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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » PB gathering – Ilkley, Yorkshire: Monday July 7th 2014 star

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  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787

    JackW said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    @BhamUpdates: Please dispose of your England memorabilia responsibly. http://t.co/hGHhuLXlfa

    Chortle

    Put it in the loft for short term use in Russia and Qatar ....

    Titter ....

    Don't be mean ;)
    Duly admonished ....

    Anyway ....

    Question - What's the difference between the England Football team and a teabag ?

    Answer - The tea bag stays in the cup longer ....

    Dons tin hat and scuttles for cover ....

    Too true, Jack. I believe Scots are experts at being knocked out in the first round (when they qualify)?
    We didn't qualify to make England look good .... as a plan it's not quite found its mark yet !!

    It does make a novel change from going out on penalties, it has to be said. It's a whole different level of disappointment: a slow seeping away of hope rather than the bitter low that the intensity of penalties brings.
    Quite.

    The irony is that England have probably played better this tournament and gone out historically early than previously when they have progressed through the group stages.

    It wouldn't surprise me if they beat Costa Rica comfortably with an excellent performance just to rub salt in the wound. Head scratching all round.

    Such is the mercurial nature of sport.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188

    Not a legal chap, but surely it's 'summoned'?:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27949867

    "Ed Balls summonsed over car crash"

    Summonsed is correct.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Swiss rolling over for France

    3:0 after 40mins.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,662
    Mr. Eagles, that's a weird-looking word.

    If we had a trebuchet-based justice system the traffic terror Balls would find himself flung into the sea.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    JackW said:

    Swiss rolling over for France

    3:0 after 40mins.

    The Swiss defence is full of holes.

    These puns about the Swiss are so cheesy.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    edited June 2014

    Mr. Eagles, that's a weird-looking word.

    If we had a trebuchet-based justice system the traffic terror Balls would find himself flung into the sea.

    One of favourite words is "enjoined" has two different and contradictory meanings
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,656

    Bloody Hell

    Ed Miliband is to be told by Labour frontbenchers that he will have to resign as leader if he loses the general election next year, as they move to prevent him following the example of Neil Kinnock by leading the party to two consecutive defeats.

    Amid increasing concern that the Labour leader is failing to connect with voters, MPs across the party are saying Labour would need a fresh start if Miliband were defeated. "Ed really cannot stay on if he loses – that really would not work," one frontbencher said. "He has to go if we lose," another frontbencher said.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/jun/20/ed-miliband-must-go-lose-election-labour-frontbencher

    "Ed has to go if we lose", said someone who wants his job.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,157

    Not a legal chap, but surely it's 'summoned'?:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27949867

    "Ed Balls summonsed over car crash"

    AFAIK summonsed is correct usage here.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,662
    Mr. Eagles, those meanings being?

    In unrelated news, I still don't have an owl.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188

    Bloody Hell

    Ed Miliband is to be told by Labour frontbenchers that he will have to resign as leader if he loses the general election next year, as they move to prevent him following the example of Neil Kinnock by leading the party to two consecutive defeats.

    Amid increasing concern that the Labour leader is failing to connect with voters, MPs across the party are saying Labour would need a fresh start if Miliband were defeated. "Ed really cannot stay on if he loses – that really would not work," one frontbencher said. "He has to go if we lose," another frontbencher said.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/jun/20/ed-miliband-must-go-lose-election-labour-frontbencher

    "Ed has to go if we lose", said someone who wants his job.
    David Miliband? I reckon it must be Yvette or Chuka
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,598

    Speedy said:

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    How many times will it be mentioned?
    We need a UK team not 4 weak teams that go no where.
    That would just be a way of getting Gareth Bale into the England team.

    Edit: and Sir Alex as manager. It's sounding better all the time.
    After Sept 18th???????
    Eh, if you can have a Swede why not a Scot?
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    Channel 4 News ✔ @Channel4News

    If you missed the debate between @y_alibhai and @JamesDelingpole: over @Mike_Fabricant's 'punch' tweet, watch it here http://bit.ly/TeWL8v

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P13LiPIxdC0

    I thought mr delingpole really told Alibhai-Brown what people thought of her ;-)
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188

    Mr. Eagles, those meanings being?

