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  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,302
    LadyG said:

    That's like saying all wars are bad, so there's no point in distinguishing between them.

    The Falklands War was bad. The First World War was a total apocalypse.

    A 5% fall in UK GDP is a really grisly recession, but we'd get through. A 20% fall in GDP in one year (with more pain to come?) is unprecedented. No one alive has ever experienced such a catastrophe. Who knows what it might do to us, how it could change us
    Trying to be positive, a 20% GDP reduction would take us back to GDP levels we had in 2003. Life was ok for most in 2003.

    Not so terrible, looked at that way :smile:
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,601
    LadyG said:

    That's like saying all wars are bad, so there's no point in distinguishing between them.

    The Falklands War was bad. The First World War was a total apocalypse.

    A 5% fall in UK GDP is a really grisly recession, but we'd get through. A 20% fall in GDP in one year (with more pain to come?) is unprecedented. No one alive has ever experienced such a catastrophe. Who knows what it might do to us, how it could change us
    Except for how I didn't say that, it is exactly like saying that. I even explicitly said some horrendous outcomes are clearly worse than other..

    My point was for the man on the street there won't be a major difference between, say, 3.5 million unemployed and 3 million unemployed, or a 15% drop rather than a 10% drop. There is a difference, and it is very real for society, but in terms of personal experiences the flavours of catastrophe are by degree rather than type.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,272
    LadyG said:

    I think a 20-25% fall is maybe worse than the S Sea Bubble?

    The S Sea Bubble saw a 15% fall
    I think the Great Frost of 1709 was the previous biggest drop. GDP then being tricky to estimate of course.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,884
    LadyG said:

    WTF is up with the UK data today? 1,200 new cases, 138 new deaths?!

    398 new cases (bulk in England). 138 new deaths (2 in Wales; the rest in England)
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,686

    That's just Middlesbrough on a normal night.
    Nope, there's no smog in any of those pictures.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,096

    @HYUFD I’m in Epping tomorrow for work experience. I’ll be sure to ask the locals what they think of the parish council.

    Almost half the town council is LD now anyway, good luck with the work experience
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,096

    You cant win with just your base.
    You certainly cannot win without them
  • LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221

    Trying to be positive, a 20% GDP reduction would take us back to GDP levels we had in 2003. Life was ok for most in 2003.

    Not so terrible, looked at that way :smile:
    I'm going to climb to the top of the Shard, it will take me about an hour, then I am going to jump off. At the end of the jump, I will be in exactly the same position I was just an hour before, so there's nothing to worry about.

    ;)
  • eekeek Posts: 29,741

    That's just Middlesbrough on a normal night.
    Boro was busier than that last week when I took the twins for theory tests and the exam location isn't in the busiest part of town.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177
    eek said:

    Boro was busier than that last week when I took the twins for theory tests and the exam location isn't in the busiest part of town.
    Newcastle city centre, or at least Northumberland Street, was pretty busy when I was there last Sunday.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 29,849

    Nope, there's no smog in any of those pictures.
    At least one of those buildings would have a crowd of people as it would be a parmo takeaway
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,096

    Not sure if HYUFD has noticed, but since we left the EU we've had this thing called the Rona. Its killed 50k people and turned the country upside down. As others are pointing out a large number of people are claiming or soon to be claiming UC for the first time as their jobs and in some cases half their industry is swept away.

    Pre-Rona obsession with Essicksinnit Man's opinion of up Norf's views on free movement won't matter a toss compared to what has happened after Brexit. This is armageddon, and we haven't even faced into the fun that no deal could pour onto the fire.

    A focus on how people actually live - rather than how he thinks they live - may help. Reading stats from a poll is very different from having the slightest idea of the lives and experiences of people which drive their answers in those polls

    Unless we get over 50% unemployment, which is very unlikely and in which case a far left or far right government becomes a strong possibility, most people will not be unemployed even despite this crisis and the cultural political divide will remain key.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,850
    kle4 said:

    Except for how I didn't say that, it is exactly like saying that. I even explicitly said some horrendous outcomes are clearly worse than other..

