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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » PB gathering – Ilkley, Yorkshire: Monday July 7th 2014 star

135

Comments

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Quincel said:

    It's half time, Costa Rica lead 1-0 and Stan James are STILL offering 1/10 on England going out in the groups! That was generous pre-match even using a treble of their own odds on the three results needed!

    I wonder what the maximum bet on that is.
  • welshowlwelshowl Posts: 4,464
    dr_spyn said:

    Costa Rica forwards will enjoy meeting England's defence.

    Only if they can find it. Think it's missing with Lord Lucan and Shergar.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    AndyJS said:

    Quincel said:

    It's half time, Costa Rica lead 1-0 and Stan James are STILL offering 1/10 on England going out in the groups! That was generous pre-match even using a treble of their own odds on the three results needed!

    I wonder what the maximum bet on that is.
    Dunno I'd probably try for a couple of hundred on it.
  • FalseFlagFalseFlag Posts: 1,801
    MrJones said:

    FPT



    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/f4798152-f858-11e3-a333-00144feabdc0.html#axzz35B3by4M9

    This is the real story today, the growing economy is not seeing a growth in tax receipts, so no wonder Avery wants to bury us in detail.

    Importing millions of extra people isn't "growth" or "recovery".

    And if the bulk of those extra millions are low-paid then it obviously won't improve the national finances at all. In fact it will make it worse.

    And if all the extra hospitals, schools, houses, roads, prisons etc needed to maintain the same level of infrastructure were being built for all these extra millions of people then the effect on the national finances would be much worse so a large part of the worsening situation is disguised inside the overloading of the existing infrastructure.

    The people who benefit are people who employ large quantities of low-paid workers as they are effectively off-loading their wage bill onto the taxpayers. This is just another example of privatizing profits while socializing costs which has become the dominant driver of the economy since the political class were bought.

    Californication, schools, hospitals and infrastructure are even more costly than welfare checks. The raising of the income tax bracket makes low wage immigrants impact even more devastating.

    Our finances are in a terrible state given the stage of the economic cycle we are in.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 52,121
    Just checking the score. Ooops. Bye-bye England?

    :(
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    On topic, what's the parking like around The Flying Duck?
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    "What's the difference between England and a tea bag?
    A tea bag stays in the cup longer."
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    I've been to Haworth. Still don't know how to pronounce it.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    Amusingly England were as low as 25-1 and Costa Rica as high as 2500-1 in this world cup.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Not a bad side Costa Rica! My nul points bet is looking promising...
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,816
    @Socrates

    The phrase I used was 'comparatively benign' and it does you no credit to chop off a word to try and manufacture -what was it you called it? Oh yes 'moral outrage'. I absolutely stand by that assertion, compared to Saudi Arabia or Bahrain, which make pre-war Syria look like a model state. Incidentally, there are also democracy movements in those countries, whose protests have been put down with the merciless vigour you would expect. Where is America and the West's 'push toward democracy' there?

    I take you on trust that you consult various sources on the matter, but frankly your surface account indicates your sources range from The Telegraph to The Guardian. It also indicates that you certainly didn't watch the video I posted earlier -no matter; I've no right to ask you to spend the time, but it demolishes the 'slaughter' angle, certainly before the conflict began in earnest. You had snipers shooting at both sides, a theme which has been repeated in Maidan, and in Crimea, where those on the ground were sensible enough not to let it trigger a full conflict.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    AndyJS said:

    I've been to Haworth. Still don't know how to pronounce it.

    Harr-werth

  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    edited June 2014
    Has Ed M commented on the Costa Rican crisis in England?
  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    We could easily see Italy, England, Portugal & Spain all going home before the knock outs...
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,564
    I see Populus reports that, asked if they remember anything from last week, 37% mention Iraq and only 21% mention the World Cup.

    Will Cameron get a negative bounce when we're out, as someone suggested? Nah. nobody expected anything else.

    Perhaps Mr Juncker could suggest a joint Euroteam...
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Italy are 10 with Betfair if anyone finds that bet attractive:

    http://www.betfair.com/exchange/football/market?id=1.112173847&exp=e
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 4,042

    Not a bad side Costa Rica! My nul points bet is looking promising...