    In unrelated news, I still don't have an owl.

    Enjoined has the following meanings

    1) instruct or urge (someone) to do something.

    2) prohibit someone from performing (a particular action) by issuing an injunction
  • scoopscoop Posts: 64
    France score to make it 3-0 Commentator with a rehearsed line "Not for the first there is a mountain between France and Switzerland"
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,157
    scoop said:

    France score to make it 3-0 Commentator with a rehearsed line "Not for the first there is a mountain between France and Switzerland"

    Crikey that brings back memories of essays on Gallic Ultramontanism
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    ToryJim said:

    scoop said:

    France score to make it 3-0 Commentator with a rehearsed line "Not for the first there is a mountain between France and Switzerland"

    Crikey that brings back memories of essays on Gallic Ultramontanism
    When the French concede a goal, am I allowed to say "The French defence proved as useful as the Maginot Line"
  • MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584
    Pair jailed for Edinburgh's Central Mosque bacon attack

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-27941589
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,662
    Mr. Johnno, cheers for that video.

    I dislike the 'women abused on Twitter' generalisation, though. It's not that it doesn't happen, but it happens more widely (the Call of Duty developer who very slightly [by tenths of a second] amended reloading times on weapons and was subjected, and his family also, to death threats springs to mind). Turning it into a 'women's issue' only tells part of the story. It's a broader area.

    Likewise the 'violence against women' line. It does suggest it's somehow worse than violence against men.

    Delingpole didn't exactly cover himself in glory with the 'you girls' approach, either.

    And then there's the deeply infuriating (Fabricant was right about that) YAB attacking 'deeply uncivilised men'. Things don't have to broken down along gender lines... people are more complicated than that.

    Quite unedifying.

    Amused she raised Diane Abbott[sp] though, given she got away with the whites dividing and ruling tweet.

    Mr. Eagles, that's confusing. On the other hand, enjoined sounds like a good word to use in a comedy at some point...
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Look on the bright side, Leicester City have their fitures out and we should see some great footy. We can even chant at Citeh "Are you England in Disguise?"

    And Leicesters World Cup interest is still going; Mahrez is doing well.

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,656
    Carnyx said:

    Speedy said:

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    How many times will it be mentioned?
    We need a UK team not 4 weak teams that go no where.
    That would just be a way of getting Gareth Bale into the England team.

    Edit: and Sir Alex as manager. It's sounding better all the time.
    After Sept 18th???????
    Eh, if you can have a Swede why not a Scot?
    Or a Swedish Scot - step forward Stuart Dickson?!
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    Seriously, Costa Rica are around 4/1 to beat England, fill yer boots
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,769
    Nice of ITV to stick the Belgium flag up on the Telly. Not sure what relevance it has to the match though
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,652
    edited June 2014
    What a collection of repellent hypocrites the Left have been over this Fabricant business. He was their hero and martyr a few months ago when Dave sacked him. Here are a few samples from CiF at the time:

    'Cameron really is a petulant pr*ck, isn't he?'

    'Fabricant is one of the few members of the House with a mind of his own.'

    'Totally nuts, am definitely not a tory neither am I constituent but Michael Fabricant engaged with the electorate in a way that many Tories will find impossible to emulate.'

    'He has an offbeat sense of humour; he's a human being, unlike most of the drones in parliament.'

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/apr/09/tory-vice-chair-fabricant-sacked?commentpage=1

    Risible!
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,598

    Carnyx said:

    Speedy said:

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    How many times will it be mentioned?
    We need a UK team not 4 weak teams that go no where.
    That would just be a way of getting Gareth Bale into the England team.

    Edit: and Sir Alex as manager. It's sounding better all the time.
    After Sept 18th???????
    Eh, if you can have a Swede why not a Scot?
    Or a Swedish Scot - step forward Stuart Dickson?!
    Well, there are strong links. I once had a very pleasant chat with a Swedish colleague about Cromarty [north of Inverness, and in the 17th and 18th centuries a major seaport]. His family turned out to have made iron and sent it there in days of old.