    My point was for the man on the street there won't be a major difference between, say, 3.5 million unemployed and 3 million unemployed, or a 15% drop rather than a 10% drop. There is a difference, and it is very real for society, but in terms of personal experiences the flavours of catastrophe are by degree rather than type.
    All because of a disease that has a death rate of about 0.3% , shows how crap and cowardly governments are these days. The mask directive tops it all
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    I've been saying from the start that the Newcastle United takeover might well not happen.

    Saudi Arabia bans beIN Sports to further complicate £300m Newcastle takeover

    Ruling makes it impossible to watch Premier League legally
    English top flight has been considering club’s sale for 16 weeks

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/jul/14/saudi-arabia-bans-bein-sport-to-further-complicate-300m-newcastle-takeover

    It shouldn't happen. The Saudis are not fit and proper anything.

    May as well call the FBI off and get Ghislaine Maxwell declared fit and proper to take over.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    It shouldn't happen. The Saudis are not fit and proper anything.

    May as well call the FBI off and get Ghislaine Maxwell declared fit and proper to take over.
    Is a Liverpool fan concerned they may have some more competition in a few years? Diddums.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177
    LadyG said:

    Potentially quite explosive

    twitter.com/singharj/status/1283094100158316546?s=20

    Why doesn’t the Government just publish it anyway ffs? Since when did they care what local councils think?
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Is a Liverpool fan concerned they may have some more competition in a few years? Diddums.
    From Newcastle? 😲

    Its good to laugh every once in a while, no the thought never even crossed my mind!
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    From Newcastle? 😲

    Its good to laugh every once in a while, no the thought never even crossed my mind!
    Newcastle United with billions of pounds of Saudi investment, sure.

    I thought you were a big believer in the free-market anyway. Why shouldn’t the PIF be able to invest in Newcastle United Ltd?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,686
    edited July 2020

    Is a Liverpool fan concerned they may have some more competition in a few years? Diddums.
    We beat the FFP busting spent a billion quid City to the the title with a net spend of 70 odd million under Klopp.

    I'm not worried.

    I mean who is reportedly top of the Saudi wishlist?

    Poch, who has never won a trophy as manager.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Newcastle United with billions of pounds of Saudi investment, sure.

    I thought you were a big believer in the free-market anyway. Why shouldn’t the PIF be able to invest in Newcastle United Ltd?
    I am a big believer in the free market.

    The Saudis are an authoritarian dictatorship and do not represent the free market.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,850
    HYUFD said:

    Unless we get over 50% unemployment, which is very unlikely and in which case a far left or far right government becomes a strong possibility, most people will not be unemployed even despite this crisis and the cultural political divide will remain key.
    We wont get that officially but with furlough and public sector non -jobs protected then effectively it will be close to that . all for a disease slightly worse than flu in terms of death rates .
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,638

    Trying to be positive, a 20% GDP reduction would take us back to GDP levels we had in 2003. Life was ok for most in 2003.

    Not so terrible, looked at that way :smile:
    Andy Haldane gave a speech on this recently, early signs are V shaped recovery.

    Now I don't doubt Boris and Rishi can cock it up, but the key numbers to watch are still COVID cases.

    We WILL have another lockdown if this gets out of control again. That's the danger.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    I am a big believer in the free market.

    The Saudis are an authoritarian dictatorship and do not represent the free market.
    A vast majority of owners of Premier League clubs are dodgy AF.

    I don’t care. Bring on the sorely-needed investment.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,686

    Newcastle United with billions of pounds of Saudi investment, sure.

    I thought you were a big believer in the free-market anyway. Why shouldn’t the PIF be able to invest in Newcastle United Ltd?
    Because they are linked to people behind the Khashoggi murder.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-52465137
  • LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221
    rkrkrk said:

    Andy Haldane gave a speech on this recently, early signs are V shaped recovery.

    Now I don't doubt Boris and Rishi can cock it up, but the key numbers to watch are still COVID cases.

