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Will Keir Starmer face leadership challenge before the next general election? – politicalbetting.com

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Comments

  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,795
    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    darkage said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    It accurately reflects the prejudices of those who work in such administrations though.
    One of the most extraordinary remarks in the GLA document is this:


    "Muslim and Jewish participants were more concerned about right-wing extremism than Islamist extremism. "

    Page 175 in the PDF

    Now, it is hardly surprising that Muslims are more concerned about "right wing extremism" as against Muslim extremism

    But the idea that Jews are more worried about Tommy Robinson than they are worried by Islamist attacks is so ridiculous it renders the whole paper redundantly stupid if not wilfully, offensively mendacious.

    Synagogues and Jewish schools in London do not have guards because of a few skinheads from Ilford. We all know why they are protected

    Sadiq Khan's London Authority pumps out this lying Woke bilge. And we all pay for it

    Incredible

    If you CTL+F for Islam, almost all the references are about Islamophobia, or Muslims not liking ISIS being linked with Islam and preferring "Daesh".
    It is incredible. My thanks to TSE for giving me the chance to direct PB-ers towards it

    The whole thing is a laborious, grotesque exercise - supposedly aimed at "battling extremism" - which is actually about exonerating or ignoring Islam and getting everyone to focus on "white right wing British extremism".

    Repulsive. Sadiq Khan is a poisonous creature
    Who could have guessed?

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-nation-of-islam/

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-zacarias-moussaoui/
    I am no fan of Khan but there's not much in this. Lawyers can't be tainted by their clients.
    For me, Khan is condemned by his performance in office, more than his past. He is bigoted and useless
    He's planning on doing just the Victoria and Central lines for night tube this year. North and South London left waiting, women in North and South London clearly less valued by the mayor than those in East and West. The Central line would be the lowest priority, surely the Northern Line which runs through Camden and Leicester Square makes a lot more sense and it serves South London too which is underserved by public transport in general.

    This is a decision taken by someone who doesn't understand London and doesn't understand nightlife in London.
    Victoria line serves Stockwell and Brixton.
    The Northern line serves Clapham, Balham and Tooting, areas which are very popular with young people (Balham and Clapham with younger women especially in my experience) who live in shared flats/houses. It goes through Stockwell too.

    And once again, if the task is to ferry people from nightlife spots to where they live, maybe actually having the bloody tube line that goes to both of London's biggest nightlife spots would be a good idea. The Central line makes no sense at all, the bits in central London are mostly in the square mile.
    Not quite true you get a lot of variety from Mile End and beyond to the West and a lot of clubbing at both ends and in the middle.
    Maybe, but compared to Camden? Which won't get night tube now until 2022 and what about everyone who needs to get beyond Stockwell? Get out and make the unsafe walk, wait for a bus in the dark or hope there's an uber? It's a really rubbish decision, worse not having the Northern line or Piccadilly Line means Leicester Square station stays shut so drunk people will be spilling out and walking to TCR for night buses or further up to get an uber.
  • Is this thread now a rousing (or not) game of Mornington Crescent?
  • MaxPB said:

    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    darkage said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    It accurately reflects the prejudices of those who work in such administrations though.
    One of the most extraordinary remarks in the GLA document is this:


    "Muslim and Jewish participants were more concerned about right-wing extremism than Islamist extremism. "

    Page 175 in the PDF

    Now, it is hardly surprising that Muslims are more concerned about "right wing extremism" as against Muslim extremism

    But the idea that Jews are more worried about Tommy Robinson than they are worried by Islamist attacks is so ridiculous it renders the whole paper redundantly stupid if not wilfully, offensively mendacious.

    Synagogues and Jewish schools in London do not have guards because of a few skinheads from Ilford. We all know why they are protected

    Sadiq Khan's London Authority pumps out this lying Woke bilge. And we all pay for it

    Incredible

    If you CTL+F for Islam, almost all the references are about Islamophobia, or Muslims not liking ISIS being linked with Islam and preferring "Daesh".
    It is incredible. My thanks to TSE for giving me the chance to direct PB-ers towards it

    The whole thing is a laborious, grotesque exercise - supposedly aimed at "battling extremism" - which is actually about exonerating or ignoring Islam and getting everyone to focus on "white right wing British extremism".

    Repulsive. Sadiq Khan is a poisonous creature
    Who could have guessed?

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-nation-of-islam/

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-zacarias-moussaoui/
    I am no fan of Khan but there's not much in this. Lawyers can't be tainted by their clients.
    For me, Khan is condemned by his performance in office, more than his past. He is bigoted and useless
    He's planning on doing just the Victoria and Central lines for night tube this year. North and South London left waiting, women in North and South London clearly less valued by the mayor than those in East and West. The Central line would be the lowest priority, surely the Northern Line which runs through Camden and Leicester Square makes a lot more sense and it serves South London too which is underserved by public transport in general.

    This is a decision taken by someone who doesn't understand London and doesn't understand nightlife in London.
    Victoria line serves Stockwell and Brixton.
    The Northern line serves Clapham, Balham and Tooting, areas which are very popular with young people (Balham and Clapham with younger women especially in my experience) who live in shared flats/houses. It goes through Stockwell too.