  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    edited June 2014
    perdix said:


    China had (has?) a system whereby its citizens could move to another district but did not qualify for any benefits unless they had official recognition.

    Yep, I've even remembered its name.

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hukou_system
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    ToryJim said:

    JackW said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    @BhamUpdates: Please dispose of your England memorabilia responsibly. http://t.co/hGHhuLXlfa

    Chortle

    Put it in the loft for short term use in Russia and Qatar ....

    Titter ....

    Don't be mean ;)
    Duly admonished ....

    Anyway ....

    Question - What's the difference between the England Football team and a teabag ?

    Answer - The tea bag stays in the cup longer ....

    Dons tin hat and scuttles for cover ....

    Too true, Jack. I believe Scots are experts at being knocked out in the first round (when they qualify)?
    We didn't qualify to make England look good .... as a plan it's not quite found its mark yet !!

    It does make a novel change from going out on penalties, it has to be said. It's a whole different level of disappointment: a slow seeping away of hope rather than the bitter low that the intensity of penalties brings.
    At least we haven't had to put up with the usual levels of tabloid jingoism.
    Or flags on cars.

    Incidentally, I do hope PBers have been preparing big buckets of sh1t to tip over me if Italy go out in the 1st Round.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    France score again.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,769
    dr_spyn said:

    France score again.

    Or is it Belgium
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,662
    Got quite a lot on at the moment, but depending how things go I *might* have a crack at a pre-Wimbledon blog. If so, it'll be up at the weekend [obviously this overlaps with the Austrian Grand Prix, as well as 'serious' work].
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,157
    edited June 2014
    dr_spyn said:

    France score again.

    Hmm I'd quite like them to win simply for the hilarity that would ensue when Hollande tries to bathe in reflected glory.

    EDIT by win I mean the entire thing
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    and again.
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312

    Speedy said:

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    How many times will it be mentioned?
    We need a UK team not 4 weak teams that go no where.
    That would just be a way of getting Gareth Bale into the England team.

    Edit: and Sir Alex as manager. It's sounding better all the time.
    Why? He took Scotland to the World Cup in 1986.

    Results? Two defeats and a draw. Hardly Earth-shattering.
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    Speedy said:

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    How many times will it be mentioned?
    We need a UK team not 4 weak teams that go no where.
    Remind me. How did a UK team do in the Olympics despite playing all its matches at Wembley?
  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    edited June 2014
    "Switzerland to beat the Frogs"

    er, possible, but they need to score 6 goals in the next 10 minutes.

    [edit] make that five.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    Ninoinoz said:

    Speedy said:

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    How many times will it be mentioned?
    We need a UK team not 4 weak teams that go no where.
    Remind me. How did a UK team do in the Olympics despite playing all its matches at Wembley?
    Err, Team GB played their matches in Manchester and Cardiff as well as Wembley.

    I know, I was at the match in Manchester.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    Swiss on a roll.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,751


    When the French concede a goal, am I allowed to say "The French defence proved as useful as the Maginot Line"

    More like Force de frappe, never used.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188


    When the French concede a goal, am I allowed to say "The French defence proved as useful as the Maginot Line"

    More like Force de frappe, never used.
    Perfect timing.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,068

    What a collection of repellent hypocrites the Left have been over this Fabricant business. He was their hero and martyr a few months ago when Dave sacked him. Here are a few samples from CiF at the time:

    'Cameron really is a petulant pr*ck, isn't he?'

    'Fabricant is one of the few members of the House with a mind of his own.'

    'Totally nuts, am definitely not a tory neither am I constituent but Michael Fabricant engaged with the electorate in a way that many Tories will find impossible to emulate.'

    'He has an offbeat sense of humour; he's a human being, unlike most of the drones in parliament.'

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/apr/09/tory-vice-chair-fabricant-sacked?commentpage=1

    Risible!

    YAB should be burned at the stake.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    Also, we can deduce, the England football team are proud and committed Unionists, as some said, England doing well at the World Cup would be a boost for Yes.