    We WILL have another lockdown if this gets out of control again. That's the danger.
    Except the newest data does NOT suggest a V-shaped recovery.

    It's going to be L. You read it here first
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    Because they are linked to people behind the Khashoggi murder.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-52465137
    Allegedly.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Why doesn’t the Government just publish it anyway ffs? Since when did they care what local councils think?
    I can guess what the Councils are worried about and why the government would be concerned too.

    When the town/city level data was released recently showing the countries with the highest cases - Leicester, Bradford etc - certain people immediately started associating a 'common denominator' between those towns.

    Postcode level data and I can imagine people doing that even more.

    Maybe that's not a bad thing. There certainly seems to be cultural issues or other issues in play here and addressing them honestly is the ideal solution . . . but I can understand why a bit of sensitivity rather than rushing headlong into publishing is being asked for here.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 51,132
    LadyG said:

    I'm going to climb to the top of the Shard, it will take me about an hour, then I am going to jump off. At the end of the jump, I will be in exactly the same position I was just an hour before, so there's nothing to worry about.

    ;)
    Make it easier on yourself, and take the lift up.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,850

    Allegedly.
    The whole idea that the Premier League can tell and judge goodies from baddies is laughable frankly .
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,823

    A vast majority of owners of Premier League clubs are dodgy AF.

    I don’t care. Bring on the sorely-needed investment.
    It's blood money. Your attitude is extremely disappointing.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,302
    LadyG said:

    I'm going to climb to the top of the Shard, it will take me about an hour, then I am going to jump off. At the end of the jump, I will be in exactly the same position I was just an hour before, so there's nothing to worry about.

    ;)
    If you took the lift down, that would be true.

    PS Good luck with trying to jump off the top of The Shard... you'll have to climb up the outside.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Allegedly.
    Oh don't play that game, you're better than that surely?

    The Saudis are evil - this has nothing to do with the Geordies. Some things are more serious than football.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,096

    All because of a disease that has a death rate of about 0.3% , shows how crap and cowardly governments are these days. The mask directive tops it all
    The death rate is under 0.5% for under 50s but up to 20%+ for over 80s

    https://ourworldindata.org/mortality-risk-covid
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    The whole idea that the Premier League can tell and judge goodies from baddies is laughable frankly .
    They can’t. The PIF is ultimately a separate entity from the Saudi Government so it will go through, and the North East as a whole will benefit. It’s sorely needed.

    I notice that people haven’t been whinging about PIF investment in BT, amongst hundreds of others.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 51,132
    Breaking: Maxwell pleads not guilty, refused bail.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    LadyG said:

    Except the newest data does NOT suggest a V-shaped recovery.

    It's going to be L. You read it here first
    8% growth during lockdown when you exclude the service sector that was largely legally barred from trading.

    That's pretty V shaped in my eyes.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,302

    I can guess what the Councils are worried about and why the government would be concerned too.

    When the town/city level data was released recently showing the countries with the highest cases - Leicester, Bradford etc - certain people immediately started associating a 'common denominator' between those towns.

    Postcode level data and I can imagine people doing that even more.

    Maybe that's not a bad thing. There certainly seems to be cultural issues or other issues in play here and addressing them honestly is the ideal solution . . . but I can understand why a bit of sensitivity rather than rushing headlong into publishing is being asked for here.
    ... which does you credit.

    Blaming the victims is always a tempting cop-out.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177
    MaxPB said:

    It's blood money. Your attitude is extremely disappointing.
    All billionaires have blood on their hands. The criticism of the Newcastle takeover is based on jealousy and nothing else.

    It’s entirely arbitrary.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,672
    dixiedean said:

    One would hope so. However, "always busy" is perhaps a tad premature.
    I wonder if there is any writing on the wall for these big frothy shopping centres?

    When I ran the numbers a few months ago it was a surprise to find that my local Macarthur Glen turns over considerably more per sqft than Meadowhall.
  • eekeek Posts: 29,741

    Trying to be positive, a 20% GDP reduction would take us back to GDP levels we had in 2003. Life was ok for most in 2003.

