said:

    Toon is insane today. Saudi flags, headdresses, about 4x the number folk around than normal. Pubs, bars full to bursting. Visit Riyadh giant adverts on Eldon Square.
    A roar that was heard all around the city.
    Public vomitting began well before 3 pm.

    I wonder what Newcastle's position will be on the prohibition on serving alcohol during matches.
    Do you mean not allowing alcohol in the stands? There's talk about that being allowed again. Personally I'd rather we didn't because people spill drinks and it's not very nice.
    In the US, alcohol is allowed in the stands. It's quite nice to sip a pint of beer while cheering your team on.
    Horse racing allows drinking in the stands using plastic containers but not close to the rails. It's fair to say alcohol consumption, both among some spectators and some of the participants (the jockeys, not the horses) is and continues to be a problem.

    It's noticeable on summer Saturdays how the "football fraternity" suddenly all become racing fans. The racecourses don't mind and the cost of the security needed to patrol the bars and stands is, I'm sure, more than off-set by the extra alcohol sales.

    The most rigorous aspect is the checking to ensure you are not bringing your own booze into the racecourse - drink 10 pints of the racecourse's beer and that's fine, bring in a can of your own and you'll be thrown out.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 97,887
    edited October 17
    I think Prince William is going through a midlife crisis, he's wearing a worse outfit that the Spurs kit. He's not fit to be a monarch.

    I mean green velvet FFS.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-10092965/Liverpool-captain-Mo-Saleh-William-Hague-leads-stars-arriving-Earthshot-green-carpet.html
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 3,694
    rcs1000 said:

    MrEd said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    HYUFD said:

    MaxPB said:

    kinabalu said:

    MaxPB said:

    Why can we distinguish between culture and religion when it comes to Christianity but not when it comes to Islam?

    The Bible says we should stone a woman to death for adultery but if a country implements that policy nobody is going to blame that on Christianity.

    Find me a country implementing biblical law to real life and I'll condemn it.
    USA Red States, way they're going. Joke, but only just.
    Sadly not a joke given what's happening on Texas over women's rights and I've condemned them multiple times, really hoping the SCOTUS will restore those rights and over the long term those Californians moving to Texas will mean a Democratic governor.
    The liberal majority in California will stay there as it is already a blue state.

    It is conservatives in California who will be more likely to move to red states seeking lower taxes and more conservative values.

    Now continue Hispanic immigration to Texas might turn it more blue but then there are also plenty of pro life Hispanic Catholics
    A California republican voter isn't the same as a Texas republican voter. Additionally, where's your evidence that it's all GOO voters moving, from my anecdotes of friends it's mostly younger people struggling to get on the California property ladder that are moving and they're all pretty solid Dem voters. All four of the people I know who have made the journey are absolutely solid blue voters, and while I'm sure that's not a representative sample it does rather undermine your made up idea that it's all GOP voters moving to Texas.
    Actually on the whole they are.

    A California Republican voter will tend to live in rural parts of the state, be religious and often evangelical just as a Texas Republican voter is.

    Certainly there has been plenty of movement of California conservatives to Arizona and Texas is no doubt the same.

    Yes there might be a few California liberals moving from LA county or San Francisco to liberal areas of Texas like Austin but they will be the minority

    How do you know that? What evidence do you have? I at least know a few that have made the move, though I admit they won't be fully representative.
    There will be some liberals moving because of high house prices, there will be some conservatives moving too for cultural and high tax reasons.

    Conservative Louisiana and Oklahoma and Ohio also send large numbers of migrants to Texas too
    How do you know these things? You have yet to give any evidence. I at least have anecdotes.
    You have anecdote.

    The 2 top states with migrants moving to Texas are California and Trump voting Florida, followed by Trump voting Louisiana and Oklahoma

    https://apnews.com/article/texas-business-census-2020-science-0d436b250dc07111bff4b4f6cdd6682b#:~:text=Most of the Texas movers,Texas over the last decade.&text=Louisiana, Oklahoma, Illinois, Georgia,residents are moving to Texas.
    I assume by your emphasis on 'Trump voting' you are arguing their will be more Republicans moving from Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma to Texas because there are more of them. Yet you abandon that argument re California. Any reason?

    If there are specific reasons why Republicans may be moving from California over Democrats, don't you think the same might be true re Democrats in Florida, Louisiana and Oklahoma?
    Texas is pretty big (29 million) so sweeping generalisations should be treated with caution but I’ll throw in a few myself as to what is happening there which are shifting the voting patterns:

    - College-educated professionals moving to places such as Dallas and Houston, as they move away from being oil towns, plus liberal cities such as Austin and San Antonio. Help to Democrats
    - Students coming to Texas to study and who stay - ditto
    - People fleeing California because of what is happening there. There will be exceptions but expect this more positive for the Republicans, as they don’t want CA replicated in Texas.
    - People coming from Florida and Louisiana. Probably coming for jobs than politicised reasons but I would think those fleeing “illiberal” Florida / Louisiana are not going to choose Texas. So probably helps Republicans in the state;
    - Hispanic vote moving more GOP

    The latter I think is the crucial point. If the Hispanic vote wasn’t shifting, I would say TX would become more like North Carolina where an influx of professionals into Raleigh has helped the Democrats. But the Hispanic vote is trending more GOP and so, I’m inclined to think that 2020 was the peak of Democrat chances in TX - from now on, a combination of the Hispanic vote shift plus some migration from CA and other Republican areas bolsters their position. I also suspect some of what Abbott is doing will also make TX less attractive a place to live for liberals.
    Interesting, but I disagree.

    I think that the trends in Texas are really very similar to the ones in Arizona. Almost all the growth in Texas's population is in urban and suburban areas, as the State become the US's second tech hub behind California.

    It's also worth noting that Trump's outperformance among Hispanics was more than all from Hispanics without college degrees. Among those with degrees, he went backwards from 2016.

    Texas was a resource State, but it is becoming a high tech, high education state, and I think that works against the Republicans in the long run.
    Actually, quite a lot of your thesis overlaps with mine - namely that Texas’ profile is changing into being high tech from being resource and that helps the Democrats.

    My point re the trend is that the balancing factors are more favouring the Republicans over time. While Trump may have fallen amongst Hispanic graduates, the fact it went up overall amongst Hispanics is the more important point.

    I flagged on here during the 2020 election that one of the big errors the Democrats were making was that all non-white groups are one big happy family. They are not. Many Hispanics consider themselves white (we know more than a few). There is also not the same historical issues for Hispanic as for Blacks in the US.

  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 25,224
    Cracking game in Oman. Could go either way, but one has fancy Scotland’s chances!
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 31,858

    I think Prince William is going through a midlife crisis, he's wearing a worse outfit that the Spurs kit. He's not fit to be a monarch.

    I mean green velvet FFS.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-10092965/Liverpool-captain-Mo-Saleh-William-Hague-leads-stars-arriving-Earthshot-green-carpet.html

    I have a British racing green velvet dinner jacket and green velvet bowtie. Believe me, it's a winning combination.
This discussion has been closed.