Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
Not if it kills them. I doubnt it - but that news report is only about one aspect of the immune response. The trials are needed to see if it works in the wild, so to speak.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
Not if it kills them. I doubnt it - but that news report is only about one aspect of the immune response. The trials are needed to see if it works in the wild, so to speak.
I realise trials are required but if a care home resident gets Covid there is a very high chance of death, I doubt there is much chance of death from complications of having this vaccine
Even a care home resident individually is more likely to survive COVID than not. It is certainly a risk though so if it is safe then they are scheduled to be first to get the vaccine as soon as it is known to be safe, before even the NHS. But we don't know if it's safe until the trials are done.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
Not if it kills them. I doubnt it - but that news report is only about one aspect of the immune response. The trials are needed to see if it works in the wild, so to speak.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
Not if it kills them. I doubnt it - but that news report is only about one aspect of the immune response. The trials are needed to see if it works in the wild, so to speak.
I realise trials are required but if a care home resident gets Covid there is a very high chance of death, I doubt there is much chance of death from complications of having this vaccine
Even a care home resident individually is more likely to survive COVID than not. It is certainly a risk though so if it is safe then they are scheduled to be first to get the vaccine as soon as it is known to be safe, before even the NHS. But we don't know if it's safe until the trials are done.
There are a couple of difficult issues there. You don't normally do trials on very old patients, so the safety of the vaccine amongst the very old may not be clear. In addition, vaccines tend to be less effective in the very old.
I have long given up responding to HYUFD on any issue relating to polling. But, his insistence on Trafalgar as the only outfit worth listening to this election because of their 'performance' in 2016 has me wondering a question. Has any polling outfit (since there has been a large number to pick from) ever been the most accurate pollster in 2 or more GEs in a row in a major Western Democracy? Ok, let's narrow that down to 'in the US or the UK'?
Survation final poll 2017 Tories +1% Result Tories +2%
Survation final poll 2019 Tories +11% Result Tories +12%
Fake news, Opinium won the 2019 GE polling contest.
Do you think it is a good idea to base current polls accuracy on the pollster's record at the last GE?
Yes and no.
Not solely on the last election, but factor in other electoral events they've gotten right in the interregnums between general elections.
But I'm reminded of Martin Boon's observation that ICM's 2015 methodology would have accurately predicted the 2017 GE.
To big up a pollster's hundreds of mid term polls on the basis that they were closest to the result last time with their final poll doesn't seem right to me. What does that tell us about the accuracy of their mid term polls at the previous election? Were they all better than the other pollsters polls as well?
I'm talking about their final polls for elections like mayorals, Scottish & Welsh Parliaments.
Polls that can be tested against reality.
Oh I am not really arguing with what you are saying, but asking a question
Actually, it seems Opinium were stronger on Boris Johnson's Tories than the other pollsters almost from when he took charge, so in that respect they were consistently closer to the eventual result. That wasn't at this stage of the Parliament of course.
They were very weak the Tories pre the Euros/May getting the chop, so that was accurate too
Does anyone know if Gavin Williamson and his counterparts in the devolved administrations have made plans if this happens in the run up and during next year's GCSE and A Level exams?
All students at Thurrock's Ortu Gable Hall School asked to self-isolate after multiple positive tests
Perhaps I can introduce you to a Mr Reckless of the Welsh Assembly. Another pleasant English export to Wales, just like the radioactive mud being dumped in Cardiff Bay. But, more harmful, ....
He defected from Tory to UKIP (2014), from UKIP to Tory (2017), from Tory to Independent (April 2019), from Independent to Brexit Party (May 2019), from Brexit Party to Abolish the Assembly Party (September 2020)
I have long given up responding to HYUFD on any issue relating to polling. But, his insistence on Trafalgar as the only outfit worth listening to this election because of their 'performance' in 2016 has me wondering a question. Has any polling outfit (since there has been a large number to pick from) ever been the most accurate pollster in 2 or more GEs in a row in a major Western Democracy? Ok, let's narrow that down to 'in the US or the UK'?
I think it has possibly happened once (or twice if you squint) in the UK. With, say, ten pollsters (numbers have waxed and waned) then even if it's entirely random there's a 1-in-10 chance that the "best" pollster is still best the next time. This is complicated by the churn in pollsters. Poor old NOP didn't have the chance to defend their 2005 title.
So I don't think that any predictive value over chance is shown. Which is why no-one sensible mentions a "Gold Standard" except satirically as a reference to previous Gold Standards falling by the wayside.
Does anyone know if Gavin Williamson and his counterparts in the devolved administrations have made plans if this happens in the run up and during next year's GCSE and A Level exams?