    Not so terrible, looked at that way :smile:
    Our total GDP figure hides a large fall in GDP per head figures. When you look at how many immigrants have come here over the past 15 years you may see the true scale of the problem

  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    Oh don't play that game, you're better than that surely?

    The Saudis are evil - this has nothing to do with the Geordies. Some things are more serious than football.
    Well your party in Government seems happy to call them our allies.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 9,012
    "Councils are concerned that the government's plan to publish postcode-level data could lead to certain neighbourhoods being stigmatised."
    This kneejerk "don't tell them" attitude is really abhorrent. We seem to have the spread of the virus under control because of individual behaviour which is informed by how the infection is spreading locally. Lack of transparency will only nurture suspicion and anxiety and inhibit sensible responses.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,686
    A new owner spending millions is no guarantee of success.

    Just look at Everton, since Moshiri took over he's invested £350 million and they are still shite.

    Their high point in recent seasons was celebrating a throw in at Anfield (with a flare) only to see Divock Origi do this.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnmRE0-M270
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,823

    All billionaires have blood on their hands. The criticism of the Newcastle takeover is based on jealousy and nothing else.

    It’s entirely arbitrary.
    No, when the Saudis were sniffing around Spurs a few years ago I was desperate for them to move on. I know Liverpool fans who felt the same when they were looking into taking over from Hicks and Gillet.

    You're welcome to the blood money, but every success you have is built on the deaths of children in Yemen.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,686

    All billionaires have blood on their hands. The criticism of the Newcastle takeover is based on jealousy and nothing else.

    It’s entirely arbitrary.
    Explain to me how John W Henry has blood on his hands?
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    A vast majority of owners of Premier League clubs are dodgy AF.

    I don’t care. Bring on the sorely-needed investment.
    That's more honest than saying "Allegedly" in reply to Khasoggi.

    Disreputable and disgusting frankly, but honest at least. Don't sell your soul to the devil, its not worth it.

    “For Newcastle United? Why Gallow, it profit a man nothing to give his soul for the whole world. . . but for Newcastle United!”
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,850
    edited July 2020

    Well your party in Government seems happy to call them our allies.
    I am sure the Saudis are baddies in this but the Premier League is so far removed from Corinthians turning down penalties in 1860 whatever because it was bad form that frankly its more insulting that the Premier League is held up to be something so pure it needs protecting from evil - I mean if the best objection is somebody was involved in a diplomatic murder then didn't the yanks openly assassinate a top Iranian only this year (seems a eon ago with the plague )
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 10,808
    LadyG said:


    I'm talking about people having mental breakdowns because of lockdown, or actually dying from covid-19
    There are many people who have lived the last 20 years in what you describe as lockdown all they have is home and work because they cant afford anything else. They managed if people are really killing themselves over three months of lockdown which tbh I doubt then they must be quite weak minded
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,188

    Amidst all the mock doom and gloom about how the UK's economy didn't bounce back in May while it was locked down . . . just saw this breakdown and its frankly better than I'd expect!
    https://twitter.com/Rob_KS_ONS/status/1282918368778092545

    I wouldn't expect any growth in services while we're locked down, but nearly double-digit percentage growth in the other sectors? That's far better than I'd have expected! Its the fact services make up such a big part of the economy that means the overall figures are awful but then vast proportions of services were legally closed in May so what else should be expected?

    That manufacturing etc were posting 8% gains in May though . . . I'm pleasantly surprised by that. Its depressing that nobody was covering this sectoral breakdown in the figures in the media today, that I saw at least.

    Its growth from the largest drop in peacetime, though, isn't it? It isn't hard to manufacture 8% gains after you've had record double digit drops in the previous months.

    It was literally some factories (which were not in fact mandated closed - remember 'go to work if you can't work from home' - but had largely closed temporarily), and construction sites, getting going again.