    And once again, if the task is to ferry people from nightlife spots to where they live, maybe actually having the bloody tube line that goes to both of London's biggest nightlife spots would be a good idea. The Central line makes no sense at all, the bits in central London are mostly in the square mile.
    Not quite true you get a lot of variety from Mile End and beyond to the West and a lot of clubbing at both ends and in the middle.
    Maybe, but compared to Camden? Which won't get night tube now until 2022 and what about everyone who needs to get beyond Stockwell? Get out and make the unsafe walk, wait for a bus in the dark or hope there's an uber? It's a really rubbish decision, worse not having the Northern line or Piccadilly Line means Leicester Square station stays shut so drunk people will be spilling out and walking to TCR for night buses or further up to get an uber.
    It really isn't that far from Leicester Square to Tottenham Court Road. I've done that walk a few times.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,372
    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    This actually reads like a sort of tragic historical source; evidence of a society desperately searching for distractions from existential threats it cannot deal with; so it retreats in to this sort of comforting denial - more interfaith dialogue will sort all this out, etc

    It also looks like evidence of how money going in to try and stop terrorist attacks like the one we had a couple of days ago has been channeled in to things like stopping hate speech; thanks to the expansive definition of 'violent extremism'.

    Its bad, and things are going to get worse.
    The government figures show the opposite, that referrals to Prevent for suspected Islamist radicalisation have been going down for years:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020

    Indeed there is a slight excess of Right wing referrals over Islamism for intervention.

    Surely we can be concerned about both ? It’s not either/or as some people seem to think
  • eekeek Posts: 28,366
    edited October 2021
    Someone just found this in Hansard - think it’s from 2019

    image
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,795

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    darkage said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    It accurately reflects the prejudices of those who work in such administrations though.
    One of the most extraordinary remarks in the GLA document is this:


    "Muslim and Jewish participants were more concerned about right-wing extremism than Islamist extremism. "

    Page 175 in the PDF

    Now, it is hardly surprising that Muslims are more concerned about "right wing extremism" as against Muslim extremism

    But the idea that Jews are more worried about Tommy Robinson than they are worried by Islamist attacks is so ridiculous it renders the whole paper redundantly stupid if not wilfully, offensively mendacious.

    Synagogues and Jewish schools in London do not have guards because of a few skinheads from Ilford. We all know why they are protected

    Sadiq Khan's London Authority pumps out this lying Woke bilge. And we all pay for it

    Incredible

    If you CTL+F for Islam, almost all the references are about Islamophobia, or Muslims not liking ISIS being linked with Islam and preferring "Daesh".
    It is incredible. My thanks to TSE for giving me the chance to direct PB-ers towards it

    The whole thing is a laborious, grotesque exercise - supposedly aimed at "battling extremism" - which is actually about exonerating or ignoring Islam and getting everyone to focus on "white right wing British extremism".

    Repulsive. Sadiq Khan is a poisonous creature
    Who could have guessed?

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-nation-of-islam/

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-zacarias-moussaoui/
    I am no fan of Khan but there's not much in this. Lawyers can't be tainted by their clients.
    For me, Khan is condemned by his performance in office, more than his past. He is bigoted and useless
    He's planning on doing just the Victoria and Central lines for night tube this year. North and South London left waiting, women in North and South London clearly less valued by the mayor than those in East and West. The Central line would be the lowest priority, surely the Northern Line which runs through Camden and Leicester Square makes a lot more sense and it serves South London too which is underserved by public transport in general.

    This is a decision taken by someone who doesn't understand London and doesn't understand nightlife in London.
    Victoria line serves Stockwell and Brixton.
    The Northern line serves Clapham, Balham and Tooting, areas which are very popular with young people (Balham and Clapham with younger women especially in my experience) who live in shared flats/houses. It goes through Stockwell too.

    And once again, if the task is to ferry people from nightlife spots to where they live, maybe actually having the bloody tube line that goes to both of London's biggest nightlife spots would be a good idea. The Central line makes no sense at all, the bits in central London are mostly in the square mile.
    Central line serves BOTH Westfield shopping centres (Shepherd's Bush and Stratford), Oxford Street and Liverpool Street.
    Who the hell is going to Westfield after 1am though? Liverpool Street is in the square mile, city wankers (myself included) all escape from there at about midnight because it's not good for proper late night opening bars or clubs. Oxford Circus is already served by the Victoria Line.

    Ultimately the failure is not to get them all running but not having the Northern Line seems like a huge oversight or speaks to a mayor that doesn't understand London's nightlife very well, I don't think you do either judging by your mentions of Westfield.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 22,815
    edited October 2021
    MaxPB said:

    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    darkage said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    It accurately reflects the prejudices of those who work in such administrations though.
    One of the most extraordinary remarks in the GLA document is this:


    "Muslim and Jewish participants were more concerned about right-wing extremism than Islamist extremism. "

    Page 175 in the PDF

    Now, it is hardly surprising that Muslims are more concerned about "right wing extremism" as against Muslim extremism

    But the idea that Jews are more worried about Tommy Robinson than they are worried by Islamist attacks is so ridiculous it renders the whole paper redundantly stupid if not wilfully, offensively mendacious.