All students at Thurrock's Ortu Gable Hall School asked to self-isolate after multiple positive tests
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
Not if it kills them. I doubnt it - but that news report is only about one aspect of the immune response. The trials are needed to see if it works in the wild, so to speak.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
Not if it kills them. I doubnt it - but that news report is only about one aspect of the immune response. The trials are needed to see if it works in the wild, so to speak.
I realise trials are required but if a care home resident gets Covid there is a very high chance of death, I doubt there is much chance of death from complications of having this vaccine
Even a care home resident individually is more likely to survive COVID than not. It is certainly a risk though so if it is safe then they are scheduled to be first to get the vaccine as soon as it is known to be safe, before even the NHS. But we don't know if it's safe until the trials are done.
There are a couple of difficult issues there. You don't normally do trials on very old patients, so the safety of the vaccine amongst the very old may not be clear. In addition, vaccines tend to be less effective in the very old.
Indeed but that emphasises the importance of waiting for the trials to end.
If the trials show it to be dangerous to the participants it will likely be even more dangerous to the elderly.
If the trials show it not to be efficacious then it will be even less for the elderly.
If on the other hand the trial shows it to both safe and efficacious for the participants there is no guarantee it will be for the elderly but there is a reasonable chance it is better than nothing.
Does anyone know if Gavin Williamson and his counterparts in the devolved administrations have made plans if this happens in the run up and during next year's GCSE and A Level exams?
All students at Thurrock's Ortu Gable Hall School asked to self-isolate after multiple positive tests
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It might, although still awaiting solid evidence and assessment. But if you advocate employing this not-fully-assessed preventative measure with possibly (until the safety assessments are fully in) serious downsides, why are you so against mask wearing, which is also not fully assessed and needs more evidence of efficacy but has somewhat more predictable worst case downsides?
Whilst the vaccine is not fully assessed the slightest hint of any problems with it is covered massively in the press. Therefore it is highly likely that the tens of thousands of people who have had it have not become ill. To me it is a no lose situation, if it does not work the person has not been put at much risk, but if as seems extremely likely it does work then their life could be saved. Australia has kinda done this by incuding large numbers of care home residents in a trial of a vaccine.
In terms of masks, since they have been introduced cases have gone up massively. I predicted this at the time. I may be wrong but if the preventative measure was anything else other than a mask then far more people would be questioning that measure as they are now with Tier 2 restrictions.
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It might, although still awaiting solid evidence and assessment. But if you advocate employing this not-fully-assessed preventative measure with possibly (until the safety assessments are fully in) serious downsides, why are you so against mask wearing, which is also not fully assessed and needs more evidence of efficacy but has somewhat more predictable worst case downsides?
Whilst the vaccine is not fully assessed the slightest hint of any problems with it is covered massively in the press. Therefore it is highly likely that the tens of thousands of people who have had it have not become ill. To me it is a no lose situation, if it does not work the person has not been put at much risk, but if as seems extremely likely it does work then their life could be saved. Australia has kinda done this by incuding large numbers of care home residents in a trial of a vaccine.
In terms of masks, since they have been introduced cases have gone up massively. I predicted this at the time. I may be wrong but if the preventative measure was anything else other than a mask then far more people would be questioning that measure as they are now with Tier 2 restrictions.
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It is actually extremely dangerous to undermine public confidence in a vaccine by using one that is untested.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It is actually extremely dangerous to undermine public confidence in a vaccine by using one that is untested.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
Have Nerys Hughes and Putin ever been seen in the same room together?
I believe ever-evolving Braden started out as a Northumbrian nationalist. Who knows where he'll be in a couple of years time (almost certainly not him)?
James O'Brien going on the government's backflip to blame the kids for being hungry. Why? he asks.
Its simple. Work doesn't pay. Universal Credit doesn't work. But they insist both are fine therefore kids can't be hungry unless they are feckless iPhone owners. They can't feed these hungry kids because to do so is to admit that work doesn't pay and UC doesn't work and their whole pack of cards falls down.
As this goes on, I suspect the UC mirage will dissipate anyway. Its one thing for Tory voters to insist UC - of which they know nothing Jon Snow - is largesse when its other people complaining about penury, another thing when its them being dumped onto it and discovering they are entitled to fuck all AND now being blamed for their situation by their former allies.
UC isn't fuck all.
The biggest problem with UC though is the taper rate (and it's predecessors were worse) which means that people on it are punitively taxed if they earn more.
Go and live on it for a year and then come back to tell us all about how it is largesse really.
Please don't put words in my mouth that I didn't use. I never said it was largesse I said it isn't fuck all.
There is a difference between fuck all and largesse.
If you are claiming for multiple children, housing benefit etc then you can be talking well over a thousand pounds a month, that is not fuck all, nor is it largesse.