    I am very concerned about the economy. I agree with @SouthamObserver that the Govt is going to have to inject an awful lot more cash into pretty much every sector. Retail needs a real boost. Leisure and Tourism too. Just back from our harbour, a few people outside restaurants - but not enough for most of the businesses to survive.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177
    @TheScreamingEagles we don’t want millions anyway. We want an owner who actually cares about maximising the potential of the club and the local area. An owner who will actually invest to further the club. I wouldn’t care if the new owners only spent what the club generated, and maximised our commercial potential.

    The new owners have promised just that. Mike Ashley has sucked the soul out of the club and the city and we want it back.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,686
    MaxPB said:


    No, when the Saudis were sniffing around Spurs a few years ago I was desperate for them to move on. I know Liverpool fans who felt the same when they were looking into taking over from Hicks and Gillet.

    You're welcome to the blood money, but every success you have is built on the deaths of children in Yemen.

    Heck, when China were talking about buying Liverpool from Hicks and Gillette I was hoping it wouldn't happen and would have rather gone into administration.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,823

    Explain to me how John W Henry has blood on his hands?
    Or Joe Lewis, or the Glazers for that matter.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 127,096
    Mortimer said:

    Its growth from the largest drop in peacetime, though, isn't it? It isn't hard to manufacture 8% gains after you've had record double digit drops in the previous months.

    It was literally some factories (which were not in fact mandated closed - remember 'go to work if you can't work from home' - but had largely closed temporarily), and construction sites, getting going again.

    I am very concerned about the economy. I agree with @SouthamObserver that the Govt is going to have to inject an awful lot more cash into pretty much every sector. Retail needs a real boost. Leisure and Tourism too. Just back from our harbour, a few people outside restaurants - but not enough for most of the businesses to survive.
    And garden centres also reopened in May
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    That's more honest than saying "Allegedly" in reply to Khasoggi.

    Disreputable and disgusting frankly, but honest at least. Don't sell your soul to the devil, its not worth it.

    “For Newcastle United? Why Gallow, it profit a man nothing to give his soul for the whole world. . . but for Newcastle United!”
    What point are you making?

    I have no influence in who Mike Ashley sells Newcastle United to.

    The fact he is selling it, finally, is news to rejoice to.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 55,191
    eek said:


    Our total GDP figure hides a large fall in GDP per head figures. When you look at how many immigrants have come here over the past 15 years you may see the true scale of the problem

    Our population has increased by approximately 10% since 2003 whilst until recently GDP had increased by more than 25% so per capita we were better off.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 34,295

    All billionaires have blood on their hands. The criticism of the Newcastle takeover is based on jealousy and nothing else.

    It’s entirely arbitrary.
    All billionaires?
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    @TheScreamingEagles we don’t want millions anyway. We want an owner who actually cares about maximising the potential of the club and the local area. An owner who will actually invest to further the club. I wouldn’t care if the new owners only spent what the club generated, and maximised our commercial potential.

    The new owners have promised just that. Mike Ashley has sucked the soul out of the club and the city and we want it back.

    You think the Saudis are going to give a damn about the soul of the club? Or investing in the club?

    You think the Saudis are altruistic or have your best intentions at heart?

    Ashley may be bad but seriously the Saudis could be 10x worse.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,672
    HYUFD said:

    And garden centres also reopened in May
    Small to medium manufacturers known to me are carefully husbanding what business they know to expect to cover themselves until whatever is their next annual peak period.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    You think the Saudis are going to give a damn about the soul of the club? Or investing in the club?

    You think the Saudis are altruistic or have your best intentions at heart?

    Ashley may be bad but seriously the Saudis could be 10x worse.
    Worse in what way? There is literally no way they could be worse.

    You clearly have zero understanding of the current state of Newcastle United.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,823

    What point are you making?

    I have no influence in who Mike Ashley sells Newcastle United to.