    Synagogues and Jewish schools in London do not have guards because of a few skinheads from Ilford. We all know why they are protected

    Sadiq Khan's London Authority pumps out this lying Woke bilge. And we all pay for it

    Incredible

    If you CTL+F for Islam, almost all the references are about Islamophobia, or Muslims not liking ISIS being linked with Islam and preferring "Daesh".
    It is incredible. My thanks to TSE for giving me the chance to direct PB-ers towards it

    The whole thing is a laborious, grotesque exercise - supposedly aimed at "battling extremism" - which is actually about exonerating or ignoring Islam and getting everyone to focus on "white right wing British extremism".

    Repulsive. Sadiq Khan is a poisonous creature
    Who could have guessed?

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-nation-of-islam/

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-zacarias-moussaoui/
    I am no fan of Khan but there's not much in this. Lawyers can't be tainted by their clients.
    For me, Khan is condemned by his performance in office, more than his past. He is bigoted and useless
    He's planning on doing just the Victoria and Central lines for night tube this year. North and South London left waiting, women in North and South London clearly less valued by the mayor than those in East and West. The Central line would be the lowest priority, surely the Northern Line which runs through Camden and Leicester Square makes a lot more sense and it serves South London too which is underserved by public transport in general.

    This is a decision taken by someone who doesn't understand London and doesn't understand nightlife in London.
    Victoria line serves Stockwell and Brixton.
    The Northern line serves Clapham, Balham and Tooting, areas which are very popular with young people (Balham and Clapham with younger women especially in my experience) who live in shared flats/houses. It goes through Stockwell too.

    And once again, if the task is to ferry people from nightlife spots to where they live, maybe actually having the bloody tube line that goes to both of London's biggest nightlife spots would be a good idea. The Central line makes no sense at all, the bits in central London are mostly in the square mile.
    Not quite true you get a lot of variety from Mile End and beyond to the West and a lot of clubbing at both ends and in the middle.
    Maybe, but compared to Camden? Which won't get night tube now until 2022 and what about everyone who needs to get beyond Stockwell? Get out and make the unsafe walk, wait for a bus in the dark or hope there's an uber? It's a really rubbish decision, worse not having the Northern line or Piccadilly Line means Leicester Square station stays shut so drunk people will be spilling out and walking to TCR for night buses or further up to get an uber.
    My clubbing days were when black cabs still refused to go south of the river so it was basically a case of night bus, walk or get in an unlicensed cab. Black cabs seemed to stop going south as early as 9pm for some reason, so even unavailable when working late.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,366
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    darkage said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    It accurately reflects the prejudices of those who work in such administrations though.
    One of the most extraordinary remarks in the GLA document is this:


    "Muslim and Jewish participants were more concerned about right-wing extremism than Islamist extremism. "

    Page 175 in the PDF

    Now, it is hardly surprising that Muslims are more concerned about "right wing extremism" as against Muslim extremism

    But the idea that Jews are more worried about Tommy Robinson than they are worried by Islamist attacks is so ridiculous it renders the whole paper redundantly stupid if not wilfully, offensively mendacious.

    Synagogues and Jewish schools in London do not have guards because of a few skinheads from Ilford. We all know why they are protected

    Sadiq Khan's London Authority pumps out this lying Woke bilge. And we all pay for it

    Incredible

    If you CTL+F for Islam, almost all the references are about Islamophobia, or Muslims not liking ISIS being linked with Islam and preferring "Daesh".
    It is incredible. My thanks to TSE for giving me the chance to direct PB-ers towards it

    The whole thing is a laborious, grotesque exercise - supposedly aimed at "battling extremism" - which is actually about exonerating or ignoring Islam and getting everyone to focus on "white right wing British extremism".

    Repulsive. Sadiq Khan is a poisonous creature
    Who could have guessed?

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-nation-of-islam/

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-zacarias-moussaoui/
    I am no fan of Khan but there's not much in this. Lawyers can't be tainted by their clients.
    For me, Khan is condemned by his performance in office, more than his past. He is bigoted and useless
    He's planning on doing just the Victoria and Central lines for night tube this year. North and South London left waiting, women in North and South London clearly less valued by the mayor than those in East and West. The Central line would be the lowest priority, surely the Northern Line which runs through Camden and Leicester Square makes a lot more sense and it serves South London too which is underserved by public transport in general.

    This is a decision taken by someone who doesn't understand London and doesn't understand nightlife in London.
    Victoria line serves Stockwell and Brixton.
    The Northern line serves Clapham, Balham and Tooting, areas which are very popular with young people (Balham and Clapham with younger women especially in my experience) who live in shared flats/houses. It goes through Stockwell too.

    And once again, if the task is to ferry people from nightlife spots to where they live, maybe actually having the bloody tube line that goes to both of London's biggest nightlife spots would be a good idea. The Central line makes no sense at all, the bits in central London are mostly in the square mile.
    Central line serves BOTH Westfield shopping centres (Shepherd's Bush and Stratford), Oxford Street and Liverpool Street.
    Who the hell is going to Westfield after 1am though? Liverpool Street is in the square mile, city wankers (myself included) all escape from there at about midnight because it's not good for proper late night opening bars or clubs. Oxford Circus is already served by the Victoria Line.