    I seem to remember mocking that bet a couple of days ago. While it still isn't odds on and for good reason, I will admit that 33/1 is looking very sweet right now.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roy_Hodgson
    Roy Hodgson (born 9 August 1947) is an English former footballer who was the manager of the England national football team. He was sacked on 20th June ...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    England 1.33 for the test. I know we've had a great day and all but that looks far too short.

    Couple of wickets tommorow and that will be cashable.

  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    I apologise for saying this to all Italians but watching this Italian performance, they look like England when it comes to ball retention, basics like what is offside...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    If Italy lose 1-0 here then a draw against Uruguay gets them through.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Unfortunately I only put a couple of quid on as insurance against a disappointing England performance.
    Quincel said:

    Not a bad side Costa Rica! My nul points bet is looking promising...

    I seem to remember mocking that bet a couple of days ago. While it still isn't odds on and for good reason, I will admit that 33/1 is looking very sweet right now.
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 4,042
    Is it just me, or does the 1.4ish available on CR winning the match seem a bit generous? Only 13 minutes left and injury time, and they look as likely to score as Italy.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    2-0 and a draw against Uruguay sends them home...

    Actually they've probably assumed Costa Rica will get thrash England so are settling for 1-0 ^_^
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    Quincel said:

    Is it just me, or does the 1.4ish available on CR winning the match seem a bit generous? Only 13 minutes left and injury time, and they look as likely to score as Italy.

    Especially with the group maths.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    I've not been able to cash out my Costa Rica bets, turns out you can't cash in free bets.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Dear Mr Milliband,

    May I put in a request for a Costa Rican Pygmy Owl?

    They are far superior to English or Italian owls...

    http://owling.com/Costa_Rican_Pygmy.htm
  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    We lost to Italy and Uruguay - CR beaten both, we might lose 5-0 or worse.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    It's curtains for England. Well, almost.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Pulpstar said:

    If Italy lose 1-0 here then a draw against Uruguay gets them through.

    If Italy lose 2:0 then a draw will put Uruguay through on goals scored.

  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    To be topical, I think the Queen is more likely to punch Balotelli in the throat...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    JackW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    If Italy lose 1-0 here then a draw against Uruguay gets them through.

    If Italy lose 2:0 then a draw will put Uruguay through on goals scored.

    Italy are good at getting draws when they need to.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    What have the Italians ever done for us?
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    AndyJS said:

    It's curtains for England. Well, almost.

    Well what do you expect, when the UK educational establishment has taught 2 generations of school children that competition, especially in sport, is wrong and anathema.

    International football is only one area that the UK are not competitive.



  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    England out.

    The "Smithson" bet turns to dust - £200 lost.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    Arsenal and Fulham reserves help put England out.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    edited June 2014
    Yet another profitable tip by me.

    In case you missed, the rest of my tips for today are

    Switzerland to beat the Frogs, also backed Sakho as FGS

    Honduras to beat Ecuador - Also backed a red card in this match
  • JackW said:

    England out.

    The "Smithson" bet turns to dust - £200 lost.

    Serves you right for taking my advice!
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787

    JackW said:

    England out.

    The "Smithson" bet turns to dust - £200 lost.

    Serves you right for taking my advice!
    You wretched gentleman .... leading an innocent fellow astray.

    Chortle ....

  • Yet another profitable tip by me.

    In case you missed, the rest of my tips for today are

    Switzerland to beat the Frogs, also backed Sakho as FGS

    Honduras to beat Ecuador - Also backed a red card in this match

    An astonishing return on your tips TSE - we must remember your "system" for future tournaments.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    I won £20 on that match but Betfair have only deposited £12 so far. Why are they splitting it up?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    edited June 2014

    Yet another profitable tip by me.