    The fact he is selling it, finally, is news to rejoice to.
    I'd honestly rather have Ashley than the house of Saud. They are despicable, blood thirsty dictators killing women and children in Yemen because if a centuries old blood fued. It's truly awful.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,672
    MaxPB said:

    Or Joe Lewis, or the Glazers for that matter.
    Man U fans spitting blood...
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,272
    LadyG said:
    Data by local authority down to Local Authority ward are visible in table 6 here, for deaths. The Teir 2 data on number of cases are not distributed to local authorities.

    https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsinvolvingcovid19bylocalareasanddeprivation/deathsoccurringbetween1marchand31may2020#middle-layer-super-output-areas
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177
    MaxPB said:

    I'd honestly rather have Ashley than the house of Saud. They are despicable, blood thirsty dictators killing women and children in Yemen because if a centuries old blood fued. It's truly awful.
    Fascinating.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,686

    Worse in what way? There is literally no way they could be worse.

    You clearly have zero understanding of the current state of Newcastle United.
    How about if there's a revolution in Saudi Arabia and/or a collapse in oil revenues?

    You won't have a pot to piss in that scenario and then you go the way of Bury.
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 10,808

    Have you ever been to Gateshead? Gateshead is basically Newcastle City Centre.
    you mistake me for some one that cares....gateshead was purely an example any run down area that has been hollowed out by the drain of people to the southeast would do
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,302
    eek said:

    Our total GDP figure hides a large fall in GDP per head figures. When you look at how many immigrants have come here over the past 15 years you may see the true scale of the problem

    Beware of looking at charts in USD but yes GDP per capita has struggled to get back to pre-2008 levels.

    Good job we have had those economic geniuses the Tories in charge, eh?
  • OllyTOllyT Posts: 5,035
    MaxPB said:

    It's blood money. Your attitude is extremely disappointing.
    and if Liverpool or Man United ever get bought out by the Chinese or the Saudis you won't hear peep of protest from the fans.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 55,191
    LadyG said:

    Except the newest data does NOT suggest a V-shaped recovery.

    It's going to be L. You read it here first
    Much to early to say. May was a lockdown month indistinguishable from April. It’s hardly surprising that output didn’t change. It will be September when we get the August figures that we will have a clear idea.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177
    I repeat, I assume that all those on their high horse about the Newcastle takeover will never use any of the following companies again:
    • BT
    • EE
    • TicketMasters
    • Carnival
    • Disney
    • Facebook
    • BP
    • Boeing
    • Shell
    • Total
    • Citigroup
    to name just a few. All that PIF has stakes in.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,686
    OllyT said:

    and if Liverpool or Man United ever get bought out by the Chinese or the Saudis you won't hear peep of protest from the fans.
    There were protests from Liverpool fans when the China Investment Group started sniffing around Liverpool in 2010.
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,559
    IanB2 said:

    Breaking: Maxwell pleads not guilty, refused bail.

    Trial scheduled to last 3 weeks to begin July 21, 2021. Two alleged victims testified - one in person, one in writing - against granting bail.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177
    Pagan2 said:

    you mistake me for some one that cares....gateshead was purely an example any run down area that has been hollowed out by the drain of people to the southeast would do
    Well you clearly haven’t got a clue what you’re talking about.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,823

    Fascinating.
    Your denial of what your prospective owners are responsible for is quite disappointing. Newcastle is an honourable football club with great fans and traditions, you will wipe away all of that good will by taking the blood money. Your entertainment is going to be funded by dead children murdered by Saudi weapons. Accept it.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,842

    Well your party in Government seems happy to call them our allies.
    As were yours the last time you were in Government, and barring some sort of Corbynite insurgency, as they will the next time they're in Government.
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 10,808

    I love how @Pagan2 claims to speak for the working class of London and yet reccomends that they leave their family, friends, and support network behind and move 270 miles north, as only an out-of-touch person would.