    Ultimately the failure is not to get them all running but not having the Northern Line seems like a huge oversight or speaks to a mayor that doesn't understand London's nightlife very well, I don't think you do either judging by your mentions of Westfield.
    Be glad it’s 2020. Back in the early 90s it was completely dead by 9pm even on a Friday
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631
    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    This actually reads like a sort of tragic historical source; evidence of a society desperately searching for distractions from existential threats it cannot deal with; so it retreats in to this sort of comforting denial - more interfaith dialogue will sort all this out, etc

    It also looks like evidence of how money going in to try and stop terrorist attacks like the one we had a couple of days ago has been channeled in to things like stopping hate speech; thanks to the expansive definition of 'violent extremism'.

    Its bad, and things are going to get worse.
    The government figures show the opposite, that referrals to Prevent for suspected Islamist radicalisation have been going down for years:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020

    Indeed there is a slight excess of Right wing referrals over Islamism for intervention.

    Surely we can be concerned about both ? It’s not either/or as some people seem to think
    Well yes. According to Prevent the numbers of Islamist referrals vs Right wingers is about equal, so we should be concerned with both. The downward trend of referrals for Islamist radicalisation is quite marked though.


  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,795

    MaxPB said:

    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    darkage said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    It accurately reflects the prejudices of those who work in such administrations though.
    One of the most extraordinary remarks in the GLA document is this:


    "Muslim and Jewish participants were more concerned about right-wing extremism than Islamist extremism. "

    Page 175 in the PDF

    Now, it is hardly surprising that Muslims are more concerned about "right wing extremism" as against Muslim extremism

    But the idea that Jews are more worried about Tommy Robinson than they are worried by Islamist attacks is so ridiculous it renders the whole paper redundantly stupid if not wilfully, offensively mendacious.

    Synagogues and Jewish schools in London do not have guards because of a few skinheads from Ilford. We all know why they are protected

    Sadiq Khan's London Authority pumps out this lying Woke bilge. And we all pay for it

    Incredible

    If you CTL+F for Islam, almost all the references are about Islamophobia, or Muslims not liking ISIS being linked with Islam and preferring "Daesh".
    It is incredible. My thanks to TSE for giving me the chance to direct PB-ers towards it

    The whole thing is a laborious, grotesque exercise - supposedly aimed at "battling extremism" - which is actually about exonerating or ignoring Islam and getting everyone to focus on "white right wing British extremism".

    Repulsive. Sadiq Khan is a poisonous creature
    Who could have guessed?

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-nation-of-islam/

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-zacarias-moussaoui/
    I am no fan of Khan but there's not much in this. Lawyers can't be tainted by their clients.
    For me, Khan is condemned by his performance in office, more than his past. He is bigoted and useless
    He's planning on doing just the Victoria and Central lines for night tube this year. North and South London left waiting, women in North and South London clearly less valued by the mayor than those in East and West. The Central line would be the lowest priority, surely the Northern Line which runs through Camden and Leicester Square makes a lot more sense and it serves South London too which is underserved by public transport in general.

    This is a decision taken by someone who doesn't understand London and doesn't understand nightlife in London.
    Victoria line serves Stockwell and Brixton.
    The Northern line serves Clapham, Balham and Tooting, areas which are very popular with young people (Balham and Clapham with younger women especially in my experience) who live in shared flats/houses. It goes through Stockwell too.

    And once again, if the task is to ferry people from nightlife spots to where they live, maybe actually having the bloody tube line that goes to both of London's biggest nightlife spots would be a good idea. The Central line makes no sense at all, the bits in central London are mostly in the square mile.
    Not quite true you get a lot of variety from Mile End and beyond to the West and a lot of clubbing at both ends and in the middle.
    Maybe, but compared to Camden? Which won't get night tube now until 2022 and what about everyone who needs to get beyond Stockwell? Get out and make the unsafe walk, wait for a bus in the dark or hope there's an uber? It's a really rubbish decision, worse not having the Northern line or Piccadilly Line means Leicester Square station stays shut so drunk people will be spilling out and walking to TCR for night buses or further up to get an uber.
    My clubbing days were when black cabs still refused to go south of the river so it was basically a case of night bus, walk or get in an unlicensed cab.
    Not dissimilar now according to a few friends that live down in Clapham. Very tough to get Uber fares accepted so they all get the night bus.
  • MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    darkage said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    It accurately reflects the prejudices of those who work in such administrations though.
    One of the most extraordinary remarks in the GLA document is this:


    "Muslim and Jewish participants were more concerned about right-wing extremism than Islamist extremism. "

    Page 175 in the PDF

    Now, it is hardly surprising that Muslims are more concerned about "right wing extremism" as against Muslim extremism

    But the idea that Jews are more worried about Tommy Robinson than they are worried by Islamist attacks is so ridiculous it renders the whole paper redundantly stupid if not wilfully, offensively mendacious.