If it was up to me I would like to (as I said) address the taper rate to make UC more generous not less.
A grand a month. To house, feed and clothe a family with 2+ children. Is fuck all.
I never said just a grand a month I said well over.
And do you have any idea what someone working full time on minimum wage takes home after tax and national insurance?
This is why I want us to tax the poorest less, have a UBI/Negative Income Tax and not tax the poorest 80% plus. What's wrong with that?
For everyone's benefit, a single person over the age of 25 working 37.5 hours at minimum wage a week takes home the following per month:
Gross: £1,417 National Insurance: -£75 Income Tax: -£75 Net: £1,267
Assuming no pension contributions, no tax credits, no student loan, etc.
Precisely my point.
Universal Credit gives a comparable amount (more even) than working full time on minimum wage. But anyone on that will be on a marginal tax rate of at least 63% and potentially upto 90% or so. It is insane.
I just put a single unemployed 26-year-old into a benefits calculator and the allowance is £410 a month. Plus an allowance for housing and council tax.
I am noticing that this is an area where the relevant hard data is difficult to find. Like what is the average total UC payout to a family with 2 children, including additional payments, and what is the value of the various subsidies and supports like FSM and council tax rebate. People can debate between large figures like £20k per annum, (obviously loads more than minimum wage) and £5k per annum for single blokes with no family and without consideration of housing costs, but it is not informative.
Usually when data is a bit hard to find someone does not want someone else to know something. I suspect both Tory governments and poverty spokespeople of having some data to hide.
For me the most important thing is not the sum it is the percentage.
If someone is on UC below NI Threshold their basic taper rate (effective tax rate) is 63% If someone is over NI Threshold their effective tax rate is close to 75% If someone is over Income Tax threshold their effective tax rate is close to 90%
We don't tax the richest in society 90% so why do we tax the poorest that?
I agree, but be wary. The only way to reduce the taper rate, without spending a lot more money, is to reduce the basic amount paid before applying the taper, or to introduce the start of the taper at a lower level.
Both those things make the effective tax rate better, but make the very poorest people poorer.
Perhaps though I would argue that the Laffer Curve would be in play here.
You can argue whether a tax rate is to the left or right of the peak of the Laffer Curve but effective 90% rates must be to the right of many people's peak of the curve.
The Laffer Curve does not just effect the richest in society it can apply to the poorest too.
That's frowned upon these days, I believe, the "Laffer Curve". And quite rightly.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It is actually extremely dangerous to undermine public confidence in a vaccine by using one that is untested.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
Given the nonsense Nerys Hughes spouts about masks I can only conclude that he's a Russian troll wanting to cause real harm to the UK.
Thinking ahead to the US election results, and knowing how long the process is, what is the optimum time range (in UK time) for me to be in front of my TV (so I can organise my diary)?
Always had a soft spot for Christie. Such honesty in this matter doesn't surprise.
Chris Christie is about the LAST guy I would associate with the word "honesty". Certain he's never come clean - and almost certainly never will - about his role in the infamous Bridge-gate scandal that ended his career as an elected (or electable) politico.
BUT will admit that CC is great at FAKING sincerity. Otherwise, a waddling puff-ball of putrid pomposity.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
Not if it kills them. I doubnt it - but that news report is only about one aspect of the immune response. The trials are needed to see if it works in the wild, so to speak.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
Not if it kills them. I doubnt it - but that news report is only about one aspect of the immune response. The trials are needed to see if it works in the wild, so to speak.
I realise trials are required but if a care home resident gets Covid there is a very high chance of death, I doubt there is much chance of death from complications of having this vaccine
Even a care home resident individually is more likely to survive COVID than not. It is certainly a risk though so if it is safe then they are scheduled to be first to get the vaccine as soon as it is known to be safe, before even the NHS. But we don't know if it's safe until the trials are done.
There are a couple of difficult issues there. You don't normally do trials on very old patients, so the safety of the vaccine amongst the very old may not be clear. In addition, vaccines tend to be less effective in the very old.
Indeed but that emphasises the importance of waiting for the trials to end.
If the trials show it to be dangerous to the participants it will likely be even more dangerous to the elderly.
If the trials show it not to be efficacious then it will be even less for the elderly.
If on the other hand the trial shows it to both safe and efficacious for the participants there is no guarantee it will be for the elderly but there is a reasonable chance it is better than nothing.
Oh dear, you are now claiming to have knowledge of clinical trials? What next? Particle physics? Try talking about something where you have a modicum of understanding. I am not sure what that would be, but there must be something surely?
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
You can see why the rest of Yorkshire wants to concrete over Barnsley.