    I never claimed to speak for the working class of london, I dont live in london. I claim to speak some truths to asses like you on your six figure salaries feeling all secure most of the time who go and say crap like no one would be bothered by a 1% extra tax because they very much would this is why no one votes lib dem because you are all pampered little c**ts
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    As were yours the last time you were in Government, and barring some sort of Corbynite insurgency, as they will the next time they're in Government.
    That is my point...
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177
    MaxPB said:

    Your denial of what your prospective owners are responsible for is quite disappointing. Newcastle is an honourable football club with great fans and traditions, you will wipe away all of that good will by taking the blood money. Your entertainment is going to be funded by dead children murdered by Saudi weapons. Accept it.
    PIF has a stake in Disney and @Philip_Thompson is happy to entertain his kids with their content.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 5,097
    Trump is so desperate now he’s having a Rose Garden briefing to take credit for some encouraging news re a vaccine in the USA.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    I repeat, I assume that all those on their high horse about the Newcastle takeover will never use any of the following companies again:

    • BT
    • EE
    • TicketMasters
    • Carnival
    • Disney
    • Facebook
    • BP
    • Boeing
    • Shell
    • Total
    • Citigroup
    to name just a few. All that PIF has stakes in.
    I don't consider many of those businesses to be reputable indeed. PIF may have small stakes in some of those too but not ownership, there's a difference between investment and ownership.

    And there's no reason why you can't condemn the Saudis while happily supporting your team. You can distinguish between your club and Mike Ashley afterall can't you? Do you feel an overwhelming urge to defend Mike Ashley and to lavishly praise him and brush off any criticism? The Saudis are no better than Mike Ashley, they're worse than him.

    Love your club I respect that 100%, but there's no need to love either Ashley or the Saudis.
  • Pagan2 said:

    I never claimed to speak for the working class of london, I dont live in london. I claim to speak some truths to asses like you on your six figure salaries feeling all secure most of the time who go and say crap like no one would be bothered by a 1% extra tax because they very much would this is why no one votes lib dem because you are all pampered little c**ts
    Do you kiss your mother with that mouth?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 55,191

    Trial scheduled to last 3 weeks to begin July 21,
    2021. Two alleged victims testified - one in person,
    one in writing - against granting bail.
    The “she’s already done a deal with the FBI who have been talking to her for a while” theory has taken a bit of a knock.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,850

    I repeat, I assume that all those on their high horse about the Newcastle takeover will never use any of the following companies again:

    • BT
    • EE
    • TicketMasters
    • Carnival
    • Disney
    • Facebook
    • BP
    • Boeing
    • Shell
    • Total
    • Citigroup
    to name just a few. All that PIF has stakes in.
    To be honest PIF must be a bit naff if they invested in BT and Carnival!
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    PIF has a stake in Disney and @Philip_Thompson is happy to entertain his kids with their content.
    Absolutely I am. I like Disney. I respect Disney. I'm not defending the Saudis because of Disney though. Oh and incidentally we're talking an investment into Disney made on the free market and that makes up a fraction of one percent of Disney shares - are Newcastle United going to be a fraction of one percent owned by the Saudis?

    Why can't you divorce your feelings for your club with your feelings for the Saudis?
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    I don't consider many of those businesses to be reputable indeed. PIF may have small stakes in some of those too but not ownership, there's a difference between investment and ownership.

    And there's no reason why you can't condemn the Saudis while happily supporting your team. You can distinguish between your club and Mike Ashley afterall can't you? Do you feel an overwhelming urge to defend Mike Ashley and to lavishly praise him and brush off any criticism? The Saudis are no better than Mike Ashley, they're worse than him.

    Love your club I respect that 100%, but there's no need to love either Ashley or the Saudis.
    I don’t love the Saudis. Far from it, but I have zero influence on the sale. I would much prefer that we had a German system where fan ownership accounted for 51% of every club but unfortunately that is not the case.

    People are just jealous that Newcastle is finally getting the investment it deserves.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,823
    edited July 2020

    PIF has a stake in Disney and @Philip_Thompson is happy to entertain his kids with their content.
    That's up to him and the board of Disney. You're a Newcastle fan, you'll have to live with knowing that your club is profiting from children being butchered by your club's owners. That's on you.