    Synagogues and Jewish schools in London do not have guards because of a few skinheads from Ilford. We all know why they are protected

    Sadiq Khan's London Authority pumps out this lying Woke bilge. And we all pay for it

    Incredible

    If you CTL+F for Islam, almost all the references are about Islamophobia, or Muslims not liking ISIS being linked with Islam and preferring "Daesh".
    It is incredible. My thanks to TSE for giving me the chance to direct PB-ers towards it

    The whole thing is a laborious, grotesque exercise - supposedly aimed at "battling extremism" - which is actually about exonerating or ignoring Islam and getting everyone to focus on "white right wing British extremism".

    Repulsive. Sadiq Khan is a poisonous creature
    Who could have guessed?

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-nation-of-islam/

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-zacarias-moussaoui/
    I am no fan of Khan but there's not much in this. Lawyers can't be tainted by their clients.
    For me, Khan is condemned by his performance in office, more than his past. He is bigoted and useless
    He's planning on doing just the Victoria and Central lines for night tube this year. North and South London left waiting, women in North and South London clearly less valued by the mayor than those in East and West. The Central line would be the lowest priority, surely the Northern Line which runs through Camden and Leicester Square makes a lot more sense and it serves South London too which is underserved by public transport in general.

    This is a decision taken by someone who doesn't understand London and doesn't understand nightlife in London.
    Victoria line serves Stockwell and Brixton.
    The Northern line serves Clapham, Balham and Tooting, areas which are very popular with young people (Balham and Clapham with younger women especially in my experience) who live in shared flats/houses. It goes through Stockwell too.

    And once again, if the task is to ferry people from nightlife spots to where they live, maybe actually having the bloody tube line that goes to both of London's biggest nightlife spots would be a good idea. The Central line makes no sense at all, the bits in central London are mostly in the square mile.
    Central line serves BOTH Westfield shopping centres (Shepherd's Bush and Stratford), Oxford Street and Liverpool Street.
    Who the hell is going to Westfield after 1am though? Liverpool Street is in the square mile, city wankers (myself included) all escape from there at about midnight because it's not good for proper late night opening bars or clubs. Oxford Circus is already served by the Victoria Line.
    Most of the Zone 1 stations on the Central line are NOT in the Square Mile. You know you can actually interchange between Tube lines, so having Oxford Circus open on more than one line serving it makes sense.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,795
    eek said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    darkage said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    It accurately reflects the prejudices of those who work in such administrations though.
    One of the most extraordinary remarks in the GLA document is this:


    "Muslim and Jewish participants were more concerned about right-wing extremism than Islamist extremism. "

    Page 175 in the PDF

    Now, it is hardly surprising that Muslims are more concerned about "right wing extremism" as against Muslim extremism

    But the idea that Jews are more worried about Tommy Robinson than they are worried by Islamist attacks is so ridiculous it renders the whole paper redundantly stupid if not wilfully, offensively mendacious.

    Synagogues and Jewish schools in London do not have guards because of a few skinheads from Ilford. We all know why they are protected

    Sadiq Khan's London Authority pumps out this lying Woke bilge. And we all pay for it

    Incredible

    If you CTL+F for Islam, almost all the references are about Islamophobia, or Muslims not liking ISIS being linked with Islam and preferring "Daesh".
    It is incredible. My thanks to TSE for giving me the chance to direct PB-ers towards it

    The whole thing is a laborious, grotesque exercise - supposedly aimed at "battling extremism" - which is actually about exonerating or ignoring Islam and getting everyone to focus on "white right wing British extremism".

    Repulsive. Sadiq Khan is a poisonous creature
    Who could have guessed?

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-nation-of-islam/

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-zacarias-moussaoui/
    I am no fan of Khan but there's not much in this. Lawyers can't be tainted by their clients.
    For me, Khan is condemned by his performance in office, more than his past. He is bigoted and useless
    He's planning on doing just the Victoria and Central lines for night tube this year. North and South London left waiting, women in North and South London clearly less valued by the mayor than those in East and West. The Central line would be the lowest priority, surely the Northern Line which runs through Camden and Leicester Square makes a lot more sense and it serves South London too which is underserved by public transport in general.

    This is a decision taken by someone who doesn't understand London and doesn't understand nightlife in London.
    Victoria line serves Stockwell and Brixton.
    The Northern line serves Clapham, Balham and Tooting, areas which are very popular with young people (Balham and Clapham with younger women especially in my experience) who live in shared flats/houses. It goes through Stockwell too.

    And once again, if the task is to ferry people from nightlife spots to where they live, maybe actually having the bloody tube line that goes to both of London's biggest nightlife spots would be a good idea. The Central line makes no sense at all, the bits in central London are mostly in the square mile.
    Central line serves BOTH Westfield shopping centres (Shepherd's Bush and Stratford), Oxford Street and Liverpool Street.
    Who the hell is going to Westfield after 1am though? Liverpool Street is in the square mile, city wankers (myself included) all escape from there at about midnight because it's not good for proper late night opening bars or clubs. Oxford Circus is already served by the Victoria Line.

    Ultimately the failure is not to get them all running but not having the Northern Line seems like a huge oversight or speaks to a mayor that doesn't understand London's nightlife very well, I don't think you do either judging by your mentions of Westfield.
    Be glad it’s 2020. Back in the early 90s it was completely dead by 9pm even on a Friday
    I think the pubs are a bit better now than they used to be and there's a lot of spillover from Old Street and Shoreditch.
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    This actually reads like a sort of tragic historical source; evidence of a society desperately searching for distractions from existential threats it cannot deal with; so it retreats in to this sort of comforting denial - more interfaith dialogue will sort all this out, etc

    It also looks like evidence of how money going in to try and stop terrorist attacks like the one we had a couple of days ago has been channeled in to things like stopping hate speech; thanks to the expansive definition of 'violent extremism'.