    In case you missed, the rest of my tips for today are

    Switzerland to beat the Frogs, also backed Sakho as FGS

    Honduras to beat Ecuador - Also backed a red card in this match

    An astonishing return on your tips TSE - we must remember your "system" for future tournaments.
    I do wonder if some bookies will stop offering "cash out" options, and we will have to "cash out" the old fashioned way via betfair.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,622
    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    Time for the English public schools to make soccer compulsory.

    Vane-Wycherley-Farquarson and Cholmondley-Smyth on the wings is the only hope left.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    @Socrates

    The phrase I used was 'comparatively benign' and it does you no credit to chop off a word to try and manufacture -what was it you called it? Oh yes 'moral outrage'. I absolutely stand by that assertion, compared to Saudi Arabia or Bahrain, which make pre-war Syria look like a model state. Incidentally, there are also democracy movements in those countries, whose protests have been put down with the merciless vigour you would expect. Where is America and the West's 'push toward democracy' there?

    I interpreted "relatively benign" to mean by government standards all over the world. If all you meant that it was relatively benign relative to only the very worst regimes, then that's more acceptable, but still only correct for pre-war Syria. Since the massacres began, I would say Syria is on an equivalent level.

    I take you on trust that you consult various sources on the matter, but frankly your surface account indicates your sources range from The Telegraph to The Guardian. It also indicates that you certainly didn't watch the video I posted earlier -no matter; I've no right to ask you to spend the time, but it demolishes the 'slaughter' angle, certainly before the conflict began in earnest. You had snipers shooting at both sides, a theme which has been repeated in Maidan, and in Crimea, where those on the ground were sensible enough not to let it trigger a full conflict.

    From where I sit I would guess you get your sources from Russia Today, Press TV and right wing conspiracy theory websites, but I'm happy to stick to the facts. I haven't watched your video because I am not currently on a machine where I can hear sound, so there seemed little point. If you're about when I do have access, I will give it a go (assuming it's a credible source). Reports like this one document the abuse very clearly:

    http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2014/images/01/20/syria-board.of.inquiry.doha.jan.2014.18.1.version.x.to.print..pdf
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    Bring back Lampard - was he the only privately schooled player in the squad?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    AndyJS said:

    I won £20 on that match but Betfair have only deposited £12 so far. Why are they splitting it up?

    They've sorted it out now.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    We are following Scotland into oblivion. Kids watch and talk about football, but do jot play it in the streets and parks, except on sunday leagues.

    Play once a week and you will never be as good as if you play every day after school.
    AveryLP said:

    Time for the English public schools to make soccer compulsory.

    Vane-Wycherley-Farquarson and Cholmondley-Smyth on the wings is the only hope left.

  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    England did win a World Cup today -

    The Junior World Rugby Cup beating South Africa 21:20 in Auckland earlier today.

  • TCPoliticalBettingTCPoliticalBetting Posts: 10,819
    edited June 2014
    Is this the worst performance by England at a World Cup Final (1958 was 3 draws and a loss)? Since a win was just 2 points then, even if we win the last game, it is probably worse than 1958. Hodgson, worst England Manager at a World Cup Final. 1950 was 1 win and two losses. Which is the best we can hope for. Also the 1950 and 58 Manager, Winterbottom never had the power to pick his own team (it was chosen by a selection committee).

    and the FA want to keep Hodgson for 2 more years?
  • corporealcorporeal Posts: 2,549
    JackW said:

    England did win a World Cup today -

    The Junior World Rugby Cup beating South Africa 21:20 in Auckland earlier today.

    Retaining their title Mr W. All credit to them.
  • Thierry Henri made a very good point that Costa Rica play as a team and England do not. That comes right back to the Manager, his selections, tactics and motivation.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    To be fair in 1994, 1978 and 1974 we dinnae qualify, so arguably worse performances.

    Is this the worst performance by England at a World Cup Final (1958 was 3 draws and a loss). Since a win was just 2 points then, even if we win the last game, it is probably worse than 1958. Hodgson, worst England Manager at a World Cup Final.

    and the FA want to keep him for 2 more years?

  • Look at it this way, at least at this World Cup finals, we've done as well as Spain.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    But as my European Colleagues inform me, not as well as Greece or Bosnia.