Barnsley, whilst not the spiritual capital of Yorkshire, is the spiritual gatekeeper of Yorkshireness. I can think of no place and no people for whom owt for nowt, god's own county, and strong i'th arm hold truer
I think the lack of switching is a little weird, even accepting that parties will be cautious to screen for loyalty and many of those chosen will have invested years, decades even, with a particular party brand, but even so the amount of stretching of the party brand before someone breaks and changes, let alone merely quits, is incredible.
Different beast altogether, but it's far from uncommon at local government level.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It is actually extremely dangerous to undermine public confidence in a vaccine by using one that is untested.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
p.s. No offence to Nick and other UK-centric thread writers but I don't find anything interesting outside of the US right now, not even Brexit, from a betting perspective. Would still love to see more State threads please Mike / Robert. I mentioned Bollier's chances in Kansas (of all places) this morning.
Yes, I've been searching this site in vain for decent coverage of the US election. Hardly seems to get a mention....
Well tell us what you think or know.
I was (I thought quite obviously) being ironic in response to Mysticrose. The coverage of the US election on here, both in headers and threads, is marvellous.
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
Debating anything except the two overpowering issues feels like a frivolous distraction
This is, I think, a very interesting point. We seem to expect any issue to be, well, oven ready as it were, and even when parties say they want an issue debated they usually know the broad strokes of what they want and the debate is designed to achieve it, not actually debate it. And taking time in debate is seen as conceding to an opponent and weakness.
It also reminds me of a European summit from earlier in the year which, if memory serves, went into a fourth day amid some tough discussions. I found it encouraging, as it seems to me that if they did always agree on everything so well they could be over and done in a weekend that would be worrying when such diversity exists. Even on Brexit and its endless, circular shouting matches, at least a genuine issue was getting thrashed out and settled, albeit not to many's satisfaction.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It is actually extremely dangerous to undermine public confidence in a vaccine by using one that is untested.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
Have Nerys Hughes and Putin ever been seen in the same room together?
Third episode of the second series of Open All Hours I think
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
You can see why the rest of Yorkshire wants to concrete over Barnsley.
Barnsley, whilst not the spiritual capital of Yorkshire, is the spiritual gatekeeper of Yorkshireness. I can think of no place and no people for whom owt for nowt, god's own county, and strong i'th arm hold truer
The only good thing to come out of Barnsley is Darren Gough, then he betrayed his roots and buggered off to Essex.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It is actually extremely dangerous to undermine public confidence in a vaccine by using one that is untested.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
Yes, in a vaccine trial. To make sure it works on old people. They aren't giving it to them because lol why not. They literally said that they're doing a trial, repeatedly to make sure it works. This isn't a mass rollout.
In Swindon a few years ago there was a Labour councillor who quit and joined the Tories, changed their mind 24 hours later, then about a year later joined the Tories for good. Fun times.
Always had a soft spot for Christie. Such honesty in this matter doesn't surprise.
Chris Christie is about the LAST guy I would associate with the word "honesty". Certain he's never come clean - and almost certainly never will - about his role in the infamous Bridge-gate scandal that ended his career as an elected (or electable) politico.
BUT will admit that CC is great at FAKING sincerity. Otherwise, a waddling puff-ball of putrid pomposity.
Eh, that's just Jersey. I do give Christie props for his handling of Sandy
I can see the lockdown lunatics are just desperate, desperate, to smear an ordinary 83 year old woman for speaking her mind and cutting through the vast panoply of propaganda and lies they have thrown at the British people in the last eight months.
I imagine Guardian journalists are looking into the poor woman's background as we speak.
O/T. Good header from Nick Palmer. Having known a few Tory MPs, some who are no longer, but a couple who are still there and who, it might be said are somewhat uncomfortable with the direction it has taken, I think the crux is that most, if not all Con MPs, have had very long relationships and friendships with people who are also Tories. It takes a lot of guts to effectively betray, or be seen to betray, all these people quite intentionally. I am sure the same must be of those that are in other parties.
As for the vehicle that is the LDs, many Tories hate them more than Labour. I suggested to a friend of mine who is a rare breed nowadays; a moderate Tory councillor, who had told me he was not voting Tory at the GE that "why not the LDs?" and he looked at me as if I had suggested voting for the Nazi Party!
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
Thinking ahead to the US election results, and knowing how long the process is, what is the optimum time range (in UK time) for me to be in front of my TV (so I can organise my diary)?
Given how quickly Florida and North Carolina will count, and they close polls as early as anyone, I'd say you need to be up from 7pm EST (midnight UK) which is when Florida polls close.
I'm unclear whether you believe anyone advocating a lockdown under any circumstances is a 'lockdown lunatic' or if that is reserved for, say, people who suggest it way too early, for too long, too harshly etc?