    Its bad, and things are going to get worse.
    The government figures show the opposite, that referrals to Prevent for suspected Islamist radicalisation have been going down for years:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020

    Indeed there is a slight excess of Right wing referrals over Islamism for intervention.

    Surely we can be concerned about both ? It’s not either/or as some people seem to think
    Yes, there seems to be a bit of a game going on at the moment, which is “who do I want to big up the threat from more?”. If you are right wing, Islamic fundamentalism, if you are left wing, right wing extremism. Unfortunately, preventing terrorism has become politicised.

  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,782
    Charles said:

    kjh said:

    Charles said:

    kjh said:

    Leon said:

    kjh said:

    Leon said:

    kjh said:

    Leon said:

    I've just realised (I'm watching Raymond Blanc on TV) that I have NEVER HAD A FONDUE

    Obviously not a skier. It is very overrated (fondue not skiing)
    It always looks so good on TV, or in books. Melted cheese and wine and garlic. Is it not?

    I DO think skiing is overrated. I did it once, in the Pyrenees, for one day, when a friend took me to the top of a mountain and pushed me off - down a black run. By the end of the day, after falling over 89 times, I was skiiing

    But. meh. Cold, snow, snooty people, generalised euro-wankiness

    I decided that scuba would be my thing. Sun, warmth, like being a cosmonaut underwater. Love it
    It gets very boring very quickly.

    Re skiing, as someone who was a black/yellow run skier I am somewhat skeptical to put it mildly that you were put on a black run on your first day and you are here to post and your friend wasn't up for manslaughter.
    I dunno. Honestly. He swears it is true, to this day

    I was an absolute novice, he was an experienced skiier, we were both in our early 20s, he was as big an idiot as me, he claims he took me to the top of a black run (coz he wanted to do it) and then thought Fuck it, and pushed me off

    I remember being absolutely terrified, it was basically a cliff, almost vertical. And I fell down the whole way. Then I did it again, and again, and again, til I was standing up

    If it wasn't a black run it was certainly something pretty daunting. Is that yellow run? I have no idea. I don't ski
    It was definitely NOT a nursery slope, it was right at the top of a big Pyrenee
    Yellows are pretty rare. They are unpisted runs and usually more difficult than blacks.

    Look up the Tortin at Verbier. It is one of the most scary runs in the world. I have done it once. Most people turn back after peering over the edge. It took me ages to work out how to start. At the end I was drenched with sweat from the physical effort and fear. It was worth it.

    You also can get solitude and great views from these runs. There is a stunning one at Zermatt.
    Really? Admittedly most times I cheat and ski round the lip of the bowl rather than going straight down but it’s easy after the first 10 feet. Col des Mine is far more fun
    I said I skied it, I didn't say I was good! If you think it's easy I guessing you are a pretty useful skier. Scared the willies out of me.
    It’s one of the harder runs in Verbier, I’ll give you that. I’ve no idea how good I am to be honest. I ski with my uncle and cousins - at 70 my uncle outpaces most professionals and is very elegant with it - so I don’t have a good comparable.

    But I can do a tidy black run and ski yellow quite well. No good at glade skiing though - I really struggle with that
    The fact that you have done glade skiing tells me you are no slouch. Tried once. Far too dangerous for my level of skiing.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,257
    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,257
    THAT'S FUCKING MAD
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    This actually reads like a sort of tragic historical source; evidence of a society desperately searching for distractions from existential threats it cannot deal with; so it retreats in to this sort of comforting denial - more interfaith dialogue will sort all this out, etc

    It also looks like evidence of how money going in to try and stop terrorist attacks like the one we had a couple of days ago has been channeled in to things like stopping hate speech; thanks to the expansive definition of 'violent extremism'.

    Its bad, and things are going to get worse.
    The government figures show the opposite, that referrals to Prevent for suspected Islamist radicalisation have been going down for years:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020

    Indeed there is a slight excess of Right wing referrals over Islamism for intervention.

    Given what Leon posted, one explanation you could argue is that the authorities are turning more of a blind eye to Islamic terrorism and trying to big up the threat from right-wing extremism.

    The facts speak for themselves though. Bar Jo Cox, the major terrorist incidents in recent years - London Bridge, Manchester Arena etc etc - have all come from Islamic radicalises.

    Still, I guess we can all sing “Don’t look back in anger” the next time an atrocity happens.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,795

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Leon said:

    darkage said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    It accurately reflects the prejudices of those who work in such administrations though.
    One of the most extraordinary remarks in the GLA document is this:


    "Muslim and Jewish participants were more concerned about right-wing extremism than Islamist extremism. "

    Page 175 in the PDF

    Now, it is hardly surprising that Muslims are more concerned about "right wing extremism" as against Muslim extremism

    But the idea that Jews are more worried about Tommy Robinson than they are worried by Islamist attacks is so ridiculous it renders the whole paper redundantly stupid if not wilfully, offensively mendacious.