    Look at it this way, at least at this World Cup finals, we've done as well as Spain.

  • To be fair in 1994, 1978 and 1974 we dinnae qualify, so arguably worse performances.

    Is this the worst performance by England at a World Cup Final (1958 was 3 draws and a loss). Since a win was just 2 points then, even if we win the last game, it is probably worse than 1958. Hodgson, worst England Manager at a World Cup Final.
    and the FA want to keep him for 2 more years?

    Well I wrote "at a World Cup Final". Hodgson was also chosen because of his tournament experience.....
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    corporeal said:

    JackW said:

    England did win a World Cup today -

    The Junior World Rugby Cup beating South Africa 21:20 in Auckland earlier today.

    Retaining their title Mr W. All credit to them.
    Indeed.

    As a passionate rugby fan, but Scot, it pains me to say England have a fantastic wealth of talent lining up for next years World Cup.

    Meanwhile Scottish rugby is lulling the world into a sense of false security with regular unconvincing performances that make England football team look like world beaters.

    You heard it hear first ....

  • FalseFlagFalseFlag Posts: 1,801
    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    No higher than other British countries and immigration was restricted to Europeans mostly. Britain has never had mass immigration until the post war period marking our decline. The US was a major power in colonial Times, it's how they won independence. Initially the US restricted immigration to Europeans Christians and only saw mass immigration in the 1850s and pre the 1920 restriction act which favoured limited immigration from NW Europe. The US has only begun it's decline with the 1965 immigration act. Actually Ben Franklin believed US high living standards were due to few labourers but plentiful land, something immigration reverses.

    How come East Asia is the richest part of the world but has and does have no immigration at all?
  • CopperSulphateCopperSulphate Posts: 1,119

    We are following Scotland into oblivion. Kids watch and talk about football, but do jot play it in the streets and parks, except on sunday leagues.

    Play once a week and you will never be as good as if you play every day after school.

    AveryLP said:

    Time for the English public schools to make soccer compulsory.

    Vane-Wycherley-Farquarson and Cholmondley-Smyth on the wings is the only hope left.

    They made it illegal to play on the streets a few years ago. There was a small park near where I grew up, but they banned ball games on that as well.

    Kids aren't allowed to do anything these days.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189
    Prince Harry is going to the England v Costa Rica game. Oops.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189
    @BhamUpdates: Please dispose of your England memorabilia responsibly. http://t.co/hGHhuLXlfa

    Chortle
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    ToryJim said:

    Prince Harry is going to the England v Costa Rica game. Oops.

    I have always thought Prince Harry would be better in the starting line up than on the substitutes bench.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189
    edited June 2014
    AveryLP said:

    ToryJim said:

    Prince Harry is going to the England v Costa Rica game. Oops.

    I have always thought Prince Harry would be better in the starting line up than on the substitutes bench.
    Oh i have better uses for him ;)
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    ToryJim said:

    @BhamUpdates: Please dispose of your England memorabilia responsibly. http://t.co/hGHhuLXlfa

    Chortle

    Put it in the loft for short term use in Russia and Qatar ....

    Titter ....

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    Ron Hamilton ‏@hamiltard 22m

    @Knox_Harrington Rodgers, Martinez & Pochettino all shown what English players can do when coached. Magnifies the Hodgery of this shambles.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    Yet another profitable tip by me.

    In case you missed, the rest of my tips for today are

    Switzerland to beat the Frogs, also backed Sakho as FGS

    Honduras to beat Ecuador - Also backed a red card in this match

    An astonishing return on your tips TSE - we must remember your "system" for future tournaments.
    I do wonder if some bookies will stop offering "cash out" options, and we will have to "cash out" the old fashioned way via betfair.
    As long as it's other punters losing out rather than Betfair they won't change it, hopefully.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189
    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    @BhamUpdates: Please dispose of your England memorabilia responsibly. http://t.co/hGHhuLXlfa

    Chortle

    Put it in the loft for short term use in Russia and Qatar ....

    Titter ....