    Clearly, England's attempt to replicate Scotland at the World Cup will be a boost for No.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,732


    When the French concede a goal, am I allowed to say "The French defence proved as useful as the Maginot Line"

    More like Force de frappe, never used.
    Very expensive, and never used? (not actually sure of the worth of the players!)
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    RobD said:


    When the French concede a goal, am I allowed to say "The French defence proved as useful as the Maginot Line"

    More like Force de frappe, never used.
    Very expensive, and never used? (not actually sure of the worth of the players!)
    Liverpool signed Sakho, the French centre back for close to 20million.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,157
    Right I'm officially transferring my loyalties for the remainder of their cup run to France just found that they have a player from my favourite French town.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    Swiss score again.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    edited June 2014
    ToryJim said:

    Right I'm officially transferring my loyalties for the remainder of their cup run to France just found that they have a player from my favourite French town.

    An Englishman cheering for France?????

    William Joyce was hanged for less treasonable behaviour.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,732
    dr_spyn said:

    Swiss score again.

    Damn! 7 goals in this game so far.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,157

    ToryJim said:

    Right I'm officially transferring my loyalties for the remainder of their cup run to France just found that they have a player from my favourite French town.

    An Englishman cheering for France?????

    William Joyce was hanged for less treasonable behaviour.
    Technically two thirds of it is ours anyway ;)
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,732
    ToryJim said:

    ToryJim said:

    Right I'm officially transferring my loyalties for the remainder of their cup run to France just found that they have a player from my favourite French town.

    An Englishman cheering for France?????

    William Joyce was hanged for less treasonable behaviour.
    Technically two thirds of it is ours anyway ;)
    We'll have the sunny bits, and wine-growing bits. :')
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    ToryJim said:

    ToryJim said:

    Right I'm officially transferring my loyalties for the remainder of their cup run to France just found that they have a player from my favourite French town.

    An Englishman cheering for France?????

    William Joyce was hanged for less treasonable behaviour.
    Technically two thirds of it is ours anyway ;)
    The buggers should be forced to honour the Treaty of Troyes.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,157

    ToryJim said:

    ToryJim said:

    Right I'm officially transferring my loyalties for the remainder of their cup run to France just found that they have a player from my favourite French town.

    An Englishman cheering for France?????

    William Joyce was hanged for less treasonable behaviour.
    Technically two thirds of it is ours anyway ;)
    The buggers should be forced to honour the Treaty of Troyes.
    Well quite.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    Swiss saved by the whistle.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    The problem with owning large parts of France is all those marching Germans every few years.
    RobD said:

    ToryJim said:

    ToryJim said:

    Right I'm officially transferring my loyalties for the remainder of their cup run to France just found that they have a player from my favourite French town.

    An Englishman cheering for France?????

    William Joyce was hanged for less treasonable behaviour.
    Technically two thirds of it is ours anyway ;)
    We'll have the sunny bits, and wine-growing bits. :')
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,732

    The problem with owning large parts of France is all those marching Germans every few years.

    RobD said:

    ToryJim said:

    ToryJim said:

    Right I'm officially transferring my loyalties for the remainder of their cup run to France just found that they have a player from my favourite French town.

    An Englishman cheering for France?????

    William Joyce was hanged for less treasonable behaviour.
    Technically two thirds of it is ours anyway ;)
    We'll have the sunny bits, and wine-growing bits. :')
    A buffer client state is in order.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    Correlation does not equal causation.

    Although I suspect that the beginning of the downturn actually lead to the restrictions on immigration, rather than the closing of the door leading to decline
  • sladeslade Posts: 2,011
    I will be watching the Tour as it comes through Kirklees but hope to be at Ilkley on the Monday.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    Correlation does not equal causation.

    Although I suspect that the beginning of the downturn actually lead to the restrictions on immigration, rather than the closing of the door leading to decline

    Of course the industrial steam and coal based economies of the Industrial Revolution were identical to the modern information based, service oriented ones we have now.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Sean_F said:

    What a collection of repellent hypocrites the Left have been over this Fabricant business. He was their hero and martyr a few months ago when Dave sacked him. Here are a few samples from CiF at the time:

    'Cameron really is a petulant pr*ck, isn't he?'