O/T. Good header from Nick Palmer. Having known a few Tory MPs, some who are no longer, but a couple who are still there and who, it might be said are somewhat uncomfortable with the direction it has taken, I think the crux is that most, if not all Con MPs, have had very long relationships and friendships with people who are also Tories. It takes a lot of guts to effectively betray, or be seen to betray, all these people quite intentionally. I am sure the same must be of those that are in other parties.
As for the vehicle that is the LDs, many Tories hate them more than Labour. I suggested to a friend of mine who is a rare breed nowadays; a moderate Tory councillor, who had told me he was not voting Tory at the GE that "why not the LDs?" and he looked at me as if I had suggested voting for the Nazi Party!
I wouldn't be surprised if they get on well with the LD MPs (or at least when there were more of them) but because for many LDs form the local gov opposition they are pretty violently against them in general.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It is actually extremely dangerous to undermine public confidence in a vaccine by using one that is untested.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
Have Nerys Hughes and Putin ever been seen in the same room together?
Third episode of the second series of Open All Hours I think
Putin's bare chested wrestling of the till just as Nurse Nerys walked in and gaped so wide that her mask dropped off was a moment of pure comedy gold.
The EU telling us we cant call vegetarian burgers and sausages "burgers" or "sausages" might cause a few wokies to defect to Leave!
And vice versa no doubt
I bought a blt from a place I didnt realise was veggie only. Realised no bacon and never been back as did feel "tricked" rather than the food being bad.
Calling them veggie burgers completely fine with me, but calling them just "burgers" does feel misleading. Id feel the same about chicken burgers, if I ordered a burger and got a chicken burger technically Ive got what I ordered, but not really.
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
Its clear there are a stack of votes in getting behind Great Barrington. Will anybody serious pick up the cause and run with it?
I doubt it, as things popular in isolation won't sustain a movement or overcome the pull from mainstream parties. A lot of people would support bringing back the death penalty, but there doesn't seem to be much of a groundswell in the parties to change things.
Either 538 missed them or is glitching (entirely possible) or Civiqs has chosen now to release polls showing that, over spring and early summer, Biden's position improved. Who knew?
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
You can see why the rest of Yorkshire wants to concrete over Barnsley.
Barnsley, whilst not the spiritual capital of Yorkshire, is the spiritual gatekeeper of Yorkshireness. I can think of no place and no people for whom owt for nowt, god's own county, and strong i'th arm hold truer
My brother-in-law, a prison officer, once had a con from Barnsley in a classroom. My brother-in-law said to the assembled crims ‘Right, hands on thighs’
O/T. Good header from Nick Palmer. Having known a few Tory MPs, some who are no longer, but a couple who are still there and who, it might be said are somewhat uncomfortable with the direction it has taken, I think the crux is that most, if not all Con MPs, have had very long relationships and friendships with people who are also Tories. It takes a lot of guts to effectively betray, or be seen to betray, all these people quite intentionally. I am sure the same must be of those that are in other parties.
As for the vehicle that is the LDs, many Tories hate them more than Labour. I suggested to a friend of mine who is a rare breed nowadays; a moderate Tory councillor, who had told me he was not voting Tory at the GE that "why not the LDs?" and he looked at me as if I had suggested voting for the Nazi Party!
Ha ha yes hating the Lib Dems is one thing that Labour and Tory die-hards tend to agree on.
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It is actually extremely dangerous to undermine public confidence in a vaccine by using one that is untested.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
Yes, in a vaccine trial. To make sure it works on old people. They aren't giving it to them because lol why not. They literally said that they're doing a trial, repeatedly to make sure it works. This isn't a mass rollout.
I know its a trial but at least they are trailling it on those that need it most. A care home resident is currently greatly at risk of dying from Covid if they get it. I really don't see the issue with giving them this vaccine now as it will be approved within 6-8 weeks.
I believe ever-evolving Braden started out as a Northumbrian nationalist. Who knows where he'll be in a couple of years time (almost certainly not him)?
Is he wearing lipstick in the picture? Not a problem, just puzzled.
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
It would be interesting to have some scientifically conducted interviews across a range of people to get their actual impressions and feeling about COVID.
I suspect that you will get a wild range of views from people who have had it - probably based on how severe it was for them and their family and friends.
Either 538 missed them or is glitching (entirely possible) or Civiqs has chosen now to release polls showing that, over spring and early summer, Biden's position improved. Who knew?
(Boris Johnson caught off camera): "...But those business that are in low-alert areas, well, yes er...well they can just fuck off..... fuck business that's what I say, because if business isn't fucked by my inept handling of corona, then well, alas it will be fucked by Brexit, which, er er er, yes, one day, I'll, well, er er er admit, THAT I never believed in it in the first place."
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
You can see why the rest of Yorkshire wants to concrete over Barnsley.