    Synagogues and Jewish schools in London do not have guards because of a few skinheads from Ilford. We all know why they are protected

    Sadiq Khan's London Authority pumps out this lying Woke bilge. And we all pay for it

    Incredible

    If you CTL+F for Islam, almost all the references are about Islamophobia, or Muslims not liking ISIS being linked with Islam and preferring "Daesh".
    It is incredible. My thanks to TSE for giving me the chance to direct PB-ers towards it

    The whole thing is a laborious, grotesque exercise - supposedly aimed at "battling extremism" - which is actually about exonerating or ignoring Islam and getting everyone to focus on "white right wing British extremism".

    Repulsive. Sadiq Khan is a poisonous creature
    Who could have guessed?

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-nation-of-islam/

    https://fullfact.org/online/sadiq-khan-zacarias-moussaoui/
    I am no fan of Khan but there's not much in this. Lawyers can't be tainted by their clients.
    For me, Khan is condemned by his performance in office, more than his past. He is bigoted and useless
    He's planning on doing just the Victoria and Central lines for night tube this year. North and South London left waiting, women in North and South London clearly less valued by the mayor than those in East and West. The Central line would be the lowest priority, surely the Northern Line which runs through Camden and Leicester Square makes a lot more sense and it serves South London too which is underserved by public transport in general.

    This is a decision taken by someone who doesn't understand London and doesn't understand nightlife in London.
    Victoria line serves Stockwell and Brixton.
    The Northern line serves Clapham, Balham and Tooting, areas which are very popular with young people (Balham and Clapham with younger women especially in my experience) who live in shared flats/houses. It goes through Stockwell too.

    And once again, if the task is to ferry people from nightlife spots to where they live, maybe actually having the bloody tube line that goes to both of London's biggest nightlife spots would be a good idea. The Central line makes no sense at all, the bits in central London are mostly in the square mile.
    Central line serves BOTH Westfield shopping centres (Shepherd's Bush and Stratford), Oxford Street and Liverpool Street.
    Who the hell is going to Westfield after 1am though? Liverpool Street is in the square mile, city wankers (myself included) all escape from there at about midnight because it's not good for proper late night opening bars or clubs. Oxford Circus is already served by the Victoria Line.
    Most of the Zone 1 stations on the Central line are NOT in the Square Mile. You know you can actually interchange between Tube lines, so having Oxford Circus open on more than one line serving it makes sense.
    You really don't understand London's night scene do you. Having the Northern Line would mean crossover points at Euston/Warren Street and Stockwell. More than anything else it gives people who live beyond Stockwell a proper option. East Londoners can still get Ubers and the buses are pretty rapid.

    Not serving Camden is putting people in jeopardy, drunk women especially so.
  • eek said:

    Someone just found this in Hansard - think it’s from 2019

    image

    Damn that's sad. :(
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Leon said:

    THAT'S FUCKING MAD

    Sounds unprofitable. Enjoy it while you can - it’s in the phase of buying market awareness
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,605
    It's amazing how much paranoia there still is about covid restrictions in some places. We've managed the transition to treating covid as an edemic virus much better than this:

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-19-precautions-prompt-backlash-on-college-campuses-11634376600

    "At the University of Southern California, 95% of students are vaccinated but they need proof of a weekly negative Covid-19 test to enter campus. Students must leave classrooms to take a sip of water, rather than just sliding their masks down."
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,952
    Charles said:

    Leon said:

    THAT'S FUCKING MAD

    Sounds unprofitable. Enjoy it while you can - it’s in the phase of buying market awareness
    It is employing the recent tried and tested business model of selling you a dollar for 80 cents.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631
    MrEd said:

    Taz said:

    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    This actually reads like a sort of tragic historical source; evidence of a society desperately searching for distractions from existential threats it cannot deal with; so it retreats in to this sort of comforting denial - more interfaith dialogue will sort all this out, etc

    It also looks like evidence of how money going in to try and stop terrorist attacks like the one we had a couple of days ago has been channeled in to things like stopping hate speech; thanks to the expansive definition of 'violent extremism'.

    Its bad, and things are going to get worse.
    The government figures show the opposite, that referrals to Prevent for suspected Islamist radicalisation have been going down for years:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020

    Indeed there is a slight excess of Right wing referrals over Islamism for intervention.

    Surely we can be concerned about both ? It’s not either/or as some people seem to think
    Yes, there seems to be a bit of a game going on at the moment, which is “who do I want to big up the threat from more?”. If you are right wing, Islamic fundamentalism, if you are left wing, right wing extremism. Unfortunately, preventing terrorism has become politicised.

    Yes, and there are people who defend Right Wing Terrorists attacking Congress, astonishing as it may seem.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,631
    MrEd said:

    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    This actually reads like a sort of tragic historical source; evidence of a society desperately searching for distractions from existential threats it cannot deal with; so it retreats in to this sort of comforting denial - more interfaith dialogue will sort all this out, etc

    It also looks like evidence of how money going in to try and stop terrorist attacks like the one we had a couple of days ago has been channeled in to things like stopping hate speech; thanks to the expansive definition of 'violent extremism'.