    'Fabricant is one of the few members of the House with a mind of his own.'

    'Totally nuts, am definitely not a tory neither am I constituent but Michael Fabricant engaged with the electorate in a way that many Tories will find impossible to emulate.'

    'He has an offbeat sense of humour; he's a human being, unlike most of the drones in parliament.'

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/apr/09/tory-vice-chair-fabricant-sacked?commentpage=1

    Risible!

    YAB should be burned at the stake.

    Friend of mine lives in Paris. Has a rather recognisable surname (in the sense of "Are you decended from the XXX who set fire to Joan of Arc?").

    His usual response is along the lines "well he didn't actually *light* the bonfire"...
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    John_M said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    Correlation does not equal causation.

    Although I suspect that the beginning of the downturn actually lead to the restrictions on immigration, rather than the closing of the door leading to decline

    Of course the industrial steam and coal based economies of the Industrial Revolution were identical to the modern information based, service oriented ones we have now.
    Just working on the basis that people who see their livelihoods at risk will seek to introduce protectionism.

    Immigration controls are arguably just a specific form of protectionism
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    If @Socrates is still on,may I apologize for my 'Bollocks' comment towards you from last night.

    No worries, mate. Don't think I even noticed it. I've given out worse.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    @Socrates

    When women are banned from driving a car, forced to walk several steps behind their husbands, and forced to wear the hijab, Syria will have had just a taste of 'equivalence' with Saudi Arabia. Which incidentally, is exactly the nightmarish type of Sharia state that the vast majority of rebels wanted to create. As for it 'now' being as bad, firstly it isn't, secondly Syria is in the grip of a civil war, which is why it's farcical that this 'killing his own people' line is still trotted out by Hague and the like with a straight face -um yes?

    My sources include RT, PressTV, the Friendsofsyria blog, NSNBC.me, Debka.org and many more, added to my standard reading matter of The Telegraph. But more importantly than that, I am aware of the agenda of each news source, and I glean what I can from each whilst dismissing the chaff. It seems that you would never take a piece of citizen journalism seriously, which in this day and age I'm afraid is asking to be ill informed. The video that I provided is not a broadcast documentary, but it is produced by and featuring professional journalists and I consider the findings to be beyond dispute. If you do feel like watching it, just google 'Syria Manufacturing Dissent'.

    I'm quite happy to take citizen journalists seriously as long as they have been established as credible. But "bloke on internet without reputation claims something" isn't that credible. Neither is the propaganda sent out by state propaganda channels from autocratic governments like Iran and Russia.

    As for your first point. The Syrian government was killing people when it was still unarmed protesters. He was shelling towns as far back as April 2011.
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    Perdix it has to be said makes a devastatingly good point about immigration. We regularly and happily bypass British workers by buying goods from abroad. As he suggests, we squirm in our made in Korea trainers as we are served a Big Mac by a Pole.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    rcs1000 said:


    Singapore is the richest country in South East Asia, with a GDP per head equivalent better than the US. It is also has some of the highest immigration levels in the world. 43% of the people in Singapore are immigrants.

    China has been an immigration story too, of course. Historially it (like Russia) had internal passports. These internal passports existed for the same reason you, and other supporters of vested interests and opponents of human freedom, support restrictions on human beings going to where work is, and businesses employing who they want: because it was in the narrow interests of a few people.

    One of the major reasons for the growth of China has been allowing immigration - i.e. allowing workers to go where the work is.

    Of course, you are happy to go and buy a cellphone made in Korea or China. Your narrow and alleged support for the British worker stops at buying goods actually made in the UK.

    It's OK for you to personally discriminate against British workers by buying goods made by foreign workers. But god forbid anyone should discriminate against a British worker by getting a haircut from a Pole.

    Singapore has mainly imported highly skilled financial workers, not low skilled migrants. As for China, you surely know that that growth is because the same workers are being considered before and after, which isn't the case for international migrants, where the workers are coming from outside the country.