    Also, I'd put mega sanctions on Saudi money and make them forced sellers of shareholdings in UK companies, I'd hope that others would do the same. There is no place for their blood money.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177

    Absolutely I am. I like Disney. I respect Disney. I'm not defending the Saudis because of Disney though. Oh and incidentally we're talking an investment into Disney made on the free market and that makes up a fraction of one percent of Disney shares - are Newcastle United going to be a fraction of one percent owned by the Saudis?

    Why can't you divorce your feelings for your club with your feelings for the Saudis?
    Well PIF is going to own 80% of Newcastle United.
  • LadyGLadyG Posts: 2,221
    DavidL said:

    Much to early to say. May was a lockdown month indistinguishable from April. It’s hardly surprising that output didn’t change. It will be September when we get the August figures that we will have a clear idea.
    Too early to say for sure, but the initial data, and anecdata, are not good.

    It is clear that large sectors of the economy - travel/leisure/entertainment/transport - are taking the most enormous hit. Much worse than anticipated.

    I have just watched yet another entirely empty London bus pass my window. Fifth in a row.

    No one is moving in London. According to reports, the Treasury has been horrified at the scale of the seize-up.

    Feels L-shaped to me.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 30,842

    Do you kiss your mother with that mouth?
    I admit, calling someone a clot isn't very nice, but this is an overreaction.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 20,177
    edited July 2020
    Pagan2 said:

    I never claimed to speak for the working class of london, I dont live in london. I claim to speak some truths to asses like you on your six figure salaries feeling all secure most of the time who go and say crap like no one would be bothered by a 1% extra tax because they very much would this is why no one votes lib dem because you are all pampered little c**ts
    Actually my salary prior to my career change attempt was circa 30k. I’m currently unemployed, and neither do I, or have ever, lived anywhere near London.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    OllyT said:

    and if Liverpool or Man United ever get bought out by the Chinese or the Saudis you won't hear peep of protest from the fans.
    Yeah because Liverpool fans totally loved Hicks and Gilette.

    While the United fans have totally adored the Glasers.

    No hint of a criticism from the fans for either of them. 🙄

    Our clubs are bigger than our owners.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,823
    I'd stop supporting Spurs if they got taken over by the Saudis or someother such regime linked to thousands of dead women and children. The board almost pushed me to the brink when they decided to take the furlough cash to pay non-playing staff but maintaining players on full wages.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    I don’t love the Saudis. Far from it, but I have zero influence on the sale. I would much prefer that we had a German system where fan ownership accounted for 51% of every club but unfortunately that is not the case.

    People are just jealous that Newcastle is finally getting the investment it deserves.
    I couldn't care less that Newcastle is getting the investment. I'd be happy for Newcastle to get the investment - you're not a rival. If someone wanted to write a blank cheque for Manchester United that might exercise me but for any other squad? I genuinely don't mind.

    I despise the Saudis though. Always have done. Doesn't change because they're proposing to invest in the Geordies. You're neither here nor there in my thinking frankly, this is all about my loathing of the despicable, despotic, frankly evil Saudi regime.
  • Lol masks everywhere as per Telegraph
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,850

    Yeah because Liverpool fans totally loved Hicks and Gilette.

    While the United fans have totally adored the Glasers.

    No hint of a criticism from the fans for either of them. 🙄

    Our clubs are bigger than our owners.
    The Premier League sold its soul a long time ago. No point in any team playing the morally superior card . The sad thing is that the clubs should be free from owners as such and be owned by the fans on a cooperative or mutual basis . Its a perfect model for sports clubs
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 55,191
    LadyG said:

    Too early to say for sure, but the initial data, and anecdata, are not good.

    It is clear that large sectors of the economy - travel/leisure/entertainment/transport - are taking the most enormous hit. Much worse than anticipated.


    I have just watched yet another entirely empty London bus pass my window. Fifth in a row.

    No one is moving in London. According to reports, the Treasury has been horrified at the scale of the seize-up.

    Feels L-shaped to me.
    Well until very recently we have had all sorts of random rules stopping businesses from trading. In Scotland we still have them although there is some relaxation tomorrow. And we have combined the reopening with lots of rules about masks that scare people. It’s not helpful.

This discussion has been closed.