    Don't be mean ;)
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    I am not trying to argue that it was other than a dire performance. We should fear Costa Rica, they want to come top...

    To be fair in 1994, 1978 and 1974 we dinnae qualify, so arguably worse performances.

    Is this the worst performance by England at a World Cup Final (1958 was 3 draws and a loss). Since a win was just 2 points then, even if we win the last game, it is probably worse than 1958. Hodgson, worst England Manager at a World Cup Final.
    and the FA want to keep him for 2 more years?

    Well I wrote "at a World Cup Final". Hodgson was also chosen because of his tournament experience.....
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Thierry Henri made a very good point that Costa Rica play as a team and England do not. That comes right back to the Manager, his selections, tactics and motivation.

    England looked like Roy Hodgson's Fantasy League team -- his favourite players picked with no thought as to how they'd play together or even whether each position was filled exactly once.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,622
    FalseFlag said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    No higher than other British countries and immigration was restricted to Europeans mostly. Britain has never had mass immigration until the post war period marking our decline. The US was a major power in colonial Times, it's how they won independence. Initially the US restricted immigration to Europeans Christians and only saw mass immigration in the 1850s and pre the 1920 restriction act which favoured limited immigration from NW Europe. The US has only begun it's decline with the 1965 immigration act. Actually Ben Franklin believed US high living standards were due to few labourers but plentiful land, something immigration reverses.

    How come East Asia is the richest part of the world but has and does have no immigration at all?
    Singapore is the richest country in South East Asia, with a GDP per head equivalent better than the US. It is also has some of the highest immigration levels in the world. 43% of the people in Singapore are immigrants.

    China has been an immigration story too, of course. Historially it (like Russia) had internal passports. These internal passports existed for the same reason you, and other supporters of vested interests and opponents of human freedom, support restrictions on human beings going to where work is, and businesses employing who they want: because it was in the narrow interests of a few people.

    One of the major reasons for the growth of China has been allowing immigration - i.e. allowing workers to go where the work is.

    Of course, you are happy to go and buy a cellphone made in Korea or China. Your narrow and alleged support for the British worker stops at buying goods actually made in the UK.

    It's OK for you to personally discriminate against British workers by buying goods made by foreign workers. But god forbid anyone should discriminate against a British worker by getting a haircut from a Pole.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    MikeK said:


    International football is only one area that the UK are not competitive.

    As with British industry, the problem is management, not the workers.
  • At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s
  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523
    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    1. America was empty (industrially speaking)
    2. open door != actual mass immigration

    The main point though is the entirely self-evident one. There's a cut off point for adding to the national finances so the national finances can't possibly be improved by importing millions of extra people if the bulk of those people are paid below that cut-off point (even if none of the extra infrastructure needed to maintain the existing level is built).

    It's simple arithmetic.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    ToryJim said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    @BhamUpdates: Please dispose of your England memorabilia responsibly. http://t.co/hGHhuLXlfa

    Chortle

    Put it in the loft for short term use in Russia and Qatar ....

    Titter ....

    Don't be mean ;)
    Duly admonished ....

    Anyway ....

    Question - What's the difference between the England Football team and a teabag ?

    Answer - The tea bag stays in the cup longer ....

    Dons tin hat and scuttles for cover ....



  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,816
    @Socrates

    When women are banned from driving a car, forced to walk several steps behind their husbands, and forced to wear the hijab, Syria will have had just a taste of 'equivalence' with Saudi Arabia. Which incidentally, is exactly the nightmarish type of Sharia state that the vast majority of rebels wanted to create. As for it 'now' being as bad, firstly it isn't, secondly Syria is in the grip of a civil war, which is why it's farcical that this 'killing his own people' line is still trotted out by Hague and the like with a straight face -um yes?

    My sources include RT, PressTV, the Friendsofsyria blog, NSNBC.me, Debka.org and many more, added to my standard reading matter of The Telegraph. But more importantly than that, I am aware of the agenda of each news source, and I glean what I can from each whilst dismissing the chaff. It seems that you would never take a piece of citizen journalism seriously, which in this day and age I'm afraid is asking to be ill informed. The video that I provided is not a broadcast documentary, but it is produced by and featuring professional journalists and I consider the findings to be beyond dispute. If you do feel like watching it, just google 'Syria Manufacturing Dissent'.