    As for your comment on international trade, that clearly doesn't have half the negatives associated with international migration. It also means that low income in the workers in the UK can go into non-tradeable jobs instead. But your approach of international free trade plus open door immigration would decimate all their options.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Just got back from seeing Belle at the cinema. Brilliant film.
  • No_Offence_AlanNo_Offence_Alan Posts: 4,464

    Mr. Eagles, that's a weird-looking word.

    If we had a trebuchet-based justice system the traffic terror Balls would find himself flung into the sea.

    One of favourite words is "enjoined" has two different and contradictory meanings
    I like the fact that "flammable" and "inflammable" have the same meaning.
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,292
    Twitter
    Patrick Wintour ‏@patrickwintour 57s
    David Blunkett former Labour cabinet minister has told local party standing down at next election - reports.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,531
    edited June 2014
    Hi TSE!

    Care to slag off the French now?

    :)

    P W D L F A GD Pts
    FRANCE 2 2 0 0 8 2 6 6
    ENGLAND 2 0 0 2 2 4 -2 0
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    Charles said:

    John_M said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    Correlation does not equal causation.

    Although I suspect that the beginning of the downturn actually lead to the restrictions on immigration, rather than the closing of the door leading to decline

    Of course the industrial steam and coal based economies of the Industrial Revolution were identical to the modern information based, service oriented ones we have now.
    Just working on the basis that people who see their livelihoods at risk will seek to introduce protectionism.

    Immigration controls are arguably just a specific form of protectionism
    Charles, my comment was directed at rcs, rather than yourself - I agree with your point. Sloppy quoting on my part, sorry to say.

    I'm of an age that leaving education at 16, 18 or 21 was a genuine dilemma - there were career paths for people with no/few qualifications, A-levels and of course, graduates (around a fifth of my sixth form went to university, it wasn't anything like as common as today).

    That's changed over time. 'Unskilled' has, and will continue to, include 'skilled but it's more economically viable to outsource or automate, so hard cheese'.

    The argument is that skills have historically become obsolete (the old chestnut of the 'buggy whip makers'), and jobs requiring different skills have emerged. I'm not convinced that there's any historical inevitability about that pattern; robots and complex software systems are quantitatively different to anything we've seen before.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,531

    Mr. Eagles, that's a weird-looking word.

    If we had a trebuchet-based justice system the traffic terror Balls would find himself flung into the sea.

    One of favourite words is "enjoined" has two different and contradictory meanings
    I like the fact that "flammable" and "inflammable" have the same meaning.
    Luckily, 'flammable' is only used in the US!
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    edited June 2014
    An article that links demographics and the recent Euro elections.
    atimes.com/atimes/World/WOR-01-280514.html
  • antifrank1antifrank1 Posts: 81
    Sanction has opposite meanings, from approve to condemn.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    Honduras lead, CASH OUT!
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    So glad I cashed out.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188

    Hi TSE!

    Care to slag off the French now?

    :)


    P W D L F A GD Pts
    FRANCE 2 2 0 0 8 2 6 6
    ENGLAND 2 0 0 2 2 4 -2 0
    I will always slag off the French, the nation of Collaborators.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited June 2014
    Cash out strategy works AGAIN. Thanks again to TSE.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,163
    Socrates said:


    I'm quite happy to take citizen journalists seriously as long as they have been established as credible. But "bloke on internet without reputation claims something" isn't that credible. Neither is the propaganda sent out by state propaganda channels from autocratic governments like Iran and Russia.

    As for your first point. The Syrian government was killing people when it was still unarmed protesters. He was shelling towns as far back as April 2011.

    The BBC has long been established as credible, but that didn't stop them accompanying a piece about one of Assad's 'massacres' with a photograph of rows of body bags that was actually from Iraq. CNN is credible, but that hasn't stopped them being caught repeatedly staging news, infamously airing someone saying 'get the gunfire sounds ready' before a video conference with an 'activist'. And where do all these 'credible' outlets go for their Syria quotes? 'The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights' -which is actually one FSA propagandist in a flat in Coventry. It isn't about the source; it's about the information, and whether the evidence convinces you or not. To imagine you are getting quality information because it's read from an autocue (obviously only a Western, non-autocratic one), is simply naive.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    edited June 2014
    As I'm at the cricket tomorrow, here's my tips for tomorrow's matches.