Barnsley, whilst not the spiritual capital of Yorkshire, is the spiritual gatekeeper of Yorkshireness. I can think of no place and no people for whom owt for nowt, god's own county, and strong i'th arm hold truer
The only good thing to come out of Barnsley is Darren Gough, then he betrayed his roots and buggered off to Essex.
No, Barnsley is famous for more than just Gough. I give you: a) Dickie Bird, and b) Arthur Scargill. Both famous for many misjudgments (though to be fair Dickie brought a bit of glamour to the world of umpiring).
Either 538 missed them or is glitching (entirely possible) or Civiqs has chosen now to release polls showing that, over spring and early summer, Biden's position improved. Who knew?
538 scrapes the pollsters websites automatically - this means that it can "reimport" polls if something changes on the underlying site (and this happens surprisngly often)
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
You can see why the rest of Yorkshire wants to concrete over Barnsley.
Barnsley, whilst not the spiritual capital of Yorkshire, is the spiritual gatekeeper of Yorkshireness. I can think of no place and no people for whom owt for nowt, god's own county, and strong i'th arm hold truer
The only good thing to come out of Barnsley is Darren Gough, then he betrayed his roots and buggered off to Essex.
No, Barnsley is famous for more than just Gough. I give you: a) Dickie Bird, and b) Arthur Scargill. Both famous for many misjudgments (though to be fair Dickie brought a bit of glamour to the world of umpiring).
Also patron saint of over 50s life insurance & free pens Parkinson?
I can see the lockdown lunatics are just desperate, desperate, to smear an ordinary 83 year old woman for speaking her mind and cutting through the vast panoply of propaganda and lies they have thrown at the British people in the last eight months.
I imagine Guardian journalists are looking into the poor woman's background as we speak.
Judging by her attitude I doubt she wants online backup citing her age as a reason for her or her views to be treated with kid gloves. Her approach is refreshing and admirable regardless of whether we agree with her or not. Not really sure what you think it has to do with the Guardian.
Just returned from town before we go into full lockdown tomorrow for two weeks and the outstanding observation was the 100% mask wearing in shops and good social distancing but utter chaos with groups of young people with no social distancing or masks or seemingly not a care in the world
Have you guys heard that the Pfizer study has been unblinded?
Really....where....when....or just to check the death of the doctor in Brazil?
Wasn't that the AstraZeneca study, and he wasn't in the trial arm?
Sorry yes you are right.
Pfizer last update form two weeks ago was unblinding could happen by the end of this month / start of next and hoping to analysis data in November in time for application for emergency use mid to end of November.
Just returned from town before we go into full lockdown tomorrow for two weeks and the outstanding observation was the 100% mask wearing in shops and good social distancing but utter chaos with groups of young people with no social distancing or masks or seemingly not a care in the world
My experience was similar but with a different age group problem: old people not wearing their masks or not wearing them correctly.
The EU telling us we cant call vegetarian burgers and sausages "burgers" or "sausages" might cause a few wokies to defect to Leave!
And vice versa no doubt
I bought a blt from a place I didnt realise was veggie only. Realised no bacon and never been back as did feel "tricked" rather than the food being bad.
Calling them veggie burgers completely fine with me, but calling them just "burgers" does feel misleading. Id feel the same about chicken burgers, if I ordered a burger and got a chicken burger technically Ive got what I ordered, but not really.
Yeah. I thought they were saying the food couldn't be labelled "plant based burger", as if a burger had to be made of meat. Maybe I got that wrong, but if so seems wrong. A burger or a sausage can be made of anything cant they?
O/T. Good header from Nick Palmer. Having known a few Tory MPs, some who are no longer, but a couple who are still there and who, it might be said are somewhat uncomfortable with the direction it has taken, I think the crux is that most, if not all Con MPs, have had very long relationships and friendships with people who are also Tories. It takes a lot of guts to effectively betray, or be seen to betray, all these people quite intentionally. I am sure the same must be of those that are in other parties.
As for the vehicle that is the LDs, many Tories hate them more than Labour. I suggested to a friend of mine who is a rare breed nowadays; a moderate Tory councillor, who had told me he was not voting Tory at the GE that "why not the LDs?" and he looked at me as if I had suggested voting for the Nazi Party!
I wouldn't be surprised if they get on well with the LD MPs (or at least when there were more of them) but because for many LDs form the local gov opposition they are pretty violently against them in general.
Or perhaps that the Lib Dems have taken over the running of local government in a growing number of places, and the Tory councillors feel rejected and unloved.....
Just returned from town before we go into full lockdown tomorrow for two weeks and the outstanding observation was the 100% mask wearing in shops and good social distancing but utter chaos with groups of young people with no social distancing or masks or seemingly not a care in the world
Given any sort of encouragement in my youth, I would willing be tactile with young women! I understand that my teenage grandson holds similar views.