    Its bad, and things are going to get worse.
    The government figures show the opposite, that referrals to Prevent for suspected Islamist radicalisation have been going down for years:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020

    Indeed there is a slight excess of Right wing referrals over Islamism for intervention.

    Given what Leon posted, one explanation you could argue is that the authorities are turning more of a blind eye to Islamic terrorism and trying to big up the threat from right-wing extremism.

    The facts speak for themselves though. Bar Jo Cox, the major terrorist incidents in recent years - London Bridge, Manchester Arena etc etc - have all come from Islamic radicalises.

    Still, I guess we can all sing “Don’t look back in anger” the next time an atrocity happens.
    There was the planned killing of Rosie Cooper too.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,399
    edited October 2021
    Londoners ought to be glad they don't live in Newcastle. The trains begin at 10:53 am, and last one back is at 9pm on Sunday.
    They are a damned sight pricier than the Tube too.
  • TresTres Posts: 2,694
    MrEd said:

    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    This actually reads like a sort of tragic historical source; evidence of a society desperately searching for distractions from existential threats it cannot deal with; so it retreats in to this sort of comforting denial - more interfaith dialogue will sort all this out, etc

    It also looks like evidence of how money going in to try and stop terrorist attacks like the one we had a couple of days ago has been channeled in to things like stopping hate speech; thanks to the expansive definition of 'violent extremism'.

    Its bad, and things are going to get worse.
    The government figures show the opposite, that referrals to Prevent for suspected Islamist radicalisation have been going down for years:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020

    Indeed there is a slight excess of Right wing referrals over Islamism for intervention.

    Given what Leon posted, one explanation you could argue is that the authorities are turning more of a blind eye to Islamic terrorism and trying to big up the threat from right-wing extremism.

    The facts speak for themselves though. Bar Jo Cox, the major terrorist incidents in recent years - London Bridge, Manchester Arena etc etc - have all come from Islamic radicalises.

    Still, I guess we can all sing “Don’t look back in anger” the next time an atrocity happens.
    There's a constant stream of far right extremists getting arrested and jailed. Luckily we are getting them before they act.
  • Leon said:

    Sitrep GoriLlas Order

    THIS IS RIDICULOUS

    As I said, I downloaded the app half an hour ago. Took 1 minute to set it up with Apple Pay

    I just, as a test, ordered 1 bottle of red wine. A decent Trivento Reserve Malbec. £8 at Sainsbury's. £8 + £.180 delivery from Gorillas

    This is 10pm on a Sunday

    I ordered it, as in clicking my phone, at 9.54pm. The app said "it will be there in 9 minutes". And it was. I have just collected it at the door. THE PROCESS FROM ORDER TO DELIVERY TOOK 9 MINUTES

    Aren't you a bit concerned, that such excessive speed might discombobulate the wine in some way?

    Not to mention adverse impact on climate change. Should have ordered at least a case!
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    Foxy said:

    darkage said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    *Shocked*

    Turns out that Prevent document lumping Brexit in with the far-right was in fact fake news.

    https://twitter.com/DamCou/status/1449724542306459651

    No one said it was. Or, at least, I didn't. It was guidance from the GLA for stakeholders implementing Prevent. As I said on here
    You literally posted the Tweet Damien deleted which said that.
    I saved you the effort. Here's my comment:

    "Incredible

    The people who run Prevent - which the Somalian assassin was subscribed to - are taught this:

    ‘This training should revolve around contemporary issues such as the rise of right wing extremism in schools, universities and public spaces, Brexit and hate crime’

    That’s right. Just quietly slot Brexit - a democratic vote by 17.4m people - alongside ‘right wing extremism’ and ‘hate crime’"

    +++

    At no point do I say "this is what Prevent says"

    Because it doesn't. This is the guidance from the GLA given TO stakeholders implementing Prevent

    Being a good PB-er, before commenting, I actually went back to the sources. You know. Actual research. Checking my facts. Here it is. You'll find the offending remark in Annexe 3

    https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/cve_strategy_20_8_19.pdf

    The whole document is astounding. It's all about combating extremism but for the first 20 of about 30 pages it bangs on and on - exclusively - about "right wing extremism in white London communities". I do not joke. Read it

    Only at about page 23 is there the first pained mention of "Islam" as perhaps also being an issue. The whole thing is a Woke Joke
    This actually reads like a sort of tragic historical source; evidence of a society desperately searching for distractions from existential threats it cannot deal with; so it retreats in to this sort of comforting denial - more interfaith dialogue will sort all this out, etc

    It also looks like evidence of how money going in to try and stop terrorist attacks like the one we had a couple of days ago has been channeled in to things like stopping hate speech; thanks to the expansive definition of 'violent extremism'.

    Its bad, and things are going to get worse.
    The government figures show the opposite, that referrals to Prevent for suspected Islamist radicalisation have been going down for years:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020/individuals-referred-to-and-supported-through-the-prevent-programme-april-2019-to-march-2020

    Indeed there is a slight excess of Right wing referrals over Islamism for intervention.

    That suggests that it isn't working; because islamic terrorist attacks are happening anyway. So it rather reinforces my sense that there is a denial of the problem.



This discussion has been closed.