    Iran to defeat the Argentinians.

    Ghana to defeat the Germans.

    Nigeria to defeat Bosnia.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    As I'm at the cricket tomorrow, here's my tips for tomorrow's matches.

    Iran to defeat the Argentinians.

    Ghana to defeat the Germans.

    Nigeria to defeat Bosnia.

    Do you have any tips for the Test match?
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    A Scottish friend on Facebook writes:
    Ok, ok, Scotland aren't there/haven't qualified but I don't know if you've noticed but our 'second' team "The Team England Are Playing", are, frankly, having a fucking superb tournament so far.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    Socrates said:


    I'm quite happy to take citizen journalists seriously as long as they have been established as credible. But "bloke on internet without reputation claims something" isn't that credible. Neither is the propaganda sent out by state propaganda channels from autocratic governments like Iran and Russia.

    As for your first point. The Syrian government was killing people when it was still unarmed protesters. He was shelling towns as far back as April 2011.

    The BBC has long been established as credible, but that didn't stop them accompanying a piece about one of Assad's 'massacres' with a photograph of rows of body bags that was actually from Iraq. CNN is credible, but that hasn't stopped them being caught repeatedly staging news, infamously airing someone saying 'get the gunfire sounds ready' before a video conference with an 'activist'. And where do all these 'credible' outlets go for their Syria quotes? 'The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights' -which is actually one FSA propagandist in a flat in Coventry. It isn't about the source; it's about the information, and whether the evidence convinces you or not. To imagine you are getting quality information because it's read from an autocue (obviously only a Western, non-autocratic one), is simply naive.

    Source credibility is necessary but not sufficient to establish reliability in a story. The BBC and CNN are held up to a certain standard, so people that will call them out if they get things wrong. Places like RT and Press TV are so widely known to be propaganda outlets, nobody even bothers to fact check them any more.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,188
    AndyJS said:

    As I'm at the cricket tomorrow, here's my tips for tomorrow's matches.

    Iran to defeat the Argentinians.

    Ghana to defeat the Germans.

    Nigeria to defeat Bosnia.

    Do you have any tips for the Test match?
    Nope, I've got tickets for tomorrow and Sunday, and I want to be able to enjoy the match, rather spending time on my phone and iPad trading out my betting positions.

    I've done that in the past, and it's ruined the enjoyment of the match.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,531

    Hi TSE!

    Care to slag off the French now?

    :)


    P W D L F A GD Pts
    FRANCE 2 2 0 0 8 2 6 6
    ENGLAND 2 0 0 2 2 4 -2 0
    I will always slag off the French, the nation of Collaborators.
    Sore-Loserman :)
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,068
    Charles said:

    John_M said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    Correlation does not equal causation.

    Although I suspect that the beginning of the downturn actually lead to the restrictions on immigration, rather than the closing of the door leading to decline

    Of course the industrial steam and coal based economies of the Industrial Revolution were identical to the modern information based, service oriented ones we have now.
    Just working on the basis that people who see their livelihoods at risk will seek to introduce protectionism.

    Immigration controls are arguably just a specific form of protectionism
    Immigration controls are a feature of a country becoming democratic.

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,769

    AndyJS said:

    As I'm at the cricket tomorrow, here's my tips for tomorrow's matches.

    Iran to defeat the Argentinians.

    Ghana to defeat the Germans.

    Nigeria to defeat Bosnia.

    Do you have any tips for the Test match?
    Nope, I've got tickets for tomorrow and Sunday, and I want to be able to enjoy the match, rather spending time on my phone and iPad trading out my betting positions.

    I've done that in the past, and it's ruined the enjoyment of the match.
    I need Lanka to take a few wickets so I can get back to supporting England !
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,068
    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    Correlation does not equal causation.