The EU telling us we cant call vegetarian burgers and sausages "burgers" or "sausages" might cause a few wokies to defect to Leave!
And vice versa no doubt
I bought a blt from a place I didnt realise was veggie only. Realised no bacon and never been back as did feel "tricked" rather than the food being bad.
Calling them veggie burgers completely fine with me, but calling them just "burgers" does feel misleading. Id feel the same about chicken burgers, if I ordered a burger and got a chicken burger technically Ive got what I ordered, but not really.
Yeah. I thought they were saying the food couldn't be labelled "plant based burger", as if a burger had to be made of meat. Maybe I got that wrong, but if so seems wrong. A burger or a sausage can be made of anything cant they?
To be fair, the EU are voting on it, not demanding it - but it is a vote on whether non meat products can be called "Sausage" or "burger". I think that is a bit silly, but maybe I dont know what constitutes a burger or a sausage
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It is actually extremely dangerous to undermine public confidence in a vaccine by using one that is untested.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
Have Nerys Hughes and Putin ever been seen in the same room together?
That was an unbroadcast episode of the LiverBirds. Thankfully taped over.
Just returned from town before we go into full lockdown tomorrow for two weeks and the outstanding observation was the 100% mask wearing in shops and good social distancing but utter chaos with groups of young people with no social distancing or masks or seemingly not a care in the world
You have to forgive young people for occasionally doing what every generation since time immemorial has been able to do in peacetime.
Look at what they face for the future.
A mountain of debt. Mass unemployment. A shattered economy it will take them decades to rebuild.
All to avoid getting a virus that doesn;t affect them, the specious bollocks about 'long covid' notwithstanding.
The EU telling us we cant call vegetarian burgers and sausages "burgers" or "sausages" might cause a few wokies to defect to Leave!
And vice versa no doubt
I bought a blt from a place I didnt realise was veggie only. Realised no bacon and never been back as did feel "tricked" rather than the food being bad.
Calling them veggie burgers completely fine with me, but calling them just "burgers" does feel misleading. Id feel the same about chicken burgers, if I ordered a burger and got a chicken burger technically Ive got what I ordered, but not really.
Yeah. I thought they were saying the food couldn't be labelled "plant based burger", as if a burger had to be made of meat. Maybe I got that wrong, but if so seems wrong. A burger or a sausage can be made of anything cant they?
To be fair, the EU are voting on it, not demanding it - but it is a vote on whether non meat products can be called "Sausage" or "burger". I think that is a bit silly, but maybe I dont know what constitutes a burger or a sausage
Surely it will just make people overconfident and lead to the abandoning of social distancing?
It might save the lives of care home residents and the vulnerable
It is actually extremely dangerous to undermine public confidence in a vaccine by using one that is untested.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
Have Nerys Hughes and Putin ever been seen in the same room together?
That was an unbroadcast episode of the LiverBirds. Thankfully taped over.
I tried to make that joke but obviously dont know who Nerys Hughes is!
Just returned from town before we go into full lockdown tomorrow for two weeks and the outstanding observation was the 100% mask wearing in shops and good social distancing but utter chaos with groups of young people with no social distancing or masks or seemingly not a care in the world
I hope the sight of those happy young people filled your heart with joy.
Comments
All students at Thurrock's Ortu Gable Hall School asked to self-isolate after multiple positive tests
https://www.essexlive.news/news/essex-news/essex-coronavirus-students-thurrocks-ortu-4627165
No defectors, Nick?
Perhaps I can introduce you to a Mr Reckless of the Welsh Assembly. Another pleasant English export to Wales, just like the radioactive mud being dumped in Cardiff Bay. But, more harmful, ....
https://senedd.wales/en/memhome/Pages/MemberProfile.aspx?mid=5227
He defected from Tory to UKIP (2014), from UKIP to Tory (2017), from Tory to Independent (April 2019), from
Independent to Brexit Party (May 2019), from Brexit Party to Abolish the Assembly Party (September 2020)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-54598135
The last is a hot and steaming pile of fresh defection, just 3 days old.
So I don't think that any predictive value over chance is shown. Which is why no-one sensible mentions a "Gold Standard" except satirically as a reference to previous Gold Standards falling by the wayside.
If the trials show it to be dangerous to the participants it will likely be even more dangerous to the elderly.
If the trials show it not to be efficacious then it will be even less for the elderly.
If on the other hand the trial shows it to both safe and efficacious for the participants there is no guarantee it will be for the elderly but there is a reasonable chance it is better than nothing.