  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,834

    For anyone interested in the Tour de France and lives around Sheffield, at Meadowhall, they have a display and mini shop commemorating the Grand Depart.

    Is downstairs near the Ladbrokes and o2 shop, near t'statues

    There's a TdF shop in Leeds on Albion St too.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    MrJones said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    1. America was empty (industrially speaking)
    2. open door != actual mass immigration

    The main point though is the entirely self-evident one. There's a cut off point for adding to the national finances so the national finances can't possibly be improved by importing millions of extra people if the bulk of those people are paid below that cut-off point (even if none of the extra infrastructure needed to maintain the existing level is built).

    It's simple arithmetic.
    More than empty, vastly empty.
    Just look at the population density of the USA from 1776 till today.
    The period of mass settlement there (the wild west) ended only in 1890.
    Slavery there was also the symptom of a lack of man power.
  • jayfdeejayfdee Posts: 618
    We do still have some incredible athletes,even as I post,Steve Birkinshaw is about to complete an amazing challenge,in a few hours he will finish an epic run,after nearly 7 days of almost non stop running,he will complete a circuit of the Lake District,summitting every peak mentioned in the Wainwright books. The previous record of 7 days and 1 hour was down to Joss Naylor,many years ago.
    This is a truly amazing demonstration of determination and endurance,perhaps our football team could use some lessons. http://stevebirkinshaw-wainwright2014.blogspot.co.uk/
    I havedone many extreme runs,including a 7 day epic,but believe me,this is exceptional.
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,834

    Good afternoon all and I ask myself what wrong has Ilkley done to deserve being descended upon by a strange bunch of folks who would bet on their granny winning a game of shove penny!

    "what wrong has Ilkley done to deserve being descended upon by a strange bunch of folks who would bet their granny on winning a game of shove penny!", surely?!

    p.s. Shove penny's a bit extravagant, no?
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    edited June 2014

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    How many times will it be mentioned?
    We need a UK team not 4 weak teams that go no where.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    Hitler hears Uruguay England score. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vi3kJKz7jh8
  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523
    Speedy said:

    MrJones said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    1. America was empty (industrially speaking)
    2. open door != actual mass immigration

    The main point though is the entirely self-evident one. There's a cut off point for adding to the national finances so the national finances can't possibly be improved by importing millions of extra people if the bulk of those people are paid below that cut-off point (even if none of the extra infrastructure needed to maintain the existing level is built).

    It's simple arithmetic.
    More than empty, vastly empty.
    Just look at the population density of the USA from 1776 till today.
    The period of mass settlement there (the wild west) ended only in 1890.
    Slavery there was also the symptom of a lack of man power.
    yeah i was meaning ye olde apache
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    edited June 2014
    Speedy said:

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    How many times will it be mentioned?
    We need a UK team not 4 weak teams that go no where.
    That would just be a way of getting Gareth Bale into the England team.

    Edit: and Sir Alex as manager. It's sounding better all the time.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Speedy said:

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    How many times will it be mentioned?
    We need a UK team not 4 weak teams that go no where.
    Size isn't everything as Mrs TSE noted on her honeymoon.

    Costa Rica refers - Population - All presently drunk close to a Brazilian football stadium and a lonely Pekingese called Eric left at home for defence of the republic.

  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,928

    Thierry Henri made a very good point that Costa Rica play as a team and England do not. That comes right back to the Manager, his selections, tactics and motivation.

    England looked like Roy Hodgson's Fantasy League team -- his favourite players picked with no thought as to how they'd play together or even whether each position was filled exactly once.
    I suspect Roy's fantasy team would have Lambert and Milner in it and maybe Kevin Davies who he signed for big money at Blackburn. However he had to pick a whole series of players who aren't really his type.
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,834

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    I think that's a bit harsh and an over-reaction. Overall, England outplayed both Italy and Uruguay but there aren't any points for possession or territory and both teams made England pay for being poor in and around both penalty areas - too few chances taken and too few given.