    Although I suspect that the beginning of the downturn actually lead to the restrictions on immigration, rather than the closing of the door leading to decline
    In the case of the USA the peak of it's power came long after it introduced immigration controls, in 1920.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,163
    Source credibility is necessary but not sufficient to establish reliability in a story. The BBC and CNN are held up to a certain standard, so people that will call them out if they get things wrong. Places like RT and Press TV are so widely known to be propaganda outlets, nobody even bothers to fact check...

    ................

    I think you seriously under-estimate how far our own press has gone down the propaganda route. When Turkey shut down youtube recently, to hide a recording of their intelligence services planning a false flag attack to justify an invasion of Syria, not a single UK media outlet reported the true nature of the conversation, let alone give a transcript. Not even the Snowden supporting right on freedom fighters at The Guardian. That's censorship, of something that could have been pivotal over this country being called to war in support of a Nato ally. You had to go to RT to get that transcript. Do they expose this stuff for our benefit? No, but thank goodness they do all the same.

  • marke09marke09 Posts: 926
    Sky News ‏@SkyNews 4m

    David Blunkett To Quit To 'Give Labour A Break' http://news.sky.com/story/1286613/david-blunkett-to-quit-to-give-labour-a-break
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312

    Socrates said:


    I'm quite happy to take citizen journalists seriously as long as they have been established as credible. But "bloke on internet without reputation claims something" isn't that credible. Neither is the propaganda sent out by state propaganda channels from autocratic governments like Iran and Russia.

    As for your first point. The Syrian government was killing people when it was still unarmed protesters. He was shelling towns as far back as April 2011.

    The BBC has long been established as credible
    Yep, except for reporting child abuse within its own organisation.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,163
    Ninoinoz said:

    Socrates said:


    I'm quite happy to take citizen journalists seriously as long as they have been established as credible. But "bloke on internet without reputation claims something" isn't that credible. Neither is the propaganda sent out by state propaganda channels from autocratic governments like Iran and Russia.

    As for your first point. The Syrian government was killing people when it was still unarmed protesters. He was shelling towns as far back as April 2011.

    The BBC has long been established as credible
    Yep, except for reporting child abuse within its own organisation.
    Well, quite.

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Watching the cricket highlights — Sangakkara should have been caught behind but no-one appealed.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,531
    edited June 2014
    "The Longest Day" - Soulsavers featuring Dave Gahan, frontman of Depeche Mode, from a couple of years ago:

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=kO9js-Pym2Q/
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Sean_F said:

    Charles said:

    John_M said:

    Charles said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    Correlation does not equal causation.

    Although I suspect that the beginning of the downturn actually lead to the restrictions on immigration, rather than the closing of the door leading to decline

    Of course the industrial steam and coal based economies of the Industrial Revolution were identical to the modern information based, service oriented ones we have now.
    Just working on the basis that people who see their livelihoods at risk will seek to introduce protectionism.

    Immigration controls are arguably just a specific form of protectionism
    Immigration controls are a feature of a country becoming democratic.

    I'd argue that the first condition needs to hold, and the second is really that the rulers need to feel effective pressure from those who are suffering - democracy being a good way to transmit that pressure.

    As for the second post in the US I'd say that a downturn ( I believe that 1919/20 was one, but not my period) is enough to create the pressure: it's not a one time event.
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,292
    edited June 2014
    Twitter
    David Blunkett MP ‏@DavidBlunkettMP 36m
    Full statement on my decision not to seek re-election in 2015 http://davidblunkett.typepad.com


    The Staggers - Blunkett to stand down at next election
    'MP says "it is clear that the leadership of the party wish to see new faces".'
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Broad took a hat trick today but didn't realise himself at the time.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Beckton councillor Alec Kellaway has died. He contested the Newham NE by-election in 1994:

    http://www.newhamrecorder.co.uk/news/breaking_news_beckton_councillor_s_death_after_27_years_of_serving_area_s_people_1_3651501
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,769
    1-1000 Blunkett gets a Lordship.
  • JohnLoonyJohnLoony Posts: 1,790
    AndyJS said:

    I've been to Haworth. Still don't know how to pronounce it.

    How Earth.

This discussion has been closed.