"The 83-year-old who spoke for a nation: Ex-housekeeper Maureen from Barnsley who said she 'doesn't give a sod' about Tier 3 survived Covid, is not a fan of Matt Hancock and laughs off calls for her to be PM
Maureen, 83, from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, became celebrity overnight after Tier 3 'don't give a sod' remark
She is a parish councillor of 50 years and has revealed she and her husband Michael both beat coronavirus
She spoke following the announcement by officials that the region would enter Tier 3 this weekend
The pensioner was hailed by social media fans for her straight talking manner and direct opinions"
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8868129/Ex-housekeeper-Maureen-83-Barnsley-doesnt-sod-Tier-3-survived-Covid-herself.html
In terms of masks, since they have been introduced cases have gone up massively. I predicted this at the time. I may be wrong but if the preventative measure was anything else other than a mask then far more people would be questioning that measure as they are now with Tier 2 restrictions.
https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/politics/scottish-politics/1643680/generation-next-braden-davy/
The irony is strong with this one.
You can see why the rest of Yorkshire wants to concrete over Barnsley.
It is hard to think of a worse situation than the one we're in -- but premature & reckless use of a vaccine that subsequently costs lives, leading to widespread loss of public confidence in all vaccines, would do the trick,
BUT will admit that CC is great at FAKING sincerity. Otherwise, a waddling puff-ball of putrid pomposity.
Different beast altogether, but it's far from uncommon at local government level.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbnPMS_VGew&list=PLn2RjxYNpcaxMHvBJO_G0ewKWoLokCeOB&index=162
'I never thought I would feel like I was in Italy when Germany invaded. This is a free country for God's sake'
I swear to god these people...
This is, I think, a very interesting point. We seem to expect any issue to be, well, oven ready as it were, and even when parties say they want an issue debated they usually know the broad strokes of what they want and the debate is designed to achieve it, not actually debate it. And taking time in debate is seen as conceding to an opponent and weakness.
It also reminds me of a European summit from earlier in the year which, if memory serves, went into a fourth day amid some tough discussions. I found it encouraging, as it seems to me that if they did always agree on everything so well they could be over and done in a weekend that would be worrying when such diversity exists. Even on Brexit and its endless, circular shouting matches, at least a genuine issue was getting thrashed out and settled, albeit not to many's satisfaction.
Was he not founder of the Northumbria Party??
Edit: sounds awfully like him:
http://openelectoralcommission.org.uk/parties/PP1791/northumbria-party-the-north-east-party/
I imagine Guardian journalists are looking into the poor woman's background as we speak.
And vice versa no doubt
As for the vehicle that is the LDs, many Tories hate them more than Labour. I suggested to a friend of mine who is a rare breed nowadays; a moderate Tory councillor, who had told me he was not voting Tory at the GE that "why not the LDs?" and he looked at me as if I had suggested voting for the Nazi Party!
https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1319276035368644609?s=20
https://www.270towin.com/poll-closing-times
Calling them veggie burgers completely fine with me, but calling them just "burgers" does feel misleading. Id feel the same about chicken burgers, if I ordered a burger and got a chicken burger technically Ive got what I ordered, but not really.
As good as Hunter S. Thompson's demolition of Hubert Humphrey.
"Hubert Humphrey is a treacherous, gutless old ward-heeler who should be put in a goddamn bottle and sent out with the Japanese current."
You should write the Fear & Loathing on the Campaign Trail '20
Yer man from Barnsley promptly covered his eyes.
I suspect that you will get a wild range of views from people who have had it - probably based on how severe it was for them and their family and friends.
Have you guys heard that the Pfizer study has been unblinded?
Presidential Poll: Joe Biden's Lead Bounces As Donald Trump 2016 Voters Slip Away, IBD/TIPP Shows
Trump's voters, here today; gone tommorow !
Pfizer last update form two weeks ago was unblinding could happen by the end of this month / start of next and hoping to analysis data in November in time for application for emergency use mid to end of November.
https://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2019/04/21/is-it-bye-bye-to-by-elections/
Nothing announced that I can see.
Moderna announced completion of enrolment for their PIII, FWTW.
And there's an FDA vaccines conference today.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XTiL9rUpkg&feature=youtu.be
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-54618520
Thankfully taped over.
I definitely meant it one way and not the other.
Look at what they face for the future.
A mountain of debt.
Mass unemployment.
A shattered economy it will take them decades to rebuild.
All to avoid getting a virus that doesn;t affect them, the specious bollocks about 'long covid' notwithstanding.
Friend 1 (OF): Fettes is the Eton of Scotland
Friend 2 (OE): No, Eton is the Eton of Scotland
Otherwise I would be calling it what undoubtedly effing is.
If there's not, there is no story, so don't insinuate conspiracy theory nonsense.
How do you think Capn Bob Maxwell prospered for so long?