    It's an extremely tough group (all the more so given how Costa Rica have played). Going into the tournament, Uruguay, Italy and England were all in the top 10 on Fifa rankings and yes, England have lost two games, narrowly. Disappointing to be sure but not a disaster.

    As for where the game goes from here, more investment in youth. I really don't know why clubs are willing to spend tens of millions on a single player who may flop or get injured when a fraction of the money could produce quality homegrown talent. (Well, I do - it's the clubs chasing instant success but the two shouldn't be alternatives, especially for chairmen and chief executives who should take a longer view).
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,950
    Good evening, everyone.

    F1: Perez's 5 place grid penalty stands:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/27950475
  • perdixperdix Posts: 1,806
    rcs1000 said:

    FalseFlag said:

    rcs1000 said:

    @FalseFlag, @MrJones

    Given the devastating impact of low skilled immigration, could either of you explain how the US - which imported so much of it between 1750 and 1915 - managed to become such a success?

    In fact, both Britain and the US had open door immigration polcies during their acendence, and the closing of the door marked - in both cases - the beginning of their periods of relative decline.

    No higher than other British countries and immigration was restricted to Europeans mostly. Britain has never had mass immigration until the post war period marking our decline. The US was a major power in colonial Times, it's how they won independence. Initially the US restricted immigration to Europeans Christians and only saw mass immigration in the 1850s and pre the 1920 restriction act which favoured limited immigration from NW Europe. The US has only begun it's decline with the 1965 immigration act. Actually Ben Franklin believed US high living standards were due to few labourers but plentiful land, something immigration reverses.

    How come East Asia is the richest part of the world but has and does have no immigration at all?
    Singapore is the richest country in South East Asia, with a GDP per head equivalent better than the US. It is also has some of the highest immigration levels in the world. 43% of the people in Singapore are immigrants.

    China has been an immigration story too, of course. Historially it (like Russia) had internal passports. These internal passports existed for the same reason you, and other supporters of vested interests and opponents of human freedom, support restrictions on human beings going to where work is, and businesses employing who they want: because it was in the narrow interests of a few people.

    One of the major reasons for the growth of China has been allowing immigration - i.e. allowing workers to go where the work is.

    Of course, you are happy to go and buy a cellphone made in Korea or China. Your narrow and alleged support for the British worker stops at buying goods actually made in the UK.

    It's OK for you to personally discriminate against British workers by buying goods made by foreign workers. But god forbid anyone should discriminate against a British worker by getting a haircut from a Pole.
    China had (has?) a system whereby its citizens could move to another district but did not qualify for any benefits unless they had official recognition.

  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,834
    edited June 2014
    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    @BhamUpdates: Please dispose of your England memorabilia responsibly. http://t.co/hGHhuLXlfa

    Chortle

    Put it in the loft for short term use in Russia and Qatar ....

    Titter ....

    Don't be mean ;)
    Duly admonished ....

    Anyway ....

    Question - What's the difference between the England Football team and a teabag ?

    Answer - The tea bag stays in the cup longer ....

    Dons tin hat and scuttles for cover ....

    Too true, Jack. First round exits being a subject I understand Scots are experts on?
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    @BhamUpdates: Please dispose of your England memorabilia responsibly. http://t.co/hGHhuLXlfa

    Chortle

    Put it in the loft for short term use in Russia and Qatar ....

    Titter ....

    Don't be mean ;)
    Duly admonished ....

    Anyway ....

    Question - What's the difference between the England Football team and a teabag ?

    Answer - The tea bag stays in the cup longer ....

    Dons tin hat and scuttles for cover ....

    Too true, Jack. I believe Scots are experts at being knocked out in the first round (when they qualify)?
    We didn't qualify to make England look good .... as a plan it's not quite found its mark yet !!

  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    How long is it since Senderos came on?
  • AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    On topic

    The Flying Duck at Ilkley looks as though it could do with a second floor.

    Perhaps the PB Tories could club together, buy the freehold, obtain planning consent for an upward extension, then trade out in time to pay for the drinks.

    I'm on.
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    If @Socrates is still on,may I apologize for my 'Bollocks' comment towards you from last night.
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,834
    JackW said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    @BhamUpdates: Please dispose of your England memorabilia responsibly. http://t.co/hGHhuLXlfa

    Chortle

    Put it in the loft for short term use in Russia and Qatar ....

    Titter ....

    Don't be mean ;)
    Duly admonished ....

    Anyway ....

    Question - What's the difference between the England Football team and a teabag ?

    Answer - The tea bag stays in the cup longer ....

    Dons tin hat and scuttles for cover ....

    Too true, Jack. I believe Scots are experts at being knocked out in the first round (when they qualify)?
    We didn't qualify to make England look good .... as a plan it's not quite found its mark yet !!

    It does make a novel change from going out on penalties, it has to be said. It's a whole different level of disappointment: a slow seeping away of hope rather than the bitter low that the intensity of penalties brings.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    JackW said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    JackW said:

    ToryJim said:

    @BhamUpdates: Please dispose of your England memorabilia responsibly. http://t.co/hGHhuLXlfa

    Chortle

    Put it in the loft for short term use in Russia and Qatar ....

    Titter ....

    Don't be mean ;)
    Duly admonished ....

    Anyway ....

    Question - What's the difference between the England Football team and a teabag ?

    Answer - The tea bag stays in the cup longer ....

    Dons tin hat and scuttles for cover ....

    Too true, Jack. I believe Scots are experts at being knocked out in the first round (when they qualify)?
    We didn't qualify to make England look good .... as a plan it's not quite found its mark yet !!

    It does make a novel change from going out on penalties, it has to be said. It's a whole different level of disappointment: a slow seeping away of hope rather than the bitter low that the intensity of penalties brings.
    At least we haven't had to put up with the usual levels of tabloid jingoism.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,704

    Speedy said:

    At long last, England football has been found out. We've not flattered ourselves, as we have in the past by sneaking out of a fairly easy group, and then saved face by losing on penalties. This time, we've been humiliated. I think we should be scared by Costa Rica.
    I genuinely don't know where we go from here. Sacking Hodgson won't improve us. Gerrard, Rooney and Lampard retiring from the international game won't change is into World beaters overnight.
    There's just nothing on the horizon.
    One of the things that really bugged me last night was straight after the final whistle, ITV cut to an ad break, and it was full of England players selling themselves. Rooney in body armour flogging Samsung, Hart flogging dandruff shampoo, trading on their footballing prowess.
    The landlord at my local reckons he will lose a fortune, now that England are out. Let's hope Rooney, Gerrard et al lose out too.s

    How many times will it be mentioned?
    We need a UK team not 4 weak teams that go no where.
    That would just be a way of getting Gareth Bale into the England team.

    Edit: and Sir Alex as manager. It's sounding better all the time.
    After Sept 18th???????
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    Bloody Hell

    Ed Miliband is to be told by Labour frontbenchers that he will have to resign as leader if he loses the general election next year, as they move to prevent him following the example of Neil Kinnock by leading the party to two consecutive defeats.

    Amid increasing concern that the Labour leader is failing to connect with voters, MPs across the party are saying Labour would need a fresh start if Miliband were defeated. "Ed really cannot stay on if he loses – that really would not work," one frontbencher said. "He has to go if we lose," another frontbencher said.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/jun/20/ed-miliband-must-go-lose-election-labour-frontbencher
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,950
    Mr. Eagles, surely it's a given if he fails, he goes?

    Surprised they're spelling it out.

    Still off to Ilkley?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959

    Mr. Eagles, surely it's a given if he fails, he goes?

    Surprised they're spelling it out.

    Still off to Ilkley?

    Well Kinnock stayed on after defeat, and Yes going to Ilkley
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,950
    Not a legal chap, but surely it's 'summoned'?:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27949867

    "Ed Balls summonsed over car crash"
This discussion has been closed.